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Stop Overthinking Video and Start Using It with Sarah Allen · UnF*ck Your Legal Marketing

• Gary Johnson: Welcome to Un-Fuck Your Legal Marketing, the show where we get brutally honest about marketing, business, and the messy middle of making it all work. I'm Gary Johnson, marketing coach, strategist, and. a professional BS detector for attorneys and business owners who are tired of doing what everyone else does. Around here, we skip the fluff. We have real conversations, real insights, and maybe a few F-bombs along the way. So, let's get into it. Day's Gas Springs big brand marketing experience into the world of video for attorneys. Sarah Allen, who is a dear friend of mine has held leadership roles in companies like Old Navy, Banana Republic and eBay, where she actually managed businesses totaling over $500 million in revenue. She later transitioned into entrepreneurship, starting up her own and really working with attorneys to help them use video to build stuff like trust, save time, grow revenue. ⁓ And I'll give you a great example of this. She has a system which we're gonna be talking about called the educational video system where she helped one of her clients generate over a million dollars in revenue Just from that one client. So I'm really excited about having her on there because this video is near and dear to my heart Sarah welcome to unfuck your legal marketing Thank you, Gary. What a warm welcome. You're such a great hype man. Whenever I need some encouragement, I'm coming on your podcast. I'm like, wow, that was really kind. Thank you. so first question for you. You've led massive brands and then shifted into entrepreneurship. What made you decide to focus in on video specifically? Yeah, that's great question, Gary. Really two things. so the first was data. ⁓ I'm a very analytical person, ⁓ actually. And the brand builders group did an incredible study on the power of personal branding. Now, some people think about personal branding as just kind of this vague thing that you should do, but they actually drilled down to like quantifiable reasons that you should do it. And one of the statistics made me want to go after video, which was 63 63 % of Americans are more likely to buy from you if you have a personal brand. Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, ⁓ whoa, how can I help people build their personal brands and video? was just, in my opinion, video is the main reason, the main way that you can really build a personal brand in the most efficient way in 2026. So that was really the first thing, data. ⁓ And then the second thing was, I am just a fan in general of doing. higher barrier to entry marketing activities. So- Wait, are videos high barrier of entry? Higher, they are. Yes, they are. Because I find that attorneys, like any attorney law firm can just throw money at Google AdWords or on Yelp, right? And there is a subset of folks that are really willing on a consistent basis to build a body of work. And when I think about what's really going to set law firms up for success in the future, it's that. So I would say those are the two things, Gary, that really made me focus on video. Why do you think that there is such a big barrier of entry with video? Because you can literally turn on your phone, start recording with a great camera. So it's not like... Ooh, I need all the equipment and that's the barrier of entry. why is there such a huge barrier? Okay. So I do think with a lot of attorneys, they're in this hamster wheel of time for money. Right? And so it's like, I need to get my billable hours in and this is not going to be a billable hour. And so a lot of attorneys are not necessarily business people. And it's funny because I actually find that the attorneys that I work with are kind of more entrepreneurs than lawyers. I mean, they are, they are lawyers. But yeah. So I think that there is, you know, I think the barrier is people, attorneys just get bogged down with work that they should probably be delegating to other people, which is not my area of expertise, but it's what I see consistently in clients that are able to like really do this on a consistent basis. And I also think Gary, just like with everything in life, We need to have proper expectations for ourselves. Right. I think with video and how high achievers attorneys are, I mean, I'm not a sports person, but they just want to hit home runs, right? Like right, right out of the gate. Like I want to, I'm going to be awesome at this and more than likely you're not going to be. And that's okay. Your first couple of times in front of the video camera and in front of your phone even. It's gonna be uncomfortable. It's like, it's basically, it's like riding a bike for the first time. It's uncomfortable. And let me just say, uncomfortable isn't bad. And so I think that there's this space that attorneys struggle with. It's like, I don't wanna do it unless I'm gonna be able to hit a home run. And I just think video is a skill, just like anything else. Like before we pressed record, you and I were talking about sales skills. It's just about getting those reps in. I think also a lot of attorneys think, ⁓ that's just not my personality. Like I don't have like a good camera presence and it can be learned. There are people that are going to be more extroverted than introverted, right? Energetically, but it's just, it's just a game of repetition. Yeah. And I never, I never thought about the whole thing of they want to be great at everything that they do. Cause they're highly scrutinized. Attorneys are and they're like I don't want to put something out there that is not Perfect, you know, even though when they started Practicing the law they weren't perfect. That's why they probably worked for a large firm Grinded it out learned the business of law and how to practice law, right? But I never thought about the video of being I want this thing to be perfect. I I've heard so many times that people are like, I hate how I look. I don't, I hate how I sound. I go, yeah, we all do. I hate how I sound. I hate how I look, but I still show up. I still do my videos every single week. Like rinse and repeat, rinse and repeat. Right. Totally. But I never thought about that's the barrier of entry to get into this because unless it's perfect, unless I'm paying a commercial grade. videography company to come in and do ⁓ a $40,000 shoe that has B-roll and drones and models and makeup, commercial, I'm not going to do anything at all. Totally. And the specific scrutiny that my clients are worried about is from their peers, right? From their colleagues. And what's interesting to me is there are these things in life that hold us back that aren't even true, right? A lot of my clients haven't received scrutiny from their colleagues. They've received gratitude. Like, thank you. These videos were so helpful. And in fact, I shared your videos with my clients as I'm referring you to them. So it's just like one of these things that's... in our head and something that I was thinking about when you were talking about just appearances because we all have ego, we all have insecurities and one of the things that has helped me and I think it has helped my clients is insert whatever you're insecure about and that is the very reason that you should be doing video. Like whatever's on your face, whatever baby fat, whatever, like that actually makes you relatable and human. to people. so I just think that, I don't know, I mean, it's cliche, like be yourself, right? But sure. Yeah, that that's helped me. I love that advice because it gives them permission to be themselves. Yeah, it gives them permission to try something new, get out of their own fucking head like, know, easier said than done. But totally, it really is. I mean, that's why people need you, Gary. I was just gonna say that's people need you is so that you can be like, look, I get it. Been there, done that. I've worked with people just like you. are some things like if you're not good at something, lean into that even more so. That's what you should be doing. That is the very reason. Yeah. I I just picked up golf for the first time in 15 years when I used to play all the time. Okay. And I will not. go on a course until I have hit 5,000 balls in my backyard because I've got a driving range in my backyard. But it's that insecurity. I don't want to look horrible to who? To people I don't know that really aren't thinking about me or my foursome? Well, if I'm with a bunch of jerks, the foursome, should I even be with them anyway? And I should be leaning into this and going, yeah. I'm not very good on the course and the only way that I'm going to get better is to get my ass on the course and start to play, lean into it. Okay, we're done with this conversation. You just helped me out. Great. All right. We're done. But I love these sort of nuggets because it's real. It's raw, right? You know, and especially when you said there's such a high barrier of entry and most people are like, no, there's not because you have the equipment, but then why is nobody doing it? You know, and it's that insecurity of I need this to be perfect, especially for lawyers. They're known as that. I want everything to be perfect. I don't want to say the wrong things because I'm afraid of risk and all that, or I'm afraid of risk that I'm going to look stupid. And let me tell you, you don't look as bad as you think you do. And as you do it more and more, you're going to get better and better. my assistant pulled up. videos that I did about six years ago. Good God, they were awful. I was like, oh, burn those. She's like, oh no, this is gold. This is a gem. Where I looked like I was filming an ISIS commercial. it was this background. No one thought that, Gary. I'm sure no one. I know, but I did. It was like this beige wall behind me. I had no depth. to it whatsoever. It was just plain and it was me just talking and I was monotone and I was like blah blah and it was like a six minute video and I actually had hair at that time but it was all and I'm like and yet I had the courage to keep doing it and going okay I'm gonna do another one and get a little bit better. early adopter six years ago. and I didn't even think I was an early adopter at that time I was like bunch of people are doing this, but I want to because people encouraged me to do this when I started my business. It took me about four or five years after I started my business to actually start doing them. it's just, yeah, it's so if you have somebody who is really stuck on, I hate what I look like. I hate what I sound like, but they know that the content that they're going to be providing is solid, absolutely solid. Is there anything that you do to get them out of their head to push that record button to get it actually going? Yeah, totally. I mean, I think for my clients, the fact that I'm showing up and we're going to do the thing helps, right? Like I don't, I don't leave it to my clients' devices to just record the video on their own. think there's some inherent pressure there of like, ⁓ I hired somebody and you know, like I need to do it. So I think that there's, there's definitely that energy. But I would say, I will say doing the work ahead of time of actually thinking about the way that you're going to communicate your message is incredibly important, right? Dive a little bit more into that. Yes. So in my opinion, preparation really does build confidence, right? Because I think that a lot of attorneys want to be clever and not necessarily clear, right? ⁓ my God, Clear over clever any day of the week. so I think when you're able to go, you know, basic video on, you know, how I would help someone navigate a divorce, like what you need to know, it would be very, it should be very important for that attorney to sit down and go, okay, how would I walk a seven year old through this? How do I think about just being super clear? And I just think that that clarity actually, it just brings people, like it makes people more confident because a lot of attorneys are, they're good at their craft, right? But it doesn't necessarily mean you're a great communicator of what you do. And so I think that that really builds a lot of confidence. yeah, I mean, I think that those things have really helped. And I think it just helps that. and working with people, need a team. You can't just do it on your own, in my opinion. And so I think that having to show up for a team also motivates people. When you say team, what type of people would be on the team? So there's different levels, right? Depending on where you're at in your business, I would say at minimum, you really need an assistant to just help. So once you've pressed record and... it's done, like they can edit it, they can come up with a good thumbnail, they can help you with all the uploading and stuff like that, like the post-production stuff. Also, if your assistant can lead or make you do a brainstorming session about what you guys are gonna talk about, how to come up with some scripting where you can do several videos, film several videos at once, I think that that is really, really helpful in terms of being consistent. But what I will say too about team is I would hire. So if you're thinking about doing YouTube, I would hire a thumbnail designer. If the budget, depending on what your budget is, I would hire a thumbnail designer before I would actually hire a video editor because thumbnails are just that important on YouTube. And this is something that most attorneys for most actually creators, it's just an afterthought, right? I'm to just do the video. I'm going to focus on the content and that attorneys, right? I'm going to focus on the content and then everything else will fall into place. No. It just doesn't, it doesn't work like that because platforms like YouTube, YouTube is actually more of a packaging platform than a video platform. Right. And so when I say package, I'm talking about the thumbnail. I'm talking about that first 30 seconds and the title. And so, you know, depending on where your budget's at or the skillset of your assistant, I would highly recommend getting a thumbnail designer because that's what makes people click on the video in the first place. Right. Cause if they don't click, nobody sees it. Nobody sees it. Your information is just sitting in a drawer. It's sitting in a drawer. And the challenge with that, you know, in the beginning, it's like, oh gosh, it's good that no one's watching because you're, going to get better. Like it's not even in a bad way. It's just like, thank God that nobody came to that webinar because oh man, you know, or whatever it is in the best way possible. mean, I'm literally talking to myself because I've been there, but you don't get data too. Like if people aren't listening on YouTube, there's all this great data that you can get to learn and to just grow. Yeah. Which is why you got into business because you're like with video, cause you're like, I'm a data queen. love data, data, data. And if there is no data, like, come on people. I need data to help. It's helpful. You had touched on a really powerful word, which I'd like you to go a little bit deeper on, which is consistency. How important is consistency with videos and how does somebody get consistent with it? And what does consistency look like in your viewpoint? Totally. And so what I will say is I focus mostly on YouTube. I'm not an expert of Instagram and LinkedIn and all the platforms. Like I really hyper-focus on YouTube. My recommendation for most clients is doing one weekly upload a week. yeah, so How do I be consistent if you're thinking about one video a week? I mean, think the biggest needle moving hack is scheduling a monthly or a bimonthly recording where you're filming everything at the same time. ⁓ yeah, yep. So even today, I filmed a podcast right before this, right? I'm like, okay, I got the room set, everything. Okay, so we're gonna do a couple today, right? Yep. just energetically, it's so helpful. And then just like picking that consistent time of month. Maybe it's on a Friday morning where you don't have as many meetings and figuring out when is my energy the best. For most people, it's going to be in the morning before the day has, you know, gotten away from you. So I think that that it's incredibly, consistency is really important, but it's like why it's helpful is you put it, you put your videos out there and then you start to get feedback and you can augment and change things. think doing the same thing over and over and expecting different like different results is like insane, right? So we have to we have to grow and we have to change but I would say yeah, just really getting that solid recording session and then having an assistant that helps you is very important. And I think that such is a stress reliever because if you've got if you record four videos all at once you got a month you're done like You're finished. So you don't have to think about it because I think one of the biggest mistakes that a lot of attorneys make with content, whether it's video or other content is that they write or do the videos once a week. So they have the consistency of week, but that is so stressful because all of a we get inundated with a bunch of work. What's the first thing we're going to stop? And that becomes the The uncomfortable task. Yes. And then I'm not consistent. And then what happens when you're not consistent? You don't get the right data. You're not making the right decisions. The algorithm doesn't like you anymore. People are showing up and going, where's her video? She used to post every Wednesday. Now I don't see it. ⁓ she must not be doing this anymore. And you're like, no, no, no, no, no. I just got busy. People don't care about you getting busy. They want to know that you're going to show up consistently and add value to them with your content, whether it's educational, it's entertaining, something that's going to be like, okay. But I love that idea of the monthly, let's get together with our assistant who understands the data and understands the post-production, pre-production, write the scripts beforehand, da da da da da, all that. Bullet points, like doesn't need to be word for word. And then I, go ahead. No, go ahead. No, what I would say too is along with the packaging, having a great thumbnail and title is important to do in the pre-production, meaning even before. Like the creators that are doing, are creating videos at the highest level on YouTube, they will not record a video until the thumbnail is done. Whoa, hold on. They don't do this thumbnail after they do it before and. The, what did you call it? The title. Title. They're thinking about the title, like that package, right? The title, the thumbnail, and that first 30 seconds. So they don't, so because they understand that this is how you win on YouTube, right? Obviously you need to be a good communicator and all that good stuff, but like this is really how people start to find you and are interested in clicking on your videos. So I just can't. express that enough. I will also say, I heard on a podcast this communicator was talking about with public speaking and communication in general, you really want to focus on design versus delivery, right? And so I think with the scripting, really thinking about, how can I package this video? Like, is it going to be in today's video, we're going to go over seven things that you need to know or... or it's gonna be a pros and cons video. Like there's just different ways that in that first 30 seconds, you can tell the viewer this is what's gonna happen and then you can actually deliver. ⁓ pre-production is very, very important. And honestly, I mean, I have some clients that only do a recording session every other month, because they just have built up the stamina and then they're like, okay, we're gonna shoot eight at a time. And I like, I like. packaging the, or not packaging, doing them, recording them in a session because you start to get into flow. You're like, and then you can bang them out. You have everything, lights, microphone is good. You're like, okay. And then it's not, okay, let's put everything down. on with my day, come back. Okay, got to set it up. Saves so much time. I mean, so much time. It always aggravates me when my assistant is like, I don't have a video for tomorrow. And I'm like, oh, come on. Like I didn't do a bit. Like, and it's always on me. mean, I'm my worst enemy. um, but I, I love like, if you're listening to this title thumbnail, first 30 seconds, focusing on that first and foremost that, and I think that that is brilliant advice, even for Instagram, even for LinkedIn, even for, I hate to TikTok. It is, it is that pre-production, that also goes to increasing their confidence too. Right? you said preparation allows you to become more confident, which you need that confidence when you hit that record button. You've got to like, okay, here's the time to go, you know, it's go time. Do you subscribe to Teleprompter? Or no teleprompter? Such a good question, Gary. And I will say that my perspective has recently changed on this. It's recently shifted. traditional teleprompter. Okay. there's, we are, I am talking to the small to medium law firm right now. Like not like super corporate, super like, you know, high video production quality and then that type of realm. Yes, I think. you know, a regular teleprompter is very important. Elgato actually has a prompter that is effectively just a screen. It just duplicates your screen. And so you can basically just put a Google doc in front of that with bullet points. And so I'm actually a fan of using that. Typically people will use teleprompters that are word for word. I just think that that is not sustainable for most people. Why so? That's not sustainable for most people because that's a lot of scripting. Got it. That's a lot of scripting. I mean, people say, OK, you can use AI. Theoretically, yes, but most people are not proficient at using AI. So like garbage in, garbage out. And the thing is, a lot of my clients, they're highly specialized and their areas are nuanced. And you can't just explain a topic in three minutes. Like you really can't, right? And you shouldn't. Right. And so, so a lot of their videos can be six, seven, eight, nine, 10, 15 minutes, which seems like, ⁓ my gosh, it's such a long time. mean, but they're building so much trust with their clients as they're watching it. But yeah, I just think that that becomes a lot of scripting. And so most people are able to, what I recommend is doing your intro that first 30 to 60 seconds, like word for word. Got it. Okay. And then have bullet points. Do not go off on your own land. Like we're still, okay. We're sticking to the bullets here. And then also have a word for word outro where you're like, okay, well now you know more about this. Like check out this video. Got it. Type of thing. Or, you know, book a call with me in the link below. So yeah, I am a fan of the Elgato teleprompters because it just allows you to see bullet points. But yeah, it's not necessary. It's not, it really just depends on, I've seen clients go either way. They ultimately. It ultimately, the last thing I was like, it ultimately what I've seen if they've got their bullet points and the scripts, sometimes the shoots can go faster, which makes it better for them. Because you know, what I have found is it all depends on the individual and it has nothing to do with intelligence because I've used teleprompters for some of my clients and I'm like, what are you doing? Because they're doing one of these. And so we want to make sure that we got, and you're like, yeah, what are you doing? You sound monotone. You sound like you're reading. Your eyes are going back and forth. I just fell asleep listening to you. ⁓ my God, exactly. And I'm like, and so I'm like, okay, let's just riff off of it. And they're clean. They're straight to it. And then I have others that it's like, no, no, no, no, no, no. I just want bullet points that we put bullet and they go off on tangents and they're like, all over and then the post-production is so much work because it's just trying to cobble crap together and then you give them a teleprompter and they're brilliant and they get it right the first time they're like boom you know and it's like so you know anybody who's listening try both and see what works for you because you know what works for somebody else may work for you and vice versa you got to try them out you know to see but If you could just riff and just speak super fantastic, that's great. But if you're like me, who's got really bad ADD, I've got to have things scripted. Otherwise I'm talking about, you know, the Denver Broncos and how great they were. And that has nothing to do with networking, you know? And it's like, what are you doing? Like, I'm like, oh, it just reminded me. I was at an event and you're like, really? Yeah. Keep it tight. Keep it tight. speaking of keeping it tight, what do you reckon for YouTube lengthwise? Is there a certain thing because like on TikTok and Instagram, they want them short, like real short to the point. But I know some people on YouTube say short good. It also transfers over. can, you can put them on the different mediums, but then others are like, I do 15 minute videos every single time and they get a killing on it. Like lots of views, lots of comments, a lot of engagement. there a sweet spot within that? Yeah, it's a really good question because I think before answering, I always like to take a step back with a question like that because it's important to identify how you make your money, right? Yeah. So a lot of people... that want to create and that do create short form content on like a YouTube, they're creators. That's their business, right? Got it. Meaning YouTube pays them or brands pay them to get views basically, right? That's their business model, okay? So most of the people that I work with, that you work with, the attorneys that are listening to this podcast, they're business owners. Yeah. That's how they make their money. Right. And this is just an incredibly important distinction, right? Because if you're a business owner, it's less about the amount of views and it's more about how much of the video did they watch? Right. And that's retention, right? Cause that's actually one of the key analytics or one of the key metrics that YouTube really looks at. Like how long do people watch? Right. I would much rather, you know, a few, I would much rather one of my clients get a few hundred views. maybe 100, maybe even 200 views where people watch most of the video, more than 50%, then like 15,000 where they watch 30 seconds, right? So I think that's like the first part of my answer. And I would say I am a fan of just going longer on videos. Really? Cause there's going to be less competition honestly with longer. I I just think there's such a space even right now for video podcasting. mean, it's like blowing up and I mean, people are really wanting clients are really needing lots of to hear a lot of content before they're choosing you. Right. As a, as a, as an attorney. I think that I, you need to make the video concise and that you don't want to be like going on and on and tangential, but. I think that a lot of the people that I work with, it takes a while. It's a nuanced topic. I wouldn't most, so to answer your question though, but most of my clients are doing videos that are north of six or seven, eight minutes. Wow. Okay. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Go longer. I love how you differentiated, you know, a quote unquote influencer with the business. Yeah. It's just different. It is and yet we're put the the influencers are just smashing us in the face that we go we need to do what they're doing. Right. Where you're like, no, you don't. You're not going to be making money off of your YouTube channel. So why are you doing the same things that they're doing? You need to be doing it this way so that people can understand what the hell is up in your head. And then they pay you $800 an hour. because they are confident that you will be able to get them whatever that they need, you know, and they're willing to pay that, type of money as opposed to, ⁓ I see this person jumping around and making a bunch of noise for 30 seconds. And it's like, yeah, it's entertaining, but is that what I want for my, my lawyer? Like maybe like, but I think most, most people who are utilizing attorneys are not that. that way. They're like, I want somebody who is going to be extremely competent that's going to help me out with my legal work. And another way to even consider podcasting is because what's so important for attorneys is building out their referral networks, right? So even having a podcast that's relevant to their colleagues is actually a really interesting thing. That's not necessarily going to be a client facing where maybe I'm, you know, attorney has a client or a tax expert expert on and they're going to go deep and you know, a client facing version of that might be, talked to a tax expert so you don't have to type of thing. But that's a, in my opinion, easy way to just have a conversation. You don't have to be as scripted and as prepared, but yeah. love that. Okay. So you started out with saying data. If you were talking to an attorney right now on this, what data? do you recommend that they start tracking to understand is this working, is it not working? What metrics should they be looking at? Well, so the first thing I would say is you really want to invest in video for about a year before you can get consistent information. That's about what I would say. You can absolutely look at data prior to that. But I think data, like simple data, Like am I actually making my recording sessions happen, right? Yeah. Like I said, I was gonna do it on tomorrow. Did I do it? Yeah. Right? Yeah. I think the biggest, the most important metric on YouTube, and I've alluded to this, is retention time. And so that's basically the amount of time that people watch. And what's cool about... YouTube is what it'll actually do is it'll pull videos that you have above average retention time and below average. And so those are great videos to absorb and study because you'll start to see themes, right? Like on the above retention time, like you'll say, ⁓ okay, well, I just like really got to the point faster or it was super clear what the video was going to be about. was, you know, there was some credibility present and then So yeah, think that those are really like that is big. Click through rate is big too with like obviously thumbnails. But I would say if you're starting out, all of the data stuff is gonna come a little bit later. Got it, got it. Consistency. Yeah, their main focus should be hit the record button. And even like the data of, okay, so how all in, how much time did this recording session take? How much energy did this take from me? Okay. And then tracking that over time, I think that that's really important data because ideally it's getting easier for you and you're able to offload more so you can keep that flywheel going and make it sustainable. It's so true. You know, one thing that I always recommend is you got a process to shoot a video. Make sure that you document that process. Yes. because you're going to have these days where you're to go, ⁓ I forgot to turn on my mic. ⁓ I just did this video and I've got no sound, but it allows you to go into just, I'm ready. I'm going. Can I say something about that, Gary? I would highly recommend if people can to just create your setup and then don't touch anything. ⁓ yeah. Like at your desk. literally, I mean, what I've been telling people is just when you upgrade your iPhone, just leave that iPhone at your desk and have that be your webcam or have that be what you're recording on. So you have your light, you have everything. So you don't have to feel like there's that inertia of, we got to get everything set up. investing like a thousand, $2,000 in just like a really great desk setup could be pivotal for your business. Oh, I love this. Yeah. God, Sarah, this has just been... Amazing. mean, absolutely amazing. And key points on this for those that are listening, make sure you use a teleprompter. She's a huge fan. it. No, I'm kidding. But look at the data and to go back to the beginning, 63 % of individuals are more likely to buy from people who have a personal brand. And there's a big barrier of entry, mostly between our ears. That's the barrier of entry to get into this. But Knowing that, knowing that a lot of people don't do it should make you excited about getting in there and making sure that you're consistent, making sure that you are clear with your messaging out there. know, rehearse, be prepared, make sure your thumbnail, your title and the first 30 seconds do that before you record. Have an assistant who can help you with pre and post production. You need to use Chat GPT great length, six to seven minutes, but see what works for you. And when you're looking at the analytics, try to first and foremost, focus in on the retention and also the click through and everything else will come through. I freaking love this. Thank you. I this has been so amazing. Like, so if somebody wants to get ahold of you, I'm actually putting all of your contact information in the show notes. So look at the show notes, hire her. Don't be a fucking moron, hire her because you can see she understands it inside and out. And that's the type of professionals you want to have in your corner. Don't mess around, get it done, have somebody professional, at least to launch this, to get it rolling. And you will thank yourself. Your future person will thank you for all the business that's going to come in. But if you lean into it, you're going to get better and you're going to get better. and it's going to suck to begin with and that's okay. Hire Sarah so it doesn't suck as much to begin with, you know. That's what you should be doing. So thank you so much for your time. I mean, so valuable. I love this. So I could actually, you're going to come on again. I'm just going to, I'm going to. Because I'm like, I got so many other questions. Oh yeah. I know. Like let's discuss all the things. And for somebody who has been doing this for six years, ⁓ I think I know it all. And I proved myself wrong today. I don't know it fucking all. Like I'm like, there's a good nugget. Hence the reason why people need to use you because you're like the best. So thank you. Thanks, Gary. Thank you. So, and again, I hope you come on again. Okay. I will. All right. Talk soon. Okay. That's it for today's episode of Un-Fuck Your Legal Marketing. If you got a spark of inspiration, learned something new, or at least got a good laugh, make sure to follow, rate, and share this with someone who needs to hear it. Thanks for hanging out with me, and remember, the best marketing is the one that actually sounds like you. See you next time.