Latest / The Ian Furness Show / Best of Ian Furness 10/5

Transcript

Best of Ian Furness 10/5 · The Ian Furness Show

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Your home for the 12th man in the NFL proudly
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: presents Hardcore Football with Hugh Millen.
• 0:08
  Speaker 2: Brought to you by Hunt Services. Get on the horn
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: and call Hunt.
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Now here's Hugh with Ian Furness on Sports Radio 93.3 KJR-FM.
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: Hardcore football, Hugh Millen joins us right now, as he
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: does every Monday, and we switch things up. During the
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: baseball season, we were still talking about the local Major
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: League Baseball team, and so we had Hugh on for
• 0:29
  Speaker 2: a couple segments in the noon hour, and as always
• 0:31
  Speaker 2: is the case, I never had enough time. This is
• 0:34
  Speaker 2: what we've been doing for a while, using the 1
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: o'clock hour for hardcore football. We've been doing that for
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: 18 years or so, since I took over this time slot.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: Of course, that time slot, Hugh, as you well know,
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: it's been 1-3, it's been 12-3, then it was 1-3,
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: now it's back to 12-3. So we're doing Hugh Millen
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: 1-2 on Mondays because I can't get enough and neither
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: can Seahawks fans. How are you, my friend?
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: I'm doing great, yeah. And with Graz prior to you,
• 0:57
  Speaker 3: I think this hour, I think we used to knock
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: out an hour.
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: So, um, yeah, there's a lot to discuss.
• 1:04
  Speaker 2: I'll never forget. I barely had, you know, knew you
• 1:07
  Speaker 2: just briefly been here kind of as the new guy, the, uh, FNG, uh, here.
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: And when I took over that, that afternoon slot, I
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: took over that afternoon slot. My friend, Hugh Millen says,
• 1:16
  Speaker 2: he calls me one day and he says, Ian, you know,
• 1:18
  Speaker 2: I've been doing this hardcore football thing with, with draws
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: for years. And I don't, you may not want to
• 1:23
  Speaker 2: do it. If you don't, that's fine. I, but I,
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: if you want to, I'm, I'm there for you. I'd
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: love to do it. And I said, Hugh, My God,
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: the first thing I thought of when we took over
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: that time slot in the middays, now 18 years ago,
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: I thought, yeah, let's go. I got to do hardcore
• 1:35
  Speaker 2: football with Hugh Millen because I listened to it anyway.
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: I was listening.
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: I was loving it. So I've appreciated you doing this
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: all these years with me.
• 1:40
  Speaker 3: Well, I think I was just planning for my season,
• 1:42
  Speaker 3: just wanting kind of to know if we're on or off,
• 1:45
  Speaker 3: but without trying to push myself on.
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: No. Just wanting to know.
• 1:50
  Speaker 4: No.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: I was like, hey, you're willing to do it.
• 1:53
  Speaker 3: Let's go.
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: We've been doing it ever since. It's been a ton
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: of fun and great feedback. I want to get to
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: the Seahawks in a second. I need to ask you
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: a question. I brought this up in the first hour.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: And you've got a unique perspective. Your sons play college football.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: You've been around big programs with them, Oregon, Florida, and others.
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: And I heard somebody say this weekend, and this isn't
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: the first time I've heard this, and it won't be
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: the last, and it's not like it's a groundbreaking statement
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: made by people, but we're hearing it.
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: More and more.
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: And what I'm hearing is the following. it's called donor fatigue.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: And what I mean by that is this, if you're
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: donating to a college program and you, and most of
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: the time it's for like a, like you're given NIL
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: money and it might go to like a lineman or what,
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: but we know most of the time it goes to,
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: you know, a skill player or what have you. If
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: you're not getting a return on the investment, And I'm
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: not going to pick on DeMond because it's too easy.
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, he's not the only one. I'll look at Cal.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: I think Cal's got that same situation going on right
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: now with JKS. They spent $ 3 million, and he's going
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: to get benched. He got hurt the other night, but
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: he's going to get benched anyway. What do you say
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: to people? Because you're a college guy. You love college football,
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: and yet fans are being asked to spend this money,
• 3:09
  Speaker 2: and yet if you don't see a return on the investment—
• 3:12
  Speaker 2: then what do you do? Like in the NFL, you're
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: paying for tickets. You're kind of doing your part by
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: paying for tickets, right? In college, you're being asked now
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: to pay for a player and pay for your tickets
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: and your parking and your seat licensing and all that
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: stuff all across the country. What do you think about
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: where we're at with that stuff right now? Because frankly,
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: a lot of places you're paying for these guys and
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: it just isn't working.
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: Well, and I think that really what the whole entire
• 3:38
  Speaker 3: structure of college football is, uh, at the top is
• 3:43
  Speaker 3: how bad do you want it? And maybe you have
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: a whale like at Oklahoma state or Oregon. Um, I
• 3:50
  Speaker 3: think Mark Cuban at Indiana, uh, you know, maybe Casey
• 3:54
  Speaker 3: Wasserman at UCLA. Now, you know, some whales are bigger
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: than others, but by definition, a whale is really big, right? Uh,
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: then other schools may not have a whale, but then
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: everybody contributes. I don't know who's the primary donator at
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: Ohio state, but, you know, they have reportedly the highest, uh,
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: income for their roster. And so it, it, before, even
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: prior to the NIL era, think of how much the
• 4:24
  Speaker 3: high dollar donors were asked to give for facilities or this,
• 4:28
  Speaker 3: you know, this or that. And that was when players, uh,
• 4:32
  Speaker 3: the terms full ride scholarship is actually, if you delve
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: into it is, is, is kind of either laughable or,
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: or you know, a tragedy because, you know, the NCAA,
• 4:45
  Speaker 3: I know a lot of football dads at the University
• 4:48
  Speaker 3: of Washington from around my kid's era and other schools,
• 4:52
  Speaker 3: like you said, Oregon, Florida, places you'd think you'd have
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: money and the scholarship itself. I remember like going through
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: the budget and going, my kid has less than $ 200
• 5:03
  Speaker 3: cash at the end of the month or for the
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: entire month.
• 5:06
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: For the entire month.
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: Beyond, His actual needed expenses.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: That's for all spending. And I'm like, what a joke.
• 5:16
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: And so, you know, I talked to these dads and yeah,
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: we all subsidize our kid.
• 5:20
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: You know, what about, you know, a kid from a
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: disadvantaged family who doesn't have a stable income and they
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: can't give that money. and yet those players were, you know,
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: supposedly on full ride scholarship, eating Tom top ramen, you know,
• 5:37
  Speaker 3: the last nine days of the month just to make
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: it to the first. So, so the, the situation was
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: a joke now. Um, uh, and I digress cause that's
• 5:45
  Speaker 3: not really your question, but I think we all understand
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: that the players needed to get more, right. Uh, you
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: could argue about how much more and, and, and, and
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: there's some very, uh, you know, sound arguments on a
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: lot of places, but, Now, you're told, look, if you
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: want to compete with Ohio State in the Big Ten
• 6:06
  Speaker 3: or Oregon or what have you, you're going to have
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: to donate because now, on top of everything else you
• 6:12
  Speaker 3: were given, we got to find a $ 25 million for
• 6:17
  Speaker 3: the payroll. Well, some of that obviously is coming out
• 6:20
  Speaker 3: of the house settlement and it's paid by the athletic department,
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: but then they're still short that money.
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 6:29
  Speaker 3: They still they're still saying, hey, well, all those reasons
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: we were asking you to give before you still need
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: to give. So so I get it. And then, you know,
• 6:40
  Speaker 3: if you're not winning or your your players and playing
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: well and you feel kind of like you're you're like
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: a mini owner in the NFL.
• 6:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: Like you want to call the coach and go, wait
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: a minute. Why did we spend a first-round draft pick
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: on him? Why did we re-up this guy? He's not playing,
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: so he's not worth what we're paying him. And so
• 7:01
  Speaker 3: I think it's real, and I think there's going to
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: be a lot of disillusioned fan bases. They're going to
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: start to lose, and then they're going to be presented with,
• 7:11
  Speaker 3: you know, the answer to start winning more is you've
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: got to give more so we can have a higher payroll.
• 7:17
  Speaker 2: That's what you hear now as a fan. That's what
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: you hear.
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: An alum, yeah. Right?
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: I want to get to CX, but I'm fascinated by this,
• 7:26
  Speaker 2: and I want to get your perspective on it, Hugh,
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: because you mentioned facilities. Back when I was doing stuff
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: and helping fundraise and hosting different things for Wazoo, it's like,
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: here's what we did. It's like, yeah, we're donating this,
• 7:40
  Speaker 2: and part of it's for the you know, the student
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: athlete scholarship fund and all that to provide it. But
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: the other thing is we're helping build facilities, right? As
• 7:48
  Speaker 2: a donor, you're helping build facilities. Well, when you're helping
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: build a facility, there's something tangible. Hell, half the time,
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: like you could have a meeting room with your name
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: on it, whatever. Well, now you're just giving money to
• 7:58
  Speaker 2: player X. Well, if player X isn't very good, what's
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: your return on investment? And you just said it well.
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: you kind of have like an ownership stake in this.
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: You feel like you should be calling the coach going, Hey,
• 8:08
  Speaker 2: I gave you all this money. What's, what's going on here.
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: Like that's a, that's a lot of pressure on a
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: lot of people, especially the young people.
• 8:14
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: And I, I think it's, it's just a case. You
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: mentioned the term donor fatigue. You've felt like you were
• 8:25
  Speaker 3: already given as much as you could before.
• 8:28
  Speaker 4: Yep.
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: And now it's, it's, it's, it's a new thing. Well, now,
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: now let's say you're at Alabama. What was your currency then? Well,
• 8:37
  Speaker 3: it was Nick Saban's expertise. You know, you're, you're, everybody's paying,
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: you know, the Supreme court in the Austin case said
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: it's horizontal price fixing. And, and it's, it runs afoul
• 8:49
  Speaker 3: of antitrust law. And, and so, you know, just a
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: simple per se examination, you say clearly this is horizontal
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: price fixing, right? If you want to, call the players labor,
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: which the Supreme Court did. Now, if you want to
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: call them student athletes and then argue some of the
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: old amateurism objectives and how it's distinguished from pro football,
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: the idea being that the consumer, meaning the fan, has
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: to distinguish the product between the NFL and college football.
• 9:18
  Speaker 3: And if the consumer thinks that the players are being paid,
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: then there's no distinction. And so college football loses its
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: competitive edge. That's the thinking that you had coming out
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: of the Board of Regents in Oklahoma and Georgia back
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: in 1984. That's 40-year-old thinking. Now it's no, no, no, no, no.
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: The Supreme Court doesn't want to hear about the amateurism rule.
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: And by the way, not a liberal court, a court
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: that overturned Roe versus Wade, right? And would be inclined
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: to think about the little guy and be pro-player. A
• 9:50
  Speaker 3: very conservative court voted 9-0 against the Supreme Court. And so, um, and,
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: and what they're saying is, you know, stop with this
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: amateurism excuse. You're, you're horizontal price fixing. You're making, you know,
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: upward upwards of, you know, nine, 10 billion a year
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: and the, and you're suppressing the wages of the labor.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: Who's the labor, the players. And so, you know, so legally,
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: you know, you, you're just saying, this entire scaffolding of
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: the compensation for players runs contrary to the antitrust law. So, okay,
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: what's the next step? They deserve part of the pie.
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: And until there is collective bargaining, that's why we have
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: all these, it seems like the Wild West, because the
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: courts have said they got to get paid, but then
• 10:41
  Speaker 3: where's the structure of how they get paid? And where
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: does the fan sit? If the fan sits there, there's
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: a lot of wonderful details generous donors, you know, certainly
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: at Wazoo, uh, the, the Washington, you know, the, the
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: Ron Crockett's, the Neil Dempsey's, the, uh, Don Bernard's, you know, the,
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: the Wayne Gittinger's, you know, like, like the ones that are,
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: you know, they're just all, you know, Rick Redden before
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: he passed, like all these, these donors that, and, and
• 11:06
  Speaker 3: I apologize, you know, there's certainly many that I left out.
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: I can't sit there and list them all, but, but
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: you know, the, these guys, wait a minute, I've been
• 11:13
  Speaker 3: given millions for years and now we need what? Like,
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: We're not going to be competitive. We're just going to
• 11:19
  Speaker 3: be all Sarans in the Big Ten. Right.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: That's the problem here. That's the issue. That's the issue
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: right now. All those guys you talked about, like they've been,
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: like I just walked by, we do the hockey broadcast
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: now in the Big Ten studios. And so I'm there
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: a lot. I'm walking through, you know, I've walked through
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: the athletic facilities for a while. All these buildings have
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: names that you just mentioned on them. They've all helped
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: build all these things up, right? All these different places,
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: the Dempsey Center and all those places, right? And it's like, no, okay,
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: so you want us to give X for the football team, great.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: But you just lost to USC. You lost to Minnesota
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: at home. And I'm using Washington because it's local. I'm
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: honest to God, I'm trying not to pick on them.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: But that's the point. Like, you're going to have to
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: go back into your pockets again. What's the return on
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: the investments? Like, that's a hard thing to justify.
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: Trust me. That message is going to be, and it's
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: not going to be unique to Washington. Sorry to interrupt you.
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: Well, your son played with D.J. Ligerway, right? Like, I'm
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: sure that happened down in Florida.
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: Well, he's at Baylor, yeah.
• 12:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, he's at Baylor now, but yeah, right?
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and so it'll happen at a slightly smaller scale
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: at Washington State and the new Pac-12, right?
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah.
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: But, okay, let's say Washington, pick a number. let's say
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: they go, I don't know, can they go eight and four?
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: Let's just say eight and four. Let's just say seven
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: and five. Seven and five, okay.
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: Okay, and so let's say they go to a bowl game,
• 12:47
  Speaker 3: kind of a growingly less impactful bowl game because they're
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: not in the playoff, right?
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 12:55
  Speaker 3: And so you're seven and five now. what's the message
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: going to be? I know you didn't like seven, five
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: and you're, you're, you're, you don't have high enthusiasm for
• 13:05
  Speaker 3: the football team, but instead of giving less, you need
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: to give more or be, or Washington will be continued
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: to be more irrelevant. That's just prospectively the message.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: And you know, there are actually some truth to it,
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: but how does that, how does that land on you
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: emotionally when you're, Not really thrilled with the 7-5. You've
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: gone through the debacle with DeMond. You don't know if
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: the head coach– you're reading reports the coach wants the
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: Michigan job. He wants the Florida job. You don't know
• 13:39
  Speaker 3: if the coach is committed. You've got your angst regarding
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: the quarterback's annex. And then now, okay, to have a
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: better record, give more money.
• 13:53
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: That's the quandary you're in right now in college football.
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: And like I said, it's not just- How bad do
• 13:58
  Speaker 2: you want it? Hugh, I was mad. I think a
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: lot of, I'll just use our school to wrap this
• 14:04
  Speaker 2: up because we got to get to the Seahawks in
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: a minute. But if you remember, Cam Ward was one
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: of the first NIL guys.
• 14:11
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: And comes in from Incarnate Word. And so the first
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: year he's there, they end up going- Seven and six,
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: four and five in the conference. And I remember thinking
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: to myself, God, we're paying this guy 150,000. Like it
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: is all in. That was like a car, condo, travel
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: for his parents. It wasn't 150 cash. Like that just, that's,
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: that wasn't worth it. Next year, he's making a little
• 14:36
  Speaker 2: bit more. They go five and seven. He transfers to Miami,
• 14:38
  Speaker 2: makes a ton of money and obviously has great success there.
• 14:41
  Speaker 2: But you're thinking, wow. The return on investment, $ 100, 000. So
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: it doesn't matter if it's $ 100, 000 or $ 10 million. What's
• 14:47
  Speaker 2: your return on the investment if you're like all those
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: donors you talked to? It's an interesting world we're in
• 14:52
  Speaker 2: right now. I bring it up because you look what
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: happens in Cal right now. Tosh Ploy is going through
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: that with JKS, his quarterback, at $ 3 million, I think.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: And they're not good. So it's just a hard place
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: to be in as a college football fan, as someone
• 15:06
  Speaker 2: being asked to donate. You're being told you're a bad
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: fan if you don't write checks for these players. as
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: opposed to writing ones for facilities. It's just, it's a
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: weird spot we're in right now.
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: Well, and look at, okay, Miami, Ty Simpson declares for
• 15:20
  Speaker 3: the draft. He's going to leave Alabama.
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: He immediately gets hit up by Miami, you know, starting
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: in about 4 million. And then there's a bidding war
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: between Miami and Oregon. And at some point, um, the, uh, Oregon, uh,
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: they're told, well, listen, there's a good chance he's going
• 15:42
  Speaker 3: to be a first-rounder. Now, I have to include the
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: word reportedly because I don't know how the law works.
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: If I assert something, I don't want to get a
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: call from anybody, right? So just reportedly. So I'm giving
• 16:00
  Speaker 3: myself an asterisk. Does that make sense? Yes. And so now, reportedly,
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: there's going to be a difference. Whatever difference... If Ty
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: Simpson comes to Oregon and he plays poorly, then somebody
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: at Oregon is going to match the difference between what
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: they would have made, what Ty Simpson would have made
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: as a first-rounder and what he did make as a third-
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: or fourth-rounder in this hypothetical world. So you're going to
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: take the finance because, well, now Miami gets more involved. Finally,
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: Miami says... Hey, we'll give you a 6 million and
• 16:36
  Speaker 3: guarantee you a $ 9 million offensive line. And, you know,
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: and yet Ty Simpson still, he goes to the draft and, uh,
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: you know, he, he made his money and, and, and,
• 16:47
  Speaker 3: and it may work out, may, may not, but look
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: at where Miami's at right now. They, they have, they, they,
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: they got Duke's quarterback, man. So prior to that, they
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: got Georgia's quarterback, the Tom Petty looking guy, right. He
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: was with the Cardinals now. Um, and then they had
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: Cam Ward. So, So Miami is going to be a
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: player that, you know, at all the, the most experienced guys.
• 17:10
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: And look at Oregon, you know, they had, you know,
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: Bo Nix was a transfer. Um, Anthony Brown after Justin Herbert,
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: last time they've had a homegrown guy was Justin Herbert. Um,
• 17:22
  Speaker 3: and you know, then they had, uh, Oh, gosh, who's
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: the guy with the Cleveland Browns? Came from Oklahoma, Dylan Gabriel.
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: Dylan Gabriel, yeah.
• 17:29
  Speaker 3: Right? And then now you've got Dante Moore. So programs
• 17:35
  Speaker 3: like Oregon and Miami, they don't even care who they
• 17:37
  Speaker 3: recruit out of high school at quarterback. Nope. They just
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: sit back and say, who's the best experienced quarterback? And
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: we'll go through, you know, in 2026, I'll say $ 6 million.
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: Two years from now, it might be $ 10 million. You know,
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: whatever the number, we know what's going on.
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: And so now it's like, do you want to compete
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: with them? If you're Florida State, if you want to
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: compete with Miami, you better give. You want to compete
• 18:06
  Speaker 3: with Oregon, you better give. You may want to, but
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: you may not be able to. All right, we've got
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: to wrap it up. Let's do a good conversation.
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: I love having you on, buddy. We can go down
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: different roads sometimes, but we've got to get to a
• 18:17
  Speaker 2: game that featured 30 penalties, 280 yards and penalty yards
• 18:24
  Speaker 2: between the two teams, multiple turnovers. But, Hugh, it's a
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: bottom-line business, and the Seattle Seahawks are 3-1. We'll do
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: some hardcore football with Hugh Millen coming up next. Hi,
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: Hugh Millen joins us on Hardcore Football. Let's get to it, Hugh.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: Lots to get to. I want to get to the
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: last sack. We'll do that in the next segment. Let
• 18:41
  Speaker 2: me start first, because I think it brings up a
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: different point, too, and that's blitzing, not blitzing. You're going
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: against a team this week in San Francisco that has
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: not giving up a sack this season in four games.
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: My God. But can I just, I want to go
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: down this road just for a second. First of all,
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: real fast, have you ever seen a game in which, well,
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: it historically hasn't happened in like 45 years, an interception
• 19:03
  Speaker 2: to start the game and then an interception on the
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: next play? Like, what the hell?
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: Well, if it hasn't happened in 40 years, yeah, I
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: was like 30 when it happened. It's nuts, huh? No,
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: I don't remember that.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: Give me your– let me just– because I asked it
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: almost rhetorically, but let me see this. Sam Darnold, 13
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: for 22, 168 yards, two touchdowns, one reception. JSN, five receptions.
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: Shahid, one. Kup, one.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: And Torrey Horton, one for the touchdown. Your quarterback eyes,
• 19:36
  Speaker 2: in a hardcore way, can you tell me what you're
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: seeing from Sam Darnold the last two weeks? The first
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: week doesn't matter. He only played a couple plays. So
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: the last two weeks, what are you seeing from Sam Darnold? Well,
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: in each game, he's had one very bad interception. The
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: one at Washington, obviously, was a pick six. Now, the
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: people around him weren't doing their job, and we talked
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: about that last week. And then there's no excuse for
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: how the game started and that first interception. And it's
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: an indicator of where Seattle had their priorities. because they
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: were trying to go play action and hit Rashid Shaheed
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: on a comeback.
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: Okay. And they had, they had a JSN on a
• 20:19
  Speaker 3: deep curl on the opposite side, but they're, they're figuring, okay,
• 20:22
  Speaker 3: let's just threaten the go route and have JSN or
• 20:27
  Speaker 3: excuse me, Rashid Shaheed run, run a deep comeback and
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: I'll buy this Seahawks sideline. And the way the, the
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: charges played there, it was a four deep defense and,
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: So the corner could play an outside leverage because he
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: had help from the safety on the inside. And it
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: kind of was squatting. You didn't get the runoff that
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: you would have wanted. Seattle would have preferred that the
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: Chargers were in a three-deep defense because then the corner
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: would have had to say, oh, boy, that skinny post,
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: that lane, that region is accessible to the Seahawks. So
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: now all of a sudden he would have played different,
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: but as it was, he played a little bit more
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: outside and wasn't there. So now you go to the
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: check down and Darnold just flat. Didn't see him. There's
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: no other explanation for what happened there. Didn't see him.
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: And that linebacker 45 helped me on his name, but
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: he had lined up on the line of scrimmage. And
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: in that coverage, oftentimes, in fact, the majority of the
• 21:31
  Speaker 3: time teams play a front and, what's called an over
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: front to go to the strong side, put the defensive
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: line on the strong side. And that allows the three
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: underneath defenders to be off the ball. And, and then
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: as a quarterback, you can kind of locate them more
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: when they, when they snap the ball and they're off
• 21:52
  Speaker 3: the ball, as opposed to somebody, you know, is he
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: an end or is he going to drop? And then
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: that was play action. So Darnold turns back and then
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: he comes back and, He checks down to the flat
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: and just didn't see him. And now there may have
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: been somebody in rush or somebody in his view. But
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: one thing I can tell you is what looks really
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: stupid on TV or in the stadium, it looks a
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: lot different in the pocket.
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 22:18
  Speaker 3: Because you've got a lot of tall guys around you
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: and they're wearing helmets. And so at your eye level,
• 22:24
  Speaker 3: if you've got a 6'5 or a 6'6 offensive line,
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: and even if you're 6'3, just do the math, the optics.
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: If you're 6'3, let's say your eye is at 5'11
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: or something, now you've got a lineman who's 6'6 and
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: he's wearing a helmet, so he's 6'8 with a helmet.
• 22:43
  Speaker 3: Now he's going to be bending down a little because
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: you don't block perfectly straight up. But those helmets... can
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: get in the way. And for a shorter quarterback, shoulder
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: pads can get in the way. And so he just
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: didn't see it, Ian. There's no question. And it happens.
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: Tui Polo, too, I think is the guy you're referring to.
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: And don't ever make me say that again. You're the pro.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: I'm the amateur.
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: You're paid to handle that stuff. I've got a hockey
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: game to call tomorrow night. I'm going through Eastern European names.
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: Now you want me to go through Polynesian names? Are
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: you kidding me? I spent five years in Utah. I
• 23:19
  Speaker 2: was dialed in for a while. I've lost my touch.
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: You're one for one.
• 23:23
  Speaker 4: Go while you're ahead.
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: Exactly.
• 23:25
  Speaker 2: You said something there to wrap up. We've got about
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: four minutes left in the segment here. You said something
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: there to wrap that I want to get to. Right
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: when you started that, what Seattle's priority was? Offensively, what
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: was that yesterday?
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: Well, they wanted to get the ball to Shahid right
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: from the jump. first play of the game. So, and,
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: and a relatively, you know, not a deep strike, but
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: they were trying to get a nice intermediate smoke, the
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: ball out. They were trying to get 15, 17 yard
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: gain out on the sideline. And the, the problem was
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: Shahid in my estimation, there's a lot to like about him.
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: Mainly his speed. Um, and that beautiful, graceful stride of his,
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: it's just, you know, you could just watch him run. Um,
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: but yeah, It takes him a long time to slow down,
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: so I think he's a relatively easy cover on that.
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: I think at some point Seattle's just got to let
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: him just run as hard and fast as he can
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: and just kind of throw it up there and give
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: him a chance to run under a ball or get
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: a pass interference or something. And even if you don't
• 24:30
  Speaker 3: hit it, then at least you're on tape as that
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: you tried it. And then those comebacks are more likely
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: to work. All the stuff, the stop, the whole entire
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: category of stop routes, you know, the deep curls, the comebacks,
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: you know, even maybe the in-breaking routes, the daggers or
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: the square ends or what have you, you know, the
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: hitches and the hooks at shorter depths, all of those
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: are more likely to be open to you because you've
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: at least thrown a go route. So I... I would
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: just throw it up there once a game to them deep.
• 25:13
  Speaker 3: And I think it'd be worth it.
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: Hugh Millen, Hardcore Football. I'm going to take a break here,
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: come back. I want to talk about the last play,
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: the sack, the last play that mattered, not the two
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: kneel downs. The last sack of the game, Nwosu had it.
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: Seattle had four sacks yesterday. Two by defensive linemen or
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: an edge rusher in Nwosu's case, but you get the point.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: The other two by a linebacker and I guess a
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: linebacker because they were Ernest Jones. and I believe Eamon
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: Warrie had the other one, if I'm not mistaken.
• 25:40
  Speaker 4: He did.
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: So let's talk about that, especially as it leads into
• 25:43
  Speaker 2: the San Francisco game, a team that has yet to
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: give up a sack this season. Hugh Millen, Hardcore Football
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: continues next. Hardcore Football, Hugh Millen. Let's get right to it, Hugh.
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: The Seahawks get the win yesterday. Kind of an ugly game,
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: weird game, strange game. A lot of things happened in
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: that game. Four sacks in the game for the Seahawks. Jones,
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: Eamon Worry, Murphy, and Nwosu get the sacks, including the
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: last one of the game, which let's discuss that one.
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: L.A.
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: Threatening to tie, have an opportunity to get going, and
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: it didn't happen. They've got a fumble recovery on the
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: sack by Nwosu. Let's talk about that.
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: Well, I find it interesting that there was a little
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: bit of commonality to the Huskies' last play, the fourth
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: and ten down on the goal line.
• 26:34
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: Because Jed Fish wanted to get an in-breaking route from
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: the right side and from the outside receiver, and there
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: was a defender sitting right there in the– in the
• 26:51
  Speaker 3: curl zone. And so the area that Fish wanted to complete,
• 26:58
  Speaker 3: there's really one opportunity. And so Gary Patterson, the defense
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: coordinator for SC, he won that chess match on that
• 27:05
  Speaker 3: play and the prior play as well, but we're not
• 27:07
  Speaker 3: talking Huskies. But in this play, the Seahawks, they line
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: up in a four deep on the fumble by Nwosu.
• 27:17
  Speaker 3: And they're trying, they got, Herbert has, three receivers to
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: his left, and they're trying to get the single receiver.
• 27:30
  Speaker 3: I beg your pardon, I thought they motioned a trip.
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: I think they stated two by two. It doesn't matter.
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: The widest receiver, he's trying to run what they term
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: a skid route, where you come up six steps and
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: then you just break in. And the part, Nwosu's going
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: to get the credit. but there's other aspects that assist
• 27:54
  Speaker 3: in the sack. One of them is just Mike McDonald
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: calling the perfect play because there's a four deep defense.
• 28:02
  Speaker 3: Think of it like an outfield in softball. You know
• 28:05
  Speaker 3: how you got a left center fielder and a right
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: center fielder. So, and so think of four deep in
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: an outfield, what Mike McDonald says, Hey, Julian love, you're
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: going to play right center. Okay. But at the snap
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: of the ball or at the time you think is,
• 28:21
  Speaker 3: is the right time you come down and play second base.
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: Almost like a Rover in softball.
• 28:27
  Speaker 3: He's got that area.
• 28:30
  Speaker 4: Okay.
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: Like, like he's got that vertical section. He's got the,
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: what's called the hook zone, but he doesn't line up
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: in the hook zone. He lines up as a deep,
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: Quarter guy.
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: As a quarterback, you might be thinking the hook zone's
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: there for you.
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you think in front of him that you can
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: get that skid route with the receiver bending in front
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: of Julian Love. And what happens, it's an inviting space because, oh, wow,
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: there's a hole there if I throw it in front
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: of Julian Love. But the construct of the defense is
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: Love has help if he comes and tries to rob
• 29:11
  Speaker 3: that from the top down. But his timing is impeccable
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: because he kind of stands flat-footed because he's looking at
• 29:19
  Speaker 3: what's called the release of No. 2. And the No.
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: 2 is counting from the outside in, and the tight end,
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: he just kind of goes up and breaks to the flat.
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: So he has nothing vertical stressing him. So what Julian
• 29:35
  Speaker 3: loves thinking is, is I'm going to stay deep here
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: until I need to try something robs from number one.
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: That's my left, right? That's the side I'm on.
• 29:45
  Speaker 4: I'm on the left.
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: And, oh, they're running a skid route. Now he, he
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: just accelerates right into that area. Comes out of right
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: center field. Immediately comes to be the second baseman. Obviously,
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: there's a scale difference from what I'm talking about.
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: Right, no, but yeah, we got you.
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: Right, and then now Herbert, he's about ready to turn
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: it loose, but he can't throw it. But Julian Love
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: caused all this indecision. Meanwhile, Byron Murphy is just forklifting
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: the center back into Herbert's So now Herbert, he's been
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: duped by Julian Love. Now he's got his center in
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: his lap, and now he starts to go evade. He
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: never saw the backside. There's a reason why they call
• 30:40
  Speaker 3: it the blind side. The left tackle, who is this
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: Slater guy, that $ 100 million left tackle, he was hurt.
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: So you've got a backup guard playing left tackle. Nuoso
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: lines up in a wide nine, comes around the edge,
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: and did a hell of a job. I mean, he
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: beat a guy that he should beat.
• 30:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: Right? But if the other part, if Julian Love, if
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: Mike McDonald doesn't call the defense to take away the–
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: The Chargers are trying to get. And if Julian Love
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: doesn't play it like a veteran perfectly, and if Byron
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: Murphy doesn't do his job, all of those factors combine
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: to set the table, white linen table with all the
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: forks and the spoons nice for Nwosu. All he's got
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: to do is sit down and eat. And that's what
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: he did. But it's a great play by Nwosu, but
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: it's multifaceted, and so you get the game-winning play.
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: By the way, I had to watch it again just
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: to see Byron Murphy quote-unquote forklift the center, which he did.
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: Did he not walk him back? I don't know if
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: you have the all-22. I don't have the all-22. Julian Love,
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: he just hovers down in this no-man land, where as
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: a quarterback, I'm.
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: Watching an end zone copy now. I see exactly what
• 32:10
  Speaker 2: you're talking about. You see how he stands flat-footed, but
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: then he triggers? As soon as he reads skid route, boom,
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: down he comes. But he laid back and baited Herbert
• 32:22
  Speaker 2: into thinking that there was a chance to get that
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: in breaking and a skid route is kind of like
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: a skinny boat, like a deep slant. That's what I
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: was going to ask you. It feels like a slant
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: sort of, right?
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: It's a deep slant. It's a six step slant. Okay.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 32:36
  Speaker 3: As opposed to a three step slant. So it's going
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: to be up the field, but then, and then you
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: also throttle down because you don't want to run into the,
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: the middle zones, whatever they may be, generally the hook zones. And,
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: and so, So that's, you know, with McDonald being from
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: the McVeigh tree, or excuse me, the Shanahan tree, Shanahan
• 33:00
  Speaker 3: loves that route. And so Seattle was ready for it.
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: Julian Love played it perfect. And that was the beginning
• 33:09
  Speaker 3: domino after the play call, obviously.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: I got a minute, Hugh. I'm going to ask you this.
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: I need a minute.
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: I know you hate when I do this, but I need,
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: So they did bring pressure more often yesterday with extra guys.
• 33:23
  Speaker 2: Are we seeing more of that this year from Mike McDonald?
• 33:25
  Speaker 2: It feels like they didn't have a high blitz rate
• 33:28
  Speaker 2: last year.
• 33:29
  Speaker 3: No, because they did a lot of simulated pressures. I
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: haven't run the numbers yet, but simulated pressures where it
• 33:37
  Speaker 3: feels like a blitz, but it's really only four guys,
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: which means you can play all your standard seven-man zones.
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: You can do two deep, five under. You can do
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: a three deep, four under. You can do The 40
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: quarters with the three under, which has to have man
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: principles within a zone because you can't play zone with
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: three guys underneath in spot drop. You got to match.
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: But when you do a simulated pressure, you're bringing irregular
• 34:04
  Speaker 3: guys and you're playing zone behind it. But there was,
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: I'll just finish, there was a sack that they got
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: where they lined up and showed six guys And then
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: you thought, well, they may back out. They may back out.
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: They didn't back out. They came down hard, and they
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: played a zone behind it with only five guys. And
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: trying to play zone with five guys makes no sense
• 34:29
  Speaker 3: on a whiteboard. But when you get there, then it
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: makes sense. But you had Nicky Manwari lining up in
• 34:37
  Speaker 3: a four-point stance, like he's getting ready to run the
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: 100-meter in the Olympics. And you just watch. that long
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: stride in how explosive he is. And I mean, that
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: is just a murder of a, of a challenge for a, um,
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: offensive tackle. And, and that allowed them to have, they have, uh,
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: DeMarcus Lawrence inside, you know, he's, he's working on guards,
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: you know, that's a problem. And, and, uh, they had,
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: they had, uh, uh, Oh, you know, Nuoso on the
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: outside and Derek Hall on the, I mean, they had
• 35:14
  Speaker 3: a whole potency. 99 was on the inside Leonard Williams.
• 35:17
  Speaker 3: And you know, that, that, those six guys and, and,
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: and Ernest Jones was the final six, those six guys,
• 35:23
  Speaker 3: like all of those guys are capable of winning their matchups.
• 35:28
  Speaker 3: And now you just bring all of them and you're
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: playing this funky, you know, unsound zone behind it from
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: a quarterback. You go, Oh man, that's, And the guy,
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: it was on him so fast. I can't remember who
• 35:43
  Speaker 3: even got that sack.
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: Was it Murphy or Jones?
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: Murphy or Jones?
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: It was Hall.
• 35:49
  Speaker 4: It was Hall. Okay.
• 35:51
  Speaker 3: No, no, no, no, no, no.
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: It was Murphy, Jones, even Wario.
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: It was even Wario. Yeah. Wow.
• 35:58
  Speaker 3: No, I lied twice. Let me get the right third time.
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: It was Ernest Jones. Ernest Jones. It was finally credited. Yeah,
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: that's right. Ernest Jones. I apologize.
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: I do remember that because I remember seeing him in
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: Wario and I'm like, damn, like that's a hard, like
• 36:11
  Speaker 2: I feel bad for the offense. I almost felt bad
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: for the offensive line there, Hugh. Almost did.
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: Not 100%. Almost. Well, when those six guys were, I thought, well,
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: they're going to do another sim pressure because that's what
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: McDonald does. He's going to drop two guys. It's a
• 36:25
  Speaker 3: great blitz because the Chargers don't know which two they're
• 36:27
  Speaker 3: going to drop. They're going to rush four and play
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: their zone behind it. But no, they actually ran the six.
• 36:36
  Speaker 3: But Eamon Worry came. flying in there so fast. Oh
• 36:39
  Speaker 3: my gosh. Like he's shot out of a cannon.
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: Well, here's the deal. This is why we do an
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: hour and we still don't have enough time, but I
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: hear there's more at four probably today with you and softy.
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: So I think that's on the docket. I think that's
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: on the docket. So more human, I should mention, uh,
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: coming up on Thursday, uh, you're going to be in, uh,
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: the Tulalip casino, right. Doing a, doing a little chalk
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: talk thing.
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: And, uh, yeah.
• 37:02
  Speaker 2: So if people want to go.
• 37:03
  Speaker 3: She'd asked me to, to, to do that. I'm like, Oh,
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: All right. We could have some fun with that. We
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: used to do that with the Garage with Gas-a-thon, the
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: gas cares thing. And so I hadn't done it in
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: a long time. And we'll get the video, the coach's tape,
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: not TV copy. We'll get the coach's tape, sideline and
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: the end zone copy. And we'll draw on the screen
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: and talk some X's and O's and almost all CX,
• 37:31
  Speaker 3: but maybe a Husky play or two.
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: I love it. All right, so that's Thursday at 5
• 37:35
  Speaker 2: at Tulio Resort and Casino. So if you want to go,
• 37:38
  Speaker 2: text your first and last name, phone number, and email
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: address to 49451. Spots are limited. We'll talk soon. Thanks,
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: my friend.
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: Okay, thank you, Ian.
• 37:46
  Speaker 2: Hugh Millen, great stuff. Hardcore football. Mike Sando takes a
• 37:49
  Speaker 2: tour of the NFL with us coming up next.
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: It's time for our Monday visit with Mike Sando of
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: The Athletic, brought to you by Hunt Services. For HVAC, plumbing, sewer,
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: and electrical needs, get on the horn and call Hunt
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: or visit HuntServices.com. Now with Mike Sando, here's Ian Furness.
• 38:13
  Speaker 2: Mike Sando joins us here on the Beacon Plumbing Hotline
• 38:16
  Speaker 2: as we get taking a peek around. The National Football
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: League Sandoz Pick 6 column is there for you every Monday.
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: It's fantastic. AthleticAthletic.com.
• 38:27
  Speaker 3: Hello, sir.
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: How are you? Oh, there he is.
• 38:32
  Speaker 3: Hey, Mike.
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: How are you doing? Good.
• 38:33
  Speaker 4: How are you? I'm good. I'm good.
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: We've got Monday Night Football tonight. I should mention real fast.
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: Right here on 93.3 KJR FM, 5 o'clock. It'll be
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: the Saints and the Falcons 20 years after the Steve
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: Gleason blocked punt. really kind of fired up the city
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: coming back from hurricane Katrina, got the rivalry going as
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: well in the NFC South. So a lot of probably
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: emotion in the building tonight. It's been 20 years. You
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: were covering the NFL, I believe back then, maybe.
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah.
• 39:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah. You were covering the NFL back then. What do
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: you remember from that night?
• 39:05
  Speaker 4: Well, Steve Leeson actually covered him when he was a
• 39:08
  Speaker 4: freshman at Wazoo. I was on the Wazoo beat. Then
• 39:11
  Speaker 4: I was sort of covering the NFL, you know, in 98.
• 39:14
  Speaker 4: So I just remembered what a, you know, what an
• 39:17
  Speaker 4: emotional player he was. And I thought it was just
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: so amazing. Of course, not knowing what was gonna happen
• 39:22
  Speaker 4: with him over the course of his life, but just
• 39:25
  Speaker 4: an amazing, uh an amazing amazing night for a city
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: remember the time i think we were i think the
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: seahawks i was on the seahawks beat i believe they
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: had just played there because dave bowling my partner uh
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: at the news tribune at the time i believe got
• 39:40
  Speaker 4: stuck coming out of there and had to hang out
• 39:43
  Speaker 4: with at somebody's house or something oh gosh uh and
• 39:46
  Speaker 4: so i i remember uh That and then just how
• 39:49
  Speaker 4: amazing it was. Like, I think I saw one of
• 39:52
  Speaker 4: those guys, Gleason or somebody, say that like he wouldn't,
• 39:54
  Speaker 4: they wouldn't trade that night for a Super Bowl win.
• 39:56
  Speaker 4: Think of that. Wow.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: That's amazing.
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: It's amazing. Yeah.
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: I mean, for people who don't remember, in 2005, Hurricane
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: Katrina in August of 2005 killed more than 1,300 people,
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: decimated the region. The Superdome, which was damaged as well,
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: was actually a shelter for a long time. A lot
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: of stuff went on. Steve Gleason was 29 years old
• 40:21
  Speaker 2: at the time, kind of a core special teams guy, really,
• 40:24
  Speaker 2: for the most part with the Saints at that point.
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: And of course, we know what's happened. He gets a
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: block punt, phenomenal emotion. And then, of course, for the last, what,
• 40:32
  Speaker 2: decade plus, Steve Gleason has been battling ALS and been
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: a massive advocate for that disease, that horrific disease.
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: So.
• 40:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, there will be some emotion in the building tonight,
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: no doubt about it.
• 40:43
  Speaker 4: Actually, my wife and I, usually when we go on vacation,
• 40:46
  Speaker 4: we like to put an audio book on for some
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: of it. We did Gleason's book. It was really, really good.
• 40:52
  Speaker 4: I think it was done with Jeff Duncan, who's covered
• 40:54
  Speaker 4: the Saints and New Orleans for a long time. It
• 40:57
  Speaker 4: was just really good and a little bit of a
• 41:01
  Speaker 4: tough upbringing for him, but it's cool for people from
• 41:04
  Speaker 4: around here because he was in Spokane, so you know
• 41:06
  Speaker 4: the You know the lay of the land. You know
• 41:08
  Speaker 4: the references better than you would if it was from
• 41:10
  Speaker 4: somewhere else.
• 41:11
  Speaker 2: His mom was a longtime Wazoo employee. I think she
• 41:14
  Speaker 2: was the academic advisor, I believe, for the athletic department
• 41:18
  Speaker 2: for a long time, right, as well?
• 41:19
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: So there's a lot of connections there along the way.
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: I did not mention this today. I do want to
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: get to it because you wrote about it, and I
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: thought what you said was bang on. Vinod Khosla, the Seahawks—
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: matriarch owner, I guess there's kind of a patriarch, patriarch, patriarch,
• 41:38
  Speaker 2: my fault. Uh, there's a kind of three headed monster, uh, husband, wife, son,
• 41:42
  Speaker 2: but he, he, he did an interview, uh, with, with
• 41:46
  Speaker 2: a newsletter, a political newsletter, I guess it is, or
• 41:49
  Speaker 2: something on, on Friday and, Never Say Never was his
• 41:52
  Speaker 2: quote about would the Seahawks ever move. And then he
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: doubled down over the weekend. Not doubled down. Then he
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: came out and said, well, kind of blame the media
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: for twisting his words. I know how most Seahawks fans felt.
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: I saw our reaction on the text line when we
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: read the story. People were going ballistic. He kind of
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: blamed the reporters. What's your read on this, Mike?
• 42:14
  Speaker 4: I think he needs to come hang out with the
• 42:15
  Speaker 4: fans more. I think it's just hard to understand that.
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: what fans go through. I know he's a fan of
• 42:22
  Speaker 4: the Steelers or whatever, but when you've been around here
• 42:24
  Speaker 4: and you have a, you've had great ownership for a
• 42:26
  Speaker 4: while that you didn't take for granted because it was
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: off and on good before and bad. And the team
• 42:31
  Speaker 4: almost left. You are really looking for cues from the
• 42:34
  Speaker 4: new owner. You're worried when a new owner comes in,
• 42:36
  Speaker 4: are they going to be bad? Cause you've had a good,
• 42:38
  Speaker 4: and you know what bad is the Sonics. We're trying
• 42:40
  Speaker 4: to get a team. We're trying to get an NBA
• 42:41
  Speaker 4: team back here. You know, shoot. My kids were, you know,
• 42:45
  Speaker 4: my kids are grown now. They were, you know, in
• 42:47
  Speaker 4: grade school when the Sonics were here. And so to
• 42:50
  Speaker 4: talk about it that callously and casually, and then to
• 42:55
  Speaker 4: just sort of die on the hill of, hey, I
• 42:57
  Speaker 4: didn't really mean it. I'm going to call out the
• 42:59
  Speaker 4: media when they twist it. No, I think you got
• 43:02
  Speaker 4: to be careful as the owner and considerate of your fans.
• 43:07
  Speaker 4: And I think that was tone deaf, really. I've been
• 43:11
  Speaker 4: impressed by the owners, you know, from what I've seen,
• 43:13
  Speaker 4: but this was the first thing that I was like, okay,
• 43:17
  Speaker 4: You know, once they get ramped up and, you know,
• 43:22
  Speaker 4: have a better feel or the team struggles, is he
• 43:25
  Speaker 4: going to have the answers? Does he know Bettis? Yes. Yes.
• 43:30
  Speaker 4: That's a little bit worrisome to me.
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: I just– everything you said I agree with. And I hate–
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: I just– I guess this is the media person in me,
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: but I mean, it's just such an easy thing to do.
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: His quote, feel sad for the reporters looking for views
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: and clicks who distort my answer out of context and
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: sent an entire city into a spiral for no reason. Well,
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: there is a reason. You just mentioned it. And I'll
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: go back. I mean, George Argyris and the Mariners tried
• 43:55
  Speaker 2: to move to Tampa. That was being discussed for years
• 43:57
  Speaker 2: before Smolian bought the team and then later, you know, Nintendo.
• 44:02
  Speaker 2: And then obviously the Seahawks moved for a day or
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: two to Long Beach and we know what happened with
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: the Sonics. So understand, as you said, Mike, spend some
• 44:09
  Speaker 2: time with the fans, understand the landscape and don't, the
• 44:12
  Speaker 2: reporters didn't twist anything. That's what you said. Never say never.
• 44:16
  Speaker 2: That's a very, a very simple thing is just to say, no,
• 44:19
  Speaker 2: we're not moving the team or no, we have no
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: plans to move the team, whatever it might be. That
• 44:25
  Speaker 2: that's on you.
• 44:25
  Speaker 4: I just say furthest thing from our minds. We're just
• 44:28
  Speaker 4: getting here.
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 44:29
  Speaker 4: Yes. We realized this was a great team and he
• 44:32
  Speaker 4: said some of those things, you know, it's just, I
• 44:35
  Speaker 4: don't know, you know, if it, I was thinking of
• 44:37
  Speaker 4: an analogy like this. Uh, uh, if, if somebody came
• 44:43
  Speaker 4: up to 10 people and asked him, what are you
• 44:45
  Speaker 4: doing this weekend? Most of them would just say, you know,
• 44:47
  Speaker 4: we got some plans. We're doing this. There's going to
• 44:49
  Speaker 4: be one guy who goes, I don't know if the
• 44:51
  Speaker 4: world doesn't exist, then, you know, who knows what we're doing?
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: You know?
• 44:53
  Speaker 4: And it's like, okay, dude, you're not smarter than everybody.
• 44:56
  Speaker 4: Like that's like, it's like that type of an answer.
• 44:58
  Speaker 4: I can't say what's going to happen in 500 years. Yep.
• 45:00
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: Oh, okay.
• 45:03
  Speaker 4: Hey, uh, Ian, you're going to be there for your kids. Oh,
• 45:08
  Speaker 4: I don't know. You can't predict the future.
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: Well, no, say yes.
• 45:11
  Speaker 2: Yes. And if the future.
• 45:13
  Speaker 4: Changes for some reason and you can't be with your kids,
• 45:15
  Speaker 4: then you won't. But just say yes.
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: Just say yes. It's very simple how to work it. And,
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: you know, somebody mentioned, a few people mentioned, hey, media training,
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: what have you. And he's like, I'm against media training. Like, well,
• 45:27
  Speaker 2: there's like a good PR staff and a good PR person.
• 45:31
  Speaker 2: You know, we've talked about this with Mike Holmgren over
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: the years, you know, and to this day, it's still what,
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: I'm assuming a lot of teams do, but Gary Wright,
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: Mike Holmgren always says, I've come out of this game
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: and Gary Wright would pull me aside and calm me down.
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: But then he would say, you're going to be asked
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: this and this, and here's how you answer it. And
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: just kind of a little bit of Dave Pearson does
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: a great job now, did it with Pete, does it
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: with Mike McDonald, does it mean it's going to be perfect?
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: Mike McDonald, I think you wrote about this. perfect way
• 45:57
  Speaker 2: to do it. Like, yeah, I, I shouldn't have said
• 45:59
  Speaker 2: those things with Graham Bensinger, whatever. That's on me. Right.
• 46:02
  Speaker 2: I got burned.
• 46:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah. He was in much better position to blame the
• 46:05
  Speaker 4: media because that sort of looked like a setup, right?
• 46:08
  Speaker 4: The camera was way in the corner and it looked
• 46:10
  Speaker 4: kind of weird. And just knowing Mike McDonald, you don't
• 46:12
  Speaker 4: think he would go on camera and say that he looked,
• 46:15
  Speaker 4: it sounded like one of those things. You're just kind
• 46:16
  Speaker 4: of shooting the breeze, right?
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 46:18
  Speaker 4: It could have easily played the media card. And I
• 46:20
  Speaker 4: would have said, you know, there's some, there's some credence
• 46:22
  Speaker 4: to that. Uh, but you know, He didn't. He said,
• 46:27
  Speaker 4: I'm responsible for what I say. I got to be better.
• 46:29
  Speaker 3: Awesome.
• 46:30
  Speaker 4: I mean, people just love that. They love that. When
• 46:32
  Speaker 4: you're a leader, be accountable because you know there's going
• 46:35
  Speaker 4: to be a time when some player on the team
• 46:38
  Speaker 4: says something that the team wishes he didn't say about
• 46:41
  Speaker 4: an opponent or about something, and they've got to be
• 46:44
  Speaker 4: able to own it. And it's easier to make them
• 46:45
  Speaker 4: own it when you own it.
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: Very much so. Mike Sandoz joining us for Curious Deal
• 46:48
  Speaker 2: Hunt Services. From The Athletic, theathletic.com. We talked about EPA
• 46:52
  Speaker 2: last night. Expected points added. Tell me this, Mike. How
• 46:55
  Speaker 2: do the Seahawks get over 30 points a couple times
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: this season with negative offensive EPA in those games?
• 47:01
  Speaker 4: Because they're so good on defense and sometimes special teams.
• 47:04
  Speaker 4: They really are. And that's why, you know, when your
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: offense is giving short fields like they did in the
• 47:10
  Speaker 4: Washington game or your offense is, you know, the first
• 47:14
  Speaker 4: play of the game is an interception and you have
• 47:17
  Speaker 4: some struggles and you're getting you're taking advantage of big
• 47:21
  Speaker 4: issues on special teams to get great field position, your
• 47:23
  Speaker 4: offense isn't the reason why you won the game. And
• 47:25
  Speaker 4: so the EPA does a pretty good job of showing that.
• 47:28
  Speaker 4: And that's why I like to look at it. And
• 47:30
  Speaker 4: especially for games I didn't see, it's very helpful to
• 47:33
  Speaker 4: look and be like, ooh, okay, I can kind of
• 47:34
  Speaker 4: get a feel for how that went. Yeah.
• 47:36
  Speaker 2: And they were plus 8.8 EPA against Chargers and special teams.
• 47:40
  Speaker 2: That probably had to do a lot with that muff punt, right?
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: Muff punt, huge.
• 47:44
  Speaker 4: Yes. Huge.
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 47:45
  Speaker 4: And so the offense benefits from that, but they didn't
• 47:47
  Speaker 4: really work for it.
• 47:49
  Speaker 2: The 49ers are rolling right now. Seattle's got them this weekend.
• 47:54
  Speaker 2: Is Seattle's run game, especially going against the best opponent
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: they will have seen so far, is Seattle's run game
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: a concern? It is.
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: One of the funny things yesterday when I was writing
• 48:04
  Speaker 4: about this, you know, the NSC West and the top
• 48:07
  Speaker 4: three teams, I went to look at the rushing yards yesterday.
• 48:12
  Speaker 4: And I believe that Seattle's rusher had the most of
• 48:15
  Speaker 4: anyone between the 49ers and the Rams for rushing yards.
• 48:18
  Speaker 4: It didn't feel that way. I think they've got– they're
• 48:21
  Speaker 4: running the ball a lot, but they are really not
• 48:23
  Speaker 4: an explosive running team right now. And so one of
• 48:26
  Speaker 4: the issues playing the 49ers, their defense has a lot
• 48:29
  Speaker 4: of injuries, but they've done a good job of taking
• 48:31
  Speaker 4: away the explosive plays. And I just don't know where
• 48:34
  Speaker 4: Seattle's going to get those in the run game now
• 48:36
  Speaker 4: that we saw Shahid get involved on a play. And
• 48:39
  Speaker 4: Mike McDonald, I thought, was great saying, I've been wanting
• 48:41
  Speaker 4: to see that. Thank you. Like we did it in practice,
• 48:43
  Speaker 4: but I think I really want to see how Brian Fleury,
• 48:47
  Speaker 4: the offensive coordinator, you know, what sort of answers and
• 48:50
  Speaker 4: wrinkles he has to try to try to prop this up.
• 48:53
  Speaker 4: Fascinating this week because both staffs know each other so well,
• 48:56
  Speaker 4: they're going to be, you know, they're going to know
• 48:58
  Speaker 4: what's coming possibly. So you're going to have to have
• 48:59
  Speaker 4: a good plan. I.
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: I, I heard yesterday something a lot. I was driving
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: in to do the hockey game and I was listening
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: to NFL radio and They're whipped around kind of like
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: the radio version of the red zone. And I heard
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: the stat like, oh, Purdy still hasn't been sacked yet.
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: The game was still going on. I'm like, that's weird,
• 49:16
  Speaker 2: having him sacked yet today. I thought, okay. Then I
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: read your story today. Brock Purdy has yet to be
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: sacked this season. Mike, we're four games in. We're four
• 49:28
  Speaker 2: games in. How can that be?
• 49:29
  Speaker 4: And the other thing is, it's not like they're handing
• 49:32
  Speaker 4: it off to Christian McCaffrey every play. His touches are
• 49:34
  Speaker 4: down quite a bit from last year. He's no one
• 49:41
  Speaker 4: No one this century has started the season with more
• 49:44
  Speaker 4: pass plays as a quarterback without getting sacked. It's 122.
• 49:46
  Speaker 4: I think next is Peyton Manning way back when, you know, 114.
• 49:50
  Speaker 4: And Peyton Manning was great at, like, getting the ball out.
• 49:52
  Speaker 4: He knows what's happening out there. Well, Hurdy's not Peyton Manning,
• 49:55
  Speaker 4: but he is a great anticipator, and he can get
• 49:57
  Speaker 4: the ball out. So I think this is a great test.
• 50:00
  Speaker 4: Seattle sort of had his number more often than not,
• 50:03
  Speaker 4: but he's hotter than he's been, too. And it's earlier
• 50:05
  Speaker 4: in the year when the 49ers still have Kittle and
• 50:08
  Speaker 4: some of their guys who tend to wear down late
• 50:10
  Speaker 4: in the year.
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: The fun thing about, we're not quite, I mean, I
• 50:14
  Speaker 2: think it's like 23, because it's a 17-game schedule, math,
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: but like 23% through the season so far. As I
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: say that, you kind of look around the league, and
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: the surprises, both good and the surprises that aren't good.
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: Let me start with one. The Cleveland Browns are 3-1.
• 50:31
  Speaker 2: Most would have said, hey, four games in, what do
• 50:34
  Speaker 2: you think the Browns' record is, and who is their quarterback?
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: I don't know if many people would have said 3-1,
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: and it's still Deshaun Watson.
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: Not at all.
• 50:41
  Speaker 4: Not only that, Watson's had decent, you know, production, decent
• 50:44
  Speaker 4: statistical production after being really the worst producing quarterback in
• 50:49
  Speaker 4: the league over his previous, I believe, four seasons, only
• 50:52
  Speaker 4: 19 games, but four seasons there. So it's surprising. I
• 50:56
  Speaker 4: think you have to give Todd Monken credit. You know,
• 50:59
  Speaker 4: I think he's, you weren't really sure when you kind
• 51:02
  Speaker 4: of heard him shooting from the hip, you know, in
• 51:04
  Speaker 4: his press conferences and stuff. Is this really a head coach?
• 51:06
  Speaker 4: But I think he's breathed some life into them. And
• 51:08
  Speaker 4: then Watson is, you know, is a hard one to
• 51:10
  Speaker 4: root for, isn't he? It's just, he's never really been contrite, uh,
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: about all of this issues. And he, he's just kind
• 51:19
  Speaker 4: of wanted to get, you know, everybody back in everybody's
• 51:23
  Speaker 4: good graces without that yet. He's playing better. You have
• 51:25
  Speaker 4: to admit it. He is playing better right now. And
• 51:27
  Speaker 4: so they're three in one leading the, uh, AFC North.
• 51:31
  Speaker 4: I don't know if that's going to hold up. Probably not, but, uh, shoot, he's,
• 51:35
  Speaker 4: he's playing, um, at least good enough to be in
• 51:38
  Speaker 4: the games and have a chance to win. And that's
• 51:41
  Speaker 4: way better than what they've had at that position since
• 51:43
  Speaker 4: Baker Mayfield.
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: Historically speaking, you know, there's always a number that we hear,
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: the 0-2 number. If you start 0-2, you know, I
• 51:50
  Speaker 2: think it's 20, it's around 20% chance to make the postseason.
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: I think it's gone up in the last couple of years.
• 51:54
  Speaker 2: I think a couple of teams have overcome that along
• 51:55
  Speaker 2: the way. But by and large, 0-2, it's a hard climb.
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: Even with 17 games, it's a hard climb. Mike, is
• 52:02
  Speaker 2: it 0-4? Is there any chance for two teams named
• 52:05
  Speaker 2: Tampa Bay and Houston at 0-4, maybe even the Chargers,
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: to find their way to the postseason?
• 52:09
  Speaker 4: I mean, you really don't think so. You'd have to
• 52:11
  Speaker 4: look at the capacity of a team to get hot.
• 52:13
  Speaker 4: And I do think that you would think the Chargers,
• 52:17
  Speaker 4: or the Texans at least, could get hot. But they're
• 52:20
  Speaker 4: about as cold as can be. So I'm definitely taking
• 52:23
  Speaker 4: the no playoffs for all of those teams. They just
• 52:25
  Speaker 4: seem like they haven't figured anything out yet.
• 52:28
  Speaker 2: The Houston one is interesting to me. It just So yesterday,
• 52:32
  Speaker 2: this is, and I kind of, in some ways, maybe
• 52:34
  Speaker 2: they're similar to Seattle, right? They're kind of a defensive-minded
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: head coach, a defense that everyone believes is an elite defense,
• 52:40
  Speaker 2: one of the best in the league, and you always
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: hear defensive guys say, hey, we want to have the
• 52:46
  Speaker 2: ability to put a team away at the end. Offenses
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: will say we want to just run the ball and
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: run the clock out and all that, but over the years,
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: talking to some of those great Seahawks defenses, guys would say, hey,
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: that's how we want it. We want to be out
• 52:57
  Speaker 2: there to finish things off, and you give us a lead,
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: we'll take care of the rest. Houston had that yesterday, Mike.
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: They had that against the Dallas Cowboys. A Cowboys defense
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: that's always kind of had question marks, right? And instead...
• 53:09
  Speaker 2: The Houston defense gives up the game-winning touchdown drive in
• 53:13
  Speaker 2: the final couple minutes. I mean, when you say who
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: has the capacity to take that next step, well, Houston
• 53:20
  Speaker 2: would have to have that, and they haven't shown that yet.
• 53:22
  Speaker 4: They really haven't. I think also Dallas is just a
• 53:25
  Speaker 4: really good offense. They've been good. They've been a little
• 53:27
  Speaker 4: up and down, but they– They really have talent, a
• 53:29
  Speaker 4: wide receiver. Obviously, CeeDee Lamb, what did he catch? 17 passes?
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 53:33
  Speaker 4: In the game. So, you know, Dak Prescott's a good quarterback.
• 53:37
  Speaker 4: So that's an offense that could really get going. I
• 53:39
  Speaker 4: was actually surprised it was 16-6 Houston at halftime. And
• 53:43
  Speaker 4: that wasn't– I was like, what? You know, only six points.
• 53:45
  Speaker 4: Maybe they're getting it back. But they haven't been able
• 53:47
  Speaker 4: to put together, you know, a complete game that way. Now,
• 53:49
  Speaker 4: they've also played Buffalo with Josh Allen, you know, and
• 53:52
  Speaker 4: they've played now, you know, a really good Dallas offense. So–
• 53:57
  Speaker 4: It's tough to win in the league. We saw that
• 53:59
  Speaker 4: even with Seattle yesterday, up 27-6. You didn't feel great
• 54:01
  Speaker 4: about it in the end.
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: No, not with Herbert with the ball in his hands,
• 54:04
  Speaker 2: turning it by seven with some time to go. But, yeah,
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: obviously the sack fumble ended things off. By the way,
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: for folks thinking that maybe JSN didn't have the statistical
• 54:14
  Speaker 2: game that he normally does yesterday, but if you think
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: JSN's getting heavy targets, how about CeeDee Lamb? Mike mentioned
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: 17 receptions on 21 targets, Mike. 21 times. Wow. 21 times. Like,
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: is Mike Leach, is this the air raid? What are
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: we doing here? And I bring that up. Javante Williams
• 54:30
  Speaker 2: had 19 carries. It's not like they didn't run the
• 54:32
  Speaker 2: ball at all.
• 54:34
  Speaker 4: No, not at all. See, what I would do with
• 54:36
  Speaker 4: great talents like that, I would be showing him, like,
• 54:39
  Speaker 4: people on the broadcast talking about JSN being the great
• 54:42
  Speaker 4: and being maybe the best receiver now. And they get
• 54:44
  Speaker 4: a guy like Stevie Lamb going, you know, because he's
• 54:46
  Speaker 4: a great talent. He really is a great talent. And
• 54:50
  Speaker 4: when you feed him, man, good things happen.
• 54:52
  Speaker 2: Pickens only had three targets and two catches in the game,
• 54:54
  Speaker 2: but one of them was a 53-yarder. So that works
• 54:57
  Speaker 2: out okay along the way. Mike Sando with us, joining
• 55:00
  Speaker 2: us here on the Beacon Plumbing Hotline. All right, before
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: I let you go, how about our guys, the Raiders?
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: I mean, I still think that's one of the better
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: stories in the league. And yes, they didn't come away
• 55:13
  Speaker 2: with a win yesterday, but they fall just short 30-27.
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: Are they for real?
• 55:18
  Speaker 4: I think that they are now able and they're going
• 55:20
  Speaker 4: to beat the bad teams. They're no longer the team
• 55:23
  Speaker 4: that everyone's looking to play. I think they've gotten as
• 55:26
  Speaker 4: much respect as we had for Pete Carroll. He had
• 55:29
  Speaker 4: a really mismatched staff last year with Chip Kelly and
• 55:32
  Speaker 4: Patrick Graham as his coordinators that weren't really his guys.
• 55:35
  Speaker 4: And then I think it really hurt him to have his,
• 55:37
  Speaker 4: you know, he had his sons in very prominent roles,
• 55:39
  Speaker 4: including offensive line coach. They just couldn't get on the
• 55:41
  Speaker 4: same page. And I think Clint Kubiak's gone in there.
• 55:44
  Speaker 4: and been able to get the staff he wants for
• 55:46
  Speaker 4: the most part. And they're all pulling together and they're really,
• 55:49
  Speaker 4: you know, you start to believe a little bit and
• 55:51
  Speaker 4: understand that your coach can put you in good positions
• 55:54
  Speaker 4: to win with a coach, by the way, in, in Kubiak,
• 55:57
  Speaker 4: who is a really good play caller. So he's going
• 55:59
  Speaker 4: to have answers right away for the offense. And you
• 56:01
  Speaker 4: have Kirk Cousins who surprising, I think he's been surprising
• 56:04
  Speaker 4: physically able to play the way he has, but knows
• 56:06
  Speaker 4: the system. is a great fit for it. So it's
• 56:09
  Speaker 4: really been a best case scenario to me for the Raiders.
• 56:11
  Speaker 4: I didn't think it would necessarily go this way because
• 56:14
  Speaker 4: of Cousins and just where he's at in his career,
• 56:16
  Speaker 4: age 38 or whatever. But I think you just really
• 56:19
  Speaker 4: have to appreciate what happens when a coaching staff comes
• 56:24
  Speaker 4: in and really meshes with a team.
• 56:26
  Speaker 2: I got one more for you. You made me think
• 56:28
  Speaker 2: of something, Mike, which that's what's good about having you on.
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: You talked about the play calling, and Chicago's gone through
• 56:34
  Speaker 2: three quarterbacks this season, yet they're 3-1. One of those games,
• 56:37
  Speaker 2: the one loss was weird. They come off historic points
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: in the first one, give up in maybe weather conditions
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: in the next one, had six. But whether it's Kubiak
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: in Vegas or what Ben Johnson does in Chicago, Kyle
• 56:50
  Speaker 2: Shanahan in San Francisco, McVeigh, When you talk to guys,
• 56:55
  Speaker 2: maybe we need tiers for play callers next year as
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: well as quarterbacks, Mike, because it feels like there may
• 57:00
  Speaker 2: be no more important thing in football right now than
• 57:03
  Speaker 2: who your play callers. Hell, I'm looking at my alma mater.
• 57:06
  Speaker 2: Wazoo just changed their play callers today. Defensive play caller
• 57:09
  Speaker 2: in Colorado State quit halfway through the game or halfway
• 57:11
  Speaker 2: through the first quarter with Jim Mora. But play calling
• 57:14
  Speaker 2: is an art. Not everybody can do it.
• 57:16
  Speaker 4: And a system and having answers, really. I think that's
• 57:19
  Speaker 4: one of the things that's happened as the coaches have
• 57:21
  Speaker 4: gotten a lot younger in the league. That's happened because
• 57:24
  Speaker 4: with technology, they can kind of learn the scheme faster
• 57:27
  Speaker 4: with the video. And so what happens is they don't
• 57:29
  Speaker 4: spend a lot of time coaching in college. So these
• 57:31
  Speaker 4: guys are all young. And what happens with youth is
• 57:36
  Speaker 4: you don't have experience. Experience is what lets you make
• 57:39
  Speaker 4: adjustments well. And so I think there's some of these
• 57:42
  Speaker 4: guys really in the sweet spots of Kyle Shanahan. Ben
• 57:47
  Speaker 4: Johnson's probably there too. They're kind of savants, but they're
• 57:51
  Speaker 4: not just... hey, I studied on video, they understand all
• 57:58
  Speaker 4: aspects of the system to have answers and be able
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: to adjust. So when Ben Johnson goes from Caleb Williams
• 58:04
  Speaker 4: to Case Keenum, you couldn't make a bigger shift in
• 58:07
  Speaker 4: style of play or experience. Or even then goes the
• 58:09
  Speaker 4: next year and plays Tyson Badgen, who's barely played before,
• 58:13
  Speaker 4: and does what he does. They had 34 first downs yesterday.
• 58:17
  Speaker 4: I mean, that is really special. And I think there's
• 58:19
  Speaker 4: never more It doesn't seem like there's more than six
• 58:21
  Speaker 4: or eight of those types of guys on offense at
• 58:23
  Speaker 4: a time in the league. And maybe fewer, like Mike McDaniel,
• 58:28
  Speaker 4: people were maybe putting in that, and he's not able
• 58:30
  Speaker 4: to do it now. Hasn't been able to do it.
• 58:31
  Speaker 4: But there's a short list of them that are really
• 58:34
  Speaker 4: great at it.
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: Mike, great stuff. Always appreciate these Monday conversations. We'll do
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: it again next week, my friend. Thank you.
• 58:41
  Speaker 4: Thank you.
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: That's Mike Sando from The Athletic. Check out his pick
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: six column at theathletic.com. The NFL tab is usually on
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: the front page there.
• 58:47
  Speaker 3: Good stuff.
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: Good to around the NFL as well. We'll take a break.
• 58:50
  Speaker 2: Come back. Factor Fiction and your text messages are coming
• 58:53
  Speaker 2: up next.