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Iowa Episode 4: The final sprint · Pod Save America

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Have you ever messaged a friend about a manager who
• 0:02
  Speaker 1: just won't stop texting you after hours? Or a coworker
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: who keeps posting weirdly suggestive Austin Powers GIFs in Slack?
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: Well, you are not alone.
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: I'm Anne Helen Peterson, and on my new podcast, Work Appropriate,
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: I set out to find solutions to these oddly specific,
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: yet somehow completely universal listener questions. Whether you work in
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: an office chair or a sixth grade classroom, my guests and.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: I are here to help.
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: Listen to Work Appropriate every Wednesday, wherever you get your podcasts.
• 0:31
  Speaker 3: I was one of those people who thought, ah, the
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  Speaker 3: electoral map is fine. I can go about my business
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: and not be as politically involved as I was when
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: I was younger.
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  Speaker 4: And then Donald Trump won.
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  Speaker 5: Alan Fire is the chair of the Madison County Democrats,
• 0:44
  Speaker 5: like the movie The Bridges of Madison County, which I
• 0:47
  Speaker 5: didn't see either, but it's southwest of Des Moines. The
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  Speaker 5: day after the election in 2016, like so many other
• 0:53
  Speaker 5: despondent Democrats across the country, Alan and his wife had
• 0:57
  Speaker 5: a moment of reckoning.
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  Speaker 3: Then Julie and I sat there at the table the
• 1:00
  Speaker 3: next day and said... We have to do something.
• 1:03
  Speaker 4: What are we going to do?
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  Speaker 5: Allen decided to run for county chair, and he won.
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  Speaker 5: We talked in November at an event called the Liberty
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  Speaker 5: and Justice Dinner. Allen says he's not sure yet whose
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  Speaker 5: corner he'll be in on caucus night, but that's not
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  Speaker 5: because he doesn't like his choices.
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  Speaker 3: I'm annoyed at some of the recent media coverage that
• 1:20
  Speaker 3: suggests that we need to find a better candidate that
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  Speaker 3: we're not happy with the current slate because so many
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  Speaker 3: people are undecided. I think people are undecided because it's
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  Speaker 3: a quality slate of candidates.
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  Speaker 4: Two months out, the polls are in flux.
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  Speaker 5: A lot of people in Iowa have yet to make
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  Speaker 5: up their minds, which means that a bunch of candidates
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  Speaker 5: are still hoping that they can get traction.
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  Speaker 4: I'm Tommy Vitor. Today in episode four of our series,
• 1:47
  Speaker 4: The Home Stretch.
• 1:48
  Speaker 5: What it looks like on the ground in these last
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  Speaker 5: few weeks, whose organization is strong, how the campaigns test
• 1:54
  Speaker 5: their teams and flex their muscles to show undecided voters
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  Speaker 5: and the national press that they can win. Because caucus
• 2:01
  Speaker 5: night is less than two months away. For some of
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  Speaker 5: these candidates, it's all riding on Iowa. Campaigning in Iowa
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  Speaker 5: has a lot of set pieces. Those are events that
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  Speaker 5: every candidate basically has to go to. There's the Hall
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  Speaker 5: of Fame dinner, the Wing Ding, the Polk County Steak Fry.
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  Speaker 5: Those are real names, by the way. But the biggest
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  Speaker 5: of them all is the Liberty and Justice Dinner, or
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  Speaker 5: the LJ as it's known. The event used to be
• 2:25
  Speaker 5: called the Jefferson Jackson Dinner, or the JJ. It was
• 2:28
  Speaker 5: rebranded in 2015 after the party decided that it was
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  Speaker 5: a terrible look to name their marquee gala after one
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  Speaker 5: guy who owned slaves and another who forcibly removed Native
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  Speaker 5: Americans from their land. Okay, so the basic strategy for
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  Speaker 5: doing well in Iowa is to organize, organize, organize, and
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  Speaker 5: then hope you get hot late. That's what's happening right
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  Speaker 5: now on the Buttigieg campaign. Whether or not that will
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  Speaker 5: hold until Caucus Day is a totally open question. I
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  Speaker 5: stopped by Mayor Pete's campaign office in Des Moines the
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  Speaker 5: day before the LJ, and the place was bustling. There
• 3:01
  Speaker 5: was music blasting. There was a constant stream of young
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  Speaker 5: people walking in and out. They were carrying big signs.
• 3:06
  Speaker 5: They were hot gluing lights onto massive letters and preparing
• 3:09
  Speaker 5: for something called the sign war.
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  Speaker 6: I feel the tops of those.
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  Speaker 4: They're laminated in case.
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  Speaker 7: There's any rain.
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  Speaker 5: The sign war is when campaigns informally compete to have
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  Speaker 5: their stuff, their signs, their posters, whatever, to be the
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  Speaker 5: most visible around one of these big cattle call events.
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  Speaker 4: It's fun. It's ridiculous.
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  Speaker 5: There are unfortunately still videos of me on YouTube wearing
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  Speaker 5: a red velour jumpsuit sprinting around Veterans Memorial Auditorium back
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  Speaker 5: in 2007. I was trying to put up as many
• 3:37
  Speaker 5: signs as I could. The outfit is another story. But
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  Speaker 5: the sign war itself is actually important. It's a visible
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  Speaker 5: show of force to everyone in attendance.
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  Speaker 8: It's intense. These are like opening stages of a battle.
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  Speaker 4: How long have you guys been planning?
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  Speaker 8: Oh, we've been having daily meetings for weeks.
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  Speaker 9: And.
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  Speaker 8: weekly meetings for weeks before that.
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  Speaker 5: Brendan McPhillips is the Iowa state director for the Buttigieg campaign.
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  Speaker 8: Especially in Iowa, it's important that you, you know, respect
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  Speaker 8: these political traditions here and you take them seriously. And
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  Speaker 8: they're really moments that are nothing but opportunity for a campaign.
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  Speaker 8: And you can either let them pass you by and
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  Speaker 8: just show up and give your stump and go on
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  Speaker 8: with your day. Or you can say like, okay, we're
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  Speaker 8: going to really organize around this and we're going to
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  Speaker 8: show people that we can do exactly what it takes
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  Speaker 8: to win a caucus, which is organize thousands of your
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  Speaker 8: supporters to go to a specific place on a specific
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  Speaker 8: time and date in probably really shitty weather and just
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  Speaker 8: be as fired up as possible about your campaign.
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  Speaker 5: In addition to turning out supporters in shitty weather, Pete's
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  Speaker 5: team has also been dropping a lot of money on
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  Speaker 5: TV and radio ads in the last few months. As
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  Speaker 5: of this recording, they've spent $ 2. 6 million on ads in Iowa. Now,
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  Speaker 5: that's small potatoes compared to the $ 34 million Mike Bloomberg
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  Speaker 5: spent on ads in a single week, but it's a
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  Speaker 5: lot more than some of his rivals.
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  Speaker 8: We've got, thankfully, the resources to have one of the
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  Speaker 8: largest teams in I think the largest organizing team in
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  Speaker 8: the country. And I mean, you know this better than anyone,
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  Speaker 8: like Iowa is about organizing and it's about doing the
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  Speaker 8: work to, you know, show that your supporters are real,
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  Speaker 8: that they're bought in and that they're as passionate about
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  Speaker 8: your candidate as you are. And we're definitely working hard
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  Speaker 8: to expand the base of folks who support Pete and
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  Speaker 8: tapping into people who might not be ordinary caucus going constituents.
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  Speaker 8: It's part of the Innovation we're trying to do and
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  Speaker 8: how to build a volunteer base, which isn't just, you know,
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  Speaker 8: put your volunteers on the phone for three hours a
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  Speaker 8: night calling the voter file and getting a 6% contact rate.
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  Speaker 8: I mean, when I was a field organizer, you could
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  Speaker 8: count on 15, 20% on a good night. And today
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  Speaker 8: it's like six, if you're lucky, because nobody answers their phone.
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  Speaker 8: So we've really focused on inviting people and having them
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  Speaker 8: just go through the address book on their phone and
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  Speaker 8: call people and take down the same data that you
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  Speaker 8: do when you're doing a traditional phone bank, but you're
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  Speaker 8: actually getting people to have conversations.
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  Speaker 5: Having people call through their contact list isn't a new
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  Speaker 5: strategy this cycle. Campaigns did it back in 2016, too.
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  Speaker 5: But it's an indication of how much tactics have had
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  Speaker 5: to change since 2008.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 8: And your contact rate is through the roof. And then,
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  Speaker 8: you know, after you build that volunteer network, the next
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  Speaker 8: phase is just putting your head down and doing the work,
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  Speaker 8: doing the voter contact. So, you know, we're knocking a
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  Speaker 8: ton of doors and we're going to keep doing that
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  Speaker 8: through December and January. Just plug people into, you know,
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  Speaker 8: the hard work of the winter.
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  Speaker 4: The day of the LJ dinner was nasty. It was raining.
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  Speaker 4: It was brutally cold.
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  Speaker 5: But every campaign had big visibility events planned. And we
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  Speaker 5: tried to hit up as many as possible. Our first
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  Speaker 5: stop was Mayor Pete's outdoor rally.
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  Speaker 4: These are hardy people.
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  Speaker 5: You have to beat a lot to be at this
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  Speaker 5: event right now.
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  Speaker 4: We've got some people playing cornhole here.
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  Speaker 5: Not sure I'd want to be throwing bags of sand
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  Speaker 5: soaked in freezing cold water if I were a rally attendee,
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  Speaker 5: but good for them. This event was a bit of
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  Speaker 5: a scene. Mayor Pete's tour bus was parked behind this
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  Speaker 5: big stage. Ben Harper was warming up the crowd with
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  Speaker 5: some gentle ballads. I met Marcia Smith at the rally, who,
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  Speaker 5: unlike me, was wearing a sensibly large coat. I'm really
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  Speaker 5: impressed that an uncommitted voter would come out to a
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  Speaker 5: rally in this weather. This is not cushy conditions.
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  Speaker 2: No, no, no. But we appreciate everybody coming out and,
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  Speaker 2: you know, hearing the candidates and welcome to the panderdome, right?
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  Speaker 5: Pete's campaign put the crowd at over 2,000 people.
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  Speaker 4: I would say it was way less than that.
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  Speaker 5: But either way, there were a lot of people standing
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  Speaker 5: around in the freezing rain when Mayor Pete bounded out
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  Speaker 5: on the stage.
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  Speaker 9: Well, friends, this is what it feels like when you
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  Speaker 9: realize you are definitely going to be the next president
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  Speaker 9: of the United States.
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  Speaker 5: His mic was cutting in and out a bit, but
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  Speaker 5: the crowd got those six key words, next president of
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  Speaker 5: the United States. Of course, there were 13 other people
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  Speaker 5: in Des Moines that day who were also vying for
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  Speaker 5: that title, or 12, I guess, since Beto O'Rourke had
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  Speaker 5: just dropped out that afternoon. A few blocks from Mayor
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  Speaker 5: Pete's rally, Elizabeth Warren's organizers were waiting to welcome their
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  Speaker 5: candidate on Third Street. These are the field staffers who
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  Speaker 5: have been knocking on doors across the state, and they
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  Speaker 5: were going absolutely apeshit. On each side of the street,
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  Speaker 5: you have campaign staffers with signs jumping up and down, chanting,
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  Speaker 5: playing music. There's a huge inflatable Bailey the dog float, which,
• 8:45
  Speaker 5: I have to be honest, got me. Got me a
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  Speaker 5: little closer to a one for Warren.
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  Speaker 4: That's a joke.
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  Speaker 5: Olivia Ellis was there. She's the FO we've been talking
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  Speaker 5: to in the last few episodes. She got up at
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  Speaker 5: 3 a.m. that morning to drive down to Des Moines
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  Speaker 5: and would still be working late into the night. Just
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  Speaker 5: par for the course for an Iowa field organizer. It
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  Speaker 5: was very loud. Warren walked down the line of staffers
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  Speaker 5: and volunteers. They were chatting, they were giving hugs, they
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  Speaker 5: were taking selfies, and everyone was just beaming. It was
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  Speaker 5: hard to get on tape because of all the shouting,
• 9:24
  Speaker 5: but you can kind of hear it. The FOs were
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  Speaker 5: saying things to Warren like, I'm so inspired, this is
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  Speaker 5: the most rewarding thing I've ever done. A staffer later
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  Speaker 5: told me that Warren often says to her team, I
• 9:34
  Speaker 5: just can't let those organizers down. This love fest was
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: immediately followed by a press conference and the kind of
• 9:40
  Speaker 5: whiplash you often get on the campaign trail. Warren was
• 9:43
  Speaker 5: getting hammered by her opponents about how she'd pay for
• 9:46
  Speaker 5: Medicare for all, and she had scrambled to respond.
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  Speaker 10: Senator, in your statement today.
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  Speaker 7: Joe Biden called your plan mathematical gymnastics and said it's
• 9:53
  Speaker 7: impossible to pay for Medicare for all without middle class
• 9:56
  Speaker 7: tax increases. What is your response to him? Two blocks north,
• 9:50
  Speaker 7: Bernie's pre-LJ event was set up just outside the Wells
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  Speaker 7: Fargo Arena.
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  Speaker 9: Whoa!
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  Speaker 7: It is nice to have some Vermont weather here. Bernie
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  Speaker 7: was joined on stage by a fast food worker and
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  Speaker 7: a farmer.
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  Speaker 9: We will defeat the most dangerous president in the history.
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  Speaker 11: Of this country.
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  Speaker 5: Sanders made some news at the event. He announced a
• 10:30
  Speaker 5: big tour the following week with a rising star in
• 10:33
  Speaker 5: the Democratic Party.
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  Speaker 9: Next weekend, coming here to your great state of Iowa,
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  Speaker 9: I'm going to be joining Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. For a series
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  Speaker 9: of rallies focusing on the need to pass a Green
• 10:51
  Speaker 9: New Deal.
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  Speaker 5: Cory Booker's pre-dinner rally was inside, thank God. It was
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  Speaker 5: a mix of Booker fans and a bunch of undecideds.
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  Speaker 12: I created this spreadsheet because I have so many friends
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  Speaker 12: who organize different campaigns. And I've also met half of
• 11:08
  Speaker 12: them now.
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  Speaker 5: This voter, Jessalyn, had a whole Google spreadsheet with the
• 11:12
  Speaker 5: candidates she's considering and the issues she cares about.
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  Speaker 12: And then I have more of a fluffy, like, inspirational category.
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  Speaker 12: So that's where I rank the amount of times I've
• 11:21
  Speaker 12: seen them and if they actually inspire me based on
• 11:23
  Speaker 12: their personality, but also based on their policies.
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  Speaker 4: Iowa voters, man, they take this stuff really seriously.
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  Speaker 5: Mitch Smith, the Booker organizer we've met over the last
• 11:34
  Speaker 5: few episodes, was staffing the station where people could make bracelets.
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  Speaker 5: The kind with letters they were spelling out, we will rise.
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: Love these bands. How's everything going? Where have you been today?
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  Speaker 4: It's been good. We went to see Mayor Pete's rally.
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  Speaker 13: He had Ben Harper.
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  Speaker 4: A little less energetic. Okay. A lot of energy.
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  Speaker 6: What time did you wake up?
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  Speaker 5: I woke up at 4.30. Two very talented and very
• 11:58
  Speaker 5: brave Booker staffers sang a ukulele song, which is a
• 12:01
  Speaker 5: total earworm.
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  Speaker 4: I apologize in advance.
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  Speaker 14: Couples are wrong.
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  Speaker 12: In time they'll change.
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  Speaker 5: The scene inside the LJ dinner was politics meets pro wrestling.
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  Speaker 5: There was a fog machine, a light show, and around 13,000
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  Speaker 5: screaming Democrats. Troy Price, the chair of the Iowa State Dems,
• 12:38
  Speaker 5: told me they could have sold double the seats. It's
• 12:40
  Speaker 5: the Iowa Democratic Party's biggest fundraiser of the year. Thirteen
• 12:45
  Speaker 5: candidates gave speeches that night. Several campaigns bought out entire
• 12:49
  Speaker 5: sections for their supporters, and they performed coordinated chants and dances.
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  Speaker 5: All the prep we saw at Mayor Pete's campaign office
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  Speaker 5: did finally pay off with a big, loud crowd of supporters.
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  Speaker 4: Thank you!
• 12:59
  Speaker 15: Thank you, Iowa!
• 13:02
  Speaker 7: Thank you, Iowa!
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  Speaker 5: Cory Booker's crew spelled out words like rise and hope
• 13:08
  Speaker 5: in big white lights. I love you.
• 13:10
  Speaker 4: Together, we will rise. The Warren team rolled out a
• 13:17
  Speaker 4: two-story Win With Warren banner.
• 13:27
  Speaker 5: After the speeches, the Warren organizers were all over the
• 13:30
  Speaker 5: venue asking people to sign supporter cards, including the beer vendors.
• 13:34
  Speaker 5: Here's Warren field organizer Morgan Sperry.
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  Speaker 11: Like, those are the people who we actually need to
• 13:39
  Speaker 11: talk to, folks who are working all night.
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  Speaker 14: It's 7 p.m.
• 13:42
  Speaker 11: On a Friday night right now. Like, they might have
• 13:45
  Speaker 11: obligations that would prevent them from going to the caucus
• 13:47
  Speaker 11: if they don't think about it.
• 13:48
  Speaker 4: Ahead of time.
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  Speaker 11: Like, that's exactly who we're trying to engage, the people
• 13:51
  Speaker 11: who are struggling to get by working as a bartender.
• 13:54
  Speaker 11: That's who we need in the Warren movement. I'd much
• 13:57
  Speaker 11: rather chase those people than, like, hi, Lisa!
• 14:00
  Speaker 6: Hi!
• 14:00
  Speaker 9: Hi, hi, hi!
• 14:02
  Speaker 4: There, she interrupts herself to greet this woman she recognizes.
• 14:07
  Speaker 4: What do you think? Are you committed to her now
• 14:08
  Speaker 4: after that?
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  Speaker 11: Okay, I look forward to.
• 14:10
  Speaker 7: Seeing you this week.
• 14:12
  Speaker 5: Morgan told us she's been meeting with that caucus goer
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: for months and she's having a really hard time making
• 14:17
  Speaker 5: her decision.
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  Speaker 4: And a few weeks ago we.
• 14:20
  Speaker 11: Met and she was like, I just feel like I
• 14:21
  Speaker 11: don't want to make the wrong choice because if Donald
• 14:23
  Speaker 11: Trump is reelected, I will feel like it is completely
• 14:25
  Speaker 11: my fault.
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  Speaker 4: And I feel like that's how every Iowan feels.
• 14:29
  Speaker 11: Everyone operates through this game theory lens, and they're like, oh, well,
• 14:32
  Speaker 11: I like them, but if this voter in Ohio likes
• 14:35
  Speaker 11: them and this other person likes them, I just don't
• 14:37
  Speaker 11: know if they're going to like them as much as
• 14:39
  Speaker 11: I like them, and da-da-da.
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: And it's like, people, just go with who you believe in.
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: You're Iowans.
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  Speaker 1: That's the whole point.
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  Speaker 11: Just vote for who you like.
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  Speaker 4: And I get it.
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  Speaker 11: And like, I'm scared too. But I mean, Barack Obama,
• 14:50
  Speaker 11: if everyone had gone through that decision through this like
• 14:53
  Speaker 11: lens of fear, he never would have been president.
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: Morgan's right.
• 14:58
  Speaker 5: And it was Obama's breakout speech at the 2007 JJ
• 15:01
  Speaker 5: dinner that helped Iowans get over that fear and elect
• 15:04
  Speaker 5: him president. Bernie supporters ended up watching the speech from
• 15:08
  Speaker 5: an overflow area next door because the campaign didn't buy
• 15:10
  Speaker 5: tickets to the event itself. The Biden team seemed to
• 15:13
  Speaker 5: have a hard time filling the seats that they had bought.
• 15:16
  Speaker 5: Early in the day, we met some Biden supporters who
• 15:18
  Speaker 5: were laying out placards and thunder sticks on seats in
• 15:20
  Speaker 5: the upper decks. But that night, those seats were empty
• 15:23
  Speaker 5: and the thunder sticks ended up in the trash. I
• 15:25
  Speaker 5: know this might all seem kind of stupid, like who
• 15:28
  Speaker 5: cares which supporters yell the loudest, who pack the bleachers,
• 15:31
  Speaker 5: whose signs light up the brightest.
• 15:33
  Speaker 4: But here's why it matters.
• 15:34
  Speaker 5: It's because these events are a dry run for caucus
• 15:37
  Speaker 5: night on February 3rd. It's a test of which campaigns
• 15:40
  Speaker 5: can turn out their supporters, which organizers will work 15-hour
• 15:44
  Speaker 5: days and be psyched about it. in which Iowans will
• 15:46
  Speaker 5: venture out of the house on a really cold night.
• 15:49
  Speaker 5: The other piece is that experienced Iowa caucus goers in
• 15:52
  Speaker 5: that room that night, they know it. They know this
• 15:55
  Speaker 5: is a test of campaign strength, and a lot of
• 15:57
  Speaker 5: them just want to be with a winner. Which brings
• 16:00
  Speaker 5: us back to our original question. Is this actually a
• 16:02
  Speaker 5: good way to pick that winner? After the break, some alternatives.
• 16:21
  Speaker 4: We're back.
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: I'm Tommy Vitor, and this is our special series on
• 16:24
  Speaker 5: the Iowa caucuses. All along in this show, we've been
• 16:27
  Speaker 5: asking one question. Is this a good way to pick
• 16:30
  Speaker 5: a president? And if Iowa wasn't first, if this one
• 16:33
  Speaker 5: small state didn't have so much power, how else might
• 16:35
  Speaker 5: we do it? Elaine Kamar is basically as expert as
• 16:39
  Speaker 5: expert gets on this exact question. Would you mind just
• 16:42
  Speaker 5: stating your full name and your position at Brookings?
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: Sure.
• 16:45
  Speaker 10: Elaine Kamar, and I'm a senior fellow in governance studies
• 16:49
  Speaker 10: at the Brookings Institution. In the Clinton-Gore administration, I ran
• 16:54
  Speaker 10: a major project called Reinventing Government. I've been a Democratic
• 16:58
  Speaker 10: National Committee member since 1997 and a member of the
• 17:03
  Speaker 10: Rules and Bylaws Committee since then.
• 17:06
  Speaker 4: And she wrote a book called?
• 17:07
  Speaker 10: Primary Politics, Everything You Need to Know About How America
• 17:11
  Speaker 10: Nominates Its Presidential Candidates.
• 17:14
  Speaker 5: Street cred established. So here's a few ideas that people
• 17:18
  Speaker 5: have kicked around as an alternative to Iowa. We could
• 17:21
  Speaker 5: make another state first, probably one that's less white and
• 17:23
  Speaker 5: less rural. We could have a national primary where every
• 17:26
  Speaker 5: state has their primary on the same day.
• 17:29
  Speaker 10: You know, for all practical purposes, we kind of have
• 17:34
  Speaker 10: a national primary on Super Tuesday. Super Tuesday has gotten
• 17:39
  Speaker 10: so big and it plays such an outsized role that
• 17:44
  Speaker 10: it almost is that. The question is, do you want
• 17:49
  Speaker 10: to have a system where presidential candidates engage in retail politics?
• 17:56
  Speaker 10: In a national primary, they simply wouldn't. You might as
• 17:59
  Speaker 10: well just sit in a television studio in New York
• 18:03
  Speaker 10: and run your whole campaign from there. The reason these
• 18:07
  Speaker 10: small states keep their privileged status is because there's a
• 18:12
  Speaker 10: feeling that it's not a bad idea to force presidential
• 18:16
  Speaker 10: candidates to meet real people and have to interact with
• 18:20
  Speaker 10: real people. That would not happen if you ran a
• 18:24
  Speaker 10: national primary. That's what you would lose in the system.
• 18:28
  Speaker 5: A bunch of other proposals have been floated over the years.
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: The Delaware plan, where states vote in order from smallest
• 18:34
  Speaker 5: to largest. A rotating regional primary. The Ohio plan, which
• 18:38
  Speaker 5: is sort of a cross between the Delaware plan and
• 18:40
  Speaker 5: a rotating regional primary. Then there's the graduated random presidential primaries.
• 18:45
  Speaker 5: And I could barely wrap my head around this one
• 18:47
  Speaker 5: But the simple version is that it combines going in
• 18:49
  Speaker 5: size order with an element of randomness. So big states
• 18:52
  Speaker 5: like New York and California aren't always last. But all
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: of these proposals have their own problems. And inertia is
• 18:59
  Speaker 5: a powerful force.
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: Elaine K. Mark has one other idea, peer review.
• 19:04
  Speaker 5: Now, for those of us used to the modern primary process,
• 19:07
  Speaker 5: this might sound almost un-American. It's just a nicer way
• 19:10
  Speaker 5: of saying let the elites decide. I think it's also
• 19:13
  Speaker 5: fair to wonder if a peer review process would actually
• 19:16
  Speaker 5: just play into the hands of a candidate like Donald Trump,
• 19:19
  Speaker 5: who is running against Washington and pledging to burn the
• 19:22
  Speaker 5: system down. But when you hear Elaine explain it, it
• 19:25
  Speaker 5: sounds pretty smart.
• 19:27
  Speaker 10: You know, peer review simply means that your peers get
• 19:32
  Speaker 10: to say whether or not they think you are acceptable
• 19:36
  Speaker 10: and have the and the qualifications to do a job.
• 19:40
  Speaker 10: So when we license doctors, we go through other doctors,
• 19:45
  Speaker 10: license them. In other words, the public doesn't vote on
• 19:48
  Speaker 10: whether your neurosurgeon should be a neurosurgeon. Your other neurosurgeons
• 19:52
  Speaker 10: decide that. We used to have an element of peer
• 19:56
  Speaker 10: review in the old-fashioned nominating system because it was controlled
• 20:02
  Speaker 10: by other elected officials and politicians who And the process
• 20:08
  Speaker 10: of getting nominated in the old days was really a
• 20:12
  Speaker 10: process of negotiating with other politicians, which sounds to some
• 20:19
  Speaker 10: people terrible, and yet, hello, this is how we govern.
• 20:23
  Speaker 10: It is all about operating in a system of shared power.
• 20:28
  Speaker 10: What we've lost when we've gone from a system where
• 20:32
  Speaker 10: politicians had something to do with the process to a
• 20:36
  Speaker 10: system where it's essentially a glorified popularity contest or reality
• 20:41
  Speaker 10: television contest is we've lost the input of people who
• 20:46
  Speaker 10: know what sorts of things are necessary to actually govern.
• 20:52
  Speaker 10: And that's, I think, a huge critique of the system.
• 20:57
  Speaker 10: But it didn't really show up until 2016 when we
• 21:01
  Speaker 10: nominated the least qualified person ever to be president of
• 21:06
  Speaker 10: the United States, Donald Trump, and when we nominated someone
• 21:11
  Speaker 10: whose temperament was simply not suited to the job. And
• 21:16
  Speaker 10: so that should make us think about the vulnerability of
• 21:20
  Speaker 10: this system. I know my Democratic friends, they get all
• 21:23
  Speaker 10: upset when I say this could happen to us. They say, oh, no,
• 21:26
  Speaker 10: we could never nominate a Donald Trump. Well, that's just
• 21:29
  Speaker 10: not true. We could easily nominate a Donald Trump. we
• 21:33
  Speaker 10: are vulnerable in the future to nominating and sometimes electing demagogues,
• 21:39
  Speaker 10: which is, of course, the worst fear of our founding fathers.
• 21:43
  Speaker 5: So is this similar to, let's say, the American Bar Association,
• 21:46
  Speaker 5: where you rate a judge qualified or not qualified?
• 21:50
  Speaker 10: Yeah, my proposal is not to go back to the
• 21:53
  Speaker 10: smoke-filled rooms, because I think there were plenty of problems there.
• 21:57
  Speaker 10: My proposal is simply that the people who will govern
• 22:01
  Speaker 10: with a president of the United States should have a
• 22:05
  Speaker 10: chance to vote on them early in the process and
• 22:09
  Speaker 10: essentially have a vote of yes or no, qualified or
• 22:14
  Speaker 10: not qualified, purely and simply.
• 22:17
  Speaker 8: Yeah.
• 22:18
  Speaker 5: Do you think there are any downsides to including some
• 22:20
  Speaker 5: sort of peer review process?
• 22:23
  Speaker 10: Oh, I'm sure that people will say, oh, it's unfair,
• 22:27
  Speaker 10: it's elites, etc., However, to the extent that you limit
• 22:31
  Speaker 10: peer review to people who are elected, it's hard to
• 22:35
  Speaker 10: say that they're elites, right, because they've been actually elected
• 22:39
  Speaker 10: themselves in elections. I think that you could create a
• 22:44
  Speaker 10: peer review system in a variety of ways. You could
• 22:48
  Speaker 10: make it simply a vote of confidence or no confidence,
• 22:52
  Speaker 10: nothing attendant on it other than bad or good publicity.
• 22:57
  Speaker 10: Or you could go much further and you could say
• 23:00
  Speaker 10: people who don't get a vote of confidence can't be
• 23:03
  Speaker 10: on the debate stage in the primaries. Or you could
• 23:06
  Speaker 10: go even further and say they can't get on the ballot.
• 23:10
  Speaker 10: And let me dwell on that for a minute because
• 23:13
  Speaker 10: that reinforces my earlier point. In 1976, Lyndon LaRouche, a
• 23:18
  Speaker 10: cult leader, was on the New Hampshire ballot running as
• 23:22
  Speaker 10: a Democrat in the primaries. And the party chairman at
• 23:26
  Speaker 10: the time, Don Fowler, took Lyndon LaRouche to court and said,
• 23:31
  Speaker 10: we will not allow your name to be placed in
• 23:34
  Speaker 10: nomination at the Democratic Convention because we do not think
• 23:37
  Speaker 10: you are a Democrat. That case went all the way
• 23:40
  Speaker 10: to the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court said, yes, the
• 23:42
  Speaker 10: party has the right to declare who can be its
• 23:47
  Speaker 10: standard bearer. And Then when we got to the 80s
• 23:53
  Speaker 10: and a racist Ku Klux Klan leader named David Duke
• 23:57
  Speaker 10: kept running in Republican primaries, the Republican Party was sort
• 24:02
  Speaker 10: of fit to be tied because they didn't want to
• 24:04
  Speaker 10: be associated with a Klan leader. And sure enough, Scott Walker,
• 24:08
  Speaker 10: who was the former governor of Wisconsin, who was a
• 24:11
  Speaker 10: young party chairman at the time, kept David Duke off
• 24:15
  Speaker 10: the Wisconsin Republican primary ballot, saying, look, this man has
• 24:19
  Speaker 10: no right. We don't consider him a Republican. So parties,
• 24:24
  Speaker 10: you know, in the extreme cases, political parties have said, no,
• 24:28
  Speaker 10: you are not capable of the job. And we do
• 24:32
  Speaker 10: not feel that you can run as the standard bearer
• 24:34
  Speaker 10: of this party.
• 24:37
  Speaker 5: Of course, the job right now in Iowa and everywhere
• 24:39
  Speaker 5: is for Democrats to figure out who our standard bearer
• 24:42
  Speaker 5: will be in 2020. And even though the Iowa caucuses
• 24:46
  Speaker 5: are less than two months away, the polls are still
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: changing all the time, which means organizers like Olivia Ellis
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: are still out there grinding.
• 24:53
  Speaker 4: We checked in by phone last week.
• 24:55
  Speaker 13: We're not just talking to someone once, learning that they're
• 24:58
  Speaker 13: undecided and then visiting them again the day before the
• 25:01
  Speaker 13: Iowa caucuses, right? We're going to these places every single
• 25:04
  Speaker 13: weekend and making the case for Elizabeth and what she's
• 25:07
  Speaker 13: fighting for. I was knocking in a precinct and I
• 25:12
  Speaker 13: got to one of my doors and someone answered the
• 25:14
  Speaker 13: door and went, oh, Olivia, I recognize you. I'm leaning
• 25:18
  Speaker 13: towards Elizabeth now.
• 25:20
  Speaker 5: Did they recognize you because you'd been at that door
• 25:22
  Speaker 5: before or how did they know you?
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: Yeah, yes, yes, yes.
• 25:25
  Speaker 13: Because I'm just constantly knocking on doors or my precinct
• 25:28
  Speaker 13: captains are knocking on doors or, you know, volunteers are
• 25:31
  Speaker 13: knocking on doors. So people for sure are undecided in Iowa.
• 25:36
  Speaker 13: I mean, you see it. But I mean, that's why
• 25:39
  Speaker 13: we just have to work three times as hard. And
• 25:42
  Speaker 13: just because they're undecided doesn't mean we're going.
• 25:44
  Speaker 8: To give up.
• 25:45
  Speaker 4: No, no. Unfortunately for them, the exact opposite.
• 25:48
  Speaker 13: Yeah, exactly.
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: See you tomorrow.
• 25:51
  Speaker 13: Yeah.
• 25:52
  Speaker 8: Yep.
• 25:53
  Speaker 5: Mitch Smith, Cory Booker's organizer, is out there doing the
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: same thing. And counterintuitively, he says the cold weather actually
• 26:00
  Speaker 5: kind of helps.
• 26:01
  Speaker 6: I found that in the summer when it was 100 degrees,
• 26:04
  Speaker 6: people with air conditioning inside said, you know, come on in,
• 26:07
  Speaker 6: have a glass of water, let's chat. And now, you know,
• 26:10
  Speaker 6: knocking in the snow, we've had very similar interactions. And
• 26:13
  Speaker 6: that's the nice thing about Iowa. The old moniker of
• 26:15
  Speaker 6: Iowa Nice is Iowa.
• 26:18
  Speaker 10: Is true.
• 26:18
  Speaker 6: I can assure you of that. I think the biggest
• 26:21
  Speaker 6: thing is I was home this past Thanksgiving. There were
• 26:25
  Speaker 6: some cable news that was turned on and there were
• 26:27
  Speaker 6: some folks saying this is a two horse race or
• 26:29
  Speaker 6: a three horse race or a four horse race in Iowa.
• 26:32
  Speaker 6: But I think the biggest thing is just the level
• 26:34
  Speaker 6: of undecided voters is so high that this thing is
• 26:37
  Speaker 6: so much more wide open than it's being depicted on
• 26:40
  Speaker 6: a national scale. So there is a lot that can
• 26:43
  Speaker 6: happen in the next two months. This thing is wide open.
• 26:47
  Speaker 5: Margaret Giroux has worked for Beto O'Rourke in Iowa this
• 26:49
  Speaker 5: year and was a regional director for the Bernie Sanders
• 26:52
  Speaker 5: campaign in 2016. She knows Iowa politics really well.
• 26:57
  Speaker 14: The biggest thing that people talk about is health care.
• 27:00
  Speaker 14: I think that a lot of that has to do
• 27:01
  Speaker 14: with the fact that Iowa hasn't expanded Medicaid. And we've
• 27:05
  Speaker 14: just passed one of the strictest abortion laws in the country. But, like,
• 27:12
  Speaker 14: people want to talk about health care and specifically mental health.
• 27:15
  Speaker 14: That's the thing that comes up. pretty much everywhere.
• 27:18
  Speaker 5: The other thing that comes up everywhere, obviously, is just
• 27:21
  Speaker 5: beating Trump. And she says that focus is actually helping
• 27:24
  Speaker 5: heal some of the wounds from the Clinton-Sanders primary.
• 27:27
  Speaker 14: I don't know if people know this, but, like, Trump
• 27:29
  Speaker 14: won Iowa by more votes than he won Texas.
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: Right, right.
• 27:34
  Speaker 14: Like, beating Trump, I think, is a pretty personal thing
• 27:38
  Speaker 14: to Iowans that actually go in caucus. I mean, they
• 27:41
  Speaker 14: want to save their state in a way.
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: Yeah, no.
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: Save the state, save the country, save all of us.
• 27:48
  Speaker 5: In seven weeks, hundreds of thousands of Iowans will begin
• 27:51
  Speaker 5: taking on that responsibility. As you may have heard, they
• 27:54
  Speaker 5: take it very seriously. After February 3rd, the campaign season
• 27:58
  Speaker 5: goes into overdrive. The New Hampshire primary is February 11th.
• 28:02
  Speaker 5: The Nevada caucuses are the 22nd, and the South Carolina
• 28:05
  Speaker 5: primary is on the 29th. Super Tuesday is exactly one
• 28:09
  Speaker 5: month after the Iowa caucuses on March 3rd. So by spring,
• 28:13
  Speaker 5: hopefully we'll have a much clearer idea of who will
• 28:16
  Speaker 5: be on the ballot in November. And whoever becomes the nominee,
• 28:20
  Speaker 5: that campaign will be stronger. That team will be smarter
• 28:23
  Speaker 5: because of all the work that's happened in Iowa.
• 28:26
  Speaker 4: Here's Mitch.
• 28:27
  Speaker 6: I think that the level of importance of this election
• 28:32
  Speaker 6: is unparalleled. And I think that everyone on every campaign
• 28:35
  Speaker 6: recognizes that regardless of who ends up winning the caucus
• 28:38
  Speaker 6: and who ends up winning the nomination, that we are
• 28:40
  Speaker 6: all going to be on the same team eventually.
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: And here's Olivia.
• 28:43
  Speaker 7: I mean.
• 28:44
  Speaker 13: The only way we're going to get this thing done
• 28:47
  Speaker 13: is if people want to be a part of this movement.
• 28:51
  Speaker 13: And I think a lot of people, you know, started
• 28:54
  Speaker 13: out in 2016 and they don't want to feel that
• 28:57
  Speaker 13: way again. They want to be knocking doors and making
• 28:59
  Speaker 13: phone calls and doing everything they possibly can to stand
• 29:03
  Speaker 13: behind the candidate that they think can get this thing done.
• 29:09
  Speaker 5: I've spent months now thinking about whether Iowa is the
• 29:11
  Speaker 5: right place to make this choice.
• 29:13
  Speaker 4: And honestly, I still don't know for sure.
• 29:15
  Speaker 5: But the reality is, as long as candidates who win
• 29:18
  Speaker 5: the nomination continue to protect Iowa's role in that process,
• 29:22
  Speaker 5: it's going to stay first.
• 29:24
  Speaker 4: O.K.
• 29:24
  Speaker 5: Henderson is the news director at Radio Iowa. And if
• 29:27
  Speaker 5: you want to know what's happening in the caucus campaigns,
• 29:29
  Speaker 5: you should follow her on Twitter because she's a damn
• 29:32
  Speaker 5: good reporter. Now, Kay is used to doing interviews, not
• 29:35
  Speaker 5: being interviewed, but she graciously agreed to talk with me
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: back in August.
• 29:40
  Speaker 2: It is the system that will exist until there's a
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: president sitting in the Oval Office who says, I want
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: to blow it up and I want something different. Until
• 29:50
  Speaker 2: that person is elected, the Iowa caucuses probably will persevere.
• 29:56
  Speaker 5: Whether or not they persevere could be dependent on the
• 29:59
  Speaker 5: caucus results themselves. If a candidate who skipped Iowa ends
• 30:02
  Speaker 5: up getting the nomination, they will have far less incentive
• 30:05
  Speaker 5: to keep Iowa first. But whatever system we devise is
• 30:08
  Speaker 5: going to have flaws, and maybe those flaws are just
• 30:11
  Speaker 5: part of being a democracy.
• 30:13
  Speaker 15: My two favorite words are more perfect.
• 30:17
  Speaker 4: That's Rob Sandigan. He's the Iowa State Auditor. We talked
• 30:20
  Speaker 4: last week.
• 30:21
  Speaker 15: The idea being that there is no such thing as perfection.
• 30:23
  Speaker 15: Even if you were to create a perfect system, The
• 30:26
  Speaker 15: next day, the world would change.
• 30:27
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 30:27
  Speaker 15: And that system would no longer, the world that it
• 30:29
  Speaker 15: was created for would no longer be there.
• 30:31
  Speaker 13: Right.
• 30:32
  Speaker 15: I think we should always just be in the pursuit
• 30:34
  Speaker 15: of improving everything and making everything more perfect.
• 30:36
  Speaker 4: That's a great way to look at government writ large, frankly.
• 30:38
  Speaker 15: Thank you. It's not my idea. I can't take credit
• 30:41
  Speaker 15: for that one.
• 30:42
  Speaker 4: Yeah, the more perfect union. I feel like that was
• 30:43
  Speaker 4: written somewhere. I can't remember.
• 30:45
  Speaker 15: I think I've read it before somewhere.
• 30:46
  Speaker 5: I mean, maybe that's the answer I'm looking for here. Like,
• 30:49
  Speaker 5: is this a good way to pick a president? Traveling
• 30:53
  Speaker 5: to 99 counties in one state, meeting with people who
• 30:55
  Speaker 5: ultimately will stand in the corner of a high school
• 30:57
  Speaker 5: gym and say they like you.
• 31:00
  Speaker 4: Is that perfect? I don't know. But maybe that's more
• 31:03
  Speaker 4: perfect than the alternative.
• 31:05
  Speaker 5: Whether or not you think this is the best way
• 31:07
  Speaker 5: to pick a president, the Iowa caucuses are happening. On
• 31:11
  Speaker 5: February 3rd, thousands of Iowans are going to brave the cold,
• 31:14
  Speaker 5: join their neighbors, and help pick the Democratic nominee. As
• 31:17
  Speaker 5: the field organizers have told us, it feels like the
• 31:20
  Speaker 5: whole country is watching. The fifth and final episode of
• 31:23
  Speaker 5: this series will come in late January, right before Caucus Night.
• 31:26
  Speaker 5: We'll check back in with Mitch and Olivia one last
• 31:29
  Speaker 5: time as they approach the finish line.
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: In Iowa, at least.
• 31:35
  Speaker 5: I'm Tommy Vitor. This series is produced by Kat Aaron.
• 31:38
  Speaker 5: Production help from Justine Daum and Agarenish Ashagre.
• 31:42
  Speaker 4: Joel Lovell is our editor. Music and mixing by Hannes Brown.
• 31:46
  Speaker 5: The executive producers at Pineapple Street Studios are Jenna Weiss-Berman
• 31:49
  Speaker 5: and Max Linsky. Thanks to Elena Schwartz and Nancy Rosenbaum.
• 31:53
  Speaker 5: A special thank you to Tanya Sominator, Sarah Wick, Michael Martinez,
• 31:56
  Speaker 5: Kyle Seglin, Brian Semel, Mickey Fancy, and Jordan Silver from
• 32:00
  Speaker 5: the Crooked Media team.