Latest / Back In The Closet - Two Crazy Cat Ladies / Senior & End of Life Care For Cats with Dr. Lindsey Wendt

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Senior & End of Life Care For Cats with Dr. Lindsey Wendt · Back In The Closet - Two Crazy Cat Ladies

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OK, so now let's get to the podcast.
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With wine. Always with wine.
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I'm Jay. I'm Adrian.
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And together we are. There's two crazy cat ladies.
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I'm going. To cut you, I think I just peed.
0:52
Buckle up. We're back in the closet.
0:58
Welcome. To another episode of Back in
1:00
the Closet with the 2 crazy cat ladies.
1:02
We are super excited to once again have back the gorgeous
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doctor. Lindsay went with us today to
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discuss a very a very important topic, but a topic that I don't
1:14
feel like it's discussed enough and more cat parents need to
1:17
hear which is senior and end of life stages for for our kitties.
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Dr. Lindsay, thank you so much for joining us again.
1:25
Thank you so much for having me, and especially a topic that's so
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near and dear to my heart both professionally and personally.
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It's a tough one. I feel like it's well, we're
1:35
about to dive in. I.
1:36
Forgot our tissues? Right, Let's not do that yet.
1:39
But for anyone that hasn't already met you, I know that we
1:42
did an Instagram Live with you before we were talking about
1:44
right Ratio and what an awesome product that is and how it's
1:47
been helping our Annie. This is a completely different
1:50
topic and now we're on YouTube and Facebook, so we may have a
1:54
bunch of new people here tonight.
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Could you share a little bit about who you are and kind of a
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little bit about your journey, which is so fascinating and how
2:01
you've come to do what you do? Certainly.
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So my name is Doctor Lindsay Went.
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I am an integrated veterinarian that practices in Los Angeles,
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CA. I started my career very
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conventionally, so working GP and emergency working on dogs
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and cats actually initially was working with zoo animals.
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So I took a little bit of a, a turn back to the domestic
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species after that. And then through a journey that
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was really spurred by my own heart dog who we lost last June,
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Nala. I found my true passion and true
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calling, which is integrative medicine and just finding new
2:35
novel cutting edge solutions to be able to help our individual
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animal companions. So at this point in my career,
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which has changed quite a bit, I would say I spend about half of
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my time in industry and half of my time clinically.
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So I still see patients. I do a lot of precision
2:52
medicine, but on the the more industry side of things, I'm
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formulating products, I'm advising companies, I'm starting
2:59
clinical trials with some botanicals, which I would love
3:02
to talk about with you all. Because this is going to be a
3:05
community effort because we're going to need people to
3:07
participate. But really just looking for more
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natural health solutions for our companions so that we can keep
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them as healthy as possible for as long as possible.
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Yeah. Oh my gosh, do you sleep?
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I do you. Have a very busy schedule so
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yeah to look so bright and vibrant we're just we're really
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excited really excited for you to be here and for this topic.
3:35
So let's dive right in when it, when we're talking about
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seniors, I wanted, I want to just start with my pet peeve.
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I know we're going to get into end of life and stuff like that,
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but the I, you know, we're writing a book right now and I
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was doing a lot of I've I've so I've been doing like deep dive
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and research and stuff like that.
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And one of the, one of the latest stats that I read as far
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as the longevity of indoor cats, you know, we were, I was looking
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at the comparison of outdoor cats to indoor cats and how long
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they live. And they said that it's 12 to 15
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years is the the average lifespan of an indoor cat.
4:14
The the oldest cat in the the oldest cats were well in their
4:19
30s. End of the 38 years old is the
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oldest 2 cats, but well into their 30s and cats, there's been
4:26
many documented cases of cats living, you know, late 20s.
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Yet right now the veterinarian industry labels a cat as a
4:36
senior and sometimes tries to start feeding them as a senior,
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if there's, if that's even a thing, a real thing.
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But they they try to start feeding them senior foods as
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young as like 7-8, nine years old.
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What? What age do you think we as cat
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parents can label our cats, if you will, as senior cat?
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Yeah. And I know this is a very
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sensitive subject for many of us, right, because we think
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senior and we start to spiral. We start thinking of disease and
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end of life and a lot of the things we're going to talk about
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today. So in my mind, the reason I use
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the term senior is I want you as their guardian to be more aware
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of these small changes that you may be noticing and you change
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your approach to how we're even screening them health wise.
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So, you know, a lot of adult cats will have blood work when
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they're spayed or neutered maybe once or twice if they are ill.
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But then after that, oftentimes we're waiting until there's a
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problem to check diagnostics. So for me, I will share with
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people, I consider them seniors anywhere from 8 to 10 years of
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age. And that really depends on the
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individual cat, right? If it's a purebred cat or maybe
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a cat that has had a significant health issue at a younger age
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and we're worried about them being more predisposed to kidney
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disease or hyperthyroidism or diabetes, I want us to start
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considering them to be a senior earlier so that we're doing
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yearly blood work, checking blood pressure, maybe checking
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chest X-rays. So a lot of that is it's, again,
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I'm going to keep saying this probably over and over again, it
6:10
depends on them as an individual.
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And also being a senior is not a scary label.
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It's just giving us all awareness so that we're meeting
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them where they are and being proactive and preventative.
6:21
Yes. Yeah, I love that.
6:23
So what is? What are some of the things
6:24
because I I feel like exactly like you said, you say senior
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and some of us will really start to spiral.
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It's like, Oh my God, how much time do we have left right.
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It, it becomes a more of a, it becomes a thing, right.
6:38
So what are some of the things though, when you're, when
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you're, I like how you just said that, that, you know, you want
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more diagnosed diagnostics the older that they get.
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And certainly, you know, we've even said, you know, once you
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have a senior Kitty, we want to do those blood panels twice a
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year because things can change so quickly.
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However, there are lots of cats that are super vibrant.
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They're 1617 years old. They don't.
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They act kind of like a kitten. Are there certain subtle things
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that you are you think that we should be watching for to, you
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know, it's like this, this cat's going to live forever, right?
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When we know cats are stoic, so they're not going to tell us
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when they're not feeling well. What are some of the subtle
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things that we should be watching for when we know we're
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getting into those advanced? Years and and can you talk about
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both the subtle things in the blood work as well as the subtle
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things in like day-to-day what we look at symptoms, if you
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will? Definitely.
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So on a day-to-day kind of observational basis, a lot of
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the things we will see and I think this is important
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differentiation is we have to separate aging from signs of
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disease because as any of us age, we're going to start
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slowing down, We're going to have a little bit of muscle loss
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that can be expected dramatic changes, so dramatic muscle
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loss. And I think the big one for cats
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that is so underdiagnosed that I know we touched on before is
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mobility. Your 12 year old cat should be
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able to still jump up on a surface, a high surface.
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And when you notice that starting to change, that's often
8:10
the first indication that they're having arthritis.
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And when we look at the numbers, 60% of cats 6 and older are
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affected by arthritis, 90% of cats over the age of 12.
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So there are more senior cats out there with arthritis than
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dogs, but it is so under diagnosed in cats.
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Again, because they are stoic, their changes will be very
8:36
subtle. I have a great example of this
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actually that just happened last week.
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A Kitty that lives in the household of where I treat a
8:43
dog. We always chat about him just
8:45
casually. And they had mentioned that his
8:46
behavior had changed over the past six months and that when he
8:50
went to the vet just for his annual checkup and to get blood
8:52
work, he was almost fractious with them.
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And I was like, well, that's really out of character.
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Did they check any X-rays? And they said no.
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And I said, OK, well, why don't you try?
9:02
Let's assume, you know, based on the statistics that he has
9:05
arthritis and that maybe there was something about that
9:07
examination procedure that was uncomfortable for him, which is
9:11
why he had such a different reaction.
9:13
And perhaps that's why his behavior has been changing at
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home. So they put him on a joint
9:16
supplement. And I just checked in with her a
9:18
few days ago. It's he's so different already.
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So it's, it's those little subtleties and you can, they're
9:27
very observant, like I've known them for years.
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So it's not that they missed the signs.
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The signs are just really, really subtle.
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So yeah, look for changes in the litter box, you know, are they
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missing the litter box? Of course sometimes that is more
9:40
behavioral, but a lot of times that can be it's uncomfortable
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for me or I don't feel safe here.
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So just really assessing any sort of change and asking
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yourself, is this a change that happened and then it's
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continuing? Is it just a one off because
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there was a stressful incident? Of course, the easy things like
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appetite and water intake, their breathing pattern.
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And this is where I don't ever want people to be too nervous.
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But let's say you have a cat that has a heart murmur, you
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know, diagnosed very young, Check their resting breathing
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rate, you know, even a few times a month or once a week, and just
10:16
keep a log of that. And if you notice that it starts
10:18
increasing, that's an early indicator to take them in for
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screening rather than when they're fully presenting in
10:25
heart failure, which is so often how we end up diagnosing them.
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We don't catch them early. So it's a lot of the subtleties.
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But a lot of it with cats especially is their behavior.
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If it's normally, you know, you're living with a normally
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very social cat or you know, a cat that's social with some
10:39
people but is selective. And if you're starting to notice
10:42
a shift, rather than assuming, oh, their personality is
10:45
changing because they're older, which I mean, of course is
10:47
possible because they sometimes become more sovereign and want
10:50
to do things differently. But sometimes it's because
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they're uncomfortable. Sometimes it's because they're
10:55
having crystals in their urine and it's causing irritation or
10:58
arthritis or there's intestinal discomfort.
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So a lot of it is knowing them and also knowing that you as an
11:06
observer, that is a very powerful tool.
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So when my clients tell me something, I take that to heart
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and we dissect it together because perhaps we'll come to
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the end of the road and it's not anything to be concerned of.
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But sometimes those subtle signs allow us to diagnose them very
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early on. Which is right, especially with
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our kiddies cause a lot of these, you know, the the chronic
11:28
degenerative diseases that the majority of our cats
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unfortunately suffer from there it's not some, it's not some
11:35
infectious disease, it's these chronic degenerative diseases
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that happen over time when they're caught early, we can
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often especially naturally help stop or reverse those those
11:47
issues 100. Percent.
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So when, when we're talking about senior care, and I know
11:53
that we're kind of blurring that line between, you know, a
11:56
disease process and, and senior care, because it's, it's there's
12:00
subtleties there for sure. And the disease process can
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certainly accelerate the aging process as well.
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Would you say that the the best what, what do you consider the
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best proactive tool then? Is it, is it that observation?
12:15
Is it senior cat food, right. Like, I love that you mentioned
12:20
you're feisty tonight, but I love that you mentioned their
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resting heart rate. A lot of us don't know that.
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I thought it was a lot. I thought they're right.
12:28
When I was looking into checking your cat's vitals, it was a lot
12:31
lower than I thought it would be for a cat.
12:34
Another thing like checking their weight.
12:35
We were talking with Doctor Ruth Roberts today.
12:37
How, you know, just weighing your cat once a month.
12:40
What are some specifics that we can do?
12:42
Not out of fear and you know that panic place, but just out
12:48
of being proactive. What are some tangible tools?
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Definitely. So I love the idea of a monthly
12:54
weight check. You can purchase a scale pretty
12:56
inexpensively. Like I even have an infant human
12:59
scale, perfect for cats. It's small.
13:02
You tuck it away in a closet every month.
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Everyone gets weighed, and that way you can catch those little
13:06
subtle increases and take action.
13:09
So yeah, I think weight is great.
13:11
Resting breathing rate for any Kitty that has a history of any
13:14
sort of asthma or heart disease. Really easy and free tool to do.
13:19
And then also, as silly as it is, journaling, even sit there
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and say, you know, like, these are all the things that they're
13:25
able to do right now or these are their favorite things.
13:27
And that will kind of circle back to later.
13:30
And there's a lot of guidance available.
13:33
So Cornell, the School of Veterinary Medicine has a great
13:37
feline medicine portal on their website that has a lot of
13:39
information that people can read on just to see, OK, you know,
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what sort of changes should I be concerned with?
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Is it that they're jumping and being a little bit more hesitant
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or is it that they're missing? Or are they just shifting
13:54
completely and avoiding some of the things that they normally
13:57
did? I think water intake is another
14:00
big one and that's a hard one to monitor, right?
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Especially in a multi cat household.
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So sometimes it's even asking yourself, do I normally see them
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drink water, right. And then now am I noticing it?
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And I'm not going to disregard that because that is
14:13
significant, especially with cats because a lot of people
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won't really see their cats drink water very often depending
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on what kind of food that they're on.
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So if you're noticing that and you didn't before, consider that
14:25
a change worth exploring any sort of like coughing or
14:29
breathing changes too, like they never made that little cough at
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night or you know, I hear them coughing early in the morning.
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All of those changes are significant and worth
14:39
exploration or at least a further conversation about.
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When it comes to blood work, this is where a nice full
14:45
screening panel and having a good baseline when they're
14:48
healthy is so helpful. Because I will tell you and I
14:52
haven't seen this as much in kitties, but I'm I can easily
14:55
imagine that it exists. The blood reference ranges that
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we use in the standard laboratories, they are based on
15:03
animals eating kibble. OK.
15:06
So when we are feeding our animals raw or gently cooked or
15:10
a kind of more, you know, species or biologically
15:12
appropriate diet, if you will, I have seen some of those
15:15
reference ranges almost shipped for the individual.
15:19
So if I see that they constantly have either a low or a high
15:22
value, but it's been like that since they were young, I'm going
15:25
to be far less concerned seeing that as a senior snapshot than
15:29
if that's the first time we ever got blood.
15:30
And now we're going down a rabbit hole of what does this
15:33
mean versus tracking them individually.
15:36
And there are some really sensitive kidney markers because
15:39
we all know kidney diseases, you know, one of the biggest
15:42
diseases that we deal with with our kiddies.
15:45
So with kidney disease, you know, making sure that the
15:47
panels have an SDMA or a renal tech, those are the two kind of
15:51
early indicators that the two major laboratories use because
15:55
that will change before their BUN and creatinine go up.
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And then another thing that is a pet peeve of mine that was
16:02
drilled into me by the internist that trained me is really for a
16:05
cat, always check urine if you can because that is the first
16:10
thing that will change. But a lot of times if you don't
16:13
ask for it and just depending on your veterinarian, they may not
16:17
do it. So you might be missing an
16:18
opportunity to again, catch kidney disease really early and
16:22
then start taking proactive steps like starting natural
16:24
supplementation and you just having more awareness phosphate
16:27
binders. So I would say with blood work,
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that's one of the biggest changes in the same thing with
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their red and white blood cell count.
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If we see that their normal tends to be on the lower end of
16:38
the reference range, OK. And then if we see that, you
16:40
know dropping or increasing, then we can act accordingly
16:43
versus just that single snapshot.
16:45
So I think the investment in taking those values periodically
16:50
and knowing kind of their own rhythm and then one little tip
16:54
or trick is even as simple as you know, are they fasted or not
16:57
before the blood work, which is not required.
16:59
But when you're comparing it, especially with BUN and
17:02
creatinine, you can see shifts, you can see shifts in their
17:04
urine pH depending. So you want to try and again,
17:07
this goes back to that journal, try to keep things as consistent
17:10
as possible or make a note of it.
17:12
Like, you know, this time we did it in the morning or this time
17:15
we did it at night. Or, you know, they were really
17:18
stressed on the way to the hospital this time because that
17:20
will even cause some of their blood values to change
17:22
temporarily. And then the last thing is blood
17:25
pressure. Please, please, please advocate
17:28
for screening blood pressure early.
17:30
Now, cats can be really, you know, nervous in a hospital
17:33
setting and we can see that artificially increase.
17:36
However, there's a kind of zone where it's OK, this is a little
17:41
bit high because of white coat syndrome or they're nervous and
17:43
then there's, oh, wait a second. This is high enough that if it's
17:46
not addressed, they're at risk of having worsening of their
17:49
kidney disease or even development of it kind of
17:52
pressure on their kidneys and then having blindness, sudden
17:56
blindness. So that's how a lot of people
17:57
end up learning that their cats have high blood pressure is they
18:01
will have retinal detachment and that's the first sign.
18:04
So being able to have that screening tool early as well.
18:08
And it's very non invasive, but that's another tip.
18:12
That I recommend for people. To advocate for.
18:15
I love that we had, we had the experience of watching them take
18:20
our Madison Grace's blood pressure when she had an
18:22
emergency last summer. And it's, it's not like, it's
18:26
not like they just slap the cuff on women.
18:29
Like, yeah, yeah. Like us humans, where they're
18:30
just like, keep your arms still. You're.
18:33
Like OK, but I. Really love this journaling tip.
18:35
And I know I, I'm that kind of person.
18:37
I'll be like, was that yesterday or is that six months ago?
18:39
You know, and I can't keep track.
18:41
So a lot of times if if our cats are doing something like like
18:45
what is this about, I will take a video of it.
18:47
And so I really encourage that video journaling or picture
18:52
journaling as well, because then it is time stamp.
18:53
Then I can look back and see, but how valuable that is.
18:56
Because in our busy lives, it's easy to lose track of it or not
19:00
realize when something, you know, if something is starting
19:03
to increase. Also real quick back to the back
19:06
to the resting heart rate. I know we've got a few folks.
19:09
I love all these beautiful people here, people acting, what
19:12
is there? What's the appropriate resting
19:14
heart rate for a cat, and what's the best way to check it?
19:18
Yeah, so resting heart rate. So the easiest way to check it
19:21
if your cat will allow is just to gently.
19:23
So if they're laying on their side and let's say this is their
19:26
chest, if you will kind of just cup your hand around and rest
19:30
gently right behind the elbow sort of armpit area and you'll
19:35
feel their heart beating. The place I always like to check
19:38
is their back pulses, which are in their back leg pit.
19:42
And if you press in there and if your kiddies comfortable with
19:44
that, you can also feel there and, and take that measurement.
19:49
What I would also recommend is starting to feel or touch those
19:52
areas before you actually want to just take the measurement so
19:55
that they get used to and they're like, OK, this is kind
19:57
of a weird way of petting, but I'll tolerate it so that they're
20:00
not as nervous when you actually want to assess that value.
20:03
Now, when they're really at rest at home, completely peaceful,
20:08
you know, normally we say a normal heart rate is 160 to 180.
20:12
But again, for a cat at home that's totally at rest, we could
20:16
probably even see them drop down a little bit lower than that.
20:18
It's not something that we get to experience a lot as
20:20
practitioners. So even again, having that
20:23
consistent evaluation tool for the individual is great.
20:27
When they're stressed, we can definitely see that go up closer
20:29
to 2:40. And then in terms of the
20:32
breathing rate, that one when they, yeah, when you want to
20:35
check that you want them to be resting, like fully asleep.
20:40
If, if I, if I deal, you know, or at least very, very rested
20:44
and calm and also making sure they're not purring.
20:46
So that's the hard part is purring will throw this off and
20:49
make it look higher. But when they're not purring in
20:51
their calm, you can sometimes see respiration rates as low as
20:54
16. And then once we start getting
20:56
up above, you know, at rest, if they're comfortable and they're
20:59
breathing above or at 30 breaths per minute, so we're talking one
21:03
breath every two seconds, that is a red flag.
21:06
So that's a time where you want to really take them in and have
21:10
them checked out, especially if they have that history.
21:13
Yeah. And again, that's not, that's
21:15
not after they've been running in and out of the catio and
21:18
stuff like that. This is when they've
21:19
established, you know, they are, they've been sleeping on the
21:21
couch or something like that. Yeah, completely relaxed.
21:25
And the purring artifact can really throw people too, so just
21:27
make sure that they're not purring right?
21:29
Yeah. Yeah, put your ear up close if
21:31
you if you can. I love.
21:34
All these tools real quick, just.
21:35
Because we have this question here, someone is asking, Karen
21:38
is asking what if a cat starts to lose their hearing?
21:41
Is that a possible sign of something as well as that, like
21:45
a symptom of and what would it be?
21:48
Great question. So conventional medicine, so
21:51
Western medicine, not really. I mean in theory if they have an
21:55
inner ear infection or they have some sort of like vascular or
21:59
stroke like event to that inner ear nerve, they could lose their
22:03
hearing. What is very interesting is in
22:06
Chinese medicine, the kidney is responsible for hearing and is
22:11
responsible for the bones. So the kidney as an organ is
22:15
associated with arthritis and it's associated with deafness.
22:19
So if you were to notice, anytime anyone notices deafness,
22:22
my first impulse is check the kidneys and make sure that
22:25
they're not starting to have a decline.
22:27
Because typically you would think that we would see the
22:30
kidney values change first, but that's not always the case.
22:32
It just depends on how the body is distributing that energy.
22:36
That's a very, very good question.
22:39
That's very interesting. Yeah.
22:41
Wow. OK.
22:42
So an incredible amount of proactive tools, and I really
22:45
love your direction on that. That's very practical and
22:48
empowering. Once we know that we do have a
22:52
bona fide senior Kitty, how do you, you know, I think it does
22:56
get into that quality of life, but again, the signs are so
23:00
subtle. Sometimes it's difficult for us
23:02
to recognize when things are really starting to infringe on
23:06
that quality of life, and we might even just be a little bit
23:09
in denial about it, which is why journaling is also so well.
23:12
Yeah, I mean, I think, you know, let's let's kind of like, let's
23:17
kind of like give us scenario, right?
23:19
Like so that, so because we're, you've already covered like how
23:22
important it is to make sure that we're doing the blood work
23:25
and we're we're taking care and we can do a whole episode on
23:27
kidney disease and a whole episode on hyperthyroidism and
23:30
all those things. But to talk just generally about
23:33
senior care, let's say that you know, they might have some
23:36
health problems, some arthritis. It is kidney levels are a little
23:39
bit elevated. This is very common, right that
23:41
we see a little elevated, but not too bad kind of have it
23:44
under control feeding him a pretty good diet if that's where
23:48
we're at now we're finish your sentence.
23:50
I forget what the question was. How do?
23:52
You, How do you as a veterinarian, you know, in
23:54
practice, if when someone comes in with their senior Kitty that,
23:57
you know, is already dealing with a few things that are being
24:00
mitigated, how do you assess their quality of life?
24:04
Yeah. That is a great question.
24:05
And there are some actual scales available.
24:08
So one of my favorites is the scale that's literally what it
24:12
looks like. It's 5HS and 2M's.
24:14
And it was developed by a veterinarian named Doctor Alice
24:17
Villalobos, who actually was at the practice that I first came
24:21
out and kind of started my career at.
24:23
So I got to work alongside her a bit and it's a very simple
24:26
scale. It's really meant to empower
24:28
Guardian. So hunger levels, happiness, you
24:32
know, are they grooming? Just the basics.
24:34
But start scaling them earlier than you need to so that you can
24:39
start noticing those changes over time.
24:42
There are more kind of standard quality of life scales that you
24:45
can find. Lap of Love has a great 1.
24:48
Ohio State University has one that they use as well.
24:51
So there's a lot of scales and tools that are, I'm going to say
24:54
validated, but more like respected both by professionals
24:58
and guardians. So it's approachable.
25:00
It doesn't feel, you know, too daunting, but it is a very easy
25:03
way of having a quantitative assessment.
25:07
You can literally score them. So you can watch that score over
25:09
time practicing integrative medicine.
25:12
I think for me, you know, I look at a lot of things like what is
25:15
their energy level like? Like when you look in their
25:17
eyes, do they have that brightness and that vigor?
25:20
Or do they look kind of sad or depleted?
25:23
Because that for me is their Shen or their mind.
25:27
And we know from human longevity, the three biggest
25:31
categories that affect longevity and health, span and lifespan
25:35
really are cognitive health, immune system health and
25:39
skeletal muscle, which I was shocked.
25:41
But that is a really, really big measure for them.
25:44
And I think that that's something that we need to all
25:46
start paying more attention to with our kiddies because it's
25:49
directly linked to how healthy they will be when they're older
25:54
and also how long they'll live, Like if we're going to translate
25:57
that over from the human side. So I think when you're watching
26:02
for their activity level, we also want to make sure that
26:08
we're encouraging activity. And this is something that I, I
26:11
love to talk about. I know it's hard because it
26:13
depends on the cat, but try to find what they love to do and
26:18
then also take know when that shifts and ask why is that
26:21
shifting? Like have they truly lost
26:22
interest or is it uncomfortable for them to do it?
26:26
And then also how they're interacting even of course, with
26:28
the people in the house, but also the other animals, their
26:31
appetite, you know, are they vomiting a few times a month and
26:34
they weren't before? Maybe they're having soft stool
26:36
every so often or again, you're finding stool outside of the
26:39
litter box. You know, is that discomfort
26:41
from their intestinal tract or from arthritis?
26:43
There's so many little time points to be able to assess.
26:46
And then also it doesn't have to be a journey.
26:49
You have to take a loan. And so if you have a partner,
26:54
both of you should scale them separately, have your separate
26:56
scores and keep track of those separately because sometimes
26:59
someone will be more aware of a certain behavior or shift than
27:03
the other. And it's really important to
27:04
come together or, you know, if there's anyone else living in
27:07
the house, they can also participate.
27:10
But I think that's also a really powerful tool.
27:13
And for a lot of us that, you know, as a culture, we don't
27:15
really deal with grief well. We're not taught how to, right?
27:19
So I know we'll get into this, but even.
27:23
Free. Bereavement, like when you get
27:26
to that point that you're starting to see some changes,
27:28
you know, maybe some of these diagnosis are worsening.
27:32
What can you do to prepare yourself?
27:34
Because if you can find a way to be crowded and regulate your
27:39
nervous system, I guarantee you it will increase the quality of
27:43
life for any living being in your household as well as
27:46
yourself. And that is not something that
27:48
we acknowledge enough conventionally, but it matters
27:51
so much. It really, really does.
27:54
Investing in yourself, your mental health, your physical
27:56
health is literally you. Investing in your companions
27:59
well-being too. I'm.
28:00
So glad you said that because it's, it's 1000% true.
28:03
We see it in in our life as well.
28:06
We are seeing it right now and it is yeah, it's, it's something
28:10
that's not talked about enough. And obviously, obviously it's
28:13
not going to be talked about in the medical field too much, but
28:17
that, but it's it's so true. Well, I'm.
28:21
Curious though, it has to have a follow up because you know, when
28:24
you do have someone that comes in and they are in this place
28:26
where we're we are pre bereavement, right.
28:30
It is this is coming, this is happening.
28:35
Do you have suggestions for people that that may not have
28:38
any kind of a personal routine, you know, whether it's
28:42
meditation or exercise or being in nature, you know, when you
28:45
say being grounded and more peaceful, do you have any
28:50
practical tools for beginners? Yeah.
28:52
What? Are some of your favorite
28:53
things? Yeah.
28:55
So I have a love and deep appreciation for yoga.
28:59
It changed Nala's kind of final time with us because I was able
29:04
to be more present and I was able to be more regulated.
29:06
So on a personal level, I always recommend people explore it.
29:10
Yoga, breath work, yes, spending time in nature, journaling,
29:14
coloring. I mean, there are so many
29:16
things. And now there's even courses
29:19
where there's a somatic practitioner in particular who
29:22
she teaches humans how to Co regulate with their animal
29:27
companions. So talk about investing, yes,
29:29
not only in yourself, but also literally investing in them
29:34
being more regulated and grounded.
29:36
So I think it looks different for everyone.
29:38
For some people it's reading a book and you know, relaxing and
29:43
just sitting and, you know, being disconnected and then some
29:45
for some people it's being social.
29:48
So it's also knowing yourself, being adventurous and trying new
29:51
things. And also, I know this is hard,
29:54
but not feeling guilty about spending time on yourself.
29:57
So I know that's a big, it's a big topic and something that I
30:01
experienced on a personal level and I know so many of my clients
30:04
do is you can't pour from an empty cup.
30:08
And so it's OK for you to step outside for a few hours and go
30:12
do something for yourself. Like, if I really feel like if
30:15
our companions could speak to us, they would want us to take
30:18
better care of ourselves rather than forcing, you know, these
30:22
feelings of guilt or questioning because they can't communicate
30:25
with us. Just keeping everyone in mind.
30:28
The whole ecosystem really needs to be functioning at the highest
30:31
level that they each individually can so that
30:33
everyone is living in that space.
30:36
Yes. It's true.
30:38
And it's funny because we're like complete opposites when it
30:40
comes to, you know, like I'm she's more like sit, read a book
30:43
and I'm like run, go for a run. And it's like the, the
30:47
relaxation methods that we that we have.
30:50
But yeah, know yourself and do and, and do, I mean, when you
30:53
said I actually cringed a little bit.
30:55
This is a so it's a very normal thing, right?
30:57
Like my, my stomach tightened up a little bit when you said it's
31:00
OK to take a couple hours out of the day and go do something for
31:02
yourself. I was like a couple hours.
31:04
Like I get minutes. Is the Max for me like?
31:06
I get like a couple minutes or, you know, like take a little
31:10
bit, you know, or maybe if it's a day off, you can go.
31:14
But like, whoa, you know, because it is, it's, it's one of
31:17
the hardest things I think for especially for US women.
31:20
I think it's, it's, it's extra hard for us to take time for
31:25
ourselves, notice that we even need to because most of us find
31:29
so much fulfillment and being there and showing up for
31:32
everyone else that why would we want to do anything else until
31:36
you're like, you know, rock bottom and then and and you,
31:39
it's your pet that tells you that you got to do something.
31:44
I want to kind of focus on this a little bit longer just because
31:46
I know that, you know, when we get to that point, especially
31:49
working with a veterinarian or just we realize that we are
31:52
entering that that final chapter.
31:55
It it does become, you know, and you see it all over the all over
31:58
social. You know, you want to spend
31:59
every last minute with them. You want to the most of every
32:02
day. You want and you feel this huge.
32:07
You know, I don't I don't want to go to work today because this
32:10
is one of my life. You know, talk a little bit,
32:13
though, about that energy. I always think, you know, when
32:15
you think about where the intention of something, where
32:18
something is coming from, I feel like it's hard, But like you
32:23
said, our our animals may say to us, Hey, will you please go take
32:26
a beat? You know, you're you're spending
32:28
a lot of your fear energy around me.
32:30
You're you're doing things that are not normal.
32:32
How do you help like pet parents kind of navigate when we know
32:38
we're in that chapter? How do you without all that
32:40
fear? How do you, are you able to help
32:43
coach them or I mean? It is tough, right?
32:46
It's there's the scarcity mentality almost associated with
32:50
the time and just every moment, every second.
32:53
And sometimes it's as simple as like Jay kind of going back to
32:56
what you were saying, let's say you do work 10 hours a day,
33:00
right? Be intentional about the time
33:03
when you are present. Just sit, even if it's 5
33:06
minutes, you know, if you're busy like rushing, making sure
33:08
everything's OK, just block out five minutes to just sit and be
33:13
there with them. Don't think about anything else.
33:15
Clear your mind as much as you can.
33:17
But that is so precious. And those are also the moments
33:22
that you, because you will get to a point right where we're
33:24
going to have to reflect back. Those are the moments that
33:27
you're really going to cherish. That 5 or 10 minutes you took in
33:30
the morning or when you get home.
33:33
If you're stressed, take 5 or 10 minutes and really ground and
33:37
deregulate yourself rather than bringing that in to the
33:39
household by that rush and really kind of frenetic energy.
33:43
They feel it. I mean, I have watched it in
33:47
front of my eyes. My clients that are anxious that
33:49
we cannot get their companions anxiety under control until they
33:53
find management tools for themselves.
33:56
It's. It's just so true and what that
33:58
looks like when you get to end of life is really different for
34:00
everyone. Like maybe that looks like you
34:03
being in a grief group, like a pre bereavement group or even
34:08
looking for pre bereavement counseling one-on-one.
34:11
Maybe it means that you do schedule an exercise class three
34:14
times a week. And of course do your best to
34:17
keep to that. But then also give yourself
34:19
grace when you can't. But just make the intentional
34:22
efforts both for yourself and in the time that you spend, because
34:27
the more you are anxious or fearful, the time actually goes
34:32
five faster. Like in terms of right, if
34:34
you're not sitting there and present, it's hard to really
34:38
cherish those moments. Yeah, that's, I mean, that's a
34:41
very good point. And I'm like Adrian really is
34:44
she does very well at that. Like she can stop and be
34:47
present, especially with our cats.
34:50
Maybe not me, but she get she with our cats, right.
34:53
Like, but for me, I will say, and I don't know if this will
34:56
help anyone, but if you're like type A always like just go, go,
34:59
go personality than to walk away from my phone, one my computer
35:06
and my phone. And for some reason taking my
35:09
shoes off and sitting down on the floor is what can bring me
35:14
back into And obviously I'm doing that to be around the
35:17
cats, but like it, it can slow down my mind enough to start
35:22
being present. I don't know why taking my shoes
35:25
off but for me. That actually does make sense.
35:29
So even going outside barefoot and just standing there and
35:32
taking a few deep breaths, that can even make the world a
35:35
difference. So if you're right, it's finding
35:37
what works for you and also figuring that out before you
35:40
need it. Like figure out what your tools
35:42
are so you have your tool kit ready and you can start pulling
35:45
those tools out when you need it because you don't know things
35:48
can change really quickly. So it's a good thing to invest
35:51
in when they're young or even adults.
35:54
Like just think of that as part of the process.
35:56
I'm going to figure out what works for my regulation so that
35:59
I can set up this environment to be as healthy for them as
36:02
possible and prepare myself for when things do shift and our
36:06
day-to-day looks different. I love this because too, it
36:10
really boils down to the the whole point that we, we try to
36:16
learn as much as we can to give them their best lives, right?
36:18
And it is about being present. It is about Doctor Luna Loudon
36:24
has a great way of putting it. I'm going to butcher it if I try
36:26
it, but it's not the length of their days.
36:29
It's the something beautiful about being present with them.
36:35
You know that I have a some of us get a little hyper focused on
36:41
Oh my gosh, they just came out with a new supplement for this
36:44
and there's a new right and I feel that that does take away
36:47
from our piece. It does come from that kind of
36:50
place of almost like a desperation.
36:53
So when it and I've I've seen and I know that we kind of felt
36:59
like we were there with Scotch, who was my first cat named after
37:03
the tape, not the drink. I know everyone knows we love to
37:05
drink, but I got him before I was old enough to drink where
37:11
we're like, I think we waited too long, right?
37:16
That carries a whole different thing and something that we
37:19
found different grief. A whole.
37:21
Different, yeah. Or maybe.
37:24
Not grief, I wouldn't necessarily say it as grief, but
37:26
it it carries definitely a a where you start a guilt guilt,
37:31
not grief, you know, level of guilt, right?
37:34
Like we would all love if if we know that our kitties are
37:37
getting older and they curl up and go to sleep with us one
37:41
night and then they just peacefully pass in their sleep
37:44
surrounded. By everybody wants that for
37:46
their for their pets and themselves right of.
37:48
Course sure, I. Mean there's such a doctor.
37:54
Karen Becker helped us through scotches she had.
37:57
She had a series out of the time called Winding Down, Winding
38:00
Down. And she talked about creating an
38:02
autumn file. Well, we're finding this, you
38:04
know, like right at the end with Scotch.
38:07
But it they were like practical tools and kind of helping.
38:11
And I don't want your take on this.
38:12
She had this kind of a practical way, like, you know, there's
38:16
going to be good days and bad days.
38:18
And she would say, I think it was like a cotton ball or
38:20
something. Have a jar and be like, this was
38:22
a good day. Put the cotton ball in there.
38:23
This was not a good day. You know, they were they didn't
38:26
want to eat or they were throwing up or whatever it may
38:29
be. What are some ways that you help
38:34
have parents kind of navigate those last?
38:37
The end of. Life.
38:41
Yeah, I think and so for me end of life is when we switch to
38:45
comfort care instead of trying to treat and fix them, right.
38:50
So we we switch the optic of our caregiver kind of approach,
38:55
right. Because at the end of the day,
38:56
we are all caregivers and so many of us will give just
39:00
everything we have. So it's how do we focus that in?
39:03
So knowing that they're at end of life, we want to do even
39:08
small things to make them more comfortable.
39:10
So I'll start a lot of this early, but maybe like a soft
39:13
little heating pad or area for them to sit, especially if
39:16
they're colder or they're arthritic, just to allow them
39:19
the ability to choose what sort of kind of setting they want.
39:23
This is also where I reach for cannabis a lot.
39:27
So for me, my kind of little rule of thumb is I feel like
39:32
every animal in their end of life stages, if they can
39:35
tolerate it, deserves to have cannabis and mushrooms.
39:38
And I'm not talking the fun mushrooms, I'm talking about the
39:41
really immune and organ supportive because it's amazing.
39:44
I mean, it's a very gentle and easy thing to institute, but it
39:47
can really make a huge difference, especially cannabis,
39:51
because if I, if our focus is to make them comfortable, we all
39:55
know for cats there are not very many tools to do that, right?
39:59
Hemp is great. And that is a really phenomenal
40:02
thing to use. Whether they have severe
40:04
arthritis, kidney disease, intestinal issues, I mean, even
40:08
asthma, it will help decrease a lot of inflammation and can help
40:12
decrease pain in their body. But making sure that we're
40:15
attending to their pain. And that may look like us
40:20
advocating in a way that we haven't had to before because
40:24
this is a problem within the conventional medicine structure.
40:27
But so often people just reach for gabapentin.
40:30
And gabapentin is not necessarily a pain medication.
40:35
It is a sedative. So before we take that jump,
40:39
let's ask ourselves, you know, what else can we use?
40:41
Is there anything homeopathic? Are there botanicals?
40:45
Can we reach for something that we, you know, maybe wouldn't
40:50
have felt comfortable with before?
40:51
But when we're at this stage, our goals have changed.
40:55
Like let's really work on making them comfortable.
40:58
Let's work on creating those special moments like you were
41:02
saying. So in terms of good days and bad
41:04
days, the cotton ball is such AI.
41:07
Love that idea. The other thing I'll have people
41:08
do is if they have an actual calendar, like a heart or
41:12
another symbol so that they can keep the day, so they can just
41:15
look, you know, how have the past two weeks been?
41:17
How has the past month been? And easily flip through and look
41:20
at that. You could do the same thing in
41:21
your journal. You have little stickers and one
41:23
sticker means one thing and one means the other.
41:25
Just whatever system works for you.
41:27
And then I think a lot of it too is just again, being present.
41:31
I it's such an underestimated thing, but it, it really is huge
41:35
because those are the little kind of funny moments you have,
41:38
you know, maybe you bring in a new toy, maybe you start playing
41:42
scent games with them. Like there's just a lot of ways
41:44
to get creative and provide enrichment or comfort.
41:50
Yeah, yeah, I think there's, there's there's nothing that
41:55
will stop cat parents and like switch their gear more than
42:02
realizing that their their cat is like end stages, like we're
42:07
going into, you know, a Hospice care even right where it's like
42:11
comfort care, as you say, right where we just need to.
42:14
I remember when Oliver Twist was when Oliver Twist started going
42:18
down. We were like animal
42:21
communication sessions. Let's see, you know, like all
42:24
the stuff that they read like therapy, PMF, all the yeah, we,
42:27
we giving them fluids. We were doing all the stuff,
42:29
letting them go outside every day, every time he wanted to go
42:32
outside, stopping, you know, and that takes a lot of to let your
42:36
cat outside. You have to, you know, it takes
42:38
all of your attention. And I would go get roses for him
42:42
every day because he really liked roses.
42:45
And I would run to the grocery store and for any of our other
42:48
cats, I would never do this because, you know, those are
42:50
full of pesticides and, you know, like things that are not
42:54
healthy for him. But I would just go get like a,
42:56
a, a rose every day and, and bring it to him because he would
43:01
love to lay with his rose for whatever reason.
43:04
And the scent of the Rose. But it's yeah, it's a.
43:08
How do you help people that may not know that they have moved,
43:13
that their cat is in a place where it has moved to comfort
43:16
care is there? I did not know that I was.
43:18
Doing that at that time, right? Is there a conversation though?
43:21
Because I know a lot of people they are going to, they are
43:25
going hard in the paint to the bitter end.
43:28
And that's literally been said. But that's how it's going to be.
43:33
How how do you have a gentle conversation or how can you help
43:38
us cat parents know when it's time to switch from, you know,
43:43
being as proactive as possible, trying to make them as healthy
43:45
as possible to all the supplements and.
43:48
All the medicine they can have. Whatever treats they want, they
43:50
can do it. Have you had to navigate that
43:54
conversation where it's time to stop trying so hard and it's
43:58
time to give comfort? Yeah.
44:02
So I think I mean a lot of that's going to depend, right,
44:04
because end of life looks different for everyone.
44:07
And so I one thing I haven't mentioned but is pertinent to
44:10
this conversation is even as my career has changed, the one
44:13
thing that I have continued to offer and service is at home end
44:17
of life transitions. So I've been doing that since
44:20
2012. I've helped literally thousands
44:24
of families. And in that scenario, it's very
44:27
interesting for me because that is the first time I'm meeting
44:30
them. I'm meeting them for the first
44:32
time to help them, you know, escort them to the next aspect
44:36
of their journey. And being able to see people
44:41
that did not know it was coming or did have a lot of
44:47
preparation. It's, it's really kind of
44:50
fascinating and very eye opening to see how different a lot of
44:53
them feel. So that's why I like that we're
44:55
having this conversation. So if your veterinarian for
44:59
whatever reason is maybe not able to have that level of
45:04
connection or have that conversation with you, I think
45:08
that goes back to a lot of the things we talked about of
45:10
looking at the scales. And maybe you do, you know, even
45:14
get a second opinion from someone that is completely
45:18
separate from who you've been getting regular care from to
45:20
just have them come in as an objective person.
45:23
Look at the lab values or the diagnostics.
45:25
Look at what you're telling them in terms of what the day-to-day
45:28
is like and just appreciate whatever they're telling you.
45:34
Because a lot of times I think we go into a place of denial,
45:37
which is fair and is very, you know, human in nature.
45:40
But part of advocating and doing our best for them is US really
45:46
being open. You know, like, let me hear what
45:48
this person is saying and take that in and factor that in and
45:51
in terms of making that transition in that switch, and
45:55
it really depends because it's so different for a Kitty that
45:57
has cognitive disease versus a cat that has oral squamous cell
46:02
carcinoma. That's literally, you know,
46:03
taking away part of its jaw and allowing them not to eat.
46:06
So to say what that period looks like is very different.
46:10
But I think that transition really times a lot is US, you
46:15
know, like they're they are who they are everyday.
46:18
It is our interpretation and our interaction that is that switch
46:22
from I'm trying to treat everything to comfort care and
46:26
knowing that being open to making that switch, even if it
46:30
feels uncomfortable for us emotionally is helping as much
46:34
as you can to prepare yourself and them for that smooth
46:38
transition. Because to make.
46:40
And my heart always goes out to anyone that is in that position
46:43
because I, I know a lot of people feel uncomfortable, they
46:45
feel guilty. It is a gift.
46:48
It is a gift to be able to allow them to be.
46:52
I mean, especially if you are have the ability to have an at
46:55
home transition or if you have a great relationship with your
46:58
veterinarian and the whole staff and you want to be there and you
47:00
need to decide that for yourself.
47:02
But knowing those options ahead of time, almost making a plan,
47:06
you know, like what kind of aftercare do I want?
47:09
What sort of memorialization would I want?
47:12
Do I want an ink paw print or a nose print?
47:15
I mean, it is so hard to think about those things before, but
47:21
having that in place and honestly even written out so you
47:24
don't have to think about it in the moment is such a under kind
47:31
of understated support that I wish that more of us had access
47:36
to. Yeah, yeah.
47:39
The I know that the at home euthanasia we have ever since
47:45
Scotch actually, he was the he was the first that we we've
47:50
advocated for mainly for our other cats, but also because the
47:55
because the cats because it's so stressful at the vet's office.
47:59
We've we haven't found a vet. We've never found a vet that all
48:03
of our cats, you know, that any of our cats really love to go
48:06
to. It's just not a thing, right?
48:08
Like they're not like, oh, I'd love to go to that.
48:11
That, you know, even if it's a fantastic vet, they don't
48:13
necessarily like the trip and going there.
48:15
So that I'm so grateful that you do that because that is
48:19
something that I wish everyone had access to.
48:22
Lap of love is who we've who we've always used.
48:25
But. But they're not available
48:27
everywhere. I don't think so.
48:30
Yeah. Have you been in the position
48:31
where? You have to help a cat parent or
48:37
a pet. Parent come to terms.
48:39
With the fact that it is time is there, that must be a gentle,
48:45
hard conversation. It is, it is a very hard
48:48
conversation and it's a. Different sort of conversation
48:50
depending on the relationship that I have with them right so
48:53
as I as I mentioned there's some people that I will come into
48:55
their house it's the first time they've met me and this is the
48:58
conversation that we're having like the amount of people that
49:01
ask me am I making the right decision when I mean and, and I.
49:05
Understand they. Just want that reassurance.
49:07
So in a lot of times that just looks like supporting them and
49:10
listening, you know, from what you're telling me, I am a huge
49:13
proponent of allowing them to transition even a day or a week
49:17
too early than an hour too late. Because there is this really,
49:22
really sensitive window of time where we will know, OK, it is,
49:27
this is it. I know it.
49:29
It usually means that we waited too long.
49:31
And I always tell people that there should be, there's never
49:34
any guilt. There shouldn't be.
49:36
I know that there is naturally, but you shouldn't feel guilty
49:39
making that decision out of a place of love.
49:41
And that doesn't mean that they need to get to a point where
49:44
they're not eating, they're not drinking, they're not able to
49:46
walk, they're pooping and peeing on themselves.
49:48
And I think a lot of people, that's almost the standard that
49:51
they hold inside of themselves of this is when it's time.
49:55
But really it should be when their quality of life is not.
50:01
And this is kind of anthropomorphic, but what they
50:03
would want it to be or what we would even want for ourselves.
50:06
Like, let's turn it around and ask ourselves that, you know,
50:09
for some of us, it would be OK for us to maybe not eat for four
50:13
or five days. I'm just saying like in general,
50:15
right? Like just big picture for a
50:18
Kitty that loved to eat and then is not, and we know what's
50:23
associated with something terminal.
50:25
Let's maybe not wait until they're also collapsing or
50:28
having seizures or something else like that.
50:30
That can be enough. That can be enough of a decrease
50:33
in quality of life that you are again acting from a place of
50:37
love. No one ever really makes this
50:40
decision out of convenience. I in my entire career, I have
50:43
maybe met two families like that and it's a very different
50:47
situation. Everyone that's getting to this
50:49
point. And if it's starting to come to
50:51
mind and you're starting to ask yourselves, you ask yourself
50:54
these questions, that is a sign that you are doing a good job,
50:58
that you're asking the hard questions and really putting
51:01
that back on yourself to make sure that you're putting their
51:04
quality of life over anything else.
51:06
Quality is so much greater than quantity.
51:08
I know it's hard not to feel that like every day or even the
51:12
time leading up and just kind of knowing, but not having the
51:18
regret of having waited too long or having it not be a
51:23
controlled, peaceful experience because maybe we did wait too
51:28
long. Like that is what I, I have
51:30
found people regret the most. Like if I go visit a family and
51:35
they're, you know, maybe undecided and they decide not to
51:38
move forward and then they're calling the next day and rushing
51:43
because a lot of these families, I'll help, you know, multiple
51:45
times over the past, you know, like almost 14 years that I've
51:48
been doing this. So a lot of times we learn,
51:52
right? And if you, let's say you are in
51:54
a position where you waited too long and you know that, don't be
51:58
hard on yourself. Just take that as a learning
52:00
experience for the future, right?
52:01
We're all just doing the best we can every day.
52:04
And I think that's the grace that we need to give ourselves
52:06
and we need to give other people like we are all acting just in
52:10
the highest good and as much as we can support them.
52:13
And that's a learning experience.
52:15
It is going back, going back to what you.
52:17
Said about being present, I feel like, and I'm I'm pretty sure
52:22
most of us here have already been through loss of some kind.
52:26
Sometimes it's very sudden, sometimes it is a chronic
52:29
illness, sometimes it's an emergency.
52:35
I find that practicing presence and kind of utilizing like when
52:41
you're like, wow, I do feel good about life in general, like just
52:45
that grounding kind of you have a, you have an elevated sense of
52:49
joy, you have an elevated sense of peace.
52:51
Like you've you've kind of grounded.
52:53
That's actually a good time to think about some of these things
52:58
in this place of big picture awareness in a peaceful joy
53:03
filled place where you can think more even pragmatically about
53:07
some of the lessons that we've learned.
53:09
Like you said, the journaling, writing down, what would this
53:12
look like ideally? What are the things that I want
53:15
for my pet when it is time? How do I want them memorialized
53:20
in a way that you're not you're you're, you're more
53:23
dispassionate and not in that awful, frantic, very sad time.
53:32
So that it is excellent advice and it is also.
53:38
It's also excellent advice as far as Becker had said this too,
53:42
that you, you might want to consider letting when we're in
53:48
that end stage and we know that time is near, let letting them
53:53
go on the good day, not the bad day, right?
53:57
And that is so hard, right? Like, I mean, it is, I agree.
54:01
And after, you know, after we, that's what we did with Oliver
54:06
Twist after the fact, I feel much better about I feel much
54:10
better about that decision. But that day, right when he,
54:14
when he stood up and then wanted to go walk the yard and go do, I
54:18
was like, what, what, what, what if, what if he, what if he still
54:22
wants to be here? You know, like that's the, the,
54:25
the question. Wait, wait, wait.
54:26
Do we cancel the appointment? Yeah.
54:28
Right, he had just spent a week. Barely.
54:31
You know, he wouldn't tolerate us giving him fluids anymore.
54:34
He was obviously not happier with the other cats.
54:38
You know, they interestingly, they really held space for him.
54:42
They stayed near him. He was so uncomfortable.
54:48
But then that day. And Karen Denny Smith was, she
54:52
was kind of our doula that day because we were doing an energy
54:55
session with her. And he gets up and he walked
54:59
downstairs, stood at the door like he wanted to go outside.
55:02
We're like, what is happening? And he did.
55:04
He walked the perimeter of the house, the perimeter of the
55:07
backyard and came in and we're like, wait, do we cancel the
55:10
appointment? Like he's doing great.
55:12
And he was like, no, you foolish.
55:14
Peasants, you're doing the right thing.
55:16
I just wanted to go say goodbye to all my all my areas.
55:20
And yeah, so I guess that that kind of brings us to.
55:26
Winding down ourselves. But if there was one thing that
55:29
you wish every cat parent could better understand about this
55:34
final stage of life with this beautiful being, what would what
55:38
would it be? Yeah.
55:42
So when it comes to, I think it's acknowledging that
55:51
supporting them, all of the decisions that we make every
55:54
day, right, the food that we feed, the supplements that we
55:57
give, everything that we're doing, the decision to allow
56:02
them to transition peacefully is literally one of the biggest
56:07
decisions we'll ever have to make.
56:09
And so keeping in mind that you are coming from a place of pure
56:14
love and wanting the best for them.
56:17
And sometimes it's almost instead of talking to yourself
56:21
how whatever your internal dialogue or monologue is, think
56:25
about your best friend. Like, what would you tell
56:27
someone that you who you really love and cherish?
56:30
Like, would you be, would you expect them to feel guilty about
56:34
this? Or would you think that they
56:35
should feel guilty? And if not, kind of turn that
56:37
around on yourself because we're, again, we're just doing
56:41
the best that we can and really presence more than anything.
56:44
I think it's my big thing. And that was a hard lesson for
56:46
me with Nala because Ji am a lot like you.
56:48
I'm very type A. I'm always go, go, go.
56:50
And especially, you know, being a primary caretaker.
56:54
And this is for all of us. Being their caretaker and their
56:57
mom and, you know, their best friend, there's so much there.
57:01
Just put them first and know that whatever decision you are
57:04
making, if that is your guiding light, you are making the right
57:07
decision. And that looks different for
57:09
everyone. And there should be no judgement
57:11
that you put on yourself for that.
57:13
Yeah, and no judgement. That we should put on each
57:17
other. Either that too that also yes.
57:21
That's good advice though. Turning it around and thinking
57:26
of it that way is that's helpful little psychological exercise
57:30
there. I like that, yes.
57:33
How do? You find.
57:33
Wait, wait, How do you find? The emotional stamina.
57:37
I I mean, I, we had the pleasure of meeting you last summer.
57:40
You really do have a a powerful presence about you.
57:44
Yeah. And I really love, you know,
57:46
getting to more know more about like right ratio and you
57:49
formulating and just these beautiful proactive things that
57:51
you're doing. And I love that there is going
57:53
to be more healthy products. We'll talk about those.
57:55
We'll get another podcast on the books.
57:59
How do you find the emotional stamina, especially for this?
58:04
And I'm asking because I used to work in a nursing home and it
58:06
was there. There is this emotional burnout
58:09
that happens. There's so much compassion that
58:11
goes into it, right. But there is this emotional.
58:15
How do you stay grounded? How do you keep yoga?
58:18
This stamina is it? I mean yoga is has was
58:21
definitely helpful in. Terms of caregiver and
58:24
compassion fatigue. Yoga was a saving grace for me
58:27
with practice. I think I just am very, I'm like
58:32
blessed and very lucky that there is something about I have
58:35
the ability to be present for people and have enough of an
58:38
energetic boundary. And that's some of the work that
58:40
I've done is like, how do I create those boundaries for
58:42
myself that I can be fully there, fully present and give
58:46
everything I have without it draining me.
58:49
And, and I think that looks a little different for everyone
58:53
also. So again, kind of playing with
58:56
those things just on a personal level, you know, like how do you
58:58
go into a stressful situation and prevent other people's
59:01
stress from affecting you? It's, it's, I would say it's
59:05
along those lines, but it's for whatever reason, I like, I, I
59:11
truly feel like it's a gift and an honor to be able to help them
59:15
have a smooth transition. And I think also I just, I have
59:18
such an immense love for animals and I know that this is part of
59:22
their journey and making sure that every step of their journey
59:25
is as easy for them as possible. That is the oath that I signed
59:29
up for and that's why I'm here, so meant to be.
59:35
Thank you. Thank you so much for.
59:37
This conversation? Yes.
59:39
Thank you. We're gonna have you back.
59:41
And talk about something really fun and crazy at some point.
59:46
Not something so I know, but this is this is really, I mean
59:50
this is something. It's, it's part of what really
59:53
is the bond that we share with everyone in our community,
59:56
right? And I think that it, it deserves
59:58
a little more conversation. It's.
1:00:00
So hard and I think especially as cat parents, we kind of feel
1:00:03
like we're, you know, thrown off a Cliff when it's when we're a
1:00:07
lot of people, you know, who's had who's had someone's face,
1:00:10
like, Oh, sorry about your cat. Like that's that's the sympathy
1:00:14
that you get. So just for ourselves to be able
1:00:17
to navigate this really special time of life.
1:00:21
I mean, it's all very special, but in with a little more
1:00:26
empowerment and grace. You've been you've been very,
1:00:29
very helpful. Thank you so much.
1:00:31
It's my pleasure and community is.
1:00:34
Such an important tool within that, whether it's, you know,
1:00:38
other people going through bereavement or, you know, even
1:00:42
finding other people that are passionate animal lovers that
1:00:44
understand and, and also knowing it's OK to say no.
1:00:47
That's a big thing that I learned in my grief journey is
1:00:50
you don't have to say yes to the normal things that you do.
1:00:54
Like you may not want to celebrate a holiday or someone's
1:00:56
birthday or whatever it is, and that's OK.
1:00:58
You should be around people that help nurture you when you are in
1:01:02
that sensitive place. Yeah, well.
1:01:06
Said that's great advice today, Doctor Lindsay, that's.
1:01:09
Great advice, we love you. Thank you so much from.
1:01:12
All of us here. Thank you so much.
1:01:14
Yes. All right, we'll get.
1:01:15
We'll get. Another podcast on the book
1:01:17
soon. You guys.