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Katie Woolf spoke with NT Electoral Commissioner Iain Loganathan · 360 with Katie Woolf

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  Speaker 1: Joining me in the studio right now is the Northern
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  Speaker 1: Territories Electoral Commissioner Ian Logan.
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  Speaker 2: Nathan, good morning to you.
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  Speaker 3: Good morning Katie.
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  Speaker 2: Busy weekend for you, no doubt.
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  Speaker 3: Oh look absolutely.
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  Speaker 4: I just want to say that I wasn't at any
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  Speaker 4: Sandba party on the weekend, so we were busy counting
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  Speaker 4: votes just to confirm.
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  Speaker 1: Well, I wasn't even planning on asking you whether you
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  Speaker 1: got to the sand Bar party, but thanks for clarifying.
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  Speaker 1: Now talk us through the results of the weekend. Firstly,
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  Speaker 1: with the by election, I know that there's been been
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  Speaker 1: discussion about there being a low voter turnout in some
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  Speaker 1: parts of the rural area.
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  Speaker 2: Was that the case.
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  Speaker 4: What we saw in terms of the turnout Katie on
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  Speaker 4: the election on Saturday, or really over the last two weeks,
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  Speaker 4: is that the turnout was close to about sixty three percent,
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  Speaker 4: which is about ten percent less than what we had
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  Speaker 4: at the territory election last year for the division of
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  Speaker 4: Daily and that's probably about what we expected. We expected
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  Speaker 4: to get somewhere around sixty five percent. By elections are
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  Speaker 4: always lower than general elections. What was interesting is in
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  Speaker 4: terms of where this lower turnout seemed to be much
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  Speaker 4: more in terms of the rural area. We actually had
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  Speaker 4: quite an increased turnout with the remote electors and a
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  Speaker 4: decrease in rural areas.
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  Speaker 2: Why do you reckon that is?
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  Speaker 4: Look, I'll leave that to political commentators. You know, my
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  Speaker 4: role as electoral commissioners obviously to be a political and
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  Speaker 4: just to give the data. What I can say is
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  Speaker 4: in relation to our advertising campaign that we know that
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  Speaker 4: on average in social media, electors in daily received our
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  Speaker 4: message seven times, and we had two thousand of those
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  Speaker 4: electors clicked through and go to our website. So it's
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  Speaker 4: clearly the message was getting through. But for some reason,
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  Speaker 4: a significant number which is probably about two hundred less
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  Speaker 4: or four percent of the electorate in the rural areas
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  Speaker 4: didn't vote at the by election.
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  Speaker 1: Did you focus more energy on the remote areas than
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  Speaker 1: what you did the rural area.
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  Speaker 4: Look, we certainly focused on both. I think we do
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  Speaker 4: all know that remote communities are generally harder to communicate
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  Speaker 4: with in terms of getting out that messaging. I think
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  Speaker 4: what we saw out in the remote communities at this
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  Speaker 4: election was that because it is a by election, the
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  Speaker 4: parties can focus the resources on just one electorate. So
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  Speaker 4: we certainly had a lot of campaign workers out there,
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  Speaker 4: and that certainly gets the message out that voting is happening.
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  Speaker 4: We also had extended voting services at what I this time,
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  Speaker 4: we were there for a week. Usually we're there for
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  Speaker 4: a couple of days. But let me say, in terms
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  Speaker 4: of the rural area, we're at Berry Springs for a week.
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  Speaker 4: We were at Koler Linga for two weeks and had
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  Speaker 4: a couple of voting centers open on the Saturday as well.
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  Speaker 1: So you feel quite satisfied with the way in which
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  Speaker 1: the electoral commissions conducted things in terms of making sure
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  Speaker 1: that people voted.
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  Speaker 4: Look in terms of the administration of the election, and
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  Speaker 4: in terms of how we've public relations. I certainly at
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  Speaker 4: this point in time, I don't have any concerns. Certainly
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  Speaker 4: if people have any issues or they didn't get the message,
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  Speaker 4: we'd certainly like to learn from that and and and
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  Speaker 4: see anything can be done in the future. I just
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  Speaker 4: was actually out at Lichfield Council doing the declaration there,
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  Speaker 4: and I sort of in the discussions there sort of
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  Speaker 4: said that their turnout was for their local government election
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  Speaker 4: was in seventy three and a half percent, which is
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  Speaker 4: significantly higher than what we've had at the daily by
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  Speaker 4: election on the weekend.
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  Speaker 2: Do you reckon there was.
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  Speaker 1: Any confusion by any people in you know, like in
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  Speaker 1: that electorateive daily about the local government election and then
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  Speaker 1: the by election happening so close to each other.
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  Speaker 4: Look, that certainly was a factor. But looking Territorians, they
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  Speaker 4: know their politics, and certainly with a by election it
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  Speaker 4: had a huge focus. There was a lot of campaigning
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  Speaker 4: done from both sides and from the from and from
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  Speaker 4: the independent candidates. So look, you know, it possibly was
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  Speaker 4: a factor, but you'd probably possibly think that they would
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  Speaker 4: be more more of a factor with the remote communities
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  Speaker 4: than we would be with the rural communities.
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  Speaker 2: Were there any complaints made in the end?
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  Speaker 1: I know that there'd been some discussion about there being
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  Speaker 1: a bit of an argie bargie at one of the
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  Speaker 1: one of the polling boots I think outam.
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  Speaker 2: Did there end up being complaints made?
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  Speaker 4: Look, we certainly received a number of complaints about sort
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  Speaker 4: of overly aggressive behavior at voting centers. Look, we have
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  Speaker 4: a code of conduct and we ask people to comply,
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  Speaker 4: and really anything that happens outside the ten meter rule
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  Speaker 4: of those voting centers is outside our control and it's
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  Speaker 4: really your you know, we've basically said that if you
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  Speaker 4: think people have.
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  Speaker 3: Breached the law, then referred those matters to the police.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, And so there's nothing else that the Electoral Commission
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  Speaker 1: needs to follow up in that space at the moment.
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  Speaker 4: Look, nothing at this stage in regard to anything that
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  Speaker 4: happened at any voting centers. There were a few queries
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  Speaker 4: and things like that, but really nothing out of the ordinary.
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  Speaker 1: Now you did just say that you've just come back
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  Speaker 1: from Lichfield. We're obviously those local government results have flown through.
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  Speaker 1: For some of them, it's been you know, like we've
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  Speaker 1: been waiting for a couple of weeks to find out
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  Speaker 1: who's going to become Alderman or who's going to become
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  Speaker 1: the mayor of both Catherine and Litchfield were two that
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  Speaker 1: were still up in the air, but we now know
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  Speaker 1: how those results have panned out.
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  Speaker 4: Look absolutely, and if you're interested, if your listeners are interested,
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  Speaker 4: all the webs all the details on our website, the
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  Speaker 4: NTC website. If you're interested about learning about the proportional
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  Speaker 4: voting system, you can go to our spreadsheets and see
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  Speaker 4: that there's a lot of data there. And look, you know,
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  Speaker 4: this is democracy, and certainly was pleasing to see an
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  Speaker 4: increase in turnout at the local government elections, but there's
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  Speaker 4: still a long way to go before we get more
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  Speaker 4: territorianes engaged in democracy.
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  Speaker 1: One of the seats that was incredibly close was that
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  Speaker 1: of the mayor position in Alice Springs.
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  Speaker 2: Is there a recount happening on that one?
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  Speaker 4: Yes, there is, so tomorrow there'll be a recount happening there.
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  Speaker 4: Some of my staff are flying down to Alys this
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  Speaker 4: evening just to coordinate that. You know, like I said,
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  Speaker 4: in our springs, we did see a decline in turnout,
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  Speaker 4: and the margin's only seventeen votes, so, as I keep
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  Speaker 4: on saying over and over again, every vote counts. But
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  Speaker 4: we'll be doing a recount there tomorrow. And we've delayed
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  Speaker 4: the declaration in Alice Springs until that has been completed.
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  Speaker 1: So only seventeen votes separating the two at the moment.
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  Speaker 1: But Bart, you're doing that recount tomorrow and then we'll
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  Speaker 1: have a much fairer idea.
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  Speaker 3: Well.
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  Speaker 4: Look, yeah, look, certainly it's not as though that mistakes
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  Speaker 4: don't occur when you're canning votes in saying that we
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  Speaker 4: have Candida in three times, but when the margins disclose,
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  Speaker 4: I think we really owe it to both candidates to
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  Speaker 4: make sure that the will of their voters has been
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  Speaker 4: accurately recorded.
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  Speaker 1: And was that the closest that we saw in some
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  Speaker 1: of these different areas. Seventeen seems pretty close, but for
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  Speaker 1: the positions of aldermen, I'm assuming that some of them
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  Speaker 1: might have even been closer.
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  Speaker 3: Yes.
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  Speaker 4: So in terms of in lines Ward, we've had the
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  Speaker 4: last elected candidate there that amy Un was success full.
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  Speaker 3: The imagine there was just twelve votes.
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  Speaker 2: Wow.
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  Speaker 4: And in Catherine, in terms of the election of the
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  Speaker 4: sixth counselor, the margin was zero, it was it was equal,
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  Speaker 4: So that was that was interesting in itself.
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  Speaker 2: So there's a tie. What do you do now?
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  Speaker 4: So all I had to actually honestly have to go
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  Speaker 4: back and have a look at the electoral actors. So
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  Speaker 4: what you do in these situations, and what you actually
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  Speaker 4: do is you go back to the previous count and
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  Speaker 4: see who was ahead at that point and that person
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  Speaker 4: is declared the.
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  Speaker 1: Winner, and so who ended up getting in there in
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  Speaker 1: Catherine or you might not have that in front in
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  Speaker 1: front of you.
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  Speaker 4: I don't have that information in front of me, But
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  Speaker 4: let me say that. We're also doing a recount obviously
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  Speaker 4: of the of the Catherine Alderman, given the fact that
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  Speaker 4: you know, one era could potentially change the result, so
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  Speaker 4: we're doing that this morning as well.
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  Speaker 1: Is that the first time that that's ever happened in
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  Speaker 1: your time that there's been a draw? I?
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  Speaker 4: Look, absolutely, yeah, So that was that was certainly something
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  Speaker 4: new for me and possibly for most of my staff.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. Is it something that's quite unprecedented around Australia orpect?
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  Speaker 1: You know, I'm suspecting that some of the electorates that
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  Speaker 1: are a little bit smaller, maybe it happens a bit
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  Speaker 1: more often.
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  Speaker 4: Look, I certainly made a few calls on the weekend
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  Speaker 4: to some learned electoral people as to how to deal
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  Speaker 4: with this, and they started sending me cases where this
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  Speaker 4: is how occurred in the future and it had gone
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  Speaker 4: to court and what the court had deemed what was appropriate.
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  Speaker 3: So that was obviously a very helpful, a very helpful.
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  Speaker 1: Guide, I reckon it would have been at least, and
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  Speaker 1: you've got, you know, you've got some experience to go
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  Speaker 1: by from other locations and in some of those different rural.
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  Speaker 2: Areas as well.
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  Speaker 1: I'm assuming that you know that there may not have
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  Speaker 1: been a huge number of votes separating or that there
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  Speaker 1: may not have been a huge number of votes for
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  Speaker 1: some of those people who did indeed get elected.
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  Speaker 4: Look, one of our smallest council is belle Ewen and
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  Speaker 4: certainly there was an interesting result there where in terms
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  Speaker 4: of being on the council. We've had someone who get
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  Speaker 4: elected on just one first preference vote, which I assume
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  Speaker 4: was their own. But it just shows you the importance
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  Speaker 4: of preferences that if you can get people to direct
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  Speaker 4: your preferences to you, you know me, they certainly have
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  Speaker 4: had a significant impact in terms of this election. If
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  Speaker 4: you looked at the primary votes for a number of
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  Speaker 4: candidates standing for mayor and standing for aldermen or counselors,
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  Speaker 4: even though they did reasonably well there, once you distributed
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  Speaker 4: the preferences, a number of those have missed out.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, one vote in Bellu and it does make
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  Speaker 1: your sort of question. I know that it's not a
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  Speaker 1: discussion for you and I to have. It's more I
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  Speaker 1: guess with the government, but one vote it does sort
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  Speaker 1: of make your question whether we need to do things
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  Speaker 1: a bit differently.
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  Speaker 3: Look, it is a very small council.
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  Speaker 4: There's only ninety people voting there, so you kind of
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  Speaker 4: have to look at that in perspective, but certainly it's
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  Speaker 4: a good electoral tale in regard to you know, sort
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  Speaker 4: of sort of odd results that often occur in the
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  Speaker 4: Northern Territory.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, anything else we should be aware of before we
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  Speaker 1: wrap up this morning.
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  Speaker 4: Look, now, just to certainly want to thank all the
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  Speaker 4: councils for their cooperation in running all these elections. Will
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  Speaker 4: be doing the declarations in over the next couple of days.
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  Speaker 4: But yeah, just a shout out to all your voters,
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  Speaker 4: all your listeners who voted, and all the ones that didn't.
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  Speaker 4: You may be receiving a letter in the mail asking
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  Speaker 4: why you didn't, and just the reminder that voting is
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  Speaker 4: important and we need the people of the Northern Territory.
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  Speaker 3: To have their say.
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  Speaker 2: Will they get fined?
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  Speaker 4: Look, in relation to the council elections, that's a matter
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  Speaker 4: for the councils, because we run those elections for them.
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  Speaker 4: They will make that determination. If they do, then we'll
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  Speaker 4: administer it on their behalf. In relation to the daily electors,
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  Speaker 4: they will be getting a letter from the Electoral Commission
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  Speaker 4: because that's our determination, right.
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  Speaker 1: And then do you know how much they'll potentially if
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  Speaker 1: they're not able to say why they didn't vote and
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  Speaker 1: give a good reason.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, so the fines twenty five dollars?
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  Speaker 2: Is that enough?
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  Speaker 4: Look, it used to be fifty dollars in local government
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  Speaker 4: and twenty five dollars in legislative assembly, and there was
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  Speaker 4: discussion about whether it should be equal, and the position
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  Speaker 4: of the Electoral Commission is yes, let's make it both
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  Speaker 4: fifty dollars.
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  Speaker 3: But they were both decreased. It was decreased, so it
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  Speaker 3: was twenty five each.
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  Speaker 4: So yeah, that's again that's a matter in terms of
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  Speaker 4: that was Parliament's decision. But we certainly think that maybe
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  Speaker 4: a stronger disincentive or a stronger incentive for people to
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  Speaker 4: vote it's probably would be helpful.
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  Speaker 2: I agree.
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  Speaker 1: I actually think that the reality of it is, you know,
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  Speaker 1: twenty five bucks, you sort of go all right, well,
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  Speaker 1: I won't buy lunch today and pay the fine. And
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  Speaker 1: we want as many people out there voting as possible.
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  Speaker 1: It is our democratic right and something that people die
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  Speaker 1: for in other locations. It's so very important in my opinion.
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  Speaker 4: Look, absolutely, you know I've been saying this for many years.
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  Speaker 4: We need more Territorians to have their say, but you know,
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  Speaker 4: I'm thankful for the ones who did. And let me
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  Speaker 4: say in terms of all the councilors and mayors who
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  Speaker 4: have been elected, we wish you all the best in
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  Speaker 4: your upcoming term.
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  Speaker 1: Well Northern Territory Electoral Commissioner Ian Logan, Nathan, we appreciate
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  Speaker 1: your time this morning, know you're very busy. Thank you,
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  Speaker 1: We'll catch up with you again soon.
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  Speaker 3: Thanks Katie,