Latest / Money And Wealth With John Hope Bryant / Profit with Purpose: Redefining Capitalism with Joshua Motta

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Profit with Purpose: Redefining Capitalism with Joshua Motta · Money And Wealth With John Hope Bryant

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome The Money in Wealth with John O'Bryant, a production
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: of the Black Effect Podcast Network and iHeartRadio. Hey, Hey,
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: this is John O'Brien and this is the Money in
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: Wealth podcast series season two. You all know that. And
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: by the way, thank you audience for continuing to make
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: this podcast one of the top one hundred in entrepreneurship
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: in the country for Apple and top one hundred and
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: fifty for business in the biggest economy in the world.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: I appreciate that I don't often bring on guests, as
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: you know, normally is just me breaking down a topic
• 0:44
  Speaker 1: over forty five minutes to an hour. If I bring
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: on a guest, they're special. And this guy is special.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: Sometimes you meet somebody and there's no saying a friend
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: you meet with a friend from the very first time,
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: and an acquaintance you meet remains an acquaintance for a lifetime.
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: You're never quite comfortable with an acquaintance. And it has
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: something to do with authenticity. And I met Joshua and
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: we're new friends, which is why I may occasionally screw
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: up his last name. Still I want to say Mota,
• 1:19
  Speaker 1: but it's Mada, right, Joshua Mada. Motta look him up.
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: He's not a household name, but he is all around you.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: His insurance company that he co founded is undergrading society
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: as we know. It is one of the biggest in
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: the world. I believe the biggest in North America. He
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: will correct me if I'm wrong about that. It's Coalition, Inc.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: Which is a cool name in and of itself. But
• 1:44
  Speaker 1: the coolest thing I can tell you about Joshua, which
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: I can't say about anybody else I know. I can't
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: tell you where we met because the meeting's off the grid.
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: They don't even have a website. And I can't tell
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: you about his prior job. Maybe he will tell you,
• 2:03
  Speaker 1: but I can't tell you about his prior job. In fact,
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: when I talked about his background, it's the one thing
• 2:08
  Speaker 1: he conveniently left out. But I think it's pretty cool
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: for the audience to know that part of his intelligence
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: experience was literally working for the CIA. I don't think
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: of everybody. I mean, I've got people I know associated
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: with intelligence agencies, but I think it's pretty cool that
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: you work with the CIA. That maybe that may be
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: the reason why your wife marriage. She was like that,
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: that's she's cool. You know, he's a good He's a
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: very very good guy. He runs his company which does
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: cyber insurance and and basically all things tech related insurance.
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: I didn't know that he insures me. I don't where
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: we met. He just knew that if you were a
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: big growing company and you're looking for best in class
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: insurance against cyber attacks, et cetera, there was a ten chance,
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: not out of ten chance, that you would be using
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: his company. And I checked with my people, thinking that
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: I'd be doing him a solid by giving him some
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: business because I liked him as a human, only to
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: find out he's already insuring us at Operation Hope. So Josh,
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: welcome to the podcast. Before we get into this, I'm
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: going to take a little bit about your background to
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: my audience. Get this out of the way before founding Coalition.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: His resume is impressive. He includes roles at cloud Flare
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: he was head of Special Project and another roles there
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: and stints and technology, finance and intelligence and cleaning. As
• 3:45
  Speaker 1: I mentioned the CIA, Microsoft Goldman Sex. He has really
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: narrated a life that frames out technology, security, data analytics mindset,
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: analytical mindset which I love in risk management. One could
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: say he's doing what he loves. He had early our
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: spiritu success when he was fifteen years old. We relate
• 4:12
  Speaker 1: together on that. He built tech tools and gained attention
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: from Microsoft Hello, which led to an early higher when
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: he was nineteen nineteen, but the sink in audience fresh
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: out of high school. Basically, he joined the CIA CIA
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: in the cyber Intelligence program, of course, after passing a
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: polygraph test, which gave him early exposures to security and
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: critical systems and national level credit, national level risk including
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: credit finance, but also business and society. A coalition was
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: founded in twenty seventeen, and it's pitched as in an
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: insure tech plus cybersecurity hybrid, not just writing policies, but
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: in betting, prevention, detection, and responds into insurance offerings. The
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: firm oddly Enough, Interestingly enough oddly Enough markets itself as
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: an active insurance company. We're going to talk about what
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: that means. But essentially the insurance is not just reactive,
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: which is paying claims. We're going to get into different
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: types of insurance, but proactive, continuing continuously monitoring, detecting, and
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: helping mitigate threats before they become losses, which is by
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: the way, one of the ways that insurance company becomes
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: successful is not by having to pay a claim, because
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: you've mitigated that risk so much that the claim gets neutralized.
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: The claim threat gets neutralized. The company really is a
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: bit of a unicorn now value in the billions. One
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: article describes the Coalitions customers that thanks to prevention their
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: prevention approach, they file seventy sent fewer claims than industry average. Okay,
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: did I get that right? My brother?
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: I think you've got it mostly right. You know, the
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: customer is always right, and you're my customer.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: I see smart man said he's he's also a capitalist
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: with a heart. By the way, Joshua, let's break you
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: down for a minute. Tell me tell the audience a
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: little bit about I asked you a question at lunch,
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: like how'd you become so decent? Like when we were
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: at lunch at this place that we cannot mention, there
• 6:29
  Speaker 1: was a lot of noise around us. It was out
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: in the open at a picnic. But you and I
• 6:35
  Speaker 1: sat down unplanned that we sat down on each other
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: and we locked into a conversation. And normally I have
• 6:43
  Speaker 1: to pull leaders into a discussion about morals and money.
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: I've got to reconnecting them, keep reconnecting them to good
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: capitalism or the good of capitalism. A lot of leaders
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: are uncomfortable talking about out the responsibility of leadership. And
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: you just kept this conversation going. It was organic. I
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: didn't lead it, you were leading it, and it was
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: something clearly embedded in you. So I didn't ask your lunch,
• 7:12
  Speaker 1: but why did you keep that conversation going on that
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: topic when it when most people would like to talk
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: about the mountains or the fishing or what the kids
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: are doing, you focused on purpose driven items when we
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: talked that were I think important for the health of society. Yeah. Yeah.
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: And then in the course I asked your lunch, what
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: made you, in my opinion, a decent human, like just normal.
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: You've got this power, you got this company run, but
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: you're very approachable. Nobody's perfect, but you're very approachable. It
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: is a reason for that we talked about it.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, look, I think I also told you
• 7:49
  Speaker 2: that I didn't quite know the answer. I could maybe
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: guess said it. But which makes you? That means you're
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: not arrogant, by the way, not to be, But look,
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: I think probably respect it is just the nurture I
• 8:01
  Speaker 2: had great parents, grandparents, family. Maybe it's I grew up
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: in the Midwest where there's just sort of a Midwestern
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: sensibility to things, But I think a big part of
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: that upbringing was like underscoring the importance of purpose. Like
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: my parents had a very clear purpose in life, my grandparents,
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: you know, and I think the meaning of life for
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: them to some degree was just helping other people. And
• 8:23
  Speaker 2: so that's kind of always stuck with me. I think,
• 8:25
  Speaker 2: you know, my purpose in so far as I can find,
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: you know, meeting in life is to help other people.
• 8:30
  Speaker 2: And look, at the end of the day, like building
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: a company, being an entrepreneur, like purpose is a is
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: such a powerful tool, right. I mean it's hard to
• 8:39
  Speaker 2: build a business. You want to make it as easy
• 8:42
  Speaker 2: as possible. Like with purpose, it's much easier. Right, Not
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: only is it easier for me to get up and
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: get excited even when things are difficult, Like there's a
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: clear mission, you know, in our case, it's to protect
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: the unprotected, to protect organizations, not for profits, for profits,
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: organizations you know, from growing sort of cyber threats. It's
• 9:01
  Speaker 2: also easy street in terms of attracting the right employees.
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: You know, we can very clearly appeal to people who
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: believe in that mission and who want to follow it,
• 9:10
  Speaker 2: you know, as you might imagine like many software engineers.
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, because they're comfortable with you as a leader.
• 9:17
  Speaker 2: That's right. I mean, I think they have to be
• 9:19
  Speaker 2: comfortable with you. I think also if they share that
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: same purpose. You know, they're willing to move mountains for
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: the company, right versus just someone who's working there because
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: it's the best paycheck. And so you know, I think
• 9:31
  Speaker 2: what I can proudly say about a lot of the
• 9:32
  Speaker 2: people that work at Coalition is, you know, they believe
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: in the mission as much as I do. They're there
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: every day to help these organizations deal with these new
• 9:40
  Speaker 2: cyber threats. You know, look, most business owners, they're not
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: worrying about how to protect the land, sea and air
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: around them. They've got the military or local law enforcement.
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: But there's now this new fourth domain that we all face,
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: which is the cyber one. The government's basically said you're
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: on your own, Like that's the message. You know, you
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: can call the police, but they're not going to be
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: terribly helpful. And so that's really the role that we
• 10:01
  Speaker 2: we that we fill, and I think people get excited
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: about that. So, you know, purpose has always been such
• 10:07
  Speaker 2: a big part of my life, and maybe it's one
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: of the reasons why I you know, I'm a decent person.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: So purpose is not just profit.
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: I don't think that they're a conflict with one another.
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: You know, like, for example, our purpose very much to
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: as you mentioned a statistic like you are far less
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: likely to have a cyber insurance claim if you purchase
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: insurance from us. That's both because we're better at determining
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: who to give insurance to, but also helping our clients
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: manage it. You know, we're not doing that because we're
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: mother Teresa, right. We have a direct financial motive, motivation
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: to help our customers to reduce their losses. And if
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: we do that, you know, we we are more profitable.
• 10:45
  Speaker 2: And so again some.
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: Staying with you which allows you to have sustainable, sustainable, renewable,
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: repeatable income.
• 10:52
  Speaker 2: That's right. I mean in this there's an area where
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: if you can align your incentives with your customers, they
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: don't want to have a claim and we don't want
• 10:57
  Speaker 2: to have a claim. You know, then that I think
• 11:00
  Speaker 2: capitalism can be an incredible model for that outcome.
• 11:05
  Speaker 1: I call that good capitalism, it's it's profit with a purpose.
• 11:09
  Speaker 1: So so, while I have not asked you this question,
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: why didn't we click at lunch? Why did you continue
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: that conversation with all that noise around his own purpose?
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: Look, I think you mentioned it. It was just the
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: authenticity of the conversation, Like, very rarely can you have
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: an authentic conversation with someone in that setting, right where
• 11:31
  Speaker 2: there's lots of power, there's you know, there's lots of money,
• 11:34
  Speaker 2: et cetera. People of their own agendas and motives, Like
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: it was very clear that you and I were in
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: that You yourself are a very authentic individual. And look,
• 11:42
  Speaker 2: those are the conversations I love that I thrive on, right,
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: you know, and I enjoy meeting other people who have
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: that sense of purpose, who have that authenticity, just makes
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: you want to learn more about them, right, it makes
• 11:52
  Speaker 2: you want to be friends with them. So I think
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: everything you said it was it was. It was a
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: mutual feeling.
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and we clicked immediately. And one of the fascinating
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: things I found about Joshua uh is he's essentially homeless.
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: Dems a multi billion dollar company. He's got thousands of employees, thousands, right,
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: but there are callous.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: We were about seven hundred, seven hundred.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: Employees my bad, okay, but it will be thousands. Actually,
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: you probably try to keep you happy. A kid count
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: low actually a district of the situation, but that you know,
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: he's in a very lead group with seven hundred and
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: fifty employees even and I have four hundred, and I
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: know that I'm one of the iutting up the top
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: less than one percent of all businesses in Black America.
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: But you're homeless. You lost, as I recalled, you lost
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: a house that right in the fires.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: Well, I was very fortunate that I didn't fully lose
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: the house, but it was dample.
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: And so my man moves around the country. I'm not
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: going to tell you where, what how, But he's very
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: he's reasonably comfortable in his own skins. Have a very
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: cool wife. All of my wife shakeye Luffy would love
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: that nobody involvement, but she loves experiences. But it's just
• 13:09
  Speaker 1: everything I learned about the guy I thought was interesting.
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: He didn't need a place to define him, He didn't
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: need a space to send a message about an address
• 13:19
  Speaker 1: to send a message about how important he was. And
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: I just think that was very cool. With that. I
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: think there was a friend of ours, a mutual friend
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: of ours that you helped out who also had lost
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: their house. We won't want his name, but he had
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: lost his house and you helped him out, even though
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: you were did on stuff at yourself. You even let him.
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: I think stay with you if I recall the CIA thing,
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: nineteen years of age, and that means you have very
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: high intelligence and they targeted you in high school? Am
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: I incorrect? Yeah?
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: I was part of the college program. Yeah, so I
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: was targeted very early and obviously helped with help with
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: the financial cost of going to school.
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: Right, And so I'm gonna assume we can't talk about
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: any about that, but if you decide you want to
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: offer something, feel free. Let's go now to now the
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: audience that was a little bit more about you and
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: why I think you're very cool. Can you unpad? Now
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: we're fourteen minute mark, so anybody is sharing this podcast
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: with others and you just you have limited time. But
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: you really have been curious about insurance, like you don't
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: understand it. You don't understand different types of insurance. Why
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: do we have insurance, what's the purpose of it? Define
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: what's good insurance versus not good insurance. Can you first
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: of all explain traditional I'm gonna say consumer facing insurance, right,
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: and then we can talk about commercial insurance. Then you
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: can layer in bad actors in insurance, like how do
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: you know a good company from a bad somebody's going
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: to pay the claim when it is legitimate, and then
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: reinsurance after that.
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely so. I mean, looking at the insurance industry
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: is all about helping people transfer risks that they have
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: in their life. Those could be health risks with medical insurance,
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: they could be you know, the life risks with life insurance,
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: of course, they could be the risks to your automobile
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: or to your home, you know, with homeowners and auto
• 15:17
  Speaker 2: you know. And when you think about a risk in
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: your life, like you know, you don't have to overcomplicate it.
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: There's kind of three things you can do. You can
• 15:24
  Speaker 2: accept the risk, but that means that if something bad
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: happens to you, you're of course responsible yourself. It's on
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: your balance sheet, so to speak. You can mitigate risk,
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: which means you can take actions and steps to try
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: and reduce the likelihood that something happens right, whether that's
• 15:40
  Speaker 2: buckling your seatbelt, when you get in the car, whether
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: that's locking your doors of your home. But of course,
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: mitigation is rarely, if ever. You know, sort of a
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: linear line that hits zero where you've just eliminated it entirely, right,
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: you can reduce it, but at some point it just
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: sort of flat and out. And that's kind of a
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: fancy way of saying. You know, you can't eliminate most
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: risk in your life. You can't eliminate the risk that
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: you'll get in a car accident. You know that your
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: home will set fire. You know this is all too
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: prescient for me. You can eliminate the cost of that risk,
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: and that's by transferring it. The third component, so you
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: can accept, you can mitigate, or you can transfer. Of course,
• 16:21
  Speaker 2: insurance is one of the ways in which you can
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: transfer your risk. You can transfer to an insurance company.
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: It's highly regulated. These insurance companies all have financial ratings.
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: You have so hold on, Josh.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: So let's back up. So for the audience he mentioned, accepted, Yeah,
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: is it mitigated? Is that one? Yep? So? Uh? And
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: and and the and then the third one is to
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: offset the risk, transfer the transfer it for the very wealthy,
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: the uber wealthy, the first two things are sort of combined,
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: except and mitigate. They're doing some uber wealthy people are
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: doing or bonding themselves. Or you might be in a
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: prop in an area where insurance companies say that's just
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: too risky at all, We're not going to ensure that
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: at all. In order to do that, you got tot
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: that all yourself and you literally bond around your own assets.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: But that's not this conversation. But I want to at
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: least raise that so that the audience knew the whole picture.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: So now you're at now you're at defining the insurance itself.
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, look the math you hit it was
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: very simple, like whatever you haven't transferred or mitigated you
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: have accepted. Right, You've got to kind of do some introspection.
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: That's a wrap there, turn.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: That into a wrap. Yeah, I mean, you have some introspection.
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: You got to look at yourself and say, look, what
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: have I not transferred? What have I not mitigated? That's
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: what I've accepted, you know. And in my world, like
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: the case of cyber risk for commercial organizations, you know,
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: they adopt all this technology and they don't they ignore
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: the risks, so most of them they're accepting that risk today,
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: sometimes without realizing it. And so I think the important
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: thing is to understand what you want to accept and
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: then you can figure out the math and what you
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: want to mitigate, how to mitigate it, and how to
• 18:08
  Speaker 2: transfer it. But that's what insurance does. It lets you
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: transfer some of those risks, and particularly the catastrophic ones. Right.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: Insurance isn't built for the things that are just happening
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: every day and for small things. It's really built for
• 18:22
  Speaker 2: catastrophic things that you know, if it happened, it's just
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: it would bankrupt you or it would you severely impact
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: your life. And so that's what it's that's what it's
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: intended for. That's why people buy it. That's the value
• 18:35
  Speaker 2: of it, you know. And at the end of the day, Yeah,
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: sometimes the insurance companies may say we're not willing to
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: ensure something. You got to listen to them occasionally, right,
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: Like you know, they don't want to ensure the house
• 18:46
  Speaker 2: in that area. It's for a good reason. It's for
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: a good reason, you know. And then of course, as
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: you mentioned, for the uber wealthy, sometimes they decide to
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: live in those areas anyway. But that's that's a decision
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: that they have to make.
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: A friend that I don't know. He doesn't come to
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: that meeting, so I'm not sure you know him. But
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: I can't say too much about him. Other whe people
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: will guess. But he runs He has a major real
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: estate company in America, and he has a house in
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: the Hamptons and this house is next to a cliff.
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: He loves his house, but the erosion keeps coming closer
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: and closer to him. And this guy decided to pick
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: the house up and move the house one hundred yards in.
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: Who shows you how much property owns at the coast?
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: Move one hundred yards in and his and his accountant
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: told him that'll give him the After accountant talked to
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: the appraiser and the assessor and all those people, the
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: account said, well, this will give you ten more years
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: of use of the house before the erosion catches up
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: with you. The erosion, for anybody's not clear. It means
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: that the ocean is taking away land because the waves,
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: and I think because of global environmental issues. But the
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: waves are continuing to push away or chop away at
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: the land, and it was going to chop away at
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: his house. And so he decided to move the house.
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: And my guess is he's self insured. My guess is
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: he's got a bondage self Yeah.
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: I did to agree with you, all right.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: So if you have car insurance, yep, you have home insurance, yep,
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: there's renters insurance. I'm trying to go through the obvious ones.
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Renter's medical life, you know, health insurance. Of course.
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: There's quite a few forms you can buy insurance for.
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: You know, jewelry, you know, your engagement ring, you can.
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: Have I have different policies that layer in on my
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: home policy. One is a jewelry there's a rider a
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: writer policy that goes on top of the overall policy,
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: like a bonus policy. And then I'm a key man
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: insurance policy. Uh well, the organizations I work for talk
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: about capitalism being the gladiator sport. My organization has gone
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: a policy in case something happens to me. It was
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: like John, really sorry for you, what you're you know,
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: this happened to you your family, So sorry John's loss.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: And then to cheing, the company gets a check. If
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: I'm immobilized, I'm no longer on the spots. That's called
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: key man insurance, and I'm the man uh in that example,
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: then you've got board of directors insurance.
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, directors and officers insurance.
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: You know, directors and officers. Sot's with the insurance that
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: most people would be dealing with. Here, let's just make
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: this easiest, uh, car insurance and I guess the easiest
• 21:57
  Speaker 1: one for you home insurance. You just dealt with this.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: Also, yep.
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: So is there such thing as a bad insurance company?
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: I mean, you know, of course there's there's such a
• 22:08
  Speaker 2: thing as a bad insurance company. You know. I think
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of regulations in each state that try
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: to weed those out. But you know, at the end
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: of the day, like the best insurance company, they do
• 22:18
  Speaker 2: pay claims, Like that's what we're in the business to do.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: If there were no claims or if we didn't pay them,
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: we'd be very quickly out of business. And so, you know,
• 22:27
  Speaker 2: while I think maybe there's certain companies that don't have
• 22:30
  Speaker 2: as much of a focus on that, or maybe the
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: claim servicing isn't good. That's I think that's one of
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: the key determinants of why consumers select one insurance company
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: versus another, Like when it comes to highly regulated spaces
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: of insurance like homeowners or auto you're actually buying the
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: exact same policy, Like if you were to look at
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: the policy from State Farm or from Progressive or Geico.
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: You know, here in California where I am, the wording
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: is identical. It covers the exact same things. Wow, it's
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: actually regulated by the state. You know, what you're choosing
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: is of course the pricing, which they have different views
• 23:05
  Speaker 2: of how risky you are, and they'll offer you different prices.
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: And then you're paying for the servicing. You know, who's
• 23:10
  Speaker 2: going to give you the best service, who's going to
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: take care of you, who's most likely to pay the claim?
• 23:15
  Speaker 2: And you know, those are reputations that are hard fought
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: for and of course easily lost, you know if they're
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: if that's broken. So big part of the businesses on trust,
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: see that. I think the churance companies you want to
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: avoid are those that don't have that long term view,
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: you know, that don't want to build that long term
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: relationship with you. But at the end of the day,
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: with companies like ours, we're you know, we're here to
• 23:35
  Speaker 2: partner with our customers, like we're in this together. We're
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: taking the same shared risk with them, and we want
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: to help them.
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: Well you're honorable. Let me when I was growing up.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: That's why I have you on this podcast and why
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: I'm one of the feature us. I think you're a
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: role model for good capitalism and responsible business. When I
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: was growing up in Common, California, No, this was South
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: and Gerrola to be specific, I did not have a
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: lot of money I bought it was my first car
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: or my second car, and all I could afford I
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: thought I could afford was liability insurance. You had. It
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: was in order to drive the car, you had to
• 24:10
  Speaker 1: at least have liability insurance, right, and you need to
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: have comp and collision if you have I guess a
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: bank loan or something like that. So I had liability
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: insurance and I went and got cheap compic collision that
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: I had a bank loan. Bank will force the insurance
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: on you if you don't get it yourself. If they
• 24:28
  Speaker 1: force it, it's going to be very expensive. But anyway,
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: I had this policy, but I got the sketchiest just
• 24:33
  Speaker 1: a full transparency. I ended up with the sketchiest insurance
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: company you can imagine because I was a little the
• 24:39
  Speaker 1: cheapest deal and audience, it looks too good to be true.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: It probably is. And I got this this policy that
• 24:50
  Speaker 1: really wasn't all that great, and I just prayed to
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: god I never had to use it. That was a fearful.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: I was definitely afraid that I'd call this company and
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: either the phone number would work or they just wouldn't
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: the claim and srure enough, I had a claim and
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: they ran me through the ringer and they send people
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: out to the repair company, and they took photos. They
• 25:13
  Speaker 1: took weeks and weeks and weeks, and then they paid
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: paid the smallest portion of it. And it taught me like,
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: you really need to do your research. You need to
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: get a company that's a good balance sheet as good reviews.
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: You got to research these companies. All these companies are
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: not made identical, even though as you just educated the
• 25:33
  Speaker 1: audience and me, the policies themselves are actually the wording
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: is identical. That's why I asked you about are there
• 25:40
  Speaker 1: sketchy firms? So what does the audience need to know about,
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: whether it's an auto policy or a home owns policy.
• 25:50
  Speaker 1: There's some quick, easy recommendations you have for them before
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: we go on.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, sure, I mean, like you said, you know, with
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: auto you can buy liability only coverage, which means it
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: doesn't cover your loss, just someone else's. If you get
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: into an accident, and that means you know, you're you're
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: kind of up the creek without the paddle if that happens,
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: that's where I think you you want to buy those
• 26:11
  Speaker 2: first party coverages, the collision, the comprehensive, you know, to
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: make sure you're covered. But at a minimum. That's like
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: you said, you only need the liability I think you know.
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: In the homeowners again, it's all fairly standardized. There are
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: some differences in policies, like whether they cover, you know,
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: your sewage line. As an example, if your sewage line
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: backs up, you have to buy that coverage specifically, you
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: need to ask your insurance company for it. Many homeowners
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: policies don't cover it, and people are surprised, you know,
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: when that happens that hey, they've got to pay for
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: it all, which can be thousands of dollars, you know,
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: in an unexpected expense. Some homeowners policies now cover cyber
• 26:50
  Speaker 2: for for people like you know, for data privacy, if
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: you know, for for things like that, you know, or
• 26:56
  Speaker 2: if your home network is hacked, you know, they'll help
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: you recover it. You know that that might be an
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: add on that people want to think about. It's typically
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: very inexpensive, so yeah, but otherwise, you know, it's they're
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: fairly standardized.
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: Fire, fire coverage, blood coverage.
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: Many owners policies don't cover flood, and so you have
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: if you're in a flood prone area, you need to
• 27:17
  Speaker 2: think about purchasing dedicated flood insurance. Sometimes sometimes the state
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: offers it. That's right, depending on the state you're in.
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: The same thing for other large natural disasters. Earthquake insurance
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: not covered under a standard policy, but you can purchase
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: it from the California Earthquake Authority for example, where we
• 27:34
  Speaker 2: are so flood and earthquake you know, tend to be
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: tend to be excluded. So you need to think about
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: purchasing those coverages specifically if you can't get insurance from
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: a standard commercial insurance company. Many states also have you know,
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: last resort insurance offerings, like in the state of Florida
• 27:54
  Speaker 2: or the state of California with the Fair Plan. You know,
• 27:56
  Speaker 2: a lot of the folks who are affected in the
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: LA fires, that's the only insurance they could buy given
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: you know how difficult it was for the insurance companies
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: to get the rates they needed, or just the extreme
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: risk of where people were building.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: So let's deal with that for a minute. You educated
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: me at lunch about the raid environment and where some
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: insurance we won't name names, but some insurance companies have
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: said I don't want to do business in California or
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: Florida whatever, I'm out. And some people may demonize that,
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: but the reality is that the honorable companies, the good
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: ones we're talking about, the shysters I talked about earlier.
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: The good companies have to make listen to the audience,
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: a profit. They've got to be able to make a profit,
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: and that means managing risk. So if you have an
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: area with higher risk, they need a rate environment that
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: mitigates the risks. So there's more coming in that's going out.
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: If all they do is paying claims all the time
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: because it's high risk, and the premiums what you pay
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: monthly or annually or semi annually don't cover that plus
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: a return to the company in reasonable return to the shareholders,
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: that company does not have a future. And in some
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: states the insurance commissioner, so there is no national insurance commissioner,
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: there's national banking commissioners. But there's insurance of state by
• 29:17
  Speaker 1: state regulated and some states have elected officials officials in
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: this role versus somebody appointed by the governor who serves
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: as the chief executive of the state. When you're elected,
• 29:35
  Speaker 1: there's more pressure on you to be responsive to to
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: be blocked the voters. What the voters want, Chief Chief, Chief,
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: Chief Chief cheap. So what do people elected who are
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: running with that role. They promised the moon and then
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: their job is then the beat up sort of the
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: big guy versus the little guy message, beat up on
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: the big guy representing the little guy, supposedly, and that's
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: the narrative. I happen to be speaking to a person
• 30:02
  Speaker 1: who's running for insurance commissioner after we had lunch, and
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: I mentioned this to him and he agreed with you.
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: By the way, he's running for insurance commissioner, and part
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: of his platform I wish I remember his name. Actually,
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: the part of his platform is once he's elected, he
• 30:20
  Speaker 1: wants to lobby for advocate for moving this from He
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: wants to be the last elected insurance commissioner. Actually it's
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: in California. He's actually a black man. And Greg raised
• 30:29
  Speaker 1: the neighborhoods like gr Up and he think it's a
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: better system, which you recommended. Now, in places like California
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: where I grew up, you might have a fire that
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: triggers a flood and maybe you were covered by the fire,
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: but the real damage was done by the flood, and
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: if you don't have flood insurance, you may not get
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: your claim pay. Am I right about that? Am I
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: wrong about that?
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's it's always really complex. It really depends
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: on all the circumstances. But yeah, it's entirely possible. I mean,
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: I mean you can also have circumstances. An earthquake, you know,
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: causes a gas leak which leads to a fire of
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: your home. You know that actually probably would be covered
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: because in this case it is covered for fire damage
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: even though the fire was caused by the earthquake. Had
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: had it just been damaged from an earthquake, it wouldn't
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: have been covered, so you know, unless of course, you
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: purchased earthquake insurance specifically. So it really depends on what's
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: the like, the most proximate cause that's causing the loss.
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: I also want to encourage the audience to think about
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of renters these days, and I'm I am,
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: I have been and will be soon again a landlord.
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: I encourage renters to goog to get renters insurance because
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: if something happens to your unit, one you might be
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: liable is it happens in your unit, but also somebody
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: unfortunately breaks in your unit, you can get your money
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: back for that. Even utilities insurance. I've had insurance for
• 32:03
  Speaker 1: very expensive utility appliances. Actually inside the house of an
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: impliance insurance, your refrigerator, all that stuff when it breaks down,
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: their insurance for that. That's so I just want the
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: audience to understand this is an entire ecosystem and you
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: have to be smart about it. The last thing I
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: mentioned is I had a employee that passed away and
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: the family was busy for doing a go fundme, organizing
• 32:30
  Speaker 1: a go fundme campaign for his funeral expenses, not realizing
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: that in his health policy health insurance policy was in
• 32:38
  Speaker 1: the small print a death benefit of twenty five thousand dollars. So,
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: anybody listening to this, if you're employed by a reasonably
• 32:46
  Speaker 1: large employer and you have health insurance from a responsible,
• 32:49
  Speaker 1: respectable firm, there's a reasonably good chance that's buried in there.
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: The word buried, but embedded in the health insurance policy
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: is a death benefit. God forbid, something happens that's covered.
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: So please read your part.
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: This is financial life insurance policy too. Yeah, I think
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: you know you could have a great landlord like John here,
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: who you have insurance for the building, but that insurance
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: doesn't cover the personal property of the renter. That's why
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: renters insurance is so important, right, you know it don't
• 33:22
  Speaker 2: it won't cover you know, they need that coverage for
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: their own personal property, their own furniture, their own you know, valuables.
• 33:29
  Speaker 1: Right. So now let's let's uh in the time that
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: you have left. It's amazing how fast thirty minutes when
• 33:34
  Speaker 1: thirty five minutes. Let's jump up now to reinsurance. Sorry,
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: unless you have something else to say about traditional insurance.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: I get only get to your side top of insurance
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: as order to drop the mic. But I want to
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: do with reinsurance people don't know about No.
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, look, i'd say, you're I want to go
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: back and emphasize a point, which is like, you know,
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: the insurance companies are not the bad guys here, right,
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: you know, No, insurance company wants to leave any state,
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: like we want to do business in every state, especially ones.
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: It's just that sometimes they have to if they can't
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: get the right pricing, if the regulators won't approve it.
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: And look, no one wants to pay more for their insurance.
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: But we also have to look in the mirror and
• 34:06
  Speaker 2: realize that, you know, as risk in our society increases,
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: you know, the cost of insurance will as well, and
• 34:12
  Speaker 2: if we don't allow it to we won't be able
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: to get it. Like that's the simple matter. But no,
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: let's talk about you know, reinsurance, which is really just
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: the insurance of other insurance companies. It's that simple.
• 34:23
  Speaker 1: Fascinating guys, listen to this. This is great stuff here.
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: And so I d of Lloyd's of London, is that
• 34:29
  Speaker 1: a reinsurre.
• 34:31
  Speaker 2: Lloyds of London is an insurance marketplace and they do
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: both insurance. You can get a policy directly from Lloyd's.
• 34:37
  Speaker 2: You know, I think David Beckham got it for his
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: you know, his calves and.
• 34:41
  Speaker 1: Being got it for his life. No insurance company would
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: give would give doctor Martin Luther King Jr. A live
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: insurance policy.
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: That's absolutely a risk insurance and then they also ensure
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: other insurance companies, so they also do they do both. Look,
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: the simple principle with reinsurance, like in our lives and
• 35:00
  Speaker 2: our wealth, it's about diversification, right, Like you know you
• 35:04
  Speaker 2: need to diversify your assets. You don't want all your
• 35:06
  Speaker 2: eggs in one basket, as they say, Well, the same
• 35:08
  Speaker 2: is true for insurance companies.
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: You can imagine that if there was one, you know,
• 35:13
  Speaker 2: with the California wildfires, you know that exposure for any
• 35:17
  Speaker 2: individual insurance company could be catastrophic if they're insuring all
• 35:20
  Speaker 2: the homes in that area. Well, by by using reinsurance,
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: they can actually buy their own insurance policy and they
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: can diversify that risk. They can pass on some of
• 35:29
  Speaker 2: the risk that they're taking from their clients and they
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: can give it to other companies, whether that's Lloyd's of London,
• 35:35
  Speaker 2: or whether that's other big reinsurance companies like Munichry or Swissery,
• 35:39
  Speaker 2: or there's there's the Renaissance Free Archery. There's many and
• 35:43
  Speaker 2: so it's all about diversification. How to insurance companies diversify
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: their risks so they can continue operating even if there
• 35:50
  Speaker 2: is a catastrophe that happens.
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: So somebody might run a policy for fifty million dollars,
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: let's pick a number, and they want to they want
• 36:02
  Speaker 1: to mitigate that. They can sell off that in ten
• 36:06
  Speaker 1: million dollar blocks to a partner in that insurance policy.
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: Is that right, Yeah, that's what. There's many ways they
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: can structure it. So one way is, hey, I write
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: fifty million, I'm going to give you forty million because
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: I can only afford to take on ten. So that's
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: one way they do it. Another way they might do
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: it is say, look, I'm I can ensure I can
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: take a loss on an event up to forty million,
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: but I want to buy reinsurance for anything above that.
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: So if the loss of a single event like a
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: wildfire or hurricane goes above that level, then I can
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: purchase reinsurance and the reinsure will take on all the
• 36:44
  Speaker 2: risk above it. That way, I know exactly what my
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: worst case scenario is and I can make sure that
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: my business, my balance sheet is set up to where
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: I can withstand that. So that's just one mechanism that
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: insurance companies used to try and just like we do
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: as people, you know, manage the risks to themselves.
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: Right. I had a situation last week where I love cars,
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: and one of my automobiles, which is one of my favorites,
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: there was a crack in the windshield. And you know,
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: I grew up not with much and so I'm thinking, okay,
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: we'll just go have the people say, you know, safe
• 37:29
  Speaker 1: light where it is, you know, just fix the crack.
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: They're like, no, that's not this kind of that's not
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: this kind of a windshield. So they called my people
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: call me or like, this windshield is fifteen thousand dollars.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: I am was passed out. I said no, no, no,
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: you mean the car. No, no, the windshield. And they said,
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: but John, not to worry. You've got a policy for windshields,
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: which I was like, oh my god. Maybe I am
• 37:59
  Speaker 1: smart as I as smart as I think I am.
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: So that costs me zero Actually no premium? No no, no,
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: what's that part where you copey? There was no copay
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: noble Yeah, no deductible. Right. So there are, by the way,
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: for those listening, there are there's insurance for if you
• 38:19
  Speaker 1: scratch your rams. You I'm joking, but I'm serious, Like,
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: there are insurance policies that will cover it almost anything.
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: You can imagine there was such an entrepreneurial environment. Anything
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: that has a risk, somebody is trying to mitigate it.
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: And in this example he just that Josh just dave.
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: Insurers are mitigating their own risk with reinsurers and partners
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: in insurance. You don't see that as the as a client,
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: but it's happening in the background. Let's not talk about
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: the biggest area, the nine hundred pound gorilla in the room.
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: We've not talked about. We're forty minutes in. Let's dedicate
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: the last eight to ten minutes or so talking about
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: this great business you really pioneered in many ways, and
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: what it is you do and why it's so important
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: to businesses. Does it Does it relate to folks who
• 39:09
  Speaker 1: find themselves held hostage. You've got somebody saying basically, shut
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: you out of your own mainframe computer, shut you out
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: of your email, shut you out. They've gotten into your
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: system and they said we won't release it unless you
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: pay a ransom to us in cryptocurrency or whatever. Is
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: that this?
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's certainly one of the things that we cover absolutely,
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: and I think most people who are listening have probably
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: experienced some sort of inconvenience from a cyber attack, right,
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: like they couldn't board their plane or it was delayed
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: or you know, I mean they've had their data compromise.
• 39:48
  Speaker 2: You know, this is just a it's a growing risk.
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: Like over about six or seven out of every company
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: that purchases cyber insurance, which is what we do, they'll
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: have a claim in any given year. It's one of
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: the highest frequency claims that you might have as a
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: business owner, and yet a lot of companies still don't
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: purchase it. Right, So that's another one of those things
• 40:09
  Speaker 2: where do you really want to accept this risk and
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: do you know how much you are accepting?
• 40:14
  Speaker 1: And an AI environment is going to be even more critical. Absolutely,
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: And my guess is as people, as computers start masquerating
• 40:22
  Speaker 1: as humans, as things like pass codes that which used
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: to be hard to crack become easier to crack. I mean,
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: I used to be really irritated at double whether basically
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: double double crunched passwords where the social media account would
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: require me to confirm twice that it's me. Now I
• 40:47
  Speaker 1: love it, but when I first started, I thought it
• 40:50
  Speaker 1: was completely nonsense. And now I can see it, I
• 40:53
  Speaker 1: can see what even that's not enough. So as the
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: risk change, and as society becomes more technology becomes more sophisticated,
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: my guess is you've got a bunch of engineers every
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: day trying to crunch and analyze the newest areas of
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: risk and how to mintigate.
• 41:09
  Speaker 2: Is that right, that's absolutely right. Yeah. I mean we're
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: in a place where I tell people, you know, they
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: asked me, do I need cyber insurance? Do you use
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: a computer? Do you use the internet?
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: And you need My God, Joshua, everything's in the cloud.
• 41:23
  Speaker 2: Everything, and even if you're using technology, chances are someone
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: else's is and if that fails, it can impact you.
• 41:31
  Speaker 2: I mean, take right now, that big yeah, you know,
• 41:36
  Speaker 2: take Jaguar land Rover. You know, they're making cars. They
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: experienced this devastating cyber attack, but the impact goes way
• 41:43
  Speaker 2: beyond them. All their suppliers, you know, who are making parts,
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: who are stitching that, you know, the seats, like whatever.
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: They can't do business. They're losing business.
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: They got shut down.
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: They got shut down. I mean, and that's the thing.
• 41:57
  Speaker 2: Even if someone else gets shut down, it can have
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: a profound impact on your own business. And so that's
• 42:02
  Speaker 2: what cyber insurance is there to cover not just your
• 42:05
  Speaker 2: own losses, but also losses you might experience because someone
• 42:08
  Speaker 2: else in your supply chain you know, has a as
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: a security failure.
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: This is not directly related to your business. But one
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: thing is that I found fascinating is twenty years ago
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: there were landline phones in everybody's house, and now there's
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: almost no landline phones in anybody's house. I have a
• 42:38
  Speaker 1: land loan land line phone is my reinsuring risk.
• 42:43
  Speaker 2: Not nostalgic.
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: I'm not just being nostalgic. If something happens to the
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: saving network, if there is a if there's a if
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: there's a bad guy and a bad actor country out
• 42:54
  Speaker 1: there that wants to mess with us. They cut the
• 42:56
  Speaker 1: cables on the ocean floor that is that transfers a
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: lot of our data, and they find a way to
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: disrupt the cell phone system, and first responders can't communicate.
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: You can't find your your loved ones, your phone, your
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: house goes dark. So I have a hard, old school
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: landline phone just in case, because people are reliable. Right, Yes,
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: I'm mitigating myself. So give us take us into your mind,
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: not not in your mind, take us into the world
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: of your company coalition, what kind of things are you ensuring,
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: what kind of things are you dealing with, and what
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: are some examples of how you mitigated that you can share? Yeah.
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, I mean, look, I'll go backward from what are
• 43:43
  Speaker 2: the claims that are that our customers are filing, like
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: where are they losing money? A lot of it is
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: with social engineering, right There's it's not even hacking, it's
• 43:52
  Speaker 2: just there being criminals are using technology, whether it's email
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: or fake invoices are now deep fakes where they're using
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: AI to mimic people's voices or whatnot to basically trick
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: you into typically wiring the money, right, or it could
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: be to give them a bunch of gift cards because
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: if you go out and run and get gift cards
• 44:13
  Speaker 2: and give them the numbers, that's as good as money.
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: And so there's just a lot of social engineering where
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: they're trying to trick people into wiring funds. I mean,
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: this morning, my CFO asked me if an invoice was legitimate,
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: and it absolutely was not, you know, and he thought
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: about paying it. That's how convincing some of these things
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: can be.
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: So that's what happened to us at Operation Hope. And
• 44:35
  Speaker 1: so how do you mitigate that as.
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: An insurer, Well, so you know, we try and advise
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: our clients to have sort of an authentication mechanism before
• 44:45
  Speaker 2: they wire money, right, like make sure that you know
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: in particular businesses they tend to be wiring to the
• 44:51
  Speaker 2: same folks. If you're getting some sort of instruction that
• 44:54
  Speaker 2: it's like, hey, we need to change our wiring instructions,
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: you need to pick up the phone or some they're
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: out of band means to communicate and verify that that's
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: in fact true, because you can't rely on email. If
• 45:06
  Speaker 2: those instructions come into an email, it could be that
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: their email was hacked, and so you want a separate
• 45:12
  Speaker 2: means of communication to validate that whatever change is coming
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: through is them or if it's a first time wire.
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: We encourage our clients to do the same thing. Make
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: sure you reach out through a different communications method to
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: confirm the wire instructions. So that's a big, big way
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: you can mitigate it just through a simple process change
• 45:31
  Speaker 2: and people should do that in their own lives. You know,
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: when you're buying homes, criminals know that that is a
• 45:37
  Speaker 2: that is a place where they can potentially get a
• 45:40
  Speaker 2: big windfall and so they'll try and hack the emails
• 45:43
  Speaker 2: of realtors of the title companies, and if they can
• 45:47
  Speaker 2: find a way in, they can try and convince you
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: to wire you know, your down payment or your the
• 45:52
  Speaker 2: proceeds to buy a house to them. I mean, it's
• 45:54
  Speaker 2: and it can be devastating. And so that's why it's
• 45:56
  Speaker 2: just so important to make sure that you're verifying, you know, instructions,
• 46:01
  Speaker 2: not just taking for granted whatever is being sent to
• 46:03
  Speaker 2: you via email.
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: So be paranoid.
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: Only do paranoid survive as they as has been said.
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: Yes, so if it looks sketchy, stop and pause.
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: And even if it doesn't look sketchy, that's the thing.
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: Sometimes these things don't look sketchy.
• 46:23
  Speaker 1: Sometimes look legitimate, but still stop and pause. In other words,
• 46:28
  Speaker 1: that are safe than sorry. Even if if you're if
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: you're if you're transferring what you consider important sums of money,
• 46:36
  Speaker 1: whatever important is to you, just take a moment to
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: this confirm, put the phone or do something as you
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: say it out of the system, to confirm that the
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: person you're that is asking for it is actually asking
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: for it. And they say, yes, we are, we are,
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: we are requesting that you do excellent and you confirm
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: this email, confirm it all before you hit that SIND button.
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: When I want to send a wire to someone I have,
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: I can have my chief of staff for me to
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: send a note to the bank. The bank must call
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: me and get a verbal confirmation for me voice to
• 47:15
  Speaker 1: voice on my on the phone before they send that
• 47:18
  Speaker 1: wire every time, which I again used to irritate me.
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: Now I'm very thankful. I have a friend of mine
• 47:26
  Speaker 1: that lost a half a million dollars to the scam
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: that you just mentioned. He has an automotive company and
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: his CFO was is send an email to the bank,
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: and this particular time it was the process was different.
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: It was a different email address. Somebody had hacked the system,
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: and the way it was done the bank he was
• 47:52
  Speaker 1: able to hold the bank accountable. The bank was actually
• 47:54
  Speaker 1: able to claw back the money. Oddly enough, they got lucky,
• 47:57
  Speaker 1: but the bank would have been on the hook case.
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: But had he not gotten lucky in the situation, he'd
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: have been out of a half a million dollars. And
• 48:04
  Speaker 1: because they were just moving too fast. So be paranoid.
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: Confirm out of system, which means if you're going by
• 48:12
  Speaker 1: email or by text, call someone or confirm in some
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: other way. Don't just respond to the email because the
• 48:19
  Speaker 1: email is Joshua said, might be hacked itself. That's once
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: a week. Could get a scam on my phone. Call
• 48:26
  Speaker 1: on my phone, somebody says. And by the way, don't
• 48:28
  Speaker 1: hit buttons when they say please press this. You know
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: your your phone's been I get this all the time.
• 48:33
  Speaker 1: Your phone's been hacked. Hit this button. Do not hit
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: that button.
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: Yes, do not send that gift card. You know for sure.
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: Now there's lots of these scams. And look, your friend's lucky.
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: I mean, most banks will won't cover it, right, They'll say, hey,
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: you made the decision, you were the one trick. There
• 48:52
  Speaker 2: wasn't any failure in our process. The other thing that
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: can be very helpful is if you have an insurance
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: company like us, you call us and we have remarkable
• 49:00
  Speaker 2: success in clawing back funds. In fact, I think in
• 49:03
  Speaker 2: the past twelve months we've clawed back over one hundred
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: million dollars for our clients.
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: Wow, can explain what clawback means?
• 49:10
  Speaker 2: Josh yeah, absolutely so. Look, when when these criminals are
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: tricking you to wiring money, you know they're typically having
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: you send it into an account that they've taken over.
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: They've they've hijacked someone's real bank account. They know they're
• 49:25
  Speaker 2: going to get caught at some point and the bank
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: account will be frozen and then they just find another one.
• 49:31
  Speaker 2: But if you can and so, some of those funds
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: are still there, they're still in the US financial system,
• 49:36
  Speaker 2: they're in that bank, and so if you can get
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: there quickly, you can claw back that money. You can
• 49:42
  Speaker 2: pull it out of the bank account that you sent
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: it to and get it back. But of course it's
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: important to do it, to do it quickly, and that's
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: something that again as your insurance company, we can we
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: help you do, right because we have an incentive to
• 49:55
  Speaker 2: get it back for you. If we don't, we of
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: course pay out your loss because typically, again and it's
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: in our experience, a bank is not often willing to
• 50:02
  Speaker 2: do that. So yeah, that's a really common one. I mean,
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: the other thing is is you pointed out this whole
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: multi factor authentication, you know, making sure that it's not
• 50:12
  Speaker 2: just a password. You know that you have your account
• 50:15
  Speaker 2: tied to maybe a text message, a code that you
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: get because the other most common claim we see is
• 50:21
  Speaker 2: people taking over people's emails accounts you know, and once
• 50:24
  Speaker 2: they're in your email, they can literally send an email
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: like you John, and it's like someone receiving it wouldn't
• 50:30
  Speaker 2: know the difference. Right, it's coming, it's legitimate, you know,
• 50:33
  Speaker 2: maybe you're asking them to send money or something very
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: difficult to detect. And so making sure you have that
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: additional protection on your most key accounts is really important.
• 50:43
  Speaker 1: Are you guys doing social media insurance yet? Have you
• 50:46
  Speaker 1: delved into that? I think that's a big market for you.
• 50:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean we do account takeover kind of insurance
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: for companies. So if someone takes over their social media
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: profile yet really yeah, we call it service fraud. If
• 51:01
  Speaker 2: they if they take over any service you have and
• 51:05
  Speaker 2: they use it in a way that causes you a loss,
• 51:08
  Speaker 2: there can be coverage for it. So for example, they
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: could take over your cloud accounts and install sort of
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: a crypto minor they want to like mind cryptocurrency, it
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: drives up your bill sky high. Or maybe they take
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: over your telephone system and drive your bill up. You know,
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: all those types of things would be would be covered.
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: But also your people can advise if you are insuring
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: somebody in that regard, you can advise the claimant on
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: ways to fight back, to mitigate. So the reason I'm
• 51:36
  Speaker 1: saying this is a celebrity friend of mine called me
• 51:40
  Speaker 1: last year. His Facebook account had been taken over, the
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: fan account, right, and there were a million people that
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: he wasn't talking to anymore. The bad people were talking
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: to him and they were asking for money from the fans.
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: But it felt like it's sat tho it. The impression
• 52:01
  Speaker 1: was the celebrity was asking for the money. It was
• 52:03
  Speaker 1: driving him crazy. For Abby's reason, Joshua, this went on
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: for months. He couldn't he couldn't get He didn't know
• 52:10
  Speaker 1: how to actually helped him. As I know the people
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: had met a Facebook. I put him in touch with
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: that would give Zuckerberg some credit here, put him in
• 52:18
  Speaker 1: touch with Mark Zuckerberg's chief of staff, and she did
• 52:23
  Speaker 1: a fabulous job of dreve's the name of resolving this.
• 52:28
  Speaker 1: I want to thank her publicly. But it saved my guy,
• 52:31
  Speaker 1: my friend, from pulling his hair out. And there's probably
• 52:36
  Speaker 1: right now twenty fake accounts in my name on Instagram
• 52:41
  Speaker 1: TikTok for sure. People just I don't know why they're
• 52:44
  Speaker 1: wasting their time trying to be like somebody else. But
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: people will put my name plus a one mispail my name. If,
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: by the way, if somebody's following me, it doesn't have
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: a check mark next to it, it's not me. Becau
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: doesn't have a blue check mark on every place other
• 52:58
  Speaker 1: than X. It's not me. It's always just my name,
• 53:01
  Speaker 1: John O'Brien. But people have told me they have lost
• 53:03
  Speaker 1: twenty five thousand dollars one friendship, or told me somebody
• 53:05
  Speaker 1: that he knows that John Brant asked them to send
• 53:09
  Speaker 1: them twenty five thousand dollars in this person somehow reasons
• 53:11
  Speaker 1: said please audience, I'm never going to ask you for money, right,
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: no legitimate public figure it's going to be asking you
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: for money. It's a scam. But Joshua has a program
• 53:23
  Speaker 1: that ensures companies and public figures like mine against these risks.
• 53:31
  Speaker 1: So you might want to look his company up for that.
• 53:33
  Speaker 1: That's a nice little bonus cherry on top that I
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: wasn't thinking about Joshua as we ramped this thing up.
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: This has been fantastic. Is there can you tell people
• 53:41
  Speaker 1: like the different services that you offer at Coalition, how
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: do people reach you? And is there like some takeaway
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: wisdom that you have for people who are dreamers with
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: a shovel in their hand. They want they want to
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: be part of the American dream. They want to be
• 53:58
  Speaker 1: part of capitalism and free enterprise. They want to be successful,
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: they want to own a home. You know, what are
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: some things that you would just recommend to people?
• 54:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, look, maybe maybe I'll start there. I mean, I think, look,
• 54:11
  Speaker 2: pick a problem that you're passionate about. You know, what's
• 54:13
  Speaker 2: something that you see that's happening in our society or
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: in your life or in your community that you know,
• 54:19
  Speaker 2: if you could fix it, it'd be better for everyone. Right, Like,
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: now you're finding something like a problem to be solved
• 54:25
  Speaker 2: that's actually valuable, you know, if you can find a
• 54:27
  Speaker 2: way to turn that into a business, you know, similar
• 54:29
  Speaker 2: to what we did. You know, I think that's powerful
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: and it makes it easier to barely be resilient and
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: push through you know the difficulties of starting a business,
• 54:40
  Speaker 2: you know. And in our case, it was like, Hey,
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: we could see all these businesses adopting technology and it's wonderful, right,
• 54:46
  Speaker 2: like all the stuff that's coming out, all the new technologies,
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: But of course there's all these risks that come along
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: with it, and we really felt that with insurance combined
• 54:55
  Speaker 2: with some security products, we could build an entirely different
• 54:58
  Speaker 2: way to approach this problem them. We could make it
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: a lot more affordable. We could make it easy for people,
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: And that's the key. Everyone wants easy, you know. So
• 55:07
  Speaker 2: I think for anyone who wants to pick up the
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: shovel and build, you know, find the thing that inspires you.
• 55:12
  Speaker 2: That's the problem that people have that you know, if
• 55:14
  Speaker 2: you solve it, you know, you think it'll be valuable.
• 55:17
  Speaker 2: You know, nine out of ten times you can find
• 55:19
  Speaker 2: a way to create a business around it.
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: And he just told you the essence of capitalism. Capitalism
• 55:25
  Speaker 1: is solving problems. Uh. And entrepreneurship in the free enterprise
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: system is how you do that. Well. Small business are business,
• 55:34
  Speaker 1: which is different from corporate business entrepreneurship. These are three
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: different routes. I'm an entrepreneur, crazy creating something out of nothing.
• 55:43
  Speaker 1: Josh is an entrepreneur crazy creating something out of nothing
• 55:46
  Speaker 1: didn't exist before. A business owner might take what we're
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: doing and try to replicate it using our business plan.
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: That's not entrepreneurship, but that is business. But find something
• 55:56
  Speaker 1: where you're solving a problem. A hair brush is solving
• 55:59
  Speaker 1: a nappy hair problem, our kiki air problem. I'm willing
• 56:02
  Speaker 1: to pay for that hair brush. Or skin care is
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: solving a problem of beautification or a rash. All of
• 56:11
  Speaker 1: this is capitalism, and I think his advice has really
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: dropped the mic. It is quite brilliant, and it's coming
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: from somebody came up with an idea in twenty seventeen,
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: which was a nothing when he started, and he's taken
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: it from zero in twenty seventeen to what's the revenue
• 56:26
  Speaker 1: and or the valuation today, Josh, they're about their.
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: About recyclon valuation.
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah, five billion invaluation from twenty seventeen. That is eight years,
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: pretty impressive. And he's created jobs for seven hundred and
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: fifty people, giving them a living wage. They're paying their
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: car notes, they're paying their insurance, they're sending their kids
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: to college, they're paying their taxes into the government, which
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: is in the place for police service and fire service
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: and public services and schools. So he's doing his part.
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: And then the vendors that he's paying out of this
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: company that is worth five billion dollars, All the vendors
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: and contractors that's all helping them to live a good
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: life and for them hopefully they to gain wealth as well.
• 57:10
  Speaker 1: That's a great takeaway suggestion. What are the things that
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: your company does.
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so our company we ensure other companies are not
• 57:18
  Speaker 2: for profits, startups, I mean, sports teams, all sorts of people.
• 57:22
  Speaker 2: We're ensuring them from their digital risks, like the risk
• 57:26
  Speaker 2: that there the data they collect gets lost, so privacy
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: related things we cover when their technology fails and interrupts
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: their business. We cover all forms of cybercrime, you know,
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: social engineering. So think of it as you know, as
• 57:41
  Speaker 2: you digitize your business, we want to cover all the
• 57:43
  Speaker 2: risks that come along with that digitization. And you know,
• 57:46
  Speaker 2: whether it's the regulatory risks, whether it's the liability you
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: have the third parties, it's pretty broad coverage for those
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: sorts of things. And then on top of the insurance,
• 57:55
  Speaker 2: we give our customers tools in a team of people
• 57:59
  Speaker 2: that can help them both reduce the likelihood that they
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: ever have a claim or they ever have a loss,
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: because no one wants to have to have an insurance claim.
• 58:07
  Speaker 2: And then importantly if they do have a claim, we're
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: nine to one one. We are the emergency services. We're
• 58:12
  Speaker 2: there to go and fight the fire to help restore
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: our customers' operations that they can keep doing business right.
• 58:20
  Speaker 2: They can't call the police, they can't call the fire department,
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: they can't be helpful. We can. It's a team of
• 58:24
  Speaker 2: instant responders that sort of go in and help clean
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: things up. And then, of course, on the back end
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: of it, just like a normal insurance company, we cover
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: you financially for whatever it is that you've lost. So
• 58:36
  Speaker 2: it's both that operational recovery and the financial recovery together.
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: Your digital crimes. Nine one one.
• 58:43
  Speaker 2: That's right.
• 58:46
  Speaker 1: Before we wrap up, And I know that I'm opening
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: up Pandora's box here, but we will just keep it
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: short and we can do another maybe podcast in the future.
• 58:55
  Speaker 1: My guess is that this AI revolution, I've said this.
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: I'm co chearing the AI Etics Council with our friend
• 59:00
  Speaker 1: sam Aldman, who I believe is the Steve Jobs of
• 59:03
  Speaker 1: this generation, by the way, very good guy. I trust him.
• 59:09
  Speaker 1: He both thinks that AI will help to solve cancer
• 59:12
  Speaker 1: within ten years. He also thinks that some very bad
• 59:15
  Speaker 1: things are going to happen the next ten years. He
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: doesn't know what they are, and I respect his honesty
• 59:20
  Speaker 1: for being blunt about that. But what I am convinced
• 59:23
  Speaker 1: of is that by twenty thirty the world that we
• 59:27
  Speaker 1: live in will be radically different, possibly unrecognizable, with the
• 59:32
  Speaker 1: introduction of AI. This is not like the Internet or
• 59:36
  Speaker 1: you know, CDs coming from cassette tapes. This is a
• 59:39
  Speaker 1: fundamental transformation, ground swell, groundwater effect in society. Is that
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: going to radically change somebody? Expand your business and are
• 59:51
  Speaker 1: you focused on that yet? Yeah?
• 59:56
  Speaker 2: Of course, I mean and look, Sam sam Almon is
• 59:58
  Speaker 2: one of my first investors in the company, So wow,
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: I didn't know that, that's right, Yeah, one of the
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: first five. I mean, I think we both saw where
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 2: things were going and how much risk that this could create,
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 2: and so I absolutely see it as just another type
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 2: of risk that we can help our clients manage. We
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: can help manage their cyber risk. We can help manage
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 2: their AI risk, and that's both giving them the tools
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 2: and the knowledge and then know how you know to
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: use it responsibly, and it's also about providing insurance and
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: financial coverage for when it creates losses. And so absolutely
• 1:00:30
  Speaker 2: we're planning to We've already expanded our products to cover
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: AI affirmatively, and we plan on rolling out more covers,
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: both for main street businesses that are using AI all
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 2: the way up to you know, companies like open Ai
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: or Xai or others Anthropic that are building their own models,
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: so specialist insurance coverages for those technology businesses.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I like the founder of Anthropic too. He seems
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 1: to be very conscious conscious as a technologists. A lot
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: of my technology friends are geniuses, but they have a
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: block I called people. I like the founder of Anthropic
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 1: and the founder of Open the Eye in particular. Thank
• 1:01:08
  Speaker 1: you very much to be I like you as a founder. Also,
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 1: you're really cool people. And I'm glad we met, and
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 1: I'm glad we're new friends and you're stuck with me.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: And thanks for empowering this audience with how.
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah no, thank you for having me on. It's been
• 1:01:23
  Speaker 2: a joy to be your friend. And we'll carry it forward.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: Let's go try to do good in the world and
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: promote a new form of capitalism, which is good capitalism.
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 1: Dare we say capitalism for all? This has been a
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: fascinating and wonderful trip through the unique nature and space
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 1: of insurance. And by the way, before you wrap, how
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: big is the insurance industry? I didn't ask this question here,
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: either here in the US or worldwide. How does it
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 1: compare like, is it a big part of the of
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 1: the of the global economic market.
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 2: It's enormous. I think it's the second largest industry, you know,
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: by assets, and so it's probably about two trillion dollars
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: a year sort of the property and casualty insurance, about
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: a trillion of which is just in the United States.
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 2: So it's a very, very big industry.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 1: And you've heard from one of the innovators in this space,
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 1: the only person I know in proactive insurance. So thank you, Joshua.
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 2: For Mota mata mata.
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 1: Oh, it's gonna be a joke that we're gonna play.
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: For the rest of our lives.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, my brain is stuck on Mota mata. All right,
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 1: God believe you, appreciate you. And for the audience, tell
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: all your friends to go play back this episode for
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: certainly starting a more minute fourteen where my friend unpacks
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: and repacks insurance for the average everyday person to understand
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: it all the way up to the most sophisticated later
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 1: in the world to comprehend and use it. And you
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 1: might want to call his service and use it. Because
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 1: social media, something that affects all of us. I assume.
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: Then get to your website.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: Coalition Yep, Coalition i NC inc dot com.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: By the way, why coalition? What a cool name? Yeah?
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 2: I mean look at the idea was like, anytime you
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 2: have a company that has the same risk, or every
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 2: company is in the case of cyber risk, it just
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: doesn't make sense to fight that problem individually. Like, let's
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 2: create literally a coalition of organizations that all face this risk.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 2: They can each chip in a little bit of money,
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: you know, we collect it and we pool it, and
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 2: we use it to pay out the claims that happen,
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 2: and then we use part of it to also invest
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 2: and build capabilities to hire people that any individual company
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 2: could never do themselves. Right. So that was the idea, like,
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 2: let's build truly a coalition of people to go fight
• 1:04:03
  Speaker 2: this problem collectively. Even the name has social justice in it,
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 2: there's meaning for sure.
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: All Right, God, bless you friend, Thanks so.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 2: Much, Thank you.
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 1: O'Brien. Money and Wealth There's been another episode in season two.
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 1: Enjoy Money and Wealth with John O'Brien is a production
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: of the Black Effect Podcast Network. For more podcasts from
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 1: the Black Effect Podcast Network, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcasts,
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to. Your favorite shows depart depend