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Big Life, Big OCD (OCD)(Episode 26) · Living Uncertain an OCD Podcast

• Opening: Hello, and welcome to the podcast, Living Uncertain. This podcast is dedicated to obsessive compulsive disorder, OCD, and the primary treatment, exposure response prevention, ERP. OCD comes in many forms, such as contamination, perfectionism, checking, harm, superstitious, religious or moral, sexual orientation, and or relationship. ERP is the gold standard to treating OCD. and it focuses on deliberately confronting fears, the exposure, while refraining from compulsive rituals, the response prevention. With repeated exposures and without engaging in compulsions, we learn to tolerate anxiety and break the cycle of intrusive thoughts. We are a married couple that have faced both the challenges of OCD and the incredible healing that ERP can provide to your marriage, family, and your home. As a person who lives with OCD, I am much more than this diagnosis. We all can be. Marc and Stacee: Hey y'all, I'm Stacy, and along with my husband Mark, we want to thank you for living uncertain with us again today. Welcome to the podcast that talks all things OCD and ERP related. And this is episode number 26, y'all, and we're gonna talk big life, big OCD. We thought it would be a good time today to talk about some of the things that have been going on in our life because as y'all know, we like to keep things very authentic. around here. And so as things pop up week by week that we can share with our listeners such as yourselves, we like to do that. because as y'all know too, OCD is a continuous battle for us. And even though we've made great strides, I personally have made great strides and I'm feeling better than ever. OCD is always going to be a part of me and I've just come to accept that. And so when I do find that it creeps back in, I A, know how to handle myself and it much better now. And B definitely want to share that as part of our ongoing journey with how we're able to kind of conquer and heal from what O C D can do to an individual and also to a family. So one couple of the we've had a couple of big events happen. To us, well, for us, they're big events. Not like big like two years ago, big, but big since we've kind of been tackling the O C D side. Yes. We've we we definitely I mean we're in middle age now and we have two teenage children. And so with that comes big life changes and big life transitions that are typical for most families. And For us, they perhaps just hit a little differently because of my struggle certainly with obsessive compulsive disorder and what additional level of challenge that puts forth with some of these very typical coming of age kinds of things. So you guys all know that Avery has decided to switch schools. We talked about that in you know, previous episode, which then last week was her first week of entering that school. And since that happened, you know, she wanted to invite her new friend over. So her new friend f spent the night Friday night. Then Saturday night rolls around. And her friend invited her over to her house to spend the night, which is the first time Avery has spent the night at another person's house in probably a year and a half. I shouldn't no. Well, let's let's yeah, let's be clear that generally speaking, she hasn't spent the night with anyone outside of her own cousins. Yeah. Who have who happen to be my brother and sister-in-law and their children. And so she really hasn't spent a lot of nights at others' homes. We tried that when she was younger, and we would always have to go pick her up. And so we've taken quite a hiatus from a lot of the Very typical friendships that that teenage girls form and when she hasn't had a lot of that. So Mark's right, she does now. She became fast friends with someone at school, which is a lovely thing to watch. And the night she wanted to go spend the night with her friend coincided with Miles going to one of his friend's birthday parties, which then after that he ended up going over to Another friend's house, which, you know, he's 18. He doesn't need to tell us what he's doing, you know, 247. But he popped in that night, picked some stuff up stuff up, and left and went to that friend's house. And he never told us that he was going to another friend's house. He was just going to that birthday party. And that was about 10 30 at night that that happened. And here we are sitting in our house with both kids gone. Now, I think that we in a previous episode too have talked about a story that happened very early in our ERP experiences and ERP therapy, which was that both of our kids left for the night with friends. I don't even think we were in We might not have been into the intensive ERP yet. We weren't even in ERP. This was two years ago maybe. And this was just they were each gonna go out to the mall areas with their friends and stay a couple of hours at most. And they were both out at the same time. And Miles actually was at a birthday party, a different person. my gosh. Yeah. And Avery was, you know, with That kid goes to so many parties. and so that night I experienced a panic attack. pretty severe panic attack to where I was on the floor and I was almost vomiting because the worry and the anxiety came on so strong. Because again, as I've shared in this podcast before, one of my intrusive thoughts that comes in and and lies to me is that if my children are out of my sight, they will die. And so I have a really hard time have for many, many years allowing them to go out and have these experiences. And so that night got so terrible that we we ended up kind of calling it, if you will, and saying, no, you guys can't stay out. And so Mark and I got into our car and we went and picked up each of our kids and brought them home and and it was a it was not the best night for our family. It was not a great experience having looked back at it now. I think Avery was relieved That we picked her up. Yeah, because she was probably still i she was back in person for school and it was the social piece was very difficult for her. So I think she was happy that we picked her up. Miles, on the other hand, not so much. Not so much, because his friends were all gonna go to a movie and this and that. And I stopped that from happening. so yeah, fast forward until last weekend and I've gotten a lot of practice with with our son with Miles, who's eighteen now and and he's done a lot and gone out and he's driving now and has a job and and so him going out isn't as much of a trigger for me, if you will. I don't have that intrusive thought anymore about him. But I haven't quite escaped that with Avery yet, who's just knew it turned fifteen recently. And so I haven't quite been able to let go of that particular intrusive thought that if she's out of my sight, she will die. And so the night she that that same night she was out spending the night I could feel the panic coming. I could feel the unease. I could feel the I'm uncomfortable with this. I don't remember exactly if I checked in. I don't think I probably did because I don't check in with Mark as often anymore because I know that his response isn't going to be what I'm looking for. You did, but I didn't give in to the Yeah. So you didn't e your response was what it always is now. And so I know that I'm not gonna get that. guarantee or that certainty that I'm looking for when I when I check in or try to get that reassurance. And so I could feel the anxiety kind of coming on, but I will say It definitely was not that I it it was not as overwhelming and it was not as severe, not at all. And again, one of those times that I feel like I'm really proud of myself. I'm really proud of us. I'm really proud of how far we've gotten into this journey of ours. because we're all better for it. I'm better for it, you are, our marriages, both of our kids certainly are. And it's just such a testament to what it can be and what it can look like if you do very seriously take ERP and you do seriously jump into what that means and you are consistent with it and you hold yourself accountable to it. And the the benefit on the other side is so amazing. Like did I felt did you sleep that night? Yes. I did. And our son didn't even Miles didn't even come home that night. No. Nor did he text us. Nor I didn't even know that he wasn't coming home. And I still slept because I'm not In that acute phase of OCD as much anymore. It comes up. I can feel it. certainly other things that come up in our life, you know, are like this is kind of it, is our our daughter's going to a larger high school now, and she's meeting new friends and having new experiences, which is different for us. And then Miles is just less than 24 hours away now from. moving into a dorm and experiencing life on his own too for a little bit. And and so that's again another big major milestone that most middle aged parents with teenage kids are are ha having right now. And and those can be triggering, especially f they can be triggering for any parent who's, you know, worrisome about is he gonna be okay? Is she gonna be okay? I that's That's what we all absolutely. That's what we're all thinking about our kids, hoping and praying that we've raised them well enough to go out and seek this, you know, life of their own and a new chapter of their own too. And I think it just adds to the complexity when you have OCD, because I've talked about it before, how it lies to me, it steals from me. And one of the things that it has stolen from me is my mother's intuition. And I don't always know that I can trust it. And it can't trust that mother's gut. And I'm finding that the older my kids get now, the more and more I can trust it. And I feel just so blessed to be able to have that gift now where I never had it before. And so we're feeling I'm feeling worried about Miles. He'll be definitely out of our sight now. Frustration. He's well, yes. I mean, again, this is all just these are all typical normal parent emotions that we're feeling. Ours just has a little extra complexity to it with the with the element of OCD. And one of the things that you and I have been talking about too is like you're not as worried about Miles moving into the dorm and you know, you're you're probably more anxious or more worried about Avery. Mm-hmm. but then you you like you told me you're like today, like I'm hyper focused on Miles. That I feel like you are right now, yeah. Yeah, I mean we're gonna make sure that he's packed and making sure we're gonna interrupt our you know our regularly scheduled O C D content for just one moment. Because yes, I think that you actually are more concerned about him moving into the dorms than I even feel like I am. And that is a strange feeling. But I don't know if I'm actually concerned. And since you made that comment, I've been kind of thinking about it. Like just before we usually come on and and we record our podcast and stuff, like you and I have conversations and like you'll make s you make a comment of something and it makes me kind of think about it, like, why is that happening? I'm not worried that he's moving into the dorm. I'm frustrated that he's not prepared to move into the dorm. so it is just Every parent everywhere whose child is moving into a dorm. But I do think that mine is more on the hyper side of frustrated because of and th this is just a a possibility. I don't even know. I mean it could be. Because before with your O C D, if things weren't just right, our life was not fun. Sure. So I I have You know, I look like I'm the planner. Yes. I have everything organized. I can, you know, when you go and pack a car, man, I can pack a car like nobody's business to make sure everything fits and everything is in the right spot. If there was an Olympic sport for that, babe, you'd be gold medal for sure. You know, so like I do think that over twenty years worth of dealing with your O C D in that that form. Yeah. It might be my way of I don't wanna say self-preservation, but it kind of is. And that's a really interesting thought and point because just hearing what you're saying there too, which is that if if we would go on a trip or if we were, you know, something with Miles going to college, like if something didn't feel just right to me, life wouldn't be fun. And I remember those moments now. I reflect on those and I have a lot of shame and a lot of guilt on the over those. However I think it's such an inter that's such an interesting thought is that what you would have to do in order to keep everything feeling just right, so that I didn't get triggered. Triggered. Thank you. Yes. And what we th what you thought you were doing to help the matter was only now after all these years we discover feeding the beast, if you will. Or keeping the cycle of compulsions and O C D going rather than interrupting them, disrupting them, which is now what we do so easily. And so it it's very easy for me to disrupt your d your OCD. But now I'm finding it's hard for me to step out of that that making sure that everything worry state that everything is okay. Especially when it comes to that type of stuff and our kids. And and like, I mean, I will tell you, I mean, he is frustrating me. You know, we tell him, Hey, why don't you pack? And two days ago he had two boxes packed and Then he didn't work, you know, one day and then it's like getting on him. Hey, you need to be packing. Listen, we have seen so many, I mean so many real TikTok reels and Instagram. We're old people, but we stuff. We watch we watch TikTok like people should watch TikTok, which is that we see the reels on Instagram when they come out like a week later or two weeks later. And we see so many if they are listening to us now. We're we're we've confirmed that because we see so many now of these funny comedic Reels where parents are feeling the same s frustration. Yeah. Where kids are procrastinating and putting it off. And then, my gosh, we're unprepared. And and so that's a very typical response from parents of teenagers. And a very typical response, if you will, from a teenager themselves, an 18-year-old who thinks, I've got it all figured out, I'm good. Where it's interesting for us and where we differ is what Mark was just saying, is that He is still caught in that cycle himself of making sure everything is okay and it feels just right. Because if something doesn't, he knows from experience what has happened to us before because I get upset, I get triggered, I feel uncomfortable, uncertain, and I can't handle it. And my anxiety goes to the roof and the panic ensues and then we're back to where we were before. And unfortunately, this is a pretty big event. I mean nine thirty in the morning time he you know he's supposed to be there moving his stuff in so I'm saying right here making it public, making it widely known to our listeners, I am okay. Yeah. So tomorrow morning when our dog wakes us up at five o'clock. And I get up to make the coffee in the morning. And I'm gonna be like, back up the car. Yeah. And if he doesn't do it and we don't make that deadline. So that's on him. Yeah. And and and I love the the title of this episode, Big Life, Big O C D that and I will give all the credit to Mark on this one, who came up with that one tonight for this episode, and I love it. One of the things that I it it This segues really well into something that has been on my mind a little bit and something that I've I saw recently in some of the the people that I follow and and in this community and and gain from and and listen to, which is that there's a way that you can determine whether or not you have what I thought I had, which was generalized anxiety for many, many years, versus what OCD is. And there's one word. There's one single word that can determine whether or not you have just generalized anxiety or you have OCD. And I told you this the other night. And do you remember what the word is? I can't remember now. So as you all know, our our podcast is called Living Uncertain. And it's called Living Uncertain for a reason because uncertainty is one of the paramount of OCD recovery, right? So with us who have O C D, everything has to be per Figured out. Everything has to be in control. Everything has to be, it has to feel just right. It has to be completely certain. Like you can't let anything go to chance. You can't ever feel uncomfortable. Everything has to be completely feeling like a warm, cozy blanket all the time, if you will. Nothing can feel outside of comfort. That's what we like. We crave it. We need it. We we find ways to get it. The one word is maybe. And it kind of goes along with the phrase living uncertain. And it also goes along with the phrase that, as you all know, is my husband's favorite phrase to say now when I try to check in it on anything ever, which is I'm not sure. I'm not sure. And I think that it's so apropos that we talk about our son moving in to the dorms. And you feeling like you need to keep everything a certain way because that's what you've had to do all these years. And here I am going. What if he forgets something? Maybe. What if he doesn't make it well hold on though? What wait a minute. No. He absolutely is gonna forget something. Come on. Okay, but I'm trying to make a point here. Listen, I'm trying to make a point about how ERP has so helped me. Embrace maybe. So maybe for someone who has anxiety, okay, you can deal with that. If you say maybe to someone who has OCD, good luck. That's going to promote so much anxiety in that person. It's going to provide them with so much panic that they may not know what to do. That word maybe, that uncertainty, that that world where you live in the unsure, that's what gets us the most. And so now what do we have to do? Maybe he he might forget something. Maybe. Well, what if he gets down there and he gets lost downtown? Maybe. What if he doesn't like his roommate after all? Maybe. And that is so hard. Well, cause I mean, as parents, you want your kids to be safe and taken care of and all that stuff. But but once again, he wants to be independent. Yes. And he's as he should. Yeah. And the fact that we're sitting here today with this episode, and I'm the one saying, Well, maybe. And and I feel like you're the one across from me going, Well, we need to make sure this is done, and we need to make sure this is done, and we have to have this in place. And I just it's just the irony of all ironies, really. And and it just goes to show that we have made so much progress. with this journey. Well, tomorrow morning I get I get to drive down to the address that he texts us. Yes, you do. Not knowing the procedure because he has no idea. Well, let me show you my forearm and we are both going to live uncertain tomorrow. And if he doesn't have everything or doesn't get everything or doesn't know everything, well, maybe. well. I'm not sure. It might be uncertain. Like those are the kinds of things that we as we who struggle with O C D have to remember that we have to commit to those ideas. Yeah. Because l because that's what it is. Live uncertain, that's not a I mean, life is uncertain. I hate that, by the way. Like O C D tells me I hate that. So I have to s I have to feel authentic about saying it to our listeners. I hate it. But it is not going to change the fact that it's not true. Yeah. And then let's add another layer. good gracious. For me. well, yes. So I'm taking off in the morning time to bring him down there to move in because you have to work your new your new job and it's kinda hard to take off, you know, the first two weeks of Yeah. You know, and I know y you're not gonna beat yourself up for missing your son's first move in date at the dorm because you're gonna see him tomorrow. No, I'm not. 'Cause I'll see Friday. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's not gonna be a big deal. Yes. Per se. And moving in. Woohoo, let's put the boxes in the cart, bring up to your room, put take out of your cart, and there you go. I think our whole audience recognizes how hyperfixated you are on our son moving into the dorms right now. This poor guy. my gosh, we are interrupting our regularly scheduled 'cause, you know, then I'll go to work and move on my own. Time and let him figure out how to unpack and put his shit away. We're gonna live uncertain. Yeah. And and let him do his thing. Yes. But then on top of it, I'm dealing with some eye issues. Yes. Because back when I was eight years old. You were age. Well, let's how do we say this? He was a kid of the nineteen eighties. Yeah. I don't know that you know, the nineteen eighties, that was just a different time. No, I know, because there was no like you played outside until the lights came on and then you went home and that type of stuff. So my friend happened to have a water balloon slingshot. So if you don't know what that is, go ahead and Google it. It's a basically a big rubber band with two handles on each end with a pouch in the middle. but this guy thought that it would be fun to No, not just me. Not just me. I'm not gonna take full blame on this. no, we're gonna blame his little schoolmates. So what's next? What's round and fun to shoot in a slingshot? A handful of rocks. Hmm. That sounds smart. So we so we had one end, because it it a water balloon slingshot, you need usually three people to launch them. Now we have learned we learned that hey if you take one end and you tie it to a pole or attach it to a pole and the other person holds on to the other end. Wow, this story's just getting better. And you step back, that person sets back just like a half a foot, maybe a foot. All of that pull back power is pushed over to that pole. So you can pull these things back really far. So we had one end attached to the pole and he's holding the other end and I'm pulling back in the center, which is the pouch, like a heavy nylon pouch. These kids invented don't throw rocks. Yeah. Yeah. Y'all invented that, you know. For parents everywhere. thing and it goes forward and doesn't release all of them. At least that's what I can now think of. There was also a sign that was fairly close to us. my gosh. So so it could have hit the sign and come back, but I don't think so. I think what happened is they got caught in the pouch and as it ricocheted back at me, they released in my direction. Right into his eye. One happened to go right in my eye, cut my iris. So I jump on my bike. And I ride home as quickly as possible because my God, you freak out. I knew something happened, but I didn't know what. So I get home, my mom gets home from work and she's like, What the hell did you do? Because she could see my eye was filling up with blood and it would just was not good. They rushed me to the hospital and you know, had to spend two weeks on my back, you know, because my eye filled up with blood. And then that same friend came over halfway through that two weeks and we played and It filled back up with blood again, so I had another two weeks during summer vacation. So fast forward forty years. And I am now paying the consequences of that to where I have cataracts in that eye. But I I knew that for the very longest time. Every time I go to the eye doctor, I go every year to have my eyes checked out. And yes, I know cataracts is happening, but recently There's been some issues with the retina in my eye. So it's kind of like a curtain coming down in your vision, which absolutely will freak you out if you don't ever know what that is. And just put your hand over one eye and then block the vision of your other eye, you know, with half your hand, and you just can't see anything. It's very limited right now. Very limited on that side. So go to the doctor, the eye doctor, and they look at my eye and they're like, Okay, I can't really see your retina because all the cataracts that's in the way. I can't see past the cataracts. So let's get you over to the cataract specialist so they can talk about what they're gonna do. So I go there Monday, Tuesday, yesterday I'm in for surgery to have the lens pulled out of your eye and putting a new lens in that's clear and all the while. While our daughters navigating early days of high school and our son is getting ready to move out. And and yeah. And your wife still has O C D. Yeah. So fast forward to today, I have a follow-up, you know, 24-hour follow-up with the doctor. They say, okay, everything looks good. Now let's put it in a referral to the retinal specialists. Yeah. So they call at like one o'clock in the afternoon. Hey, we can get you in today at 145. Okay. So I go down there today and have the appointment with the doctor and now she's like, Well, I want you to wait two weeks to come back and see me again so we can talk about surgery 'cause we want everything to settle with your surgery and the way everything's kinda looking and by the way, the cut in your eye might make this a little bit more difficult. So needless to say, we've been hit with some more challenges here this week, above and beyond, even those that relate to O C D. So, you know, when you're sitting in the doctor's office and you're by far the youngest person sitting in there, because this type of stuff does not usually happen to people my age unless you have a eye injury, that's bringing on a little bit of extra stress to me. Like you know, being a previous But being a principal and knowing that I'm gonna have to be out a certain amount of time and you start talking to people like, yeah, my mom had it, my dad had it, or my cousin had it, you know, type of thing. And they were down for two weeks, a month, you know, they had to lay on their face, you know, with the special pillow and stuff. And it's like, my goodness, I can't miss two, three weeks worth of work. Yeah. And it might not always be it's not easy anybody. If if you like it's not we were talking about this earlier too. It's not easy for any of us to live uncertain. Like that's it's not it it might be a a a fact of life, it might be a fact of nature, et cetera, that life is uncertain and you can't predict things and and living in that space of discomfort is inevitable sometimes. And it's hard for anyone. Yeah. And then when you take it on from the approach of someone who has OCD. And the idea of living in that uncertainty causes so much anxiety and so much panic that you cannot like I know my think of anything else. You can't move, you can't do anything. Like I know I'm going to be on the other side of this, let's say in a month, potentially. You know, hopefully I can push the the surgery out till we have you know, a a fall break for for my work. Do I only have to miss a week's worth of work? Because she's no, maybe a week you'd have to want to take off. And but it's like, I know everything will continue to move forward. Even if I take a week off, it should, because if you've built systems in place, they should be able to still go if you're not there. And I know they will be, you know, but it's just, it's difficult. And I can see how if you're living with OCD and just constantly living in that uncertain feeling, how Dysregulated that can make your entire life. Mm-hmm. I know mine's gonna come to an end here soon. Mm-hmm. Yours doesn't. Mm-mm. You know, and to go through the ERP to get you to the other side to where you can feel like You have an end point. Mm-hmm. must feel good. Yes. So anybody out there that's talking about or thinking about or in the middle of ERP, keep going because you're you're gonna wanna f have that endpoint feeling. You do. And and once you start to gain successes from from the exposures that you give yourself and that you allow others to help you with, you start to to crave that instead of the comfortable feeling. Because it's It's such a freeing feeling. It's hard to even put into words. It really is. But it's such an amazing feeling on the other side. Well, once once I get this detached retina issue taken care of, I won't need glasses in that eye anymore. Mm-hmm. That's very freeing for me since I've had to wear them for forty years. Mm-hmm. And and to know that I can just, you know, only have to use readers every now and then because I'm old. Would be fantastic. Now I've got to get my left eye done with the cataract, because it's in that eye too. But and that's just because I I rely on that eye so heavily. I've always closed my right eye when I'm outside. I know I do it all the time. And so that 'cause that little cut lets in extra light in your eye and it's like a big bright flashlight when you're outside. Mm-hmm. So I'm very proud of you where you have Come and gone with your ERP. It's a big undertaking. And you tattooed it on your right there. You know, living uncertain every day. That that's that's a hard thing to do. And and I'm trying to learn to do that right now and give myself grace, give Miles some grace, you know. Absolutely. It's easier for me with Avery because she's in the same school district that I work and I feel like have a little bit more connection in that side of it. And I drive her to school every morning. Mm-hmm. You know. It's amazing too, though, how much s someone's OCD, like myself, for example, can affect the pattern of behavior of someone they love. And in this case, it's my husband, it's my significant other. And and to h to hear us kind of talking about that tonight is really interesting. How you are always trying to make sure And sub in and subconsciously doing it. Yeah. No, that's because it's gonna have to if I have to let go of certain things or or take on certain challenges or or whatnot, it we didn't even think initially about the things that you may have to adjust to. That it's okay that you let go of that feeling of, well, I need to make sure that everything continues to be just right, because if something triggers her OCD or her discomfort or her A, B, and C, then it'll all be over. And we don't necessarily live in that world anymore. But I think that you've just lived so long in that world, too, that it's fair to give grace to you. It's, it's, it's, it's very fair for us as those of us who have OCD to give grace to our significant others, give grace to our family members and friends who are there for us, who have been there for us, who are supporting us. And if they can help us support if they can help support us through something like intensive therapy or ERP, even just one exposure. It's life-changing for us. And and I've said it before, and I'll say it again. I'm so grateful to Mark and to my family and and to my kids and and our therapist and everyone. I'm so grateful for the idea that our son is about to move into a dorm. And I am not feeling how I might have thought I would be feeling by now. So worried about him. I'm still, you know, hoping everything is gonna be okay. And as a Gen X parent raising a Gen Z son, I am, you know, praying right now very hard, very fast, and very often. And I think that that's what most parents are probably doing right now with eighteen year old budding college freshmen. Yeah. So wait till next week. When the saga continues. But we certainly appreciate He made it through the first week. We certainly living on his own. Appreciate you all listening, you all living uncertain with us every day. And just know there's there's support out here in this O C D community and we're so blessed and so grateful to be a part of it. Yes. And if you want to come on, please reach out to us and and we can, you know, do a video session with you and and have you share your story and your experiences with O C D and You know, maybe your partner or significant other can come on too or just yourself. we would love to hear those success stories out there. Absolutely. So you can share that. I know it's scary sometimes to to share, you know, something so personal, but it's a safe group to share it with. It absolutely is. So thank you everybody. Yes, thank you all so much. Until next time. Marc & Stacee: Thank you for joining us on today's episode and Living Uncertain with us. We are not therapists and this podcast is intended to provide information and support. It should not replace traditional means of seeking help from a licensed mental health professional. If you like this episode or would like to hear more, please like, subscribe or share with someone you think may benefit. Here at Living Uncertain, we're building a community of support. If you and your significant other would like to share your story, we would love to have you on the podcast. Please click on the link in the episode description and fill out the interest form.