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The Fundamentals of PR Didn't Change, the Mediums Did · Sales Pipeline Radio

• 0:16
  Matt Heinz: All right.
• 0:17
  Welcome back, everybody, to the second half of day two.
• 0:20
  We got six interviews down, we got six more to go here.
• 0:23
  Today is the long day of interviews, and I couldn't be more excited to be doing this.
• 0:28
  So thanks again to the Forrester team for making this possible.
• 0:30
  Sales Pipeline Radio, live on the Forrester B2B Summit
• 0:33
  floor, next to the giant boot.
• 0:35
  This episode, very excited to have with us Lindsey Groepper.
• 0:38
  She's the Executive VP of Biz Dev and Marketing for PANBlast.
• 0:42
  And, you know, we've talked about a bunch of different things we could cover in
• 0:45
  this session, but I thought 20 minutes of Georgia football might be more fun.
• 0:48
  Lindsey Groepper: Let's go.
• 0:50
  Where do you wanna start?
• 0:51
  Matt Heinz: Well, I got a buddy who is a Georgia alum, and his youngest
• 0:54
  daughter is going to Oregon, which as a Washington fan really bothers me,
• 0:58
  but for him it's kind of whatever.
• 1:00
  His youngest daughter is down to Georgia and Florida.
• 1:04
  Lindsey Groepper: Gainesville is a cesspool.
• 1:05
  Matt Heinz: I know.
• 1:06
  Lindsey Groepper: So… that's all I have to say about that.
• 1:09
  Matt Heinz: Okay.
• 1:09
  So here's my challenge here, right?
• 1:11
  So, my oldest is 17, she's a junior, she's looking at schools now, and she's always
• 1:16
  thought she wanted to go to UDub, right?
• 1:18
  Just, you know, that's where her parents went, good school, it's close to home,
• 1:21
  she doesn't wanna go that far away.
• 1:23
  But she's a math and science whiz — she's like girls in
• 1:25
  STEM, just couldn't be prouder.
• 1:27
  She wants to do environmental engineering, and the best environmental engineering
• 1:30
  program in the area is Washington State.
• 1:33
  Lindsey Groepper: Mm. Mm.
• 1:34
  Matt Heinz: And as much as I can sit here and say, like, moving up
• 1:36
  from California — like, you know, the Apple Cup, our big rivalry, it's
• 1:40
  nothing like a cocktail party, right?
• 1:42
  But you come up to — the Apple Cup is a rivalry, but if you're a Washington
• 1:46
  fan, you kind of consider Wazzu kind of your dumb little brother, right?
• 1:50
  Where, like, you'll make fun of him, beat him up, but if anyone else tries to beat
• 1:53
  him up, you're like, "No, no, no, cool, we're a family here." Oregon's different.
• 1:56
  Oregon is our cesspool.
• 1:58
  Those are just terrible people who made poor life choices.
• 2:01
  Lindsey Groepper: And their school's just in a terrible, downtrodden town, and—
• 2:05
  Matt Heinz: Unfortunately Eugene's pretty wonderful.
• 2:07
  Lindsey Groepper: Yeah.
• 2:07
  Matt Heinz: Yeah, but—
• 2:07
  Lindsey Groepper: —but Gainesville's not?
• 2:07
  Gainesville's not?
• 2:07
  Mm-mm.
• 2:07
  Okay.
• 2:08
  Okay.
• 2:08
  I've never been to
• 2:08
  Matt Heinz: Gainesville, never been to Athens.
• 2:13
  I've been to Neyland Stadium — that's as close to an SEC game as I've been.
• 2:16
  Lindsey Groepper: Neyland's—
• 2:17
  Matt Heinz: —awesome.
• 2:17
  'Cause I went to Neyland in August one year, and it's just, it looks
• 2:20
  like it's about to fall down.
• 2:21
  It's like 170 years old.
• 2:22
  Lindsey Groepper: Yeah.
• 2:23
  It's taken a beating, for sure, over the years.
• 2:26
  But, yeah, Athens, you should go.
• 2:28
  Athens is — people equate it to Bloomington, like IU
• 2:32
  Bloomington, Indiana, campus.
• 2:35
  It's beautiful.
• 2:36
  Matt Heinz: I—
• 2:36
  Lindsey Groepper: —love it.
• 2:36
  A lot of architecture and really cool music scene, great downtown.
• 2:40
  Matt Heinz: So my sports bucket list at this point — I've been to most of
• 2:43
  the baseball stadiums I wanna go to.
• 2:45
  The number one is Augusta, and I'll go in July — I just wanna see, I just wanna
• 2:48
  walk the course, there doesn't have to be golf happening, but I want to—
• 2:50
  Augusta for the Masters is top.
• 2:52
  And then two through, like, 90 is the college stadiums as well
• 2:57
  as the iconic games, right?
• 2:59
  So a game in Sanford Stadium, yes, but also a cocktail party game.
• 3:04
  There's those games that are just — even if they're at the
• 3:06
  neutral fields — there's something… what is it about college football?
• 3:11
  Lindsey Groepper: I mean, I was not a college football fan growing up.
• 3:14
  So I grew up in Cincinnati — we had the UC Bearcats, but football
• 3:18
  really wasn't it, necessarily.
• 3:20
  So I didn't get real exposure to college football until I went to Georgia.
• 3:24
  And then it was like a slap in the face — holy shit, this is awesome.
• 3:26
  Yeah, yeah.
• 3:27
  Sorry, can I cuss on this show?
• 3:28
  Matt Heinz: Sure, why
• 3:28
  Lindsey Groepper: not?
• 3:29
  Okay.
• 3:29
  I was like, "Oh my gosh, this is awesome. Where has this been my whole life?"
• 3:35
  And there — just the amount of passion that people have, and it's new passion.
• 3:41
  That's one of the things I loved about it — I didn't have any long history with
• 3:46
  the Georgia Bulldogs, but the second that I get on campus, this is my team.
• 3:49
  And you hold it so close.
• 3:51
  And to me — when you get into the professional sports, it becomes much
• 3:56
  more individual performance, this is just opinion — whereas college, there's
• 4:03
  a lot more passion on the field.
• 4:04
  Now, there's a lot of things that have changed — transfer portal, NIL — that's
• 4:09
  a whole other episode we could talk about — has changed it quite a bit.
• 4:13
  But it is awesome.
• 4:14
  But our cocktail party, the Georgia-Florida game, is leaving for
• 4:17
  the next two years from Jacksonville.
• 4:18
  So where's it gonna play?
• 4:19
  Gonna go Atlanta and then Tampa.
• 4:21
  Matt Heinz: Okay.
• 4:22
  Lindsey Groepper: Because Jacksonville's stadium's being renovated.
• 4:24
  So we're all gonna descend on
• 4:26
  Matt Heinz: wherever—
• 4:27
  —wherever it takes, yeah.
• 4:29
  I think the other thing is when you think about who you associate
• 4:32
  with versus who you identify with, there's a big difference.
• 4:34
  I'm a Cubs fan — my dad raised me a Cubs fan, and it's sort of a family thing.
• 4:39
  But I just like going to games, I like the Cubs.
• 4:41
  My sons like the Mariners 'cause we live in Seattle.
• 4:44
  But I am a Husky.
• 4:46
  Lindsey Groepper: Right.
• 4:46
  Matt Heinz: I went to school there.
• 4:47
  So it's not just someone I enjoy watching — it's part of my identity.
• 4:51
  For sure.
• 4:52
  There's a shared identity, not just with the team, but with everyone
• 4:54
  else tailgating there every Saturday.
• 4:56
  Like, we are one big family.
• 4:57
  And you could do all the Steelers Nation stuff you want, but it's different—
• 5:02
  Lindsey Groepper: I agree—
• 5:03
  Matt Heinz: —in college.
• 5:03
  Lindsey Groepper: I agree, and it's because you lived it every day, especially
• 5:06
  when you go to big football programs — it's every single day, everywhere you
• 5:10
  look, it's bringing in all the money.
• 5:11
  Same thing, raised in Cincinnati — I'm not a Cincinnati Reds diehard, you know?
• 5:16
  I'd love to go to the games, will cheer for them—
• 5:18
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 5:18
  Lindsey Groepper: —but I don't feel it in my bones — it
• 5:21
  doesn't affect me emotionally—
• 5:22
  Matt Heinz: —the way that college does.
• 5:24
  Lindsey Groepper: Yeah.
• 5:24
  Matt Heinz: Well, so I listen to a podcast called The Solid Verbal, and it's a
• 5:28
  couple guys — one went to Penn State, one went to Oregon — and they just started
• 5:32
  talking about college football twice a week, years ago, and they still do it.
• 5:36
  And they talk about the emotional side of college football a lot, and
• 5:40
  the crazy side of college football.
• 5:42
  And they have what they call — it's called The Solid Verbal, they call
• 5:46
  their followers the Verbalers, and they have a Verbaler line open on Saturdays
• 5:49
  so you can call and leave a message.
• 5:51
  And on their Sunday recap show, they'll play voicemails
• 5:53
  from people that called in.
• 5:54
  Lindsey Groepper: That
• 5:54
  is so great.
• 5:56
  Matt Heinz: And most of them are people just emotionally reacting
• 5:59
  toward the end of their game—
• 6:00
  Lindsey Groepper: Yes.
• 6:01
  Matt Heinz: —90% are when they lost, right?
• 6:03
  Lindsey Groepper: It's
• 6:04
  so great.
• 6:04
  Matt Heinz: Where you may have had a beverage or four, and your team lost.
• 6:07
  And, like, even as big a Cubs fan as I am, if they lose, I'm like,
• 6:12
  "Ah, it really sucks," but, okay.
• 6:13
  It bothers me way more when the Huskies lose.
• 6:16
  Lindsey Groepper: Oh, yeah.
• 6:17
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 6:17
  Lindsey Groepper: Have you seen there's all these reels right now
• 6:20
  on Instagram where it's people turning their texts into songs?
• 6:23
  Okay.
• 6:23
  So it's, like, either an emo song or it's like an upbeat pop song.
• 6:27
  I wanna do that to my Georgia group text — and turn it into a funny,
• 6:34
  soft, peaceful music overlay, but with the lyrics being what comes out
• 6:37
  of our group chat during the season.
• 6:39
  Is this a safe-for-work
• 6:39
  Matt Heinz: kind of a—
• 6:40
  Lindsey Groepper: —kind of a song?
• 6:40
  It would definitely not be safe for work at all.
• 6:45
  But it is a group of men and women — we were all former athletes at Georgia.
• 6:48
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 6:49
  Lindsey Groepper: Very intense, and when things are bad, that group
• 6:52
  text — it actually is so funny the next day to go back and read the rage.
• 6:57
  And read the
• 6:58
  — Matt Heinz: half the things—
• 6:58
  —people don't remember saying.
• 6:59
  Lindsey Groepper: Yes.
• 7:00
  It's so great.
• 7:01
  Matt Heinz: So I don't think I knew this — what did you play?
• 7:03
  Lindsey Groepper: I played soccer.
• 7:04
  Matt Heinz: Oh, nice.
• 7:04
  Yep, that's awesome.
• 7:05
  Lindsey Groepper: Yep.
• 7:06
  It was a good time—
• 7:06
  Matt Heinz: —I played soccer too, but it was like the dorm intramural, right?
• 7:09
  Probably a different level of competition.
• 7:11
  A little bit.
• 7:12
  But, you know, we had fun.
• 7:14
  All right.
• 7:14
  Well, I could literally talk about this for—
• 7:16
  Me too—
• 7:16
  —the whole time.
• 7:17
  This is great.
• 7:17
  But we gotta start somewhere.
• 7:19
  All right.
• 7:19
  So, you started Blast like 20 years ago — you've been doing this for a
• 7:23
  very long time, you've seen quite the evolution of B2B in that time.
• 7:28
  What's one of the biggest things that's changed, and what's one of the
• 7:30
  biggest things that absolutely has not?
• 7:33
  Lindsey Groepper: Good question.
• 7:34
  Yeah, so, just to put it in context — when you think about
• 7:36
  20-plus years ago, we started Blast before social media, before iPhones.
• 7:43
  So there were really only a handful of mediums available.
• 7:47
  It was: you advertised, you did PR, there was word of mouth, outdoor.
• 7:51
  But Google existed certainly, but not as it does today.
• 7:56
  The one thing that hasn't changed is actually the thing that's rubbing me right
• 7:59
  now and annoying me right now, which is that credibility has always mattered,
• 8:05
  third-party validation always powerful, trust always been a driver of currency.
• 8:11
  But now, thanks — the bots are now validating — "Oh, wow, credibility
• 8:16
  compounds, all this stuff matters." We've been saying this literally
• 8:20
  since the history of our profession.
• 8:21
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 8:21
  Lindsey Groepper: So that has not changed.
• 8:24
  That has always been true, and now PR's just having a bit of an "it girl" moment
• 8:29
  with AI visibility, which — great,
• 8:32
  we'll
• 8:32
  take it.
• 8:33
  What has changed is the sheer amount of media and mediums that are available.
• 8:38
  And people used to come to us for media relations because that
• 8:41
  was really one of three channels.
• 8:44
  And what's interesting is people will still come to us for only media relations,
• 8:48
  and we have to say, "That is not enough. We can do that, but that is not going
• 8:55
  to give you what you need ultimately." So that has changed quite a bit — you
• 9:00
  really can't just do media relations and think that that is going to drive your
• 9:05
  credibility, visibility, or maturity.
• 9:07
  Matt Heinz: I would imagine it's
• 9:07
  a bit of a red flag when someone comes and says, "I just — if I
• 9:10
  just get in The New York Times, we'll be fine, we don't have to
• 9:11
  Lindsey Groepper: do anything else."
• 9:11
  Still happens, Matt.
• 9:12
  Oh, yeah.
• 9:14
  And my question always comes back to, "Okay, why?" Because you sell
• 9:18
  to, like, deep dev nerds, and I promise you they're not reading that.
• 9:24
  Right.
• 9:24
  So, but there's still this idea — we get all the time, "TechCrunch, I
• 9:28
  wanna be in TechCrunch." I'm like, oh my gosh — it's just like, no.
• 9:32
  TechCrunch is great, same with The Wall Street Journal — but we still get that.
• 9:37
  You just have to think about why.
• 9:39
  What do you think that's actually gonna do for you?
• 9:43
  Matt Heinz: On the Forrester B2B Summit floor with Lindsey Groepper.
• 9:46
  She's the co-founder of BLASTmedia and executive VP of business
• 9:52
  development and marketing.
• 9:53
  Basically means you're the rainmaker at BLASTmedia.
• 9:56
  Lindsey Groepper: I try to be.
• 9:57
  Matt Heinz: No.
• 9:57
  Lindsey Groepper: Oversee all things revenue.
• 9:58
  Matt Heinz: Well, anytime I see an up-and-coming company and they're like,
• 10:02
  "Who can help us with our PR?" — you guys are the first people I think
• 10:06
  about, given the reputation you have and all the results you've generated.
• 10:08
  And it must — on a scale of one to ten, how much does it bother you, given
• 10:11
  what you just said, when people say, "Hey, PR's back," and you're like,
• 10:14
  "Fuck you, it's always been here"?
• 10:15
  Lindsey Groepper: So we can cuss on this show?
• 10:17
  Matt Heinz: Now I've decided that this episode we're
• 10:19
  gonna put a little E next to.
• 10:20
  Okay — I'm
• 10:21
  Lindsey Groepper: fine, opened up the floodgates.
• 10:22
  So you
• 10:22
  Matt Heinz: did—
• 10:23
  Lindsey Groepper: —knock yourself out.
• 10:23
  Great.
• 10:24
  Yeah.
• 10:25
  It is quite annoying.
• 10:29
  Because, well, you know, you've lived in the agency world for quite some time
• 10:32
  as well, sort of all ebbs and flows on the demands and the thoughts around it.
• 10:37
  But the reality is — I have said this and I will always say it — is
• 10:40
  that scaling revenue wins quarters, but a strong brand wins categories.
• 10:45
  That has not changed, it will not change, and even today it probably is
• 10:49
  even more true, based on where we are with AI visibility, which I do believe
• 10:54
  is gonna all even out and course-correct and get back to normal at some point.
• 10:58
  But right now it's just a big black box and no one can figure it out.
• 11:02
  But it's annoying, but it's also great, because there's a
• 11:05
  demand for what it is that we do.
• 11:07
  Matt Heinz: Yep.
• 11:07
  Lindsey Groepper: So I'll take it.
• 11:08
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 11:08
  Well,
• 11:11
  and your point about media relations versus — and even just beyond sort of
• 11:15
  PR the way people traditionally think about it — one of my first jobs out of
• 11:18
  school, I was an intern at a PR agency in Seattle, and you were writing press
• 11:22
  releases and calling reporters, "Did you get this?" And it was all about
• 11:26
  the clip book and getting all that.
• 11:28
  There's still a lot of optics and credibility in getting all of that.
• 11:33
  But if my job is just to get media coverage, that may not
• 11:36
  necessarily attract my audience.
• 11:38
  I was at a company — they were in real estate, and they were excited they
• 11:41
  had got into a travel publication.
• 11:43
  I'm like, "Why does that… I don't…" So — talk about the evolution there, not only
• 11:49
  from a "who is our audience" standpoint, but from a storytelling standpoint.
• 11:53
  'Cause that same founder — probably the founder that wants to be in TechCrunch
• 11:56
  — says, "What is the story?" And he's like, "Well, just us and what we do, our—"
• 12:00
  Lindsey Groepper: —products.
• 12:00
  Matt Heinz: Right?
• 12:00
  And what we do — everyone's gonna wanna know that.
• 12:02
  It's like, no, no one wants to know that.
• 12:03
  Lindsey Groepper: Literally.
• 12:04
  Matt Heinz: How do you coach clients on audience and story?
• 12:08
  Lindsey Groepper: So the audience is super fragmented, as you know.
• 12:12
  And, to your point, a singular media hit—
• 12:15
  Matt Heinz: Yeah—
• 12:16
  Lindsey Groepper: —will hit a portion of your audience briefly.
• 12:20
  So what we have to really figure out is where does your audience live?
• 12:23
  So, specifically, title — what's the title into which you're selling?
• 12:27
  What's the industry?
• 12:28
  And then we just build this ecosystem around them — where are they going to
• 12:31
  get their information, not necessarily their news, but where are they influenced?
• 12:35
  And, fortunately, there are more tools than you could ever imagine that give
• 12:39
  you insights into audience data, to help us figure out where we're gonna start.
• 12:44
  And the great thing with AI visibility tools is, when we pull reports for
• 12:48
  our clients on AI vis, what we're looking at is how are they appearing
• 12:52
  in certain prompts versus competitors, but more specifically, what sources
• 12:56
  are the LLMs deeming as authoritative?
• 12:59
  So for us, that really helps shape our strategy — yes, there
• 13:02
  is trade media being indexed way more than there is national press.
• 13:06
  So let's focus on the trades.
• 13:08
  But also we're seeing executive LinkedIn — those are always the
• 13:12
  top sources for a specific prompt.
• 13:14
  So coaching our clients on why they need to contribute to LinkedIn,
• 13:18
  allowing us to write on their behalf to contribute on LinkedIn.
• 13:22
  So, figuring out where your audience is influenced, and to build that trust.
• 13:26
  I think about it like the people that I trust in my personal life.
• 13:29
  Matt Heinz: Mm-hmm.
• 13:29
  Lindsey Groepper: They built that trust because they show up consistently.
• 13:32
  They do what they say they're going to do, and they tell me hard
• 13:36
  truths, sometimes when it hurts.
• 13:38
  And the same is true for brands — we have to show up where people expect us,
• 13:42
  we have to back up our words, and we have to do what we say we're gonna do.
• 13:46
  And so we take that same building-trust lens through PR efforts.
• 13:50
  And, yes, so it is media relations, it is LinkedIn.
• 13:53
  Trust us when we tell you that if you're already active on
• 13:55
  Reddit, post to a Reddit AMA.
• 13:57
  Trust us when we tell you that there's a specific podcast, like Sales Pipeline
• 14:01
  Radio, that is gonna be influential to your audience — and not overly focused
• 14:06
  on, "When can we get a feature in the Wall Street Journal?" 'Cause the
• 14:08
  answer's actually never, because you're small and they just don't do that.
• 14:12
  But there are ways to get in there.
• 14:13
  Matt Heinz: So what I'm hearing from you is your challenges are similar to ours.
• 14:16
  We're fully focused on pipeline, and everyone's looking for the easy button.
• 14:19
  Everyone wants one channel — "We're just gonna do this and it's all gonna work,
• 14:22
  we're just gonna get in the Journal or New York Times, and everything's gonna work"
• 14:25
  — and the answer is far more complex.
• 14:28
  You need to work a matrix and a body of work, and there is very much a
• 14:32
  playbook for doing that, if you're willing to follow it, and in many
• 14:35
  cases, kind of lean into a little more complexity than you expected.
• 14:39
  Lindsey Groepper: Mm-hmm.
• 14:39
  Matt Heinz: But it works.
• 14:40
  Lindsey Groepper: It does work, and we do have a checklist of what makes
• 14:45
  a client go from good to great.
• 14:47
  Matt Heinz: Mm-hmm.
• 14:47
  Lindsey Groepper: And our number one thing that we've just
• 14:50
  established as an agency is when our clients have a "say yes" mindset.
• 14:53
  Matt Heinz: Nice.
• 14:54
  Lindsey Groepper: And that is, yes, involves some trust — but
• 14:57
  you're hiring us for a reason.
• 14:59
  We want you to say yes, and just open up your mind to, "Okay, this isn't
• 15:03
  what I thought, this isn't maybe what I was expecting in terms of strategy
• 15:07
  or where to go." But have a say-yes mindset and trust us that we're
• 15:10
  recommending this stuff for a reason.
• 15:12
  And, you're all about driving pipeline, and certainly that has an even bigger
• 15:16
  sense of immediacy than what we do.
• 15:19
  But for us — we always laugh, because we're so impatient as marketers.
• 15:25
  Yeah.
• 15:25
  Everybody is.
• 15:26
  And what we always say is, you can't just turn on the PR switch
• 15:31
  and think it's just gonna work.
• 15:33
  So when you start a PR program, it's like anything else — it's
• 15:37
  like a sales pipeline, truly.
• 15:38
  It takes your first 90 days — it's building pipeline,
• 15:42
  creating the opportunity, you're — get early wins, right?
• 15:45
  But you're building the relationships, you're getting early wins.
• 15:47
  And we're always like, "Trust us, guys, month four — trust us."
• 15:51
  Everything becomes more predictable.
• 15:52
  All of the work that we've put in — you got to wait and trust us, it will happen.
• 15:57
  Matt Heinz: I hadn't thought about this in forever.
• 15:59
  I remember we actually had a kind of a pipeline report
• 16:01
  — maybe you guys do as well.
• 16:02
  So there's the stuff that gets published, so, "Look, you got here, you got here."
• 16:05
  But we would kind of say, "Here's all the conversations we're having on your behalf,
• 16:09
  and so-and-so is working on a special edition of whatever, but it doesn't
• 16:12
  come out till June, but we're working on having this angle go into that." So
• 16:15
  even if they weren't seeing immediate results, they were like, "Oh, I can see
• 16:18
  that something is building here." In the same way that today I'm like, "Oh, you
• 16:21
  don't just magically close deals — here's the demand you're seeing, here's the
• 16:25
  qualified pipeline you're seeing, here's the multi-threaded buying group that is
• 16:28
  now engaged together." And so you start to see evidence of that momentum over time.
• 16:33
  All right.
• 16:34
  We're starting to run out of time.
• 16:35
  We — since we broke the seal on swearing, can we talk about drinking now?
• 16:40
  Lindsey Groepper: Oh, my gosh, yes.
• 16:42
  Football and drinking and swearing, Matt.
• 16:45
  Matt Heinz: Best day ever.
• 16:46
  Oh, my gosh.
• 16:47
  Season five of SaaS Half Full — we were talking before we got started
• 16:52
  about what I think would be the ideal scenario for a live SaaS Half Full
• 16:57
  podcast, coming to a conference near you.
• 17:01
  Share with us your vision.
• 17:02
  If you're listening and you're doing a conference and you would like to have
• 17:05
  Lindsey do what she's about to describe, give us a call, we'll hook you up.
• 17:08
  Lindsey Groepper: Yeah, so I'm sitting here with Matt in person
• 17:10
  at the Forrester B2B Summit.
• 17:11
  Yes.
• 17:11
  He has a little recording studio set up, which is awesome, and I said, "Matt,
• 17:15
  I wanna do this," 'cause I run SaaS Half Full — I've been running it for, I
• 17:18
  don't know, six years or so — where my whole shtick is that I send my guests
• 17:24
  a cocktail or a mocktail kit of their choice, and we share a drink on the show.
• 17:27
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 17:28
  Lindsey Groepper: Love it.
• 17:28
  Would love to do that in person at events, and my vision is that — I mean, this
• 17:34
  involves me drinking a lot during the day, but that's okay — where we set up
• 17:38
  like a bar situation, recording studio, and I have guests come in, and we talk
• 17:44
  about all things SaaS and AI marketing.
• 17:47
  I would have to get some clearance to serve alcohol, I'm sure, at a show.
• 17:50
  But if there are certain shows that you think this would be
• 17:52
  a great fit for, let me know.
• 17:54
  I wanna get going
• 17:54
  — Matt Heinz: so the bar is the show.
• 17:57
  I mean, we're sitting here — it's just a square table, it's very
• 18:00
  nice, thank you, Forrester.
• 18:01
  Shout out to Amanda for making all this possible.
• 18:03
  But you're literally on a stool at a bar, drinking and talking about
• 18:08
  whatever you wanna talk about.
• 18:09
  I think that would be phenomenal.
• 18:11
  Your question about alcohol — it's a conference center,
• 18:13
  of course there's alcohol.
• 18:13
  So it's just a matter of the timing of it all.
• 18:16
  One of my favorite things to do, if I'm moderating a session that's right
• 18:19
  before the happy hour at a conference, I'll set it up in advance, and I'll
• 18:22
  have everyone go around — okay, everyone on the panel, introduce yourself,
• 18:26
  who you are, and what's your drink?
• 18:29
  What's your drink at the happy hour after this?
• 18:31
  And someone in the back's taking notes, and right before we get to Q&A, a tray
• 18:35
  comes up and they get their drinks, so they get the first piece of their drink.
• 18:39
  Yeah, so five seasons of SaaS Half Full — where can people find that?
• 18:44
  Lindsey Groepper: Anywhere that you listen to podcasts, and on YouTube.
• 18:46
  So we're on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, our own website.
• 18:51
  And if you're interested in being a guest on SaaS Half Full, also hit me
• 18:54
  up on LinkedIn, at Lindsey Groepper.
• 18:56
  Matt Heinz: So right before we started recording, you mentioned something that
• 18:59
  I chuckled at — I chuckled because, for whatever reason, I flashed to Pat
• 19:04
  McAfee standing on his chair yelling, "Who's that coming down the tracks?"
• 19:09
  Lindsey Groepper: Yes, yes.
• 19:10
  Pat McAfee's recording studio is literally like two miles from my house.
• 19:14
  I pass it almost every day.
• 19:15
  Matt Heinz: That's awesome.
• 19:16
  Lindsey Groepper: So if you were a crazy Pat McAfee fan, you could easily
• 19:19
  get into… it's an old church that he—
• 19:20
  Really?
• 19:21
  —transformed into his studio.
• 19:22
  Yeah,
• 19:22
  Matt Heinz: that's pretty impressive.
• 19:22
  I think — so Pat McAfee's one of those guys — I remember back in the
• 19:25
  day, um, what was his name, the shock jock, still on now — Howard Stern.
• 19:31
  Lindsey Groepper: Yes.
• 19:32
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 19:34
  More people listen to Howard Stern that didn't like Howard Stern
• 19:37
  than listen to him that liked him.
• 19:39
  And I have to imagine Pat McAfee might have a bit of a polarizing
• 19:42
  audience like that, too.
• 19:43
  Lindsey Groepper: Yeah, I mean, he's insane.
• 19:44
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 19:44
  Okay, so this is being recorded — I don't know if you know him well — thoughts on
• 19:48
  McAfee on Game Day, good, bad, or neutral?
• 19:50
  At
• 19:51
  Lindsey Groepper: first I was unsure, because he's just so bro,
• 19:54
  Matt Heinz: you
• 19:54
  Lindsey Groepper: know?
• 19:55
  I just wasn't sure.
• 19:56
  But I will say it has brought a really good energy, and the thing I like is that
• 20:00
  all the other hosts of Game Day think he's so freaking funny — 'cause he's just
• 20:04
  like their little crazy brother who does dumb shit, and they think it's so funny.
• 20:10
  So it's brought — for me, I think it's brought a really good energy to it.
• 20:14
  And, you know, 'cause you had Lee Corso, who — love him — but he was getting
• 20:17
  crusty, and we needed some new energy in there, and he's definitely brought it.
• 20:21
  I mean, he's insane.
• 20:21
  He's
• 20:22
  Matt Heinz: brought it — I mean, Corso, he was getting to a point
• 20:25
  where, bless his heart, he'd had his stroke, and he was just getting old.
• 20:28
  And Nick Saban's phenomenal at the X's and O's, but is not
• 20:31
  exactly the effusive personality.
• 20:31
  Oh my God, don't even
• 20:33
  Lindsey Groepper: get me started.
• 20:33
  Matt Heinz: Oh, no, okay — now we gotta — oh, we're not quite done there.
• 20:35
  I know.
• 20:35
  Okay, we're gonna keep — so, but I like the interaction between Saban
• 20:39
  and McAfee, 'cause I think they kind of play off each other quite nicely.
• 20:43
  There is a high level of respect there, I think, in part, and you
• 20:46
  can see it, 'cause Saban shows up on McAfee's show quite a bit, especially
• 20:49
  once you get into the playoffs.
• 20:54
  I look at this from a distance, right?
• 20:56
  I don't have the emotional connection as an SEC fan and alum.
• 21:00
  I look at Saban as someone that I think I have a lot of respect for.
• 21:04
  Lindsey Groepper: No, totally, yeah, I agree.
• 21:06
  I respect him immensely.
• 21:07
  How can you not?
• 21:08
  Matt Heinz: Yeah.
• 21:09
  Lindsey Groepper: I mean — he's a great coach.
• 21:09
  How, how can you not?
• 21:10
  I don't know.
• 21:12
  If you're an
• 21:13
  Matt Heinz: Auburn fan, maybe you got all kinds of
• 21:14
  Lindsey Groepper: reasons.
• 21:14
  But he — no, he has, as a coach, right — he has his personality, and it's super
• 21:18
  dry, and whatever the male version of resting bitch face is, he has it.
• 21:22
  And I'm like, "Okay, he's done, he's retired, or he's gonna be on
• 21:27
  GameDay — we're finally gonna see Saban's personality." And then—
• 21:32
  No—
• 21:33
  Matt Heinz: —no.
• 21:33
  Lindsey Groepper: Still, I'm like, okay, I thought maybe he was
• 21:36
  just intentionally under control.
• 21:37
  No — maybe that's
• 21:38
  Matt Heinz: it.
• 21:38
  Lindsey Groepper: Maybe that's it.
• 21:39
  That's it — that is literally it.
• 21:40
  That is his personality.
• 21:41
  Matt Heinz: Well, not everyone can be Dabo Swinney.
• 21:43
  Obviously — not everyone can be.
• 21:46
  I do like watching a little Kirby Smart on the sideline, pretending
• 21:49
  he didn't call a timeout when everyone knows he called a timeout.
• 21:52
  You know who I'm talking about.
• 21:53
  Lindsey Groepper: I do.
• 21:54
  Kirby was at school when I was — he was a senior when I was a sophomore, I believe.
• 22:00
  Dated one of my teammates.
• 22:01
  So I have some in-the-vault pictures — yeah, partying with Kirby.
• 22:05
  Matt Heinz: Coming — come next year, we're gonna do video, and we're
• 22:10
  gonna have a lot more fun with this.
• 22:12
  Thank you so much for doing this — this has been fun.
• 22:14
  We get to talk a little work, we get to talk a little drinking, and we get
• 22:16
  to talk a little college football.
• 22:17
  Lindsey Groepper: Perfect.
• 22:18
  Matt Heinz: We'll do it again soon.
• 22:19
  Lindsey Groepper: Thanks, Matt.
• 22:19
  Matt Heinz: Thank you.