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JFK ASSASSINATION - Ep. 346 - What A Novel Idea... · The Lone Gunman Podcast : JFK Assassination

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: I don't know what he's up to. It's picking me
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: like chickens, shocking me like corn, storing me like an
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: ice dummy, and he ain't putting nothing down but that.
• 0:12
  Speaker 2: Yoyo.
• 0:12
  Speaker 3: It's your boy, the Tesla King Helon Mosk. The boys
• 0:16
  Speaker 3: always make my rocket shoot straight up? No, homo, you
• 0:20
  Speaker 3: bout to listen to the number one JFK related podcast
• 0:23
  Speaker 3: on planet Mars. Now plug in your neural link for
• 0:28
  Speaker 3: two numb nuts who aren't a waste of government spending,
• 0:32
  Speaker 3: The Triple B and Joe b.
• 0:36
  Speaker 4: Is U.
• 0:39
  Speaker 5: Show me Joe me Yoe me joey and numb ye me.
• 1:12
  Speaker 6: Sellom show kill.
• 1:15
  Speaker 7: Lee and here we go.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: That's right, Joseph, what's up everybody? It's episode number three
• 1:25
  Speaker 2: hundred and forty six of the Lone Goming Podcast. What
• 1:31
  Speaker 2: a Novel Idea, Because tonight it's gonna all be about
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: mister Gordon Novelle Gordon Dwayne Novell. Is that his real name.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: Possibly he does have an aka Gus Rose, not to
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: be confused with the Dallas Cop. He's believed to be
• 1:57
  Speaker 2: the illegitimate son of a circus side trip performer named
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: Billy Rose. But uh hey, Gordon novelle is a cool name, right, rightful? Yeah? Yeah,
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: what the hell? All right, Joe, real quick, before we
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: get started, let's welcome some folks in here. You've got
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: the tiniest of dancers in the house. Tiny, hello, tiny,
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: little tiny. We got the double B branding up in
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: the house. What's up? Brand Sree? Poor tray is up
• 2:34
  Speaker 2: in the house, right, tray, Tray tray, social outcasts here?
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: What's up? S O? Randall Brooks is back in the house.
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: What's up Randy? Miss Sally? What's up Sally?
• 2:54
  Speaker 8: Hello?
• 2:54
  Speaker 7: Sally?
• 2:57
  Speaker 8: Scott Hello, Scott, Mister Edwards south to west slide in
• 3:05
  Speaker 8: the d MS barely and that's it, but I'm sure
• 3:10
  Speaker 8: we'll have a lot more stragglers straggle in.
• 3:17
  Speaker 2: Did you have a chance to do Jack's thing, Joe,
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: or you want to hit that in the middle?
• 3:22
  Speaker 7: I do, I just put it on real quick, yeah.
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: All right. So to set this up a little bit,
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: our very own Jack Taylor, friend of the show. And oh,
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: by the way, thank you to our sixty six Big
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: Mike just re upped his covert operator status yesterday. Thank you,
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: Big Mike. But yeah, our buddy Jack is in New
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: Orleans and he has been doing some man on the
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: street ship much like Mike. Uh, I see you, Paula.
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: Maybe our feed is strapped, Hey, Paula, al right, Paula,
• 4:08
  Speaker 2: Terry and Horse. Sometimes I straggle too. I'm a struggling
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: straggler at times. Joe, whenever you're ready to project, to
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: take us on a tour of New Orleans, No Orleans,
• 4:23
  Speaker 2: New Orleans, mister Gason, going.
• 4:24
  Speaker 7: Back and alls, mister Gaston. Yeah, you know, it's always
• 4:31
  Speaker 7: fun when I see these type of pictures. And uh,
• 4:35
  Speaker 7: I ended up curryinging three of them in in this one.
• 4:39
  Speaker 7: But uh, on the I guess I'll start on the left.
• 4:46
  Speaker 2: That is.
• 4:50
  Speaker 7: The plaque that is now standing on the property adjacent
• 4:54
  Speaker 7: to where Guy Banner's first office was at five point
• 4:56
  Speaker 7: forty four Camp Street. And ironically, like Jack pointed out,
• 5:02
  Speaker 7: word commission member Jack.
• 5:03
  Speaker 4: Box, hailballs, hail box, I am, I am reading and
• 5:11
  Speaker 4: having another thing off right now. And on the top
• 5:18
  Speaker 4: right you are going to see Adrian Albums parking garage.
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: Well, you're going to see William Riley Coffee Company on
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: the right, and immediately to the left the big the
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: big structure with the four by four by ten windows Yep,
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: black and white. That's Adrian Alba was buted right up
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: against the William Riley Coffee Company. So that's how close
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: it was, folks.
• 5:46
  Speaker 7: Yeah, right next, right next to each other. And I
• 5:49
  Speaker 7: was going to get there, Robert, but but uh, like
• 5:54
  Speaker 7: Jack pointed out, really interesting to realize how close when
• 5:59
  Speaker 7: you see it, uh, in a picture like this, and
• 6:02
  Speaker 7: how he literally just you know, took a couple steps,
• 6:08
  Speaker 7: went a quarter or block and then allegedly was hanging
• 6:12
  Speaker 7: out in Adrian's office reading the Gun magazine not working.
• 6:20
  Speaker 7: And the last one I have here he had a video,
• 6:25
  Speaker 7: but I didn't want to put that up here, and
• 6:29
  Speaker 7: enough time, too, fair enough. And this is the Napoleon
• 6:35
  Speaker 7: House restaurant, rob where Garrison watched the assassination aftermath unfold
• 6:43
  Speaker 7: on the small TV in the corner only in the movie.
• 6:49
  Speaker 7: Still a cool spot to visit.
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: I still have the Commander or the bring a Store picture.
• 7:01
  Speaker 9: Mm hm.
• 7:04
  Speaker 2: The Casa Rocca that was right next door to Orspanas
• 7:08
  Speaker 2: Habanabar on the corner of can Now Indicator.
• 7:14
  Speaker 7: I don't oh, I think that was the video.
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: M h m hmm.
• 7:25
  Speaker 7: Yeah, it's hard to download from a Facebook messenger here
• 7:29
  Speaker 7: but very nice of of Jack to to share those
• 7:34
  Speaker 7: pictures with us. Very cool.
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: Yes, thank you Jack, Thank you, Jack, appreciate it.
• 7:40
  Speaker 7: And uh, never know, there might be a new Orbleans
• 7:43
  Speaker 7: meet up in the Lone Dublin podcast future.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: Never know. Mhm mm hmm. All right, let's get right
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: into it, Joe, because we got a lot to cover
• 7:53
  Speaker 2: tonight with Gordon Noville. This dude was all over the
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: freaking place doing all kinds of shit with all kinds
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: of different people, including our intelligence agencies. So yeah, I
• 8:10
  Speaker 2: actually share a birthday with this guy as well. Really yeah,
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: February seventh. Uh, he was born in nineteen thirty eight,
• 8:19
  Speaker 2: February seventh, So I guess he was maybe one year
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: older than Oswald possibly or maybe Yeah, I think Oswald
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: was born thirty nine. Wasn't he three?
• 8:40
  Speaker 7: Yeah, that's about.
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: Right, something like that. They're pretty close in age, or
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: they were pretty close in age. But I teased a
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: little bit on our members only section about finding another
• 8:58
  Speaker 2: Jay Martin, So thank you Gordon Novelle for this. In
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: nineteen fifty nine, Gordon Novelle was arrested with two accomplices
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: and they were charged with grand theft, auto and His
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: two accomplices were Julius Paul Martin, twenty year old male,
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: and they were arrested in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. At approximately
• 9:43
  Speaker 2: eleven am. On June twenty sixth, nineteen fifty nine, Agent
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: Robertson of the NA Theft Bureau came into police headquarters
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: with subject Julius Paul Martin from New Orleans, this being
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: the subject wanted for the theft of a nineteen fifty
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: eight Chevy Corvette see Auto Theft Report and Auto Theft
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: Recovery Report. Upon questioning the subject, Julius Paul Martin at
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: the police station orally admitted coming to Baton Rouge on
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: Friday night. He and a white guy known as Sal
• 10:16
  Speaker 2: Wait a minute, yeah, and they were driven here by
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: a white male known only as Gordon. Their purpose of
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: coming to Baton Rouge was for stealing the Corvette and
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: taking it back to New Orleans to be changed about
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: and the motor to be used for hot ride purposes.
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: So basically, what these guys did, they went and they
• 10:39
  Speaker 2: boosted this Chevy Corvette because at the time Gordon Novelle
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: allegedly owned a drag strip where I'm not sure how
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: legal these races were Joe, but this is this is
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: the kind of thing that they would do. Now, this
• 11:04
  Speaker 2: other guy sal that they refer to is actually a
• 11:08
  Speaker 2: guy named Rancier Blaze Ellinger, and why he is significant.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: So that was the three. It was Gordon, Novell, Rancy
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: and Julius that got busted. And they had brought back
• 11:30
  Speaker 2: the corvette to New Orleans to and they had already
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: got the engine out of it. So but the cops
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: called up to him busted him out, and mister Ellinger
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: was interviewed on March thirtieth, nineteen sixty seven, at two
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: thirty five pm by William Gerbach, aide to Jim Garrison.
• 11:56
  Speaker 2: So this is what old Rancier Ramcier mister Blaze Ellinger
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: had to say. Ellinger stated that he had been interviewed
• 12:08
  Speaker 2: by Jim Garrison about four or five weeks ago relative
• 12:10
  Speaker 2: to an incident in Huma, Louisiana or Homa or whatever
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: how they you say it, relative to the burglary of
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: explosives in that area. Alkock and I interviewed Ellinger again
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: about this and other matters. He stated that he has
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: known Gordon Novel for approximately twelve years and attended high
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: school with him in Metie, Louisiana. Ellinger stated that between
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: March and September sixty one, he Gordon Novel, David Ferry,
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: Sergio Kasha Smith, Missus, Gordon Novell, Marlene Mancuso traveled to Whoma, Louisiana,
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: and Novelle's nineteen fifty six Lincoln automobile for the purpose
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: of carrying out a pre arranged plot to burglarise bunkers
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: on the hum airport for the purpose of obtaining explosives
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: and munitions. Two others who were members of this plot
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: followed them in a van truck and participated in the burglary.
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: One of the occupants of this truck was Layton Martin's.
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: The other seject is unidentified. Yeah, so, I mean, I
• 13:21
  Speaker 2: know everybody's heard a lot of these names before. You know,
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: you got Gordon Novell there with David Ferry, Sergei Orcassias Smith,
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: Marleone Mancuso, who was the daughter of the owner of
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: Mancuso's restaurant, which is right beside Guy Banister and associates
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: Layton Martin's as well. One of David Ferries f boys.
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: According to Ellinger, it was Gordon Novell, who originated this plot.
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: Novelle and Ellinger had been on this airport before for
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: the purpose of attending dragstrip races. It was at that
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: time that Novelle noticed the bunkers and returned to New
• 14:03
  Speaker 2: Orleans and discussed this with Sergio Arcassia, Smith and David Ferry.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: These discussions took place at Ferry's residence in Metai and
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: are Conscious residence in the Gentilly section of New Orleans.
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: Ellinger stated that he and Novelle had operated a drag
• 14:19
  Speaker 2: strip and Hammond, Louisiana Right. Otherwise it as the home
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: of clay Shaw, original home of Clayshaw and where David
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: Ferry spent the night on his way back from his
• 14:33
  Speaker 2: ice skate ice skating trip and an all boys dorm.
• 14:38
  Speaker 7: Yeah the college student right Yeah.
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: Ellinger stated that he did not know who owned the truck,
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: which appeared to be old and of a dark color.
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: The only tool used to force entry into the bunker
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: was described by Ellinger as a bolt cutter, which to
• 14:54
  Speaker 2: his knowledge, was in the truck. Ellinger does not know
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: for sure who actually entered the bunker, but states that
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: all persons mentioned by him were present and participated in
• 15:03
  Speaker 2: one way or another. The unidentified subject in the truck
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: wore a marine type fatigue uniform spoke of guerrilla training,
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: had dark curly hair, and was over six feet in height.
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: Taken in this burglary by these individuals, according to Ellinger,
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: were artillery simulators, thirty caliber machine gun, tracer bullets, signal flares,
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: shoot tight and other unidentified explosives. The entire burglary took
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: approximately fifteen minutes, and all persons involved returned to the
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: vehicles returned into vehicles to New Orleans, arriving sometime around midnight.
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: They had departed New Orleans at approximately seven pm for Huma.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: The explosives were taken directly to the residents of David
• 15:49
  Speaker 2: Ferry on Atherton Drive in Metory and stored in his garage.
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: Layton Martin's and David Ferry and possibly one or two
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: others unloaded these Stolens explosives from the van truck and
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: carried them to the storage place. Shortly after this, Ellinger recalls,
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: Gordon Novell, Missus Gordon Novell and Ellinger went to the
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: seventeenth seventeenth Street Canal in the Meticary area and exploded
• 16:14
  Speaker 2: an artillery simulator underwater, which, according to Ellinger, created a
• 16:19
  Speaker 2: ten foot fireball, and the explosion shook the levee on
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: which they were standing and caused the water to rise considerably.
• 16:28
  Speaker 2: Ellinger stated that Novelle later told him that some of
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: these explosives had ultimately reached Havana, Cuba. Novelle had also
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: stated that he was to be paid money by this
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: or for this by Sergio or Kashia Smith from the
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: proceeds that would be raised from a television telethon, ostensibly
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: in the interest of Cuban refugees. However, Arkasha never paid Novell,
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: and Ellinger received no reward either, although he did expect
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: some money from Novell, hence why he's rating his assets
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: out now. Apparently despite being high school buddies. Ellener stated
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: that he slept quite a bit on the return trip
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: from Huma and does not know for certain how far
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: back the truck was, nor if any explosives were thrown
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: from this truck and ignited along the highway. During the
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: return trip, Ellinger was shown ten black and white photographs
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: from which he selected one of Clay Shaw, Sergei or
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: Kasha Smith, Leyton Martin's and David Ferry. He said that
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: he had never met Clay Shaw before, but knew who
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: he was and knew that he was a friend of
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: Gordon Novell. He identified the photograph of Sergei or Kasha
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: Smith as being one of the persons on this Huma trip.
• 17:41
  Speaker 2: The photograph of Martin's was identified as another person on
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: this trip, and he identified David Ferry as being on
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: the trip and was the one who lived on Atherleson
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: Drive and meticy where the explosives were originally stored eventually
• 17:53
  Speaker 2: stored all right. Ellinger also stated that in nineteen sixty five,
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: Novelle had met with Clay Shaw to discuss concession rates
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: in the trademark. At that time, Shaul was the general manager.
• 18:07
  Speaker 2: Noville knew little of the food or restaurant business and
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: consulted a friend of his, Joe Ricabona, for advice. Legal
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: papers for this enterprise involving shawl, Noville, Ricabona, and one
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: other identified person were drawn up by attorney Dean Andrews.
• 18:25
  Speaker 7: Yeah in sixty.
• 18:27
  Speaker 2: One, sixty five.
• 18:33
  Speaker 7: Yeah, still still the same network.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, the same name, same network. Wow.
• 18:43
  Speaker 7: Just want to get a little shout out, Bobby thunder
• 18:45
  Speaker 7: Nuts said last week that one of these weeks he'd
• 18:49
  Speaker 7: stay up to the end. This is also not one
• 18:52
  Speaker 7: of those weeks.
• 18:53
  Speaker 4: Well, hello, we'll be you made it, you made it
• 18:59
  Speaker 4: a nice team minutes.
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: Or yeah, it's congratulations, but all good.
• 19:06
  Speaker 7: I'm pretty sure he's on the different time zone and
• 19:09
  Speaker 7: hopefully not West Coast.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: He's over there with Sally, so oh he is Okay, Yeah,
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: Sally's man man, Bobby thunder Nuts.
• 19:19
  Speaker 7: I'm sure we'll cash up. So I just want to
• 19:21
  Speaker 7: say hi.
• 19:23
  Speaker 2: Uh, I asked Ellinger if he could recall an incident
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: in June of fifty nine in which one Rex McGee
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: of Baton Rouge, Louisiana, accused them of stealing his corvette,
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: valued at five thousand dollars at the time. Now, this
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: is from the police reports that I you know where
• 19:41
  Speaker 2: we found Julius Martin this anger guy in Gordon Novell. Right.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: The vehicle was some parts missing, recovered in a garage
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: rented by Gordon Novell and used by both Novelle and Ellinger.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: At the time of recovery, Novelle and Ellinger were in
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: the process of painting the motor. The transmission had also
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: been removed from this vehicle. Ellinger admits having painted the
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: body of the Corvette from which both the motor and
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: the transmission had been removed. Ellinger added that the purpose
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: of removing the motor and transmission was to sell them.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: They were mugged, finger printed, The mugged means photographed, finger printed,
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: and booked in Baton Rouge, but were not held. Three
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: other individuals, Vincent Banamo now deceased, A Daved Vincetti, and
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: Julius Martin, were later arrested in charge with the actual autotiff.
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: According to Ellinger, de Vincenti was sent to the state
• 20:40
  Speaker 2: penitentiary following his conviction for the crime. Although official records
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: of the Baton Rouge Police Department and the Louisian State
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: Police show that Novel and Ellinger admitted knowing that this
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: vehicle was stolen at the time that they took it
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: into their custody, and having admitted they intended to sell
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: the motor and transmission, but neither were prosecuted, so they
• 21:01
  Speaker 2: basically received stolen property. M On March third, nineteen sixty seven,
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: Superintendent Melan Melanchon of the Homa Police Department personally delivered
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: to the undersigned their complaint report dated August twenty second,
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: nineteen sixty one, relative to the burglary on the bunkers
• 21:19
  Speaker 2: of the Huma Airport. Ellinger came into this office voluntarily
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: and stated that he would be willing to give testimony
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: in this matter if necessary. So he's rolling, Joe, he's
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: a rat. We're telling you, Brian, just listen. That's all
• 21:38
  Speaker 2: you got to do. We're going to tell you who
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: Gordon Novelle is.
• 21:42
  Speaker 7: Yes, in very short, a New Orleans character that intertwined
• 21:47
  Speaker 7: with all the other New Orleans characters we study. Yes,
• 21:51
  Speaker 7: I got involved with Garrison. But we'll get there, we promised.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: Yes, and much much more and much more, Yeah, much more,
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: much more. I came across an interesting document Joe from
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: nineteen sixty seven, February of nineteen sixty seven, to be exact.
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: And it's a CIA handwritten note. And while I love those, yeah,
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: and this one is.
• 22:23
  Speaker 7: Yes, and the handwritten notes and the cursive notes, it
• 22:27
  Speaker 7: doesn't look like that one was in cursive.
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: Oh it is.
• 22:30
  Speaker 7: But I can read it, okay, good.
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, very good cursive. Yeah, I can read it. It's
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: addressed it solely. Who I'm guessing is Bruce solely, right,
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: So this is an internal CIA memo, Yeah, right at
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: the top.
• 22:46
  Speaker 7: Solely Yeah, worked under Angleton.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: Allegedly John Newman's mole correct, Wow, looking for the Soviets.
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: What he's And I don't excuse me, I have no
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: idea who this is from, because uh, it's just illegible
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: and it's just uh, I have no idea. Maybe Gus,
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: I don't. I don't know, very hard to say, or
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: Stu or something. I don't know. Anyway, solely minor point
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: of possible interest to mister Stevens is or regarding Novelle
• 23:38
  Speaker 2: May and who May is is Hoke May or how May?
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: Who was a New Orleans based CIA personnel person yea,
• 23:52
  Speaker 2: he worked in the New Orleans.
• 23:53
  Speaker 7: CIA office is a domestic context.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: I don't know. He just worked in the New Orleans CIO.
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: And we'll get there. But it says we had that
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: draft letter was formed allegedly under a piece of linoleum
• 24:17
  Speaker 2: covering a sink dream board rather than a rug. Also
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: still question of who may have written draft letter, and
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: of course, and most importantly, why Novelle may be trying
• 24:34
  Speaker 2: to link himself to the CIA is obscure to say
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: the least. Again, this is from February nineteen sixty seven.
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: And what they're referring to here is Novelle was staying
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: in an apartment in New Orleans and he moved out right,
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: and these new chicks moved in. Well, in the process
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: of I guess in the kitchen that linoleum was off
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: fucked up, so they figured that they would rip it
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: up and put new linoleum down in the kitchen. Well,
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: they started tearing up the linoleum, but under the linoleum
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: they found a letter from Gordon Novell saying some very
• 25:17
  Speaker 2: interesting things about some CIA, things that he probably shouldn't know. Joe.
• 25:25
  Speaker 7: Yeah, and you gotta wonder, Rob, is that for insurance,
• 25:31
  Speaker 7: like if something happens to me type of thing?
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: This is where Not? Really, it wasn't that kind of letter, Okay.
• 25:38
  Speaker 2: I think it was maybe some kind of a letter
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: that maybe fell off the counter and went under this linoleum.
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: I don't know, maybe he hit it, I don't know. Yeah,
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: But so in July of sixty seven, July fifth, I
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: have another internal CIA memorandum to mister Stevens, whoever that is,
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: she of the srs. She curdy reach her staff maybe,
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: but right Underneath it says Oswald case Hoke Smith May
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: number one sixty seven three one four. So they're linking
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: this already to the assassination the Oswald case. And here's why.
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: So the note in the attached New Orleans States Item
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: article that it reportedly was to Hoke May Okay. Hok
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: May was a reporter of that newspaper. That was an
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: incriminating letter which Gordon Novell allegedly wrote to a mister
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: Weiss who was quote presumably connected with CIA, was delivered.
• 26:55
  Speaker 2: According to the State's Item article of May twenty six,
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: sixty seven, the letter, which appeared to be a draft,
• 27:01
  Speaker 2: had been found under a linoleum in an apartment occupied
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: by Novell prior to his departure from New Orleans in
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: about mid March nineteen sixty seven, and had been turned
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: over to the boyfriend of one of the two girls
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: who found it while cleaning the apartment. The boyfriend had
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: turned it over to his professor at a New Orleans
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: university who was a friend of reporter Hok May, and
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: he delivered it to May. Novelle's attorney has stated that
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: Novelle worked for the CIA in New Orleans in nineteen
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: sixty one. Hok May, without question is subject who in
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: April of nineteen fifty eight was granted a covert security
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: approval for unwitting use by Project FJ Indulge. Okay unwitting,
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: which means this guy had no fucking idea that he
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: had been approved for use in a project called f
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: J Indulge. May was not to be directly employed by
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: FJ Indulge, but was to be used in connection with
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: his position with a private firm which handled work for
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: the project. Investigation of Subject by this agency in February
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: March of nineteen sixty eight reflected nothing of a derogatory nature.
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: It did indicate, however, that what has in the past
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: had an interest in politics, and in nineteen fifty two
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: was employed as a political campaign manager and the unsuccessful
• 28:38
  Speaker 2: race of a candidate for Congress from Georgia. Subject's grandfather
• 28:42
  Speaker 2: was a governor of Georgia and later a senator from
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: the state. Blah blah blah, blah blah. Right now, the
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: letter appears to be a draft which later might have
• 28:58
  Speaker 2: been recopied or typed. There's no indication that this whatever
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: was found was ever mailed, however, and Plotkin said he
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: does not know whether the draft was sent to the
• 29:11
  Speaker 2: addresseee blah blah blah blah blah. And this is a
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: nightmare to read. But basically the letter to Weiss begins
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: like this quote. This letter is to inform you that
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: Da Jim Garrison has subpoenaed myself and in associates testify
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: before his grand jury on matters which may be classified
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: as top secret actions of individuals connected with Double Check
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: Corporation in Miami in first quarter of nineteen sixty one. Now,
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: Gordon Develle should not know anything about the Double Check Corporation. Okay,
• 30:02
  Speaker 2: uh in Miami in nineteen sixty one. This was a
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: front company used by the CIA, primarily JM Wave Station,
• 30:15
  Speaker 2: to pay out uh it's agents if you will, to
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: pay out you know, widows of certain things, just to
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: They used it for payouts. Basically a shell company where
• 30:34
  Speaker 2: people weren't getting paid directly by the CIA. They were
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: using this company called Double Checks, a shell company to
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: pay out operatives. Okay, Now, Gordon Deville should not know
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: shit about this, right and there should know anything, but
• 30:56
  Speaker 2: he does. The authoritative book entitled The Invisible Government has
• 31:04
  Speaker 2: identified Double Check Corporation of Miami as a CIA front
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: organization which recruited pilots and other Cuban personnel for the
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: Bay of Pigs invasion in nineteen sixty one. We have
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: no current contact available to inform of this situation. The
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: letter continues, so I took the liberty of writing you
• 31:24
  Speaker 2: direct and apprising you of the current situation. I'm expecting
• 31:28
  Speaker 2: you to forward this through appropriate channels. Our connection and
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: activity of that period involved individuals presently about to be
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: indicted as co conspirators in mister Garretson's investigation. We have
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: temporarily avoided once subpoena not to reveal Double Check activities
• 31:49
  Speaker 2: or associate them with this mess. We went out of
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: this thing. We want out of this thing by Thursday,
• 31:56
  Speaker 2: March whatever sixty seven. Our attorneys have been told to
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: expect another subpoena to appear and testify on this matter.
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: The Fifth Amendment and or immunity and legal tactics will
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: not save us. Mister Garrison is in possession of unsworn
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: portions of this testimony. He is unaware of Double Check
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: involvement in this matter, but has strong, strong suspicions, and
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: I have been questioned extensively by local FBI recently as
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: to whether or not I was involved with double Check's
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: parent holding corporation during this time. My reply on five
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: queries was negative, Bureau unaware of double check association in
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: this matter. Our attorneys and others are in possession of
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: complete sealed files containing all information concerning matters an event
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: of our sudden departure, either accidental or otherwise, they are
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: instructed to simultaneously release same for public scrutiny in different areas.
• 33:04
  Speaker 2: So you can see why this letter it's kind of suspect.
• 33:13
  Speaker 2: Now this whole time, there is internal memorandum in the
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: CIA because every time Gordon Novelle is arrested or questioned,
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: he always claims that he's working for the CIA. Now
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: is this another grift or is this the truth? The
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: CIA does many internal investigations, and I've seen at least
• 33:43
  Speaker 2: five of them where they claim he does not work
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: for them, He's never worked for them and will never
• 33:50
  Speaker 2: work for.
• 33:50
  Speaker 7: Them, right, right, and Rob. I think it's important to
• 33:54
  Speaker 7: note that when someone makes these claims, it starts this
• 33:59
  Speaker 7: whole back and forth internal memos. Someone writes a letter,
• 34:03
  Speaker 7: does this guy, is this claim true than the person
• 34:06
  Speaker 7: checks with the records person, then they get back to
• 34:10
  Speaker 7: the person.
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: Who has that shoe. But it also creates reports about
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: what Novelle's saying or doing right exactly right then, like
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: he does a four year request later on in the
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: seventies to the CIA through an attorney, demanding everything that
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: he's mentioned in right, so it can bolster the fact
• 34:34
  Speaker 2: that you know, there's files CIA files on this guy
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: going back, you know, to nineteen sixty one, and he
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: can say, hey, I work for the CIA, and he's
• 34:46
  Speaker 2: going to say, well, of course, the CIA is not
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: going to say that I work for him. It's our
• 34:49
  Speaker 2: secret shit I'm doing here right, So I don't know
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: if it's a grift as well. If it is, it's
• 34:56
  Speaker 2: fucking brilliant.
• 35:00
  Speaker 7: If it is, it's brilliant, and I have some thoughts
• 35:04
  Speaker 7: on it.
• 35:04
  Speaker 10: I also have some documents i'll pull up later that
• 35:07
  Speaker 10: of some of these internal memos.
• 35:09
  Speaker 7: They're really interesting.
• 35:11
  Speaker 10: So whatever happened so in February sixty seven and where
• 35:19
  Speaker 10: when he left the.
• 35:21
  Speaker 7: His apartment and that letter was found in March sixty seven,
• 35:25
  Speaker 7: Other than the February sixty seven document that starts the
• 35:29
  Speaker 7: whole internal CIA process, memos. That's when all of them
• 35:35
  Speaker 7: are March July.
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of that's on the can of worms open, right.
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: It only gets crazier from there. So moving on to
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: March nineteen sixty seven. March seventeenth, we have a FBI
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: document concerning the assassination of President Kennedy, where it says
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: Gordon Noville, who has in the past furnished insufficient information
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: to determine his reliability, advised us on February twentieth, nineteen
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: sixty seven that in September of sixty one he was
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: through an associate his friend, mister ed Butler, executive director
• 36:19
  Speaker 2: of the Cuban Democratic I'm sorry of the Information Council
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: of the America's INCA Right, the guy that interviewed Oswald
• 36:27
  Speaker 2: is his buddy.
• 36:28
  Speaker 7: Yeah, okay, I had it. It's up here now.
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: Yep. Yep introduced him to Sergio Orkasia Smith, the head
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: of the Cuban Democratic Revolutionary Front otherwise known as the
• 36:41
  Speaker 2: CRC that occupied space above Guy Banister at five point
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: forty four Camp Street. Folks. Novelle said Butler had requested
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: that he assists Smith in any way that he could,
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: as Smith was working on plans to overthrow Fidel Castro
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: in Cuba. Novell stated in subsequent conversations with Smith, the
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: possibility was discussed of purchasing explosives, firearms, pt boats and jets. Smith,
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: Novelle said, was especially interested in purchasing machine guns, anti
• 37:16
  Speaker 2: personnel minds two millimeters Swiss solo ren rifles and automatic
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: m two to thirty caliber car beings. Novelle said Smith
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: was discussing the possibility of also obtaining medical supplies like blood, plasma, drugs,
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: and the like. Novelle said that he and his partner
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: discussed Smith's proposition and during the discussions were called some
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: prior information that they gained concerning an explosive cash. Novell
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: said they had learned through drag racing circles, which you know,
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: we're talking about the humor thing again. Novelle said that
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: a number of visits with Sergio Orcascia Smith had ultimately
• 37:57
  Speaker 2: told Smith that he could get the explosives for him
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: for a twenty five thousand dollars fee. Novell said he
• 38:04
  Speaker 2: also related to Smith it was his understanding plugged automatic
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: weapons can be purchased from a firm in the North
• 38:12
  Speaker 2: and New barrels for these weapons could be purchased from
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: a West Coast firm, Novelle said. He told Smith he
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: had also determined the possibility existed. He purchased surplus Canadian
• 38:25
  Speaker 2: vampire jets at the cost of three thousand dollars apiece.
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: Novelle said. Sergio displayed numerous photographs and documents relating to
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: the atrocities being committed by the Castro regime in Havana.
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: He said. Mister Butler during this time restated his interest
• 38:45
  Speaker 2: in assisting Smith's movement. He advised it became more apparent
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: the plans of this group were becoming more and more complicated. Ultimately,
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: he and his partners were taken to the residents of
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: David Ferry, where they were introduced to Smith or by
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: Smith too. Ferry two young Cubans and two young ex marines,
• 39:03
  Speaker 2: he said. Upon arriving at the house, he was taken
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: directly to the attic, where there were maps of Cuba
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: displayed on the walls, instructive material lying around, and a
• 39:12
  Speaker 2: number of different types of firearms sitting in a rack,
• 39:16
  Speaker 2: he stated. In the basement of the same house there
• 39:18
  Speaker 2: were two roughly assembled two man submarines Novelle advised Fairy
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: was was referred to as Captain Fairry, and the two
• 39:28
  Speaker 2: ex Marines who were sitting in the attic upon their arrival,
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: behaved in extremely unusual manner. It seemed that they were
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: very bloodthirsty and boisterous. He said. The two x Marines,
• 39:39
  Speaker 2: whose names he does not recall well, while sitting around
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: the attic, were somewhat sullen, and one drew quite a
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: bit of attention because he kept cocking and snapping an
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: M one Grand rifle. He said. At the same initial meeting,
• 39:55
  Speaker 2: he was told Fairry was an airplane pilot. Novelle said
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: that he told Smith the whole plan was far too complicated,
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: but that he would direct Smith and his associates to
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: a place where they could obtain explosives. Novelle advised his
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: ex wife, his partner, Smith Ferry, two Cubans, two ex Marines,
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: and an individual whose name is unknown who had custody
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: of a linen delivery truck traveled to whom My Air
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: Force Base in Huma, Louisiana. He said they utilize his
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: nineteen fifty six Lincoln Supreme, one other automobile, a panel truck,
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: and a metro type step van and he goes on
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: and talks about you know how they stole all the
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: shit from hum. Yeah, a lot of a lot of
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: stuff going on here. So then we move on Joe
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: to May of nineteen sixty seven and another FBI document,
• 41:00
  Speaker 2: this one. By this time, Uh, I believe Gordon Novell
• 41:07
  Speaker 2: has bounced from New Orleans. He got the hell out
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: and went to Ohio. Right, he's on the lamb. He's
• 41:17
  Speaker 2: on here, He's on the run Ohio, Ohio refused the
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: extrad item. The governor of Louisiana. Garrison convinced him to
• 41:26
  Speaker 2: call the governor of Ohio to try to get novel
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: back to Louisiana, and the Governor of Ohio said no, right,
• 41:34
  Speaker 2: so uh Novell was able to not have to go
• 41:40
  Speaker 2: back to Louisiana at this time. Mm hm.
• 41:43
  Speaker 10: Which also makes you think, Rob, I mean, why would
• 41:47
  Speaker 10: the random governor of Ohio care about it, like, refuse
• 41:52
  Speaker 10: the request from another governor without maybe being told to
• 41:57
  Speaker 10: do so.
• 41:57
  Speaker 7: Doesn't unless he's like, very.
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: Well, somebody had set something up in Ohio for mister
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: Novell because he was given a place to live rent free,
• 42:07
  Speaker 2: he was given a dealer car to drive while he
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: was there, right, he didn't have to pay for anything.
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: So somebody was taken care of Novelle in Ohio as
• 42:21
  Speaker 2: well as the state of Ohio.
• 42:23
  Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, there has to be some reason why
• 42:25
  Speaker 7: a governor would refuse another governor and you know, risk
• 42:28
  Speaker 7: that back up making that governor enemy unless there's a
• 42:31
  Speaker 7: reason for it.
• 42:35
  Speaker 2: So May tenth, nineteen sixty seven, we have another FBI
• 42:39
  Speaker 2: document from New Orleans, Louisiana, concerning the assassination of President Kennedy,
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: and it says this Gordon Dwayne Novell, fugitive witness in
• 42:49
  Speaker 2: District Attorney Jim Garrison's investigation into the assassination, telephonically contacted
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: the New Orleans Office New Orleans Office of the FBI
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: on May sixth, sixty seven, and Novell stated that, with
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: the aid of newsman and CIA man Walter Sheridan, he
• 43:08
  Speaker 2: has uncovered the individual's identity who was involved with him
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: at David Ferry's apartment during the September sixty one meeting
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: when plans were made to remove munitions from the bunker
• 43:20
  Speaker 2: at the Huma Air Base. Novell advised that he had
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: previously furnished information describing one of the individuals at the
• 43:28
  Speaker 2: apartment as a young ex marine, possibly by the name
• 43:31
  Speaker 2: of Andy. Novell realized he has now determined that this
• 43:35
  Speaker 2: ex marine is, in reality, Jerome Andrew Blackman. Novell stated
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: that Blackman is very likely District Attorney Garrison star witness
• 43:45
  Speaker 2: in Garrison's attempt to prove a conspiracy in the death
• 43:48
  Speaker 2: of President Kennedy. Novell, now here's where things get weird.
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: Novell further stated he believes District Attorney Jim Garrison is
• 44:00
  Speaker 2: directly responsible for the death of David Ferry. He says
• 44:06
  Speaker 2: that he saw District Attorney Jim Garrison himself is responsible
• 44:15
  Speaker 2: for the death of David Fairry, and he says he
• 44:17
  Speaker 2: saw him leaving David Faerry's apartment at approximately five thirty
• 44:23
  Speaker 2: am on February twenty second, nineteen sixty seven, the Dave
• 44:28
  Speaker 2: Fairy was discovered dead. Novelle said that on the February
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: twenty first, he and District Attorney Garrison were discussing ways
• 44:37
  Speaker 2: to abduct Fairry, and that Garrison was very interested when
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: Novelle suggested the possibility of hitting Ferry at the base
• 44:44
  Speaker 2: of his skull with a rubber Hammer for the purposing
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: purpose of abducting him prior to injecting him.
• 44:52
  Speaker 11: Full of truth, Serum Jim, shut up, folks, And just
• 44:58
  Speaker 11: in case you thought we were making this up, rob
• 45:01
  Speaker 11: I did sniff this part because I read it.
• 45:04
  Speaker 7: And I was like, stop it. Yes, I got it.
• 45:09
  Speaker 7: I gotta put this up. So we are not making
• 45:11
  Speaker 7: it all, ladies and gentlemen, we are not.
• 45:14
  Speaker 2: Novell further advised that he and Sherid And had developed
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: the fact that one Louis Rebel, a New Orleans resident,
• 45:22
  Speaker 2: was the owner of the laundry truck that District Attorney
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: Garrison is trying to weave into his assassination plot. Novell
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: stated that this is the truck used by Serge R.
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: Kysias Smith, David Ferry, two Cubans, Novelle, Marlene, Novelle's partner,
• 45:39
  Speaker 2: and the two ex Marines, one of whom was named Blackman,
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: during the September sixty one alleged burglary of the munitions
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: bunker at the Huma Air Force Base. Novell stated that
• 45:49
  Speaker 2: Garrison knows of the laundry truck and the fact that
• 45:51
  Speaker 2: it is also owned by Louis Rubel, who in fact,
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: took over as president of the CRC after Sergio or Ky.
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: I should either step down or what's booted out? Right?
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: In nineteen sixty two.
• 46:06
  Speaker 7: Rob, I just want to stop you here because we
• 46:08
  Speaker 7: had a couple of comments Leon delivery truck. I know
• 46:14
  Speaker 7: what they're thinking. And and Paul stopped in earlier. He
• 46:16
  Speaker 7: was a little late. He said he was busy researching.
• 46:20
  Speaker 7: And also Sally caught it too, and yeah, action Paul
• 46:27
  Speaker 7: look into.
• 46:27
  Speaker 2: The Yeah, I know it was Louis Rebell's truck. I
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: don't know if he had a laundry service or he
• 46:34
  Speaker 2: worked for one or what.
• 46:37
  Speaker 7: Yeah, but sold later?
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, who knows. So they go through this and according
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: to Noville District Attorney, Garrison has in his possession the
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: following letters. A letter from Clay Shaw to David Ferry,
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: a letter from Lee Harvey Oswald to Clay Shaw regarding
• 46:59
  Speaker 2: certain monies for services rendered if you know what I'm saying, Joe,
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: a letter from David Ferry to Jack Ruby, a letter
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: from Jack Ruby to Lee Harvey Oswald. And a letter
• 47:14
  Speaker 2: from former Attorney General Robert Kennedy to David Ferry, which
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: supposedly is a letter thanking Ferry for his anti Castro
• 47:22
  Speaker 2: activities on behalf of the country. But it gets stranger
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: and we hear more names that we're all familiar with.
• 47:33
  Speaker 2: Here we go. Novell also informed that a New Orleans
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: man by the name of William Dalzell had in the
• 47:41
  Speaker 2: past contacted Special Agent Regis Kennedy of the FBI and
• 47:46
  Speaker 2: CIA employee Logan. Novell stated the conversations between Dalzel and
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: Kennedy seemed to be of interest to Garrison. Novell said
• 47:56
  Speaker 2: that the information concerning Dalzel had been furnished by Dalzell's
• 48:00
  Speaker 2: former landlady. Novelle. Further stated that all of the information
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: Garrison is presently utilizing regarding the CIA in the alleged
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: Kennedy assassination was obtained by Garrison from one Hubert Badeaux,
• 48:15
  Speaker 2: whoever the hell that is. Andrew Jerome Blackman, the alleged
• 48:23
  Speaker 2: marine that took part in the Huma thing, was interviewed
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: by a special Agency of the FBI on August thirty first,
• 48:30
  Speaker 2: nineteen sixty one, at the Third District Police Station in
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: New Orleans, following his arrest for vagrancy pending investigation of
• 48:38
  Speaker 2: burglary by the New Orleans Police Department on August thirtieth.
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: Blackman is described as a white male born September fifteenth,
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: nineteen forty two, in Greenville, Mississippi, and claimed his residence
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: was Natchez, Mississippi, and that he was a student at
• 48:55
  Speaker 2: Perkinson College in Perkinston, Mississippi. Advised that he thought his
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: arrest might possibly be the result of his association with
• 49:04
  Speaker 2: one Captain David Ferry, who he understood was being investigated
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: by Jeff Parrish authorities concerning what he termed indecent charges.
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: Louis Rebell, as of October twelfth, nineteen sixty two, was
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: the admitted head of the Cuban Revolutionary Council in New Orleans,
• 49:26
  Speaker 2: an anti cast organization with headquarters in Miami, Florida. The
• 49:30
  Speaker 2: New Orleans States Item final edition of April fifth, nineteen
• 49:33
  Speaker 2: sixty seven identified Steve Plotkin as Gordon Novelle's attorney. The
• 49:38
  Speaker 2: current New Orleans Telephone Directly directory lists Eddie Sapier as
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: an attorney, and various news sources have reported that Eddie
• 49:46
  Speaker 2: Sapier was recently elected councilman for the City of New Orleans.
• 49:51
  Speaker 2: The sixty six New Orleans City Directory list judged David
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: Gertler as a judge of the Civil District Court for
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: Orleans Parish, and on October ninth, nineteen sixty one, Sergey
• 50:01
  Speaker 2: Orchonscious Smith identified himself as the head of the Front
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: Day Revolutionario Democratical otherwise known as the FRD, and that
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: it emerged with the Cuban Revolutionary Council under his guidance. Okay,
• 50:24
  Speaker 2: let's see any other juicies shit in here. A confidential
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: source who has furnished reliable information in the past advised
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: it on March first, nineteen sixty one, that the source
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: overheard a conversation between William Dalzel and another individual that
• 50:43
  Speaker 2: they were to meet a big wheel from Honduras at
• 50:46
  Speaker 2: the Airport bar on March first to arrange for the
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: transfer of two thousand Thompson machine guns and a number
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: of M one rifles. The source did not know the
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: identity of the individual holding the machine gun us, but
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: advised that the transfer was supposed to be accomplished by
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: the use of a fifty one foot yacht crew boat
• 51:07
  Speaker 2: tied up at that time in Venice, Louisiana. According to
• 51:12
  Speaker 2: the source, the transfer of guns to this vessel would
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: occur some place between New Orleans and Baton Rouge, after
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: which time the guns would be transported to the high Seas,
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: where the representatives from Honduras would either take over the
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: cargo or the actual vessel. The source advised that these
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: weapons were to be used by a group of military
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: men who had recently participated in a revolt in Honduras
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: and were then living near the border of Honduras. William
• 51:40
  Speaker 2: Wayne Dalzel was interviewed in connection with the above mentioned
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: matter by special agents of the FBI on June sixth,
• 51:46
  Speaker 2: sixty one. Dalzel admitted being connected with the quote Free
• 51:50
  Speaker 2: Voice of Latin America, Inc. And the Friends of Democratic Cuba.
• 51:57
  Speaker 2: Dalzel also admitted discussing with two persons to possible ability
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: of getting weapons for five Hondurans residing in Central America
• 52:04
  Speaker 2: who opposed the then existing hon Duran government. However, he
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: says that these discussions did not go beyond the discussion
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: discussion stage. At the time of the interview, Dalzel furnished
• 52:19
  Speaker 2: a copy of his personal history and employment record, at
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: which he reflected he was born and we've talked about
• 52:26
  Speaker 2: Dalzel extensively and his mastery of like seven languages and
• 52:29
  Speaker 2: his alleged CIA ties as well, which all goes down
• 52:37
  Speaker 2: in uh, let's see. The first confidential source advised on
• 52:41
  Speaker 2: February second, nineteen sixty one, that William Dalzel allegedly stated
• 52:45
  Speaker 2: he was going to Cuba as a news reporter and
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: that he was working for a man in the CIA
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: known as Larry Ray. Dalzel was interviewed by special agents
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: of the FBI on June second, and claimed he had
• 52:56
  Speaker 2: visited the CIA office in New Orleans on three occasions,
• 52:59
  Speaker 2: commencing late in nineteen sixty and ending in the early
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: nineteen sixty one. Dalzell claimed he was interviewed by CIA
• 53:08
  Speaker 2: agent Lloyd Ray, and Ray was interested in determining certain
• 53:11
  Speaker 2: information regarding radio stations in Cuba as well as certain
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: microwave equipment in possession of the Cuban government. Now, when
• 53:23
  Speaker 2: we did when we did our Martin thing, I kind
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: of uncovered that William Dalzel was a disc jockey at
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: one point in Omaha and definitely had ties in the
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: radio business as well. So it kind of makes sense. Yeah,
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: let's see on nineteen or Yeah, June second, nineteen sixty one,
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: Hunter Leak, a CIA agent out of New Orleans office
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: confirm the fact that Dalzel had paid three visits to
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: the CIA office in New Orleans to speak to mister
• 53:55
  Speaker 2: Lloyd Ray, a CIA agent. Mister Leak furnished the dates
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: of dalzel visits as November sixteenth, sixty January twenty sixth,
• 54:03
  Speaker 2: sixty one, and February eleventh, sixty one. This document contains
• 54:10
  Speaker 2: neither recommendations nor conclusions of the FBI to the property
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: of the FBI and is loaned to your agency, and
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: its contents are not to be distributed out. So I
• 54:18
  Speaker 2: don't know who got this FBI memo, but it's definitely
• 54:23
  Speaker 2: out there. Next up, Young Joseph. FBI document from June ninth,
• 54:34
  Speaker 2: nineteen sixty seven out of Memphis, Tennessee.
• 54:38
  Speaker 7: Okay, Rob, before you start that, I had a very
• 54:42
  Speaker 7: interesting video of novelle an interview in March of sixty
• 54:47
  Speaker 7: seven before you read the document of June sixty seven
• 54:50
  Speaker 7: talking about Jim Garrison, and it's titled quote Missing Witness.
• 54:56
  Speaker 7: It's only a minute long, in forty seven seconds actually,
• 55:00
  Speaker 7: and I thought the audience may be have a good
• 55:03
  Speaker 7: time to play that before you read that document.
• 55:06
  Speaker 2: If you don't mind, Yeah, who ahead.
• 55:09
  Speaker 7: It is from the YouTube channel Helmer Rienberg, who has
• 55:16
  Speaker 7: a lot of good stuff just in my million tabs
• 55:22
  Speaker 7: that I have open here.
• 55:26
  Speaker 10: But yeah, he has a great ton of great JFK videos.
• 55:31
  Speaker 10: I'll put that link in the comments in a second.
• 55:34
  Speaker 10: But this is what Novell says about Garrison in March,
• 55:38
  Speaker 10: and in March sixty seven, we'll get what do you
• 55:41
  Speaker 10: think after that's from.
• 55:44
  Speaker 1: And you need perpetrating one of the most enormous frauds
• 55:48
  Speaker 1: on the world and on the United States in particular,
• 55:52
  Speaker 1: and on my home state and on New Orleans. And
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: if it goes much further, there's just no telling where
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: mister Garrison will go.
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: What is his motive?
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: Why is he doing with He reminds me of Hughey Long,
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: and he reminds me of a combination of Hughey Long.
• 56:10
  Speaker 6: And some things that I've read about doctor Goebels.
• 56:13
  Speaker 1: He's a little bit of both.
• 56:15
  Speaker 7: What is his motive?
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: Well, Walter, that's open to conjection. Well, he can go
• 56:22
  Speaker 1: anywhere with this thing if he convinces the public that
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: he's real and if this farce is real, this circus
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: that he's putting on down there is real. Uh, He's
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: gonna try and ultimately drag in the CIA, and he's
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: gonna drag in left and right. And as he says,
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: through the looking glass, black is white and white as black.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: I think he's the one that's black and white. At
• 56:42
  Speaker 1: the same time, he can go anywhere. He can say, well,
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: your government did this, he can say there's just no
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: telling what he's gonna try and say. If the rate
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: he's going, maybe tomorrow you'll be it.
• 56:53
  Speaker 12: Did he offer you anything to help him?
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: Yes, mister Garrison said that if I needed any financial assistance,
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: or did I have any business problems or anything that
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: I could get him, that I could get anything that
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: I wanted to help him. And I said, no, I
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: don't need any assistance. Do you have any indication of
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: what he wants you to testify too?
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: And why he considers you such an important witness?
• 57:19
  Speaker 1: He could get me, I guess if he could put
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: enough pressure on me, or if he had me in
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: his pocket the way he has an awful lot of
• 57:24
  Speaker 1: people down there.
• 57:25
  Speaker 13: He could get.
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: He could probably get me to say just about anything
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: he wanted me to say.
• 57:35
  Speaker 2: You know, Joe, we'll get there. I've got some of
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: this stuff that he alleges that Garrison did down there.
• 57:46
  Speaker 7: Did you catch who was doing the interview?
• 57:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Walter Sheridan, Yes, yeah, yeah, And a couple of
• 57:53
  Speaker 2: things that Novelle says here actually did come to fruition.
• 57:58
  Speaker 2: Garrison did drag this CI in to it. Garrison did
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: blame the CION to it, and he also drug Walter
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: Sheridan into it and called him out as an employee
• 58:09
  Speaker 2: the CIA sent by Bobby Kennedy to disrupt his investigation.
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: And I believe at some point, because Novelle did have
• 58:20
  Speaker 2: knowledge like this whole Dollzel thing, he did have knowledge
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: of what Garrison knew. So I think he was at
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: it for a time, maybe initially doing a little work
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: for Garrison, but came to realize very quickly what Garrison
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: was up to. Right, And I know this is a
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: big point of contention when you're talking about the Garrison investigation.
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: Did he do unethical things? And I think the answer
• 58:54
  Speaker 2: is yes. Now, I praised Garrison for trying right, but
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: we all know his investigation was off the rails. And
• 59:10
  Speaker 2: I'm I'm pretty sure that the you know, can the
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: conjecture of most people that have studied the Garrison case
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: against clay Shaw realized that he didn't really have a
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: case against clay Shaw. He was grasping its straws with Shaw.
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: And you know, if things could have been different, I
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: don't know. But you know, this whole use of you know,
• 59:41
  Speaker 2: sodium penthethal on witnesses, and you know, the constant barraging,
• 59:50
  Speaker 2: the the you know, the alleged payoffs and promises and
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: this that and the other non prosecutor and uh things
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 2: like this probably did go on, you know. Yeah, yeah,
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 2: so yeah.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 7: I agree with that. And at the same time, uh, you.
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: Know, accuses them of killing David Ferry.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 7: Yeah, that that was that was very interesting. But at
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 7: the same time, the government isn't playing by the rules either.
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 7: Uh so in terms of the Garrison investigation looking into
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 7: it and look, you know, doing reports, uh, updates on
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 7: what's going on and investigation into jurors everything. So no one,
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 7: to be fair, was playing by all the rules.
• 1:00:46
  Speaker 2: No, And and the government definitely had people like Sheridan,
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: uh possibly Boxley, possibly Noville reporting back to them from
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 2: the inside of the Garrison investigation, letting them know what
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 2: he was up to, you know, what he was doing. Right,
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 2: So we'll get more into that here in a little bit.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: So like I said, this is from Memphis, June sixty seven.
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: And this is an odd one because Okay, by this
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 2: time Novelle has made his way to Ohio, right, but
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: he has a buddy in good old music City Nashville, Tennessee,
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 2: joe a mister Charles Walker, who was the owner of
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 2: the radio station WKDA. There in Nashville. A guy by
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: the name of Dick Buckley was the program director at WKDA,
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: and their attorney, William F. Carpenter, Junior, appeared at mister
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 2: Merritt's office of a May twenty second, nineteen sixty seven,
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 2: and furnished in the presence of Davidson County District Attorney
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 2: General Investigator Charles Hunter. The following information. One Gary Edwards,
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 2: which is a pseudonym for Gerald Mundy, the news director
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 2: of KADIA, is an old friend of Gordon Novell's. Edwards
• 1:02:13
  Speaker 2: has been employed in this post by station w NOE
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 2: in New Orleans, Louisiana, another radio station that Hey William
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: Dauzel worked at for a time, by the way, when
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: he came to know Novelle, also of New Orleans. During
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: the New York World's Fair, Edwards took leave of absence
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 2: to work on the Louisiana exhibit, and at that time
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: renewed his friendship with Novelle. Several months ago, Novelle called
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: Gary Edwards and discussed with him Develle's relationship to the
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: Garrison investigation of the assassination of President John F. Kennedy
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: and how Garrison had planned to arrest an extradite in
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: novel from Ohio to New Orleans. Novell told Edwards thereafter,
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 2: in a conversation with Walker and Buckley, that he had
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 2: worked sometime prior to January and February of sixty seven
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 2: for Garrison on the Kennedy assassination. As quote an electronics expert.
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 2: Noville had told them in the past that he had
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 2: been getting money from the Governor of Louisiana and the
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: CIA for information obtained regarding Garrison and the assassination. So
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: there you go. The CIA was paying Novelle for information,
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: and so was the Governor of Louisiana, Allegedly as a
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 2: result of Novelle and Edwards's relationship. On Tuesday May sixteenth,
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 2: Novelle came from Ohio to Nashville and played for Edwards
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: a number of tapes that he had secretly made of
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: conversations which allegedly took place in meetings between Garrison and
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 2: his associates in the Kennedy assassination investigation. Also, there were
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: tapes which he had attained from illegal wire taps from
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 2: phones in the New Orleans area. Gary Edwards had this
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: information in his files, and he had overheard and had
• 1:04:07
  Speaker 2: listened to all of Novelle's tapes. Novelle and Edwards spent
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: Tuesday through Saturday, May twenty and sixty seven going over
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: these tapes at WKDA, located in downtown Nashville. Edwards called
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: some of the people on these tapes and asked some
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 2: very pointy questions which would indicate that he knew of
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 2: the conversations that Novelle had taped. Edwards also allegedly taped
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 2: his conversations that he had with these people. According to Walker,
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 2: an underworld character offered to buy all of Novell's tapes,
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 2: but that this character would have to call quote the man,
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 2: meaning Garrison, to see what they were worth. And allegedly
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 2: there were some conversations regarding a meeting on a boat.
• 1:04:54
  Speaker 2: So what that saying is they were ready to sell
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: these tapes to some underworld figure who you know some
• 1:05:03
  Speaker 2: mysterious guy, but that they should probably check with Garrison
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: to see if he was willing to pay for them
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: and otherwise blackmail Garrison with these tapes right right. So,
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 2: on Saturday night, May twentieth, Novella and Edwards were at
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 2: the radio station and returned to Edward's apartment from the
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 2: radio station in a panel truck. As they went into
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 2: the driveway, a bullet went through the front of the
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 2: cab and hit the deck, where both of them hit
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 2: the deck and the first shot was followed by a
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 2: series of shots, some of which went through the cab
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 2: and window of the truck. This information came to Walker
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 2: from Gary Edwards, who telephoned him at five in the
• 1:05:46
  Speaker 2: morning on Sunday, May twenty first, from Bowling Green, Kentucky.
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 2: Fled after this. Allegedly the shooting occurred shortly after one
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: am on Sunday, May two, twenty first, nineteen sixty seven.
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: Novell was allegedly shot in the arm, but not badly,
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 2: and Edwards was not hurt but did receive some wounds
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 2: from flying glass. Buckley went to the scene and did
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 2: find that some bushes in the area had been tramped down,
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 2: as if someone had been lying there for a while.
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: The panel truck was there, and there were indications that
• 1:06:24
  Speaker 2: it had been shot up, including bullet holes and broken glass.
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 2: Edwards said, and Novell somehow got to Bowling Green, Kentucky
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 2: in another automobile, although Edwards did not own a car.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: From somewhere in Kentucky, Edwards and Novell split up. Novell
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 2: then high tailed it back to Columbus, Ohio, and Edwards
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: was allegedly to proceed to DC, where he was to
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 2: appear in a meeting previously scheduled for news editors. At
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 2: a Department of State briefing, US attorney Merit made available
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 2: a zox copy of a memo found in the files
• 1:06:57
  Speaker 2: of Gary Edwards which relates to the allegtion tape recordings
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 2: mentioned above, which is attached here too. Mister Merritt stated
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: that he did not know the significance of this information,
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: but that he had made it available to the DOJ
• 1:07:11
  Speaker 2: and no action was recommended other than to place it
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 2: in our files. According to the FBI, nineteen sixty seven
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 2: is crazy as year, boy, But it gets crazier, folks,
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 2: it gets crazier. Let's see here, now we're jumping to
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: nineteen and sixty nine, or Joe, where we have a
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: CIA memorandum subject Garrison and the Kennedy assassination Gordon Dwayne
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: Novell two oh one eight three four eight two two.
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 2: So now by nineteen sixty nine, guess who's got a
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 2: two oh one file? Gordon Novelle.
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 7: Yeah, he must have triggered enough of that, Yeah you
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 7: think yeah.
• 1:08:07
  Speaker 2: Uh, Apparently Novelle told a Miss Jane Morilli that, uh
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: worked at a answering service, okay, or I'm sorry. Apparently
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 2: there's a miss Jane Morilly. She was the president of
• 1:08:33
  Speaker 2: an answering service that provided CIA representatives with information about
• 1:08:37
  Speaker 2: a client, Gordon Novell, who has received much publicity throughout
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 2: the course of the Garrison investigation. Novelle told Miss Marilli
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 2: that persons associated with Garrison and with Ramparts magazine had
• 1:08:50
  Speaker 2: planned an article in which Novelle would be linked to
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 2: the answering service and the service Courtesy Associates to the
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 2: CIA Central Cover staff has used the firm services for
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 2: fifteen years. Novell told Miss Marilly not to worry about it,
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 2: because he had let Garrison and company know that Courtesy
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 2: Associates would sue if such a story were printed in
• 1:09:14
  Speaker 2: the story would be killed. Mss Morillley provided additional information
• 1:09:19
  Speaker 2: about Novel, who in the past has falsely implied and
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 2: even claimed association with the CIA. So now here in
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 2: nineteen sixty nine we have Gordon Novel using the same
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 2: answering service courtesy Associates that the CIA has been using
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 2: for fifteen years. And Novell knows this and reassures the
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 2: owner of this service that don't worry. If anything comes
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 2: up about this and they associated to the CIA, the
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 2: story will never come out. It'll be killed immediately.
• 1:09:56
  Speaker 7: In theory. Not everyone knows all about.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 2: That great so and of course this is CIA internal memorandum.
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 2: So they get with missus Marilli or whatever her name
• 1:10:07
  Speaker 2: is there and she tells them everything that Gordon Novell
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: told her. Now when he set up his answering service
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 2: through Courtesy Associates, this is what he told her that
• 1:10:21
  Speaker 2: he anticipated The following callers, Okay, Number one is a
• 1:10:27
  Speaker 2: mister Willard Robertson. Robertson now Robertson is a Volkswagen distributor
• 1:10:33
  Speaker 2: in New Orleans and a member of the Truth and
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 2: Consequences Incorporated, which is a private association of Garrison supporters
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 2: who have donated funds to Garrison's office for his investigation
• 1:10:44
  Speaker 2: into the assassination. Excuse me. An FBI report of ten
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 2: October sixty seven stated that Robertson wanted another businessman to
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 2: file charges of theft or fraud against novel in connection
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: with a seven hundred dollars diamond ring in order to
• 1:11:02
  Speaker 2: get Novelle in jail and quote under the floor number
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 2: two a mister Elmer Gertz comment no prior record in
• 1:11:12
  Speaker 2: Garrison case number three a mister Phillip Gabriel. Number four
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 2: a mister Walter Sheridan Novelle listened the following is in
• 1:11:24
  Speaker 2: emergency contact and missus Abby Novelle. So by this time
• 1:11:28
  Speaker 2: him and Marlene have divorced and now Gordon Novelle married
• 1:11:33
  Speaker 2: a woman named Abby who is a former. Her name
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 2: is Abby Mulligan. She is a former playboy bunny and
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 2: she was smoking hot, folks.
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 7: I've seen pictures, he busy said, I had his comment
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 7: start earlier. He asked me to say my great comment.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 7: But he's leaving for the pub and he asked me, oh,
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 7: I already said it. If we go back to New
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 7: Orleans Smiths.
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 2: So I want to I want to give that to
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 2: drink one for us to busy.
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 7: Yes, one of.
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 10: Our covert operators. If you're a COVID operator, you could
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 10: ask for West like that and I will interrupt Rob
• 1:12:15
  Speaker 10: to do it. How a great night team is.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 7: We'll talk to you soon.
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 12: Uh.
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 2: She even told them that Novelle banked at the Riggs
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 2: National Bank in DuPont Circle at one seven zero one
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 2: K Street and that his lawyers in DC were Miller, McCarthy,
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: Evans and Cassidy. So she's telling the CIA everything, man. Uh,
• 1:12:40
  Speaker 2: even who is actually calling him?
• 1:12:43
  Speaker 7: All right, she's yapping like six barbers.
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 2: She is yapping like six barbers.
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 7: Uh.
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 2: So the following our telephone calls listed by courtesy associates
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 2: as placed to Novelle's number that he did not answer. Again.
• 1:13:05
  Speaker 2: This Gabriel guy, whoever he was, Mister Gabriel called from
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 2: New Orleans on August thirtieth, nineteen sixty eight. No further information,
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 2: possibly identical with Philip Gabriel of the above. A couple
• 1:13:20
  Speaker 2: days later, same a couple of days later, and Amy
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 2: Helmets from Reno, Nevada. No further information. A couple days
• 1:13:29
  Speaker 2: later office of mister Cork, Bureau of Indian Affairs in Michigan.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 2: Next caller JJ Harris said that there had been no
• 1:13:42
  Speaker 2: word from London. No more information left comment one. Jones
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: Harris is an assistant of Richard Popkin, a journalist who
• 1:13:52
  Speaker 2: has made repeated trips to New Orleans who is strongly
• 1:13:55
  Speaker 2: pro Garrison and wrote a book called The Second Oswald.
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 2: A couple days later call, another call from mister Gabriel.
• 1:14:03
  Speaker 2: A call from Missus Hellman of Reno, Nevada, asking mister
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: Novelle to call Missus Francie. A call from Missus Francie,
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 2: call from mister Gabriel. Call from Missus Francie. He calls
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 2: Amy Helmuth and let her know that she was to
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 2: call Joe Caperro. A call from mister Gabriel again, another
• 1:14:26
  Speaker 2: are a meeting with mister Cork in Washington and the
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 2: phone numbers left. A call from mister Wallace from American
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: Aircraft in Washington, UH. Two calls actually. Another call from
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 2: mister Williams of a Huntington National Bank in Ohio. A
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 2: call from Amy Hellman Reno. Another call from mister Wallace
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 2: from the spy shop in Washington, h h An FBI
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: report or mister Logan Calls. An FBI report of MA
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: eleven sixty seven says that a source of the bureau's
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 2: New Orleans office was in contact with the landlady who
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 2: told Andrew Schiambra, an investigator for Garrison, that William Wayne
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 2: Dozel had been placed in contact with the CIA and
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 2: the New Orleans man named Logan by a former district
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 2: attorney named Grady Durham, according to Rampart's magazine, who was
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: linked to a group called the Friends of Democratic Cuba.
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: But you get the idea, folks, So it says here
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: at the end of it, and this is from us
• 1:15:34
  Speaker 2: Donovan Pratt, who was dc CI RNA whatever that is.
• 1:15:45
  Speaker 2: Novelle's motives remain obscure. As was reported earlier, there is
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 2: a clear possibility that he remained in ally of Garrison
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 2: after their seeming antagonism developed. If so, his efforts to
• 1:15:57
  Speaker 2: link himself publicly with the CIA could be part of
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 2: Garrison's attack upon the agency. This theory would also explain
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 2: Novelle's relationship to Garrison crony like Willard Robertson. Another possibility
• 1:16:09
  Speaker 2: is that the few to genuine Novelle has made very
• 1:16:12
  Speaker 2: strong accusations against Garrison in major radio broadcasts. These include
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 2: charges of occasional homosexuality, which those allegations did come out
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 2: in the early seventies. I mean, he's like a fortune teller, folks,
• 1:16:31
  Speaker 2: you know, he says things that tend to come true,
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 2: like him or not. And possible direct involvement in the
• 1:16:41
  Speaker 2: alleged murder of David Ferry. Ms Marilli formed a clear
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 2: impression that Nevelle's dislike of Garrison is genuine. If so,
• 1:16:48
  Speaker 2: his Protestant attempts to link himself to the CIA may
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 2: be part of a campaign to create for international dynamics
• 1:16:55
  Speaker 2: corporation and aura of prestige as a result of supposed
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 2: ties to the federal government. He listed the US Government
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 2: with Courtesy Associates as one of his clients. His relationship
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 2: to Willard Robertson might be explained by his repeated assertion
• 1:17:09
  Speaker 2: that he has a penetration in Garrison's entourage. And again
• 1:17:13
  Speaker 2: this is from internal CIA memorandum. M Let's see, I
• 1:17:25
  Speaker 2: know I'm happening like six barbers here and like I said,
• 1:17:27
  Speaker 2: but there's a lot to get through with this bullshit.
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 10: It's all good while you uh segue, let.
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 7: Me just go through a common or two. Yeah, Paul
• 1:17:39
  Speaker 7: Cummings said no link between Clean Towel and Fort Worth
• 1:17:43
  Speaker 7: and the laundry in New Orleans. And you know when
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 7: I said that, rop, I was like, Paul already looked
• 1:17:49
  Speaker 7: into that. I'm sure.
• 1:17:51
  Speaker 2: Probably what's up Timothy, We say yeah, yeah.
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 7: Yeah, he's one of my I already did that for
• 1:17:57
  Speaker 7: Tea Biz going through Shaw to get to Ferry. Well,
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 7: I wanted to actually comment on one of the claims
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 7: that Novelle said that you know, he saw it that
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 7: Garrison was directly responsible for Farry's death, which of course
• 1:18:19
  Speaker 7: is Garrison might have colored outside the lines.
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 10: I don't think he would have killed as potential star witness,
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 10: So that was an interesting one to me. T Busy
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 10: said before I left. Nice Paul, he's never seen that
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 10: clip before.
• 1:18:40
  Speaker 2: Joe. You could look at it like this, if David
• 1:18:45
  Speaker 2: Ferry refused to implicate either himself or others that he knew,
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 2: like if he refused to talk, and he blatantly refused
• 1:18:56
  Speaker 2: to talk, Garrison might have said, well, if David Ferries did,
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 2: he could blame him for anything then he wanted, which
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 2: he ended up doing see what I'm saying, because dead
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 2: men don't talk.
• 1:19:11
  Speaker 7: Yeah, uh yeah, But I was gonna say even if
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 7: he was wasn't directly related, I think he was probably
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 7: indirectly related.
• 1:19:24
  Speaker 10: That's where I kind of land where his his uh,
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 10: his focus on Faery might have got him whacked by.
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 2: Whoever, right, possibly, I mean, there's a there's a million scenarios,
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 2: right right.
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 7: I land on more indirect but you never know, of course.
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 7: And yeah, hello, hello, Tim, you're late as usual in Philadelphia.
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 2: That is Garrison's investigators, I believe were didn't they interview him,
• 1:19:58
  Speaker 2: like the night before he died? They were there, yeah,
• 1:20:03
  Speaker 2: right before. I don't know what if Garrison was there
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 2: and they lifted.
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 7: Out Orson was seen leaving and Novell blamed him.
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 2: For it, yeah, or his investigators called and said, look, Jimmy,
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 2: got come over here quick.
• 1:20:19
  Speaker 7: I mean, the problem is we see the contempt that
• 1:20:22
  Speaker 7: Novell had for Garrison at the time, right at the
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 7: time of the document. So it's hard.
• 1:20:27
  Speaker 10: To to take any of that at face value.
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 2: And it's hard to explain the contempt when we'll we'll
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: see here in a matter of a couple of years
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 2: he hires Jim Garrison to be his lawyer. Yeah, but
• 1:20:41
  Speaker 2: we'll get there. I promise it's.
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 7: Ups down, down as up. Sally did ask and I unstarted.
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 7: She asked, was Novell rich? Or am I missing something?
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 7: Or was he blessed? Novell had money. He wasn't the
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 7: normal New Orleans drifters that were used to like hustling
• 1:21:00
  Speaker 7: to make ends meet. He was buying properties like the
• 1:21:04
  Speaker 7: place in Homa. And by the way, Rob Paula did
• 1:21:07
  Speaker 7: correct us, it's home and you a u h home Uh.
• 1:21:15
  Speaker 2: Homa Homa, Yes, a lot of homes and Homo.
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 7: Yes. I had a girlfriend from there in high school.
• 1:21:25
  Speaker 7: Ironically we met on a trip to d C of
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 7: all places, and uh potential.
• 1:21:31
  Speaker 2: I'm banged the ticket. High school from Lake Charles, Louisiana
• 1:21:35
  Speaker 2: later went on to be in a Playboy magazine whoa
• 1:21:42
  Speaker 2: Girls next Door?
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 10: Crushing it? I can't claim that perfessional perpetual concepts came
• 1:21:51
  Speaker 10: in a little lake. Can I get a Mulligan Joe
• 1:21:53
  Speaker 10: by or two? You can get to two Mulligan's and
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 10: rob My plate golf yesterday, That's what he's referring to.
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 10: The first shot.
• 1:22:01
  Speaker 7: I had was absolutely horrible, and I said, so I
• 1:22:05
  Speaker 7: thought I thought of PC when I did that. So yes,
• 1:22:08
  Speaker 7: you can get at least two.
• 1:22:11
  Speaker 2: That is that, sir, All right? Moving along, we had
• 1:22:14
  Speaker 2: FBI document from July sixteenth, nineteen sixty nine, Joe. And
• 1:22:22
  Speaker 2: this results from a letter I guess, maybe some kind
• 1:22:33
  Speaker 2: of a legal letter to the FBI concerning I guess
• 1:22:42
  Speaker 2: claims that Novelle made, and it says that we would
• 1:22:46
  Speaker 2: therefore appreciate have an opportunity to depose agents Chase and Bombardier.
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 2: The enclosed transcript contains lengthy passages which do not relate
• 1:22:57
  Speaker 2: directly to the FBI. A reading of such passages is necessary, however,
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 2: in order to place Novell's claims concerning the Bureau in
• 1:23:04
  Speaker 2: proper perspective. The testimony herewith transmitted maybe summarized as follows.
• 1:23:10
  Speaker 2: Novelle claimed privilege under the National Security Act of nineteen
• 1:23:13
  Speaker 2: forty seven with respect to certain categories of documents which
• 1:23:16
  Speaker 2: he had been asked to produce. He also claimed that
• 1:23:19
  Speaker 2: under the National Security Act that he would not answer
• 1:23:21
  Speaker 2: questions with respect to his knowledge of karate, a matter
• 1:23:25
  Speaker 2: which arose by reason of his testimony concerning a street
• 1:23:27
  Speaker 2: brawl he claimed such privilege with respect to weapons training
• 1:23:31
  Speaker 2: as well. He declined to answer any questions concerning his
• 1:23:34
  Speaker 2: involvement in governmental intelligence activities. After day and a half
• 1:23:38
  Speaker 2: of testimony had been taken, and after he had been
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 2: admonished that we would seek an order compelling him to
• 1:23:44
  Speaker 2: answer the questions as to which he had claimed a
• 1:23:47
  Speaker 2: privilege of secrecy, Novell appeared in our office for the
• 1:23:50
  Speaker 2: next session of his deposition and announced that he was
• 1:23:53
  Speaker 2: dropping the claim of privilege. He then began to answer
• 1:23:57
  Speaker 2: a series of questions relating to his nineteen sixty one activity.
• 1:24:00
  Speaker 2: He described how he had become involved with the c
• 1:24:06
  Speaker 2: Huban Democratic Revolutionary Front and its president, Sergeio Akasha Smith.
• 1:24:11
  Speaker 2: He described his work with the Front with mister Guy Banister,
• 1:24:15
  Speaker 2: formerly of the FBI, and a mister Phillips, whom he
• 1:24:19
  Speaker 2: took to be a representative of the governmental security or
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 2: the intelligence agency. Mister Phillips Joe.
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 7: Yes, possibly on David to the athlete.
• 1:24:33
  Speaker 2: Possibly. He testified that under the auspices of the Front,
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 2: he had been trained in Karate, Sabbat and Judo Joe
• 1:24:43
  Speaker 2: the Deadly Asian arts.
• 1:24:46
  Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, Rob, I find.
• 1:24:48
  Speaker 10: It really weird that he claims that that intelligence act
• 1:24:54
  Speaker 10: of whatever it was to cover up his karate training active.
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 2: It's bizarre, some top secret shit, Joe.
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 7: But how do you even know of that? I mean its.
• 1:25:10
  Speaker 2: Novelle described his deepening involvement in the activities of the Front,
• 1:25:14
  Speaker 2: how he had supplied names of other people having anti
• 1:25:16
  Speaker 2: Castrist sentiments, discussed the recruiting of professional divers and demolition
• 1:25:22
  Speaker 2: experts assistant in finding storage space, storage space and poisons,
• 1:25:27
  Speaker 2: and how he came to believe that he himself was
• 1:25:29
  Speaker 2: under surveillance by people from quote counter intelligence. Novelle continued
• 1:25:35
  Speaker 2: to attend karate classes and do odd jobs for the
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 2: Front from late sixty until late sixty one. All activities
• 1:25:42
  Speaker 2: were conducted in a secret manner as possible. He became
• 1:25:45
  Speaker 2: convinced that he was part of a vast federal government operation.
• 1:25:49
  Speaker 2: He testified a great lengths concerning the organization and execution
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 2: of the trip to Huma Homa, Louisiana for the purpose
• 1:25:58
  Speaker 2: of removing munitions destined for use in the Bay of Pigs.
• 1:26:01
  Speaker 2: He received a five hundred dollars bill, Joe, which are
• 1:26:05
  Speaker 2: very rare these days, by.
• 1:26:06
  Speaker 7: The way, worth a lot more than five.
• 1:26:09
  Speaker 2: Hundred for his part in the matter, cashed it and
• 1:26:12
  Speaker 2: split the proceeds with a friend. These activities, he testified,
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 2: were the basis for the claim of privilege which he
• 1:26:19
  Speaker 2: had made.
• 1:26:20
  Speaker 7: Hopefully he split the bill physically.
• 1:26:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Novelle also commented upon, and in part corroborated, a
• 1:26:27
  Speaker 2: statement concerning the same matters which a friend of his
• 1:26:30
  Speaker 2: had given to District Attorney Garrison. Novelle filed no income
• 1:26:35
  Speaker 2: tax returns personal or corporate for the years nineteen fifty
• 1:26:39
  Speaker 2: eight through nineteen sixty eight.
• 1:26:44
  Speaker 7: A long time.
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 2: That's a long time not to work. So dude had
• 1:26:48
  Speaker 2: money or was obtaining it illegally or under the table
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 2: or clandestinely. He claims to have tape recordings proving that
• 1:26:59
  Speaker 2: he was once employed by Garrison, but he has never
• 1:27:02
  Speaker 2: produced them. He also claims the documentation of his relationship
• 1:27:06
  Speaker 2: with Garrison may be found in the files of attorneys
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 2: who have represented him. Novelle claims that he gave a
• 1:27:12
  Speaker 2: tape recording of a conversation between Garrison and himself to
• 1:27:14
  Speaker 2: the FBI. The subject of the alleged conversation was a
• 1:27:18
  Speaker 2: plan to frame some FBI agents. His FBI contacts were
• 1:27:22
  Speaker 2: mister Bombadier and agent Chase. He asked about the nature
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 2: of the relationship with the Bureau, and he stated the
• 1:27:28
  Speaker 2: FBI occasionally worked for me. In nineteen sixty seven, the
• 1:27:35
  Speaker 2: press reported that a document had been found in Novelle's
• 1:27:37
  Speaker 2: former apartment addressed to a mister Weiss. In it, Novell
• 1:27:42
  Speaker 2: sought help in evading a grand jury subpoena claim to
• 1:27:45
  Speaker 2: have lied to the FBI about CIA matters. YadA, YadA, yadah.
• 1:27:49
  Speaker 2: We already talked about this. Novell claims it was standard
• 1:27:53
  Speaker 2: operational procedure to lie to the FBI about CIA activities,
• 1:27:58
  Speaker 2: that he was associated with the Sea, and that he believed,
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 2: at the time he participated in the Homa munitionis transfer,
• 1:28:07
  Speaker 2: that he was playing a part in a government operation.
• 1:28:11
  Speaker 2: Novelle talked to the FBI about the Mafia in nineteen
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 2: sixty six under a reciprocal trade agreement. The Bureau furnished
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 2: him with information useful in his personal business dealings, and
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 2: he gave the FBI information concerning the mafia and political
• 1:28:27
  Speaker 2: groups in Louisiana. In exchange, Garrison asked Novell to become
• 1:28:34
  Speaker 2: his quote chief of security. The two had lengthy conference
• 1:28:37
  Speaker 2: in which Novell advised Garrison how he might frustrate efforts
• 1:28:40
  Speaker 2: by the FBI to tap his phones and by the
• 1:28:43
  Speaker 2: CIA to infiltrate his staff, which they did. Despite misgivings
• 1:28:49
  Speaker 2: over Garrison's alleged proposals, Novelle agreed to perform services for
• 1:28:53
  Speaker 2: Garrison when the latter promised him generous compensation. Joe, despite
• 1:29:00
  Speaker 2: miss Gibbs, I'm sorry, Garrison told Novelle. A man named
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 2: Tracy Barnes was quote in charge of the cover up
• 1:29:07
  Speaker 2: for the CIA during the Warren Report. There's an interesting
• 1:29:12
  Speaker 2: name to come out in the sixties, wasn't it.
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 7: Yeah, we haven't talked about him in a while.
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 2: A New Orleans policeman asked Novelle if he knew anyone
• 1:29:20
  Speaker 2: who could get him an interview with the CIA, and
• 1:29:22
  Speaker 2: whether Novelle was working for the FBI to bug Garrison.
• 1:29:29
  Speaker 2: After his lengthy meeting with Garrison in February of sixty seven,
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 2: Novelle returned home and it quote looked like an armada
• 1:29:36
  Speaker 2: of FBI agents were waiting for him there. Roger Bombadier
• 1:29:41
  Speaker 2: and Peter Chase were among those present as FBI agents.
• 1:29:45
  Speaker 2: A number of the agents went upstairs with him to
• 1:29:47
  Speaker 2: his apartment. He told them about his conversation with Garrison.
• 1:29:52
  Speaker 2: There were a number of messages accumulated on his answering machine.
• 1:29:56
  Speaker 2: I had contact with a French news service that was
• 1:29:59
  Speaker 2: in town, and they wanted to buy some of my
• 1:30:01
  Speaker 2: electronic surveillance equipment. And I had, oh Christ, everybody in
• 1:30:05
  Speaker 2: town wanted to buy my bugs. He didn't call anyone
• 1:30:09
  Speaker 2: back while the FBI was there. I may be friendly
• 1:30:11
  Speaker 2: with them, but they don't fool with my broads, and
• 1:30:15
  Speaker 2: they don't fool with my business. According to Novelle, he
• 1:30:21
  Speaker 2: did not tell the FBI that he was going to
• 1:30:23
  Speaker 2: consider continuing to work for Garrison. He asked the FBI
• 1:30:27
  Speaker 2: agents to check their files concerning the nineteen sixty one
• 1:30:30
  Speaker 2: munitions transfer.
• 1:30:33
  Speaker 10: YadA, YadA, YadA, Rob there is no record of him
• 1:30:41
  Speaker 10: ever working for Garrison.
• 1:30:42
  Speaker 7: Is there.
• 1:30:47
  Speaker 2: No? Garrison denies it. I get along with them pretty good.
• 1:30:55
  Speaker 2: The agents told him that the Homa munitions trains had
• 1:31:00
  Speaker 2: been a CIA operation. They asked him a number of
• 1:31:03
  Speaker 2: questions about Double Check Corporation about the munitions. He did
• 1:31:07
  Speaker 2: not tell them about Banister or Smith quote. A guy
• 1:31:11
  Speaker 2: from Washington did most of the questioning. The Bureau had
• 1:31:14
  Speaker 2: nothing in their files relative to the munition's transfer. That
• 1:31:20
  Speaker 2: On May eight sixty nine, Novelle placed the telephone call
• 1:31:23
  Speaker 2: to the CIA and spoke to a mister Joseph Goodwin.
• 1:31:27
  Speaker 2: He had previously called the CIA's legal department two months
• 1:31:29
  Speaker 2: before Before that he had a number of telephone conversations
• 1:31:34
  Speaker 2: with Alan Dulles. He had also sent telegrams to mister Helms.
• 1:31:43
  Speaker 2: Whenever Garrison attempted to connect him with the CIA, Novelle
• 1:31:46
  Speaker 2: would send the CIA telegram. The telephone call, which he
• 1:31:50
  Speaker 2: made approximately two months prior to May eight sixty nine,
• 1:31:53
  Speaker 2: involved an effort on Novell's part to get a statement
• 1:31:55
  Speaker 2: from the CIA that he had never worked for them.
• 1:31:58
  Speaker 2: Since the home munitions transfer was obviously a CIA operation,
• 1:32:03
  Speaker 2: it was a secret which would come under the National
• 1:32:06
  Speaker 2: Security Act of nineteen forty seven. But Garrison, or however,
• 1:32:11
  Speaker 2: since the CIA would not give him the statement he requested,
• 1:32:13
  Speaker 2: he advised that he was going to drop his claim
• 1:32:15
  Speaker 2: of privilege, and mister Goodwin told him to go ahead
• 1:32:18
  Speaker 2: and testify. Noville did apply in nineteen sixty seven Joe
• 1:32:24
  Speaker 2: for employment with the CIA, not because he wanted employment,
• 1:32:29
  Speaker 2: but because he wanted to be able to prove that
• 1:32:31
  Speaker 2: he was not a CIA employee already, although there's a
• 1:32:37
  Speaker 2: little bit of a difference between being an official CIA
• 1:32:41
  Speaker 2: employee and being a CIA asset being paid through shell
• 1:32:47
  Speaker 2: companies like double Check right, for which the CIA could
• 1:32:53
  Speaker 2: have plausible deniability. Well, we don't pay this guy this
• 1:32:58
  Speaker 2: other company and double Check whatever that is is, you know.
• 1:33:02
  Speaker 7: There's a difference between that.
• 1:33:03
  Speaker 10: Yeah, they only acknowledge the asset of agents.
• 1:33:08
  Speaker 7: They really have to.
• 1:33:10
  Speaker 2: But get this. Dean Andrews here we go again introduced
• 1:33:18
  Speaker 2: Gordon Novell to Walter Sheridan, who was doing the investigative
• 1:33:22
  Speaker 2: work for NBC's white Paper Unit report on Garrison. Sheridan
• 1:33:27
  Speaker 2: told him that the FBI I thought Garrison was a fraud,
• 1:33:30
  Speaker 2: and he told Sheraton what he had told the FBI.
• 1:33:34
  Speaker 2: Shereton then asked Novell whether Novell would like to be
• 1:33:37
  Speaker 2: Sheridan's chief of security while he performed similar duties for Garrison,
• 1:33:41
  Speaker 2: and Novelle accepted. Novelle told Sheridan things he had not
• 1:33:45
  Speaker 2: told the FBI or Garrison. He did investigative work for. Sheridan,
• 1:33:49
  Speaker 2: located Layton Martin's and attempted to find a laundry truck
• 1:33:52
  Speaker 2: which figured into Garrison's investigation. Novidepe volunteered that Sheridan never
• 1:33:57
  Speaker 2: asked him to bug Garrison. The FBI thought that he
• 1:34:01
  Speaker 2: might be bugging his conversations with them, but he did not.
• 1:34:05
  Speaker 2: Everybody thought that he carried out bugging operations, but he
• 1:34:09
  Speaker 2: claims merely to have been a dealer in the equipment
• 1:34:11
  Speaker 2: and an expert in the field, not an actual doing
• 1:34:16
  Speaker 2: the bugging guy right. He did attempt to transmit from
• 1:34:20
  Speaker 2: a portable radio apparatus communications he had with Garrison and
• 1:34:24
  Speaker 2: his staff at a meeting in Garrison's office, but the
• 1:34:26
  Speaker 2: effort failed. He discussed with Garrison and his staff security
• 1:34:30
  Speaker 2: measures which should be imposed to safeguard the secrecy of
• 1:34:33
  Speaker 2: their investigation. He was asked if he had been approached
• 1:34:37
  Speaker 2: by the FBI, and Novelle told Garrison and his staff
• 1:34:39
  Speaker 2: that he was still friendly with them, and almost got
• 1:34:42
  Speaker 2: into a physical altercation with William Gervich. He was told
• 1:34:46
  Speaker 2: to break off his friendship with FBI agents. Now at
• 1:34:50
  Speaker 2: this point, Joe, I'm going to put up a picture, okay,
• 1:34:55
  Speaker 2: since we're talking about radio communications and electronic wizardry and
• 1:34:59
  Speaker 2: all this happy horse shit. Right now, of all the
• 1:35:05
  Speaker 2: pictures Joe of Umberella Man taken in Daly Plaza and
• 1:35:11
  Speaker 2: who it could possibly be, right, We don't think it
• 1:35:14
  Speaker 2: was Louis Witt, that's for sure. But one of the
• 1:35:19
  Speaker 2: most convincing comparisons that I've ever seen to Umbrella Man
• 1:35:26
  Speaker 2: actually is Gordon Novelle. Look at this shit, Joe. I
• 1:35:33
  Speaker 2: know it's a little bit of a fuzzy picture on
• 1:35:35
  Speaker 2: the right, and we've all seen a clearer picture. You
• 1:35:37
  Speaker 2: get the picture right.
• 1:35:41
  Speaker 7: It's there's a likeness for sure.
• 1:35:43
  Speaker 2: It's yeah, you know, you can say it's Jerry Buchanan,
• 1:35:50
  Speaker 2: or you can say it's Roy Hargraves. But to me,
• 1:35:54
  Speaker 2: the closest resemblance to Umbrella Man is Gordon. He's got
• 1:36:03
  Speaker 2: the high forehead, the low ear, the pointy nose, the
• 1:36:07
  Speaker 2: strong jawline, sunken eye. I don't know, man, it's pretty
• 1:36:15
  Speaker 2: fucking uncanny, and Novelle, being an electronics expert, could have
• 1:36:21
  Speaker 2: provided the you know, radio communications for that day. I'm
• 1:36:29
  Speaker 2: just saying it's an interesting thing to think about.
• 1:36:37
  Speaker 7: It definitely is. And although he's definitely not my leading
• 1:36:41
  Speaker 7: suspect for sure, maybe.
• 1:36:43
  Speaker 10: Not my top whatever, five, top five, top ten, you
• 1:36:48
  Speaker 10: can't deny that picture that you just showed.
• 1:36:52
  Speaker 7: His likeness right.
• 1:36:54
  Speaker 2: To me, that's the most convincing likeness to likeness that
• 1:36:59
  Speaker 2: I've ever seen. You can say, you know, it might
• 1:37:01
  Speaker 2: be this guy, might be that guy, but when it
• 1:37:04
  Speaker 2: comes down to strictly compared comparing likenesses, this is a
• 1:37:10
  Speaker 2: strong one to me. M I don't know who knows.
• 1:37:21
  Speaker 2: Continuing on here, Uh, and we're almost I'm almost done, Joe,
• 1:37:24
  Speaker 2: I don't worry.
• 1:37:25
  Speaker 7: I'm loving it.
• 1:37:28
  Speaker 2: Uh, let's see. A Louisiana state trooper asked Novelle to
• 1:37:35
  Speaker 2: lend him a miniature tape recorder. Novelle told him that
• 1:37:39
  Speaker 2: all of his equipment was in use. Novelle has made
• 1:37:41
  Speaker 2: many tapes and continues to do so. The state trooper
• 1:37:45
  Speaker 2: had borrowed bugs from Novelle in the past, and on
• 1:37:47
  Speaker 2: one occasion, Novelle had installed a bug in the state
• 1:37:49
  Speaker 2: trooper's bedroom so that the latter might try to catch
• 1:37:52
  Speaker 2: his wife cheating. Novelle denies that he told the state
• 1:37:56
  Speaker 2: trooper that he Novelle knew a number of people mentioned
• 1:37:59
  Speaker 2: by Garrison at the time they were being investigated by
• 1:38:02
  Speaker 2: the CIA and the FBI. Novella alleges that he sent
• 1:38:06
  Speaker 2: copies of his communications to Garrison, to the FBI and
• 1:38:09
  Speaker 2: the CIA, And we hope that upon review of this transcript,
• 1:38:13
  Speaker 2: you will agree to make misters Chase and Bombadier available
• 1:38:16
  Speaker 2: to us for depositions in the cities of their residents.
• 1:38:20
  Speaker 2: Very truly, yours, Lawyers Devaux, Shuder, Mikvah and Plotkin. So
• 1:38:29
  Speaker 2: apparently this is some kind of a legal deposition thing
• 1:38:36
  Speaker 2: that Novelle was deposed and those were his answers, and
• 1:38:39
  Speaker 2: he implicated specific FBI agents right that they wanted to
• 1:38:45
  Speaker 2: talk to.
• 1:38:46
  Speaker 7: Yeah, he wasn't afraid to use litigation and him assuing people.
• 1:38:53
  Speaker 7: And obviously what you're saying, deposition is punishable by perjury.
• 1:39:00
  Speaker 10: Yeah, not saying you're telling the truth, but that the
• 1:39:03
  Speaker 10: States are a role Risen rose higher higher.
• 1:39:09
  Speaker 2: There we go. All right, let's fast forward a bit
• 1:39:15
  Speaker 2: into the seventies. We jumped to nineteen and seventy six
• 1:39:19
  Speaker 2: Joe another federal FBI document d OJ New Orleans, Louisiana,
• 1:39:26
  Speaker 2: concerning the assassination of President Kennedy. On November twentieth, nineteen
• 1:39:32
  Speaker 2: seventy six, an individual who described himself as Frank Bartees
• 1:39:35
  Speaker 2: contacted the New Orleans office of the FBI. Excuse me.
• 1:39:40
  Speaker 2: He described himself as a former anti Castro activist who
• 1:39:43
  Speaker 2: has cooperated with the FBI in the past. Wink wink.
• 1:39:47
  Speaker 2: If you know what I'm saying, he's a dirty rat. Uh.
• 1:39:53
  Speaker 2: He currently resides in Tabany in Metie, Louisiana Blah blah
• 1:39:57
  Speaker 2: blah and furnish the following information. During the Batista regime
• 1:40:01
  Speaker 2: in Cuba and until Fidel Castro declared himself in his
• 1:40:04
  Speaker 2: government as Communists in nineteen sixty, Bartes was the president
• 1:40:08
  Speaker 2: and chief shareholder of the Western Consolidated Railroad in Cuba.
• 1:40:13
  Speaker 2: This particular railroad essentially constituted all railroads in the western
• 1:40:17
  Speaker 2: half of the island of Cuba. The eastern half as
• 1:40:20
  Speaker 2: a railroad operation, was nationalized by Batista in nineteen fifty three.
• 1:40:25
  Speaker 2: When Castro came to power, Bartes's counterpart for Cuba's eastern
• 1:40:29
  Speaker 2: railroad was Raoul Chivas. In October fifty nine, Chivas and
• 1:40:35
  Speaker 2: Bartes were conferring about mutual railroad concerns. During this conference,
• 1:40:40
  Speaker 2: news arrived of the disappearance of Camillo Sian Fuegos, one
• 1:40:45
  Speaker 2: of the three powers in Cuba, with Castro at the time,
• 1:40:49
  Speaker 2: sing Fuegos had disappeared on a flight and a massive
• 1:40:51
  Speaker 2: effort to locate him was being generated. Bartes stated that
• 1:40:55
  Speaker 2: he wished he could do something to assist in that search,
• 1:40:58
  Speaker 2: to which Chivas replied that Bartes with his private plane
• 1:41:02
  Speaker 2: would certainly be welcome and that Chievas would attempt to
• 1:41:05
  Speaker 2: obtain a permit for Bartes's flying in Cuba. The next day,
• 1:41:11
  Speaker 2: Bartes with flying permit and Chivas flew in Bartes's plane
• 1:41:15
  Speaker 2: from Havana to Kama guy to join the search. At
• 1:41:19
  Speaker 2: the Camagui airport, Bartes landed with moments of within moments
• 1:41:24
  Speaker 2: of Fidel Castro's plane, and Chivas introduced Bartes to Fidel.
• 1:41:29
  Speaker 2: They all spoke for several moments together, and it was
• 1:41:32
  Speaker 2: during this conversation dealt with the only problem in hand,
• 1:41:34
  Speaker 2: which was the search for seeing Fuegos. So blah blah
• 1:41:38
  Speaker 2: blah blah blah right buck. In nineteen seventy five, Gordon
• 1:41:44
  Speaker 2: Novell was introduced to Bartes in New Orleans by a
• 1:41:47
  Speaker 2: mutual acquaintance. Novell apparently had been told that Bartes, with
• 1:41:51
  Speaker 2: his anti Castro reputation and contacts, would possibly know of
• 1:41:55
  Speaker 2: anti Castro activists who might want to buy weapons. Bartes
• 1:41:59
  Speaker 2: met novel at Mason's Restaurant in the summer of nineteen
• 1:42:03
  Speaker 2: seventy five, where novel displayed for Bartes an extensive array
• 1:42:08
  Speaker 2: of all kinds of weapons, including conventional firearms, electronic equipment,
• 1:42:12
  Speaker 2: and even tanks and aircraft. Novell asked Bartes if he
• 1:42:17
  Speaker 2: knew of any buyers of such material, and Bartes said no,
• 1:42:21
  Speaker 2: that he did not know of anyone interested in purchasing
• 1:42:24
  Speaker 2: such weapons, but if he did, he would recontact Novell.
• 1:42:30
  Speaker 2: Bartes can remember, incidentally, that Novelle stated that delivery of
• 1:42:34
  Speaker 2: all portable material purchased would be made in international waters,
• 1:42:39
  Speaker 2: but that if someone purchased an aircraft or tank, that
• 1:42:45
  Speaker 2: require the possibly bribed corporation cooperation of a Central American
• 1:42:50
  Speaker 2: country in which to make the deal. Bartes also mentioned
• 1:42:55
  Speaker 2: to Novelle that he was looking for a job, and
• 1:42:57
  Speaker 2: in response, Novelle said he would try to assist him
• 1:42:59
  Speaker 2: in finding one. However, Bartes did not hear from Novelle
• 1:43:03
  Speaker 2: until about June of seventy six, when Novelle asked for
• 1:43:07
  Speaker 2: another meeting with him, and they were Bartes was at
• 1:43:09
  Speaker 2: that time distracted by a family problem, Novelle did drop
• 1:43:12
  Speaker 2: by his house. During that discussion, Novelle stated that the
• 1:43:17
  Speaker 2: assassination investigation of President Kennedy was to be reopened by
• 1:43:22
  Speaker 2: Congress at that time. Novelle did not state any further
• 1:43:26
  Speaker 2: details about a reopening of that investigation, but he did
• 1:43:29
  Speaker 2: arouse Bartes's interest. Bartes later saw on media covers that
• 1:43:34
  Speaker 2: Novelle was correct in his statement, and this led Bartes
• 1:43:36
  Speaker 2: to believe that Novelle had contacts in Washington. So apparently,
• 1:43:42
  Speaker 2: before it was known to the public, Novelle knew that
• 1:43:46
  Speaker 2: the HSCA was coming. And then in the summer of
• 1:43:51
  Speaker 2: seventy six, Bartes learned through the New Orleans media of
• 1:43:57
  Speaker 2: the prosecution of Novelle and his partner John Lane on
• 1:44:00
  Speaker 2: charges of aggravated arson involving a plot to firebomb downtown
• 1:44:08
  Speaker 2: New Orleans Central Business District one Marty Gras Day in
• 1:44:12
  Speaker 2: nineteen seventy six. Now these are big charges, right, So
• 1:44:18
  Speaker 2: apparently Noville and his buddy are being arrested on charges
• 1:44:25
  Speaker 2: that they were going to firebomb the Marti Gras Parade
• 1:44:29
  Speaker 2: in downtown New Orleans.
• 1:44:32
  Speaker 14: Yeah, yeah, he did a trial for that.
• 1:44:38
  Speaker 2: I believe yeah, yeah, this is when he hires Garrison
• 1:44:41
  Speaker 2: as his lawyer. Let's see.
• 1:44:50
  Speaker 7: And Bartes, by the way, Rob was I'm not sure
• 1:44:55
  Speaker 7: if he was arrested in the fracas, but I know
• 1:44:58
  Speaker 7: he was definitely in the court with the other Cuban
• 1:45:03
  Speaker 7: exiles Brinia and stuff. And I remember David Boylan saying
• 1:45:10
  Speaker 7: that all of them were either FBI or CI informants
• 1:45:14
  Speaker 7: or assets or agents, and I think Bartes was an
• 1:45:19
  Speaker 7: FBI one, that's almost I just can't remember which agency,
• 1:45:23
  Speaker 7: but interesting he's talking about him there.
• 1:45:28
  Speaker 2: So during that discussion, Novelle asked Bartes if he had
• 1:45:31
  Speaker 2: ever met Castro, and Bartes replied that he had, and
• 1:45:34
  Speaker 2: in response to Novell's requests for proof, he displayed to
• 1:45:37
  Speaker 2: Novelle photograph taken at the Kamagoui Airport conversation in November
• 1:45:42
  Speaker 2: or I'm sorry, October fifty nine. Bartes maintained a scrap
• 1:45:46
  Speaker 2: book which contained several of these photographs, including the one
• 1:45:49
  Speaker 2: that was published in Bohemia magazine. During that discussion, Novell
• 1:45:53
  Speaker 2: was greatly interested in the photograph. He asked Bartes if
• 1:45:56
  Speaker 2: it will be possible to superimpose the head of Lee
• 1:45:58
  Speaker 2: Harvey Oswald on of one of the persons in that
• 1:46:01
  Speaker 2: photograph to make it appear that Oswald was at that
• 1:46:04
  Speaker 2: same conference with Castro in nineteen fifty nine. Bartes, who
• 1:46:08
  Speaker 2: was an amateur photographer, said that that would be ridiculous,
• 1:46:12
  Speaker 2: that it would be extremely difficult to do so and
• 1:46:15
  Speaker 2: make it appear to be a real photograph, and even
• 1:46:18
  Speaker 2: though it would not stand professional scrutiny. Then, Bartest stated
• 1:46:22
  Speaker 2: that the only other way to accomplish the same goal
• 1:46:24
  Speaker 2: wuld be to try to find someone in the photograph
• 1:46:27
  Speaker 2: who bore a resemblance to either Oswald or Ruby. With
• 1:46:31
  Speaker 2: that suggestion, novel Novelle carefully examined the photograph, then pointed
• 1:46:36
  Speaker 2: out one face on the right hand edge of the
• 1:46:38
  Speaker 2: exposure and asked Bartes if he recognized them. Novelle said
• 1:46:43
  Speaker 2: that this guy looks like Clay Shaw. Bartes said that
• 1:46:46
  Speaker 2: such a resemblance was doubtful, and that's such an example
• 1:46:49
  Speaker 2: of why he hadn't mine to raise a doubt in
• 1:46:51
  Speaker 2: public mind. Bartes stated that he had never met Clay Shaw,
• 1:46:54
  Speaker 2: but remembered Shaw as the individual prosecuted by Jim Garrison.
• 1:46:58
  Speaker 2: Blah blah blah. So they go on and on about
• 1:47:04
  Speaker 2: trying to fake this photograph. Right. Gordon Dwayne Novell is
• 1:47:12
  Speaker 2: known to the New Orleans office of the FBI as
• 1:47:14
  Speaker 2: an individual representing morning Star Associates with supposed connections to
• 1:47:19
  Speaker 2: the Central Intelligence Agency. Now to rewind just a cooney
• 1:47:27
  Speaker 2: hair to go back to when Novelle was meeting with
• 1:47:33
  Speaker 2: people in New Orleans at the CIA office in New Orleans,
• 1:47:36
  Speaker 2: he was proposing to them a project that he came
• 1:47:41
  Speaker 2: up with called Project morning Star Right, which was basically
• 1:47:48
  Speaker 2: taking a modern day battleship much like the USS Liberty right,
• 1:48:00
  Speaker 2: outfitting it with all of the latest weapons technology available
• 1:48:06
  Speaker 2: in the world, from guns, lasers, equipment, the whole nine yards, munitions, guns,
• 1:48:18
  Speaker 2: and sailing it around the world to sell to prospective buyers.
• 1:48:29
  Speaker 7: Sounds like a grift.
• 1:48:31
  Speaker 2: You think he wanted the CIA to fund this.
• 1:48:39
  Speaker 7: I imagine the officer that did that interview, it was like, yeah,
• 1:48:42
  Speaker 7: it's a good idea, just like writing down, like rejected.
• 1:48:49
  Speaker 2: You can't make this stuff up.
• 1:48:53
  Speaker 7: He uh as, we'll see them a little bit. He
• 1:48:56
  Speaker 7: uh went off the reservation.
• 1:49:00
  Speaker 2: Just a little bit. So after all this horse's assery,
• 1:49:08
  Speaker 2: we have more horses assery. Gordon Novell fids a one
• 1:49:12
  Speaker 2: billion dollar damage suit in nineteen seventy seven. Gordon Novell,
• 1:49:20
  Speaker 2: who was tried in New Orleans on a conspiracy to
• 1:49:22
  Speaker 2: commit arson last year, filed a suit for one billion
• 1:49:25
  Speaker 2: dollars in federal court in Atlanta, Georgia, Wednesday against thirteen individuals,
• 1:49:30
  Speaker 2: including Orleans Parish District Attorney Harry Connick, businessman Joseph Calzarro
• 1:49:38
  Speaker 2: and Lester Kabakov, local CIA agent Peter Hoak, and un
• 1:49:44
  Speaker 2: Dingwall consultant for Louisiana Expo Incorporated. Novelle alleges in his
• 1:49:49
  Speaker 2: suit to knock certain CIA agents and others conspired in
• 1:49:53
  Speaker 2: prosecuting him in order to discredit his plan to locate
• 1:49:58
  Speaker 2: a nineteen eighty World's Fair in eastern New Orleans. Louisiana
• 1:50:03
  Speaker 2: Expo Inc Are planners of one hundred and twelve million
• 1:50:06
  Speaker 2: dollar project on the riverfront for the proposed fare. Novelle
• 1:50:11
  Speaker 2: charges in his suit that the rival plan to locate
• 1:50:13
  Speaker 2: the fare between the International Trademark and the Greater New
• 1:50:16
  Speaker 2: Orleans Bridge would benefit real estate holdings in league with Conic.
• 1:50:23
  Speaker 2: Novelle is asking for ten million in compensateor compensatory damages
• 1:50:28
  Speaker 2: from Conic fifty million from Canazaro, thirty five million from Kabakov,
• 1:50:33
  Speaker 2: seven million from Dingwall, and fifty million from Dietrich. Punitive
• 1:50:38
  Speaker 2: damages asked in the suit amount to one billion dollars
• 1:50:43
  Speaker 2: in nineteen seventy seven money Joe, that's a lot, Yes, Yes,
• 1:50:49
  Speaker 2: and compensatory damages totaling more than two hundred and fifty
• 1:50:54
  Speaker 2: million dollars. Novelle was charged with conspiracy to set fire
• 1:50:59
  Speaker 2: with the Federation of Churches building on Saint Charles Avenue
• 1:51:02
  Speaker 2: in Marti Gras or at Marti Graus in eineteen seventy six.
• 1:51:06
  Speaker 2: His trial ended with a hung jury and a mistrial declaration.
• 1:51:13
  Speaker 2: The focal point of his defense at that time was
• 1:51:15
  Speaker 2: a project Novelle called morning Star, a privately funded operation
• 1:51:20
  Speaker 2: to display military weapons and intelligence equipment to other countries
• 1:51:24
  Speaker 2: aboard a ship that Novell described in his testimony. The
• 1:51:29
  Speaker 2: prosecution presented taped recordings of discussions between the Novelle and
• 1:51:33
  Speaker 2: an undercover agent of plans to fire bomb the building.
• 1:51:39
  Speaker 2: Novelle's defense, led by former DA Jim Garrison, sought to
• 1:51:42
  Speaker 2: prove throughout the trial that Novell had been quote set
• 1:51:45
  Speaker 2: up by a federal undercover agent who Novelle thought was
• 1:51:49
  Speaker 2: attempting to infiltrate the project. Project morning Star, that is,
• 1:51:55
  Speaker 2: Novelle was scheduled to go on trial a second time
• 1:51:57
  Speaker 2: in January, but failed to sh show up. The Orleans
• 1:52:02
  Speaker 2: DA has since attempted to have Novelle reportedly now and
• 1:52:05
  Speaker 2: Georgia extradited back to Louisiana. Novelle attorney Reid Kennedy is
• 1:52:10
  Speaker 2: appealing at Georgia court ruling issued today that would allow
• 1:52:13
  Speaker 2: the extradition. But apparently that never happened, folks.
• 1:52:21
  Speaker 7: So he ran for the second time, right, he ran
• 1:52:23
  Speaker 7: after the Garrison, second Grand juris of poena, and now
• 1:52:27
  Speaker 7: that he's running after I have an article that says
• 1:52:32
  Speaker 7: this fourth trial. So after this third trial resulted in
• 1:52:36
  Speaker 7: a hung jury, he goes to Georgia this time and
• 1:52:40
  Speaker 7: they didn't extra ride him back.
• 1:52:43
  Speaker 2: Right, No, they did not. Shocker that Novelle knows just
• 1:52:49
  Speaker 2: where to go, much like Thomas Beckham, to not be
• 1:52:53
  Speaker 2: extradited packed two guys with alleged CIA ties. Folks can't
• 1:52:59
  Speaker 2: make the ship up. That is the good annualgy Sir grifters,
• 1:53:04
  Speaker 2: con mean hustlers. David Ferry, the anti cast of Cubans, Oswald, Beckham, Banister, Noville, Hidell,
• 1:53:23
  Speaker 2: Nate gil.
• 1:53:27
  Speaker 12: Hey.
• 1:53:32
  Speaker 2: But Neville's story doesn't end here. No, and it only
• 1:53:38
  Speaker 2: gets crazier. So strap in, folks, you're in for a
• 1:53:41
  Speaker 2: bumpy ride. Joe take it from here, brother.
• 1:53:44
  Speaker 10: Sure, sure, sure, So I'm going to get into the
• 1:53:47
  Speaker 10: a little bit of the crazy stuff.
• 1:53:48
  Speaker 7: But I have a couple of slides I want to show.
• 1:53:51
  Speaker 7: This is from a newspaper article. I believe it was
• 1:53:55
  Speaker 7: in sixty seven. Wait, Garrison was in the seventies, right
• 1:54:00
  Speaker 7: with him, seventy five, seventy six, seventy six.
• 1:54:03
  Speaker 10: So this is one of those court drawings where they
• 1:54:06
  Speaker 10: can't take pictures, where we have to sketch it.
• 1:54:08
  Speaker 7: Yeah, where is Garrison? Is he on the left of
• 1:54:11
  Speaker 7: the table, the left of the four people.
• 1:54:14
  Speaker 2: No, he's all the way on the right, the tall one.
• 1:54:16
  Speaker 10: Oh the okay, I mean yeah, all the way. I
• 1:54:20
  Speaker 10: think our things are inverted.
• 1:54:22
  Speaker 7: And and Novelle has the glasses right.
• 1:54:26
  Speaker 2: Next to him. No, Novelle's the third.
• 1:54:31
  Speaker 7: One over, third one over to the I think it
• 1:54:36
  Speaker 7: might be inverted. But Garrison is the tall one, right,
• 1:54:39
  Speaker 7: the tallest head. Yeah, yeah, and he's right next to him.
• 1:54:44
  Speaker 2: No, that's Garrison's co counsel, his other lawyer.
• 1:54:50
  Speaker 7: So he's all the way on the right, or is he.
• 1:54:53
  Speaker 2: Said all the way on the all the way on
• 1:54:54
  Speaker 2: the left. It looks like a woman, So he's the
• 1:54:57
  Speaker 2: third one. Okay, I don't know. It's a horrible fucking
• 1:55:03
  Speaker 2: drawing anyway, That's what I was.
• 1:55:05
  Speaker 7: Asking because I don't know. But interesting. And you know,
• 1:55:11
  Speaker 7: one thing I wanted to bring up is this was, uh,
• 1:55:16
  Speaker 7: this was part of the article. It's a four page
• 1:55:18
  Speaker 7: article that the CIA is you know, internal memoying over
• 1:55:24
  Speaker 7: and they talk about this is a title of this
• 1:55:30
  Speaker 7: little paragraph, the case for the Defense the Jolly Green Giant, which,
• 1:55:34
  Speaker 7: of course Jim Garrison and Gordon Novell have something in common.
• 1:55:39
  Speaker 7: They are both hypnotized by the specter of the CIA.
• 1:55:46
  Speaker 7: In fact, a rumor at the courthouse has Garrison took
• 1:55:49
  Speaker 7: the case in exchange for some of Novelle's information concerning
• 1:55:55
  Speaker 7: the US intelligence community, specifically they are possible involvement in
• 1:56:00
  Speaker 7: the assassination of John F. Kennedy.
• 1:56:03
  Speaker 10: That that's not the story Garrison tells. He says Novelle
• 1:56:08
  Speaker 10: badgered him into it, wouldn't take no for an answer.
• 1:56:12
  Speaker 10: Why maybe I wanted to figure people.
• 1:56:18
  Speaker 7: On the jury would I'm sorry, maybe I wanted to
• 1:56:22
  Speaker 7: figure people on the jury would know. Speaking on his behalf,
• 1:56:28
  Speaker 7: maybe he thought he would understand his fears.
• 1:56:30
  Speaker 10: Of sea activity in the case. So I don't know
• 1:56:34
  Speaker 10: what to think of that allegation because this is way
• 1:56:41
  Speaker 10: after Garrison's case in the seventies, in the sixties.
• 1:56:45
  Speaker 2: I well, I think also n K brings up when
• 1:56:52
  Speaker 2: he went to Atlanta, Georgia. He went there to live
• 1:56:56
  Speaker 2: with a guy named Mitch Burbell, okay, who is a
• 1:57:01
  Speaker 2: known CIA operative inventing many of silencers for weaponry used.
• 1:57:11
  Speaker 2: You know. Yeah, he was arrested in Georgia where bailed
• 1:57:16
  Speaker 2: him out and let him live with him for a time.
• 1:57:19
  Speaker 7: So that that is telling. That is telling.
• 1:57:24
  Speaker 2: I mean, the same name, just keep coming up, coming, up,
• 1:57:27
  Speaker 2: coming up.
• 1:57:28
  Speaker 7: M Yeah. I just don't understand how it went from
• 1:57:35
  Speaker 7: him running from Garrison to him hiring Garrison as his
• 1:57:40
  Speaker 7: counsel less than ten years later.
• 1:57:45
  Speaker 2: No, No, you got the timing mixed up, okay, love
• 1:57:50
  Speaker 2: he hired Garrison as his lawyer and it was a
• 1:57:52
  Speaker 2: hung jury in a mistrial the second trial. Yeah, in
• 1:57:57
  Speaker 2: the seventies seventy six. After that, they wanted to retry him,
• 1:58:01
  Speaker 2: and he bounced a year later, less than a year later.
• 1:58:07
  Speaker 7: Got it? No, I understand that. I was saying, how
• 1:58:09
  Speaker 7: did he go from running from a subpoena in the
• 1:58:16
  Speaker 7: Garrison trial to then hiring him in the seventies?
• 1:58:20
  Speaker 2: Oh you mean to Ohio?
• 1:58:22
  Speaker 7: Yeah? Yeah, I'm sorry. I didn't make that clear.
• 1:58:24
  Speaker 2: Well, you know, he went from talking all that shit
• 1:58:26
  Speaker 2: about Garrison, you know, talks about blackmailing him and reporting
• 1:58:30
  Speaker 2: back to the CIFBI about what Garrison was up to.
• 1:58:34
  Speaker 2: Yet here we have him in the seventies hiring him
• 1:58:36
  Speaker 2: as his lawyer. Right, I mean, I don't know what
• 1:58:41
  Speaker 2: it's about. It's it's who knows. Again, there was that
• 1:58:48
  Speaker 2: FBI theory that possibly this was all a ploy between
• 1:58:57
  Speaker 2: Novelle and Garrison to kind of disrupt the CIA into
• 1:59:03
  Speaker 2: spilling showing their hand as far as interfering with Garrison's investigation.
• 1:59:10
  Speaker 2: Who knows what the real truth is here? Right? As
• 1:59:13
  Speaker 2: we'll see, Noville is a very ah dude, very odd dude.
• 1:59:25
  Speaker 7: So that just didn't make sense to me. And I
• 1:59:28
  Speaker 7: know we don't know the complete story of how that,
• 1:59:30
  Speaker 7: you know, three sixty happened. It's just fascinating to me
• 1:59:35
  Speaker 7: because he also rob accused Garrison of directly murdering David Ferry.
• 1:59:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so why would Garrison agree to be his lawyer
• 1:59:45
  Speaker 2: or he badgered me? Well, you know, but if Noville
• 1:59:49
  Speaker 2: really you don't know, to ship to him in the sixties,
• 1:59:52
  Speaker 2: Garrison likely would have told him to go fuck off
• 1:59:55
  Speaker 2: and pound saying you know what I mean, not give
• 1:59:59
  Speaker 2: in after he injured me unless he promised to tell
• 2:00:04
  Speaker 2: Garrison what he knew about the assassination as a.
• 2:00:10
  Speaker 7: Form of payment. Almost But and that's why I just
• 2:00:14
  Speaker 7: brought that little clip from that article up. And that's
• 2:00:16
  Speaker 7: like four or five pages in a document. But Garrison's
• 2:00:21
  Speaker 7: case is way over by then, and I know he's
• 2:00:23
  Speaker 7: still kind of I don't want to use the word
• 2:00:26
  Speaker 7: obsessed with the case, but probably obsessed. But could that
• 2:00:29
  Speaker 7: be used as currency to represent someone that from all
• 2:00:35
  Speaker 7: accounts eccused you a murder and FBI documents and all
• 2:00:38
  Speaker 7: his other drama.
• 2:00:40
  Speaker 2: And that's your angle that you're going to go with,
• 2:00:43
  Speaker 2: is that, you know, to get out of this arson
• 2:00:46
  Speaker 2: charge for obviously whoever this John Langford is was, he's blaming.
• 2:00:52
  Speaker 2: He's saying this guy was like a co intel pro
• 2:00:54
  Speaker 2: guy that basically planned all this shit and then and
• 2:00:58
  Speaker 2: then you know, out of him him as isna gonna
• 2:01:01
  Speaker 2: do it? You know? And it was in retaliation for
• 2:01:06
  Speaker 2: his project morning Star wherever the fuck right, And if
• 2:01:10
  Speaker 2: that's the angle he's going going with that, now you
• 2:01:14
  Speaker 2: know the CIA has double crossed Novelle. I mean, how
• 2:01:18
  Speaker 2: many lawyers are going to go up against the CIA
• 2:01:21
  Speaker 2: and the FBI in New Orleans at that time? Right,
• 2:01:25
  Speaker 2: There's probably one guy that comes to mind, you know
• 2:01:28
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying, who would a have the knowledge and
• 2:01:32
  Speaker 2: you know wherewithal to fucking do it? And that's Jim Garrison.
• 2:01:37
  Speaker 2: And this is after he was a judge and like
• 2:01:39
  Speaker 2: Cammy says, he didn't need the money, so and apparently
• 2:01:44
  Speaker 2: Novelle had money, folks, and CAMMI.
• 2:01:48
  Speaker 7: High, how are you gonna think it gave them a
• 2:01:50
  Speaker 7: little la?
• 2:01:51
  Speaker 10: That's where I was, like my Aukham's razor mind went to, uh,
• 2:01:56
  Speaker 10: maybe at that point.
• 2:01:57
  Speaker 7: It just passed. And you know, Novelle did was not broke, so.
• 2:02:05
  Speaker 10: Could have probably hired And who's a better lawyer to
• 2:02:07
  Speaker 10: hire than a person that jurors will know and think
• 2:02:11
  Speaker 10: is respectable right defending you like, that's that's worth something.
• 2:02:16
  Speaker 10: A lot of these former das and prosecutors become defense lawyers, So.
• 2:02:23
  Speaker 7: I don't know, it's just very interesting. I just want
• 2:02:26
  Speaker 7: to point that out, Okay, And before we get into
• 2:02:31
  Speaker 7: the craziness of a novel in later life and his
• 2:02:37
  Speaker 7: crazy thoughts, I had two more documents that I wanted
• 2:02:40
  Speaker 7: to share mister Ron here, and we went through these.
• 2:02:44
  Speaker 7: Of course we were talking about in sixty seven, in
• 2:02:48
  Speaker 7: March and April and May, things were, you know, all
• 2:02:52
  Speaker 7: the documents were flying, internal memos. This guy saying he
• 2:02:55
  Speaker 7: works for us, did he actually work for us?
• 2:02:57
  Speaker 6: Is?
• 2:02:57
  Speaker 10: Of course everything's compartmental. So this is a response from
• 2:03:05
  Speaker 10: Robert S. Wattles, director of Personnel for the Central Intelligence Agency,
• 2:03:10
  Speaker 10: and in that capacity, have cost his custody of the
• 2:03:13
  Speaker 10: personal records of the CIA. These personal records are maintained
• 2:03:18
  Speaker 10: in the state of Virginia. I have directed that a
• 2:03:21
  Speaker 10: diligent search of the CIA personal records be made to
• 2:03:25
  Speaker 10: ascertain if Gordon Dwayne Novel has ever been employed or
• 2:03:29
  Speaker 10: considered for employment by the CIA.
• 2:03:32
  Speaker 7: The diligent search has been.
• 2:03:33
  Speaker 15: Completed and indicates that Gordon Novel at his request, which
• 2:03:40
  Speaker 15: you pointed out earlier, Rob, on December twenty second December
• 2:03:44
  Speaker 15: in nineteen sixty seven, was interviewed as an applicant for employment,
• 2:03:52
  Speaker 15: as the morning.
• 2:03:53
  Speaker 10: Starts off, by a member of our Office of Personnel.
• 2:03:57
  Speaker 10: The search indicates also that, based on the information applied
• 2:04:00
  Speaker 10: at such interview, the interviewer did not recommend employment and
• 2:04:04
  Speaker 10: his application.
• 2:04:06
  Speaker 7: For employment was not further processed by the Central Intelligence Agency.
• 2:04:12
  Speaker 7: The personal records contain no record of employment of Gordon
• 2:04:18
  Speaker 7: Doing Novel and signed by Skufuza Robert Wattole's.
• 2:04:23
  Speaker 2: So again, this is all officially.
• 2:04:26
  Speaker 7: Right, right, right. But something I found very interesting is
• 2:04:32
  Speaker 7: about a month, exactly a month after this, another internal
• 2:04:36
  Speaker 7: memo from the CIA. They are and the subject is
• 2:04:42
  Speaker 7: Garrison and the Kennedy assassination, Gordon doing Novel. They are
• 2:04:47
  Speaker 7: debating here whether they can use Novel's story. So let
• 2:04:52
  Speaker 7: me read this. If the surmise that NBC is building
• 2:04:56
  Speaker 7: up Novel as a ladder David who is to slay
• 2:05:02
  Speaker 7: the jolly green giant Goliath analogy is correct, that a
• 2:05:10
  Speaker 7: CIA exposure of Novelle's claims of agency affiliation as false
• 2:05:15
  Speaker 7: might be damaging to our own interests. On the other hand,
• 2:05:19
  Speaker 7: the likelihood that an NBC anti Garrison program is still
• 2:05:24
  Speaker 7: weeks away from presentation is disturbing. They go and talk
• 2:05:28
  Speaker 7: about a study of persons, of a poll of what
• 2:05:35
  Speaker 7: people believed in the assassination. But and I have to
• 2:05:38
  Speaker 7: read this a couple of times, and you know, it's
• 2:05:41
  Speaker 7: like a seminary page document. They are trying to figure
• 2:05:46
  Speaker 7: out if Novelle's claims, the fake claims they say of
• 2:05:50
  Speaker 7: agency affiliation can be can be beneficial in some ways,
• 2:05:56
  Speaker 7: or can damage their own interests. And they come to
• 2:06:00
  Speaker 7: the conclusion that there is no benefit to that. So
• 2:06:07
  Speaker 7: it's hard to think that they'd be debating that in
• 2:06:12
  Speaker 7: internal memos if he was, But.
• 2:06:15
  Speaker 2: You never know.
• 2:06:16
  Speaker 7: Also, and one more as we go up the timeline here,
• 2:06:23
  Speaker 7: this is an article from The Times Picky Yun Rob
• 2:06:28
  Speaker 7: January eighty one, Novell face his fourth trial in Arson
• 2:06:33
  Speaker 7: case because, like you mentioned, his third case was a
• 2:06:36
  Speaker 7: home jury. The saga, known as the Gordon Novelle case,
• 2:06:42
  Speaker 7: will continue next month following a decision by the Orleans
• 2:06:47
  Speaker 7: Parish District Attorney's office to prosecute Novell for the fourth
• 2:06:51
  Speaker 7: time on a conspiracy to commit aggravated arson charge. Novell,
• 2:06:58
  Speaker 7: convicted two years ago for conspiring to burn down the
• 2:07:01
  Speaker 7: the Fed Federation of Churches building on Charles Avenue on
• 2:07:08
  Speaker 7: marri Gras, was recently granted a new trial by Criminal
• 2:07:13
  Speaker 7: District Court Judge Frank Morello Junior. The decision by the
• 2:07:18
  Speaker 7: District Attorney's office to go forward with the fourth prosecution
• 2:07:22
  Speaker 7: was made Tuesday.
• 2:07:25
  Speaker 9: And uh, Novelle says, is only quote only in this
• 2:07:32
  Speaker 9: banana republic known as the Twilight Zone of New Orleans.
• 2:07:35
  Speaker 7: Could this happen?
• 2:07:38
  Speaker 2: That's a nific quote.
• 2:07:41
  Speaker 10: Well, hey, I mean they got a hung jury, but
• 2:07:44
  Speaker 10: they chose to re prosecute after every home jury.
• 2:07:49
  Speaker 7: Right, you don't have to. It's something in the discretion
• 2:07:52
  Speaker 7: of the DA.
• 2:07:53
  Speaker 2: When later on in this articles as his buddy Langford,
• 2:07:56
  Speaker 2: who he alleged set him up for all this shit,
• 2:07:58
  Speaker 2: was was acquitted in the first trial in nineteen seventy
• 2:08:03
  Speaker 2: seven by Judge bran if In. A hung jury was
• 2:08:08
  Speaker 2: declared in Novelle's case at the time. Huh, yeah, so
• 2:08:13
  Speaker 2: Langford got off shot up.
• 2:08:17
  Speaker 10: Yeah, I'm just going to skip to the end. The
• 2:08:21
  Speaker 10: decision to try Novell for a fourth time coincides with
• 2:08:24
  Speaker 10: a lengthy document recently filed by Novel and is pending
• 2:08:28
  Speaker 10: one billion dollar federal court suit against Louisiana Expo Incorporated,
• 2:08:32
  Speaker 10: the organization sponsoring the proposed nineteen eighty four World Affair
• 2:08:38
  Speaker 10: in New Orleans.
• 2:08:39
  Speaker 7: And he just loves the drama.
• 2:08:46
  Speaker 2: Huh, dude, this guy is full of it.
• 2:08:52
  Speaker 7: Well if you thought he was full of it.
• 2:08:57
  Speaker 2: Well wait, there's more.
• 2:08:59
  Speaker 7: There is more, And why don't you check a couple
• 2:09:03
  Speaker 7: of comments as I bring this up, as I realized
• 2:09:06
  Speaker 7: I closed.
• 2:09:08
  Speaker 2: To myself. Yeah, Sally says, what is the pyromaniac? Well no,
• 2:09:13
  Speaker 2: I mean he didn't really do do much, but possibly
• 2:09:21
  Speaker 2: I've got an interview handy where he taught. The guy
• 2:09:25
  Speaker 2: asked him, so did you did you set models model
• 2:09:28
  Speaker 2: airplanes on fire as a child, And he's like, actually
• 2:09:31
  Speaker 2: I did. And the guys like so did Neil Armstrong.
• 2:09:35
  Speaker 2: So you're in good company.
• 2:09:37
  Speaker 1: Hmm.
• 2:09:38
  Speaker 2: So he might have been a pyromaniac, Sally.
• 2:09:41
  Speaker 7: Yeah, never know, he was. He like stealing stuff too,
• 2:09:51
  Speaker 7: so could have been a klub though.
• 2:09:54
  Speaker 2: You mean showed a little his video while you, uh,
• 2:09:58
  Speaker 2: his cafoo's around over there.
• 2:10:00
  Speaker 10: Sure I am runny now, but you kind of you're righty,
• 2:10:03
  Speaker 10: that's fine, all.
• 2:10:04
  Speaker 2: Right, all right, folks, here we go now, Jack Sarfati, Okay,
• 2:10:20
  Speaker 2: let me set this up a little bit. Novelle dies
• 2:10:23
  Speaker 2: and I believe it's twenty eleven or twenty twelve. I
• 2:10:26
  Speaker 2: think it might be twenty twelve, twenty twelve. This is
• 2:10:29
  Speaker 2: five years before he dies. And he was considered a
• 2:10:36
  Speaker 2: part of this group that called themselves the Avians. Okay, Now,
• 2:10:43
  Speaker 2: Gordon Novell was part of this. Jack Sarfatti was part
• 2:10:46
  Speaker 2: of this. People like how put off? All these different
• 2:10:52
  Speaker 2: UFO investigators were part of this group, and they called
• 2:10:58
  Speaker 2: themselves the Avians. Right, I'm not gonna play the whole
• 2:11:01
  Speaker 2: thing here, just a little piece about what he says
• 2:11:04
  Speaker 2: about Garrison. Looking back, Here we go.
• 2:11:09
  Speaker 6: H They wanted me to run a counter intelligence operation
• 2:11:14
  Speaker 6: on Garrison because I already had an inside track and
• 2:11:17
  Speaker 6: they had figured out that I.
• 2:11:19
  Speaker 12: Could be used as the perfect double agent for a while.
• 2:11:22
  Speaker 12: It worked.
• 2:11:24
  Speaker 6: So I became Garrisons chief security, and so I caught
• 2:11:27
  Speaker 6: him fake and all the evidence in the hiburiity the
• 2:11:31
  Speaker 6: way it happened.
• 2:11:32
  Speaker 7: So who got you the job?
• 2:11:33
  Speaker 6: As Garrison's Willard E. Robertson, his chief backer, the Volkswagen
• 2:11:38
  Speaker 6: distributor in the very close friend.
• 2:11:41
  Speaker 7: Since I was a kid, what did you think about Garrison?
• 2:11:52
  Speaker 6: I would have to say from first blushes that he
• 2:11:56
  Speaker 6: was a political opportunist, not think twice about the framing
• 2:12:02
  Speaker 6: his mother to make a case.
• 2:12:06
  Speaker 7: Some So, now, what what did you uncover.
• 2:12:13
  Speaker 6: That that that that when I was his chief of security.
• 2:12:16
  Speaker 6: I uncovered the fact that he was fabricating evidence that
• 2:12:19
  Speaker 6: he was typing up on the typewriter that he had
• 2:12:21
  Speaker 6: seized from the Clay Show, and he was writing letters
• 2:12:25
  Speaker 6: to Oswald blaming Clay Show, phone taking, creed and conspiracy.
• 2:12:31
  Speaker 7: It never have What was his motivation in your opinion?
• 2:12:35
  Speaker 7: Be god?
• 2:12:37
  Speaker 6: I mean he was the guy had I mean he
• 2:12:40
  Speaker 6: and I used to discuss how we were in a
• 2:12:42
  Speaker 6: stepping stone to the Kennedy assassination investigation into the White House.
• 2:12:48
  Speaker 7: Political ambition?
• 2:12:50
  Speaker 6: Sure?
• 2:12:52
  Speaker 7: Did you? You don't seem like a political ambitious step
• 2:12:57
  Speaker 7: to me?
• 2:12:58
  Speaker 8: I have been I.
• 2:13:02
  Speaker 1: Would.
• 2:13:02
  Speaker 12: I would say that.
• 2:13:03
  Speaker 6: The political ambition I have is a simple Alexander the
• 2:13:11
  Speaker 6: great viewpoint of it's my eyays.
• 2:13:14
  Speaker 12: If I can figure out how to rule it, I'm
• 2:13:15
  Speaker 12: going to do it.
• 2:13:16
  Speaker 6: If I can create a revolution that makes the planet
• 2:13:18
  Speaker 6: into utopia, and it sucks up everything that's considered hollowed
• 2:13:24
  Speaker 6: by the current administrators. But I can pull it off
• 2:13:27
  Speaker 6: without killing anybody.
• 2:13:28
  Speaker 12: Let's do it.
• 2:13:29
  Speaker 7: Let's go back to Garrison. So you're.
• 2:13:33
  Speaker 2: How long did you work at the White House before
• 2:13:35
  Speaker 2: you went to Texas to work in other cases.
• 2:13:38
  Speaker 12: Before I went to New Orleans? Workers probably.
• 2:13:45
  Speaker 7: Three months? At what other operations did you do with
• 2:13:49
  Speaker 7: the White House?
• 2:13:53
  Speaker 6: Nothing that had anything to do with anything other than Checkmate, Checkmate,
• 2:13:58
  Speaker 6: and double check. We had we had another operation having
• 2:14:03
  Speaker 6: to do with the sale of intelligence equipment.
• 2:14:05
  Speaker 12: To the boys in the White House that I had designed.
• 2:14:10
  Speaker 7: And so then you went to Texas, New Orleans, New Orleans. Well,
• 2:14:16
  Speaker 7: tell us who killed Kennedy?
• 2:14:18
  Speaker 6: My opinion, Yeah, everybody's just like you know, it's like assholes.
• 2:14:22
  Speaker 12: Everybody's got one.
• 2:14:25
  Speaker 6: It was probably orchestrated from the very top by David
• 2:14:31
  Speaker 6: Rockefeller and Henry Kissinger, and they probably did it for many,
• 2:14:38
  Speaker 6: many reasons, but the primary reason was to prevent prevent
• 2:14:44
  Speaker 6: the macroeconomic, socioeconomic, and geopolitical revolution that comes with the
• 2:14:50
  Speaker 6: release of free energy and time control.
• 2:14:55
  Speaker 2: And we'll pause it right there. Like I said, folks,
• 2:15:03
  Speaker 2: it gets weirder and weirder, and it was all about
• 2:15:08
  Speaker 2: free energy and time control. You heard me right, time
• 2:15:14
  Speaker 2: travel and free energy.
• 2:15:21
  Speaker 7: He is consistent, rob And I think what I'm going
• 2:15:25
  Speaker 7: to play here, I think was from two thousand and six.
• 2:15:30
  Speaker 7: He does think was it was. I think the Builder
• 2:15:33
  Speaker 7: Birds too, along with you know, the Rockefellers and everyone else.
• 2:15:39
  Speaker 7: But man, this I feel like, first of all, I
• 2:15:47
  Speaker 7: feel like he's kind of like was the Alex Jones,
• 2:15:50
  Speaker 7: like before Alex Jones his leader things sound like that.
• 2:15:54
  Speaker 7: Almost when I play this, You're gonna know what I'm
• 2:15:58
  Speaker 7: talking about. So let me start and here we go.
• 2:16:09
  Speaker 13: Oh, heard of Gordon hopefully hopefully? Okay, tell me a
• 2:16:16
  Speaker 13: little bit about who you are for people that have
• 2:16:19
  Speaker 13: never heard I know it's hard to believe, but have
• 2:16:21
  Speaker 13: never heard of Gordon of Elle.
• 2:16:24
  Speaker 6: Well, I'm I don't know how my name is Gordon Ovel.
• 2:16:32
  Speaker 6: I have been involved in things like Watergate and JFK's
• 2:16:37
  Speaker 6: assassination and the Larean drama and Waco and others that
• 2:16:45
  Speaker 6: would be better not mentioned that. We're more intelligence oriented,
• 2:16:50
  Speaker 6: are foreign intelligence oriented, so I kind of stay away
• 2:16:53
  Speaker 6: from talking about that, okay, And I have never worked
• 2:16:57
  Speaker 6: for the CIA. I'm not a agent. I'm affiliated. I
• 2:17:02
  Speaker 6: work with and we have a mutual admiration society based
• 2:17:07
  Speaker 6: upon my relationship with the individuals I work.
• 2:17:09
  Speaker 13: With, Okay, and those individuals are not.
• 2:17:16
  Speaker 12: I prefer not to.
• 2:17:17
  Speaker 2: It's this time we should also mention at this point too,
• 2:17:23
  Speaker 2: Joe that allegedly, when he's talking about the Watergate affair,
• 2:17:28
  Speaker 2: allegedly he was called in by Chuck Colson because he
• 2:17:32
  Speaker 2: had designed this special degausing gun that was capable of
• 2:17:39
  Speaker 2: erasing magnetic tapes. Hence the uh, the gaps in the
• 2:17:45
  Speaker 2: in the Watergate tape, according to Gordon Noville, right right, yeah, And.
• 2:17:55
  Speaker 7: I think we have I have a timestamp on water Gate,
• 2:17:59
  Speaker 7: uh and about three timestamps. So we'll see what he
• 2:18:05
  Speaker 7: has to say about that.
• 2:18:07
  Speaker 13: Okay. And is it correct that the CIA is actually
• 2:18:12
  Speaker 13: backing your other project?
• 2:18:14
  Speaker 7: Is that?
• 2:18:15
  Speaker 6: Is that something you want to say that they're they're
• 2:18:18
  Speaker 6: interested in supporting and endorsing a number of things that
• 2:18:21
  Speaker 6: I'm doing because they are capable of changing things like
• 2:18:26
  Speaker 6: global warming and getting rid of warming, and getting rid
• 2:18:29
  Speaker 6: of the chaotic conditions of our current new world order
• 2:18:34
  Speaker 6: and that kind of thing, getting rid of the murder
• 2:18:37
  Speaker 6: and mayhem that goes on in the planet.
• 2:18:39
  Speaker 7: Yeah, that's who I would choose to get rid of.
• 2:18:44
  Speaker 7: Murder and mayhem. Unbelievable. And I don't know what to
• 2:18:48
  Speaker 7: think of these comments. We could discuss after.
• 2:18:52
  Speaker 13: Okay, and this is now, would you say the good
• 2:18:56
  Speaker 13: side of the CIA? There's more than one side.
• 2:18:59
  Speaker 6: The CIA has multiple sides. But it's been my experience
• 2:19:05
  Speaker 6: over the years that they're basically the only good guys
• 2:19:07
  Speaker 6: in the entire United States government. They're really patriots. Most
• 2:19:11
  Speaker 6: of them are patriots, and I've never known I personally
• 2:19:16
  Speaker 6: have never known them to do anything criminal ever. And
• 2:19:21
  Speaker 6: they didn't kill John Kennedy, and they they didn't kill
• 2:19:26
  Speaker 6: a lot of people that they've been accused of causing
• 2:19:29
  Speaker 6: the death of, but I don't know that to be true.
• 2:19:32
  Speaker 6: So I can tell you that my experience with them
• 2:19:35
  Speaker 6: has been like dealing with Eagle Scouts.
• 2:19:38
  Speaker 13: Okay, how long have you been dealing with them?
• 2:19:41
  Speaker 12: Since about aged?
• 2:19:43
  Speaker 7: Eagle Scouts?
• 2:19:46
  Speaker 2: Right? Very upstanding.
• 2:19:52
  Speaker 7: So these comments make me think, like, is he pretending
• 2:19:59
  Speaker 7: to protect the CIA? So he's considered a CIA agent.
• 2:20:03
  Speaker 2: I have no ideas believe that they have paid him
• 2:20:07
  Speaker 2: very well over the years. For certain things.
• 2:20:12
  Speaker 7: Something, because I mean, let's I do think there are
• 2:20:18
  Speaker 7: good people in the CIA without a doubt, but to
• 2:20:22
  Speaker 7: say they're eagle scouts, and I think I'd choose them
• 2:20:26
  Speaker 7: to stop the murderer mayhem in the world. Is is
• 2:20:31
  Speaker 7: is interesting?
• 2:20:33
  Speaker 2: Well, you definitely don't want them as enemies too.
• 2:20:35
  Speaker 7: You don't know. And if you're listening, I said the
• 2:20:40
  Speaker 7: good people there are good people.
• 2:20:42
  Speaker 2: Or if you want them to fund your future projects
• 2:20:44
  Speaker 2: or current projects, yes, yes.
• 2:20:46
  Speaker 7: If you'd like the fund with the Long Coming podcast,
• 2:20:49
  Speaker 7: our emails, the Long.
• 2:20:50
  Speaker 14: The podcast atchibail dot com.
• 2:20:55
  Speaker 2: That's right, roll us of being CIA shills.
• 2:21:03
  Speaker 7: We're open to discussions.
• 2:21:05
  Speaker 13: As you're listening, people think that you.
• 2:21:10
  Speaker 12: Did because I.
• 2:21:13
  Speaker 13: No, absolutely not all with the death of Robert Kennedy
• 2:21:16
  Speaker 13: or Jack Kennedy.
• 2:21:19
  Speaker 12: No, absolutely not all.
• 2:21:20
  Speaker 13: Well why do people think that you did?
• 2:21:22
  Speaker 6: Because I was first became I was working at the
• 2:21:27
  Speaker 6: White House and then on a counterintelligence project that was
• 2:21:31
  Speaker 6: kind of important, and then I got referenced over to
• 2:21:36
  Speaker 6: Garrison and he made me as chief as security and
• 2:21:40
  Speaker 6: I discovered that he was fabricating evidence, and he found
• 2:21:43
  Speaker 6: out that I had discovered that, and it turned it
• 2:21:46
  Speaker 6: over to NBC. So he decided that the best way
• 2:21:49
  Speaker 6: was to make me his most important material witness since
• 2:21:52
  Speaker 6: he wasn't.
• 2:21:52
  Speaker 12: Accusing me of a crime.
• 2:21:54
  Speaker 6: But it cost me a lot of grief and a
• 2:21:56
  Speaker 6: lot of people thought I was involved, which I wasn't.
• 2:21:59
  Speaker 6: Never involved in that, Okay, And one of the best
• 2:22:02
  Speaker 6: alibis in the world.
• 2:22:04
  Speaker 13: And you actually, you have a lot of feeling or simpotico.
• 2:22:10
  Speaker 13: Isn't that true with what Kennedy stood for?
• 2:22:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah?
• 2:22:14
  Speaker 6: I was in favor of his revelations that were apparently
• 2:22:18
  Speaker 6: about to happen, having to do with extraterrestrials, the technologies,
• 2:22:24
  Speaker 6: and I think that they kept him in the dark
• 2:22:25
  Speaker 6: and a lot of stuff, and it was one of
• 2:22:27
  Speaker 6: the reasons that motivated him to want.
• 2:22:29
  Speaker 7: To go to the moon.
• 2:22:31
  Speaker 12: So I was very pro John F.
• 2:22:33
  Speaker 13: Kennedy, Okay, and pro very pro Yeah. And what about
• 2:22:40
  Speaker 13: Robert Kennedy.
• 2:22:41
  Speaker 6: I was personally affiliated with the Attorney General during the
• 2:22:48
  Speaker 6: Garrison thing and afterwards when he ran for president. And
• 2:22:53
  Speaker 6: my only feeling about him is that he probably helped
• 2:22:59
  Speaker 6: Precipit take a lot of the problems that caused the
• 2:23:02
  Speaker 6: assassination of his brother. Okay, So chasing the mafia, for example,
• 2:23:07
  Speaker 6: because the mafia supported his brother's election and substantively and
• 2:23:14
  Speaker 6: they got very angry at him, along with folks like
• 2:23:17
  Speaker 6: the ex Galen or or Galen organization of the Nazis
• 2:23:22
  Speaker 6: and other people like that.
• 2:23:23
  Speaker 7: That and he goes into Ryan Hark Galen and some
• 2:23:27
  Speaker 7: paper clip stuff and all the good stuff here. But
• 2:23:33
  Speaker 7: let us let us continue, Rob, I don't know if
• 2:23:38
  Speaker 7: you know this. That's crazier. And by the way, RFK
• 2:23:48
  Speaker 7: was assassinated on June sixth, nineteen sixty eight. So today
• 2:23:53
  Speaker 7: on the state in nineteen sixty eight, so.
• 2:24:00
  Speaker 13: As well as day, are you building a craft to
• 2:24:05
  Speaker 13: go to Mars.
• 2:24:06
  Speaker 2: We're building.
• 2:24:07
  Speaker 6: We're building power generators and technology to build starships.
• 2:24:13
  Speaker 2: That's what.
• 2:24:13
  Speaker 13: Okay, to go to the edge of the solar system.
• 2:24:16
  Speaker 12: The edge of the universe.
• 2:24:18
  Speaker 6: We're not interested in the solar system, solar systems. There's
• 2:24:21
  Speaker 6: nothing out there of any.
• 2:24:22
  Speaker 7: Consequences, nothing out there in the solar system. Went to
• 2:24:26
  Speaker 7: the edge of the.
• 2:24:27
  Speaker 2: Universe star Trek style baby around.
• 2:24:33
  Speaker 13: Okay, And have you met any aliens?
• 2:24:39
  Speaker 12: No?
• 2:24:39
  Speaker 6: No, I know people who claim they constantly communicate with
• 2:24:43
  Speaker 6: them so and are in touch with them, But no,
• 2:24:46
  Speaker 6: I haven't had the pleasure of displeasure?
• 2:24:48
  Speaker 13: Have you ever have you ever communicated with them through
• 2:24:51
  Speaker 13: your friends?
• 2:24:52
  Speaker 6: Say, yeah, we attempt to have these surrogate little discussions.
• 2:24:56
  Speaker 13: But oh yeah, and because you work with Lizette, isn't
• 2:24:59
  Speaker 13: what's her last name, Marc Larkin? Yeah, and she wrote
• 2:25:02
  Speaker 13: the book Talking with Extraterrestrials and sounds like she communicates
• 2:25:08
  Speaker 13: with someone out there.
• 2:25:09
  Speaker 6: Yeah, she's You can't attribute her level of intelligence to
• 2:25:14
  Speaker 6: going to school.
• 2:25:15
  Speaker 7: It's just not there.
• 2:25:16
  Speaker 6: That type of thinking and the type of philosophy that
• 2:25:21
  Speaker 6: she says that they advocate in the way that they
• 2:25:24
  Speaker 6: see life and how we should live it is completely
• 2:25:28
  Speaker 6: it's not it's not anything that we currently enjoy.
• 2:25:34
  Speaker 13: Right, So you've had dialogues through her.
• 2:25:37
  Speaker 6: We're currently trying to set up contact, Okay, but I
• 2:25:40
  Speaker 6: don't know if we'll ever have any success now, okay.
• 2:25:43
  Speaker 13: So you don't know what the what the ET thinks
• 2:25:45
  Speaker 13: of you, I know, and in your project.
• 2:25:49
  Speaker 6: I don't know whether or not they even think on
• 2:25:51
  Speaker 6: that level. We are trying to find out if they do.
• 2:25:54
  Speaker 6: And it's been our experience that women seem to run
• 2:25:58
  Speaker 6: the future and and exterrestrial societies are supposedly led and
• 2:26:05
  Speaker 6: directed by women, so the female side of the equation.
• 2:26:08
  Speaker 6: So we're very pro that idea because women don't like
• 2:26:14
  Speaker 6: war and don't like the consequences.
• 2:26:17
  Speaker 7: Of going a little uh off topic here. But let's
• 2:26:25
  Speaker 7: see what you have to say about Waco. And Scott
• 2:26:27
  Speaker 7: asked me about an article had on my parent point.
• 2:26:30
  Speaker 7: I'll try to bring that up after this.
• 2:26:33
  Speaker 13: But you were very involved in Waco, isn't that right?
• 2:26:36
  Speaker 7: Yeah?
• 2:26:37
  Speaker 13: So what can you what happened with Waco? Because you
• 2:26:39
  Speaker 13: have a very interesting story on those lines.
• 2:26:43
  Speaker 6: Mass murderer the GF at Hackam and they got the
• 2:26:48
  Speaker 6: response that they asked for because they knew what they
• 2:26:51
  Speaker 6: were going up against, and they blew up the front
• 2:26:54
  Speaker 6: door and they killed everybody standing around front door, and
• 2:26:58
  Speaker 6: they then hit the front door. Of course after they
• 2:27:01
  Speaker 6: still after they fill them full of actually came and
• 2:27:05
  Speaker 6: got him and got rid of him. They set the
• 2:27:07
  Speaker 6: place on fire and they threw him up.
• 2:27:09
  Speaker 13: And why, I mean, why do you know why?
• 2:27:14
  Speaker 6: Part apparently part of the games that they're playing to
• 2:27:18
  Speaker 6: set us up for nine to eleven and some of
• 2:27:21
  Speaker 6: the other things in order to create us into a
• 2:27:23
  Speaker 6: neo fascist political police state. So that was something that
• 2:27:27
  Speaker 6: was the military political police state.
• 2:27:30
  Speaker 13: Okay, but didn't you tell me that you got the
• 2:27:34
  Speaker 13: FBI sort of into a corner in that.
• 2:27:37
  Speaker 12: Yeah, I got him with the Fleer tape.
• 2:27:40
  Speaker 6: Myself and Bill Coleby got together and we discovered that
• 2:27:43
  Speaker 6: there was a lot of gunshots on the Fleer tape,
• 2:27:46
  Speaker 6: and government then put on a charade test of it.
• 2:27:52
  Speaker 7: They he likes to drop names, Rob, that's for sure.
• 2:27:56
  Speaker 7: Oh yeah, he definitely knows how to do that. So
• 2:28:00
  Speaker 7: let's let me bring up this thing, just because Scott
• 2:28:05
  Speaker 7: asked us really quick. This article I had about Waco
• 2:28:11
  Speaker 7: colorful character part of Waco Probe.
• 2:28:14
  Speaker 14: Waco, Texas, a colorful New Orleans electronics expert, private and
• 2:28:20
  Speaker 14: private eye and business promoter is back on the fringes.
• 2:28:24
  Speaker 7: Of history, this time in connection with the nineteen ninety
• 2:28:28
  Speaker 7: three federal siege of the Branch Division Davidian cult compound
• 2:28:34
  Speaker 7: near Waco. Gordon Novelle sixty one is the originator of
• 2:28:39
  Speaker 7: allegations that federal agents fired upon David Koresh's followers as
• 2:28:44
  Speaker 7: his cult complex was bursting into flames. Some eighty people,
• 2:28:48
  Speaker 7: including a number of children, died, and you know, blah
• 2:28:52
  Speaker 7: blah blah. I don't want to spend too much time
• 2:28:54
  Speaker 7: in that, but I guess he was the original person
• 2:28:58
  Speaker 7: that made allegations against it. I don't know the timeline.
• 2:29:02
  Speaker 4: But.
• 2:29:06
  Speaker 7: Let me go to my last time stamp here, and
• 2:29:11
  Speaker 7: this is the Watergate one.
• 2:29:14
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 2:29:15
  Speaker 7: We had touched on that.
• 2:29:16
  Speaker 13: Earlier a little bit, diaper human being. We're gonna kind
• 2:29:25
  Speaker 13: of backtrack a little bit, and we're going to ask
• 2:29:29
  Speaker 13: you about Watergate, Okay, because now, if I understand, you
• 2:29:35
  Speaker 13: wired the Oval Office.
• 2:29:37
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I put an electronic counter measure system to defeat
• 2:29:41
  Speaker 6: people bugging.
• 2:29:42
  Speaker 2: The Oval Office.
• 2:29:43
  Speaker 6: Okay, but now conversations are recording any conversations in the room.
• 2:29:49
  Speaker 13: Right, But were you involved? You were involved? And also
• 2:29:53
  Speaker 13: supposedly the tapes of Ni Nixon's tapes, right, it was
• 2:30:00
  Speaker 13: a good idea.
• 2:30:01
  Speaker 6: Yeah, I wish i'd have done it, Okay.
• 2:30:03
  Speaker 13: But they weren't erased. And you've heard them then, right,
• 2:30:08
  Speaker 13: you've heard you must.
• 2:30:09
  Speaker 6: Have heard all four thousand and four tapes.
• 2:30:12
  Speaker 13: Really, and so what can you tell us? What do
• 2:30:16
  Speaker 13: you know?
• 2:30:20
  Speaker 6: I think if I had, if I had, knowing the
• 2:30:24
  Speaker 6: the level of intrigue that was going on and what
• 2:30:29
  Speaker 6: Watergate was really all about, was much of a cover
• 2:30:32
  Speaker 6: up of our of why we lost the war in Vietnam.
• 2:30:35
  Speaker 6: It was that they were about to have Senate hearings
• 2:30:38
  Speaker 6: for is this all? Yeah, They were about to have
• 2:30:42
  Speaker 6: Senate hearings about a post mortem on Watergate, and they
• 2:30:48
  Speaker 6: the powers that be elected to create Watergate to take
• 2:30:53
  Speaker 6: our attention away from the post mortem, and the Senate
• 2:30:56
  Speaker 6: and the House Intelligence committees became so busy with Watergate
• 2:31:01
  Speaker 6: that they couldn't do the post mortem on the Vietnam,
• 2:31:04
  Speaker 6: which I believe is.
• 2:31:07
  Speaker 12: The crime of crimes. It was a terrible crime.
• 2:31:10
  Speaker 6: We were over there just to get money and take
• 2:31:13
  Speaker 6: the money out the Golden Triangle for dope, take it
• 2:31:15
  Speaker 6: out the Area fifty one.
• 2:31:17
  Speaker 13: So you're saying that the money for dope went straight
• 2:31:21
  Speaker 13: to Area fifty one.
• 2:31:22
  Speaker 6: The whole Vietnam exercise and killing fifty five thousand Americans
• 2:31:26
  Speaker 6: and about two million Vietnamese was for the purposes of
• 2:31:32
  Speaker 6: operating the Golden Triangles heroin operations in order to pump
• 2:31:35
  Speaker 6: the money into Area fifty one. Because it had they
• 2:31:38
  Speaker 6: couldn't fund it except by going off balance sheets. And
• 2:31:41
  Speaker 6: they did Vietnam, and then they did Afghanistan in the eighties,
• 2:31:46
  Speaker 6: and then they did Columbia in the nineties with the cocaine,
• 2:31:49
  Speaker 6: the cocaine crap, which is as evil as evil gets.
• 2:31:53
  Speaker 13: And so basically you're saying that our government is running
• 2:31:57
  Speaker 13: the drugs.
• 2:31:58
  Speaker 6: I'm saying that the Majestic is an r is no
• 2:32:03
  Speaker 6: longer part of the government of the United States.
• 2:32:09
  Speaker 7: All right, I think we have enough of that. I
• 2:32:11
  Speaker 7: don't know if you call it the Watergate part at
• 2:32:13
  Speaker 7: the end, Rob, but he was trying to delete all
• 2:32:16
  Speaker 7: the Watergate tapes, but he couldn't in time. Tiny has
• 2:32:24
  Speaker 7: a great comment, this is what happens when you invite
• 2:32:26
  Speaker 7: Jolly west over for the weekend with the surface of
• 2:32:30
  Speaker 7: warning to all. I can't disagree with that one, Tiny,
• 2:32:35
  Speaker 7: I definitely can't Sally apart from the idea of woman
• 2:32:43
  Speaker 7: being charged. Definitely a bit of a fruit loop. He's
• 2:32:46
  Speaker 7: out there, for sure. He was ahead of the game
• 2:32:51
  Speaker 7: on the global warming thing, for whatever that's worth. And yeah,
• 2:33:00
  Speaker 7: you know he brought the tapes to Area fifty one
• 2:33:02
  Speaker 7: or whatever he brought there. Obviously, what we're trying to
• 2:33:07
  Speaker 7: portray here is he's a little a little on the
• 2:33:11
  Speaker 7: crazy side. But does that mean that everything he's saying
• 2:33:15
  Speaker 7: is not true? That's the question, you're muted.
• 2:33:25
  Speaker 2: Bro, You're muted. I was saying, you know, he was
• 2:33:32
  Speaker 2: referring to like the Kennedy memorandum from like November twelve,
• 2:33:37
  Speaker 2: sixty three, when he asked the CIA for all information
• 2:33:40
  Speaker 2: on unidentified flying objects and then all of a sudden,
• 2:33:43
  Speaker 2: two weeks later he's killed. You know, it's a bit
• 2:33:46
  Speaker 2: of a stretch to say that's why, you know, and
• 2:33:53
  Speaker 2: I think that he wanted to be apprized of situations
• 2:33:58
  Speaker 2: because they could be mistaken as like a Russian attack
• 2:34:02
  Speaker 2: on America or an American attack on Russia, the type
• 2:34:06
  Speaker 2: of thing, if they're truly existing. And he wanted this,
• 2:34:09
  Speaker 2: you know, to know what the CIA knew, and of
• 2:34:11
  Speaker 2: course they didn't tell him anything. But the CIA was
• 2:34:17
  Speaker 2: actively investigating UFO phenomenon, as we know from you know,
• 2:34:21
  Speaker 2: things like Majestic twelve documents and Operation Blue Book and
• 2:34:26
  Speaker 2: all of this stuff. Right, And of course it goes
• 2:34:31
  Speaker 2: back to like the Fred Christmas Fred Christmin thing as well,
• 2:34:34
  Speaker 2: the Morey Island incident in nineteen forty seven. Of course,
• 2:34:40
  Speaker 2: the other thing that Roswell happened in nineteen forty seven
• 2:34:42
  Speaker 2: as well, and of course Fred Christman is implicated by
• 2:34:46
  Speaker 2: Garrison and the Kennedy assassination. You know, fast forward some years.
• 2:34:52
  Speaker 2: It's all a bit of a crazy coincidence. And you
• 2:34:57
  Speaker 2: know what he's interested in here is, of course anti
• 2:35:01
  Speaker 2: gravitic gravitic technology populating Mars, long range space travel, warp drives,
• 2:35:11
  Speaker 2: time travel, wormholes, uh, you name it. And then something
• 2:35:16
  Speaker 2: interesting happens in I think it was two thousand and three, Joe,
• 2:35:21
  Speaker 2: there was an autistic hacker with Asperger syndrome from the
• 2:35:26
  Speaker 2: UK who hacked a NASA computer and found I guess
• 2:35:38
  Speaker 2: it was navy personnel and non terrestrial entities listed as servicemen,
• 2:35:48
  Speaker 2: pictures of UFOs, all kinds of stuff. Gary McKinnon was
• 2:35:55
  Speaker 2: his name, and they wanted to extrad him over to
• 2:36:01
  Speaker 2: America to face charges. You know, America was trying to
• 2:36:05
  Speaker 2: get him over here, and they went to corridor over
• 2:36:07
  Speaker 2: there and decided that they're not sending him here to
• 2:36:11
  Speaker 2: face charges. Now he could never travel here or else.
• 2:36:15
  Speaker 2: He could be held here, but they basically ruled it,
• 2:36:19
  Speaker 2: you know, due to his condition that he wasn't fit
• 2:36:24
  Speaker 2: to travel over here and answer for his crimes, if
• 2:36:30
  Speaker 2: you will. But he apparently hacked these NASA computers and
• 2:36:34
  Speaker 2: found all kinds of crazy shit, like you know, off world,
• 2:36:39
  Speaker 2: you know, stations, substations in lower thorbit, Mars colonies, off
• 2:36:47
  Speaker 2: at you know, non terrestrial entities, and I forget how
• 2:36:52
  Speaker 2: many different kinds of aliens they said they were, but
• 2:36:57
  Speaker 2: you know, if it's true, and of course Novelle thought
• 2:37:01
  Speaker 2: it was, he used this this hack to bolster what
• 2:37:08
  Speaker 2: he's talking about, trying to help everybody on and like
• 2:37:12
  Speaker 2: you put like you put up earlier, is the et
• 2:37:15
  Speaker 2: grift now you know? Or is it a grift? I mean,
• 2:37:20
  Speaker 2: it can certainly be used as one, sure, mm hmm.
• 2:37:25
  Speaker 2: But the truth of you know, aliens and UFOs and
• 2:37:30
  Speaker 2: and what our shadow or secret government basically they were saying,
• 2:37:34
  Speaker 2: it's it's a coalition of of of all the major
• 2:37:38
  Speaker 2: countries in the world. The United Nations are part of this,
• 2:37:41
  Speaker 2: and it's all super top secret ship. But and they
• 2:37:44
  Speaker 2: all work together to do this, and you know, apparently
• 2:37:50
  Speaker 2: they've been had this secret space program for years, going
• 2:37:54
  Speaker 2: back to I think the eighties, you know where where
• 2:37:58
  Speaker 2: they're they've gotten it all. But this aliens and alien
• 2:38:02
  Speaker 2: technology and anti gravitic technology and free energy and all
• 2:38:10
  Speaker 2: this other stuff. So who the hell knows.
• 2:38:15
  Speaker 7: But man, he's ahead of his game, ahead of the game.
• 2:38:19
  Speaker 7: He's ahead of Bob Blazaar, he's ahead of Alex Jones.
• 2:38:24
  Speaker 7: So he definitely had some information, maybe enough to be
• 2:38:29
  Speaker 7: dangerous possibly, But yeah, I don't know where he got it,
• 2:38:33
  Speaker 7: but he had some.
• 2:38:36
  Speaker 2: Well supposedly he knows, and or I don't know if
• 2:38:43
  Speaker 2: he came up with his own or him and a
• 2:38:46
  Speaker 2: group of these aviary people came up with anti gravitic technology.
• 2:38:51
  Speaker 2: You know what the UFOs used to move around and
• 2:38:57
  Speaker 2: you know apparently you know, you go to these big
• 2:39:00
  Speaker 2: areas based companies and you know, if you can grift
• 2:39:05
  Speaker 2: them into funding your research, right, you know it can
• 2:39:13
  Speaker 2: be used as a grift for sure.
• 2:39:18
  Speaker 16: Yeah, yeah, yeah, And and NK just had a comment
• 2:39:23
  Speaker 16: here I want to talk about he's right about the
• 2:39:26
  Speaker 16: CIA's and drug trafficking money to drug trafficking to raise
• 2:39:30
  Speaker 16: money off label, as.
• 2:39:32
  Speaker 7: Malcolm Blanc wrote about. Yeah. See see that's the thing
• 2:39:36
  Speaker 7: with I don't want to see these grifters, right, they
• 2:39:40
  Speaker 7: have kernels of truth in their story.
• 2:39:43
  Speaker 2: Right that knows things they shouldn't know. If they're really
• 2:39:47
  Speaker 2: just nobody right.
• 2:39:52
  Speaker 6: Now?
• 2:39:53
  Speaker 7: Is it because they have access to that or they're
• 2:39:55
  Speaker 7: just really perceptive or or I don't know, but it
• 2:40:01
  Speaker 7: definitely makes you wonder about it for sure. So as
• 2:40:06
  Speaker 7: we kind of wrap this up, Rob, I definitely had
• 2:40:10
  Speaker 7: my thoughts pre this show. I had my thoughts after
• 2:40:16
  Speaker 7: we looked into it for a few days Gordon Novel,
• 2:40:18
  Speaker 7: and I kind of have my thoughts now, and I'm saying,
• 2:40:23
  Speaker 7: I'm like landing on this one hundred percent, But I'm
• 2:40:29
  Speaker 7: not sure he I mean, he of course denied involvement
• 2:40:33
  Speaker 7: in anything. Of course, his involvement would have been with
• 2:40:37
  Speaker 7: the characters of the assassination, and you know, said he
• 2:40:41
  Speaker 7: knew Oswald and Ruby at different points. I'm not sure
• 2:40:46
  Speaker 7: I can really believe anything he says from it's It
• 2:40:55
  Speaker 7: would be hard for me.
• 2:40:58
  Speaker 2: But the thing is, Joe, he is definitely around the
• 2:41:02
  Speaker 2: right group of people to know Oswald.
• 2:41:07
  Speaker 7: Yes, a million persons.
• 2:41:08
  Speaker 2: Married to fucking Marlene Mancuso, Yeah, who allegedly Oswald and
• 2:41:15
  Speaker 2: in the restaurant all the time, Yes, Carlos and Sergio
• 2:41:20
  Speaker 2: orcotcias Smith. It's beside Banister's.
• 2:41:24
  Speaker 7: Office for sure, Rob, I don't.
• 2:41:27
  Speaker 2: Doubt a thing with Ferry and Smith.
• 2:41:31
  Speaker 10: That's what I was gonna say, Like I think I
• 2:41:34
  Speaker 10: think that that is accurate. He was around Orcottias Smith,
• 2:41:39
  Speaker 10: he was around Banister and Ferry. That doesn't surprise me
• 2:41:45
  Speaker 10: at all, and I believe it. But does that mean
• 2:41:48
  Speaker 10: he had any special knowledge?
• 2:41:50
  Speaker 7: And of course you heard him vigorously defending the CIA
• 2:41:56
  Speaker 7: and their alleged involvement.
• 2:42:00
  Speaker 10: It's it's one of those uh New Orleans.
• 2:42:05
  Speaker 7: And mysteries that I think will live on for a
• 2:42:07
  Speaker 7: little bit.
• 2:42:08
  Speaker 2: But yeah, did him and Oswald know each other? I
• 2:42:10
  Speaker 2: mean they were both born in New Orleans about the
• 2:42:13
  Speaker 2: same age. Seems to me like they were born on
• 2:42:16
  Speaker 2: different sides of the track, though, if you know what
• 2:42:18
  Speaker 2: I'm saying, Okay, but both involved in some seedy, underbelly
• 2:42:24
  Speaker 2: type shit, you know, because at the time Oswald is it,
• 2:42:29
  Speaker 2: you know, in the Marine Corps or defecting to Russia.
• 2:42:31
  Speaker 2: He's boosting cars and stripping them and selling stuff, drag
• 2:42:36
  Speaker 2: racing things, and then all of a sudden, within the
• 2:42:40
  Speaker 2: next year he's robbing you know, the Huma or Homa
• 2:42:45
  Speaker 2: municialty co. David Ferry and Lighton Martin's and Louis Rebel
• 2:42:49
  Speaker 2: and you know, all these other guys, and it's like
• 2:42:55
  Speaker 2: that transfers into now you know he's an electronics expert,
• 2:42:59
  Speaker 2: demolitions expert, karate expert, working with all these anti Castro
• 2:43:03
  Speaker 2: Cubans that we know were around at the time doing
• 2:43:07
  Speaker 2: their anti Castro Cuban thing in New Orleans. And then
• 2:43:11
  Speaker 2: you have Oswald coming back in sixty three. Now, in
• 2:43:14
  Speaker 2: the one video, Noville said he has an airtight alibi
• 2:43:19
  Speaker 2: for November twenty second, sixty three. He doesn't mention what
• 2:43:22
  Speaker 2: it was, right, which is interesting.
• 2:43:26
  Speaker 10: So yeah, I mean, of course, as always, we leave
• 2:43:32
  Speaker 10: it up to you are very educated viewers and listeners,
• 2:43:37
  Speaker 10: to make up your own mind. But there's no doubt
• 2:43:42
  Speaker 10: whatsoever that this guy was a fascinating character trip and
• 2:43:48
  Speaker 10: was definitely involved in a lot of the scuffoozas we
• 2:43:52
  Speaker 10: talk about in New Orleans for sure.
• 2:43:55
  Speaker 7: Years before that you have ka assassination.
• 2:43:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and he was into all this shit balls deep
• 2:44:00
  Speaker 2: until the day he died, and we didn't mention it here.
• 2:44:07
  Speaker 2: But there is more to the story if you'd like
• 2:44:09
  Speaker 2: to go out and find it. The Jerry Pippen radio Show,
• 2:44:13
  Speaker 2: I believe did interviews with Gordon Novell's son, Sir Novill
• 2:44:17
  Speaker 2: after he passed away, and allegedly reveals more about everything.
• 2:44:24
  Speaker 2: But you know it's a lot man, you know, with
• 2:44:30
  Speaker 2: Gordon Noville, he knows some interesting people, He's in some
• 2:44:33
  Speaker 2: interesting places, some interesting times, and I just don't know
• 2:44:41
  Speaker 2: what to make of it.
• 2:44:46
  Speaker 7: Yeah, it's definitely one of those New Orleans characters that
• 2:44:49
  Speaker 7: will live in infamy for sure.
• 2:44:51
  Speaker 2: I think, Oh yeah, all right, folks, that's it for
• 2:44:56
  Speaker 2: Gordon Noville. What a novel idea? Right, I had to
• 2:45:01
  Speaker 2: come up with a catching name for the show. And
• 2:45:04
  Speaker 2: with that being said, thank you to everybody out there
• 2:45:08
  Speaker 2: for hanging out with us and putting up with us
• 2:45:10
  Speaker 2: for almost three hours here you appen like six Barbers.
• 2:45:14
  Speaker 2: As for the usual, you know, we go deep on
• 2:45:17
  Speaker 2: this show. We try not to leave anything out, leave
• 2:45:21
  Speaker 2: anything to the imagination. So you know that's what we
• 2:45:25
  Speaker 2: do around here. So without any further Ado, let's call
• 2:45:28
  Speaker 2: in our buddy.
• 2:45:29
  Speaker 7: Yeah, and speaking of speaking before you call her, speaking
• 2:45:33
  Speaker 7: of going deep, Rob, we're going to be going super
• 2:45:37
  Speaker 7: deep next week with a very special guest, which member.
• 2:45:43
  Speaker 2: Who will review next Wednesday show?
• 2:45:48
  Speaker 7: Exactly you took the rest of my mouth. Make sure
• 2:45:53
  Speaker 7: it didn't uh drop the ball, But yes, we're excited
• 2:45:58
  Speaker 7: about that. Good guy, and yeah with that being said, oh.
• 2:46:12
  Speaker 2: Oh any girl.
• 2:46:18
  Speaker 13: Mm hmm yeah.
• 2:46:23
  Speaker 1: H m hm.
• 2:46:26
  Speaker 17: The greatest cam the greatest crimes are committed justice and
• 2:46:32
  Speaker 17: salid that could be used for him or against him
• 2:46:36
  Speaker 17: in this strange case.
• 2:46:38
  Speaker 2: Good night. Imagine Jack is in New Orleans and dance
• 2:46:44
  Speaker 2: like this. Good night.
• 2:46:49
  Speaker 4: Night night, Sally, thank you for thank you for staying
• 2:46:53
  Speaker 4: up as always selling I love you.
• 2:46:58
  Speaker 2: Until next Wednesday, Folks, we out this bitch. Peace and
• 2:47:06
  Speaker 2: Ruby grease