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Tom Zawistowski - WeThePeopleConvention.org · Brian Thomas

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Speaker 1: See the talk station.
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Speaker 2: It's seven thirty one here fifty five KCD talk station.
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Speaker 2: Happy Tuesday, Good time to be tuned in the return
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Speaker 2: of Tom Zawastowski. You can find him at we the
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Speaker 2: People at convention dot org. He's got a podcast each
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Speaker 2: week that's worth listening to and also posting up some
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Speaker 2: great articles and thoughts and opinions, including the anti Data
0:23
Speaker 2: center hysteria is a foreign funded repeat of every failed
0:26
Speaker 2: ludite crusade. Nice headline, Tom z, welcome back to the program,
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Speaker 2: my friend.
0:32
Speaker 1: Glad to be with.
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Speaker 3: You, and after your test that Joe puts your chorice
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Speaker 3: on pronunciation pronunci names.
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Speaker 1: I'm glad you can say Zawastowski. It's awesome.
0:41
Speaker 2: That's an easy one. Yeah, you know, it may have
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Speaker 2: been that I mispronounced it previously. My buddy John News
0:47
Speaker 2: as he sent me a text after I endeavored to
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Speaker 2: read through those names, he said, are those common spellings.
0:56
Speaker 1: Great?
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Speaker 3: Here?
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Speaker 2: Sometimes that's all that keeps me going through the day
1:00
Speaker 2: of terrible headlines, as the humor I get from Joe
1:02
Speaker 2: and folks like a John out there chiming in the topic.
1:06
Speaker 2: So you know, I read these the couple of articles
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Speaker 2: about the chat GPT, which is of course kind of
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Speaker 2: an offspring of artificial intelligence generally, kind of an offspring
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Speaker 2: of data centers. Generally, you need these massive data centers
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Speaker 2: to crunch all of the information that allows I guess
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Speaker 2: chat GPT to function the way it does quite often
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Speaker 2: in a horrific way, tom Z. So we can all agree.
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Speaker 2: I think that like for example, chat GPT can be
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Speaker 2: dangerous and based upon the way it's programmed, can be
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Speaker 2: nefarious and can be biased and twisted, which to me
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Speaker 2: suggests maybe don't rely on it, which is where I
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Speaker 2: am as a default mechanism. No ludite, am I, But
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Speaker 2: I'm not going to go down that road because I
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Speaker 2: don't need it. But it doesn't mean that artifica or
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Speaker 2: the data centers themselves carry with it the same you know, taint,
1:55
Speaker 2: or or that they are just by virtue of their
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Speaker 2: existence dangerous or a nefari is Tom Your take, Well,
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Speaker 2: you're making a very important point because the people are
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Speaker 2: getting the two things confused.
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Speaker 3: Okay, So you know, when I'm talking about data centers,
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Speaker 3: I'm talking about you know, the physical structure, the you know,
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Speaker 3: the use of water, electricity, the noise, you know, the
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Speaker 3: things that people are concerned about, but also, holy cow,
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Speaker 3: benefits the property taxes these places are going to pay.
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Speaker 1: That can really help, you know.
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Speaker 3: The people are complaining about their property taxes being too high.
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Speaker 3: So that's one side of it. The other side of
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Speaker 3: it is is AI good or bad?
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Speaker 1: You know?
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Speaker 3: And the Pope did an encyclical over the more of
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Speaker 3: the weekend which was very good. People should read it
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Speaker 3: where he's you know, raising the moral concerns about AI
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Speaker 3: and all that. But this article you refer to it
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Speaker 3: we people convention dot org. It's written by this really
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Speaker 3: interesting guy called Alexander Muse who posts a lot of.
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Speaker 1: Things on as really smart guy.
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Speaker 3: He kind of goes through it from a historical perspective,
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Speaker 3: comparing data centers to the invention of electricity, you know,
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Speaker 3: the railroads, the highways. Every new technology as its opponents,
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Speaker 3: and there's fear connected with it because it's new. You
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Speaker 3: don't understand it. But it's hard for people to separate,
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Speaker 3: you know, the the AI. You know, is AI good
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Speaker 3: or bad? Is it ready now or not? Versus is
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Speaker 3: this data center okay to put in our in our backyard?
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Speaker 3: Particularly Brian, when there is a literally organized effort by
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Speaker 3: people outside this country and inside this country to confuse
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Speaker 3: you and just completely destroy any common conversation you can
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Speaker 3: have about that question.
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Speaker 1: Is it is it okay to put a data center here?
3:44
Speaker 3: Let's pause.
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Speaker 2: We'll elaborate on all these points with Tom z Awastowski.
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Speaker 2: You can find them online. We the People Convention dot org.
3:49
Speaker 2: Be right back, and if if you've got GARCD talk station,
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Speaker 2: Happy Tuesday. Brian Thomas with Tom Zawastowski from We the
3:56
Speaker 2: People Convention dot org. Tom was not arrested in the
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Speaker 2: street overtakes take last night. Maybe that's how I can
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Speaker 2: pronounce your name there, Tom Anyway. In terms of data centers,
4:07
Speaker 2: before we get to the know the belief, and I'm
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Speaker 2: firmly of the mind that the Chinese Communist Party not
4:12
Speaker 2: Chinese people. Mind you, for those who immediately accuse someone
4:15
Speaker 2: of being racist merely because they attack the Chinese Communist
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Speaker 2: Party got to hate when people do that, Tom Anyway,
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Speaker 2: they have an incentive to try to undermine our desire
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Speaker 2: to embrace the data centers. We can get to that
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Speaker 2: in a minute. I know you're going to elaborate on it,
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Speaker 2: but you mentioned three of the specific reasons people will
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Speaker 2: protest are AI coming to their community in spite of
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Speaker 2: the fact that it will generate pretty massive tax dollars.
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Speaker 2: You mentioned water, electricity, and noise. Now, as I hear
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Speaker 2: that with the exceptional electricity, which we can deal with separately,
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Speaker 2: water and noise, I am of the mind because I've
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Speaker 2: heard so many times that the data centers don't necessarily
5:00
Speaker 2: depends on what type of system they have to cool
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Speaker 2: all the electronics, but they don't use up the water.
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Speaker 2: They merely bring the water out, use it to recirculate
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Speaker 2: it in a closed system, and then put the water back. Now,
5:11
Speaker 2: some have pointed out that well, during that loop process,
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Speaker 2: chemicals are introduced and pollutants are put into you know,
5:17
Speaker 2: as a consequence of the pipes or whatever. So give
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Speaker 2: them their due on that. But that's something that seems
5:23
Speaker 2: to need to be easily remedied if you have a
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Speaker 2: regulation in place it says the water coming out must
5:28
Speaker 2: be equally clean as the water going in. Hell, if
5:31
Speaker 2: we can scrub crap out of coal production, I imagine we
5:34
Speaker 2: can manage doing a little filtration on water, right Tom.
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Speaker 1: Well, see, now.
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Speaker 3: Again you're making another great point because we're exaggerating the
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Speaker 3: effects of these data centers and not even putting in
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Speaker 3: context of the you know, the steel plants we have
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Speaker 3: and all the auto manufacturing, and you know the things
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Speaker 3: that are using all kinds of chemicals.
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Speaker 1: So let me give you an example.
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Speaker 3: On Friday, I went to an open house in Shaylersville Township,
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Speaker 3: which is in northern Portage County, for a data center
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Speaker 3: that they have that they're proposing there. And in social
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Speaker 3: media on Facebook, they're saying this thing is going to
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Speaker 3: use a million gallons of water a day and in
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Speaker 3: huge amounts of water. Okay, Now, I toms Awastowski went
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Speaker 3: to Masslin, Ohio to visit a data center that's already
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Speaker 3: built that this company is proposing a Shaylersville. I go
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Speaker 3: to the data center and Brian, there's racks of computers,
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Speaker 3: and I've had racks of computers in my business, and
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Speaker 3: they give off a lot of heat. And right across
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Speaker 3: from them is a wall that looks like the radiator
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Speaker 3: in my car. Okay, And going through that wall is
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Speaker 3: the same stuff that's in the radiator of your car that.
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Speaker 1: Does what cools your engine.
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Speaker 3: So the heat from the service goes through that wall
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Speaker 3: and comes out and it's cool on the other side,
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Speaker 3: time you put water in your radiator, Brian, Well, the
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Speaker 3: last time you put water in your radiator.
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Speaker 2: Never really mean I own a modern car. I'm not
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Speaker 2: driving around in a nineteen forty forty.
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Speaker 1: Get this, Get this.
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Speaker 3: I gotta finish this because it's it's really a part
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Speaker 3: of the problem. So at this open house they've got
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Speaker 3: to display that shows this is our closed loop system.
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Speaker 1: By closed loop is like the radiator on your car.
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Speaker 3: They're gonna use three thousand gallons.
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Speaker 1: Of water total.
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Speaker 3: There's no well, they're not drilling any wells, they're not
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Speaker 3: putting any water back anywhere. They fill it up, put
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Speaker 3: the free on or whatever the chemical is that does it,
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Speaker 3: and then that's it.
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Speaker 1: People would come to the.
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Speaker 3: Open house, see that, talk to a person who's like
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Speaker 3: a technician who knows they're talking about and look at
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Speaker 3: them and say, I don't believe you.
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Speaker 1: You're lying. Okay, Now, this is.
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Speaker 3: The difference I want to make for you and everyone
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Speaker 3: listening between cracking, which is the fight that the Teep
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Speaker 3: Party fought in Ohio. We literally saved fracking in the
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Speaker 3: United States when the left tried to kill it by
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Speaker 3: saying it's going to poison your water. It's gonna take
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Speaker 3: your water out of your well. Your faucet's gonna start
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Speaker 3: on fire because the gas will.
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Speaker 1: Go into your water.
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Speaker 3: All that stuff was lies that was put forward to
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Speaker 3: stop us from fracking. I thought that fight eleven years ago.
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Speaker 3: The difference is back then I could have an intelligent
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Speaker 3: conversation with someone.
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Speaker 1: Now, after you and I and every one of your.
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Speaker 3: Listeners has been subjected to the COVID hoax, the twenty
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Speaker 3: twenty election hopes, Russia, Russia, Russia, social media censorship. The
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Speaker 3: difference today is that we've been conditioned to not trust
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Speaker 3: anyone or anything.
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Speaker 1: So how do we have a conversation?
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Speaker 3: How can I bring facts to your listeners when they
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Speaker 3: believe some stupid thing on the internet for no reason
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Speaker 3: and they won't listen to any.
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Speaker 2: Thought an ever growing problem, Tom Zawastowski. That's get people
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Speaker 2: getting their closed speaking of closed loop, closed loop information environment,
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Speaker 2: only going to one source or sources that they agree
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Speaker 2: with or that appeal to whatever conclusion they've reached and
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Speaker 2: refused to use logic and reason to to sort of
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Speaker 2: listen to the retorts, listening to points.
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Speaker 1: That you make.
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Speaker 2: How can you argue that a closed loop cooling system
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Speaker 2: which doesn't spit anything out is polluting our water. It's
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Speaker 2: a finite amount of whatever solution is in there. Maybe
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Speaker 2: they fill it with anti freeze, which has a heating
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Speaker 2: and cooling effect. Whatever, it's not going out into the world. Now,
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Speaker 2: that doesn't mean that all systems operate that way, because
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Speaker 2: I've been told some of the systems draw water in
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Speaker 2: and then put the water back out. Let's say you
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Speaker 2: got a river, and this is maybe theoretical, but it's
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Speaker 2: what I've been told. Water goes in, it cools the plan,
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Speaker 2: and it goes back out. To the extent that system
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Speaker 2: is in place in any given facility, I think we
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Speaker 2: have the technology to clean any water that come. You
10:00
Speaker 2: could deal with that up front. And you know, in
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Speaker 2: so far as noise is concerned, you know, we'll build
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Speaker 2: windmill farms of thousands and thousands of acres of droning,
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Speaker 2: bird killing windmills the name of keeping carbon dioxide out
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Speaker 2: of the area. You gotta stare at them, hundred plus
10:14
Speaker 2: foot towers that are monstrous and ugly. That's okay, no
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Speaker 2: NIMBI suit to keep that crap out of your yard.
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Speaker 2: And what does it give us? Inefficient electricity production. It
10:24
Speaker 2: only works when the wind blows.
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Speaker 1: But that's okay.
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Speaker 2: You got a small footprint AI facility which apparently is
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Speaker 2: churning out a lot of good in addition to potential evil,
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Speaker 2: but also provides some jobs and some tax revenue for
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Speaker 2: the area. People complain about it.
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Speaker 1: Noise.
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Speaker 2: Oh, they have noise statutes, don't they, Tom, I mean, Ryan.
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Speaker 1: It's almost it's even's crazier than that.
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Speaker 3: This data center is literally next to the Ohio Turnpike.
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Speaker 3: How much noise you think is coming off the Ohio
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Speaker 3: Turnpike and Nasaline.
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Speaker 1: I walked around.
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Speaker 3: The facility with a a noise meter, okay, and measured
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Speaker 3: the noise all over the place. They're literally our houses
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Speaker 3: thirty five feet off the property at this data center
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Speaker 3: in Massaline, and the noise was nothing less more than
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Speaker 3: traffic noise.
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Speaker 1: Okay.
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Speaker 3: But again, you got to have this conversation. And I
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Speaker 3: respect the fact that people, you know, they want transparency.
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Speaker 3: And I listened yesterday to the Ohio Channel testimony, the
11:29
Speaker 3: you know, the negative testimony by citizens about data centers.
11:34
Speaker 3: Two things were really important there. The first one was
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Speaker 3: there's a lot of government agencies like townships and county
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Speaker 3: officials and economic development people who are lying to people. Okay,
11:48
Speaker 3: and here's the problem we're having. And I saw this yesterday,
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Speaker 3: and you made a good point. The problem is they're
11:55
Speaker 3: using the term data center, and everyone thinks every data
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Speaker 3: center is like the monstrosity and uta they're proposing that's
12:03
Speaker 3: the size of Manhattan. Okay, so if you say data center,
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Speaker 3: they go immediately to that.
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Speaker 1: But that's not true. Every data center is different.
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Speaker 3: The ones we're talking about here in Ohio and some
12:15
Speaker 3: of these places, and there are some big ones in
12:16
Speaker 3: Allow two or three, but they look like the storage
12:20
Speaker 3: units around Cincinnati where you store your RV or your boat.
12:24
Speaker 3: I mean, it's nothing compared to the plants we see
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Speaker 3: all over Ohio.
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Speaker 1: But here's the thing that we've got to do.
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Speaker 3: We've got to start to have a fair conversation. And
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Speaker 3: I wrote to Vivek Ramaswami yesterday. I wrote to Alex
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Speaker 3: the chairman of the Republic Party, and I said, guys,
12:42
Speaker 3: you've got to understand we've got a real problem here
12:44
Speaker 3: because the left is splitting our base. The left is
12:49
Speaker 3: getting us to go against the people in our base
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Speaker 3: who are now against data centers. And if we're for them.
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Speaker 3: We're gonna have a problem in November with the election
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Speaker 3: if we don't start to spend money to get the
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Speaker 3: truth out and to fight for transparency, to basically say
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Speaker 3: no NDAs and the wine with his you know tax
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Speaker 3: exect you know, uh breaks for data centers. There's no
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Speaker 3: need for tax breaks for.
13:14
Speaker 1: DAIS data centers.
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Speaker 3: They're making a ton of money and this data center
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Speaker 3: in Saylersville isn't asking for any tax breaks.
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Speaker 1: We have to be on the side of those things.
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Speaker 3: And you know what we got to do most of all,
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Speaker 3: you got to get the PUCO to protect citizens' rate
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Speaker 3: bills from data centers. This is not the data centers saying, oh,
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Speaker 3: I want you to pay for my electricity. Read the
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Speaker 3: article at read the People Convention dot org about this
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Speaker 3: and you'll find that the problem is the PUCO isn't
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Speaker 3: protecting the citizens, not that the data centers are trying
13:48
Speaker 3: to hurt you.
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Speaker 1: And that's part of the hearings that are going on.
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Speaker 3: And they're gonna have more testimony on Thursday at the
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Speaker 3: Ohio Channel and you're gonna see the ohioi PA and
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Speaker 3: the Ohio UCO who are really the culprits in this
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Speaker 3: that need to protect us. It's not the data centers,
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Speaker 3: it's our government.
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Speaker 2: Let's pause from one. We have just a couple of
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Speaker 2: minutes left with Tom Zawastowski. We the People Convention dot org.
14:09
Speaker 2: Find Tom bookmark the site. You'd be glad you did.
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Speaker 1: Be right back.
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Speaker 2: I first want to mention Prestigentias improving the way families
14:15
Speaker 2: come together in the kitchen for.
14:17
Speaker 1: Fifty five krse the talk station.
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Speaker 2: Seven fifty two if you have PERCD talk station right
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Speaker 2: the time was the Tom z Awastowski We People Convention
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Speaker 2: dot org, where you can check out the article we've
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Speaker 2: been talking about this morning. The anti data center hysteria
14:30
Speaker 2: is a foreign funded repeat of every failed lu Dai crusade.
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Speaker 2: I just love the headline there, Tom, you dealt with
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Speaker 2: the water lie at closed loop systems, And I guess
14:41
Speaker 2: according to the fun facts that this article reveals, you know,
14:45
Speaker 2: may three thousand gallons maybe used today or something which
14:48
Speaker 2: is less or typical about office building. But moving aside
14:52
Speaker 2: from that, I appreciate the interjection of the point about
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Speaker 2: an average eighteen whole golf course in America south five
15:00
Speaker 2: one hundred thousand gallons of water per day during growing season,
15:05
Speaker 2: and nobody complains about a moratorium on golf. But over
15:08
Speaker 2: to the electricity, clearly they use a lot of electricity.
15:11
Speaker 2: Nobody can deny that. And you know we've struggled with
15:16
Speaker 2: peak power problems here. I know my electricity bill went
15:19
Speaker 2: up because I guess do kind of go out and
15:22
Speaker 2: buy additional electricity from the open market, which costs a
15:25
Speaker 2: lot more over the wintertime. How do we address that?
15:28
Speaker 2: My answer has always been, well, let the data centers
15:30
Speaker 2: bring their own power supply with them, and I always
15:33
Speaker 2: then default two small modular reactors. I don't know if
15:35
Speaker 2: we're there yet, but we got regulatory hurdles that put
15:38
Speaker 2: a problem in front of that. But that's something that
15:40
Speaker 2: every community could benefit from. If they bring an SMR,
15:43
Speaker 2: it'll be more than enough to power the AI facility
15:45
Speaker 2: and the neighborhood might get the benefit of the extra power.
15:48
Speaker 2: Tom your thoughts.
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Speaker 3: Yeah, you'll see an article on our website where you
15:52
Speaker 3: people Convention dot org. We're President Trump called all these
15:55
Speaker 3: data center companies in and had them sign an agreement
15:58
Speaker 3: that said, you will bring your own power, you will
16:01
Speaker 3: do exactly what you said, and they're willing to do it.
16:04
Speaker 3: The problem is if you read the article that we're
16:06
Speaker 3: talking about, they talk about how the public utility commissions
16:10
Speaker 3: in these various states are stopping them from doing this.
16:14
Speaker 3: And in Ohio we've had just gross mismanagement of our power.
16:19
Speaker 3: Again going back to hey, let's close twenty four coal
16:23
Speaker 3: plants that would be really handy to have right now,
16:25
Speaker 3: wouldn't they right? And we got all this coal, but
16:27
Speaker 3: we got nowhere to burn it. You know, this is
16:30
Speaker 3: part of the problem. And nuclear you know, Ohio ledded
16:33
Speaker 3: nuclear babcocks and willbox out of Barbara to Ohio like
16:37
Speaker 3: invented nuclear plants, and why aren't we doing that? What
16:41
Speaker 3: we're starting to but we're behind the curve. So your
16:46
Speaker 3: point is really important. I want everyone to understand this.
16:50
Speaker 3: The bottom line is we can build safe data centers
16:54
Speaker 3: that will benefit the community. What we need to do
16:58
Speaker 3: is have transfer guaranty. No NDA's no, you know, not
17:03
Speaker 3: telling people what's going on from you know, the township
17:05
Speaker 3: trustees and stuff. Yeah, and we need to answer their questions.
17:08
Speaker 3: And then in this Sellersville site, here's the deal. I'm
17:12
Speaker 3: talking to the developers. I'm saying, here's the deal. You're
17:15
Speaker 3: gonna sign a contract with the Sellersville's trustees that say, this.
17:19
Speaker 1: Is exactly how you're going to build it, just like
17:21
Speaker 1: you said.
17:22
Speaker 3: And you're gonna answer these specific questions about noise, about water,
17:26
Speaker 3: about power and all that stuff. And then you're going
17:30
Speaker 3: to give us a guarantee instead of projections about property taxes,
17:35
Speaker 3: you're gonna commit to some minimum payments that the community's
17:39
Speaker 3: gonna get because it's huge. I mean, I'm talking Shellersville Township.
17:43
Speaker 3: If this data center does what they think it's gonna do,
17:46
Speaker 3: it will double their township budget, double it.
17:50
Speaker 1: The school district will get two million dollars year.
17:53
Speaker 2: That's exactly what I was gonna ask. Aren't the teachers
17:55
Speaker 2: unions in favor of this? Because of that point?
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Speaker 3: Tom Well, her intendant's eyes got real big when they
18:02
Speaker 3: told her about that, and I we're gonna see how
18:05
Speaker 3: much pressure the unions have from their communist brethren right
18:10
Speaker 3: to to cut off their noses spite their face.
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Speaker 1: So then the third part is we're gonna have.
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Speaker 3: A bond that's tied to this contract that says, hey,
18:19
Speaker 3: if the closed loop system leads, you know, there's insurance
18:23
Speaker 3: to cover for, you know, fixing the problem. Okay, So
18:27
Speaker 3: and So the bottom line is we can do this
18:30
Speaker 3: in an intelligent way without the hysteria. And yesterday I'll
18:36
Speaker 3: finish with this and you'll laugh. I lost it when
18:39
Speaker 3: when I was watching it. Here he goes to say,
18:41
Speaker 3: and a woman brought up Silent Spring, the Margaret Sanger
18:46
Speaker 3: book about DDT care you're damaging the shells of birds,
18:50
Speaker 3: you know, eggs, and.
18:51
Speaker 1: How we had to band DDT.
18:53
Speaker 3: She brought it up and compared data centers to DDT.
18:58
Speaker 3: When that book was totally disgraced and found there was
19:02
Speaker 3: a complete lie. Indeed, the banning of d T actually
19:06
Speaker 3: killed hundreds of thousands of people around the world because
19:11
Speaker 3: they couldn't use it to stop mosquitoes. And they brought
19:14
Speaker 3: it up in that hearing. That's the hysteria I'm talking about.
19:17
Speaker 3: You're making decision based on nonsense, right, the climate change,
19:22
Speaker 3: you know, to the un just versus climate change?
19:25
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, because it's all bull crap.
19:28
Speaker 2: It is hock facts.
19:30
Speaker 3: Let's get to the bottom of this and let's do
19:32
Speaker 3: what's right for America and for our communities and for Ohio.
19:36
Speaker 3: The Pirch County Teaparty dot com also you'll see this
19:39
Speaker 3: whole Shalersville thing spelled out with all the details.
19:42
Speaker 1: Go to that too.
19:43
Speaker 2: There's another side to check out, a edition to week
19:44
Speaker 2: the people at convention dot org. Tom, it's always a
19:46
Speaker 2: pleasure having here on the show. I have a fantastic weekend.
19:48
Speaker 2: Keep up the great work, my friend. We'll deal with you.
19:50
Speaker 2: We'll talk again next week.
19:52
Speaker 1: Don't go