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SMNTY Classics: Ellen E. Armstrong · Stuff Mom Never Told You

0:05
Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I don't come to
0:07
Speaker 1: stephan would never told you protection iHeart idea. And it's
0:19
Speaker 1: already February. Can you believe in Samantha your favorite month?
0:22
Speaker 1: To say? I hate? I hate it so much. It
0:26
Speaker 1: is a complicated one. It is, uh, well, time is
0:31
Speaker 1: flying by. In my opinion. We try to as we
0:35
Speaker 1: always say, you know, we try to focus on highlights,
0:39
Speaker 1: um wind with color, marginalized communities all year round. That's
0:44
Speaker 1: like a very important part to our whole mission, the
0:47
Speaker 1: whole podcast. But it is Black History Month, so we
0:51
Speaker 1: thought we would. I think this is kind of a
0:54
Speaker 1: tradition now where we bring back, uh some classics that
0:58
Speaker 1: Eve's brought on for Female First. Um, some amazing women
1:03
Speaker 1: who often don't get enough attention or spolight and have
1:08
Speaker 1: like fascinating stories. Um yes, yes, and this first one
1:14
Speaker 1: I remember this episode. It was about the mistress of
1:16
Speaker 1: modern magic. Yes, so please enjoy this classic episode. Hey,
1:28
Speaker 1: this is Annie and Samantha. I'm welcome to stuff I've
1:31
Speaker 1: never told you production of I Heart Radio. It is
1:42
Speaker 1: time for another episode of Female First, which means we
1:45
Speaker 1: are once again joined by our good friend and colleague Eves. Hello, Eves. Hey,
1:50
Speaker 1: Hey y'all. I oh, We're so happy to have you.
1:53
Speaker 1: As always. We did have some technical difficulties this morning,
1:59
Speaker 1: but I'm supposed to be a professional. But the fact
2:05
Speaker 1: that you caught it before we were in the middle
2:07
Speaker 1: of recording, yeah, I knew. That's where I don't know
2:11
Speaker 1: until after the fact. That's what I was afraid of.
2:14
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, God, like, if if this all,
2:16
Speaker 1: if this all falls apart in the middle of the episode,
2:19
Speaker 1: I'm going to be so sad because I feel like
2:22
Speaker 1: losing content, like losing anything you recorded or anything you
2:25
Speaker 1: have saved. It's just it's the waist feeling in the world. Yeah. Yeah,
2:30
Speaker 1: and I've done that twice now. When I first started
2:36
Speaker 1: on stuff, I never told you as the producer, I
2:38
Speaker 1: was so nervous because again I had like no training
2:41
Speaker 1: for that job, and they taught me, but I was
2:43
Speaker 1: just like, I'm a nervous soul anyway. And then they're like, okay,
2:46
Speaker 1: record this podcast, and I forgot to press record and
2:51
Speaker 1: I realized like ten minutes in. But it took me
2:54
Speaker 1: like two minutes before I got the courage to stop them,
2:57
Speaker 1: and I lied and I said something like Oh it
2:59
Speaker 1: was a technical man, but I definitely just forgot there
3:09
Speaker 1: is what I'm trying to say. Yes, I'll be there. Yeah.
3:12
Speaker 1: So I did want to ask you all in relation
3:15
Speaker 1: to this episode and what we're gonna be talking about today,
3:17
Speaker 1: were either of you ever into magic? Do you have
3:20
Speaker 1: any tricks? Alice Semanthic Semanthew, I had a couple of tricks,
3:28
Speaker 1: and both of them were very amateur at best. And
3:33
Speaker 1: I'm not going to give away my tricks. When we
3:35
Speaker 1: see to the face to face, I might actually be
3:38
Speaker 1: able to do something I can't remember. I think one
3:41
Speaker 1: of them was done by my brother taught me one
3:44
Speaker 1: of them, and the other one just happened because I
3:46
Speaker 1: had the equipment for it. But it's very specific and
3:52
Speaker 1: I'm very good entertainer, so I was able to, like,
3:55
Speaker 1: you know, pull it off as a child. So I'm
3:58
Speaker 1: pretty sure half of it was adults just be nice
4:01
Speaker 1: and pretending like they don't know what I'm doing. But
4:04
Speaker 1: I felt like I was a success. Wow, I have
4:07
Speaker 1: so many follow up questions to that very vague for it. Yeah,
4:14
Speaker 1: what does that mean? You can't tell you can't tell
4:17
Speaker 1: your tricks? If I tell you the equipment that I
4:19
Speaker 1: have for then you know, come on so much more.
4:23
Speaker 1: Great magician never never gives away. M Wow. Okay, well
4:32
Speaker 1: I would definitely love to see a semanthemic magic show
4:38
Speaker 1: once Quarantine it's over. Yeah, yeah, I feel like we
4:41
Speaker 1: should just we should put on a magic show. You
4:44
Speaker 1: would understand my magic second. It would be a thirty
4:50
Speaker 1: second extravaganza. You look away, you just missed the whole thing.
4:55
Speaker 1: I'm about to doing it again. It was amazing. Yeah,
4:57
Speaker 1: I have none, I have no, I've never Yeah, I
5:01
Speaker 1: was never into magic. Um, I read about magic, but
5:04
Speaker 1: that was the farthest it went growing up. The magic
5:07
Speaker 1: that I'm going to claim is that my birthday is
5:09
Speaker 1: the same as Harry Houdini's, which I must have some
5:12
Speaker 1: legacy in the that is Mars twenty four magic in
5:16
Speaker 1: whatever kind of universal universal situation is happening on Mars.
5:21
Speaker 1: But yeah, other than that, I just know there there
5:24
Speaker 1: is no magic, no magic talent here for me. Wait. Wait,
5:29
Speaker 1: that Houdini was like an escape artist, right, Yeah, so
5:33
Speaker 1: we're gonna need you to learn an escape trick of
5:35
Speaker 1: some sort. Yeah. Well, I will say I've just been
5:37
Speaker 1: watching a lot of Arrested Development because of Jessica Walter's death,
5:40
Speaker 1: and I was like, oh, I'm gonna I want to
5:41
Speaker 1: see this. Did not age? Well, just just put that
5:45
Speaker 1: out there. Um, but I do love Joe's magic stuff
5:49
Speaker 1: all the time. I'm like, that's about right, that's about
5:51
Speaker 1: how I would do it, too awful. Yeah, well, happy
5:58
Speaker 1: belated birthday. Yeah yeah. My little brother was really into
6:05
Speaker 1: magic and magic tricks, although I can't recall any of them,
6:07
Speaker 1: so I must not have been very impressed. I have
6:10
Speaker 1: one card trick I can do, but it kind of
6:13
Speaker 1: takes a minute, so I feel like people get bored
6:16
Speaker 1: during it. It's not the best trick, but I can
6:18
Speaker 1: do it. And then I have it's not really a
6:21
Speaker 1: magic trick at all, but I can do that thing
6:22
Speaker 1: where you like make fire in your hand with a lighter. Yeah,
6:27
Speaker 1: I have anything with fire fantastic. Black people who have
6:32
Speaker 1: known me for a long time will tell you that's
6:33
Speaker 1: probably the worst trick. I'm very clumsy and accident form
6:36
Speaker 1: and I should not be messing with fire. But so
6:39
Speaker 1: you're like, where you set people on fire and or
6:41
Speaker 1: just put a lot of fluid on people. Yeah, yeah,
6:45
Speaker 1: I have accidentally set a trash can on fire. Once. Um,
6:48
Speaker 1: So anyway, we're talking about someone who had much more
6:53
Speaker 1: success than any of us today. Who did you ring
6:57
Speaker 1: for as Eves Ellen e er Strong today? And that's
7:01
Speaker 1: the reason we're talking about magic, because we're talking about
7:03
Speaker 1: a magician, and she came from a family of magicians too.
7:07
Speaker 1: So as always, like the first are a very weird
7:10
Speaker 1: thing and there I'm sure there are a lot of
7:12
Speaker 1: undocumented like magical arts performers that are happening, but like
7:16
Speaker 1: the first that we're going for today is that she
7:18
Speaker 1: was the first and only black woman of her time
7:21
Speaker 1: to run an independent during magic show. So there are
7:24
Speaker 1: a lot of caveats in there, but I think it's
7:26
Speaker 1: just good to think about this quote unquote first as
7:30
Speaker 1: just like she was one of the very few people
7:33
Speaker 1: at the time who was a black woman who was
7:36
Speaker 1: performing magic, and she had her own show in which
7:38
Speaker 1: she toured around the United States. Yeah, we were very excited,
7:42
Speaker 1: uh a magic show. I'm sorry to disappoint in that regard.
7:48
Speaker 1: Maybe I should learn something and bring it back to you.
7:51
Speaker 1: I'll te one of my tricks. Okay, I only have
7:54
Speaker 1: to alright, alright, I'll take that, but no, yeah, I
7:58
Speaker 1: really magic, really excites me too, like a fit earlier.
8:01
Speaker 1: I'm like into fantasy and into reading about magic and
8:03
Speaker 1: and things like that, and I think just I'm into
8:06
Speaker 1: the occult and all of the things that have to
8:09
Speaker 1: do with illusion and things like that are really cool
8:11
Speaker 1: to me too. So I'm excited about Lennie Armstrong too.
8:14
Speaker 1: And there have been some people who have, you know,
8:16
Speaker 1: talked about her and her biography, but there's not a
8:19
Speaker 1: whole heck of a lot out there about Ellennie Armstrong
8:23
Speaker 1: and the specifics in the details of her story. But
8:26
Speaker 1: there have been a bunch of newspaper stories about them
8:31
Speaker 1: performing in different locations around the United States, mainly on
8:35
Speaker 1: the East Coast. And yeah, we'll get into that a
8:37
Speaker 1: little bit, and a little bit about the just not
8:40
Speaker 1: too much, but a little bit about the magician, the
8:43
Speaker 1: background of black magicians in the United States, and of
8:46
Speaker 1: her family's magic. Yeah, I mean family of magicians. I
8:49
Speaker 1: saw already, like I'm in and this needs to be
8:52
Speaker 1: a book series. So shall we get to her history? Yeah,
8:56
Speaker 1: let's do it. So family of magicians, including her father.
9:00
Speaker 1: Her father was a pretty noted magician, and there were
9:04
Speaker 1: magicians early on the eighteen hundreds in the early nineteen hundreds.
9:07
Speaker 1: Of course, there is a very rich history of the
9:10
Speaker 1: performing arts and vaudeville and those kind of circuits in
9:14
Speaker 1: the United States back in those days, and black performers
9:16
Speaker 1: were often a part of that. There were traveling circuses
9:19
Speaker 1: in the US that included performances by magicians, and there
9:23
Speaker 1: were other names back in the day of some early
9:26
Speaker 1: black magicians, such as people like Richard Potter, who was
9:28
Speaker 1: considered the first black American magician and may have even
9:32
Speaker 1: been the first American born magician of any race according
9:35
Speaker 1: to documentation for the United States History. But yeah, there
9:39
Speaker 1: are magic and traveling shows were a part of of
9:43
Speaker 1: U S history at that time. And Ellen herself, she
9:48
Speaker 1: was born in nineteen fourteen, but she came from this
9:51
Speaker 1: family of black American magicians. Her father was John Hartford
9:56
Speaker 1: Armstrong and he was born in South Carolina around eighteen
9:59
Speaker 1: eighty six. He was probably a mixed race. This is
10:03
Speaker 1: kind of I guess I should tell a little bit
10:05
Speaker 1: about my like interest in ELLENI Armstrong in the first place,
10:08
Speaker 1: because I was trying to have a list of people
10:10
Speaker 1: who I keep running to do for for the female
10:12
Speaker 1: first series and was like thinking of doing another person,
10:17
Speaker 1: and then I was like, hmm, I don't know. I
10:19
Speaker 1: kind of wanted a bit more information on her. And
10:21
Speaker 1: I was waiting for a book to come in, and
10:23
Speaker 1: I was looking around my house and I was like,
10:25
Speaker 1: wait a second, I have a poster. I have a
10:28
Speaker 1: Broadside of ellen E. Armstrong on the wall in my
10:31
Speaker 1: living room. And I was like, wait, why don't I
10:33
Speaker 1: just do Ellenie Armstrong? Like, I know there's not a
10:36
Speaker 1: ton of documentation out there on her, but obviously I
10:39
Speaker 1: knew that we would love a magician, like we haven't
10:41
Speaker 1: done a magician before. Yes, we haven't done a magician before.
10:45
Speaker 1: And magic is really fun, Like it's really lighthearted, you know,
10:50
Speaker 1: like it's I think it's a really cool practice. And
10:54
Speaker 1: also it was just, you know, wanted to dig back
10:55
Speaker 1: into her history and learn a little bit more about her.
10:58
Speaker 1: And the other part of that, it's a really cool broadside.
11:01
Speaker 1: You know. I think posters from back in the day,
11:03
Speaker 1: and we'll talk about some of those posters and what
11:05
Speaker 1: they said on them a little bit later on in
11:07
Speaker 1: the episode are really cool. So I was drawn to
11:10
Speaker 1: her when I found the broad Side. So I was
11:13
Speaker 1: just like, Okay, I had to get this and I've
11:14
Speaker 1: had it for several years now. But the other connection
11:17
Speaker 1: there was that her family lived in South Carolina and
11:19
Speaker 1: I'm from South Carolina Columbia specifically, so Spartanburg and Columbia
11:22
Speaker 1: are things that come up in her history. So yeah,
11:25
Speaker 1: that's that's like where I came from. Why I felt
11:28
Speaker 1: this connection to ELLENI Armstrong in the beginning. But yeah,
11:31
Speaker 1: moving on with her story, her father learned magic and
11:34
Speaker 1: toward the American South Um. He dubbed himself the King
11:37
Speaker 1: of Colored Conjurors, which is we all love a good alliteration.
11:42
Speaker 1: More alliteration is going to come in here later. But
11:46
Speaker 1: he and his brother also performed magic. They build themselves
11:49
Speaker 1: as the Armstrong Brothers, and they performed at black churches
11:53
Speaker 1: in schools in North and South Carolina. And John would
11:57
Speaker 1: include black history and his magic at too, so things
12:01
Speaker 1: like including the story of Frederick Douglas in one of
12:04
Speaker 1: his acts. So blackness and black history were things that
12:08
Speaker 1: came up in their actual acts. You know, of course
12:10
Speaker 1: they lived their lives as black people, but that was
12:14
Speaker 1: also something that came up in their acts that they
12:15
Speaker 1: tied into them. And his wife, his first wife, Mabel White,
12:19
Speaker 1: joined the act as an assistant. She died years later,
12:22
Speaker 1: but he remarried to Lily Armstrong, and she was a
12:26
Speaker 1: musician and she would help with the Armstrong shows. So
12:31
Speaker 1: she joined the family and performing magic. So all the
12:35
Speaker 1: hands of the family were coming in and assisting on
12:37
Speaker 1: the shows, and the shows were doing really well. Of course,
12:41
Speaker 1: there weren't a bunch of black American magicians at the time,
12:45
Speaker 1: but there's a description of the Armstrong family in one
12:49
Speaker 1: of the papers in the collection at the South Caroliniana
12:52
Speaker 1: Library at the University of South Carolina. It says that
12:56
Speaker 1: they were one of a handful of black magic of
13:00
Speaker 1: this era and likely were the only ones to have
13:02
Speaker 1: an international reputation um and it said that they performed
13:06
Speaker 1: along the Atlantic seaboard from Philadelphia to Key West, in Cuba,
13:10
Speaker 1: and in Europe from eighty nine to at least in
13:12
Speaker 1: nineteen thirties. So, of course some of that time is
13:15
Speaker 1: before Ellenie Armstrong herself was born, but she was born
13:17
Speaker 1: into this family that was already doing touring of magic acts.
13:22
Speaker 1: So some of the acts that they performed were things
13:24
Speaker 1: like mind reading, sleight of hand, changing water to wine,
13:28
Speaker 1: it said, card tricks, and changing an egg into a chick.
13:33
Speaker 1: So those are some of the things. And when you're
13:34
Speaker 1: taking chick, you're talking about a chicken, right, yes, Just
13:37
Speaker 1: so I know, I'm just thinking, I feel like the
13:44
Speaker 1: modern day. Uh, this reminded me. I saw this magic
13:51
Speaker 1: show and I was an Indian and I'm pretty sure
13:53
Speaker 1: something was lost in translation, but I didn't get what
13:56
Speaker 1: was going on. And I was called out to be
13:59
Speaker 1: a volunteer and I just had to pour water out
14:02
Speaker 1: over and over again, and he would say Watcher of India.
14:05
Speaker 1: And it was supposed to be a trick, but I
14:06
Speaker 1: don't get it. I did not get it around Like
14:10
Speaker 1: there's still water in here, I'm not pouring out all
14:13
Speaker 1: the water. Yeah, the context was just lost there. It
14:16
Speaker 1: was lost on me. Wow. If anybody knows what that
14:21
Speaker 1: trick is, has seen that trick before, please let us know.
14:25
Speaker 1: Be curious. It haunts me, that's funny. Yeah. Some of
14:47
Speaker 1: the places where they performed were churches, high schools, colleges
14:52
Speaker 1: and so these were family events and they performed for
14:55
Speaker 1: white audiences, for mixed audiences, and auditoriums and theaters and
15:00
Speaker 1: opera houses in other places like that. And there are
15:02
Speaker 1: other newspaper articles and letters talking about Armstrong performances, which
15:07
Speaker 1: you can find online at the collection at the USC.
15:10
Speaker 1: They're digitized. I'll read from some of those just so
15:14
Speaker 1: you can get a sense of like what people were writing,
15:16
Speaker 1: because they're there are a bunch of them, and a
15:18
Speaker 1: bunch of letters of recommendation that people were sending to
15:21
Speaker 1: recommend them and saying they were these great magic performers,
15:25
Speaker 1: very glowing reviews of the things that they did. So
15:28
Speaker 1: here's one from the Florida Centinel. It's called the Armstrong's
15:32
Speaker 1: in Town. It said Professor J. Hartford Armstrong, Hertford the
15:36
Speaker 1: Great and Mrs Armstrong prestigiators, which was a word that
15:40
Speaker 1: I did not know, but it's an old word for
15:42
Speaker 1: contraar and my readers arrived in the city last Wednesday
15:46
Speaker 1: from a splendid trip from Cuba and up the East
15:48
Speaker 1: coast where they held big engagements and mightily pleads the people.
15:52
Speaker 1: So that's one of the glowing reviews, and they're a
15:55
Speaker 1: bunch of them like that. They are pretty much the same.
15:57
Speaker 1: And here's another one about before mints in Tampa, Florida.
16:01
Speaker 1: During the past two weeks, all of Tampa has been
16:04
Speaker 1: unusually entertained in the different churches, halls and school houses.
16:07
Speaker 1: The exercises have been of a high moral nature, and
16:11
Speaker 1: the throngs of people have pronounced them the best ever
16:15
Speaker 1: seen in their lines. And to know that Afro Americans
16:19
Speaker 1: possess such excellent talent, control such large audiences and entertain
16:24
Speaker 1: them until midnight is another proof that the race. The
16:28
Speaker 1: race is successfully competing with other races in the most
16:32
Speaker 1: intelligent pursuits in this world. This has attributed to the
16:35
Speaker 1: Armstrong Brothers. Yeah, you know, magician names, but obviously there's
16:42
Speaker 1: a lot to unpack there, But I do really love
16:44
Speaker 1: magician names, and there's a lot of excellent words used
16:49
Speaker 1: in these glowing reviews of like splendidly and mightily and
16:52
Speaker 1: high moral like interesting, yeah, family fund, it's got like
17:00
Speaker 1: that's what I've seen as some of the magical tricks.
17:02
Speaker 1: And then of course the ones after dark, like they're
17:04
Speaker 1: very specific on who they're targeting. Oh, yeah, that is true,
17:08
Speaker 1: Yes they are. The audiences are very clear and the
17:12
Speaker 1: lines there are delineated pretty strongly. Yeah. I just thought
17:16
Speaker 1: I thought that one was pretty pretty funny, just like
17:19
Speaker 1: how they brought the whole race into it and saying wow,
17:23
Speaker 1: like these look at these model Negroes essentially, I mean
17:29
Speaker 1: it was unusual to see, you know, black people performing
17:32
Speaker 1: magic at the time, and they were a very notable family. Yeah,
17:36
Speaker 1: even today though, I think I don't know much about magic,
17:38
Speaker 1: but there's definitely a few people who just pop in
17:40
Speaker 1: your head, whether it's like the Chris Angel or you know,
17:42
Speaker 1: Sick Graded Roy, David Blade. Yeah, like then they're you
17:47
Speaker 1: rarely see people's color. You definitely don't see women, so
17:50
Speaker 1: it's kind of like, Wow, they were making big headway
17:52
Speaker 1: even for today's standard. Yeah, yeah, that's interesting too, just
17:58
Speaker 1: the names you floated there, Like, I don't know much
18:01
Speaker 1: about magic and magicians either, but that, like, apart from
18:06
Speaker 1: say Fried and Roy, I feel like those dudes are
18:09
Speaker 1: real intense, Like it's almost become like a metal like
18:15
Speaker 1: copper Field. Is that a better one? Davidsto's name, Penn
18:20
Speaker 1: teller Old, I don't know, we don't know. Don't talk
18:29
Speaker 1: about copper Field right who you're talking about va, But
18:32
Speaker 1: the point is they're like a very a handful of
18:35
Speaker 1: like household name magicians, but obviously they're also This is
18:39
Speaker 1: not to say that there aren't like a to more
18:40
Speaker 1: people who are working in magic who are very successful. Yes,
18:44
Speaker 1: they're also many more black people and people of color
18:48
Speaker 1: who are also working in magic. So not to to
18:50
Speaker 1: say that just because we don't know their names specifically
18:53
Speaker 1: that they don't exist that I think you know, or
18:56
Speaker 1: that they're not. Oftentimes that is purposeful and it is
19:00
Speaker 1: systemic that there are specific names that we don't know.
19:04
Speaker 1: But yeah, it wasn't like there were black people left
19:08
Speaker 1: and right back in the day who were entire families
19:10
Speaker 1: who were performing entering magic acts. I think is what
19:13
Speaker 1: it really boils down to. But yeah, the occult and
19:17
Speaker 1: spirituality and things like that were often something that was
19:21
Speaker 1: taboo back in that day. So yeah, from another article
19:25
Speaker 1: talking about them coming back to Newport News, the Armstrongs
19:29
Speaker 1: will tickle your shoe strings and make your big toe laugh.
19:32
Speaker 1: They will not pay doctor's bills if you faint from laughter.
19:37
Speaker 1: Was that a saying? Was that an old time you saying?
19:40
Speaker 1: I don't know, I don't really know what tickle your shoestrings.
19:45
Speaker 1: I mean, there's so many things I don't understand about that. Yeah,
19:49
Speaker 1: but I guess they were funny. I don't know if
19:51
Speaker 1: fainting from laughter was a thing that really happened back
19:53
Speaker 1: in the day, because they said that in some of
19:55
Speaker 1: their copy in the documentation, and I just I get like,
20:00
Speaker 1: I don't know if that was a thing or if
20:02
Speaker 1: that was I don't know, women fainting in media was
20:05
Speaker 1: a big thing back then for no reason. So I
20:08
Speaker 1: don't know if it has anything to do with that.
20:09
Speaker 1: But I thought that was interesting too. Yeah, so there's
20:14
Speaker 1: also another one. Um. I got a couple more here.
20:16
Speaker 1: Here's a quote. Professor Armstrong's work is highly creditable and
20:19
Speaker 1: does not cater to ignorance nor superstition. His feets are
20:23
Speaker 1: all the results of phenomena, which are the results of science.
20:27
Speaker 1: We commend the artists especially because of his endeavor to
20:31
Speaker 1: remove superstition from our people and to have them understand
20:35
Speaker 1: that everything which we cannot comprehend at a glance does
20:40
Speaker 1: not originate from the Prince of Evil. Professor Armstrong, after
20:45
Speaker 1: many years of work and experiment, has evolved some instructive
20:49
Speaker 1: data on the existence and identity of the fifth dimension.
20:57
Speaker 1: Isn't that great? They're fighting Satan, right. It's so many
21:04
Speaker 1: like little little phrases in there that I really like.
21:07
Speaker 1: In this quote, the Prince of Evil and I think
21:11
Speaker 1: that the our people thing was was really interesting to me.
21:15
Speaker 1: That turn of phrase to remove supercisition from our people,
21:19
Speaker 1: which I'm guessing they mean black people by that. And
21:23
Speaker 1: also how they wrapped, how they just tried. They just
21:26
Speaker 1: tried so hard to make it seem like it was
21:28
Speaker 1: something that was so straightforward, so straight down the middle.
21:30
Speaker 1: It had nothing to do with anything occult. It wasn't
21:33
Speaker 1: anything that was weird, nothing that was woo woo, nothing
21:35
Speaker 1: about it. It was all good. But then you end
21:37
Speaker 1: with the fifth dimension. It was like all science and
21:42
Speaker 1: data and also the fifth dimension. Okay, yeah, but yeah,
21:48
Speaker 1: there's there's a lot to unpack there. And then the
21:50
Speaker 1: last one is just a letter of recommendation from Bethel
21:52
Speaker 1: a m. E. Church in Dalton, Georgia in April of
21:55
Speaker 1: nineteen fourteen, and they said this is to certify that
21:57
Speaker 1: the Armstrong Brothers gave one of their high clas entertainments
22:00
Speaker 1: at our church, Bethel AMI last Monday night to a
22:04
Speaker 1: crowded house. To say that they please the audience to
22:07
Speaker 1: the highest degree of satisfaction is put putting it mildly.
22:11
Speaker 1: The people of Dalton, Georgia, representing all classes, were loud
22:15
Speaker 1: in their praises of this very high class entertainment Georgia
22:20
Speaker 1: that is ridiculously progressive of them. M yeah, as that's
22:25
Speaker 1: still one of the areas that I'm always timmant to
22:28
Speaker 1: go to myself. Yeah yeah, wow. Yeah. Granted it was
22:32
Speaker 1: at a m E church, but yes, yeah, yeah. So
22:35
Speaker 1: that's that's just a sampling of some of the um
22:39
Speaker 1: the letters and the articles that were written about them
22:44
Speaker 1: and their performances, and there are a bunch more that
22:47
Speaker 1: you can go through and read. Yeah. So in that
22:50
Speaker 1: collection you can also find portraits of the family, so
22:54
Speaker 1: you can see pictures of them, and you can find
22:58
Speaker 1: it's like pictures of them in front of their home,
23:01
Speaker 1: separate portraits of the different family members. But I think
23:05
Speaker 1: it's funny that they mentioned representing all classes in that
23:08
Speaker 1: last quote. Their shows would appeal to middle and working
23:12
Speaker 1: class Black people, well you know what you can call
23:16
Speaker 1: like what you would consider middle class, but who didn't
23:18
Speaker 1: care to go to menstrual our vaudeville shows and were
23:23
Speaker 1: attracted to that kind of educational spin of the Armstrong shows.
23:28
Speaker 1: Some Black American entertainers would. And I think that's like
23:34
Speaker 1: the whole class thing is a whole other conversation and
23:36
Speaker 1: thinking about who were the types of people who attended
23:38
Speaker 1: their shows. But some black American entertainers would pretend not
23:42
Speaker 1: to be black, and instead I pretend they were forre
23:43
Speaker 1: and born to make it in the United States. But yes,
23:47
Speaker 1: Ellen herself, that was kind of a long background on
23:50
Speaker 1: her family. But I think it's you know, necessary to
23:53
Speaker 1: just kind of know where Ellen came from. So she
23:56
Speaker 1: grew up in that magic and entertainment realm, and in
23:59
Speaker 1: our early she assisted her father with the magic shows.
24:03
Speaker 1: She even had her own part of the show doing
24:06
Speaker 1: my reading. And by the time that she was a teenager,
24:10
Speaker 1: she was doing what was called talk talk, in which
24:13
Speaker 1: she drew cartoons on a chalkboard and when wouldn't vite
24:17
Speaker 1: audience members up to draw as well. And her father
24:21
Speaker 1: died in nineteen thirty nine, and it was at that
24:24
Speaker 1: point that she took over his magic show and kept
24:26
Speaker 1: it going, and she continued to focus on black churches
24:29
Speaker 1: in schools on the East coast of the United States,
24:33
Speaker 1: and she was probably the only black female magician touring
24:38
Speaker 1: in the US at the time solo. And in the
24:41
Speaker 1: early years of her doing the show on her own,
24:44
Speaker 1: she was called the Mistress of Modern Magic, which you
24:46
Speaker 1: can see on some of her posters, and the posters
24:49
Speaker 1: would also describe her acts and coming back to that
24:54
Speaker 1: alliteration thing. For some reason, on her posters they seemed
24:56
Speaker 1: to really love alliteration, starting with the letter M for
25:01
Speaker 1: I don't know why that letter, but for instance, the
25:03
Speaker 1: broad said that I have it says and her modern
25:06
Speaker 1: Marvelous Matchless Mary making march through mystery Land. I love that.
25:14
Speaker 1: You know, M is letter if I'm remembering correct, So
25:19
Speaker 1: figuring it out, connecting the dots nothing to do with it,
25:24
Speaker 1: but I had to count it out. Wait a second,
25:29
Speaker 1: you know, any I feel like you just opened a
25:31
Speaker 1: cannon worms, because that's one of those things that conspiracy
25:33
Speaker 1: theorists are going to go back and say, wait a second.
25:35
Speaker 1: He was trying to figure out he was the fifth
25:37
Speaker 1: dimension and the thirteenth letter, and that's going to connect
25:41
Speaker 1: these dots and there's something. There has to be something
25:43
Speaker 1: deeper going on. It's gonna be a Reddit tread. Yes,
25:46
Speaker 1: I've been down that Reddit tread. That's not good. Don't
25:49
Speaker 1: go down it. This is why they went from Reddit. Yeah,
26:12
Speaker 1: so some of her acts are so called novelties, as
26:15
Speaker 1: the posters called them was silken sorcery. I'm not exactly
26:20
Speaker 1: sure what what some of these tricks are, but these
26:23
Speaker 1: are the names for them. Silken Sorcery, the Miser's Dream,
26:27
Speaker 1: the Mysterious Jars of Egypt, and the Puzzling Parasol. Really
26:34
Speaker 1: good names they are. And the poster also said that
26:38
Speaker 1: she had original chemical, mechanical and electrical magical experiments, and
26:45
Speaker 1: as we talked about earlier, kind of like the educational
26:47
Speaker 1: spin that it had on it. Some of the other
26:49
Speaker 1: words that were used to describe the acts were clean, scientific, educational,
26:56
Speaker 1: and amusing. So the imagery and the portrayal of what
27:03
Speaker 1: her entertainment acts were were's very like. It seemed like
27:06
Speaker 1: a very buttoned up thing. And so we're all the
27:09
Speaker 1: letters are recommendations, and the articles the way they described
27:11
Speaker 1: here in such a like very neat way, it seems
27:15
Speaker 1: like it was very controlled. Like the words that people
27:17
Speaker 1: were using to describe them to make sure that they
27:20
Speaker 1: were able to perform in more venues and that they
27:22
Speaker 1: would appeal to audiences and that they would actually get
27:25
Speaker 1: the money, you know, that they needed to get from
27:28
Speaker 1: these performances because it was a living you know, they
27:31
Speaker 1: were being paid for this, so it was important for
27:34
Speaker 1: them and for her to be able to continue to
27:36
Speaker 1: do that. Right. I find it interesting that they keep
27:38
Speaker 1: calling this, I guess, and it is a letter of recommendation,
27:41
Speaker 1: essentially having to be like, see this other plus really
27:43
Speaker 1: liked us and they approved, Yeah you should too. And
27:45
Speaker 1: I find that very like a fascinating way of traveling
27:48
Speaker 1: and entertaining. Yeah. Well, I feel like there's an air
27:52
Speaker 1: of like kind of being safe. Like see it's educational,
27:56
Speaker 1: Like it's not like the occult. It's a very educational
27:59
Speaker 1: child only show. It's gonna be good. We we don't
28:03
Speaker 1: do anything to entertain the evil of darkness. Yeah, no
28:07
Speaker 1: Prince of evil to be found in any of these performances.
28:14
Speaker 1: So the Times in Democrat newspaper out of Orangeburg, South Carolina,
28:19
Speaker 1: had a section titled news of Interest to Colored People,
28:22
Speaker 1: which is funny to me, is as if only only
28:26
Speaker 1: people of color could be interested in things that were
28:28
Speaker 1: happening about people. This is in February ninety and he
28:32
Speaker 1: said Ellen E. Armstrong will present a magical act at
28:35
Speaker 1: seven thirty Friday at East Middle School. The act is
28:39
Speaker 1: the same as that formerly performed by the original Jay
28:42
Speaker 1: Hartford Armstrong at mission will be thirty five cents for adults,
28:45
Speaker 1: twenty five for students, in fifteen cents for tots, which
28:49
Speaker 1: is what they called children in several instances in some
28:51
Speaker 1: of these tots. And I think thirty five cents in
28:54
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty that would be about a little less than
28:56
Speaker 1: four dollars in today's money. So yeah, she later she
28:59
Speaker 1: focus on her talk talk act and would use a
29:02
Speaker 1: pad in crayons instead and will let other people come
29:04
Speaker 1: up and draw. Still, and she was still she was
29:07
Speaker 1: emphasizing her cartooning skills. So you'll see her called an
29:10
Speaker 1: extraordinary or cartoonists extraordinary or something like that, and the posters.
29:15
Speaker 1: So not only was she a magical artist, she was
29:17
Speaker 1: also great at drawing and did cartoons. And she retired
29:21
Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy and spent her later years in Spartanburg,
29:24
Speaker 1: South Carolina, and she died in nineteen seventy nine. But
29:28
Speaker 1: I'm not sure of the circumstances of her death. But yeah, Fortunately,
29:33
Speaker 1: like I said, you can find some of those digitized
29:36
Speaker 1: writings about her online and we still have access to
29:40
Speaker 1: pictures of the family and know a little bit about
29:42
Speaker 1: what their magical acts were, although I wish that there
29:45
Speaker 1: was video. I wish that there was video some of
29:47
Speaker 1: those acts. That's what I really want. I would love
29:50
Speaker 1: to know more about what the actual acts were. Like. Yeah,
29:56
Speaker 1: so based on some of the names, I know that
29:59
Speaker 1: they were pretty cool. But yeah, the puzzling parasol, that's
30:03
Speaker 1: what I want to know, right, You don't want to
30:06
Speaker 1: know that Egypt one that seemed cool too. Yeah, that
30:09
Speaker 1: one's related to my water of India things saying that's
30:18
Speaker 1: that's the backstory that we didn't know that the jar
30:20
Speaker 1: you reported from was mysterious Jar of Egypt because the
30:25
Speaker 1: water was Indian water. Oh, somebody was I like this?
30:33
Speaker 1: Was there any cartoons, especially, like, did they have any
30:35
Speaker 1: records or patriots of the cartoons that she had drawn
30:38
Speaker 1: at any point in time? I haven't seen any. I
30:40
Speaker 1: haven't seen any interested. I would imagine if I think
30:43
Speaker 1: some of those people took them home, so I took
30:46
Speaker 1: them with them, some of the drawings that were done
30:48
Speaker 1: as part of her acts. So I wonder if there
30:49
Speaker 1: are any out there that people still have from going
30:52
Speaker 1: to one of the shows. But I'm not sure that
30:55
Speaker 1: I would love that's that's her beginning of her career
30:57
Speaker 1: with her father. I would love to see people obviously
31:00
Speaker 1: liked it that it carried on. I'd love to see
31:03
Speaker 1: her work. Yeah, that would be cool. Like the progression
31:06
Speaker 1: of it too, that would be really cool. Well, this
31:11
Speaker 1: this has been a delight, so many fun names and
31:16
Speaker 1: words going on in this one. Is there anything else
31:21
Speaker 1: you have before we wrap up on this one? No?
31:25
Speaker 1: I think that is it. Man, I do wish I
31:28
Speaker 1: could just see in her show. I'm wondering what it
31:30
Speaker 1: was like. The description makes it so intriguing on how
31:34
Speaker 1: they're trying to be that fine line of no, we're
31:36
Speaker 1: not into devil worshiping, but we do know magic, and
31:39
Speaker 1: fifth a moment like just like what is this? And
31:43
Speaker 1: then the fact that the entire thing is if laughing
31:45
Speaker 1: hearts stay at home like a light that's part of
31:47
Speaker 1: their poster, and like wait huh, Like she's not just
31:52
Speaker 1: like she's obviously a very much an entertainer. Her family
31:54
Speaker 1: was an entertainer. But I don't wonder. No, I wish
31:58
Speaker 1: I was one of those shows. I know. Okay, well
32:05
Speaker 1: we'll get this smimty magic throw together and it's gonna
32:07
Speaker 1: be a train wreck entertaining. No, but well, not for us,
32:13
Speaker 1: but other people might laugh out terrible it is. That's
32:18
Speaker 1: how I get fired because I started to fire at
32:20
Speaker 1: the office. Essentially, she just sets herself on fire and
32:23
Speaker 1: we see the zoom video and I'm like, well, that
32:26
Speaker 1: was a mistake. Never again, I've made a huge mistake.
32:31
Speaker 1: Going back to job and his Magic show, Well, I'm excited.
32:36
Speaker 1: I'm excited for the possibilities. And thank you so much
32:40
Speaker 1: for bringing this story to her attention. Eaves. It was
32:43
Speaker 1: a very very fun one. Yes, thanks for having me.
32:46
Speaker 1: That was That was fine. It was Where can the
32:50
Speaker 1: good listeners find you? You can find me on Twitter
32:53
Speaker 1: at us Jeff co on Instagram at not Apologizing, And
32:58
Speaker 1: also on the show This Day and His Class, which
33:00
Speaker 1: is a daily show about history talks about other people
33:04
Speaker 1: that did cool things in history, just like Ellenie Armstrong
33:07
Speaker 1: and events that happen in history. And also on the
33:10
Speaker 1: podcast Unpopular, which is about people in history as well,
33:15
Speaker 1: but a little bit different in terms of talking about
33:17
Speaker 1: their biographies and what they did in order to disrupt
33:22
Speaker 1: systems and were they were often persecuted and it goes
33:26
Speaker 1: through those stories. And this also here, I think this
33:31
Speaker 1: is okay. Yeah, I feel like we went through this
33:35
Speaker 1: Samantha twenty one the last time because I feel like
33:38
Speaker 1: in my record keeping, I feel like I've had a
33:40
Speaker 1: scripted episodes, so I'm like record keeping, I make it
33:48
Speaker 1: sound like it's very serious and important, like I don't
33:50
Speaker 1: know a micro fush and like fire safe block containers somewhere.
33:54
Speaker 1: But no, it's just my notes app. And but how
34:00
Speaker 1: like a skip something in there, so I don't know,
34:02
Speaker 1: I'm gonna have to go back in go through. Yeah, yeah,
34:05
Speaker 1: we'll have to fact check that it's very important, very important. Yeah,
34:10
Speaker 1: there's no way we can ever know slash it's recorded.
34:16
Speaker 1: I think I I believe we can get to the
34:18
Speaker 1: bottom of this, but I actually am if listeners know this.
34:22
Speaker 1: But I actually have a really weird thing with numbers,
34:24
Speaker 1: so I do want to know so I can keep
34:26
Speaker 1: tracking specific important numbered episodes so by next episode will know. Okay,
34:32
Speaker 1: we have to also know when to eat the cheesecake.
34:34
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we're coming up on that.
34:42
Speaker 1: We might have already missed it. We might already be
34:44
Speaker 1: too late, because if you're talking about episode doing that,
34:49
Speaker 1: we'll figure that. We'll good do smint tea housekeeping and
34:53
Speaker 1: figure that out. In the meantime, listeners. If you would
34:57
Speaker 1: like to contact us, you can Our email is Stuff Media,
34:59
Speaker 1: mom Stuff at iHeartRadio dot com. You can find us
35:01
Speaker 1: on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast or on Instagram and
35:04
Speaker 1: Stuff I've Never Told to You Thanks as always to
35:06
Speaker 1: our super producer Christina. Thank you Christina, and thanks to
35:09
Speaker 1: you for listening. Stuff I've Never Told You production to
35:11
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio. From more podcasts from I Heart Radio,
35:13
Speaker 1: visit the iHeart Radio at Baffle podcast or if you
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