Latest / Ghost Cult Magazine Podcast / PODCAST: Episode 875 - Frayle’s Gwyn Strang and Sean Bilovecky Talk New Album "Heretics and Lullabies"

Transcript

PODCAST: Episode 875 - Frayle’s Gwyn Strang and Sean Bilovecky Talk New Album "Heretics and Lullabies" · Ghost Cult Magazine Podcast

• 0:00
  You have to kind of pick and choose who you share your energy
• 0:02
  with. Mm hmm.
• 0:03
  Some people can drain you, some people can pump you up, you
• 0:07
  know, And so you've got to be really choosy in life and in
• 0:11
  your work and your your passion, who you share that energy with,
• 0:14
  because it could go one way or the other.
• 0:16
  Yeah, I feel like if we were like big partiers and not at
• 0:19
  bars all the time, maybe that'd be a different story.
• 0:21
  But like DoorDash is the only people that vote.
• 0:24
  We even make them drop it off on the front.
• 0:26
  Dude, Yeah. What is that like?
• 0:27
  You don't? Why is that rude?
• 0:29
  Like to not interact with your DoorDash?
• 0:30
  I don't know. Say greetings y'all.
• 0:38
  This is Don from Ghost Cult magazine.
• 0:41
  Cleveland, OH's Frail is hands down one of America's best kept
• 0:45
  secrets and my current favorite band, an obsession.
• 0:48
  So their new album Heretics and Lullabies drops on October 10th
• 0:52
  via Nepalm Records and I'm psyched to be speaking with
• 0:55
  Frail, Sean and Gwen once again. So anyway guys, thank y'all for
• 1:00
  doing this and for being patient with me.
• 1:03
  Of course, of course. So, you know, I'm not going to
• 1:07
  lie. I'm not going to lie to the
• 1:08
  viewers. We had a great thing going and
• 1:10
  we had a snafu with the recording.
• 1:11
  And so now we're going to do it over again and they're going to
• 1:13
  act so nicely and so patient with me that I appreciate it.
• 1:17
  So. But this is our. 3rd fucking
• 1:19
  time doing this fucking interview.
• 1:24
  Actually, they're being nice. It was their fifth time doing
• 1:27
  this interview. But but again, like thank you
• 1:30
  all for doing this again though. And you guys have just been like
• 1:34
  I said, the album has been incredible.
• 1:36
  I've enjoyed listening to it so much.
• 1:38
  But I like to start off with an icebreaker here because to kind
• 1:40
  of redo it here, it's like, what is the question you guys get
• 1:43
  asked in interviews so much that like if you get asked it again,
• 1:46
  you'll release the hell hounds of Hades or something?
• 1:50
  I don't, I don't think we, I mean, honestly, we're just so
• 1:53
  stoked to be talking to, to you guys like you know, and being
• 1:58
  able to get the word out as much as possible that, you know, any
• 2:01
  question is a is a great question.
• 2:03
  Yeah, I think we, we look at the, the world in a way that
• 2:06
  like everyone, you know, has their own person and they can
• 2:10
  ask questions and it's, they don't know what happened the
• 2:12
  last 20 minutes or whatever. So we're like, I don't, I don't
• 2:14
  think we get like that. You know, we, we see, we watch
• 2:17
  some interviews of other like actors, usually they get all
• 2:20
  pissy and stuff. It's always funny to watch that
• 2:21
  'cause I'm like, what's wrong with you?
• 2:23
  I wish somebody cared enough to interview me, like that'd be
• 2:27
  awesome. Why don't we?
• 2:28
  Why don't we do that? You already asked us questions.
• 2:30
  I think it's it's our. Turn, Yeah.
• 2:32
  Well, it all started when I was a kid, you know, I'm just
• 2:36
  kidding. Well, you guys can ask me
• 2:39
  anything you want, but like, I've got to do my job here too,
• 2:43
  so. Yeah.
• 2:43
  But, you know, But like I said, like I said, you guys earlier,
• 2:47
  is that, you know, a guy my age, 52 years old, I'm, I, I'm not
• 2:52
  impressed very easily. You know, I find things to be
• 2:55
  kind of repetitive, drab. And if anything, sometimes I
• 2:57
  hear stuff and I'm like, OK, I've heard like 10 of these
• 3:00
  bands already, but you know, frail was something super
• 3:04
  special. And, you know, we kind of
• 3:06
  touched on this earlier, but a lot of influences that kind of
• 3:09
  tug at my heartstrings came through.
• 3:11
  You know, we were talking about like the Sneaker Pimps also
• 3:14
  everything from, you know, Vatane to elements of Lost to
• 3:20
  Dead Can Dance even with the kind of ethereal vocals.
• 3:23
  I mean, like, am I getting that right on any of these bands at
• 3:27
  all? Or like some of these?
• 3:28
  Influences. Yeah, for sure.
• 3:29
  I think our influencer influences are very varied.
• 3:34
  And you know, I come from like a gothic industrial background.
• 3:38
  That's my music that I grew up with and my music of choice.
• 3:41
  And Sean comes from more of like Crowbar and and Sleep and stuff
• 3:46
  like that. But I think, you know, so we you
• 3:50
  grow with this stuff and and so it innately becomes part of your
• 3:54
  vocabulary when you're writing. I think that this album that we
• 3:58
  did decide to kind of step away from, you know, thinking of
• 4:02
  influences so much and just being more into like, what can I
• 4:06
  do that's really going to impress him?
• 4:09
  You know, what can I write that's gonna get him to go?
• 4:12
  Wow. Yeah, This is.
• 4:13
  This is it, you know and. And also thinking in the studio
• 4:16
  more is like a painter looking in a blank canvas to just get
• 4:20
  this stuff out. I think for me, music has always
• 4:23
  been medicine and a way for me to like, be less sad or be angry
• 4:28
  about like have someone else the song be angry with me about
• 4:31
  something. You know, it's always about
• 4:32
  emotions coming out and trying to, you know, listen to it to
• 4:35
  help myself, I guess. And so to stand in front of a
• 4:38
  blank canvas and just say, like, man, this, I feel this singing
• 4:41
  with my guitar that I learned how to play, not because I
• 4:43
  wanted to play other people's songs, but I wanted to play
• 4:45
  because it would help get it was a tool to help get emotions out.
• 4:48
  So if you just do that in from a blank cannabis and whatever
• 4:52
  comes out and you shut out the rest of the world, I think
• 4:55
  that's when we feel like we're getting the most, you know, work
• 4:58
  done, the best work done, I guess, you know, and then trying
• 5:01
  to impress each other, which we do.
• 5:02
  Like she said that she'll try to impress me and I'm I'm like, Oh,
• 5:05
  this riff is the scariest, heaviest thing.
• 5:06
  And then she'll come upstairs and crush my dream and say.
• 5:12
  Keeps you humble man. You know, like trust me, my
• 5:17
  wifes not even a musician or even into the stuff I'm into.
• 5:19
  But like when I, when I I play music, you know, I've been
• 5:23
  writing at making an album, she'll listen to it and she'll
• 5:26
  go, that's really great. And I'll be like, yeah.
• 5:27
  And she'll listen when she goes, yeah, I don't know about that
• 5:30
  one. You might want to rethink that.
• 5:31
  And I'm just like, why did I ask you, you know, but like.
• 5:35
  But we appreciate honesty. Well, that's what it is, is that
• 5:38
  is that when you have that kind of that, that kind of
• 5:41
  camaraderie with each other and that kind of bond where you're
• 5:43
  just like, you know, like I'm not trying to hurt your
• 5:46
  feelings, but if I did, sorry, get over it.
• 5:48
  But like this is what I'm trying to convey or this is what I
• 5:51
  want? Yeah, no, absolutely.
• 5:52
  And I think that, you know, especially since at the end of
• 5:55
  the day, you know, what we put out there has both of our names
• 5:58
  on it, right? If I'm not super stoked on
• 6:01
  something, I'm probably not going to be super happy if if he
• 6:04
  pushes something and, and vice versa, you know, but for the
• 6:07
  most part, we get out of each other's way and we just let each
• 6:11
  other do their own thing. And that's kind of how we end up
• 6:14
  with what we have is because, you know, like I mentioned
• 6:18
  earlier, if we tried to do something together, like in the
• 6:22
  same room, writing something together, I feel like it would
• 6:24
  just be like a muddy mush, you know?
• 6:26
  And, and so come at, come at it from my point of view and he
• 6:30
  comes at it from his point of view.
• 6:31
  And then this is what you get. Yeah, we never jam, but then you
• 6:34
  might have done it once or twice if I just.
• 6:36
  We're gonna. Hurt.
• 6:37
  Yeah, it was. I'm, I need to go sit down and
• 6:41
  get into my happy place and, you know, get in the right mindset
• 6:45
  and then I can write stuff. Like I feel like I would just
• 6:48
  laugh at her if I was playing guitar and she's like closing
• 6:50
  her eyes and saying what are you doing?
• 6:51
  Yeah. It's like super awkward.
• 6:55
  Yeah, it would be awkward, Yeah. So we don't do that.
• 6:57
  Although I had to say what I love what you're talking about,
• 6:59
  how, like, music is medicine, you know, and how it makes you
• 7:01
  feel happy. And it's like, yeah, it's like,
• 7:04
  sometimes it's like the darkest, the heaviest music that makes me
• 7:07
  happy. Like I feel like that gelator
• 7:09
  meme where like, I don't want to feel feelings, I want to be
• 7:12
  angry all the time. It's just, there's such an irony
• 7:17
  to that though, you know, that there's like a catharsis to it.
• 7:20
  And as a listener, like I can honestly say that like I that
• 7:25
  ethereal sound, that kind of just hodgepodge of influences
• 7:29
  and things that tug on my heartstrings, like made it very
• 7:33
  easy for me to to immerse in those songs.
• 7:36
  And so whatever you guys are doing, don't change it because
• 7:40
  that was just, I mean, this is a perfect record to me and I don't
• 7:43
  say. That you know.
• 7:45
  I mean, the fact that I listens to it on a web browser, you know
• 7:49
  what I mean? And then I was like, you know, I
• 7:51
  was listening to it in my car, on my phone, on a web browser,
• 7:54
  you know, because I was like, I need to hear this at least a few
• 7:57
  times. And it was just, you know,
• 7:59
  again, like you guys managed to take these influences, put them
• 8:03
  together and create a sound that is yours.
• 8:06
  It's not tired. It's not like I feel like
• 8:08
  whenever you see the word doom, like, at least for me, I'm just
• 8:11
  like, oh God, really? Another doom band.
• 8:14
  I'm like, really? I mean, I know what this is
• 8:16
  going to sound like. I did not see this coming, you
• 8:19
  know? But so that's why I did love the
• 8:21
  fact that you had that as a part of your tag, but that you're not
• 8:24
  packaging yourself as like, we're a doom band.
• 8:26
  Yeah, we don't know how to package ourselves.
• 8:28
  We I think we just did that because like the first label
• 8:31
  that we are on, they have a lot of like doom and Stoner stuff,
• 8:33
  which is awesome. We're fans of that music, but
• 8:36
  we're not Stoner. So we said OK, I guess we're
• 8:38
  doomed. Yeah.
• 8:40
  Just slide right in here, yeah. We can't come up with a clever
• 8:43
  name to describe whatever genre we are, so we just let other
• 8:46
  people do it. Yeah, because we're like our
• 8:49
  own. You guys have given me an
• 8:50
  assignment, I feel like, so I'll get back to you when I come up
• 8:53
  with a good a good genre tag for.
• 8:56
  You. Yeah.
• 8:56
  All right. Cool.
• 8:57
  Oh, wait, hold on. I have to do this again because
• 8:59
  I did this in the first three interviews, but I'm going to do
• 9:01
  this again. The number one most added at
• 9:04
  metal radio and yes, we also did just discuss this that anything
• 9:08
  with a number and one with your picture on it means you're doing
• 9:12
  incredible. So tell me about, I mean, so
• 9:14
  tell me about how that that kind of resonated with you because
• 9:18
  you know, obviously I feel like that as songwriters, musicians
• 9:21
  like, like nobody sets out to do that, right?
• 9:24
  But when that happens, like how has that resonated with you?
• 9:27
  And do you feel like that that kind of moves you into a
• 9:29
  different direction? No, I, I don't think so.
• 9:33
  We're actually in a call with our manager yesterday and we
• 9:36
  were talking about, you know, we have a tour coming up with dogma
• 9:39
  in the US and we're talking about next year, right?
• 9:42
  Like working with our booking agents to just be as busy as
• 9:46
  possible. And is, you know, Des was like,
• 9:49
  oh, hey, hold on a second, this Oh bro, no way.
• 9:52
  You, I just got an e-mail from Napalm and they said if this
• 9:55
  holds, you guys are going to be #1 most added this and this.
• 9:58
  And I was like, what does that mean?
• 10:00
  Anastasia does his wife in the background and she's like, what
• 10:03
  do you mean? What does it mean?
• 10:06
  Tell me what it means. I don't know what it means to
• 10:07
  know what this means. It should, right?
• 10:10
  I mean, we're that that's, we're stoked.
• 10:12
  Obviously we're stoked. That's awesome and but it
• 10:15
  doesn't really like in affect us because like, again, if you set
• 10:19
  out and you make something and all you're doing is trying to
• 10:22
  put your soul onto a canvas, like if people listen to it and
• 10:26
  like it, that's amazing. But like it's I don't, I don't
• 10:29
  think we like crave that validation.
• 10:30
  Like we we'd like to have careers making music.
• 10:33
  You know, that would be awesome if someone was like, Hey, you're
• 10:35
  going to, you know, for the rest of your life be able to just
• 10:38
  play music. That would be fucking amazing.
• 10:39
  But like the, the this kind of stuff, which is it's awesome and
• 10:43
  we're happy about it and so grateful, but it doesn't like
• 10:46
  change us or like make us Oh my God, now we're nervous and we're
• 10:48
  going to get weird or some shit like that, You know, we're.
• 10:51
  We're already weird, yeah. But I'm about to say stay weird,
• 10:54
  folks. Come on, you know, embrace your
• 10:57
  weirdness. Look, I, I, I already want to
• 11:00
  come over for dinner, you know, like that.
• 11:02
  That's. There are knives that we.
• 11:04
  Yeah, it's you're going to have rusty bread.
• 11:06
  Well, that. Thanksgiving carving, you know.
• 11:09
  Yeah, I just, I just hit the wall with my elbow and I think.
• 11:13
  Comes at it like perfect slices, but you know, it's, you know,
• 11:18
  again, talking about the label, I feel like that, especially now
• 11:21
  you hear a lot of bands, a lot of artists saying things like,
• 11:23
  you know, oh, don't go for a label.
• 11:25
  What can labels do for you? You can do more on your own.
• 11:28
  Like, you know what? Have you guys feel like you've
• 11:31
  benefited from being on a label? Wow, so napalm has been
• 11:37
  incredible, Like they're they're like the most supportive parents
• 11:42
  that you could ever hope for. So they're like, this is
• 11:45
  amazing. You know, we want to make sure
• 11:46
  that you realize your vision fully.
• 11:50
  What can we do to help you do that?
• 11:52
  But at the same time, if you turn in something where they
• 11:55
  know that you could do better, they'd be like, you know, this
• 11:59
  is this is really good, but we think you have better in you.
• 12:02
  And okay, I, I love that. I love that you don't just roll
• 12:07
  over. Yeah, like with the music, when
• 12:10
  we deliver it, they were stoked in the music, but it's like the
• 12:13
  Alamar, like we had a different cover at 1st and they're like.
• 12:17
  Yeah. Not bad, but you guys could
• 12:21
  probably do better. And so that we, you know, it
• 12:23
  just pushed us to do better. So that's what Glenn means.
• 12:25
  Like they're like super supportive parents.
• 12:27
  They're not overbearing at all. They've never asked us to do
• 12:30
  anything we don't want to do. They suggest things and if we
• 12:32
  like it, yes, If we don't, OK. But to me, like that part, like
• 12:36
  the higher up stuff is great, but the boots on the ground
• 12:39
  people that you talk to every day, like the the PR people or
• 12:42
  the social media team, those people are fucking awesome.
• 12:46
  Like, they help us so much and we talk to them daily and
• 12:50
  they're just the best. Yeah.
• 12:51
  Like so good. Yeah, that's the one thing that
• 12:55
  I think, you know, we were kind of missing previously.
• 12:57
  You know, we of course we've done press and things like this
• 13:00
  and, and but this was just a whole other level.
• 13:03
  Like I felt like I was the president when we when we went
• 13:05
  to Europe. Yeah, we had some at the
• 13:08
  festivals. We had press.
• 13:10
  We we were ushered into the, into the press area, Yeah.
• 13:14
  And then our liaison would. Now you're going to be walking
• 13:17
  past, you know, like that kind of.
• 13:20
  So and so from this magazine, and they specialize in so and
• 13:23
  so. Yeah.
• 13:24
  And then they would be, yeah. Buck OK and.
• 13:26
  Then one you'll be having a photo shoot in an hour over
• 13:28
  here. Just wanna make sure I will come
• 13:30
  and get you and you will be. It was it was crazy.
• 13:32
  It was a whole other level that. You're just like, do I just look
• 13:35
  at the cell phone and take a cell?
• 13:37
  They're like, no, no, you got the photographer going on, you
• 13:39
  know? Yeah, yeah, it was.
• 13:42
  Oh God. And here's our cat we have.
• 13:44
  Thank you for bringing the cat on.
• 13:46
  You just made my night. Oh my God.
• 13:48
  What is the cat's name? And please tell me has a great
• 13:50
  name. This is no this ones the we have
• 13:53
  3 this ones just jinx because she breaks everything and my
• 13:55
  daughter named her but she's riding a box of records that's.
• 13:58
  What this is that is. There.
• 14:04
  Absolutely. I'm paying attention to her
• 14:05
  because he loves me. I wish he was here, but I have
• 14:07
  an 83 LB Doberman named Ozzy Posbourne who hangs out on my
• 14:11
  couch with me at night. But my wife gets him at night.
• 14:14
  So, you know, she, he, it's like, we're married, but we have
• 14:18
  like joint custody of our own dog, you know?
• 14:21
  Like I get him during the day, she gets him in the evening.
• 14:26
  Ozzy Posbourne. Ozzy Possbourne, the Prince of
• 14:29
  Bartness. Yes, I you.
• 14:32
  Thought of it all. Hey, you know what?
• 14:33
  I'm a man of many talents here. But yeah.
• 14:37
  But you know, so again, you were talking about with the the
• 14:40
  label, I would almost feel like just based on what you were
• 14:42
  talking about, like with the way you construct songs, the way you
• 14:45
  kind of come at it, the creative process is that there needs to
• 14:49
  be a certain level of creative freedom.
• 14:51
  Do you Did you have to sacrifice any of that stuff to be part of
• 14:55
  a label? Nope, Never.
• 14:57
  Not once. Ever.
• 14:57
  I mean, they, they work. They sought us out because they
• 15:01
  like what we were doing. And I think that that same
• 15:04
  attitude that we have with each other, like get out of our way.
• 15:06
  They do the same thing. Like they'll literally post or
• 15:10
  they'll, they'll ask us stuff and like, like, and our guy will
• 15:13
  be like, well, what do you think about this?
• 15:14
  We'll be like, oh man, I don't know.
• 15:15
  They're like, yeah, you're probably fucking dumb.
• 15:18
  Just do a group thing literally that like that's how that's how
• 15:21
  it goes. Or they'll say stuff and they're
• 15:23
  they're great suggestions and like, holy.
• 15:25
  Things that have blown our minds where we're just like, this is
• 15:28
  amazing. We never would have thought of
• 15:29
  this and Oh my God, here's a calendar with this and that and
• 15:33
  the assets unlike this is like totally.
• 15:37
  Yeah, we're super stoked. What's the kind of thing though,
• 15:40
  that when you're, you're an art, you're a musician and you're
• 15:42
  having to do all this shit by yourself.
• 15:44
  It's kind of nice. I would assume because I, I
• 15:47
  haven't had, I don't have a liaison, you know, but like, but
• 15:51
  like, I would assume that it's a, to have a lot of that taken
• 15:55
  off your plate and tell us and just be like, OK, great.
• 15:57
  All we need to do now is just be musicians.
• 16:00
  We can be the writers, we can be the performers.
• 16:02
  Like does that weight lifted off also kind of carry over into
• 16:06
  anything as far as like? So it's.
• 16:09
  I. Think there's still?
• 16:10
  A lot to tell. There's still a lot to do, like
• 16:13
  we're still doing a lot of like, like there's more business stuff
• 16:17
  than creative stuff right now. And I think that's just because
• 16:19
  it's like releasing or you know, but it would be great to get to
• 16:24
  the point where like that's all you have to do is be the artist.
• 16:27
  I don't know if we'd be able to do it though.
• 16:28
  I think we have too much ADHD to fucking.
• 16:30
  We yeah, we like our hands in every single pot and we do like
• 16:36
  we're both very visual people, so we know what we want to
• 16:40
  project and you know, both obviously love music.
• 16:43
  So we know exactly how we want this to look and sound and and
• 16:47
  the message that we want to get out there.
• 16:48
  So I think yeah, but I think like it.
• 16:53
  I think it's still too early to kind of figure out if them
• 16:55
  taking, you know, doing all of this and setting it up for us.
• 16:59
  It's still too early to tell whether that frees up time to do
• 17:04
  like do more artistic stuff. Because right now we're just,
• 17:07
  you know, we're balls deep and in the promo stuff.
• 17:10
  And and, you know, once we kind of get, you know, even maybe
• 17:14
  next week or, you know, a month from now, it'll, it'll ease up a
• 17:19
  little bit. There's.
• 17:19
  Still more to do though, like I think that if you just like lay
• 17:22
  back and like let other people do all your stuff, you have the
• 17:25
  potential to not grow as much. As yourself.
• 17:28
  Possibly could and we're both like have owned our own
• 17:31
  businesses and and we know what it's like to have to kill your
• 17:34
  dinner, you know what I mean? Or else you're not going to.
• 17:36
  So that mentality mixed with a group of people that are helping
• 17:40
  you do things. I think that's what feels really
• 17:43
  good because they're still allowing us to have that like
• 17:45
  super hungry mentality, which we are.
• 17:47
  And we're, you know, we're we have like, for example,
• 17:49
  tomorrow, like we have press set up all morning that that napalm
• 17:53
  has done for us. But then after that our meetings
• 17:55
  that we set up ourselves with like publishing or, you know,
• 17:58
  endorsements and things like that, we're yeah, we have forgot
• 18:02
  about that. Yeah, we have.
• 18:03
  The video is too different tomorrow that we set up.
• 18:05
  So we're still aggressively doing things ourselves.
• 18:09
  And I think that is important for for a band until you're
• 18:13
  like, you know what, fucking Metallica or, you know,
• 18:16
  whatever. Yeah.
• 18:17
  So you need to, you still need to be the one that's actively
• 18:21
  searching out opportunities and new things to be able to kind of
• 18:26
  put yourself at, because no one's going to do that.
• 18:29
  You know, like they're going to set up certain things for you
• 18:33
  and things that they know how to do.
• 18:34
  But you know, you also have to be the one out there kind of
• 18:37
  pushing your stuff and figuring out how else can I grow what or
• 18:41
  say what I'm trying to say or do what I'm trying to do because
• 18:45
  ain't nobody going to do that. Yeah.
• 18:46
  I mean, because like, yeah, the record label does the the
• 18:49
  marketing and sales and things like that, but they're not doing
• 18:52
  booking, they're not doing endorsements.
• 18:53
  They don't, you know, they're they'll they'll give you a video
• 18:56
  budget, but they're not going to fucking make up some video for
• 18:59
  you. Yeah.
• 19:00
  So it's like you have to do all that stuff still, right?
• 19:02
  You have to be driven and you have to stay hungry.
• 19:04
  And I think if you do and you have a supportive team, then you
• 19:07
  have, that's a recipe for like really growing I think as a
• 19:11
  band, I think. I agree.
• 19:13
  I think there's also something to be said about, again, like we
• 19:15
  were talking about with the the creative process being that it's
• 19:18
  just, yeah, the two of you guys that yeah, you have a formula
• 19:21
  that works for you that keeps too many people from being in
• 19:24
  the kitchen at the same time. In some ways.
• 19:26
  I would assume that that kind of goes to with like what you were
• 19:29
  just talking about is that while you're going to have people
• 19:32
  taking care of certain aspects of your life as far as your
• 19:36
  music and whatever you still want to have hands on for a lot
• 19:39
  of things to go back again, like we were talking about was
• 19:42
  quality control. Like, you kind of want to know
• 19:45
  that you still have a hand in what's being done because I
• 19:48
  mean, you're a relatively young new band, you know?
• 19:51
  So it's you want to have your band and your music represented
• 19:56
  in a way that you're like, OK, I can, we can oversee this.
• 19:59
  Well, we're, I mean, we're building not just a band, but
• 20:02
  it's a brand I think. And that brand is like what
• 20:05
  we're, we're passionate about building brands, whether that's
• 20:07
  like apparel brands or you know, which is what our background,
• 20:09
  both of our backgrounds are. And we don't know any other way
• 20:13
  to do it. I don't think, you know, like, I
• 20:15
  don't think we'd ever be comfortable just laying in a
• 20:17
  chair and have people saying yes to us all the time and whatever.
• 20:20
  Not that we're even close to that.
• 20:22
  But that's just not who we are. And I don't think that's what we
• 20:24
  want out of the band. We want the band because we want
• 20:28
  stuff to do. Yeah.
• 20:30
  Gonna find something else to do, you know, like any way to?
• 20:33
  Express, yeah. Yeah, we'll fucking go do
• 20:35
  something. Else it's your happiness.
• 20:36
  So like what we were just talking about earlier, you know,
• 20:38
  it's like it's the things that bring you joy and you have to be
• 20:42
  able to nurture that and keep that, you know, I don't know,
• 20:45
  keep it in the family, so to speak, you know?
• 20:48
  Yeah, and, and just be careful, be very choosy on who you let
• 20:50
  into your family. How hard has that been as as
• 20:53
  you've you're, because obviously your band Frail is growing and
• 20:57
  growing and as you grow more people tend to kind of
• 21:01
  intertwine themselves around you.
• 21:03
  How hard is it for you to kind of feel like that certain people
• 21:06
  might be coming in with not great intentions or whatever?
• 21:09
  Like does that does it hamper you at all or do you?
• 21:13
  Got there yet? No, we're pretty introverted,
• 21:16
  quite honestly. And so there's not a lot of
• 21:19
  interaction other than other than other than cats.
• 21:23
  And you know, what we seek out intentionally and then even that
• 21:27
  is very intentional. Like Sean said, you know, with
• 21:30
  picking a producer, we talked to several and then we chose to,
• 21:34
  OK, let's go with this one. So, you know, I think that's
• 21:37
  important just in life as well. Like you have to kind of pick
• 21:40
  and choose who you share your energy with.
• 21:42
  Some people can drain you, some people can pump you up, you
• 21:46
  know, And so you've got to be really choosy in life and in
• 21:50
  your work and your your passion, who you share that energy with,
• 21:53
  because it could go one way or the other.
• 21:55
  Yeah, I feel like if we were like big partiers and not at
• 21:58
  borrows all the time, maybe that be a different story.
• 22:00
  But like fucking DoorDash is the only people that vote.
• 22:03
  We even make them drop it off on the front.
• 22:05
  Dude, Yeah. What is that like?
• 22:06
  You don't? Why is that rude?
• 22:08
  Like to not interact with your dash?
• 22:10
  I don't know, I feel like. Fucking kidding.
• 22:12
  I try to avoid human contact as much as possible.
• 22:16
  Like my wife and I like we're like, we're the same.
• 22:19
  Like if we're like we have to go somewhere.
• 22:21
  Like is it your turn to go into the store?
• 22:23
  Is it my turn to go into the store?
• 22:25
  You. Know yeah, sometimes I want her
• 22:28
  to go with me to places and I'm like look, you don't have to get
• 22:30
  out of the car and you like we have super tinted windows on our
• 22:32
  car. I'm like, you could stay and
• 22:34
  even the back if you want it because you don't have to put
• 22:36
  makeup on everything and just go with me so I can go to Target.
• 22:39
  Pajamas not sitting bad. Yeah, Oh my God, We should
• 22:42
  double. We should do an introverted
• 22:44
  double date. Like you guys and my wife feel
• 22:46
  like we can just go, like not talk to people and just ride
• 22:49
  together. Right, ride it right and you and
• 22:53
  your car, us in our car just kind of riding along same.
• 22:56
  Yeah, is like you meet at a parking lot of a restaurant and
• 23:00
  you drive by slowly. What's up?
• 23:01
  And then you go. Home get the head nod.
• 23:03
  Hey, it was a great. Thing, yeah.
• 23:06
  You never even know how to get out of your pajamas.
• 23:07
  Yeah. So another thing I wanted to ask
• 23:11
  you about too is is the, the, the concept around like the
• 23:15
  lyrical content, the music, everything like we've talked
• 23:18
  about, like this music is a very it's, it's not something that
• 23:23
  can just be played just to be cool, you know, or whatever.
• 23:26
  So like this kind of material, especially coming from the
• 23:29
  lyrics, is that it comes from a place of connection.
• 23:32
  And So what is that connection for you?
• 23:34
  Like, do you guys, are you guys like interested in like a cult
• 23:39
  or things like, you know, old literature, things like what is
• 23:42
  it that brings that interest, puts it in the music?
• 23:44
  I, I think it's all of the above, you know, like I, you
• 23:48
  know, I don't know if it's Even so much because seeking a
• 23:51
  connection while I'm actually writing it, I think it's more of
• 23:55
  getting it out and working through stuff.
• 23:57
  I think it's therapy for me when I'm finished, you know, I, so
• 24:02
  the writing process is all about me and, and getting that stuff
• 24:06
  out and leaving it on the paper. But when I'm, when we're
• 24:10
  performing, that's where the connection comes from, you know,
• 24:13
  and that's where, or even when people are listening to it, when
• 24:16
  I'm finished writing, I, I want people to be able to maybe get a
• 24:21
  little couple of things out of there that they can connect with
• 24:24
  and not feel so alone. Or, you know, I try to, even
• 24:28
  though some of my lyrics are pretty dark, there's always a
• 24:31
  little glimmer of hope in there somewhere or a resolution that,
• 24:36
  you know, I would say like depression is a house that you
• 24:39
  you can visit, but you don't want to live there, you know,
• 24:42
  and so I want to help you to visit, but then I'm going to I
• 24:46
  want to slam the door on you and kick you out.
• 24:50
  So like you're. Like, welcome, here's the back
• 24:52
  door. Go.
• 24:53
  Yeah. Thanks for coming.
• 24:56
  Yeah, like let me show you all these wonderful things and get
• 24:59
  you through all these emotions, but we really need you to, to to
• 25:03
  work through this. So, you know, let me help you,
• 25:07
  but you know, there's always light at the end of, of the, of
• 25:12
  the tunnel. There's always like, like again,
• 25:14
  a resolution. So hopefully that you know,
• 25:16
  hopefully people can see that. And, you know, if it helps even
• 25:20
  one person feel not alone or to not feel, you know, abandoned
• 25:24
  or, or pushed out or marginalized or whatever, then,
• 25:28
  you know, then I've done my job. I mean, it's interesting to me
• 25:30
  because it's that's such a personal level, you know,
• 25:34
  especially songwriting is a very personal thing.
• 25:37
  And that is not a light subject like what you're talking about
• 25:40
  in in in these songs. And so it's kind of heavy.
• 25:44
  I almost feel like in some ways. Is there like a sense of
• 25:46
  catharsis for you, knowing that like, you've been able to put
• 25:49
  this out of music that hopefully somebody might be like, I feel
• 25:52
  seen. For sure.
• 25:53
  So I think like again, initially, I think it's, it's my
• 25:56
  way of working through it. You know, if I can find the
• 26:00
  words to accurately say what I'm feeling, then it helps me to,
• 26:08
  again, it's a catharsis, right? It helps me to work through it.
• 26:10
  And the hope is at the end of the day that again, someone can,
• 26:14
  maybe someone who doesn't have the ability to, to put things
• 26:19
  into words or can't quite think of how they're feeling or or
• 26:22
  doesn't know how to, you know, work through something.
• 26:26
  If they can find just a little grain in there somewhere, then
• 26:31
  that's what I hope for. Being from, you know, Ohio, like
• 26:35
  I would assume that there's not a lot of bands on the local
• 26:37
  scene that sound like you guys. Like how did you?
• 26:40
  Or is it like I was saying, what is the scene?
• 26:42
  Like? Is there a scene that we don't
• 26:43
  know about that has like some frail to it other than frail?
• 26:47
  I don't know. I don't think so.
• 26:49
  I. Mean so we have our local bands
• 26:52
  that we like and we'll always go out to sea.
• 26:55
  Yeah, No, Ohio, it's not like Cleveland's not like a thriving
• 26:57
  market. Most of the bands that we like
• 26:59
  skip Ohio, like they'll do or skip Cleveland, they'll do like
• 27:02
  Pittsburgh or Philly and then they skip over to Detroit or
• 27:05
  Chicago. So we have to travel a lot to go
• 27:06
  see bands. I just, it's just not a, it's a
• 27:09
  definitely AB market, maybe even AC market.
• 27:11
  I don't know how that stuff goes.
• 27:12
  But there's, you know, there's a there's a small group of bands
• 27:15
  around here that we usually play with when we do play Cleveland,
• 27:18
  but we haven't made Cleveland like a big target to play all
• 27:21
  the time. Like I think we do a show like
• 27:23
  once a year here and usually it's to get ready to go on tour
• 27:26
  somewhere, you know, so it's not like we're playing Cleveland
• 27:30
  once a month or something like that.
• 27:31
  So we don't, I don't know. I think that we have just
• 27:35
  traveled the world enough playing to know like where to
• 27:39
  put our energy. And I feel bad saying about
• 27:42
  Cleveland, but like, I don't feel the need to play.
• 27:45
  Or maybe that's because I've been in bands playing Cleveland
• 27:47
  once a month for a long time. You know, maybe that's maybe
• 27:50
  that's. Why I love it and I would play
• 27:53
  more here, but I get it. At the same time, you know, it
• 27:58
  takes a lot of energy and, and organizing to get everybody kind
• 28:02
  of together to, you know, for a night.
• 28:04
  And, and for me, there has to be a reason like why why are we
• 28:09
  playing tonight? You know, like CD release or
• 28:12
  like Sean said, getting to getting ready to go on the road
• 28:15
  or something like that. So that makes sense to me, but
• 28:18
  at the same time, I do enjoy that connection that I get with
• 28:21
  the people and and you know, like it's like a whole energy
• 28:25
  sharing thing and it's it's kind of an interesting interaction.
• 28:29
  But yeah, I mean, I I love playing Cleveland and I think
• 28:32
  there are some great people that come out to the shows.
• 28:35
  Like there's there's people that come out to, you know, not just
• 28:38
  our show, but like all the a lot of.
• 28:40
  The shows. Yeah.
• 28:41
  And it's, you know, so, so there is that.
• 28:44
  There is a very I. Guess it's more of a sense of
• 28:46
  strong community than it is. Yes, Music 100.
• 28:48
  Percent, Yeah, OK. That's, that's yeah, that's I'd
• 28:51
  say that for sure. You know, that's great.
• 28:53
  And that's like the my favorite thing about Braille is the
• 28:56
  people that we get to meet. Like it's awesome, whether
• 28:58
  they're musicians or fans or just these characters.
• 29:01
  And we try to stay friends with as many as possible.
• 29:03
  And we, you know, now that we're playing festivals in Europe and
• 29:06
  if they show up at that festival, we only get to say,
• 29:08
  hey, Oh my God, you know, I don't even know how to get to
• 29:10
  where you are. But like, let me figure this
• 29:12
  maze out. And it was easier a while ago
• 29:15
  when it was just all small shows all the time.
• 29:16
  We could just hang out because, you know, I think we really
• 29:18
  enjoy the the people meet and we try to stay friends with on
• 29:20
  Facebook and it's like the weirdest group of people too
• 29:24
  like that we've met. It's awesome.
• 29:26
  It has no rhyme or reason, but it's just like that's what
• 29:28
  happened. People from every different walk
• 29:30
  of life and yeah, it's, it's great.
• 29:32
  I, I love that because especially like being a Music
• 29:34
  Writer, like I, I mean, if you looked at my, my Rolodex, I was
• 29:38
  always like to cut like it. It's, it's hilarious.
• 29:40
  It's like everybody from, you know, Sarah Mclachlan's PR
• 29:44
  person to yeah, etcetera from Exodus, you know what I mean?
• 29:49
  This is like, so anywhere along the way, like you said, you can
• 29:51
  make a connection, you make a friendship.
• 29:53
  I mean for more reasons than just a business aspect of it.
• 29:57
  But it is kind of nice to build, build a base around you of
• 30:00
  people that are going to support you and that are going to root
• 30:04
  for you. Not be yes people, but like you
• 30:06
  know, like you said, like create that environment for you that.
• 30:09
  Helps you thrive. And I think that a lot of the
• 30:12
  people that I really respond well to, and again, it's a
• 30:14
  hodgepodge because it, it comes down to like me feel us feeling
• 30:18
  like we've known each other for years and years and years and
• 30:21
  already doing inside jokes and making fun of each other within
• 30:24
  like the 1st 20 minutes, then yeah, usually like sticks.
• 30:27
  And like, like I said, it's a weird group.
• 30:29
  Sometimes there's musicians, sometimes it's just like fans
• 30:32
  over the shows or, you know, people that might not even like
• 30:34
  the fucking band, I don't know. But like, we just like have this
• 30:37
  rapport that that, that lasts. And like, it'd probably be less
• 30:41
  musicians than than and less people in the industry that
• 30:44
  could actually, you know, it's not a business move at all.
• 30:46
  It's just like, yeah, buckheads like me.
• 30:48
  They're fun, yeah. And, you know, you just hit it
• 30:50
  off and sometimes you can just tell that you're going to get
• 30:52
  along with people just from that first interaction.
• 30:55
  Kind of like how you guys are doing this interview for the
• 30:57
  17th time with me tonight. You know how?
• 30:59
  Do you fucking learn Zoom? This will always see.
• 31:03
  See, I feel like we've got our thing already.
• 31:04
  You're going to be like, oh, that's the guy I did 10
• 31:06
  interviews with and one night before he hit record.
• 31:09
  Yeah, I know that for Christmas that Wilson goes called Zoom for
• 31:13
  idiots. Just direct it to me.
• 31:18
  And so, you know, Ghost called, you know, care of.
• 31:20
  Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
• 31:23
  Well, so I guess a couple of last things I want to touch on
• 31:26
  is that we were talking early about the visual aspect, about
• 31:29
  how you guys are really into the visuals.
• 31:31
  I took some time to watch the Live at the House of Wills
• 31:35
  video. Yeah.
• 31:36
  I fucking love that shit so much.
• 31:39
  Like, because again, like I felt like the music of a band like
• 31:43
  frail or even just frail in general, like thrives in like a
• 31:47
  small environment that kind of is condensed, but that can be
• 31:51
  decorated in like an ornate fashion that kind of kind of
• 31:55
  fuels the Oh, I love that view. By the way, I interviewed a band
• 32:00
  from Atlanta called Lunar vacation and they had they have
• 32:03
  a cat named Science. And during our interview, the
• 32:06
  cat turned around and flipped his tail up and I was like,
• 32:08
  really did a screen cap of that. But but so so, like I said, like
• 32:13
  playing in this in a in an environment like that made me
• 32:16
  think like, has there ever been like a talk of you guys about
• 32:19
  like putting together some sort of like a musical, like a like a
• 32:23
  film or something that could kind of.
• 32:25
  We've, we've thought about that and talked about that.
• 32:29
  And I think what, well, so first of all, House of Will is backing
• 32:32
  up. We didn't do a fucking thing in
• 32:34
  there. That's what that place looks
• 32:35
  like. That is an abandoned, like an
• 32:37
  old Funeral Home that a friend of ours owns.
• 32:39
  He just puts a bunch of spooky shit in there and it's just
• 32:43
  insane in there, like insane. So that's just what it looked
• 32:46
  like the day we showed up. All I did was put lights up and
• 32:48
  we played like it's just what it looks like all the time.
• 32:50
  And then we go back like we shot another video there.
• 32:53
  Our walking wounded video didn't look like that looked different,
• 32:55
  right. So it's like, and there's
• 32:57
  multiple levels and hallways and all this weird shit in there.
• 32:59
  So that place is awesome. But environments like that feel
• 33:03
  like right for for real. And so it's great to just go in
• 33:07
  and roll in and it's almost like another member of the band that
• 33:11
  the environment, you know, and we have also shot videos in
• 33:14
  environments that we thought were going to be cool and we
• 33:16
  were going to make look cool and it looks stupid.
• 33:17
  So we're never going to release it, you know, So, but like that
• 33:22
  environment, like it, like I said, it's just it's it's a it's
• 33:25
  a character in itself. So back to the movie idea.
• 33:28
  We we've definitely talked about it and we like that our music
• 33:30
  videos have a thread that's continuing with like the
• 33:32
  sacrophants, like the the brides that followed went around and we
• 33:36
  already shot the first part of the of our next video with
• 33:39
  again, the the sacrophants and kind of kicked it up a notch.
• 33:42
  That'll be cool when it comes out.
• 33:43
  And then we're shooting tomorrow in this like state-of-the-art,
• 33:47
  like movie and film production studio in Cleveland where they
• 33:51
  like that that movie weapons that just came out that the
• 33:55
  people that did that movie are shooting another movie.
• 33:57
  I don't want to spoil the spill the beans on it, but a lot of it
• 34:00
  was shot there. So it's like world class, you
• 34:03
  know, studio that we're that we're rolling into.
• 34:06
  But again, it's just going to be another music video like we saw.
• 34:09
  So we talked about that idea and then we saw like Beyoncé try to
• 34:11
  do a movie. And so she's got money.
• 34:14
  She's got access to the best, the best producers.
• 34:18
  Yeah, she's Beyoncé. But we saw it and we were like,
• 34:21
  we're already, I don't know, we're not like super stoked on
• 34:23
  it. So if she can't do it, maybe
• 34:25
  it's not the right thing for a band to try to pull that off and
• 34:28
  just stick to like videos with a common thread versus trying to
• 34:32
  like make someone sit through an hour of your bullshit.
• 34:36
  You know, especially when you're competing now against Netflix
• 34:39
  and everything else, which is on your TV or on your phone.
• 34:42
  And they're fucking amazing. And every once in a while they
• 34:45
  get a breakout show and we'll let you, you want to spend an
• 34:48
  hour there. But for the most part you're
• 34:50
  like, Oh, I get bored. I'm going to bounce.
• 34:51
  So like right to try to pull that fucking feet off, you know,
• 34:56
  I think we got like a little like reality check.
• 34:59
  Not to say that it might not happen someday, but like right
• 35:02
  now, we're just kind of stoked on, you know, it feels right to
• 35:04
  do what we're doing, I think. You know, it's, I don't know if
• 35:06
  you guys saw the, the, the Vitane DVD, the, was it the Opus
• 35:10
  Diaboli or something like that? Did they?
• 35:12
  It was like a small, it was like a short.
• 35:15
  I mean, it's a long, I mean, a video, but it, yeah, had like a
• 35:18
  lot of concert footage. But then there was always these
• 35:20
  like little clips of just vision just like this beauty behind the
• 35:24
  eeriness of them, you know, and like, and of course, like as I
• 35:28
  was watching this video, I was like, I could see frail going
• 35:30
  into it, into a realm like that at some point.
• 35:32
  So I love that you guys have thought about that as well.
• 35:35
  Oh, for sure, yeah. Because visual is like we were
• 35:38
  both went to fashion school, so we were trained early on to be,
• 35:41
  to express ourselves visually. You know, when you, it's not an
• 35:43
  easy thing to like try to get your feelings out in a fucking
• 35:47
  piece of clothing, right? It's like it's, you really have
• 35:49
  to learn how to like get every oz into the right thing and, and
• 35:52
  not do too many bells and whistles to overdo it.
• 35:54
  It's something, you know, we talked about a lot.
• 35:55
  So that visual expression when we do something musically, which
• 35:59
  for frail always the music comes first, But like we don't feel
• 36:01
  like it's done until there's like a visual spin that we put
• 36:04
  on it. And you keep bringing up, like I
• 36:06
  say, Watain is probably wrong. Whatever those dudes like, like
• 36:10
  that's the man. Like buries their jackets in the
• 36:12
  mud and shit like that and like have pig heads, you know, go
• 36:15
  crazy. I think that I don't know, I
• 36:19
  just imagine that they're doing that right.
• 36:20
  So when you said it like there's a little bit of that nuts, I was
• 36:23
  like, the only thing that Gwen would do is like maybe bury her
• 36:26
  makeup and then she would like wash it off before she it was
• 36:31
  just so funny. Like to think about like a bunch
• 36:32
  of like cool Jeffree Star eyeliner or whatever, whatever
• 36:35
  bread you're into buried in the mud before you bring it out to
• 36:39
  apply it's. Like, y'all are the cleanest
• 36:41
  black metal band ever. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 36:45
  That's a hygienic black metal band.
• 36:48
  And actually, The funny thing is, the only reason I even say
• 36:50
  the band name that way is because I interviewed Eric
• 36:53
  Jameson, like, probably about eight years ago.
• 36:55
  And I said Vatane. And he goes, it's Vatane.
• 36:58
  I was like, oh. Great.
• 37:00
  OK, yeah, Vatane, it does have this kind of sense of like oomph
• 37:05
  to it, I guess. But yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 37:07
  And by the way, if you've never seen them play, it is actually
• 37:10
  the the most horrifyingly stinky thing you've ever seen in your
• 37:13
  life. I mean, apparently they go to
• 37:15
  butcher shops in every city and they basically get like the
• 37:18
  spare parts, the heads and stuff like that.
• 37:20
  And then these put them on Tri dance and light them on fire.
• 37:23
  Right. Yeah, just ridiculous.
• 37:26
  Shit, Oh my God, it's like I smelled them before I saw them.
• 37:29
  And which is a bummer because I had to leave early.
• 37:31
  I couldn't take it. I would have loved to have seen
• 37:32
  the show, you know, So, so, so you know, if I want to see a
• 37:36
  frail show, please don't ignite like roadkill on stage.
• 37:43
  Well, I guess to close things out, what's going on with you
• 37:46
  guys? Like what's coming up?
• 37:47
  I mean, we're kind of heading towards the end of 2025.
• 37:50
  Do we have some plans after the release going into next year?
• 37:54
  Yeah, we have a trip from Anna. Well, this weekend we play
• 37:59
  Tennessee Metal Devastation Festival, which we're stoked on
• 38:02
  that. It's like kind of a, it's a
• 38:04
  festival, but it's still like a, it's a very intimate stage, but
• 38:08
  in a festival setting. So it's like I think 3000
• 38:11
  people. So we're super stoked about that
• 38:13
  maiden voyage for our brand new trailer that I call the frailer.
• 38:16
  Very excited to have that. And then?
• 38:18
  Brilliant, by the way. It's awesome.
• 38:21
  Gwen's got her own dressing room in there just in case.
• 38:23
  We never, you know, have a sometimes we play these shows
• 38:26
  with bands where they they eat up all the dressing rooms and we
• 38:28
  don't have anything but Gwen obviously, you know, frail band
• 38:31
  that requires the dressing room. So I made the back trailer turn
• 38:35
  into a dressing room, just in case.
• 38:37
  And then once we get back from that, we go out with Dogma.
• 38:42
  Another band from Chile. That we played with the
• 38:44
  Bloodstock this year. We they played right after us
• 38:46
  and we were right next to them. We didn't know that we're going
• 38:48
  on tour with them at that point, but we're going out to support
• 38:51
  them from the West Coast and then we go down the South all
• 38:54
  the way to Atlanta for a couple weeks.
• 38:57
  So that happens in 25 and we're doing this really fucking sweet
• 39:01
  thing in on Black Friday in Detroit.
• 39:03
  Oh yeah, yeah. Krampus Ball, which is just
• 39:05
  bananas. That's.
• 39:07
  Awesome. They have one of those in
• 39:08
  Atlanta. We're from Atlanta.
• 39:11
  We live in unfortunately, South Carolina now.
• 39:13
  But yeah, I love that. Jesus, it's terrible here.
• 39:17
  But that's awesome though. I love the Krampus ball.
• 39:20
  That's that's gonna be incredible for you guys.
• 39:23
  We're trying to do like more unique shows like that.
• 39:25
  Like we've you know, I think there's been just discussions
• 39:29
  about other normal sort of stone or Hard Rock things that we're
• 39:32
  just like, I don't know if that's like the right fit.
• 39:34
  Like I think we'd rather do weird shit for a little bit and
• 39:36
  then hopefully 26 is gonna go bananas with just having us as
• 39:40
  busy as fuck. Like we're a up and coming band
• 39:43
  with like giant booking agents. So like we're always the last
• 39:46
  like in the yeah. So we're hoping that to kick
• 39:51
  that up a little bit. And, you know, things like the
• 39:52
  record being most added to metal and, you know, the napalm being
• 39:56
  really excited about, I think all that helps get the booking
• 39:59
  agents more excited about. I think it's gonna be
• 40:01
  incredible, and I hope that we'll get to see more of you on
• 40:04
  tour in the Southeast at least in 26, because I'd love to try
• 40:07
  to make it back to Atlanta to see you guys.
• 40:09
  But if I can't, I'm going to be pissed if you don't come through
• 40:11
  again. Yeah, I.
• 40:12
  Feel like we're going to be busy.
• 40:14
  That's what it looks like, you know, so.
• 40:17
  I will make you do 5 interviews again, yeah.
• 40:21
  Yeah, no, we're going to make you do something like yeah, five
• 40:24
  times. I don't know what it is, but
• 40:25
  it'll be. We'll figure it out.
• 40:27
  It'll be almost interval. My age, it's hard to do a lot of
• 40:30
  things five times in a seriously.
• 40:33
  But well, Sean, Gwen, you guys have been incredible to talk to.
• 40:39
  I really enjoyed getting to know everything and like I said, the
• 40:42
  band is incredible. The new album is awesome, you
• 40:46
  know, Heretics and Lullabies coming out on October 10th.
• 40:49
  I can't think of a more perfect name that describes the kind of
• 40:52
  aura to the songs and you guys are fantastic and I can't wait
• 40:55
  to see more from you guys. Thank you so much for taking the
• 40:59
  time to talk to us. Absolutely.
• 41:00
  It really means a lot to bands like us.
• 41:02
  So thank you and. Go ghost call, ghost call.
• 41:04
  It's been awesome. Like.
• 41:05
  Ever since the. Yeah, the first time we talked
• 41:07
  to him like years ago. Amazing.
• 41:09
  And we always check it out. So support Ghost Call.