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When you’re here (at Hot Topic) you’re family · Like a Virgin

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: You know I was listening to on the way here
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: was Oh well, imagine as I'm pacing the you know,
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: the church corridor, and I can't help it to here, No,
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: I can't help but to hear in exchanging of it,
• 0:14
  Speaker 1: just like being as a kid and then just waiting
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: for permission to scream, you know what I mean, Like
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: literally twelve and being like there was nothing more thrilling
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: than being like on the dance floor and the school
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: played this song. They bleeped it out of course, but
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: you were like, you know, just like stop volume. So Rose,
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: you're kind of a you're kind of a spooky girl.
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: You're saying, I have a dark, foreboding energy. That's exactly
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: what I'm saying. Yes, okay, yeah, you're right. Where does
• 0:52
  Speaker 1: that come from in here? In your upbringing? Well, when
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: I was in middle school, I was a god and
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: that was not a popular thing to be. Let's let's
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: actually let me say this. I wasn't a goth Goth.
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: I was a malga. Oh my god, I walked into
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: a mall, walked into hot topic and have never been
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: the same since you're not like the other goths. You're
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: a malga exactly, and Meanwhile, Gotham was the scariest thing
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: to me, but I wanted to be got so bad. Brand.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: I'm so excited to pop your cherry on what it
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: means to be a mall guy. I am clutching my
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: rubber sex bracelets because this is like a virgin the
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: show where we talked about yesterday's pop culture and give
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: it to day's takes. I'm Rose, damn you, and I'm
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: frand Toronto. We're going to talk about what's going on
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: in pop culture now, and then afterwards meet us inside
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: the mall. Of course, at the top, we're going to
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: discuss new Adel album. And I guess you have some
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: U news. Well it's not news, it's just something I
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: saw on Twitter that I thought it would be fun
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: to to touch on briefly. I guess we also we
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: have to mention Anie Redmain, But I think mostly what
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: I'm interested in is what we've both been watching, which
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: for me is the new season of the Great and
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: for both of us is Ultimate Girls Trip. That's right.
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: I think we all have been in an emotional vortex
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: caused by Adele. Yeah, y'all can't see right now, but
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: we've both poured just gargantuan glasses of wine. Um, just
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: while that's not true, I don't like wine Rose famously
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: hates wine Rose. I don't know if you knew this
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: about me, but like I really, um obviously love Adele
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: and I think that she's like perfect and her music
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: is perfect. But I've never been in Adele stand Are
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: there Adele stands though, Right, that's kind of true, Like
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: Adele stands are just like the world, and that she is, like,
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: according to social sciences, like one of the most popular
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: people on the planet. Yeah, she's like so ubiquitous that
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: I don't think there's like an Adele army the way
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: there is for Gaga or you know, Ariana Grande. Right,
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: what I mean to say is that I don't think
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: I've ever given one of her albums a close listen,
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: And I think that this album like really shifted different.
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: I just wasn't expecting it, Like when you first took
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: it in, was it what you expected it to be?
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: I was really expecting, you know, sad girl Autumn. And
• 3:28
  Speaker 1: it's not that she didn't give us that. It was
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: just very angry and sexy. It's also like so introspective.
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: My Little Love is just like a punch to the gut.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: I also think that on this album, like she's conscious
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: of the fact that, you know, she's taking things that
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: are incredibly personal to her and um giving them out
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: to the world and then those things are going to
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: live in the public consciousness forever. And I guess she's
• 3:58
  Speaker 1: just leaning in because you think, like something like the
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: voice notes on My Little Love, like I can't imagine
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: bearing that kind of like gaping open wound to the world,
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: but she did in a way that it's so intimate.
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: But like that's what great art is. I usually like
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: hate voice memos and or like things like that, like
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: in songs that you can can get really like cheap, organicky,
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: really fast. But like the emotional devastation was like so
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: shaking and so real. I felt like, I don't know,
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: it's such a gift. But it also had like a
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: shot Day vibe. There's like Amy influences in it. Oh. Absolutely,
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: All Night Parking really sounded to me like it could
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: have been on Frank a first record, and that's very
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: much like the lineage that I think of adult really
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: being in. It's like, you know, these British like torch
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: song writers, and it really felt to me like the
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: Adele of twenty one on an even nineteen, like the
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: Adele who was like such a wild card when she
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: came onto the scene and had like this really riotous
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: energy and it was nice to hear her in this
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: process of you know, like letting go of her marriage,
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: finding herself again. Oh yeah, I mean adult like will
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: not stop talking about her Saturn return just like an amazing,
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: highly relatable she knows her demographic like so well. Um,
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: but like production wise, like it just like immediately shook me.
• 5:32
  Speaker 1: Like from the first song, like Strangers by Nature, which
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: is definitely one of my favorite songs, it just has
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: this like Disney esque overture that was like Judy Garland
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: like Lovey and Rose like like she was doing things
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: with this the production that we have just never heard
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: from her before. This album, like compared to her others,
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: are less like technically perfect and designed for like radio pop. Um.
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: A lot of the songs on here obviously are gonna
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: are huge radio songs, and I don't know about that actually,
• 6:05
  Speaker 1: Like I don't know if this album will really translate
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: to radio. I don't know if it's meant to um
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: and like she's she even said um to Be Loved,
• 6:15
  Speaker 1: which I think is like the real crescendo of the album.
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: She said she won't perform it live, right I heard that,
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: I think I'm thinking of can I get it? Which
• 6:25
  Speaker 1: I just was reading the other day that um Adele
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: had never heard of Max Martin and heard for the
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: first time. When she heard um that, I knew you
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: were trouble and was like, who is that? Guy? Called
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: him up? I want to work with him, and it's
• 6:39
  Speaker 1: like like that and that and that, like years later
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: led to this collaboration, which like, I mean, the song
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: does what it does. It's it's like it's a it's
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: a bob. It's to me, that is like the radio play.
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: But I love that, Like if you listen to like
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: cry your Heart Out or even oh my God, there
• 6:56
  Speaker 1: are these kind of like sixties girl all band kind
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: of vibes, like the Chip Monkey choruses, it is like
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: you know, mom, Mom's night out energy And I really
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: like that. And it was the first song on the
• 7:14
  Speaker 1: album where I was like, oh, I wasn't expecting this. Yeah.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: I do really like how intentional she was about you
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: having to listen to the album all the way through
• 7:21
  Speaker 1: because she tweeted about UM. She told Spotify that they
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: had to take off the setting that they have that
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: all albums like automatically. The only the like automatic selection
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: is that you will shuffle play them, and she said
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: that they had to not do that for her album
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: because it's meant to be listened to in the order
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: that she made it. It's which is such a serve,
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: I mean, such a flex but it won't be a
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: TikTok sound because Adele said that she refused to listen
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: to her label and make short songs that you know,
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: like could like pop off on TikTok, which more artists
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: should do. By the way, did you read that there
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: is a fifteen minute version of I Drink Wine? All
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: songs should be ten or fifteen minutes. I think that's honest,
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: though they know they shouldn't. And I hope we're not
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: getting thirty Adele's version. No, no, no no, I don't
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: wish for that. I want Adele honestly. She's given us
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: so much with this album. I want her to hold
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: onto as much as she wants to hold onto UM
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: most importantly, and it must be said, she can deadlift
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: one and seventy pounds. Did you know that I didn't,
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: but it actually makes total sense. Does you know who
• 8:34
  Speaker 1: I think can probably deadlift significantly more than that, but
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: maybe not, maybe not that much more. Actually is Keanu Reeves,
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: Fran Have you seen Speed? I honestly haven't really seen
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: most Keanu Reeves movies. I've I watched Matrix one and
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: two so stoned that I could barely comprehend what was
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: going on. Okay, Virgins, we will be doing the Matrix.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: It's actually on our list. But Speed is a great movie.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: And there was this story making the rounds about how
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: while they were making Speed, Sandra Bola had kind of
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: just like blown up and she like told Keianu Reeves
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: that she had never had champagne and caviare I believe
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: or maybe like oysters um And he was kind of
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: shocked by that. And then a couple of days later
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: showed up at her house that she had just bought
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: while she and her friend were at home like painting
• 9:28
  Speaker 1: each other's nails, and he showed up on his motorcycle
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: with the bottle of champagne. It was like, I really
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: wanted you to experience this, And then he stayed and
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: they painted his nails and I just thought that was
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: so sweet. Not the motorcycle. That is like an algorithmic
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: perfect boyfriend gesture, Like what is that the motorcycle, the caviar,
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: the painting, the nails, like he's so hot. I did
• 9:49
  Speaker 1: see someone retweet it and say something like Keanu Reeves
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: was written by a woman, and like, we have to
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: stop that thing. I hate that. Like, no, you know
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: what I do of is um caviar and potato chips
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: with little cram fresh on some dell. I love caviar.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: We have caviarts. Yeah, next time you come over, we'll
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: do it like like a Virgin Um Christmas party. Yes,
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: are like a Virgin Christmas party at Margaritaville. You heard
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: it here first. Yes, we are booking the Universal City
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: Walk Margherita Ville for our company holiday party, and we're
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: saying this on the record. It's definitely gonna happen. Fran.
• 10:28
  Speaker 1: Thinking about Margaritaville has me thinking about what it exists
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: in very close proximity to, which is Universal Studios, where
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: the Wizarding World of Harry Potter is housed. And as
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: I mentioned earlier, a star of a Harry Potter film
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: was in the news. Okay, wait, I'm gonna I'm gonna
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: let you finish, but can we talk about that transition
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: that was a that was a black belt jiu jitsu transition.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: I cannot believe the leap you just made it. We
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: just have to we have to like honor and hold
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: space for that. Anyways, continue, what did Eddie Redmain do
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: when we're talking about my sister, Eddie Redmain. We have
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: to get the transition right? Right, of course, right, Eddie Redmain.
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: I guess Um said in an interview that he regrets
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: playing the Danish Girl in The Danish Girl, the movie
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: which he won an Oscar for where in which he
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: plays a trans woman. I've never seen The Danish Girl.
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: I do not feel called to see it. I do
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: not really have anything to say about it other than like,
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: if they want to like c g I him out
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: of the movie, Uh, they're free to use my image,
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: but like it's gonna cost them. It's an extremely average movie.
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: I have seen it. All I feel like it needs
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: to be said is that Um Eddie Redmain was told
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: the whole time, his whole press tour, the whole course
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: of taking on this role, that it was not okay
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: for him to take this role. So the fact that
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: he's listening to it now is like not surprising, just
• 12:00
  Speaker 1: fitting into the culture climate whatever. Like to me, it
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: reminds me of when Um Darren Chris like a year
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: ago or two ago, was like, I will no longer
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: be playing any gay roles. Um, I've learned that that's
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: not okay, And I was like, cool, I'm glad you
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: are announcing this after you've done it a million times.
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: So it hasn't like it hasn't been that long since
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: The Danish Girl came out. It's not like we were
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: in a radically different culture when he made the movie. Like, truly,
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: I don't care. He should just not have talked about it. No,
• 12:34
  Speaker 1: And I personally don't even like like period dramas. You
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: are a period drama and I think you were watching one.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: I love a period drama. Um, I especially love a
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: period drama, you know, like with a contemporary sensibility. And
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: I have started watching the first couple episodes of The
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: Great season two, which is who Lose show about Catherine
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: the Great with Al Fanning. I really liked the first
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: season and I liked how like ir Reveren was and
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: how it's not even just like modern sensibility, Like they
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: use a lot of modern language, and like it is
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: very much the Marie into Ain utification of costume dramas.
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: Sofia Coppolis Marie Antoinette, which is one of my favorite movies,
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: is definitely the blueprint for um I. It's definitely, oh,
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: absolutely similar vibe. It's yeah. Well, like, I think even
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: something like Dickinson on Apple TV, which I also love
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: very much, falls into that category of looking back at
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: these historical figures, some of them girl bosses, and grafting
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: modern feminist ideas onto them. I mean, I can't wait.
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: That makes me really really want to watch it. I
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: did start watching, and I think I stopped when, like
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: my Apple TV subscription canceled, But I did restart my
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: Apple TV subscription to watch the Morning Show, which I
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: cannot get into. But it is maybe the most poorly
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: written show I've ever watched, and I've watched Riverdale all
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: of it. Well, Thankfully you and I have a taste
• 14:08
  Speaker 1: for shows that require no writing whatsoever, like Bravos Ultimate
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: Girls Trip. People have been saying forever that there needs
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: to be a Real Housewives All Stars, and I think
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: that the way Ultimate Girls Trip is set up is
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: the perfect framing for a Real Housewives All Stars because
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: what are the best parts of any Real Housewives franchise?
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: The vacations. That's where all the drama happens, because it's
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: taking all of these women and putting them together in
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: a space where they can't leave, supplying copious amounts of alcohol,
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: and having them fight over like rooms and expensive dinners.
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: So getting all of these housewives from different franchises and
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: putting them on a vacation together is perfect. It was
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: to me very smart to include Ramona, who is a
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: chaos agent. I think they've already filmed the hate her
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: this or like the second rendition of this. I know
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: she she is a white supremacist. She showed that off
• 15:05
  Speaker 1: in the first episode by continually calling Kenya Portia like
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: multiple times, and it's like, Ramona, do you not read
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: the briefs they send you? Like? Do you go into
• 15:16
  Speaker 1: this completely read? She probably can't. She doesn't know who
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: any of them are. She doesn't know who she is.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: She has Yeah, to me, who, Okay, I'm curious to
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: know who's in your personal Real Housewives All Stars. I
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: think we have some people, right. I think Kenya absolutely
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: needs to be there because she is chaos, pure and simple.
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: I do think we need someone like Cynthia there to
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: balance out Kenya's chaos a little bit, but Cynthia can
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: get messy too. Think Cynthia is a little too middle
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: of the road for an All Stars cast as well.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: Teresa has to be there, Luanne has to be there,
• 15:53
  Speaker 1: even Ramona has to be there, because in my opinion,
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: I could take Ramona or Luanne, and unfortunately, even though
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: I hate her, I would pick Ramona. I understand where
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: you're coming from. We need definitely more Beverly Hills girls.
• 16:08
  Speaker 1: I think Derit would do really well in this context
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: because she would be serving looks which no one is doing.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: I feel like they very intentionally only cast one demon
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: into this season because to me, I would add Brandy
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: Glanville into this into the mix, but like to have
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: Ramona and Brandy against each other might be honestly, like
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: the Island might sink. I would also love if we
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: had a cameo allah Jill Zarin showing up on Scary Island.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: So I think maybe having like Lisa vander Pump helicopter
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: in would be well. Jill is going to be in
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: season two of Ultimate Girls Trip. I was reading um
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: as is Brandy, Oh my god, Oh my god. Okay,
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: so I would throw those Meredith marks after this last
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: episode is now to me in my All Stars cast.
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: So we need Bethany, we need we need Bethany. I
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: hate to say we do need Bethany. I would say
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: maybe Wendy from Potomac and we need Camille Grammar. We
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: need Camille Grammar. And we would never get Kneanie because
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: she's Nannie. I was actually gonna say needs the game.
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: So I was gonna say we need Kim Zalsiac, but
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: say would add more you're you're right. I don't know
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: that Kim would do it because if she would only come,
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: if she could bring her husband in all twelve of them,
• 17:25
  Speaker 1: nor would Bethany. Bethany would like they would have it
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: at a property she owned, and she would greet them
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: and then and then she'd make them all audition to
• 17:33
  Speaker 1: be her interns, and then she burned the house. Rose.
• 17:37
  Speaker 1: You have to know that in the third or fourth
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: episode of Ultimate Girls Trip, they of course bring an
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: astrologer and and this astrologer is also a psychic and
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: can read into people's past lives. I'm using air quotes
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: around astrologer because clearly no one knows what an astrologer
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: is or does. And also the mystics and astrologers and
• 17:57
  Speaker 1: the palm readers that they hire for Housewives are usually like,
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: you know, scam artists. No, but that's how you know
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: this is hitting because the most iconic Real Housewives seasons
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: have psychics involved. Yes, exactly. I mean that is one
• 18:12
  Speaker 1: of my favorite episodes I've ever watched is the psychic
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: that smoked the fake cigarette? What was her name? She's
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: I know exactly when she's going to die, and I
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: love that about me. That is maybe one like a
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: top ten Real Hot Swives episode, maybe even top five. Um.
• 18:28
  Speaker 1: But anyways, what I was saying is when the astrologer
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: comes in, she starts talking about people's past lives, and
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: she looks at Kyle and she says, in your past life,
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: you were a man trans icon. Kyle rich Kyle Richards,
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: and Eddie Redmain, y'all should link up. Um. Well, now
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: let's travel through time back to two thousand one and
• 18:53
  Speaker 1: go to the mall. Don't don't, don't, don't, don't, don't, don't,
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: don't don't don't don't, don't, don't, don't. I'm really needed
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: to know the difference between a goth goth and a
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: mall god. To me, it's about the context of your Gotham.
• 19:21
  Speaker 1: Maybe a true goth, I think that kind of happens
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: in isolation. A mall goth is more public and more
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: tied to like capitalism, more tied to fluorescent lighting, anance, pretzels,
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: and hot topic. If there's a mall goth starter pack, like,
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: what are the things that kind of make up like?
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: To me, it's like the giant coo jeans, right, yeah, bondage,
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: big big pants, huge pans, huge, huge parachute pants you
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: could fit. What do you put in your big pants anyways? Um, depression?
• 20:01
  Speaker 1: You didn't put drugs because when you're a mom, got
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: you weren't cool? Like, do mom cost do drugs? Maybe
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: like huffing? Well I did. I did used to huff
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: when I was Your pockets filled with yeah umps. Okay,
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: so it's definitely the big pants. Um a T shirt
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: with some kind of slogan on it. Oh you woke
• 20:24
  Speaker 1: me up? Now? What? Yeah? Um? I used to have
• 20:27
  Speaker 1: this one T shirt that had a monkey on it
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: and it said eifling pooh. What Yeah, that is it was.
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: It's so stupid. I owned it. Um, you would have.
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: I'm still way it said, iifling pooh because monkeys throw pooh.
• 20:48
  Speaker 1: I oh my god. That era of T now okay,
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: this is like a whole era of T shirts. I
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: wonder if there's like a listic Okay anyway, sorry, continued Um.
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: There would also be, obviously the chain wallet. Yeah, yeah,
• 21:01
  Speaker 1: or pants sometimes come with additional chains as well. Yeah,
• 21:04
  Speaker 1: I would say they were their vanity chains. They don't
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: really do anything. Where's the chain wallet exists too? Keep
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: your wallet attached to your genes? Can we talk about
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: these vanity chains real quick? Because they were called bondage pants?
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: But when when I was in high school, I don't
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: know what fucking bondage was. No, I didn't know what
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: these chains were for. And they were loosely tied to
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: like something in like related to sex. And that was
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: an adult, like my bondage does not usually involve pants,
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: And yeah, exactly now, isn't. I'm like, you can chain
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: me to this bed, to this bed frame yet? Yeah,
• 21:34
  Speaker 1: but let me take these pants off, let me take
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: these huge pa I'm thirty thirty years old, please, let
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: me take off these huge jango jeans, let me just
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: ship me out of the eat, and then let me
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: just take the chains off of the of the genes
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: so that you can tie me up to this bed post. Okay,
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: and then as we continue working our way up, I
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: would say, you know, there's probably like a studied bracelet.
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: What about those sex bracelets? Oh my god, okay, wait
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: where people was real? Like we're people actually doing sex? Okay?
• 22:03
  Speaker 1: For those don't know, they're these like teeny tiny little
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: like multicolored plastic bracelets and people would collect like what
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: like dozens of them, and they were supposed to be
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: for the colors were for a different sex sexual act
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: and if you broke one, you had to do the
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: thing was one when you it was like pokemon like
• 22:21
  Speaker 1: got to catch them all. Yeah, but none of us
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: weren't doing like it's like this is for me he
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: and Jeb. This is real mean blue jab this is
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Like this for snowballing. What's snowballing?
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: I actually forget Okay, let's wait, we need to google
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: right now. Snowballing slang snowballing passing come from person to
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: person in such a way that the amount of come increases.
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: The childhood game of phone tag, it's like that, it's
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: like that a little grown up. Okay, wait, have you
• 22:50
  Speaker 1: heard that the kids are soaking these days? You know
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: what's soaking? What is what is soaking? Soaking is I
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: guess the sexual practice maybe popularized by like Mormon and
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: send sexually conservative people were in like someone sticks it
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: in and just stays there without moving at all, and
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: why because they don't want This is very relatable to
• 23:15
  Speaker 1: my upbringing. A lot of Christians have like a barer
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: to entry on sex specific to like penetration, and so
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: they create all these loopholes, and so soaking is this
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: sexual loophole where it's like I can still be a version,
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: but if I stick my dicking you and just stay
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: there and I don't gyrate at all, it doesn't count us. Oh.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: So it's about the movement, like you can you can
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: put it in, but you can't, you can't move. But
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: here's the thing. Here's the thing. Soaking now has an
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: additional new thing added on just so we can called
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: jump thumping. And it's when when a guy goes to
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: soak and his buddy jumps on the bed next to
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: them to create gyrations that are not voluntary. It's called
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: jump thumping. That sounds that reminds me of that the
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: jump pumping. It reminds me of that band Chumba Wumba.
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: I get knocked down, but I get up again. You
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: ain't never gonna keep me up, which is actually very
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: relevant to this period of time that we're talking about
• 24:12
  Speaker 1: with with mall goth culture. So then okay, after the bracelets,
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: I guess more jewelry is um the and these have
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: I see people wearing these now. The chains with that
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: are just like big balls. They look like anal beads. Wait,
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: I actually haven't seen you've never seen this? Should I
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: google big balls? Yeah? No, I'm not going to do that. Yeah,
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: they were just like big They're like big metal balls
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: on a chain. Um. And then the crowning glory was
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: like hair, so it was usually like spiked or mohawk.
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: Did you spike your hair? I did? This is what
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: the listeners I was. I had a different gender presentation
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: as a as a teenager than I do. Now what
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: kind of what kind of like like spikes? Were they
• 24:56
  Speaker 1: like like porcupine spikes or was it a mohawk or
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: they like I did. I did everything, of course, right
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: when you're a mall goth, there are no rules. You
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: can you kind of change up all the time. And
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: I part of all goth culture totally. And I guess
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: hair was my entry point into mall goth culture because
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: the first time I ever went to hot Topic was
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: to buy manic panic hairte This is maybe I'm projecting,
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: because I mean, long story short, I had was so
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: scared of like goth culture, but I did have a
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: lot of like bisexual goth friends. I don't know how
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: y'all keep finding me. So I was goth for Halloween.
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: My culture is not a costume. Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: I'm that was a little appropriative of me. Um, But yeah,
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: I feel like it was part of like my gender journey,
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: like straightening my hair and like wearing eyeliner for the
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: first time. I was like, oh, this is so fun.
• 25:57
  Speaker 1: And I only did it one day on Halloween. But
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: like I'm laddering up to was there any part of
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: like goth culture that they were like inklings of, like
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: where you were as like a queer person, maybe only
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: in the broadest sense that I felt like I was
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: accessing this thing about me that was other because you know,
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: like I came out as gay pretty young when I
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: was fourteen, so like I guess I had I was
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: accessing some type of queerness. But this was like before that.
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: And I actually think once I came out as a teenager,
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: like when I had a different gender presentation, I felt
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: more pressured to conform to like what at that time
• 26:46
  Speaker 1: we thought like gay men were. So it was like
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: not it was like not goth because I went from
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: like mall goth to maybe like indie alternative to you know,
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: I lived in Florida, so Abercrombie and Fitch, Oh my god,
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: triggered just the smell of fierce just hit me right
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: in the nose. I know that you had a lot
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: of restrictions about things that you were allowed to do.
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: What was when you were a teenager? Did you ever
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: go to the hot topic at the mall? You know? Okay?
• 27:24
  Speaker 1: I mean first of all, yes, I later, as I
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: kind of you know, started to break my parents rules
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: and like come into my own. I really did actually
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: love shopping a hot topic. I loved getting band t
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: shirts there. I loved like kind of shopping a hot topic.
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: But at the beginning, absolutely not, and I have Actually
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: I think one of my earlier memories of going to
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: Hot Topic was maybe with my sister, but my mom
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: was there and we walked by and I was like, Oh,
• 27:52
  Speaker 1: there's some cool like band t shirts in that crazy store.
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: Do you want to go in? Mom? With like the
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: spooky like yeah, they're blasting um my chemical romance or
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: whatever my mom's like, and like, anyways, we go in.
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: We were in for maybe less than five minutes, and
• 28:12
  Speaker 1: my mom walks up to me and she goes, Francisco,
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: we have to leave because there is an evil spirit
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: inside this store. She was right, I was the evil spirit.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: I wish. I definitely applied to to get a job
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: at Hot Topic, was never hired, but that did not
• 28:36
  Speaker 1: stop me from endlessly trying to become friends with the cashiers. Well,
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: there is an exclusivity um circulating within Hot Topic around
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: like how you were really greeted? Right? They kind of
• 28:47
  Speaker 1: are mean to you on purpose to create the vibe
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: of the store. You know, it's kind of like the
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: boom boom room of Malgos, you know what you mean. Yeah,
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: they were gate keeping, Yeah they were gate keeping girl bossing.
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: Um but I or maybe I'm just projecting, because I
• 29:01
  Speaker 1: just felt so polarized by any hint of devil worship,
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: like I still had all of this like lat in
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: shame and like who I was as a person that
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: like anything that looked like darkness was like terrifying and
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: and to me it was seductive. Yeah, you were home.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: It was like Olive Garden when you're here your family.
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: So if you if you went to did you I
• 29:26
  Speaker 1: assume if you were a mall, you went to the
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: mall all the time? How how often did you have
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: to go? How did you get there? I spent all
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: my free time at the mall, basically, like any time
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: that I wasn't at rehearsal because I was a theater kid,
• 29:41
  Speaker 1: I was at the mall. Um sometimes a whole other
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: episode about theater kids, honestly, totally Um. Sometimes I was
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: at the mall with friends, like we would go together
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: and go shopping, and sometimes I just went alone. Actually,
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: the mall that was closest to me. I'm from Boca Raton, Florida,
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: which is a very like bougie part of Florida. Um,
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: and the mall nearest to me was like very bougie
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: um and there was no hot topic there. The closest
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: hot topic was the mall that was twenty minutes away.
• 30:10
  Speaker 1: And before I had a car, I used to call
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: a taxi because this was like early two, so obviously
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: there was like no uber. This is when I was
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: in middle schour team, so like you were calling cars
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: and I would call it. I would call a taxi service.
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: I would like go to the in the Yellow Pages,
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: look up a taxi service, and take a taxi twenty
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: minutes to go to hot topic. The first time I
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: did it, I went to hot Topic and I was
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: immediately felt like I was home. I bought manic Panic
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: red hair dye, went home, dyed my hair like that
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: red color that all that all alternative girls have. And
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: then that weekend we were going to Universal because I
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: think it was like just when Islands of Adventure had opened.
• 30:58
  Speaker 1: And I just have the most vivid memory of sitting
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: in the in the very back of my stepdad's old
• 31:05
  Speaker 1: white suburban with my freshly dyed red hair, reading, yes,
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: reading Wicked The Life and Times of the Wicked Witch
• 31:15
  Speaker 1: of the West, which is the novel that Wicked the
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: musical is based on familiar I'm familiar. I feel like
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: I I think I started reading because it was I
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: remember being like, this is going to be a kid's book,
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: but it was I had to go to the adults.
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: It's very adults and it's very like political. I really
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: would have finished it if I did kind of get like,
• 31:32
  Speaker 1: if I didn't have like undiagnosed a d H D,
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: I definitely would have finished that book. Yeah. I I
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: spent all of my time in malls, and like a
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: hot topic was obviously my favorite store, but I did
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: not discriminate. There were there were so many stores that
• 31:49
  Speaker 1: I went to them all. I was like, obviously a
• 31:51
  Speaker 1: huge reader as a kid, so I spent a lot
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: of time at um borders. There wasn't a border to
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: my mam. There was a Walden Books. R Alden Books
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: are specific to malls. I feel never so low our mall.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: It was like, um, the Walden Books was in the
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: food court. I'm honestly, to be totally honest, I'm still
• 32:12
  Speaker 1: stuck on the fact that you hailed cabs to the mall,
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: like they were so terrifying to me. You were like,
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: so you're basically like a goth like Eloise at the plaza. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: I was like in my in my big pants on
• 32:25
  Speaker 1: the side of the street, like hailing attacks and you
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: would walk up to the mall to you would walk
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: up to the concierge and be likes to wait. But
• 32:32
  Speaker 1: speaking of the pants, this is maybe one of my
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: most traumatic childhood memories. So I had just buckle up
• 32:40
  Speaker 1: once I started going to Hot Topic regularly, you know,
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: like I had my I like I think Hot Topic
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: was really going. There was the first time I ever
• 32:50
  Speaker 1: bought close for myself. That's nice. And then maybe that's
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: how my experience of the mall changed, because like when
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: I was a kid, I always used to go to
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: the mall with my mom and she would like bias
• 33:00
  Speaker 1: clothes that I didn't care about. And then the mall
• 33:04
  Speaker 1: was then the place where I had agency and how
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: I presented, So I had um you know, as we
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: discussed a couple of like gross T shirts that I
• 33:12
  Speaker 1: used to wear from Hot Topic. But my favorite item
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: of clothing was a pair of big pants. They were
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: these like big blue Jinko They were blue. They were
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: bright blue. Wow that sounds really yeah, no, actually I
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: think I would totally wear them out because they were
• 33:31
  Speaker 1: like big, like now I know what I'm getting you
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: for Christmas. They were like big raver pants and I
• 33:36
  Speaker 1: would wear them. If I could have worn them every day,
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: I would have worn them every day. You know how
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: when you're a kid, you have like one item of
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: clothing that you just want to wear all the time.
• 33:47
  Speaker 1: Of course I had a similar pair of pants. That's
• 33:50
  Speaker 1: what they were for me. Like if I was a
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: cartoon character, that would have been my look, oh yeah,
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: if you were Daria, which you are, Yes, I am, um.
• 33:58
  Speaker 1: But my mom hated them. Of course parents hate hated them.
• 34:04
  Speaker 1: You know, I think we we We've talked about before
• 34:07
  Speaker 1: how I had like a real kind of lack of
• 34:09
  Speaker 1: supervision as a child, and so that extended to this
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: part of my life with hot topic. This thing used
• 34:16
  Speaker 1: to happen with my mom where like we would get
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: into cycles where she would kind of like be like
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: focused on other things for a while and then would
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: like check in on me and be like what's going
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: on with her? And then when she did, we'd be like,
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: I gotta we gotta cut this ship out, cut the cameras,
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: dead ass. So that's what happened with the pants, Like
• 34:37
  Speaker 1: I was wearing them over and over again for so long,
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: and then I think one day she realized we gotta
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: get those, gotta go. So one day that I didn't
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: wear them, I came up from school to find out
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: that she had thrown them away. Rose this, Okay, wait,
• 34:55
  Speaker 1: what did you do? I was devastated. I cried, I screamed,
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: I threw a it and I ran away. You were
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: nineteen years old, I was no. I wasn't just kidding
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: I was. I was in eighth grade. Um I ran away,
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: by which I mean like I strapped on my roller
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: blades and rollerbladed down the block down town in my
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: big pants. It wasn't in my big pants because my
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: mom threw them away. I thought maybe you had multiple pairs,
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: only had one, only had one pair. They were really expensive.
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: They were like hundreds of dollars. There weren't hundreds of dollars.
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: Maybe they were like sixty dollars, which was a lot.
• 35:32
  Speaker 1: In two thousand. Some bondage pants were over a hundred dollars. Yeah,
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: but these weren't. Okay, Okay, they were maybe mistakes there
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: they were maybe like for you cried over a pair
• 35:44
  Speaker 1: of bondage stuff, I would They were my whole identity.
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: Where were you Where were you shopping at them? All? Um?
• 36:11
  Speaker 1: I did frequent American Eagle, which was less affordable for
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: me at the time, but I would like save up
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: to get like a hideous pair of like fake leather
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: flip flops or like some horrible plaid shorts because I
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: couldn't be a goth and so I pivoted to PREP
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: very fast. I did eventually pivot to PREP very late
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: in my high school career. Um, I guess American Eagle
• 36:35
  Speaker 1: was kind of like the more affordable Abercrombie. Yeah, okay, yeah,
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: I guess it was. Um. The flip flops is very
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: triggering because again I lived in Florida. I used to
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: wear rainbow flip flops. Like every day. You would bully
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: yourself if you if you had met your childhood self.
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: I'm sure yeah, I did bully myself because I hated myself. Okay,
• 36:59
  Speaker 1: So what others did you guys do? Uh? Kaby toys?
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: Remember Kaby toys? I actually don't. Oh. You know what
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: I was into was, um, that store that had all
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: of that as cn TV stuff where they had like
• 37:12
  Speaker 1: the massage chair. There was special store for Landers, and
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: like they were always at the mall. Yeah yeah, yeah,
• 37:17
  Speaker 1: or like a Brookstone, Yes, Brookstone where you do the
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: massage thing and you'd like sit in the massage you
• 37:23
  Speaker 1: tell someone kicked you out. A lot of my mall
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: experience was like going to stores where I couldn't buy
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: things because I wasn't a girl, right, um, so like
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: Claire's um limited to Libby Lou? Did you have a
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: Libby loo at? Your mom did not have a Libby Lou?
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: It was like budget limited to It was actually tween
• 37:42
  Speaker 1: limited to um like pack Son, but walking through the
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: girl's side a Lizzie McGuire fan. Yeah, okay, I feel
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: like Lizzie McGuire. The Lizzie McGuire too. Limited to Pipeline
• 37:53
  Speaker 1: was like a big like you know, totally and Delia's
• 37:56
  Speaker 1: also Delia, I mean because I couldn't really afford like
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: Abercambie or I really wanted American Eagle stuff I would
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: ask for Christmas, but I could shop it like Cole's obviously,
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: which was my favorite store. Um, and I I also
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: would go to Old Navy. Oh bitch, Old Navy. Old
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: Navy was it? I really think that it had some
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: kind of like resurgence and popularity, like when we would
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: have like when we were in middle school in high school. Yeah,
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: there was an old Navy's once. Yeah, definitely old Navies
• 38:33
  Speaker 1: ons UM, I think very tied to the ski vests.
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: That was the thing that really popped off. And also
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: the Bermuda the pants that UM turned into shorts shorts,
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: Well that was a different thing. There was the Bermuda shorts,
• 38:49
  Speaker 1: and then there were the pants that zipped so you
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: could like unzipped the bottom halt turned them. So many
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: pairs of convertible pant shorts. But why was I in
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: Florida dressed? I was wearing old Navy ski pants and
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: a ski vest dressing like I was in Aspen at
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: Gay Ski Week. We can't talk about malls without talking
• 39:12
  Speaker 1: about food at malls, Cheese Kick Factory obviously like the
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: place to be. They would come over, they would give
• 39:21
  Speaker 1: you the binder that is their menu. Like that's where
• 39:24
  Speaker 1: I always used to go. UM. When I was in
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: high school, we had UM. Like I guess what you
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: would call an outdoor mall across the street from the
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: high school campus. An outdoor mall, you know, like like
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: the like the Grove al Fresco. Not good for goths
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: though because of the sun. Yes, they're they're used to be.
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: This like very iconic blog called Goths in Hot Weather,
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: which is very that. It's really hard to be a
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: go when it's I'm literally it's not on Tumblr. It's
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: like a blog spot block um block spot. But there
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: was a cheese Kick Factory, and so we always used
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: to go there, you know, if it someone's birthday, like
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: we would go after school. And you know, I think
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: the thing that I remember most about Cheesecake Factor as
• 40:07
  Speaker 1: a teenager is um, one person orders the Shirley Temple
• 40:10
  Speaker 1: and then everyone at the tables like, oh, that sounds good.
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: Do they have unlimited bread sticks and cheesecake Factory. Yeah,
• 40:17
  Speaker 1: they have the the like brown bread with the oats
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: on it. It's so good. I remember that brown bread.
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: Remember that brown bread. We should go to Cheesecake Factory.
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: I'm not going. We my family specifically is really good.
• 40:31
  Speaker 1: I don't remember any of it. You'll have to convince
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: me of that. My mom wouldn't let us go because
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: she's favorite pasta if you know. Okay, speaking of pasta,
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: my parents would take us to the corner bakery at
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: the mall Maggiano's Bukabpo not unfortunately, but it was we
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: still have to go to We're not going She's not
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: going to be there. It's not I wouldn't want her
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: to be No, I guess not. Yeah, okay, well other stores.
• 41:06
  Speaker 1: I mean, we'd loved any End's moment, but my mom
• 41:09
  Speaker 1: wouldn't take us there. Our babysitter would. Oh yeah, we
• 41:13
  Speaker 1: had a we had a well nice sister and I
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: were nightmare children because we would fight constantly, and then
• 41:20
  Speaker 1: that fight would kind of like become a ball of
• 41:23
  Speaker 1: wrath that would inevitably involve our babysitters. And by the
• 41:26
  Speaker 1: time I was in middle school, we had gone through
• 41:28
  Speaker 1: like six or seven babysitters. No joke, you had babysitters
• 41:33
  Speaker 1: up until high school? Like well maybe like no, no,
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: I should say like maybe late middle school. My parents
• 41:38
  Speaker 1: definitely didn't trust me as a child. My my mom
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: started leaving us alone when I was like eight. Yeah, no,
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: the first time. I'm actually this is relevant the conversation.
• 41:47
  Speaker 1: The first time my mom left me alone, Um, she
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: didn't really mean to leave me alone. But I was
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: like seven or eight, maybe six or seven, maybe even younger.
• 41:59
  Speaker 1: I was waching James and the Giant Peach Tim Burton, Hello,
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: so my mom. I didn't think she was going to
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: leave for that long. She just went across the street
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: to go get something from the neighbors, and then it
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: ended up staying and chatting. Meanwhile, I'm like six or seven.
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: I'm at home watching James and the Giant Peach in
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: the comfort of my mother's bedroom. That movie is really scary.
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: Have you watched it recently? Not? Not in a while.
• 42:26
  Speaker 1: We should do an episode on it because it's very
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: formative to me as a child. But the rhinoceros in
• 42:31
  Speaker 1: it is extremely scary, and the movie ends on a
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: very jarring, scary high stakes note. I really liked the
• 42:39
  Speaker 1: mean ants I love from James, Spike and Sponge. It's
• 42:43
  Speaker 1: us Spiker and Sponge high key. Susan's Randon also amazing performance.
• 42:48
  Speaker 1: Voted oh god, look the movie ends, I, you know,
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: go to find my mom because I am scared and
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: my mom is not in the house. For the first
• 43:02
  Speaker 1: time in my life, my mother is not there. I
• 43:06
  Speaker 1: wig out because my six year old seven year old
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: brain was like this rhino ate my mom period, And
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: so what did I do? I called the cops and
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: it is the first. It is the first nipples are
• 43:23
  Speaker 1: so hard right now, well it's a little it's a
• 43:25
  Speaker 1: little cold in this studio. It is the first and
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: only time I called the cops, and I don't the
• 43:31
  Speaker 1: cops never even came. I even think that I may
• 43:34
  Speaker 1: be dialed the wrong number. But whatever I dial did
• 43:36
  Speaker 1: connect me to an operator of some kind. I remember
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: at least that. And by the time my mom came home,
• 43:41
  Speaker 1: I was like sobbing and I had called the cops
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: and like anyways, So all that is to say is
• 43:46
  Speaker 1: that's the first time my mom left me alone. And
• 43:48
  Speaker 1: that's why I needed a babysitter until I was in
• 43:50
  Speaker 1: like late middle school. And who used to take you
• 43:54
  Speaker 1: to the mom? Michelle. She was the one that survived
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: the terrors that me and my sister were and she
• 43:59
  Speaker 1: stayed around for a few years before she inevitably quit
• 44:02
  Speaker 1: because of us as well. Um, I there was an
• 44:05
  Speaker 1: age where I stopped having babysitters, and I used to
• 44:08
  Speaker 1: love like when my so my parents got divorced and
• 44:12
  Speaker 1: then my mom, like there were a couple of years
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: where she was dating before she married my my stepdad,
• 44:17
  Speaker 1: and I used to love the nights that she would
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: go out because like the big thing would be I
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: would get to like order food in or like go
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: out and get something and then like have a night
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: at home. And like the big thing was subway, which
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: subway is so disgusting and I haven't eaten it and
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: maybe like ten years because it's so gross. Um. But
• 44:40
  Speaker 1: I loved the subway chicken teryoaki foot long. I feel
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: like my mom used to order that because my mom
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: and my sister were obsessed with tarayaki. But I was
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: a picky kid. But the smell of subways so gross.
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: There was the smell of subways disgusting, and when someone
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: has eaten it, it's the kind of smell that lingers.
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: There was one one one time I was at a party.
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: This was like my like mid twenties, and was dancing
• 45:07
  Speaker 1: with this boy who I like, I wanted to take
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: home um um. But like while as we were dancing,
• 45:17
  Speaker 1: the few these fumes started to waft off of him
• 45:21
  Speaker 1: and I said to him, did you eat subway earlier today?
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: And he said yes, And you were turned on? And
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: I could smell it coming out of his pores And
• 45:29
  Speaker 1: there was no way I could have had sex with him,
• 45:31
  Speaker 1: so I like, you know, went home with someone else.
• 45:33
  Speaker 1: I thought you were going to say that that got you,
• 45:35
  Speaker 1: that got your got you going? Um, did you know that?
• 45:38
  Speaker 1: You did? You know that? A Supreme court in Ireland,
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: literally this was a Supreme court case that ruled that
• 45:47
  Speaker 1: the bread in subways sandwiches cannot legally qualify as bread,
• 45:52
  Speaker 1: that it's literally cake because the sugar content is too high.
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: I did not know that, but that makes sense. It
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: explains a lot, honestly. A normal maybe like weekend for
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: me as a you know, a middle schooler, was like
• 46:09
  Speaker 1: going to rehearsal for whatever play I was in, going
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: to the mall, coming home, and then like reading Harry
• 46:17
  Speaker 1: Potter or Buffy the Vampire Slayer fan fiction while listening
• 46:20
  Speaker 1: to Evanescence for twelve hours until like five am, and
• 46:25
  Speaker 1: then sleeping for you know, a couple of hours and
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: getting up and doing it all over again. Wait, that
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: is a mall goth culture thing. Is not sleeping so
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: that when you go to school you look like a corpse.
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: I stayed up all night, and like, remember how much
• 46:40
  Speaker 1: how tired we were as teenagers. I used to sleep.
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: I would sleep on the weekends. I could sleep till
• 46:47
  Speaker 1: like two pm easily. Oh my god. Now I like,
• 46:53
  Speaker 1: I want to be up at seven as soon as yes,
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: exactly the same time. I'm not going to waste the day.
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: My mom would have to drag us out of bed.
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: We were so bad at getting up as kids. Wait,
• 47:02
  Speaker 1: what other music did you listen to? Because I had
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: a lot of like gateway music into like hot topic culture. Well,
• 47:09
  Speaker 1: I guess overlap. There was of course a soundtrack to
• 47:13
  Speaker 1: Being a Mall Goth, which for me was very heavy
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: on the evanescence. Okay, that and and that you know
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: did not stop into your adulthood. You still are an
• 47:23
  Speaker 1: evanescence stand absolutely. While I was actively in mode sicco
• 47:30
  Speaker 1: mode um in like middle school, it was a lot
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: of evanescence. It was um. There's this band, kiddie that
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: I was really into. They were like an all girl
• 47:40
  Speaker 1: like Metals scream Oh band. Actually forced the DJ at
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: my bar Mitzvah to play them. No. I like walked
• 47:48
  Speaker 1: up with the c D is like put this on
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: the beginning of the album and he was like no,
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: And I was like, We're you're paying, We're paying you
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: to celebrate me becoming a man. Today, so you better
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: put this on. No, that's what I'm aware. I'm aware.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: Is there like a book smizvah? Is is that like
• 48:08
  Speaker 1: a thing? Now? Maybe it should be. Honestly, my I
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: guess the evolution of my musical taste post small Goth
• 48:16
  Speaker 1: was like very you know, parallel to my stylistic evolution,
• 48:20
  Speaker 1: because you know, I went from GoF to like more
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: like indie alternative. So I was listening to a lot
• 48:27
  Speaker 1: of and this was post um seeing Garden State, My god,
• 48:32
  Speaker 1: the Garden State soundtrack, Girl, we could do a whole
• 48:36
  Speaker 1: episode sound shock, the shock waves that were felt um,
• 48:40
  Speaker 1: you know a lot of like the shins and like.
• 48:44
  Speaker 1: But every movie after that wanted to be the Garden
• 48:47
  Speaker 1: State sound Absolutely the most I think the most impactful
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: soundtracks for for me, like in my teen years were
• 48:55
  Speaker 1: Garden State and Marie Antoinette Marie Antoinette soundtrack Slaps. I
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: remember we're checking that out from the library. For me,
• 49:01
  Speaker 1: it was there was an O C soundtrack that I
• 49:03
  Speaker 1: got from the library that I loved because I had
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: a Sufion Stephen song. You're such a Sufion Stephen's girl,
• 49:09
  Speaker 1: I am. I was. I was all through college like
• 49:12
  Speaker 1: I can't do it, like speak up, speak up, speak up,
• 49:15
  Speaker 1: stop whispering the lyrics. Interesting of you to say, considering
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: there were a lot of Sufion references in the Taylor's
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: version of red Um that maybe you had missed because
• 49:25
  Speaker 1: you're not a Sufion stan Um. But anyways, to you, okay, fine,
• 49:31
  Speaker 1: what does it alternative look like? Because I think I
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: can kind of picture it in my head, like what
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: it visually looks like. I definitely know the music that
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: comes with it, Like I was definitely alternative as well,
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: maybe a little bit after you, like in college that
• 49:44
  Speaker 1: was like my vibe. Well I went back around to
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: it in college because it was like mall goth to
• 49:49
  Speaker 1: alternative to preppy, and then I went to college in
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: New York City, so it was like back to alternative
• 49:56
  Speaker 1: and then this was like I was in college whence
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: the like indie sleeves thing was starting, which was like
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: really big on tumbler Um. So you know, like I
• 50:07
  Speaker 1: guess the aesthetics of alternative for me was like dirty
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: converse um, you know, cut off jeans, jeans, skinny jeans,
• 50:16
  Speaker 1: a vest. I was very into vest a vest over
• 50:20
  Speaker 1: a T shirt. Yes, or had that or a T
• 50:23
  Speaker 1: shirt over a long sleep button loud or a double
• 50:27
  Speaker 1: a double shirt like a double T or or um
• 50:30
  Speaker 1: a T shirt over a long sleep Yeah, I um,
• 50:35
  Speaker 1: I definitely remember driving to like a dinner with a
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: bunch of friends in high school, wearing a T shirt
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: over a long sleep button down, listening to panic at
• 50:45
  Speaker 1: the disco. How how can how could it possibly be
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: that there are actually probably a lot of goths that
• 50:51
  Speaker 1: became prepped, Like that's so polar opposite to me. But
• 50:55
  Speaker 1: then you went batch alternative because you know, you don't
• 50:58
  Speaker 1: have any morals or principles. You just you call loyalty
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: to your your base of God. Well, no, I do
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: think it's you know what I was saying before, Like
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: in high school, I was one of the only out
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: queer people, and I felt this pressure to conform to
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: like the stereotype of what that looked like at the time,
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: like a very kind of like will and Grace gay.
• 51:25
  Speaker 1: And then by the time I went to college, like
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: I was you know, I was eighteen, living in New
• 51:31
  Speaker 1: York City, and I like was able to actually be
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: like truer to what I like I was interested in.
• 51:39
  Speaker 1: You didn't have to perform anything because you were among
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: people like you instead of being the only one in
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: like your your your school body. Yeah, like I was,
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: you know, in high school, I was the freak. And
• 51:49
  Speaker 1: then I moved to New York, which is you know,
• 51:51
  Speaker 1: like the Kingdom of freaks. I okay, I went to
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: a school that was like a thousand kids per grade.
• 51:58
  Speaker 1: It was like a pretty big school, and I was
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: friends with every single like bisexual goth as I mentioned earlier.
• 52:06
  Speaker 1: And it is just hitting me now that the you
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: saying like I felt the need to like perform that
• 52:13
  Speaker 1: like being the only by kid or being the only
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: gay kid or whatever. Like those were all of my friends.
• 52:19
  Speaker 1: This is really a full circle moment. And I feel
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: like that those folks would like literally induct me into
• 52:26
  Speaker 1: like secular culture. Like I was like a totally like innocent,
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: like scared of everything challenge, but I was attracted to
• 52:35
  Speaker 1: like counter culture or the performance of counterculture, and like
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: they would show me things like panic at the disco
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: or like my chemical romance or actually one of my
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: best friends in high school, um was this girl Jessica Tanuda.
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: If you're listening, please reach back out. I miss you.
• 52:53
  Speaker 1: Um she would draw like gorgeous, like Tim Burtony Skeleton
• 52:59
  Speaker 1: Girls unless into like my chemical romance and like and
• 53:02
  Speaker 1: like we would be like walking and like people would
• 53:04
  Speaker 1: throw things at us and it was great. Well, Tim
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: Burton does have a choke called on on Alternative Kids,
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: but now it's because it's like saturated culture so much
• 53:15
  Speaker 1: that it's not that anymore. Tim Burton was easily at
• 53:19
  Speaker 1: this time, like high school, my favorite of anything, my
• 53:26
  Speaker 1: favorite filmmaker, my favorite like cultural object, like your At
• 53:32
  Speaker 1: the time it was Corpse Bride, which I think is
• 53:34
  Speaker 1: objectively a bad movie. It's a bad movie, but at
• 53:36
  Speaker 1: the time I loved it and I thought it was amazing.
• 53:39
  Speaker 1: In retrospect, they're not really any Tim Burton movies that
• 53:42
  Speaker 1: I would feel the need to rewatch, except for Batman,
• 53:44
  Speaker 1: which is perfect his Batman yeah with Michelle Fifer. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 53:50
  Speaker 1: In retrospect, it's like it's funny, how like he was
• 53:54
  Speaker 1: the thing. And when like Alice in Wonderland was coming
• 53:57
  Speaker 1: out Our Child and Child Fatory, it's like that was
• 53:58
  Speaker 1: like the Wonderland, It's rotten, terrible movie. But when Charlie
• 54:02
  Speaker 1: and Chuck Effectory came out, like that was the most
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: anticipated movie of my like high school career, and now
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: it's like timber is fully a punchline and like has
• 54:11
  Speaker 1: not made anything good in EON's. What was your favorite
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: Timburton movie? Probably Beetlejuice, and it's still I've never seen it.
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: It's what you I've never seen it. I've literally never
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: watched it. Yeah, I've never watched Oh my god, well
• 54:25
  Speaker 1: let's do an episode on it. Oh have you never seen?
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: We can't wait until next Halloween to watch it when
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: we have to, because that's when I watched it every Halloween.
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: We need to, but I can't wait. I can't believe
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: we've never seen Beetle Juice. I know that Katherine o'harro's
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: in it, and yeah, a writer, writer, like the blueprint
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: for goth Girls. She kind of, my whole life is
• 54:48
  Speaker 1: a dark room? Is Wait? Was that also Beetlejuice? Yeah,
• 54:52
  Speaker 1: that's what she said. I have no idea what you're reference.
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: Her dad says, we'll build you a dark room, and
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: she says, my whole life is a dark room. Did
• 54:58
  Speaker 1: Tim Burton every a movie that had a person of
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: color in it? I'm gonna google list movies people of
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: Actually I think, um, yeah, the Dumbo remake that he did.
• 55:14
  Speaker 1: I think like some of the actors were were black.
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: I believe I do not on a cursory Google search
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: do not see any um people of color in any
• 55:26
  Speaker 1: of these castlests. So I will just say definitively that
• 55:30
  Speaker 1: it was not the te um. Oh. I also do
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: love Sleepy Hollow, Yeah you do, which I've also never seen. Well,
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: stay tuned Virgins for next Halloween. This Halloween episode that
• 55:42
  Speaker 1: when we do a full month of Tim Burton, No,
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: just kidding, we could do like a honestly, we could
• 55:47
  Speaker 1: do an episode on the Tim Burton Cinematic Universe. Absolutely,
• 55:50
  Speaker 1: that's that's that's we could for sure. Um. So I
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: still I guess to this day, like, do spend a
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: lot of time at malls? Um, especially now that I
• 56:00
  Speaker 1: live in Los Angeles, I go to them all kind
• 56:03
  Speaker 1: of a lot, do you? Yeah? You actually? I feel
• 56:06
  Speaker 1: like every time I call you, you're like, yeah, I'm
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: not fucking Beverly Hill Center or like whatever, what's the
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: other one that you go to? Outdoor one? Well, and
• 56:14
  Speaker 1: you know, I go to Sephora or like Lordstrom and
• 56:17
  Speaker 1: you're there in your bondage, your red hair going to
• 56:20
  Speaker 1: build a Bear for you into build Bear. Yes, there
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: was when I was a senior in high school. As
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: my graduation gift for all my close friends, I made
• 56:31
  Speaker 1: them all in build Bear and dressed it up to
• 56:33
  Speaker 1: like look like them. That is a nice gift. It's
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: so thoughtful, isn't it. I remember every time I was
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: so nice the girls. All the girls had their birthdays
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: at Build a Bear in that like era of our lives,
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: And every time I have that, my mom was so
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: mad because that bear is so fucking expensive. So it's like,
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: isn't it like twenty five bucks or something like my
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: things baseline with inflation, and then with these you have
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: all the clothes and accessories. I always loved them. The
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: part where you take the heart and like make a
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: wish and then you put it was fucking gay. My
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: favorite part was when they stuck the bears hole onto
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: the giant pipe that filled it with cotton in a
• 57:16
  Speaker 1: very suggestive way. You're sick and I'm not sick. This
• 57:20
  Speaker 1: is a literal like TikTok. Yes, I'm aware of you're
• 57:23
  Speaker 1: aware of that. I also still love a Yankee candle
• 57:27
  Speaker 1: moment disgusting. I was a Bath and Body Works girl, sure. Um,
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: if you didn't have like a bathroom body Works hand sanitizer,
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: you were nothing. All of these store garbage, all of
• 57:38
  Speaker 1: these stores immediate headaches, Yankee candle headache, the bathroom body
• 57:42
  Speaker 1: Works headache, Abercrombie American Eagle, immediate migraine. But you know,
• 57:47
  Speaker 1: like a boy smells candle, you could burn it for
• 57:49
  Speaker 1: maybe a week, a Yankee candle, you could burn that
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: chip for two years. You don't go through a boy
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: smells candle in a week the way I burn it.
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: You do, girl, You do not savor anything voice smells.
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: Please know? Why would I say I want my apartment
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: to smell nice? So I burn a candle all day,
• 58:06
  Speaker 1: not all day like for you know, a couple of hours.
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: It is actually better for your candles to burn them
• 58:11
  Speaker 1: for longer periods of time. It does actually make them
• 58:14
  Speaker 1: last longer as opposed to burning them in hour long spurts.
• 58:17
  Speaker 1: Just FYI, candle users, Okay, thanks for man splaining candles
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: to me. Um, I wasn't man splaining that first of all.
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: Second of all, um, I was it's definitely from also
• 58:28
  Speaker 1: from a TikTok, like I saw a TikTok that explained
• 58:30
  Speaker 1: to me how to properly burn a candle? Uh? You
• 58:33
  Speaker 1: know what's really eerie? Have you seen any of those
• 58:35
  Speaker 1: YouTube videos of people walking through abandoned malls only the
• 58:40
  Speaker 1: Billie Eilish music video like Urban Explorers. They're all of
• 58:44
  Speaker 1: these malls across America that are just empty now and
• 58:48
  Speaker 1: there's yeah, there's very spooky videos of people going through them. Wait,
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: we should do that? Can we finally go to an
• 58:54
  Speaker 1: abandoned mall and do what they're I don't know how apart,
• 58:58
  Speaker 1: let's snort some at I did. I would have loved
• 59:02
  Speaker 1: to have a part like when I was um in
• 59:04
  Speaker 1: working night life and throwing parties. I would have loved
• 59:07
  Speaker 1: to throw a party in an abandoned mall. And I
• 59:08
  Speaker 1: actually used to throw a party called mall goof what Wait,
• 59:13
  Speaker 1: let's throw a party called mall now and do it
• 59:16
  Speaker 1: in an abandoned mall. No, my my party days are
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: behind me and on in my like and honestly, like,
• 59:21
  Speaker 1: nothing will ever come close to being like what that party.
• 59:25
  Speaker 1: I'm going to start throwing a mall party and I'm
• 59:28
  Speaker 1: not going to credit you. I will I will sue.
• 59:31
  Speaker 1: You know, everyone's kind of virgins. You can all hear
• 59:34
  Speaker 1: this now, I will sue fran fringing on my infancal
• 59:37
  Speaker 1: sue me. Fine, you were talking earlier about like the shirts,
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: shirts that you buy a hot topic, Okay, I feel
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 1: like or rather, I actually was reading recently that there's
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 1: a very distinct difference between hot topic when we were
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 1: at hot topic and hot topic now. Oh yeah, hot
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 1: topic now is all like um Rick and Morty merch
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 1: Rick and Morty, which I still do not understand. It
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 1: makes me, I don't know what it is. I don't
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: ever want to watch it, but in the it has
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 1: a guerrilla grip choke called on hot topic. It really does,
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 1: and it it's like but also it also makes me
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 1: like I want to kill myself because you walk in
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: and be like do you remember the oldies friends the office?
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 1: And it's like you're like, what, like what happened hot topic?
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 1: It's just a merch store. Well I was reading actually
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 1: that you know, in our days it was it was
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 1: a lot more manic panic bondage pants, like true alternative,
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 1: like counterculture. It was a counter culture store. It's like
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: capitalizing on countercultural store. So to me, like that's that
• 1:00:57
  Speaker 1: was hot topic in its purest form. And it was
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: reading that in fucking two thousand four or whatever, when
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: Napoleon Dynamite came out, a movie that ruined all of
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 1: our lives, like truly, like why was that the most
• 1:01:11
  Speaker 1: popular movie on the planet. Did you watch the movie?
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: Did you like I'm seeing like twenty minutes of it? Really,
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 1: I didn't think it was funny. I didn't think it
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: was funny either. But everyone in my in, like my
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 1: student body, thought it was the greatest movie ever created,
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: and we would quote it every single class period all
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: day and it was like so fucking annoying. But I
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: was reading that Napoleon Dynamite and the year came out
• 1:01:33
  Speaker 1: was it was such a huge like thing, that hot topic,
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 1: like when they started to because they do all these
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 1: licensing deals for their T shirts, when they started to
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: sell like Napoleon Dynamite merch and like the vote for
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: Pedro shirt or whatever, there was an overwhelming demand for
• 1:01:49
  Speaker 1: Napoleon Dynamite shirts and that was when they pivoted to
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 1: licensed merchandise. And it is basically because of Napoleon Dynamite.
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: And also I guess Twilight in two thousand and eight,
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 1: that hot topic is like we actually don't really care
• 1:02:02
  Speaker 1: about this whole counterculture thing as much, and we're just
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 1: gonna like license like a billion dollars worth of T shirts.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 1: That is incredibly but I guess it also makes sense
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 1: because the reason I even knew about Hot Topic was
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: because I, as a teenager, was like really involved in
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 1: fandom online and that was really my first experience of
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: like a some kind of like countercultural community. And a
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 1: big trope at the time was writing fan fictions about
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 1: like Harry Potter, but making all the characters goths and like,
• 1:02:41
  Speaker 1: you know, talking about how they shopped at Hot Topic.
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: And that's definitely how I found out was always comes
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 1: back to fan fiction, it does. Fan Fiction is like
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 1: the thing that has informed my life most for sure.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: I feel like I I felt like, um, the Gotham
• 1:02:59
  Speaker 1: of it all definitely pushed me to experiment with things
• 1:03:04
  Speaker 1: that were outside of my realm of Christianity, like Panic
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: at the Disco inevitably became my favorite band because I
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: mean it's honestly, I listened to it recently and it's
• 1:03:13
  Speaker 1: still slaps, but that one album is amazing. I was
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 1: one of those girls that actually did like the folk
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: See follow up album that everyone hated that because they
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: like sold out, but I loved it, and I saw
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: them in concert for their full album too. Um, did
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 1: you only saw them a concert once? I saw them
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 1: a concert twice, possibly three times. I'm going to guess
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 1: it was four. No, I've seen there's some people I've seen.
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 1: I've seen Solange four times. I've seen Solanche like seven
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 1: or eight times. I've seen Florence in the Machine six times.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: Oh my god. Um. Anyways, what I was saying is that, um,
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: before I actually did like Panic at the disco and
• 1:03:50
  Speaker 1: All American Rejects and um, all American rejects playing that
• 1:03:55
  Speaker 1: CD was on heavy play in my car. Yeah, that
• 1:03:59
  Speaker 1: era of music. But before I got into that, I
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 1: did pretend to like Green Day for quite a while.
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 1: I never listened to what do you mean you pretended
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 1: to like them? Well, I this is a custole moment
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 1: of my life. I have basically figured out, in real time,
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: right in the middle of the very beginning of my
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 1: high school career, that what I've been doing all the
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 1: way up into this point is really not cool, like
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 1: wearing the Christian shirts, like being outside of like all
• 1:04:26
  Speaker 1: the culture that everyone was participating in. Like I figured
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 1: out at that point where I was like, oh my god,
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: I'm missing out on something and I'm a loser, and
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: so I just grasped for the nearest cool thing near
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 1: me which was at hot topic, and it was like
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: Green Day and people around me that loved Green Day.
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 1: So like Green Day merch, Green Day merch, Green Day albums,
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 1: everything I um. I took up acoustic guitar lessons when
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 1: I was a kid because I wanted to be a
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: youth pastor. But I did learn. The first song I
• 1:04:56
  Speaker 1: ever learned was good Riddance by Green Day. But as
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: a child, I never not once listened to a Green
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 1: Day album all the way through. So you were just
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 1: like wearing Green Day T shirts. Yes, actually very specifically,
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 1: I had one. I think I only had a one
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: Green Day T shirt and it was a it was
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 1: a green green Day T shirt UM that had a
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 1: four leaf clover on it and a safety pin safety
• 1:05:22
  Speaker 1: pin malka alternative um through the leaf of the four
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 1: leaf clover, and it said kiss me, I'm punk Green Day.
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 1: There was a girl that I went to middle school
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 1: with who used to um stick safety pins through her
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 1: skin as like as you had that too, as like
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 1: jewelry thankles around Sky did that it was decorative and
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: I did like tell on her to a teacher about it.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: Oh my god, you're a cop. So you're a cop. Wow.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: I just I just unearthed that memory in real time
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 1: and you're tattling on this girl and me calling the
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 1: cops when I was six because of a rhinoceros o
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 1: that I you know, I hope she's I hope she's okay.
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 1: We're a cap now, it's fine. I will also say
• 1:06:08
  Speaker 1: that I was scared for her, but I also kind
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 1: of was just living for the drama with this safety
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 1: pin green day shirt. I also would wear this Newsy
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 1: this like kind of like a distressed Newsy hat um
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 1: that I bought at Coles, kind of like the hat
• 1:06:22
  Speaker 1: that Taylor is wearing on the Red Tailor Version album cover,
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: and it's on the hat it said Rebel Newsboy hats
• 1:06:29
  Speaker 1: were very much a thing I'm sort of around, Like
• 1:06:34
  Speaker 1: I feel like we progressed from um Old Navy Too
• 1:06:40
  Speaker 1: Gap and then to Banana Republic, and like the newsboy
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: caps was very big at Banana Republic and newsboy caps
• 1:06:47
  Speaker 1: were the precedent to Fedora culture, as led by Jason
• 1:06:50
  Speaker 1: rass lady. Yes, I saw Jason Morass in high school. No,
• 1:06:54
  Speaker 1: I Virginia ras BiCon. I definitely is he by Yeah,
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 1: he came out as bisexual a couple years ago. Wow,
• 1:07:00
  Speaker 1: go off for Dora's. All I know about him is
• 1:07:03
  Speaker 1: that he's a raw foodist. I love Jason Mraz, I
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 1: think in college, not as much as I loved Ingrid Michaelson,
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 1: who was definitely my favorite artist. When I was like
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: a song, is that the uh huh oh no, no, no, no, no,
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: m yeah, I was into Ingrid. Michael said, oh, maybe
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 1: I should read it as her. I'm going to type
• 1:07:24
  Speaker 1: her into my Spotify. R oh, oh my god. Wait.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 1: I just opened my phone and I remembered that we
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 1: Fran and I have both pulled up like images of
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 1: ourselves in high school to show each other, and and
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 1: mine just shot up as I open my phone. Maybe
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 1: but okay, okay, let me pull up mine. Hold on,
• 1:07:41
  Speaker 1: let me type Ingrid Michaelson into my Spotify to remind
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: myself or oh yeah, you and I, that's the song
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 1: as parents. I was also really obsessed with Dresden Dolls.
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 1: What are those? Amanda Palmer's band Amanda Palmer in recent
• 1:07:59
  Speaker 1: years has like, let's just say she writes really long
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 1: Instagram captions, yeah, and like there might be some turf crossover. Yeah.
• 1:08:12
  Speaker 1: But but one of the best concerts I've ever been
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 1: to was seeing her at Webster Hall. That was so good.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 1: One of the best concerts I've ever been to was
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 1: I went alone alone, my first concert ever alone, to
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 1: see Ingrid Michaelson at Lincoln Hall, and I remember crying.
• 1:08:29
  Speaker 1: I was I have to listen to Amanda Palmer after this,
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: I'm just like now like hearing girl and achronism in
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: my head. Um Rose, we have reached the point of
• 1:08:38
  Speaker 1: the podcast where you and I are going to reveal
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 1: to each other a photo from childhood and are well,
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 1: you're gonna show me your goth Damn no, no, no,
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: this is no, this is post goth. This is like
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 1: this was at the point in my life where I
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 1: had not only was my flat ironing my hair most days,
• 1:08:57
  Speaker 1: I had gotten my hair chemically straight. No, you didn't know,
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 1: as I did not chemically straight chemically straightened. Yep. Okay,
• 1:09:08
  Speaker 1: So I'm going to show you this is I'm being
• 1:09:10
  Speaker 1: very vulnerable. I'm showing you a pre transition high school photo,
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 1: which I've actually literally never seen for contact. I mean
• 1:09:18
  Speaker 1: it's very blurry. You can't see much because there's this
• 1:09:22
  Speaker 1: is a group photo, and I'm zooming in as far
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: as I can on myself. So I will say I'm
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 1: in the center of the image. I'm wearing the blue shirt.
• 1:09:30
  Speaker 1: Oh you're so cute. Your hair looks great, Virgins. The
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 1: photo I'm showing France shows a group of loser theater
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 1: kids at a like hotel banquet table. I am in
• 1:09:45
  Speaker 1: this in the back kind of center, smiling very widely.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: I'm wearing a blue button down and tie and jacket,
• 1:09:53
  Speaker 1: and I have black hair that is like chemically straightened,
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: you know, swooshing down over my face. And I will say, um,
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 1: dear Virgins, that it is not an embarrassing photo, and
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 1: you have scammed me. It is. Well, you don't get
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 1: to tell me how I feel about it, because it's
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 1: like it's like a photo of me, not as a woman.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 1: See you say that, but you haven't seen my photo yet.
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 1: And I will say that this is a photo of
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 1: me being like I was the loserious loser kid and
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: all I wanted to do was be golf and so
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 1: I was like, okay, I'll be golf for Halloween. And
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 1: for one day I was like, oh my god, this
• 1:10:31
  Speaker 1: is incredible, and I straightened my hair. Okay, let me
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 1: see this photo, let me see it it is. I
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 1: also will say it's a photo booth photo. It's from
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 1: like the the photo booth. And the best part about
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 1: this I'm so mad at you. And then the worst
• 1:10:53
  Speaker 1: it's a black in my photo and I'm wearing a
• 1:10:57
  Speaker 1: beanie over my my straight and iron hair that I
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 1: strained myself. And I have to say, the most crucial element,
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 1: don't you fucking dare take a photo of this Rose?
• 1:11:07
  Speaker 1: Take it to the contact photo of you on my phone.
• 1:11:11
  Speaker 1: Oh let me see you have to okay I'm wearing
• 1:11:14
  Speaker 1: I'm wearing a spiked choker that I bought. A hot topic.
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 1: The worst, the most disconcerting element of this photo is
• 1:11:22
  Speaker 1: that I didn't understand Rose. Stop, Rose stop, I can't
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: your eyes are open. So I have to say that
• 1:11:36
  Speaker 1: the most disconcerting element of this photo is that I
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 1: didn't understand goth makeup or like a goth aesthetic, and like,
• 1:11:42
  Speaker 1: obviously what I should have done was worn like Eyeland
• 1:11:44
  Speaker 1: or eyeshadow, but instead I drew black tear drops under
• 1:11:49
  Speaker 1: my eyes, which is what gang members do when they've
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 1: killed someone. You were in your MUA bag, but I
• 1:11:55
  Speaker 1: thought that this was like what you people. So we
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 1: have like a fun, a fun little thing we want
• 1:12:06
  Speaker 1: to do with y'all, virgins. We want you to confess.
• 1:12:10
  Speaker 1: I think of this as a digital confessional booth. Call
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 1: into this number and let us know what is the
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 1: thing that you are so obsessed with that you force
• 1:12:20
  Speaker 1: everyone in your life to experience it along with you.
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: And we want to hear from like both sides of this,
• 1:12:26
  Speaker 1: whether you're a rose or whether you're a friend, whether
• 1:12:28
  Speaker 1: you were like a totally like culture nerd growing up,
• 1:12:31
  Speaker 1: or if like you didn't know anything and this was
• 1:12:34
  Speaker 1: like the first thing that like cracked you open. We
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 1: have a hotline ready for you. Three to three penance, okay,
• 1:12:41
  Speaker 1: And if you don't know how to spell that, because
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 1: I didn't know how to spell it, it's three to three,
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 1: seven three, six to six to three. That is three
• 1:12:48
  Speaker 1: to three penance. So call in. We will play your responses.
• 1:12:56
  Speaker 1: It's good. If it's good, well, thank you so much
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 1: for coming on this journey to the mall with us today.
• 1:13:06
  Speaker 1: Meet me behind the mall as Taylor's What's said? UM.
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 1: Join us next week when we will be talking finally
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 1: about father Son and Tom. She starring Lady Gaga. I
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 1: don't know if you've heard of her. You can tweet
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 1: your takes at us on this week's episode. You can
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: post it on your Instagram story anyway you want to.
• 1:13:26
  Speaker 1: You know, get in touch with Rose or I about
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 1: what you think about this topic. We'd love to hear it. Yeah. Also,
• 1:13:32
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