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POST-GAME DEBRIEF: The Pacers Are Headed To The Conference Finals Again · Small Ball with Kenny Beecham

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Let's talk about it.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_00: Another elite night of hoops.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: The Indiana Pacers are headed to the conference finals again with the 114-105 victory over the Cavs.
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_00: And the nightcap game, the OKC Thunders shut the Fawcett off in their fourth quarter to take a 3-2 series lead over the Denver Nuggets.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: But before we get to the nightcap, we have to talk about the Pacers because they won this series and they're going back to the conference finals.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: Now, you know, I do these recaps almost nightly.
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_00: I shoot two podcasts a week with numbers on the board, or really three if you count the TV show.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_00: And it's about to be four.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: Spoiler, we're getting a second TV show a week.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_00: And then I also shoot Smallball with Kenny Beachum.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_00: So at the very minimum, I'm doing five podcasts a week plus four to five videos on this channel.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I try my very best not to get takes and have them be across different platforms.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: I want you to watch everything and get a different opinion or get a different topic talked about.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_00: But one of the things I mentioned on Smallball, I have to mention again here because I think it's really, really relevant to what the Indiana Patriots have been able to do, right?
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um the conversation is really relevant now because of the draft lottery happening about 24 hours ago.
• 1:01
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the main conversations had an after the after that is people questioning if the flattened odds are doing exactly what the commissioners slash the NBA want them to do.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: The question from Sam Presti when these flattened odds were trying to be incorporated was how are smaller market teams supposed to get started players, retain star players, and do a successful rebuild if they don't draft high?
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: And as you know, teams like the Wizards, teams like the Jazz, the teams that really went out there to suck the season, dropped four to four spots, five spots in some cases.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_00: And now they're looking at instead of having Cooper Flag, Ace Bailey, then Dylan Harper, they have to figure out do they want Kaspars, Jacques Shoney's like they have to figure things out that way.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe the Pacers are an anomaly, or maybe they're the blueprint to kind of solving that problem because the Pacer team that we are seeing right now have never really emptied out uh and went full tank mode, if you will.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_00: In the last 30 years, they have one pick in the top 10, and that was Benedict Matthew a few years ago.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: Every single other addition they've had to this team is drafting very well outside of the top 10 or making the right trades at the right time.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_00: And again, maybe, maybe KP Kevin Pritchard is just a genius, and nobody in Washington, nobody in Charlotte, or nobody in these other places can replicate that.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: But maybe this is just one of the ways you do.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_00: I want to remind you how they acquired Tyrese Halliburton.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: It was the Montesabonis, Jeremy Lamb, Justin Holland, and a second round pick.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_00: They got Tyrese Halliburton who was climbing his way up the top two of the Indiana Pacer all-time player ladder.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: Like who's there?
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's like Ricky Miller, shout out to Reggie.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like Paul George, you put Mel Daniels if you count the ABA stuff, and then it's like Tyrese, Paul, Paul George, Tyrese, but now Tyrese is going to a second conference finance appearance just like Paul George did.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: It's insane.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: Umner was a pick, and you know, there he's been in rumors for a gazillion years in a row, and he's again staying here, his staple here, and they've just done the right decision, made the right decision time and time again.
• 2:51
  SPEAKER_00: This is how crazy it is of how my mind has shifted away when it comes to this pacers team.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: Getting an up 3-1 in this game, and with eight minutes left, eight minutes and 10 seconds in my notes exactly, the Cavs are up 19 points.
• 3:03
  SPEAKER_00: And I promise you, there was not a second in that game when they were up 19 points, and I thought this game was over.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if that's more of a testament to the Cavs showed me they were in this series, or more of a testament to the Pacers, right?
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I was a guy that was a big believer in the Cleveland Cavaliers.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_00: I didn't have them as my championship team, but I believe them to be a championship contender, right?
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_00: I believe them to be at the minimum a conference finals team.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: And they went out sad.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: They went out sad.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_00: They blew a 20-point lead in the series, a 19-point lead in the series.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: Max Schroez is in the group chat, according to the to the um the broadcast, if you if you don't believe you can win this series, don't show up to work.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: And and and he was 0 for 9.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: And but you know what, I did believe he gave some good hustle plays.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes the shots just don't fall.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_00: Um it's a it is a very weird ending to a really successful regular season.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: Because by all metrics, they were one of the best teams in the modern era, right?
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um, they have the defensive player of the year, they have a closer in Donovan Mitchell, they have so one, they have so many different things.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_00: And again, we get into this game four and they're up by 19, and I truly never believed that this was going to be a win for them.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_00: Like, they kind of got into the mode where it was like, prove it to me.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_00: To me.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: They were what, two and seven, two and nine against the Pacers this season.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: I forget exactly what the stat was on the screen, but they've been able to beat up everybody.
• 4:19
  SPEAKER_00: And something about this Pacers team really prevented them from doing that.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_00: And and I watched this series, and I watched this game, and I'm gonna have to re-watch this game specifically, but but there are a lot of times in this series where I thought about who the hell the Cavs were in the regular season as far as the way they offense moved and how they didn't, they were towards the bottom of the league last time I checked in total passes, but it always felt like they made the right timely pass to get the right look.
• 4:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I felt like in this series, they played so much my turn basketball that it completely eliminated the beautiful basketball that they were playing.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: It seemed like they had lost their identity on both sides of the floor, right?
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_00: You think about the last game or a couple games ago when they ended up winning, they throw the zone out there, boom, Evan Mobley's at the top.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: They're roaming, he's doing great stuff.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: He got like seven stocks total or six stocks total.
• 5:05
  SPEAKER_00: And then the next game they try to run the same thing.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_00: And Rick Carlisle and them, they're really prepared.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: Pascal Siakam, I need you to do this.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: Miles Turner, I need you to dominate this inside to get them out of the zone.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I felt like they lost their defensive identity time and time again.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_00: They also lost their offensive identity.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, this Pacer team is not, they're not a team that we talk about like the OKC Thunders defense.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_00: They're not a team that we hell, we don't talk about the Cavs defense uh this one.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_00: But they found a way to make the Cavs look silly.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: They found a way to make the Cavs look silly, and now we got to go into the what's next for the Cavs thing because there's a couple different ways it can go.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know, you talk about these aprons, you can you can look at and say they don't have a lot of wiggle room to get better or to do really anything.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm sure there may be a portion of Cass fandom that was like, hey, this is bad luck, right?
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: They went against a super hot team, a top four team since January 1st.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_00: I'll say it again.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_00: And then we also had all of our knickknack injuries where we missed our DPLY for a game, we missed our all-NBA point guard for a game, we missed our six-man of the year candidate for a game, and you know, we run it back with another year under Kenny Atkinson, and maybe it becomes better.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I think um even Donovan Mitchell was like, we'll be back next season, whatever, whatever.
• 6:10
  SPEAKER_00: But it also is a world where it's like maybe, maybe we should be making some decisions, right?
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_00: I I think Jared Allen has not been as good in the postseason as he is in the regular season.
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: Lights too bright from a few years ago.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um I just I haven't loved his play.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that a lot of the conversation around Evan Mobley has been does he project more to be a four or five, you know, when he gets into his prime.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I think that's gonna be something that they really explore.
• 6:40
  SPEAKER_00: What happens with Jared Allen at this point?
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_00: Because I don't think he made a lasting imprint on this game.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, early on, you know, him and Evan Mobley started off this game being really aggressive and getting some buckets here or there, but it didn't really last.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_00: And there are gonna be a lot of teams that are interested in Jared Allen as the player.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's a lot of teams that could use center play, and it's just like, okay, if we're trading away Jared Allen, what are we expected to get in return that can make us better?
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_00: We're probably gonna lose Ty Jerome, who it he didn't even get real minutes to what the second half because he was just not so good in the series, and he gave them a little spark in two straight threes or whatever.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but even he ended up having some possessions down the stretch.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_00: Was like, what are you doing, Ty?
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think he gave up like two and ones in the third and fourth quarter, which is just too much.
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but they just like that going back to the Pacers here, Halliburton gives you 31, six and eight.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_00: And um one of the best things to happen to him is people saying that he was overrated.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_00: The 13 or 14 people to say he's overrated.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: Because it really put a magnifying glass on him as a player, because there's no way in the world he was the most overrated player for what it was worth.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_00: But now it's like I you redo the same poll three weeks later to a month and a half later, however, hell it's been since that poll happened.
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_00: There's no way in hell you get 13 or 14 people say he is the most overrated.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_00: Because even in the games where he's not giving you 31, 8, and 6, he is the general here, right?
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes that doesn't show up on total assists or something like that.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_00: Where like there have been games where Tarry Taliburn can give you eight points and he still is the most impactful pacer on the floor because of what he's doing and how it feels like he's two steps ahead.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_00: I remember we were having a conversation about the supercomputers, uh, supercomputers across basketball.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_00: We mentioned Luca, we mentioned Braun, we mentioned Jokic, we mentioned like old ass Chris Paul for whatever, whatever, and some other players like James Harden came into conversation, yada yada yada.
• 8:24
  SPEAKER_00: Tarry's Halliburton deserves to be in that group of guys, again, and just talking about the processing of basketball on the offensive side of the ball.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_00: There was a time in this game, one of his and ones, and that was one I thought he was gonna get a T for because he got an A1 on Max Struce, and it was like, what?
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_00: Um, he jumps into the air and was like, should I pass out?
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: And felt a little amount of contact, went into, and this is all happening in a split second, and then boop went up for the layup and one.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_00: Like some of the stuff that he did in this game when his team was back against the wall for him to close out that second quarter in the manner that he did, where I think he has seven, was it 17 points?
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_00: What do I what did I write down?
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_00: I think it might have been 17 points in the second quarter, 15 points in the second quarter, and five for five from the field, five from five from three.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like that is just ridiculous production at that point in time because that was around the time where I was mentioning that the Cavs were up by 19 points, and they just had so many people step up.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: TB, Thomas Bryant comes in and hits a corner three.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, no way in hell.
• 9:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, they didn't even get a good, um, a good TJ McConnell or Benedict Matherin game, but they walked out of there with another victory.
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_00: Now they wait to see is it the Knicks, which I feel like it will be.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_00: Get well soon, Jason Tatum, Tatum, because that was scary and he already went through a surgery and it was successful, but the road to recovery is going to be a long one.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_00: So get well soon, Tatum.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_00: But now we're about to see potentially more likely than not a Pacers Knicks conference finals.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I do not subscribe to the people on Twitter that are acted like that will be the worst conference finals of all time because these two teams historically have hated each other.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_00: These two teams went to game seven just last season.
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_00: So like I don't give a fuck about ratings, right?
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: I care about good basketball, I could, I care about good series, and at the end of the day, I feel like good series should verse ratings personally.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that was going that's going to be a good series.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: And we were talking about, and people were uh P was asking, based on right now, who would you take in as series?
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_00: And I just don't, I just don't know right now.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_00: So I gotta I gotta lock back in and look at some of the last year's series, even though they um they changed some people around and look at some of the regular season games.
• 10:18
  SPEAKER_00: But okay, OKC Thunder.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_00: OKC Thunder, OKC Thunder, OKC Thunder.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_00: There was a stretch in this game from the Denver Nuggets where I think they went six minutes, six minutes without having a field goal in the fourth quarter.
• 10:29
  SPEAKER_00: Second game in a row where the Nuggets came into their fourth and just didn't provide anything.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: I think last game they missed what five free throws in the fourth quarter in a game that they ended up losing by five.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, we talked about it being just a matter of time before the best player in the world arrived to the series, right?
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_00: Uh Chet Homgren, Isaiah Hardenstein, Jay Wheel had done a phenomenal job uh outside of game one, but like he's he's inevitable.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: When you are the best player in the world, you're gonna expect him to give you a few games.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_00: And tonight he gave you 44, 15, and five.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: And that five is very significant because it didn't that he didn't allow uh the OKC Thunder didn't allow them to get the assist to him to get the assist that he normally would.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_00: But it's this was a back against the wall.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: I want to come out there.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_00: We need this victory more than anything.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, the shot they hit in the fourth quarter, the the spinning on one leg, throwing it up, heaving, and it just sinks in perfectly.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_00: That is Nicole Yokis shot.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_00: But not a lot of people came along for the ride.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: Jamal Murray has a good game in theory, but at the down the stretch, it came to like missing bunnies and missing layups.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, Christian Brown, they just left him open wide open all game long.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought that that one of the games that they was that last game that their best offense was Christian Brown getting downhill.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_00: I think he did settle for a lot of three-pointers in that game as well, but him getting downhill, that didn't work this time around.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: Michael Porter Jr.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_00: played so bad, but so did Peyton Watson, and so did Russell Westbrook that Michael Porter Jr.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_00: still had to be on the floor because the worst version of Michael Porter Jr.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_00: is way better than the worst version of Russell Westbrook.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: So he ended up getting the ball in his hand like two times when less than a minute to go in a game that he don't got his jump shot going.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: So it's bad.
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, who's coming along for the ride?
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_00: And nobody was really there for Nikola Jokic.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_00: And he tried to do it all himself.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_00: He almost did it all himself, but they ran out of gas.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: And then um the OKC Thunder started to pick it up.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_00: And Shea ended up hitting some big shots and one over Jamal Murray, which is huge.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_00: And then the three-pointer to put him up six, if I'm not mistaken.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_00: Dub hits the big three-pointer in the corner, and like there's so much pressure on that shot.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_00: Because this is like, you know, you win game five in a 2-2 series, you feel so comfortable.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you probably shouldn't feel comfortable because we see team lose those next two all the time, but it gives you it gives you that type of comfort.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_00: So shooting that that corner shot, I can imagine the amount of pressure that is on him, and that ball barely got over the lip to land into there and a big three from him.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: I thought, um, I think that Jay Will, this entire series, is just giving them something because for for what for um, for better or for worse, he's beaten the hell out of Jokic.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: And you can argue that some of them may be fouls that are getting called, but like he's doing, he's playing his role to a T.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_00: Some of the ones are like getting under Jokic's skin, right?
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: He's doing that perfectly.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_00: Some other people came along for the ride.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, Alice Caruso continues to just be great in Lou Dort, fourth quarter.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_00: Lou, we hit the group chat like in the second quarter, and Pierre's like, man, Lou, Lou Dort may have to get benched again.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_00: Just like he did in last game for Kasen and Alice Caruso.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: Then Lou Dort comes in and hit what three threes in the fourth quarter when they're down by whatever.
• 13:23
  SPEAKER_00: Come on, Lou.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, they have a decent offensive game.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and this that's just kind of that feels like that's been rare in this series, right?
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_00: Other than their big ass win in game number um two and then game number one that they choked away.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_00: That the offense hasn't been alone for the ride as well.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and this is one of those games, and now they get two shots to win one, one in ball arena, one at home, and that home crowd is electric, right?
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: Even when the Nuggets are up by nine, with what did I have?
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_00: Up by 12 at one point in this game.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_00: The the crowd did get a little bit quiet, but like as soon as the next basket hit, the crowd was right back at two.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, they got all the shirts on.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: And OKC's one game away from the conference finals, but I can't say it's over because of what Nikola Jokic just did.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: Nicole Jokic has one other player come along for the ride.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna use that again, and this game could be different.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's how bang bang these series can really be.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: Just like a game number one.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, this series could be over if Mark Dave now does a foul up three.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_00: But, but, but, you know, a one to two to three minute stretch can really determine what the hell is happening at the end of a series.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: So um, yeah, what what a night for basketball.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_00: Tomorrow we get uh yeah, we get two two games that could end the series.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_00: Knicks are up three one.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: We'll see how the Celtics react to not having Tatum out there.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um and then the Wolves are one game away from winning against the Warriors as well.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: So uh appreciate all y'all.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_00: Um go watch the other stuff.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, if you want to, I guess.