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Transcript

Safe Space · Divas That Care Network

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's Divas the Care Radio.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_00: Stories, strategies, and ideas to inspire positive change.
• 0:06
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to Divas that Care, a network of women committed to making our world a better place for everyone.
• 0:13
  SPEAKER_00: This is a global movement for women, by women, engaged in a collaborative effort to create a better world for future generations.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_00: To find out more about the movement, visit divas that care.com after the show.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: Right now, though, stay tuned for another jolt of inspiration.
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_02: Namaste, and welcome to the Divas That Care Network.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_02: I'm your host, Jiraquel Rose, owner of Airs Above Yoga, and you are listening to Above the Ground Podcast.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: If this is your first time tuning in, our network is going into its 16th year and is listened to in over 30 countries.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: I'd like to personally thank you for giving me the gift of your time.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_02: As always, it is my honor to hold space with and for you.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_02: And today we are very lucky to have Danielle Costa Macab, a licensed professional counselor, to join us and help us continue the conversation, heavy as it may be, on women, not necessarily just women, but standing in our truth, having power in a safe space in a safe way, and how we might best be able to do that.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_02: So, Danielle, thank you so, so much for joining us today.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_02: And may I give you a moment to just introduce yourself to our listeners?
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_02: Of course, yes.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Gia.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: And thank you for having me on.
• 1:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm happy to be here.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yes, I'm Danielle Costa Macab, a licensed professional counselor.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_01: I have been in the field for over 20 years, uh, working with families and individuals.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_01: I also have a history working with DV victims um and their children.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_01: So something probably, Gia, you didn't know about because that's that's a previous life for me when I just got started out in the field.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: So uh yeah, I go way back um with with that too.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, and then also I'm a yoga instructor.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: So of course that is uh to add on to my to add on, and that's that's how we connected, obviously, and why why on now more than one account, you are just the perfect perfe person to have this conversation with, which I like you said, I didn't even know, but I've been leaning very heavily into the throat chakra aspect for for the entire kind of conversation when we talk about you know firm boundaries, kind of staying, staying true to yourself.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_02: And and then, you know, as I've kind of gone through the other the other episodes, I've had to say out loud, and I said to you when we had the conversation before this, like, and even today and in this day and age, A, we live in a country that that allows us, we have probably one of the best chances to stand in our truth as women and to convey our boundaries and hold them strong.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_02: There are many countries in this world where that's not even an option, and then I still have to preface and make sure that you are have the emotional awareness and intelligence to know that you can do so safely because sometimes giving that advice to women is simply unsafe.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: And how horrible is that?
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes it's unsafe um climate-wise, sometimes it's unsafe within our own world where we don't feel the support of our families and friends, um, our social network to feel like we can live in our truth and be open about who we are and what we represent.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so yeah, absolutely.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes it just it doesn't feel safe.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 3:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, unfortunately.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I love that you brought up the social aspect too, because there is, you know, the the the whole conversation of what and I I I don't personally like the word victim, but you you kind of have to throw it out in its in its present relevance to this conversation, is when the victim then gets re-victimized, if that's a word, to a second degree by their own social circle, ostracized when they make the choice to break away, when they make the choice to stand in their truth.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: So now you're taking someone who has gone through, let's say, any form of abuse where a boundary needed to be set.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm not gonna, you know, I know that, you know, it's been an inst narcissistic abuse has been like an Instagram buzzword, and I think it gets a lot of attention, some very warranted and some very unwarranted.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but let's just talk about the idea of verbal or emotional abuse or the the blind abuse, right?
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_02: The abuse that isn't on your skin, isn't on your body, things that that can be ignored, right?
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_02: Suffering in silence, if you will.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_02: And the then second step of what someone who says who does stand up for themselves in a safe space is able to disengage from that relationship.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_02: And then they get a second bout of alienation, victimization, like pick pick your Asian, right?
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_02: Pick your word that is then compounding an already vulnerable person who's gone through a lot and removing potentially the support they thought they had.
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, no, absolutely.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's it could be very damaging.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, through our support, so through our family, you know, I mean, if you can't be yourself through your support network, I mean, that's what they're there for, right?
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: And friends and family, where can you feel safe?
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: Where can you speak your truth if not there?
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so I I always tell um, I tell all my clients, but you know, my my women too, that just, you know, it's so important, even if you just have that one person who you can speak your truth to and who gets it and can honor you and validate.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's it can be life-changing, life-saving.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_02: Because you do need some, I feel like you need the idea of a cushion to fall on in order to extricate yourself from a situation that's not for your highest and best good.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_02: Let's let's yeah, let's go on the on the less dire aspect of the conversation.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_02: But is there are there any cues you look for?
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_02: There is there any advice that you give to men or women?
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_02: Because I don't want to say that you can't have abusive females in your life.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_02: They exist too, a hundred percent.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_02: So it is not, this is not a and again, I always kind of say no gender, we're just going on the dichotomy dynamics as they as they are.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_02: Is there are there things that you can look for or got give guidance to people on how to determine if they and I know this is a loaded question, so at the best of your ability, how to determine if they are safe, or how to how what is there a safe way to verbally create a boundary?
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_02: Or if you're unsure, are there cues to look for in a relationship where if you think as a human you feel unsafe or you you're feeling taken advantage of used abuse, whatever word you want to want to use, is there a way that you can, is there some sort of factor that you can rely on to say it's safe for me to do this or it's not safe for me to do this, and I need to think of another way to go about this at a later date in a different fashion?
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: Is there anything that you see through what you've experienced that that gives a person the idea to be that helps with that deciding where that line is?
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because I know it's gotta be completely situational to each person.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_02: So it's a hard, it's a hard question.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yeah, definitely.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um really, if if there's anything that I am like picking up that someone is saying in within, you know, in context of like their relationship, their partner relationship, um, I always like to tease that out a little bit more.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um asking those questions like, well, you know, do you feel safe?
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_01: What if you were to say, you know, this or that?
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, does how do you feel like your partner can support you in that?
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and and also, uh Gia, I work a lot with teens.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um so I do have actually a checklist um that I that I go over, you know, uh healthy relationships versus unhealthy relationships.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_01: And then sometimes we bring out, you know, the the wheel of uh abuse, you know, and um sometimes it is really eye-opening uh for someone to be like, you know what, I didn't even identify that as unhealthy, but I see it on the unhealthy list.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_01: So you're like, wow, I was just, you know, because a lot of it also has to do with you know how we grew up, like the our first family relationships, too.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: That that then if something was normalized when we were growing up and then we experience that in our um partner relationships, we may not know that that is something that we we don't have to accept, something that's not healthy for us.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, just having that discussion around that is helpful.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: And I will I will confess, I did not see that wheel or know about that wheel until I was well out of my teenage years.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so I love that, you know, I love that as we evolve as a species and we start to can be more considerate, and I think that's that's generally that generationally that's always the move, right?
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: We hope that the generation coming up after us knows better and does better.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_02: And but I've had this conversation recently, and it it's not really about abuse, but it was about it was about that same generational gap.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_02: And at what point is the fact that they've always, you know, we're talking about elderly parents, or we're talking about, you know, these ingrained dynamics that are not going anywhere, right?
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_02: And and at what point is it not okay?
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_02: And I had a friend that was going through something, and she's going through something really, really challenging, and she's got an elderly parent, and he's he's not getting it.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, I I have to, I'm like, at what point do you just stop letting him off the hook?
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: At what point is it do you just call them out and say, you know what?
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_02: Like, this is what I'm going through.
• 11:11
  SPEAKER_02: You can do that short today.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like, at and that's where like my throat chakra is probably okay.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe I need to dial it back a notch.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_02: I've been told that.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't be surprised.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's all about balance, but you know, that's part of the conversation too.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: Abuse is one one side of a sliding scale, right?
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_02: And even that has its own scale.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_02: But there's these these daily interpersonal dynamics with family members.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't have to be a partnership or a relationship in that in a sexual, you know, romantic way.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_02: It can be these family dynamics.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_02: And and at what point is it healthy to say, you know, that's it?
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_02: I'm done.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_02: Or or here's my boundary, and and that's enough.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_02: And in theory, that should be safe as adults, one would hope, right?
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_02: Um, although you can't make that broad-based statement.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: But do you have any again, any insights into, you know, what where where it's where it becomes like reverse abuse of the older person because they're so set in their ways, right?
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_02: Like where your boundary can become like aggressive.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I want to go down there and and yell at her, yell at her parent for her, right?
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what are you doing?
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_02: So, where is there a line or is there a way to obviously hire a paid therapist, hire a professional, but what if that person won't go, right?
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_02: Like, is what is is there some sort of insight that you can provide to someone that's just looking at this generation above us and going, you know, hey, that's not okay anymore.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_01: I understand that so well because I do work with families um as well.
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_01: So going back to my, you know, what I was saying earlier about like working with teens um or even young adults in my practice, that, you know, their their parents um either are, you know, don't don't have the boundaries that they could or should have, but they're also they've they're coming from an abusive situation, and they don't see anything wrong with that, you know, if if they went through it.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_01: So um, yeah, in in my work with with clients in those situations where it's just they're the the lines are blurred, you know, the boundaries have been crossed so many times.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we do work on uh self-care.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: I I believe that it starts there um because when you are, you know, you're you're being abused or your your your boundaries are being constantly violated, you're not able to take care of yourself.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_01: You're not able to build any strength that way.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I always um I always try and encourage self-care, individuation, separating out, you know, wherever you possibly can, you know, um whether it's I'm going to I'm gonna take a class or I'm going to, you know, work on my my health or fitness, because it really can feel like I don't have any power in this situation.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: And but, you know, we do, we do us women can be powerful, and and of course, not only women, but even um, you know, men in this situation, they can take care of their personal space, um, and learn how to do that through through, I believe, self-care.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um, obviously, exploring in therapy is helpful.
• 14:59
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, like if you can do it 100%, yes.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so that is one of the top things that I recommend.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_01: And also journaling, journaling and meditation.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_01: Just to be able to, you know, get in touch with what their truth is.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Sometimes when when you've you've been uh abused or or mistreated um for so long and you've been in that family cycle, you don't know what your truth is versus what somebody else is telling you that your truth is.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_02: How scary is that, Danielle?
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like that's you know, yeah it's so scary because a lot of a lot of times I think in abusive situations, isolation is a huge part of that abuse because the more the more that that control and that power dynamic, the more, the more you don't have set points of reference for reality, healthy, conscious choices and behaviors, the more the more surrounded you are by unhealthy dynamics, the more they become true for you or acceptable or whatever.
• 16:12
  SPEAKER_02: And the and as soon as you start to fall down that rabbit hole, you know, it's it's not it's not a pleasant one.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's not a pleasant one.
• 16:22
  SPEAKER_02: And and you know, so I think that the reverse isolation, you know, I think my what I've said to people, I am not a therapist, right?
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_02: But what I've said to people is if you can't, like, and and and my friend does this, but like if you can't get them to hear you, stop trying.
• 16:39
  SPEAKER_02: Like, just walk away, like leave, like, like yes, leave, you know, take yourself out of it because it's it's I can't tell you how in many different scenarios and situations, I tried over and over and over again to be heard, to communicate, to use my voice, and it it has fallen at life across in different relationships and different dynamics on deaf ears.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_02: And and then it became very recently with my own father, I I just said, I'm done.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not doing this anymore because I, you know, it's it's affecting my peace in my physical body, I can feel it affecting me.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_02: And my voice is fine.
• 17:21
  SPEAKER_02: I will communicate very str with with much strength.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_02: That's not my problem, but it falls on deaf ears and the the cycle continues.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_02: And watching that spiral of whatever you want to call it, psychosis, if I don't know what the word is, but the spiral of like you can see the re the repeating beh behavior pattern over and over and over again.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_02: Can't make him go to therapy, can't change, can't force any other human being to do anything.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so right, you know, I luckily enough have uh have an aunt who happens to also be a therapist.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_02: I think she's uh published, and you know, she was like, You just what happens if you if you just don't?
• 18:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, Yes, yeah, I think I think we're there now.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_02: And that's so hard.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_02: And it's so hard, but it it's so like I I realized for me, because I I don't I'm not a therapist, so I can't speak for anybody else, but I would start to get a physical tension in my heart in my heart space at a certain point in the aggravation and the back and forth and the engagement and the fighting or whatever.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, if I feel that I'm done.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_02: The conversation is over, the phone is hanging up, the I'm leaving, I'm walking away, whatever it is.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I said, that is my it took me years.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_02: I'm 43.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: It took me years to get to that.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_02: One of the reasons I practice as your yoga instructor, I'm sure you do the same.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_02: I I always tell people, because I'm not a therapist and I can't give the advice that you give.
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_02: I always tell people develop the intuition with your body.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_02: Your body is constantly speaking to you, and we don't listen.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yoga teachers probably listen better than most.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_02: People who meditate listen better than most.
• 19:07
  SPEAKER_02: But nine times out of ten, people are running around like me today, frazzled, a mil a to-do list, one million months long, and we are so out of our bodies.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_02: And so listening to that signal, and it was huge.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_02: That one, like I feel I could feel it now.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_02: That one feeling in my body, and I guarantee that 90% of people have have that feeling when they're in these stressful circumstances, no matter the relationship dynamic, no matter with whom romantic, familial, whatever the relationship, friends, no matter what it is.
• 19:45
  SPEAKER_02: I guarantee you there's a part of their body that is internalizing and screaming at them to pay attention.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, so right.
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: So right.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: And we talk about that, you know, being trauma-informed as well, you know, the the trauma responses within the body.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you know, the body holds a score by um Bessel Vanderkoek, um, you know, wrote that book.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: And it's so true.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_01: And we see that, you know, in therapy, um, where it comes to people who've come in with a lot of abuse trauma history, and their bodies are struggling with that.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_01: They have ailments, they have injury, they have tightness, they have, you know, all kinds of things that you can it makes sense when you hear their trauma history where where that trauma gets stored, you know.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_01: So um, I love what you said about, you know, getting in touch with with our bodies through breath work, through meditation, through self-care, and being able to identify, you know, when when we're experiencing a trauma, you know, or something that's re-traumatizing for us, right?
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_01: Makes sense.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: And like I said, that's my only, that's my frame of reference, right?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_02: But it took, you know, I'm again, I'm in my 40s.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: So like when I was in my 20s, I didn't have, I didn't have a relationship with my body.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_02: I wasn't in tune with anything.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_02: I was in tune with a, you know, I was in tune with a bottle in my hand, and you know, I was so like, you know, it's I I don't anticipate, and you work with teens, so obviously, you know, as it's so important.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I wish I had had that.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_02: Where do you feel this in your body question 20 years ago?
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_02: But going back to the conversation of as we generationally improve, we improve.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_02: So 20 years ago, I'm sure there were tons of people that did have that yoga, you know, yoga instructors and people who practice these that wasn't necessarily in my wheelhouse at that point in time.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: And so if my My therapist at the time didn't have that in their in their bag of tricks.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't accessible.
• 22:06
  SPEAKER_02: But but imagine the students that you're, I'm sorry, clients from your professional versus the students from a yoga perspective.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_02: But imagine sometimes they're students too.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_02: There's a little overlap, right?
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but imagine like how much farther along if at 14, 15, we ask them, hey, you know, I can see you're upset.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_02: Where do you feel that right now?
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: And like let that be a trigger for any other situation in your life, not in a negative way, but a positive trigger to know that that's your body setting a boundary before your brain even does.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_02: That's a safety cue.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_02: I don't feel safe, or I am experiencing something that is not only taking me out of my power, but like talk about a waste of your energy.
• 22:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_01: Mm-hmm.
• 22:53
  SPEAKER_01: No, definitely.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's um, it's becoming so much more um, you know, in in the consciousness, I believe, of our society.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I definitely know in the therapy world, it is it, it's it's out there, you know, it's all over for therapists to, you know, to begin thinking along those lines.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: And that's why I think like therapy and yoga, they go hand in hand.
• 23:21
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's they're all connected.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and I uh right now actually I'm trying to um get a group up and running for teens uh for yoga, specifically for you know kids who've experienced some trauma um and do some work around that because oftentimes with the um you know with these teens and even um you know older adults, we don't know how to cope around the trauma.
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_01: You know, we don't know how to how to move that energy so that the trauma doesn't remain locked um and stored in our body, continuing to hold us back, continuing to make us feel stuck, and affect our choices, and affect our choices, right?
• 24:07
  SPEAKER_02: It can affect it can affect your whole life trajectory, right?
• 24:10
  SPEAKER_02: Because you feel stuck.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_02: Um, you know, and that's a big one, right?
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_02: As we talk about the the yoga aspect of it, um, A, I love that you're doing that, by the way.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_02: I think that's amazing.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_02: And and B, you know, I I don't know if you've seen it in your classes or in your own practice, but I've seen a lot of times for specific types of trauma, like you'll have nine times out of ten, it's a it's a woman, and and pigeon pose is a huge release, and people will say, Why am I crying?
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_02: Right for me, it was a seated twist.
• 24:40
  SPEAKER_02: It was after my mother passed away many, many years ago, and it was when I that's what brought me to yoga, and I was practicing yoga with a DVD.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_02: I think it was Guyam and I have David something, Lee or whatever.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, I'm sure that's not his name, but yeah, yeah.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_02: I think it was David Lake Ye.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_02: Um and I did a seated twist, and I just lost it.
• 25:00
  SPEAKER_02: And it was all in the left side of my rib cage, and it was at that point that I started to realize like it really your whatever you don't process mentally, your body holds on to physically.
• 25:15
  SPEAKER_02: So you're not only affecting your your choices, your brain's capacity to to focus and make good positive choices, but you're affecting your body's physical health.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, trauma can create disease in the body.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_02: I believe that.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: I believe that.
• 25:30
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, absolutely.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and I just feel like it's such an important conversation because it's not just about it, they are intrinsically licked, licked, like linked, linked, but yes, they are body, mind, and soul, you know, um, and to to I think I I love that the therapeutic world is now is now combining all of that because I think that it is absolutely critical.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, it is to overall healing and wellness, right?
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_01: It's not absolutely not isolated, yes, it's not isolated, it's all about wellness, it's a full-body wellness, I believe.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like for so long, I think, you know, in the therapy world, it was dealing with you know the mind.
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_01: The mind was separate from the body, but realizing how interconnected everything is, it's just I mean, it just makes sense.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it makes sense why people get stuck, um, you know, and they're really they they they develop ailments around or because of certain traumas that are they're still in their body, get stuck.
• 26:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, and they they feed off each other.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_02: So I know that we we don't have all the time in the world today.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_02: So I would do want to ask one thing.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_02: So as I've gone through the series, and I think this is I really wanted to ask this one this one question, we kind of touched on it um because you mentioned, you know, we were talking about our voice, we're talking about the throat chakra.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I had I had, I think it was the instead of talking about asana in the first, I usually do yoga poses as they relate to whatever the topic might be.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_02: But I actually talked about breath work and specifically a few different breaths, um, mainly the humming breath and lion's breath, as two ways to do exactly what we were just talking about, which is in an instance where maybe you are not safe to speak your truth in a moment, and that energy is there in your body and it you it falls on deaf ears, right?
• 27:39
  SPEAKER_02: Or like you said, like it doesn't land or you can't say it.
• 27:43
  SPEAKER_02: Let's say, let's say you're in a meeting in a boardroom or at work and you cannot say the thing, and you want to say the thing, yeah.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_02: You're gonna get fired if you say the thing, right?
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like that's pretty accessible for everyone listening to this podcast.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_02: Everyone's at that daily life, right?
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_02: And what do you do with that energy?
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because you can, as I said, I feel it in my you feel it here.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's almost like you're swallowing your words.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_02: So I use those two breaths as a way to dissipate the energy that gets trapped.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_02: And what and the lion's breath, in my humble opinion, is the one you would use for that, for that get it out after the fact.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_02: While the humming breath would be one a little more for I need to, I need to release, I need to calm this energy, I need to soothe this energy.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_02: The lion's breath is I need to purge this energy.
• 28:35
  SPEAKER_02: So is there anything that you would in that kind of vein save to people, give to people from your yoga background or from your therapy background as a way to if you can't express it, what do you do?
• 28:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: Well, yeah, I I love those.
• 28:55
  SPEAKER_01: I definitely love those.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_01: Um so I had a client years ago, um, you know, that that always would say to me, I just need to scream.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: She felt that it was inside.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_01: She is she was just going through so much and so much um oppression within her family, um, culturally, you know, just uh all kinds of stuff.
• 29:22
  SPEAKER_01: And she would say to me, I just need to scream.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_01: And she um this was really good.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: She formed a little group.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, she called it the screaming group.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, what's wrong with the scream?
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_01: I I love it.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_01: And she she um organized a group of a few other girls.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_01: They would go out into this place in the woods that they knew, just they would just scream and let all of their emotions out.
• 29:53
  SPEAKER_01: I thought it was beautiful and it was so therapeutic for her.
• 29:57
  SPEAKER_01: So I often think about that when I when I see clients that are um, they're stuck, they have they you could just like sense it from them.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: Like they just need to like get that out.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: So while, you know, I recommend screaming, not everyone feels comfortable or has the space to do that.
• 30:19
  SPEAKER_01: But I love those breaths.
• 30:20
  SPEAKER_01: I I love that.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_01: And also I would say that a little less um, a little less purge-like, but I do recommend sitting with, you know, the meditation and just just sitting with and sitting with the emotions that come up and that can be uncomfortable.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so we're we're um whereas the tendency is to avoid, yeah, you know, I see a lot with these clients like I avoid, avoid, avoid, um, or press it down, press it down.
• 30:57
  SPEAKER_01: I I encourage, like let the emotions come up, feel and identify what is coming up for you emotionally in your body, and let it be.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_01: Let it arise and let it be and let it express itself because the more we squelch it down, the more it's going to stay.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: And so um, I it's hard to do, and um, you know, it it's it's fearful, but with my clients, I try and really um, you know, create that safe place.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_01: It it comes with a lot of support and safety within the therapeutic relationship, of course.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so you know, gaining that trust with with me as their um as their guide with this, um, that that matters because of course with trauma comes, you know, you know, trust.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: Trust.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: There's that lack of trust.
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_02: And it's in yourself a lot of times too.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's start like the lack of self, I or the lack of self.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_02: There's a Freudian slip for you.
• 32:08
  SPEAKER_02: But the but the I think a lot of the trust is it fundamentally.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_02: I had a friend, I've said this before on this podcast, and I know we're gonna wrap up in a moment here, but it it was, you know, the ending of relationship, the the betrayal, the however it ended poorly, right?
• 32:26
  SPEAKER_02: It's not the relationship.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_02: It is, but it's not, it's the I believed this.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_02: I in my heart of hearts, I believed this was my person.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_02: I believed my intuition, I believed, I believed, I believed.
• 32:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so it's it's the stop trusting yourself.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, you did.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and at the core of that, if you don't trust yourself, you can't trust anybody else because you can't meet anybody else where you haven't met yourself.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, having someone to form a trusting relationship with you, I mean, I I applaud you for what you do in that vein of the level of vulnerability you have to hold as a practitioner while remaining professional to give these people that space to to, you know, I I I like in my mind's eye, I see like an abused puppy.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_02: Like they're scared, they're you know, they're not safe.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_02: And and what do they do?
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_02: They lash out, right?
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_02: And being that safe space is is a wonderful thing that you do.
• 33:29
  SPEAKER_02: And so I just want to thank you for doing that and for being a yoga instructor and for and for having the capacity to do both and to integrate the two.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: I think the people that are lucky enough to work with you will have will have leaps and bounds, especially the younger they are.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_02: Not that I want anyone young to have trauma, but we all experience it, such is life.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_02: So I know that you are setting them up for success.
• 33:53
  SPEAKER_02: I know that you are.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much, Gia.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_01: I appreciate that.
• 33:58
  SPEAKER_01: I hope so.
• 33:59
  SPEAKER_01: I I know so, I know you are we can do our best, yes, but um oftentimes it it takes it takes a while, it takes consistency, it takes it takes trust and it takes that relationship.
• 34:12
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yeah, and it takes faith in in the process because we always say therapy is a process, yeah.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: We're gonna do this and it's a cure.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's never that, you know, it's about a process, it's about uh learning, a lot of self-discovery as well.
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I want to thank you so much for being here, for sharing your experience with our listeners and with me.
• 34:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I will just say that I also appreciate each and every one of you listeners for sharing this space with us today and ask that you please feel free to share the same with your loved ones.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_02: For more goodness, follow me on all the socials at Above the Ground Podcast and visit my website, airsaboveyoga.com.
• 34:57
  SPEAKER_02: As always, don't forget to check out my other episodes and all of my amazing sisters at the Divas That Care Network.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: You can find us on Spotify, Odyssey, Apple, Amazon, iHeartRasia Radio, or anywhere else that you might feel guided.
• 35:10
  SPEAKER_02: Again, my name is Gia Raquel Rose, owner of Airs Above Yoga, and you are listening to Above the Ground Podcast, where every day is a good one.
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_00: Thanks for listening.
• 35:21
  SPEAKER_00: This show was brought to you by Divas That Care.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_00: Connect with us on Facebook, on Instagram, and of course on divasThatcare.com, where you can subscribe to our newsletter so you don't miss a thing.