Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / BOMBSHELL! Sex killer Jodi Arias ensnares new boyfriend. Part 2

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BOMBSHELL! Sex killer Jodi Arias ensnares new boyfriend. Part 2 · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: What are we learning about Jodi Arius's life behind bars?
0:09
Speaker 1: Well a lot. I hope you're sitting down. Jody Arius
0:14
Speaker 1: convicted in the murder of her lover, Travis Alexandra, even
0:18
Speaker 1: converting to Mormon, the Mormon religion to please her lover,
0:23
Speaker 1: Travis Alexander, a devout Mormon. He ends up dead, his
0:27
Speaker 1: body decomposing in the shower stall with about twenty eight
0:30
Speaker 1: to twenty nine stab wounds. Nobody was ever sure how many,
0:34
Speaker 1: because of overlapping stab wounds and a gunshot wound to
0:38
Speaker 1: the head in the prime of his life. Why Although
0:42
Speaker 1: the state doesn't have to prove motivation, it was speculated
0:45
Speaker 1: because he insisted on breaking up with her and dating
0:48
Speaker 1: a new woman, actually planning a trip with a new person.
0:53
Speaker 1: But as I said, it ain't over yet right now
0:57
Speaker 1: an appeal hangs in the balance with Joe the areas
1:00
Speaker 1: as we learned disturbing new information regarding Jody Arius spending
1:07
Speaker 1: the holidays with her boyfriend behind bars. What clime stories
1:19
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace? What's going on? Um? Our friend of
1:27
Speaker 1: ours is dead in his bedroom. We hadn't heard for
1:31
Speaker 1: a while. We think instead his roommates just going in
1:34
Speaker 1: there and so they bought some blood. I didn't know
1:37
Speaker 1: when that. I can give you the song to someone
1:40
Speaker 1: who went in there. Yes, please, Hello, Hi, So what's
1:44
Speaker 1: going on? He's dead. He's in his bedroom in the shower. Okay,
1:51
Speaker 1: how did this happen? Do you have any idea? We
1:54
Speaker 1: have no idea. Everyone's been wondering about him for a
1:56
Speaker 1: few days. She said that there's blood, So is it
1:59
Speaker 1: coming from his head? Did he it's all over the place?
2:03
Speaker 1: Hold on just a moment. Okay, you're a good friend
2:09
Speaker 1: of travissam. Okay. Has he's been depressed it all? Thinking
2:13
Speaker 1: about geting suicide anything like that. I don't think he's
2:17
Speaker 1: been being that. He's been really depressed because he broke
2:20
Speaker 1: up with this girl and he was upset about that.
2:23
Speaker 1: But I don't think he would actually kill himself over that.
2:27
Speaker 1: Has he been threatened by anyone recently? He hasn't. Has
2:31
Speaker 1: an ex girlfriend that's been bothering him and following him
2:35
Speaker 1: in flashing tires and things like that. And you know
2:37
Speaker 1: the ex girl friend Sam m His her name is Jody.
2:41
Speaker 1: Jody Arius is her name, and she's sitting behind bars
2:44
Speaker 1: right now on Murder One with me An all star Panel,
2:48
Speaker 1: Kirk nurmi Arias former defense lawyer at trial, author of
2:52
Speaker 1: Trapped with miss Arius on Amazon. Bobby to Come, former
2:56
Speaker 1: special Asian FBI star of Facebook series Curse of Acricord.
3:01
Speaker 1: Doctor Karen Start renowned psychologists joining me out of Manhattan
3:04
Speaker 1: at Karen Stark dot com. Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics,
3:09
Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon,
3:14
Speaker 1: but right now to investigate. A reporter with Radar Online
3:17
Speaker 1: dot Com. Alexis terres check. Alexa's not only have you
3:20
Speaker 1: uncovered that she's spending weekends and holidays with her former lover,
3:24
Speaker 1: but that she actually has documented in writing her desire
3:29
Speaker 1: to get pregnant behind bars to mitigate her sentence. Right now,
3:34
Speaker 1: her appeal is hanging in the balance. Two claims that
3:38
Speaker 1: I know of, one that her prosecutor, Martinez created a
3:44
Speaker 1: circuslike atmosphere, and that the media created a circuslike atmosphere,
3:50
Speaker 1: including myself. So, alexis are there any other claims on appeal?
3:55
Speaker 1: That's the gist of it. They have many instances where
3:58
Speaker 1: they say that one Tinez, the prosecutor, had done things.
4:02
Speaker 1: You know, he had his picture taken on the front
4:04
Speaker 1: steps of the courthouse with fans. They they claimed he
4:08
Speaker 1: allegedly had an affair with a woman who was connected
4:11
Speaker 1: with a juror who was released. What wait wait waite
4:14
Speaker 1: right there claims that prosecutor lead prosecutor has an am
4:19
Speaker 1: as Martinez had a relationship with a jurar. Wasn't that
4:25
Speaker 1: jurar released from the jury at the time? It was?
4:29
Speaker 1: It was not with the juror. It was, yes, the
4:32
Speaker 1: juror was released. It was with somebody that the juror. Okay,
4:35
Speaker 1: so that he was getting information third hand, but that
4:38
Speaker 1: has never been I still want to emphasize on this
4:42
Speaker 1: allegedly because even though there are lots of blogs and
4:45
Speaker 1: people that say that this has never been anything that
4:48
Speaker 1: Martinez has admitted to, or that it's another claim, just
4:52
Speaker 1: like Kirk Nurmi, the attorney and author, has said about
4:58
Speaker 1: some of Arius's clients aimes that they were claims. Has
5:03
Speaker 1: there ever been substantiation regarding Martinez. No. You can see
5:08
Speaker 1: there is video of him on the front steps of
5:11
Speaker 1: the courthouse getting people wanted his autograph, but nothing. I
5:14
Speaker 1: don't care about that Beside the court. There's nothing wrong
5:17
Speaker 1: with an autograph or a photo. I'm talking about anything
5:21
Speaker 1: that would affect the jury to the state kept saying.
5:25
Speaker 1: During the appeals hearing, they were saying none of this.
5:28
Speaker 1: They pulled that jury over and over and over. They
5:31
Speaker 1: kept asking the jury, have any of you had any
5:33
Speaker 1: contact with anybody as anything affecting you? And the jury
5:35
Speaker 1: said no, And they said, this is fundamentally our system,
5:39
Speaker 1: our jury system. We trust these people. They take their
5:42
Speaker 1: jobs very seriously and they did their jobs. They were
5:45
Speaker 1: not influenced by the media. While the rest of us
5:48
Speaker 1: were on television all across the nation, probably all across
5:52
Speaker 1: the world, talking about this and covering this from inside
5:54
Speaker 1: the courtroom, these people were not paying attention to that.
5:58
Speaker 1: They were paying attention to Jody's lies and that they
6:01
Speaker 1: did not believe what she said. They had no problem
6:04
Speaker 1: convicting her. It was a very quick decision. Well, I'm
6:07
Speaker 1: just wondering how much evidence there is of these climbs
6:11
Speaker 1: supporting these climbs psychlists and our friends at Phoenix ABC fifteen.
6:15
Speaker 1: This is John Geneva. Now, a major theme in her
6:16
Speaker 1: argument was that Martinez routinely took statements or words out
6:21
Speaker 1: of context, then brought them up in a way later
6:24
Speaker 1: that could have an impact on the jurors. Now in
6:27
Speaker 1: terms of the alleged media circus in this that was
6:31
Speaker 1: the words that Arius' attorneys have used for some time now.
6:35
Speaker 1: She was asked by this three judge panel about how
6:38
Speaker 1: much Jodi Arias contributed to that as. She said that
6:41
Speaker 1: Jody only gave one er excuse me, two interviews before
6:44
Speaker 1: she retained counsel, but one interview on the day that
6:48
Speaker 1: she found out she was eligible for the death penalty.
6:51
Speaker 1: Now again, write at about ten thirty they switched. An
6:54
Speaker 1: attorney for the state stood up and said, really, all
6:57
Speaker 1: that should be considered is what impact the jurors? What
7:01
Speaker 1: if any misconduct actually made their way to that jury
7:05
Speaker 1: box and had an impact on the verdict in this trial.
7:08
Speaker 1: They don't dispute that there may have been misconduct as
7:11
Speaker 1: alleged by Arius's team outside of the courtroom or even
7:15
Speaker 1: inside the courtroom, But if it was not heard by
7:18
Speaker 1: the jury, then they said, in some case law in
7:20
Speaker 1: which they believe that this should not be overturned. What
7:23
Speaker 1: matters is did any of this affect the jury's decision?
7:27
Speaker 1: With me our renowned attorney, Jody Arius, former defense lawyer
7:31
Speaker 1: author of Trapped with miss Arius on Amazon Curtain Army.
7:35
Speaker 1: What were the claims of misconduct against veteran prosecutor Juan Martinez.
7:42
Speaker 1: What were the claims against him? Well, there were many
7:45
Speaker 1: claims against Juan Martinez, and this is consistent with Jody
7:48
Speaker 1: Spattern right lie about me make accusations about men who
7:52
Speaker 1: who've upset her, and Martinez is just delated. There's been
7:55
Speaker 1: all sorts of allegations of him having affairs with bloggers
8:00
Speaker 1: and possibly with a dismissed juror and things of that nature.
8:04
Speaker 1: I haven't kept on it as well as Alexis has,
8:07
Speaker 1: but I just see the continuing pattern of Jody attacking
8:12
Speaker 1: men that she feels have done her wrong, and myself
8:15
Speaker 1: and mister Martinez are just now in her sight. Yeah,
8:18
Speaker 1: Alexis terres Chuck. Following up on what kurtin Army has
8:21
Speaker 1: just said, Alexis terres Chuck joined me from writer online
8:24
Speaker 1: dot com. What specifically are the misconduct claims against prosecutor
8:30
Speaker 1: Juan Martinez. I know she claimed he signed autographs and
8:36
Speaker 1: took pictures. I mean, Alexis, when people come up to
8:39
Speaker 1: you and want you to sign something or take a
8:41
Speaker 1: picture of course you do it. Why would you be
8:44
Speaker 1: rude to someone that has no bearing on the trial,
8:50
Speaker 1: that's not a witness, not a jurar. That doesn't even
8:53
Speaker 1: make sense. What are the other claims against Juan Martinez. Well,
8:57
Speaker 1: they're very specific about the way he treated um. Mister
9:01
Speaker 1: Nurme's co counseled Jennifer Wim and I remember during the
9:08
Speaker 1: trial that they were pretty shocking statements as well. He
9:11
Speaker 1: said something to her along the lines of I'm glad
9:14
Speaker 1: I'm not married to you. That would be and I
9:17
Speaker 1: think he said effing terrible. You know, he was very
9:20
Speaker 1: derogatory towards her, and it was said in open court.
9:25
Speaker 1: I don't believe it was in front of the jurors,
9:27
Speaker 1: but he was very dismissive of her and it seemed
9:31
Speaker 1: very misogynistic. But so they actually brought up very specific
9:35
Speaker 1: points of how he was treating her, and the appellate
9:40
Speaker 1: judges asked questions about that, and they said to the
9:43
Speaker 1: to the state, you know, don't you think that these
9:44
Speaker 1: are terrible things that this prosecutor has done. And they
9:47
Speaker 1: would say, well, yes, but this didn't affect the jury
9:50
Speaker 1: and whatever you might say. Now, let me understand something
9:53
Speaker 1: What is it you're telling me wal Martinez did to Wilmot.
9:56
Speaker 1: He said he never wanted to be married to her,
9:58
Speaker 1: and I you know he was a It's something like
10:00
Speaker 1: it would be disgusting if I'd be married you, And
10:02
Speaker 1: I think, why did he say that in front of
10:04
Speaker 1: the jury. I don't believe it was in front of it.
10:08
Speaker 1: Then who cares? Exactly? Then? Who cares? I mean, kirk Nermy,
10:13
Speaker 1: kirk Nermy, let me, let me just I'm not saying
10:17
Speaker 1: that I agree with what Martinez may or may not
10:19
Speaker 1: have said. But I'm talking about a murder conviction. I'm
10:23
Speaker 1: talking about a reversal. I'm talking about a new trial.
10:27
Speaker 1: I'm talking about reversal with prejudice. And there cannot be
10:30
Speaker 1: a new trial if he doesn't like Wilmot and he
10:34
Speaker 1: berated her or says something rude to her, if the
10:38
Speaker 1: jury didn't hear it. In the legal world, nobody gives
10:42
Speaker 1: a flying fig It doesn't matter. It only matters if
10:47
Speaker 1: it affected the jury decision. Yes, no, kirk It only
10:51
Speaker 1: to me, it only matters what the jury heard. Crime
11:07
Speaker 1: stories with Nancy Grace, the thirty year old businessman and
11:17
Speaker 1: devout Mormon, had been stabbed twenty seven times. His throat
11:22
Speaker 1: slit so deep, he was almost decapitated, and he was
11:25
Speaker 1: shot in the head. This is over, This is absolutely over.
11:30
Speaker 1: You need to tell me the truths. On the tape,
11:35
Speaker 1: Arius repeatedly denies she was at Alexander's house the day
11:38
Speaker 1: of the crime, even after the ever patient detective confronts
11:42
Speaker 1: her with racy pictures of her in his bed that day,
11:47
Speaker 1: and even after he tells Arius her palm print was
11:50
Speaker 1: found at the bloody crime scene. At one point the
11:55
Speaker 1: detective leaves the room, Arius stretches in her chair. Then
12:00
Speaker 1: he stretches the truth even more. The admitted killer really
12:04
Speaker 1: turns on the tiers to my family, and I think
12:15
Speaker 1: Travis's families. You're hearing our friends at ABC News. That
12:21
Speaker 1: was Ryan Owens now Travis Alexander nearly decapitated, with Jodi
12:30
Speaker 1: Arius insisting she wasn't there. But oh listen, but prosecutors
12:38
Speaker 1: alleged Arius is a stalker who brutally attacked her x
12:41
Speaker 1: in a jealous rage when she found out he was
12:43
Speaker 1: seeing other women. Arius's defense, which is expected to start
12:47
Speaker 1: next week, will have to overcome a mountain of forensic evidence,
12:51
Speaker 1: including pictures taken on this camera found in Alexander's washing machine.
12:56
Speaker 1: Prosecutors say Arias literally tried to wash that evidence away,
13:00
Speaker 1: But on its memory card, detectives discovered not just those
13:03
Speaker 1: racy photos from the couple's sexual encounter the day of
13:06
Speaker 1: the murder, but a series of twenty shots of Alexander
13:10
Speaker 1: posing in the shower. Minutes before his death. Prosecutors say
13:14
Speaker 1: Arias put down the camera and picked up a knife,
13:17
Speaker 1: stabbing her unsuspecting victim. The most damning picture comes after
13:22
Speaker 1: the camera was dropped. It's too graphic for us to show,
13:25
Speaker 1: but the jury saw a shot of what appears to
13:27
Speaker 1: be Arias actually moving the bloody body. Prosecutors say she
13:32
Speaker 1: was especially cold blooded after the crime. They played this
13:37
Speaker 1: voicemail Areas left on Alexander's phone a few hours after
13:40
Speaker 1: she killed him. Morbidly enough, she invited a man she
13:44
Speaker 1: knew was dead to come visit her. Wow, she sounded
13:50
Speaker 1: pretty chipper on that, and, according to her own statement,
13:56
Speaker 1: as she was driving away from the scene of Travis
13:58
Speaker 1: Alexander's murder, she actually saw blood on her hands. Even so,
14:05
Speaker 1: managed to leave that bright and cheery voicemail message to
14:09
Speaker 1: cover her tracks. The Digi camera Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics,
14:15
Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon.
14:20
Speaker 1: Joe Scott, why is it that so many killers suddenly
14:24
Speaker 1: turn into neat nicks? They bleached the floor, they do
14:28
Speaker 1: the laundry, They vacuum, they mop, they clean surfaces like
14:33
Speaker 1: never before. What do you make of the digital camera
14:37
Speaker 1: found in the wash with the sheets and how was
14:41
Speaker 1: it used at trial? Yeah? I think that her idea, Nancy,
14:45
Speaker 1: was to try to take this camera and subject it
14:48
Speaker 1: to detergent obviously the water the washing, in order to
14:52
Speaker 1: destroy any kind of digital evidence that would have been there.
14:57
Speaker 1: Of course, we know that that's not the case. There
14:59
Speaker 1: were an number of images that were still left behind.
15:03
Speaker 1: I think the police did a fantastic job and the
15:06
Speaker 1: technicians in the lab of recovering these, because they did
15:10
Speaker 1: recover them, and we were able to appreciate them even
15:13
Speaker 1: you know, I remember you and I covering this trial.
15:16
Speaker 1: Appreciate them from trial and you could make out detail.
15:19
Speaker 1: What was really interesting about this, Nancy, is that they
15:22
Speaker 1: were able to recover these tom stamps, and it kind
15:25
Speaker 1: of measured this thing out and you could get an idea,
15:28
Speaker 1: a sense for what was going on. I've always thought
15:32
Speaker 1: that she kind of got him into that shower. They're
15:35
Speaker 1: already in kind of a frisky mood. Maybe they've had
15:38
Speaker 1: a fight. She's trying to lull him into a sense
15:41
Speaker 1: of security. She begins to take photos of him. It's
15:44
Speaker 1: really sad. You can actually see I still remember to
15:47
Speaker 1: this day of him kind of looking over his shoulder
15:50
Speaker 1: in one of these photographs, probably the one right before
15:53
Speaker 1: she began burying that knife in his back, and he
15:56
Speaker 1: looked so innocent. He's looking into her eyes, into the
16:00
Speaker 1: eyes of the camera, if you will, and she snaps
16:02
Speaker 1: that shot of him, and it really tells a lot
16:05
Speaker 1: about her. I've often thought of Jodi Arius is like
16:09
Speaker 1: a praying manness. You know, one of these female praying
16:12
Speaker 1: mannas is that after they mate, they kill their mate,
16:16
Speaker 1: they literally cut the head off of the mate and
16:19
Speaker 1: cannibalize their bodies. She's not too far removed from that.
16:22
Speaker 1: She's very scary indivigil and as it turns out, Travis
16:25
Speaker 1: Alexander is not the only man Arius photographed in the shower. Listen, sir,
16:33
Speaker 1: could you introduce yourself to the jury police. On day
16:35
Speaker 1: one of her defense, Tuesday, Arius's attorneys called an ex
16:39
Speaker 1: boyfriend she dated before Travis Alexander, the man she now
16:43
Speaker 1: admits she's stabbed and shot in June of two thousand
16:45
Speaker 1: and eight. Arius says she killed the thirty year old
16:47
Speaker 1: Mormon businessman in self defense. I know, because we were
16:53
Speaker 1: in love. He didn't want his face shown publicly. But
16:56
Speaker 1: Daryl Brewer told the jurors he dated the much younger
16:59
Speaker 1: Areas for four years. They even bought a house together,
17:03
Speaker 1: and the divorce dad says she was great with his son.
17:07
Speaker 1: Was a very responsible, caring, loving person. Did you ever
17:11
Speaker 1: see Jody at jealous towards women that you came in
17:16
Speaker 1: contact with. No, But on cross examination, Brewer may have
17:20
Speaker 1: done damage to his ex girlfriend's case. He told the
17:24
Speaker 1: prosecutor Arius took a nude picture of him in the shower.
17:27
Speaker 1: Remember she snapped these photos of Travis Alexander in the
17:30
Speaker 1: shower seconds before prosecutors say she started stabbing him. Ouch.
17:35
Speaker 1: That's ABC News reporter Ryan Owen speaking to Kurt Narmy Arias,
17:39
Speaker 1: former defense attorney, author of Trapped with miss Arius Monday
17:44
Speaker 1: morning quarterbacking. You probably thought it was a good idea
17:47
Speaker 1: to call this guy who had dated her for four years,
17:50
Speaker 1: that she was never jealous, that she never pulled any
17:54
Speaker 1: of the antics she pulled with Travis Alexander. But then
17:57
Speaker 1: on Cross it comes out she took naked photos of
18:01
Speaker 1: him too in the shower, verging on a similar transaction
18:06
Speaker 1: or course of conduct. I doubt Aris expected that to
18:11
Speaker 1: come out on the stand cur well Monday morning, quarterbacking,
18:14
Speaker 1: I would have ran away when my boss tried to
18:16
Speaker 1: hand me to file at the Public Defender's office. That
18:18
Speaker 1: would have been the smart move. But to your question, look,
18:22
Speaker 1: as an attorney, I don't go back in second guess.
18:25
Speaker 1: We had to humanize miss Arius and that's the best
18:29
Speaker 1: we could do. Is it true that Jodi Arius actually
18:33
Speaker 1: called police within hours of the murder, asking for information
18:37
Speaker 1: and asking detectives to keep her sex relationship with Travis confidential?
18:43
Speaker 1: Did that happen, Kurt Nermy yes, Detective Flora as the
18:46
Speaker 1: lead detective on the case. She had a conversation with
18:49
Speaker 1: him within a couple hours after his arrival on scene,
18:53
Speaker 1: which was early that next morning, I believe, and they
18:56
Speaker 1: had a conversation that he recorded and that was played
18:59
Speaker 1: into during the tribe. But my question is my next
19:03
Speaker 1: question Kurt Nrmy is wouldn't that be drawing attention to herself?
19:08
Speaker 1: And it seems like she's worried about her relationship becoming
19:12
Speaker 1: public when Travis has been brutally murdered. I mean, to me,
19:15
Speaker 1: that's putting up a billboard on Fifth Avenue. I did it? Well, Look,
19:20
Speaker 1: I think that was certainly something that signaled to Detective
19:23
Speaker 1: Floris that this was a person that was on his radar.
19:26
Speaker 1: Keep in mind, at that point in time, people were
19:30
Speaker 1: approaching either officers or Detective Flores himself mentioning miss Arius's name.
19:36
Speaker 1: That's why she probably felt compelled to reach out and
19:41
Speaker 1: control the damage. I guess crime stories with Nancy Grace
20:05
Speaker 1: in the bath, oh oh, when we took a bath together,
20:12
Speaker 1: that was that was surreal, like honestly, and I think,
20:16
Speaker 1: I mean maybe the candlelight, some bubbles all had something
20:19
Speaker 1: to do with it. But you were amazing. You made me, seriously,
20:25
Speaker 1: you made me feel like a goddess. Like I wasn't
20:29
Speaker 1: saying you were like worshiping me, but you were. You
20:32
Speaker 1: made me feel like I was the most freaking beautiful
20:37
Speaker 1: woman on the whole planet, right, I so felt like
20:41
Speaker 1: I was the goddess and so aside from all those warm,
20:46
Speaker 1: fuzzy feelings, but like it was, it was so sexy
20:50
Speaker 1: and it was so hot and oh gosh, okay, that
20:54
Speaker 1: could go on and on and on. That is a
20:57
Speaker 1: phone sex tape that was played in court, Jody Arius
21:02
Speaker 1: and murder victim Travis Alexander getting hot and heavy over
21:05
Speaker 1: the phone. The relationship and the trial was sex charged
21:13
Speaker 1: to doctor Karen Start, psychologist. You can find her at
21:17
Speaker 1: Karen Start dot com. You and I lived through the
21:19
Speaker 1: trial together and covered it together, met there at the
21:24
Speaker 1: courthouse and you joining me from New York. Karen, it
21:30
Speaker 1: seems to me that Travis Alexander for a period of
21:33
Speaker 1: time was just blinded by the crazy sex he was
21:39
Speaker 1: having with Jody Arius, and he was, I guess, blinded
21:44
Speaker 1: to who she really was. Then when he came out
21:47
Speaker 1: of his fog, he broke up. How does that work, Karen?
21:51
Speaker 1: Somebody like Jody is extremely a feeling she's created. She
21:54
Speaker 1: can come up with all kinds of scenarios. She can
21:57
Speaker 1: make him feel we can see that, right, she's wonderful liar,
22:01
Speaker 1: and she could make him feel like he's the best
22:03
Speaker 1: person in the world, which she can't hide who she
22:07
Speaker 1: really is, her true person, and so she becomes suspicious.
22:12
Speaker 1: She starts to go through everything that he owns, and
22:17
Speaker 1: he begins to realize that despite the excitement that she's created,
22:22
Speaker 1: there's something off about her. That's when it really becomes
22:26
Speaker 1: a problem Nancy, because it's like quicksand she's sucking him
22:30
Speaker 1: in and she can't extricate himself from this relationship. Amazing
22:36
Speaker 1: how she could hide her true nature for so long.
22:40
Speaker 1: Take a listen to this. So, yeah, the timeline we
22:47
Speaker 1: broke well, it was kind of a mutual thing, but
22:50
Speaker 1: I sort of more broke up with him. Um, and
22:54
Speaker 1: it was hard to do because I really loved him,
22:56
Speaker 1: but I just realized that without trusting had anything and
23:00
Speaker 1: I violated. This is that the main reason you guys
23:03
Speaker 1: broke up is to trust and trust. I think that
23:07
Speaker 1: there's not not that the relationship was unhealthy because of
23:10
Speaker 1: the sexual activity, but just that you guys couldn't trust
23:14
Speaker 1: each other. I think that and this doesn't make it right.
23:18
Speaker 1: I think that, you know, being a convert, you know
23:20
Speaker 1: I've had I've I've been I've had a couple of
23:24
Speaker 1: serious relationships before where I was where I was into
23:26
Speaker 1: both a few people and it's kind of silly, but
23:32
Speaker 1: I used to always joke that regardless of what the
23:36
Speaker 1: Bible says, and yes I'm Christian, I just lived my
23:38
Speaker 1: life by the ten Commandments and that's like, those are
23:40
Speaker 1: my roles, da dat. You know that'll shut not this
23:44
Speaker 1: or that, But it doesn't say that. So I just
23:48
Speaker 1: used to joke about that. Alexis terres Chuck, investigative reporter,
23:51
Speaker 1: writer online dot com. You recall how all of his
23:54
Speaker 1: friends came forward to say, we knew at the get
23:59
Speaker 1: go he had snakes in her head, and we begged
24:02
Speaker 1: Travis not to see her. They could see it. He couldn't. Well,
24:05
Speaker 1: they were not having sex with her. Travis was having
24:08
Speaker 1: sex with her, So I think that was what he
24:10
Speaker 1: was very much enjoying. And that was outweighing the crazy.
24:15
Speaker 1: And there was tons of crazy. You know. There was
24:17
Speaker 1: a party in this house one night and she's like
24:19
Speaker 1: hid under the Christmas tree. She climbed in through a
24:23
Speaker 1: doggy door in his house. Okay, please stop, please stop,
24:25
Speaker 1: please stop. Right there, I forgot about the hiding under
24:29
Speaker 1: the Christmas tree. Please tell the listeners about Jodi Arias
24:33
Speaker 1: hiding under Travis Alen Sanders Christmas tree. Because I don't
24:38
Speaker 1: care how great I thought a guy was, he'd be
24:40
Speaker 1: out the door. I would tell him to take the
24:43
Speaker 1: patent turner pat in the street and turn the corner.
24:46
Speaker 1: If he got up and hid under the Christmas tree
24:50
Speaker 1: during my Christmas party, oh yes I would. What happened, Alexis,
24:54
Speaker 1: Travis was having a Christmas party and for some reason
24:58
Speaker 1: Jody was high behind the tree, kind not even behind
25:02
Speaker 1: the tree leg underneath the tree during the party. It
25:05
Speaker 1: was very weird, and everybody there noticed. Did nobody said anything,
25:10
Speaker 1: and but it was like she wasn't welcome at the party,
25:13
Speaker 1: but she didn't want to leave. It's truly probably the
25:16
Speaker 1: strangest thing of the whole case to me, other than
25:19
Speaker 1: the fact you know that she slid her throat shott
25:21
Speaker 1: on the forehead and stabbed him twenty nine times. Okay,
25:23
Speaker 1: wait a minute. According here in the studio with me,
25:27
Speaker 1: Jackie Howard, she broke in his home to vacuum his floor.
25:30
Speaker 1: You know, somebody wanted to break into vacuum and clean
25:33
Speaker 1: my house. I think I'd be okay with that. They'd
25:35
Speaker 1: leave immediately after. But what about that, Alexis terrest Chuck Again.
25:41
Speaker 1: That's a fun fact about Jody Airis. I had forgotten.
25:44
Speaker 1: Did she break in Travis's home to vacuum? Yes, she did.
25:48
Speaker 1: She broke in and she cleaned up the house, which
25:51
Speaker 1: is also why after she killed Travis, she knew where
25:55
Speaker 1: all the cleaning supplies were and that's why that house
25:58
Speaker 1: was spick and span clean. His roommates didn't even know
26:01
Speaker 1: anything was up for three days because the house looked
26:04
Speaker 1: so spotless, there were no signs of anything. She had
26:07
Speaker 1: cleaned the floor, she cleaned up any trace of blood,
26:10
Speaker 1: dumped everything in the washing machine, and I guess blessed
26:12
Speaker 1: those bachelor boys hearts that didn't do any laundry for days,
26:15
Speaker 1: and so they didn't even find the bloody sheets and
26:19
Speaker 1: the camera in the washing machine for days. But the
26:22
Speaker 1: reality is, Joseph Scott Morgan, forensics expert, to get rid
26:25
Speaker 1: of DNA evidence, you've got to use something like a
26:28
Speaker 1: myriadic acid and detergent is not going to do the trick. Yeah,
26:32
Speaker 1: sometimes even you know, even Bleach will not do the trick.
26:36
Speaker 1: I gotta tell you something else, And Nacy, she may
26:38
Speaker 1: have cleaned up the rest of the house, she didn't
26:40
Speaker 1: do much of a job in his bathroom though, if
26:43
Speaker 1: you remember, there was there was a significant blood spatter
26:50
Speaker 1: that was left behind, blood stain that was left behind
26:53
Speaker 1: on his sink where it was indicative of him having
26:59
Speaker 1: watched himself die. You know, we go back to you know,
27:02
Speaker 1: him seeing himself, you know, him being photographed by her.
27:07
Speaker 1: But he literally put his hands on that sink. There's
27:10
Speaker 1: actually contact trace blood that's left on the sink that
27:14
Speaker 1: appears where he placed his hands. He coughed and aspirated
27:21
Speaker 1: blood on the surface of the sink, and then he
27:24
Speaker 1: tried to make his way down the hallway away from
27:27
Speaker 1: the shower Nancy, and he left trace evidence along there.
27:32
Speaker 1: There was actually a large stain in the carpet where
27:36
Speaker 1: I believe this is where I believe that she had
27:39
Speaker 1: taken this knife. She essentially straddled his back around his
27:44
Speaker 1: neck and then really used a tremendous amount of force
27:48
Speaker 1: to cut his throat, cut his throat to the point
27:51
Speaker 1: where people had mentioned he was almost decapitated. I wouldn't
27:54
Speaker 1: go that far, but it was a deep decut. And
27:57
Speaker 1: then afterwards, and I believe this was post more of
28:00
Speaker 1: she shot him in the head. Uh. There was no
28:04
Speaker 1: hemorrhage in that wound track, So this is a classic
28:07
Speaker 1: case of overkill. But then she takes his body and
28:10
Speaker 1: drags it back down the hallway and places it in
28:14
Speaker 1: the shower. This took a tremendous amount of effort, and
28:17
Speaker 1: this was not clean enough. Climb stories with Nancy Grace
28:37
Speaker 1: stand some twenty seven times, and I don't know who
28:50
Speaker 1: do you think of them? I have no idea. Do
28:56
Speaker 1: you think that it was a random thing of somebody
28:58
Speaker 1: that knew him? This is a guy that you were
29:00
Speaker 1: pretty close to. This was a guy I was close
29:04
Speaker 1: to at a time when we were really trying to
29:06
Speaker 1: move apart from each other. So I mean, there were
29:09
Speaker 1: certain details about his life that I never did know about,
29:13
Speaker 1: and there are even more details that I did not
29:16
Speaker 1: know about, as as well as details about my life
29:19
Speaker 1: that he didn't know about because I had moved on.
29:21
Speaker 1: I had moved to California, so we were making a
29:25
Speaker 1: sincere effort to grow apart and to be apart and
29:29
Speaker 1: to move on. But nonetheless, he did remain a close
29:32
Speaker 1: friend of mine. And I just can't begin Kirk Nermy,
29:38
Speaker 1: It just everybody Kirknrmy with me a special guest arias,
29:42
Speaker 1: former defense law your author of Trapped with miss Arius
29:46
Speaker 1: on Amazon, Kirk, it just occurred to me, all the
29:50
Speaker 1: hours and hours and hours you spent with Arius alone
29:54
Speaker 1: and with the other defense member team members, When you
29:59
Speaker 1: look back on that and you remember looking right into
30:04
Speaker 1: her eyes, what feeling, if any, did you get? I
30:10
Speaker 1: think it was it was a disconnection. I mean, I
30:13
Speaker 1: certainly was not someone that I wanted to connect with.
30:15
Speaker 1: It was a job that I was ordered to do
30:17
Speaker 1: by the court, and that's what I did. That's what
30:21
Speaker 1: I focused on. I didn't focus on the individual and
30:25
Speaker 1: who she was. Bobby to come former special Asian FBI
30:29
Speaker 1: star Facebook's watch series Curse of acacor Bobby. So many
30:34
Speaker 1: times with defendants and witnesses and once with a defense lawyer,
30:42
Speaker 1: I would look into their eyes and it would be
30:44
Speaker 1: like I was looking at a reptile in that they
30:49
Speaker 1: seemed just cold blooded, like there was no feeling. There
30:52
Speaker 1: was nothing behind the eyes. It's just like dead back.
30:56
Speaker 1: There no feeling, no emotion, no understand standing, no empathy,
31:01
Speaker 1: much less sympathy, just blank And it's kind of like
31:07
Speaker 1: when you look at your pet cat and they look
31:10
Speaker 1: at you and you know, deep down inside, even though
31:13
Speaker 1: they're your pet, that if they were bigger than you,
31:16
Speaker 1: they would totally eat you. Okay, that's whenever I look
31:22
Speaker 1: directly into Jodi Arias's eyes. That is the feeling I get, Bobby,
31:27
Speaker 1: I mean, Karen start the psychologists and probably describe it
31:30
Speaker 1: better than I am. But you've dealt with so many
31:33
Speaker 1: defendants and they just it looks like nothing phases them,
31:37
Speaker 1: like they're playing a video game or something. And this
31:42
Speaker 1: is one of those unique experiences to investigators or defense
31:46
Speaker 1: counsel and prosecutors have that the general public doesn't have.
31:49
Speaker 1: I often talk to people about this that that that
31:51
Speaker 1: aren't in our business. That I'm saying, when you sit
31:54
Speaker 1: across the table from someone that's evil, someone that's done
31:58
Speaker 1: something that you're accusing them doing, and you know that
32:00
Speaker 1: they've done it, and you get that disconnect, you get
32:03
Speaker 1: that lack of empathy, and you get that you know
32:06
Speaker 1: that that ability just to to do these in human
32:10
Speaker 1: things to other human beings and not having an an
32:13
Speaker 1: ounce of feeling about it. There is something that colors
32:17
Speaker 1: our world. Right that have been in that, and I
32:19
Speaker 1: try to impart that to some audiences sometimes and you
32:23
Speaker 1: just it's very difficult to convey that feeling that we
32:26
Speaker 1: have because we've sat across from evil Um to the
32:30
Speaker 1: general public, because they've and thankfully so, they've never had
32:34
Speaker 1: to come across somebody like that in their lifetime. But
32:38
Speaker 1: when you do, you never forget it, you know. To
32:41
Speaker 1: Alexis Torez Chuck, investigative reporter, writer online dot Com, Alexis Um,
32:48
Speaker 1: I'm very happy to realize that you are someone else
32:53
Speaker 1: that loves to look at commissary purchases and jailhouse menus.
32:58
Speaker 1: And I see that you have very carefully detailed what
33:04
Speaker 1: Jody Arius is buying behind bars. I do love it.
33:08
Speaker 1: I can't help it. It fascinates me to see, first
33:11
Speaker 1: of all, what's available, in second what people are buying,
33:14
Speaker 1: specifically Jody, because she seems to have endless amounts of
33:17
Speaker 1: money to buy this stuff too. But the one thing
33:21
Speaker 1: that really sticks out to me is that she every
33:25
Speaker 1: month purchases a ten pack of razor blades. I don't
33:32
Speaker 1: know anything about I have not I'm not in the
33:36
Speaker 1: prison in Arizona, so I don't know if these are
33:39
Speaker 1: to shave her arms or her legs or what. But
33:41
Speaker 1: I would think that the woman who stubs somebody twenty
33:43
Speaker 1: seven times and slit somebody's throat. Wouldn't get razorblades behind
33:46
Speaker 1: bars like this seems like a threat, So that thing
33:49
Speaker 1: stuck out to me the most. She also buys, you know, toothbrushes.
33:54
Speaker 1: She seems to have gained a little bit of weight
33:57
Speaker 1: because you buy clothes and she's buying a size medium
34:02
Speaker 1: in some of her sweatshirts. But she also buys tons
34:05
Speaker 1: of food. I mean, she has sardines and cans, she
34:08
Speaker 1: has salmon flakes, she has Cheetah which I don't think
34:12
Speaker 1: they're actually Cheeto brands, but she gets chips, and then
34:17
Speaker 1: she buys an acids. She has to buy toothpaste. It's
34:20
Speaker 1: a fascinating look into somebody's life. And I get a
34:23
Speaker 1: lot of criticism for this though, even though people hate
34:26
Speaker 1: Jodi Arius, they say that this is really violating her privacy,
34:29
Speaker 1: which I don't see. But that is something that people
34:32
Speaker 1: tell me. Well, I tell you this much. Whoever's in
34:35
Speaker 1: charge of the prison system out there better take notices
34:38
Speaker 1: she's bloating up on razor blades, because I would not
34:42
Speaker 1: put anything past Jody Arius. Alexis. Where does her appeal
34:47
Speaker 1: stand right now? It has been filed, there has been
34:51
Speaker 1: a hearing where they've heard the appellate judges have heard
34:53
Speaker 1: the arguments from Jody Arius' attorneys and from the state,
34:58
Speaker 1: and usually in Arizona, it seems like it takes about
35:01
Speaker 1: twelve weeks for the appellate court to hand down a
35:04
Speaker 1: decision about an appeal. We are at leek eight, so
35:07
Speaker 1: we are in the final stretch of when we anticipate
35:09
Speaker 1: hearing it. I checked every single day in the court.
35:12
Speaker 1: I know that you check, Nancy, and that your staff checks,
35:15
Speaker 1: so we are expecting this to be any minute now. Alexas,
35:19
Speaker 1: what's your take on Jody Arius. Judy Arius is a psychopath.
35:23
Speaker 1: She you know because she spoke about you all the time.
35:27
Speaker 1: I think she has called me personally crazy after I
35:32
Speaker 1: wrote stories, literally sacks from the prison about her, called
35:36
Speaker 1: me obsessed with her. I am not obsessed with her.
35:39
Speaker 1: You are not obsessed with her. We are obsessed with
35:41
Speaker 1: getting the truth and justice for people that were involved
35:44
Speaker 1: in this case, meaning Travis Alexander. She has a huge ego,
35:49
Speaker 1: even locked up behind bars, the world revolves only around
35:53
Speaker 1: Jody Arius. She was a liar, She was a proven liar.
35:57
Speaker 1: She was very sneaking, and she very methodically planned Travis
36:01
Speaker 1: Alexander's murder. I'll always have our time in court together
36:05
Speaker 1: when she shot a bird at me. We'll always have Arizona,
36:09
Speaker 1: my happy memories of Jodi Arias. But you know what,
36:14
Speaker 1: I have to say that I've met an American Idol,
36:16
Speaker 1: because Jodi Arias did win American Idol. Behind bars, take
36:22
Speaker 1: a listen. Oh holy night, the stars are Bradley shine.
36:30
Speaker 1: It is a nighte of our Dearsey Fancy Grace crime Stories.
36:36
Speaker 1: Signing off, goodbye friend,