Latest / Linen Suit & Plastic Tie / What Makes A Good Friendship Story? ft. a Novelist-Advika & The Hollywood Wives (Kirthana Ramisetti)

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What Makes A Good Friendship Story? ft. a Novelist-Advika & The Hollywood Wives (Kirthana Ramisetti) · Linen Suit & Plastic Tie

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Welcome. Welcome to the linen suit and
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plastic tie podcast. This the podcast where we
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dissect and analyze the effort to cool.
0:12
The unbelievably awesome power of Storytelling and learn how to
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harness that power to supercharge our everyday lines.
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I'm going and I'm Kevin Kev its cunning a bad word.
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The way I learned it, it's been used as an - descriptor or.
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Yeah. I had this fight in my, you see
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like College English class about this, because I think
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definitionally wise, I want to have cunning, like I want to be
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I want to be Swift and smart and strategic in my thinking, like,
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why is that bad? Why is that a bad skill to have?
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But it is an interesting conversation with the English
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language with their Are words that just negative connotation
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right? And do the words that are the
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same. But one has - colloquial
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connotation and they've changed over time and I think cunning is
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technically a bad word like it's a it's a derogatory word.
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But I think if you look at its core what it means it's not
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stuff. You don't want to have right?
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Yeah. I mean contacts definitely plays
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a huge part in a lot of the semantics the way.
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You understand words and of course that is story telling us
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well because the story is associated with these words.
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The people you use these words to describe play a huge part of
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you know what people end up thinking about certain words.
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Okay. So I'm Googling this million
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Webster. Says cunning means dextrous or
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crafty and use of special resources such as a skill or
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knowledge or Entertaining, an end or another definition is
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characterized by Willie a wiliness and trickery see, this
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is what I'm saying. Another definition, they have a
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man, what's his dexterous kill and subtlety as in inventing
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devising or executing, that. Just saying using your resources
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in a crafty and complex way to entertaining a goal?
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Like, that's good. Like, I want to be cunning.
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I want to use my special way. Choices and you unique and
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proper ways to attain a goal and really all depends on the
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context. And since I have a Linguistics
2:38
degree, I should know that languages are never set in
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stone. They are alive and they are
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changing. They are a kind of a contract
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between the many people who use it.
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So, you know, given certain context, the same word can have
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different meanings. That being said, Ed.
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We could try generating enough momentum in the society today so
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that we can shift the word of cunning in the future.
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If you know, we really want it to me in a certain way.
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So I'm just saying Justice with the word cunning and that's how
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it starts the, the cunning campaign spent a campaign, it is
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a great wood. And I think you're adding the
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see to it. You're adding negative to it if
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you use it in a negative way, like anything.
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But Kev, speaking of the ability to use the English language and
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expert ways who is speaking to today, we are welcoming back a
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great friend of the show keerthana.
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Ramit Sethi, if you remember, last year, we had her on the
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show to talk about the first novel she has ever published
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David shastri's last day, which is a great story about.
3:58
Nation about Indian culture, the immigration experience,
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celebrity Legacy, and last, we heard that book is going to be
4:08
adapted into a TV show by HBO Max.
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So, really excited for Katana and this time Captain is coming
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back to us with a new book coming out in April 11th, called
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Advocate and the Hollywood wives.
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So this is a story about advocate.
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His six-year-old aspiring screenwriter in Los Angeles by
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accident meeting. A very famous Hollywood producer
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Julian's. Elding ending up marrying him
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very quickly but over the course of time, finding out about
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Julian's, true character throughout the stories of his
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Ex-Wives and it is a great story.
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A about friendship about grief about love.
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So, let's get into it. Sorry, boys.
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I'm looking at another definition.
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Cunning. And like this one has so many
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different definitions. Like there's like five and one
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of them is informal is a cunning means informally.
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Charming, cute or appealing. A cunning little baby.
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What's the now? It means cute.
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I'm sorry. I'm just saying I'm all I'm
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saying. Is that So I kept the not to
5:32
start us off. Can you tell us a little bit
5:36
about yourself again? What is your story and how has
5:39
their story changed since we last talked about a year ago?
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Yeah, that's an interesting question.
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I think about like what is my story at this point and the
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first thing I could think of is I can have say that I can call
5:53
myself an author two times over and that means a great deal to
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me. It's one of those things when
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you've always dreamed of writing a Book and then you get to do
6:01
it. And it happens, you're like
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great. But then that's not the Finish
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Line. The whole goal is to keep
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writing books. So, my story is that I wrote a
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book that came out in November 20 21 called Java shasta's, last
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day, and now I have a new novel out.
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I'd be cut and the Hollywood wives, which will be out in
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April. And that is my story right now.
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That's the dream come true twice over and it can't be more
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excited and thrilled. Yeah, amazing.
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And I know probably there's not much you can share.
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I don't know how Much progress, it has.
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But so exciting to see since we last taught that a film at has
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picked up, that was just his last day, it's being developed
6:38
into series and we were so excited member.
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We talked last time with all my casting ideas and I know so many
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people compared it to like succession in White Lotus.
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So think a trio math is such an interesting home for it.
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But how did that feel? How did that call goes anything?
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You can tell us about the process or what to look forward
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to That was amazing. And the funny thing is I do
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remember last time I spoke to you guys and we were talking
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about this and I already had already knew it was coming.
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I just couldn't announced it. So it's just kind of fun to talk
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about with you guys but not equal to actually show you
7:10
details of that point. And to be honest, I can't share
7:13
that much right now either. But what I will say is that it
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was never in my wildest dreams. I thought that would happen and
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partly because you know as a co-author just try to publish a
7:24
book that's the end goal. So I never really dreamt about
7:27
About getting option for to be or anything else, but also,
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because it features my first novel, David features an engine
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American woman in her 70s. By just didn't seem like
7:37
something that TV would be interested in the alone.
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A multi-generational saga about Indian American family.
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So one of the Y's interest in there was excitement and after
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option different television, I was just over the moon and no
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matter what happens with the project, I'm still very excited
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that somebody saw the potential in it and means it means a great
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deal. And of course, congratulations
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on all the success you achieve with your first book.
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We're so happy to you know be a part of it to witness and
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celebrate that story, of course. And I wonder you know, for this
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time around as a writer who is now publishing your second
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novel. How do you feel differently in?
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What kind of you know? Changes storytelling skill-wise?
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Have you developed or been? Influence.
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Now that, you know, it is the second time around.
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It's also a really good. Question, is actually at we had
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to go back and think about my process as I was working on the
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difference between the first and the second book.
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A one of the things I realize is that with Dava, you know, I was
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primarily telling a story from her point of view.
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But I was also telling it from the perspective of other
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characters in the novel meeting her her children primarily, and
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with the new book with odd, because I was only telling the
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novel from her perspective, so it's close third.
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Person. And because of out during the
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drafting process literally be writing and thinking, okay, I
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need somebody to help take out because here.
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So I just drop in a character is really as simple as that.
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But what happens when you do that, is that the rest of your
9:11
Supporting Cast becomes very two-dimensional?
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And they're not very interesting because I've literally sorting
9:17
them into a story as I need them.
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And so, I have to go back and really think about who are my
9:21
characters besides, my main character and make sure they
9:24
have dimensionality and that they seem that they have a life.
9:27
Outside of the course what's happening during the course of
9:30
the novel. And that was a really good
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lesson for me is that as much as my novel is focused on a main
9:34
character and have a very specific.
9:36
Quite I could not ignore my other characters and I had to
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make sure there was just as well been on did as my main character
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and the kind of the funny thing is I decided to lean into that a
9:46
little bit. The fact that because of how I
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was writing out because initially she came off very
9:51
self-involved and only interested in her own issues.
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So I decided to have other characters call.
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Out on that. And so part of the art of optic
10:00
has journey is learning, not to be so self-involved and stuff
10:04
focused. But also opens her eyes to what
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else is happening in the world. So it actually became a really
10:08
good lesson for me that also passed on to my character.
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You know what I love about that is how Decay and I love how you
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develop kid does. I think going back to Dava was
10:21
such a complex care? That we talked a lot with, like
10:23
this times, we like, oh my God, in this times, like, oh my God,
10:26
right? There it was so hard to like see
10:31
that she was like this, Conquering Hero.
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She was such a strong amazing character, but there's moments
10:35
like, oh she cheated. Oh, she did this.
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Oh, and you're like, you're so complex.
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And I felt that would Advocate as well.
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And before we get too deep into kind of talking about the book,
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do you want to give us a little bit of a quick recap of the
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book? Synopsis kind of long line type
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thing. So my novel is about because she
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is an aspiring screenwriter. As she is still grieving the
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death of her twin sister And she's working at after-party for
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the Oscars. When she meets Julian's, elding,
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who is Oscar winning film? Producer who happens to be 40
11:06
years. Her senior, they hit it off.
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They have a whirlwind courtship and they get married and not
11:13
long after they get married, Julian's first wife dies and she
11:17
leaves in odd because bequeathment of 1 million
11:20
dollars in her. Will saying, I'll be cleaved
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this to you if you divorce Julian and so of course,
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AdvoCare freaks out. Out.
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She realizes, she doesn't know her new husband at all.
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And she decides to explore who he really is through the eyes
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and experiences of his famous Ex-Wives.
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One of the very interesting about this book is it is a story
11:42
based in the city of Los Angeles, which, of course, Grove
11:46
and I have both lived in for quite some time and they won't
11:50
jump in real quick. Before you finish send it.
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There was moments where I like I'm sitting here as Polly would
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reading this book in a coffee shop to make.
11:56
Oh, She's like, I remembered, I was reading the first chapters
12:00
in West Hollywood, at this land. I'm coffee shop.
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And I was just sitting there and it's like, oh, we're talking
12:04
about the Chinese Theater. And we're talking about the
12:08
Dolby as like these monuments, and it was so interesting living
12:12
here reading it, reading these Pages, while being here and
12:16
thinking about the time Kevin, I went and saw some show at the
12:18
Dolby and we're like, oh, this is above a shopping complex,
12:22
this parallelism Los Angeles of the glitz and glamour.
12:25
It's so fascinating and it was great to kind of be in it while
12:29
reading your book and not only the landmarks but there's also
12:33
like a lot of Courts of the fun parts of LA the you know,
12:37
someone annoying parts. So yeah.
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Just kind of want to hear from you.
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What was it like for you to integrate the city or Hollywood
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into your story? What led you to this choice?
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And how does that affect how you developed the story once you
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decided on the setting? You know, one side Sire.
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That Africa, was to be a screenwriter and made perfect
13:00
sense, for her to be based in Los Angeles, especially, when I
13:03
decided that she would just start at the Oscars and she
13:07
would meet her future husband at the Oscars.
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I just thought, well, this is definitely a story and that was
13:13
fun for me. Because as you guys know, I went
13:16
to UCLA. I also grew up in Orange County,
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so I'm very familiar with Southern California.
13:21
And I like that there are so many distinctive parts of Los
13:24
Angeles and they can use that to tell this story.
13:27
In some cases, actually use my own memories.
13:29
For example, when either because is telling Julian, how much he
13:32
likes the Hollywood and Highland exists because it was a
13:36
Hollywood. Now that people who come to
13:38
visit, they can take them to. And that was really based on
13:41
something from my childhood, like we used to have people come
13:44
and visit us in Southern California, and they want to go
13:47
see Hollywood. And at the time I was growing up
13:50
there wasn't much to take them to.
13:52
You would take him to the Hollywood Walk of Fame.
13:54
Maybe show them the sign in the Hollywood Hills, but there's not
13:57
Something I said Hollywood and so I thought I would because I
14:01
really would appreciate the fact now that there is something
14:04
tangible and palpable exist, because so many people think of
14:07
Hollywood as a dream to achieve, but it wasn't really a place you
14:10
can visit before. And now it kind of was, it was
14:14
really fun, just incorporating, some of my aspects of growing up
14:18
in Southern California into odds because stores.
14:21
Yeah, and I mean, avoid bashing Hollywood, but we've been here.
14:27
Long time now and there's this parallel of the city, you know,
14:31
it sounds like, oh the Glamorous Walk of Fame, like, it's not
14:34
glamorous. Oh, Santa Monica, it's not good.
14:36
A right. There's these ideas of
14:39
Hollywood, but they, I think there was this idea, I was
14:42
trying to get it at how Hollywood often sets the tone in
14:47
a lot of ways for median representation, because it's
14:52
created, in this little bubble that seen as very glamorous,
14:55
right? And that bad Elevate to the
14:58
country. And I think this was only
15:00
thinking a lot about about this image of like the perfect person
15:03
or the, to say like hi would image and branding that
15:08
reverberate in, I think that's an open wide representation.
15:10
So important in Hollywood and stories like this because when
15:15
you take it to the screen when you, because it's not just the
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people in your city towns and states and worldwide will see
15:22
this. And I don't know if there's a
15:24
question there, but this is a part I had It was a really
15:28
interesting thing for me to have Los Angeles.
15:30
Be such a central role in this novel compared to Dava, which
15:34
primarily took place on a private island that I made up
15:37
with fictional setting a Lay's definitely not fictional.
15:40
And what was so interesting to me is that I feel like I've
15:44
become such an Insider and an outsider at the same time, which
15:47
is what I was hoping to capture in telling her story and
15:50
specifically setting it at La, because she is a person who's
15:54
grown up her whole life in the Los Angeles area.
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She also attended CLA. So she's highly aware of all the
15:59
different neighborhoods, how to navigate and also aware of how
16:02
class is represented by where you live as well.
16:06
So she's so value versed in being a Los Angelino.
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But at the same time, she's also an outsider because I someone
16:13
with Hollywood aspirations, she's always on the outside.
16:16
Looking in Wishing she could be a part of something that has
16:19
never been traditionally open to her.
16:20
So I really feel like a Los Angeles play.
16:23
Such a pivotal who she is? It kind of gives you a base in
16:26
terms of her. She and her friends has always
16:29
been a comfort to her for a long time.
16:31
And when that gets Stripped Away from Her, with the death of her
16:33
twin sister, she is flailing and she is lost, which is why she
16:37
clings to her Hollywood aspirations, even more.
16:41
This book Incorporated, some very interesting elements, I
16:46
remember when I first opened it, one of the very first Pages says
16:51
that it's, you know, dedicated for friends like mine and
16:55
siblings like yours. I wanted to get into that a
16:59
little bit, this story of friendship, because as much as I
17:04
have occurred, you know, I has put herself into an isolated and
17:09
all along situation. There are times when he's not
17:13
and of course, all of him. The Okies are relationships that
17:18
have really developed throughout the stories as well.
17:22
And we see a lot of not only support from the friends but
17:26
also be The absence of support at times Y, which I thought was,
17:32
you know, very interesting and educational, just on that impact
17:38
of the importance of friendship and support.
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So can you tell us a little bit more about the friendships in
17:44
the book? So, when I came up with this
17:47
premise of the screenwriter, marry in the much older, man,
17:50
one of the things I said to myself, there's like I wanted to
17:52
write something that was not a family Saga, first and foremost
17:56
to other had been a family song. My two books, I've worked on
17:59
previously, the data that we're never published, that was for
18:01
family Saga. So I'm like, let me not write
18:04
about families anymore, and that family dynamic because I've done
18:06
that. So I thought, well, let me read
18:08
about family friends. That was a notion.
18:10
I wanted to write about this book.
18:11
The idea that especially if you're an immigrant I you know,
18:16
so much of your relatives are back in the country of your
18:18
origin. That was my case.
18:20
I'm very close to my relatives in India, the most of them live
18:23
in India. So when you're growing up at
18:25
least for me, I grew up without with Allah.
18:27
Of other Indian families and we be kind of came.
18:29
Each other is de facto cousin's. We spent all our holidays
18:32
together. We travel together and just a
18:35
very close friendship that I boost.
18:37
So important special to me, especially after I moved to the
18:41
east coast and they all remained in the west coast because I felt
18:44
since I know them, since I was in elementary school, it was his
18:47
friendship. I felt completely understood.
18:49
We were all from similar backgrounds, we've known each
18:51
other for so long. I was a very special kind of
18:54
friendship and bond. I decided I wanted to write this
18:57
book. About in a way about that very
18:59
special friendship and bond that comes from being around people
19:02
who know you. Well, they feel like family and
19:05
of the kind of people you can call at 2:00 a.m. and say you
19:07
know, I have a body in my trunk. Can you come help me and they'll
19:11
do that without question? That's the kind of friendship.
19:13
I wanted to pick them. This novel, it's funny to be
19:16
where sometimes I've heard this book called a love story and
19:20
it's not in the way you would think it is.
19:22
It's not about a love story between Africa and Julian.
19:25
It's a love story about friendships and Atomic bonds and
19:29
the same with all of the one of the things I wanted to do with a
19:31
new friend like all of us. I think, especially as I get
19:34
older, you know, know if you're be able to continue to make the
19:37
same kind of close friendships, you did, when you're in your
19:40
your 20s, you know, when you're in college and you're school
19:42
together or four people you grew up with, but it's been really
19:46
amazing to me that the friendships I've made in my, you
19:49
know, being older now and still making very meaningful
19:52
friendships and having those close bonds.
19:55
It could happen at any age and To be important to you in your
19:58
life as well. And that's what all of
20:00
represents me in this novel. So I was kind of wanting to pay
20:04
tribute to friendships in this book, their friends that you've
20:06
known forever and there by Odin's eye and the opportunity
20:09
to the canoe amazing. Lovely friends as well and how
20:12
they can play a significant role in your life to, you know, I
20:16
love that. I love that.
20:17
I love the power of friendship. I think this is something in
20:20
Hollywood to that. I love seeing a good friendship
20:24
story, whether it's I always, I'm always texting my friends,
20:29
like this is a great friendship. And there's this, this story is
20:31
when Mike, this is an amazing friendship, please don't make
20:34
them fall in. Love, right there are times when
20:37
he didn't like I love this friendship don't have them fall
20:40
in love because it happens too much, that rope and I despise
20:43
it. I love a good mom Kim.
20:45
I love a good woman to tomini but we don't we don't talk about
20:49
friendships enough in media entertainment and was seen it
20:52
more for sure. I'm thinking like working moms,
20:55
which I'm obsessed with, that's Ash.
20:58
What can I was also gay. But there was a show that was
21:02
the show working moms, the Canadian television show, great
21:04
friendships, amazing. And I think about great
21:08
friendships and media and I think there's this vein that I
21:11
think I thought a lot about in college and as I developed more
21:14
friendships as I grew up. There's this idea of romance
21:19
where that's your ride or die. That's your person.
21:21
That's your everything and you almost start ranking the other
21:24
people like, oh, this is the only person I need.
21:26
This is it, this is the The world.
21:28
But this book actually explores that and in a way that's like 12
21:31
different people, serve different purposes and different
21:34
functions in your life. It's not about like these are
21:37
the most important person. This is my favorite in my
21:40
iPhone. This is how I think people like
21:42
this is my emergency contact. Like I think the thing is here
21:45
that what I love about your book is it also, even if he was the
21:49
prince charming, the perfect, the person, in the beginning of
21:51
the book, right? There are still ways that other
21:54
people, serve different functions and I think it's a
21:56
story. In where we tell ourselves.
21:58
All the one, the person yada yada.
22:01
And I think it's so important that we might find ourselves.
22:04
Different people come into your life for different reasons.
22:06
And not. Let ourselves get stuck in that
22:08
story of like, I need to find the one cent.
22:12
I mean, for very brief. Second, I thought of as you have
22:16
Africa, having relationship with one of the Okies, and then I
22:19
quickly Nick sticks. I'm like, I don't want this to
22:21
be about her meeting someone else.
22:23
I want this to be about her, reconnecting with herself,
22:26
what's important to her, but Also having a greater
22:28
appreciation for her friends and I think I didn't want to muddy
22:31
The Waters at all by having it like some subplot romance.
22:34
It was not, that's not what this novel is about.
22:36
So, I appreciate what you said because that was top of my, to
22:39
me to this might seem to have a lot about romantic comedies, and
22:44
how much my character loves them.
22:45
And I love them too. But to me, this was always a
22:48
friendship novel. Yeah.
22:50
And as much as romantic relationship is the front of the
22:56
story. It is.
22:57
Is the Friendship that's been the core and as we were talking
23:01
about the friendship and support also thought of this kind of
23:06
strange, but it also makes sense Sisterhood that kind of develops
23:11
between avocado and the Hollywood wives which is you
23:16
know, the other half of the title.
23:18
Can a walked us through those characters as well because each
23:22
of them has such an interesting story.
23:26
Julian's three Ex-Wives for each famous in their own waves.
23:29
The first wife is e v Lockhart and she is an actress that
23:34
Julian she met. When they were both at the
23:35
beginning. As of their careers, he became a
23:38
very famous producer and her career.
23:41
As soon went career went up, her career went down and so she had
23:45
only a short filmography before she retired from acting Julian.
23:49
Second wife is Nova. Martin.
23:52
She is a pop star in the end. I should.
23:55
I'd say because what is a much older person not because so I
23:59
should say, Evie's career, largely happens in the 70s and
24:02
early 80s before she retired from acting Nova.
24:05
Martin was a pop star in the MTV era 80s.
24:09
And so she is a person who, who wanted to be joining Mitchell,
24:12
but because of the time she was in and the husband, she was
24:16
married to who want her to be more commercial.
24:18
She ends up having a trajectory closer to Madonna, which is
24:21
something she did not want or aspire to, and then the third
24:25
wife, Her name is Victoria Toronto, and she is aspiring.
24:31
She wants. Anyway, I think she was like a
24:33
person who would have flourished on Instagram.
24:35
It was a little ahead of her time.
24:36
She just wants to be a personality.
24:37
She wants to be on TV, she wants to be famous.
24:39
I so she entices Julian. Her third husband to be on a
24:43
real housewives, ripoff so-called luxury wives and then
24:46
she pursues a reality TV career from the.
24:49
So they're very distinctive woman each in their own ways and
24:52
they each have a connection to Julian that Africa, uncovers, as
24:56
she reached researches each of their lives through, you know,
25:00
the media that the interviews they do, the movies are in the
25:03
TV shows are on and she learns a lot about I think.
25:08
But women go through in the entertainment industry and how
25:10
much so much of their stories are shaped and molded or even a
25:13
released by the people who have power and it's not something out
25:17
because I ever realized until she was kind of caught up in the
25:19
same Whirlpool of control that her predecessors were You know,
25:26
I mean, I think this was the rambling point.
25:28
I was trying to get to earlier to where the high road is such
25:32
an bubble of like a very small group of people and they set the
25:38
tone for the stories that people see as the world.
25:42
Right? And it's the thing about, that's
25:44
why representation in Hollywood is so important.
25:46
Because if we don't have representation in the writers
25:50
room or on a screen, they are not seen as the people of the
25:53
world, like we see, That the perfect person is this box,
25:57
right? And I think that was so
25:59
important. The way you talk about how the
26:01
people in power shaped these young women stories in the
26:04
Press, whether it's through suppressing, copies of novas
26:10
music, whether it's through suppressing articles, or
26:13
suppressing stories in the media or telling or the loudest voice,
26:18
becoming the most true version of the story, right?
26:21
I think that was so interesting about how she had to fight Learn
26:25
about these women because a long time she was told not to and
26:29
long time they were shut out. Their stories were cut short
26:32
because this powerful man, it didn't fit into his narrative
26:35
right. So I think it's the importance
26:37
of authenticity and storytelling the importance of us, try and
26:41
make sure there's more representation.
26:43
So few people don't control the narrative for many and I think
26:47
that was such an interesting talk about Hollywood as a whole
26:51
because this one man shut off the voices of Are these really
26:55
interesting and diverse women and also I think it was
26:58
interesting how each in the four wives, they were all women of
27:03
different races and different careers.
27:05
Why was it so important that each wife were so diverse in
27:08
that way to you? It was important because I feel
27:10
like, if this set a novel Los Angeles, it could be a diverse.
27:14
You have all people from all different backgrounds.
27:16
We grew up in the cat Los Angeles area, and it didn't make
27:18
sense to me to not have that kind of representation and also
27:22
figured out the author of this novel.
27:23
Why shouldn't I have? Representation, I think it's I'm
27:26
need to make sure it's an organic part of the story and it
27:30
makes sense, but they're in the story, but I love that, you
27:32
know, for example, Victoria is a Vietnamese and the backpack that
27:36
she's a Vietnamese American phrase, important part of her
27:39
story and who she is and also her marriage to Julian.
27:42
And what happens after that it was just a lot of but the other
27:45
thing is, in terms of their careers, I'm a pop culture
27:48
person and honestly this novel was inspired by watching Real
27:52
Housewives of Beverly Hills. So It made sense to me, when I
27:56
thought about the idea of like, giving this famous film
27:58
producer, famous Ex-Wives. One of them had to be reality
28:02
star because I love the Real Housewives.
28:05
But I'm, you know, I love my explore, the idea of what it
28:08
meant to be a musician in the 80s when you're fighting against
28:10
the grain of expectations. And with Evie, I thought it
28:14
would be interesting because we've seen it so many times.
28:16
Especially in the post me to movement actresses would be, you
28:20
would see an actress in so many movies.
28:21
They would be everywhere and they just be gone and disappear.
28:25
And we didn't have an understanding why they were gone
28:27
and what happened to them. And sometimes, we're told
28:29
stories about, oh, they were difficult on set as an example
28:32
or no one like to work with them.
28:34
And then the real story comes out.
28:36
And again, it's a stories that were told if versus what
28:39
actually happens, and usually, sometimes it had tragic
28:42
Dimension, so what really happened to them in their
28:44
careers. So for me, the opportunity to
28:46
give them different careers, let me explore different aspects of
28:49
what it'd be like to work in that career.
28:51
And also I'm a pop culture fans are just friends.
28:54
Diving into the different elements of all those different
28:57
careers to. Yeah, and, you know, there's
29:00
such they're such big and important characters in.
29:02
It was so amazing to see how she viewed her story through their
29:05
story and how because of the different mood she was in, she
29:08
had different perspectives on their story and I think this is
29:11
so important about us as humans as well.
29:14
And storytelling and hearing other people's stories that he
29:17
one day. It can be very dismissive.
29:19
One day, you can be really annoyed with something the other
29:21
day, 20. You see it with a different
29:23
perspective. So, I think empathy is huge here
29:26
because taking time to understand them as best as she
29:29
could was so important to her life, right?
29:32
And, you know, I think there's so many different characters in
29:34
this book. There's so many big stories with
29:36
the wives and you had to build up, can the Julian and because
29:41
love story and then integrate the wives and then all to the
29:45
time attending and things like that.
29:47
How do you go about pacing this book or pacing?
29:50
These toys? Where, how do you know when to
29:51
bring in which wife want to go a little bit deeper?
29:54
Deeper went to end. Like, what was that process like
29:57
for you? This novel.
30:00
I like the first novel, which I worked on for several years and
30:03
before I submit it to agents and then editors the second level I
30:06
sold sample chapters in a synopsis.
30:10
So it was different in the sense that I had an idea of how the
30:13
novel begin to those first chapters and also have an
30:16
overarching idea of the entire platform beginning to end.
30:19
So what you wrote like you read in, the novel is how I always
30:22
imagined that this novel, The transpire, everything that
30:24
happens is from that sin, obviously wrote from day one, I
30:28
think it changed, but I I have to write a whole novel but I
30:30
have to figure out what happens when and how each of these wives
30:34
are introduced into the story as as because learning more and
30:37
more about who should really married.
30:39
And so for me, what I found really works for me as a writer
30:42
is having an outline. The one difference for me in
30:45
terms of book 1 and book two is with book.
30:48
One I wrote the entire outline in advance before I even started
30:51
writing the novel with book to I cuz I had a deadline now, which
30:55
changes everything about my writing process because now I
30:59
had And I can look at a calendar and say, okay, this first draft
31:02
is due in x amount of months, and there's a lot of pressure on
31:06
you, so may generate pages. So what I found worked for me
31:10
for this book anyway, is that I did kind of a version of book 1
31:15
which is I wrote couple of chapters in the outline that I
31:18
drafted it then I wrote the outline for a couple chapters of
31:22
that outline and then drafted it.
31:23
So went back and forth between outline and novel and then
31:27
taught an entire draft and What really helped me after the fact
31:32
is, I read somewhere that you should it's helpful to you
31:36
during the revision process. And all novels are honestly
31:39
boring. The revision process, drafting
31:41
is just getting words on the page.
31:42
So you have something to work with but revisions are where the
31:44
novel is boring. So I read something where they
31:48
recommend after you finish your manuscripts, you go back and you
31:52
summarize every chapter in your novel and for me, I chose to do
31:55
that scene by scene. So chapter 1 scene, 1 seem to
31:59
check After two seen, one seemed to affect you and by having that
32:02
blueprint it was so helpful because of course.
32:04
So now we'll changes a little bit from outline to final drafts
32:08
so I can always go back in terms of what you're asking about
32:11
pacing. I can see, okay, maybe this
32:12
information comes too early and maybe that Revelation should
32:15
come later and I was able to move things around like a puzzle
32:18
pieces to see where exactly certain things to fall into
32:21
place and that was immensely helpful.
32:24
That's such an interesting insight for us as people who
32:29
don't know, a lot about the writing process to, you know,
32:33
see behind the curtain. So thank you for walking us
32:36
through that. And I think one other element
32:40
that we're seeing in this book is the integration of film and
32:46
TV. Obviously this is an l.a. base
32:48
story makes a lot of sense integrate that and in your first
32:52
book, you did also. We'll have the element of music
32:57
has a very in central part of Donna Story.
33:01
I want to for you as a Storyteller.
33:03
Why do these? How do we see these elements
33:06
enhance? The story you're trying to tell
33:09
it's like, was music indaba the movie and TV stuff?
33:14
Is it's an intelligent choice. I have to say, it's Indulgence
33:17
in me. So I had another edict for
33:20
myself. When I wrote this novel, I
33:21
couldn't write about music again, in the same way, did Dava
33:24
it was really very easy for me to because I love music so much.
33:27
I'm like let me not do music this time but a long time ago I
33:31
wrote a short story and it's a story, short story lived, a
33:35
total history of a band solely through what was written about
33:38
them. So interviews, television
33:40
appearances page. Six, gossip items is the entire
33:44
history of Albans through everything that was ever said
33:47
about them. And I had a lot of fun writing
33:50
it and that short story never got anywhere near I got
33:54
rejected. The face, but I love that short
33:56
story. So I decided to take, what was
33:58
so fun about writing, a short story and integrate it into this
34:01
novel. So for me, I loved writing, you
34:04
know, behind this Behind the Music, like, watching on
34:07
YouTube. Sometimes, you know, these
34:08
episodes are broken up into Clips.
34:09
You can watch the whole thing or writing, you know, a biography
34:13
of a character or watching looks like to, like, watch a TV
34:17
binge-watching, entire season of television with another person,
34:20
and you got your cracking jokes with their friend as you're
34:22
watching it. So for me, it's just a fun way.
34:24
A to tell a story because pop culture TV and movies is such a,
34:28
you know, for most of us with big, it's a fun aspect of our
34:31
lives, but I also think it communicates a lot about who we
34:34
are. For example, if a friend
34:36
recommends, a Spotify playlist to you or he says, hey, you
34:38
should go check out that movie, that tells you a lot about who
34:42
they are, what's of interest to them.
34:44
But also what they think about you what they think.
34:46
Hey, I think my friend might like this too.
34:48
Is says, a lot about their relationship to you as well.
34:50
In terms of there's a thing I liked and here's a thing, I
34:53
think you will like to It's a good way, we communicate a lot
34:57
of the worlds and make connections in the world.
34:58
And so I think it's important thing to share.
35:01
And for agriculture, she comes to really bond with her
35:05
predecessors, the xy's by learning, what makes them tick
35:08
and what they were passionate about and make sure we think
35:10
about what she's passionate about to in terms of her craft,
35:13
which is screenwriting. It took me a couple chapters, do
35:17
realize that the chapter titles were romantic comedies or
35:20
romance movies which was embarrassing.
35:22
But as soon as I started, I'm like Oh, 10 Things I Hate About
35:25
You. I see it, but I loved.
35:28
I loved that. You did this again and we talked
35:30
about this in first episode of you about interweaving music to
35:34
invoke emotion for the people who knew the music.
35:36
But at the same time, you could still understand that if you
35:39
didn't, I think the same thing with the movies here, where does
35:41
that show little Easter eggs? If I could you knew the movie if
35:43
you knew the references a little bit deeper but it still works.
35:46
I love that too. Be mindful.
35:55
If your precious time we have a closeout segment called
35:59
suspenders. It works like this.
36:02
We ask you a fun random question that's unrelated to anything and
36:06
you can give us any answer. You feel like question of the
36:09
day is, if you could have any fictional creature as a pet,
36:16
what would it be and why? I don't know how it'll work out.
36:21
But the first thing that comes to mind, where is it that you
36:23
walk? Maybe.
36:23
Because it's fuzzy and cute, but it's got would be kind of like
36:27
having a pet dog in a way but they can actually interact with
36:30
it more and communicate with them.
36:31
Or this is just the first thing that comes to mind.
36:34
I'm sure they're better answers to this question, but I feel
36:37
like they seem fun to hang out with.
36:39
They were vital part of Return of the Jedi, so look at what do
36:42
you walk? Okay, st.
36:44
Pete, the first thing that came to mind with the Griffin from
36:48
Sandman, I don't know why, but that's what I was thinking.
36:52
I Griffin, Our God go out and I was a good.
36:55
I think, I don't know. But anyways again, thank you so
36:58
much for joining us. It's always amazing to talk to
37:00
you hear more about your stories with huge fans and we're so
37:03
excited for this book to come out on April 11th, 2023.
37:08
A be kind of Hollywood wives was so excited.
37:11
Thanks for having me. This has been a really great
37:13
conversation. Welcome back to Top Hat.
37:23
This is the part of the episode Kool-Aid dissect and analyze
37:26
some of the cool learnings, we got from this week's at split
37:30
Storyteller. And this week, we welcome back
37:33
the amazing kiffin RMS, Eddie back to the show, to talk about
37:36
her new book. I have weakened the Hollywood
37:39
wives. Yeah, carved in this book for
37:43
you. And I are very interesting to
37:45
read because it is based in the city of Los Angeles and we both
37:50
lived here for a bunch of years, so we can the City of Angels.
37:54
Yes, at least see, you know, not only the Glamorous Parts
37:59
depicted. Also some of the, you know, very
38:02
strange, but very true quirks of that City.
38:04
And yeah, it's a really interesting City for sure.
38:07
I think every city is so unique and Style and the pace in that
38:12
energy in their goals and really shapes how you experience it and
38:17
what you do in that City. Absolutely.
38:21
And, you know, with LA is obviously a very diverse City,
38:27
and of course, Hollywood entertainment.
38:30
And the show business is very central part to the identity of
38:35
La. That's what arvika story is
38:38
about as well. She's an aspiring.
38:40
And screenwriter, she met her soon-to-be.
38:45
Husband had an Oscars after-party.
38:48
She is an outsider Show Business trying to get him.
38:53
So the choice of this city really makes this story, you
38:57
know, Lively and believable. Yeah, you talk about identity.
39:01
They are which is really key your identity because cities do
39:04
have identities and your identity is affected deeply by
39:09
that City like When you intact and working in San Francisco,
39:13
there's this kind of energy of it that other people around you
39:17
on Tech and kind of the superstars in that City to God's
39:20
the city of San Francisco are the tech billion is, right?
39:23
It's similar to Hollywood, where you going to Coffee Shop, you
39:26
see a lot of script writers or struggling actors in The Gods of
39:29
the city, as the kind of the Hollywood Elite, and this is
39:33
seen in so many different cities in so many different goals.
39:36
And when you move to a city, like I'm moving to the big city
39:39
to explore. My dreams because that's where
39:41
the opportunities are. That's where the, the VCS are
39:44
attack, that's what the studios are.
39:47
And even in this post pandemic world, where you can now work
39:51
virtually or work from home and you're spending more time at
39:54
home, you don't actually have to move to a city.
39:56
But certain job these City still have identities, still have
40:00
these residencies that greatly affect your goals and greatly
40:05
affect the Ambitions and the opportunity to have.
40:08
So I think it's such an important concept for her.
40:10
Work. Well, she explores the city of
40:12
Los Angeles and how the main character living, their
40:15
Advocate. How living in Los Angeles, the
40:18
images. He sees the people, she talks to
40:20
the environment. She's in affects the decision.
40:23
She makes in her career. Not just in our passion for
40:26
screenwriting, but the decision she makes in her life.
40:29
It's really important is a really interesting idea of the
40:32
stories. Your city tells write the story
40:34
is the people around you, in a city, tell the different stories
40:38
that are being told when you travel.
40:39
So I think this is Is a very good exercise for everyone.
40:42
Ask yourselves. What store is your City Nails?
40:45
What are the people? They are fighting for?
40:46
What's the general kind of vibe storytelling of your city and
40:49
then when you travel to other cities, ask yourself the same
40:52
question. And see the difference is see
40:54
who moves where to explore with stories and it can greatly help,
40:59
you kind of Define what you value, your life, why you value
41:03
in it? And if you're in the right
41:04
place, another thing, very interesting topic.
41:10
Is this story or this very overarching storyline of
41:16
friendship. How friendship is represented in
41:21
Hollywood or in film and TV in general?
41:24
Yeah. And you know I think I'm always
41:26
I love a good friendship story. It is so many romantic romance.
41:31
Oh, isn't there are some amazing friendships.
41:32
Do is to, you know, chewy and Han Nick and Schmidt.
41:41
Joey and Phoebe. There are some really truly
41:44
great friendships toys. But, you know, I think it's one
41:47
of the worst things people can do friendships writers can do is
41:49
when they make them fall in love.
41:51
There's so many great friendships.
41:52
Aren't they? Amazing amazing.
41:53
Amazing, I know that there are two people of the opposite sex.
41:57
I know they're both heterosexual but please, please, please don't
42:01
make them fall in love, please. I mean, it perpetuates that
42:04
story that you can't have female friends, right?
42:06
Which I think is total BS by the way.
42:09
But Insulted, some of them are so frustrating.
42:12
Like I think a very clear one is Joey and Rachel, I'm like, why
42:17
are we doing this? Just because they're both
42:19
straight and then there's any of each other.
42:21
No, don't do this to us. Like, come on.
42:24
And I think it's, this idea this concept that the another concept
42:28
that I hate that I rally against the, like, you complete me story
42:32
or that, like, the epitome of relationships are like the
42:35
topmost. The only thing that matters is
42:36
finding love and I think No, I think this book, what it does
42:42
really well, that some stories don't is the reminder that
42:46
different people. Serve different roles in your
42:48
life. Yeah, it will be a lot of
42:51
unrealistic expectation to put on one single person to for
42:56
that. The one there it is and
42:58
friendship is its own thing. It is not the intermediate
43:04
romantic relationship. Romantic relationship is not the
43:07
next level of friendship. We can have both friendship and
43:11
romantic relationships. This has been another episode of
43:15
the linen suit in plastic tie podcast.
43:18
If you like a Content, make sure to subscribe and follow us
43:22
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43:25
the let us know what you're thinking.
43:27
Follow us on Instagram and Tick-Tock at LSP teapot and we
43:32
will see you next time. Have a good one.