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Grace Ogren Is Writing Stories for Her Young Generation · Inspiring Stories

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Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to the picture of the radiant.
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Speaker 2: Rat.
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Speaker 3: You readything to me?
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Speaker 4: Oh well, well.
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Speaker 3: Say, oh well.
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Speaker 5: Not a bad stop.
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Speaker 3: Alone.
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Speaker 2: I just see you.
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Speaker 5: So call LASSI so.
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Speaker 4: Alon?
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Speaker 5: Is it dead.
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Speaker 4: Event?
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Speaker 1: Welcome back everyone to inspiring stories. Let's speak a little
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bit of about the importance of literature and our young people,
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that how important it is to get them to read
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and to read lots, not just what's what they find
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on Google, but to actually get them actively reading books,
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turning the pages of a book and reading a novel,
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reading literature, reading it right from a actual book, not
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just a tablet, and trying to get them involved in
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their own education by teaching them to read and getting it,
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getting that information from the page into their minds is
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so important. And with that, I want to introduce you
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to Grace Ogrin. She's an author. She writes novels for
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young adults and educational content that helps people find addiction
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and mental health treatment. She has one published novel and
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one in the world, and she's planning on writing many,
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many more. And she has worked as a freelance writer,
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copywriter and editor over the last four years, honing her
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voice as an author and her goals for the future. Well,
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you can find her work on Recovery dot Com or
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on Amazon, so and I will double check later in
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the show to be certain that we can find her
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on both Amazon dot Com and Amazon dot Ca. So
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let's welcome Grace to the show. And oh, for the record,
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Grace is one of those young people who has found
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education through reading and who has found a love for
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reading as well as writing. So she's writing to her
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own audience, and that's what really makes her so special
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that she is one of those young people writing for
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young people. So let's welcome her to the show.
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Speaker 3: Something we can.
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Speaker 1: All right, great, So welcome to the show. So you well,
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you got quite a bit of story. Let's start off
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with why is it that you love writing so much?
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What about that just get you going?
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Speaker 2: That's a good question. It's kind it's hard for me
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to define, I can, but it's also very broad. At
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the same time. I think it boils down though, to
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having a lot of respect for it, and that comes
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from writing being something that I've enjoyed throughout like the
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good and the bad of life, and just seeing how
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it has stayed as this kind of constant presence. And
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so I have a lot of respect for like the
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the creative, like exploring of that, and just I know
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it affects me quite a bit. Like writing in general,
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it's a really good way for me to process, even
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if I'm not writing directly about something that's happened to me,
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Putting characters through tough situations has given me a lot
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of perspective. And that's another reason why kind of I
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just respect writing as like a something you can learn
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and then something that I think is just kind of
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in you as well. And yeah, just the create creative
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process of it. It's really fun to build a world,
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build characters, have them interact with each other, interact with
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the world, and it does give me a lot of
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perspective for things I'm going through and things I went
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through as a kid. So it feels kind of very
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full circle. It feels healing. It's very powerful I think
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writing and kind of transcendent. I think it goes beyond
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words like you can do with other forms of art.
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So that is my long winded answer. Yeah, Well, the.
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Speaker 1: Way did answers good here because I hate we're part
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of what we do here. If you want to support
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artists right and along with it, is is cool. Because
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it keeps people listening to us. So you talked about healing,
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So are you able to talk about some of those
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wounds that your writing has help you heal.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. I've struggled pretty constantly with depression and it
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developed when I was about fourteen fifteen, and it was
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very severe. I had to go to pretty intensive treatment
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and that was when I started writing, and it was
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part of why I wanted to get better, was because
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I wanted to finish my book, and it helped me.
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Like what I was saying earlier about putting a character
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through a tough situation, I think that was so appealing
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because I was in a lot of pain myself with
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depression and where we were living in a very rural area,
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rural Minnesota, and there just wasn't resources. We didn't know
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what to do, So it's a lot of like stuff
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was out of control. It was confusing, and when I
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discovered with writing, it was really nice to have some
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sense of control. But then it also allowed me to
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put someone in a worse situation than my own and
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just even see it being possible for them to get
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through it. And because I was the one guiding it,
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it gave me stronger sense of agency over my own story,
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my own healing. So yeah, it was just depression, and
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then had a recurrence of it about a year ago
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and kind of the same thing. I started another book
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and started it in treatment and now I'm out of
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treatment and I finished the book. So and that's another
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reason why I also have so much like respect for
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writing is because it it stuck with me through all
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of that. Like I used to be pretty into like painting,
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graphic design, kind of anything artistic, and when the depression
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got worse, those things just fell away. But I didn't
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lose writing, and that was pretty like powerful to me.
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And it's kind of a sign of, like, I think
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this is really important to me and it's really something
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that I'm meant to be doing because it just the
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way it felt and the fact that it stuck around
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was telling yeah to me. But yeah, most of what
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I work through in process, mainly it's the feelings associated
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with depression. And as a kid, I also moved quite
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a bit, so that feeling the feelings of like loneliness
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and not fitting in and being like the outsider, being
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the underdog is what I really like writing about. Yeah,
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I would say that about covers that.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm going to say this about about depression and
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mental health in general. It's like, no woe shade ever
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diminished that because you know what, that's part of your
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story and I'm glad that you found like an art
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for that allows you to express what's inside of you. Right. Yeah,
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it seems like you're very deeply expressive person and to
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be able to get that out on to pen and
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paper or it was a if it was a brush
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or something like that or whatever, it took right to
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get it out of you, right, So that's that's that
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part's cool. So you also talk about building a world
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and then having your characters interact with that world and
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with themselves. So how do you work that out?
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Speaker 2: Mm hmmm. I would say, Man, whenever I start a book,
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I start with a very rough outline and that's kind
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of where the world comes into being. But it's I'm
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as a writer, I'm a very like exploratory I guess
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or panser for sure, where I learn about stuff as
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I go. But world building it's very it's so complicated.
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I mean, when you start, it feels easy, like you
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could I can picture the world that I want people
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to be in and think of all the parts of it,
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and then when you actually start writing about it, it's
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easy to like have your current world slip in, And
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I think that's something that I also find healing about writings.
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You kind of have to shut out the true world too,
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like very to connect with your world to the level
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that you need to to understand it enough to have
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your characters interact with it. So that is not something
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I'm super conscious of, I guess as I write, but
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as I'm thinking now, like it is, it's a lot
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of shutting out this my world in order to focus
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on the other one and see the characters as they
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grow with the world, as things change in the world,
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did things change with characters and vice versa. So it's
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for me very exploratory as I go, and then I
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try to smooth it out in the second draft. Usually
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by the end of the first draft is when I
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actually have a clear grasp of what my world is.
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And I've written like two main different stories, and one
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of them in the world isn't as important like it's there,
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But in this second book, the world is very important
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to the story and to the characters. So that's it's
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been interesting to just feel the difference in that as
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I'm writing and what it takes to make it realistic
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when the world is very involved and not just a backdrop.
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Speaker 1: So when you're when you're writing, do you see and
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hear what's happening around why you're why you're writing it's
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you can fit slid down and describe it to the
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to the rest.
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Speaker 2: Of us, Like the world I'm seeing.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, can you see it in your head?
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Speaker 2: Usually yeah, And I do try to incorporate like all
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the senses I can when I'm writing about it. So
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like in my current book, now there's two worlds in
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there split it's like above the Earth's surface and below.
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So for the below, I wanted it to be pretty
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different from the above in as many ways as I could,
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So like one side smells different, one side has a
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different temperature, the light is different on either side, and
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so yeah, incorporating all those sensory things have been important
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for me with this book, especially as a way to
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differentiate it. And then it's a way for to see
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like which characters notice what about each side of the world,
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and like do they notice the smell, do they like it?
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Does it remind them of home or something? Else, So
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it kind of it just gives you more elements that
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I think your characters can interact with. But yeah, overall,
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I do try to put in a lot of sensory
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stuff so people can like feel it and hear it
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and smell it.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, wow, it's it. Okay, you're getting me hopeful and
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you're writing now because you said a couple of details
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in there. It's like that, Okay, analytical science bring kicks in, Like, Okay,
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it's below the surface, So how to your light when
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quote unquote the sun can't get through the surface to them,
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but there's got to be something else that could actually
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potentially cause the light. So how did we write that
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into the book? And how do we right like spectrums
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of color and things like that into into it all.
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And it's like, you've got that going through my head
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right now.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, I had it the algae, which I don't know
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if that I don't know if that works, but I'll
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figure that out.
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Speaker 1: No, it's I bet you that that could actually work.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, just be different.
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Speaker 1: Yeah you know, yeah, well, well we'll leave it at
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that and just be different because because I don't want
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to influence your book. But okay, so with that being said, right,
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you must do a lot of great reading on the
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outside of your books so that you can incorporate like
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details inside.
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Speaker 2: Your Yeah, I read a lot of I try to
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read in my same genre as much as I can,
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so might would be fantasy, so I try to look
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at how other authors are doing that, and then also
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like actual worlds, actual climates that would mimic the ones
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I'm trying to create. That can be helpful. I try
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not to like focus too much on that because I
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almost don't want to be like influenced by somewhere that's real.
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I think that can be helpful, but that's just been
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my approach where I kind of spit out a bunch
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of stuff and then like I'm in a writer's group
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right now, I have been as I've worked on this book,
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and they've pinted out similar stuff to like the light, Like, well,
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how does that part work? And I don't know, I know,
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figure that out, but for my creative process, I almost
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have to put it out and then like deal with it.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I would imagine some details like like how
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the like it's formed, how it actually gets there eventually
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falls away to the backdrop of the of the story.
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Anyway and then ah, the character interaction and and uh
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and story takes over anyway, So I will worry about
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it too far into it because I think some some
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of my favorite books, like There's one that it happens
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way in the future, but you know what, that part
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falls by the wayside because the interaction of the characters,
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the story itself, it's it just takes over and then
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you you wind up focusing on that anyway, and it
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and it could be this world and and all that
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stuff anyway, because you know, you just get tracked them.
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What are the characters actually doing? What, what's the plot
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like and all that kind of stuff. So so how
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do you come up with the with with the plot
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lines and everything? How does what does your more of
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your creative process you go from rough outline and they
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narrow it down to to something uh yeah, so.
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Speaker 2: The actual Like the very beginning of this idea, I
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think it was like almost a dream. I was about
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to fall asleep and I had this like image and
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the and that triggered this and then yeah, I wrote
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the rough outline is just bullet points. It's pretty much
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not at all like what I outlined the finished product,
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So I I do that outline, and then as I write,
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I usually end up creating a note on my phone
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and then I just add stuff to that. So it's
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kind of a pretty informal continuing outline with as I write,
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I write out what I want to do next. I
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put in the note, and that's where I track ideas
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as I'm like marinating on it and I think of
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things I want to do for the plot. A lot
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of it is just kind of it's working in the background,
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like subconsciously for me is and then things kind of
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just drop and I just write it down pretty much,
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and I think I've gotten used to that also, so
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it can it's feeling more like a habit to try
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to become more aware of it going on in the
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background and try to kind of feed it more instead
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of just seeing what happens, but to try to just
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get that side of my brain going. But a lot
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of the ideas kind of comm at random times and
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I just write them down. But that's usually draft one.
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I've got a rough outline, and then as I write,
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I get more ideas I write them down Draft two.
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Usually the first draft is my outline, and then I
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use most of the plot points from draft one and
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then I usually end up rewriting the whole thing. But yeah,
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I don't follow like a set structure. Usually i'll compare
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it to one once i'm done, like I've compared to
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The Hero's Journey with finished drafts, just to make sure
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I'm aligned with that structure, because I feel like that
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one's really strong and I want to be close to that,
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and I think that's just something readers expect, so to
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fall in with that, it's something I shoot for. But yeah,
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I think overall, I'm not very structured with how I write.
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It's more like I just write, and I keep track
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of ideas and kind of comes as it comes.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, is it is it that it's or is it
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we could say, not traditionally structured or is it grace structure?
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Like it fits how your mind works so that she
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actually can put it all together into something that's like
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really cool, wonderful. Hey, I can't stop reading.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I definitely need to do it like
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my way first, and then yeah, I would get I
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think so distracted and kind of annoyed with the actual
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structure that I wouldn't write, So I have to like
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blurt it out and then mm, hmm, kind of decide
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how worried I'm going to get about having it follow
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a like predetermined structure, because you got to what you said.
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I want it to be to follow the story and
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not necessarily some like plot out line made by someone
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else with like a different story in minders.
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Speaker 5: But I do.
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Speaker 2: I think of it kind of as like a a guide,
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especially when I'm done with the draft, just to make
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sure it's got like good beats to it.
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Speaker 1: But yeah, yeah, who who are you actually aiming your stories?
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Who do you want to who do you want to
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read them?
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Speaker 2: I think basically like young adults, people from people in
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high school pretty much, who don't feel like they fit.
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That's what I would say, Like they want stories with
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like this isn't the right word, but like feeling and
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depth is really what I shoot for. So it's people
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who feel a lot of feelings and have a lot
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of depth. And I know when I was their age,
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which was not long ago, I didn't see a whole
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lot of that in books like the ones that I did.
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I latched onto it and that was like the Hunger Games,
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mainly because there was so much like emotion in that,
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so much depth and like the main character, Catonists makes
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so many tough decisions, and just to see really tough
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stuff in a book where a character works through it
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is I think powerful And it was really helpful for
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me as a kid. So I want to target yeah,
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that audience of people who want something deep. Yeah.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I didn't read read The Hunger Games. I watched
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the movies, and so I know the I know the storyline.
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Of course, a movie is somebody's interpretation of what they
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saw out of the book, what they thought was important
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from out of the book.
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Speaker 2: Uh.
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Speaker 1: And also you have like a compilation of all those
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things because now you have the actors like, oh, I
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think the character should be this way. Yeah, maybe you know.
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But but Candice in the in the movie version had
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to be a strong character, a strong person, uh, in
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order to adapt an overcomplict what was happening in her world.
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So yeah, I can see how that could strengthen a person.
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Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And I've had people the book that I
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have published, people have been with this reminds me of
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The Hunger Games and then like yay, like that's I
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was hoping for that vibe, that feeling like, so I
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think it's Yeah, it's good to have stuff like that
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to shoot for, like a vision in a sense, that
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feeling I wanted to capture that the Hunger Games gave me.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, so you want the readers of your books to
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find that in the strength inside of themselves.
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Speaker 4: Yeah.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's a really a really good thing to have.
27:18
Is like most of us, ever, most was in our
27:21
society kind of learned to toss our inter strength to
27:25
aside and we go with the external strengths and h
27:33
So that's good. You're trying to promote that inter string, right, yeah.
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Speaker 2: Yeah.
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Speaker 1: How does your inn strength work for you?
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Speaker 2: Mm hmmm kind of depends. M it's been it's been good,
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and then it's been not nearly enough. But I do
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feel like wright these the types of stories that I
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like to write, where they're kind of more intense and
28:05
high stakes, has been enlightening in that sense too, where
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I feel like people can really be pushed and you
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can kind of surprise yourself with how you react.
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Speaker 1: And I have that.
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Speaker 2: I see that happen in stories in mine and then
28:27
in my personal story where I feel like I can
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think like this is this reminds me of this part
28:34
of my story where this was happening to this character,
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and they felt discouraged and like they were, you know, done,
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but then a lot twists happens, or they just gather
28:45
some men or something inspires them. Like it, I always
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see it work out in my own stories, which kind
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of sounds funny because I'm the one making it work out.
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But it's like the things just kind of build on
29:01
top of each other and seeing how it kind of
29:05
unfolds is interesting to me. I feel like I'm kind
29:10
of just translating and guiding it. But so my yeah,
29:17
my under strength is not always there, but stuff like
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writing has helped I have a really supportive family, and
29:29
even just having this book published, I think it's a
29:32
good like physical representation of that strength, having some strength
29:41
to one get it written and to publish it because
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that opens you up to a lot of feedback and
29:51
possible negativity.
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Speaker 1: So yeah, we can tell the naysayer to go awesome work.
30:07
Can you just write from your one book that hasn't published?
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Can you describe the hero of that book?
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Speaker 2: Did you say the one that is published is published?
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Speaker 1: Okay, yeah, because she don't want to give too much
30:25
a way about the one that published yet, because we
30:27
wanted to go read it.
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Speaker 2: Yeah, she is kind of Her name is Mary Lou
30:35
and she's seventeen, and she basically is like a mix
30:40
of catnus and a normal girl. I would say, so
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she's very human is what I really wanted to narrow
30:53
in on with her, Like, she makes very major mistakes
30:58
that put a lot of people out right and has
31:02
to just deal with it, and so she is I
31:06
almost view her as like broken, like she's she is
31:10
searching for things like love and trying to make things right.
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She makes it worse, and then I was like, now
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what is she going to do to fix it? And
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that was pretty much the second half of the book
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is her contending with what she did and then also
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trying to fix it. And I wanted to have a
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main character like her who was making really bad mistakes
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even as the protagonist, like messing things up very completely,
31:45
and to see that she was forgiven is that I
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think is also a big theme of my book, is
31:55
that she was forgiven by the people that her mistake
32:00
hurt very badly or even like threatened their lives by
32:06
what she did. So it focused on also her being
32:12
able to accept that. So I wanted her to be
32:17
strong and make those tough decisions like Kinnis did, and
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be like physically a good She's like a fighter, she
32:25
has she knows how to do that conveniently, and but
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then she also has a lot of fears, a lot
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of flaws, and I, yeah, I just feel like she
32:39
is a good middle ground between like you're kind of
32:44
typical fantasy novel everyone and then a normal person who
32:50
would actually be experiencing these things and how they would react. Yeah.
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I just I want her to feel very human, and
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so she has cool parts about her. She's got yeah,
33:04
neat things, but then I would say she's mostly just
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normal and kind of messed up, and then she is
33:12
like loved anyway and forgiven anyway. So that was healing
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for me too.
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Speaker 1: Yeah. Well in your opinion, we as human beings, aren't
33:28
we all kind of messed up anyway?
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Speaker 2: Yeah?
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Speaker 1: And I say so, and then we all always her
33:36
likes and some like please forgive me for this uturistic ideas?
33:40
Mean I didn't really didn't need that, right, Yeah?
33:47
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely.
33:48
Speaker 4: Yeah.
33:53
Speaker 1: How does she relate to you?
33:58
Speaker 2: I would say, like the lengths she has to have,
34:04
I felt like I have just needed to be strong
34:09
and it's not been a choice, and that's definitely true
34:12
for her throughout the story, and I relate to her
34:19
also with like the fear of making a mistake and
34:25
kind of being paralyzed by that. But when that happens,
34:31
she ends up making it worse. So it's then, yeah,
34:38
interesting to see her mess up so bad and then
34:41
what ends up happening is not as bad as I
34:44
would have thought, so, and I can relate to that
34:47
personally where I mess up something and I've been like
34:52
surprised with how I have been forgiven. But yeah, mainly
34:59
that like that sense of strength, and it's from my
35:02
struggles with depression and moving and kind of just other
35:08
stuff in young adulthood seeing someone be strong but also
35:15
be human and yeah, messed up.
35:20
Speaker 1: Yeah, so it's your humanness help you write the books.
35:33
Speaker 2: I think it's probably the most helpful thing for me
35:36
because I've kind of been thinking about this lately too,
35:41
or I've had a lot of strong negative emotions and
35:46
feelings and things that have happened, but and I feel
35:50
things very strongly, which can be not good at times.
35:56
But then I was realizing, like, in order to write
36:00
books with the depth that I want and have them
36:04
make people feel to the extent that I want. I
36:07
think that I first have to be able to feel
36:10
the things I'm writing about, and so having the experiences
36:15
that I've had that have been negative, those have been
36:22
the most helpful because I know how to write like
36:26
despair and hopelessness and when everything seems like it can't
36:31
get better. I feel like that's where I'm the most
36:34
comfortable as a writer, and I think it makes my
36:41
stories more realistic because I can better relate to the
36:45
characters when they're going through something hard. Just the type
36:50
of stories that I write, they're more yeah, intense, high stakes,
36:53
so they're not usually super characters aren't very comfortable. Usually
36:59
through the story, they're facing things and trying to improve.
37:06
So I think, yeah, my experiences have been what's made
37:09
me able to write the types of books that I
37:12
want to write and want to read.
37:20
Speaker 1: So a lot of your audience is gonna look like you, Yeah,
37:25
that's my hope. Mhm, It's okay, because you know what
37:35
I'm gonna I'm gonna say this. I see in front
37:38
of me a very strong, loving a person in front
37:43
of me. So if we can create a whole bunch
37:47
of of that out of out of people in our world,
37:50
they ain't too bad always. Yeah, so yeah, hey, could
37:58
we're going to run out of soon? In your next
38:05
book that you're looking to publish, what does the plot
38:09
line look look like? For that.
38:13
Speaker 2: Plotline, it is mostly about mmm, I would say, like
38:22
questioning who's in charge. Broadly, it's basically a journey of
38:27
that between these two teenagers who are basically under control
38:34
of government and they It's kind of like in the
38:39
Hunger Games or the people who live in the capital
38:43
have been kind of disillusioned to what's happening outside of
38:46
the capital. So it's that similar vein. So it's coming
38:52
to the realization of what's actually going on and then
38:57
exploring what they're going to do about it. Got two
39:01
main characters in that story, so they both have different
39:05
reactions and yeah, it's it's one of those like who
39:10
started are you really on? At high stakes tough decisions again,
39:15
And it's also about learning about themselves for the characters
39:21
and like what, yeah, what they really stand for and
39:23
what they're willing to fight for.
39:28
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was one of the the big things that
39:35
I get out of the Hunger Games versus versus real
39:43
life was how are we going to stand it gets
39:50
those who want want to turn our government into something
39:54
that is weaponized against us, yeah, instead of something that
39:59
is there for us to work with us. Right. So yeah,
40:06
at that itself isn't too too bad an idea to
40:10
help get people thinking, hey, I can't have a Yeah,
40:17
well my surroundings, right, So yeah, it's something that you
40:24
hold valuable being able to protect what you love out
40:27
of your surrounding and change those things that you think
40:31
need to be changed.
40:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. So another bonus to writing is where you
40:38
feel like you really can't do that when in reality,
40:43
I don't feel like I always can, but I do try,
40:47
and that's important to me to fix things that I
40:51
think are being done to people that are not right. Yeah.
40:58
Speaker 1: Since we are on is at the forty minute pork
41:01
best ways to find your books?
41:04
Speaker 2: I would say Amazon right now it's called Gilded Evils,
41:09
and I am on Instagram. I'm wanting to be more
41:13
active in the new year. I can find it there,
41:17
but yeah, mostly Amazon is where I've got it right now.
41:21
Speaker 1: So yeah, second, let's make sure for all of our
41:26
are you say guilded to evil?
41:30
Speaker 2: Gilded Evils? Yeah, Okay, So.
41:58
Speaker 1: For all of you folks that do live in Canada,
42:01
you're probably gonna have to click over to the dot
42:04
conversion of Amazon, and for everybody who's listening in the
42:07
United States and dot com works perfectly well to find
42:12
Grace Obrid's book Gilded Evils, and look for her next book,
42:19
which is.
42:22
Speaker 2: Right now. It's called Cursive Saviors.
42:25
Speaker 1: So yeah, and of course, if you had the chance
42:29
to go on Instagram and and follow Grace, please do so.
42:35
I'll put links in the show notes so that we
42:40
can follow along and watch Grace's books blossom off the
42:45
page and into our imaginations. Grace, thanks for joining us.
42:53
You know, it's really good to beat you.
42:56
Speaker 2: Yeah, thanks for having me. This is one really great.
42:59
Speaker 1: All right, thank you for listening, everybody. We'll see you
43:01
next time.
43:03
Speaker 3: The bust to the back.
43:17
Speaker 5: So I don't know, so I wish you from the match, So.
43:36
Speaker 3: N listen, says.
43:47
Speaker 4: I'm reason, shake me back, chick, wh.
44:04
Speaker 3: You can't tres s wait.
44:09
Speaker 2: So wa.
44:43
Speaker 5: She go to st.
44:59
Speaker 2: Stup.
45:25
Speaker 1: The show has been produced by Depictions Media. Please contact
45:30
us at Depictions dot Media for more information.