Transcript

Jimmy · Recovery Chronicles

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Welcome to the Recovery Chronicles, where we dive deep into the inspiring journeys of
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individuals who have triumphs over adversity and found folk healing and resilience on the path
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to recovery from drugs and alcohol. We'll sit down with people who have embrace
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changed and emerged stronger than ever. Get ready to be uplifted, motivated,
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and empowered as we embark on a journey of healing, growth and possibilities.
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Welcome back to the Recovery chronal Coles, thank you for tuning in today.
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I have Jimmy who's here to share his amazing story of recovery. So thank
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you Jimmy for coming today. Yes, thank you Amanda for having me.
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What's up? What's up? What's up? World? So starting out,
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what is your drug of choice and how long have you been sober? Well?
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Drugs plural drugs of choice? For me, we're methinfetamine, alcohol,
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marijuana, pretty much any psychedelics and and cocaine and the street life and like
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the hustle life, street life that was that was definitely a drug. It
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was an addiction for sure, yep. And I have been sober for two
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and a half years. Amazing, It's it's been two and a half years.
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It was two and a half years April twenty eight. Awesome, that's
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amazing. Thank you. So take us back to where the using started.
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The using started, technically, I started. I smoked. I smoked weed
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for the first time when I was six years old with my cousin. That's
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young, and but like I didn't like keep smoking from that point on.
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But that was the very first time. The first time I drank alcohol,
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I was fourteen, and me and some friends we got drunk off of Boons
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Farm. It was like there's like six of us. I think we all
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just kind of pulled our money together, you know, And you know it
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is when you're young and you're just trying to get drunk, you know,
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like you just throw all your change together and you don't try to get as
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much booze as you can. You don't really care about the quality or what
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it is. Yeah, so we we got like nine bottles of Boon's Farm
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and binge drink that. You know, my very first time drinking was binge
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drinking. And where did it take off from there? Really about from fourteen,
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so that the very first time I got drunk like that. That's and
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before that, I had been smoking weed pretty pretty regularly, regularly basically seventh
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grade, seventh grade in Mandan. I'm old school. I'm old school Mandonian
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grew up in Mandan. Proud of it, you know, but yeah,
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Mandan Junior High that's where it started. You know, nothing against It's not
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that like it was Mandan's fault, but it's just you know, yeah,
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we like to party back then. Sure, Like what was the appeal for
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you or what did you like about it? I just like the way it
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made me feel. To be honest, you know, it wasn't until later
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on, like later in my life where when I got sober and I started
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seeking like mental health therapy, when I really started to like really really discovered
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that there was there were psychological and emotional reasons to why I used, but
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they were at a subconscious level, you know, like consciously, you know,
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I just wanted I just like the way it made me feel. I
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like the way being drunk made me feel. I like the way being high
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made me feel. You know, I wasn't necessarily doing it to escape anything,
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to escape any kind of like abuse or pain or you know, but
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yeah, I just like the way it made me feel. It made me
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feel confident and kind of care free. You know, because when I wasn't
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stoned or drunk, I was always in my head. I was very shy,
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low self esteem, not very outgoing, really just in my head a
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lot. And when I got drunk, it's like all that noise was quieted
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and I had confidence and I was outspoken, and I was like a social
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butterfly, you know, the complete opposite of how I was when I was
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sober. I didn't like how I was when I was sober, but I
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liked how how I was when I was drunk. You know. Now only
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did I feel good about liked how I was. I liked how I was
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interacting with people. I liked how sure of myself I was. I liked
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how care free I was, you know, I was just I felt like
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I was more of an exciting person when I was drunk. That's just alcohol.
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With weed, I was very calm and I was relaxed. I was
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happy. It was very soothing. It wasn't until, like I said,
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when I got sober and I started going to mental health therapy, that I
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that my can I give a shout out to somebody Okay, I want to
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shout out shout out to Patrick Joyce. It was my first therapist. But
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he asked me, I'd rather talk to him like how we made me feel?
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You know, It's like, what does we do for you? How
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does it make you feel? And he said and I told him, like,
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you know just what I said. You know, it relaxed me as
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souths me. It calms me down, It makes me happy, you know.
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And and I won't go like to a store or I won't go anywhere
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public until unless I smoke weed first, you know. And he said,
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do you think that maybe you've been self medicating depression and anxiety with marijuana?
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And I was like no, but yeah, you know, yeah, but
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he was spot on. Though he was spot on, and that's when I
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was like, well, I was like, jeez, I wonder what else
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I've been like medical self medicating. What other psychological disorders have I been self
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medicating with drugs? Is it maybe possible that my drug use and my alcoholism
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went beyond just the feel of it, were there's subconscious forces driving this,
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you know? That was that was a real eye opener and that's what really
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like propelled me and to keep going into mental health therapy, which is something
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I still do to this day. So it's been it's been over two years
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now. Wow. Yeah. When you were talking about the benefits or what
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you liked about the alcohol and weed, I kind of the thought went through
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my head of like, well then why stop. I mean, it sounds
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great, right, yeah, but I'm assuming there is a point in your
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life where it wasn't great anymore. So you talked about also using you know,
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meth and cocaine and all of those things. So where how did that
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happen? Or methan fetamine started when I was sixteen, So when I was
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sixteen, it was the year two thousand, you know, it was a
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while ago. But back in the year two thousand, it's when crystal meth
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when they started, they started to crystallize method fetamine. Before that, it
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was methodphetamine, was just it was powder form known as crank. You know.
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When they started to crystallize it, it took the nation by storm.
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You know, it was two to three times as opponent as the powder form,
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and you know, just that just as that much addictive, more addictive
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too, you know, and it was it was an actual it was a
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nationwide epidemic comparable to what the opioid crisis crisis is now, except back then,
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people weren't dying like the very heartbreaking and disturbing way that they are today.
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But I mean they were doing news you know, Dateline, you know,
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NBC whatever, you know, all kinds of news specials about crystal meth.
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You know, it was an actual nationwide epidemic back then. I started
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when I was sixteen, and I struggled with crystal meth from the time that
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I started when I was sixteen until I've been sober for two and a half
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years. I'm thirty. I just turned thirty nine. So from sixteen to
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thirty seven. Wow, I struggled twenty years. Yeah, two decades off
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and on meth. You know. I would have periods of where I wasn't
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on it, but I was still doing other things. I was still drinking
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and smoking weed and doing coke and doing Mollie and doing X you know,
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and psychedelics, but I wasn't doing math. Yeah, So I would consider
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myself sober, so sober so to speak, because I wasn't doing like my
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my drug of choice that was completely destructive. I could do all those other
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things and I could maintain a job, I could maintain an apartment, you
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know, my own place. You know, I was relatively a law abiding
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citizen. But when I you know, as soon as I start doing meth,
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I just lose everything quick fast. Yeah, and not just everything,
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but I go to being a criminal, you know as well. You know,
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so that crystal meth is by far the most destructive thing for me,
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you know, but you know even that, Okay, so that too.
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You know, when I would do math, it calmed me down, it
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relaxed me. I didn't. I wasn't the kind of a person who would
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do math and like just take off and go like like I would. I
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would sit there. It was soothing to me. You know. Well that
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I did like a little research about ADHD and ADD, you know, and
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about how you know, like they give people who have ADHD stimulants you know,
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ridlin, and it calms them down. Someone who doesn't have ADHD or
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ADD takes the same stimulant, it hypes them up. You know. So
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then then again there you know, like a psychological disorder that had been self
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medicating, you know, that kind of goes beyond like, yeah, I
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like the way it maybe feel, but overall, was soothing, you know,
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you know, and these are things that I wouldn't have realized or really
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kind of like dug into unless I had gotten sober and you know, started
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getting to mental health therapy, which was that by complete accident. We were
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we were at West Central, you know, and I was doing services there
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with on drug court and they're shifting to Heartview, and so our group got
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busted into just individual meetings with the counselor. Yeah, and that's how I
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met, you know, Patrick, when I went with Patrick, you know,
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and then that's where we're talking about my usage history, how it began,
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why I did it, you know, and then he kind of opened
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my eyes to help me realize that, you know, there's probably some psychological
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reasons why you did the things you did. You know. Yeah, so
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you said drug court and treatment. What was kind of the final straw what
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broke the camel's back that you ended up being in drug court and treatment.
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The straw that broke the camel's back was the last time that I that I
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got arrested. My sobriety date is October twenty eighth of twenty two, twenty
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one, So October twenty seventh of twenty twenty one. I got arrested at
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at a hotel here in a Bismarck. Yeh names, but it's a it's
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a very notorious hotel for illegal activity. But anyways, I got I got
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some pretty serious charges there, and like your room just got raided, or
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a room that I was that got raided, a room that I was that
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got raided, and there were there was myth, there was weed, and
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nobody wanted to claim like there's like six of us if I remember correctly,
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six of us in the room. Nobody wanted to claim the myth right,
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so they just charged us all with it. Okay, but there was baggies
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and a scale with the myth, and so that's conspiracy. Yeah, to
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distribute the controlled substance, it's teken. The charge was a conspiracy to possess
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a controlled substance with the attempt to deliver. So it's a class to be
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felony. The possible max for that is ten years in prison. And then
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I got the marijuana charge and that was that who was the possible max of
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five So altogether I was looking at the possble max of fifteen years in prison.
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Wow, I've been in prison where there is your first charge. No,
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obviously, Yeah I had now before this, I had had been to
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prison twice, wow, two and a half years each time, you know.
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You know, so this was gonna be my third time going back.
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Yeah, there was really no way out of this, you know. And
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I was sitting in jail at Brilly Morton Detention Center and I finally like took
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accountability. You know, I have a problem. Yeah, I am the
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problem. Yeah, this is my fault. I'm going to do this again
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to my family. And you know, I tell you it wasn't so much
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the time, Like, you know, what's messed up is that, like
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I've been to prison twice in county jail. I don't you know how many
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times I've been in county jail. I can do time. And that's not
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like I don't that's not I'm not trying to brag about that, but it's
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just it's a fact. It's I can do time. Some people can do
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time, some people can't. I can do time. And after the first
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time I went to prison, I realized that, you know, I'm someone
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who does well in structure. I'm someone who does well like, oh,
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there was just routines, you know, you know, so like my routine
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was, you know, work out, play cards, reading my books,
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watch my TV programs, you know, repeat, repeat, repeat, you
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know, and and I was good. I was cool with that, you
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know. You know. And in the prison system here in North Dakota isn't
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crazy violent, you know, so it's like, excuse me, it's not
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a hard place to do time. But anyways, I didn't want to do
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that to my family. Again. I didn't want to put my mom through
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that. Again. I didn't want to. You know, this is before
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I became my dad, you know. So like my nephews, like I
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love them like my kids, you know, and they're they're getting older,
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you know, they were getting older, and they were starting to understand things
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and what kind of people go to jail, and you know, so I
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just didn't want to put my family through that. And I I tell myself
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that if I get another if I can just get another chance in my life.
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Like I don't I don't know if I was talking to God, I
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don't know, but I was just like, I just want another chance at
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my life. And if I get another chance at my life, not only
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am I going to stay sober, but I'm going to live the best life
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that I that I possibly can. I didn't know what that was going to
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look like. I had never been completely sober, you know, other than
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being in prison. You know, I'd never been completely sober. So I
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didn't even know what a sober life was going to look like. What do
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sober people do? What? You know? I was like, I used
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to think, I'm like, what are sover people? Do? You know
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what I mean? Like my life had just been partying, smoking weed,
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working, you know, jobs here and there, you know, jobs were
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it's just like the working staff where they all drank and smoked. Me too,
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you know. I was in the food service industry, you know,
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so it's like a party, you know, workforce. Everybody partied, you
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know, so cool, that's my lifestyle anyway. You know. So my
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life had been a whole, like been a big party from fourteen to thirty
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seven. Yeah, that's over too, that's the LA's two decades. You
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know, I'm literally half my life. I'm not even forty years old yet,
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right, you know, so like half my life has been spent partying.
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And so I had no idea what any of it was going to look
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like, you know, but I knew that I wanted to be sober.
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I knew that my drug addiction was a problem at the time, I still
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wasn't thinking my alcoholism was a problem though, right, Alcoholism what landed me
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in jail. Alcohol was what landed me in prison. Alcoholism what caused me
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to lose all of my my my values and my principles and my morals and
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you know, become Alcoholism was wasn't what caused me to become a liar,
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cheat, a thief, a con artist, a manipulator, all these things
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I hated about myself and my addiction. It was it was meth that caused
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me to do that. So I had a meth problem. Therefore I had
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a drug problem. Right. You know, I still didn't think I was
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like an alcoholic, and I didn't think alcohol was a problem. That didn't
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come until way later, until I got out and I got involved in an
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A start working the steps with a sponsor. We go, we start going
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to the Big Book, and you know what makes an alcoholic? You know,
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according to the Big Book. And I was like, oh, yeah,
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okay, well maybe I am an alcoholic. I didn't think I was
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though, to me, an alcoholic was before I got involved in a to
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me, an alcoholic was like somebody who slept on the bridge, you know,
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a drink, bottle of paper bag or pan for a change to go
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to liquor store. To me, that was an alcoholic. I just saw
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myself as like I just liked to have fun, you know, party.
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So you're in jail and you have this epiphany of Okay, I want to
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not be doing this anymore. So what do you do? So I started
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applying for you know, like I said, I had been to prison twice.
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I've been to jail a bunch of times, and I knew that there
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were programs that could get you out of jail, you know. So I
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started applying to them, you know, Team Adult, Team, Challenge,
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Hope Manner, and Drug Court, and I ended up getting into Drug Court.
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So how did you hear about those programs or what inspired you to apply
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for them or did you just kind of know? Do they just have applications
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hanging out in jail? Well, they have a lot of They have applications
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for everything in jail. Okay, that's for all these programs. Yeah,
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for these programs. They have all these you know they have I will say
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this about our detention center here in Burley They do have a lot of sources
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and information for people who want help, if they want help. If you
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want to you know, if you want to get into sober living, they
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got applications for that. If you want to get into Adult and Teen Challenge
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Hope Manner, drug Court, you know they got they have applications for that.
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Yeah you know, so you filled out applications for you, said,
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Drug Court, Teen Challenge Hope Manner. Yeah, okay, yeah, so
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my Okay, so I actually got the I got a reply from Adult Team
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Challenge. First, they had a bed open for me and they were gonna
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accept me. I call my PO. Excuse me. I call my PO
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and she's like, well, I think you should get into I think you
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try to get into drug Court. And I was like okay. So,
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so I mentioned that I'd been to prison once before, okay, or twice
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twice. The first time was because I got kicked out of drug court.
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I had been in drouble. Okay. So I had been in drug court
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before. Okay, So you were hesitant. Yeah, I was tessited because
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I knew everything that drug court want. I just knew. I knew.
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I was like, I don't know, man, I like, look I
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want to get sober, but I'm like, I don't know if I want
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to go under all that, right, you know. Yeah, And but
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I knew that if I completed drug Court, if I got accepted into drug
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Court and I completed it, that my charges I was facing out there would
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be dropped, you know, which is amazing. Which is amazing. You
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known a shout out to drug Court too, you know, the whole the
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whole drug court team, you know, the judge. That program is an
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amazing program. It is. And you know, if you want to get
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your life together and you don't want to live being a slave to your addiction
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or your alcoholism anymore, and you got some legal trouble that you got yourself
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into because of those you know, afflictions, that's that's a two birds,
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one stone streak right there. Yeah, you know, and it's like it's
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this amazing opportunity for people. You know, the first time I didn't have
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that, I didn't have that mindset. I was still trying to just you
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know, do my thing and just get out of prison and kind of do
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things on the sneak. I wasn't trying to be sober. I was just
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trying to get out of prison the first time, and it showed. You
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know, the thing about drug court is like it catches up to you.
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You know, you you think you can, Like I remember thinking like I
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could get away with everything, you know, but like those people are like
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professionals at what they do, and they hurt it all. Yep, they've
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heard it all between the judge and like the state's attorney. They got cops
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on their team, they got parole performation officers on the team, they got
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treatment counselors on their team, and it's all one whole drug court team.
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And between all those people and all their experienced, all their education, like,
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you're not getting away with nothing. You're not gonna I always said that
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people in drug court too. I said, you will get caught, You
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will get you will get caught regardless. I don't care matter what. I
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don't care for. It's something that like you're you're doing in person, something
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you're doing on Facebook, like you're gonna get caught. You're gonna get caught.
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You can't, no, you can't, not not in drug court.
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That really brings things to surface, you know, and then they're able to
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weed out people real quick, real quick. So yeah, that's so I
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had knew about drug Court my and then my probation officer, uh suggested that
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I go to it. And I was like, Okay, I guess I
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mean, I do want to be sober and I do have some pretty serious
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legal troubles. Funny story, So when I got arrested at the sorry,
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let's drop the name. When I got arrested at the hotel in Bismarck where
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I got my charges, okay, uh, that I was facing fifteen years
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in prison for it was it was. It was by a team of probation
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officers. I had never seen that before. You know, I had a
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pretty I had a pretty extensive criminal life, and I've seen a lot of
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different facets of law enforcement, you know what I mean, from undercovers,
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the task force and what whatever. You know what I mean. I had
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never seen a team of probation officers kicking in a hotel room door. You
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know, it was new to me. But anyways, one of the probation
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officers who kicked that door in and who arrested me just so happened to be
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one of the probations She she was the probation officer. She is the probation
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officer for drug court. Shout out to Tash Nago. Yes, yeah,
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shout out to Tash. Yeah, she was really nice. She was nice
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that day when I got arrested. She was the only one who gave me
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a drink of water. As I've said, the being handcuffed. But when
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they called me to the door, I knew I was getting get interviewed by
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the drug court probation officer. And so when they called me to the door,
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I couldn't see. It was because inside the jail up proably more attention
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than there for all of those all those of you who have been there.
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It's reflective glass. You can't see outside, but they can see inside.
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So the door opens and there's Tush. I was like, oh, hey,
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Hi, Hey, how's it going, you know? And she's like
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hey, So we sit down and we have the interview of you know,
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of what could be required of of meet in drug court and if it's something
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I still want to do so but yeah, and I actually had I had
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two weeks. I stayed in really more in attention center for two extra weeks
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because I wanted to get out into halfway house once I was accepting to drug
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court. When you're accepting to drug court, you're property of the state,
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and you can they can place you wherever they see fit, if it's with
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family, as long as they approve it, check it out, you know,
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halfway house or sober living. And my plan was go to BTC or
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Mandane Center. But Mandane Center was three months out from an open bed and
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BTC was two weeks from having having an open bed, and so I just
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asked if I could to stay in jail until a bed opened up. I
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mean that's pretty big. Yeah, most people don't want to stay there.
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Yeah, So that's telling of where your mindset was at. I think,
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you know, yeah, you get out of jail, you go to BTC.
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Then what mm hmm, Well I'm in drug court and BTC. Okay,
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so I go. I go to BTC and there's there's a lot of
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there were a lot of things happening there at that time that like it wasn't
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really conducive to like the type of life that I was trying to live,
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you know, I was trying to live sober, law abiding life, you
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know, and I was just there was just a lot of activity there that
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I wasn't supporting that. You know, when you're in drug court, you
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know, so I'm not I'm not happy at BTC when I'm there, you
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know, but I don't really see a way out of it, you know,
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And I have to be there because I'm in drug court, you know,
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till you get my own players. But when you're in drug court,
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you get voluntold to do things activities. Voluntold is you volunteering, but you're
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being told to volunteer, and so it's in other words mandatory, but I
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like to call it volunteld. We get voluntard to do a lot of things
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in drug court. But one of the activities that we got volunteld to participate
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in was the Santa Run. And you know, the Santa Run is a
25:18
it's a sober event sponsored by RAD, which is an acronym stands for Runners
25:25
Against Dangerous Decisions, started by a judge, David Reich, and a bunch
25:30
of people just get dressed up as Santa Claus and they either run or walk
25:36
around the state capitol once a year, you know, in support of people
25:40
in recovery and sobriety. And but anyways, we have to go, you
25:44
know, because I'm in drug court, like you gotta go volunteer, volunteld
25:48
volunteld of volunteer. So I go there and there's other there's other entities there
25:52
too, you know, other programs there too, on participating sober livings are
25:56
there. And I see a friend of mine who who I had used with
26:00
for over ten years each time I went to prison. We were in prison
26:04
together. We were in halfway houses together where he went to jail together.
26:10
Like we're in the streets together, like I knew this dude, like like
26:14
my only history with him was was through addiction and criminal life. And I
26:19
see him there and he's sober, yeah, and he's healthy and I've never
26:25
seen him sober or healthy looking before. And he's happy, you know,
26:30
I mean like he sees me and I see him, and we give each
26:33
other a big hug, you know, and you know, how's everything going?
26:37
Man? Could to see you? I haven't seen it, you know.
26:38
We haven't seen each other since Fargo, you know, which is where
26:41
I was before I before I got busted. And he asked me where I'm
26:45
at. I s know, I'm in I'm at BTC. And he's like,
26:48
how's how's that? And I said, well, it's it's in BTC,
26:52
you know how it is. And he's like, you should come where
26:57
I'm at. I said where that. He's like, I'm at Hope Manor.
27:03
And I was like I heard of it. I was like, what
27:07
is it like sober? What is it again? He's like, it was
27:08
like a sober house, right, He's like, well, it's a sober
27:11
living house. He said. It's real strict. He's got a lot of
27:14
rules. It's strict, he said, But he said, you know,
27:18
it's we're like a family there. We have like a lot of camaraderie.
27:22
We support each other, we build each other up. Man. He's like,
27:25
it's a great it's a great thing to be a part of. You
27:26
should come apply. We got four beds open. So I'm like, well,
27:30
okay, oh, anything to get out of where I was, you
27:34
know, So I apply. I meet with I meet with Megan Man.
27:41
Shout out to Megan Man, lots of shout outs. Yeah. So I
27:47
meet with Megan Man and she she very very patiently and goes through like all
27:57
the rules and requirements of holl Manor. And it is a lot. There's
28:03
an extensive like little it's like a thick little pack at the contract, you
28:07
know, and you sign a commitment for how long you're going to be in
28:10
there, and I sign up. I sign it, and I signed up
28:17
for a three months commitment and I go to Hope Manor. But yeah,
28:22
I was in for Rude Awakening. You know. When I got there,
28:26
it was strict. Yeah, but I my friend didn't mention anything about meetings,
28:33
AA meetings, NA meetings. You know, I wanted to be sober,
28:40
but at this time, you know, I I felt like I could
28:47
just be if I I can think my way into better living. You know,
28:52
I don't need support groups. I don't need church. I don't need
29:00
anything other than my own self will to get sober and stay sober. That's
29:03
how naive and arrogant my mentality was back then. I used to look down
29:08
on people who needed those things. I wasn't treatment because I had to be.
29:14
You know, I was in drug court, I had to take chemical
29:17
email. You gotta go to a treatment or whatever they say. You know,
29:19
I didn't think I needed to be in treatment. I didn't think I
29:22
needed that. If I made the decision to be sober, I can stay
29:25
sober on my own. I don't need nobody else. I'll need no help.
29:27
I need no support. You know, this is how arrogant and naive
29:32
my thinking was back then. So when I get to Hope Manor and I
29:36
find out I have to go to seven meetings a week. They can need
29:40
to be a or ana, but you have to go to seven week and
29:44
have a job if you have a job and you work twenty hours that week
29:48
at that job. If you don't have a job, or you work less
29:51
than twenty hours a week at your job, then you have to go to
29:56
fourteen. And they regulate that very well. You have to bring in your
30:02
clock out slips, you know, they tell you up all the hours.
30:04
There's a there's a meeting card that you get signed for every meeting you go
30:08
to. You have to write the date, your name, the date of
30:12
the meeting, what meeting it was, and the person who chairs that meeting
30:15
has to sign off on it. And you have you turn that card in
30:18
every Thursday. So this is all very monitored, you know, no,
30:26
no, and it just so happens. I'm in so now. So now
30:29
I'm in Hope Manor and I'm in drug court. So now I'm in in
30:32
two programs where there's a lot of rules, a lot of structure, a
30:37
lot of accountability, accountability was major life changing for me, you know,
30:44
because I didn't take accountability for anything ever. I didn't have I didn't have
30:48
to, you know, I did what I wanted, I broke the law,
30:51
I went to prison, didn't care about those consequences. You know,
30:53
whatever, run it. You know. If I got a fat commisary,
30:56
yeah, I'll go back, you know what I mean. They got a
30:59
dope weight room out there, any and you know, and they'll play cards
31:00
with the boys again. And they got access to the whole library of the
31:03
State Library, you know. So I didn't have to take accountability for anything,
31:07
you know. So, but that was really hard for me, being
31:11
in drug court, being in a whole manner because they made it to where
31:18
if you were having a consequence, it is your fault. And in drug
31:23
court you go before an actual judge every Friday, you know, and before
31:29
you even sit down, they had a they have a staffing with all with
31:33
with the whole drug court team. You got, you got your po you
31:37
got you got treatment representatives from West Central and Hartview, you got the judge,
31:41
you got the prosecutor, you got the the cops who were actually on
31:45
the team. And then then there's there's attorneys too on the team, you
31:49
know, and so like this whole drug court team staff your case every week
31:56
before drug court, so they know everything that happened, everything that you that
32:01
like you think they don't know, they know, and everything that you know
32:06
that they know they know. And then then they discussed all that and then
32:09
Friday comes, so before you even go sit down in front of the judge,
32:13
they know how your week's been. They know it's up yep, you
32:16
know. And they hold you accountable for everything for all of your actions are
32:22
in actions, you know, and they don't put up with excuses. I
32:28
didn't understand the purpose of that at first, because I thought it was just
32:34
more authority, more control, you know. But I had lived a life
32:37
of being unaccountable, you know, and I shouldn't say I shouldn't say that,
32:44
you know, like my mom held me accountable for my actions, you
32:47
know, in like childhood. But I'm talking from like fourteen seventeen and after,
32:52
like the older I got, the more wild I got. Right,
32:55
two decades of using you didn't have any idea. Two decades of using a
32:59
party had no accountability whatsoever, not even not like even with myself, though
33:06
with my actions and my behaviors and my attitude. I had no self accountability
33:10
and no accountability anywhere else in the world. It was just not existent.
33:14
So when I get when I'm in drug court and I'm in whole manner,
33:16
Hope Manner is the same way too. You know, you know, they
33:21
teach you accountability. They teach accountability by having these rules and these guidelines and
33:28
these requirements. You can follow through, you can you know, you can
33:31
do these things or you're going to be They're going to be addressed while you
33:37
didn't do them. They're going to hold you accountable and they're not going to
33:42
take your excuse. They're not going to take your That's that's the thing about
33:44
Hope Maner too. Okay, So Hope Manner. So Judith Roberts and Megan
33:45
Man at this time we're running Hope Manner. Okay. So, and they're
33:53
they're they're in recovery as well too, long term. They've been long term,
33:58
long term recovery. You know, you know what people in recovery is
34:01
is that they have used all the excuses and the lies and the manipulation and
34:08
all the stuff that you're using. They've done that before to other people.
34:12
In their lives, right, So like Judith wasn't putting up with any of
34:15
it, Megan wasn't putting up with any of it. Drug Court's not putting
34:19
up with and I And here I thought, okay, well these are two
34:22
separate things though, so like I'm pretty sure I can get away with some
34:24
stuff here at hold manner that they're not gonna find out about drug court.
34:28
No turns out Tasha my drug court PO and Judith and Meghan they know each
34:32
other on a first day basis. They have each other's phone numbers, they
34:35
talk regularly, so they do it. They do everything, you know,
34:43
and they teach you accountability by having these these rules and these requirements to be
34:49
successful in these programs. But they can't. They can't like walk with you,
34:57
you know, and hold your hand. Here's where you be accountable.
35:00
Okay, here's where you be responsible. You no, like here it is
35:02
there, this is what's required of you. You're an adult. Do it.
35:07
If you're not going to there's going to be consequences. They call them
35:13
consequences in drug court and in Hope manner, not punishment, because and I
35:21
didn't understand either. There's so much like you know, when I was first
35:23
got sober, I didn't realize like how much of not just like my addiction,
35:29
but how much of recovery is psychological, you know. I didn't really
35:32
I didn't realize that making my bed every day, making sure my room is
35:37
clean, having a chore at the house at Hope manner, signing off,
35:43
and all these chores. There's a sign in, sign out poart. Anytime
35:46
you leave, you sign out what time are you leaving, where are you
35:50
going, what's the address? How did you how are you going to get
35:52
there? How are you coming back? What's your eta? And then you
35:58
come back, you write the time in that you came back, and then
36:00
you you initial it. Sign in, sign out board. I thought I
36:04
was stupid. You know, if you don't do it right, there's a
36:08
consequence for that. Why do you think they made you do all those things?
36:14
It was teaching me responsibility. It was teaching me to plan my day.
36:17
It was teaching me to plan and manage my time. These are like,
36:22
these are like and the little things I never did, I never done
36:24
before in my life, you know, but the exception of having to be
36:28
to work, which I always went to work like late, you know,
36:30
walking the stone, you know. I mean, I mean I was a
36:32
cook, you know, at a restaurant, you know, so I was
36:34
like, no big deal, you know, but it was teaching me accountability,
36:37
responsibility, time management, and how to plan my life out. How
36:40
long did you push try and push back on that? I a while,
36:47
So a while. I was kind of like I was the problem child in
36:52
Hope manner for for about the first month. The first month, you know,
37:00
I was masked and manipulator, and I was trying to manipulate and dodge
37:07
and play play dumb like no, you know, and it just wasn't it
37:12
wasn't. They weren't buying any of it. Consequences, Yeah, nobody was
37:15
buying names. I had all these consequences, consequences, consequences, and it
37:19
was their fault at first, you know, at first it was their fault,
37:22
you know, And it was I remember being frustrated because I was like,
37:30
I have all these consequences when you when you do you like a small
37:38
infraction. So there's like there's like different levels of consequences at Hope Matter.
37:43
So like the very first one, the lowest level of consequences called a book
37:46
report, So you you pick the the a book is called it's called the
37:52
Big Book. You know, there's personal stories in the back of that.
37:57
In any narcoticstonymous their book is called the it's referred to as the basic text.
38:04
Just personal stories in the back of that one to them. So you
38:06
can pick a personal story or of either the AA book or the NA book,
38:09
and you write a one page report about that story and how that story
38:15
relates to an experience in your life. Stupid, more control, right,
38:19
And I'm thinking dumb, you know, like why why you know, I
38:22
don't understand why if I left my coffee cup on the table, now I
38:28
have to read this stupid story out of this book and apply it to my
38:30
life. Dumb? Why like why does it have to be like you know,
38:36
the coffee cup is that is that is me being held accountable the coffee
38:43
cups. All the cups are supposed to be rented out and put away after
38:45
you use them. I forgot What did I forget? Because I was in
38:50
a hurry. Why I was in a hurry because I wasn't planning my life
38:52
out. I wasn't planning my day. Accountability, accountablity, accountability. So
38:59
I'm reading the I'm doing these book reports and I think I did, probably
39:05
it did probably like five before it really clicked the purpose of them. This
39:10
one particular story really really resonated with an experience in my life during my addiction,
39:19
and it really got me thinking about where my life was and where my
39:23
life is now. You know, Am I in this really strict sober living
39:29
house. Yes? Are there a lot of rules? Yes? Do I
39:30
agree with and of them? No? But you know what, I'm sober
39:37
and I'm not breaking the law. And it really that really kind of helped
39:42
to chip away that that heardheadedness that I always had, you know, when
39:45
I was able to start seeing things from a different perspective, a different lens,
39:50
you know, who knew? Maybe that's why they have you do these
39:54
book reports. Interesting, maybe there's a psychological reason until I do. It
40:00
was therapeutic for me, you know, you know, like a light went
40:05
off, you know, light bulb in my head and you went up.
40:07
Who knew? You know? So I did the book reports and I start
40:12
having a change of attitude. Then the hardest part for me was my was
40:16
my mentality, my psychic change. In the Big Book of a Toy talk
40:20
about having a complete psychic change is required. You know, I had to
40:22
have a complete psychic change my attitude, my perspective, my behavior, my
40:30
reaction to things, which is all askewte you know, I was hard headed,
40:37
and I was a criminal, you know, who didn't care about consequences
40:39
and who took no accountability, you know. So I was just I was
40:43
just a wreck, you know, as far as a wreck of a person
40:45
mentally, you know. And I had to change all that, you know,
40:50
and none of it came easy, you know. And but I think,
40:52
I truly believe and I know that I needed both Drug Court and Hope
40:58
Manner at the same time. To do one of those programs on their own
41:04
is hard, but to do both at the same time, was it was
41:10
extremely hard. Once you submitted, was it as hard? Yeah? No,
41:20
So once I submitted, so like, once I was, the more
41:22
I started to change my attitude and my behavior. Really my perspective, you
41:29
know, really my perspective of like and my perception of things, of the
41:37
situation of situations, you know, life on life terms, you know.
41:43
Hope Manner and Droll Court was life on life terms, man like, you
41:49
know. And but once I was able to see from the perspective of like
41:54
what this is you know, droll court is an opportunity to get your life
41:59
back. You want to roll the dice and being another was that recidifist,
42:04
you know, and then just go back to prison, you know, and
42:07
keep doing the same thing. Yeah, you can do time. Is that
42:10
what you want to do. I remember being in prison the first time,
42:13
and like guys had talked about like this was the fourth time, fifth time,
42:15
sixth time, seventh time in and I remember thinking to myself, like
42:20
what are you doing? You know, and here I had went to before
42:23
I knew it, I had already did to stints in prison, bought to
42:25
do a third you know. Drug court was an opportunity to not only get
42:34
my life together, but to get my life back, get my freedom back.
42:38
My freedom was on the line. You know, you have to plead
42:42
guilty to get into drug court, whatever your chargers are that you're facing.
42:46
There's an actual court hearing that happens with the state's attorney and your attorney and
42:52
the judge. And they had, you know, the states attorney has to
42:54
even agree to like let you have a chance at your life. They could
42:59
say no, and then you don't get into drug court. You know,
43:00
the states attorney has to agree to that you have another chance of your life
43:04
being in drug court, you know, so my freedom is on the line,
43:07
you know. But drug court it wasn't all just about freedom either.
43:09
Was they were teaching me accountability and responsibility as well, you know, and
43:16
and whole manner was was teaching me the same thing. You know. But
43:22
once I stopped fighting so much, and once I stopped trying to find a
43:29
loophole and everything and trying to manipulate and con my way out of people who
43:34
were too smart to be conned and manipulated. You know, on one side
43:37
you have people in recovery. You know, jud doesn't make it okay.
43:42
So like my my lies, my manipulation and my Connie wasn't going to war
43:50
and there playing the dumb you know, uh uh baby deer in the woods
43:54
was it wasn't going to work on them. And the same thing with with
43:59
with drug court because there you got lawyers, prosecutors off you know, cops,
44:02
probation officers, a judge you know, treatment counselors you know, so
44:08
it's not going to work on them either, you know. So I couldn't
44:12
finagle my way out of anything. Yeah, well it sounds like it was
44:15
taking any more effort to try and finagle your way out of things than it
44:19
was to just do it. Yeah. Yeah, because like you know,
44:22
there's a there's a there's a level of defeat that comes with that came with
44:25
me, you know, once I figured it out that I couldn't finagle.
44:29
You know, well, now, now now like I have to admit defeat.
44:31
Okay, So then then I have a bad attitude about that. That
44:35
might be resentful about that. Yeah, you know. Okay, so now
44:37
that gives me with the ammunition to have bad attitude about it, you know.
44:43
And as I wrote that for a little bit too, you know.
44:46
But slowly, yeah, slowly things started, things started to change, and
44:52
I was able to change my I was able to have that psychic change.
44:55
You know, I don't think, I know, it wasn't just on my
45:00
my own, you know. I I truly believe then and to this day
45:05
that that my higher power. I don't know how else I was able to
45:10
get through all that. The old me would have just said, tech with
45:15
all this, I'm gone, I'm not doing this. I'll just you know,
45:20
I'll just roll the dice on prison again. I don't want to go
45:22
to meetings. I don't want to get a sponsor. I don't want to
45:25
make my bed. I don't want to do a book a port Okay.
45:29
Like I don't want to go to treatment. I don't. I didn't want
45:30
to do any of this stuff. I just wanted to be sober. Many
45:34
you know, I don't need you. I was like, I don't need
45:36
you to tell me how to do it, you know, but we know
45:39
that you have to do all those things. Yeah, yeah, I'm so
45:43
I'm so grateful that like all the people in drug court and all the people
45:46
at Hope mannor you know, and Judith and Meghan were so patient with me.
45:50
They're they're patient with me, and and and and loving with me,
45:54
you know, because I did not make it easy. I didn't. I
45:58
know, I didn't make it easy for them, you know. But as
46:00
time went on and I and I surrendered, you know, and and I
46:04
didn't see that surrendering. Okay, Well, let me just you know,
46:07
what all I ever did was just break the rules and find loopholes. Let's
46:13
try following the rules for once. Maybe, Jimmy, just like how addiction
46:17
and alcoholism is a problem for you, Maybe your attitude is a problem.
46:25
Maybe the way you're perceiving things is a problem as well. Maybe your whole
46:30
thinking is a problem, probably the root of the whole whole everything, you
46:36
know, and mind blowing. And when yeah, and when I realized that,
46:40
because that's not, like you said, that's not something that's easy to
46:43
like swallow, you know, because you think it back, you think,
46:45
okay, well, if that's the case, plan take back my whole life.
46:50
There is not all my faults. That was more again, more accountability.
46:55
You know, it takes courage to be accountable, to hold yourself accountable
46:59
for you, you know, it's it's something that you know, I'm I'm
47:04
so grateful that that whole manner and drug Crest taught me that at that level,
47:07
because you know what, things didn't get easier just because I stayed sober.
47:15
You know, it wasn't so I heard this girl this meeting one time.
47:20
I'm gonna say it whatever. She's like, she's like, it's not
47:22
all rainbows and stripping litter, but but anyways, it's it's just it's it
47:29
didn't it didn't just get easier life to get easier because I got sober.
47:32
It got more meaningful, more beautiful, more amazing, more promiseful, bountiful
47:42
than I could ever imagined. But it didn't It didn't mean that, like
47:46
there was never going to be any hard times. There didn't mean that I
47:51
was never going to be not be stressed out still make mistakes, you know,
47:58
like before you get sober, what do you when you're able to actually
48:01
admit? For me? Anyways, I'm speaking from my own experience here too,
48:05
everybody out there, I just felt like, Okay, if I get
48:09
sober, everything is gonna work out. If addiction and alcoholism is my problem,
48:15
if those are removed, then there will be no problems. Life will
48:17
have no problems. There will be no problems in life because there's two biggest
48:22
things. And at the time these two things are my alcoholism and my addiction,
48:27
are seemingly insurmountable. I had lived over two decades like this, you
48:30
know. So if I can get past these two mountains and create this whole
48:36
new life for myself and sobriety, whatever that looks like, then everything is
48:40
going to be smooth sailing from here on out. You know. That's what
48:44
I thought anyways, you know, but reality hits, you know, and
48:49
then that that that that life is life, and there there are ups and
48:52
downs, you know, there's ebb and flow. You know. It's not
48:57
that it's not that sobriety sober life is hard. Life can be hard in
49:00
general, you know. And that was another thing too, that that I
49:06
had to realize. You know, it's not that sobriety is so hard,
49:09
you know, it's that it's that life can be hard, you know.
49:15
And but I I've had the guidance of amazing sponsors. You know, I
49:21
have a sponsor in A in n A, and I have a sponsor in
49:23
A, And I've been blessed with having such a strong support system with my
49:30
recovery community. From this recovery community and this and this, these sponsors who
49:36
I met going to these meetings that I didn't want to go to that I
49:39
didn't think I needed, that I thought were for weak minded week world people.
49:45
You know, I meet these sponsors, these two, these two men
49:47
in my life, you know, who who who guide me, who who
49:54
hold my hand through things, who walk with me through things, who share
49:59
with me their experience in sobriety. With these situations that I'm going through,
50:04
Here's how we got through them, Here's how we stayed sober, and here's
50:07
what we learned. You can take my suggestion, or you can just do
50:12
whatever you're going to do. Yeah, you know, and to show me,
50:16
you know, there, to show me how they were taught the twelve
50:22
steps in AA or NA and how they applied these steps in their everyday life.
50:28
How a situation that happens in your life can be directed back down to
50:32
whatever step you know, one through twelve. Here's how we can learn,
50:37
here's how we can grow. Is it going to be easy? No,
50:39
you know. The thing about recovery is like recovery. Now, recovery is
50:44
not easy though, because recovery, you know, is recovering in a twelve
50:50
step program is based on spiritual principles and values, you know, and the
50:54
twelve steps. It's not an easy way to live. If you're gonna do
50:59
it true harder and hold yourself completely accountable to that way of living. It's
51:04
not easy, but it's so it's so beautiful though, It's such a beautiful,
51:07
an amazing and rewarding way to live. You know, to treat people
51:14
how they you know, to love, we say, recovery, to love.
51:17
To treat everybody like like your God, like they are God's children,
51:20
because we're all God's children. God everybody I use in a very general way.
51:23
It's whatever a higher power of your understanding. So whatever God is to
51:29
you, that's that's what I mean. But you know we're we're all God's
51:34
children, you know, so you treat everybody like that. Love, intolerance,
51:37
patience, kindness, open mindedness, generosity. You know. These are
51:45
some spiritual principles that live my life by. Is it always easy to be
51:47
loving and tolerant to people? No, it's not. Is it always easy
51:52
to be Patient's it always easy to be open minded? Is it always easy
51:55
to be kind? It's it always easy to be generous? No, it's
51:59
not. But if you do these things when you're feeling the exact opposite,
52:04
that's spirituality, and that's like part of that's a major part of what recovery
52:08
is. And it's not an easy way to live, you know, but
52:10
you grow so much. You know, if you can find patience when you're
52:15
not, when you're feeling fairly impatient, you grow. That's discipline. Yeah,
52:20
if you can find a way to be loving and tolerant to somebody when
52:23
you don't feel like being loving and tolerant to that person that is growth right
52:29
there. It's hard to do, but you know, when you do the
52:31
opposite of what you're feeling, it's it's so much more rewarding. You grow
52:36
stronger, and you grow stronger, and you go stronger, and you go
52:37
stronger, and then pretty soon as time goes on, you're this person that
52:42
you didn't even see yourself foresee yourself becoming. However many you know, months
52:45
ago, years ago, when you first got sober, you know, and
52:50
that's that's the life I'm living today. That's awesome. I think to those
52:53
principles are just principles of life, Like we all should live by those principles,
52:58
regardless of being in our or not, because it's just being a better
53:02
person, like you said, yeah, being a good person. And that
53:06
was you know, I hated I hated myself when I was when I was
53:08
using, you know, and because I was a liar, I was a
53:14
manipulator, I was a con artist, I was a thief. I did
53:19
despicable things when I was using, and I hated myself for them, you
53:22
know. And then when I got sober, I wanted to be the exact
53:29
opposite of who I used to be. You know. It wasn't just about
53:32
getting clean and being sober. It was about just changing everything about myself,
53:37
you know, and changing my mentality too, you know. And that's that's
53:45
that's one of the most rewarding things of living a life of recovery in a
53:47
tall Step program is living my life in spiritual principles and values. And those
53:53
spiritual principles and values are they're expanding and they're evolving too, you know,
54:00
ye all the time, all the time, all the time. And they
54:02
don't and ladies and gentlemen, they don't just evolve on their own. No,
54:06
they're evolved because they're tested. Because I'm tested. They'll just like,
54:12
oh yeah, it just happens to grow on its own. No, you
54:13
grow because you're tested. You grow because you're growing. You're going through something.
54:17
We're tested, you know. And and you can either choose to grow
54:22
or you can just go through it, you know. And I choose to
54:28
grow through things. But it's hard, it can it can be hard,
54:32
you know. I recally became a father. Well it's been over a year
54:37
now, you know. My daughter, thank you, My daughter is healthy,
54:44
beautiful little girl. And she just turned a year year old April tenth,
54:50
and that was man. You know, I thought drug court and manner
54:53
at the same time was hard. Man. Parenting, parenting by far the
55:00
biggest challenge of my life. By far, the biggest challenge of my life.
55:05
I uh and and it's you know, I I remember thinking like,
55:15
I don't know if I could do this. Yeah, I'm talking like when
55:19
it's like the when she's two months old and we're going through the cluster feedings
55:23
and like we've I've we've only had like two Like if you add all the
55:28
little little little bits of sleep throughout the night together, it probably adds up
55:31
to like an hour and a half. And I got to go to work,
55:35
you know, and then I'm sponsoring, and then I got my meetings
55:37
and then you know, so I was doing all these things still, you
55:40
know, and it was it was very challenging. You know. I remember
55:46
thinking that, like this is this is too much, you know, and
55:52
then you know, I call my sponsor. My sponsor just so happens to
55:57
be a father as well. It's good another parenting recovery, you know,
56:02
calling my sponsor multiple times this year that my daughter has been born multiple times,
56:08
multiple multiple times to event to cry because I'm stressed. Out because I
56:14
can't. You know, I'm freaking out. You know, I'm exhausted,
56:16
you know, you know, the heart is tired. And then there's being
56:21
a parent. Oh my god. Yeah, they don't tell you that.
56:23
They don't tell you that. You know. I thought that being a parent,
56:28
I thought that, like, all I was going to need to do
56:30
was change some diapers, make some bottles, buy some baby stuff, and
56:36
like be there, you know for like their games and stuff. Boom parenting.
56:39
That's what I thought. No, No, they don't give you the
56:44
disclaimer about the exhaustion. The exhaustion was just unreal. The exhaustion was traumatizing.
56:52
It was the exhaustion was straight up traumatizing. I had never been that
56:57
tired before in my life. I used to be a wildland firefighter, okay,
57:00
like in the mountains. All right, I've never been that. I've
57:02
been that tired before, you know. But man, I teach it.
57:07
It's taught me perseverance, taught me patience. Man, my daughter teaches me.
57:15
Patients. Holy, but compared to where I was a year ago with
57:21
my patients, you know, phenomenal, And I think, uh, kudos
57:25
to you. You stayed sober through that. You know, yes I did.
57:30
I didn't because you know what, as a parent with a newborn baby,
57:37
you know, when you're getting no sleep and your baby's waking up every
57:43
hour throughout the night, and that's just one night, you know, and
57:47
you go through like two weeks of that, a month of that, two
57:53
months of that, Like you like, we were defeated. There were times
58:01
where my daughter's mom and my and myself, we were just defeated. We
58:06
were exhausted. We didn't know what day it was, we didn't know,
58:09
we couldn't really plan anything. We're just like just like zombies trudging through this,
58:14
you know. But never once was that, like, you know,
58:16
I'm going to this is too much. I'm a bill. Yep, you
58:20
know this is too much. You know what i'mna I'm gonna go smoke a
58:24
joint and just take the edge off. I'm gonna have a beer, just
58:28
take the edge off. I deserve this. I'm doing all these things.
58:30
You know. Never once was that an option. So I do know that
58:37
you have a lot more to your recovery story, So I think I'll have
58:40
to have you on again. I can talk more about it and parenting,
58:45
because you're right, it's very difficult, but I appreciate your time today.
58:50
Thanks for having me on. Coming on. I think you had a lot
58:52
of great insight into what recovery looks like, so I really appreciate that.
58:55
Thank you, thank you,