Latest / Healthy Happy Wise Wealthy / Healing Behind Bars and Badges: Dr. Davena Longshore on Law Enforcement Wellness Pt2

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Healing Behind Bars and Badges: Dr. Davena Longshore on Law Enforcement Wellness Pt2 · Healthy Happy Wise Wealthy

0:00
Welcome
0:05
to Healthy, Happy, Wise, Wealthy, the podcast where we take people who
0:09
have lived through some fire and now want to take that light and help
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guide others. I am your host, Mary Meyer. I'm so glad you're here.
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I want you to step away from today feeling like you
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know some things about how to heal, about how to move
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forward, about how to create the life that you want to live.
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Let's get started. Welcome Back to part two with Dr. Davena
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Longshore with the Cummings Foundation for Behavioral Health. I'm excited
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for this episode. We're going to talk about biases and how we all
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have them. Doesn't matter your, your gender, your age, your
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religion, your political affiliation, your skin color. And we are going to
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talk about how we can all come together to make our world a better place.
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We actually recorded this on Juneteenth even though you all are listening to it
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for the first time in July. These conversations are
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that can be good for everyone. Everyone is invited to this table.
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Welcome and let's get started. I want to just put a
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short call to action because if you have, if you'd
1:10
like to see programs in your area, in your
1:14
precinct, with your police officers, you can email
1:17
you about that. And also if you want to donate
1:21
towards this because this is a thing that brings a lot of
1:25
healing and health and safety to the community and to
1:29
the country, you can also donate also,
1:32
which is Cummings C U M M I N G
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and S S on the end of it and then c
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f b h.org
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CummingsCFBH..org so I just want to throw
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that in there in case someone's listening. That's the way to do it. So
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what, tell me how, how does physical health play, play into
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behavioral health? Because behavioral health is maybe a word people
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aren't as familiar with, but my understanding is kind of a mix
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between mental and physical.
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So yes, the, the mental, the mind and
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the body are connected to each other. So your
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emotions that you experience
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throughout the day, I'll just use this as an example. They cause you to produce
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certain hormones. Your brain produces those hormones. We
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know from a basic biology class that the brain is the
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powerhouse of the body, right? It is making sure that every
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organ system is running. So if the brain
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is malfunctioning and not producing the chemical
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signals that it needs to produce for your other organ systems
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to run properly, then it will cause health issues.
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So things like depression are linked to heart
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attack, stroke, cancer, metabolic
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diseases, diabetes. And people
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don't realize it because we've been Taught
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go get a physical exam or. And that's
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even. Not even to be proactive. Our society is a little.
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We act after the fact that, you know, like, let me go get an exam
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because my stomach hurts. Instead of being preventative,
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but taking care of your mind, your
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emotions and the impact that they have on the
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brain is also preventative because you can work out
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all the time. You can be a bodybuilder, you can eat
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vegan or vegetarian, but if you're
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hurting emotionally, you will still
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get physically ill. Yeah. Yes.
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And I've. I've had some guests on the, the show that their, their episodes
3:50
are coming out in the next couple weeks. And as an example, both of them
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talked about breath work. Right. And. And one of them
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yoga, too. So. And those are things I think you've talked about in terms
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of like, helping people regulate. Yes. Incorporating those
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also. So kind of the whole, the whole gamut. I know
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this. The. The stuff you're coming up with, you're not. It's
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not, it's not myopic. It's just, it's very.
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Feels like you're covering all the bases.
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Yes. So what I can say about my model is
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it's based on some of our basic
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psychological tenants of what humans need to
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survive and to be happy. And so in those
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models, things like Maslow's hierarchy of needs,
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they explain that humans
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need things emotionally and physically to
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be happy, to thrive, to do their best in life.
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So you need to feel like you belong. You need to have food,
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you need to have shelter, you need to have security, you need
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to have interactions with others. Humans are social
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beings. We need each other.
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Which also is not a huge thing that's popular right
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now. Right. You know, everything's about, I can do
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it myself, Right? Not really. Not really.
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We're not designed that way. We're social beings, so we need each other.
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So the model I created is built off of
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all the things that psychology has found out years
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ago that humans need to thrive in life. And
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then what I did was I looked at those and looked at their connections
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between mental disorder, and they're all
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connected to depression, anxiety,
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personality disorders, schizophrenia.
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They're all connected. So I looked at the connections and I
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designed a program that's preventative. It
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offers interventions that feed those areas
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of you that are in need so you never get to the place
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of depression or anxiety or a
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psychotic disorder. And yes,
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believe me, genetics plays a role, but
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we know that human behavior is so complex, and it's
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a complex interplay between our genetics and our
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physical environment. And so what I do is what I can
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do. I can't determine who you were born from, but
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we can look at your environment, the behaviors,
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the things that you're getting and that you're not getting,
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and we can play with those things and maneuver those things
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so that you don't set off that gene. And
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that's linked to depression. Yeah,
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that's so powerful. So
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what's next for the Cummings foundation for Behavioral Health
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and for you, Dr. Longshore, what is kind of like the next
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steps of what you're looking to do with the work you're
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doing? So with this particular project,
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the next steps is we're looking at expanding to several different
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agencies. So that is the hope for
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next year. What we do on the back end is we do test
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this model. We test the program to make sure it's
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doing what it's supposed to be doing to see if we do need to tweak
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it in some way. So we'll be expanding
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to other agencies next year. Another thing we'll be doing
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because our desire at the Cummings
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foundation is to use behavioral health
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to positively change the community at large.
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So we're not just focused on police officers, even though
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that's our first main project. We want
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to help the community. And I know, and people in
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my field know from history, when it comes to social change,
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psychologists have always been at the cusp of it. Their research
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has always been at the cusp of social change. And
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so my desire is to put psychologists back in
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the rightful place and let the experts
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of behavior help lead the
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community when it comes to social issues and inform
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politicians and policymakers of how
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what they're doing is impacting society and the community and what they
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can do to make it better. So one of our next
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projects is going to be dealing with intimate partner violence,
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which is a huge concern right now in the US the numbers
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have escalated. You have many women dying at the hands of men
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and researchers. The few researchers who are
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researching it, they have a call of action. They need more
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researchers to help them figure out why this is happening and
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what the solution is. And so the Cummings foundation wants to
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participate in being a part of the solution. Yeah, that
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is a very tough.
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That's a very tough one. And I feel like most of us have had if,
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you know, as if we haven't experienced it
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ourselves, we know someone close to us who's experienced that.
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Yeah. And I think that's how the world is right now. And it's very.
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It's. It's just gotta stop, like, it's just gotta stop rolling downhill to
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the generations to come. I feel that very strongly. Let's, like, what can
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we do? We have to do something else to stop this
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from being so common, so commonplace.
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And it. I think it's been commonplace for a long time in some ways, but,
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man, it doesn't. It was. It's got. It's got to stop. There's got to
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be ways. So that's. That's exciting to me that you're.
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You're working on that also. Yeah, I'm
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very excited to work on that. So. Yeah,
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and we. I'm sure we could have an entire conversation around that
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topic, which we will do another time. Yes.
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And there is the. The other one. We're actually working on that. This year,
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we had a board member ask us a question.
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Why hasn't there been a solution to the gun violence in America?
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And so my team and I, we did a major review and we found that
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a solution's been given. That's not the problem. The problem
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is how Americans view guns.
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And so we're doing what we call, like a meta
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analysis or a scoping review where we pull
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all this data in from all these researchers who've already
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answered this question, and then we look at that in American
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culture, and we're going to be tying the two together to
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show hopefully, that the real issue is
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how Americans see weapons and how Americans see
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guns and how it's so entrenched in American
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culture. And then we're going to be looking at what are the solutions to
11:10
that? What are the solutions to moving American
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culture from the ideals that cause them
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to not want to support laws
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that will change who has access
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to guns so that we can reduce the gun violence in
11:28
America? Yeah, these are just
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like, you're just diving in at the very, very deepest end of the pool.
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Right? It's like, let's see how many issues
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that are super heated and have been going on for a
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long time and we can't seem to resolve. And I'm gonna. I'm gonna do
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what I can to. To do something about this. And the way you
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come at it is so you come at it, I think, with
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so much intelligence, research experience
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and compassion and a level of understanding, I think,
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for everyone involved in the. In the situation.
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And because, you know, you were counseling the.
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The predators, you know, so, you know, it's like,
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those are the ones I want to have no understanding or no understanding and no
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compassion for, but, you know, that it's. People are.
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We can be a crazy bunch. People
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are hurting. And
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when I worked in the prison system, that's what
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I saw. I mean, it was
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sad how many of the inmates were the
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victim of sexual violence, the victim of physical
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violence at very young ages. They were orphans, they
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were poor and homeless.
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And so they became a victim of their circumstance.
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And at the root of it,
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I look at it as this. I was one decision in my life
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away from being them because we
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had some of the same childhood experiences.
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The difference was the one decision that I made that was different
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from their decision. And so we're alike.
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We're not as different as we think that we are. And
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if society at large would begin to see that,
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that we are more alike than we are different, it would
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heal a lot of things in our community. I think it probably
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would. And I also do think this is some of the things that I
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have noticed in general about people is sometimes they
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refuse to feel.
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Not. Not on purpose, but like they want to detach because they're afraid
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it could happen to them. So it's easier to go, oh,
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you over there. I'm gonna. Gonna. I'm gonna put my hand
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you over there. I'm gonna. I'm gonna send you a little
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goodwill. But I don't want to
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emotionally engage at too much of a level, because it scares
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me too much that what you're experiencing is a thing that I
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could experience in life. And
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that's. That's another. Maybe that's a schema. I don't know what that is, but
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it's just. It seems like there is kind of that reaction where
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that scares me. And so I'm just going to say, so
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sorry. You'll get through.
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It's a coping mechanism. Yeah, it's a coping
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mechanism. It's a mechanism that people use
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to deal with the horrors of the world. And
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it's. It's not always beneficial because it
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can cause you to not show
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empathy for others. I mean, some of the.
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One of the most impactful
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situations for me was when I resigned
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and I was walking through yards, and I had
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people. Inmates that people call killers
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collapsing to the ground in the middle of the yard. Not in private,
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in front of other inmates, crying, I
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can't believe you're leaving us. You're the only person in my life
15:23
who ever believed in me. Oh.
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They are. We're all humans. And
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I think that's one of the reasons, too, why I was able to have the
15:37
impact that I had, because I understood that I didn't treat
15:41
them like I was better than them. I was different from them.
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We're humans. And the same needs that I have, you have too.
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It doesn't matter if we look alike. I've had
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white supremacists in the prison begin to only
15:57
want me to treat them. And it was because I
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showed them we are alike. And we're more alike
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than we are different. And I know you feel like that
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idea and that belief was your protection in the world.
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I understand it. But you don't have to hate
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me because I'm here to help you. I'm not going to harm you.
16:19
Yeah. Such a, Such a position of power and
16:23
compassion on your part to just, you know, just be.
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I don't know. I'm crying through this whole thing.
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I am. You can see it. I'm like, you're making me cry,
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you know, and I, I have over the years and, you know, I'm a white
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person group in all white community. There weren't. There
16:43
wasn't. I mean, there was racism, but you didn't know who it was because there
16:46
weren't any black people or really people of any other race. So just a
16:50
little, little town in the 80s in Iowa. And so you learn
16:53
over time as our, as our communities get more integrated. And it was something.
16:57
When I moved to the South, I was very much like, I didn't
17:01
know. And I think I didn't, you know, you know, I, I only know was
17:04
taught the history I was taught. I didn't even know to go look for other
17:07
history. I didn't. So, you know, and I still don't know if
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I know what to go look for. Sometimes I just. You read something and you're
17:14
like, that's insane. Like, I, you know, I had no idea.
17:18
But I know when I moved to the south and this is, you know, in
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my mid-20s, I'm like, we gotta like, do something
17:25
to be integrated. You know, it's, you know, it's
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way more black and white in the south where it's, you know,
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it's more. Not necessarily 50, 50, but ish. But, you know, we're
17:37
more integrated there.
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And it took, I,
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it took a long time, I feel like, to find a
17:47
situation where I felt like I was accepted. You
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know, I think there's just. There was such a stereotypes on
17:55
maybe both ends, but like, I didn't know the questions to ask. I didn't know
17:58
the things to say either, you know, so. And this was actually a
18:02
church and for a while. And so I think we're all showing up and just
18:05
being polite and not knowing what to do.
18:09
And then, you know, I think that what really helped me develop,
18:13
really starting to develop. And I'm saying all this for the
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sake of, of people who are white, people who really don't. Maybe
18:20
they have a black friend. They know that there's this
18:24
racism thing that's going on in America. Sometimes it really, you know,
18:28
you know, pops out and grabs us like it did in 2020. And
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we're just, you know, we don't know what to do. We.
18:36
And we haven't even thought about it. We haven't thought about what we haven't thought
18:39
about. We haven't known to ask the questions we know to ask,
18:43
to think to ask. You don't even know what you know because that history
18:47
is. Is far enough removed and are from some of us,
18:50
not from all of us. But I think in the north, we're not as. Or
18:54
Midwest, where I grew up, we're not as hands in the. We're not as aware,
18:59
but we have, we have a responsibility also. So
19:03
if, if we don't know if, if we're not integrated with people
19:07
of other cultures, so we just have the bias that they're
19:11
not going to vote the way we want them to, or they're, they're going to
19:14
take our resources or they're going to do whatever it is. Those are, those are
19:18
biases. And your life is better
19:22
when you learn outside your culture, when you
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integrate with people who are not. Don't look like you.
19:31
And I think it's all. And it's not just black, white, all the,
19:35
all the different cultures that can be here. You will learn things
19:38
and it will make your world better. It will make you
19:42
more understanding, human. But it's not just that, like, you're gonna,
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you're gonna find your people. You're going to realize that
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there's people who don't look like you, who didn't grow up where you grew
19:53
up, who don't think like you, who don't
19:57
believe like you or vote like you, or live where you are the
20:01
same age in you, or, you know, if you're a female, they might be male
20:05
or vice versa. Like, you're gonna find people that
20:08
support you, that love you, that have your back
20:12
outside of where you think they're going to be. Right? So
20:16
if you, if, if you will take the energy and the time
20:19
and it might really take. If it's, if you're as a white person
20:23
in a largely white Community, or if you're in a community
20:26
that just kind of is. Is. Is together, but
20:30
separate, which. And I moved from Atlanta, and you've lived in Atlanta, and
20:33
sometimes Atlanta is like that. You know, we're together, but we're separate.
20:37
You know, usually you see groups of people, and they're not necessarily racially
20:40
mixed. So we have to. But
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it's awkward. And so that's one thing. I think it's awkward at
20:48
first. It is. Especially if
20:52
you just don't say how you feel.
20:55
And, I mean, I know, you know, living on the west coast, people are a
20:59
little more passive and chill, and they don't. They're not as deep.
21:03
But, you know, I'm from the Southeast, and
21:07
me, I just say, let's have the conversation. Like, let's just get the
21:11
awkwardness over. Over. Let's say how we feel. Let's talk
21:14
about it, and then we can work through it. And
21:18
I think sometimes, too, people are afraid
21:22
to do that. They're afraid to just talk through it. There was
21:26
a white male sergeant that I had to work with with
21:30
one of the other stations, and it was awkward for me
21:33
at first. I mean, he was like, in the black community. We
21:37
would look at him and be like, classic. Go hunt a black person. You
21:41
know, like, he drove a big truck. He
21:45
loved big guns, you know, and he. And
21:48
so one of the first things I said to him was that, like, you hunt
21:52
black people. And it was a joke. He, like, looked,
21:56
and he just burst into tears and laughing.
22:00
And that's where the conversation started. And it was hilarious
22:04
because people were kind of afraid to get in our conversation because we were just
22:07
going back and forth with black and white stereotypes. He's like, why
22:11
do black people like Cheesecake Factory? I'm
22:15
like, white people don't season their food, you know,
22:19
and all the stereotypes he and I
22:23
both learned about each other, we were throwing them
22:27
out at each other, just getting it
22:31
over with and then talking about, well, where do you think the
22:34
stereotype came from? Do you agree with it? We just had the
22:38
uncomfortable conversation. Yeah. I do
22:41
think also sometimes people are just bad at knowing how to get out there and
22:45
meet people. I think there's also that in society. So
22:48
it's not just like, you just, you know. And we got it. We got to
22:52
address that, too, maybe, because we can't get to know each other if we're just
22:55
bad at. At knowing how to talk to people. And I just think more people
22:59
are. Feel awkward about that than not.
23:02
So, you know, sometimes you just Go compliment
23:06
their hair. Give. Give them a compliment, you know? You
23:10
know, just say. Ask them a question about, you know, you got
23:14
your shirt on. Say, that's interesting. Where does that. Where does that
23:18
come from? What's. What's that all about? You know, I don't know. Sports
23:21
team. You gotta, like. And if you're. If you're next to each other,
23:25
ask them questions about, you know, their work and where
23:29
they grew up and just. Just start asking some. Just throw out some
23:32
questions. Just.
23:36
Sometimes the simplest way to disarm people is
23:39
just to look them in the eyes and smile.
23:43
That's true. Yeah. Yeah. And. And that can start a
23:47
conversation. I mean, I blame social media
23:50
for people's lack of communication skills
23:54
these days. And then it was just compounded by
23:57
Covid when people were separated from each other.
24:01
So people are definitely lacking in
24:05
communication skills. And I've had people come to me
24:09
just to be coached on that. Like, how do I
24:12
talk to people? I'm not dating. I don't know how to introduce
24:16
myself to people. I don't know how to start a conversation.
24:20
I've had people come to me just for that. Like, can you help
24:23
me and teach me how to do that? Yeah. I
24:27
almost feel like that's. That makes me go. I feel like that's like a. Multiple
24:31
episodes I could do, but it does. It does feel like that. Right. Like,
24:35
that's, I think, way before COVID people. I mean, I grew up with people that
24:38
were bad. I. Most people
24:43
that I know have not been great at that.
24:48
I don't know. And I think it was something that is a skill I learned.
24:50
I don't think I was great at it either for a long time. So
24:54
anyway, that's. That's ideas. Ideas to.
24:58
You know, if you just don't talk to anyone, fine. Go start by
25:02
talking to someone who looks like you, and then after that, go talk to someone
25:06
who doesn't look like you.
25:09
Yes. I've been since I went into the psychology
25:13
field. I thank my program because they made us take
25:17
classes that brought out
25:21
our biases and they made us work through them. And
25:25
so I've had a habit of always.
25:28
Because I know my biases, I intentionally
25:32
go interact with the people that I have that
25:36
bias against so that I can deconstruct it.
25:40
Yeah, that's. And that's. I think that's the example that we should all
25:44
follow. Just, you know, whether we have a class on it or not.
25:48
Is. There is. You're going to. You don't even know sometimes you have a belief
25:51
system until it's threatened or challenged.
25:54
Yes.
25:55
So,
25:59
today is Juneteenth, when we are recording this, but,
26:03
you know, we've talked some on race and, you know,
26:07
even though people will be not listening to it on this day, is
26:11
there anything you want to say about the day and the significance of it?
26:19
No one is free until everyone is free.
26:23
And no one can do
26:27
their best until everyone
26:30
has resources and everyone has the same rights and
26:34
everyone is being treated the same way.
26:38
And while we
26:41
feel like we've come so far,
26:45
we still have so much further to go.
26:49
There's so much inequity
26:53
within a capitalistic system. System.
26:57
And so I'm thankful today that
27:02
I finally met people in
27:06
the right places who did
27:10
not see my race, did not see my gender,
27:14
did not see my sexuality. They saw
27:17
my skill. Yeah. And my integrity
27:22
and my heart. And they put me in a position
27:26
where now I can help other people.
27:30
And I'm grateful for it. I'm very
27:34
grateful for it. Where I hurt
27:38
is knowing that many people won't get the opportunity
27:42
that I got because they're Hispanic
27:46
or black or. Or Asian or female or
27:50
transgender or gay or lesbian.
27:55
They won't get. Or disabled. They won't
27:59
get the same opportunity because people look at them
28:02
for those things, those outside things, instead of
28:06
looking inside at who they really are. Do you have any
28:09
thoughts on merit based? I know we talked to merit based before. And how.
28:13
How do we get there where it's clear, just clearly
28:17
the. The best person for the job or the best person for the,
28:22
you know, gets it without. Without seeing the
28:26
stuff that might cause the bias?
28:32
I don't. The only way you're
28:36
going to fix that is to fix the people. That. That's the
28:40
only way you're going to fix that is to fix the people. And it's sad
28:43
because there's recent studies that show things, for example,
28:47
that a white male felon is more likely to get a
28:50
job than a black male who's never been arrested before.
28:55
It's. People
28:59
lead with their biases. And the danger of it is people
29:02
don't think they have biases. And it's
29:06
because there's such a negative stereotype. And
29:10
I feel like we throw the word
29:14
racist around a little bit too much these days,
29:18
and people are going to automatically throw up their guard because that
29:21
word has such a negative connotation. And so I've had
29:25
conversations with people that I knew had negative biases against
29:29
black people. But when I use the word bias.
29:33
They're more receptive than if I just said, hey, you're racist. Do you know that?
29:36
You know? And so I
29:42
A lack of education is always
29:46
room for destruction. It's always the route to destruction.
29:50
And so when you don't know yourself, when you don't know
29:54
your beliefs truly, when you don't know who you are, when you don't know how
29:57
you see the world, there's no way you can
30:01
correct for your biases at all.
30:05
And the only way to fix that is for people to
30:08
understand that they have biases and you have to be
30:12
intentional about correcting. For me, I grew
30:16
up in South Carolina, about 40 minutes away from
30:19
the. The slave dogs. My father
30:23
helped integrate schools in South Carolina in 81. It
30:27
was 81 when they were integrating schools. And when they
30:31
integrated them, the wealthier whites
30:35
created a private school in my town so they didn't have to go to school
30:38
with us. And it left us with the poor whites. And so they
30:42
zoned the middle to upper class blacks to go to
30:46
school with the poor whites. I had to pass schools to go to school
30:50
because they were zoning to make sure poor
30:53
whites only at least went to school with middle class, upper class black.
30:57
So I grew up going to school being
31:01
called the N word. You know, white boys telling me they can't date
31:05
me because I'm an N. I grew up with that
31:08
stuff. I was interviewing and people thought
31:12
my resume belonged to a male because it's science and math on
31:15
it. And I would walk in an interview and they would ask me to
31:19
multiply because they didn't believe a black woman knew math,
31:23
mathematics. So I grew up very
31:26
entrenched in you cannot trust white people.
31:30
But I became aware of my bias. And so when
31:34
I met a white person, I intentionally said, you need
31:37
to give them a chance. They're all not bad.
31:42
You have to understand your biases. Yeah.
31:46
And vice versa, you know, white and black. And
31:49
this conversation to me is such a good example
31:53
of the way forward as
31:56
humanity is to start
32:00
talking to each other, to lay down our guard a little
32:04
bit. And I think in politics it's
32:08
been so much where it's like, all wrong, all wrong.
32:12
Right. And that's just how it. I feel like the last
32:15
20 years has been more and more like, let's get. Keep each other mad at
32:18
each other. Yes. And that keeps us from having
32:22
conversations where so many things could probably
32:26
be resolved really simply
32:30
if we were talking to each other and listening to each other
32:33
and not just coming at each other with. You're so
32:37
stupid. That's why. So dumb. You're so, you know, you're, you know, whatever.
32:41
All the, the, the words that come out then where we're, you know,
32:45
calling each other names and, or we're just not going to listen because
32:49
you're not doing what I want you to do, you
32:52
know, And I want you to do this because this is the way to do
32:55
it. And even if you're right and it
32:59
is the way to do it, is this person harming you?
33:03
Right. Are you going to be harmed by listening? Right. Even if you know
33:06
that, you know they're wrong and you know, that's a whole nother thing.
33:11
We have our strong beliefs. Is it really harming you
33:15
to be kind to someone who doesn't, who
33:19
isn't what you think they should be, who isn't doing what you think they should
33:22
do? And you know, let's be honest
33:26
with ourselves. I do things that I don't think I should be
33:30
doing. I don't agree with my own self. So, you know, you know what I'm
33:33
saying? Like, we're all like that too. So we all do things we don't think
33:36
we should really be doing. So give everyone a little grace.
33:40
And just because one person, and
33:44
there's. Every demographic has, every demographic, no matter how you look
33:47
at it, has people that are going to be, can be harmful
33:51
people. And, and I think every demographic has people that are
33:55
good, that are good to people, even if they're irritated about it
33:59
or what you know, or, or have a bias or they're still going to, in
34:02
their nature, do, do good. And this kind
34:06
of goes back to what you were saying about
34:10
different communities and how polarized they can be.
34:14
So this black and white concrete, very concrete
34:18
thinking that you see right or left. Right. No, in between.
34:22
It comes from a lack of experiencing other cultures and people who
34:25
are different from you because that does something to the brain.
34:30
When you're able to see differences,
34:33
see differences in culture, understand that not everybody
34:37
operates the same way that you do, you then
34:41
can understand that two opposing things can
34:44
both be the truth. An officer
34:48
can. Yeah, an officer can be racist but
34:52
also have PTSD and a mental health
34:55
challenge. Two, two opposing views can
34:59
both be true. And I think that's what
35:03
we're seeing a lot of now, that people don't understand that,
35:07
that we can believe two different things and they both be
35:11
accurate. Right, that's, that's true.
35:15
And so much in. Right in politics because I, I have, I
35:18
listen to both I, in terms of, like, people talking of who are very strong
35:22
beliefs on both sides, I, I tend to go, yeah, well, what you're
35:26
talking about. I think everyone agrees with what you're talking about. I think everyone agrees
35:29
with because, like, you're talking, you're talking about maybe
35:33
I want to be able to get a good job that I'm not going to
35:36
be excluded from because of how I look. And everyone will go, well, yeah, you
35:39
should. And the other side is like, this is about national security and we can't
35:43
be threatened by, you know, terrorism, all that
35:47
stuff. And I'd be like, I think everyone agrees with that too. Like, you know,
35:51
so, like, you're, it's just, you're looking at different things. So.
35:54
And that's where the, the talking to each other, it's like, well, yeah,
35:58
all these things are commonly
36:01
agreed on. Right, right. So. And I
36:05
know I, I thought once when I went through a contentious divorce, I know you've
36:09
had one. It's like if, if, if that can get
36:12
settled legally and that kind of
36:16
environment where you're like, there's no way to come to an agreement on this of
36:19
any sort because we're so far apart, then what
36:23
couldn't be agreed on? Right.
36:27
Right. Act like all these issues in the country can't come to some kind of
36:30
conclusion. Sure they can. Sure they can. What it takes is
36:35
saying it has to come to an agreement and then reasonable people at the
36:39
table, you know. Right. And, and not the thought that
36:42
in order for me to survive, I have to put another group down, I have
36:46
to step on someone else in order for me to get my needs
36:50
met. Everyone can get their needs
36:53
met. There is a solution where we all can get our
36:57
needs met and we don't have to fight each other or harm each other
37:01
to get that done. And I think that's what we need. To be looking for.
37:05
And that's the only solution in my mind. I don't think there is any other
37:08
solution. Yes, the only solution towards peace
37:12
is one where everyone can, can have, you know, the,
37:15
what they, what they need to just have a peaceful life. Right,
37:19
right. You know, to have a peaceful, prosperous life without, you
37:23
know, the amount of work that you put in should
37:27
be the reward you get back, you know? Yes. If you don't want to go
37:31
get a doctorate and three master's degrees. I mean, I don't. So,
37:35
you know, like, there's going to be a different.
37:39
Maybe I do. Maybe I'll change my mind, but you know what I'm saying? Like,
37:42
obviously, then who. Who gets to have the seat at the table? The one
37:46
who's done the work. You know, the one who's done. The people who have done
37:49
the work in the different areas should be the ones who have the seat at
37:52
the table and the voice, so. Right. Agree.
37:55
Yeah. Well, thank you so much for your time today.
38:01
So if you guys want to learn more, I'm gonna say it one more time
38:04
for the Cummings foundation, it's C u m m I n g
38:07
s and then c
38:09
fbh.org CummingsCFBH.org and then you can just email admin@cummingscfbh.org
38:13
and Dr. Longshore,
38:17
any last words you'd like to share with everybody?
38:22
Go talk to someone today who doesn't look like
38:26
you, talk like you, doesn't go to the same church as you,
38:29
doesn't believe the same thing as you. That's where you can
38:33
start to become a different and happier person.
38:38
I am in that and saying that. See, people have been saying that forever,
38:42
and now I have a doctor who said it.
38:48
All right, Dr. Longshore, let's see your. Let's see your shirt. My ancestors
38:52
would be proud. Yes, they would. Yes, they would.
38:56
Screenshot that.
39:00
Oh, thank you so much. I appreciate you so much as a human and
39:04
I'm just so thankful to have met you and have gotten to work with
39:07
you. So thank you for coming on today. Thank you. I
39:11
am thankful to have met you, my newest
39:15
white friend.
39:20
That's awesome. All right, and that concludes
39:24
our two part episode with Dr. Davena Longshore with the Cummings foundation for
39:28
behavioral health and all of her incredible insights
39:31
into our first responders. Stay tuned for more from
39:35
Healthy, Happy, Wise Wealthy with new episodes coming every Thursday.
39:40
Thanks for joining us on Healthy Happy, Wise Wealthy. If you believe in
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40:02
next time. You all have a wonderful week and
40:06
keep on keeping on feeling
40:10
like you're stuck in a hurricane because
40:13
everything around you just keeps on turning
40:16
I can see searching for run escape.