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Fictional Women Around the World: Rose Nylund · Stuff Mom Never Told You

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Hey, this is Danny and SMITHA and welcome to stuff
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: I Never told you production to iHeart Radio, and welcome
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: to another sub subsegment of fictional women around the world. Today,
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: in homage to actress Betty White, who died in December one,
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  Speaker 1: jes shy over on birthday, we're going to discuss one
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  Speaker 1: of her most iconic characters, Rose Nilan, from the hit
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  Speaker 1: American television sitcom The Golden Girls. And actually today I
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  Speaker 1: was at the grocery store Samantha, because as we record,
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  Speaker 1: this winter storm is approaching a lot of the country,
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  Speaker 1: including here, and people in the South know that that
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  Speaker 1: means there's panic buying um bed and milk, because that's
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  Speaker 1: essentially the only thing we need, which is not good
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  Speaker 1: when there's already shortages because of COVID. But as I
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  Speaker 1: was checking out, there was a magazine and I think
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  Speaker 1: it must have been completed before she died, but the
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  Speaker 1: cover said Happy Birthday to Betty way to her hundredth birthday,
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  Speaker 1: and I got a little her birthday, right, I think.
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  Speaker 1: So it's it's near as we record this, which is
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  Speaker 1: the January two, it is close because they were gonna
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  Speaker 1: have a parade, but then people were like, maybe not
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  Speaker 1: on MLK, we can maybe the time. So Also, I
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  Speaker 1: think we've talked about this before, because there is a
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  Speaker 1: classic episode you can listen to that we've run before
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  Speaker 1: about the Golden Girls. I still haven't seen the Golden Girls.
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  Speaker 1: I feel like maybe we should do a live episodes
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: of that since we're doing Sex in the City, because,
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: as many have pointed out, that was the original Sex
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  Speaker 1: in the City. Yes, I also saw an article other
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  Speaker 1: day that said that the Golden Girls were younger and
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  Speaker 1: the women in Sex and the City are now today. Yep, yep.
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  Speaker 1: To the point on TikTok when a content creator was
• 2:10
  Speaker 1: talking about can someone please just change the hairstyles and
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: update the hairstyles so we can make a comparison to
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  Speaker 1: see the differences. To be fair, they did age them up.
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  Speaker 1: We know it's still Getty who played Sophia was actually
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  Speaker 1: a lot younger, but they made her up to be
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  Speaker 1: an old grandma. Yeah, yeah, I want to see it.
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  Speaker 1: I think I'll really like it. I have my good
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  Speaker 1: friend Katie who's been on here many times. She was
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  Speaker 1: raising a really conservative both religiously and socially and also politically,
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  Speaker 1: so it's three things. Um, family, but her and her
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  Speaker 1: mom loved to watch Golden Girls together and I just
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  Speaker 1: thought that was so funny. Yeah, very sweet. They would,
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  Speaker 1: you know, tell me the jokes that are in there,
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  Speaker 1: and they both laugh at them, and I just loved it.
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  Speaker 1: I took the test last night. I got Dorothy. I
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  Speaker 1: don't know if that's right, but yeah, I would have
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  Speaker 1: thought you would have leaned a little more towards Rose
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  Speaker 1: reading like doing the research on this character. I agree.
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  Speaker 1: I was like, this sounds kind of like me. Yeah,
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  Speaker 1: like I'm I'm very surprised. I think you need to
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  Speaker 1: retake this. I think take this. Yeah, so be Arthur,
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  Speaker 1: who plays Sophia's daughter, was only one year younger. No,
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  Speaker 1: when you're older than her. Actually, so she was born
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  Speaker 1: in nine two and Estelle Getty was born in nine Okay, okay, anyway, sorry,
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  Speaker 1: some Golden Girl facts for every Girl facts, because I
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  Speaker 1: would assume I would have been to Sophia. Oh and
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  Speaker 1: she's kind of feel like lusty one, isn't she. No,
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  Speaker 1: Sophia is a sassy older one older the mother of
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  Speaker 1: the character and just going in on everybody. Okay, well, listeners,
• 3:51
  Speaker 1: let us know who you think we are. And I
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: will I will retake this very important quiz because I
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: need to know. So, Yes, um, we're like we said,
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: you can go see the classic episode if you want
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: to learn more about this show and the impact that
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: it had. But very briefly, The Golden Girls premiered in
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: and quickly became a hit. It followed the lives of
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  Speaker 1: four older women living together, and you've got sarcastic Dorothy
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  Speaker 1: played by b Arthur ri spit fire, mother Sophia played
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  Speaker 1: by A Stelle, Getty lusty, Blanche Devereaux played by Rue McClanahan,
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  Speaker 1: and spacey Rose played for eight years by Betty White,
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  Speaker 1: including in several spinoffs, which I know one of them
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  Speaker 1: just came on Hulu. She won many awards for the role,
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  Speaker 1: including an Emmy and for Outstanding Lead Actress in a
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  Speaker 1: Comedy Series. Yeah. So. Rose Nylin born Rose Lindstrom was
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  Speaker 1: born out of wedlock to a monk and his lover
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  Speaker 1: in st Olaf, Minnesota, in nineteen thirty and was known
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  Speaker 1: for telling long, nonsensical stories about it. Yes, st Olaf
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  Speaker 1: just became in itself. You knew it was gonna be
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  Speaker 1: good when she talked about her hometown. Her mother died
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  Speaker 1: during childbirth, and her father returned to the monastery, and
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  Speaker 1: she spent her first eight years in an orphanage, believing
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: her biological father was comedian Bob Hope, a belief she
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: held onto until she met him many years later on
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  Speaker 1: the show. She was adopted by Norwegian Minnesota dairy farmers
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  Speaker 1: Gunter and Alma Lyndstrom and grew up with eight siblings.
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  Speaker 1: She was a happy kid, and growing up on a
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  Speaker 1: farm fostered a love of animals true in real life
• 5:20
  Speaker 1: for her. Yes, the love animals, not the farm part. Yeah. Um.
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  Speaker 1: Rose didn't graduate high school due to a case of mono,
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  Speaker 1: but went to college for business, and she also studied
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  Speaker 1: pike Latin. Her parents forbade her from dating until she
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  Speaker 1: was a high school senior Um, and between then and
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  Speaker 1: marriage she dated around fifty six men. One of these
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  Speaker 1: men was Charlie Neiland, a World War Two vet that
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  Speaker 1: she'd known since she was a young child. He had
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  Speaker 1: sold her an insurance policy on her little red wagon. Uh.
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  Speaker 1: They went on to get married and had five children.
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  Speaker 1: They were happily married for twenty two years until Charlie's
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  Speaker 1: death in nineteen seventy. Um He died of a heart
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  Speaker 1: attack while they were having sex, and this gave Rose
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  Speaker 1: a fear of sexual intimacy for several years. And several
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: years after that, another man Rose was with died in
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  Speaker 1: similar circumstances, and Rose had to tell his wife she
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  Speaker 1: didn't know he was married at the time, what had
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: happened And hearing these plots like without it being in
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  Speaker 1: her context, that sounds so serious, and tried to when
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  Speaker 1: it was a comedic thing when she would talk about it,
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  Speaker 1: I was really like knowing her history and knowing how
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  Speaker 1: she delivered it versus this like, wow, this sounds really bad,
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  Speaker 1: but it really wasn't all I mean it was and
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  Speaker 1: it wasn't okay. So she moved to Miami after a
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  Speaker 1: few years, where she worked at a grief counseling center,
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  Speaker 1: though she wasn't great at the job. Right before the
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  Speaker 1: series begins, Rose is evicted from her apartment for violating
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  Speaker 1: her lease by adopting a cat. Needing a new place
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  Speaker 1: to live, she finds an old supermarket bulletin, which is
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  Speaker 1: how she met Blanche Devereaux, who let her move in
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  Speaker 1: after witnessing her kind act of giving the cat to
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  Speaker 1: a boy at the supermar Ucket and Blanches space was
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  Speaker 1: shared with Dorothy and Sophia. Yes, and the show is
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  Speaker 1: largely about the friendship between these women, um supporting each
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  Speaker 1: other and teasing each other. When Rose's friends forge an
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  Speaker 1: application that allows her to win st Olaf Woman of
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  Speaker 1: the Year, for instance, Rose refuses the award but gets
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  Speaker 1: it anyway for demonstrating the qualities that they were looking
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  Speaker 1: for by being honest refusing this award. Um the runner
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  Speaker 1: up was also disqualified for having a literal skeleton in
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  Speaker 1: the closet, which made me Rose has story arcs like
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  Speaker 1: finding a new job after her pension is eliminated, entering
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  Speaker 1: the dating world again, meeting her biological father, a boyfriend
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  Speaker 1: and witness protection, and a run in with the mafia,
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  Speaker 1: Love lost, some health scares, relocation with Sophia and Blanche.
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  Speaker 1: After Dorothy Mary's um, and perhaps because at the lack
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  Speaker 1: of Dorothy's constant sarcasm, Rose becomes more assertive, leading Dorothy
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  Speaker 1: to comment when visiting, when did she become the strong one?
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  Speaker 1: I must have stopped watching it before or Dorothy left.
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  Speaker 1: That's the Golden Palaces. I think it's what's yeah, okay, okay,
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  Speaker 1: So when you do the breakdown of character attributes. Rose
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  Speaker 1: is most often described as spacey, naive, innocent, sometimes a pushover,
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  Speaker 1: which is the source of many running gags. Also is
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  Speaker 1: one of the things that hear and Sophia like. It
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  Speaker 1: never hurts her feelings, even though Sophia is so mean
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  Speaker 1: to her. And she was definitely one of the most charitable,
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  Speaker 1: if not the most charitable, often in running a up
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  Speaker 1: for Volunteer of the Year. And she has a wide
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  Speaker 1: range of hobbies hilarious from cheesemaking, music, Miami vice trivia,
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  Speaker 1: clay modeling, baking, sewing, and knitting. And it's a sort
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  Speaker 1: of fight animal lover. According to her, she was a
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  Speaker 1: highly decorated scout in Minnesota, and she's very competitive, and
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  Speaker 1: she has done her fair share of dancing. Yes, this
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  Speaker 1: character also secured a significant fan base in the lgbt
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  Speaker 1: Q plus community thanks to her behavior in taboo episodes
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  Speaker 1: also called after school special episodes. In a season two episodes,
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  Speaker 1: and Rose realizes that a woman named Jean, who is
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  Speaker 1: a lesbian who recently lost her partner, as a crush
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  Speaker 1: on her. Rose tells her she doesn't feel the same way,
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  Speaker 1: but hopes that they can be friends. And here's a
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  Speaker 1: quote from Decider about that with Jane, we see a
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  Speaker 1: woman in mourning for her partner, an emotional state that
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  Speaker 1: the girls relate to having lost her husband's. The point
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  Speaker 1: subtly made is that Jean's same sex love and loss
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  Speaker 1: is the same as everyone else's love and loss. So
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: when Blanche's brother, Clayton comes to visit in season four,
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  Speaker 1: Blanches under the impression that he is as much of
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  Speaker 1: a ladies man as she is man's lady. However, Clayton
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  Speaker 1: reveals to Rose that he is in the closet and
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  Speaker 1: she coaxes him into coming out to his sister, but
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  Speaker 1: he instead tells her that he's having an affair with Rose.
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  Speaker 1: It all works out, but fact is he came out
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  Speaker 1: to Rose first, and then in a season five episode,
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  Speaker 1: Rose learns that a blood transfusion she received may have
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  Speaker 1: been contaminated with HIV, necessitating a test. However, the results
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  Speaker 1: wouldn't be available for three days, and Rose is racked
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  Speaker 1: with fear and questions and uncertainty. Sofia starts using a
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  Speaker 1: different bathroom than her and marking her coffee mugs with
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  Speaker 1: an R. Rose finally pontificates about being a good person.
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  Speaker 1: How would make sense for someone who was promiscuous like
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  Speaker 1: Blanche to get HIV, to which Blanche responds, HIV isn't
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  Speaker 1: a bad person's disease and Rose's results come back negative.
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  Speaker 1: But a lot of people wrote about this and and
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  Speaker 1: kind of in general, roses Um, I guess innocence are
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  Speaker 1: night Nativity where she's like a really nice person and
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  Speaker 1: she's you know, with gene like it's just like, oh,
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  Speaker 1: this is another person. It doesn't matter if they're gay,
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  Speaker 1: but this being a really big moment where you know,
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  Speaker 1: we all love her and she's so kind and nice
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  Speaker 1: and but it's this like learning thing for her and
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  Speaker 1: she does take it in and kind of it's like, okay,
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  Speaker 1: you're right, just yeah, pretty big for the time, right. Well,
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  Speaker 1: And I know we're gonna talk about this in a second,
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  Speaker 1: but just as a reminder because of that HIV episode
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  Speaker 1: has been brought up a lot and talking about being
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  Speaker 1: bringing awareness and really having that conversation because yeah, kind
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  Speaker 1: of the Sofia reaction was so derogatory in itself and
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: looking back on it from where we are today and
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: what we've learned is kind of shocking and offensive, but
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  Speaker 1: we understand and they do come back and address it.
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  Speaker 1: But they they are the ones that really bring out
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  Speaker 1: this conversation at a time that everybody was scared, without
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  Speaker 1: knowing any without having any real education. Even the government
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  Speaker 1: was using it as a way of saying, this is sin. Uh,
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: this is a cost of sin. And it was ugly,
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: but we will come back to that. But from Collider
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  Speaker 1: an article states, for the audience, they you Rose didn't
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: have a main bone in her body to put her
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  Speaker 1: alongside Jean or Clayton met comedy gold Oblivious to Jane's sexuality,
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  Speaker 1: Rose has to play catch up and when trying to
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  Speaker 1: be a matchmaker to Clayton early on, he eyes a
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  Speaker 1: man and she thinks it's a joke. Quote. She says,
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  Speaker 1: he's a man, You're a man. You're both men, she exclaims,
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  Speaker 1: and then just a second later she gets it. There
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  Speaker 1: we are judging from the lefter alone. The studio audience
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  Speaker 1: loved these moments, but Jean and Clayton were not punchlines.
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  Speaker 1: They had substantial screen time and this was incredibly vital
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: in showing positive LGBT representation during a time when life
• 12:38
  Speaker 1: was not easy for that community. Yeah, um, and I
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  Speaker 1: believe In that same article they brought up Clayton actually
• 12:43
  Speaker 1: comes back, so it wasn't just like a one time
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  Speaker 1: thing as it often is a year and yeah, like
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  Speaker 1: you were saying, Samantha, this was the height of the
• 12:53
  Speaker 1: AIDS epidemic. There was a lot of misinformation, There was
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: a lot of um finger pointing and stigmatizing of of
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: all of this. And I think we talked about that
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: in an episode. I can't remember. It was in our
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: Modern Medicine episode. One of the women we talked about
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: was like her big thing was trying to dispel all
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: of these harmfulness, including like I can get AIDS from
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: toilet seat right, which is kind of being commented on here.
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: Editor Peter Debate wrote about the importance of episodes like
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: this after his partner Dean contracted the virus. Quote, this
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  Speaker 1: was in early time when there was still so much
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: shame about the disease. Having grown up in Louisiana, I
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: already was feeling shame about being gay. My partner was
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: dyk and now I was ashamed about that too, feeling
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  Speaker 1: on some levels like I deserved this. While editing the episode,
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: Bait dialed into the words Blanche told Rose AIDS is
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  Speaker 1: not a bad person's disease and it affected him greatly.
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: And here's another quote from him. I broke down. Of course,
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  Speaker 1: I had to stop working, and then I pulled myself together.
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: And from that point, right in the middle of my
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: partner's battle, I no longer thought I was a bad person.
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  Speaker 1: The show changed me in that moment of desperation, and
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: my god, did the world ever need that to be said?
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: So it's pretty powerful. This is one example of the many,
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: many beloved characters Betty White portrayed in her long career.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: Uh not to mention the body appearances and speeches she
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: made after shocking people who were used to her as Rose,
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: which is funny because she actually she auditioned for Blanche first,
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: but they thought it would be funnier to kind of
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: play against type and put her as Rose. She made
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: it to the Guinness Book of World Records for quote
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: longest TV career for an entertainer female. And yeah, a
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: lot of these characters, like Rose have had a huge
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: and lasting impact, right. Yeah. I think this is not
• 14:46
  Speaker 1: for today's episode, but there's definitely been some conversation about
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: how we cover older women's celebrities and their death versus men.
• 14:55
  Speaker 1: Different episode, But I did. I just wanted to talk
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: about one of the characters she played that I know
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: meant so much to so many people, and she did
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: it so well. She did it so well. She really
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: defined a whole new type when it came to characters
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: and being dizzy and who knows what, and and the storytelling.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you've seen the clips that were
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: as a way of a tribute to her when she
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: would add lib her stories and how amazing they were
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: and how amazing of an actress she really was. And yeah,
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: and the fact that she as an individual, a real person.
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: There's not a bad thing being said about her. That
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: everything she did was in defense of humanity or just kindness,
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: whether it was she was a huge animal activist, but
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: she was also very much into the anti racism work,
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: and she has been from jump when she was creating shows,
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: when she was creating as a young actress her own career,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: she stood by her beliefs and I love that. And yeah,
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: these these shows specific late at a time where yes,
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: I think we were at a different point in time,
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: but definitely more accepting of offensive jokes and offensive stereotypes.
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: They went against that. They did not play on those
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: and it's beautiful to see today. Yeah, I want to
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: watch it. I think I'll really like it. I think
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: you will too. Yeah, all right, well, who knows we
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: have another one. Your content is endless in the meantime, listeners,
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: if there's anyone else you think we should highlight in
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: this segment or any other segment, please let us know.
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: You can emails at Stuff Media, mom Stuff I Heart
• 16:38
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• 16:42
  Speaker 1: Things It's Always Starts. Super producer Christina, thank you and
• 16:45
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