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Shapiroworld by Strictly Business · Strictly Business

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You're listening to Strictly Business Podcast with Lindsay Williams.
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It's Monday, so it's time for Shapiro World with David Shapiro from SAS for
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Insecurities,
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and he's back on terra firma in Johannesburg.
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David, you've got a long trip to the United States.
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Just quickly sum up the mood there, if you would.
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We've done it a couple of times, but now you're back and you can look back.
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How do you feel about it?
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How do people feel about it?
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It's all politics.
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and it's so...
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When I say dynamic, I'm talking about, you know, there's so many different subjects
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that you have to discuss.
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I'm trying to summarize it in my head.
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People are turning to the right.
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There's no doubt that business now is significantly behind Trump.
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And I think you can understand why when you see the market up again today.
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They're making money.
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There are lots of deals taking place.
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Not so much pressure on regulation.
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so I think business has turned quiet.
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No one's willing to go at him if he does criticize them.
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So they tend to support whatever he does, you know, at a time where you need people
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to speak up,
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certainly against his attack on the constitution and, you know, weaponizing.
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I like that word.
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It's used a lot, you know, the judiciary and to all the state institutions, you
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know,
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particularly against his old neighbor.
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I mean, his old adversaries or even sometimes past supporters like Bolton.
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But I think that… And Comey.
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Comey and Bolton are the ones that he's got in his sights at the moment, aren't
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they?
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Yeah.
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So that kind of attitude, you know, you went for me, I'm going for you.
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And they try and find… He influences the institutions to take action against them.
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So, yeah, there's a lot to, you know, look into.
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But on the other hand, you've got the Democrats that are going nowhere.
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They've got no leader.
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They've got absolutely no leadership at all.
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So where I had the conversations in Boston,
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there's certainly a swing towards from center-left to center-right.
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I don't want to even call these people left, although Boston is a lot more left
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than New York.
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So you've got the markets moving.
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The economy is still a little slow.
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you know, needs interest rate cuts and everything.
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But politically, I think wokeism is dying.
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You know, no one focuses it.
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No one cares what you call them anymore.
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The thems and the that's and the those and, you know, all that nonsense.
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I think it's past its prime.
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But a lot of stories.
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But in New York, it's very interesting.
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You know, with Mondani now in the lead for the mayoral election.
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And this is a big story.
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You know, he's...
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What I find about New York is it's a rich city.
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Now, New York has always been a capitalist city.
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From the time that the Dutch bought it from the tribes, the Indian tribes, I
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don't know what they,
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you know, maybe for a bottle top or whatever they used to buy it.
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I mean, they bought it for nothing, which is today Manhattan.
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New York has always been unapologetically capitalistic.
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Yeah.
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And that's what it is.
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It's a rich city.
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And the concern is that this Mondami is, I don't know what definition they use for
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socialism.
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You know, he's left, but all his policies are very
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1960s socialist type policies.
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You know, look after the people, the downtrodden people who have been ignored
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and, you know,
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give them free education.
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Well, they do get free education, you know, but help them with free rides,
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with free groceries.
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You know, everything, all those socialistic policies that you've heard
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from the left before.
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The problem is that you do that, the taxpayers have to pay and they leave as
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they did during COVID.
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So there's a big outcry.
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You know, you don't want to bring, you don't want to.
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If there's an outcry, then don't vote for him.
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I mean, who's voting for him?
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The people that are going to get the free groceries.
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Yes, yes, yes, yes.
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That's exactly, you know, which is the Bronx and Queens areas, you know, Brooklyn
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areas of.
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Generally, lower income earners.
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So I watched it with great interest.
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But the big worry, and you've seen it in Joburg.
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You've seen it in Johannesburg.
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Joburg was a rich city.
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It was where industry took place here.
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This was the golden city.
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And you've seen what the ANC have done to it now.
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It's a poor city.
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It's falling apart.
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And the problem is when you start to turn the parks into...
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Either squatter camps, I don't think that's a politically correct word anymore,
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homeless camps or whatever you call them.
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But you're allowed to say anything you like.
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You just said so.
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Work is dead.
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No, what I'm trying to say is, you know, everybody puts nice words around these,
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but they're nothing more than, you know,
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squatter camps.
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No electricity, no sewerage, nothing.
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They just spring up with and it's a shame.
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You know, it's an absolute shame.
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But they convert green areas, growing areas, you know, and given the property,
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they'll just squat anywhere.
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And you see it all over Joburg wherever you go.
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You know, you run through parks, which might not be Give me an example because I
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haven't been to Johannesburg for
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ages and starting that sort of zoo lake area.
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Yes.
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Is that being used now as, let's call it temporary shelters?
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You'll find vagrants there sleeping.
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You know, many of the parks that I run through in the morning, you find vagrants
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sometimes in the gutters or the sluice,
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whatever you call them, the streams, you know.
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So there's plenty of people around here.
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I don't know.
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There's a park that I run through in Melrose, just off Turret Avenue.
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and that you know it's not It's not fenced in, it's not, but you'll find, and they're
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harmless people.
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I don't think they're necessarily going to attack you, but you don't know.
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You know, certainly there's a lot of crime around this area that I'm in now,
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simply because there's a big park which is monitored, which is guarded, but a lot of
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people go there,
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so they prey on the people going there.
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You know, it's...
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There's a lot of green around where I am,
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and you do find a lot of vagrants or homeless people sleeping there.
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But anyway, we've gone from the mood in the United States to harmless homeless
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vagrants in Johannesburg.
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I'm saying that if you don't regulate these things, in other words,
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if you… If you take away its richness, in other words, when you start to lower the
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bar,
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then the city starts to deteriorate.
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You know, it can come like a Detroit.
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You've seen it in many other large cities.
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I asked a chap in the same business as you, but just in a different form.
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He lives in Manhattan.
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And I said to him, what do you think about
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Trump? What do people that you speak to think about Trump?
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And he says they don't give up, you know what, as long as they're making money.
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They don't care in New York.
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That is what New York is all about.
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And that's what I've learned since I've lived here.
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And you're more or less saying the same thing.
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I'm saying the same.
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They carry on.
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But what they don't want is, you know, they don't want it to become,
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they don't want it to become poorer.
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They like it rich.
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You know what I mean?
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They like to have it rich.
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You know, they put up buildings, they put up new housing,
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the upper west, or sorry, the midtown is a better way.
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I would say from the 20s to the 40s, those are the streets, which has always been
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business.
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They're turning a lot of the office areas now into housing or into flats, into
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apartments and that.
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And demand is increasing.
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It's very difficult to get rentals now in Manhattan.
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So it does attract or it's re-attracting, if that's a word, because a lot of people
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left it COVID,
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quite a few people coming back in.
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So I spoke to a developer.
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Well, he's more a builder.
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He does renovations within the buildings and so on.
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He doesn't build anything new, but he'll come and do your kitchen or do your
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bathroom and things like that.
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He says he's never been so busy in his life.
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He's been incredibly busy.
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Here is a man.
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who came from Eastern Europe, and I think from Kosovo or somewhere around there.
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And he's done incredibly well working hard during the last 20-odd years,
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to a point where he's built an hour out of New York.
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He's built this fabulous home.
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He'll tell you that his kids don't do anything.
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He can't get them to work.
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But he worked like anything.
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But he's very, very busy.
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And you get your guidance from him how busy he is.
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and what he's doing, and he's telling us all the renovations he's doing.
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So things are happening, but you don't want this to go down.
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You know, you don't want to introduce socialistic policies and that and kind of
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degrade the city.
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So I think there's I might be exaggerating.
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You know, I might be kind of over the top,
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but you want to maintain Broadway.
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You want to maintain those areas.
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You know, at a high level, restaurants that people can go into restaurants, don't
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feel threatened.
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Remember New York in the 70s, how before Giuliana came in?
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It was a no-go zone.
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Yes, you don't want her to return to that.
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And that's a worry if you lose control or administration over the city.
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Right.
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So the other thing is, the other story, I mean, we're going on here, sorry,
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but the other story is
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I was asked by a friend to buy an Apple Watch.
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Where did you go, Fifth Avenue?
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And the reason is because...
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an Apple Watch here, the 17 Pro can cost you about R29,000, R30,000.
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Whereas in New York, the conversion is R21, which is the lower level here in
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Joburg.
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So this friend said, well, can you buy me that?
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You know, I was going to buy the 17, but for the same price, I can buy the upper
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one, you know, the better model.
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So I said, fine, you know, I'll go look around.
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In total, it comes to about a little under.
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$1,200.
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You can do your own conversion at $1,726, whatever it is.
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But anyway, that's not the story.
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The story is there are four big Apple stores in Manhattan.
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There's one about three blocks from where I stay and another one across the park,
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which is about a 15 to 20-minute walk away,
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not even.
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So I go in there, and this is the 17 Pro, which has just been released.
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I say there are three colors, blue, silver, they're all metallic and like an
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orangey color.
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So, you know, the gentlemen, they're very jacked up there because as you come in,
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they're ready to serve you and you don't have to go to a counter.
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Everything is done, you know, at the desk, wherever you are.
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They process the invoices, we pay, package, whatever.
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So he says, sorry, we're out of the two.
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I can give you the metallic orange or something like this.
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So I'm not sure.
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I was asked to get a blue one.
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I go back.
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And it's overnight, so I have to wait until the next morning, come back.
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Sorry, we're out of all of them.
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No more 250s, gone.
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But you can go to Fifth Avenue.
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Yes, at the top, that store which is underground.
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You go in the glass dome and then go underneath.
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That's the one I went to, yeah.
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Yeah, so I go there.
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I cross town, first of all.
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So I cross town, they go there, and someone greets me, and I said, okay.
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Um, you know, okay, I'm looking for a blue, sorry, we're out.
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I said, but they just said you've got, he says, look downstairs, look.
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Lindsay, I promise you there were four to 500 people in the store.
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Admittedly, it was a long weekend.
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And I said, is it all, you know, is this because of the long weekend?
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He said, no, it's always like this.
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So when I said, you know, where's the blue ones?
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This is gone.
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I said, why?
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Have a look.
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There were.
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Out of the silver, I had to take the orange.
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I just took one.
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But this thing has been out for over a month now, hasn't it?
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You cannot believe, you cannot believe the demand.
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And I was the oldest by probably 40 years.
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Youngsters, but packed, packed, packed.
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You know, I try to count, so I counted all the desks and how many people were around
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the desk.
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But I promise you, I estimate anywhere between 400 to 500 kids.
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or young people in the store.
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And I've just seen that Apple sales of this watch are up about 14% on the 16,
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this is the 17.
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But it's just something to behold, you know.
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And they handle all of them.
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You know, people are there, boy, they've got plenty of assistance.
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You know, I came out with it within 10, 15 minutes of the call.
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Maybe they should get more phones and less assistance.
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I mean, yeah.
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It's unbelievable what you just said.
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I suppose it will calm down.
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But then you're going into the Christmas period, and of course that won't… Yeah,
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yeah.
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That's exactly what they were saying.
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You know, just wait until you're going to get Black Friday coming up in November.
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You're also going into November, which is now they've brought Christmas forward.
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It becomes a very, very busy shopping time.
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I was also there.
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The other thing which is quite astonishing is just, you just see these little
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tricycles.
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Well, they're a little more complicated than a tricycle, but they're specially
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built for Apple.
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The whole day you've got these Apple, you know, delivering packages to the buildings
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in New York.
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And as I've said, I think before on the show, that our building had to introduce a
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new packaging system,
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you know, that scans and then tells you.
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sends a notice to your email that there's a package for you.
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But they're piled, and I'm a small building, relatively speaking, in New
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York.
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It's only 26 stories, and it's not, you know,
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but the number of packages that come in on a day-to-day basis from UPS, from all
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over,
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and super efficient.
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You know, whatever you order.
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is delivered within a day or so, maximum.
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You see the dynamics, how they've changed.
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And then you've got the groceries that come, anything that you want.
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The result is that there's a lot of retail space that has opened up,
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a lot of retail space as people have shifted
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towards e-commerce.
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uh especially on the upper width what you're saying is what you're saying is is
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is that the place is booming i mean okay there's a lot of tourists there
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that are doing it but um yeah i'm just looking now if you've maybe got the train
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down to birmingham alabama
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alabama they've got stock of the of the iphone pro iphone
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17 pro i've just had a look so you got what you got to do david is get a train
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down south to
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i mean to obviously across the whole country No,
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my daughter told me.
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She says, you're so dumb.
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Here we go.
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Yeah, go on.
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She says, you're so dumb.
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She says, you order it online.
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Exactly.
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And you go and collect it.
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That's why you haven't got it, because people have ordered it online.
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Exactly.
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And they take priority, unfortunately.
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You walking in, you're a second-class citizen.
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It's the online orders, David.
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Can we talk about markets, please?
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We had a wobble.
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Yeah.
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We had a wobble.
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The gold price went to $4,391.
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It went down to $4,251.
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That's nearly a $150 swing.
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It's shooting back up again today, up nearly
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2%. But there's these constant wobbles and people talking about an asset class called
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private credit,
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which has caused a couple of large-ish companies to go under
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in recent weeks.
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I don't know, what's the next wobble going to be?
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And will the next wobble be the one that doesn't recover quickly?
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You know, the headlines are all around wobbles.
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And there's virtually every major newspaper calling for,
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warning, sorry, warning about, and that included, what's her name, Gita
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Gopinath, if that's right.
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Yes, the World Economic Forum. I've been reading some of this stuff.
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No, no, she's the IMF.
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That's the same thing.
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I think deputy chief, CEO, I don't know what her exact title is, but she's number
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two there.
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And she wrote an article in The Economist, you know,
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warning that this could be a $35 trillion bubble simply because so many foreigners
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now own
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U.S. equities.
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And that's the reason is that their economies don't hold much hope.
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No, there's not much opportunity within their economy, so they shift to the United
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States.
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So, you know, in her world, she's concerned.
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But, you know, yeah, I have to take heed of the warnings and I'll watch very, very
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carefully.
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And yet today, you know, NASDAQ up another 1%.
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Results are coming out very positive.
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When you talk to the companies, The building of the infrastructure continues,
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the development of faster, better chips continues.
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All of those things are not stopping in any kind of way at all.
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And so I think there's, you know, how when that does come to an end,
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we're not quite sure, or whether it does come to an end.
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But certainly the media are, you know, are certainly pumping that side of it.
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It's, Lindsay, you've got to be, you never say never, and you don't want to be
19:05
arrogant, and nobody wants to be in that position.
19:07
And you always have to remain vigilant, and you've always got to remain on your
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toes.
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That's the market.
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It doesn't matter what you're trading in.
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You've been in markets, you know.
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You can't go back and say, no, I'll worry about this in a month's time or two
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months' time.
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So we're very conscious of every...
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every day of what it means comes out.
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The AI stocks have been very resilient.
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I watched the pricing video and it stays in the 180s no matter whether Trump's
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putting 100%
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tariff on China across the board, whether people are protesting.
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They said 7 million.
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Some other people said 2 to 3 million on the No Kings March.
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It doesn't matter.
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You can have as much social unrest as you like.
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And as many tariffs on China as you like, it's all absorbed by the companies that
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are importing the stuff.
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That's been proven already.
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Whether they can continue to do so, I don't know.
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But these things are going up because people know it's the future.
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OK, they're overvalued and they need to come back 10%, 15%, I would say.
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If you ascribe old valuation techniques like P-E ratios, David,
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that's what you were brought up on, wasn't it?
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I bet your father would turn in his grave if he saw his son invested in something
20:23
that's got something
20:25
like a what is Ford PE and video?
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Do you know?
20:29
Look, if you go one or two years forward, it's not that.
20:34
I mean, it's not ridiculous.
20:39
We don't know what the I'm going to look for you now as we talk.
20:43
I'm going on to fact test.
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And if I look at the Ford PE one year out on NVIDIA,
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if my internet would work a little faster here.
20:53
Yeah, you are.
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So the PE on NVIDIA two years Ford is 29.
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That's not bad.
21:00
One year Ford is 40, yeah.
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It's the same as Capitech, for example.
21:05
Yeah, it's not ridiculous.
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If you go to Microsoft or Alphabet in the 25, so these are not hundreds.
21:13
You know, they're not ridiculous.
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If you go to something like Palantir or something like that, that's ridiculous.
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You know, that's 600% or, you know, whatever it is.
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So, yes, the PEs are high, but the growth rates are around there.
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I reckon when we talk about...
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the bubble bursting, I would look for a 5% to 10% correction.
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Something like that is due relative to where we've been.
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And I don't think we'd be uncomfortable if we saw something like that happening.
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You want to get rid of those peripheral traders,
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all those people who have been over-speculating.
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You need to flush them out every now and again.
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So, um...
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It's, you know, I'm not saying it's going to happen.
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What might happen is that earnings catch up with PEs and, you know, nothing happens
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in the market.
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Earnings grow nicely, but the market price does nothing.
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That's also a way of correcting the market.
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But this, you know, you never want to say never.
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It's not going to happen this time.
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It's different.
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That's nonsense.
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You've got to remain vigilant and you've got to be aware of what is happening, what
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the news is.
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You've got to look at results.
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carefully you've got to look through them not through rose-tinted glasses you've got
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to look realistically you know through through what is
22:38
happening so um yeah but for the meantime we got another good day on wall street
22:43
today
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that's another good day everywhere gold price as i said so look at the bond market
22:50
look at the south african 10-year david yeah the the 52-week
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range on this thing is a high of 11.27%.
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It went to something like 11.07% after Liberation Day.
23:00
And it is now 8.90, 8.9015%.
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So let's call it 8.90.
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So let's go from 11 to 8.90.
23:09
What's that?
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That's 210 basis points.
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It's a massive, massive move for the bond market.
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Normally, conservative bonds have been tracking equities in terms of performance
23:22
in some cases.
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Everything's going up.
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Our market's dangerous, huh?
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The JSC is dangerous in the sense that if you look at what happened today,
23:33
platinum price down nearly 8%, you know, palladium price 9.5% lower.
23:40
I don't know what the news around that is.
23:41
Not at all.
23:42
That's been going down.
23:43
Because, you know, we've seen the silver price come back.
23:46
Gold is holding at 4, I don't know where you've got it, what's it, 4,000?
23:52
I've got on my CRB index, I've got it at, where's gold?
23:53
$4,327 up 1.3%,
23:59
$77.
24:01
And the high was $43.91 on Friday, or Thursday or Friday, whenever it was.
24:07
And that's when it came crashing down again.
24:09
So it had a big reversal day.
24:11
But goodness me, it's just...
24:14
For me, I can't get to the bottom of what's driving gold.
24:18
You can give me all the excuses.
24:20
It's not inflation.
24:22
It's not any of those kind of things.
24:25
Lindsay, what's also interesting, and if we go back,
24:31
because I'm trying to look at gold's performance and saying, why is it doing
24:36
what it's doing now?
24:38
If we go back or all the way back to, remember, the Thai baht and long-term
24:43
capital,
24:45
all those crises that we had that started there.
24:47
Remember that we had the internet bubble, then we had various wars, and then we had
24:53
07, 09,
24:55
the financial crisis.
24:57
We've had banking crises, European banking crises, all of those.
25:00
And in every one of those instances, gold at best was up maybe 30%,
25:07
something, you know, then came back or something.
25:10
It's nowhere near doubling that we've seen in 2025.
25:15
You know, so the 2025 doubling has kind of distorted
25:19
the long-term returns because you've got everybody saying yeah you know gold has
25:26
outperformed this but take
25:28
away this doubling it it's been a long time coming
25:31
Whether this can continue is very difficult because you can't get to the
25:38
bottom of why gold price is going up like
25:40
this.
25:42
And Lindsay, I'm no chartist.
25:44
I like to look at charts, but I don't draw lines and try and read various curves and
25:47
all the definitions
25:49
that you can use.
25:51
I can give you a whole string of ways to look at charts,
25:52
but I don't understand any of them other than the direction.
25:57
But if you look at gold shares like Angus, gold and goldfields, I mean, they look
26:04
scary.
26:04
They look seriously scary.
26:05
The gold price itself looks scary.
26:07
It's almost a straight line.
26:09
It's like a musk rocket.
26:11
What are you talking about, sir, the white metals doing so badly, David?
26:17
I don't know.
26:18
I've got platinum up on the day.
26:20
Which day are you looking at?
26:21
Are you looking at Friday or are you looking at today?
26:23
I think you've got some.
26:25
Either your screen's wrong or my screen's wrong.
26:27
Because platinum's up on the day-to-day.
26:31
Yeah, you know, it happens.
26:32
The one thing about FactSet that we use, their commodity pricing is terrible.
26:37
And that's why whenever we used to talk, I'd say, Lindsay, you tell me, because you
26:43
watch it, you've got a much better feel for it here.
26:45
I don't know whether they haven't got the right licenses or whatever it is, but I
26:49
never get the right prices.
26:51
If I do, I have to go into Bloomberg's, you know, I go onto my phone.
26:53
Look up the Bloomberg's app and get a much better feel for what's happening in
26:58
platinum.
26:58
Yeah, you have to.
26:59
For the miners.
27:00
That hasn't happened.
27:01
What you just said, they're actually, platinum's up and palladium's just
27:07
slightly weaker.
27:09
So I think you're being given duff information there.
27:12
Anyway.
27:13
It doesn't work.
27:13
You know, that's why I say I have to, the one thing that we can't get right on this,
27:18
you know,
27:18
where I fall behind and don't get the right price.
27:21
So I've got to use my app, my Bloomberg's app, to find the right, you know, when it
27:27
comes to pricing commodities and that.
27:29
Okay.
27:31
So nothing's changed, David.
27:33
We've had a tiny wobble again on Friday, and then we're back up again.
27:35
So it's all systems go.
27:37
And I don't know how many times we've said it, just stick with what you've got.
27:39
If you've got it and you like it, then stay with it.
27:42
That is the only thing I would say.
27:44
I've looked, you know, I try to do that all the time.
27:49
You know what I mean?
27:50
I try generally to say, okay, where should I go?
27:56
What should we do?
27:57
Where should we be?
27:58
Is there anything that I should be going?
28:00
And the more I look at Europe, the more I'm turned away.
28:04
They can't get their act right.
28:09
There's nothing to get excited about apart from, you know,
28:13
I always say the Netherlands is the only place where there's some really dynamic
28:18
businesses taking place.
28:20
Give or take something else in the rest of Europe, maybe one or two businesses.
28:24
UK, I don't know.
28:25
If it wasn't for the Premier League, I don't know what would hold the country
28:28
together.
28:31
So it's a difficult place to be.
28:35
And China, growth, he's battling along there.
28:39
Retail sales were down, investments falling.
28:43
Growth, what's it, 4.7?
28:45
I don't know how they manufacture that, whatever.
28:48
emerging markets, you don't want to be there.
28:52
And South Africa is vulnerable because take away what gold shares have done, take
28:57
away what
28:58
NASPERS process, which is more 10 cent, and take away, there's a few gold shares
29:04
and a few platinum shares.
29:06
The rest of the market is tricky,
29:07
although I see the weight of money is probably pushing into our market.
29:13
I don't find it appealing in any way at all.
29:17
Okay, well, we'll continue our chats on a Monday, David,
29:22
and we'll continue to say the same thing.
29:26
I'm glad you're back in Johannesburg, in a way.
29:29
How did you feel when you landed?
29:31
Last question, how did you feel when you landed at whatever the airport's called
29:36
now?
29:36
Oliver Tambo, isn't it?
29:37
Yes.
29:38
To be honest, you know what it is?
29:43
We've got these...
29:43
um You know, we've got these WhatsApp groups around our area.
29:50
Now, I'm at the Wanderers.
29:51
I stay in a nice little apartment here.
29:54
But it's a so-called wealthy area.
29:56
It's Melrose, Elova, Birdhaven, all of that.
30:01
Lindsay, I say this to you because you're not going to appreciate this.
30:06
When I left about a month ago to go to America,
30:11
the electricity was out here for four days.
30:14
People had to… take away they had to take anything that was in their deep freeze and
30:20
chuck it away
30:22
because it had all melted you know the
30:23
it's starting to rot huge amounts and uh you know we gave an instruction to the
30:30
lady works for us
30:32
just to just to give it away.
30:34
But the point is that every week since then, there's been further crises with
30:40
electricity.
30:42
But that's a local substation, right?
30:43
It's not an Eskom load shedding problem, right?
30:45
Yes.
30:46
It's not even load shedding.
30:48
It falls apart where the repairs can take anywhere up to six to nine hours.
30:53
Yes.
30:54
Now, it's not load shedding.
30:56
So load shedding, you'd go out for two hours, three hours.
30:59
Here you go out.
31:00
you know, until they repair it.
31:02
But it affects major areas.
31:04
It affects businesses within the area.
31:07
Then you've got the biggest problem of all is the water, which is an absolute
31:13
calamity.
31:15
The water system here is completely collapsing.
31:17
Every day there are pipes being burst, people out of water, and you just hear the
31:24
moans and groans of saying,
31:26
yeah, you know, posting, and that's Jobo.
31:30
It's really deteriorating.
31:32
That's what I'm saying when a rich city becomes a poor city.
31:35
Yes.
31:36
And that's why when I come back I say, am I really in the mood to handle all of
31:42
this?
31:43
I can't just brush it aside, just say no.
31:45
There's no one you can talk to, that's the other thing.
31:48
We've got to stop now, but there's no one you can talk to.
31:51
It's not like talking to your Apple person and them telling you to, well, it wasn't
31:57
them, it was your daughter.
31:59
or your granddaughter or whatever, telling you to order it online.
32:01
No one's got the answer because there isn't an answer.
32:03
There's no way you can stop these rotting pipes that have been there for a long time
32:08
and need replacing.
32:10
Anyway, we're moaning away here.
32:11
David, thank you very much.
32:12
There you are.
32:13
Thank you very much.
32:14
You asked me.
32:14
I said that's the one thing.
32:15
I want to know.
32:17
It's just sad to hear.
32:19
It's sad to hear about Joburg.
32:21
It's great to hear about New York.
32:23
When are the mayoral elections?
32:25
I said it was my last question.
32:26
No, no, within the last...
32:27
I think within two to three weeks.
32:30
Okay, we'll watch out for that.
32:32
And if it doesn't work in New York, he can come to Joburg, Mandani.
32:35
Everyone would love him here.
32:38
Well, that's what Trump is celebrating.
32:40
If he's elected, he says, because it'll turn the blue city into a red city,
32:44
meaning from Democrats to Republicans.
32:47
Yeah, very quickly.
32:48
Okay, David Shapiro is from Saxon Securities, and that was Shapiro World.
32:52
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32:56
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33:03
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