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Chris Watts Now Blames "Evil Outside Source" for Killing Pregnant Wife Shannan, 2 Tot Daughters · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. The so-called killer dad, the
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: family annihilator, Chris Watts, now blames an evil outside source
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: for the murder of his pregnant wife, Shanann, and his
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: two little-taught daughters, Bella and Celeste. An evil outside source.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: Who's that? The devil? Actually, no. It was you, Antonite,
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: a sick letter that Watts writes to his dead wife, Shanann,
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: to be read at her grave on her birthday. And hint,
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: it starts with, hey, boo. Good evening. I'm Nancy Grace.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: being with us.
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: I'm calling because I'm concerned about a friend of mine,
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: but she won't answer the door.
• 1:06
  Speaker 3: She won't answer phone calls. She won't answer text messages.
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: And I'm just really, really concerned.
• 1:11
  Speaker 4: All the girls' blankets are gone.
• 1:13
  Speaker 3: Their blankets, they sleep with.
• 1:14
  Speaker 5: They don't leave anywhere without them.
• 1:17
  Speaker 6: I didn't think any time that could happen was the
• 1:19
  Speaker 6: last thing I'd ever do it, but I did.
• 1:20
  Speaker 7: I looked at her, and I just hung on top
• 1:24
  Speaker 7: of her, and I put my hands around my wife's neck.
• 1:30
  Speaker 6: I'm just like this is a horrible horrible thing like
• 1:32
  Speaker 6: how dare you you know and people aren't gonna understand
• 1:35
  Speaker 6: that you know they're gonna say oh you know you're
• 1:39
  Speaker 6: the woman that had an affair with this man who
• 1:41
  Speaker 6: took out his whole family and i take a step
• 1:45
  Speaker 6: back and it's just like.
• 1:48
  Speaker 8: I didn't know like i i uh it's.
• 1:53
  Speaker 9: It's He's so disgusting. I'm so ashamed of him and everything.
• 1:59
  Speaker 6: And I just, I saw a report that was like
• 2:04
  Speaker 6: this woman who's 15 weeks pregnant and her two daughters
• 2:08
  Speaker 6: are missing.
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: And I was like, whoa, what? And I was just, like,
• 2:16
  Speaker 3: so floored.
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: And I read a couple other articles.
• 2:19
  Speaker 9: Just to make sure that, you know, all the newspapers are.
• 2:22
  Speaker 4: And, like, just double-check, like, am I really reading this right?
• 2:25
  Speaker 7: And I'm like, okay.
• 2:26
  Speaker 6: And he had told me previously, like, she said she's
• 2:30
  Speaker 6: pregnant with another man's kid, but he'd said, like, he
• 2:34
  Speaker 6: could kind of tell in North Carolina. But that girl is, like,
• 2:39
  Speaker 6: obviously pregnant. I mean, in her photos, I mean, 15 weeks,
• 2:43
  Speaker 6: that's like four months. I remember talking to Chris during
• 2:47
  Speaker 6: this time and it was like all texts. I did
• 2:50
  Speaker 6: not talk to him on the phone at all on Tuesday.
• 2:54
  Speaker 6: And I was pretty upset where I was just like,
• 2:57
  Speaker 6: you know, I was going back and forth, like, where's
• 2:59
  Speaker 6: your family, this and this and this. But I'm like,
• 3:01
  Speaker 6: she's pregnant, you know, and this and this. And he's like,
• 3:05
  Speaker 6: the baby's not mine. The baby's not mine. And I'm
• 3:08
  Speaker 6: just like, you told me yesterday that you think that
• 3:14
  Speaker 6: when she said that she cheated on you, she did
• 3:16
  Speaker 6: it out of spite.
• 3:17
  Speaker 9: And he was like, yeah. And I'm like, so that
• 3:19
  Speaker 9: is your kid.
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: That is Nicole Kessinger. And I just want to make
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: sure I heard something correctly. Is she actually worried about
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: about how the brutal murders of Shanann Watts, Bella, and
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: Celeste will make her look. Let me hear that one
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: more time.
• 3:38
  Speaker 6: I'm just like, this is a horrible, horrible thing. Like,
• 3:40
  Speaker 6: how dare you? You know, and people aren't going to
• 3:43
  Speaker 6: understand that. You know, they're going to say, oh, you know,
• 3:47
  Speaker 6: you're the woman that had an affair with this man
• 3:49
  Speaker 6: who took out his whole family. And I take a
• 3:53
  Speaker 6: step back and.
• 3:54
  Speaker 9: It's just like, I didn't know.
• 3:58
  Speaker 3: Like, I, I, ugh.
• 4:01
  Speaker 9: It's, he's so disgusting. I'm so ashamed of him and everything.
• 4:07
  Speaker 6: And I just.
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, he's disgusting. But you knew he was married and
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: that did not stop you from hooking up with him
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: everywhere you possibly could. Every nook and cranny possible. You
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: knew he was married with children. But you also sent
• 4:25
  Speaker 1: a lot of sexy selfies. Oh, wait, that's not a selfie.
• 4:28
  Speaker 1: There's Watts in the background. This is during his marriage.
• 4:32
  Speaker 1: But you know what? I could talk about the relationship,
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: if you want to call it that, with Nicole Kessinger
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: all day long. First, Chris Watts' freaky letter that he
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: once read to his wife at her grave. Let me understand.
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: Dave Mack joining us, Crime Stories investigative reporter. What?
• 4:58
  Speaker 5: When I was looking at this letter, Nancy, I almost cried.
• 5:00
  Speaker 5: All I could think of is what this man did
• 5:03
  Speaker 5: to his pregnant wife and his two little girls and
• 5:08
  Speaker 5: that he would have the temerity, whatever you want to
• 5:10
  Speaker 5: call it, to write this letter. He's in prison for
• 5:14
  Speaker 5: killing them and he writes a letter like they're alive
• 5:18
  Speaker 5: and like they're going to go to dinner this Sunday.
• 5:21
  Speaker 5: It is the most, it's crazy, Nancy.
• 5:24
  Speaker 1: It's sick. Okay, let's take a look at the letter.
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: Chris Watts' letter to his wife's grave. Dear Shanann, hey boo! Okay,
• 5:37
  Speaker 1: stop right there. Stop right there. To Dr. Sue Kornbluth
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: joining us. And boy, do we need to shrink. She's
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: a family relationship expert, owner of Dr. Sue and You
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: and author of Building Self-Esteem in Children and Teens. Dr. Sue,
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: did I just read correctly? Hey, boo, happy birthday. He
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: murdered them. He brutally murdered his pregnant wife. She had
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: coffin birth after he put her in a shallow grave. Post-mortem,
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: after death, she expels baby Nico, who would have been
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: their first and only son. He did that. Then he
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: murdered both Bella and Celeste. Can I see Bella and Celeste, please?
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: That video, I have them singing. He murdered the two
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: little children one by one and stuffed them in oil
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: containers that were so narrow it pulled the skin off
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: their arms. Okay, Dr. Kornbluth. Hey, boo.
• 6:43
  Speaker 10: Happy birthday.
• 6:44
  Speaker 1: Happy birthday. I'm not a shrink. I'm just a JD.
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: But what is that?
• 6:51
  Speaker 8: You don't need to be a shrink to understand this
• 6:54
  Speaker 8: because it's absolutely despicable and disgusting.
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: I don't know what world he.
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: Is living in, but it is not a world that
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: any of us are living in.
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: This whole thing is just despicable. It was premeditated, I believe.
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: And all this guy cares about is nancy is his
• 7:14
  Speaker 2: self and that is what you are seeing.
• 7:16
  Speaker 3: Here in this letter that he wrote and starting.
• 7:20
  Speaker 2: Out with hey boo like oh nothing happened you know
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: and i love you and i love these kids and
• 7:28
  Speaker 2: i did nothing like this is beyond delusional this guy's
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: mind must be so sick inside and he thought that
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: he could get rid of his whole family and have
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: whatever the hell he wanted in life.
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: And it is horrific. And he should be in prison forever.
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: Because look at those two children's beautiful faces and his
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: wife and what he did here.
• 7:59
  Speaker 3: He's acting as if nothing has happened.
• 8:02
  Speaker 2: To me, this isn't about mental health. This is about
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: a guy that knew exactly what he was doing.
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: Let's take a look at this letter. And it's my
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: understanding to Sherilyn Cato, who originally obtained the letter. Let
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: me go to Sherilyn very quickly. She is the author
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: of The Murders of Christopher Watts and The Many Faces
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: of Christopher Watts, a five-year update. One book wasn't enough
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: to cover this guy. The books are amazing, Sherilyn. You
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: obtained this letter. How did you get this letter?
• 8:35
  Speaker 7: He sent it to me. He said this is what
• 8:38
  Speaker 7: he also sent to his mother to read at the
• 8:42
  Speaker 7: gravesite on Shanann's birthday.
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: Let's take a look at the letter. Dear Shanann, hey boo,
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: happy birthday. 36 years young. You're two years older than me.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: You didn't like that too much, but I liked messing
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: with you. Okay, you know what? Right there. Right there.
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: To Philip Dubé joining me. He is a veteran defense
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: attorney out of the L.A. jurisdiction. Philip Dubé, you know
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: people that go, now, I'm just kidding. And then they
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: say something horrible. Here we go. You didn't like, he says,
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: you didn't like that too much when I continued to
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: joke with you about you're two years older than me.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: But I liked messing with you. Sounds like a bully.
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: I know this gets you upset. But I'm going to
• 9:32
  Speaker 1: do it anyway because I've killed you and there's nothing
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: you can say about it.
• 9:37
  Speaker 4: I don't think that's what's going on at all, to
• 9:40
  Speaker 4: be honest with you. Remember where we started from. This
• 9:43
  Speaker 4: is a man who is clearly mentally ill. And I
• 9:46
  Speaker 4: think what he is trying to do is build a
• 9:48
  Speaker 4: case that is trending toward a writ of habeas corpus
• 9:52
  Speaker 4: to set aside the plea. He has nothing to lose
• 9:55
  Speaker 4: at this point because on the date of his plea,
• 9:59
  Speaker 4: the death penalty had not been repealed yet in Colorado.
• 10:02
  Speaker 4: So he got a deal of life without parole. But
• 10:05
  Speaker 4: fast forward two years, the governor, Polis of Colorado, he
• 10:09
  Speaker 4: repealed the death penalty. So now he could get a
• 10:11
  Speaker 4: free trial assuming he can prove up his incompetency at
• 10:15
  Speaker 4: a habeas hearing. So frankly, I think it's legally brilliant.
• 10:19
  Speaker 1: To Dave Mack, Crime Stories investigative reporter, incompetent insanity. Well,
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: he was competent enough to lie and blame Shanann for
• 10:31
  Speaker 1: Bella and Celeste's death. Remember this?
• 10:33
  Speaker 11: She heard them like that.
• 11:06
  Speaker 4: So Dr.
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: Kornbluth, he has the wherewithal to lie and claim that
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: Shanann is the one that killed Bella and Celeste. And
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: then out of anger, he killed her. That was his
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: first story before he told the truth.
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: And because of that, it says to me that he
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: knew exactly what he was doing. So this claim of
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: mental illness, I don't buy it. And if you look into.
• 11:31
  Speaker 8: The history of people that kill others, you will find
• 11:36
  Speaker 8: that there is a pattern of some kind of trauma
• 11:40
  Speaker 8: that happened within that family.
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: That doesn't mean.
• 11:44
  Speaker 8: that every time someone develops a mental illness from that, okay?
• 11:50
  Speaker 8: So when we're throwing around the name mental illness here,
• 11:54
  Speaker 8: let's be sure about what we're saying, because in this
• 11:57
  Speaker 8: particular case, it seems that this was planned, it was plotted,
• 12:02
  Speaker 8: he knew what he was saying, and now he's changing
• 12:05
  Speaker 8: things and acting like he was the best husband on earth,
• 12:10
  Speaker 8: probably to get himself another trial.
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: But what mental illness does he have? Because is it schizophrenia?
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Is it delusional disorder?
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: Just because now he's saying that he heard the devil
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: tell him to do this. So they better start doing
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: some evaluations here to figure out what is going on.
• 12:32
  Speaker 3: Cause I don't buy this at all.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: Oh, you're edging dangerously toward a Clancy style murder. claiming
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: a psychotic break. Philip Dubé is the one that stirred
• 12:56
  Speaker 1: the pot on this. Let's put up his words, not mine,
• 13:01
  Speaker 1: for my list. Need to only do Saturday through July 4th.
• 13:05
  Speaker 1: Let's see his list. Here's a person that Dubé says,
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: Is insane. Sell the house? I guess he got that
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: idea from Scott Peterson. He tried to sell his house
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: that he shared with Lacey and their unborn son Connor.
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: And he tried to sell Lacey's car while she was
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: quote missing. Call to daycare? Read info. Because he's going
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: to have to call daycare to cover the fact that
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: the children are not showing up. Shred in truck? Shred what?
• 13:37
  Speaker 7: What?
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: Holiday programs center. What, he's going to have to change
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: the holiday programs? Shut down Facebook. File for the children
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: and conversations. Make a list of plan Y. This is
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: his murder to-do list. Store the lawnmower.
• 14:01
  Speaker 7: Whoa.
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: Gas up the tank for Sunday to go dispose of
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: the bodies. So, Philip Dubé He's making a meticulous murder
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: to-do list, but yet you're claiming he was insane?
• 14:13
  Speaker 4: I'm not saying it's a winner, but that's where he's trending.
• 14:17
  Speaker 3: It's pretty obvious.
• 14:18
  Speaker 4: When you look at the timeline of when Governor Polis
• 14:22
  Speaker 4: repealed the death penalty, it was conveniently after the plea.
• 14:26
  Speaker 4: And he then commuted all death sentences that were retroactive
• 14:32
  Speaker 4: to the new bill repealing the death penalty to life
• 14:36
  Speaker 4: without parole. So I think what he's trying to do
• 14:39
  Speaker 4: is get a free trial. He's got nothing to lose.
• 14:42
  Speaker 4: Does it mean it's a winner? Of course not. I mean,
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: if I were defending him.
• 14:45
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't take the case. Dubé, Dubé, when you first
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: brought up insanity and incompetence, you acted like you believed it.
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: But now that I've shown you his meticulous to-do list,
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: remember she was killed on Monday, and this is in
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: the days leading up to that. That is his murder
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: to-do list. Now that you've seen that, you're like, okay,
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: so I can't plead insanity or incompetency because the guy's
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: making lists. So now what? You say, oh, yeah, well,
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: I really didn't mean that. Let's take a look at
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: the letter Sherilyn Cato, author of The Murders of Christopher Watts,
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: managed to get her mitts on. You're 36 years young. No,
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: she's dead. You killed her. And yet, even in death,
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: he rubs it in that she's older than him. There's
• 15:31
  Speaker 1: so much I wish I could say to you and
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: make up for what I did to our family. No
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: one needed to go through this. You and our babies
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: had a long life ahead of you, ahead of them,
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: and deserve to see that life. But then he suddenly
• 15:46
  Speaker 1: starts talking about himself. I promise the man you married
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: isn't the man who turned his back on his family.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: That man was an aberration brought on by an evil
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: outside source. What? Here we go. Sherilyn Cato. He's actually
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: blaming an evil outside source for the murders of Bella, Celeste, Shanann,
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: and baby Nico.
• 16:18
  Speaker 7: That's correct. He is. And, you know, to go further
• 16:22
  Speaker 7: with that, he, he even kind of plotted that with me. Uh,
• 16:27
  Speaker 7: he's sent me one letter where he talks about being
• 16:30
  Speaker 7: visited by demons, um, in the form of his grandparents.
• 16:35
  Speaker 7: So he took quite a lengthy detail where he was
• 16:42
  Speaker 7: trying to let me know that he felt possessed and
• 16:47
  Speaker 7: he felt like a devil made him do this. He
• 16:50
  Speaker 7: went to sleep at night. All the lights in the
• 16:52
  Speaker 7: house were off. He wakes up a couple hours later,
• 16:56
  Speaker 7: all the lights in the house were on. All of
• 16:59
  Speaker 7: this was demonic. And he wasn't himself. In fact, he
• 17:04
  Speaker 7: even states that as he was choking Shanann, it was
• 17:08
  Speaker 7: like something was on top of him, holding his hand
• 17:11
  Speaker 7: to her neck and making him kill her, that it
• 17:15
  Speaker 7: wasn't him, that it was something that made him do it.
• 17:18
  Speaker 7: So this goes more with, you know, blaming something else.
• 17:23
  Speaker 7: Sometimes it's Nicole that he blamed and other times it's
• 17:27
  Speaker 7: Shanann that he blamed and other times it's the devil
• 17:30
  Speaker 7: that he blames.
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: Uh oh, I smell a rat because this sounds like
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: he is sitting behind bars, Philip DeBay, and he's watching
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: the Lindsay Clancy trial. He's like, what? Darn, that could
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: have worked. Psychotic break. Now he's talking about being possessed
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: by a devil.
• 17:56
  Speaker 4: Well, it's not as if he has postpartum psychosis. I mean,
• 18:00
  Speaker 4: that wouldn't work for obvious reasons. But nonetheless, it could
• 18:03
  Speaker 4: really be that he had psychopathic sort of dark triad
• 18:08
  Speaker 4: narcissistic traits that went undetected pre-plea. And now you want
• 18:12
  Speaker 4: to work that up on a habeas petition. You never know.
• 18:15
  Speaker 4: It might land him a new trial. Does it mean
• 18:18
  Speaker 4: it's a winner? Of course not. But again, he has
• 18:20
  Speaker 4: nothing to lose because the death penalty has been repealed.
• 18:24
  Speaker 4: in the state of Colorado.
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: Remember, you've got to quadruple homicide, including the feelings. Did
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: you actually say that he had, quote, dark triad narcissistic traits?
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: Yes.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: Is that a thing? What is that dark triad?
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: Oh, it is a combination of narcissistic personality disorder with
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: psychopathic traits and sort of a Machiavellian personality. And it's
• 18:54
  Speaker 4: basically marked by.
• 18:56
  Speaker 1: But none of those are insanity.
• 18:58
  Speaker 4: Well, it's a delusional disorder.
• 19:00
  Speaker 7: I mean, Dr.
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: Sue Kornbluth, the dark triad narcissistic traits, what is he saying?
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: Because narcissism is not insanity. Histrionic is not insanity. Nothing
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: he just said is insanity.
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: These are personality disorders.
• 19:17
  Speaker 8: And most people that have narcissistic personality disorder.
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: do feel like they are above everyone else.
• 19:23
  Speaker 8: But many people that suffer from that do not go
• 19:27
  Speaker 8: and kill their family in the way that this was done.
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: I mean, if you want to argue anything, you can argue.
• 19:35
  Speaker 2: He's a psychopath or a sociopath, but not a narcissist.
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: I mean, to me, again, what we're seeing here.
• 19:45
  Speaker 2: I'm not a lawyer, but I think the mental health
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: argument is just off the charts right here in terms
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: of what.
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: Has happened especially Nancy.
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: That you have shown us a list a list so
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: was the devil telling him to make that list too
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: I mean come on he's.
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: Got a lot of devil talk Dr. Kornbluth because not
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: only does he say an outside evil Source is responsible
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: for the three murders. He also says Nicole Kessinger, the mistress, was, quote,
• 20:18
  Speaker 1: of dark, evil spirits akin to Jezebel, another biblical reference.
• 20:26
  Speaker 12: She is of evil spirits like Jezebel. The words of
• 20:29
  Speaker 12: a harlot have brought me low. Her flattening speech was
• 20:32
  Speaker 12: like drops of honey that pierced my heart and soul.
• 20:35
  Speaker 12: Little did I know that all her guests were in
• 20:38
  Speaker 12: the chamber of death. How did I let this happen?
• 20:41
  Speaker 12: The blessings you have bestowed upon me were right in
• 20:43
  Speaker 12: front of me, and I still followed the perfume of
• 20:46
  Speaker 12: a strange woman.
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: The perfume of a strange woman. I don't think that's
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: what he was after, not her perfume. That said, back
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: to the letter from Cheryl and Cato she managed to obtain.
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: I promise you the man you married is not the
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: man who turned his back on his family.
• 21:04
  Speaker 8: Yes, he is.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: That man was an aberration brought on by an evil
• 21:08
  Speaker 1: outside source. Aberration means out of the norm. His cheating
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: and wanting to be out of the marriage and not
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: have children was a constant with him. Now listen, he's
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: acting like she's alive. You know the husband and dad
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: I am and would testify to that today if only
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: I hadn't killed you. I look outside my window and wonder,
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: what would we be doing today? Then I get this
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: overwhelming feeling you're looking at me with our baby saying,
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: we love you. Dave Mack, is this real? Did he
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: write this? What did he want done with this letter?
• 21:49
  Speaker 5: Nancy, he wrote that letter, sent it to his mother,
• 21:53
  Speaker 5: and asked her to read it at the graves of
• 21:57
  Speaker 5: his wife and two babies.
• 22:00
  Speaker 1: All of you are a blessing to my life. And
• 22:04
  Speaker 1: your memory lives in my soul every waking moment.
• 22:08
  Speaker 4: Really?
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: Because didn't he just get a jailhouse mistress, Dave Mack,
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: give her an engagement ring, which may have been Shanann's,
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: and then call the whole thing off because his mommy
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: told him to?
• 22:19
  Speaker 5: Yeah, that and, well, he actually had two reasons for
• 22:21
  Speaker 5: calling off the wedding to Lizzie. One, that mom told
• 22:25
  Speaker 5: him to. And the other was that, well, God wasn't
• 22:27
  Speaker 5: behind it. You know, God didn't want me to do it.
• 22:30
  Speaker 5: This is something he allowed.
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: To take place for a long time. Since when did
• 22:33
  Speaker 1: he listen to God?
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: Exactly.
• 22:35
  Speaker 5: There's that whole.
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: Ten Commandments thing, thou shalt not kill. But now he says,
• 22:41
  Speaker 1: where did that get into the Ten Commandments? Thou shalt
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: not get a prison mistress and marry her. I don't
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: recall that, Philip DeBay.
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: Well, that's what hyperistophilia is. There's this whole phenomenon of
• 22:51
  Speaker 4: women and other romantic interests who want to hook up
• 22:54
  Speaker 4: with prisoners and inmates doing life. And He's got nothing
• 22:59
  Speaker 4: to lose. If he can have conjugal visits, love interests.
• 23:03
  Speaker 1: Are you blaming the women? They're all Jezebels. Wait, they're all, quote,
• 23:08
  Speaker 1: of dark evil spirits. Man, you and watch you get together.
• 23:12
  Speaker 1: You have a lot in common when it comes to
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: views on women. It's the woman's fault. Did you just
• 23:17
  Speaker 1: actually say the women have a disorder? You did. I
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: heard you.
• 23:22
  Speaker 4: It's not just women. Hybristophilia could also be men who
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: go after female inmates. It could also be the LGBT
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: plus community that's drawn to inmates. It just it crosses
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: all gender and orientation lines. So it doesn't surprise.
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: But in this case, it is women. And you are
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: blaming them, whoever they may be, man, woman, doesn't matter.
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: Instead of him, don't you see? You know what? Never mind.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: Back to the letter. All of you are a blessing
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: to my life. Your memory lives in my soul every
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: waking moment. I close my eyes and I imagine the
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: light of, oh, he's dragging God into it again. God
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: shining across your cheeks. The love you felt down here
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: won't compare to the love you feel up there. Wait,
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: is he somehow taking credit for her feeling love? He's
• 24:14
  Speaker 1: dragging God in, God's love. God is like, I do
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: not want to be part of this. I've dedicated the
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: rest of my life to showing the love he has
• 24:22
  Speaker 1: shown me. Really, Dave Mack? Tell me some more about
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: the jailhouse mistress.
• 24:28
  Speaker 5: Well, Nancy, you know, he started seeing Lizzie, and Lizzie
• 24:32
  Speaker 5: actually changed her last name to Watts, if you remember.
• 24:35
  Speaker 5: And she then relocated to Wisconsin so she could be
• 24:39
  Speaker 5: closer to the prison so she could see him more often.
• 24:42
  Speaker 5: But what most of us really remember about Lizzie there
• 24:46
  Speaker 5: is that on the day after the anniversary of the murders,
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: Chris Watts was seen in serious PDA, public display of affection,
• 24:56
  Speaker 5: making out with Lizzie in the meeting area where you're
• 25:00
  Speaker 5: allowed to have visitation. And it was so despicable and
• 25:03
  Speaker 5: disgusting that many people were talking about it, that how
• 25:06
  Speaker 5: could he do that on the day after this anniversary date?
• 25:10
  Speaker 5: But beyond that, She had changed her entire life, moved
• 25:13
  Speaker 5: to Wisconsin, changed her name, and then he called.
• 25:17
  Speaker 1: Off the wedding. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
• 25:30
  Speaker 7: End of letter.
• 25:31
  Speaker 4: Cheer me on.
• 25:33
  Speaker 6: Right.
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: This is to Shanann, Bella, Celeste, and baby Nico. Cheer me... Me, me, me, me, me, me,
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: me on as I walk the path God is putting
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: right in front of me. I love you all to
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: the moon and back. Love, Chris. Okay. Reality check. To Dr.
• 25:53
  Speaker 1: Jessica Dwyer, joining us out of Dallas, Director, Chief Medical Examiner,
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: Southwestern Institute of Forensic Science. Dr. Jessica Dwyer, speaking of them,
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: in death, cheering him on. What exactly did he do
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: to Shanann, Bella, and Celeste?
• 26:18
  Speaker 11: Well, there's a lot to unpack here at first. You know, really,
• 26:20
  Speaker 11: I think where everybody should start is even just considering
• 26:23
  Speaker 11: what the scene looked like. You have three individuals all
• 26:27
  Speaker 11: within a same geographic area. One is buried, and then
• 26:31
  Speaker 11: two children are dumped into separate oil tanks, and that
• 26:36
  Speaker 11: alone is just very jarring and heinous. Now, when you
• 26:42
  Speaker 11: talk about what the findings were, even from the autopsy,
• 26:45
  Speaker 11: there were findings of manual strangulation in Shanann. And then
• 26:50
  Speaker 11: there were findings to support asphyxial deaths for the two
• 26:53
  Speaker 11: little girls. Now, the condition of the two little girls'
• 26:57
  Speaker 11: body might have hindered to say specifically how that asphyxiation occurred,
• 27:01
  Speaker 11: whether it was strangulation, smothering with a blanket, even strangling
• 27:06
  Speaker 11: with a blanket. but also the condition of their bodies
• 27:08
  Speaker 11: really inhibited a true portrayal of what might have actually occurred.
• 27:14
  Speaker 11: But regardless, they're both dead. Shanann is dead. And even
• 27:20
  Speaker 11: when you consider asphyxial deaths, there's inherent pain and suffering
• 27:24
  Speaker 11: that goes with that. Because if you think the victim
• 27:27
  Speaker 11: is feeling that life leaving them, and it's a very
• 27:31
  Speaker 11: up-close and personal death, between the victim and the suspect,
• 27:35
  Speaker 11: you know, especially with strangulation or even if you think
• 27:38
  Speaker 11: of smothering, you know, that requires hands. So you have
• 27:42
  Speaker 11: to be up close and personal with this person and
• 27:45
  Speaker 11: actually see the death occurring. You know, it's a weird way,
• 27:49
  Speaker 11: a weird analogy to make, but if you think shoot
• 27:52
  Speaker 11: somebody from across the room, shoot them in the head,
• 27:54
  Speaker 11: they're instantly unconscious. But that's a very different set of
• 27:57
  Speaker 11: circumstances as to what you see with these three victims.
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: What exactly happened to the girls when they were shoved
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: into the oil receptacles?
• 28:10
  Speaker 11: You know, whatever is in these oil tanks, you presume
• 28:13
  Speaker 11: it's oil and whatever other debris there may be equivalent
• 28:16
  Speaker 11: to like a trash can almost. And so you have
• 28:19
  Speaker 11: these small apertures at the top of each of those
• 28:22
  Speaker 11: oil tanks that I'm sure required some manipulation of those
• 28:25
  Speaker 11: little girls' bodies to actually get them into those oil tanks. Um,
• 28:31
  Speaker 11: It's just hard to even imagine him trying to get
• 28:33
  Speaker 11: those lifeless bodies into those tanks, but I'm sure it
• 28:36
  Speaker 11: required some degree of effort.
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: It ripped the skin off their arms, Dr. Jessica Dwyer,
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: and the tanks were about this wide, about eight inches wide,
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: yet he shoved the girls down those receptacles.
• 28:56
  Speaker 11: It just shows that the presence of oil in the stomach...
• 29:00
  Speaker 11: just shows that there is submersion in this oil. And
• 29:05
  Speaker 11: also from what was described in Bella's autopsy report, she
• 29:09
  Speaker 11: had these abrasions or scrapes on her back that looked
• 29:15
  Speaker 11: post-mortem and maybe from his efforts to actually get her
• 29:19
  Speaker 11: body into that oil tank through that small aperture. So
• 29:24
  Speaker 11: truly thinking about this objectively, I don't think that, at
• 29:28
  Speaker 11: least for Bella, that she might've been alive when she
• 29:31
  Speaker 11: went into oil, into the oil tank. But again, the
• 29:34
  Speaker 11: condition of their body is really hard to say. But
• 29:37
  Speaker 11: the one thing I do also want to point out
• 29:38
  Speaker 11: is one of those girls had to watch her sister
• 29:41
  Speaker 11: and probably her mother be killed and disposed of. And
• 29:44
  Speaker 11: that alone is something really hard to sit with.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: And could you explain, Dr. Dwyer, what is coffin birth?
• 29:54
  Speaker 11: So this is, like you had mentioned earlier, a post-mortem
• 29:57
  Speaker 11: artifact specifically for Shanann. I mean, all three of these
• 30:01
  Speaker 11: victims had features of decomposition, and specifically a type of
• 30:05
  Speaker 11: decomposition we describe as putrefaction. So after you die, we
• 30:10
  Speaker 11: all have microbes that live in our systems, but when
• 30:13
  Speaker 11: you die, those microbes have a chance to do their thing,
• 30:16
  Speaker 11: take over. So one of the byproducts of fermentation, which
• 30:20
  Speaker 11: is what microbes like to do, is they produce gas.
• 30:23
  Speaker 11: So you get these gaseous distinctions of the soft tissues.
• 30:27
  Speaker 11: And because of that, it can actually cause insides to
• 30:33
  Speaker 11: expel out through orifices. And in this instance, the uterus
• 30:36
  Speaker 11: was actually expelled with the fetus. It's very graphic, but
• 30:40
  Speaker 11: it is a post-mortem artifact.
• 30:43
  Speaker 10: My daddy is a hero. He helps me grow up strong.
• 30:50
  Speaker 10: He helps me on snuggle too.
• 30:55
  Speaker 8: He reads me books.
• 30:57
  Speaker 10: He ties my shoes. If you're a hero, blue and blue,
• 31:06
  Speaker 10: my daddy, daddy, I love you.
• 31:11
  Speaker 1: To Sherilyn Cato, joining us, who has visited extensively with Watts,
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: wrote The Murders of Christopher Watts and The Many Faces
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: of Christopher Watts. Two books. One wasn't enough to cover
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: this guy. What is he thinking about writing this loving letter,
• 31:31
  Speaker 1: it's anything but loving, to Shanann, Bella, and Celeste, and
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: baby Nico, and having his mother go to their graves
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: and read it on Shanann's birthday? What?
• 31:43
  Speaker 6: Why?
• 31:45
  Speaker 7: Well, my opinion, um, is because he wanted people to
• 31:51
  Speaker 7: think better of him. He sent me that letter. Actually,
• 31:54
  Speaker 7: there were several that he sent me. He also wrote
• 31:56
  Speaker 7: one to the girls on their birthday. And he sent
• 32:00
  Speaker 7: me those letters because he knew we were writing the
• 32:04
  Speaker 7: book and he wanted them published in the book because
• 32:07
  Speaker 7: he wants people to think what a nice guy he is.
• 32:11
  Speaker 7: I know that sounds ridiculous, but he really did.
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: He thrived.
• 32:16
  Speaker 7: On being the nice guy, the guy that everyone loves, the, the,
• 32:20
  Speaker 7: the one that just put up with so much, um,
• 32:23
  Speaker 7: out of this marriage. And he just, he's so delusional.
• 32:26
  Speaker 7: He doesn't see himself for what he is. He went
• 32:29
  Speaker 7: through an extreme amount of time there where it was
• 32:32
  Speaker 7: just poor me, you know, I'm just such a good person.
• 32:35
  Speaker 7: Look what's happened to me. Um, and so those letters
• 32:39
  Speaker 7: were for attention. Those were, I think they were just
• 32:43
  Speaker 7: to kind of show off, um, Look at me. I'm regretful. I,
• 32:48
  Speaker 7: you know, I'm remorseful. I, you know, love my family
• 32:52
  Speaker 7: so much. It was this demon that had a hold
• 32:55
  Speaker 7: of me and I didn't know what I was doing. But,
• 32:58
  Speaker 7: you know, now I'm come back to reality and I
• 33:03
  Speaker 7: want you to feel sorry for me. That's basically what
• 33:06
  Speaker 7: he was doing by sending me those letters, I believe.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: When you stay, he kept... recounting what he, quote, endured
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: during the marriage. What does he think he endured?
• 33:19
  Speaker 7: Well, he writes to me about how he put up
• 33:23
  Speaker 7: with so much, am I saying the word right, demasculation
• 33:29
  Speaker 7: or whatever, that Shanann tore him down constantly. He said
• 33:33
  Speaker 7: he couldn't even hang a picture on the wall without
• 33:35
  Speaker 7: being there.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: Put up, Sherilyn, please. Emasculation, you mean while she was
• 33:40
  Speaker 1: out making all the money, And bringing it home and
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: designing the home and giving birth and making the meals
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: and the fairy book home. She went to great lengths
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: to do that. She did all that. And he's claiming
• 33:56
  Speaker 1: that emasculated him. In other words, cut his balls off.
• 34:01
  Speaker 7: Yeah, exactly. So he would talk about how they would
• 34:04
  Speaker 7: have dinner parties and he was expected to take all
• 34:08
  Speaker 7: of the children and and go upstairs with them and
• 34:10
  Speaker 7: stay while the adults had dinner. He gave many instances,
• 34:14
  Speaker 7: which I don't even think they were true, but he
• 34:17
  Speaker 7: gave many instances how he was treated like this. And
• 34:20
  Speaker 7: so it drove him outside of the home. And he
• 34:27
  Speaker 7: ran into this Jezebel that took it from there, I guess.
• 34:31
  Speaker 7: And she was evil also.
• 34:33
  Speaker 1: I thought they met online. Wait, was she a coworker?
• 34:37
  Speaker 7: She was a co-worker.
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: She was a co-worker. But isn't it true that he
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: met all kind of women online?
• 34:42
  Speaker 7: Yeah, he did have some dating sites he was on.
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: Well, that's certainly putting perfume on the pig. Now I
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: am hearing tonight for the first time, Sherilyn Cato has
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: letters he wrote to his dead daughters that he murdered.
• 34:58
  Speaker 1: I wonder if they start with, hey, boo. At this hour,
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: we understand that Chris Watts is considering having his plea,
• 35:08
  Speaker 1: his guilty plea, reversed. A la Brian Koberger? Good luck
• 35:15
  Speaker 1: with that. Tonight, we remember an American hero, Deputy Sheriff
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: Francis Blake, Burnett County Sheriff, Texas, killed in the line
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: of duty, leaving behind his wife, now widow, Tanya, and
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: four sons. American hero, Deputy Sheriff Francis Blake. Thank you
• 35:36
  Speaker 1: to our guests, but especially to you for being with
• 35:38
  Speaker 1: us tonight. It never ends with Chris Watts, does it?
• 35:42
  Speaker 1: Nancy Grace signing off for tonight, but God willing, I'll
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: see you tomorrow night. Until then, good night.