Latest / The Junto Podcast / E18: Analyzing Law Enforcement Training Deficiencies with Ricky Robinson

Transcript

E18: Analyzing Law Enforcement Training Deficiencies with Ricky Robinson · The Junto Podcast

• 0:00
  Music.
• 0:10
  Hello, America. Welcome to the Junto Podcast, where we promote the practical
• 0:15
  applications of critical thinking and bold creativity.
• 0:18
  I am your host, Edgar Mills. Thanks for joining us.
• 0:22
  Music.
• 0:29
  Thanks for listening. This is episode 18, entitled Law Enforcement Training
• 0:34
  Analysis with my friend, Ricky Robinson.
• 0:36
  I'm going to let Ricky tell you a little bit about his
• 0:39
  background and then we're going to going to kick it off go ahead
• 0:42
  Ricky well let's say November 6th
• 0:46
  of this year I'll be going into my 25th year of being
• 0:49
  a mandated officer a lot of what I do now is focused on training I work for
• 0:54
  Georgia Northwestern Technical College where I go in and help with the academy
• 0:58
  classes and help with training our campus officers and our our armed security
• 1:03
  officers and weapons retention and things of that nature so that's kind of where I'm at right now.
• 1:09
  All right. Right on. All right. So good people.
• 1:13
  What we're going to address here today is, well, our analysis of the state of
• 1:20
  law enforcement training, mostly as it relates to lethal, you know,
• 1:25
  firearms training and stuff like that.
• 1:26
  And we'll talk about some other things. But what I want to juxtapose that to
• 1:30
  is my background is the soft truths and special operations forces all across, you know, the force,
• 1:39
  there are five soft truths and everybody knows these within the force.
• 1:45
  And number one is humans are more important than hardware.
• 1:49
  And I don't think I need to elaborate on that too much.
• 1:52
  Obviously, individual judgment and individual training is the thing that matters
• 1:57
  above and beyond sexy equipment and technology and all those things.
• 2:03
  So humans are more important than hardware. The second one is quality is better than quantity.
• 2:09
  In the conventional army, man, it's all about numbers, recruiting,
• 2:13
  recruiting, recruiting.
• 2:14
  And I get a strange feeling that cops are like that too.
• 2:18
  Standards tend to lower so that we can get more and more and more.
• 2:22
  I think a small, better trained force is just more effective.
• 2:29
  That's it. Unless, of course, you're in a war of attrition. You know what I'm
• 2:33
  saying? Right. But that's not, that don't relate to the police.
• 2:37
  And then the third soft truth is special operations forces cannot be mass produced.
• 2:42
  Well, that applies, I think, directly to cops.
• 2:46
  Whenever you try to mass produce, churn out people, numbers, numbers, numbers.
• 2:52
  The standards hurt. The quality goes down. That's just it. That directly supports the second soft truth.
• 2:59
  The fourth soft truth, competent special operations forces cannot be created
• 3:04
  after an emergency. It's too late.
• 3:08
  If you weren't prepared and you're not ready, it takes time to create well-trained dudes.
• 3:14
  That's all there is to it, or gals. And then finally, and this one was an addition
• 3:21
  within the past 10 or 15 years, most special operations require non-SOF assistance.
• 3:29
  So read that as support and enablers.
• 3:34
  And in the special forces business, that means EOD personnel or additional intelligence personnel.
• 3:45
  And if you're a company, if you're a special forces company,
• 3:48
  you're going to deploy with a couple of supply guys, for instance.
• 3:54
  So narrowing that down to police, I think how that might apply,
• 3:59
  especially with, like, intelligence, right?
• 4:02
  I don't know how detectives, they kind of build their own things.
• 4:05
  Well, you know, they'll go out and build cases and stuff.
• 4:08
  But we also have the agencies, they'll have programs where they can,
• 4:12
  you know, if they're looking at something specific, they can pull up a program
• 4:18
  that'll tell them, hey, this is something that's been going on in this area.
• 4:22
  It's very similar to what you have going on. So they can look harder into it.
• 4:25
  I think probably some of those big, like LA probably has an intelligence section.
• 4:29
  Yeah. As far as around here, you don't have anybody that's just stuck as an
• 4:35
  intel analyst. You're going to have your detectives, your patrol officers, and your admin.
• 4:40
  So juxtaposing those soft truths to a modern law enforcement,
• 4:45
  and not just SWAT folks, I'm talking about everyday cops, patrolmen, whatever you call them.
• 4:52
  These things, I think, directly relate because they speak to the need for a
• 5:00
  good selection process.
• 5:01
  Can't just hire anybody off the street.
• 5:04
  No. Well, you got to have an aptitude, right, for...
• 5:07
  Allegedly. A lot of... Allegedly. Allegedly. Right.
• 5:10
  And then sort of a continuous training mindset, which...
• 5:16
  In the military, yeah, we kind of get that. Whether it's organizational or formalized
• 5:24
  at the schoolhouse, we kind of get that.
• 5:26
  I think cops would benefit from that.
• 5:30
  And then that selection process and that continuous training kind of leads to
• 5:36
  a culture of high performance.
• 5:40
  And that's what I think a police chief should want out of his folks.
• 5:45
  Yeah. If I were a chief, I'd say, okay, we're 19 people short.
• 5:51
  But I don't just want somebody who can pin on a badge and hold up a uniform.
• 5:56
  I need somebody that's competent, capable, and willing to go out there and do
• 6:00
  the job and physically able to do the job.
• 6:04
  And there's your physically able to do the job. Not just fitness.
• 6:07
  Yes, fitness, but technically able to.
• 6:10
  Technically able to shoot you. I posted a thing on Instagram.
• 6:12
  Did you see the thing I posted?
• 6:14
  The officer had the gun holster upside down on the belt. Yes, yes.
• 6:19
  And I looked at that and I'm like, I'm trying to give the benefit of the doubt
• 6:23
  that maybe they were into something and didn't realize their holster got turned
• 6:29
  upside down, but it's hard.
• 6:30
  Ricky, I thought that too, man. I thought, oh man, that officer got,
• 6:34
  something started happening, they grabbed their belt, threw it on upside.
• 6:37
  Nah, that holster was routed through the belt. And I was like,
• 6:41
  I didn't get to look at it like for too long.
• 6:45
  So I didn't get to critique it that much, but I was like, yeah,
• 6:48
  maybe they just, I don't know.
• 6:50
  It's, it's hard to say. I mean, if you, it's not hard to find,
• 6:55
  like you'll see an administrator from one of these really big departments that's
• 7:00
  going out for their photo op and, and.
• 7:04
  Their gear, you can tell they haven't worn it in so long that it's not in place
• 7:08
  where it should be. It's probably their assistant going, here, put this on. Yeah.
• 7:13
  And they're so disconnected from where they're at in admin to what's happening out on the road.
• 7:18
  They can't even put the gear on right now. Now, look, I'm kind of making fun
• 7:21
  of cops right now, but there was a photo that was on, like, the Navy Times or something.
• 7:28
  There was like a commander out on a boat and he was shooting a rifle and it
• 7:32
  was like a Trijicon or something.
• 7:36
  Some bitch was mounted backwards. Yeah. I've seen that. You remember that one? I've seen that. Yeah.
• 7:40
  And we just pontificated on how many dudes got fired over that,
• 7:44
  making him look like a jackass.
• 7:46
  There's no telling. But I mean, he was the final stop on that, right?
• 7:51
  Right. You should be able to look at your equipment and go, that don't look
• 7:53
  right. If you look through a scope and everything gets smaller, you're doing it wrong.
• 7:58
  Again, that's, that's where we talk about the, uh, the photo opportunity and
• 8:02
  it, it doesn't go over well. That's right.
• 8:05
  All right, folks. So overall, what we're going to talk about,
• 8:09
  yes, we are going to talk about, we're going to examine and analyze training deficiencies.
• 8:15
  Good and bad, not just deficiencies, but good stuff too.
• 8:19
  We're going to try to talk a little bit about some cultural attitudes,
• 8:22
  things that Ricky sees from his perspective.
• 8:25
  Things i've seen from other cops that i know that he that he knows and then
• 8:30
  we're going to try to offer some positive actionable reasonable solutions to
• 8:37
  the things that we come up with.
• 8:41
  So we'll jump into current training and standards so you're working at northwest
• 8:47
  now you're you're right there on the yeah ground zero yeah and and you know
• 8:53
  i i go up and i'll teach pit and and we We just got,
• 8:56
  we've got a new class starting in a week or so.
• 9:01
  And, you know, they'll send out the calendar. Where do you want to teach?
• 9:03
  Or what can you help teach? And, you know, I pepper that thing.
• 9:07
  I try to teach everything I can.
• 9:10
  But with the new curriculum, now it's 809 hours. Now it's doubled.
• 9:17
  So you got 20 weeks, a little over 20 weeks. Some academies are a little bit
• 9:21
  longer. Like Cobb counties will be a few weeks longer.
• 9:23
  Yeah. And, you know, that's their departmental academy, and it's a really good one.
• 9:29
  But they have expanded a lot of the curriculum into stuff that now you're not
• 9:33
  getting sent back to your agency and you're having to find this training that's
• 9:36
  in the academy, which is good. Like, you know, they're going over active shooter response.
• 9:40
  They're getting, you know, a fair amount of training in that that they might
• 9:45
  not get immediately upon returning to their agency.
• 9:49
  Crisis intervention is a it's a 40 hour class. It's mandated by the state that
• 9:53
  everybody has to take us, you know, dealing with mental health people who are
• 9:58
  in crisis. Yeah, that's a tough one, man.
• 10:01
  It is. And it's funny. And I've always looked at it like this.
• 10:05
  You know, you'll see this new class that comes out and it's mandated by the
• 10:08
  state that, you know, you as an officer have to take.
• 10:12
  And it's like, man, something comes out and there's a problem and it's give it to the cops.
• 10:16
  Let the cops deal with it. Well, that's what my son and I, my son's a firefighter and a paramedic.
• 10:21
  Right. And we've discussed like roles and responsibilities, like at what point as a cop.
• 10:28
  All right what is your role in dealing with
• 10:31
  somebody who's meant like yeah maybe a crime has been
• 10:33
  committed sort of but like this dude's mentally off right well here's the other
• 10:39
  problem is you know a number of years ago like northwest regional they shut
• 10:45
  it down yeah used to be if somebody was going through a mental crisis or if
• 10:50
  they're just having a mental breakdown,
• 10:52
  and a doctor signed a 10-13 on them, put them on a 72-hour hold,
• 10:56
  they'd pick up the phone, hey, we need a bed for this patient.
• 10:59
  The ER would call, hey, can you transport this patient over to Northwest?
• 11:03
  You'd take them over there, they'd go in, they'd have professional medical staff,
• 11:08
  psychologists, and everything else.
• 11:10
  Now we don't have that around. And like proper security guys. That's right.
• 11:13
  And now it is like pulling teeth to try to find a facility somewhere just to
• 11:21
  get somebody on a 72-hour hold
• 11:22
  that can, you know, have that kind of treatment that they need. But...
• 11:29
  And you'll read the comments in the newspaper. You know, somebody will get locked
• 11:32
  up for this and goes, oh, he's got mental health problems.
• 11:35
  Well, you can't just let them go back out in society. At least at the jail,
• 11:39
  they have mental health people up there that can come and see them. Right.
• 11:44
  And at least they're going to be where somebody can keep an eye on them,
• 11:47
  where they're not going to hurt themselves or somebody else. Yeah.
• 11:49
  And it's a double-edged sword. It really is. It's tricky, man,
• 11:53
  because me, I'm no fan of the state in general.
• 11:57
  Everybody knows I'm a libertarian. kind of anti-state as
• 12:00
  it were but if you
• 12:03
  got somebody who's now you
• 12:06
  may or may not you're not qualified probably to assess somebody's mental
• 12:09
  you can pretty much tell when somebody's acting crazy but do
• 12:13
  you really know history and background and all those things you don't no you're
• 12:17
  unless it's somebody that you've dealt with time and time again and that you
• 12:21
  know is like a legit paranoid schizophrenic or or somebody that's extremely
• 12:26
  bipolar and there are those people out there that they may only want to talk
• 12:31
  to one officer that they've dealt with before.
• 12:33
  And that might be the only officer that can, can deal with it. Yeah.
• 12:36
  And if that officer ain't working, what do you do? You know,
• 12:40
  you have to look at all your options.
• 12:43
  That whole mental health thing is very tough, man.
• 12:46
  Because that's a delicate, even nevermind crime, that's a delicate,
• 12:50
  delicate situation anyway.
• 12:53
  Yeah. Now we're talking about holding somebody for 72 hours.
• 12:57
  If they're not mentally well we don't law
• 13:01
  enforcement officers they're not the ones that will will do
• 13:03
  a 10 13 that's got to come from a doctor that's got to be a doctor
• 13:06
  yeah or and and this i don't like this two family members can go to the courthouse
• 13:12
  and say you know jim bob is off his rocker and we need him evaluated and we'll
• 13:17
  go pick him up on a 72 hour hold if the judge believes him and haul him off
• 13:21
  that's all that's this that's the standard two family members yeah.
• 13:26
  Oh, man. That is...
• 13:28
  I don't know if I like it. The last I have heard it is that,
• 13:31
  and that's not been too long ago that I've heard that.
• 13:35
  But again, with law enforcement, policy, and everything, everything changes.
• 13:39
  Yeah. You know, that's why you got legal updates. Well, I don't know much about
• 13:42
  these red flag laws, but that's pretty, it's seemed like a pretty horrible bar
• 13:49
  to set to go take somebody's guns.
• 13:52
  Well, you know, I can say as far as a 10-13 goes, I know judges are very,
• 13:56
  very mindful of signing those to where if I take somebody to the hospital that's
• 14:01
  just wigging out, a doctor can look at them and go, something's not going on.
• 14:05
  But as far as red flag laws go, here's my stance on that.
• 14:12
  Somebody don't like you, and they go tell somebody, hey.
• 14:16
  I'm scared. Edgar is, I'm scared of Edgar because, you know,
• 14:20
  Edgar is this well-trained guy and he's, he said something that I didn't like.
• 14:25
  And if somebody believes him, somebody will knock on your door.
• 14:28
  Well, I'm going to tell you this.
• 14:30
  Don't ask me to come to Edgar's house or anybody else's house and knock on the
• 14:34
  door and say, we need your guns because somebody's afraid of you or somebody
• 14:37
  thinks you're going to hurt yourself.
• 14:38
  Well, Ricky, that's, that's kind of one of those halfway jokes I tell when I train with cops.
• 14:42
  Right. But hey, if you come around here, the first four guys are out of luck.
• 14:48
  Yeah, I mean, I get it. And there's not. But yeah, that's a bullcrap standard.
• 14:54
  Let's get back on. Let's stay on track for current training and standards.
• 14:59
  So describe to me real quick.
• 15:02
  What does active shooter training look like in the academy?
• 15:06
  Well, it's all about how you respond to an active shooter, and it is not stand outside and wait.
• 15:13
  Right. Now, you just hit the punchline for me.
• 15:17
  I'm going to say this. I hate to. I'm going to go ahead and throw them under the bus.
• 15:21
  Uvalde and that dude down in Florida that was listening to kids get killed.
• 15:24
  So it would take God himself to come down from the heavens and stop me from
• 15:30
  going and stopping somebody that's killing kids. Right, exactly.
• 15:33
  So here's my stance on that, is that if you ain't willing to run into that danger
• 15:39
  to save kids, you're in the wrong job.
• 15:42
  I agree with you. That's it. You shouldn't be a cop. I don't care what the Supreme
• 15:46
  Court's already stood on that.
• 15:49
  Well, I don't know about the Supreme Court. district courts have said you as
• 15:53
  a cop don't have to put your life in danger to save someone else when i worked
• 15:58
  for rome pd i went through active shooter and we were on the range doing some drills,
• 16:03
  and and i tell this story to everybody i'm not going to say the dude's name
• 16:07
  he's no longer in law enforcement it's a really good thing but everybody that
• 16:10
  knows me is going to know exactly who i'm talking about this was somebody that
• 16:15
  had been at the city a lot longer than me Closing in on like 20 years.
• 16:20
  And the instructor, John Walters was the instructor at the time.
• 16:25
  And I don't mind saying his name because, you know, he's, you know.
• 16:30
  He's a, he's a hundred percent sheepdog. He's going to do what it takes to get
• 16:33
  things done. He's retired now. Right.
• 16:36
  But he's like, look, something happens over here at Rome High and say somebody
• 16:42
  did, you know, have a homemade bomb that went off, but now they're in there killing kids.
• 16:48
  Edgar, this officer at the time said, those are not my kids.
• 16:52
  I'm not going in there. Oh no.
• 16:54
  And you, you, you'll have to, you'll have to forgive me or bleep it out.
• 16:58
  I looked right at him and I said, I will shoot you in the fucking back on my way in. Yeah.
• 17:04
  That's a shitty thing to say. And that alone probably. It pissed me off because
• 17:07
  I got kids in the school system. They don't go to Rome.
• 17:09
  Exactly. They're in the Floyd County school system. I'm like,
• 17:11
  you're a freaking coward.
• 17:13
  And that, I mean, does that warrant disciplinary action?
• 17:18
  I would definitely put his ass in the chair, though. I wouldn't.
• 17:21
  Well, he got fired. Oh, well, good. There we go. All right. Fair enough.
• 17:24
  You don't need to be in this job, man. That's right.
• 17:28
  Golly. All right, so unless you're giving away some TTPs and you're supposed
• 17:32
  to, what are the recruits or the cadets? Is that what they're called?
• 17:38
  Yeah, just boots, rookies. What do you call them? Well, we just call them students, really.
• 17:42
  Students. Oh, man. Okay, we can't haze. It's a lot, you know,
• 17:47
  it's a lot different now from where it used to be paramilitary police academy to where now it's not.
• 17:56
  Well, I noticed that there are several, like the years is at a college.
• 18:00
  My son, who's a firefighter now, he went to a police academy in Florida.
• 18:05
  And it was like Hillsboro State College.
• 18:08
  When I went to the police academy, it was in Kay Spring, Georgia,
• 18:12
  at the Georgia School for the Deaf.
• 18:13
  They give us a, they give them a couple of classrooms down there.
• 18:17
  Yeah. And, you know, that's where he's at.
• 18:20
  And, you know, been a long time. But you have, like Cobb County, they have their own.
• 18:25
  Then you have regional police academies that JIPSTIC, the Georgia Public Safety Training Center, have.
• 18:33
  Throughout the state. And then you'll have, like Georgia Northwestern,
• 18:38
  they have their own academy.
• 18:40
  And when the students come through that academy, and a lot of them,
• 18:43
  I don't say a lot of them, some of them, usually two or three of a class,
• 18:47
  will pay their way through the academy. And the rest of them are being sent there by their agency.
• 18:52
  Sponsored, yeah, by an agency. And when they're done, they get so many hours
• 18:58
  toward an associate's degree.
• 18:59
  Yep. So that's another benefit of that. No, that's good.
• 19:04
  As far as how that goes, it's kind of irrelevant to me is where they were training.
• 19:11
  But what I do know is that none of the curriculum are the same.
• 19:15
  There's some mandated stuff, right? But if you go to Cobb County and you go
• 19:19
  to Georgia Northwestern or you go to- It's going to be very similar.
• 19:23
  It's going to be very similar because the academy that we teach is approved by Post.
• 19:30
  And you've got to teach what Post says you have to teach.
• 19:33
  Every academy's got to teach what Post says you have to teach.
• 19:37
  So it is pretty much standard. So it's pretty uniform across the board.
• 19:40
  Okay. Now, like Cobb County, they may say, okay, our academy's 24 weeks long.
• 19:44
  But during that academy, they're going to cover more of their policy.
• 19:47
  And they're going to do their agency policies. As long as you cover what Post,
• 19:51
  then you can have your other stuff. You've got to cover that 809 hours that
• 19:54
  Post says you've got to cover. Yeah, yeah.
• 19:56
  Well, that makes sense. Yeah, so it's very uniform across the state.
• 20:01
  That's good. Well, that's something that bothered me, and I'm glad to know that
• 20:05
  it is at least somewhat standardized.
• 20:07
  Yeah. That way, every cop. Now, that's not to say anything about tactics,
• 20:12
  techniques, and procedures on the objective or on the scene or whatever,
• 20:16
  but at least you guys are all getting the same information up front.
• 20:20
  Right. And, you know, we were talking about expanded training.
• 20:23
  Like, now, defensive tactics is two weeks long instead of three or four days. Okay.
• 20:30
  Firearms is almost three weeks long now because we do pistol,
• 20:35
  rifle, and shotgun. Yep.
• 20:38
  And also, you know, they have to qualify on the state test.
• 20:43
  But then, you know, we're doing other stuff with tactics.
• 20:48
  And I'm using the term we loosely. I see a lot of the firearm stuff,
• 20:52
  but technically I can't teach it until I get done with my firearms class at the end of the year.
• 20:58
  Well, we both know that the qualification is at the low end of the shooting skills spectrum there.
• 21:06
  There's been a lot of talk about that, not just with the instructors at Georgia
• 21:11
  Northwestern, but in my speaking with a lot of them that I know throughout the
• 21:16
  state is, you know, they dropped the 25-yard line.
• 21:20
  Yeah. And so, you know, you're shooting...
• 21:24
  15, 7, and 3. Well, you know, as well as I do at 3 yards, 3,
• 21:28
  7, 15, you don't even have to aim.
• 21:31
  And, you know, coming out here at the pistol workshop, you know, we shot out to 55. Yeah.
• 21:38
  And you're right. The closer you get after that, that target looks really big. Yeah, yeah.
• 21:42
  And what's being found is that you're having people who are not very strong
• 21:47
  shooters who are eking by and making that 80% to qualify when,
• 21:52
  if you put the 25 in there and they got to shoot six rounds
• 21:55
  from 25 they're going to drop those rounds yeah and they're
• 21:58
  either going to have to force themselves to get better or they're
• 22:02
  going to have to come back so yeah it's pretty low standard for shooting and
• 22:07
  i don't know and that and it's you know and i hate to say it and it may chap
• 22:12
  some people's rear end that you know put it out there but it we're talking about
• 22:16
  a low standard and it's just target shooting you got Yeah, you're not even...
• 22:21
  All the time in the world to shoot, you know.
• 22:23
  I had a sheriff deputy jailer come down from Chattanooga, kind of nervous about
• 22:31
  passing the upcoming qual.
• 22:33
  And I was like, okay, well, what's the time standard at this yard line?
• 22:37
  Just looked at me and blinked. I was like, what do you mean time standard? There's no time.
• 22:43
  Okay, well, so you got all day? Yeah. I was like, well, okay.
• 22:47
  Well, that changes things, but...
• 22:49
  You've got 30 rounds to score 80% on 15, 7, and 3.
• 22:55
  My mother-in-law, who's 63 years old. I know.
• 22:59
  And, you know, I brought her out here that one day, and she's gotten so much more confident.
• 23:04
  She likes shooting that 19, but I put a Glock 48 in her hand.
• 23:07
  She controls it a lot better. She can get all the way around the grip.
• 23:11
  And she shoots 95% on the GDAC. She's 63 years old.
• 23:19
  Never, wasn't even comfortable with following. Ladies and gentlemen,
• 23:23
  if you're a police officer right now, listen to this.
• 23:26
  She's what? 60 what? 63 years old. 63 year old mom.
• 23:32
  Nervous as hell. So she, yeah, you remember. Yeah. When we brought,
• 23:36
  when I brought her. And now she's shooting a 90 something.
• 23:40
  She shoots, she shoots between 90 and 95% every time. And there's cops out there failing it. Oh my gosh.
• 23:50
  And that's madness, man. And, you know, some of my, you know,
• 23:54
  who are capable of shooting and they shoot really well and they can shoot semi fast.
• 24:00
  When it comes time for the, this is the one that's going to pass or fail you.
• 24:04
  They're like, they're standing on the line shaking sometimes.
• 24:08
  So that's the thing to me. And
• 24:11
  I know, you know, probably the council of elders have got to bless off.
• 24:16
  But to have a higher standard to qualify with time standards, man, time standards.
• 24:23
  I think there's too much time. I think that could be adjusted.
• 24:29
  I would like to see the 25-yard line be put back in there.
• 24:33
  And, you know, we can practice them at that. We can train them at further distances.
• 24:40
  But I would like to see that come back as part of the qualification.
• 24:43
  Yeah, for sure. And I think with, you know, in my talking to other people,
• 24:47
  I think with what we're seeing, I think it'll probably...
• 24:51
  I think it'll probably come back. I don't know when, hopefully sooner than later.
• 24:57
  So the Georgia, the GDAC or the Georgia, the post is what it is, whatever it is, right?
• 25:03
  That's what's got to pass the academy.
• 25:08
  But can you not build a curriculum to train at a higher standard?
• 25:13
  And that way, you know what I'm saying? Like who sets up the curriculum?
• 25:18
  So the curriculum comes from post.
• 25:20
  Post sends out the curriculum and says this is this is what has to be done to
• 25:25
  pass yeah you know and we do and what we found with the last one the last class that went through was,
• 25:33
  if we qualify them early
• 25:36
  and they're like okay i'm done i'm
• 25:39
  qualified then they lose interest on the tactics portion of stuff
• 25:42
  so now they're going to have to go through all the
• 25:45
  tactics portion of everything and the qualification will
• 25:48
  be the very last thing they do that way they're forced to
• 25:51
  keep interest well look man in the army you do a diagnostic pt
• 25:55
  test for whatever and then you do one for
• 25:58
  record right so whether they pass a diagnostic or
• 26:01
  not it's irrelevant you you got to pass the one for record that's
• 26:03
  right you know i'm saying you got well so do that you know it's like as soon
• 26:08
  as they pass that qualification it's just like i'm ready to move on and so i'm
• 26:14
  assuming then that was by the way you laid that out that tactics is not a pass
• 26:19
  fail thing no it's not and.
• 26:23
  And i don't know i don't know,
• 26:26
  how it would go over trying to implement something like that,
• 26:29
  or if folks would be on board with saying, hey, you need to be able to shoot.
• 26:32
  Well, how would you quantify tactics, man?
• 26:35
  So I tell you how. You run through a scenario, and you have marksmanship problems
• 26:41
  in there to solve, and you solve them under time, you know, in a house with furniture and things.
• 26:49
  Yeah. And no shoot targets. That's something else to look at.
• 26:54
  Could we get access to a shoot house? because we don't have one,
• 26:57
  or could we get the funding to build one?
• 26:59
  If we could build one, I'd be all for it. Well, I got news for you, bud.
• 27:02
  The SIMs or the UTM are plenty accurate in a house. So we have some SIM stuff that we're using.
• 27:10
  You know, run off gas, shoot BBs and stuff. Was that the unit system? What is that?
• 27:17
  It's one of the Glock blue guns. I'm not really sure. I mean,
• 27:22
  so UTM specifically, I know is accurate.
• 27:26
  You know, you could probably, no, it's not pinpointing. I think we just got a UTN.
• 27:35
  Ultimate Training Munitions is the name of the company. I think we just got
• 27:38
  one of their AR-style rifles in to try to use, where it's got actual detachable mag and stuff.
• 27:44
  Well, they got bolts for the ARs.
• 27:47
  All you got to do is take your bolt out. Okay, so this is a totally different
• 27:50
  one. So that might be simunition that you're talking about.
• 27:52
  Well, I'll find out exactly what it is that way. I mean, Glock has guns, too.
• 27:58
  I think only law enforcement can purchase those, in fact.
• 28:01
  Well, not in fact, I think. Yeah, so how would you quantify?
• 28:06
  So tactics is not even a pass-fail, it's just...
• 28:09
  It's familiarization. Familiarization. And what kind of scenarios are you running in there?
• 28:16
  I haven't really been there too much for that. Like I said, I get to see the
• 28:21
  aftermath and get to go over the critiques and stuff.
• 28:25
  But because I'm not an instructor in that, I don't get to be out on the range.
• 28:29
  I see exactly what's going on with that.
• 28:32
  That's interesting, man.
• 28:35
  Definitely when i when i get to get through my firearms it school which hopefully will be,
• 28:42
  should be sometime coming up in the fall yeah and i
• 28:45
  get to see more of that you know we can go over that and hopefully
• 28:49
  it's something that's i have confidence
• 28:52
  in what the guys up there now are doing i
• 28:55
  mean they're very competent instructors so i i
• 28:58
  have confidence that they're running them through real world
• 29:01
  type stuff because they do get to use the blue
• 29:05
  guns and run scenarios wearing their face shields and stuff
• 29:07
  i do i do know they're doing that and well
• 29:10
  that's let's get it and i'm i want to say i think they're setting up something
• 29:14
  in the bay because it looked like when i was down there last time that they
• 29:17
  had some stuff set up so they could run some stuff in a big open bay yeah what
• 29:22
  you know and that's better than not doing anything of course we got like the
• 29:25
  fire tower down in the bottom that I think they probably used.
• 29:29
  Well, I think the Northwest, the campus that got shut down, we were using that
• 29:35
  for training for a while, but I think they're starting to look.
• 29:39
  Oh, Georgia, Georgia regional, the middle hospital. Yeah.
• 29:43
  I did a couple of courses in there. I did some with cops and did some with some
• 29:48
  cops from out of town and did one of my, my own courses in there.
• 29:52
  Yeah. I'm not sure what they, what all they have planned. It's awesome training.
• 29:55
  Is too, they're going to turn it into an office park or a industrial park.
• 30:00
  But right now, as it is, man, so much training opportunity. Right.
• 30:06
  Because there's houses on the outskirts that are all normal.
• 30:09
  I mean, they're old houses, but they're still houses.
• 30:11
  Yeah. I think there used to be staff housing back in the eighties. Yeah.
• 30:15
  Not sure about nineties and beyond. Well, those houses look like they were built in the fifties.
• 30:21
  Yeah. Those look like fifties houses. Right.
• 30:23
  Great training area, man. If I had millions of dollars, I would have bought
• 30:26
  the place and turned it into a dadgum training area.
• 30:29
  I wanted to so bad. I mean, between me and you and the listeners,
• 30:33
  if I had millions of dollars, I'm going to turn into a magician and disappear.
• 30:39
  All right. So active shooter. I still want to know what the active shooter training
• 30:43
  looks like. And what are they teaching these guys?
• 30:45
  Are they saying, look, just go find the shooter and kill them?
• 30:48
  Are they saying you're under no legal obligation to go into?
• 30:53
  Uh, no, it's a little bit more blunt than that.
• 30:56
  It's more like, you need to go and find this person.
• 31:00
  And you need to stop what's going on. And you're probably going to have to step
• 31:04
  over a dead body on the way or somebody asking for you to help.
• 31:08
  And you've got to ignore them.
• 31:10
  I've, I, I used to train with St. Petersburg SWAT team down in Florida.
• 31:16
  And they had access to, after hours, they had access to the,
• 31:21
  there's a big mall down there in St. Petersburg.
• 31:24
  So after they closed, we'd go in and train at night.
• 31:29
  Yeah. And the question was, hey, Edgar, how would you do a maw?
• 31:34
  I was like, well, I would take a battalion of infantry, man.
• 31:38
  And they were like, well, I mean, active shooter in the maw.
• 31:41
  I was like, that's a tactical nightmare.
• 31:44
  Right. But you got to go toward the gunshots. That's all you can do.
• 31:50
  That's, yeah, I mean. Yeah, watch your. The very first thing you should do is
• 31:54
  be going for those while keeping your head on a swivel.
• 31:57
  Well, yeah. And hopefully if, listen, if you're the only dude going into a mall,
• 32:01
  you got to at least get close enough to the shooter.
• 32:05
  You know what I mean? Yeah. But that's easier said than done.
• 32:08
  I know it's, it's a crazy setup, but two guys, that's all you need,
• 32:13
  man. You can cover each other's movement.
• 32:15
  Yeah. You got to be on the job. Right. Cover those, those dead spaces,
• 32:19
  cover the corner, you know, whatever.
• 32:21
  Yeah. And get to where, where it's going. Yeah. I mean, there's no magic bullet
• 32:25
  for that to train on is what I'm saying.
• 32:27
  Right. every scenario is going to be different man yeah and that even when i'm
• 32:32
  teaching people like you know i'll do weapons retention and ground fighting
• 32:37
  with with our people and uh,
• 32:41
  i try to stress to them like it's all circumstantial and every circumstance
• 32:46
  is different every single one it's you you never know it's like playing chess
• 32:50
  but it's a different chess game every time you walk into a different room. Yep.
• 32:55
  That's it. It's different every time. So that's why, that's one of the reasons
• 33:00
  why I stress marksmanship so hard.
• 33:03
  Absolutely. Because the problem, ultimately, if it's active shooter,
• 33:08
  it's a shooting problem to be solved.
• 33:10
  Yeah. You got to get there safely. I'm 100% agree with it with you.
• 33:15
  And, you know, how do we, you know, you have such a short amount of time,
• 33:20
  even though we have more time now for firearms than we did have,
• 33:24
  it's still a relatively short amount of time to try to get folks where they need to be.
• 33:31
  I would love to see what Post does with three weeks of firearms training.
• 33:37
  Because three weeks is, yeah, it's short, but man, that's.
• 33:40
  Yeah, it's a lot of time. And if you work that right, you can get all the stuff.
• 33:46
  Do you need as much training on a shotgun? I mean, what do you guys use shotguns for?
• 33:50
  No, just the shotgun is not like, you know, you're not going to be teaching
• 33:57
  them how to breach doors with a shotgun.
• 33:59
  So you guys, you don't breach with them. You use them, do you use slug?
• 34:02
  Or is that for like non-lethal?
• 34:05
  No, no, you would, you know, it would be for buckshot, slug, buckshot type thing.
• 34:11
  The thing with less lethal stuff like if you had bean bag
• 34:14
  rounds you got to go to the certification for that for the
• 34:17
  state you can't just say here here's these three bean bag rounds we're going
• 34:20
  to go in here and you use them first you got to have a certification if you
• 34:24
  if you trained on shotgun it ain't that good enough you would think you would
• 34:29
  think but you got to be certified on this less lethal stuff that's like my argument
• 34:34
  with the taser when they first went to tasers,
• 34:38
  it's like well you got to get hit with a taser to catch you need to know what
• 34:40
  it feels like i'm like you know what i don't have
• 34:43
  to stick my hand in a damn fire to know it's hot yeah i don't
• 34:46
  have to get a shot with him yeah um and it's a no you know i still took my taser
• 34:51
  ride but at the same time i still argued against it nah i got i got the old
• 34:56
  taser yeah whatever man it sucks and we don't it's like oc spray is not done
• 35:02
  in the academy anymore if you want your officer certified OC spray and taser,
• 35:06
  you do that when they get back to your agency.
• 35:09
  Because the academy don't want to deal with it? I don't think it was the academy.
• 35:13
  I'm not really sure who made that decision.
• 35:15
  But I was like.
• 35:18
  So pretty much every department has OC. Is that right? Every guy, a taser, firearm.
• 35:26
  And then some may or may not have an AR-15 in the trunk. It depends on the department. Yeah.
• 35:34
  You got some more well-funded departments and some that are not so well-funded. Right.
• 35:40
  I know some that they get like a little stipend. Well, not stipend.
• 35:45
  Well, you get a uniform allowance.
• 35:46
  Yeah, you get a little allowance to go buy a gun, but it's only like.
• 35:49
  Well, no, it's not really specific for a gun. Coming out with a palmetto arms.
• 35:53
  It's more for, you know, you get X amount of dollars for a uniform allowance during the year.
• 35:58
  And if you don't want to buy a uniform or replace your uniform stuff,
• 36:02
  you know, and there may be some agencies that say, if you have this left over,
• 36:07
  you can use it to purchase backup or something like that. I know...
• 36:11
  The AR that I used on the road was my personal one. Yeah. I carried it for 15
• 36:15
  years. It's in my gun safe at home. That's crazy.
• 36:18
  It's crazy that, yeah, well, I mean, yeah, it's money. I get that.
• 36:23
  And I had a shotgun before that, but I had to beg to get the shotgun.
• 36:26
  And there's like, well, we got to have somebody turn one in first.
• 36:29
  Well, why don't y'all just buy some more? It's not in the budget.
• 36:33
  I'm like, come on now. So in the scope of police work, though,
• 36:35
  the shotgun's used in the same capacity as a rifle or whatever.
• 36:38
  It's a defensive firearm.
• 36:41
  To yeah you just happen to be less capacity which you get the attention of a
• 36:46
  crowd if you get out rack a shotgun and you need to i mean no that's true man
• 36:50
  but i'd rather have the i'm a capacity man i'd rather have the range of capacity
• 36:56
  and i don't do i don't subscribe to the to this,
• 37:00
  buckshot slug business it's you know fucking either go buckshot that'll kill
• 37:07
  people but i hear I hear these NRA dudes talking about,
• 37:11
  well, you put birdshot in your first load, and then you have, nah, man.
• 37:16
  I'm not putting birdshot in anything, but. Well, we won't scare him.
• 37:19
  No, that ain't what you want to do.
• 37:22
  If you're scared enough to shoot somebody, you need to be, like, do the job.
• 37:28
  Yeah, so shotguns are weird because they're very versatile. They don't get trained
• 37:32
  to the extent of the versatility.
• 37:37
  No, they don't. You know, and it's like your sidearm is your primary,
• 37:44
  so we're going to train more with it. Yeah.
• 37:46
  Then we'll train with your rifle, and then we'll train with your shotgun. Yeah.
• 37:50
  And, you know, as far as the academy goes, as far as what Post has put out,
• 37:54
  they've done a really good job at expanding the curriculum and getting more
• 37:58
  training out there. Yeah.
• 38:00
  So that, you know, when these officers go back to their agencies,
• 38:03
  they do have a lot more training than we've ever seen sending somebody back.
• 38:09
  You know, because, you know, on top of the active shooter and stuff like tactical
• 38:14
  casualty control, you know, when an active shooter is over, if you can render
• 38:17
  aid to people, render it and this is how you do it. Yeah.
• 38:21
  You know, they're focusing on mental health more, officers' mental health, you know. Yeah.
• 38:26
  In the academy? Yeah, yeah. There's an officer resiliency course that they go through.
• 38:31
  And it does address, you know, the mental and emotional toll that you can get out of law enforcement.
• 38:39
  Just to give you an example. I started with the county when I was 19.
• 38:44
  Yeah. I was on the road by the time I was 20.
• 38:49
  The first murder I was ever involved in was right before.
• 38:53
  It was two months before my 21st birthday and it's
• 38:58
  a 14 month old kid yeah and i
• 39:01
  like had this kid that's dying in my arms i didn't know what to do
• 39:04
  handing him off to firemen didn't know it
• 39:07
  was a murder to begin with come to find out later that the kid's
• 39:10
  aunt had thrown him up against the wall yeah blunt force
• 39:13
  trauma to his to his brain and stuff is what
• 39:16
  killed him but you know that's that's one of those
• 39:18
  things you something you really it's like oh
• 39:21
  look man let me just look at this from a
• 39:24
  what i think is practical like that
• 39:27
  that's tough but that's sort of
• 39:30
  an after fact after the fact sort of care right i think they need to focus on
• 39:34
  the aftercare now i think in the academy like yes you're gonna see gruesome
• 39:38
  shit yeah that's that and that's kind of that's kind of the basis of like hey
• 39:43
  you're gonna see this stuff and then if you keep you know if something's bothering
• 39:47
  you You definitely want to talk to somebody,
• 39:50
  you know, and this is stuff like that's nobody was telling you that back when
• 39:54
  I first started. Hey, you need to talk to somebody. Right. I got you.
• 39:57
  And so just making officers aware and the academy of the resources available.
• 40:05
  Yeah. How long is that block of instruction?
• 40:09
  I'm not really sure exactly the whole time frame. I mean, like if it's more than a few hours.
• 40:15
  I don't think it's not like a week long or a day long.
• 40:18
  It's not a very long course. And now, you know, this is one thing.
• 40:23
  They're covering extremist groups and stuff to look for.
• 40:26
  So I can see that. And I can see intelligent, like that kind of.
• 40:30
  Right. Yeah, yeah. I can see that. I think I had mentioned this to you in the
• 40:35
  past, something that I said, hey, we'll talk about this,
• 40:37
  is when Homeland Security locked up the dude over here in Rome at the Islamist
• 40:45
  Center of Rome for aiding terrorists, financially aiding terrorists.
• 40:50
  And I didn't know it until after the fact. Yeah. Nobody had said anything.
• 40:54
  And I put this out on our chat log. I said, hey, if y'all didn't know this, take a look at this.
• 41:01
  And I made one comment that said, you know, the apple don't fall far from the tree.
• 41:07
  My captain read that and he said, you insensitive son of a bitch.
• 41:11
  Then my phone started ringing.
• 41:13
  He said, I need to see you at the station. Oh, man.
• 41:16
  I went in his office and I'm like, hey, what's going on, Cap?
• 41:19
  He's like, you need to be very, very careful what you say on chat because it's
• 41:23
  public record and everybody can read it. I'm like, what are you talking about?
• 41:26
  And he said, right here, you said the apple don't fall from the tree.
• 41:30
  I'm like, Well, yeah, it doesn't.
• 41:33
  He's like, you know. Prove me wrong. Right.
• 41:38
  And I'm like, and when I left, I was like, did that really happen? Did he just get on there?
• 41:44
  Oh, man. Yeah, it happened. It did. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I'm like, okay.
• 41:48
  This is like 2010, 11. Still, that'll be twisted in every which way.
• 41:55
  But, you know, that's one of those things. Like, I want my road dogs to be aware
• 41:59
  of this. And if you see something, if you're going by there,
• 42:02
  I'm not saying go and sit there and stop it. No, but that's a higher level thing.
• 42:07
  That's a higher level of intelligence gathering.
• 42:10
  And it may be. Outside the purview of a street cop. How do you know how this guy moves money around?
• 42:16
  And you don't. But the fact that you know somebody who's aiding terrorism from there.
• 42:21
  But if somebody else knows that, they should. Now you can kind of see.
• 42:27
  Just take a look around. You never know. Yeah. Now, that's sort of an ambiguous
• 42:32
  one, man, because that's... Like, the guy's probably an upstanding citizen otherwise.
• 42:36
  You know what I'm saying? Yeah, maybe.
• 42:38
  And he just happens to be a financier. Yeah.
• 42:42
  Because on the big territory, like...
• 42:45
  There's financiers living all over Europe and Scandinavia and everywhere else
• 42:49
  who drive nice cars, dress nice.
• 42:53
  They're not. Yeah, they're not out there making IEDs and stuff. Right.
• 42:57
  They don't walk around with their S-vest on or whatever.
• 43:04
  And yeah, so that's a higher level of intelligence gathering.
• 43:07
  It's good. It would be good to let you guys know what's going on.
• 43:11
  Not to see the report four months later, it's like, oh, we got this guy.
• 43:15
  Sitting here yeah if they were moving guns in and out of there that's a whole
• 43:18
  nother thing we'll see that was one that was that was kind of my thing like
• 43:21
  you know look and see what's going on because,
• 43:23
  you see somebody taking in a bunch of crates in there for some reason
• 43:26
  you know maybe maybe i don't know maybe worth looking at but that's that's like
• 43:33
  a couple years ago when the them knuckleheads got locked up for plotting whatever
• 43:39
  you didn't know about that around here did you and then what were They were, like,
• 43:45
  sacrificing a goat, and they were, like, somebody who's crazy.
• 43:47
  Oh, shit, and I didn't hear about that one.
• 43:50
  Yeah, they, uh. What was the charges, like, animal cruelty?
• 43:55
  No, they were, like, legitimately planning on going and assassinating people
• 44:01
  and stuff. Like, they had an undercover guy.
• 44:04
  Like, teenagers, or was it, like, sort of a little group, like an organized group?
• 44:10
  I lost my train of thought on it, but it was very interesting. of madness.
• 44:15
  So, all right. So back to the Academy. So we got three weeks of firearms training.
• 44:20
  We got some active shooter response training of some sort.
• 44:27
  And then we got all the, you know, the stuff you could do online at home,
• 44:32
  training like resources and things like that.
• 44:36
  And you said defensive tactics was longer? Yeah, it's significantly longer now.
• 44:42
  I think when I went through, I had three days of a couple scenarios and a couple pressure points.
• 44:49
  And what i found out
• 44:53
  in the long run is those pressure points
• 44:57
  are fine motor skills and you can't always get those oh man
• 45:00
  and it's it's a rarity to get mad and now it's what a couple three how long
• 45:06
  uh two weeks two weeks damn that's pretty good so so those of you don't know
• 45:11
  defensive tactics is essentially fighting but subduing folks cuffing folks defending
• 45:18
  yourself like literal fighting,
• 45:20
  ground fighting, standing, all that stuff.
• 45:22
  I guess you use batons as well.
• 45:25
  Yeah, they get the ASP training. ASP, yeah. And stuff like that.
• 45:31
  A lot of hands-on, you know, how to take down and control somebody. Yeah. No, that's good.
• 45:38
  See, that's worth extending. So the things I think are important are the things
• 45:43
  to where you could end someone's life or where your life could be ended. Right.
• 45:47
  And those two things are like top of the list right there like who even if,
• 45:53
  all we had to do was teach them how to drive and driving yeah for sure and teach
• 45:58
  them how to shoot and teach them law and that's all we had to spend time on.
• 46:04
  That'd be awesome. But we got to cover these other requirements too.
• 46:08
  Yeah, that's what I'm saying. The other requirements. At some point,
• 46:12
  you got to examine the priorities and how important is this.
• 46:17
  And then you do, in the Army, we have the composite risk management.
• 46:22
  Yeah. You weigh, you know, it's for operations, for training,
• 46:27
  whatever it is, you got to do a risk management. and you got to weigh the likelihood
• 46:31
  of something versus the severity of that thing happening. You know what I'm saying?
• 46:36
  So if it's highly likely to happen, and if it does happen, it's very severe,
• 46:40
  guess who ain't going to sign your, you know, con op, your commanders and be like, no, fix all this.
• 46:46
  So when you're training new recruits and you're spending time sitting in a classroom,
• 46:52
  talking about the resources available in case your feelings get hurt,
• 46:55
  like that that's an after the fact thing to me so they probably don't take as
• 47:01
  much time as i'm making out here no no so you got it doesn't if you got three
• 47:05
  weeks of uh firearms and two weeks of,
• 47:10
  defensive tactics i mean that gives you what another week and a half or so so
• 47:15
  oh driving probably yeah we got to do you know emergency vehicle operations and and,
• 47:22
  that's where they have to go through a cone course and show driving proficiency and stuff.
• 47:28
  But you know the cone course we're teaching them the cone course they're going
• 47:32
  to know where they're supposed how to drive it by the time they're done because they're going to do it,
• 47:37
  repetitively and you know these chiefs and sheriffs are sending their people
• 47:40
  down there so that when they come back they are mandated officers so they're
• 47:45
  going to want that repetition so that they can pass. That's like when we do the GDAC.
• 47:50
  It's repetition after repetition after repetition until you know you can shoot
• 47:55
  it and you're not going to miss.
• 47:56
  But essentially you're teaching the test. Teaching the test.
• 47:58
  You're not teaching the skill.
• 48:01
  That's right. Yeah. Now, I'll say when we do the pit, and I'm going to backtrack
• 48:06
  a little bit on the pit, is when you're teaching them how to pit,
• 48:09
  you are teaching a skill.
• 48:11
  If you don't do that right, it's going to hurt. No, it's nuanced.
• 48:14
  It's going to hurt. Yeah, yeah.
• 48:17
  Should the pit maneuver be in the academy? That's a freaking lootly not. No? No.
• 48:23
  Hell no. You got these folks coming in there who have no life experience.
• 48:28
  Yeah. This might be their first job.
• 48:31
  I mean, you'll have the one or two unicorns in class. It's like this real high-speed dude.
• 48:38
  He's 35 or 40. He's been in the military most of the time. He's real disciplined.
• 48:44
  He's paying attention to what's going on.
• 48:47
  And he can handle a certain level of stress. And he can handle an adrenaline dump.
• 48:53
  But you have people who literally have never been in a fist fight.
• 48:57
  That their dream is to become a law enforcement officer
• 49:00
  you know what i'm glad people have dreams and
• 49:03
  aspirations but becoming a
• 49:07
  cop and being on the road is not the place
• 49:10
  you want to find out how hard you can be punched in the face yeah you need to
• 49:14
  you need to be going and doing something whether it's boxing kickboxing judo
• 49:20
  jiu-jitsu something that's one of my training cliches is you don't want to learn
• 49:24
  something for the first time in real life. No, absolutely not.
• 49:28
  Whether it's getting hit, whether it's getting shooting.
• 49:31
  You know, in some of the classes we do when I train with military and cops and
• 49:36
  stuff, you know, we'll lay down side prone shooting underneath cars and all
• 49:40
  the crazy stuff like that.
• 49:44
  I don't think that stuff's that important, but also I don't think you want to
• 49:48
  be trying to figure it out for the first time when somebody's shooting at you.
• 49:52
  I 100% agree with you. So it's worth doing, you know, things like that.
• 49:56
  You don't want to have a shit moment. What do I do?
• 49:59
  Yeah. Because you've never done anything. Yeah.
• 50:02
  Or just shooting from awkward positions. Like dudes who do it a lot,
• 50:06
  they'll jump down on whatever fucked up position they get in and put boom, boom, boom.
• 50:11
  Guys who don't do it, they spend, 30 40 seconds trying to figure out how to
• 50:15
  get so they can put their gun oriented on i mean if you can get your gun up
• 50:20
  and you can see the target you should be able to shoot it in theory yeah but.
• 50:25
  You know all shooters not created equal i don't consider myself a strong shooter
• 50:30
  i'm working on it yeah well i mean it's expensive man training but i think it
• 50:36
  should be done i well i think it's.
• 50:37
  Shame that the academies don't have like formalized follow-on
• 50:41
  regular training anytime out here's
• 50:44
  your 50 rounds for the month or yeah that's
• 50:48
  where we're talking about departmental open range days yeah so
• 50:52
  here's what i call open range days when i went to socom i
• 50:54
  was a i became the socom marksmanship program lead
• 50:59
  right and when i showed up there they had open range
• 51:01
  days and i showed up to one of those open range
• 51:04
  days and it was just a dude who literally opened the
• 51:07
  range and then you can go out and shoot
• 51:10
  whatever you want to shoot i called that whatever the fuck you want friday
• 51:13
  right that that that stopped immediately
• 51:16
  if you're just out there that if you
• 51:19
  don't have something it's like going to the gym and you just go
• 51:22
  in there and lift this lift that if you don't have
• 51:25
  something you're doing purposely yeah
• 51:28
  you're wasting bullets man i agree with you i agree with
• 51:31
  you it should be hey this is the open range
• 51:34
  day that we're having we'll have something for you when you get there
• 51:36
  and when you get there we're going to work on this you got
• 51:39
  you absolutely have to have that that purpose of
• 51:43
  being there not just going and yeah shooting
• 51:46
  a couple rounds at a target and that's you know but also it shouldn't be volunteering
• 51:52
  i don't think you got to have some formalized i know dudes are off or dudes
• 51:58
  are i see this is what this is one of the things I've seen the most training
• 52:02
  with police is that it's a, it's a training day, right?
• 52:06
  Here's what we're doing today. And dudes kind of just come and go.
• 52:11
  Middle of training oh man i gotta go i got my well you know whatever so we're
• 52:17
  talking about mandatory training and in-service training and stuff like that
• 52:20
  rome does a really really good job with in-service training it's mandatory you
• 52:26
  have to be there yeah and it covers everything,
• 52:31
  that you're going to have to have for the year to maintain your certification
• 52:34
  and then more and you know they'll go through repetitive active active shooter
• 52:40
  training and it might not be,
• 52:43
  you know going out on the range this time it may be more of a classroom setup and then the next time,
• 52:49
  maybe some range time involved yeah um but
• 52:53
  they're in getting down in nuts and bolts like i think
• 52:56
  video analysis counts as training if you're
• 52:59
  doing you know what i'm saying yeah if it's if you if
• 53:02
  you do it in a very structured way that you get the best i can remember
• 53:04
  there's there's a lot of video that the
• 53:07
  active shooter portion that rome put when you know when they do their
• 53:10
  in-service yeah the best i remember i haven't been one
• 53:13
  of their in-services since 2017 so i don't want to
• 53:16
  i don't want to you know step on my toes with that but you know as far as tactics
• 53:22
  and active shooter and stuff don davis out there at the training center really
• 53:26
  excellent trainer really really knows what's going on and yeah i'd go to a hot house with him yeah.
• 53:35
  All right. So initial training, it's getting better.
• 53:39
  It's gotten a lot better. I think the standards are weak. Like the qualifications
• 53:43
  as well. Qualification standards. That's what I'm harping on the most.
• 53:46
  Could use some improvement.
• 53:47
  No argument with me there. I agree with you. I think it should be very difficult. Yeah.
• 53:53
  And I don't think 80% should be.
• 53:56
  I'd like to say, hey, you got to shoot 100%. But that's not going to happen.
• 54:00
  Yeah. Do I think everybody should at least be pressed to do 90 or better?
• 54:05
  Well, are you providing the training to get them there?
• 54:09
  Now, at the academy, you get it, man. If you're at the 15, 3,
• 54:12
  and 7, there's no reason nobody, anybody should not be shooting a 300.
• 54:16
  Yeah. Well, yeah, for sure.
• 54:18
  I mean, never mind that. That's right.
• 54:21
  And then it's only 80%. And that's the whole silhouette, right?
• 54:24
  Mm-hmm. Oh, man. Yeah, that's madness. Well, I mean, there's,
• 54:27
  you know, you've got the center, the center.
• 54:31
  Let's talk like an Ipsic target, like the A zone, and then you have like the B zone.
• 54:35
  Oh, I thought it was just scored silhouettes. So you got points for the zone.
• 54:39
  Yeah, you'll see there's little dash marks that it's like this is your primary
• 54:44
  zone where you score most of your points, and then the further you go out,
• 54:50
  you lose points. If you're in the green, it's just zero.
• 54:52
  So it's similar to Ipsic or something like that.
• 54:57
  I didn't remember there being scored zones on their target. Well,
• 55:02
  at least they got that, but 80%, yeah, still, oh, man.
• 55:05
  Yeah, and like I said, there's no reason on that 15, 3, and 7 that anybody should
• 55:10
  be shooting less than 100%.
• 55:12
  So I'm going to throw some, these are kind of oldish numbers,
• 55:17
  but this is, and from 1998 to 2006,
• 55:23
  NYPD and all the gunfights in that time period,
• 55:29
  those jokers had an 18% hit rate.
• 55:34
  Yeah, that's... That is... That's an...
• 55:39
  18 percent we just said oh it should be higher than 80
• 55:41
  percent 18 percent hit rate yeah and
• 55:46
  that's uh you know with all the factors involved when people have that oh moment
• 55:52
  if they're shooting 100 percent and they hit that adrenaline dump if they're
• 55:57
  a real life is going to degree life is going to degrade that down but not a
• 56:01
  lot like i mean maybe it depends on how much you train,
• 56:06
  if you're just yeah but i'm like just throwing this out there if you're like
• 56:09
  the everyday dude that goes and shoots the gdac and you shoot 100 you can expect
• 56:13
  that don't mean yes that don't mean anything you could you in real life you're
• 56:17
  going to be shooting like 40 nah if you're shooting 100 on that don't mean shit
• 56:21
  if you have a higher standard and you're shooting 100 on that yeah.
• 56:27
  Variables are going to come into play and there's going to be you're dealing with more variables,
• 56:33
  that don't mean that don't mean 18 is
• 56:36
  not except that means you just determine whether
• 56:39
  or not to take that shot right in the moment no
• 56:42
  matter how much adrenaline or whatever i and i've had cops go egger you don't
• 56:46
  understand under stress no i'm not i'm not gonna say that i know your background
• 56:50
  but i get it but you can train that too man you can you can't completely do
• 56:56
  out here when we're we're training against the clock you know we're adding that
• 56:59
  little bit that's a little I'm a fan.
• 57:02
  I don't know if all the high end firearms trainers, I'm a fan of UTM and force on force.
• 57:10
  Because that's where you can replicate. You can throw in variables and people have to react.
• 57:15
  Right. And, you know, it hurts enough that you're getting lessons learned out
• 57:22
  of it. Yeah, it's going to get your attention, but it's not going to.
• 57:24
  Especially if you're caught short, not bringing your cup to training.
• 57:29
  But that's one way to test those tactics. Because you get a little amped up,
• 57:33
  even though you know it's blue guns, you're still a little amped up, you know.
• 57:39
  Well, I look at it like this when I get the blue guns, like I want to be the
• 57:42
  winner anyway. You want to win. I want to win. And I don't want to win.
• 57:48
  I mean, even in real life, I don't want to win and be carrying a bullet with
• 57:51
  me. I don't want to be the winner. You want to win. I want to win. That's it.
• 57:55
  That's right. I mean, I tell people this all the time, functionally speaking,
• 58:00
  everyday carry competition and our action shooting and combat shooting or whatever
• 58:06
  you want to call it is functionally all the same.
• 58:09
  And everything has a, and you, and it, and, and USPSA, you just,
• 58:14
  you're not up on, you know, you don't get the clout.
• 58:17
  The other ones, that's it.
• 58:22
  Right. You don't go home or you catch some pillow or you get put in a wheelchair
• 58:27
  for the rest of your life.
• 58:28
  Yep. So how people don't take it more seriously is just freaking beyond me. Well, you know...
• 58:35
  Know some of the same guys i know yeah they get out there and they're spending
• 58:41
  their own money buying their own ammo yeah and man i just i wish departments would be like here take,
• 58:49
  and i get it budget money it's always gonna be about money yeah here's your
• 58:52
  300 rounds if you're gonna go shoot with edgar and you're gonna pay him to shoot
• 58:56
  we're gonna pay for your ammo they should do that they should do that i know
• 59:00
  one department that does but i i'm not gonna I'm not going to say it out loud.
• 59:05
  Everybody would be applying to that. Yeah. Well.
• 59:08
  But even 300. See, that's another thing that non-shooters don't understand,
• 59:14
  the amount of bullets you shoot.
• 59:16
  Yeah. And when you're buying, even if you're buying, you know,
• 59:20
  decent range ammo out of pocket, you're looking, you know, $15 to $18 a box for 50 rounds.
• 59:28
  And you're going to burn through 50 rounds in 10 minutes. I'm going to plug
• 59:31
  Southern munitions. I get remanufactured ammo from them, 1,000 rounds for $190-something bucks.
• 59:37
  Dude, that's awesome. And that's where I get my ammo from.
• 59:42
  I go through 1,000 rounds. Well, I know. I've seen you shooting out here,
• 59:45
  and I never did pay attention to what kind of ammo you got.
• 59:49
  It's not like you're having malfunctions or stove popping with it. It's good ammo.
• 59:54
  I've had bad batches from them before. Hey, man, work on your daggum clear malfunction
• 1:00:00
  and keep moving. You know what I'm saying?
• 1:00:02
  People get bedazzled when I'm shooting the drill. I'm trying to demonstrate,
• 1:00:05
  and then I just have a light strike unbeknownst to me, and I just pop it and
• 1:00:09
  keep going. They're like, oh, man, you did that so fast.
• 1:00:12
  Yeah, no shit, because that's the game, right?
• 1:00:17
  Stay in the fight and all that stuff. I hate when people have a malfunction and look at me.
• 1:00:23
  Look at their gun. Slap, right, pull, keep moving.
• 1:00:28
  Yep. So even light strikes, whatever, man. Quality ammo. Yeah.
• 1:00:32
  You can get 1,000 rounds for $190-something bucks.
• 1:00:35
  Yeah. I mean, that's pretty serious. That's pretty good. Let's see.
• 1:00:41
  I still want to rip a little bit. Dallas, from 2003 to 2017,
• 1:00:46
  hit rate, 35%. Dallas PD.
• 1:00:50
  Now, that's a big, and they got a lot of crime down there. Yeah, they do.
• 1:00:53
  FBI statistics in 2023, FBI statistics of 810 fatal officer-involved shootings, incidents,
• 1:01:06
  well, 810 out of all the ones that happened, 810 of those had stray rounds.
• 1:01:13
  There were bystanders some got hit some didn't that's
• 1:01:17
  810 lawsuits potentially yep
• 1:01:20
  and that's you know that's one thing that if
• 1:01:23
  anybody's listening to this who have you
• 1:01:27
  know their goal is to become a police officer number one they need to understand
• 1:01:34
  that every single round that comes out of that firearm you don't get to take
• 1:01:40
  it back it's not going to come back to you and whatever it hits,
• 1:01:43
  you're responsible for.
• 1:01:44
  So my libertarianism is going to step in here.
• 1:01:49
  Qualified immunity. So here's the thing that I think that that does is that
• 1:01:54
  it's a little bit of a crutch.
• 1:01:56
  Now it's a safety net, right? That's what it's meant for.
• 1:01:59
  But it's also to me a little bit of a crutch.
• 1:02:02
  Because if I accidentally, if
• 1:02:05
  some dude tried to rob me and I shot him and missed and shot someone else,
• 1:02:10
  there ain't no qualified immunity going to keep Edgar from standing in front
• 1:02:13
  of a man and getting charged with involuntary manslaughter or reckless endangerment
• 1:02:18
  or whatever other things they could pop on there.
• 1:02:22
  So I know that I have, because for cops and for civilians,
• 1:02:27
  and soldiers for that matter, people have this impression that soldiers can
• 1:02:32
  run around and just go do the village, right? That don't exist, man.
• 1:02:38
  Every shooting in the military gets a freaking investigation.
• 1:02:42
  Every one. Well, one, they're looking for body. They want to know one,
• 1:02:47
  how many and who and what caused it and who made a decision and this and that and the other.
• 1:02:54
  Obviously, everyone has rules of engagement changes throughout the time,
• 1:03:00
  but everyone still gets an investigation, man.
• 1:03:03
  And just like every one of yours gets investigated by GBI probably. Thank you.
• 1:03:08
  And every civilian gets investigated. GBI is the, they're going to get called
• 1:03:13
  if it's an officer. Right. For sure. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:03:16
  So every bullet has a potential lawsuit attached to it.
• 1:03:21
  Everyone. You're accountable for every single one. Yep. Even if you're training
• 1:03:25
  out here in my yard and you shoot yourself in, or shoot someone else in the
• 1:03:30
  foot, still you're accountable for that, man.
• 1:03:33
  So it ain't just cops and just soldiers or just anything.
• 1:03:39
  People don't yeah you know qualified immunity
• 1:03:42
  you know it was meant for you know this officer is doing this in good faith
• 1:03:47
  he's not being neglectful he's not doing anything intentionally yeah i get it
• 1:03:51
  and a lot i mean sometimes i when i hear people talk about that you can tell
• 1:03:57
  the people that know what they're talking about and then you can tell the people it's like oh well,
• 1:04:02
  he shouldn't be able to not do a b or c you
• 1:04:06
  know if if he's in the right i get it if he's
• 1:04:09
  just being neglectful or he's just a criminal himself right he's
• 1:04:12
  not getting qualified immunity well yeah reputation goes a long way probably
• 1:04:18
  with that history work history oh yeah if you've been in like eight officer
• 1:04:23
  involved shootings in the past three years you probably probably need to go
• 1:04:27
  ahead and put the brakes on that,
• 1:04:30
  probably need to be put in, you know, internal affairs or something else.
• 1:04:35
  A desk job somewhere. Yeah.
• 1:04:37
  So let's talk a little bit about the.
• 1:04:39
  Mentality right the dudes that'll go buy their own
• 1:04:42
  ammo they have a mentality one well
• 1:04:46
  a few but one of the one of the guys i know who was the
• 1:04:49
  most who was and it's a it's a shame
• 1:04:51
  that got to this but a cop he got shot
• 1:04:54
  in the leg you know he ended up killing the guy
• 1:04:57
  it was a good shoot all the all the things but let
• 1:05:01
  me tell you who's super duper serious about training bro that guy
• 1:05:04
  and he spends money and he's got his his
• 1:05:07
  equipment's good he comes out thousand rounds of
• 1:05:10
  ammo he's not fucking about because he
• 1:05:13
  he don't want to get shot again you know i mean so it became real
• 1:05:16
  to him i think for a lot of cops that they some go their whole career never
• 1:05:21
  have a chance to make it real yeah now the world's getting crazy you know and
• 1:05:25
  people are are doing wild things but yeah it's it's not nobody's going out there
• 1:05:32
  saying hey i want to get in a gunfight today Nobody's doing that. No, for sure.
• 1:05:35
  But if it happens, damn, you got to be ready for that. Yeah, for sure.
• 1:05:40
  And that's one of my whole mantras about train to a high standard so you can
• 1:05:45
  have confidence, so you can be more judicious when it comes time,
• 1:05:49
  so that you don't have to use it.
• 1:05:51
  But if you're slow and this guy's already got the drop on you, that's it.
• 1:05:58
  You're stuck to a course of action. I asked the guys we were doing weapons retention
• 1:06:03
  the other day. I said, what wins a gunfight, speed or accuracy?
• 1:06:06
  And they were both like, speed. I said, speed don't mean shit if you can't hit
• 1:06:09
  what you're aiming at. Yeah. It's always a trick question, ain't it? Yeah.
• 1:06:13
  Yeah. Always. And, uh, yeah, I don't mind telling you I stole that from you.
• 1:06:18
  No, no, it ain't stealing.
• 1:06:20
  I probably got it from some crusty old dude.
• 1:06:23
  It was, you know, good training day. So, I mean, I'd like to get them on the range more myself.
• 1:06:30
  But that's a good mindset, though. because there are people who swear to you.
• 1:06:34
  Oh, you just got to be accurate. Just take time, breathe.
• 1:06:38
  And then there's other dudes that swear to you, man. You got to get that sub-second
• 1:06:41
  draw. You got to be out there.
• 1:06:43
  I don't disagree with either of them, but you got to. You can't do one or the
• 1:06:48
  other. You got to do both. You got to do them both.
• 1:06:50
  And you got to have the mentality, one, train enough that you're confident enough
• 1:06:56
  that you can employ it when it needs to be employed and only when it needs to be employed for up.
• 1:07:04
  I was telling somebody the other day, man, I got pulled over once.
• 1:07:08
  I think I was out east, heading towards South Carolina.
• 1:07:13
  I may have even been in South Carolina. I got pulled over by a young dude.
• 1:07:16
  I was speeding because I drive like a damn race car driver.
• 1:07:21
  All my things man put my i don't even put my hands on stairwell i'll put them
• 1:07:25
  over here where i roll my window down i put my hands at the at the about 10
• 1:07:31
  and 11 you know what i mean,
• 1:07:33
  this dude comes up and i don't know if i fit the description
• 1:07:36
  i don't know what he already had
• 1:07:39
  his hand on his gun which to me is an escalation and
• 1:07:43
  he comes up and he kind of does this little peek or
• 1:07:46
  something i don't know what caused him to draw his gun but he drew
• 1:07:48
  his gun and then he kind of pie all around to
• 1:07:52
  me and the fucker had his hand on his finger on
• 1:07:55
  the trigger and i was like hey man i know
• 1:07:58
  you don't hear anything i gotta say right now but please take
• 1:08:02
  your finger off the trigger right dude looked like
• 1:08:04
  he was about 22 years old man and i
• 1:08:07
  was so stressed that this dude was because he was clearly
• 1:08:10
  nervous i don't know if they i don't know
• 1:08:12
  uh and you know again that's
• 1:08:16
  one of those things that a lot of people who've
• 1:08:19
  never been in stressful situations or never had
• 1:08:22
  to deal with any kind of adversity or coming into
• 1:08:25
  law enforcement and i mean you know i don't know if something happens and they
• 1:08:31
  just stay scared all the time but i see like a combination of complacency with
• 1:08:39
  a little bit of fear and a little bit of anxiety and and.
• 1:08:44
  And I got stopped here a while back, and I just happened to know the name of
• 1:08:49
  the officer that was coming up there.
• 1:08:52
  And, you know, he'd been on the road. He's probably been on the road about five years now.
• 1:08:58
  And I start critiquing him when he gets out of the car out of habit. And I'm like, okay.
• 1:09:04
  And then, you know, he's walking up. He's paying attention. Did an awesome job.
• 1:09:10
  And i'm like yeah man you caught me walking the dog i was i was hauling it up through here,
• 1:09:17
  he's like yeah he said yeah you were he said
• 1:09:19
  where you headed to i'm like i got a call about a
• 1:09:22
  snake in a pool i'm gonna go get a snake out of a pulley said is it your pool
• 1:09:25
  i said no if it's my pool i'd be in it it was hot that day you know and uh did
• 1:09:30
  a really good job but then there's been a couple times that i've pulled over
• 1:09:34
  when i've seen an officer lock up on 53 with it be coming in the city or going out of the city.
• 1:09:41
  And I just kind of pulled over and kind of watched because they're by themselves.
• 1:09:44
  And I don't want to say it's a good habit because I don't want them to get nervous,
• 1:09:47
  but I never parked close enough that it would raise a flag to them.
• 1:09:53
  You know, and I've seen them walk up to the car, hand on the gun the whole time.
• 1:09:58
  And I like it, man. You know, I'm with you. And it's like I told our guys the other day.
• 1:10:02
  I said, when you're standing there and you're talking to somebody, what does this tell you?
• 1:10:06
  And they're like, well, I was like, it tells you I'm getting ready to pull my
• 1:10:10
  gun. Don't do that. It makes people nervous.
• 1:10:13
  Like you can practice going from here and out of the holster.
• 1:10:15
  You can practice that all day long. Don't do it with a bullet in the chamber.
• 1:10:19
  And don't do it if you're carrying a Sig P320.
• 1:10:25
  Is there any official stuff around y'all's department yet
• 1:10:28
  on that everybody's can't everybody's canceling
• 1:10:31
  320 man except for the select few
• 1:10:34
  of i mean i don't want to say select few but i think the michigan state police
• 1:10:39
  are going forward with their p320 order and i'm like are you serious they're
• 1:10:45
  probably getting them super cheap and if it's not michigan it's massachusetts
• 1:10:48
  it's one of those m states yeah so if i got that wrong you know crucify me later but,
• 1:10:53
  And that's a big write-up on that, you know, state police continuing with their
• 1:10:57
  CIG order after controversial firearms or something or other.
• 1:11:01
  I'm like, there's no way. Look, man. Yeah, yeah, yeah. To me,
• 1:11:05
  you're taking your chances.
• 1:11:06
  I've seen some dudes on YouTube, you know, kind of pull the trigger, you know.
• 1:11:12
  Like right just to the wall, not through the wall. Yeah, just to the wall, shake, boom. Yeah.
• 1:11:17
  That's not good enough, man. No. That's not good enough. I'm not a, you know, a gunsmith.
• 1:11:23
  But I'm telling you, that's not good enough. No, you shouldn't have that much
• 1:11:26
  plane manipulation in your slide anyway, but that's neither here nor there.
• 1:11:31
  I don't know anybody around here that carries one, all the agencies around here carry Glock. Yeah.
• 1:11:38
  Yeah. That's good, man. I'm glad to hear that.
• 1:11:41
  I carry a Glock. Yeah. Cause it ain't going to break. All right.
• 1:11:46
  Let's get back on that mindset a little bit. So.
• 1:11:49
  Think i got here check the box box mindset for that's what i equate the qualification
• 1:11:56
  to to me that's a check the box i don't that's not a qualification shouldn't be called one,
• 1:12:01
  yeah it's it's uh let's make sure we can do this let's train to this check the
• 1:12:06
  box you're right i mean i agree with you yeah and then so check this out i view
• 1:12:10
  it this is a this was from a gbi,
• 1:12:15
  some study or some paper.
• 1:12:18
  Resistance to voluntary training. 25% of Georgia officers cited a lack of interest
• 1:12:24
  in any voluntary training whatsoever.
• 1:12:28
  So one quarter of the troopers out there just ain't got no time for any additional.
• 1:12:35
  Was that just state troopers or was that across the board?
• 1:12:38
  It was GBI. It said Georgia officers.
• 1:12:40
  Okay. It wasn't true. Yeah, it was Georgia officers. So.
• 1:12:44
  Now, I don't know how many they polled. I don't know.
• 1:12:48
  That 25% is the 25% that were being honest.
• 1:12:53
  That were being honest. I'm telling you right now, there's nothing worse.
• 1:12:57
  Bumped the numbers up another 10 or 12.
• 1:12:59
  Nothing worse than trying to get officers to train.
• 1:13:03
  You know, we talked earlier about in-service training and it being mandatory at Rome.
• 1:13:09
  I went to it and I wasn't always engaged in it. Some of it, I was like,
• 1:13:13
  why am I having to do this again over, you name it? Yeah.
• 1:13:18
  You know, but. Well, some training is more valuable than other training,
• 1:13:21
  man. Well, that's where I was going to. That's a fact.
• 1:13:23
  Where I was going to go with, like, you know, use of force and defensive tactics
• 1:13:27
  training. It's mandatory you do it.
• 1:13:31
  Having officers just like, well, I'm going to sit in this chair and watch.
• 1:13:35
  It's mandatory that they be there. Well, it's got to be mandatory that they
• 1:13:38
  do something as well. And it shouldn't just be your patrol officers wanting to do it.
• 1:13:44
  And you hear so many complaints.
• 1:13:47
  If y'all try to hurt, nobody's trying to hurt you. We're trying to teach you
• 1:13:50
  something. Would you rather pull a muscle here?
• 1:13:54
  That's an excuse. I think you hear a whole lot about that. That's why I say
• 1:13:58
  I don't think the 25% is accurate.
• 1:14:01
  And also what I don't agree with is when you have qualification on the range,
• 1:14:07
  Admin should not have their own designated time to go where it can be only admin.
• 1:14:12
  Admin should be setting an example for everybody else.
• 1:14:17
  Admin shouldn't have to go out there and have six attempts to qualify.
• 1:14:22
  And I'm not going to say that I know it from personal experience or,
• 1:14:29
  But your number two pencil will poke a hole in the target about the size of a nine mil.
• 1:14:37
  That ain't right, man. That's wrong. That's a bad mindset. Especially from a leadership ad, man.
• 1:14:44
  Yeah, they're not all created. We can talk about that when we get to it.
• 1:14:48
  And then on my, well, and then I got another note here about some cops. I was surprised.
• 1:14:56
  I trained with a SWAT team.
• 1:14:59
  And there was a core group of dudes that were shit hot. They trained on their
• 1:15:03
  own. They cared. They cared. They were in it to win it.
• 1:15:07
  And then there was a lot of them that weren't even like gun guys.
• 1:15:11
  They were like almost anti-gun.
• 1:15:14
  They were on SWAT team for a little extra pay or a little more clout or something.
• 1:15:18
  But they weren't gun guys. Right. Now, I don't expect you to be a freaking,
• 1:15:23
  you know, good old boy gun guy.
• 1:15:25
  Gun you'll build do your own builds and
• 1:15:28
  all this stuff but i mean you can't
• 1:15:31
  have an aversion can't be anti-gun and
• 1:15:34
  be a armed freaking professional
• 1:15:37
  because if that anti-gun behave i
• 1:15:41
  get it if you're shit hot and you're anti-gun right but but you got to be shit
• 1:15:47
  hot you can't just use that as an excuse not to train right i can't imagine
• 1:15:53
  anybody in this general vicinity up here as anti-gun any cops. I can't imagine.
• 1:16:00
  This is the southeast of the United States, man.
• 1:16:03
  I haven't blatantly seen anybody that thinks or that said, yeah,
• 1:16:09
  I don't think people should have firearms. It should be only us.
• 1:16:12
  Not around here, especially in the south. Yeah.
• 1:16:17
  Think if somebody said that at one of these departments or agencies we got here
• 1:16:20
  they probably find a way to get rid of them what about have you seen any of
• 1:16:24
  that with female officers at all,
• 1:16:26
  i've had a couple females out here that were uh like this right yeah i mean
• 1:16:31
  i've seen some who are nervous now i'm gonna tell you this i've worked with
• 1:16:35
  a few female officers that will,
• 1:16:39
  jump in any fight out there will they will screw a friggin glock in your ear hole.
• 1:16:44
  I've worked with some badass females yeah no they're they're out there man they're
• 1:16:48
  out there for sure yeah but then i've worked with some who are just males too have no business at all,
• 1:16:56
  well i did a podcast a few
• 1:16:59
  episodes ago i was talking about cop shootings and that
• 1:17:01
  one female cop that pulled her
• 1:17:04
  glock yelled taser taser taser and blasted blasted
• 1:17:08
  the guy oh yeah is that the one from oklahoma over there on the side of the
• 1:17:11
  road next to the issue somewhere somewhere like that
• 1:17:14
  yeah and she'd been i don't
• 1:17:16
  know she was a 26 year yeah i
• 1:17:19
  was gonna say more than two decades 26 year veteran and said
• 1:17:22
  i thought i was getting my taser i carried
• 1:17:26
  a taser for about six months before i turned it back in but
• 1:17:29
  not one time that i ever think i didn't know what my firearm
• 1:17:32
  or my taser was now i don't know if this was pre
• 1:17:35
  and i know like most agencies you get you wear your taser on
• 1:17:38
  the left side yeah you cross draw it yeah um i don't know
• 1:17:41
  if they if she had that dynamic i can't remember
• 1:17:44
  and i've seen the video and i can't remember seeing that
• 1:17:47
  i can't either but i mean but aren't
• 1:17:51
  like even under stress they don't even feel the same they don't feel the same
• 1:17:55
  i'm pretty sure most tasers are yellow yeah they're yellow and black and they
• 1:17:59
  don't weigh the same and what does that tell you about what she was looking
• 1:18:03
  at i mean like she was either fixated on the guy and had no,
• 1:18:10
  like legit tunnel vision.
• 1:18:13
  She's not the only one. They had a BART transit officer guy. Had a guy prone.
• 1:18:18
  Thought he was putting his... Thought I was putting my taser in his back and
• 1:18:22
  popped around off in his spine. Now was that guy a reserve cop?
• 1:18:25
  I don't know if he was a reserve or not. I just know he's a BART transit officer.
• 1:18:28
  I can't remember if he was a reserve or not. There was a reserve cop that I
• 1:18:32
  think did that. But the video, you can see when he heard the pop You could see
• 1:18:37
  that his demeanor and his face changed. He knew he messed up. Yeah, yeah.
• 1:18:43
  Madness. Training. I think training would have solved that.
• 1:18:47
  And then I want to talk one more thing about mindset, and then we'll move to whatever.
• 1:18:51
  There was a documentary on, no, no, no, no, no. It wasn't a documentary.
• 1:18:55
  It was a, you know, like a miniseries on Waco, the Branch Davidians. You remember that? Yes.
• 1:19:02
  Yeah. And it was a good miniseries, but there was a scene that made an impact on me.
• 1:19:07
  And the scene was it was
• 1:19:10
  between the lead negotiator and the
• 1:19:13
  lead uh whoever the tactical lead was managing
• 1:19:17
  all the fucking atf and
• 1:19:21
  whoever else fbi and whoever else is all
• 1:19:24
  out there and they were sitting at a picnic table and you
• 1:19:28
  know the negotiator guy was trying to like talk him down talk them out and this
• 1:19:32
  guy and this was already several days into now i know this was a dramatic reenactment
• 1:19:39
  right but the guy was like he said something like the tactical guy he said.
• 1:19:45
  7500 and the guy was like what what is that he goes that's how many of us there
• 1:19:50
  are that's how many citizens there are per cop and it's us against them and
• 1:19:57
  i made a mental note i was like,
• 1:19:59
  Do real cops think that? Because that's pretty...
• 1:20:03
  If you got an us against them mentality as a cop, especially a local cop that
• 1:20:08
  you grew up in the area, I think that lends itself to some bad business right now.
• 1:20:13
  So, us against them. I've heard that.
• 1:20:18
  And I honestly believe there are some officers that have thought that.
• 1:20:23
  And I look at what makes you think that.
• 1:20:28
  And I talked to somebody about this one time, and I'm not going to say his name.
• 1:20:33
  He's a good dude, still employed, very knowledgeable, and very fair person.
• 1:20:38
  Yeah. He had something on his computer, and I'm like...
• 1:20:41
  And it was like, you know how you can make your, your homemade screensaver? Yeah.
• 1:20:46
  Well, he had it on, he had it on his computer and, uh, I asked him about it
• 1:20:52
  and I said, how's that going to look if your computer screens up and somebody reads that?
• 1:20:57
  Was it like that? Like us against them type? No, no. It was,
• 1:21:01
  it said seek and destroy.
• 1:21:04
  And I'm like, and he, you know, he ain't been on the road long by himself. Yeah.
• 1:21:08
  And, uh, and, you know, we kind of. talking
• 1:21:12
  about it i'm like well he's like no not
• 1:21:15
  he's like i'm talking about the one percent of people we deal with
• 1:21:18
  that need to be in jail and and he
• 1:21:22
  said yeah that's kind of us against them because that's who we're looking for we're
• 1:21:24
  not looking for joe citizen we're not out here looking for
• 1:21:28
  the people who are your upstanding
• 1:21:31
  citizen who are contributing to the betterment of society he
• 1:21:34
  said but all these other folks that need to go that's that's who we're
• 1:21:37
  out here looking for and he's yeah that's that's what it's for
• 1:21:40
  and i'm like you know that makes his mind i'm like
• 1:21:43
  it's my it makes sense i said
• 1:21:46
  you know but your random citizen reads that yeah they're not going to understand
• 1:21:52
  that yeah and i said i understand it because you just explained it to me right
• 1:21:55
  and you know this has been 15 20 years ago you know well that reminds me of
• 1:22:02
  you remember the shooting. It was in a hotel.
• 1:22:06
  The cop had an AR-15. The guy was, he had like a- In the hallway?
• 1:22:11
  In the hallway. And he had like a pest control, like air gun or something. Right.
• 1:22:15
  And the guy was barking orders at him and he was fucking confused.
• 1:22:18
  He didn't know what to do. And then the guy pumped him up. Yeah.
• 1:22:21
  And his dust cover said something like-
• 1:22:25
  Die motherfucker or something like that yeah i remember them making a real big issue about,
• 1:22:31
  about that dust cover i don't remember exactly i can't remember
• 1:22:34
  it says something to that effect though and and
• 1:22:37
  that's just it though that's a that don't mean anything but it's an indicator
• 1:22:42
  yeah of his mindset well it's like you you've got somebody that changes the
• 1:22:47
  back plate on their glock to the punisher skull at a punisher skull something
• 1:22:51
  like it's like if you have if you're justified and you have to pop somebody
• 1:22:54
  while you're carrying that?
• 1:22:56
  Well, look, man, their attorney's going to eat that up. You know how many external
• 1:23:00
  modifications I've made to my guns?
• 1:23:03
  Fucking zero. I make internal modifications and I wrap grip tape around the
• 1:23:07
  hat. Right, right. I don't need to punish the skull on my gun.
• 1:23:10
  I get it. They're trying to flare it up. I understand.
• 1:23:13
  And we do understand that. But an attorney who's wanting to But a greasy attorney
• 1:23:18
  is wanting to make a lot of money, they're going to chew that up.
• 1:23:20
  The punish the skull is notorious for what? The Punisher was a cop,
• 1:23:24
  a Marine cop, vigilante.
• 1:23:27
  That's right. Who ran around just whacking dudes. Yep.
• 1:23:30
  And there's young guys who, they want that. They believe in that.
• 1:23:35
  So that mentality of us against them is fucked up.
• 1:23:40
  Now, I know it exists. And when I say them, I know who I'm referring to.
• 1:23:45
  Yeah. Right? The bad guys. Yep. the the
• 1:23:48
  the friggin rapists and the murderers and
• 1:23:52
  that i i i get it but if
• 1:23:55
  that's if that's on your like you ain't gonna throw a bumper sticker on
• 1:23:58
  your cruiser says search and destroy no or you know kill motherfuckers or whatever
• 1:24:04
  no i'm gonna put a red ribbon around my push bumper for a reason you know it's
• 1:24:07
  red ribbon week or whatever yeah man like so i think there's young guys out
• 1:24:12
  there though with that not even young guys i think guys my age probably out there with that mindset,
• 1:24:17
  And I don't even want to get too deep into like...
• 1:24:21
  Racism or like whatever other biases that exist. Right.
• 1:24:26
  But you can't, as a cop, man, you got to put them biases, you got to leave them at the house.
• 1:24:30
  Yeah. And then you start hearing, well, it's a subconscious bias and it's this. That does exist.
• 1:24:36
  But if you are, if you consider yourself a truly good guy, which cops are good
• 1:24:41
  guy, you should be a good guy.
• 1:24:44
  You got to take that whole bite of good guy, not just. Yeah.
• 1:24:47
  And we talk about bias. Everybody has biases. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:24:50
  For sure. everybody does and you have to be able when you're out on the road
• 1:24:56
  working look at everybody,
• 1:24:59
  fair and impartial yeah and that is so freaking hard to do hard to do man it's hard to do and,
• 1:25:07
  you got to be able to let people run their mouth and get under your skin that
• 1:25:11
  don't mean you know you get to knock them in the dirt and haul them off yeah well you know like.
• 1:25:17
  Smoking weed's not a death warrant no you know
• 1:25:20
  what i'm saying it's not i'm going to tell you something about
• 1:25:22
  that my view on that is never really
• 1:25:26
  made a lot of weed cases especially if you caught somebody
• 1:25:29
  with a little little joint there were times i'm like
• 1:25:32
  hey you need to stomp that out and then if there's
• 1:25:35
  nothing else wrong see you bye call supervisor
• 1:25:39
  hey this is what happen you know if the
• 1:25:43
  state would go ahead and legalize marijuana no bro that's a whole nother pocket
• 1:25:48
  yeah it would just take so much off there's so much to be decriminalized yeah
• 1:25:54
  easy for law enforcement yeah i'm just i'm just i'm just touching on it because.
• 1:26:01
  If you legalize marijuana you're going to take so much off the plate of law
• 1:26:04
  enforcement officers but now i'm going to have somebody that's that they'll
• 1:26:07
  either comment or they'll call me later But if we decriminalize marijuana, then,
• 1:26:12
  you know, I can't just sniff the car. Now I got my probable cause.
• 1:26:16
  They might be carrying four pounds of meth in there.
• 1:26:18
  I get it. They might be. They might not.
• 1:26:22
  So now you're looking for. Yeah. Yeah, man. That's the mindset.
• 1:26:28
  Impartial. I smell weed. You got weed? All right. You got anything else? No.
• 1:26:33
  Yeah. You get lied to sometimes. Sometimes you don't. Whatever,
• 1:26:36
  man. Go on what you got. Yeah. I'd say you get lied to.
• 1:26:42
  About 85% of the time. Mindset.
• 1:26:47
  And that's, you know, that's just, that's my opinion of somebody that,
• 1:26:52
  you know, has worked the road.
• 1:26:54
  And it's one thing if you got somebody moving a bunch of weight and they got
• 1:26:58
  a bunch of stuff and they're, you know, making sure little Bobby gets it.
• 1:27:03
  No, I get it. There's indicators, different things. I get it.
• 1:27:07
  And we could, it's an indicator. I get that.
• 1:27:10
  I think decriminalization, yeah, man, I don't want people to think because you're
• 1:27:16
  on my podcast, you share my opinion.
• 1:27:18
  I think decriminalization of drugs in general will make it what it is,
• 1:27:24
  is a health problem and a mental health problem and not so much a legal problem.
• 1:27:30
  Now, if you get high and go rob somebody, you still rob somebody.
• 1:27:35
  And robbing somebody is and should be illegal, right?
• 1:27:39
  Yeah, it is. And I'm not going to say across the board decriminalization.
• 1:27:45
  You know, I think we should be out there trying to get as much fentanyl as possible
• 1:27:49
  off the street and stuff like that.
• 1:27:51
  It's dangerous, but the crim—OK, I don't want to get off track too bad.
• 1:27:56
  I want to use Portugal as an example.
• 1:27:59
  They decriminalized drugs. Crime went down.
• 1:28:03
  Drugs went down. they start they basically centralized or
• 1:28:08
  or rounded up these these people and they did
• 1:28:11
  they did drugs and isolation yeah it
• 1:28:15
  was an overall benefit now are we anything like portugal nah
• 1:28:17
  but i think it's worth trying anyway yeah
• 1:28:21
  i mean i just uh you know i don't know who
• 1:28:25
  really i mean who really knows we could
• 1:28:27
  try that and it could just have the opposite effect it could be
• 1:28:30
  really really good really really bad you i mean maybe or
• 1:28:34
  just like everything else you have to you don't really
• 1:28:37
  know until you you have to work it yeah until you
• 1:28:41
  try it but that's a very libertarian perspective and i i happen to have yeah
• 1:28:45
  but what else what else what else cultural shifts now okay let's talk about
• 1:28:53
  cultural shifts and i don't know if you're seeing anything at your level.
• 1:28:58
  But i'm seeing it on the internet because there's
• 1:29:01
  some high level trainers out there that have been busting balls
• 1:29:04
  on cops for several years and
• 1:29:08
  then there's cops that are now high level guys who are getting on who were jumped
• 1:29:14
  or guys who train and who care about it and now they've made their way up the
• 1:29:19
  ladder and they're starting to be able to influence their agencies and dudes
• 1:29:24
  are starting to shoot competition shooting versus not.
• 1:29:28
  And they're starting to put emphasis on practical competition.
• 1:29:33
  Realistic training, not some tactical madness that you see all over the place.
• 1:29:37
  And I think there might be a, I think it's starting to take hold.
• 1:29:41
  It's what I see on the internet anyway. Yeah.
• 1:29:44
  You know, I see everything, like you said, going from the tactical stuff to
• 1:29:48
  shift into that reality-based scenario training. Practical. Yeah.
• 1:29:56
  I'm seeing that a lot more too. I know there's a few people in some of these
• 1:30:01
  local agencies that are,
• 1:30:02
  for instance, they're post-certified Brazilian jiu-jitsu
• 1:30:05
  instructors and when they have an officer
• 1:30:08
  who wants to train with them you know they can document that
• 1:30:11
  time and after 100 hours if
• 1:30:14
  that officer passes a skills test then
• 1:30:17
  they can certify them and you know
• 1:30:21
  that's just one of those things like how are we going to get better at
• 1:30:24
  controlling people to where we don't have to pull our gun on them not saying
• 1:30:28
  hey we're going to try to control this guy that's got a brandishing knife yeah
• 1:30:32
  I ain't gonna go up against a 300 pounder either but but if we're well it's
• 1:30:37
  a 300 pounder don't know what he's doing yeah maybe no factor but nowadays there's
• 1:30:42
  a lot of people who are training.
• 1:30:44
  The uh the gym i go to emperor
• 1:30:47
  city grappling club you know i'm not a
• 1:30:50
  small fellow but we got some you got some big boys there i
• 1:30:53
  got some dudes in there that that a couple of
• 1:30:56
  them make me look small you know i'm in that high
• 1:30:59
  calorie grappler crowd you know yeah i'm in
• 1:31:02
  the high calorie crowd but that's you
• 1:31:05
  know that's where things have shifted from how do i look to how do i perform
• 1:31:11
  right yeah yeah man and i'm happy to see it yeah that's good and i'm glad i'm
• 1:31:16
  glad that's happening and i'm trying to be a part of that i hope i had a fellow
• 1:31:21
  out here he brought some folks from his agency out last week or the week before.
• 1:31:27
  I started, you know, Facebook stalking with dudes, a published author, man. It was pretty cool.
• 1:31:32
  So what I'm doing on that is I've been talking to our training officer saying,
• 1:31:37
  hey, this is a really good opportunity.
• 1:31:41
  And I just started talking to him earlier today about it, you know,
• 1:31:45
  trying to get you to do some training.
• 1:31:48
  And hopefully it'll take and then they'll start wanting to train on their own more. Yeah.
• 1:31:52
  Well, here's what I'll try to do when I train with cops is like,
• 1:31:54
  and you witness it firsthand. Yeah.
• 1:31:57
  You somebody does some bizarre shit and i say why and and then i i either beat beat it right,
• 1:32:07
  or explain why it's right inefficient and and the clock don't lie man like if
• 1:32:14
  you're right it doesn't the clock don't lie if it's less efficient it's gonna
• 1:32:17
  it's gonna you know when i when i come out to train with you i'm happy for the
• 1:32:20
  clock because it lets me know yeah
• 1:32:22
  and and because i I want to go fast and because I want to be accurate,
• 1:32:27
  it highlights the flaws. Yeah.
• 1:32:31
  And I say it all the time, man. Anybody can shoot with no time.
• 1:32:36
  Absolutely. I can get my four-year-old out of range. Absolutely.
• 1:32:40
  To shoot the Georgia qualification. The GDAC, yeah.
• 1:32:45
  You know, with no time standard. And it'd score 80%, no problem.
• 1:32:50
  But as far as cultural shift, yeah, I'm seeing...
• 1:32:54
  Seeing that and some of you know like
• 1:32:58
  i said i know a few guys that are with the local
• 1:33:01
  agencies that do that and then there are other people within the local agencies
• 1:33:06
  that have reached out hey when are you going to be doing this or can i come
• 1:33:12
  to this the campus police department for georgia northwest what we're doing
• 1:33:17
  right now is we're working a training calendar to where,
• 1:33:20
  we are trying to implement a four-hour
• 1:33:23
  block of that hands-on jiu-jitsu training twice a
• 1:33:26
  month and it's going to be open for everybody in
• 1:33:29
  the department and if we have people outside the
• 1:33:32
  department that want to show up come on yeah i'm
• 1:33:37
  hoping by next month we have we have something set in stone to
• 1:33:40
  where we can do that because i would love nothing more
• 1:33:43
  than these officers to come out and
• 1:33:45
  learn these hands-on skills to where like i said if you
• 1:33:48
  don't have to pull your firearm and you can control somebody yeah awesome
• 1:33:52
  i like it and look at the mindset you know
• 1:33:55
  i don't training mindset is
• 1:33:58
  a weird thing because it's a series of things right but confidence absolutely
• 1:34:03
  that's what you're building right there yeah that's part of that is is building
• 1:34:08
  their confidence and the better your skill gets the more you're confident and
• 1:34:11
  the more you're confident ironically the more calm you are when right and bad things happen.
• 1:34:17
  I posted some pictures earlier today or late
• 1:34:20
  last night from one of the guys that
• 1:34:23
  we were working with and what i do at
• 1:34:26
  the end of class is we do two two minute drills with
• 1:34:29
  them where i'm telling them
• 1:34:31
  hey i'm taking your gun before this is over and you
• 1:34:34
  need to keep it and at the end of
• 1:34:37
  that two minutes they're so exhausted and they're humbled
• 1:34:41
  yeah and they're like i didn't realize i don't know
• 1:34:44
  anything you know i may be breathing a
• 1:34:46
  little bit but they're over there gasping sucking wind and
• 1:34:50
  i'm like i'm able to relax doing this
• 1:34:53
  because i've done it so much yeah to where you're freaking out you're using
• 1:34:56
  all your muscle and but also the same
• 1:34:59
  as on the range as on the mat economy of motion
• 1:35:02
  and efficiency you're exerting less energy getting
• 1:35:06
  the same effect and i'm going to put something
• 1:35:09
  out there and i and and i told our training officer that i wasn't going to say
• 1:35:13
  this but i'm going to go ahead and do it anyway i'm a jiu-jitsu fanatic yeah
• 1:35:18
  and i was fortunate enough that post awarded me that certificate based on my training and and.
• 1:35:27
  Carlson gracie jr awarded me my blue belt i'm just a blue belt in jiu-jitsu
• 1:35:32
  brown belt and judo So I've been doing it a long time.
• 1:35:34
  I never really focused on trying to get belts and stuff.
• 1:35:37
  You know, Bruce Lee says belts are good for holding your pants up. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:35:42
  I want to reach the coveted black belt in jiu-jitsu absolutely it might be when
• 1:35:45
  i'm 60 but it whenever it is it'll be when somebody greater than me says you're ready but,
• 1:35:54
  now that i have that certificate and we work so closely with the academy for georgia northwestern,
• 1:35:59
  we are seeking approval to implement that into the academy because they're required
• 1:36:05
  in the academy to do one hour of pt every other day so three days a week 60 hours in the course,
• 1:36:14
  but we're going to offer it every day so the officers that want to come in and
• 1:36:19
  do that for their pt on these three hours they've satisfied that and they also
• 1:36:23
  get their documentation.
• 1:36:26
  If they come all five days at the end of that
• 1:36:29
  20 weeks that's their 100 hours i will put them through a skills test
• 1:36:32
  and if they're if they pass that skills test
• 1:36:35
  this is not a give me skills test right and it
• 1:36:38
  is a 100 percent pass or fail i'll let
• 1:36:41
  you do it twice yeah if you miss two or three skills
• 1:36:44
  i'll go over them with you it's a lot to remember i mean it's a
• 1:36:47
  lot of skills involved in it it covers all the
• 1:36:50
  basic skills that you would need to be a brazilian
• 1:36:54
  jiu-jitsu blue belt i'm not going to award anybody
• 1:36:57
  a blue belt i would rather them be in.
• 1:36:59
  An academy and do that but if they pass their skills test
• 1:37:02
  i'll sign off on their post documentation and
• 1:37:06
  they can go back to their agency and have an extra
• 1:37:09
  certification that other academies are not
• 1:37:12
  offering yeah to people coming in and i
• 1:37:15
  think it's a good idea yeah it's incentive
• 1:37:18
  you know it's incentive marietta was the first one
• 1:37:21
  to implement brazilian jiu-jitsu into their
• 1:37:24
  stuff their liability went down their officer injuries went down
• 1:37:27
  everything went down now we got
• 1:37:31
  to get approved i'm pretty
• 1:37:33
  confident that it's going to be smiled upon and
• 1:37:37
  you know the post gods are going to open up and say yeah let's do
• 1:37:39
  it so if anybody's listening to the podcast and
• 1:37:43
  you come in and i'm there and we're able to teach it
• 1:37:45
  fine if you come in and you're a student and
• 1:37:48
  you're looking forward to it we can't do it that's just
• 1:37:51
  one of those things beyond my control but once
• 1:37:55
  you're mandated if you want to continue your training i'll let
• 1:37:58
  you know where to find me so we can do that's good man that's good because that's
• 1:38:02
  a that's a big deal man you see videos all the time cops getting their ass whooped
• 1:38:06
  man cops getting their ass whooped and it's it's tragic sometimes it's embarrassing
• 1:38:13
  a little bit especially when it's a big boy yeah.
• 1:38:17
  Getting scuffed up yeah and you
• 1:38:20
  know if that if that is implemented they're going
• 1:38:23
  to be those officers who advance really quickly and
• 1:38:27
  they may learn those basic skills very quickly and i know
• 1:38:29
  that at the end of this and they've got
• 1:38:32
  their hundred hours documented not going to be a problem
• 1:38:35
  there's going to be the ones that's like you know okay i
• 1:38:38
  get it you can't make everybody have the bump too yeah
• 1:38:41
  that's right and it's not jujitsu is
• 1:38:45
  the basis but we're we're gonna you know we have that
• 1:38:47
  defensive tactics portion too we're gonna teach you how to throw some strikes
• 1:38:51
  yeah for sure we're gonna you know teach you how to throw a good elbow you know
• 1:38:55
  um that's good man that's good stuff so a little extra not legally binding not
• 1:39:03
  legally binding not legally binding But that'd be a good, it's a good incentive.
• 1:39:07
  It's a very good incentive. Because here's, speaking of culture,
• 1:39:12
  nevermind amongst the police, here's what I'm noticing.
• 1:39:16
  Well, I noticed it early in SF and then I'm starting to notice it or I'm noticing
• 1:39:22
  it more just in the general population.
• 1:39:24
  These days, man, there are teenagers
• 1:39:28
  and 20 year olds walking around like professional athlete fitness.
• 1:39:33
  The crossfitters and they're and they got these meal plans and
• 1:39:36
  they and they all these things and they're already at a level that you know
• 1:39:40
  back in my day when i was in the army it was just hard like you just be hard
• 1:39:44
  and yeah push up sit up run yeah and and yeah there was a lot of physical stuff
• 1:39:50
  you just fought through it and did it i didn't know too many dudes who were like.
• 1:39:56
  Athletes these days in sf man everybody's a freaking d1 athlete and they're fucking crossfit,
• 1:40:05
  x games whatever's i'm i'm
• 1:40:08
  gonna tell you what and i have to brag on him a little bit my
• 1:40:11
  17 year old and you know i've been able to throw
• 1:40:14
  him around forever he went
• 1:40:16
  to the penn state wrestling camp over the summer and
• 1:40:20
  last week he was
• 1:40:23
  a little teed at
• 1:40:26
  me and i said look if you're mad that's fine so we'll
• 1:40:29
  go out here in the yard and we'll wrestle until you're not mad anymore so i'm
• 1:40:32
  not gonna get mad i'll wrestle with you whatever and uh
• 1:40:35
  we went a couple rounds and that first round i was like you didn't realize you
• 1:40:39
  made i was like oh my god i was like this kid he's gotten faster yeah and he's
• 1:40:44
  157 pounds he's like six feet maybe even six more now he's a little bit taller
• 1:40:49
  than me but he got fast i'm like he's hitting everything that i had that was open and i'm like,
• 1:40:55
  i'm like okay and you know i was like i'm gonna have to move more with him well
• 1:41:00
  we went the second round and i decided i'm gonna pick up the pace a little bit
• 1:41:03
  and we kept going until i i put some pressure on me he's like all right i'm done.
• 1:41:13
  He listens to this then kudos but if not i didn't want to i let him go in the
• 1:41:18
  house first because my wife's like you got to realize you're older and i'm like
• 1:41:21
  i think i'm gonna throw up,
• 1:41:25
  and that little dude man i was like i and i told my wife i said i wanted i wanted
• 1:41:33
  him to know that i've taught him everything he knows but not everything i know
• 1:41:37
  yeah yeah that's about he He's just got an upper-end fitness.
• 1:41:42
  Yeah. I got a real good buddy. His son is, I don't know, a middle schooler.
• 1:41:47
  But he's going to all these wrestling camps, and he's smoking it, man.
• 1:41:52
  Yeah, I got a lot of hopes for him this year. He should do very, very well.
• 1:41:56
  And I think he will as long as he maintains his discipline and keeps after it.
• 1:42:03
  It'll be a long season to start from October to February. But when young guys
• 1:42:08
  ask me about going in the military and stuff like that, I was never a wrestler.
• 1:42:13
  I played a little baseball. I played a little football. I moved around a lot. I never stuck anywhere.
• 1:42:18
  But I tell them, wrestling, like young, young guys, like go wrestle, man.
• 1:42:24
  Be a wrestler. Because that's one of the most grueling physical, you're going to be fit.
• 1:42:29
  Well, he's been doing no-gi jiu-jitsu too.
• 1:42:33
  And I watched him a little bit the other day after work. and i'm like how many
• 1:42:36
  rounds have you done he's like uh nine or ten i'm like nine or ten i'm like
• 1:42:40
  six minute rounds good lord and i'm like i'll do four of them and i'll take
• 1:42:45
  a break in between after the second one and i'm still i'm like man i'd like
• 1:42:48
  to have his endurance but you know he's,
• 1:42:51
  he started college he's doing dual enrollment so he's taking one high school class and the rest
• 1:42:57
  college nice and he's going to uh georgia northwestern for hbac and he's worked
• 1:43:04
  through the summer the last two summers doing it and his boss is like yeah we
• 1:43:07
  let him do you know troubleshooting and everything now i just check make sure
• 1:43:11
  it's good and then we go to the next job i'm like that.
• 1:43:14
  I don't know where he got that big brain energy from. Well, that's good, man.
• 1:43:19
  I think, you know, again, speaking of culture shift, man, I think that's the way, man.
• 1:43:25
  Kids getting that technical skill, trade, making lots of money,
• 1:43:29
  and then don't cost arm and leg to get there. You know what I mean?
• 1:43:34
  Right. You know, because he's doing the dual enrollment through the Floyd County
• 1:43:38
  schools, he's not going to have to worry about having like student loans and
• 1:43:41
  stuff. Right. So that's a plus.
• 1:43:43
  And if there's anybody in, you know, Floyd County that's got an intelligent
• 1:43:48
  kid that wants to learn a skill, I wholly support the dual enrollment program. Yeah, for sure.
• 1:43:55
  I wouldn't talk them out of it. Yeah.
• 1:43:58
  Nah, man. If they can manage that workload, do it because it's just a benefit.
• 1:44:04
  And back to cultural shift too, what I've also seen is, and you hear it all
• 1:44:09
  the time, these new, these young people don't want to do this, that.
• 1:44:13
  I'm starting to see a lot of young people. It's got really, really good work ethics.
• 1:44:18
  Something that had been missing for a few years. I don't know where it went, but it's coming back.
• 1:44:23
  I tell you what, man. My daughter, she is 23.
• 1:44:27
  She hated college. She went to, we first sent her to Colorado Christian University,
• 1:44:33
  which is an awesome school, awesome programs, big deal.
• 1:44:39
  We were very excited. She went and hated it.
• 1:44:42
  So she came home. I was like, babe, you got to go to school.
• 1:44:46
  Okay. She enrolled in Georgia Highlands.
• 1:44:50
  It she just don't like school it's just the environment
• 1:44:53
  but she she's a
• 1:44:56
  worker man she's got work ethic by the
• 1:44:59
  truckloads right she's just trying to find what she
• 1:45:02
  wants to do with it but yeah she'll be
• 1:45:05
  one that'll have an entrepreneurial mindset no
• 1:45:08
  that's that's probably what's yeah she already she
• 1:45:12
  yeah she already has ideas out there but yeah man
• 1:45:15
  there i think there was a time there like these kids
• 1:45:18
  don't want to do anything they got stuck on the screens but now i
• 1:45:21
  think they're starting to come out of this stuck on the screens right you
• 1:45:25
  know what i'm saying yeah well i think because it's no big deal that
• 1:45:28
  that are you know taking that stuff away from them at certain times of day now
• 1:45:32
  well managing it especially for young ones for sure yeah you know our our 11
• 1:45:37
  soon to be 12 year old is uh he scares me when it comes to eating because he's
• 1:45:43
  he's 11 and then he's 5'9",
• 1:45:46
  140 pounds and eats like a freaking horse.
• 1:45:50
  But anyway, we have to monitor his because he likes to, I'm like,
• 1:45:54
  no, you got to get off of that.
• 1:45:55
  Yeah. But now that he's playing football, a lot of times he just comes in and
• 1:45:59
  is like, I'm tired of him. He ain't got time, man. He ain't got time. He smoked.
• 1:46:02
  That's right. And it's doing him some good, you know. Yeah.
• 1:46:06
  And I always hated school. I did. When I graduated high school. I hated it.
• 1:46:11
  I had to go to a class. It's called the College of Career Academy now.
• 1:46:16
  It used to just be Coosa Valley Tech High School side of it.
• 1:46:20
  I had to go to a class to have enough credits to graduate high school.
• 1:46:24
  And I ordered my cap and gown like a week and a half before we graduated.
• 1:46:28
  I hated it so much. I did that too.
• 1:46:31
  Look, man, in my senior year, so my senior year is when Georgia implemented
• 1:46:40
  the, if you miss 10 days or more of school, it's automatic fail.
• 1:46:45
  My junior year and prior, man, I skipped school like a big boss.
• 1:46:49
  I hated school but i was a good student i guess i
• 1:46:52
  was passing tests i it wasn't challenging right
• 1:46:55
  my senior year i thought yeah whatever so i missed i don't know however many
• 1:47:01
  30 40 days they're like look you're not gonna graduate and i was like well why
• 1:47:06
  am i here no you're not graduating so i left then i decided i want to join the army so i got an army.
• 1:47:14
  A recruiter and he was like well we're not doing waivers for geds man you got
• 1:47:19
  to have a real diploma and i was
• 1:47:20
  like well damn dang i kind of quit school and he's like i got a program,
• 1:47:26
  and in smyrna some off south cob drive there was like a cob adult education high school right,
• 1:47:33
  and it was a work at your own pace i was
• 1:47:36
  like man if i'd have known about that i'd have been doing that the whole
• 1:47:39
  time right i went in there and knocked out half of
• 1:47:42
  my senior year in like three weeks right because
• 1:47:47
  you could test out you didn't have to like there
• 1:47:49
  was a teacher there right but i was like hey just give me the test the one the
• 1:47:55
  one high school class my son has to take is is online he actually doesn't start
• 1:48:00
  his hbac courses till the 18th of august and they're like well you have to come
• 1:48:04
  to school until you finish that one he's like can i work on at home They're like, yeah.
• 1:48:08
  And he's like, yeah, I'm going to smoke through that in like a week and a half.
• 1:48:11
  Yeah. And then they're like, you don't have to come back here except for when
• 1:48:14
  wrestling starts for wrestling practice. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:48:17
  I'm like, where was this when I was in high school? Yeah. And,
• 1:48:19
  you know, we're talking about hating school.
• 1:48:21
  When my wife first went into the Air Force to do radiology, that's when I left the city of Rome.
• 1:48:28
  And when we got to Texas, I was like, I got to find something to do.
• 1:48:32
  So I went to aeronautical college and you got my A&P license. Nice.
• 1:48:36
  And so, you know, I do that on the side and stuff.
• 1:48:40
  And we come back to Georgia and I'm like, well, I don't want to just be down
• 1:48:45
  here. And I know a lot of these upper positions, you know, they're required
• 1:48:50
  to have a master's and this or that.
• 1:48:52
  So I started going back to school again. I was like, well, I'll get my bachelor's
• 1:48:57
  in criminal justice because I'm already really close to having that.
• 1:49:00
  And then I got looking at it and I was like, well, if I get a doctorate in public
• 1:49:06
  administration, what job does that open up?
• 1:49:08
  And I'm like, I hate to do it because I hate school.
• 1:49:13
  But if i can get into this position then i
• 1:49:16
  can have a lot of say in what happens at these lower positions like
• 1:49:19
  implementing stuff well i've got about three years and two months to finish
• 1:49:24
  my doctorate in that and i'm hoping eventually i would like to be i mean if
• 1:49:30
  we stay around here i'd like to be like the dean over public safety for gncc
• 1:49:34
  over all those programs yeah nice and And, you know,
• 1:49:37
  that way I can, depending on who's up there,
• 1:49:40
  you know, we can really try to foster these programs and make them more real-world specific.
• 1:49:47
  Not that Post is, I mean, Post is doing a great job. They're going to say you got to do this.
• 1:49:52
  But at the school, what can we add to it that's going to be better?
• 1:49:55
  Right. You do Post and then you can, yeah, yeah, that's right. Yeah.
• 1:49:59
  Because, and they also give you, it's an 809 hour total curriculum,
• 1:50:04
  but they're going to give you some of those hours so you can go back and revisit
• 1:50:08
  stuff that you need to revisit. Right, right, right.
• 1:50:10
  Well, if we're going to go back and revisit stuff, we're going to make it better. Yeah, for sure.
• 1:50:14
  So I got a game plan in the long run. That's a good plan, man.
• 1:50:17
  Are we going to call you Dr. Ricky or what? I don't know. It's kind of weird, isn't it? That is weird.
• 1:50:23
  My wife's like, how are you going to do that? I said, could you imagine when
• 1:50:27
  this is over and done with, I have a doctorate, and people are going to look
• 1:50:32
  at me like, this kid barely even graduated high school. I know. I can't.
• 1:50:37
  Nobody I know, I'm an uneducated guy. I can't even imagine having a doctorate.
• 1:50:41
  And what I tell, I tell my wife this all the time. That's funny.
• 1:50:44
  I tell her, I was like, I got a 4.0 grade point average right now.
• 1:50:47
  She's like, how do you do that? And I'm like, I treat it like a job.
• 1:50:52
  That's it, man. That's it. I treat it like a job. Yeah, that's it.
• 1:50:55
  I would look... Yeah, I mean...
• 1:50:58
  I can't imagine on my career trajectory right now what I would do in a degree. You know what I mean?
• 1:51:04
  Because it's all about the range. Which, by the way, we're...
• 1:51:09
  Close to Handshake. Down south? No, over on Morton Bend Road,
• 1:51:16
  50 acres over there. Yeah, down south.
• 1:51:18
  It's actually directly west. Well, I mean, south side of the county,
• 1:51:23
  southwest. West side, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
• 1:51:26
  It's almost on the azimuth freaking directly west side.
• 1:51:32
  It's just off of Highway. Morton Bend kind of does that loop,
• 1:51:36
  but it's Highway 100. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:51:39
  We're so close to that, man. Golly, I can't wait.
• 1:51:43
  Well, regardless of continuing education or not, but the range and the firearm
• 1:51:48
  stuff, that's pretty important to me.
• 1:51:50
  So that's going to be a long-term thing on my end. Yeah, for sure.
• 1:51:55
  I bought some of those stands that way. If I'm not able to come out,
• 1:51:59
  I've got stuff at home to where I can put my stuff up.
• 1:52:03
  Yeah, well, my partner, Kurt, that's what he says. He's like,
• 1:52:05
  we got to have, the range has got to be awesome because everybody around here has got five acres or 28.
• 1:52:13
  You know, everybody can step out on their back porch. You said Kirk, Kirk Fennell? Yeah.
• 1:52:17
  Yeah. Yeah. I heard a lot about him. I've not met him, but a lot of people think
• 1:52:20
  highly of him. He's a beast. Yeah. He's a beast. He's an athlete.
• 1:52:24
  Pure, pure bread. He's one of them specimens. Thoroughbreds.
• 1:52:27
  He's a specimen. He's a specimen. I think he played football,
• 1:52:30
  college ball for Ole Miss.
• 1:52:31
  He's a bit of a renaissance man. I think he was a chef for a while. He's a Green Beret.
• 1:52:35
  He's a current Green Beret with him, 20th group. Okay. Okay.
• 1:52:39
  And now he's sponsored Tactical Games, Elite Division guy. And that's his life right now.
• 1:52:46
  Yeah, he's a beast. Absolute specimen.
• 1:52:50
  Yep. Yep. A lot of people claim genetics, but genetics don't give you work ethic.
• 1:52:58
  No, this guy's, it's work. Now, I don't know how his dad looked when he was
• 1:53:03
  30, but, you know, he's a lawyer.
• 1:53:06
  He's kind of rotund.
• 1:53:09
  I know his dad. Oh, yeah. So, yeah, I don't know genetics or what,
• 1:53:14
  but I know he works hard because Joker lives in a gym.
• 1:53:19
  Yeah. Yeah, I admire his dedication to it.
• 1:53:26
  I can only imagine what it would have been like, you know, we're talking about
• 1:53:29
  young people now, how they're, some of them are just extraordinarily fit. Yeah.
• 1:53:38
  And sometimes you can look at some parents and go, parents have some given direction in that.
• 1:53:45
  And then you look at some parents and you're like, where'd that come from? Right.
• 1:53:48
  Yeah. I'm kind of like, when I look at my kids, I'm like, where'd that come from?
• 1:53:54
  Especially with my oldest one like you know i don't
• 1:53:58
  think i've grabbed hold anybody at 157 pounds
• 1:54:01
  that was that strong like in
• 1:54:04
  recent years i would rock good god yeah yeah well
• 1:54:08
  look man let's let's circle that back around the cops like
• 1:54:11
  you're out here on the streets if you
• 1:54:14
  ain't tip top man like some of these people they're
• 1:54:18
  they're they're they're little mma ninjas man they
• 1:54:21
  will stuff you up they will twist you up right and i
• 1:54:24
  and i've told people on numerous
• 1:54:28
  occasions that you know you can lift all the weight in the world but you know
• 1:54:33
  what you gonna do if somebody gets you in a rear naked choke yeah you know you
• 1:54:37
  gotta be the total package these days because there's young guys out there who
• 1:54:41
  are doing that they're going to the gym yeah and they're doing mma shit and,
• 1:54:45
  brazilian jiu-jitsu and they're shooting i tell you what another realization i had,
• 1:54:51
  i follow a whole bunch of shooters right on instagram and all that and i'm not
• 1:54:55
  talking about pro shooters i mean just just shooters just in georgia man just
• 1:55:00
  in the atlanta metro area.
• 1:55:03
  There's 50 guys right now i could i could sort of point out who are you know
• 1:55:09
  master a class master grandmaster level shooters and they work various jobs
• 1:55:15
  and do the thing they're not all pro shooters Right.
• 1:55:17
  They're just, they just go train. That's their hobby. That's the thing they do. Yeah.
• 1:55:22
  Got some cop rolls up on you and and you catch this dude you know and uh and
• 1:55:29
  you get you get out drawn you know what i'm saying there's people out there who are better than you,
• 1:55:34
  so the way you handle these things you either
• 1:55:37
  got to be ready for them well they're gonna be a bunch of people that
• 1:55:40
  think i'm just shit talking when i say what i'm about to say because
• 1:55:43
  obviously i'm not in peak physical
• 1:55:46
  shape by no means i mean but there
• 1:55:50
  are a lot of people out there that are better than most
• 1:55:53
  of us when it comes to fitness as far as people on the road i like when i see
• 1:55:59
  the officers out there you know that maintain their fitness and their training
• 1:56:03
  like casmar great dude yes he's doing it right yeah yeah and i know there's
• 1:56:08
  other officers doing it right too because I see it. Yeah.
• 1:56:11
  You know, but then you look at some officers and I'm like, no, just no.
• 1:56:18
  Look, man. And I, and I've reached out to some that I know and I'm like,
• 1:56:22
  hey, I'm concerned about you.
• 1:56:24
  You're still out here doing this job, but I'm seriously concerned about your physical health.
• 1:56:31
  Like I, you know, I know I'm carrying about an extra 40 pounds and,
• 1:56:34
  and I need to work it off and I need to change my diet to reflect that.
• 1:56:40
  But I also know that I gained 60 when I had a shoulder replacement.
• 1:56:43
  And it's not easy. It's not coming off like it did when I was in my 20s.
• 1:56:46
  It's harder as you get older. It's harder to learn them down.
• 1:56:49
  Nine months post-op. Yeah.
• 1:56:51
  And, you know, I just now, four weeks ago, got cleared to where I can start
• 1:56:56
  doing push-ups again. Right.
• 1:56:58
  And I try not, you know, man, when we get out here on the range,
• 1:57:00
  I try not to let it aggravate me too much.
• 1:57:03
  But you'll see me out there doing this about every round just because I'm trying
• 1:57:07
  to shake out the soreness already.
• 1:57:08
  So one of the things i tell people guns
• 1:57:13
  or no guns fighting whatever it is
• 1:57:16
  all things equal the fitter
• 1:57:19
  guy is going to win all other things equal the fitter
• 1:57:22
  guy is going to outlast the lesser fit
• 1:57:25
  guy yep and heaven forbid
• 1:57:28
  he's got skill too yep so yeah
• 1:57:32
  it matters man i try to roll with people i
• 1:57:35
  trust at the gym i'm like hey i guess for sure new shoulder you do whatever
• 1:57:40
  you want you roll as hard as you want but if you start attacking that side and
• 1:57:44
  i start getting uncomfortable you win we're done right and we'll start again
• 1:57:48
  and i love rolling with coach pj he's
• 1:57:53
  very respectful for it sam's very respectful shot everybody i roll with is very
• 1:57:58
  respectful of it and it's one of the few gyms that i've been to that when you
• 1:58:01
  got something going on like that They're real respectful of it.
• 1:58:03
  They want you to train and learn and stay healthy. You know? And, uh.
• 1:58:09
  I'll get to rolling with, like, I rolled with Sam.
• 1:58:12
  I've only rolled with Sam once since I've been there. I've only been to,
• 1:58:15
  like, eight or nine classes since I've been back.
• 1:58:18
  I rolled with Sam once. I'm like, this dude is going to smoke me.
• 1:58:21
  And I knew it was coming. I knew I was going to be dead.
• 1:58:24
  Six-minute round, I'm like, yeah, two minutes in, I'm smoking. Yeah.
• 1:58:29
  And that's pretty much how it went. You know, and they just went to a tournament
• 1:58:33
  this past Saturday, They won a state tournament overall team points, 16 or 18 gold medals.
• 1:58:41
  PJ still undefeated as a black belt Georgia state champion. Nice.
• 1:58:45
  And I can't remember what all they won. Really good team.
• 1:58:49
  But PJ, not a law enforcement officer, but has the post certification to teach officers.
• 1:58:56
  So if there's any officers listening and they want to go to Emperor City Grappling
• 1:59:01
  Club, he can document their time.
• 1:59:03
  There you go. there you go and you know even though
• 1:59:06
  i can teach you i still go up there because i want to progress and get better
• 1:59:10
  yeah you know i got to bring pj down here he's he's interested and he's like
• 1:59:15
  you know i've grown up shooting guns and i love to turkey hunt i'm like i know
• 1:59:18
  a guy so i've already i've already told him he's you know my schedule's pretty
• 1:59:23
  tight i was like we'll work it out yeah
• 1:59:25
  so i'm gonna bring i'm gonna bring him down here one day that's good man do it i'd like to meet
• 1:59:29
  guy i've heard danny talk about him he's always talking about yeah danny was
• 1:59:35
  up there the other evening he's always talking about emperor bjj on his yeah podcast that's good man,
• 1:59:43
  yeah overall man we we do need to do better as far as law enforcement officers.
• 1:59:50
  It's easy to to get complacent ride around in your car you know you go,
• 1:59:55
  however long nothing really happens you answer some calls nothing
• 1:59:59
  you know too out there and then it's going to
• 2:00:01
  hit one day and you're going to be like what the hell well that's
• 2:00:05
  the bad part is it may never hit but when it does you got to be there you got
• 2:00:09
  to be in the game you got to be ready you know fortune favors are prepared it's
• 2:00:13
  not comparable regular patrol cops right guys are just out riding the streets
• 2:00:19
  it's not comparable to what i did at all swat cops i think it is It's because you can plan a mission,
• 2:00:25
  execute the mission. It's a thing.
• 2:00:27
  You know, you go in, you got your team maneuver, however you set up on the house.
• 2:00:32
  You raid the house. Do your thing.
• 2:00:35
  But cops who are out on the street every day, that can get, that can beat you
• 2:00:39
  down. Just being in the car all day.
• 2:00:42
  You know, being in the car all day, if you don't get out and move,
• 2:00:45
  you don't get out and stretch.
• 2:00:46
  Your gun belt's weighing on you. It's going to start causing you back problems.
• 2:00:50
  But instead of doing a little PT here and there stop and get a burger yeah and
• 2:00:56
  it's you know it's hard not to especially when you're on night shift and everything's closed and.
• 2:01:04
  No, that's a lot of stuff working against you right there for sure.
• 2:01:07
  And then in your time off, I know, man, in your time off, you want to go chill.
• 2:01:11
  You better find some beef jerky and water at night or something.
• 2:01:15
  Yeah. Because if you start eating them 24-hour McDonald's, it's going to.
• 2:01:20
  I tell you what, man, I've done a lot in my career. I did a lot of surveillance
• 2:01:24
  training and surveillance stuff, mobile and food and whatever.
• 2:01:31
  I never eat worse than when I'm doing mobile surveillance, man.
• 2:01:35
  Right. Because you're grabbing stuff on the go, and you grab what's easy, you know. Yeah.
• 2:01:42
  It's very easy. And just gallons of coffee. Just go and get something that's in a hurry. Oh, yeah.
• 2:01:47
  Not a good habit, and I wouldn't recommend it. But, you know,
• 2:01:50
  I work third shift for a lot of nights.
• 2:01:53
  And you'd be fine until about one or two, and then your eyes start getting hit.
• 2:01:56
  What do you do? and you slam a five-hour energy, you know? Yeah.
• 2:02:01
  And then, and it is the price of doing business. You work all night,
• 2:02:06
  and then you have to go sit in court all day, and you sleep an hour,
• 2:02:08
  and then you have to go work all night again. Yeah, man.
• 2:02:10
  That's not favorable, but you still got to make some time for yourself.
• 2:02:16
  Yeah, you got to try to prioritize. And I don't mean making time for yourself to sit and do nothing.
• 2:02:23
  I mean, make time for yourself. Make time for your health and your fitness a
• 2:02:26
  little bit. I've never been like an overly healthy guy as far as eating freaking
• 2:02:32
  kale and whatnot, right?
• 2:02:35
  I eat meat, bro. I eat chicken and steak and hot wings.
• 2:02:39
  Yeah, it's just the potatoes and stuff that go with it. Yeah.
• 2:02:42
  That's a little bit too much sometimes.
• 2:02:44
  But yeah, man, you got to make time to try to be a little healthy, man.
• 2:02:49
  But yeah, Kazmar, it's good that you brought him up. Yeah, I think he does it right.
• 2:02:54
  He does. He hits 5Ks. he's out there he comes out here and shoots matches,
• 2:02:59
  right and you know he's got to make time for it and I talk to him I'm like hey
• 2:03:04
  how are you training for your running and stuff he's like man he said I have
• 2:03:08
  to sacrifice sleep and go to bed late so I can run at night yeah.
• 2:03:13
  He's got kids. You know what I mean? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and a farm, running a farm.
• 2:03:16
  So, you know, he's a supervisor on the road, you know.
• 2:03:23
  Cook Farms. Cook Farms, that's right. They got really good beef,
• 2:03:26
  too. Yep, Cook Farms down in, it's like Cave Spring, no, Cedartown. Cedartown. Yeah.
• 2:03:31
  Cook Farm and Cedartown. We want some beef. But Kazmar is one of those supervisors
• 2:03:36
  that is leading by example, or trying to lead by example.
• 2:03:41
  But again you know it's you lead a horse to water you can't make them drink yeah for sure and.
• 2:03:47
  Usually the lights come on and and there.
• 2:03:50
  Something happens and somebody's like yeah that'll never happen again
• 2:03:53
  and then all they
• 2:03:56
  want to do is train and then sometimes something
• 2:03:59
  will happen and you never have that opportunity because now
• 2:04:03
  you just crap out of luck you're no longer with us
• 2:04:05
  well i hope that don't happen around here you know as a
• 2:04:08
  cop man you got to stay up on the cultural freaking ebbs
• 2:04:12
  and flows the political ebbs and flows because there's
• 2:04:15
  a couple years there man cops are targets bro i
• 2:04:18
  mean it's kind of still going on a little bit but oh what
• 2:04:22
  i was talking about the three guys that i was talking
• 2:04:24
  about earlier from rome that 2014 2015 they
• 2:04:29
  were arrested and they had detailed plans
• 2:04:33
  on using pop bombs yeah and some other means toward
• 2:04:37
  local police departments here in rome yeah and there
• 2:04:41
  is actually a lot of great detail from the undercover agent
• 2:04:44
  who went and met
• 2:04:47
  with him and like went to their went to this
• 2:04:50
  i guess some kind of party or
• 2:04:52
  whatever and they kind of invited him in open
• 2:04:55
  arms and stuff and and he details it really good
• 2:04:58
  on joe rogan's podcast oh yeah and i was just kind of i just caught a snippet
• 2:05:03
  of it he's like yeah i went to this thing and check that out man he said i went
• 2:05:06
  to this thing in rome georgia and they were going to sacrifice a goat and when
• 2:05:10
  i heard rome georgia it got my attention and then i was like oh i remember that
• 2:05:15
  and i just listened to him tell the story and i'm like this dude.
• 2:05:19
  This this is wild it is it is a good a good listen to all that that's good man.
• 2:05:26
  Man. What else? Let's see. We've, let's see. We've pimped Emperor City, Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.
• 2:05:32
  We've pimped Cook Farms. Yeah. Let's see. Who else?
• 2:05:36
  Who else? Who else? I think that's about it.
• 2:05:40
  Was it Southern Munitions? Oh, Southern Munitions. Southern Musicians. Yeah. Glock.
• 2:05:44
  Glock for sure. Yeah. Hey man. Not P320. Look man, uh, Kurt for it.
• 2:05:50
  Kurt's a sponsored shooter, right? He's got a Atlas.
• 2:05:54
  I can't remember what Atlas I see shooting right now, but, you know,
• 2:05:56
  that's about a $7,000 gun. I can tell you, old Edgar ain't ever going to be shooting a $7,000 gun.
• 2:06:02
  Well, if I do, it's going to be somebody else's. Yeah, somebody else's.
• 2:06:05
  I'm a Glock man. I've got a 1911.
• 2:06:09
  I like Smith & Wesson M&P's pretty good. I'm never going to buy a 2011 light hot rod.
• 2:06:15
  I may end up with a CZ Shadow Compact 2, the Compact carry.
• 2:06:21
  That's about as much as I plan to spend on a gun, but I'm a Glock man.
• 2:06:26
  That 2011 was nice, though, the way he had it set up. He run it pretty good,
• 2:06:30
  too. Oh, yeah. Well, yeah.
• 2:06:33
  You can feel the quality. When you pull the trigger, you're like, yes.
• 2:06:39
  We were talking about the same guy that was at the pistol workshop, right? Oh, no, no, no.
• 2:06:45
  So that, what gun was that? The one at the pistol workshop? Yeah.
• 2:06:51
  No, it was a Staccato 2011. He had the aluminum grips and stuff on it.
• 2:06:57
  Look, I personally think Atlas smoked staccato on just finesse. You know what I mean?
• 2:07:03
  I don't know, but I've been looking at one called B-U-L Bull.
• 2:07:07
  Or B-U-L. I'm not sure how it's pronounced.
• 2:07:10
  I'm not looking to buy one, but I've been looking at people shooting them in a review.
• 2:07:13
  There's so many guns out there. There's so many custom 2011 makers out there
• 2:07:18
  right now. Yeah, and I'm not. It's insane. I'm probably not going to.
• 2:07:22
  I'm still thinking like, do I put a Johnny Glock trigger in my 19 or do I put
• 2:07:30
  a, do I put a apex trigger in my, in my Springfield?
• 2:07:36
  So I got a Johnny Glock in my, in my daily gun.
• 2:07:39
  But one of the guys that was out at that, that workshop, Andrew,
• 2:07:43
  he had a new, I think it was a Glock 45 and he had the Ramjet compensator,
• 2:07:51
  and he had, whatever hollow sun on it and i can't remember what trigger i was
• 2:07:56
  like man i i want to do that setup and he just he just got that too because
• 2:08:01
  he had a sig for a while yeah i'd been looking at that ramjet setup too but
• 2:08:05
  i'm like i don't know if that's something i'll i'm looking at it like,
• 2:08:10
  i really really like that hellcat pro i carry from adc but also that glock 45
• 2:08:16
  i had at work But, bud, them Hellcats, they kick so hard.
• 2:08:20
  I don't, how does, how does that gun recoil so hard? What design flaw?
• 2:08:26
  Because they immediately, you know, when they first come out,
• 2:08:28
  man, like, it wasn't a couple months later, they started making compensated models.
• 2:08:32
  Well, yeah, the Hellcat Pro is better than that regular, the first one they
• 2:08:37
  came out with by four. Oh, yeah. Well, okay, the Pro, yeah.
• 2:08:40
  The Glock 45 I carry at work, it's got the EOTech on it. I'm like,
• 2:08:45
  I really like it, too. Yeah.
• 2:08:50
  And i went and traded that the one that i had for that that pistol course that didn't have the,
• 2:08:56
  red dot on it i went and traded that one
• 2:08:59
  that following monday they said yeah we got got that one in and uh i was like
• 2:09:06
  we're gonna make sure this thing zeroed and all that man i probably done put
• 2:09:10
  like 800 rounds through that thing i love this thing yeah which also makes me think do I want to.
• 2:09:18
  Get one for myself but
• 2:09:21
  put the hollison on there or do i just want
• 2:09:24
  to try to see what that glock with
• 2:09:27
  the koa on it's all about man to me red you know what price factor is what matters
• 2:09:33
  to me like if it's got the baseline quality which hollison does and it's affordable
• 2:09:38
  the red dots i happen to like the chevron that's why i got the one i got right
• 2:09:43
  if loophole still made the,
• 2:09:47
  the mini red dot that had a chevron on it the dealt the old version of the delta
• 2:09:52
  point i would have been running that uh because it was all about the reticle
• 2:09:56
  for me that's why i hadn't i hadn't changed the triggers on that glock or that
• 2:10:01
  springfield yet because i'm like,
• 2:10:04
  it costs money i'm like i need to but yeah but there's some good glock especially
• 2:10:09
  you can but you can get a good trigger just drop right on in there man oh yeah
• 2:10:13
  and i think the next one i get it's going to be an apex.
• 2:10:17
  It depends. If I can talk Chad Wright into selling me, he's got a CZ shadow
• 2:10:21
  to compact that he tested out. I think it's his daily carry gun though.
• 2:10:27
  I assumed he was going to sell it and get rid of it. Right.
• 2:10:30
  And I texted him when he got it. I was like, Hey man, when you get ready, I watched one.
• 2:10:35
  I know, I know he's been carrying a hell cat in his like cross country bag.
• 2:10:39
  When has he, when he's ready, he's ready to sell that CZ. It.
• 2:10:44
  You put me on that. It was just a few videos ago, and I don't think it was like
• 2:10:47
  an old video that I watched. Yeah.
• 2:10:49
  Because he was talking about stuff he put in his bag for like going cross country and stuff.
• 2:10:54
  I don't know, man. That might be an older video. I think I remember that one.
• 2:10:57
  I don't know if it was that old or not. Maybe not. I don't know.
• 2:11:01
  I mean, who knows? If you're listening, I want that shadow, buddy.
• 2:11:05
  Everybody talks about guns so much, you know. John Lovell. Yeah.
• 2:11:11
  He put out a video he says the quickest
• 2:11:14
  way to fix your cp320 was you take
• 2:11:17
  the slide off of it and you take your shadow systems slide
• 2:11:21
  and you put it up here but then you take this and then you put
• 2:11:24
  the shadow systems bottom up here and that solves your problem yeah oh
• 2:11:27
  this is great well he's fortunate enough to have
• 2:11:30
  his own liner his own signature i've seen signature gun i've seen them yeah
• 2:11:35
  as far as i know they're good guns too though i mean oh yeah i know a few guys
• 2:11:40
  that run shadow systems to me it's not worth the money i just just put a trigger in your glock.
• 2:11:49
  Well how about how about this if glock is listening we need an edgar mills custom
• 2:11:53
  special yeah right i'll be down i'll be down in smyrna at the glock factory
• 2:11:59
  next week but it would be It would just be a stock lock with like an apex trigger.
• 2:12:03
  I mean, that's fine. A little signature on the slide, you know.
• 2:12:06
  A little OSS model. I'll be down there going through their armors course next
• 2:12:10
  week. That's good, man. That's good.
• 2:12:12
  A buddy of mine. My employer is sending me to that.
• 2:12:15
  I do have to plug my chief because he is an advocate on training.
• 2:12:21
  Yeah, that's good. And he's like, everybody that works under me, if you want,
• 2:12:26
  you know, we can get you 160 hours of additional
• 2:12:29
  training a year and that's pretty
• 2:12:32
  good you know i went back through my training record and even
• 2:12:36
  rome city they love to send you to training you know and like
• 2:12:40
  160 hours a year so i just went back because it'll give you your yearly average
• 2:12:44
  when you go through your post record yeah and i think the highest yearly average
• 2:12:48
  i had was like 78 hours and i'm like i'm gonna eat up this 160 hours yeah i'd
• 2:12:53
  be trying to scoop all them hours up bud I'm going to get 80 when I go to Firearms
• 2:12:57
  IT, and then I got a couple more.
• 2:13:01
  I'm going to go to First Responders. I'm on the wait.
• 2:13:04
  Well, it's not a wait list, but I'm hoping to get selected for that class next
• 2:13:07
  month, which, you know, that's a lot of, like, triage and, you know. Yeah.
• 2:13:16
  It's good stuff. Kind of a critical incident type response.
• 2:13:20
  We did a course out here with a company called VITAC.
• 2:13:24
  And it was one day of, or was it half day?
• 2:13:28
  Yeah, half day medical and then a half day everyday carry on the range.
• 2:13:32
  Right. It was pretty good.
• 2:13:35
  Start doing that i'm not qualified you know i've done all the t triple c i've done all that stuff,
• 2:13:42
  throughout my career but i'm not qualified to
• 2:13:45
  teach it so i don't i don't feel like i should teach
• 2:13:48
  it because it'd be it'd be down and dirty if
• 2:13:51
  i was teaching it tourniquet the limbs seal the box and pack the junctions and
• 2:13:56
  get them get them somewhere yeah pack it till you can't pack it no more yeah
• 2:14:01
  i've got first-hand experience with that and that was bizarre it was afghan guy i was just.
• 2:14:10
  Stuffing gauze stuff and gauze like when's it
• 2:14:13
  gonna stop stuffing gauze stuff and gauze like
• 2:14:16
  it was never ending unfortunately and i tried to and once i ran out of gauze
• 2:14:21
  man i had my finger in there and i was pressing as hard as i could that was
• 2:14:25
  the first guy i ever seen you know the lights go out but man it was like you
• 2:14:31
  underestimate how much gauze oh yeah you can stuff in a wound,
• 2:14:37
  to me what's weird is when the lights look like they're out and then they come back,
• 2:14:41
  it's this whole boy yeah up here on on mlk when we turn a kid a guy's leg off
• 2:14:48
  he damn cut it with a damn chainsaw and it was only being held on by like a
• 2:14:52
  flap of skin in the back oh man and he He went through his thigh all the way
• 2:14:58
  through the bone. Oh, my God.
• 2:15:00
  That joker was as wide as paper when we got there. And he's just like,
• 2:15:04
  and I'm like, I thought, I was like, this dude's gone.
• 2:15:08
  Well. Did he throw his own turn? Did he have a tourniquet or anything on?
• 2:15:11
  No. And I had one in the car, but when I turned to go into the field he was
• 2:15:15
  in, it rolled off the seat. Somehow or another, the dang thing got stuck under the seat. Oh, my God.
• 2:15:19
  So I used his, the other guy, the other guy's nephew's hoodie. Yeah.
• 2:15:26
  Andy Rast, who works at the city, we tied it off and he gave me a stick.
• 2:15:30
  We were tightening it up.
• 2:15:31
  And then that thing got, and then that stick broke. And I was sitting there
• 2:15:33
  having to hold it, waiting on people.
• 2:15:35
  But when we did that, his blood pressure started coming back up.
• 2:15:39
  And he went from being pale to moaning and stuff. And I'm like,
• 2:15:42
  I looked at him kind of funny.
• 2:15:44
  And then the Joker's hand started bleeding. Oh, man. Where he grabbed a chainsaw
• 2:15:49
  to try to pull it out of his leg and it was still running.
• 2:15:52
  Anyway, and I think I mentioned this on Burnham's podcast.
• 2:15:55
  That had i known then what i know now i'd have drove a lot slower and i wouldn't
• 2:15:59
  give him any aid that he passed anyway didn't he no he didn't pass he he lived
• 2:16:04
  through it did he did a lot of a lot of surgical repair and he just lost an appeal to suit to uh,
• 2:16:12
  what's that word i'm looking for he lost an appeal about some evidence that
• 2:16:17
  where he was caught trying to arrange a sexual meeting with an underage female
• 2:16:21
  oh man come on now so you tell me If you get your leg cut off, I mean, you know what?
• 2:16:27
  And you go through all that. Yeah. And you get another chance at life.
• 2:16:32
  And you didn't find Jesus. You went the other way. Good Lord, man.
• 2:16:37
  And, you know, a year after that happened, his house burnt to the ground right
• 2:16:41
  before Christmas. Oh, my God.
• 2:16:43
  And then when the fire captain told me about that, fire captain,
• 2:16:46
  he said, you remember that guy, you know, y'all saved his life?
• 2:16:51
  The one, I said, yeah. His damn house burned down. Did he live alone? I don't know. I don't.
• 2:16:58
  I mean, if he's trying to set up liaisons with underage women,
• 2:17:02
  maybe he's trying to get a little insurance fraud.
• 2:17:06
  Probably. That's probably what happened. But now that was 2015 and 2016 or 17.
• 2:17:12
  This other one was, he lost the appeal back in February to suppress the evidence. Yeah.
• 2:17:19
  Lord man if he ain't been sent to prison yet
• 2:17:21
  i hope he's on the way that's crazy good
• 2:17:25
  lord that's crazy stuff out there that's that's one of those things you know
• 2:17:29
  you come across in law enforcement and you think you're doing good and then
• 2:17:31
  you find out later you should have just let him go well no you can't you can't
• 2:17:35
  yeah man woulda coulda shoulda you know yeah you're doing right you're doing
• 2:17:40
  the right thing always do the right thing regardless of what happens later,
• 2:17:44
  I have that in one in my uh force on force class that we do that's all situational
• 2:17:51
  I go on um active self-protection and I pick out some incidents that happen in and around Atlanta,
• 2:17:57
  replicate those with role players and then have the dudes react like so nobody
• 2:18:03
  everybody goes in cold nobody gets to watch it and the guys go first right so
• 2:18:09
  once you go you get to sit back and watch So that's what we need to do with
• 2:18:12
  the officers that go in cold. Yeah, to go in cold.
• 2:18:14
  Is that type of force on service training. So I set one of them up.
• 2:18:18
  Now, some people are going to, whatever they think about it.
• 2:18:23
  So one of my role players was a transsexual.
• 2:18:26
  She comes out here all the time to shoot. She was a former infantryman and highly
• 2:18:33
  intelligent and military, a little historian, tactically sound,
• 2:18:38
  shoots well, loves to train.
• 2:18:40
  We don't get into politics. We don't get in anything.
• 2:18:43
  She just offers to come out and help. She likes to come out and shoot.
• 2:18:48
  So I'm purposely, so the scenario was this.
• 2:18:53
  There was a row of cars and you were coming from a building and you were going
• 2:18:57
  in front of those cars to walk on the sidewalk, to walk down the sidewalk to your car.
• 2:19:02
  Well, as you round the corner, there's somebody getting boot stomped and beat by two dudes.
• 2:19:08
  And I made her the victim and to see if anybody the topic of conversation after the fact was I.
• 2:19:18
  Who's sitting here getting beat right now it's like
• 2:19:21
  you may disdain you may hate transsexuals you
• 2:19:24
  may think they're freaking you know whatever i was like does it matter does
• 2:19:30
  it have to be a little old lady or does it have to be or what if it's some big
• 2:19:35
  beefy ass black dude and he's got all the freaking gangster clothes on but he's
• 2:19:41
  sitting there getting boot stomped by two dudes,
• 2:19:43
  like what do you do does it matter who's getting beat
• 2:19:46
  at the moment now granted there
• 2:19:49
  are times when you can put your nose in where it shouldn't be but i'm not gonna
• 2:19:53
  sit and watch somebody get beat to death right personally right so that was
• 2:19:59
  a deep conversation about about like why are we good guys you know what i mean
• 2:20:04
  and and are we good guys if we don't stop a tranny from getting beat to death,
• 2:20:09
  but we stopped a little little granny from getting beat to death.
• 2:20:11
  You know what I mean? Oh yeah.
• 2:20:13
  And so this guy, yeah, he was, turned out to be a shit bag, but yeah,
• 2:20:18
  he said, he should have saved his life.
• 2:20:21
  Absolutely. You can't, you can't know. Everything, you know,
• 2:20:25
  what we've said, everything is circumstantial. You know, you see what's going on.
• 2:20:30
  Yeah. He absolutely should have saved his life because he's
• 2:20:34
  thrown it away with all that
• 2:20:37
  shit you know whatever that's that's on him but whatever man
• 2:20:41
  crazy and that's the kind of ambiguous shit
• 2:20:44
  that cops gotta deal with daily so being a
• 2:20:48
  libertarian right i'm not i'm not a what do you like an anarchist where are
• 2:20:52
  you there needs to be law and order 100 i agree with that i think there's too
• 2:20:59
  many laws i think our lawmakers are flawed everybody's flawed but i I mean, I think.
• 2:21:06
  Yeah, everybody's flawed. I think there's too many laws.
• 2:21:09
  You know, we're talking about you need law and order.
• 2:21:13
  You need some form of government. But it ain't no way in hell it needs to be
• 2:21:16
  as big as it is now. Oh, no.
• 2:21:18
  Now, minimal government. Now, I am a minarchist. That's the thing,
• 2:21:21
  minarchist. I do believe in minimal government.
• 2:21:25
  Yeah. To do the bare minimum governmental functions as outlined in the Constitution.
• 2:21:31
  It's the it's all that what really irks me is the the overreach and then when you're you're making,
• 2:21:37
  you know rules for thee and not for me no that's right and that applies to everybody
• 2:21:43
  all the way down the chain too i mean you can even go and look at your local
• 2:21:47
  government find that no that's right that's right and that's you know it it's.
• 2:21:53
  It avoids me to no end that when you have a county commissioner say something
• 2:21:59
  to the effect of, you know, I was put here by the citizens to make hard decisions and, you know,
• 2:22:06
  your property tax is going up because I voted yes to this.
• 2:22:09
  Well, the right decision and the hard decision would be everybody's struggling right now.
• 2:22:15
  No, don't look for the property tax to go up.
• 2:22:18
  Live within your budget for this year instead of trying to earmark all this other stuff.
• 2:22:23
  Well, I was put here to make hard decisions is bullshit. You were put there
• 2:22:27
  to make good decisions. Yeah.
• 2:22:30
  And sometimes those good decisions. One, there shouldn't be no fucking property
• 2:22:33
  tax, but that's a whole other story.
• 2:22:36
  Well, if you're a disabled veteran in Texas, you don't pay property tax.
• 2:22:41
  Yeah. That's a plus. But I ain't moving to Texas.
• 2:22:44
  I like it, but I ain't moving there.
• 2:22:48
  You're talking about property tax. I'm a firm believer that once you no longer
• 2:22:51
  have kids in the school system, you'll not be paying property tax to the school. Hey, man.
• 2:22:56
  There's a fellow named Shane Hazel out there who he fights that all the time.
• 2:23:02
  He does not get anything from the state or the county or anything.
• 2:23:07
  He's self-sustained. His kids are homeschooled.
• 2:23:11
  I think he composts his own trash. Let's say that. And, you know,
• 2:23:15
  if you've got kids who are homeschooled and you're paying, you know,
• 2:23:19
  65% of property tax in Floyd County goes to the school system.
• 2:23:23
  But then you have the commissioner stand up and say, well, we need more money
• 2:23:28
  for our operations budget. Nah, man.
• 2:23:31
  But here's the thing. Miss, man. If you raise property tax again,
• 2:23:36
  the school system is still going to get 65% and you're only going to get this.
• 2:23:41
  It makes no sense. them but look yeah i
• 2:23:44
  we could talk we could do this forever yeah politicians
• 2:23:47
  at all levels of garbage yeah we could we could
• 2:23:50
  do this forever but all right man well look thanks for coming thanks for talking
• 2:23:56
  about cop stuff yeah i'm gonna get some more detail on you know because when
• 2:24:01
  i do help out at the academy i'm not there for every single thing so i don't
• 2:24:05
  want to give insight on something that i hear you yeah for sure teaching you
• 2:24:09
  can only speak on what you know about absolutely.
• 2:24:11
  I do suspect I'm going to be more involved in that as the year goes on.
• 2:24:15
  Yeah. And hopefully it'll be looking on the full-time side of things for that
• 2:24:21
  to where I'm not just working for the campus police and as needed.
• 2:24:25
  So there's some things coming down that hopefully if they come to fruition,
• 2:24:29
  then I might be able to say, hey, we got a special guest to come up here today to help run this range.
• 2:24:35
  Yeah, I'll do it, man. I'll do it for sure. And especially for tactics portion of stuff.
• 2:24:41
  Yeah, I got some insights, you know. I'm a very fluid guy when it comes to tactics, man.
• 2:24:46
  If anything that I can help to send a student from the academy back to their
• 2:24:53
  agency that is going to benefit them, then that's what I'm all about.
• 2:24:58
  Absolutely, that's right.
• 2:24:59
  And Brandon is the same way.
• 2:25:03
  And the guys up there now who are, you know, doing the job, they're doing a great job.
• 2:25:09
  You know there's been talks of retirement stuff i mean you know after you've
• 2:25:13
  been teaching for 20 years doing the same thing it's time you know people want
• 2:25:16
  to settle down right yeah yeah so,
• 2:25:19
  you know hopefully when we we get up there and i don't think hopefully i know
• 2:25:24
  we're going to we're going to do it right when we send students back so that's
• 2:25:27
  good man yeah so this wasn't just to bang on cop training i do that enough as
• 2:25:33
  it is just trying to see you know what's going on and how it could be better.
• 2:25:38
  Now, I got to say, I think three weeks of firearms training is pretty good.
• 2:25:42
  Yeah, it's pretty good. I don't think that's too bad at all.
• 2:25:45
  Now, that being said, like in SF, we do advanced urban combat course,
• 2:25:51
  and it's about two or three weeks of just shooting.
• 2:25:55
  But we do it like once a year. Right.
• 2:25:58
  Well, we'll be running two academies per year. Now with the 809-hour course,
• 2:26:03
  you know, it takes up a lot of time.
• 2:26:05
  Yeah. So you'll get two classes a year out of the academy for that. Yeah.
• 2:26:11
  The only way for us to do more would be having two classes going on at once
• 2:26:15
  with a bunch more instructors.
• 2:26:17
  Yeah, now you're talking about big budget stuff because you're paying salaries
• 2:26:20
  and all that stuff. Yeah, that's going to be not something that'll be anytime soon. Yeah.
• 2:26:25
  Actually, I don't know if that'll ever happen.
• 2:26:29
  Oh, that's a big bite to have two classes going at the same time, man.
• 2:26:34
  We'll put our focus and everything to the ones we have now because,
• 2:26:38
  like I told Brandon, when I first took the job and I started,
• 2:26:42
  you know, helping out here and there,
• 2:26:44
  I'm at a point now that I feel like it's time to give back to where I can take
• 2:26:51
  my knowledge and my training and my experience and, you know,
• 2:26:55
  say this is how we did things and it was wrong.
• 2:26:59
  Yeah. Now we've learned, now we know, and this is how you, you know,
• 2:27:03
  this is how you do things. Yeah.
• 2:27:05
  You know, you've got to be able to look at things outside the box.
• 2:27:09
  Well, these days with cops, especially, you kind of got to deinstitutionalize
• 2:27:14
  dudes and then teach them how to be critical thinkers or at least how to apply
• 2:27:19
  it to the, to training and to work.
• 2:27:22
  Some guys are critical thinkers at everything.
• 2:27:24
  Then they go to work and they do the same. It's the way we've always done it.
• 2:27:27
  It's the way we've always done it. And that's right. And, you know,
• 2:27:30
  we could take that back to cultural shift, too.
• 2:27:32
  Yeah. People are realizing that, hey, and this is what I want people to understand
• 2:27:36
  about the job that they're in when it comes to law enforcement.
• 2:27:40
  Know your job. Know what you're doing with your job.
• 2:27:44
  And be undeniable to where when you say this is how it should be because it's written right here.
• 2:27:52
  It's right here in this law book. Case law says this.
• 2:27:57
  Legally, I can do this. and you're doing it.
• 2:28:01
  Be undeniable with it. Know what you're talking about. Yep.
• 2:28:04
  And if you need to show it to somebody in black and white, be able to open the
• 2:28:08
  book and go, it's right here. Yeah, that's right.
• 2:28:12
  Way about doctrine you know everybody in sf especially
• 2:28:15
  when young guys come in they want to do all this wazoo shit and i
• 2:28:18
  and i always said you can't manipulate doctrine unless you know doctrine
• 2:28:21
  yep you got to know what well back
• 2:28:24
  in the day it was 7-8 now it's three dash something i don't know what the infantry
• 2:28:29
  manual but and definitely know your departmental policy know your policy inside
• 2:28:33
  and back i know you got you've got to know them and you also have to be aware
• 2:28:38
  of those administrators who will look at that policy and say,
• 2:28:43
  oh, you broke that policy, even though you didn't break that policy. Yeah.
• 2:28:47
  They'll try to use policy against you and you need to be able to put.
• 2:28:49
  Well, that's why you got to know it. That's why you got to know it.
• 2:28:52
  Or at least a reinforcing reason why you got to know it.
• 2:28:56
  So that you can say, no, I didn't. I know exactly what that policy is.
• 2:29:00
  Yeah. Yeah. You can't, you can't manipulate. You got to know within the parameters of your job.
• 2:29:05
  One thing that took me a long time to learn is i wanted
• 2:29:09
  to do things i wanted to do in the art like you know
• 2:29:12
  kind of my way and i realized that like
• 2:29:14
  my boss and i had i've had a series of good and bad bosses throughout my time
• 2:29:20
  there and and sf well and the army in general but like at the end of the day
• 2:29:26
  their their priority is my priority they're my boss i don't really have a magical
• 2:29:31
  I shouldn't have a priority,
• 2:29:33
  right? You tell me what's important.
• 2:29:35
  And then within the scope of commander's intent, you know, and doctrine.
• 2:29:41
  Yeah. I'll do, I'll do what you want me to do. Yeah. Yeah.
• 2:29:46
  Do what you want me to do back you gotta back me up yeah yeah and a hundred
• 2:29:51
  percent if you ever get called on the road if you ever get called in the office
• 2:29:56
  chief's office any supervisor's office,
• 2:30:00
  and you're getting grilled and they say did you do this
• 2:30:03
  they already know you did it yeah you better stand
• 2:30:06
  there with pride poke your chest out and say yep i did
• 2:30:09
  it and this is why yeah and this is why exactly the quickest
• 2:30:13
  way to get a bad reputation in law enforcement is
• 2:30:16
  going there with your supervisor and lie about something and that's the fastest
• 2:30:19
  way out the door yep that's a well that's a sign of kind of maturity level and
• 2:30:24
  stuff like that too it's it's a sign of poor integrity not right lying about
• 2:30:30
  it like yep yeah man you got to know you got to know your stuff,
• 2:30:36
  you got you can't just oh so and so told me
• 2:30:39
  you got to know your stuff now and you got to know how to talk
• 2:30:41
  to people especially as a cop especially as
• 2:30:45
  a cop you talk if you talk to people on the road like you've
• 2:30:47
  known them forever you'll go a lot farther than if you talk to them like they're
• 2:30:54
  ignorant or talk to them like they don't understand anything yeah you're gonna
• 2:30:58
  run into the people that they only understand one way of being talked to and
• 2:31:03
  unfortunately you may have to use foul language to get the point across.
• 2:31:08
  That's just that's just we call that reading the room yeah yeah gotta know your
• 2:31:13
  audience that's right yeah and that's not it's not everybody most people you
• 2:31:17
  can talk to like we're talking now and everything's all good but.
• 2:31:22
  I've been in some i've been to some domestics where the
• 2:31:25
  house be tore up from the floor up you separate them and you're
• 2:31:28
  talking to them like we're talking to now and you know
• 2:31:31
  somebody did do wrong somebody's going to jail but you know they're they're
• 2:31:35
  all calm and well that's that's professionalism yeah being able to deal with
• 2:31:41
  things however calm but being ready for whatever happens yep especially violence
• 2:31:46
  right you can be talking to a guy like this and that joker's guy He's just waiting.
• 2:31:51
  It is the, you be nice, polite, and professional to everybody,
• 2:31:56
  but always have a plan to kill them if you need to. Yeah, that's right.
• 2:31:59
  Who said that? Was that? That was a Marine. Who was that?
• 2:32:03
  Shoot. I heard that from the first day I walked into the police station as an
• 2:32:07
  employee before I went to the academy. Nope.
• 2:32:10
  A Marine said, damn, what Marine was it? Somebody said that. Anyway, that's right.
• 2:32:14
  It might have been Chesty Poirot. It sounded like something he'd say.
• 2:32:16
  That's right, especially as a cop.
• 2:32:18
  Because you know, I'm not even a cop, and I know criminals will lie.
• 2:32:24
  They'll smile right in your face.
• 2:32:26
  And that's not saying that's something you want to do, but you got to be prepared
• 2:32:29
  to do it. No, that's right. That's right.
• 2:32:31
  Because there's people out there, they don't care about you.
• 2:32:34
  They don't care about who you got waiting on. Prepare to respond,
• 2:32:36
  you know, prepare to deal with whatever comes.
• 2:32:39
  But anyway, just, you know, not trying to get off on a tangent about that or anything.
• 2:32:47
  I got to give props to the instructors out there. We have a lot of jam-up instructors.
• 2:32:52
  Some of them has got a lot of combatives
• 2:32:54
  experience. And not just Georgia Northwestern, but post instructors.
• 2:32:59
  You got James Manning down at the Regional Academy of Georgia Highlands. Yeah, I know James.
• 2:33:06
  He's a scrapper. He knows what he's doing. He does really good when he puts on DT courses. Yep.
• 2:33:12
  We could go all day long about the quality of some of these instructors out
• 2:33:16
  there. Yeah. Any future.
• 2:33:19
  Yeah, let's caveat it right now. We're talking about institutional training, not individuals.
• 2:33:25
  We talked about mindset stuff, but yeah. Right. There's some freaking stellar
• 2:33:29
  cops walking the street.
• 2:33:30
  Yeah, there are. Stellar cops walking the street, doing exactly the right things,
• 2:33:36
  training on their own time, their own dime. Yeah.
• 2:33:40
  Those things yeah for sure what i
• 2:33:42
  want to address more than anything was you
• 2:33:45
  know institutional training and then maybe a little
• 2:33:48
  bit how do you get guys in the right mindset who who ain't
• 2:33:51
  but that that's uh it's
• 2:33:54
  difficult that's a leadership thing yeah and you
• 2:33:58
  hear people you know talk about morale within
• 2:34:01
  a department which is also a leadership thing
• 2:34:04
  leadership sets the sets the tone it does
• 2:34:08
  and i hate when i hear somebody say well if you
• 2:34:11
  don't have good morale it's your fault how's that my fault when
• 2:34:14
  i work for you and you're doing all this
• 2:34:17
  extra stuff leadership sets the tone on that
• 2:34:19
  for sure it's uh if you got dudes
• 2:34:22
  walking around scared to lose their job at any moment because
• 2:34:26
  your senior guy's freaking bipolar like one
• 2:34:29
  day you're his best buddy and next day he's in your ass about everything or
• 2:34:34
  anything or if or if you do something that doesn't look good on camera but you're
• 2:34:39
  right you're well within your right to do it and it needed to be done oh that
• 2:34:43
  don't look good we gotta get ahead of this so guess what guess who the scapegoat is,
• 2:34:49
  well yeah stuff like that man that's that's too much man i i don't think i'd be a cop.
• 2:34:56
  You'd be you'd be a really good campus cop yeah you think so yeah just chilling
• 2:35:02
  around because you just got to walk around the campus and say hey to everybody
• 2:35:05
  and go back to your office,
• 2:35:06
  go back to your office or when they call say hey we're gonna do training today
• 2:35:10
  let's go do some training let's do it perfect.
• 2:35:14
  Heck, I'm at a campus now. I don't have the tolerance to be on the road anymore. Oh, man.
• 2:35:20
  All right, man. Let's wrap this madness up. So, what's your last words?
• 2:35:25
  What you want to say to the few people that are listening, the three or four
• 2:35:30
  people that are listening?
• 2:35:32
  Well, if they're cops, just, you know, know your job and be undeniable in what you're doing.
• 2:35:39
  Always do the right thing and make sure you're doing it better than everybody else. There you go.
• 2:35:44
  And I'll add to that, if your heart ain't in it, get on out. That's right.
• 2:35:49
  If your heart ain't in it, get you a job at a buy here, pay here car lot.
• 2:35:53
  You'll be a DJ. That's what I tell everybody.
• 2:35:56
  All right, man. Good. All right, good people.
• 2:35:59
  This has been myself and Ricky Robinson talking about all kinds of stuff, mostly cop training.
• 2:36:07
  What's coming up? Damn, OSS. I should have pulled my calendar up.
• 2:36:11
  I think we got August 9th. We got a rifle workshop coming up.
• 2:36:16
  Let's see, August 23rd, we got another pistol workshop coming up,
• 2:36:23
  which is not going to be a heartbreaker like the last one.
• 2:36:27
  We're going to work on some moving in and out of positions and some agility
• 2:36:32
  and stuff like that, shooting fast.
• 2:36:35
  And then August, where are we at?
• 2:36:39
  I want to say the 30th, we have a wild card day. Yep.
• 2:36:45
  And those are random drills that we pull out of the Drill Index card deck.
• 2:36:50
  We run about three or four of those drills together, analyze them together for
• 2:36:54
  value or whether they were bullcrap or good.
• 2:36:58
  And then we all run the Blackjack 33 challenge.
• 2:37:03
  And if you score 90% or better on that, you get yourself a Blackjack 33 coin.
• 2:37:08
  Please go on the website to look at the backstory on that.
• 2:37:11
  And then one september that's labor day that's monday labor day we got an action
• 2:37:19
  pistol match so if you top shooter on that action pistol match you will you
• 2:37:25
  can win some free training,
• 2:37:28
  and that will be we'll be able to post your or we're going to post the scores
• 2:37:34
  to practice score for that.
• 2:37:37
  And then as always, private sessions, we're always scheduling folks always.
• 2:37:42
  And then for two team guys, please check out the website, two team guys.com.
• 2:37:48
  We got land navigation coming up date to be determined in September.
• 2:37:53
  And we got the way we're scheduling those courses is that you,
• 2:37:59
  if you have four or more people who want to train, we will schedule a course
• 2:38:03
  for you. I'm not going to put them on the calendar.
• 2:38:06
  It's too difficult to get that many people on the same sheet of music for an
• 2:38:11
  open enrollment course.
• 2:38:12
  So if you've got a group of people
• 2:38:14
  that want to do some outdoor adventure leadership and team building.
• 2:38:21
  We've got Search and Rescue Mountaineer. We've got Situational Awareness.
• 2:38:25
  We've got a small mission unit or a small unit mission training or not training.
• 2:38:32
  That's a scenario-based course where we do a little bit of light fire training
• 2:38:38
  and then we do some team development and planning and then we go execute a mission. Pretty awesome.
• 2:38:43
  We've got Surviving Captivity, which is designed specifically for overseas travelers.
• 2:38:50
  Whether you're a salesman, a missionary, student going abroad.
• 2:38:55
  A journalist working for a small-time organization, it's good preparation for overseas training.
• 2:39:03
  But, folks, it's called surviving captivity.
• 2:39:05
  There is a captivity portion, so be advised.
• 2:39:09
  What else we got? Search and rescue mountaineer. Those are very technical climbing
• 2:39:15
  skills. We'll do some climbing, rappelling. and that is also a scenario-based
• 2:39:19
  course where we will go and rescue a lost and broken hiker.
• 2:39:24
  So we will work on climbing, then we'll work on haul systems,
• 2:39:29
  a little bit of first aid, and things like that.
• 2:39:33
  Very teamwork intensive and very detail-oriented.
• 2:39:36
  So check that out. And as always, thanks for listening to the podcast.
• 2:39:41
  Please go on thejuntopodcast.com. check out the blogs. I'm always posting blogs up.
• 2:39:48
  Please give me some feedback on those. Some of them are a little deeper than others.
• 2:39:52
  Some of them are a little lighthearted, but I'm always welcome your feedback.
• 2:39:57
  And if you got any topic suggestions for the podcast, or if you know just some
• 2:40:04
  compelling human beings you'd like to get on the podcast, let me know and I'll
• 2:40:08
  see what I can do to get them here. Other than that.
• 2:40:12
  Music.