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The 79th Tony Awards | The BSB Podcast · The BSB Podcast

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welcome back, Theater lovers, to another exciting episode of the BSB Podcast.
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Today we're unpacking the seventy ninth Tony Awards at Radio City Music Hall,
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hosted by Pink. But before we dive into it,
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like follow and subscribe to us on all social media platforms at BSB.insider.
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And spoiler warning, if you haven't watched the seventy ninth annual Tony Awards
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and wish to avoid spoilers, please pause this video and come back once you have.
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RJ, it's wild to me how this season of shows felt like such a runaway season.
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With the nominations when they were announced.
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But truly the Tony Awards gave us a mixed bag.
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There also was like an unexpected level of unexpectedness from
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I feel like most from the recent seasons of the Tony Awards.
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Yeah, the last couple of years,
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which
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I think is why I didn't watch them the last or at least didn't watch them live
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the last couple of years was because it was so runaway.
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This year finally felt even though the nominations had me worried,
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the outcomes restored a little bit of my faith in the Tony's.
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You know, I do want preface before we dive into the nominations.
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RJ, we don't see a lot of plays.
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Plays are not usually our our ~ go to shows when we go to Broadway.
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We actually saw our first play our first two plays this season when we went
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to New York in January. One of them was a winner from last year.
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so the only play that we had going into this was he we had seen was The Liberation.
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other than that, we didn't really know much about the the play.
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So when Death of a Salesman took nine nominations,
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Oedipus or Oedipus, depending on what world you're living in,
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~ took seven, you know, and then you have five for August Wilson's,
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Joe Turner's, Come From Gone, Come and Gone,
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The Ballusters, Fallen Angels,
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Liberation.
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I wasn't I didn't have much to really be like,
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yeah, okay, that makes sense. ~ and truly the plays kind of like w went
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the way that they were kind of expecting,
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is what I'm saying here. Like Death of a Salesman pretty much
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sh took the categories, with the exception of a few here and there that it did not,
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but
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It was the musical specifically that just you they were unexpected.
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or did you do you feel like maybe the plays went kind of unexpected too?
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I mean, yeah, obviously Death of a Salesman
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I don't know why I knew that that was gonna do well.
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I think maybe it was the chatter around it so n it wasn't shocking to
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me when it when it won everything that it won.
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But yes, n not knowing aside from seeing liberation,
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not knowing much about anything else.
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It was it was all right. The outcome was I mean,
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obviously not great for everyone who lost,
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but but yeah,
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Shout out to the losers.
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I mean it was I I think plays are yeah,
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I mean it just wasn't unexpected.
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plays have less
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plays I think the the environment is less volatile.
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So there's less to like where musicals you're comparing like choreography
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Sure, yes.
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and costuming and vocals and orchestration.
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Like there's so many pieces to a play or to a musical.
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Not saying that there isn't a lot to a play,
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but there are less things to have to gauge.
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And so I think when one thing in a play is successful,
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like that kind of also means that
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There are at least a few more things that are doing well,
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which is why it doesn't shock me that this is the way that it went.
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Yeah, and I mean there was one big shocker I think that we'll talk about
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in little bit, which is that Nathan Lane did not win for Best Actor,
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which was a little bit shocking when it pretty much swap every other category.
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But also, yeah, I think you're right.
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When you look at the musicals,
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I mean twelve nominations for Lost Boy and Schmigadoon!,
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those seemed like the front runners to just wipe this competition.
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Eleven for ragtime, also a highly contended contendable contended show.
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Nine for Cats The Jellical Ball.
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And for the Rocky Horror Picture Show,
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eight for two strangers carry a cake across New York.
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And I am gonna vindicate myself by saying that I'm gonna say it right this show.
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~ after the editing of podcast where I said the name entirely wrong
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the entire time and RJ just nodded there and let me say it wrong.
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He was like, Yeah.
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The the best part
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is in in the back of my brain I was like,
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He's gonna listen back on this in the future and be like,
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What was I even saying? Which is why I didn't say anything in the moment.
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So confidently listeners, did I keep referring to it as carrying a cake across
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New York? Because I feel like with a verb it feels more actionable.
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And so that makes sense instead of carry a cake,
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but I digress. So eight nominations for that one,
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five for chess, and then less than five was Titanique I thought we would
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be going into the Tony Awards with a Lost Boy sweep.
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I thought it was gonna take every category.
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~ I didn't think Schmigadoon! had a chance in hell because again,
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it's such a particular show. Granted we haven't seen it,
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but it was based off a television show on Apple Television.
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and I heard very mixed reviews.
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You either loved it or you hated it.
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There wasn't really like a lot of middle ground.
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And then of course ragtime was the other contender.
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But I think I I think from talking with you,
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I was almost convinced Lost Boys was gonna take all twelve,
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basically, or like most of the twelve.
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It just
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be the big winner of the night.
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And truthfully it did not shake out that way.
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Yeah, I think well, in general,
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the press for Lost Boys was like just everywhere.
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Like everything, like shout out to their PR team because they were doing the work.
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Like
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I I have not seen much publicity for literally any other show except
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ironically Two Strangers. ~ and that's just ads.
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Like I wasn't even seeing like a lot of press.
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It was just like those automated same same ad over and over again.
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~ but Shmigadoon,
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like I literally until the nominations came out,
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I think I knew the least.
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about Shwigadoon and I've seen the least from it.
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For sure.
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Yeah. Like 'cause it wasn't highly publicized in the way that the other
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one like I feel like everybody was running a really hard campaign and Schmigadoon!
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was just riding on vibes. I mean,
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I I don't know how else to describe it.
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There wasn't really a a pinpointing way of being like,
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I'm seeing Schmigadoon! everywhere.
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But they were also the one like when they got twelve nominations,
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I'm not gonna lie, RJ, I was gobsmacked I was absolutely shocked.
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I like, there's no way that this has more than ragtime because it just didn't make
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sense to me.
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Yeah, I mean clearly
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I personally have not seen the T V show,
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I have not seen the Broadway show,
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I haven't even listened or like like maybe I've seen like I mean I
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saw the Tony's Like that that's the only performances I've seen of Schmigadoon!
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So I can understand the appeal,
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~ and obviously we can get into this further,
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but from the standpoint of just where entertainment is right now in
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the world and what people are needing in order to
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Escape or find comfort in.
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And so I think Shmigadoon does that.
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~ and it does it quietly. in in this PR sense.
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For sure.
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Like it doesn't do it quietly.
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I I understand it's very comical and very loud the show itself,
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but from a PR standpoint, it kind of just like snuck in.
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~ and I think it it surprised a few people.
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I wonder if part of it has to with the fact that Lauren Michaels was behind it,
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you know, the creator of SNL, he's he's found comedic talent left and right.
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And just having him be like his name attached to this was just they were riding it's
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like having Harrison Ford in a film,
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you know what I mean? They were just riding on the fact that name recognition
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for voters was just gonna carry them through.
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And obviously it did because it's one of the highest winning shows.
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It won four awards along with Ragtime and Lost Boys.
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Like
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Clearly it worked whatever they were doing and and it succeeded.
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I mean it's crazy to me that it won Best Musical.
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I'm gonna start off right there.
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I think w that's the win that shocked me the most.
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And listeners, I
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am the biggest supporter of Two Strangers carry a cake across New York.
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~ and I thought it should have won.
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Having not seen Lost Boys or Schmigadoon!
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have seen Titanique off Broadway.
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Two Strangers to Me has such a great
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emotional depth to it that I couldn't see Lost Boys or Schmigadoon!
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having. And so that's why I think RJ was wild to me that a one best musical.
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But I think you're right. It speaks to what people need right in this moment.
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They needed escapism. They needed laughter.
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They needed something that was just easy to digest.
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And so Schmigadoon! checked all those boxes where two strangers,
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yes, it was easy to digest. Yes,
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there was lots of funny parts,
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but you couldn't walk away with the without the emotional weight that came with that
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show.
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And so reflecting on it after I had my little bit of a of a of a mental breakdown,
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it wasn't that bad, guys. But it I definitely was a sad.
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~
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I understood why two strangers didn't win where I thought it deserved to win.
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Sure. I mean, y'all Brian was upset.
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Brian was in denial when this happened.
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~ rightfully so.
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I sat there
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I sat there in just shock for a little bit.
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I mean again, having not seen Lost Boys or Schmigadoon!
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I understand why Titanique did not win.
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~ Two Strangers, as much as I love that show,
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it is very, very hard for a two person musical
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to compete against a broad ensemble show.
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I think even though it is so much more difficult on those two people because they're
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running the entire show, I think again,
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there's more pieces that are involved in bigger shows.
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And so that spectacle or the idea of a spectacle
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is grander ~ and I think more encompassing.
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Like when I think of out of all of these,
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when and if they tour.
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Which one's gonna do well? You know,
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like or which which which one's gonna draw the audiences who aren't familiar with
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any of them. I and I do think,
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I mean, you have that title recognition,
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even if people didn't watch the show,
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y it it's somewhere in the back of their brain,
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right? They've they've maybe heard the word or the general idea.
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~ Lost Boys, I would say, is probably next.
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And then two strangers in Titanique it's a toss up.
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It's interesting.
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So what's interesting about that is I'm going to I'm actually gonna disagree with
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you just a little bit, but bear with me.
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I think what?
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You're allowed to have an opinion.
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On a podcast? I mean everybody does that nowadays.
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Why am I so special? but The Lost Boys I think actually has
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the most recognition because that's such a cult classic film that
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I think people like Back to the Future.
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We didn't think it was good, but people were flocking to Back to the Future ish.
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You know what I mean? Like it like it was pulling in that cult classic.
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To me that like for a general audience,
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that speaks more to than what Schmigadoon!'s doing.
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I also think Titanique has ran such a great platform on when it was
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off Broadway on social media. I think people would flock to that too.
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I actually think it would be Lost Boys Titanique,
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Schmigadoon!, then two strangers.
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I'm j that's that 'cause my thing is that Schmigadoon!
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is a casual person gonna look at that and say,
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Hmm, let's go see it. No, Broadway people are gonna go see it because
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it won the Tony Award for best musical.
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But I don't think outside the general world it has any pull.
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And I could be completely wrong.
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I could be I mean, obviously it got cancelled by Apple because it wasn't doing well
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after two seasons. Like
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That's
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fair. It is a it it is to a very specific person,
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right? Typically leaning towards the musical theater realm ~
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or just musical oriented in general.
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~ Yeah, I mean I much like Back to the Feature,
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I have never watched The Lost Boys,
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I've never heard of it before now,
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so
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Everybody, I just I just have to let you know,
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I had once text RJ, I want to say it was about like like eleven o'clock
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at night and I like, man, we need to watch the movie and his response was
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it was a film question mark. Like like it was very much just like the ~
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you d you didn't like he you didn't realize that it's not just a film,
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it's a film series. There's three or four films to the series.
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And but then also I I think it speaks to that again,
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I'm clueless. No idea.
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what speaks the general audience it's gonna depend,
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you know.
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So like maybe in that instance it's not gonna speak to people because maybe
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the younger generations don't know that because that was an eighties film,
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you know? And also you didn't grow up watching horror like that.
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So like that's probably it's like a horror punky film,
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so. but but ultimately I think that the bigger race
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Yep.
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for our household, our BSB household here,
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is the revival of the musical,
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which was Cats, obviously, Ragtime,
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and then the Rocky Horror Picture Show.
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~ and arg argumentably RJ, the right show won,
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correct?
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Yes. I mean, hard hard to say because we haven't seen the other two.
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Okay.
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I would say based on reaction from people who are close
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That's fair.
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to me that have seen cats.
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I think that's a really close call.
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Okay.
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I I think ~ I know that a lot of people were upset by that.
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and obviously a ton of commentary around race
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and ~ just kind of systemic issues.
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~ but at the same time
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I I don't think that that deters from from ragtime winning,
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because I do think that it was an incredible show and ~ very much deserves
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the accolades that it's getting.
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I do wonder, and I again we have not seen Cats The Jellical Ball,
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but you did not also see the Rocky Horror Picture Show.
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They were not there in New York when we were there.
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We would have loved to see Cats is actually closing this month,
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June, you know, so that's really sad.
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But of the shows that we saw, which was only Ragtime,
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it was fantastic. This is where I'm wondering what happened.
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Cats the Jellical Ball is such a deviation from it's about queer joy,
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you know, black queer joy.
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People of color, you know, it's it's such a deviation from
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the original source material that I'm wondering if that is what stopped
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it from winning for the voters.
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Like if the people who voted it,
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they they remember the cat. Like again,
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I don't know what the polling pool of voters for Tony Awards is,
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you know what mean? But like people who loved cats back in the nineties,
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this was not the same kind of cats,
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you know what I That's what I'm trying to say.
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It's like it's a different take on it,
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like a significantly different take.
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Then wondering if a lot of people went for something that felt more comfortable
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in the fact that ragtime pretty much is like the same show every time you get it.
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You know, it's consistently ragtime is ragtime is ragtime.
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Yeah. Well, and there was a part of me for a minute that was like,
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why because of the changes to Cats,
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why was it even in this in the revival category instead
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of the regular musical category?
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~ but I guess like 95% of the orchestration was the same,
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which is why
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even though the concept was different,
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It's staying.
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that's why it stayed as a revival.
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~ but yes,
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Much like Sunset Boulevard.
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yes. I was gonna say I remember us having this conversation around that too.
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~ I kind of wish there was like something in between because or or some type
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of another rule for that. Because it just feels so different.
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Like and it makes it makes the difference.
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Like the the delivery matters.
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And you're you're capturing a completely different demographic of people,
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like you kind of just said, like it this is a a show about black queer joy.
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~ it is that it is celebrating ballroom culture.
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Right.
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That is so far from what Cats was.
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~ it so it just I don't know.
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Correct.
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Like if if
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I in my in the back of my head,
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like, it's still a winner. ~ because of
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Sure, ~ absolutely.
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the really like a reincarnation of the show.
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Like after the movie came out however many years ago and bombed,
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I was like, why would anyone ever try to do anything with cats ever again?
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And then this happened and it has just imploded in a great way.
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so I in that way I think that it's a winner of the just creativity and
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Yeah, I I don't
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There almost needs to be a like a category for like r I think that people would take
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more chances, I think, if there was a category for like reimagining versus revival.
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Cause like with revival, you get things like Sweeney Todd,
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which was like pretty much the same exact Sweeney Todd that you see,
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because you can't really change that.
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Ragtime, you can't really change it.
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The Rocky Horror was pretty much a carbon copy of the film.
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You know what I mean? Like those are what I would say revivals,
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because you're basically telling the same visual and like narrative story.
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Where cats is is d it took such a swing,
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like Sunset Boulevard, that like I it should be applauded and awarded
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for the swing that it took, but maybe more shows would take more swings like that
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if there was a Tony Award that reflected the this was cats,
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but it also wasn't. Like this isn't your grandma's cats.
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And I think that's a beauty of this too.
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Right, so you know
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Broadway League, ~ Tony,
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I can't remember the ~ official full name of the award board,
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but reimagining create create a new ~ create a new Tony for reimagining.
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You you've heard it here first.
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Absolutely. And before we kind of go into the the some of the big winners
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for that are tied to ragtime, I do want to make I think it's really important that
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we talk about cats just for another second more.
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It won for best direction, but I won for best costuming,
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which makes absolute sense. I think I won for best choreography too.
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but specifically costuming,
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RJ, I think that we need to mention here because it was the first trans black woman
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or trans woman period who had won a Tony Award for costuming.
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Which is a hu like, I feel like it shows that like regardless of what's happening
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in the world, there's still reasons to celebrate.
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And absolutely it deserves this award.
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But I know this is one that when it happened,
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I watched your face kind of light up.
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You kind of were very excited about that win,
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and rightfully so.
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Yeah, ~ Queen Jean, who was the costume designer for it.
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Just
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The amount of joy wa watching that amount of joy happen in real time.
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And I think shock too, because I can only imagine what was going through through
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her mind. ~
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especially in today's time. In America specifically.
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Can't speak for the rest of the world.
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But ~ so the the authenticity and everything that
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I think she brought to the costumes,
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obviously she won. ~ and so I think that that speaks loudly.
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~ also the they won for best direction
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~ which again just speaks
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Yes.
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to
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Everyone just being true to what they wanted to accomplish,
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I think. ~ in front from what I remember of their speeches.
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Like it was just very ~
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we want to bring exposure and awareness to this culture,
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to this joy, and we want everyone to feel like they can
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find a home at Cats, the Jellicle Ball.
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I think is one of one of the directors men said that.
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~ which yeah when you when we're in today's political climate,
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Correct.
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when rights are being taken away from humans for just being themselves,
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~ it is even more potent when
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you see someone who may look like you
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Who may be like you or identify like you on the big screen.
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~ just for all the kids sitting at home,
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right? Or even adults ~ who are maybe unsure of their own identities
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or what they can accomplish. I think ~ it's just
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a testament that your identity is not a barrier to your success.
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It can ~
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enhance your your abilities to do the thing that you're passionate about
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and that you love and you can do it well.
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Absolutely. And I feel like that was kind of you know,
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when you talk about like the poignancy of all of this,
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I think that's where I th love that Ragtime did get some recognition because people
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like Joshua Henry and the story he's telling with Colehouse Walker Jr.
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in Ragtime absolutely deserves an award and recognition because
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I mean he's him and Casey Levy,
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like they like are I mean that whole show's so great,
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but they are the the emotional powerhouses of the show.
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It only it to me there was like almost no other wins in my head that were gonna take
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away best leading actor and actress in a musical.
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And so I like that there's like we could celebrate the queer joy that came with Cats
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the Jellicle Ball, but also the poignancy of like what happens when history
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is cruel or wrong, like we see in ragtime.
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Yeah, it was two two very different
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perspective musicals, which I really enjoyed.
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And I mean at the beginning, the opening of The Tony's ~ one of
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the first things that Pink mentioned was kind of about that in regards to,
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you know, yes, w sometimes you can use theater as an escape,
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but in more recent times, you know,
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we're we're getting this art that is
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kind of reinvigorating us in a way to go out and ~
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see what's what's happening in our lifetimes,
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in our culture ~ on both ends of the spectrum,
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the not so good and the beautiful.
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~ and so I think we did kind of get that with both ragtime and cat.
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Absolutely. And I think I I love that you said that about the opening number 'cause
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when Pink said that it did really sit like heavy in a way that like
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it needed to sink in. And I think it needs to sink in for more people when you're
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just like, There's there's a lot going on in the world and
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we can celebrate everything, but also like the messages of what we're talking about
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is important. Ragtime was and is important in this moment.
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And not to say that it's wasn't important twenty years ago when they did it,
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I think they did it in ninety six.
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~ so that was thirty years ago.
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Wow, sorry.
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~ not quite 30 years ago. It doesn't matter.
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But that was a long time ago.
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There was a lot of messages there that were probably still important,
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but what a world to live in now where that is even more important now
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to see that show r actualized.
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And so I think that that is the beauty.
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And like I knew, I knew as soon as they announced Joshua Henry and Casey Levy
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as nominated ~ as being nominated for those.
24:18
There was no way that anybody else was just gonna be able to to compare
24:20
to what was going on on the stage with them.
24:22
Yeah, I I wasn't sure about chess.
24:28
~
24:29
taking a lead actor. ~ just because there'd been so much again,
24:35
when we talk about PR and the importance of really campaigning for the Tonies,
24:41
it seemed like they were doing a lot of work to make that kind of happen.
24:47
~ and obviously he was notorious
24:51
for his eternally long note.
24:52
That note.
24:55
~
24:56
But I am glad that it went to Joshua Henry,
24:59
~ and Casey because I it's just it is it is both the physical,
25:06
emotional, and to a certain degree spiritual
25:10
~ exhaustion and the weight that they carry every time they have to go
25:16
out onto that stage and portray this storyline that
25:20
in some ways are running parallel to the culture that we're seeing today.
25:24
~ that's that's heavy.
25:27
And I think y you feel that as an actor or an actress,
25:31
you feel that every time you go and perform.
25:34
So
25:35
You know, as much as I wanted two strangers to win,
25:37
I knew I was okay with it because of of exactly.
25:41
~ and also shout out to both of them,
25:43
~ Casey Levy and Joshua Henry,
25:45
because the show just got extended for two more weeks.
25:47
It has to close by the end of August.
25:49
And they're two of the only people,
25:52
including Brandon Uranowitz ~ are staying through the extra two weeks,
25:57
which is like they know the importance,
26:00
they know the weight and they are willing to deliver.
26:06
So because we can't talk about every show,
26:07
RJ, I know there's a lot of awards and there's a lot of shows and
26:09
we can't talk about them all. is there any wins that were surprising for you?
26:15
Was there anything that you were just like,
26:17
I wasn't expecting that? And I will just say this I think that
26:20
~ John Lithgow winning for giant over Nathan Lane,
26:24
even though I hadn't seen either one of them,
26:25
seemed shocking in the fact that I thought for sure Nathan Lane
26:29
was walking away with that one.
26:30
I think that was the I was literally like,
26:31
wow. Besides Schmigadoon! winning best musical,
26:34
but we don't need to ever go back to it.
26:36
Over that again.
26:39
Yeah, I well, oddly.
26:43
I do again. I remember seeing some PR about Giants.
26:46
I remember hearing good things about Giants.
26:48
I know that there was a little bit of drama around Nathan Lane,
26:53
~ and some previous awards, which I I heard about after the Tony's happened.
27:00
~ I mean the the events happened previous to the Tony's but I heard about it after.
27:05
~ and so I'm curious, like, I mean,
27:07
how much does politics play a role,
27:09
you know, in not literal politics,
27:10
for sure.
27:12
but the politics of the show business and ~
27:18
I think I mean obviously John,
27:21
incredible actor, like doesn't but I think this whole the whole list
27:27
of lead actors ~ in a play was stacked.
27:31
Same thing with actresses. So I don't think that it
27:36
was super shocking to me.
27:39
I think I would have been happy whatever way it went.
27:43
~
27:44
The featured roles though, I will say that I think those shocked me too.
27:44
But
27:47
The featured role for a musical,
27:49
both Ali and Soshana winning for Lost Boys,
27:52
I was not expecting like again I I was expecting to sweep it,
27:57
but I thought for sure Ben Levy Ross from Ragtime was taking the featured role.
28:02
Yeah, I am a little shocked that it didn't that didn't sweep in that way.
28:06
Like usually I feel like if you're if you're gonna do lead actor,
28:10
lead actress featured like I would have thought Ben had it in the bag.
28:17
~ but again, I haven't seen Lost Boys so
28:21
Yeah. Sure.
28:23
But Nichelle Lewis and Hannah Cruz for Ragtime and Chess respectively were
28:27
up against Shoshana. Like that look I'm just like that for some reason,
28:31
the perfor the the actress in the featured role felt so tight in just like
28:34
Yeah.
28:36
the people that they had. It was a little I was a little like n again,
28:40
not shocked, but also just like not but also shocked.
28:44
I don't know like how else to describe it.
28:45
I was expecting it to go ragtime or cr or chess in that in that one.
28:49
I thought that was maybe the
28:51
The one w
28:52
that chess was gonna run away with besides maybe lead actor.
28:55
Well, and maybe, you know, obviously we're not in the room where it happens,
28:59
but I am curious if that's a conversation,
29:04
like sweeps our conversation. ~ because it it almost
29:08
Sure.
29:10
it it easily seems like ragtime could have swept ~ based
29:16
on the lead.
29:18
Two leads getting it. Part of me is like,
29:21
did they, you know, did they sit in that room and be like,
29:24
mmm, gotta have some versatility here.
29:27
We want to acknowledge like more than one show.
29:30
Obviously, we know that that hasn't happened in previous years,
29:34
right? Like the years that like Hamilton sweeps and and there are other ones,
29:38
right? So maybe this is the direction that Broadway and the Tonies specifically
29:42
are going in regards to trying to spread the wealth,
29:45
knowing that.
29:47
There's there's plenty of people nominated,
29:49
right? ~ but maybe making the winners a little
29:55
bit more spread a little more thin.
29:57
~ I mean Shoshana I I love I I'm not shocked because her vocals
30:03
are absolutely absurd.
30:06
~ so ~ I mean I we love we know that I love Hannah.
30:12
~ special place in my heart. ~ Rachel
30:18
Does she even really sing? I I don't know.
30:20
I don't know. I but everything that I've seen of her performances
30:24
is like talk singing. ~ so I like
30:25
Correct. absolutely. Cause it's the per it's the
30:28
professor, you know, he doesn't really sing.
30:30
Yeah. So like I I can't really see that winning.
30:34
~ just even that role specifically,
30:37
I can't see winning for a musical.
30:39
and then obviously Nichelle singing Daddy's son just makes everybody weep.
30:45
~ and then Schmigadoon!
30:48
haven't seen it, but ~ since they won for Best Musical,
30:53
it is a little bit shocking to me that they didn't win.
30:56
~
30:57
additional like more in a way.
30:59
But
31:00
I saw this thing I
31:01
saw this thing that was talking about this one specifically,
31:03
because somebody was bringing up that Lea Michele should have been nominated.
31:06
And first off, part of me agrees.
31:08
Because I'm just addicted to the soundtrack of chess right now.
31:12
~ but s someone pointed out but like why didn't,
31:16
you know, like Nichelle Lewis win and they said when you look at the role,
31:21
she can sing her butt off, but the role itself isn't ~ like there isn't much to
31:27
to the role of Sarah, you know what mean?
31:29
Like, and they're looking for both acting and singing in when they pick
31:33
a the winner of an actress. They need somebody,
31:36
they want somebody who's talented in singing,
31:38
but also performing their butt off.
31:40
And so that's part of how some of the how people are voting.
31:43
And so you have to take that into account that you think that like Nichelle Lewis
31:46
is fantastic because of the note she hit,
31:48
which again I think she's fantastic in the entire role.
31:50
But they said, but the role of Sarah itself isn't much more than a plot line
31:54
for Colehouse Walker Jr.
31:56
And therefore there's not much acting getting to do in that part.
32:00
one hundred percent agree. Like honestly,
32:02
love her, but I was a little bit shocked that she
32:06
was nominated ~ because of the size of the role.
32:10
~ like really aside from Daddy's Son and Wheels of a Dream,
32:16
we don't see much of well, we see her.
32:19
Standing at the top of the staircase.
32:20
Yes.
32:20
But that's like all we see until obviously ~ I won't give spoilers,
32:27
but some things happen. but it's like one or two scenes com comparatively
32:28
Yeah.
32:32
to like Ben, who is in basically every other scene throughout the entire show.
32:38
~ but I mean again, that's why it is featured role.
32:43
~ but
32:44
Right. Or like Hannah
32:45
Cruz who shows up in Act Two, but she's in most of Act Two.
32:49
Right, right. So it it is an interesting those are those are
32:54
the conversations that I'd love to just like be a a fly in the wall.
32:57
Like I just wanna know what the thought process is.
33:00
Obviously it probably changes every year as they have different ~ voters and such,
33:06
but ~ it's a it's an interesting dynamic to have to kind
33:11
of finagle because they're all different roles,
33:14
they're all such different shows and the expectations are very different.
33:19
absolutely. And so when, you know,
33:21
as we're transitioning into just like the the wrapping it up part portion of this,
33:27
you know, RJ, we did have some biggest losers,
33:29
which there's one that I want to talk about specifically,
33:33
but I'm just gonna go through them really quick.
33:34
And I just wanna preface by saying,
33:36
listeners, every show is a winner,
33:37
the fact that it got nominated and you should celebrate that whether your show
33:40
won or not. ~ but chess did not walk away with any awards.
33:44
Rocky Horror did not walk away with any awards.
33:49
But the one that was interesting to me because you called it before it even went
33:52
to Broadway was Titanique. And you said,
33:56
I loved that show off Broadway.
33:58
I don't know how it's gonna do a Broadway stage.
34:00
Also, it's not gonna win any awards if it gets nominated because it's not
34:06
it like I don't wanna say ca it's not not of the same caliber,
34:08
but it just there was it's not like a ragtime.
34:11
It's not like a Shmigadoon, like it is like a very like it's
34:14
an intimate comedy house almost musical.
34:17
Like you called that so early before like they announced it Broadway
34:21
and you said it's not winning and you were right.
34:22
And I don't know how you did that,
34:24
but like that's some magical shit right there.
34:26
I mean, it is its own
34:28
It it gives me black box theater vibes,
34:32
which is not a bad thing. It's it's very it is very niche though.
34:33
yeah.
34:38
And so even their performance on the Tony's I'm sorry,
34:42
love you all, love the show, but it just felt
34:46
like everyone was trying to make it bigger than it actually is and so then
34:51
it didn't translate super well e even to like T V.
34:54
~
34:55
Because you didn't ha there's there's too much y you have to set up too much.
34:59
And so I mean, even just like looking over obviously
35:03
the commentary post Tony's like it people really didn't like it.
35:10
I mean, like actively did not like the performance.
35:12
Yes.
35:13
And so and I can't say first of all,
35:17
I do not think it was a strong performance.
35:19
I'm just gonna say it. I don't think it was.
35:22
yeah.
35:24
Vocally there were some issues.
35:26
I'm sure nerves were playing a role.
35:29
~ but it's just more difficult to it's it's
35:35
so much easier to like dampen a show rather than to like blow it up
35:40
to fill the space. And I feel like coming into Broadway,
35:45
I mean, we've heard it's doing quite well.
35:47
I don't know what theater it's at,
35:49
but I think that makes a difference too.
35:51
~
35:53
Titanique
35:54
But I'm very curious
35:54
I don't know, that's a good question.
35:56
if it tours like again, I'm just thinking like the person in,
36:01
you know, seat three thousand on the last balcony,
36:04
last row, how impressed are you going to be by this Bitan Titanique?
36:10
I'm not
36:11
Because we were what? Like we were basically on the stage.
36:11
You wanna know?
36:14
I mean, it was so small and so tight and you could see every like
36:15
Correct.
36:19
the facial expressions, it's like Oh, Mary!
36:22
It's so important to be able to see every single thing that's happening that
36:28
if you don't, it's not spectacle enough.
36:31
Nothing the set doesn't change.
36:32
Yes.
36:33
No there's literally nothing coming on and off that set except for the people.
36:38
And that just doesn't
36:40
translate well to houses that are that fit thousands,
36:45
basically.
36:46
Gonna I looked it up. RJ, we saw a show there last year.
36:51
And when I tell you the show, you're gonna be like,
36:54
that theater was n is not big it's too big.
36:57
It's even bigger than you think it is.
36:59
We saw Sunset Boulevard at the St.
37:02
James Theater last year.
37:02
And that's where Titanique is at right now.
37:04
And maybe it's because the Queen of Versailles,
37:07
~ that it was also there. It obviously got it got canceled quite early.
37:12
But and so they just need something to fill it.
37:15
But if you could imagine where we sat for Sunset Boulevard and we weren't even
37:19
at the top, I wouldn't be able to see half the show.
37:21
Yeah, that's very I was completely anticipating it being like at the Daryl Ross.
37:27
You know, like something if if that's like relatively intimate or even like
37:27
Yes.
37:32
~ where was it maybe happy ending?
37:33
Hudson? ~ yes.
37:33
~
37:35
But I mean, good on them. I'm sure they've obviously made some changes,
37:39
but wrapping this circling back to the Tony's it just Yeah,
37:45
it it doesn't shock me. ~ and it makes me so sad because that cast is stacked.
37:52
I think they are relying heavily on that,
37:54
or did rely heavily on that. And I I will one hundred percent go see
37:55
yeah.
37:59
it for the cast. ~ especially since I I already know what I'm getting into.
38:01
yeah, for sure.
38:05
But also politics. The show is very queer,
38:10
it's outwardly gay, it's it's making the jokes,
38:13
yeah.
38:14
~ and it rides the line.
38:18
I mean, obviously it's satire,
38:19
but it rides the line of like if you're a Celine Dion fan,
38:23
like a real Celine Dion fan, and you're not into comedy,
38:26
you're gonna absolutely hate it because it is poking fun at her,
38:29
Correct.
38:30
~ in a loving way. So
38:34
~ yeah, that that's long story long,
38:38
Я
38:38
that's my thoughts.
38:41
It is interesting win when you think of it that way because I th like you're talking
38:46
about gay, like like the queerness of it.
38:48
When Selene Dion makes the joke at the Tony's about Pink being a lesbian,
38:52
like that's the entire show. And like that if that's the energy that
38:55
you didn't like that joke, you're not gonna like this show because
38:59
it is outwardly gay all over. I mean when we saw ~ Andrew ~ Bulger was in it.
39:05
~ Andrew Keenan Bolger and it was I mean
39:10
He's a he's a lovely man, he's great,
39:12
he's wonderful. But he brought a lot of gay to Victor,
39:15
you know, Garber. And like so you have those roles.
39:17
Right now it's being played by Frankie Grande,
39:19
you know, and you have ~ my god,
39:22
the guy from the Big Bang Theory.
39:23
Like you have so much gayness in this show that you have to be able to embrace it.
39:28
And you should also be able to see it.
39:30
I could not imagine seeing this in the theater it's in.
39:33
A theater like O'Mary though, where you're like on top of the cast,
39:37
that's a great idea. ~
39:39
But also when you said you were thought maybe it should be somewhere like
39:42
the Daryl Roth Theater, when it was that's the off-Broadway theater it was at,
39:45
is it's pretty on the nose there,
39:47
RJ. But I do have to say though,
39:51
when you talk about the performances of the Tony's I think a lot of them
39:55
did fall flat for me in the same way that Titanique did.
39:58
Not that they were bad, but I was just like the like that's the song
40:02
you chose to perform for us. Or like that's how you're
40:07
trying to campaign one last time.
40:08
Like not that you really campaign,
40:09
but you're trying to show off like why you should be best musical.
40:11
like Schmigadoon!, I wasn't really I wasn't enthralled with Shemigadoon's
40:16
performance. ~ I can only semi remember The Lost Boys performance.
40:21
I remember Cats. I remember Two Strangers,
40:24
but again I have that emotional connection to it.
40:26
Like I don't really half of the shows I can't tell you be like,
40:30
yeah, that was something that really stood out in my head.
40:32
~
40:33
Even I have the Rocky Horror, I forgot that it performed until I just looked
40:36
at the list. Like you know what I mean?
40:37
'Cause like I think that kind of shows you where I am at least with
40:41
the the shows that are currently on Broadway.
40:43
And maybe I feel different once I've seen some of
40:45
Yeah, I mean Lost Boys.
40:47
~ I can like see it in my head what it was,
40:50
but like there was also almost too much going on that I was like,
40:54
It was like a concert.
40:55
what am I s what what am I supposed to be getting out of this?
40:57
Yeah.
40:57
and then you had the opposite effect for some of them,
41:01
right? Like you just said, like again,
41:04
Rocky Horror, very similar, but like everyone knows that song.
41:07
So like it was basically a sing along.
41:09
~
41:10
Ragtime doing their overture or prologue makes sense.
41:14
Makes sense.
41:16
It's literally exactly like they just copied and pasted their music in choreo.
41:22
~
41:24
Correct.
41:26
And so I don't know,
41:29
and yeah, it's maybe doing I mean a lot of dancing,
41:31
right? Which obviously that show has it.
41:32
Yeah.
41:34
~ and the comedy piece, two strangers.
41:38
I mean again, kudos to like them for it's so hard for
41:44
two people to fill that stage.
41:47
And so
41:48
And she did a
41:48
costume change midway.
41:51
Yeah. So I mean I do I was I like awestruck by literally any single performance?
41:53
Bravo to
41:58
No. ~ was I
42:02
Not like when we saw The Outsiders
42:03
perform, you know, a few years ago.
42:05
When we saw that and we're like,
42:05
shoot, we have to go to Broadway to see that show.
42:06
Right.
42:09
Well, and that's like even for the ones that won for scenic design and like choreo,
42:15
I mean cats was exactly what I would expect,
42:19
I guess, ~ with some weird choices in there.
42:23
but and then
42:27
the like Rachel singing from chorus line,
42:31
~ that kind of felt empty to me.
42:35
I didn't love it. I mean I love her,
42:37
but like I would have loved if we could have incorporated a like some type
42:41
of cast or like more people,
42:43
Yes.
42:45
not just her. Like what does she have to do with a chorus line?
42:49
I don't know. ~ so
42:51
Correct. I agree. Absolutely. It made no sense
42:53
in that degree in that way. And they didn't do anything with it.
42:56
Like you could have brought out people who were still living from
42:58
the original chorus line, granted they're in their like eighties,
43:00
but like you could have done something to celebrate it in a bigger way.
43:04
If it was if it was so important to showcase at the Tony's,
43:07
why didn't we do more to showcase it?
43:11
Right, and I'm sure there's there's I know earlier this year,
43:14
or was it last year, when they did like a anniversary s type ~ performance,
43:20
I think it was down in in Times Square or around there,
43:22
like why couldn't we have done you know,
43:25
just one do the song one? It it's a chorus line,
43:29
right? I mean so meh but honestly the most impressive number,
43:34
which it usually is, ~ it was the opening number with ~ yeah.
43:38
Pink killed it.
43:40
Yeah, it was it was very good.
43:42
I was a little bit worried. Not because I mean Pink's an insane wonderful performer,
43:47
but I was sh not sure how they were going to mesh like a pop star with Broadway
43:54
and if they were gonna lean towards her strengths or towards musical theater.
43:58
So I'm glad and obviously it makes total sense,
44:00
Lady Marmalade. ~ it makes complete sense.
44:03
For sure. It was great.
44:07
they didn't need Megan Thee Stallion after the debacle that was Moulin Rouge earlier
44:13
this year. But I I appreciate it.
44:15
And I like that they also showcased other people like Lea Michele who wasn't
44:19
up for an award, but it was truly about celebrating the art that's
44:22
on theater and not just about celebrating the people who are up for the awards.
44:25
So I I thought that was kind of cool too.
44:27
It felt a little bit like and granted,
44:29
this is probably not Pink's choice,
44:30
but it felt like Pink was like we
44:32
Everybody should be celebrating this moment.
44:33
We've done so much. We've come so far.
44:35
We've also had such a tough year and theater's still going.
44:39
So let's let's celebrate all of those pieces.
44:41
And that was a really that was my favorite part of the entire show too.
44:44
Was that. That was that was amazing.
44:46
Agreed. I think celebrating bringing all of those casts out,
44:51
~ bringing folks who weren't,
44:54
like you said, weren't nominated or weren't even performing.
44:57
~ it just speaks to the importance of every single person
45:04
who plays a an important role,
45:07
whether they're nominated or not.
45:10
~ it it's
45:12
What the Tony should be, celebrating theater overall,
45:15
~ and not just like a select small few.
45:21
And so with that though, the two thousand and twenty five,
45:23
two thousand twenty six Broadway season has come to a close.
45:26
But RJ, what is coming up next in the world of theater?
45:30
What do we have to look forward to?
45:31
Well, depending on when this comes out,
45:33
we are coming up on the Jimmy Awards on June twenty second,
45:34
It's coming out next week.
45:40
which is very exciting. ~ those will be streaming live.
45:45
I'm not sure what on I think it's online.
45:48
I'm not sure if it's actually on a T V channel,
45:52
but it's for sure live streaming.
45:54
~ so make sure to check that out.
45:57
~ obviously with shows
46:00
kind of ending with this kind of Tony cycle.
46:02
We have a bunch of new ones coming up.
46:04
~ you know, looking into August,
46:08
September, October, ~ paranormal activity.
46:13
Not my thing, but I mean we've
46:14
Hell yeah.
46:19
I'll go see without you, it's fine.
46:19
got yeah, Paranormal Activity,
46:21
Other Desert Cities, Wanted, Fantasticks Much Ado About Nothing,
46:25
Avita. Like there's so many shows that
46:27
Absolutely incredible show.
46:28
are also gonna be s
46:30
pretty star studded too. ~ so it's gonna be it's gonna be a season.
46:37
I mean, that's gonna be a great season.
46:38
And then here in Michigan, we have some great shows coming up,
46:41
so don't miss the notebook, maybe happy ending,
46:43
Dirty Dancing the Musical, Boop.
46:44
Those are all in the first part of the year.
46:46
but yeah, there's so much to be excited for.
46:48
So stay tuned for future episodes of the BSB podcast where we're gonna keep
46:52
you up to date with all the excitement here in Michigan and on Broadway.
46:54
Thank you so much for being here until next curtain call.