Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / Australian Association of Christian Schools EO Vanessa Cheng says the NT Government's proposed changes to anti-discrimination laws would actually discriminate against religious schools

Transcript

Australian Association of Christian Schools EO Vanessa Cheng says the NT Government's proposed changes to anti-discrimination laws would actually discriminate against religious schools · 360 with Katie Woolf

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  Speaker 1: You may have heard Bishop Gauchi on the show yesterday
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  Speaker 1: about the changes to the Northern Territories Anti Discrimination Act
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  Speaker 1: and the concerns that he has. Well, the Australian Association
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  Speaker 1: of Christian Schools agree that the proposed changes to the
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  Speaker 1: Discrimination Act could cause serious problems for faith based schools.
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  Speaker 1: Now joining me on the line is Vanessa Chang, the
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  Speaker 1: executive officer of the Australian Association of Christian Schools. Good
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  Speaker 1: morning to you, Vanessa, Good morning, Thanks you, Katie, Thanks
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  Speaker 1: so much for your time this morning. Now, Vanessa, what
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  Speaker 1: are your concerns around these changes?
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  Speaker 2: Can We're really concerned about these changes proposed by the
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  Speaker 2: Northern Territory government. And what your listeners need to understand
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  Speaker 2: is this bill passes in its current form next week,
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  Speaker 2: the Northern Territory will be the only state of territory
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  Speaker 2: the entire country that does not have protections for religious
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  Speaker 2: schools to employ people of the same faith. And what
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  Speaker 2: we're concerned about is that Christian schools to Catholic schools
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  Speaker 2: could be sued for not choosing to employ someone of
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  Speaker 2: the same faith. And for us, that's fundamental, it's a
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  Speaker 2: fundamental protection that the Northern Territory government is proposing to
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  Speaker 2: strip away from our schools and ultimately it's going to
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  Speaker 2: remove choice to parents in the Northern Territory and choosing
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  Speaker 2: a genuine faith based education for their children.
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  Speaker 1: Vanessa. For those of us that maybe don't have our
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  Speaker 1: kids at a faith based school, why is this so
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  Speaker 1: important for those faith based schools, well, Katie.
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  Speaker 2: In any organization, your people define your culture. It's not
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  Speaker 2: just a name on the front gate. It's much more
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  Speaker 2: than that. So for us to be able to call
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  Speaker 2: ourselves a Christian school, it just makes sense that we
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  Speaker 2: need to be able to have Christian staff working in
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  Speaker 2: our schools. The law that the Attorney General is proposing
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  Speaker 2: to pass next week, we'll actually discriminate it against religious schools.
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  Speaker 2: But the interesting thing is political parties are still protected
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  Speaker 2: and their ability to hire people of the same political beliefs.
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  Speaker 2: I imagine when Chancey Paige is employing advisors, he would
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  Speaker 2: want people that share the same values of the Australian
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  Speaker 2: Labor Party. And all we're asking for is that same protection,
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  Speaker 2: the ability and a jobing to be to ask somebody,
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  Speaker 2: are you a Christian? Are you active in your local church?
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  Speaker 2: Are you happy? To read the Bible with the students,
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  Speaker 2: pray with the students, talk about what it is to
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  Speaker 2: be a follower of Jesus Christ. These are the things
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  Speaker 2: that are fundamental in the Christians ruel for us in
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  Speaker 2: terterents to enroll their children in a Christian school. They
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  Speaker 2: understand that and they want that belief system talk to
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  Speaker 2: their children. They may not be Christian themselves. Our schools
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  Speaker 2: are open to a wide range of families from all
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  Speaker 2: sorts of faith and cultural backgrounds. But when parents are
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  Speaker 2: paying the extra to send their children to a faith
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  Speaker 2: based school, they must have confidence that they're getting what
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  Speaker 2: they're paying for.
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  Speaker 1: Now, from your perspective, how many schools around the Northern
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  Speaker 1: Territory is this going to impact and how large could
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  Speaker 1: the impact be.
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  Speaker 2: It's really significant, not only Northern Territory Christian schools, of
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  Speaker 2: which there are seven in the Northern Territory. I know
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  Speaker 2: there are thousands of students that also attend Catholic schools
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  Speaker 2: that don't have the figures at hand, but there's a
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  Speaker 2: significant portion of Northern Territory independence schools that have a
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  Speaker 2: faith basis. And as Bishop Charles Gouchi said yesterday, he's
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  Speaker 2: taking these changes very seriously, and it's actually concerned about
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  Speaker 2: whether his schools would continue to be viable. And I
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  Speaker 2: can understand his concerns. They're concerns that we've been talking
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  Speaker 2: about for so many weeks now, and we saw this bill,
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  Speaker 2: which by the way, hasn't been consulted on at all.
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  Speaker 2: When the Attorney General said on your program yesterday that
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  Speaker 2: this has been consulted on, I just want to point
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  Speaker 2: out that no faith leaders saw any of these changes
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  Speaker 2: that have been introduced in the final bill that will
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  Speaker 2: be passed next week. In particular, section thirty seven A,
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  Speaker 2: which is the protection we rely upon the religious educational exemption,
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  Speaker 2: that's been completely removed and has not been consulted on
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  Speaker 2: with any faith leader.
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  Speaker 1: So from the drafts that you had previously seen, that
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  Speaker 1: was still in there, that thirty seven I e. That section,
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  Speaker 1: and that's now been removed and there's been no consultation
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  Speaker 1: with the government on that.
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  Speaker 2: Exactly right, Katie. Thirty seven A provided for an exemption
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  Speaker 2: around religious belief and activity, and that was in the
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  Speaker 2: draft bill that was put out for consultation back in August.
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  Speaker 2: We provided feedback on their bill, and there are many
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  Speaker 2: other elements of the bill that we have concerned about
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  Speaker 2: as well, but in particular that protection around employment of
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  Speaker 2: staff of the same faith was completely stripped away with
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  Speaker 2: no consultation. We've been trying for weeks now to get
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  Speaker 2: a meeting with the Chiefs Minister and the Attorney General,
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  Speaker 2: and our request has been refused. And I understand that
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  Speaker 2: other faith leaders share similar frustration. So it was quite
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  Speaker 2: misleading for the Attorney General to say in your program
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  Speaker 2: yesterday that they've consulted widely on this bill when he
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  Speaker 2: knows full well that the complete removal of thirty seven
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  Speaker 2: A was not included in that draft bill that they
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  Speaker 2: put for consultation back in August.
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  Speaker 1: Vanessa, what would you say to anybody that's listening this
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  Speaker 1: morning that's thinking, you know that thirty seven A was
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  Speaker 1: just a you know, just a clause that meant that,
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  Speaker 1: you know that Catholic schools or faith based schools could
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  Speaker 1: discriminate against certain people.
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  Speaker 2: Look, Katie, what it's all about really is choice for parents.
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  Speaker 2: When parents choose a religious school and pay fees to
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  Speaker 2: send their child to a faith based school, they're expecting
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  Speaker 2: that they get what they pay for, that the staff
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  Speaker 2: who are employed by that school understand the faith will
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  Speaker 2: be role models of the faith. Teachers do much more
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  Speaker 2: than simply transmit dry curriculum knowledge. I think here in
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  Speaker 2: your program the Attorney General made the comment that it
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  Speaker 2: doesn't matter whether your teaching US or English in the
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  Speaker 2: religious school or a state school, it's the same information
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  Speaker 2: that's shared. Well, we know that teachers do much more
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  Speaker 2: than just transmit information. Their role models are to students,
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  Speaker 2: whether it's in the playground, whether it's coaching sporting teams
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  Speaker 2: or on school camps. And our teachers, we expect them
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  Speaker 2: to be modeling the faith, being able to answer questions
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  Speaker 2: about God in the playground, in the classroom. So I
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  Speaker 2: think by his comments yesterday, he shows you have a
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  Speaker 2: very narrow understanding of what religious education is and not
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  Speaker 2: regardless of whether it's a Catholic, Christian or a Jewish school.
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  Speaker 2: You know, our people are what make us different and
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  Speaker 2: what make us who we are.
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  Speaker 1: What is like, what's your national body saying at the moment,
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  Speaker 1: because I know that on a national scale, we had
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  Speaker 1: mentioned this yesterday that the Federal Attorney General had said
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  Speaker 1: that you know that there was liaising happening. I believe
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  Speaker 1: with the Australian law society on that national scale before
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  Speaker 1: any change made nationally to this aspect of their act.
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  Speaker 1: So you know what's being said nationally from your perspective
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  Speaker 1: within the Australian Association of Christian Schools.
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  Speaker 2: That's a really good point, Katie, and something that we
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  Speaker 2: have been agitating for as well. At a federal level,
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  Speaker 2: the Australian Labor Party made a commitment to faith groups
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  Speaker 2: that people of faith would be able to employ people
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  Speaker 2: in their religious school to share the same faith. That
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  Speaker 2: was an election commitment that the Albanezi Labor government made
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  Speaker 2: to faith groups prior to the election. And so the
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  Speaker 2: Attorney General, the Federal Attorney General, Mark Grafis, has asked
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  Speaker 2: the Australian Law Reform to look at this because it
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  Speaker 2: is a complex area of law. There is the important
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  Speaker 2: role of balance in human rights of different people and
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  Speaker 2: so that Law Reform Commission inquiry will be due to
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  Speaker 2: report back to government in April next year. So what
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  Speaker 2: we're asking the Northern Territory government is to hold off
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  Speaker 2: on passing this law next week until that with thoughts
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  Speaker 2: has run its course and is reported back to federal government,
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  Speaker 2: because what we're asking for is a nationally consistent approach
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  Speaker 2: to these issues. It's no good having the Northern Territory
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  Speaker 2: with the one set of laws and different to other states.
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  Speaker 2: And I'm sure you'd agree that religious readom is actually
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  Speaker 2: the fundamental human rights that's protected in international law. And
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  Speaker 2: yet the Northern Territory government is completely ignoring this world
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  Speaker 2: respective international human rights and ignoring the real trait concerns
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  Speaker 2: that respective leaders such as the Catholic Bishop, Shile, Scouts
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  Speaker 2: you have, and other Faithe leaders have around this law.
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  Speaker 2: So we're asking him to hold our pause, sit down,
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  Speaker 2: listen to us about our concerns. We want to come
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  Speaker 2: to the table with constructive solutions. We have proposals that
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  Speaker 2: we think are fair and reasonable and can solve a
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  Speaker 2: lot of these problems. But the difficulty is we haven't
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  Speaker 2: even been able to have that conversation with the government.
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  Speaker 1: Well look, it's going to be incredibly interesting to see
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  Speaker 1: now whether whether the Attorney General or the Chief Minister
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  Speaker 1: are prepared to sit down with yourself, with Bishop Gauchi,
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  Speaker 1: with any of the faith based organizations that are really
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  Speaker 1: saying we need further consultation here, particularly you know, following
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  Speaker 1: on from what you've just told me, where there had
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  Speaker 1: been consultation, but then with that draft bill you know
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  Speaker 1: that's now been seen where the thirty seven A has
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  Speaker 1: been taken out, To then not have further consultation or
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  Speaker 1: further discussions I think is a bit disingenuous at this point.
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  Speaker 2: Absolutely. I was really gobsmacked by the comments made by
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  Speaker 2: the Attorney General yesterday when he said that there's been consultation.
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  Speaker 2: It's not just my experience. I've spoken to other faith
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  Speaker 2: leaders who are also extremely disappointed with the lack of
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  Speaker 2: consultation and it seems like the government has the intention
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  Speaker 2: of just ramming this through next week without listening to
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  Speaker 2: the concerns that faith leaders have around the territory.
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  Speaker 1: Well Australian Association of Christian score Rules executive Officer Vanessa Chang,
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  Speaker 1: we appreciate your time this morning. Thanks very much for
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  Speaker 1: coming on and just explaining to us the concerns that
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  Speaker 1: you've got.
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  Speaker 2: Thank you so much, Katie, thank you