Latest / King Dems Podcast | Growth Mindset, Leadership, AI and Business Insights / Inclusive Wealth Playbook: Elaine Rasmussen on AI, Leadership and Growth Mindset Strategies

Transcript

Inclusive Wealth Playbook: Elaine Rasmussen on AI, Leadership and Growth Mindset Strategies · King Dems Podcast | Growth Mindset, Leadership, AI and Business Insights

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Tenacity and courage of moving forward and walking forward
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despite fear, right? I think the third thing is
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understanding the math. And when I say the math, it's
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not always financial. It could be qualitative, it
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could be quantitative. And so I include relationships,
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understanding the math of relationships, knowing when you
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need to walk away and not saying that not walking away doesn't
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mean that that person's a bad person and that person is not
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aligned with the situation or the goals that you're working
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towards. And yeah, so I mean, there's I
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could, I could talk infinitum about this, but I think those
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are those are some of the things that I have seen of
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understanding the math of the financials, whatever the
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situation where it's personal financials, financials, the
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business financials, but also the math of a leadership, the
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math of relationships and being able to have some critical
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analysis to be able to make quick relatively low information
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decisions to be able to propel you forward.
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Ladies and gentlemen, you once again welcome to the Kingdom's
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broadcast. And today I have of me fighting
2:19
out of Saint Paul's, Minnesota make welcome, Elaine, the
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greatest therapist on earth. Rasmussen, How are you, Elaine?
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I'm doing amazing. How are you today?
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I'm good, you know, your voice is actually therapeutic.
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So anyone that needs anyone that needs therapy.
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I'm happy to hear that. I'm not a therapist though,
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let's be clear. You you, you are my therapist.
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I give you the title. Just run with it.
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OK, sounds good sounds. Good.
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Just because yeah, your voice is therapeutic, you haven't
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elevated to the position of greatest therapist on earth.
2:57
I'll take it. OK, please take care.
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You know, Johnny has actually been adventurous, you know, Wall
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Street insider to social impact architect.
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So how would you describe yourself, you know, as a person?
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And of course, you know, did the journey from Wall Street to
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becoming a champion for inclusive wealth, right?
3:22
And of course, what's the pivotal movement that actually
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LED you to shift your focus from traditional finance to social
3:30
impact and democratising access to capital?
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Wow, that was a mouthful. So I'll try to, I'll try to
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weave all of that in. So I think the first part of
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your question is, you know, sort of what's been my journey.
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And so I shared with you before we started that I really had
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this tumultuous beginning, right, coming from a very poor
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family, a lot of housing insecurity, a lot of drug
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addiction, alcohol. Addiction.
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And so, yeah, just trying to figure out how to navigate the
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world and growing up with very having a parent who had a very
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deficit mindset around money and having a grandparent who had a
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very abundance mindset around money.
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But so I accidentally found myself in being a stock analyst
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and you're not necessarily directly related to money, but
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you're able to see patterns. That was another one of my gifts
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we talked about before the show gifts, right?
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One of my other gifts is I'm very good at seeing very, very
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quickly. And so I was able to leverage
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that in analysing stock and I was very good at it.
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However, I didn't want to stay doing that.
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This was the 80s. I was working for a company
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named Shearson Lehman, which is partially responsible for the
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housing crisis. They are no longer around
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anymore, but I work for Shearson Lehman Brothers, right?
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I worked for Shearson Lehman Brothers in the 80s and I was
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the only woman working in the place where I worked that wasn't
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a secretary. Wow.
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Yeah, right. Mild dominated technical space.
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Right so and I think there was only one other person of colour
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that worked there And so while I love what I did, I decided to
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not stay in the finance sector created a whole career working
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in marketing and communications had a 25 year career across a
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variety of different sectors. So working fashion,
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entertainment, manufacturing, higher education, but I did
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communications and then finally landed in philanthropy.
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This gets to the year is the pivotal moment.
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So while I was working in philanthropy had been hearing
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about conversations about this thing called impact investing.
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And because I had this finance like foundation, I was one of
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the few people in philanthropy who could actually understand
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that language, what people were talking about.
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But what I quickly realised was there's a disconnect between
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wealth holders and and people with capital and them saying
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that they wanted to have the impact and the stories that they
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would tell about the impact they were having.
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And what I took away from their stories was that you are doing
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like the bare minimum like, but but you're thinking that you are
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actually making some great critical impact.
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But what I knew was garbage impact.
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It was garbage. It was garbage.
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And but how do you tell somebody who has wealth that their whole
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thesis is trash? It's hot.
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Right. I mean, and that's, this goes to
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one of my gifts, right? A lot of people who know me say,
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Elaine, you're the only person I know that can deliver bad news
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and people thank you for it. So I had a gift for telling
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people that they were garbage and, and then wanting to
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actually like, like change and like do something different.
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So when I saw that there was this disconnect between the
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people who had capital or people had wealth and the impact that
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they were trying to have, I said, oh, this and then that the
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people who had these wonderful projects or had these wonderful
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investments who had no pathway to these people, they were also
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not prepared for the conversation, right?
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And so I'm like, I had a lightning rod moment when I'm
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sitting in this. I was at I was in a pre
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conference. It was a meeting before a
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conference. And the conference was a
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breakdown of, you know, what is impact investing, what are
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programme related investing, you know, programme related
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investments. And as people were in this room,
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it was a small room, It's about maybe 40 people in this room.
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Every single person was introducing themselves.
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My name is so and so from so and so organisation, I manage X
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millions or billions of dollars of assets under management.
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Now for me, coming out of philanthropy, I thought that was
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a very strange way for people to introduce themselves.
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I'd never heard people introducing themselves by how
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much capital that they manage. I was like, OK, while I'm
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listening to every person in this room introduced themselves,
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I'm in this room. I didn't manage any capital,
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right body experience of like, why am I in this room, right?
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I don't have millions of dollars of assets under management, but
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OK, let me put that on a bike racket.
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I'll circle back to that existential crisis in a moment.
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So as everybody was introducing themselves and I'm doing this
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back of the envelope calculation of how much money is in this
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room, quickly running out of fingers and toes to calculate
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the number of zeros that are in this room.
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And you know, I don't know if I can curse on your show, but
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like, what would this is like, like, like the bullshit stories
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of impact that they're telling us.
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I'm like, OK, OK. So after that convening, I, I
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sat down with a friend of mine and I said, I want to make sure
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I understand what, what, what they were talking about South.
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And I, and I said to her, I said, oh, so the people have
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figured out how to not pay taxes on the money that they have have
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now figured out a way to make money on that money and still
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not pay taxes. And my friend looked me then the
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eye who had been doing this work for a long time.
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She said, you're absolutely right.
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So I told you I'm very good at patterns like I can.
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I can catch a pattern really good.
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Technician. Right.
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So I said OK, because I'm also a marketing strategist.
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So I'm like, OK, now that I understand the what, right now
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the how is going to be easy for me.
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I'm like, OK, I understand The Who, I understand the how, I
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understand the what. I'm like, OK, there is an
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opportunity for me in this space to be able to close the gap
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between these universes, right? But when I, when I left that
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conference, I never understood when people said that they had a
9:27
calling. I understood that like from a
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practical standpoint, right? From it, from an academic
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standpoint, understood people who said they had a call, but I,
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I didn't understand that in my soul.
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Like I, I didn't have that lightning rod moment until that
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day. I'm like, I know what my purpose
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is on this earth. My purpose on this earth is to
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move money differently. That's my purpose.
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My sole reason for breathing in and out is to move money
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differently. That's what I'm here to do,
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right? And all these gifts that I've
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acquired naturally as well as collectively, accumulatively, is
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to move money differently, to get people to move money, but
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also to get people who don't have money or have money
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detachment disorder, which is what I like to call it, for them
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to think differently about money, but to educate people to
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move money differently. That is my goal and that is my
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purpose. And so that was the lightning
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rod moment of getting people to think people and institutions to
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think differently. Hence like my my podcast, do
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different better. But that has been now my life
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mantra is to do different better always and in always.
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So it not only personally, but in all the ways, so financially,
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spiritually, mentally, physically do different better,
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right? Different isn't always better,
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but better is always different, right?
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And so I truly, truly, truly believe that.
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And so if we believe that, then if we want to want different
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outcomes, it requires A fundamental shift within us full
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stop to be able to do that. Otherwise, we're just moving
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pieces around the chess board, right?
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We're not really moving anything forward.
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We're just we're playing checkers and not really playing.
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Chess. He, he read my mind on my mind.
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I was like, OK, you playing chess, some other people playing
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checkers, and of course some other people are not even on the
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board at all. No, yeah, and they don't want to
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be. That's the crazy part, right?
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So that's the other part of this of I lead a women's wealth
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wisdom group. And one of the things that I ask
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the women to reframe, right? Because I don't give advice, I'm
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saying I'm going to invite you to think about this differently.
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They're like, well, I'm going to do this in the future.
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I'm going to think about where my bank, where I bank, even
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though I'm currently banking in an organisation that is
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investing against my own values, right?
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I'm going to do that at some time in the future.
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And I said, OK, well, let me, let me invite you to think about
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something. That organisation is continuing
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to use your money to work not only against your interest, but
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your children's interest. And when I said that to her,
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well, I did not give her any advice.
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When I said that to her, she's like, once I talked about her
12:09
children because her children's bank accounts were at this bank
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as well. Her back straightened up and I
12:15
said, and the fact that they're taking that money and they are
12:18
leveraging it 10 times because that's what a bank can do if
12:21
they're going to take your dollar and they're going to
12:24
leverage it. So that means they are making
12:26
10X off of your money and your children's money because you are
12:31
finding it that it is too much work or it's something you want
12:34
to do in the future. And so that once again just
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completely changed her whole entire mindset around, I got to
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do this this weekend. Like I need to take my money out
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of this bank. I said OK, right?
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And so my personal going back to like, so what's my personal
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goal? My personal goal is to move $500
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billion, right? To move differently.
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That's like my life, my lifetime goal.
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You move some of it my way and move it to my company.
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I'm trying to get it to my company.
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I'm trying to get it to my company.
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Then, then I'll get it. To your eyes.
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So I'm not, I'm not greedy, I just need.
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Very, a little bit, a little bit.
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That's a drop. You're in line.
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I gotta, I gotta, I gotta, I gotta place in line for you.
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It's all right. Wow, thank you very much.
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Love, love, appreciation and respect.
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Oh, I'm not going to forget. I'm not going to forget.
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I'm actually very curious about how you introduce yourself in
13:28
that meeting. So I'm trying to remember.
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That's a good question. So no one's ever asking me.
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I'm, I'm very cheeky. So I probably said I have no
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assets under management. But I probably said something
13:41
very like very cheeky. And just like you know, I'm
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Elaine Rasmussen from so and so and so and so and I have no
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assets under management. Now I feel I now like you or a
13:53
fewer version of myself because so many times people have told
13:58
me, hey, Adi, you're so cheeky and a girl.
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I'm like, OK, baby, I, I should, I should create a frame
14:05
somewhere and say cheeky because I, I love to play, you know,
14:11
with words and I love being authentic.
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So being an authentic person who is artistically inclined and
14:19
scientifically inclined, it makes you to be able to have
14:24
this accelerated thinking of making sense with witty words
14:29
and sleeping yourself. Why I went into marketing,
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right, That's why so I made the decision to go into marketing
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because I wanted to use both sides of my brain I wanted to
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use the analytical side, which is market research, market
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analysis, right consumer behaviour, but I also love to
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create myself. I love creating campaigns.
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I love creating expression. I love and I tell people I'm in
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the, when I was doing marketing full time, I'm like, I'm in the,
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I'm in the word business. Like marketing is all about
14:56
navigating. And I think if you, if you have
14:58
any job where words are a core element of your job, you can't
15:04
help but have a sense of a very deep understanding of words.
15:08
And which then you need to have to be a comic, right?
15:11
To be a comedian, you have to have a deep understanding of
15:13
words. To be a songwriter, you have,
15:15
you need to have a very deep appreciation and expansive
15:19
knowledge of words. I think marketing is up there,
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right, because you work with words all the time, every day.
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That is the basis, right? Because the words that you
15:27
choose count, right? They are distinct meanings
15:30
behind different words. And regardless of what the
15:32
dialect or the context is, you need to understand that like
15:35
what's cheeky in in England versus what's cheeky like what
15:40
is even that word cheeky mean and then United States contact.
15:43
So being able to have that deep love, understanding, I think
15:47
makes us and even as a podcaster, right?
15:49
Makes us more purposeful and intentional about everything
15:52
that comes out of our, whether it's written or whether it's
15:55
verbal. We are very thoughtful and
15:57
mindful about the construct of the word that we select to
16:00
create a very distinct picture that we want people to walk away
16:03
from after they've had an encounter with us.
16:06
Exactly. And of course, being wheaty with
16:09
it and being artistic or poetic with it actually makes it
16:13
sinking deeper. And I met a friend recently,
16:16
shout out to cheater, a Nigerian like myself.
16:18
And then she, she's like these things you're telling me, did
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you actually rehearse them before?
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And I'm like, excuse me, I'm a wordsmith.
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I am a wordsmith. You know, that's a thing.
16:29
You can pick up anything and run the words through, run rhymes
16:36
with it and still makes sense. But I don't know how you were
16:40
able to, would I say, build your own vocabulary?
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Because I was a nerd growing up. I did not watch movies or watch
16:48
TVI pretty much was reading a lot.
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Philosophy, psychology, anthropology, sociology.
16:54
And of course, I think when I was probably like 5678, I used
16:59
to just read the Oxford English Dictionary.
17:02
So. Oh wow.
17:03
OK. Like getting the word for.
17:06
Me, yeah, for me it was really about it was a couple of things.
17:11
So one, I was a big reader as well, but that was also because
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I was an introvert. So and and I because of my home
17:17
situation, reading was a form of escape, right.
17:21
So I see I was very much AI was a big reader.
17:24
But the other thing that I think is very distinct part from my
17:28
experiences, I loved comedians. Like from a very early age, I
17:34
would watch comedians. Yeah, and you see the way the
17:37
string, the string, the words together, right, the words.
17:41
Together. I was very, I was in awe.
17:43
Like I remember watching Chris Rock when he was 18 on on like
17:47
he got like his first spot on Tvi remember because we had just
17:52
gotten a colour television. We hadn't had a colour
17:54
television before. So to be able to see Chris Rock
17:58
at 18 and he was so masterful. But money comics are masterful
18:04
with words. And I was just like, wow.
18:05
And the other thing that I loved was we we had a very limited
18:09
access to TV. And so I watched a lot of old
18:13
movies and watching old movies was another like I felt some of
18:17
the language in the movie was lyrical.
18:19
And I love to love. I heard music when I would hear
18:24
like people talking and I wanted to imitate that.
18:27
So that those three things, I think just like, and I watched a
18:32
lot of public television, right. So, but that's all we were
18:34
allowed to watch as as a kid, I wasn't allowed to watch a lot of
18:37
the other stuff. So it was a lot of public
18:39
television. And, and so I remember watching
18:41
like Masterpiece Theatre. And so there are a lot of
18:43
British television on public television in the United States.
18:47
So I watched a lot of British television.
18:49
I remember one of the things that I actually my, my son to
18:52
this day, who's 28, he loves keeping up appearances.
18:56
He loves what was the other show we used to watch?
18:59
There were two British like shows, I think from the 80s that
19:02
was on in the 90s. And my, my son, he watched out a
19:05
lot. And to this day it's one of his
19:07
favourite show. As time goes by.
19:10
I think it was as time goes by and keeping up appearances to
19:14
this day two of his like favourite shows.
19:16
Yeah, you guys. Come see you.
19:18
Guys should come see us in London, come pay some homemades,
19:20
you know? Absolutely, absolutely.
19:23
But you know, having that as a backdrop and then also going to
19:27
private school. So while even through all that
19:30
tumultuous like background at home, my mom having the
19:33
foresight and the energy to put me and my brother through
19:37
Catholic school. So there was this natural thing
19:41
around education, learning, reading, but then also coupled
19:45
with like getting access to wit at a very young age, right, of
19:49
watching comedy on the regular. It was that I think all of that
19:53
informs how I engage with people and getting people maybe to not
19:57
to go through things maybe from the side as opposed to going to
20:00
things straight on. Because you know, like your
20:03
vocabulary is like, it's like a breeze of war.
20:05
It's like a database like you need, you need that very massive
20:10
database. If you do not have that
20:12
database, it's it's going to be hard for you, no matter how
20:15
talented you are, in order to become a wordsmith.
20:19
Because to be a wordsmith, you need to have a large database of
20:24
words in your head to be able to string together.
20:28
And even not just being a wordsmith, but to be able to
20:30
communicate your thoughts and feelings, like if you're sitting
20:33
in a boardroom or you're sitting in a team meeting right at work
20:37
and you want to, you want to articulate and persuade your
20:41
colleagues to the brilliant idea that you have.
20:45
You have to have some master of words so that they can see what
20:50
it is you see. And so I think it's just a
20:52
valuable tool, particularly for women to have a strong
20:56
vocabulary to be. Able why?
20:59
Why women? I keep hearing women empowerment
21:02
but no men empowerment. Why?
21:05
Well. Because I'll tell you why.
21:07
Because men already take up the space, and they take up the
21:10
space whether they deserve it or not, right?
21:12
So right, I don't believe. That.
21:20
You want me to give you an example?
21:22
Give me an example please. Thank.
21:23
You, I'll give you an example and I don't want to hurt your
21:26
feelings because I appreciate you and love you for what you're
21:29
doing. But when we did our when we were
21:32
on our pre interview call, I don't know if you realise that
21:34
you spoke for a whole 30 minutes and you didn't ask me one
21:37
question. Absolutely.
21:40
I did tell you a lot of things, right?
21:43
But then I told you and you don't know why I did not ask you
21:47
a question, right? I give you an open-ended, you
21:51
know, opportunity to speak about yourself and, and and.
21:55
Not until. Not until 30 minutes.
21:57
Not until it was 30 minutes in. I was watching the clock.
22:00
You spoke about yourself for 30 minutes.
22:04
You did not ask me a question. You did not really.
22:07
You gave me an opening to affirm what you said.
22:10
You did not ask me about me. You.
22:13
You asked me a question to affirm what you had already
22:15
shared with me did not ask, right?
22:18
So that's a very so So you took up a lot of space and I now I
22:23
let you because I wanted to see how long you were going to go.
22:26
And I gave you 6060 minutes on the podcast to talk about
22:30
yourself, because if you talk about yourself outside, well,
22:32
we're going to talk about inside.
22:35
And so that's why women need to take up more space, because the
22:38
rationale you just gave is the rationale that men get for
22:41
taking it. Women, you know, women are.
22:43
Taking more space? I took 30 minutes.
22:45
You're taking 60 minutes. Who?
22:47
Who's got more space? You invited me here.
22:49
You invited me, right? That is not the same.
22:52
You invited me here. So you're saying.
22:54
So you're saying it's OK that you took up a whole bunch of
22:58
time and that you're giving me space when you asked me here, I
23:02
didn't ask to be here. You asked me to be here.
23:05
Absolutely. Absolutely.
23:07
So let's be fair. Let's refer to each other,
23:09
right? Let's be fair.
23:10
And of course there's the man woman argument right here.
23:13
Of course. Is that 90 minutes now?
23:16
OK, yeah, 90 minutes, right? The man takes 30 minutes and the
23:21
woman is actually given 60 minutes.
23:24
And yet. But I'm not getting 60 minutes.
23:27
Yet the woman is completely in that of the 60 minutes.
23:30
So this is gaslighting. So.
23:32
So then let me explain to you how you just gas lit me and this
23:35
is what men do, right? OK. 1st.
23:38
OK, let's talk about it, right? I'm happy, yeah.
23:42
OK, so you're comparing 2 completely different contexts
23:49
that have nothing to do with one another.
23:51
You have invited me on your show to talk about me.
23:56
I know right? That is a very different thing.
23:59
Then you and I are spending 30 minutes to get to know one
24:02
another so we both feel comfortable with the hour that
24:04
we're going to spend together. How can I get comfortable in the
24:08
30 minutes that we're supposed to?
24:10
A conversation is a for two people, not a monologue is for
24:13
one person. You did not get to know me
24:16
because we spent the 1st 30 minutes just talking about you.
24:19
So by the time we get on the show you don't really know
24:22
anything about me because we just talked about you.
24:26
So you are comparing 2 completely different things that
24:29
have nothing to do with one another.
24:31
And so This is why we need we need both things right?
24:37
I think men, I'm not saying I'm. Do I get a chance for your
24:41
report? Let me then hold on.
24:42
Let me finish. See.
24:43
You're not See. You've just interrupted me.
24:45
You. Just interrupted me.
24:48
You just interrupted me. You just interrupted me.
24:50
You didn't even. You didn't even let me finish my
24:52
thought. You didn't even let me.
24:53
Finish my thought before you. Wanted to defend yourself,
24:57
right? You didn't even let me finish my
24:59
thought because you felt the need that you needed to defend
25:01
yourself. I know and if you right, so if
25:04
you had let me finish, I would have said this isn't about this
25:08
isn't about women getting more time, right?
25:11
That's not the point of my comment.
25:13
My comment is that if you are having a conversation, one I
25:18
love when I do a facilitation. I do facilitations with with
25:21
companies all the time and I there's a term that I use.
25:26
Why am I talking and why am I not talking right?
25:30
Sometimes we take up a more space.
25:33
We don't realise it. We are humans, especially
25:35
extroverts. We take up more space.
25:39
When you take up more space and you don't give space, you are
25:42
actually losing out on the opportunity of somebody else's
25:44
genius to actually wash over you when you take up all the space,
25:50
right? Absolutely.
25:52
And when you are not talking, you are denying the room of the
25:56
genius you have to bring to the room.
25:58
And everybody does have genius to bring to the room.
26:00
So while it sometimes sits in the context of a male female,
26:04
this isn't necessarily a gender thing, but it does show up.
26:08
It has a predominance of like men could listen better and
26:12
women can speak up more. Not to not to say that that men
26:17
should not talk or men should talk less.
26:21
My point is men should listen more.
26:23
That's a very. Different thing.
26:25
Absolutely. Therefore, language skills,
26:27
Listening, speaking, writing, reading.
26:29
Yeah. And people don't take listening
26:32
seriously. I love.
26:34
I love being an active listener. Right.
26:36
And it's a very, very important skill to master.
26:40
The very, very important. But, you know, talk talking
26:43
about you. I did my research, you know,
26:45
once you. I love your profile.
26:47
I appreciate what you do. But you know, me doing that
26:51
research about you and, you know, digging into you, you
26:54
know, and creating specially created questions for you shows
26:59
how much appreciate you appreciate your profile right as
27:02
a person. However, in the podcasting
27:04
space, most podcasts are just surface level and their guests
27:09
do not even know anything about what they do, right?
27:12
So for me, when you, when we started the interaction, you're
27:16
like, oh, this two hours. I don't think I have up to two
27:19
hours to you know of content. And then I was like, no, the
27:23
first 30 minutes typically, you know, is a getting to know each
27:27
other phase, right? I know about what you do
27:30
already, right? But what you most likely know
27:33
about me is being a podcaster. But then there's a lot to me,
27:38
and if you get to know me better as a person, you got to feel
27:41
comfortable speaking with me, not just from a formal
27:45
perspective, but you're speaking to the personality, to the
27:48
person, you know, sharing things we have in common, right?
27:53
You have not researched me, you know invited.
27:55
How do you know that you didn't ask me?
27:57
You haven't asked me by research here.
27:59
OK, So what do you I? Did actually I actually did
28:01
research here. Talk to me.
28:02
Tell me. Tell.
28:05
Let's go. But this goes back to my point.
28:08
This goes back to me. Tell me, what do you know about
28:09
me? As opposed to starting with a
28:11
question of starting with a question of like, hey, did you
28:15
do some research? You let me tell you, you asked
28:19
in your inner in your the e-mail communication, you asked me to
28:23
go and research you. So I'm like, OK, if somebody's
28:25
asking me to go and do a little bit of research, you know, went
28:28
listened to, I listened to multiple of your episodes.
28:31
I. Did not see a response on it.
28:36
Well, because I, I, I, I don't think it's meaningful or
28:39
relevant at this point, right? I think that.
28:42
So for me, once again, I feel like that's it, that's a, that's
28:46
a mechanism by which to discount what I'm saying, right?
28:49
And so. No, it's not to discount what
28:51
you're saying, to be honest, right?
28:52
I'm an auditor and we only say something if it wasn't
28:55
documented, it wasn't done. He gets it.
28:58
So I reach out to you. I say, OK, this is a
29:01
communication. If I don't get response on
29:03
something, I don't bother. Like it means probably the
29:07
person did not have the time. I've had over 100 episodes,
29:09
right? And over time, more often than
29:12
not, most people don't do that research on me.
29:15
I do the research on that. Right.
29:18
And I get that, but I think you should always, I come from a
29:21
place of inquiry. So my, my, my philosophy is I
29:25
would have started the conversation not from an
29:27
assumption, but say, hey, did you get an opportunity to
29:30
research me? Now you're laying the groundwork
29:33
for me to now go into a monologue about myself.
29:36
It's like, I understand maybe you didn't have time, maybe
29:39
whatever the case, like I don't even need a reason why you
29:41
didn't do it, but I'm like, I'm going to start from a place of
29:44
inquiry and not from a place of a baseline assumption that you
29:47
didn't do any research on me, right?
29:49
And for me it doesn't even and it doesn't as my personal
29:53
feeling. It doesn't even matter because I
29:55
know how to navigate a conversation, regardless of
29:59
whether you've done research on me.
30:00
We're gonna have a good time. We're gonna have a great time
30:02
because we're gonna have a great time.
30:05
So. And I could tell.
30:06
And of course, we are having a great time.
30:08
We are having a great time. We are.
30:09
Having a great time we're. Having an amazing time, Yeah.
30:13
And you know the beautiful. Thing.
30:14
It'll be really interesting to hear what your your listeners
30:16
say. Yeah, I'm telling you.
30:18
And the beautiful thing about this back and forth is that it
30:21
is we are logo heads, but we are still respectful to each other.
30:27
And yeah, it's something that well.
30:30
And this is another value, like one of my values is no one
30:33
deserves to lose their dignity, right?
30:35
So if that's a baseline core value that I have, that no one
30:39
deserves to lose their dignity, we can agree to disagree and we
30:45
can still go out and have a cocktail, right?
30:47
We can go out. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely.
30:50
You know, I've said this on the part so many times.
30:53
My core values, kindness, respect, hospitality, those are
30:56
my core values. That's what I stand for.
30:58
That's what I leave for. You know, it's, it's very
31:01
essential to be respectful to people, to the kinds of people
31:03
and to be hospitable, you know, and you know, I'm quite curious.
31:07
You saying you talk into a bit of research about me?
31:12
I'm quite curious to to find out what you found out so.
31:16
Well, I found out, I ironically found out a lot of what you
31:19
shared, right? So I don't, I can't offer
31:22
anything different than what you shared with me prior.
31:26
You know, before we started recording, you know, I wouldn't
31:28
say that I spent hours, right? But I, you know, I listened to a
31:31
number of your podcasts. I wanted to understand the flow
31:34
of how, you know, once again, what's the pattern of how you
31:38
associate with your guests. I'm like, OK, now I have a good
31:41
understanding of what our our back and forth is going to be.
31:44
I, you know, obviously could see that, you know, that you're, you
31:51
migrated to, to the UK, but you know, once again, I, I wouldn't
31:56
say that I know more about you than what you've already shared
32:00
with me. That was high level.
32:02
I, I kind of hit some of those high points already because
32:05
they're public information, right?
32:07
But, you know, and, and I think what I would have, I really
32:10
appreciate you sharing with me kind of your what's going on
32:13
with you privately. And so, you know, that gave me a
32:16
little bit more than just what I could find, you know, on the
32:19
Internet. Yeah, on the Internet, right?
32:22
Yeah, Yeah. And it's always good to connect
32:25
with people you know, Yeah, on a private basis, on a.
32:29
Heart level. On a heart level, Yeah, right.
32:30
Heart to heart basis, yeah. Yeah, cuz we're at the end of
32:33
the day, we're all humans and even I find that especially in
32:37
the US political climate and we're so on polarised at the end
32:45
of the day, everybody wants to make sure their families are
32:49
taken care of. Everybody wants to get paid well
32:52
for their work, everybody. And even though some people use,
32:55
you know, some abusive tactics to, to exclude others, it's
33:00
really all coming from that place, right.
33:02
So if we can, we can get to some kind of human.
33:07
I think you talked about this before the show of see each
33:11
other's humanity. We need more of that.
33:13
And I think we've forgotten how to disagree, right?
33:17
And that disagreeing does not necessarily mean that your
33:21
perspective is worthless, right? And that two things can be true
33:26
at the same time. My perspective and your
33:29
perspective can both be true, but we and 1 does not is not
33:34
mutually exclusive of the other, right?
33:37
Absolutely. Sometimes there are no right
33:39
answers and no wrong answers. Right, right.
33:41
But my experience is it's different.
33:44
We can we can go to a concert, we can go to the same concert
33:48
and have two very bit different experiences based.
33:52
On. Internal or external things?
33:55
You should watch episode 100 of my podcast OK Joanne Diaz.
34:01
It's on customer experience, customer service.
34:07
And then he said something along the same lines of what you're
34:10
saying, like two different people go to the same restaurant
34:15
and eat the same food, have the same service, but we'll come out
34:20
with different customer experiences, same customer
34:24
service, different customer experiences.
34:25
Why? Because human beings are
34:27
experiencing different emotions, different life circumstances at
34:32
the same time, right? So the experiences, it's all as
34:36
different. Showed up at the restaurant with
34:39
different like they showed up at the restaurant from a different
34:42
place. One person may have had a
34:44
terrible day, they're just got fired their their partner left
34:48
them right and another person may have gotten a promotion
34:51
right. So they're showing up before
34:54
they even experienced anything at the restaurant from a
34:57
completely different mental space which is now going to
35:01
colour their experience. Absolutely.
35:04
You know, one thing I appreciate about, you know, what you've
35:07
said previously is the fact that you are very, when I say gifted
35:13
at identifying patterns. And that's, that's a hallmark of
35:18
an analyst, you know, but we, we share a lot in common, you know,
35:23
as human beings. Unfortunately, the divider is
35:26
probably the gender. And I would, and I would say,
35:31
and I would say embrace. I think, I think people, I think
35:34
people would say, I think people would say of me like I
35:38
definitely learn more masculine. So.
35:43
I don't. I don't think I need anymore.
35:45
I think I'm good. Oh, probably man.
35:48
I don't, let me say. But you know some people.
35:51
Will say you're going to you're going to be cancelled.
35:53
I'm Sir, you better be careful. You are going to be cancelled.
35:58
Women are going to come for your neck.
35:59
Let let, let us cancel. Cancel.
36:01
Listen, I'm a big fan. I can get behind that movement.
36:05
Let us cancel cancel culture but.
36:07
I'm behind that I I want to cancel cancel.
36:09
Culture. All I got to say, OK, you are,
36:12
I'm a millennial. I guess you are Generation XX.
36:16
Yeah. Yeah, it's an X.
36:18
The generational wars or what's happening?
36:21
I feel like I'm the I'm the I'm the diplomat between X and Gen
36:26
Z. OK.
36:29
Yeah. Here's my thought.
36:32
I think I even think within millennials, there's two kinds
36:36
of millennials, right? There's the older millennials
36:38
that are, have a lot of Gen X in them, a lot of Gen X DNA, right?
36:45
And then there's the, the, the, the millennials that are closer
36:50
to the Xennials, right? So you've got 2 factions, right?
36:54
But what I have found is I don't know, you may personally be a
37:04
liaison, a bridge builder. I don't know that I would say
37:08
that your generation is a bridge builder.
37:12
My experience is that, and I'm not judging like this isn't a
37:17
judgement, this is just an observation.
37:19
Generation X was never allowed to focus or centre themselves.
37:26
I think the the things that we have lived through and they've
37:30
experienced gave it an opportunity and created a sense
37:36
of wealth was a big W right now, maybe not individual wealth, but
37:41
wealth with a big economic wealth that allowed millennials
37:45
to be hyper focused on themselves.
37:47
And what I don't think millennials understand are two
37:53
things on that because we may not have grown up in the
37:57
computer age that we don't have anything to offer, which is
38:04
wrong. Why?
38:06
Why so I'll give you an example. So I remember I had to learn
38:18
programming. That was my four way into like
38:24
technology. I did not see a computer until I
38:27
was 17. And the only reason why I saw a
38:30
computer at 17 is because my high school was on a college
38:34
campus. Only college campuses because
38:36
computers are still too expensive to like have at your
38:39
home, right? So large institutions, right?
38:42
So as a result, I learned to code.
38:45
In learning to code as a generation, many of us had to
38:48
learn. In a theoretical way.
38:51
You have a set of critical thinking skills that I often do
38:56
not see in millennials. The fact that millennials often
39:00
can't make change. Like if I give you a dot like
39:03
you say, hey, the bill is $22.00 and and eight cents.
39:07
Like I can make change in my head, right?
39:11
Many millennials cannot make change.
39:14
Like literally cannot make change, right?
39:16
No, not me. Right.
39:18
I'm like. OK, I guess I'm meet millennial.
39:22
By the way, I'm 33, born in 19. 90 You're in the middle, right?
39:25
So I'm right in the middle, you know?
39:27
Right. And what I find is even with
39:29
people that I hired to work for me, there has been a
39:34
generational loss of critical thinking, like how to think out
39:38
through a problem. How do you think?
39:40
That's actually true. That is true.
39:42
That is true. I've said this on the podcast
39:44
before that it's it's really sad that we are at the height of the
39:48
age of artificial intelligence, but we are also at the height of
39:51
the age of human foolishness. Yes, and and you can't like even
39:56
the natural evolution of solving a problem or even the act of
40:01
like, what might be the questions I need to ask to solve
40:04
this problem and being the presumption of like, well, I'm
40:07
not an expert. Well, like who's an expert?
40:10
Like who's an expert in life? No one is an expert in life.
40:12
Like ask the next natural question, but they actually
40:15
don't know what the next natural question is because the hyper
40:19
dependence on going to Google. The other side of that is that
40:23
Google. Has all the answers.
40:25
Google, even AI has a framework. It has a framework that still
40:30
needs inquiry. Right?
40:31
So I was literally on, I was on a call last night and I said
40:35
listen, AI still hallucinates. It is a high degree of
40:38
hallucination. You must critically analyse what
40:42
you received from AI because it is a high degree of
40:46
hallucination. Be careful.
40:48
Be careful how you talk about AI because you're.
40:51
Listen, I ask my AI please and thank you all the time.
40:54
The robots are going to be my friend.
40:57
Are you sure? OK.
40:59
Listen, my my robot, my robots are going to love me.
41:02
I'm very kind to my AI agent. If you say so, do do, do, do, do
41:07
you know? Do you know what my initials
41:09
are? Your initials?
41:13
The ones other than what's on your name?
41:14
Do you have other initials? So check OK my name is Attimola
41:20
first name, middle name is Ethim Emma and my initials are AI.
41:27
AIO. I, you know, I'll just tell
41:31
people. That's a stretch, my friend.
41:34
Be. Careful, be careful what you say
41:36
about AI, because I am AI, you know my parents are the studio
41:40
assignment, right? And of course, what AI are you
41:43
talking about? Of course, artificial
41:45
intelligence, you could be talking about a team or AC
41:47
member, or you could be talking about, wait for it, artificial
41:52
insemination. So.
41:55
Well, seeing that we that was not part of our previous
41:58
conversation, I don't think we're talking about that.
42:05
That was, you know, Many thanks to an Australian guest on my
42:08
show, Andy, Andy IDE. So he actually has this AI tool
42:14
for horses, right? And he sponsors the horse racing
42:18
in Australia. You know, he was like, be
42:20
careful what artificial, what AI you're always talking about
42:24
because it could be artificial in semination.
42:26
And of course, I've I've learned to use that, that line on, on
42:29
people like you that just keep using AIAIAI.
42:33
Are you talking about me? You said what AI gave you.
42:35
I did not give you anything. But that we weren't talking
42:38
about any of those things. We were talking about
42:41
technology. So the natural presumption would
42:43
be I'd be talking about artificial intelligence.
42:46
Why? Why are you presuming about me?
42:48
Because that's what we were talking about.
42:51
The previous sentence was about technology.
42:53
Literally this. Is a problem millennials have
42:58
with Jet X? No, you.
43:03
What you're saying is ridiculous.
43:05
It doesn't. Yes it is.
43:07
That is the aim to be ridiculous, right?
43:10
Of course it is going to be a joke.
43:12
We don't have time for this. We don't have time for this.
43:15
There's no. We do have time for that.
43:16
You know these, there's these. Are the generations but you all
43:19
you all don't understand. I think this is to your point.
43:22
This is the other difference, right?
43:24
Like we were, we were very brought up about time and place.
43:30
There is a time and place for everything.
43:31
It's in the Bible. There's a time and place for
43:33
everything. Let's go to Let's go to the
43:36
Bible. Let us go to the Bible.
43:38
Let me finish. Y'all, and I'm being hyperbolic
43:42
right? But you all believe that
43:44
anytime's a great time and it's not anytime's.
43:48
That, that is Ecclesiastes, right?
43:50
Yeah. That's the time for everything
43:52
under the sun. Yeah, I think Ecclesiastes.
43:54
Chapter 3 and you all think anytime is a great time and it's
43:57
like it's not the anytime is not a great time to have a
44:00
breakdown. Like we need you to schedule
44:02
your breakdown. OK.
44:03
We've scheduled our breakdown, so.
44:05
Like do you do? Do you want to know my favourite
44:09
Bible verse? Sure.
44:13
Do you really want to know it? Philippines Chapter.
44:16
Four, it's your show, so can you tell me whether you whether I
44:20
want to or not? Philippines Philippines Chapter
44:23
4 verse 13 I can do all things through crisis strengthens me.
44:28
Perfect. That fits.
44:30
That's on brand. Yeah.
44:32
And you know, talking about the logical reasoning you're talking
44:35
about, right, The problem solving skills.
44:37
I think I did tell you about the economy students conference that
44:41
I sponsored in Nigeria. And one of the main reasons why
44:45
I did that was to help the younger generation, apparently
44:51
the Gen Z, right, to improve their problem solving skills,
44:57
critical thinking, critical analysis, logical reasoning.
45:01
And you know, the solution mindset, you know, it goes back
45:05
to what you were complaining about.
45:07
That is a lot of people do not have a solution oriented mindset
45:12
in this age and time. You know, it's, it's sad, but
45:16
it's, it's, it's just a reality, right?
45:19
But you know, taking the generations downward, you are my
45:24
parents generation. My parents are Gen X, right?
45:27
We don't see eye to eye on so many things, right?
45:30
You guys are way more serious than us millennials.
45:33
And of course, you know I'm a meet millennial.
45:36
Right. I think there's two camps of Gen
45:38
Xers. I think they're the ones that
45:40
are super serious and I agree with you.
45:42
Yeah, I think you guys are way too serious.
45:44
Wait, I think I'm in the other camp, right?
45:47
No, no, you are my. Parents Camp.
45:49
You are my hold on so that there's another.
45:52
You're collaborators. I think there's another camp at
45:55
Gen Xers. They're just like millennials.
45:56
There's two camps. I think that there's two camps
45:59
with with Gen actors. I think they're the one.
46:01
I think also being there's a different context with
46:06
immigrants, right? If you are immigrating, you have
46:09
to be serious because it is a serious thing to go to a place
46:13
that is not your home. Absolutely, absolutely.
46:16
And go to a place that maybe doesn't want you there to go to
46:20
a place that you know is going to that is not set up for you to
46:25
be successful, right. So I think there's, there's that
46:30
piece of it. I think so.
46:32
So I, I want to, I want to give your parents grace because that
46:36
is a very different thing that I'm not sure it has anything to
46:39
do with generation, right. The other part of that is, and I
46:42
can only speak in an American context, right?
46:45
There are Gen Xers such as myself.
46:47
I think work is serious, but I can have fun at work, but work
46:51
is serious. But I also, I'm a fool.
46:54
Like my friends like know that like I just told somebody the
46:58
other day I said, you know, they're like, well, do you care
47:01
about this? And oh, well, I'm just worried
47:03
about this. I said, listen, I have no
47:04
pockets for the fucks. I don't have to give.
47:07
Like I don't have, I do not like, I don't care.
47:12
Like I don't care there. There's so many things.
47:16
I don't care what people think about me.
47:18
I don't care about people talking about me behind my back.
47:21
I don't care if you don't like me.
47:23
I don't care like right. So I think and, and, and part of
47:26
that was, you know, I saw this meme on Instagram, which I think
47:29
embodies, it's embodies sort of the Gen X.
47:32
It's like if you didn't like somebody, if you wanted to tell
47:35
somebody off, you couldn't just type in a type or in a, in a
47:38
keyboard and walk away. You had to call them on the
47:41
phone. You had to say what you wanted
47:43
to say and and. Organic conversations.
47:47
Organic conversations you. Know, right, you couldn't just
47:49
like like hide and run, right, like hide behind a keyboard and
47:53
never have to space that person again, right?
47:55
So if you wanted to cuss somebody out, you had to cuss
47:57
somebody out in their face, right?
47:59
There's a there's, there's a resilience that comes from
48:02
having right. Tell me to my faith.
48:05
Right. There's a resilience that comes
48:08
out of having to do that, having a regular habit of having to do
48:11
that, that I also. Confidence and character
48:14
building. Right.
48:16
So, so be able to and to not have someone else sway your
48:23
conviction, right? I find that millennials often
48:28
are easily, their convictions are easily swayed, right?
48:31
Really. How about Gen Z?
48:34
How about Gen? ZI think they're so emotionally
48:40
sensitive they can't even bring themselves to get that far to
48:44
what to think about right? We've, we've, we've sheltered
48:48
them from so much or they haven't had to experience.
48:52
They, they, they've been, they've been sheltered, right?
48:55
I mean, I think about, I think about the things that I have
48:58
seen in my lifetime. And that's not to say that it's
49:01
any better or worse than millennials or zennials, right?
49:04
I know personally for me, like I've been through multiple
49:08
devastating earthquakes. I have been through Mount Saint
49:13
Helens. I remember waking up as a young
49:16
person in California. So Mount Saint Helen was in
49:19
Washington. That's two states north of where
49:21
I lived and ash coming down and having our cars covered in ash
49:26
from a volcano that went off in a 2.
49:29
State. Right.
49:31
For weeks, ash falling on the cars, falling in the streets,
49:35
falling everywhere, being in major earthquakes were actually
49:38
where my high school was a a wall fell on a human being from
49:42
as a result of the earthquake. Wow, the Sylmar earthquake,
49:49
which was a huge earthquake that happened when I was like 3 years
49:52
old, four years old then having this watching on television,
49:56
live television. The space shuttle blowing up as
49:58
like 1/3 grader, right? Very similar to the young people
50:01
who had to watch 911. But we watched the difference
50:04
between 9/11 is you saw footage. We saw the spaceship explode in
50:10
real time because every school had it on to watch the space
50:14
shuttle go up. We literally watched it happen
50:17
in real time. That's crazy, right?
50:20
Then we have, you know, obviously 9 like we've just had
50:25
to see an experience a lot of things in an era where
50:30
expressing feelings is not OK. Your generation, it was like all
50:34
about express yourself, tell how you're feeling.
50:37
We weren't, we weren't allowed to have feelings even when you
50:40
go into the workplace, right? Like feelings were not a thing.
50:43
No one gave a shit about your feelings, even your parents.
50:47
I don't know if it's a good thing.
50:49
I think everything and I think, right, Right.
50:51
Exactly. And I don't know that that's
50:52
good, right? Because it always like I think
50:54
about our, our feelings and our trauma is like a balloon.
50:57
So what happens if you have a balloon and you squeeze it,
51:00
right? It pops out on another way.
51:02
So it never goes away, right? But something is going to happen
51:06
that's going to squeeze it and it's going to pop out sideways,
51:09
right. So I don't know that we did it
51:11
right either. I'm not, I'm not saying that Gen
51:14
X has figured it out, but I think there needs to be a
51:17
healthier balance. Like I'll give you, I'll tell
51:20
you another thing like a healthier balance.
51:23
Well, I don't know if you guys have got it figured out either,
51:25
but here's what I will say. I will just tell you going back
51:29
to your point about my generation being serious, like,
51:32
so I joke, but I'm not joking. So I tell, I tell, I tell my, I
51:36
tell my colleagues, especially colleagues that are responsible
51:40
for hiring. I say, listen, you know what?
51:42
I, I want to tell people who I hire or people who work in my
51:45
office, you know, your generations, like I want to
51:47
bring my whole self to work. I said, I don't want your whole
51:50
self to work. And I said, I guarantee you, you
51:52
don't want me to bring my whole self to work because me bringing
51:55
my whole self to work, I'm going to hurt all your feelings.
51:57
I'm going to hope I'm going to hurt every single one of your
52:00
feelings. So you don't want me to bring my
52:01
whole self to work. And I don't want you to bring
52:03
your whole self to work. I want you to bring the part to,
52:06
to, I want you to bring the parts of yourself to work that
52:09
want to work. That's it.
52:12
I don't want the other part. You see millennials, millennials
52:16
are the best, you know, of course, you know, for me, I
52:20
strongly believe in balance, you know, do not be extreme.
52:24
It's just like the pH to be. Extreme.
52:27
Yeah, it's it's like the pH go, don't be too acidic, don't be
52:30
too alkaline. Find a place in the middle.
52:33
I remember when I joined PwC in 2018, my very first formal
52:39
meeting. I think during the training or
52:41
something, you know, accountants in your generation always had to
52:45
put on a suit and a tie. I do wear panties.
52:49
I hate, I hate ties. And I remember I was thinking
52:53
about it like, well, I have to work with an accountant firm
52:56
now. I need to force myself to stop
52:58
putting on the ties. And the first day they say that
53:02
ties are no longer compulsory. I was so happy.
53:05
I was happy. But, but here's but can I share
53:08
something with you? I want to share something with
53:10
you. What I find with your generation
53:16
is that there's no appreciation of what had to happen to get
53:20
there, right? What?
53:21
Happened unfortunately. People like me appreciate it.
53:25
Of course there are people that are pace setters, right?
53:29
Setters, pathfinders. And that is, you know, not even
53:32
your generation, the baby boomers.
53:34
Yeah, it's like, I mean, like I said, I had to wear pantyhose.
53:37
Women had to wear pantyhose, you know, awful pant there.
53:40
It's far worse than a tie. Just think about you're having
53:43
to wear something and your genitals are in this very tight
53:49
cavern all day long, right. So the young women who come in
53:57
to my, you know, who come into the workplace And it was like,
54:00
do you understand? Like, what had to happen for you
54:04
to now show up without a bra at work, which I don't want to see.
54:10
I mean, yeah, so. So some, some people take it too
54:13
far now. Now you're giving, Now you're
54:18
giving me trauma. Now you are giving me your legit
54:22
legitimately trigger. Warning Trigger warning Trigger
54:24
warning. Why?
54:29
Why you're giving me trauma? Like I have seen things in my
54:32
days. Like, that's why I tell people I
54:35
feel like I'm in a sweet sport. I'm not too old and I'm not too
54:38
young. Like I'm just, you know, in the
54:41
middle. Yeah, I clocked 33 in April and
54:44
I said wow, Jesus Christ, you know, finished this mission at
54:48
the age of 33, and I feel I just started my own mission at 33.
54:52
Well, you need that foundation, right?
54:54
You needed the foundation. And now you've been given,
54:57
you've been giving, given the kit, and now you should be able
55:00
to go forth and prosper, right? So yeah.
55:03
Amen. Amen to that.
55:05
Some people go too far. I have, I'm not gonna mention
55:08
the workplace, but I've been in a workplace where, you know,
55:11
they were encouraging business casual, you know, dress for your
55:15
day, be free, be comfortable. And I never.
55:19
Never. So I saw at some point setting
55:22
individuals putting on sleepers and you know.
55:27
Absolutely not. You know what?
55:28
I. Told the workplace I'm.
55:29
Not. It's it's not acceptable.
55:31
I tell people who come to work for me, I say, listen,
55:34
colonisation is real and it's in in effect here in this office.
55:38
The patriarchy is real, and it's at work in this office.
55:42
Oh and as I I say here, colonise modern day coloniser.
55:48
I'm like because I I I people to your point take it too far and
55:54
so I said it should not matter you it.
55:58
If that bothers you then this isn't the place for you to work.
56:02
If wearing a bra is a problem then this is not a place for you
56:06
work. You have the freedom to choose
56:08
where you work 100% and you should be able to go to work
56:12
without a bra on. It just won't be here.
56:15
I absolutely believe that you should be able to go to work
56:17
without a bra. It just won't be here.
56:19
I absolutely believe if you want to come wear sleepers to work,
56:22
you should absolutely be able to do that.
56:24
It just won't be here. And you don't get to tell me how
56:28
what a terrible person I am because I'm dictating how I want
56:31
you to address that represents me.
56:34
So I think this is where good cop, bad cop works.
56:39
I feel like yourself and myself, if we, you know, had a company
56:43
together, we'll do well because you, you are the bad cop.
56:47
And of course, I'm the good cop. So we have different approaches.
56:50
So I left the big four accounting firms as an assistant
56:54
manager, and I think that's the most difficult job.
56:59
Middle management is horrible I feel like.
57:01
Management is. Horrible.
57:02
Bad for middle managers. It's a horrible.
57:04
It's it's horrible. It's horrible because you have
57:10
to be essentially a people pleaser and I am, well, you.
57:14
Have to do all The Dirty work that management doesn't want to
57:16
do. Then you're going to take all
57:18
the crap. From the employees.
57:19
Yes, exactly right. And you need to coordinate them
57:23
efficiently, keyword efficiently.
57:26
So for me it's horrible in terms in terms of my management style
57:30
if I had somebody doing that basically I, I lead by example.
57:37
I love, I love collaborative leadership and I would I say
57:44
promote setiveness over aggressiveness, right?
57:48
So basically I'll tell you, you're a professional and you
57:53
have professional code of ethics, right?
57:57
Part of your code of ethics is professional behaviour, right?
58:01
You have to express professionalism.
58:03
Like I respect you and I appreciate how far you've come
58:07
in your carpier and you know, you should actually hold
58:11
yourself to set in, you know, a standard and this is beneath
58:18
you, this is below you. You shouldn't do this, right?
58:20
So you should respect yourself and you know, respect what you
58:24
stand for. You should actually do better
58:26
because you know, much is very much expected of you because you
58:30
have got great potentials and you shouldn't do this to
58:33
yourself. So that way people feel more
58:36
respected and like, oh, they're holding me to.
58:39
I agree with you, but I think there's two different contexts.
58:42
One, you're coming at it from a manager perspective, I'm coming
58:45
at it from ACEO perspective. Yeah, from, from.
58:47
My company, right, I'm, I'm, I'm the CEO, but but I also find
58:53
that and I think it's different in a corporate setting.
58:55
Like I think you can say what you just said and it lands.
58:59
I think anything outside of a corporate setting, what I have
59:02
found, what my experience has been and my colleagues have
59:05
experienced, it's like they don't even know what
59:07
professional is like their notion of professional.
59:11
They think, they think what they're doing is professional.
59:15
And then and you and, and, and it's, and it might be if you're
59:19
a startup, if you're working at Google, yes, you can come in
59:21
flip flops. This is not Google.
59:23
And particularly if you're working for a woman of colour,
59:25
right? I don't have the luxury to come
59:27
into a meeting with my sleeper on, right?
59:31
Otherwise all of this goes away. There won't be any paychecks for
59:34
anybody. And understanding who you work
59:36
for and how you are representing them in the context of which
59:41
you're representing them, right? So working for a black woman in
59:44
AUS context, working in finance, yes, the bar is higher and the
59:49
expectation is different than if we are doing a black woman owned
59:53
startup, right? Those are two completely
59:55
different context and I need you to understand that and make a
59:59
choice if do you want to do that.
1:00:01
Because if you don't want to do that, that is fine.
1:00:03
That is a choice. I am not here to take away a
1:00:05
choice. But if you don't want to do
1:00:07
that, then this is not the place for you.
1:00:09
No matter how much you love the job, no matter how much you love
1:00:12
working for me, no matter how much you anticipate learning
1:00:14
from me, I need you to show up in this way.
1:00:17
Because it is my reputation on the line and I don't get a
1:00:21
second bite at the apple. And if you can't understand that
1:00:23
because you're placing yourself in the centre, then you there is
1:00:27
not a place for you to work here.
1:00:30
That does that. That never works with Gen Z.
1:00:35
No, and that's and. I've worked.
1:00:36
I've worked with a lot of them. And no.
1:00:38
And, and that's and that's the thing.
1:00:40
But here's the thing that I tell Gen Z right now, in this moment,
1:00:44
unless you are going to start your own business, you are going
1:00:46
to work for a Gen Xer. So you can either get on board
1:00:50
or start your own business, which is fine, right?
1:00:52
Or work for another Gen ZR or work for an work for a
1:00:55
millennial. Because here's the thing, I
1:00:57
don't. They they they work with
1:00:59
millennials like me. And, and that's fine, right?
1:01:02
And that, and I, that's why I say, and like I said, if you're
1:01:04
not willing to come up to this standard, because also here's
1:01:07
the thing, the stakes are higher for me.
1:01:08
I don't have another 20 years to make up for a mistake that you
1:01:12
made. Right, exactly.
1:01:14
I don't have that timeline, so This is why I understand there.
1:01:17
I feel like there's no understanding.
1:01:19
Well, while Gen Xers, maybe I will say this, I don't think Gen
1:01:24
Axers like baby boomers any more than than millennials or
1:01:28
Zennials like us. And that's fine.
1:01:29
I think that's a regular natural progression.
1:01:32
So I think that every generation has issues with the generations
1:01:35
before I said, but I think the difference that I've
1:01:38
experienced, once again, I'm only going to speak from my
1:01:40
experience. The difference is while we,
1:01:43
while Gen Xers may not have liked Baby boomers and their
1:01:46
theories and then their constructs, we understood it and
1:01:50
respected it. What I find is these next two
1:01:53
generations don't respect us. And that to me is all the
1:01:58
difference. We don't have to agree, but I
1:02:00
need you to respect the shit that I've gone through for you
1:02:03
to be able to sit here and be able to say that I want to show
1:02:06
up to work with my whole self, right?
1:02:09
That's where I find, it's been in my experience, the breakdown
1:02:13
between and the difference between the relationship that
1:02:16
Gen Xers have with baby boomers and the relationship that Gen
1:02:19
Xers have with the the generations that are coming
1:02:22
after us. And with that, I've got to go.
1:02:27
OK, so when are we scheduling in Part 2 for the class we have, we
1:02:32
have well. I want to finish conversations
1:02:34
because they they may not want the Part 2, we might want the
1:02:36
Part 2, but does your audience want the Part 2?
1:02:39
Absolutely, absolutely. Before, before I let you go, I
1:02:42
have this very important question that's been on my mind.
1:02:45
You know, you're good, you're good with pattern recognition,
1:02:49
right? And it's something, you know, we
1:02:52
both have in common. That's why we are both I would
1:02:55
say great. I what would you and me being a
1:03:01
millennial, a meet millennial. I have a lot to learn from
1:03:06
yourself in particular and your generation.
1:03:09
And like I said, and I always say, kindness, respect and
1:03:14
hospitality are my own core values.
1:03:16
So I'm very, very respectful, very because of respect.
1:03:19
But I always try to, you know, achieve that balance.
1:03:22
I work with the Gen C's, right? And I'm a young CEO.
1:03:25
And it's, it's not easy paving that pathway because you need to
1:03:29
find dynamic ways to motivate, you know, the younger
1:03:33
generation. And I believe in incentivizing
1:03:35
people because people, you know, like I said, self preservation
1:03:41
is what is a need for people. If you see, if you let people
1:03:44
know what is an E for them, they will push themselves, right?
1:03:48
You know, and you keep moving at the bar.
1:03:50
But from your experience, what would you say is the common
1:03:55
denominator? You know, you have worked with
1:03:57
Fortune 500 companies, accelerated over 400 companies.
1:04:02
What's a common denominator when it comes to the companies that
1:04:05
make it and the companies that have potential but do not
1:04:10
achieve that potential? Because potential doesn't
1:04:13
necessarily equal to credential, right?
1:04:16
Credential is evidence based or potential might not much
1:04:21
realise. So what's the common denominator
1:04:26
between? So a couple of guys that make
1:04:28
it, Yeah. So a couple of things.
1:04:30
One, and we've talked about, we've intimated about some of
1:04:33
these during our conversation. So one, I think humility,
1:04:37
humility of receiving criticism and taking a step back and be
1:04:42
like, I don't know if I believe that, but I'm gonna take that in
1:04:46
and I'm going to let that marinate for a while.
1:04:49
Now, you might still come back and say like, no, I don't
1:04:51
believe that. But the fact that you, you take
1:04:54
a step back and be like, I'm going to let that sit.
1:04:56
So I think humility is a huge thing.
1:04:59
And I don't mean humility to the point of view, capitulate.
1:05:02
I don't mean humility to the point of view, Put yourself
1:05:05
last, but humility in. I don't have all the answers.
1:05:10
There are smarter people than me and let me connect with those
1:05:12
people. Humility and the fact that I
1:05:15
have something to learn from. I have something to learn from
1:05:19
other people, even my employees, right?
1:05:22
That just because I'm in a position of power, just because
1:05:25
I'm in a position of power doesn't mean that I am the
1:05:28
default expert. The other thing that I will say
1:05:30
is tenacity, right? Going forward despite fear, So
1:05:35
courage, right? Tenacity and courage of like,
1:05:37
even though I'm afraid, even though I'm not sure I don't have
1:05:40
all the answers or how this is going to work out.
1:05:42
Tenacity and courage of moving forward and walking forward
1:05:46
despite fear, right? I think the third thing is
1:05:52
understanding the math. And when I say the math, it's
1:05:55
not always financial. It could be qualitative, it
1:05:58
could be quantitative. And so I include relationships,
1:06:01
understanding the math of relationships, knowing when you
1:06:03
need to walk away and not saying that not walking away doesn't
1:06:07
mean that that person's a bad person, but that person is not
1:06:10
aligned with the situation or the goals that you're working
1:06:13
towards. And yeah, so I mean, I there's I
1:06:15
could, I could talk infinitum about this, but I think those
1:06:18
are those are some of the things that I have seen of
1:06:21
understanding the math of the financials, whatever the
1:06:23
situation where it's personal financials, financials, the
1:06:25
business financials, but also the math of a leadership, the
1:06:28
math of relationships and being able to have some critical
1:06:33
analysis to be able to make quick relatively low information
1:06:36
decisions to be able to propel you forward.
1:06:41
I very, very much appreciate what you said, and I would need
1:06:45
to compel the directors in my company to watch this.
1:06:49
Of course, I think what you've absolutely said actually
1:06:53
describes me as a person. But I, they say never Judaics in
1:06:58
courses. Well, that is a Latin expression
1:07:00
in lore that man cannot be a judge in his own case.
1:07:04
So I will push this to my directors.
1:07:06
They need to watch this because in my head I think this is my
1:07:10
philosophy. And that's what I leave as you
1:07:12
know, as ACEO. And for me to you, it's it's
1:07:15
love and absolute respect. To you, they say gratitude is
1:07:19
good attitude. I'm very, very grateful to have
1:07:22
you. I'm grateful to have been here.
1:07:24
I've got a joke. Go.
1:07:25
I've got to leave for my next. Call, but goodbye.
1:07:28
And of course. See you see your Part 2.
1:07:30
OK.