Latest / Heroes Behind the Badge / Inside the Crisis Facing America’s Police Leadership: Steven Sund Breaks It Down (Part 1)

Transcript

Inside the Crisis Facing America’s Police Leadership: Steven Sund Breaks It Down (Part 1) · Heroes Behind the Badge

• 0:00
  I can tell you a absolutely as soon as you start saying it, because
• 0:03
  it was the time I felt like I had a shockwave go through my body.
• 0:06
  I'm sitting in a chair at the command center.
• 0:08
  I'm at the front of this, large command center.
• 0:10
  We have video screens up on the front.
• 0:12
  I'm at a U-shaped desk.
• 0:14
  I'm watching all the video screens, at, the front.
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  It's probably about 1253.
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  The, riot began and I saw my officers quickly being overpowered.
• 0:24
  picked up the phone, called, you know what?
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  Luckily, first call was the MPD and they sent me some assistance right away.
• 0:29
  But by law, I have to get permission to bring in, federal resources and
• 0:33
  resources for my men and women.
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  So I called the Capitol Police Board, which I'm still by law, even in
• 0:38
  emergency, I have to get, permission, called speaker Pelosi, Sergeant At Arms.
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  He, and he had permit, he had the ability to give me permission, but he wouldn't.
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  He wanted to run it up the chain.
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  I couldn't believe it.
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  I've got liaisons from the Capitol Police Board sitting right behind me
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  watching the same thing I'm watching.
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  I can't get permission to bring in any federal resources from my officers
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  watching them being, beaten, struck, protesters, running past them.
• 1:05
  I call the Senate Sergeant At Arms and I get denied again repeatedly.
• 1:19
  Before January 6th, 2021, Steven Sund spent 30 years preparing for
• 1:25
  the worst days in American history.
• 1:27
  This conversation begins before the moment that defined him along with many others,
• 1:31
  and ends where his authority disappeared.
• 1:34
  I've been thinking.
• 1:36
  That a lot of the guests, Steve, that we have on Heroes Behind the Badge,
• 1:41
  they are known for that one day.
• 1:45
  I think we talked about that in previous interviews.
• 1:47
  Oh, yeah.
• 1:48
  Steve Sund, he's that January 6th guy, and I've always felt that's not
• 1:53
  totally fair, because in your case.
• 1:58
  There's a 30 year career that very few people could ever endure.
• 2:02
  policing in DC as we've talked, is like nothing else in the world.
• 2:07
  That is a unique policing situation.
• 2:09
  You were chasing kidnappers, homicide offenders, cop killers for years.
• 2:14
  You helped plan 30.
• 2:16
  Special national security events, 30, including five, inaugurations.
• 2:22
  And on September 11th, you were asked to go to the White House to consult
• 2:26
  with the White House in Secret Service to coordinate a response for 9/11.
• 2:32
  you worked alongside Secret Service for years.
• 2:35
  every living president you have helped protect.
• 2:41
  You you've had barricade situations, you know all the things that real cops do.
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  You had all that, and sometimes that gets lost and I don't
• 2:48
  want that to get lost today.
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  the hostage rescues, the standoffs, responded to the active shooter, like the
• 2:56
  congressional shooting situation at the na at, the baseball field, the navy yard.
• 3:02
  So today I wanna talk a little bit about the man behind the badge.
• 3:07
  It's about what actually happened in your time in the complicated
• 3:12
  policing atmosphere of Washington dc trying to stand between order
• 3:17
  and chaos, but all the time in Washington dc the history is watching.
• 3:23
  History is watching, so I thought I'd ask you.
• 3:28
  one particular question and,
• 3:33
  as, history tries to reduce your career, your reputation to a single day.
• 3:41
  Okay.
• 3:42
  What do you wish that people understood about the real man behind the badge?
• 3:47
  So I'll, take this, before I go into my personal story, I think you have
• 3:52
  what, 879,000 police officers out there.
• 3:56
  Yes.
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  These are men and women that have raised the right hand sworn an oath.
• 4:00
  my story is gonna be just one of those, and when you think about it, I was just,
• 4:04
  I was just thinking about what you went over and picturing a lot of the things
• 4:07
  that I've, I had been involved with and, it's been an incredible career.
• 4:10
  But, every police officer's gonna have just incredible
• 4:13
  stories that they're gonna.
• 4:14
  That they're gonna have with them, they're gonna go home.
• 4:16
  And ultimately, when you think about it, you go back and, when we're long gone,
• 4:20
  and people are looking back on it, what, will they remember of, the individuals.
• 4:26
  and for me it's, my personal, everybody becomes a police officer for different
• 4:30
  reasons, but for me it was a lot of.
• 4:32
  Just personal satisfaction, and a lot of personal satisfaction
• 4:35
  that I've gotten out of it.
• 4:37
  for me, when I, look back and I run into people now, and it's
• 4:40
  really interesting 'cause you had mentioned that, oh, you're, that guy.
• 4:44
  there were so many times that right after January 6th, first, year,
• 4:49
  and a half, you'd run into people and as soon as they found out,
• 4:52
  you get this funny look like, oh.
• 4:54
  Yeah, you're him and men, the pop, conversation would change.
• 4:57
  Yeah.
• 4:57
  That has taken a 180 degree change with me.
• 5:01
  Which is really interesting.
• 5:03
  I have people go, oh wow.
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  Hey, I've heard about you.
• 5:05
  you're that guy.
• 5:06
  Wow.
• 5:07
  Tell me you are that.
• 5:07
  Tell me what it was really like.
• 5:09
  and it's just a complete difference.
• 5:11
  there was times I was sitting in this exact chair, think
• 5:14
  about it, we're five years now.
• 5:18
  Four years, four years ago, and it was pretty damn dark.
• 5:21
  I'd lost friends.
• 5:23
  I was trying to figure out what's, what's going on.
• 5:24
  I'm, putting this after action together and, trying to figure out what happened.
• 5:29
  never thought I'd get to the point where we are now complete, like I
• 5:32
  said, 180 and change, where, now I'm being, asked to speak on, crime, Around
• 5:39
  the United States crime globally.
• 5:40
  I just, interviewed on the, Bondi Beach.
• 5:44
  Oh yeah.
• 5:46
  the, you have the terrorist attacks, taking place over overseas are
• 5:49
  some of the Christmas markets.
• 5:51
  so it's taking the, that experience that you just talked
• 5:54
  about and now relating it to.
• 5:56
  To bigger issues.
• 5:58
  I was just involved in the, US Saudi Investment Forum,
• 6:01
  2025 at the Kennedy Center.
• 6:03
  November asked to do a security plan for part of the, the,
• 6:07
  event, which was, something else.
• 6:09
  Wow.
• 6:10
  it's, so you're seeing people now bypassed.
• 6:14
  That guy from January 6th, and now they realize what happened.
• 6:18
  They realize the efforts you took and they're like, Hey, that's the guy we want.
• 6:21
  That's so it's changed.
• 6:23
  So what do I want, people to, to take away Yeah.
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  Is, a, real understanding of what happened.
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  Take the time, research it.
• 6:31
  Don't believe one side or the other.
• 6:33
  Whatever I tell you, go back.
• 6:34
  Research what I'm telling you.
• 6:37
  do your research and make a critical decision.
• 6:40
  Make a informed decision on, what you're finding out.
• 6:43
  Now, I tell this to students nowadays when I talk to, classes.
• 6:46
  it's important that people learn, how to think critically because.
• 6:50
  Honestly, too many people pay attention to, social media and make a decision
• 6:54
  on social media without analyzing the information they're getting.
• 6:57
  Yeah.
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  And then they jump to these conclusions that just, you know,
• 7:00
  in increases the division we're dealing with in the country.
• 7:02
  wow.
• 7:03
  Ultimately, study the facts and, let the facts speak for themselves.
• 7:07
  and that's enough for me.
• 7:08
  That's a great answer.
• 7:09
  Yeah.
• 7:10
  Is there any part of your career, as you look back on your highly successful
• 7:14
  career, is there any part of the career that really stays with you?
• 7:19
  That, when the noise finally quiets down, everything settles down, is there
• 7:24
  any one or two things that you can point to and say, yeah, that defined me.
• 7:29
  Wow, that, defined me.
• 7:30
  The, I'll tell you the call from the White House, we had
• 7:34
  the, first plane hit on, 9/11.
• 7:37
  Yeah.
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  I got a call to remember Steve Woodard.
• 7:38
  sad to say that, a special agent passed, away.
• 7:41
  Yeah.
• 7:42
  and then we're on the phone when the second plane hit and that's
• 7:44
  when they called me down, to go to their emergency operations center.
• 7:48
  that is something I'd always, I'll always, take with me and remember.
• 7:53
  That's something.
• 7:54
  But it's interesting and, probably every cop has this, where you
• 7:56
  drive through the area that you.
• 7:58
  Been assigned to your career and you drive through and you look, go, Hey, that
• 8:01
  happened here, or that happened here.
• 8:03
  We had, I don't know if you guys remember years ago, we had a guy that
• 8:05
  drove a tractor into Washington DC yes.
• 8:08
  Into reflecting Pond.
• 8:11
  And held DC downtown DC literally 150 yards from the White
• 8:16
  House hostage for three days.
• 8:18
  Yes, I remember that.
• 8:19
  yeah, we were involved with that with Park Police.
• 8:21
  it was my, my SWAT team when I was working with Park Police, trying to,
• 8:24
  work a, a. Peaceful resolution to that, which we ultimately did, but
• 8:29
  I couldn't believe morning, after morning waking up and going, wow,
• 8:31
  we're still dealing with tractor guy.
• 8:33
  so there's just different areas I look at as I drive through the city, whether
• 8:36
  it's Anacostia, whether it's Martin Luther King Avenue, whether it's, 46, 46 place.
• 8:41
  Wow.
• 8:42
  That what a fun place where you just remember, as you're going
• 8:46
  through, you remember the Chases, you remember the shootings.
• 8:48
  And so it's just interesting stuff.
• 8:50
  But there's a number of things I'll always think about.
• 8:52
  Right after January 6th, the first, year and a half, you'd run into people and
• 8:57
  as soon as they found out you get this funny look like, oh yeah, you're him
• 9:01
  and the pop, conversation would change.
• 9:03
  Yeah.
• 9:03
  That has taken a 180 degree change with me, which is really interesting.
• 9:09
  I have people go, oh wow.
• 9:10
  Hey, I've heard about you.
• 9:11
  You're, that guy.
• 9:12
  Wow.
• 9:12
  Tell me you're that guy.
• 9:13
  Tell me what it was really like.
• 9:15
  and it's just a complete difference.
• 9:17
  there was times I was sitting in this exact chair.
• 9:20
  think about it, we're five years now, four years, four years ago,
• 9:25
  and it was pretty damn dark.
• 9:27
  I'd lost friends.
• 9:29
  I was trying to figure out what's, what's going on.
• 9:30
  I'm, putting this after action together and, trying to figure out what happened.
• 9:35
  Never, thought I'd get to the, point where, we are now complete, like I
• 9:38
  said, 180 degree change, where, now I'm being, asked to speak on, crime,
• 9:45
  Around the United States crime globally.
• 9:46
  I was just, interviewed on the Bondi Beach, soul.
• 9:51
  Oh yeah.
• 9:52
  the, you have the terrorist attacks, taking place over overseas are
• 9:55
  some of the Christmas markets.
• 9:57
  so it's taking the, that experience that you just talked
• 10:00
  about and now relating it to.
• 10:02
  To bigger issues.
• 10:04
  I was just involved in the, US Saudi Investment Forum,
• 10:07
  2025 at the Kennedy Center.
• 10:09
  November asked to do a security plan for part of the, the,
• 10:13
  event, which was, something else.
• 10:15
  Wow.
• 10:16
  it's, so you're seeing people now bypassed.
• 10:20
  That guy from January 6th, and now they realize what happened.
• 10:24
  They realize the efforts you took and they're like, Hey, that's the guy we want.
• 10:27
  Hey Steve.
• 10:28
  we're doing this interview right around the five year anniversary of January
• 10:34
  6th, 2021, the riot at the Capitol.
• 10:38
  You were chief of police on that day, and you've written a book and
• 10:42
  I, want our audience to understand that this is the definitive.
• 10:46
  piece of work.
• 10:47
  If you wanna know what really happened on January 6th, what
• 10:51
  led up to it, the aftermath.
• 10:54
  all the good things that happened that day, the heroism of, the Capitol police
• 10:59
  and, other jurisdictions, and how they were able to protect the capitol and
• 11:03
  prevent, any member of Congress or staff from being, injured or killed.
• 11:09
  and I wanna get that out there.
• 11:10
  First of all, because we're not gonna be able to cover
• 11:13
  all the details in this book.
• 11:14
  We've already interviewed you in a great three-part series a year ago.
• 11:19
  About what happened on January 6th, and we talked about your book, but, in hindsight,
• 11:24
  okay, here we are five years later.
• 11:26
  I'd like you to just, reflect on January 6th, the lead up, the aftermath.
• 11:32
  What was your toughest challenge, the toughest moment
• 11:36
  that you faced on January 6th?
• 11:39
  And then we'll talk about, some of the mistakes that were made in some
• 11:43
  of the, lessons that we've learned.
• 11:45
  What you've heard so far isn't the riot.
• 11:47
  It's the moments before authority mattered most and failed to arrive.
• 11:51
  In the next episode, we step back into the command center and ask the
• 11:55
  question that still haunts this story, what happens when leaders are held
• 12:00
  responsible but denied the power to act.