Latest / EGGS! The Podcast / Eggs 461: The Blueprint for Becoming an 8-Figure Course Creator with Justin Montgomery

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Eggs 461: The Blueprint for Becoming an 8-Figure Course Creator with Justin Montgomery · EGGS! The Podcast

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  And now back to the show. Hey everybody, welcome back to
• 1:55
  eggs the podcast. Today's special guest is Justin
• 1:57
  Montgomery. Justin, welcome to the show.
• 1:58
  How are you, man? I'm.
• 1:59
  Good man, thanks for having me on.
• 2:01
  Here. Absolutely thrilled to death to
• 2:03
  have you here, and I think you've got a really good topic.
• 2:04
  It's going to be a lot of fun. Let's start, I guess, kind of at
• 2:08
  the beginning. Let's talk a little bit about
• 2:09
  who you are, what you do, and how we got to where we are
• 2:11
  today. Sure.
• 2:13
  Yeah, My name is Justin. I kind of a serial entrepreneur,
• 2:16
  sure. Like what a lot of your guests
• 2:18
  are, you know, kind of just grew up poor and decided I wanted
• 2:22
  something different, you know, like a lot of other
• 2:24
  entrepreneurs too, you know, just kind of had that, that
• 2:28
  spark, that motivation to do something and break out of that,
• 2:31
  that cycle. So anyways, I went to school, I
• 2:34
  got a master's degree. I ended up becoming a nurse
• 2:36
  practitioner. For some people who might not
• 2:39
  know what a nurse practitioner is, it's kind of in between a
• 2:40
  registered nurse and a doctor basically.
• 2:42
  Like I can diagnose, I can prescribe medication, I can
• 2:45
  order tests, I can essentially function like a doctor in a lot
• 2:49
  of states. And so I became a nurse
• 2:51
  practitioner, did OK doing that, you know, making $150,000 a year
• 2:55
  kind of thing. But but I realized that it was
• 2:59
  still a job, you know, like it's still just a job.
• 3:03
  I'm still kind of just stuck in that time for money trap.
• 3:05
  And about five years into my career, I just realized that I
• 3:09
  needed to do something else. So I wanted to truly build some
• 3:12
  wealth. I mean, you know, I could pick
• 3:14
  up extra shifts in the emergency department and keep doing stuff
• 3:17
  like that and make an extra 1000 bucks here or there.
• 3:19
  But still, that's not building wealth, you know?
• 3:23
  And so I decided to start my own practice, my own medical
• 3:26
  practice, started a couple clinics, mostly men's health
• 3:29
  clinics where we did testosterone replacement therapy
• 3:32
  and that sort of stuff and started a few men's health
• 3:34
  clinics, grew those, scaled. Those started a telemedicine
• 3:38
  practice that I ended up selling kind of during the during COVID
• 3:42
  when, you know, everyone was kind of moving to more of the
• 3:44
  digital space sort of a thing. So I started a telemedicine
• 3:46
  practice, a hormone replacement therapy, telemedicine practice
• 3:49
  grew that scaled, that sold it and end up selling my men's
• 3:54
  health clinics as well. And during this time period as
• 3:58
  well, I started a business which is what would basically build my
• 4:01
  8 figure net worth. I mean, I was doing OK with the
• 4:04
  medical practices, but it still wasn't like real significant
• 4:08
  wealth. I mean, I was, I was, I was
• 4:09
  building wealth, but not significant 7-8 figure wealth.
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  And so I started a business called the Elite Nurse
• 4:15
  Practitioner, which is an online continued education course
• 4:17
  business. And through that business I
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  taught medical providers. So nurse practitioners, doctors,
• 4:24
  physicians assistants, chiropractors, etcetera.
• 4:27
  I would teach them how to start their own medical practice.
• 4:30
  So I basically took what I knew what I was doing and I just
• 4:33
  turned that into an education business, teaching people how to
• 4:35
  do it 'cause I mean, I just, I was doing it over a few, you
• 4:37
  know, a few years. And so I started that in
• 4:40
  basically 2020 and my first course sold like 50,000 bucks in
• 4:46
  seven days. And I was just like, holy shit,
• 4:48
  like this is real money. Like that's real money, you know
• 4:52
  what I mean? And so I just doubled down on
• 4:54
  that. And yeah, 2-3 years later,
• 4:57
  business was, you know, evaluated at 8 figures and
• 5:01
  essentially allowed me to retire before the age of 40.
• 5:03
  I love that. Well, let's talk a little bit
• 5:05
  about just deciding to make the decision to monetize your
• 5:08
  expertise, right? And like when was the right time
• 5:10
  for you? Because there's a lot of people
• 5:11
  that, I mean, obviously if you're a solopreneur or even an
• 5:14
  established entrepreneur, you know, you've done a lot of
• 5:17
  things. And I guess even if you're not
• 5:19
  an entrepreneur, maybe you've done a lot of things that might
• 5:20
  be really good or useful for people.
• 5:23
  You obviously took, you know, what was specifically your
• 5:25
  wheelhouse and this was the thing we've been doing and, and
• 5:28
  translated that into coursework that people could then buy.
• 5:31
  But let's talk a little bit about just sort of, I mean, that
• 5:34
  first inkling where you went, you know what, maybe this should
• 5:36
  be a course. Like you know, how did you even,
• 5:38
  I guess maybe it's a a confidence thing or a self
• 5:41
  esteem thing, but when were you comfortable enough with your
• 5:43
  knowledge to be able to go forward with it as a course?
• 5:46
  Well, I started the business originally.
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  It wasn't even really a business.
• 5:50
  I started it as a blog. And so I would just write
• 5:53
  articles about, you know, the state of healthcare and things
• 5:57
  like that. And I started getting a
• 6:00
  following from it. And people started then just
• 6:03
  asking me, you know, hey, how did you start your men's health
• 6:07
  clinic? How did you start this medical
• 6:08
  cannabis clinic? How did you start this
• 6:09
  telemedicine practice? And so I started doing some
• 6:12
  consultations, private consultations, just through my
• 6:15
  blog. People would read my blog and
• 6:17
  then they would just e-mail me. Hey, can you know, do you, do
• 6:19
  you do consultations? Sure, you know, 500 bucks an
• 6:22
  hour or whatever. And, and so I started doing
• 6:25
  those and I started getting like more and more of those booked
• 6:29
  and I started realizing like, you know, this is I'm still
• 6:33
  exchanging my time for dollars. This wasn't the goal.
• 6:35
  I'm just doing consultations And so basically just people asked
• 6:39
  me and so I was like, you know what, I'm going to turn this
• 6:41
  into an actual like Evergreen product.
• 6:43
  I'm going to turn this into a pre recorded course where I'm
• 6:46
  teaching people the same thing during the consultations, but
• 6:48
  let me just record it and let me just sell it.
• 6:50
  So it's passive in nature. So I just honestly, I didn't
• 6:53
  really have a plan. I just, I started it as a blog
• 6:56
  and people just started asking me for consultations.
• 6:58
  And then just I just had an idea of like, let's just create a
• 7:01
  course over this instead and sell it.
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  So you know, it wasn't really more of a comfort thing.
• 7:06
  It was just that's what people were asking for.
• 7:09
  And so I just kind of create it and, you know, delivered the
• 7:11
  demand. Well, it's really interesting
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  and there's a couple things there that maybe we could dive
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  into a little bit. I mean, one is sort of the
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  notion of niching, right? I mean, obviously this is a
• 7:18
  pretty tight niche that you're in, you know, where you're
• 7:21
  speaking to either, you know, elite nurse practitioner folks
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  that you want to talk to or people that want to go into
• 7:27
  starting their own medical clinics of 1 variety or another.
• 7:31
  You know, it seems pretty narrow anyway.
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  I mean, imagine there's a lot of diversity in those groups, but
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  still, you know, it's relatively niche.
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  And so I mean, maybe there's something to talk about there,
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  which is just, you know, identifying your niche.
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  In your case, you kind of, it seems like kind of fell into it
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  like this is the way that just your career path took you.
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  But if you were, you know, I don't know, trying to create
• 7:50
  something new today or you're trying to identify a market, I
• 7:53
  don't know that you would have just googled and come up with,
• 7:55
  oh, well, OK, nurse practitioners.
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  That's the thing. You know, so I mean, in your
• 7:59
  case, obviously the the experience is what drove the the
• 8:02
  decision. But for if you were trying to
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  advise somebody, if somebody was calling you for that
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  consultative approach and you were trying to help somebody
• 8:09
  create a course or not, is there a metric or a boundary or
• 8:13
  something that you help establish that this is worth it
• 8:15
  and this isn't? Yeah, I think the way I mentor
• 8:20
  people now 'cause then, you know, I, I help people start
• 8:22
  these kind of course businesses now.
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  And the way I do it during those mentorship calls and stuff is
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  that, you know, everyone is an expert in something.
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  I mean, sure, you know, somebody who works down at Starbucks
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  really isn't. But you know, if you are
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  somewhat, you know, an entrepreneurial spirited person
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  and you have some kind of skill based knowledge base and
• 8:44
  whatever it may be coding or some sort of customer service
• 8:48
  thing or accounting or whatever. And you should know kind of who
• 8:53
  your niche is. I mean, in a way, you shouldn't
• 8:57
  know who you could target through the information,
• 9:00
  knowledge and skills that you have.
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  And sometimes it just takes a lot of prying to figure out who
• 9:07
  that niche could possibly be. And so now I feel like if you
• 9:13
  just use some artificial intelligence tools, I mean, just
• 9:16
  ChatGPT or Gemini or Claude or whatever, you should be able to
• 9:20
  allow it to do some market analysis for you and some market
• 9:23
  research to identify maybe what you know, who could benefit
• 9:28
  mostly from your skill set and the knowledge and information
• 9:31
  that you have. Because there's definitely
• 9:34
  something, someone out there who is willing to pay for what you
• 9:38
  know, as long as you are somewhat specialized or
• 9:41
  knowledgeable in something, right?
• 9:44
  I mean, if you're not knowledgeable or you know about
• 9:46
  anything whatsoever, then you need to fix that and you need to
• 9:49
  learn some skills, right? So, So yeah.
• 9:52
  Anyway, the second part of your question was what?
• 9:53
  I don't know if you remembered. Well, no.
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  And I think what you're getting to is kind of the crux of the
• 9:57
  thing, right? I mean, the notion is, you know,
• 9:59
  is there a reason to or like, you know, is your course idea
• 10:03
  not going to be effective where somebody else's course might be
• 10:05
  right. And you might be able to derive
• 10:07
  some of that even using an AI tool or doing some basic market
• 10:10
  research. And you know, and, and I kind of
• 10:14
  agree with you too, or at least I, I think that this is kind of
• 10:16
  what you're saying, which is basically there's a market for
• 10:18
  almost anything. So depending on what you want to
• 10:19
  do, there's somebody there. And if that happens to be your
• 10:22
  wheelhouse, you know, in your case, it was nurse
• 10:24
  practitioners, but I don't know if you're an auto mechanic or
• 10:26
  you're whatever, you know, you're going to find your
• 10:29
  people, right? And there's this sort of
• 10:31
  marketing idea. I always screw this up, but I
• 10:33
  think it's Steven Pinker that that talked about the thousand
• 10:36
  true fans or no, it's not it's somebody else something Kelly, I
• 10:39
  think. But anyway, this notion that
• 10:42
  really all you need is 1000 true fans to find success, right?
• 10:44
  Or to make enough money to to do what you want to do a.
• 10:47
  Hundred 100% that's all you need like that's what I tell people
• 10:51
  all the time is that you do not need 10s of thousands hundreds
• 10:56
  of thousands of customers. You don't need a few 100 to 1000
• 11:01
  like I scaled this continue education course business over
• 11:04
  here to literally I mean there were some months we made 7 or
• 11:08
  $800,000 in one month and I had 7000 customers total.
• 11:14
  I mean it was an 8 figure business like.
• 11:17
  Well, it's great, right, because the the economy or economics on
• 11:20
  these things are great. You know, I mean, if you have
• 11:22
  even just let's say $100 course for easy math and then you have
• 11:25
  500 customers, you know, I mean, you're making real money.
• 11:28
  Like, I mean, that's, you know, and you don't need it to be a,
• 11:31
  you know, like to your point, you don't need it to be
• 11:32
  1,000,000 customers or whatever. You know, so a lot of people are
• 11:35
  have these like moon shot notions that it's like, man, how
• 11:38
  do I get, you know, broad market adoption and I get everybody in
• 11:41
  the, you know, country or whatever on, on my thing, but
• 11:44
  that that's not what it's really about.
• 11:45
  It's about finding, you know, in this case it was Kevin Kelly's
• 11:48
  thousand true fans. And you know, with that, that
• 11:51
  notion anyway, you know, if you had that 1000 people and each of
• 11:54
  them are dropping $99.00 a month into your program, like, you
• 11:57
  know, you're making serious cash and you know, a a real viable
• 12:01
  business there. So I think that, you know, to,
• 12:03
  to maybe just close the loop on the point about niching, you
• 12:06
  know, and like you put it, if you've got expertise in almost
• 12:09
  anything, there's room to make a course.
• 12:11
  Yep. 100% agree. Yeah.
• 12:13
  And The thing is too, like you said, the economics of these
• 12:16
  sorts of things, this, you know, this kind of business is really,
• 12:20
  really good, especially if you especially if you're providing
• 12:24
  something truly valuable. And you know, people always
• 12:27
  throw this term value out there. And I don't think what a lot of
• 12:30
  people, a lot of people don't understand what a value
• 12:32
  proposition is. It's the value you're proposing
• 12:35
  to the world, right? What solution are you solving?
• 12:39
  And you know what, what, what solution to what problem, right?
• 12:44
  You need to, you know, you need to identify the problem first
• 12:47
  within a specific group of people and then do your
• 12:50
  knowledge and skills translate into a solution.
• 12:52
  And if the solution is something, that's it.
• 12:56
  If it's solving a real problem amongst a certain group of
• 13:00
  people, right? A real problem, not no bullshit
• 13:03
  problem, a real problem. You can sell that course for 500
• 13:07
  to $1000 lot. Most of courses that I sold fell
• 13:11
  between the 500 and $1000 range. And so you do the math there,
• 13:17
  you have 1000 customers and you sell your course for $8000.
• 13:21
  That is $1 million. And so that's the thing, you
• 13:25
  don't need to have lots and lots of customers.
• 13:28
  You only need to have a handful really.
• 13:30
  I have a client right now that I'm mentoring and she's
• 13:32
  developing a course that targets lawyers.
• 13:35
  And it's what she's teaching is extremely niched.
• 13:39
  And she's going to be, she's selling this course for $3500.
• 13:44
  You do math there. You don't need to sell a whole
• 13:45
  lot of them to make some good money.
• 13:47
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 13:48
  Well, and maybe so, and I'd like to get into maybe some pricing
• 13:51
  strategy here a little bit later.
• 13:52
  But one of the things that you kind of mentioned here was, you
• 13:55
  know, understanding what value you're actually bringing in the
• 13:57
  market. And I think that this goes a
• 13:58
  little bit back to what we were just talking about in terms of
• 14:01
  identifying your niche or deciding what it is you're going
• 14:03
  to pursue in your course. But I think that there's kind of
• 14:07
  this misnomer, right? Or this idea that just 'cause I
• 14:09
  said it, it's valuable. And so the idea of
• 14:12
  understanding, you know, the, the real value of what you're
• 14:15
  saying. I wonder if we could talk a
• 14:17
  little bit more about really identifying that.
• 14:18
  And, and I just want to point out 'cause you mentioned this
• 14:20
  kind of earlier, but the, you know, if you have a set of
• 14:25
  skills or, let's say you work in a place or you've developed a
• 14:27
  career or something, you, you've developed skills and you've no
• 14:30
  doubt run into roadblocks or things that are annoying or, you
• 14:34
  know, the, the pain points of doing that job, right?
• 14:37
  And that's where I think these real opportunities start to
• 14:39
  emerge. So it's funny that not only did
• 14:42
  you say, you know, in terms of being able to create a course,
• 14:44
  you know, you can rely on the information or the knowledge
• 14:46
  that you've built in a career or, or something, you know,
• 14:49
  you're passionate about. But I think also in terms of
• 14:52
  identifying what to be talking about in your course, you can
• 14:55
  uncover those things by just solving your own problems.
• 14:58
  And so I wonder if that, you know, is good direction or if
• 15:01
  that's sort of something that you would encourage out of your
• 15:02
  students or mentors or mentees, whatever we call them.
• 15:05
  I. Mean, I think that's a pretty
• 15:07
  solid direction really. You know, I think that a lot of
• 15:11
  people don't you basically word it perfectly, like just because
• 15:17
  you say it's valuable doesn't really mean it is.
• 15:20
  You know, a lot of people think that just because they, you
• 15:23
  know, whatever comes out of their mouth is going to be
• 15:25
  valuable, They think it's going to sell.
• 15:26
  And I've seen a lot of people who who will start one of these
• 15:29
  kinds of, you know, this, this sort of business and it just
• 15:32
  falls on deaf ears because they're not really solving a
• 15:35
  real problem. And so I think step number one
• 15:39
  in this entire process is, you know, to summarize it up, is you
• 15:43
  need to determine if the problem that you're solving is actually
• 15:47
  a real problem. And by that I mean, you know, my
• 15:52
  wheelhouse is professional education.
• 15:54
  I'm not, we're not talking about developing a course on how to
• 15:58
  like trade options or how to like quilt or how to tie flies
• 16:03
  or something like that. You know, we're creating a
• 16:05
  course here that is targeting a professional demographic who has
• 16:10
  money and who have problems. And so if the problem you're
• 16:16
  solving within, you know, more of this professional based
• 16:18
  education business, if the problem that you're solving
• 16:21
  helps someone make more money, if it helps them get a career
• 16:24
  advancement that helps them get a new job, you know, those sorts
• 16:28
  of things are valuable. And P or help them start a
• 16:31
  business, you know, is another example.
• 16:32
  These things are extremely valuable.
• 16:34
  And so you can charge more money for them and there will be some
• 16:38
  demand for it because these are real problems people are facing.
• 16:41
  And so just be thinking about that, I think it's critically
• 16:44
  important, yeah. Yeah, I know.
• 16:45
  I think that makes a lot of sense, you know, having some
• 16:47
  stakes in it, you know, versus sort of course for course sake,
• 16:50
  right. I mean, to your point, people
• 16:51
  could be teaching really anything.
• 16:53
  And it doesn't mean that there isn't, you know, an audience for
• 16:56
  the the fly tires and there isn't an audience for some of
• 16:59
  these other groups. It just means that maybe the
• 17:01
  marketing model is a little bit different.
• 17:03
  And so we could get into that. I think next would be a great
• 17:05
  topic to start getting into, which is how do we even tell
• 17:07
  people about this? So we put together our course,
• 17:10
  you know, in something that's a little bit niche and maybe this
• 17:13
  is a good evidence for or a good argument for being more niche.
• 17:17
  It seems like you might have AI don't want to call it easy, but
• 17:21
  maybe an easier opportunity because you already know who
• 17:23
  you're talking to, right? You're talking, you know, just
• 17:25
  to use your example of nurse practitioners again, you know,
• 17:28
  this is a professional services group.
• 17:29
  These guys have to do continuing education and other things like
• 17:32
  that all the time. You know, they're looking for
• 17:34
  courses. You know, man, I don't want to
• 17:36
  take the same dumb course we took last year.
• 17:37
  Let's find something new, you know, whatever it is like, so
• 17:40
  there's people actively looking for this and you've got a, a
• 17:42
  product that may be niched specifically for them.
• 17:45
  So, so you have an audience that you know who to talk to.
• 17:49
  Fly tying is maybe niche enough that you've got that.
• 17:51
  But like, let's say you're running into a general like
• 17:53
  marketing course or something, right?
• 17:55
  All of a sudden your audience is everyone.
• 17:57
  And so with a bigger audience like that, you know, the ability
• 18:00
  to hyper target who you're talking to or to get your
• 18:02
  message in the right person's hands might become more
• 18:05
  challenging. So I wonder as you talk about,
• 18:07
  you know, or as you're helping your mentees sort of start to
• 18:11
  develop their plan and decide what they're going to go after
• 18:13
  and the type of content they're going to teach.
• 18:16
  How do you talk to them about marketing?
• 18:17
  And how do you talk to them about, you know, what's actually
• 18:20
  useful versus what isn't? You know, is it good to be on
• 18:22
  Twitter or is it, you know, not useful, you know, etcetera.
• 18:26
  Yeah, 2 points. So 1 you kind of hit on, it's
• 18:31
  like, are people searching for this?
• 18:34
  You know, are they, are they looking for a solution to this,
• 18:37
  you know, particular problem. So you need to ensure that you
• 18:41
  have two marketing strategies here, one for warm leads and one
• 18:44
  for cold leads, right? And so the warm lead strategy is
• 18:50
  your basic stuff in terms of just SEO, search engine
• 18:54
  optimization, Geo generative engine optimization.
• 18:58
  So you're coming up on ChatGPT and Gemini and those sorts of
• 19:00
  things and making yourself just easily found.
• 19:05
  So as an example, you know, I was targeting nurse
• 19:10
  practitioners, I was targeting medical professionals.
• 19:13
  People would go on to Google or ask ChatGPT or whatever.
• 19:16
  I am a burnt out doctor. What can I do to get out of
• 19:22
  burnout? And some of the results would
• 19:25
  come back and it would say you can start your own practice and
• 19:28
  the elite nurse practitioner would show up, right?
• 19:30
  Because I have articles about burnout.
• 19:32
  You know what I mean? I knew, I knew what these people
• 19:34
  were searching for, right? Because I've been there.
• 19:36
  I was, I was, you know, like I, I walked the walk, right?
• 19:40
  And so you want to make sure that you maximize your warm lead
• 19:45
  collection, your conversion. So that is just simple content
• 19:49
  creation, lots of content on your website, lots of content on
• 19:52
  your social media channels, YouTube, et cetera.
• 19:55
  The more you have out there on your website, the more topics
• 19:59
  you talk about, the more questions that you that you
• 20:02
  answer, the higher the chances that people are just going to
• 20:05
  find you through just searching. If they're searching for
• 20:08
  something that's specific to what you're teaching, they are a
• 20:10
  warm lead. They are looking for something
• 20:12
  to help them, right? So you want to make sure you
• 20:14
  extract those warm leads and convert them as much as you
• 20:16
  possibly can. One quick tip is that every
• 20:19
  single piece of content you that you create, 1 great way to get
• 20:24
  found on like ChatGPT or Gemini is to have a frequently asked
• 20:29
  question section of the article or the video and a key
• 20:33
  takeaways. So you literally just at the end
• 20:35
  of the article, just put key takeaways heading 10 key
• 20:38
  takeaways from your article FAC five, you know, 5 to 10
• 20:43
  questions or whatever. That way, the more questions
• 20:45
  that you have that you're answering on your content, the
• 20:48
  more likely check GBT will find someone who's asking a similar
• 20:53
  question, then find your content to answer them with.
• 20:55
  Right. So that's warm leads and then
• 20:58
  cold leads strategy is probably where you're going to be getting
• 21:02
  the majority of your, of your sales.
• 21:05
  Probably a lot of people might not be really looking for a
• 21:10
  specific topic or be looking for a specific solution to their
• 21:13
  problem because they might not be aware that it's actually a
• 21:17
  problem that's solvable. Like a lot of these people don't
• 21:19
  even realize it. You know, a lot of people that I
• 21:22
  was teaching didn't even realize they could start their own
• 21:24
  practice. They're like, what I can do
• 21:26
  that, you know, so some people might not even realize it's a
• 21:29
  solvable problem. And so you need to send out
• 21:34
  signals out there to your target demographic.
• 21:37
  You know, like you mentioned before is that you have to hyper
• 21:42
  target. That's what separates a very,
• 21:45
  very successful teen education course business from one that's
• 21:48
  not really very successful is that if you identify your target
• 21:52
  demographic and you identify your target market very
• 21:54
  specifically, you know who you're selling to, it is
• 21:57
  extremely easy to target those people online through social
• 22:02
  media channels. Essentially, you can target them
• 22:04
  specifically on, you know, Facebook, Meta, I don't care
• 22:07
  what anyone says, Meta is still the largest social media
• 22:09
  platform and it is still one of the most effective advertising
• 22:12
  platforms there is. It just is I make a shit ton of
• 22:15
  money on Meta still. And so Meta, LinkedIn, YouTube,
• 22:20
  etcetera. You can hyper target people and
• 22:23
  if you know who your target market is, you can speak
• 22:25
  directly to them and you can send them out signals to gauge
• 22:30
  interest. And, and it's, it's really not
• 22:32
  that complicated. Sure, you can push your course
• 22:34
  product to them. That's not the most effective
• 22:37
  way to do this. Most effective way to do it is,
• 22:39
  is to push your content at them and then let them make the
• 22:43
  decision if they're interested or not.
• 22:45
  So instead of spending lots and lots of money on advertising
• 22:49
  your course or your product, and I see this mistake all the time,
• 22:53
  people will dump thousands, 10s of thousands of dollars
• 22:57
  marketing their product, their course, and they spend no money
• 23:01
  at all advertising, marketing, promoting their content and just
• 23:06
  trying to get engagement and building an audience.
• 23:09
  So you need to flip around what you think and that's what you
• 23:11
  need to be doing. You need to be building an
• 23:13
  audience, promoting your content, getting engagement up,
• 23:17
  getting people to subscribe to your e-mail list.
• 23:19
  Then that's when you can sell them.
• 23:21
  So instead of spending $10,000 promoting your course, spend
• 23:25
  $8000 promoting content, and then spend $2000 promoting your
• 23:29
  course retargeting the people who clicked on your content,
• 23:33
  right? Retarget them and you'll be much
• 23:36
  more efficient with your marketing dollars.
• 23:38
  Hope that makes sense. Yeah, no, I think that makes
• 23:40
  sense. Well, and I think for a lot of
• 23:41
  people too, like if you're starting off with no budget, I
• 23:43
  mean, content creation is ostensibly free.
• 23:46
  I mean, you know, you can do a little bit of thought, you know
• 23:48
  that, you know, decide what you want to do.
• 23:49
  Maybe you got to buy a couple props or whatever.
• 23:51
  But you know, generally speaking, I mean, it's between
• 23:53
  you and your iPhone or whatever. And and so it's not that, you
• 23:57
  know, or it's not at least the barrier to entry is much lower
• 24:00
  than it might have been in the past where you needed a
• 24:03
  production team or something to come to it.
• 24:05
  And so I think you're right that that, you know, focusing your
• 24:09
  energy on the content creation is important.
• 24:11
  And, and I think that you've kind of alluded to this too, but
• 24:13
  it's like a big chunk of this is, is giving a lot away, right?
• 24:17
  You're actually kind of giving away some of what you're going
• 24:20
  to be teaching, right? I mean, I guess people need to
• 24:22
  be able to empathize with whatever your content is and
• 24:24
  understand that, you know, the learnings they'll get from your
• 24:26
  materials are, you know, going to be in line with this piece of
• 24:30
  content. And so that's kind of how people
• 24:32
  can make the correlation that I think this course will be worth
• 24:35
  it because, you know, this content's worth it.
• 24:37
  So why wouldn't the course be? And so I think it's important,
• 24:40
  but I think there's a lot of people who will try to gatekeep
• 24:43
  and, you know, maybe not be as forthcoming with their
• 24:45
  information. So what's your thought on on
• 24:49
  that? Like, I mean, maybe you need to
• 24:50
  hang on to the secret sauce, I don't know.
• 24:52
  But maybe we can talk a little bit about just sort of the
• 24:53
  strategy of your contact creation, which is, you know,
• 24:56
  how forthcoming should you be? You know, where should you give,
• 24:59
  where should you hold back and, and that sort of thing.
• 25:00
  Yeah. That's a good point, yeah.
• 25:04
  A lot of people gatekeep it. A lot of people are very, very
• 25:07
  scared or hesitant about creating content because they
• 25:11
  feel like they're going to be giving away what they're
• 25:13
  teaching in their paid course, right?
• 25:17
  You know, if you looked at the CE businesses, the continued
• 25:20
  education course businesses that I've created, and if you went
• 25:23
  through all the content I ever created, podcasts, videos,
• 25:28
  articles, etcetera. If you want to spend the time
• 25:31
  and go through all of those things, you probably would end
• 25:34
  up extracting the same information that I would teach
• 25:37
  in a four hour course, right? How long would it take you to do
• 25:40
  that though? Very, very long time, if, if at
• 25:45
  all, because it's completely unorganized, right?
• 25:48
  With a course, it's organized, you know, it's there's a step by
• 25:52
  step procedure within it. When you create content, you can
• 25:55
  take 1 little procedure out of here, one step out of there, one
• 25:58
  little piece of content in this course here and you can create
• 26:00
  literally years worth of content from one course if you just
• 26:04
  spread it out, make it unorganized, you know what I
• 26:06
  mean? So I think that don't be scared
• 26:08
  of providing a lot of free value out there.
• 26:12
  Just don't make it into don't organize it basically is is, is
• 26:16
  the whole point. Don't don't have an article
• 26:18
  series where it goes step by step through whatever it is that
• 26:21
  you're teaching. Don't do that.
• 26:22
  Just pull out little, you know, little pieces here and there and
• 26:25
  you can just publish. You need to publish content
• 26:27
  that's completely random in nature.
• 26:29
  It doesn't have to, you know, it doesn't have to be congruent.
• 26:32
  It doesn't have to make sense from, you know, previous article
• 26:34
  or previous video. Just create random content with
• 26:37
  the information that you know. If it's random enough and
• 26:40
  unorganized enough, no one will ever get the same kind of value
• 26:44
  out of it as they would with a course.
• 26:45
  So. So don't worry too much about
• 26:48
  that. A lot of people worry about
• 26:49
  that. It's completely unnecessary.
• 26:50
  Well, I would say it's not so different than, you know, almost
• 26:52
  anything else. I mean, big part of the things
• 26:54
  that we pay for, you know, just as consumers in in the world is
• 26:58
  we're paying for convenience, right?
• 27:00
  And so part of the convenience here is somebody has already put
• 27:03
  together the course. Like, why should I scour
• 27:05
  Instagram for hours? Or why should I, you know,
• 27:07
  Google every potential topic and, and read every article?
• 27:10
  You know, like, I mean, I'm paying for the course.
• 27:13
  I mean, in part for the knowledge, but also because it's
• 27:15
  already here. Like here's this package, I can
• 27:16
  just buy it and be done, you know?
• 27:19
  Yeah, 100% exactly. It's you.
• 27:21
  You, you hit the nail on the head.
• 27:22
  Convenience. It's the convenience factor of
• 27:25
  it. Most people are willing to spend
• 27:27
  a couple 100 bucks to be told exactly what to do from an
• 27:32
  expert who has experience with it versus just finding a bunch
• 27:36
  of random pieces online and putting it together yourself,
• 27:40
  right? Especially within the
• 27:42
  professional space, especially when it comes to continuing
• 27:46
  education, some kind of highly skilled, high, you know,
• 27:50
  knowledge base kind of course that requires skill and
• 27:53
  experience education, that sort of a thing.
• 27:56
  So, so, yeah, no, that's, that's that's.
• 27:58
  Exactly. Well, and, and so much of it
• 28:00
  too. I mean, it's convenience, but I
• 28:01
  mean it, you know, you make a good point, especially in
• 28:03
  continuing education stuff. Like my wife is a teacher and
• 28:06
  she has to take a certain number of CE credits every couple years
• 28:08
  or whatever. And you know, but she's also a
• 28:11
  full time teacher. Or in the case of a lot of your
• 28:13
  audience, you know, maybe they're full time nurse
• 28:14
  practitioners or men's clinic runners or, you know, whatever
• 28:17
  it is. And like these guys that, I
• 28:19
  mean, they don't have 40 hours a week.
• 28:20
  Commit to learning. I mean, you know, they've got to
• 28:22
  pick up a few things as they go and, and that kind of thing, you
• 28:24
  know, or I, I, I'll commit to taking this 4 hour course over
• 28:27
  the weekend, but like, I'm back to work on Monday.
• 28:30
  Like I can't, I can't just do this every day, you know?
• 28:33
  So I mean, you know, convenience is, yeah, part of it, but I
• 28:35
  mean, it's also, you know, almost a requirement.
• 28:38
  I mean, these people are working hard and they're, you know, in
• 28:41
  their careers and all that kind of stuff.
• 28:42
  And, you know, CE might be a state requirement or it might
• 28:45
  be, you know, federal requirement or whatever it is,
• 28:47
  depending on the the course and the position.
• 28:49
  But, you know, you're doing something almost because you
• 28:52
  have to or because you want to stay relevant or whatever it is.
• 28:54
  And, you know, you don't have a lot of time to commit to this.
• 28:57
  So I mean, it's one thing to sit and flip through Instagram and
• 29:00
  maybe, you know what, my wife gets all the teacher
• 29:02
  influencers, right? So there's no shortage of
• 29:04
  teachers with different ideas, but you know, but if she
• 29:08
  actually has to take a course, like she'd much rather sit down
• 29:10
  and hammer through something in an hour or two then have to drag
• 29:13
  that out, you know, for multiple hours over the week or whatever.
• 29:16
  Yeah, 100% exactly right. That's the that's the cheat code
• 29:21
  when it comes to continue education course business.
• 29:23
  Everyone like it is required for professionals for various
• 29:29
  professions. I mean dozens, if not hundreds
• 29:31
  of professionals have to have contained education course
• 29:34
  credits, hours to maintain their license to be able to work.
• 29:38
  So you have immediate built in demand with a business like
• 29:43
  this. It's built in and often times
• 29:47
  the person's not even really paying for it, their employer's
• 29:49
  paying for it or the school district's paying for it or the
• 29:52
  hospital system's paying for it. They're not even paying for it,
• 29:54
  right? And so, yeah, so it's built in
• 29:57
  demand, but yeah, you're not going to be able to, you know,
• 29:58
  like you're not going to get that from just searching online
• 30:01
  and going on a ChatGPT and asking it some questions or
• 30:04
  whatever. So, yeah.
• 30:06
  So just just be aware of that. But in terms of content creation
• 30:09
  goes though, don't worry about it.
• 30:11
  You have to deliver free valuable information if you want
• 30:16
  this, if you want a business model like this to work, you
• 30:19
  have to there's it's it's not optional.
• 30:21
  Like you you, you have to if you want to build it the right way.
• 30:24
  Yeah. Well, and one of the big things,
• 30:25
  I think that's going to be a big factor in the future, like is
• 30:28
  we're all trying to survive AI and not lose our jobs.
• 30:30
  You know, I mean, because theoretically ChatGPT could put
• 30:32
  together some kind of training course for you or something.
• 30:34
  You know, I mean, you could do that.
• 30:36
  But we still look out for experts.
• 30:37
  And I think a big part of that and the way that we survive, you
• 30:39
  know, as professionals, especially people in sort of the
• 30:42
  education space or people who are trying to relay information,
• 30:47
  you know, that you could theoretically get in other ways,
• 30:50
  is I think having a point of view.
• 30:52
  And I think, you know, if I'm going to pay for a course or I'm
• 30:56
  going to hire somebody as a consultant or whatever it is, I
• 30:59
  want that person to have a point of view.
• 31:01
  And it's not that the information you're teaching, I
• 31:03
  mean, maybe the way that you teach, you know, and not
• 31:05
  singling you out, of course, but I mean, maybe the content in
• 31:07
  your thing could be taught by any number of people who have
• 31:10
  been successful in that kind of line of work.
• 31:13
  But people hire you or by your version of the course because of
• 31:16
  you and your personality and the way that you say things or the
• 31:19
  way that you handle your business.
• 31:20
  And that's appealing to a certain group of people.
• 31:22
  And I think if you're not sharing your point of view in
• 31:24
  your content, you know, so for example, if you're just either
• 31:28
  not doing it or you're doing some kind of AI generated really
• 31:30
  boring content or something like you're, you're missing the
• 31:34
  opportunity to share your point of view.
• 31:36
  And I think the point of view is what's going to help you survive
• 31:38
  AI and everything else. You know, I always use, it's
• 31:40
  probably not even that good of example, but I always use
• 31:42
  something like Picasso. It's like, hey, OK, I want to
• 31:44
  have a Picasso in my house. That's my big goal is I want to
• 31:47
  buy a Picasso. Well, I don't want the Picasso
• 31:49
  NFTI don't want the JPG that I ran off the computer.
• 31:52
  You know, I don't want something that looks like a Picasso.
• 31:54
  I want, I want Picasso's thing. And what makes Picasso
• 31:57
  interesting is his point of view.
• 31:59
  It's his take. It's I mean, the paint is the
• 32:01
  paint, the canvas is the canvas, all that stuff.
• 32:03
  But what's interesting is the point, you know, is his point of
• 32:06
  view or his perspective on the world.
• 32:08
  And if you are trying to stand out anywhere, you know, there's
• 32:12
  plenty of artists who are not successful in the world.
• 32:14
  And a lot of people would look at it somebody like Picasso's
• 32:17
  art and be like, dude, this guy's crazy, like mental illness
• 32:19
  or something, what's going on? But at the same time, people
• 32:22
  love it and they want it, but they want it because it's him,
• 32:25
  not because of, you know, some other factor.
• 32:27
  They're not just buying cool paint or something.
• 32:29
  So, so I think as it pertains to content strategy and things like
• 32:32
  that too, I think it's really important to make sure that
• 32:34
  you're sharing your actual point of view on things because I
• 32:37
  think that that can really help drive people into a course or
• 32:40
  especially if you want them to follow you as A, and I hate the
• 32:42
  term, but like as an influencer or something in a genre, you
• 32:47
  know, I mean, you have to do in order to be influential, you
• 32:49
  have to have a point of view, I think, I guess the moral of the
• 32:51
  story. 100% I get, I get asked this question all the time.
• 32:57
  Well, AI was going to take over this stuff.
• 32:58
  Why should I even bother? You know, you hit the nail on
• 33:03
  the head. It's because of your point of
• 33:05
  view. It's because of your experience.
• 33:06
  It's because of the blood, sweat and tears that you put into your
• 33:10
  life, into your career, into your knowledge base.
• 33:13
  You know, I mean, you've worked, you know, you've worked hard,
• 33:18
  you've worked your ass off trying to get to the place that
• 33:20
  you're at. And ChatGPT, Gemini, Claude,
• 33:26
  they have it right. And so you can put your point of
• 33:29
  view into it. You can put your personal
• 33:32
  experience, the knowledge, the blood sweat, the tears, the
• 33:35
  failures, the successes, everything that makes you a
• 33:38
  human you can put into your course or your content.
• 33:44
  AI can't do that. AI is not going to resonate with
• 33:49
  people. It's, it's just not, I mean,
• 33:51
  everyone, you know, when you're reading AI slop or not, you just
• 33:56
  do. You know, when you're watching
• 33:58
  an AI drive video versus someone who's actually sitting there
• 34:01
  talking, you can just tell, right?
• 34:05
  So yeah, if you put some true authenticity into it, your point
• 34:09
  of view, your blood, sweat and tears, you don't really have to
• 34:11
  worry too much about it because at the end of the day, people
• 34:13
  are always going to, people are always going to pay a premium
• 34:17
  and more money for something that's human derived, human
• 34:22
  made, recorded by a human. People still want that human
• 34:26
  interaction. And I have a feeling as the
• 34:28
  years go by, people are going to crave more and more of that.
• 34:32
  Because I don't know about you, but I know when I go through my
• 34:35
  feed, I'm like, how much of this garbage is just AI at this
• 34:38
  point? I don't even want like, I can
• 34:40
  just tell it is. It's just like how much of this
• 34:42
  stuff online now, which is completely AI garbage.
• 34:44
  It's just, it drives me kind of crazy.
• 34:46
  And I think it's going to get worse.
• 34:47
  Yeah, it's funny because at this point I'm like ready to abandon
• 34:50
  most of the social platforms anyway because like, I mean,
• 34:52
  even just like, you know, I used to be able to, you know, flip
• 34:54
  through a couple platforms and at least get some semblance of
• 34:57
  the news. You know, maybe it'd be a little
• 34:58
  tilted or whatever, but you could kind of get a handle on
• 35:00
  world events or whatever. But I've really noticed, like
• 35:02
  with all this stuff going on with Iran right now, that it's
• 35:05
  like I can't make heads or tails out of what's actually being
• 35:07
  said. You know, you got every, you
• 35:09
  know, bot farm and regime and government and whatever.
• 35:14
  And they all have opinions it takes.
• 35:16
  And you know, like for me, it's become so noisy that it's barely
• 35:19
  even worth tuning in, you know what I mean?
• 35:21
  And so it's become a real problem.
• 35:22
  And actually it's funny because on my, my Instagram profile, my
• 35:25
  wife always makes fun of it because it's so boring.
• 35:27
  But like, there's about 5 verticals.
• 35:29
  You know, I've got Porsches, I've got cooking, I've got, you
• 35:33
  know, occasional baby animals, I've got, but I mean, like, but
• 35:36
  my thread or my, my algorithm consists of like 5 or 6 things,
• 35:40
  you know, and, and so it's kind of funny 'cause I'm really
• 35:43
  siloed in that way. But it's the only way that it's
• 35:45
  made it any kind of, you know, valuable to me at all is that,
• 35:49
  you know, because if you just kind of are looking at the
• 35:51
  network writ large, you're getting so much noise.
• 35:53
  And, you know, I have another little like metaphor that I've
• 35:56
  been using to sort of describe what I think the future looks
• 35:58
  like. And just to reinforce your
• 36:00
  point, which is I, I sort of imagine this like sort of post
• 36:03
  apocalyptic, post apocalyptic dystopian, like Tokyo or
• 36:06
  something where every piece of glass is a screen and that, you
• 36:10
  know, everything is moving and it's all this stuff.
• 36:12
  And then like across the way, you know, under this, under the
• 36:15
  street light, you see just a little ramen stand, you know,
• 36:17
  some little old dude just cooking, you know, slinging up
• 36:19
  ramen. And I just go, I'm going to go
• 36:21
  to the ramen guy. I'm not going to choose any of
• 36:23
  this other stuff, right? I'm going to look for the thing
• 36:25
  that's uniquely human. And I think, you know, to just
• 36:28
  back up what you're saying, I think, you know, the world is
• 36:30
  certainly going to get noisier. And, you know, marketing is one
• 36:33
  of the first spots that AI is really creeping into.
• 36:35
  Like, I think it's just because it's so easy to generate
• 36:37
  content. People are going that way and
• 36:40
  but it's going to become so noisy that the only things that
• 36:42
  will stand out will be the things that are truly human or,
• 36:45
  you know, again, back to this idea about a point of view.
• 36:47
  And so I think people are going to be craving more and more for
• 36:50
  human stuff. And I would rather have a course
• 36:52
  from somebody like you who talks about the UPS, the downs, the
• 36:55
  problems, the things that you've been through.
• 36:57
  And I mean, hell, you could even maybe be a little wrong on
• 36:59
  something, you know, but it worked for you.
• 37:02
  But maybe it's wrong by the way the textbook reads or whatever.
• 37:05
  But I would rather have your take than just, you know, read,
• 37:10
  you know, something out of Chechi PT or whatever that's
• 37:12
  sort of built to please me. And so I think it's really
• 37:14
  important, you know, that human component.
• 37:16
  And and so to your point, you know, as people are making these
• 37:19
  courses or, or maybe talking themselves out of it, I think
• 37:22
  they have to understand just how important a role the humans will
• 37:25
  be in the the future AI world. 100% agree.
• 37:29
  Like don't worry about it. I think that if you're
• 37:33
  authentic, you're providing something valuable.
• 37:37
  There's some entertainment involved with it too, you know,
• 37:40
  make it engaging. I don't think there's anything
• 37:42
  to worry about. I just, I really don't.
• 37:44
  Yeah. So let's shift gears a little
• 37:47
  bit and talk about mechanics of doing coursework.
• 37:51
  You know, certainly people come to you with a notion of an idea
• 37:53
  or they'll come with a little crumb of a, you know, hey, this
• 37:56
  is what I think I want to do a course on.
• 37:58
  But what are the non negotiable ingredients or the things that
• 38:01
  you, you know, really have to include in a course like this to
• 38:03
  make make it prove valuable? And we've probably talked about
• 38:06
  a few of these things, but I wonder if we could talk about it
• 38:08
  in sort of a process driven kind of way.
• 38:13
  I mean, it really depends on what kind of really depends on
• 38:17
  what kind of course you're going to create, right, What you're
• 38:19
  going to teach that sort of a thing.
• 38:21
  But I think just a general principle is you got to look at
• 38:24
  this, it's not just building a course.
• 38:26
  You got to look at this as building a a course business.
• 38:31
  Way too many people focus on the course itself.
• 38:34
  And the course itself is important.
• 38:37
  It's your product, right? I mean, it needs to be solid,
• 38:41
  but it doesn't have to be perfect and it doesn't need to
• 38:44
  be amazing. At the end of the day, it's
• 38:47
  you're going to be your messaging and your content and
• 38:49
  stuff that pushes people to that course.
• 38:51
  As long as you're solving the problem, it doesn't have to be
• 38:53
  perfect by any stretch of the imagination.
• 38:54
  It just doesn't Way too many people focus way too much on the
• 38:58
  course itself, on building the course, making it perfect.
• 39:01
  They spend months, months. I've even I had one client who
• 39:05
  spent almost a year on their course and has yet to release
• 39:08
  it. I'm just like, dude, this course
• 39:10
  is fine. Just get it launched, get it out
• 39:13
  there like you work. You can figure out the problems
• 39:15
  later. But, but the issue though is, is
• 39:19
  that people focus on the course and not the course business.
• 39:21
  You need to flip that around. You need to focus on the course
• 39:24
  business. Your course is the product, yes.
• 39:26
  Put the time it needs to be put into it to develop something
• 39:29
  stellar. It doesn't have to be longer a
• 39:31
  month or two to do that. It really doesn't.
• 39:33
  If you got, you know, 10 hours a week to work on it.
• 39:35
  These things happen pretty quickly as you're working on it.
• 39:38
  Focus on the container education course business.
• 39:40
  The way I like to kind of frame it is that the foundation of the
• 39:44
  CE business, the container education course business, the
• 39:47
  foundation of it is your value proposition, your mission, and
• 39:52
  just the general idea of the business itself.
• 39:54
  That's the concrete foundation of the house that you're
• 39:56
  building. Without it being solid, the
• 40:00
  entire, it doesn't matter how much infrastructure you build on
• 40:03
  top of it, what you fill the house up with, it's going to
• 40:06
  crumble. And not enough people spend
• 40:08
  enough time developing their value proposition, their mission
• 40:11
  statement, and their idea. You need to spend more time on
• 40:14
  that than anything else. Anything else?
• 40:17
  It takes you a month to come up with that and to do enough
• 40:20
  market research, whatever. That's fine because your entire
• 40:23
  courses business is built off of this.
• 40:26
  So you need to spend some time on that.
• 40:27
  And then the walls of the house that you're building lay on the
• 40:30
  foundation, the value proposition and the mission
• 40:32
  statement. And that's just the
• 40:34
  infrastructure of the business itself.
• 40:36
  That's just building any kind of digital business, right?
• 40:38
  Having a website, having payment processors, having a course
• 40:42
  hosting platform, having marketing channels, build e-mail
• 40:45
  platforms, etcetera, right? That's just the basic
• 40:47
  infrastructure of it. And then you need to fill it up,
• 40:50
  right? Then you build a roof on it,
• 40:52
  which would be mostly just like, you know, the shell of the
• 40:54
  business, the, the website, the content strategy, you know your
• 40:58
  strategy. And then within it though, is
• 41:00
  the furniture and the assets of the actual house itself.
• 41:03
  And that's going to be most of your content.
• 41:05
  That's the way you kind of kind of got to look at it, but you
• 41:08
  have to focus on that foundation.
• 41:09
  I don't know if that answers your question or not.
• 41:11
  No. Well, and I think that's really
• 41:12
  good. There's actually one of the
• 41:14
  things I wrote really early on in our conversation today was no
• 41:16
  plan that you didn't go into this whole thing of, of building
• 41:19
  these continuing education courses with like a plan to be
• 41:22
  like the course guy, for example.
• 41:25
  And and So what, the way that translated to me is exactly what
• 41:28
  you're just talking about, which is people get so caught up and
• 41:30
  trying to be perfect that they let it be the enemy of good,
• 41:32
  right? And I imagine there's kind of a
• 41:34
  boundary here, which is, you know, there's decent film
• 41:38
  production and to be totally honest, you can do probably good
• 41:40
  enough on your cell phone these days.
• 41:42
  But if you have anything reasonably modern, but the I
• 41:48
  think being able to go out and do the production is maybe less
• 41:53
  important than, you know, some people might think it is.
• 41:56
  And, you know, maybe in professional courses, and this
• 41:58
  is, I guess, maybe a question for you, which is in
• 42:00
  professional courses, there's probably some level where if you
• 42:03
  don't look professional enough, you don't come off credible.
• 42:06
  And so, you know, and maybe you can accomplish this, you know,
• 42:08
  with an iPhone and a shirt with a collar, Maybe that's enough to
• 42:11
  get, you know, over that hurdle. But I wonder if you just talk
• 42:14
  about, you know, if they're like in, in terms of, you know, we
• 42:16
  don't need to make it be perfect.
• 42:18
  But if the course is good enough, like kind of what what
• 42:21
  is good enough look like, I guess, you know, just to help
• 42:23
  people gauge where the the bar, the bar might be.
• 42:26
  Good enough is good enough is are you delivering on the
• 42:34
  promise within your messaging, right.
• 42:37
  I mean, if you're talking about a problem and you're hammering
• 42:40
  on this problem within your, your, your, the, the content
• 42:44
  that you're producing on the sales page of the course, you
• 42:48
  know, if your business's value proposition and mission
• 42:51
  statement revolve around this problem, and it should, then
• 42:57
  does your course deliver a solution to that problem?
• 43:01
  Or are you just BS ING everyone you know, if you cannot deliver
• 43:06
  on the promise, if you cannot deliver on your mission, then it
• 43:09
  is not good enough, obviously, right?
• 43:11
  So number one is, are you solving the problem that you're
• 43:15
  proposing? Are you know, are you solving
• 43:17
  it? Are you delivering on your
• 43:18
  promise? A lot of people create courses
• 43:21
  and don't do that. And it leaves the, you know, the
• 43:24
  student walks away from the course scratching their head
• 43:26
  like I'm more confused now. I don't know what to do.
• 43:31
  And then they ask for a refund or they're starting to blow up
• 43:34
  your e-mail, your inbox with questions and stuff that
• 43:37
  happens. Then you did not deliver on your
• 43:39
  promise. So you need to make sure you do
• 43:41
  that. Make sure you solve the problem
• 43:42
  that you're talking about. And then obviously, if it's good
• 43:45
  enough, it needs to be, it needs to look OK.
• 43:48
  You know, it does not need to be $1,000,000 production here.
• 43:51
  Like you can use your phone. You can use the camera on your
• 43:53
  phone if you want. You don't even have to even
• 43:55
  record a video if you don't want to.
• 43:58
  You can just record audio and then sync the audio to
• 44:01
  PowerPoint slides. That's what all my courses are.
• 44:03
  None of my courses actually have me on the course, Not one of
• 44:06
  them. Not 50 plus courses.
• 44:09
  It's all just me talking off through a mic.
• 44:12
  I record on Audacity, which is free recording software.
• 44:16
  I just record on Audacity and then I just take that audio,
• 44:20
  give the slide deck to someone in Mexico or India or whatever
• 44:25
  and pay them $10.00 an hour to edit the audio, sync it to the
• 44:29
  PowerPoint size and give me video.
• 44:30
  Costs a couple 100 bucks to get the whole thing edited.
• 44:33
  It's good enough, right? I'm solving the problem.
• 44:37
  That's what people care about. Then I host it on the course
• 44:39
  hosting platform, whatever course hosting platform you
• 44:42
  want, as long as it's long as the user interface is not
• 44:46
  confusing, you know what I mean? That's good enough.
• 44:49
  Yeah, no, I love that. And I think that's really good.
• 44:51
  In fact, the fact the, the note that you just mentioned about
• 44:54
  using just sort of voice over PowerPoint, I think that this is
• 44:57
  one of the spots where a lot of people probably flounder or
• 44:59
  start to, you know, walk away from doing their course or talk
• 45:02
  themselves out of it, which is they don't want to be on camera.
• 45:04
  And so, you know, a lot of people hate the sound of their
• 45:07
  own voice. So that's a hurdle for people.
• 45:09
  But I mean, man, getting on camera is a scary one for a lot
• 45:11
  of folks. And so the fact that you don't
• 45:13
  necessarily have to do that, you know, and I, I think you're
• 45:17
  right. And I think honestly, it's a, a
• 45:18
  business learning, it's a, you know, life learning, It's
• 45:20
  everything. This notion of delivering on the
• 45:22
  promises is huge. I mean that that really is the
• 45:25
  whole thing. As long as you get out of this,
• 45:26
  what I say you'll get out of it, then, you know, you've pretty
• 45:29
  well nailed it. And you know, for me, I tend to
• 45:32
  be one of those guys that tries to do a little more professional
• 45:34
  quality video and stuff like that.
• 45:35
  And I know that for me personally, the course that I've
• 45:38
  been working on for, you know, a number of years now, granted, I
• 45:42
  will say I don't work on it with any regularity.
• 45:44
  It just pops into my head every now and then.
• 45:45
  So I'm not in line with some of your clients who are actively
• 45:48
  trying to get something done. But, but I've been working on
• 45:51
  this course and now I've, I've got scripts, I've got everything
• 45:53
  written. I'm at the point where now it's
• 45:55
  like, OK, we should do video, but I'm like, well, I need to
• 45:58
  get a friend over here that can help me with the lighting and
• 46:00
  I've got to get a studio that looks nice and I've got, you
• 46:02
  know, and so, and those are all the reasons for me to not move
• 46:04
  forward, right? Those are the things keeping me
• 46:06
  from, from getting to the finish line.
• 46:08
  And I think a lot of times, you know, maybe that's fear or
• 46:11
  trepidation or whatever, but we make excuses a lot to try and,
• 46:14
  you know, actually not do the thing that we're trying to do.
• 46:17
  And so, so I wonder if, you know, if that's something you've
• 46:21
  seen too. But I, I like the freedom you're
• 46:23
  giving us here to, to not have to necessarily do that.
• 46:27
  Yeah. I mean, I see a lot of people
• 46:28
  work, I guess focus on a lot of different random things.
• 46:33
  Well, let me ask you, what do you think your biggest hold up?
• 46:35
  You said you've been working on this course for one year.
• 46:38
  Yeah. And well, and probably more than
• 46:39
  that, to be honest. OK.
• 46:40
  So what would you identify as the biggest hold up?
• 46:44
  I would say the biggest thing for me is a production thing.
• 46:46
  And you know, like I say, I mean for me I need to.
• 46:49
  My goal was to do it on film. And so the idea is I need to
• 46:54
  schedule a day or two or a week or whatever to shoot all the
• 46:57
  content. And then, you know, then there's
• 46:59
  the editing hurdles and all this other stuff that chase it, you
• 47:01
  know. So for me, I've turned it into
• 47:03
  this big production job, you know, and it's nothing crazy.
• 47:06
  I mean, honestly, it's just a course on on podcasting and
• 47:09
  helping people get from nothing to something right.
• 47:11
  I mean, so the, the goal isn't, you know, to make you a world
• 47:13
  class broadcaster. Instead, the goal is how can we
• 47:16
  get you into podcasting, you know, and get more people into
• 47:18
  the into the space? And so, you know, it took some
• 47:21
  years to develop some theories and some ideas and, you know,
• 47:23
  and I've got some things, but it's like, it's not rocket
• 47:26
  science either, right? You know?
• 47:28
  And so it's like, so the biggest hurdle is not, I mean, the
• 47:31
  contents been written probably for a couple years by now, but I
• 47:35
  haven't actually sat down to tape it because it's like, well,
• 47:37
  OK, I got to figure out time of my day to do that.
• 47:40
  You know, I have to set up the cameras, I have to rig up the
• 47:42
  lights. I have to do all this stuff, you
• 47:43
  know, because I don't really have a team to help me do that.
• 47:46
  And so it's just like, I don't know, there's enough of a
• 47:48
  boundary there to keep me from moving forward.
• 47:51
  And, you know, and I suspect I'm not alone in that.
• 47:54
  Like, there's probably plenty of people who sort of procrastinate
• 47:56
  by virtue of making things too hard and so.
• 47:59
  Yeah. No, you're not alone by any
• 48:01
  stretch of the imagination. No, I would say this is probably
• 48:04
  a huge factor, probably a huge factor that I see amongst a lot
• 48:11
  of content creators online general or even just
• 48:15
  entrepreneurs in general. I, I don't even see the same
• 48:17
  thing when I consult people starting a medical practice as
• 48:20
  an example, you know, you get analysis paralysis, overload
• 48:24
  paralysis over, you know, one simple thing that really if you
• 48:28
  just sat down and knocked it out, it would be done and then
• 48:31
  that would be passed you and you can move on with life, right.
• 48:33
  So, so you know, for that production aspect of it though,
• 48:36
  I do see that, you know, people are hesitant being in front of a
• 48:40
  camera. They might be camera shy, they
• 48:43
  don't want to, you know, look stupid in front of a camera,
• 48:45
  etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. Again, dude, you do not have to
• 48:51
  be on camera. You anyone creating a course
• 48:54
  business a course, you don't have to be on camera.
• 48:57
  You can literally just record audio and then have a slide deck
• 49:01
  on the screen. That's literally all you have to
• 49:03
  do. I have always found personally
• 49:06
  that when there is a face on the screen talking and then there's
• 49:10
  like a slide deck, you know, superimposed with that, I've
• 49:14
  always found that the the talking head there is actually
• 49:16
  distracting and takes away from the actual learning itself.
• 49:22
  So you will actually have a higher completion rate and a
• 49:24
  higher satisfaction rate in general, depending on what kind
• 49:28
  of course you're creating. But this is just a general
• 49:29
  statement. If it's just your audio, I think
• 49:34
  you've got a slide deck on the screen, maybe a video
• 49:36
  demonstration or something. If it's a procedure, you need to
• 49:39
  show people a screen share. If you're guiding people on how
• 49:42
  to, you know, upload a podcast episode or edit or whatever.
• 49:46
  So yeah, you do not have to have a tremendous amount of, of, of,
• 49:49
  of production here. I literally, I built $1,000,000
• 49:53
  container education course business with a $80 mic that I
• 49:57
  bought at Best Buy like a JBLI. Don't even remember what it was.
• 50:01
  It was one of those, you know, kind of crappier podcast, like
• 50:04
  you'd see like Best Buy, you know what I mean, $80, Mike,
• 50:09
  PowerPoint and Audacity, which is free.
• 50:13
  That's it. That was literally it.
• 50:16
  Yeah, no. And I think it's really a great
• 50:17
  point because, you know, even just in having this conversation
• 50:20
  with you, like I'm rethinking my strategy because I'm going, OK,
• 50:22
  well, God, I mean, like, you know, and I'm really bad on the
• 50:25
  content front. So I don't spend a lot of time
• 50:27
  espousing my expertise or anything.
• 50:29
  So I'm not putting myself out there in that way.
• 50:32
  So the reality is this course doesn't hinge on me or my
• 50:35
  popularity, right? The, the, the course itself
• 50:37
  would kind of hinge on the popularity of the topic or
• 50:40
  finding people who are actually interested in that topic.
• 50:43
  And, you know, so I mean, to be totally honest, like a slideshow
• 50:47
  and, you know, a little bit of information and maybe a couple
• 50:50
  little video demos of how to hook stuff up or whatever might
• 50:52
  be it. Like that's kind of enough, you
• 50:55
  know what I mean? And so, and instead I've built
• 50:57
  this whole thing, you know, it's called the podcast master class
• 50:59
  and it's sort of branded after this show and stuff like that.
• 51:02
  And so it's got this whole thing.
• 51:03
  So my thought was, well, God, you know, it's got to have this
• 51:05
  big media package and all this stuff.
• 51:07
  And like I say, it's, it's spun me out to the point of not doing
• 51:09
  it because I start going, oh, OK, well, you know, the video
• 51:13
  and then the editing and then, you know, sequencing everything
• 51:15
  and then gathering all the assets and blah, blah, blah,
• 51:17
  blah, blah. You know, when I've already got
• 51:19
  scripts, I'm already talking from a slide deck basically, you
• 51:22
  know, I mean, I've already got the deck.
• 51:24
  And so, so theoretically, I mean, and, and maybe this is,
• 51:27
  this is the point I was going to make earlier is that nothing's
• 51:30
  permanent either, you know, so like, if your version 1 isn't
• 51:33
  your dream version of your, your presentation, that's OK, Get out
• 51:37
  there, make some sales and then go reshoot or go, you know,
• 51:41
  whatever. If you want to improve it and
• 51:42
  you want to make it better for whatever reason, whether it's
• 51:44
  practical or just for your own edification.
• 51:47
  Like, you know, this is the beauty of everything being
• 51:49
  digital these days is that you can kind of have infinite do
• 51:52
  overs. You know, if you if my, if I
• 51:54
  want to roll out V1 of my course with slide decks and then V2 in
• 51:58
  six months with video production, You know, I mean, I
• 52:01
  don't know if one or the other would even move the needle If
• 52:03
  the if you know, we're doing sort of what you described as #1
• 52:06
  here, which is delivering on the promise.
• 52:09
  It probably would make no difference in your sales
• 52:12
  whatsoever if you did that. If you recorded it and then got
• 52:16
  it launched and then later on did a higher production video
• 52:19
  about, you know, about higher production video, whatever, it
• 52:23
  would probably not affect your sales whatsoever.
• 52:26
  At the end of the day, this is a business and your goal is to
• 52:31
  generate sales. That's what your goal is.
• 52:34
  So that should be the priority of whatever it is that you're
• 52:38
  doing is, is this going to generate income?
• 52:41
  And would these little tiny changes that I'm trying to make
• 52:44
  recording a video or having a professional editor and spending
• 52:48
  thousands of dollars on it or whatever, having a super high
• 52:51
  definition, you know, $1200 camera recording it versus your
• 52:54
  iPhone. Do those little things, are they
• 52:57
  going to increase the actual income, the revenue?
• 53:01
  They're not. They're just.
• 53:03
  They're just not. If you're solving a problem it
• 53:06
  no one gives a shit what it looks like.
• 53:08
  Well, it's an interesting point. And if you think about it, just
• 53:10
  even in practice, like think about the, the videos that have
• 53:13
  gone the most viral or the content that gets, you know,
• 53:15
  spread around the Internet, the the wide furthest and widest.
• 53:18
  Like it's not usually the high level production that somebody
• 53:22
  put together. You know, it's almost always,
• 53:24
  you know, some little candid home video of a kid making a
• 53:26
  joke or, you know, like whatever it is, you know, it's like, but
• 53:29
  it's almost always low fidelity, you know, no thought put into
• 53:33
  the production. The, the lighting's not perfect,
• 53:35
  you know, I mean, it's very rarely the, the really high
• 53:38
  production pieces are the ones that, you know, go viral or, you
• 53:42
  know, do all the, the metrics that people want.
• 53:44
  So. So I think, you know, that's a
• 53:46
  good way to at least look at it in terms of like looking for
• 53:48
  physical evidence that what it looks like matters less than the
• 53:51
  the quality of the content, or at least I guess the the
• 53:55
  content's ability to resonate with people.
• 53:58
  Because, yeah, it's, I mean, clear as day that like, video
• 54:00
  quality really isn't the the factor.
• 54:04
  I mean, as long as it doesn't look like shit, right?
• 54:06
  I mean, as long as you're not recording on grandpa's old
• 54:08
  camcorder, right? I mean, you know, I mean, as
• 54:11
  long as it looks decent, you know, I wouldn't record on just
• 54:15
  the little tiny, you know, crappy camera that's on your
• 54:18
  laptop. I wouldn't do that.
• 54:20
  You know, at least have some decent quality stuff.
• 54:23
  Yeah. And it probably ties a little
• 54:25
  bit to just like sort of credibility in general, right?
• 54:27
  I know you spend a lot of time talking about trust and
• 54:29
  authority and we've discussed a number of facets of that today.
• 54:32
  But I mean, like, you know, some of it is, you know, you don't
• 54:35
  want to look like this was shot out of the backroom with some
• 54:38
  sleazy apartment or something. Like, I mean, especially if
• 54:40
  you're going to try and sell this into a professional
• 54:42
  environment, you want doctors to buy this video that looks like,
• 54:45
  you know, you let your 3 year old run the camera.
• 54:47
  You know, it's like, you know it.
• 54:49
  I mean, there's a little bit of like boundary setting there,
• 54:51
  which is just, you know, OK, well I need it to look of a
• 54:53
  certain level of quality so that I come off credible.
• 54:56
  Right, right, exactly. It just it needs to be good
• 54:58
  enough, right? Like good enough.
• 55:00
  It doesn't don't make it doesn't need to look like, I mean don't
• 55:03
  want to look like crap. You don't want it to also look
• 55:05
  like something that's a professional cost you 10s of
• 55:08
  thousands of dollars to produce. It's not necessary.
• 55:10
  The the founder of Atari and Chuck E Cheese.
• 55:15
  Surprisingly, the guy founded Atari.
• 55:17
  Also started Chuck E Cheese of all things.
• 55:19
  Yeah, that's a range I. Know right Atari and then Chuck
• 55:23
  E Cheese. Like anyways, that guy, I forgot
• 55:26
  what his name was, but he has a quote.
• 55:29
  I'm probably going to butcher this, but this is basically what
• 55:31
  the quote is. It's just like, get your product
• 55:35
  out on the market. Even if you think it's too early
• 55:38
  to get it out on the market, get it out there.
• 55:41
  Even if it's going to break, get it out there and start
• 55:44
  generating sales and fix the problems later on.
• 55:47
  Because your goal is to get out there to get it out there as
• 55:51
  quick as you possibly can. As long as it's somewhat
• 55:54
  functional, as long as it still solves the problem, as long as
• 55:56
  it still delivers on that promise.
• 55:57
  Just get it out there. I mean, I've, I mentored a guy
• 56:02
  who started the continued education course business and he
• 56:07
  spent four months, that's it, four months.
• 56:09
  Super proud of this person. He spent four months building
• 56:12
  the continued education course business out, building the CE,
• 56:15
  the actual courses itself out. He spent four months building
• 56:18
  this out, then spent about three to four months building an
• 56:21
  audience after everything was completed and was just lots of
• 56:25
  content, all those kind of stuff.
• 56:27
  And within that 6 to 8 month range, he had generated almost 3
• 56:31
  or $400,000 in sales, with the business being less than a year
• 56:36
  old by the end of that year. He had $1,000,000 in sales in
• 56:41
  one year because he just got it out there.
• 56:44
  Fix the problem later on. Well, and I think for any of the
• 56:47
  entrepreneurs listening to this or whatever, I mean, I think
• 56:50
  anyone, if you spend time around like startup culture or
• 56:53
  whatever, one of the things that really push is this notion of an
• 56:56
  MVP. And the idea is it's your
• 56:58
  minimum viable product, right? So it's your V1, this is the
• 57:01
  first thing you're going to the market with, and it often has
• 57:04
  very little resemblance to whatever the final product is or
• 57:07
  the big thing that became famous or whatever.
• 57:10
  You know, there's all these examples, you know, I mean, even
• 57:11
  like Facebook, you know, it was like, I think it was like a
• 57:13
  dating site or something like that initially on college
• 57:16
  campuses. And then it evolved into being
• 57:18
  the world's biggest social media platform, you know, but from day
• 57:20
  one, you wouldn't have known that it was going to be what it
• 57:23
  is today, right? And so to the point that you're
• 57:25
  making about this, this gentleman, you know, I mean, he,
• 57:28
  you know, rolled something out. It's probably been refined.
• 57:31
  He's probably gotten questions over time from people and fixed
• 57:34
  those questions or addressed those questions or, you know,
• 57:36
  whatever. He's taking feedback, but he
• 57:39
  didn't let that lack of perfection keep him from just
• 57:41
  rolling it out. And, and I think that that's
• 57:44
  really an important point is because I think, I mean, there's
• 57:47
  the old phrase, you know, don't let perfect be the enemy of
• 57:50
  good. And I, and I think that that's
• 57:51
  sort of the, the thing that holds up so many people is
• 57:53
  they're just like, well, it's not good enough or they really
• 57:56
  want it to be perfect. And, you know, but I think that
• 57:58
  really is at least I know in my own life I've used that as a
• 58:01
  form of procrastination more than once, which is, yeah, I'm
• 58:04
  not going to launch this business until I get the website
• 58:06
  just right or what if the product isn't good enough, you
• 58:09
  know, or whatever. And so we just relaunched our
• 58:12
  company as a new business on the the first of the year.
• 58:15
  And that's been one of the things we've been rolling hard
• 58:18
  on, which is we're just refining this product all the time.
• 58:20
  You know, we rolled it out with stuff that was, you know, ready
• 58:23
  good enough. It would do a passable job of
• 58:25
  what we said it would do, but it's been something we've been
• 58:28
  iterating and iterating and iterating on even without
• 58:31
  customers asking, You know, just like we're making it bigger and
• 58:33
  stronger and more robust all the time.
• 58:35
  And you know, it's this consultative offer and and so
• 58:39
  we've been making it better all the time.
• 58:41
  But I think you could translate that into any business, any
• 58:43
  start up business, especially, you know, if you're going to
• 58:46
  roll out a new widget, you know, whatever widget A is probably
• 58:49
  not going to be as good as version 300, you know.
• 58:52
  But if you start, if you just get it out there, you know, you
• 58:55
  can actually start to make some headway, maybe faster than you
• 58:58
  think. And then use real live market
• 59:00
  feedback to actually evolve your product instead of just guessing
• 59:03
  and and ruminating on it in your own head.
• 59:05
  Yeah, completely agree with that.
• 59:07
  I mean, completely agree with that.
• 59:09
  It's just get it out, start the business.
• 59:12
  Every business I've ever started, I literally I had no
• 59:16
  business plan. I've never written a business
• 59:18
  plan in my entire life. It's a waste of time, complete
• 59:22
  waste of time. Instead of spending the time
• 59:23
  right riding the business plan, why don't you just go ahead and
• 59:25
  get the business started? You know what I mean?
• 59:27
  Do the shit you need to do to get the business up and going
• 59:29
  instead of riding out a business plan.
• 59:31
  Never wrote a business plan out. And every business I've ever
• 59:34
  started, I got up and running within one to two months.
• 59:37
  Like it was nothing crazy. I just what's the objective of
• 59:41
  any business? It's it's to make money.
• 59:43
  So what's the quickest way I possibly can get this product or
• 59:46
  service on the market? The fastest possible way and
• 59:49
  just get it out there. And that's what I would focus on
• 59:52
  and I can work out problems as they come.
• 59:55
  You know what I mean? My men's health clinics, my all,
• 59:57
  every medical practice ever started, The amount of problems
• 1:00:01
  that happened during the first three months of operations, I
• 1:00:03
  couldn't even tell you. I mean, it was an absolute train
• 1:00:06
  wreck, but I was treating patients, I was seeing patients,
• 1:00:10
  I was making money. Right.
• 1:00:12
  So the goal of the business was there with the elite nurse
• 1:00:15
  practitioner. I had absolutely no clue what I
• 1:00:17
  was doing at all. 0 This is the first time I ever created a
• 1:00:20
  course in my entire life. I don't even know if it was even
• 1:00:23
  good enough, right? And I listen to that course now
• 1:00:26
  and I'm like, man, I was such a newbie.
• 1:00:28
  Like I was such just a novice. Like when I listen to that
• 1:00:32
  course now and I've listened to a course I record now, you know,
• 1:00:35
  I mean, I've developed 50 plus courses at this point, pretty
• 1:00:38
  good at it. And but it was good enough,
• 1:00:41
  right? I just, I got it out there.
• 1:00:42
  I spent maybe 3 or 4 weeks on it.
• 1:00:44
  That's it. And I got it and I got it on the
• 1:00:46
  market, used a course hosting platform.
• 1:00:48
  I used Teachable of all things and I got it out there.
• 1:00:51
  I don't even know if the painted processor was going to work.
• 1:00:53
  I don't even know if the checkout page was really going
• 1:00:55
  to work. Whatever.
• 1:00:56
  I'd send an e-mail out and come to find out it was going to
• 1:01:00
  everyone's spam folder because of some stupid thing that I had
• 1:01:03
  the DNS server connection, whatever it was on the
• 1:01:06
  background I had to fix. So I mean, it was, it was a
• 1:01:09
  disaster really, you know, and it was, that was just just
• 1:01:14
  completely winging it the very first year of that business,
• 1:01:17
  completely winging it. And I figure stuff out as I went
• 1:01:21
  on, but I was still hitting the main objective and that's to
• 1:01:25
  make money. I'll still, but I was making
• 1:01:27
  money. I'm still delivering a product,
• 1:01:28
  still delivering a service, delivering on my promise,
• 1:01:32
  providing a solution and making money.
• 1:01:34
  Everything else is noise. You figure that shit out later,
• 1:01:38
  you'd work on it as you go. Yeah, no, I love that.
• 1:01:41
  Well, I think so many people just keep beating this drum on
• 1:01:43
  procrastination. I think so many people do keep
• 1:01:46
  themselves from finding that success or whatever because
• 1:01:48
  they're either trying to make something perfect that isn't,
• 1:01:51
  they're trying to factor in or guess every living thing that
• 1:01:54
  might happen and try and plan for those things.
• 1:01:57
  Or, you know, try and create their content in such a way that
• 1:01:59
  it's going to be applicable to everybody.
• 1:02:01
  Or, you know, like there's all these little things that we do
• 1:02:03
  that almost kind of our landmines that we put in front
• 1:02:05
  of ourselves, you know. And so I think it's really
• 1:02:07
  important to to share that message and what you just talked
• 1:02:10
  about, which is just, you know, just go do it.
• 1:02:12
  Stop wasting your time. You know, and I think that
• 1:02:15
  that's a really strong place to wrap up.
• 1:02:17
  So Justin, let's take a quick minute before we get out of
• 1:02:19
  here. Where can people track you down
• 1:02:21
  online if they want to learn more about you, if they want to
• 1:02:23
  check out your products, your services, anything?
• 1:02:26
  Where can folks find you? Yeah, super easy.
• 1:02:29
  I'm still old school. I still like e-mail.
• 1:02:32
  So if you, I mean, you want to ask me a question directly,
• 1:02:36
  e-mail me justin@procorestart.com.
• 1:02:41
  I will answer. I don't have AI, don't I don't
• 1:02:42
  have Avai, don't have a virtual system.
• 1:02:44
  I don't have an AI agent. OK, like I will answer it.
• 1:02:47
  So e-mail me if you have a question like I'm I'm, I'm, I'm
• 1:02:49
  happy to help. You can go to procorestart.com.
• 1:02:53
  That's just pro core start.com. You can check out, you know, I
• 1:02:56
  have content on there. Not as consistent as I preach,
• 1:03:00
  but I should be. But I do have a pretty large
• 1:03:04
  marketing budget, so I don't really need to be, Yeah, you
• 1:03:08
  know, so if you if, if, if you got a large marketing budget,
• 1:03:11
  you don't have to produce as much content, you know.
• 1:03:15
  Yeah. So I have a fairly large
• 1:03:16
  marketing budget at this point. But, but anyways though, but you
• 1:03:18
  can check out Procore, start.com, a lot of articles got
• 1:03:20
  some videos on there too. And we have a mastermind if
• 1:03:24
  you're interested in joining that, where I teach you how to
• 1:03:26
  do this step by step. Also have a, a pre recorded
• 1:03:29
  Evergreen course. So we're 15 hours long on how
• 1:03:31
  to, on how to do this the right way.
• 1:03:33
  So you can check that out as well.
• 1:03:35
  But yeah, my mom, I'm on all the social media pages too, except
• 1:03:38
  for LinkedIn. I don't.
• 1:03:40
  Linkedin's been a real thorn in my side, so I'll just get it.
• 1:03:43
  But yeah. I love it.
• 1:03:45
  Well, cool man. I appreciate you taking the time
• 1:03:47
  to talk to everybody today. Lots of really good information
• 1:03:49
  in there and now I'm inspired to stupid finish my stupid course,
• 1:03:52
  so I appreciate it man. Thanks so much.
• 1:03:55
  You're welcome. Absolutely, and thanks so much
• 1:03:57
  to everybody who tunes in the podcast this week and every
• 1:03:59
  week, and we'll see you guys next time.