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IFH 822: From Video Games to the Big Screen: The Filmmaking Journey of Nicole Jones-Dion · Indie Film Hustle® - A Filmmaking Podcast

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  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Indie Film Muscle Podcast, Episode number eight
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  Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome to another episode of the Indie Film Huscle Podcast.
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  Speaker 2: That's film bizbook dot com. Enjoy today's episode with guest
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: host Dave Bullis.
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: On this week's episode of the podcast, my guest is
• 1:56
  Speaker 3: a screenwriter, producer, and director co wrote Tech and two.
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: She eccessfully crowdfunded her film Debris, and now she's working
• 2:06
  Speaker 3: on a ton of other stuff which we're going to
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  Speaker 3: get into on the show with Nicole Jones Dion. Hey, Nicole,
• 2:12
  Speaker 3: thanks a love for coming on the show.
• 2:13
  Speaker 4: Oh thanks for having me.
• 2:15
  Speaker 3: You know, it's my pleasure to Coole because I think
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: you're the first person who have had on who is
• 2:20
  Speaker 3: also a member of the Screenwriting You Alumni series. I'm
• 2:25
  Speaker 3: pretty sure you are the first person. Oh cool, Yeah,
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: it's uh yeah. I don't know why I haven't had
• 2:30
  Speaker 3: anybody else on there yet on here yet, excuse me,
• 2:33
  Speaker 3: because you know, it's that that group is always doing
• 2:35
  Speaker 3: great things. And one of the reasons I wanted to
• 2:38
  Speaker 3: have you on here is because every time I turn around,
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: you're always up to something new. You're you're always creating
• 2:44
  Speaker 3: some great content. So that's why I wanted to have
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: you on. I think everyone could learn a lot from you.
• 2:50
  Speaker 3: So just to get started, you know, just learning more
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: about Nicole Jones Dion, I wanted to ask, you know, Nicole,
• 2:56
  Speaker 3: what made you get started in screenwriting and the film
• 2:59
  Speaker 3: industry in general.
• 3:00
  Speaker 5: You know, it's funny because when I moved to La
• 3:02
  Speaker 5: oh God, a long long time ago. I don't want
• 3:04
  Speaker 5: to exactly how long go give away my age, But
• 3:06
  Speaker 5: when I moved out here, I my intention was never
• 3:09
  Speaker 5: to get into films or screenwriting.
• 3:10
  Speaker 4: It was to get into the video game industry.
• 3:13
  Speaker 5: So I started out working in video games and then
• 3:15
  Speaker 5: I kind of segued into comics and then the stories
• 3:18
  Speaker 5: I was coming up with.
• 3:19
  Speaker 4: People were like, oh, the great movies, and I was like, oh,
• 3:21
  Speaker 4: that's such a clichet.
• 3:22
  Speaker 5: I don't want to be that shade Hollywood screenwriter. And
• 3:25
  Speaker 5: you know, flash forward and here I am. So I
• 3:29
  Speaker 5: think because I started out working in that comic book
• 3:31
  Speaker 5: and video game space, a lot of my my cream
• 3:34
  Speaker 5: plays and the genres that I'm naturally drawn to are
• 3:37
  Speaker 5: are these like, you know, fun sci fi action or
• 3:40
  Speaker 5: you know, horror, you know, just just these really fun
• 3:43
  Speaker 5: fanboy type projects. And you can see that in the
• 3:46
  Speaker 5: films that I've done, you know, if you look at
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  Speaker 5: you know, like Dracula the Dark Prince, which we did
• 3:50
  Speaker 5: John Voight, that's a very even though it's a Dracula film,
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  Speaker 5: it's more of a fantasy epic, you know, sword and
• 3:56
  Speaker 5: sorcery type take on the Dracula missos. And then tech
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  Speaker 5: In two, which is based on the video game series.
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  Speaker 5: You know, I kind of got that gig, you know,
• 4:04
  Speaker 5: directly through a Dracula and then also because I had
• 4:06
  Speaker 5: that tie with the video game industry and.
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  Speaker 4: You know, and then writing for the Sci Fi Channel.
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  Speaker 5: Which I did last October, I did an original film
• 4:16
  Speaker 5: for them, which aired as part of their Thirty Days
• 4:18
  Speaker 5: of Halloween series that was called They Found Hell. And
• 4:23
  Speaker 5: now I'm I'm transitioning into directing and I just directed
• 4:25
  Speaker 5: my first feature which is called Stasis, which is another
• 4:28
  Speaker 5: sci fi kind.
• 4:29
  Speaker 4: Of action films. But it's funny.
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  Speaker 5: A lot of people think of me primarily as a
• 4:33
  Speaker 5: horror writer, but my genesis of my career in the
• 4:38
  Speaker 5: start of it is really more in that sci fi
• 4:40
  Speaker 5: video game type space.
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  Speaker 3: So did you find that, you know, the video game industry?
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  Speaker 3: You know, I actually made a project for the video
• 4:51
  Speaker 3: game industry kind of sort of And what I found
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: is when I reached out to them, a lot of
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  Speaker 3: them were kind of leary, always about going and making
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  Speaker 3: things you know about you know, uh uh, you know,
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: different projects because of you know, X, Y and Z.
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  Speaker 3: So I want to ask, you know, Nicole, did you
• 5:06
  Speaker 3: find it it's harder or easier? And I know this
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: is that's a very run stroke. Did you want its
• 5:12
  Speaker 3: harder or easier in the video game industry to get
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  Speaker 3: your foot in the door than it is the film
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  Speaker 3: and TV industry?
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  Speaker 5: I think, I mean it changed. The video game industry
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  Speaker 5: changed a lot since I worked in it. I mean,
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  Speaker 5: just to kind of put it in perspective. When I
• 5:25
  Speaker 5: was doing it, it was during that weird time when
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  Speaker 5: they were doing live action video games. So it was
• 5:31
  Speaker 5: almost like a two short adventure movie that was.
• 5:33
  Speaker 4: Kind of a friend. So now I'm dating myself, people will.
• 5:36
  Speaker 5: Know that era and uh and at the time, and
• 5:40
  Speaker 5: that ended up being a failed experiment because you ended
• 5:42
  Speaker 5: up with all the cost and expense of making a
• 5:44
  Speaker 5: movie plus all the cost and expense.
• 5:45
  Speaker 4: Of making a video game. And so they got away
• 5:48
  Speaker 4: from that really fast.
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  Speaker 5: And now with you know, the way that the computer
• 5:51
  Speaker 5: graphics have advanced, it's like you're getting like these amazing
• 5:54
  Speaker 5: photo realistic results without having to do like a live
• 5:57
  Speaker 5: action shoot. But I would say because of the costs
• 6:01
  Speaker 5: involved in video games, it's definitely easier to do films because.
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: You can go out and shoot a little movie on
• 6:06
  Speaker 4: your iPhone.
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  Speaker 5: Now. Whereat with video games, you know, you've got programming
• 6:10
  Speaker 5: and and and and the solid modeling and the video
• 6:13
  Speaker 5: you know, all the tepee that that's intrinsic as part
• 6:16
  Speaker 5: of that process.
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  Speaker 4: I think it is the harder not to crack, especially now.
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: You know, you know, I remember all of those live
• 6:23
  Speaker 3: action video games too. I think there was one called
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: fox Hunt, and I remember, you know, trying renting those games.
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: I'm thinking to myself, this can't be the future ken
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: it and uh yeah, I remember that era where everyone
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: was doing at least everyone had one. There was someone
• 6:37
  Speaker 3: called Psychic Detective. I remember that one.
• 6:40
  Speaker 4: I mean there was kind of the big one with
• 6:41
  Speaker 4: Mark Hamill was.
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember that one too.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah, weird, It was a weird time. I think a
• 6:47
  Speaker 5: lot of people kind of try to forget that that
• 6:50
  Speaker 5: era even existed.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember that so well. Uh so, you know,
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  Speaker 3: you went to the video game industry and you know,
• 6:58
  Speaker 3: you tried your hand at that, and I agree with
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  Speaker 3: you completely. The video game industry has changed immensely because
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: I have friends who work in the video game industry,
• 7:07
  Speaker 3: and you know, even when I was pitching some of
• 7:08
  Speaker 3: my projects, things have changed even five from five years ago, now,
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: you know, I mean, and now look at us now, Nicole,
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: Pokemon Pokemon Go is the new uh you know, the
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: new craze. And they're they're they're making a mobile nes
• 7:20
  Speaker 3: system for sixty bucks and you know, I'm sure that's
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: going to be a number one best seller as well.
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: So it's like the retro now is, you know, making
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: a whole uh everything stickleholds. I'm trying to say, yeah, no.
• 7:30
  Speaker 4: It's amazing, it's amazing. I mean, an augmented reality is
• 7:33
  Speaker 4: such a fascinating thing.
• 7:34
  Speaker 5: I'm trying to avoided the Pokemon Go phenomena just because
• 7:38
  Speaker 5: I had this addictive personality and I know, once I
• 7:39
  Speaker 5: get sucked in that did I'm done. There goes my
• 7:41
  Speaker 5: productivity for the rest of my life. But I did
• 7:44
  Speaker 5: play Ingress, which is a platform that it was based on,
• 7:47
  Speaker 5: and and I think augmented reality is just fascinating. The
• 7:52
  Speaker 5: gameplay experience is really really interesting. And yeah, I think
• 7:57
  Speaker 5: there's it could be the way of the future, at
• 7:59
  Speaker 5: least way of the future.
• 8:00
  Speaker 4: For right now. It's a fun little trend. I'm definitely
• 8:03
  Speaker 4: keeping an eye on it.
• 8:04
  Speaker 5: I mean, uh, Nintendo's market value went up like seven
• 8:06
  Speaker 5: billion dollars a weekend just based off this one game alone.
• 8:10
  Speaker 4: So yeah, it's it's an exciting time.
• 8:13
  Speaker 5: It's exciding time for to be in video games, film, TV, anything,
• 8:16
  Speaker 5: because it's just the wild West right now, you know,
• 8:18
  Speaker 5: with all the new cable outlets and Netflix and Who
• 8:21
  Speaker 5: and everybody doing all this original content. It's it's it's
• 8:25
  Speaker 5: interesting because the rules are all changing and they're changing daily,
• 8:29
  Speaker 5: and it's like trying to keep you know, you don't
• 8:31
  Speaker 5: you can't even chase trends anymore because the trends are changing.
• 8:34
  Speaker 4: So it's like trying to figure out, you know, to
• 8:36
  Speaker 4: have to get one step ahead of that curve and
• 8:38
  Speaker 4: and stay ahead of the rest of the flock. You know.
• 8:41
  Speaker 4: It's fun time.
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and even with crowdfunding, you know, I noticed all
• 8:47
  Speaker 3: the video games now or we're just being crowdfunded because
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: they were you know, basically they company would say, hey,
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: we can't take a chance on these video games, so
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: that you know, the developers you know, would go out
• 8:57
  Speaker 3: and they would go make, you know, raise funds on Kickstar.
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: And I was shocked at seeing some of the prices,
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: you know, some of the amounts that they were raising
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: because I was thinking of myself, Wow, you know these
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: you know, I'm granting you these are the head developers,
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: you know, and they're coming out and saying, you know,
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: this is us doing this. But but still, you know,
• 9:11
  Speaker 3: I was a little shocked that they were getting the
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: the the amount that they were Yeah.
• 9:15
  Speaker 4: Well, because a lot of these the video game companies.
• 9:16
  Speaker 5: A lot of the board game companies too, are using
• 9:18
  Speaker 5: crowdfunding almost as a way of doing pre sales for
• 9:21
  Speaker 5: the product.
• 9:21
  Speaker 4: It's also as a way to test. Thanks could you do?
• 9:23
  Speaker 4: I do a lot of work now with Sean Cunningham.
• 9:25
  Speaker 5: This is the creator Friday the Thirteenth, and they just
• 9:27
  Speaker 5: did a big crowdfunding campaign for the Friday the Thirteenth
• 9:31
  Speaker 5: video game, which they just previewed at EAT three a
• 9:34
  Speaker 5: couple of weeks ago. And the gameplay looks amazing. So
• 9:37
  Speaker 5: if you're a fan of I'm gonna go do a
• 9:38
  Speaker 5: little pitch here. But if you're a fan of a
• 9:40
  Speaker 5: Friday the Thirteenth franchise, this looks really cool.
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: Well, and I'm a huge brand of it, so I
• 9:45
  Speaker 3: can't I can't wait for the video game, by the way.
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: But anyways, we know, you know, as we we follow
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: your career, I know, you know, you obviously transfer uh
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: you know, translated out of out of video games and
• 9:56
  Speaker 3: he started doing doing more feature films.
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: So how did you get you know, attached to writing
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: you know, Dracula the Dark Prints that one.
• 10:15
  Speaker 5: It was such a long.
• 10:16
  Speaker 4: Story, but I had met where to begin.
• 10:20
  Speaker 5: So I had written an adaptation of an image graphic
• 10:24
  Speaker 5: novel called The Scribbler, which I'd done for Kicktart Entertainment.
• 10:28
  Speaker 5: They went on to do Wanted with Angelina Julie and
• 10:31
  Speaker 5: James mcilvoy, and so at the time they were going
• 10:34
  Speaker 5: around shopping my script, approaching different directors, and one of
• 10:37
  Speaker 5: the directors that they had introduced me to as a
• 10:39
  Speaker 5: possibility was this gentleman by the name of Perry Tail.
• 10:42
  Speaker 5: And then the writer's strike happened and that project ended
• 10:44
  Speaker 5: up never going anywhere. But Perry and I stayed in
• 10:46
  Speaker 5: touch over the ears, and we collaborated on a bunch
• 10:48
  Speaker 5: of projects. And he had been approached with, you know,
• 10:53
  Speaker 5: the possibility of writing and directing this Dracula film, and
• 10:57
  Speaker 5: he's like, I need help with the script. Do you
• 10:58
  Speaker 5: want to come on board? And I was like, absolutely, dude,
• 11:00
  Speaker 5: you're my guy, you know, And so we we worked
• 11:04
  Speaker 5: on Dracula together, then we worked on Tech and together,
• 11:06
  Speaker 5: and then he just produced my first feature film. So
• 11:09
  Speaker 5: it's one of these ongoing, you know, long term relationships
• 11:12
  Speaker 5: show It's one of the things with this industry It's
• 11:14
  Speaker 5: all about building relationships, finding champions who are willing to
• 11:17
  Speaker 5: go out there and you know, put their necks out
• 11:21
  Speaker 5: for you, and you making that really good first impression,
• 11:24
  Speaker 5: and then that'll it'll just carry. You can build a
• 11:26
  Speaker 5: creaer out of that, or at least get your foot
• 11:28
  Speaker 5: in the door.
• 11:29
  Speaker 3: So when you got your foot in the door, were
• 11:32
  Speaker 3: you mainly doing like script out of pats or did
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: you come in with already having some of your own
• 11:36
  Speaker 3: original material already written?
• 11:38
  Speaker 4: Oh gosh, I had probably at the time I did.
• 11:41
  Speaker 5: Dracula, I probably had at least fifteen specs already on
• 11:45
  Speaker 5: the shelf that had won various contests and had been optioned.
• 11:48
  Speaker 4: Nothing that had actually gone into production at that point.
• 11:50
  Speaker 5: So with Dracula and Tech and those types of things,
• 11:54
  Speaker 5: those were all writing assignments that I was brought on
• 11:56
  Speaker 5: to either fixing fisting scripts or develop ideas from.
• 11:59
  Speaker 4: Scrip with the producers.
• 12:03
  Speaker 5: Yeah, but I would say that Stasis, which is the
• 12:05
  Speaker 5: script the Future that I just wrote and directed, is
• 12:07
  Speaker 5: the first time I actually pitched an idea. I was
• 12:09
  Speaker 5: hired to write my original idea. Everything prior to that
• 12:12
  Speaker 5: had been somebody else had an idea or had an
• 12:15
  Speaker 5: existing script that needed work, which is what ninety percent
• 12:17
  Speaker 5: of the industry is is developing other people's stuff.
• 12:21
  Speaker 3: So before you know, you wrote Drag, before you came
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: on the project of Dracula, you had written fifteen spec scripts.
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: So my question then is, Nicole, how did you find
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: the time to write fifteen spec scripts?
• 12:31
  Speaker 4: Oh?
• 12:32
  Speaker 1: You just do it.
• 12:33
  Speaker 4: You just.
• 12:34
  Speaker 5: I have no life, and I think I mentioned I
• 12:36
  Speaker 5: have an addicted person at company. So instead of once
• 12:40
  Speaker 5: I actually had to give up video games, I had
• 12:42
  Speaker 5: to give them up coul Turkey, which is really hard.
• 12:44
  Speaker 4: And but one of the things I.
• 12:46
  Speaker 5: Used to fill the void then is I just I
• 12:48
  Speaker 5: just write. I write constantly. I write every day all
• 12:50
  Speaker 5: the time. I have no life. I have no real
• 12:54
  Speaker 5: family out here in La I mean, I have my husband,
• 12:56
  Speaker 5: but all my family's back East, so I don't have
• 12:58
  Speaker 5: a lot of the normal day to data distractions that
• 13:00
  Speaker 5: other people have, and I can just immerse myself completely
• 13:03
  Speaker 5: in my work, which is fine.
• 13:04
  Speaker 4: Because I love it.
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: So, you know, just speaking about your work, you know,
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: could you deal with just a glimpse and you know
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: into your process, you know, is there a certain time
• 13:13
  Speaker 3: of day you write, is there anything any sier special
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: rituals you go through just to get sort of put
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: yourself in that in that writing mindset.
• 13:20
  Speaker 4: I tend to.
• 13:22
  Speaker 5: Because I'm kind of a night out and I get
• 13:23
  Speaker 5: because I tend to write things that are darker. Anyway,
• 13:25
  Speaker 5: I work better at night, which kind of sucks good
• 13:30
  Speaker 5: if you're working vampire hours, it's hard to associate with
• 13:33
  Speaker 5: the real world.
• 13:35
  Speaker 4: But yeah, and as far as rituals, I don't really
• 13:37
  Speaker 4: have any rituals.
• 13:38
  Speaker 5: I do have a treadmill desk that I use just
• 13:43
  Speaker 5: because sitting is is not good for you all day.
• 13:47
  Speaker 4: But I like working on that, and yeah, I just
• 13:50
  Speaker 4: do it at night. It's like something about when the
• 13:51
  Speaker 4: sun goes.
• 13:51
  Speaker 5: Down, that's when my creativity is at it's it's peak.
• 13:56
  Speaker 3: So do you do you subscribe to any method like
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: the USC sequencing method, you know, like you know the
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: three X structures say the cat. Do you do you
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: subscribe to any of these of these methods?
• 14:06
  Speaker 4: I do kind of a blend. I do Save the
• 14:09
  Speaker 4: Cat with you know what Christo.
• 14:11
  Speaker 5: Called the many movie method, which is essentially the sequencing method.
• 14:14
  Speaker 5: I kind of do an overlay of the two.
• 14:17
  Speaker 4: The event A lot of the structuring tools they're all
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: very similar.
• 14:21
  Speaker 5: There's a lot of overlap anyway, and if you just
• 14:23
  Speaker 5: look for the things that they have in common, I
• 14:26
  Speaker 5: would say those are the things to focus on.
• 14:28
  Speaker 4: You know.
• 14:28
  Speaker 5: It's like they all have turning points and act breaks
• 14:31
  Speaker 5: and inciting incidents, and.
• 14:34
  Speaker 4: There's there's some subtle differences.
• 14:35
  Speaker 5: But I found that by using Fath the Cat with
• 14:37
  Speaker 5: a mini movie method, that seems to cover most of
• 14:39
  Speaker 5: the bases.
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I've noticed there is a lot of overlap too,
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: especially with the USC sequencing method and Chris MANI movie method,
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: you know, but I think Chris so to me, I
• 14:51
  Speaker 3: really do like that many movie method, and I find
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: that that, you know, breaking in eight sequences really does
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: help me sort of plan out the movie, if you
• 14:58
  Speaker 3: know what I.
• 14:58
  Speaker 5: Mean, right, And it breaks the down into these smaller,
• 15:01
  Speaker 5: bite sized chunks.
• 15:02
  Speaker 4: Who it's not so daunting.
• 15:03
  Speaker 5: So when you're first starting out, you're not looking at
• 15:05
  Speaker 5: a blank page and thinking, oh my god, I have
• 15:06
  Speaker 5: to write ninety or one hundred and twenty pages. Now
• 15:08
  Speaker 5: it's like, oh no, I just have to get to
• 15:10
  Speaker 5: the next sixteen pages. And that's a lot more manageable
• 15:13
  Speaker 5: I can do, you know, fifteen pages in a day
• 15:15
  Speaker 5: or two and then you're like okay, and then we
• 15:17
  Speaker 5: go on to the next day.
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: So when when you're sitting down to write, you know
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: you sort of what what do you sort of need
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: before you write? Meaning do you need to sort of
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: outline this heavily or write even a treatment, or do
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: you just sort of get a starting point and just
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: sort of a map from there.
• 15:35
  Speaker 5: I'm a huge fan of outlining and advance, and I
• 15:37
  Speaker 5: think this is a really good skill set, especially if
• 15:39
  Speaker 5: you want to be a working writer in Hollywood, because
• 15:42
  Speaker 5: a lot of these producers and I'm just going to
• 15:44
  Speaker 5: hire you to write the script, They're going to need
• 15:45
  Speaker 5: to see outlines, They're going to need to see treatments
• 15:47
  Speaker 5: in advance.
• 15:48
  Speaker 4: It's it's a skill you're going to have to learn.
• 15:49
  Speaker 5: Se may as well practice those muscles while you know
• 15:52
  Speaker 5: you're working on your own specs. For me, I'm so,
• 15:56
  Speaker 5: I do have this one thing where it's like I
• 15:57
  Speaker 5: can't write a script until I do you know what
• 15:59
  Speaker 5: it's called?
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: And it's this weird hang up I have.
• 16:01
  Speaker 5: So I have to start with the title, and it's
• 16:03
  Speaker 5: so dumb and the title will change, but I have
• 16:05
  Speaker 5: to have it leave the title and then and then solid,
• 16:08
  Speaker 5: solid log line. I always refer back to my log line,
• 16:10
  Speaker 5: So I'll first things first, I write the title, I
• 16:12
  Speaker 5: write the log line, and then I start breaking out
• 16:14
  Speaker 5: the bare bones of it, you know, doing like the
• 16:17
  Speaker 5: breaking it up into the four acts, one act, the
• 16:20
  Speaker 5: first half of the second act, second half of the
• 16:21
  Speaker 5: second act, and then the third act, at least having
• 16:23
  Speaker 5: like a sentence for each, knowing what that.
• 16:26
  Speaker 4: Backbone is for the story.
• 16:28
  Speaker 5: And then I'll start getting deeper into that they have
• 16:31
  Speaker 5: the cat or the mini movie breakdown.
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: But yeah, I have to have.
• 16:35
  Speaker 5: At least at least the three or four page outline
• 16:39
  Speaker 5: flash treatment before I'm comfortable.
• 16:41
  Speaker 4: Starting actually writing the script.
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: You know, something I found out recently is something where
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: I basically I can't write unless I can build the
• 16:53
  Speaker 3: movie and then break it down again, you know what
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: I mean. Like it's sort of building and rebuilding, building
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: and rebuilding, and because I don't know why, but I'm
• 17:00
  Speaker 3: terrible with titles anymore, like titles to me, you know
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: what I mean, Like I just if I don't know
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: the title, what I do is I just sort of
• 17:07
  Speaker 3: go past, because I'll end up obsessing over the title
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: and all the like you know, I can't figure out.
• 17:13
  Speaker 5: What it is. Spend a day looking up for titles.
• 17:16
  Speaker 5: Also another thing I get hung up on. This is
• 17:18
  Speaker 5: just my weird little brain. I have to know what
• 17:20
  Speaker 5: my characters' names are, and names have to ask significance
• 17:22
  Speaker 5: to the story somehow, which you know this is.
• 17:25
  Speaker 4: I can't just call them John and Jane. It's like
• 17:27
  Speaker 4: they have to have a meaningful name.
• 17:30
  Speaker 5: I don't know, it's just my own little quirk, I guess.
• 17:34
  Speaker 5: But yeah, and for me, if I going back to
• 17:36
  Speaker 5: that log line, even like if I start to write
• 17:38
  Speaker 5: and it's not feeling like it's something's not working out,
• 17:41
  Speaker 5: go back to that log line.
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: Not always because my sanity check. It's like, is this.
• 17:45
  Speaker 5: Because you want to make sure it's high concept and
• 17:46
  Speaker 5: marketable and you can sell it and people get it,
• 17:49
  Speaker 5: and just as few words as possible.
• 17:51
  Speaker 4: And if I start to stray.
• 17:52
  Speaker 5: From that log line, I go back readjust course and
• 17:55
  Speaker 5: then dive back in.
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I often too, where I just put
• 18:01
  Speaker 3: in like you know, like you know, guard A guard B.
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: You know, I'm just trying to fly through it. But
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: I think you know, your method has a lot of
• 18:08
  Speaker 3: validity to it because characters suggest plot, and you know,
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: if you have a character and just sort of map
• 18:13
  Speaker 3: that character out and everything, you know, he or she
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: would dictate, you know what they do, you know what
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: I mean, because for instance, you know, a a upbeat
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: you know, you know, uh, you know, law bidding citizen
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: is going to handle problems differently than you know, maybe
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: somebody you know, you know born and they you know,
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: they they've decided to take a criminal life, if you
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: know what I mean. And they both had to, like,
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: you know, get something from somebody that each have incredibly
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: different methods of how to how to get that thing
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: from that person.
• 18:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and one of the things I'll do too. And
• 18:41
  Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I can't remember which book.
• 18:44
  Speaker 5: I got this from, but when you're when I'm looking
• 18:47
  Speaker 5: at the outline for the story, it's like you break
• 18:49
  Speaker 5: it down.
• 18:49
  Speaker 4: By plot, and then I'll go through and I'll and I'll.
• 18:52
  Speaker 5: Split it out and say, Okay, what are my three
• 18:54
  Speaker 5: major characters doing in each of these sequences? And you
• 18:57
  Speaker 5: always you have your protagonist, your antagonist, and it too
• 19:00
  Speaker 5: whoever the emotional character is. Sometimes it's a love interest
• 19:03
  Speaker 5: or a best friend or a mentor. But make sure
• 19:05
  Speaker 5: that each of them is doing something in every scene.
• 19:07
  Speaker 5: And the other thing to keep in mind is if
• 19:09
  Speaker 5: you want to have a compelling story, the antagonist is
• 19:13
  Speaker 5: the hero of his own story, so they need to
• 19:16
  Speaker 5: be doing something in opposition to the protagonist every time.
• 19:19
  Speaker 5: And so that's I'll break it down and I'll say,
• 19:21
  Speaker 5: I'll have the plot and then like a one fentance
• 19:24
  Speaker 5: description about what each my my protagonists, my antagonists, and
• 19:27
  Speaker 5: my emotional character are doing in that scene as well,
• 19:31
  Speaker 5: and that helps them.
• 19:32
  Speaker 4: In character arcs and theme. You know, having a theme
• 19:36
  Speaker 4: is also very important.
• 19:37
  Speaker 5: And that's a kind of a controversial topic because I
• 19:40
  Speaker 5: know some people have different definitions about what seem is,
• 19:43
  Speaker 5: but you know, it's just some sort of statement about
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: the universal human condition, you know, working that and that's
• 19:49
  Speaker 5: where that emotional character usually comes in, helping resonate, you know,
• 19:51
  Speaker 5: to become a change agent, to bring your protagonist from
• 19:55
  Speaker 5: wherever they are at the beginning of the film.
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor,
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: and now back to the.
• 20:05
  Speaker 4: Show through their character arc to the end to that
• 20:09
  Speaker 4: changed person at the end. And you can figure all
• 20:11
  Speaker 4: that out in the outline.
• 20:12
  Speaker 5: It's so much easier to do it in the outline
• 20:14
  Speaker 5: stays and write your whole script and then realize, oh,
• 20:18
  Speaker 5: nothing changed or.
• 20:19
  Speaker 4: It doesn't have the heart that it needs.
• 20:21
  Speaker 5: I'd much rather do all that work up front, in
• 20:24
  Speaker 5: the outline stage, when it's easier to fix and see
• 20:27
  Speaker 5: and see those problems.
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and you're you're you're ready too, because you know,
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: as I've found, you know, and reading other scripts and
• 20:35
  Speaker 3: you run my own scripts. The antagonist is sort of
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: the person leading the film because they're the sort of
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: the ones you know, in a superhero movie, that's the
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: superhero you know, meets the antagonist when the antagonist launches
• 20:46
  Speaker 3: their plan, you know what I mean, like and you
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: see that in the Avengers movies, So the antagonist and
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: even in horror movies like you know, Fire the Thirteenth,
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: Jason's the one sort of you know, going through the film,
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: and he's taken out these teenagers one by one up
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: until one of them finds, you know, oh my gosh,
• 21:00
  Speaker 3: where's my friend that they go look for they find
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: our dead body. Then Jason springs and attacks again here
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: stuff like that. You find the antagonist really is sort
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: of the engine of the whole story.
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's why you.
• 21:09
  Speaker 5: Have to spend much time developing your antagonists as as
• 21:12
  Speaker 5: you do your protagonist, and you know, and make them real,
• 21:15
  Speaker 5: flesh them out. Don't don't come up with the two
• 21:17
  Speaker 5: dimensional you know, mustache twirling villain. It's like, give them
• 21:21
  Speaker 5: a goal and a motivation and a reason for doing
• 21:23
  Speaker 5: what they're doing, and just you know, be evil for
• 21:26
  Speaker 5: the sake of being evil. Okay, sometimes you can get
• 21:29
  Speaker 5: away with that, but I think sympathetic villain, at least
• 21:33
  Speaker 5: empathetic villains are are always much more.
• 21:35
  Speaker 4: Powerful and much more effective.
• 21:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, very true. And you know you touched on theme.
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: You know, I was talking to another write about this
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: about whether the theme should be one word. I've also
• 21:46
  Speaker 3: heard theme should always be a question, you know, you know,
• 21:49
  Speaker 3: what would you do to achieve your goal? You know,
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: big question mark at the end there, you know, because
• 21:53
  Speaker 3: I've seen you know, like you were saying, you know,
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: it's always a statement about the the human condition. And
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: some people will have said, well, it should be a
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: quotquestion that the movie answers, if you know what I mean.
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean I don't.
• 22:04
  Speaker 5: I don't have like absolute you know, when it comes
• 22:07
  Speaker 5: to theme, it's like, yeah, sometimes it takes a form
• 22:08
  Speaker 5: of a question. Sometimes it's a statement. It just has
• 22:12
  Speaker 5: to be something universal and that everyone can relate to.
• 22:16
  Speaker 5: And I would also caution against, you know, writing from
• 22:20
  Speaker 5: a soapbox. You know where you're you're you have an
• 22:22
  Speaker 5: agenda that you're trying to preach down onto people. I
• 22:25
  Speaker 5: think that usually fall flat in the in the telling.
• 22:29
  Speaker 5: It's I think it's much better to take something like
• 22:31
  Speaker 5: a universal theme and then explore it from different angles
• 22:33
  Speaker 5: and maybe leave the ending ambiguous. It's like, what is
• 22:36
  Speaker 5: you know, like raise this big question, but then maybe
• 22:39
  Speaker 5: there are several answers and this is just one of many,
• 22:42
  Speaker 5: you know, And and the attack And I think in
• 22:44
  Speaker 5: the in the best stories, the antagons and the protagonists
• 22:46
  Speaker 5: are both trying to achieve the same theme, I guess,
• 22:50
  Speaker 5: or approach that same theme, but from different directions.
• 22:53
  Speaker 4: And you know, maybe you agree with it, maybe you don't,
• 22:55
  Speaker 4: But at.
• 22:55
  Speaker 5: Least now it'd opened a thought provoking conversation about who
• 23:00
  Speaker 5: we are as humans and that sort of thing.
• 23:03
  Speaker 4: I don't know, kind of cool.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that is an excellent way to put it.
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: And you know, because you know, I think when we
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: when when we when we get better I think, you know,
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: as I've realized too about when we get better at
• 23:15
  Speaker 3: certain things, like you know, for instance, you were talking
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: about writing the treatment in the outline, there's a skoes
• 23:19
  Speaker 3: you need to have. And that's also something that I've
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: realized too, is that you know, as we the more
• 23:25
  Speaker 3: the more of what we do, the better we get
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: at it.
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: You know what I mean.
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: Uh, that's usually a rule. Uh you know, a rule
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: fulm so this speak. And so when we when we're
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: writing a theme or treatment, or even when we're writing
• 23:36
  Speaker 3: you know, the script itself, We're we're always trying to
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: get better at doing those fine details. And that's that's
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: a trick of screenwriting though, because we're always trying to
• 23:43
  Speaker 3: put all these different skills together, you know what I mean,
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: building a world, building a character, writing compelling action lines,
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: writing compelling stories. You know, it's it's and themes and
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: all that stuff. That's why screenwriting, I think is so
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: challenging at the end of the day.
• 23:55
  Speaker 5: Yeah, and there's always room to grow, there's always room
• 23:57
  Speaker 5: to new to learn new things and trying news gills.
• 24:01
  Speaker 4: I'm always trying to get better. I'm never you know,
• 24:04
  Speaker 4: I've had four.
• 24:05
  Speaker 5: Films made and a fifth one that's in post production
• 24:07
  Speaker 5: right now. And I'm not an expert. I don't claim
• 24:09
  Speaker 5: to know it all. There's always things out there to
• 24:13
  Speaker 5: learn from other people, read script from professional writers who
• 24:16
  Speaker 5: are better than you, and push yourself.
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: To get to that next level because there's always room
• 24:20
  Speaker 4: to grow.
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: Absolutely, and speaker of some of those movies. You know
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: you had Tech and two because you use revenge. You
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: know that movie came out in twenty fourteen, so you know,
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: you know, how did you get you know, how would
• 24:34
  Speaker 3: usual you get board that project?
• 24:35
  Speaker 5: Well, it was the same people who had done Dracula,
• 24:37
  Speaker 5: so it really my Dracula was like was like a
• 24:40
  Speaker 5: proving ground and then they're like, oh, well, we'd like
• 24:42
  Speaker 5: to bring you, We'd like to invite.
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: You back for Tecan.
• 24:44
  Speaker 5: And Tecan had its own unique challenges because originally our
• 24:48
  Speaker 5: vision with that one was we wanted to do something
• 24:51
  Speaker 5: that was very, very true to the video game and
• 24:53
  Speaker 5: very true to the fan, because the director who was
• 24:55
  Speaker 5: attached at the time was like a huge TECHU fan,
• 24:57
  Speaker 5: very passionate about it, and we pitched them this awesome,
• 25:00
  Speaker 5: awesome thing, and that's not what they wanted to do.
• 25:03
  Speaker 5: They wanted to do something different, and so there's been
• 25:05
  Speaker 5: some a little bit of pushback from the tech and
• 25:08
  Speaker 5: community because they're like, this isn't really a tecond movie,
• 25:10
  Speaker 5: and I'm like, dude, I wish you could have seen
• 25:11
  Speaker 5: the original treatment because that was it was awesome. Then
• 25:14
  Speaker 5: you know, maybe someday that movie will get made. It's
• 25:17
  Speaker 5: just in this case, the producers wanted to do something
• 25:20
  Speaker 5: a little different. So we at the end of the day,
• 25:22
  Speaker 5: I'm just a hired gun.
• 25:23
  Speaker 4: You know, you'd give them what you You're there to
• 25:25
  Speaker 4: make the producer happy and give them what they want.
• 25:28
  Speaker 3: So yeah, yeah, you know, I agree with that completely.
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: You know, that's why you know, I have had friends
• 25:34
  Speaker 3: in simple situations and you know, at that point, yeah,
• 25:37
  Speaker 3: you you know, like you just said, you realize you're
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: the hired gun. You know, the producer. It's whatever. You know,
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: since they hired you, you're you know, you have to
• 25:44
  Speaker 3: deliver what they're looking for, you know. And I have
• 25:46
  Speaker 3: friends who are who've had similar situations when who are
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: trying to always force the issue and you know things
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: didn't go well. Let's just say that, Nicole.
• 25:53
  Speaker 5: Yeah, it's like, you know, you have to remember if
• 25:56
  Speaker 5: you're writing a spec that's yours, you can do whatever
• 25:58
  Speaker 5: you want. But if you're writing for someone else and
• 26:00
  Speaker 5: you and your job then is to take their vision
• 26:03
  Speaker 5: and make the best possible version of that vision. You know,
• 26:08
  Speaker 5: even if you don't necessarily agree with the vision that
• 26:11
  Speaker 5: that's not what you're there for.
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: I mean, you can raise objections or whatever, try to,
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: but at the end of the day, you work for them.
• 26:16
  Speaker 4: It's their idea.
• 26:17
  Speaker 5: Give them the best possible version of their idea that
• 26:20
  Speaker 5: you can.
• 26:21
  Speaker 3: Yes, yeah, I concur And you know, speaking of your projects,
• 26:25
  Speaker 3: we actually should moved and talked to you about Debris,
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: which is, you know, your short horror film. You know,
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: you actually raised just about twenty thousand dollars on Indiegogo.
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: You raised three hundred and thirty percent over your goal.
• 26:39
  Speaker 3: So I have to, you know, ask us, you know,
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: I have to ask you know, can you just give
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: us a little bit about what debriss about? And I
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: want to ask you too about you know, your crowdfunding campaign.
• 26:47
  Speaker 5: Yeah. Yeah, Debris was really funny because it was the
• 26:49
  Speaker 5: first time I tried to do crowdfunding and I was like, oh,
• 26:53
  Speaker 5: I don't know what I'm doing.
• 26:54
  Speaker 4: We're gonna this. This is going to be a mess.
• 26:56
  Speaker 4: So I only originally asked for.
• 26:57
  Speaker 5: Five thousand, which wasn't going to be nearly an to
• 27:00
  Speaker 5: get the film made. But I'm like, I don't, you know,
• 27:01
  Speaker 5: I don't know if I'll be lucky if I get that.
• 27:03
  Speaker 4: And then the fact that we were able to raise
• 27:05
  Speaker 4: you know, almost twenty was mind blowing.
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: I mean it got to the.
• 27:08
  Speaker 4: Point where I'm like, well, who all you people, and
• 27:10
  Speaker 4: why are you giving me money? I don't understand. And
• 27:14
  Speaker 4: I wish I could.
• 27:15
  Speaker 5: I wish magic formula wives so I could like replicate
• 27:19
  Speaker 5: it at will. And I've done another craft funding campaign
• 27:22
  Speaker 5: since then for another short film called Death Date, which
• 27:24
  Speaker 5: is also successful, but.
• 27:25
  Speaker 4: Not the same runaway train that Debris was.
• 27:27
  Speaker 5: And I think the difference is Debris just had this
• 27:30
  Speaker 5: really cool concept, like a really high concept that people
• 27:33
  Speaker 5: resonated with.
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: Into The concept behind.
• 27:35
  Speaker 5: Debris is in the aftermath of the Fukushima tsunami, you
• 27:39
  Speaker 5: had the.
• 27:40
  Speaker 4: Curse down on his luck.
• 27:42
  Speaker 5: Trikor Hunter is out with a metal detector on a
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: California beach and finds a curse Samurai sword that's washed
• 27:48
  Speaker 5: up on the beach from the Tukushima tsunami wreckage and
• 27:53
  Speaker 5: then he brings it home and the bad things happened.
• 27:55
  Speaker 5: But I think by having this, you know, there's.
• 27:58
  Speaker 4: People love Damma.
• 28:01
  Speaker 5: There's a huge like cult following, I guess, just around
• 28:04
  Speaker 5: Samurais and the fact that the story itself was based
• 28:06
  Speaker 5: on ourn actual Japanese legend, and there's been a variety
• 28:09
  Speaker 5: of films made in Japan about this particular store and
• 28:12
  Speaker 5: the bad things that happened to the people who own it.
• 28:14
  Speaker 5: But I thought this was kind of an interesting to
• 28:16
  Speaker 5: put Couden nowt like East me Sweat. You have this
• 28:18
  Speaker 5: very ignorant American finds a sword, doesn't realize it's dangerous,
• 28:21
  Speaker 5: and then why yeah, as his life slowly unravels.
• 28:24
  Speaker 4: So yeah, we made the short film and it I
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: think it's been in probably all god over.
• 28:31
  Speaker 5: It's been in over a dozen festivals like genre festivals,
• 28:34
  Speaker 5: been nominated for a bunch of awards, won a couple
• 28:36
  Speaker 5: of awards, And so with that one, now I've I'm
• 28:40
  Speaker 5: trying to turn it into a feature if possible. So
• 28:44
  Speaker 5: I've written a future version of the script, going out
• 28:46
  Speaker 5: to different producers and if I can find someone who'd
• 28:48
  Speaker 5: be interested in tackling the subjects on a broader on
• 28:51
  Speaker 5: a bigger scale, because there's interest. I think it's I
• 28:54
  Speaker 5: think it's a project that people like and would be
• 28:57
  Speaker 5: like to see more of, you know.
• 28:59
  Speaker 4: More of this story, more of the sword, and make
• 29:01
  Speaker 4: it bigger.
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: Is that online anywhere for everyonet to check out?
• 29:06
  Speaker 5: The trailer is a field online Because it's still technically
• 29:08
  Speaker 5: in the festival circuit, I can't release the film itself.
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: Well, probably we'll.
• 29:13
  Speaker 5: See where things are at by the end of the year,
• 29:14
  Speaker 5: but I think we'll probably finish our festival run.
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: By the end of the year and then maybe we'll well,
• 29:18
  Speaker 4: either release.
• 29:19
  Speaker 5: We're also looking into getting distribution deals internationally, so it
• 29:22
  Speaker 5: might be available on I don't know, video on demand
• 29:26
  Speaker 5: or something TV, whatever markets are available out there.
• 29:31
  Speaker 3: Cool, you know, yeah, I definitely think there was a
• 29:33
  Speaker 3: market for something like that. And you know, when I saw,
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: you know, how much by the end, I saw how
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: much this was, how much this is raising because I
• 29:40
  Speaker 3: think I donated five dollars to this or can't re
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: your market under my pleasure because I you know, I
• 29:47
  Speaker 3: checked on I checked it. I checked on it a
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: couple you know, a couple of weeks later, and I
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: saw well, you know, this is almost ending, and I
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: was like, wow, Nicole is killing it. I was like,
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: well three past their goal, I mean, and I thought,
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: you know.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 30:07
  Speaker 2: and now back to the show.
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: Either somebody a huge contact list or somebody, well, I said,
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: you know, somebody did something right, you know somewhere. You know,
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: either you have a massive contact list. You you know, you
• 30:19
  Speaker 3: have a rich, very rich relative. It donates you know,
• 30:21
  Speaker 3: money into it.
• 30:22
  Speaker 5: Oh wait, I have no rich relatives.
• 30:24
  Speaker 4: I wish.
• 30:25
  Speaker 5: No. This was definitely like the Bernie Sanders of the
• 30:27
  Speaker 5: crowd funny campaign. It with a lot of small donations,
• 30:30
  Speaker 5: you know, and they did to add it up over time.
• 30:33
  Speaker 4: And No, it was.
• 30:35
  Speaker 5: Really phenomenal just to watch the response to this idea
• 30:38
  Speaker 5: and this little film. It was really gratifying and it
• 30:40
  Speaker 5: gave us a lot of confidence that we were making
• 30:42
  Speaker 5: a story that people wanted, you know, the people wanted
• 30:45
  Speaker 5: to see, and that resonated with people and ye know,
• 30:48
  Speaker 5: and at the end of the day, that's really what
• 30:50
  Speaker 5: it's about, you know, telling stories that people want to
• 30:53
  Speaker 5: hear and maybe make them think a little bit along
• 30:55
  Speaker 5: the way.
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I concur and you know, obviously you know that
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: the concept was popular as well as you were saying,
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: and you know, there's always a crowd for an audience
• 31:07
  Speaker 3: for horror of any kind, you know what I mean.
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: There's always gonna be an audience for horror.
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 31:11
  Speaker 5: Well, and it's funny because you know, the when I
• 31:15
  Speaker 5: was doing all the research for Debris and then the
• 31:17
  Speaker 5: feature link script for Debris, I stumbled on this other
• 31:20
  Speaker 5: Samurai story and so I'm like, okay, I have to
• 31:24
  Speaker 5: write this when it's true story set in Fuel, Japan.
• 31:26
  Speaker 5: And that was a script that ended up winning the
• 31:28
  Speaker 5: Grand Prize at the Palm Street Films.
• 31:31
  Speaker 4: Okay, if you're writing competition. So it's like I went
• 31:34
  Speaker 4: to my little Samurai phase, I guess, and it's it's
• 31:38
  Speaker 4: it's great. I love it. I love action films. I
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: love martial arts films.
• 31:41
  Speaker 5: And so it's like I also I always coughd in
• 31:45
  Speaker 5: writers about you know, pigeonholing, because Hollywood will pigeonhole you.
• 31:48
  Speaker 4: And I'm like, you know what if this.
• 31:50
  Speaker 5: Is a whole I got stuck in, It's what I
• 31:51
  Speaker 5: wouldn't mind living in because I just love that space
• 31:53
  Speaker 5: so much.
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and you actually by the way, congratulations because you
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: just did you just did win the Palm uh Palm
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: Palm Street competition. I always was it on Monday, I
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: believe or tuesdays.
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: They just announced the winners like Monday or Tuesday of
• 32:08
  Speaker 4: this week. Yeah, so that that's that's very new.
• 32:10
  Speaker 5: And you know, and that was kind of interesting because
• 32:13
  Speaker 5: I don't normally enter contact because I'm a genre writer generally,
• 32:16
  Speaker 5: and and those unless it's a genre specific competition, don't
• 32:19
  Speaker 5: do well in these broad mainstream contests. But in this case,
• 32:23
  Speaker 5: because it was it was actually an action drama, you know,
• 32:26
  Speaker 5: set in feudal to pant with Samuraise and Pingis and
• 32:28
  Speaker 5: it's just like a you know, all kinds of blood
• 32:29
  Speaker 5: in action. Uh hey, you know, this one might actually
• 32:32
  Speaker 5: the standard chance and and then it ended up winning
• 32:34
  Speaker 5: the Grand prize.
• 32:35
  Speaker 4: So that was really gratifying.
• 32:38
  Speaker 3: So you know, I know you can't talk too much
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: about it, but so I wanted to ask, obviously, is
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: you know, what what upcoming projects that you what upcoming
• 32:46
  Speaker 3: projects you're working on that you can actually talk about,
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: if any if any easy to talk about.
• 32:50
  Speaker 5: I mean, well, let's see, so there's my my feature
• 32:53
  Speaker 5: film that I directed Stacis, which is currently amp post.
• 32:56
  Speaker 5: We already have distribution lined up for that, which is
• 32:59
  Speaker 5: really exciting to So that film is supposed to be
• 33:01
  Speaker 5: ready for as Sand which is in November, and that's
• 33:03
  Speaker 5: kind of at the Ya sci fi film. It's been
• 33:06
  Speaker 5: called Terminator for teens, so if you like time traveling
• 33:10
  Speaker 5: terminator type things, you know, check it out when it
• 33:12
  Speaker 5: comes out.
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: I think that'd be really cool.
• 33:15
  Speaker 5: What else I'm working, I'm right now, I'm trying to
• 33:17
  Speaker 5: raise money for my next feature, which is a horror
• 33:21
  Speaker 5: script that's based loosely on actual events.
• 33:25
  Speaker 4: So I don't want to get too much away of
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: that that but that one, in fact, seems like a
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: phone with you.
• 33:29
  Speaker 5: I have a call with.
• 33:31
  Speaker 4: The producer for that, so that'd be nice to get
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: that started production before the end of the year. And yeah,
• 33:38
  Speaker 4: what else, I'm just you know, I always got things
• 33:42
  Speaker 4: going on.
• 33:43
  Speaker 5: We're still in post production on Death Date, which is
• 33:45
  Speaker 5: the other short film that I did after Debris.
• 33:47
  Speaker 4: It's a meeting with my editor next week. We're going
• 33:49
  Speaker 4: to try to lock picture on that soon. And I
• 33:52
  Speaker 4: don't know, I mean, you just gotta.
• 33:55
  Speaker 5: Multiple irons in the fire, you know, waiting for something
• 33:57
  Speaker 5: to hit just keep on chugging.
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and that has excellent advice to Nicle. Before we go,
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: I have one Twitter question come in okay, and that
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: was Nicole, what do you look for when you're deciding
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: to be involved with a particular project?
• 34:16
  Speaker 4: That is always a million dollar question?
• 34:18
  Speaker 5: Right.
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: It's like it has to it has to appeal to
• 34:21
  Speaker 4: me at some level.
• 34:22
  Speaker 5: I don't know. It's hard to say. I'm because I
• 34:25
  Speaker 5: have this genre background. I love what I guess if
• 34:29
  Speaker 5: it were literature, if it called speculative fiction, basically Twilight
• 34:32
  Speaker 5: Zone types.
• 34:33
  Speaker 4: Things that appeal to me personally are things that really
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: cool twists at the end, or are just thought provoking
• 34:41
  Speaker 4: in some way.
• 34:42
  Speaker 5: I love like old sci fi from like the seventies
• 34:46
  Speaker 5: and eighties, when there was like some sort of like
• 34:47
  Speaker 5: social message, but it was buried within the context of
• 34:50
  Speaker 5: the film, you know what I mean, Like with Story
• 34:51
  Speaker 5: Lent Green and Planet of the Apes and logans around
• 34:55
  Speaker 5: those types of films I really like from a sci
• 34:57
  Speaker 5: fi perspective. On the horror side, I'm drawing more towards
• 35:04
  Speaker 5: what I call hidden realities, so less flashers, more paranormal,
• 35:09
  Speaker 5: more occult, more.
• 35:12
  Speaker 4: Supernatural type stuff. Uh, yeah, I don't know.
• 35:16
  Speaker 5: I did have to something that's cool, like if it
• 35:18
  Speaker 5: could be made into a video game or comic book.
• 35:21
  Speaker 4: Chank, that is are I'd like it because that's where.
• 35:23
  Speaker 5: That's my world, that's where.
• 35:24
  Speaker 3: I come from. Uncle. Very cool. You know, it's been
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: a pleasure having you on. And before I go, I
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: just want to ask Nicole, where can people find you
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: out online?
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: Oh?
• 35:35
  Speaker 5: I'm on Facebook.
• 35:36
  Speaker 4: You find me on Facebook. If you like weird news,
• 35:38
  Speaker 4: then totally follow me on Twitter. I'm at navars n
• 35:41
  Speaker 4: O v A R I S.
• 35:43
  Speaker 5: I post all kinds of wacky, weird news stories, conspiracy theories,
• 35:48
  Speaker 5: and every now and then I'll toss in a screenwriting kip,
• 35:50
  Speaker 5: just you know, for good measure.
• 35:54
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 35:54
  Speaker 5: But that's and I'm on LinkedIn too, but mostly I
• 35:56
  Speaker 5: like I live on Facebook and Twitter, so that's a
• 35:58
  Speaker 5: good place to look for me. Yeah.
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: I saw the tweet you just put out on Natural
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: predicts the end of Western civilization.
• 36:04
  Speaker 4: Yeah you all love Yeah stuff like that.
• 36:06
  Speaker 5: Let's talk with this stuff into the world stuff, conspiracy theories,
• 36:09
  Speaker 5: killer virus is gonna wipe out humanity.
• 36:12
  Speaker 4: If you like that stuff, follow me on Twitter. It's
• 36:14
  Speaker 4: full of it.
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: Nicole. I want to say thank you so much for
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: coming on and I wish you the best of luck
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: with everything, and I will see you in the Screenwriting
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: You Facebook group and well you know we'll be chat
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: in screenwriting there more. And you know, if you ever
• 36:31
  Speaker 3: need anything, please let me know.
• 36:32
  Speaker 5: Awesome, Thanks so much, David.
• 36:33
  Speaker 4: It is great.
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: a great job on this episode. If you want to
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: head over to the show notes at any film uncle
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: dot com Forward slash eight twenty two and if you
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: have it already, please head over to Filmmaking podcast dot com.
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: Subscribe and leave a good review for the show. It
• 36:53
  Speaker 2: really helps us out a.
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: Lot, guys. Thank you again so much for listening.
• 36:55
  Speaker 2: Guys, as always, keep that hustle going, keep that dream alive,
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: Stay safe out there, and I'll talk to you soon.
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Indie Film Hustle Podcast at
• 37:06
  Speaker 1: indiefilm hustle dot com. That's I N D I E
• 37:09
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• 37:11
  Speaker 1: dot com.