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Bills x Browns: Game Preview - How Bad Will The Blowout Be This Week? - Cleveland Browns Podcast for 12/18/25 · The Dawgs - A Cleveland Browns Podcast

• 0:07
  [SPEAKER_00]: Welcome to the Dog's Podcast with your hosts, Lake Renaker, Justin Charles, and Josh All.
• 0:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, what's up, dog pack?
• 0:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Welcome back to another Discord dog pack episode.
• 0:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Live here in the Discord with everybody.
• 0:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hangin' out, Josh, all, Kenny Mac, hosting the preview show today.
• 0:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've got the bills coming down from Buffalo to face off against our just crap-tastic, horrible, laughable, hilariously bad Cleveland Brown.
• 0:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: It will be a fun one on Sunday, one where another because there are things to watch for.
• 0:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: We do have some records in the works that certain players are aiming for, obviously there's the continued development and offensive quarterback play of Shidorah Sanders, what can he continue to show as an audition for next year?
• 0:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: All that kind of stuff we'll talk about everything.
• 0:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: here on the show if you want to be part of these dog pack discord episode in the future head to join the dogs dot com become official dog pack member on the patreon page sync up with the private discord that gets you access to everybody in the dog pack community and the 24 seven conversations that go on in there plus we play fancy football every year you get access to join those leagues we have dinosaur football the fancy football leagues
• 1:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: and of course these live shows that we're going to be doing once a week even after the season is over because there's going to be a lot of stuff to talk about which I'm sure we'll dive into some of that here today on the show.
• 1:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: Kenny, I guess before we get started, how are you doing today?
• 1:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: great great man.
• 1:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: I am looking forward to getting down to Cleveland this weekend.
• 1:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: I will be at the game.
• 1:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm thinking there will probably be a lot more blue than brown there this weekend.
• 1:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I am going to go see Miles Garrett.
• 1:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm putting it out in the universe.
• 1:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to go see Miles Garrett get not one.
• 1:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's going to get two sex get this record.
• 1:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to be there for it.
• 1:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: And after that, I'm going to get what happens this season.
• 1:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm ready for the draft.
• 1:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: I need some new players, new philosophy.
• 2:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: I need to see something different.
• 2:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe maybe should or I'll provide that with some offensive spark who knows.
• 2:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I just want to see Miles get his record and get it done and get it done before 16 games hit.
• 2:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Let's do it.
• 2:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I think Blake said it last week on the show after the game.
• 2:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to just be waiting until the next week or the very last week of the season to try to get this record.
• 2:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was on such a strong pace.
• 2:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: At one point, I think he was going to finish close to 30 sacks.
• 2:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: he was on pace for a one count.
• 2:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's kind of slow down.
• 2:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously, we lost Malik Collins.
• 2:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: We can't maintain the ball on offense or generate any sort of score, which means we're never playing with a lead.
• 2:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: So it's really hard.
• 2:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: My old scared is really up against it trying to get this sack record.
• 2:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I think that's one thing people need to do, take into consideration when you're watching the games and you're listening to these stealer fans online talk about how, well TJ, what did it in this amount of games or whatever,
• 2:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: Miles Garrett has it has done this and it's like I need to look at the numbers and like post this on social media because I have seen it But it's significantly fewer past rushing plays for Miles Garrett to have these 21 and half sacks than anybody in NFL history if I'm not mistaken So I'll look that up and get those numbers, but that's just something to keep in mind But I can't I hope you and Justin up there Sunday get to see it
• 3:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I'm excited for it, but I mean, don't forget with Miles Garrett, too.
• 3:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think he's close to or is he, I can't, I don't the stats of front of me, but he's somewhere high right now with tackles behind the line of Scrimmage, too.
• 3:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, he's leading.
• 3:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: He was like 33.
• 3:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: Both.
• 3:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's a great nomination for, you know, defensive player of the year.
• 3:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I think it's, it's somewhere in the 30s.
• 3:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: It might be like 33 TFLs on the season.
• 3:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think that's easily leading the league.
• 3:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: You guys, if anybody in the audience here remembers the stat, I think they threw it up on the broadcast last week.
• 3:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's, I'll have to see, it might be one of the most in recent histories, or recent season for TFLs in the season.
• 4:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's already at that point.
• 4:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, Miles Garrett continuing to dominate,
• 4:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now he's got Josh Allen, you know, MVP candidate last year's MVP winner coming into town looks like, you know, he's playing strong right now.
• 4:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: The bills are rolling toward the playoffs and I'll tell you what, Kenny, I'm thinking, let's see, Ash, and the Joker says I think he's close to the TFL record.
• 4:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know what, I'm going to look that up here next time Kenny takes over and talks for a second.
• 4:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'll look that up and get those numbers.
• 4:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: what I want to do here, Kenny.
• 4:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just want to do the preview for this game before we dive into talk and shit or Sanders or draft or any of these other things that I'm sure you guys down here in the audience would like to talk about today because honestly, if you've watched the last couple episodes this week that I've done, you know how I feel about this game.
• 4:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I didn't really even prepare anything.
• 4:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: for this preview because what I've done all season for these preview episodes, I go and I look at the stats for the two teams who they've played, what they're kind of trending, some of their players to see like where's where can the Browns take advantage?
• 5:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Two potentially win this game or if they're going to win this game, how's it going to happen?
• 5:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm done.
• 5:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm I'm done doing that.
• 5:11
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm done doing that with this team and I'm done doing it especially for a game like this where I already told you guys my prediction 41 6.
• 5:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think the bills come in here.
• 5:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's another blowout at home ugly empty stadium by middle third quarter Kenny and Justin will be the only two up there.
• 5:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: You guys can go sit wherever you want.
• 5:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Probably
• 5:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I just think it's going to be bad, but so I just want to talk about the game first real quick and then we'll we'll move on, but you got the ten and four buffalo bills are coming into Cleveland to face the three and eleven browns.
• 5:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: I find it very difficult to imagine this team gets a fourth win this year.
• 5:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I think it's a second straight three and fourteen season.
• 5:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: The bills are ten and a half point favorites on the road.
• 5:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Think about that real quick.
• 5:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they're 10 and a half point favorites.
• 5:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: In Cleveland, against a defense that earlier this season was heralded as like the best defense in the league, especially at home.
• 6:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now we are 10 and a half point underdogs.
• 6:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a 41.5 over under and the Browns are plus four, 90 to win the game, essentially no chance.
• 6:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like no one's given us a shot and held
• 6:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: and that's it.
• 6:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's pretty much my preview of the game, Kenny.
• 6:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: What do you think about this one?
• 6:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know what, man, I don't blame you and I love getting up in front of you guys and talking, but you want to talk about something with substance and you know for the effort given for the most part for most of these games is tough to
• 6:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, get up because our team doesn't get up for these for the game.
• 6:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: So how can you get up for this, right?
• 6:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Ultimately, where the bills are right now, they have an elite quarterback, something that we've wanted for so long, so long.
• 6:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: And the thing that's making them good is just a running game overall.
• 7:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think Cook's got over a hundred and fourteen or, sorry, 1,400 yards.
• 7:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: rushing and that's something that we're not doing well right now.
• 7:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: And if they just fits death by a thousand paper cuts and what I mean by that is just like three, four, five yards by James Cook and he's just running us up.
• 7:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean it's going to be hard for miles to get his, um,
• 7:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I mean, Miles number one, we can't have you run in up the field and creating these big running gap lanes and this kind of thing, guys, Brown's defense, listen to me, please play some run defense, get the bounce, get the bills in.
• 7:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: burdened long and you know give miles some opportunity because he's been playing his ass off for this record but I mean the one like with the with the bills what you have to do if you look at any other losses they just don't seem to score over 20 points how this defense can do it without Malik Collins from what we've seen I don't know you know but
• 8:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: uh... there is an opportunity after a big win for a let down uh... that could be a possibility but we would have to see of substantial amount more effort from them we saw last week we'd have to see some preparedness we'd have to see some gap integrity you know we'd have to see some receivers
• 8:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: hold the ball through the end zone and drop it into the lap of defensive backs and maybe we might have a chance but guys just play some football.
• 8:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: Get out there and show them why you're in the league and that's all I'm going to say.
• 8:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like begging right now almost because I put money down just to show up to this game and I want to see something.
• 8:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm with you man.
• 8:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm obviously not taking the or paying the money and taking the time to go to the game.
• 9:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I'm gonna watch it.
• 9:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna spend my afternoon watching it.
• 9:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I hate whenever I'm sitting there like, why am I doing this?
• 9:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like this just sucks.
• 9:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: And to talk about James Cook because I think that's, I'm glad you pointed him out.
• 9:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is the key to this game as James Cook because he's been,
• 9:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: freaking stud this year.
• 9:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: He already has almost 300 carries on the year.
• 9:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got 271 carries, and this is a smaller running back.
• 9:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like you said, 1400 yards.
• 9:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got 10 touchdowns.
• 9:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: He has games of 132 yards.
• 9:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: 108, 117.
• 9:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got an 87, then a 216, a 114, a 116, a 144, and last week, a 107, and a game where the bills were down.
• 9:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: What was it?
• 9:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: 21 nothing?
• 9:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: to the, in New England to the Patriots to the, I think they were at the time, I have seen leading Patriots of our member correctly.
• 9:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: And they came back and won the game.
• 9:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: They came back and won 35 31.
• 9:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think I said this earlier this week with the way our run defense has been playing in the last.
• 10:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: two months and just the pieces we've lost and the way the team just seems to quit on the field and we get so behind in games so early and we can never come back.
• 10:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: A hundred yards and two touchdowns for James Cook is my minimum.
• 10:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: My minimum for him tomorrow on Sunday.
• 10:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I mean, it depends.
• 10:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: There's our special teams going to give up 50 yards a kick, because then he won't get as much yards, you know what I mean?
• 10:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Because the field position will be so good.
• 10:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm being sarcastic, but I mean, the other thing is our special team just, our kickoff coverage and our pun coverage has just been awful this year.
• 10:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: He is the key to the game, and they're overall running game, because Josh Allen's going to get a couple of yards too.
• 10:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: He has 12 rushing touchdowns this year, I believe.
• 10:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: you know what the bills are very similar to the bears and that's why it's kind of hard are not hard really to prep for notes for this because they got to do the same thing.
• 10:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: They got to stop the run game.
• 10:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: You got to get the bills or the bears because it's the same thing into third and long and then you got to stop the pass and that's basically what they have to do but I just don't
• 11:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: see them stopping the run.
• 11:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: And if they do somehow, because they're in Cleveland, and they all have something to remember how to play like alpha dogs, maybe that's the thing.
• 11:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I'm like you, I don't see the Browns winning another game based on the effort given and how they're playing.
• 11:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, the effort given and the way they're, I'm just the way they're coached because he watched the way these guys open games and it's like, okay, what do we do all week?
• 11:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: How are we not, how do we look this unprepared to start a game every freaking week?
• 11:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: it's infuriating real quick.
• 11:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: I did want to mention I went and looked at those stats up.
• 11:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: So you guys in the chat, you're right Miles Garrett very close to the record for most TFLs in the season.
• 11:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: He's got 32 and that's second most all-time in the season.
• 12:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Number one is J.J. Watt with 39.
• 12:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: So he's seven away from tying eight away from having that record to himself.
• 12:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, again, I mean, getting guys behind the lion's scrimmage, everybody's got to have some kind of gap integrity, stay in their lanes, and he can get this record and hopefully become the defensive MVP, which will be bizarre for a team that is going to be looking at three and 14.
• 12:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: You mean defensive player the year actually win the MVP award?
• 12:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, defensive MVP.
• 12:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Sorry, defensive MVP.
• 12:36
  [UNKNOWN]: Okay.
• 12:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't think you'd be the MVP.
• 12:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, I mean, how much worse could we be?
• 12:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: There'd be more, way more offensive players that would be ahead of just the MVP.
• 12:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I was gonna say, yeah, there'd be no chance there, not on a 3 and 14 horrible team, but we got Brad or first person wanting to jump up here today.
• 12:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Again, if you guys need audience, wanna come up and talk.
• 12:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: This is gonna be pretty much open the rest of the way.
• 12:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: This game, we can talk about whatever other topics you guys want to talk about, cause you're kind of
• 13:08
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, uh, first thing, uh, pairs out to Greg Buffles family.
• 13:14
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, I know we're not really a NASCAR podcast, but that's a pretty big loss for the NASCAR world and everything.
• 13:22
  [SPEAKER_04]: So, pairs out to them first off.
• 13:25
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, the second thing, let's talk about the next depressing thing, our bounds.
• 13:32
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, uh, you know,
• 13:36
  [SPEAKER_04]: I was looking through, you know, history and stats and stuff.
• 13:39
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, do you know that Kevin Sophanski has had one more year than Marty Shotnammer had?
• 13:48
  [SPEAKER_04]: Really.
• 13:49
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
• 13:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, if that doesn't surprise me, I mean, Marty could have been here as long as he wanted, but art model ran him out of town.
• 13:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: So, you know, they are.
• 14:00
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and then like, and then I think I posted on there the other day, nobody acknowledged it.
• 14:06
  [SPEAKER_04]: But, um, damn, reticulano is a how he says name.
• 14:10
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
• 14:11
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
• 14:12
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
• 14:12
  [SPEAKER_04]: He was, he was here for about five, six seasons two and had the same records Kevin, he got fired too.
• 14:20
  [SPEAKER_04]: So.
• 14:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: I just wanted to have the same kind of had the same thing where they had, they were the cardiac kids, they hit, they hit up the AFC championship game and after that, they were just a mess for two years after that I believe you got to fire two years later.
• 14:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, so, I mean,
• 14:39
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, even like glossy sports and everything pretty much has like Kevin one of the higher percentages of being fired this off season and be it a crazy thing happened or Jimmy just like I was going to stick with the same regime.
• 15:00
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, we're definitely just going to have to, you know, we got three games left.
• 15:05
  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, I think everybody besides a few people in the chat and around me is kind of already looking at like the next head coach and, uh, so yeah, that's his camera.
• 15:20
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, if you look,
• 15:22
  [SPEAKER_04]: look at the injury port looks like the walking moon did right now and that you know that's this kind of where we're at and I you know just you know if I was very kind of like ah man three games left we suck I'm just gonna sit this out and get healthy for next season I feel it's like how some of the guys are probably already thinking just checked out sure I mean
• 15:53
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean.
• 15:54
  [SPEAKER_04]: You know, I would like to see the last three games just be somewhat competitive, but like the injuries are adding some players mentally and by just be checked out in general, injury check out.
• 16:10
  [SPEAKER_04]: We suck.
• 16:14
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I can see we're like, how's Garrett just like gets the sack record and
• 16:23
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, but uh, you know, it's just like, here we are again, and we could be an off season where, you know, we're looking for a head coach, maybe even looking for a quarterback, it's just, we're back into the cycle again, boys, and it's just, you know, it's just, you know, it's just, you know,
• 16:45
  [SPEAKER_04]: You know, I'm excited for the off seasons because it's hopefully we can rebuild this thing and fix it, but, you know, what throws a wrench into things is you never know like what coaching regime we're going to get after we fire Kevin, what their philosophy on quarterback play, what quarterback they want.
• 17:06
  [SPEAKER_04]: You don't know if Ann or Barry is going to be here or if he's going to get promoted and another GM is going to I don't know I don't know that situation But
• 17:17
  [SPEAKER_04]: There's just a lot of things up in the air and it's just, you know, oh, yeah, well, I was going to ask you while you're up here too.
• 17:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: First of all, let me just say to everybody who's in the audience here and then it's everybody listening after the fact, you know, going forward, I don't think there's a wrong way to feel about this whole thing.
• 17:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I said that earlier this week too.
• 17:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like if if you're in the camp of get rid of everybody, front office, coaching staff, go all new,
• 17:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think like your reasons for that are valid.
• 17:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't even need to hear them.
• 17:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: I know they're valid.
• 17:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: And at the same time, if you're like, no, let's run it one more year with AB or with Kevin or with both.
• 17:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I don't need to hear your reasons either.
• 17:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, they're valid.
• 17:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: There are reasons to go either way with this.
• 17:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: You guys know how I feel, but Brad, how do you feel what what would you do if you were in charge of, you know, this whole operation?
• 18:07
  [SPEAKER_04]: If that was, yeah, if I was the president or owner of this organization currently.
• 18:17
  [SPEAKER_04]: it would keep and you bury.
• 18:19
  [SPEAKER_04]: Okay.
• 18:20
  [SPEAKER_04]: And maybe some of the front office people I would get rid of the nine employed people we have for analytics that don't do anything right now.
• 18:33
  [SPEAKER_04]: But like I would keep him just for stability purposes because he's been with the scout team all year scouting for next year.
• 18:46
  [SPEAKER_04]: If you put another GM in this off season, it'll basically ruin what they were trying to build on.
• 18:53
  [SPEAKER_04]: And then I would do a hardcore coach search and really search for that guy that doesn't only elevate
• 19:14
  [SPEAKER_04]: A lot of things to help this team turn the corner again, be a locker room, yeah, and you know, and I do respect Kevin and the aspect of like he's an even kill guy, but like that only plays so well, when you do that just in general and don't like, you know,
• 19:36
  [SPEAKER_04]: push your guys to the next level and, you know, make them accountable for their mistakes or make your your coordinators.
• 19:44
  [SPEAKER_04]: And that's been the problem Kevin.
• 19:46
  [SPEAKER_04]: He doesn't.
• 19:46
  [SPEAKER_04]: He's not accountable for his coordinators failing him or having some par play on the field.
• 19:53
  [SPEAKER_04]: And that's my big thing I'm Kevin that I want to go on is because he just doesn't let people go that are
• 20:00
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, when you're in a job and you're doing sub-power work constantly, you get fired, you know, that's just, that's just the business stuff like that.
• 20:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, it's performance based business, too.
• 20:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, I mean, NFL, it's entertainment performance, and that's it.
• 20:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you're not performing and being entertaining, then there's no use for you.
• 20:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's cut throat, but that's just,
• 20:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's just the way it is.
• 20:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And do you guys remember the article that was written over the, I think it was after last season wrapped up some anonymous Browns players like, was it Jason Lloyd?
• 20:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can't remember who wrote the piece, but there was, you know, comments and there from players about how certain quarterbacks, aka Deshawn Watson, we're not being criticized for things in the film room because of whatever like they didn't want to go down that route or whatever.
• 20:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: So like when they're watching film, they wouldn't.
• 20:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: basically what you're saying.
• 20:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're not holding people accountable.
• 20:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you can see it on the field.
• 20:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we make the same stupid mistakes all the time.
• 20:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: How many puns is gauge larvae, they're going to screw up one way or another, just either muffing it or trying to touch it when you shouldn't, just doing stupid things.
• 21:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, and it's mind-boggling.
• 21:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: This episode is sponsored by Bodden Sports.
• 21:14
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• 21:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: You could find some really nice Christmas gifts for the athletes in your life.
• 21:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Obviously baseball season would be right around the corner in the spring.
• 21:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: They've got training balls, they've got regular game baseballs, bats, baseball gloves, all sorts of basketballs and other gear pumps, ball bags, gym bags, things like that for your basketball players.
• 21:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then the gifts that I really like to give family members and people like that would be the backyard games.
• 21:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Get those for Christmas gifts because then they can hold onto those and break them out when the weather gets nice and it's like that Christmas gift.
• 22:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: that didn't get used right away, Christmas, and they get to experience that joy again later in the year.
• 22:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Bad mitten, outdoor volleyball, bachi horseshoes, kickball, they've got a knockout game set, and of course pickleball, which I know I've been saying on here, I need to learn how to play.
• 22:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: I haven't.
• 22:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I do plan to learn at some point and I will be getting my first pickleball set from Bodden Sports so head over to botan Sports.com slash dogs and get 10% off your entire order with promo code dogs DAWGS when you check out.
• 22:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's botan sports BADEN Sports.com slash dogs.
• 22:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's super tough with him with that kind of stuff.
• 22:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: And that's where you kind of, it's why there's such a rudder-less ship right now.
• 22:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: The fans, he just, like he should have fired Andy Dickerson last year.
• 22:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, how long we, how long the prefer way too long?
• 22:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: We're holding on to Bob of a trauma way too long.
• 22:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: Joe Woods, you know?
• 22:59
  [SPEAKER_03]: And Joe Woods, thank you, you know, that's another one.
• 23:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: And it's just this never ending cycle of, you know, not being how accountable and like, it's the biggest thing that happens in business.
• 23:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: It needs to happen in pro sports, which is a business.
• 23:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, that's not happening.
• 23:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, one thing I'd like to hear though from Brad, though, is like,
• 23:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: who would be the coach to replace it because one thing that drives me nuts if air like, I mean, there's a lot of guys that's called first to Fansky since his since he went seven and nine to four years ago, right, or five years ago.
• 23:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: But nobody has a candidate.
• 23:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: What's your, what's your number one candidate?
• 23:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: Or what's somebody off the top of your head if you haven't really researched it well?
• 23:46
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, so I've been on back and forth on my top candidates, I have after research, but like I think I'm kind of tired and they're both on the Rams by the way.
• 24:17
  [SPEAKER_04]: And I know it's kind of like a, okay, maybe not, but like just hear me out kind of thing, another one maybe is and you got to look at the stats and everything and how his coaching career kind of got cut short with the jets is Robert Sala.
• 24:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: Now, I don't know right there on him yet, but I'm not gonna say, like, I don't know, like, I haven't, I don't know what he learned in his firing to make him better, but it's not to say that coaches can't be better.
• 24:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: And what is he taking from his second stint with San Fran right now and what can he move forward?
• 24:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I think I've said this before, they won't let me in the room during interviews, so I don't like it either, I don't know.
• 25:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm sure him, but give me what you think and why.
• 25:07
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, so I like Chris Shula, or the fact of, uh, obviously his bloodline, um, coaches well.
• 25:18
  [SPEAKER_04]: He's done a really good job with that defense.
• 25:21
  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh, we have it.
• 25:22
  [SPEAKER_04]: I know, I know like we're kind of like sometimes against like the defensive minded coaches coming in here.
• 25:29
  [SPEAKER_04]: That's why, you know, Rob Asal is one of them.
• 25:33
  [SPEAKER_04]: Uh,
• 25:34
  [SPEAKER_04]: But I've seen success with them as long as they bring a good offense a coordinator.
• 25:39
  [SPEAKER_04]: And I think him being under Sean McVeigh would at least he's learned that.
• 25:44
  [SPEAKER_04]: And the same with, you know, Michael for, I mean, obviously his brother does really well in green.
• 25:49
  [SPEAKER_04]: But I mean, the green base having come to Jesus moment with all their injuries, but you know, it is he can't get involved in the role.
• 26:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: So the last four out of five coaches that we had were offensive, right?
• 26:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: We had Schermer, then we had Patton, then we had Hugh Jackson, and the cup of coffee with kitchens, and then it would have been our guys to Fanski right now.
• 26:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yep.
• 26:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: And so maybe they do go defense.
• 26:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know.
• 26:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: And the guys, one thing that I've kind of read on the net, like what do you guys think about Bill Belichek and I'm not saying I'm pounding the table for them, but things aren't going well on Chapel Hill.
• 26:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: There's three teams he might coach for, but I don't see that when happening.
• 26:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: People are proud of the table for Jim Schwartz.
• 26:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: I wouldn't be comfortable with that unless it's Schwartz is like a guy that's, he's the head coach and he does not touch the offense whatsoever.
• 26:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: You have like the call-a-hands come in or something like that.
• 26:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: They, they run it and he does his own thing.
• 26:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: And then the other guy's John Gruden, I'm talking all about recycled coaches because
• 26:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: All the coaches that I mentioned previously, those guys are all first year coaches.
• 27:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 27:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: They needed to learn how to do things.
• 27:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: They made a lot of mistakes.
• 27:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, look at Stephanski.
• 27:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: There's times that guy should have kicked a field goal and we would have probably been better off into the game more than we were, right?
• 27:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: Or there's some stupid fork down conversion or whatever it is.
• 27:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: with these guys circumvent that who knows that might be too old, the game might have passed a buy like who knows, but that's why I'm kind of like figuring like, where's everybody's mind at?
• 27:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think you can tell by the type of coach, maybe we're the person out, we're the person who thinks that coach should be here is in life, maybe.
• 27:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: But,
• 27:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think it's interesting that everybody wants to fire, but this next solution.
• 27:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, so here's the thing I would caution, and I'm not saying it's not a good route to go, if you want to go the defensive coordinator head coach route.
• 27:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: The thing with that is, like you said, they got to be able to bring in a good offensive coordinator for the offense, and if the problem with having a defensive head coach on the offensive side of the ball,
• 27:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: is if your offensive corner comes in does a good job, they're getting hired for a head coaching opportunity next year or the year after something like that.
• 28:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to lose them.
• 28:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to lose your Ben Johnson.
• 28:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know Buffalo's going to lose their Joe Brady who I would consider as a candidate for this season.
• 28:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're going to lose your Clint Kubey act up and Seattle if you're Mike McDonald because of the job that they're doing.
• 28:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, if you get the offensive head coach,
• 28:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now, on the positive side, you've got the offensive system for that head coach and it's there as long as he's there, it's there and you're good to go the problem is if the offensive system starts to suck like Kevin's defense keys and doesn't adapt doesn't change gets figured out now you're stuck in a hole and you can't do anything either because now you got the offensive head coach and his offense and it ain't no good.
• 28:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: So
• 28:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is, it is really touching.
• 28:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I do think there's, I hear, I see people say like, there's, there's no candidates in this coaches, there will be candidates.
• 28:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: There will be guys come out of this coaching cycle to be successful NFL coaches.
• 28:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if anybody really thought Mike McDonald's gonna have the success in Seattle that he's having right away.
• 29:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that kind of stuff like there are guys that are gonna get jobs.
• 29:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: And it's gonna be like, oh, that was a good candidate.
• 29:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: So they're out there.
• 29:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: They will be out there.
• 29:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: who do you guys think is this year's been Johnson then because that's the thing like the show Ben Johnson is a Ben Johnson is a a unique thing man like there's no like this guy's been sought after for the last three years or whatever there's there is not that guy.
• 29:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: What do you think about Clint Kubiak?
• 29:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's been kind of kicking around.
• 29:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's got, here's what I like, he's got, he's got Jackson Smith and Nijigba go in, cooking.
• 29:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, what if he comes in here, grabs tate like we want, grabs an offensive tackle, and then, you know, you're gonna sign a veteran receiver, maybe there's one off of Seattle, or somebody he's familiar with in previous stents.
• 29:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, he drafts one and gets us off and's going, you know, maybe the cattle hands would want to come to work for him too.
• 30:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: They're all kind of on the same page.
• 30:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: And, you know, like, I think that would be as close as you could get.
• 30:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: to Ben Johnson and I'm not, I only brought up the defensive side just kind of as a devil's advocate and for what I'm reading.
• 30:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't want a defensive coach.
• 30:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: I want offense.
• 30:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: I want to see offense.
• 30:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think the Browns, like I made the point, they've hired four offensive minds for head coaching position in last five hires because we're star for offensive success that we haven't seen much other than when Nick Chub was here and making things look better than maybe they were.
• 30:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so if you do Clint Kubiak, I like that idea, Kenny, because I don't know if you signed a long-term deal.
• 30:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'd have to look that up.
• 30:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: But Rashid Shaheed just opted to get traded from the Saints to Seattle before the trade deadline because of Clint Kubiak.
• 30:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And point.
• 30:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: So if you hired Kubiak as your head coach, there's a chance maybe you get your hands on a Rashid Shaheed to go along with your hopefully car null tape.
• 31:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And you can revamp this wide receiver core a little bit, because it is bad, it is league bottom bad right now.
• 31:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: Dude, I don't want to keep anybody other than, and then bonds got some potential right you know Brad is there anything else before we see if anyone else wants to jump up here?
• 31:21
  [SPEAKER_04]: The only thing I'm going to say is
• 31:24
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, don't don't expect anything amazing on Sunday because it's probably going to be awful.
• 31:29
  [SPEAKER_04]: And it's just going to, and uh, I give a lot of crews to continue to go to the game.
• 31:35
  [SPEAKER_04]: Just to watch miles, but offensively brother, it's going to be rough.
• 31:40
  [SPEAKER_04]: Oh, I'm going to say.
• 31:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, they did.
• 31:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know what, I don't get the craft beer that I can get here there.
• 31:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: So I'm going to really enjoy those craft beers at the game.
• 31:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm going to get me a brought worse too.
• 31:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: There you go.
• 31:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: See, there's always things to look forward to.
• 31:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, if you just put your head in the right spot for these situations, real quick in the chat.
• 32:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Change your paradigm, man.
• 32:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's right.
• 32:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Ashen the Joker in the chat says Kevin is a, if things are going well, he can keep that boat afloat, but he can't be the head coach of a build this team up, get the ball rolling lay a solid foundation type of team.
• 32:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I agree, and my thing with Kevin Stephansky is like, if so the last two years, he's had to turn over play calling duties to Ken Dorsey, and now Tommy Reese, he's hired offensive coordinator last year.
• 32:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was Ken Dorsey to come in and revamp the offense this year.
• 32:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was Tommy Reese to come in and add some wrinkles to the offense or whatever terminology we were told and all that kind of stuff.
• 32:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: you've handed over play calling duties two years in a row.
• 32:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: What do you bring to the team?
• 32:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: If you're if you're not bringing a strong solid successful offense to the team anymore and you're not bringing any sort of player development over these last six years that we can point to.
• 32:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: and you're not bringing discipline to the games, you're not bringing good game management, clock management, in game decision making, all that kind of stuff, what do you bring to the table?
• 33:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I like Kevin as a guy and I appreciate and respect what he's done in the past with the Browns.
• 33:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: But that's over, that's gone and it's just, I feel like he offers no value right now to this team.
• 33:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's why I just think he's got to go.
• 33:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think everybody, the whole coaching staff
• 33:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jim Schwartz.
• 33:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't, I don't want anybody who's associated with this losing culture right now that we've had these last two years.
• 33:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't want, I want them all gone.
• 33:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I find it tough, too.
• 33:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: But, I mean, I was reading an article about from Dan Graziano and he, I think he's pretty connected.
• 33:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's got 10 coaches and in his coaching, like he's got number one.
• 33:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's got Vance Joseph.
• 33:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's got some guys we're speaking about.
• 33:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's got Joe Brady in there who are going to be seeing this, uh,
• 33:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Sunday, uh, Jesse Mentor, he's got couldn't could be back in there, but he, he listed nine out of his 10 and then as his 10th, he said he could go anywhere and it's Kevin's to Fansky and he equates Kevin's to Fansky to if he is available that he could jump any one of the candidates.
• 34:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: that he mentions in his article, and he would jump in short order similar to what Andy Reid did when he ended his tenure in Philadelphia, and I find that hard to believe based on the tape that's out there on the games in the last, let's say, two seasons.
• 34:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: I know the season's not done yet.
• 34:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: based on what you were just saying.
• 34:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: The other flip side though, you guys have heard me talk about this before.
• 34:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: Ever since the previous season started, so 2024, if I was Kevin Stephansky, I'd want to throw my card into quit because the stuff that I was given on offense to deal with, like why would I want to deal with that?
• 34:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: Why would I want to deal and redo everything with all these rookies that made the team?
• 34:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I'm coming in this year, I'm drafting two,
• 34:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: two rookie, two rookie quarterbacks.
• 34:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, if you draft two rookie quarterbacks, that means we're going to see two more quarterbacks this year, plus we started Joe Flacco.
• 35:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: So we were talking earlier about 15 minutes ago, about the same old, same old Browns.
• 35:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, what have we seen every year?
• 35:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: We've seen two three quarterbacks every year.
• 35:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: The defense is tired because we can't get an offense going because we never got anything going because of the two quarterbacks,
• 35:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm sorry, I have the three quarterbacks.
• 35:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Couldn't you really play that much in the preseason or get enough snaps?
• 35:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: So we're in the same cyclic...
• 35:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: Brown's football mentality were, it's always the next guy up.
• 35:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: We just got to stick to a guy and we got to make this work somehow because it's just super frustrating.
• 35:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, for sure.
• 35:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think Kevin Stephansky should he owes Joe Flacco a lot for helping him get that second head coach of the year award.
• 35:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: A lot of these analysts that have Kevin Stephansky is one of the top coaching candidates if he gets fired and all that kind of stuff.
• 35:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're hanging their hat to on that.
• 36:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, this is a former two-time coach of the year.
• 36:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't care about that anymore.
• 36:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: That does done nothing for this team the last three years.
• 36:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't care about two head coaches or, you know, a year of the head coach of the year works.
• 36:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can get out of my mouth.
• 36:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't care.
• 36:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't care because it's been four losing seasons in six years.
• 36:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: 2023 was on the trajectory to be a losing season until Joe Flacco came in and we got hot and then we saw how that went and the playoffs got absolutely obliterated by a defense that new our plays because we're that predictable because this offense sucks because he's not a good offensive coach anymore.
• 36:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Just is what it is in my opinion, but
• 36:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Um, does anybody in the audience now want to jump up here?
• 36:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: We could keep talking about the coaching stuff.
• 36:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: We could talk about, um, should or Sanders, the drafts.
• 36:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Uh, we, I, what was a Tony Rizzo yesterday?
• 36:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yes, Ben Cleveland said, from what he's hearing, the Browns are leaning toward drafting a quarterback in April, and then like last week.
• 36:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Mary case said that she thinks the Browns are trending towards sticking with should-or-sanders and then like the next day or the same day she said if I were in charge I would draft another quarterback in the first round and now today she comes out on 92 three of the fans as you say and that they're going to draft a quarterback or that she thinks they could just keep Kevin but get him a new quarterback next year so
• 37:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Cleveland media is all over the place.
• 37:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: They don't know what they even think or want.
• 37:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, what do you guys think?
• 37:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's hard.
• 37:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's hard to know because you can't really see anything, especially like when the last game of last week, lingers in your mind.
• 37:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, man, when you posted the one,
• 37:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: that what was it to DVOA post?
• 37:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: That was like super frustrating.
• 37:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: There was 11th worst game that those has ever been played.
• 37:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like 11th worst offensive output since 1978.
• 37:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: And man, like, you can't even take anything away that because the Browns played so bad last week.
• 38:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: It didn't even give the quarterback a chance to win.
• 38:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think there was an 8% or 8% of the players were,
• 38:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: Consider good like that's That that's so frustrating.
• 38:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: We're not that when that sits on your mind then you'd you're like you can't really think of anything Alcer what you can do or what can you do to get out of it other than you just go let's just restart We've been there been there done that that hasn't worked out tanking hasn't worked out so man what like what do you do?
• 38:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I see a lot of comments on our social media posts and on YouTube and stuff where people will say, well, I think you guys should get rid of Kevin and I think you should keep Andrew Barry.
• 38:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I can always tell when it's either a, like a Shador fan that's new to the fan base or just a new Browns fan in general, who just started paying attention because they're like, well, you guys should definitely keep Andrew Barry.
• 38:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: He had the best draft class in the league last year.
• 38:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, go look at the last five drafts that he's done before this year and tell me if you still feel the same way.
• 38:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: because they were bad.
• 39:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've had a couple, a couple starting players out of those drafts.
• 39:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's pretty much it.
• 39:06
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, a lot of the guys never stuck around.
• 39:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've got them traded them, whatever.
• 39:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's why the team is so bad right now.
• 39:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, they're all off a cliff like not playing, you know, like look at Sayaki Yika, you know, like I was pumped for that That pick awful, you know, like there was like this the Schwartz pick was a headscratcher Remember when we we we drafted DTR we were all like what is this like what are you doing?
• 39:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, it doesn't even it like the style of football that we play the the AFC North
• 39:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, and that was right after we had Deshawn Watson, and that was back in heading into 2023, and it's like, you got this guy you just traded all this draft capital for.
• 39:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: Why are you another pick on a rookie quarterback?
• 39:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, just sign a free agent to be the backup or whatever.
• 39:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, we already had who was a Josh Dodd.
• 39:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: It made no sense.
• 39:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's something that the decision making this organization just frustrates the crap out of me.
• 40:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, absolutely.
• 40:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I mean, you want offensive football, you know you need receivers.
• 40:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: And when's the last time that we drafted one eye?
• 40:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, we traded a second round pick for Elijah Moore and that didn't go anywhere.
• 40:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: And we're so bad on the receiver end this year that Elijah Moore got cut at the Buffalo Bills.
• 40:23
  [SPEAKER_03]: He went to a go play for Kansas City that had, they've got a glut.
• 40:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: of receivers.
• 40:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 40:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, he would at least get playing time here.
• 40:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: He knows what they're trying to do.
• 40:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: He's like, you know, and I'm going to play you on and get them all.
• 40:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 40:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And that's the thing.
• 40:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, you look at the wider receiver.
• 40:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: room for the Browns and I'm sure a lot of people out there that don't follow the team, closely like we all do or saying like how can this be so bad?
• 40:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's been this bad.
• 40:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: We cannot evaluate wide receiver telling, don't have been people's Jones is our number two receiver and acting as our defectal one at some points for a couple years.
• 40:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: And he was a six-round pick.
• 40:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: You got the only move that Andrew Barry has made at wide receiver.
• 41:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's been any good or probably provided any benefit with the Mari Cooper.
• 41:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's got a Mark Cooper for like a football pick.
• 41:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Give us two solid years.
• 41:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: The only receiver I think in Browns history would ever have backed it back a thousand plus you are receiving season to all that stuff.
• 41:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then he fell off a cliff.
• 41:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: But then he got like then he just swung on Jerry Judy and gave him a bunch of money.
• 41:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: Now we're stuck with Judy's contract because can't get out from under that one for a couple of years and he sucks.
• 41:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: And everybody he draft sucks.
• 41:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's such a gentleman can't play.
• 41:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's just...
• 41:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah, I didn't even stand the field.
• 41:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, and yeah, the, um, he just brought up the point there.
• 41:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Um, it'll come back.
• 41:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: Okay, but yeah, they'll keep going, sorry.
• 41:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so Ashon says, I pray we end up with the top pick, whether we trade down or take men dosa.
• 41:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think we can go wrong with an asset like that.
• 41:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I agree.
• 41:46
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, obviously if we have the number one overall pick,
• 41:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: you could do whatever you want to do with that.
• 41:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: You could say we're investing in Mendoza and that's going to be our guy or I don't know.
• 41:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe by the time the draft rolls around maybe Dante more jumps up and people's ranks to the I don't know how I was going to go.
• 42:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: He might go back who knows.
• 42:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Or you could trade it.
• 42:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 42:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: You could you could trade down to two or three and still stay in the top three.
• 42:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Get whoever you want.
• 42:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: You trade down to get help.
• 42:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: You wanted to go four or five if you wanted to to try to get.
• 42:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: your top receiver and then really start picking up draft capital.
• 42:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think there would be could we have to get another defensive tackle.
• 42:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's what we need.
• 42:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's what we need.
• 42:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Another defensive tackle that we suck up the middle.
• 42:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Imagine that.
• 42:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: Top five pick and we can't stop the run.
• 42:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Got to love it.
• 42:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Sorry, Mason Graham, just as what I did buddy.
• 42:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, so you're in a half the fan base mad that we're not using that pick to take the freaking quarterback and fix the problem then you're going to have half the fan base mad that we're, you know, sticking with shit or not sticking with shit or Sanders and just accumulating draft capital so.
• 42:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Brad's got his hand up.
• 42:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: I guess we'll bring Brad back up.
• 42:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nobody else wants to talk to today.
• 42:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Guys, what's going on here?
• 42:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nate, I see you in the chat.
• 42:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nate is the greatest.
• 42:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: We've got a dynasty semi final matchup this week.
• 43:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's in Brad's league.
• 43:05
  [SPEAKER_01]: Actually, Brad's the commissioner of that league.
• 43:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Nate and Nate are head to head this week.
• 43:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: So good luck, buddy.
• 43:11
  [SPEAKER_04]: And I hope you lose.
• 43:21
  [SPEAKER_04]: My own, my own league, my team completely fell.
• 43:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hey, that happens, man.
• 43:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: It just goes that your league doesn't always mean you're going to be the top dog.
• 43:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: I got some leagues I can miss first, just like, I don't know what to do this week.
• 43:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: I can't play this guy, this guy, it sucks.
• 43:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: So what's up?
• 43:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: What do you got on your mind now?
• 43:39
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, so my, my two scenarios for the draft coming up, um,
• 43:48
  [SPEAKER_04]: My first scenario is, and I know some people will be mad and some people won't, and especially Gage and Jordan.
• 44:01
  [SPEAKER_04]: My first scenario is we trade for Mac Jones, and then, whatever pick we got to give for Mac Jones, it shouldn't be a first or second, it shouldn't be like a third round or maybe
• 44:17
  [SPEAKER_04]: Keep the core racks we have, and then use the rest of the draft and the free agency, fix the line, draft wide receivers, and bring some talent back to this team.
• 44:30
  [SPEAKER_04]: So near your two is.
• 44:33
  [SPEAKER_04]: We draft a quarterback with our first overall pick.
• 44:36
  [SPEAKER_04]: And just draft some line and get a lot or see you're in the free agency.
• 44:42
  [SPEAKER_04]: That's two scenarios I have.
• 44:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, you know, when people say that stuff, and I know I'm, you're not saying it, but just for anybody listening, I hear a lot of people say, or just draft line, or just accumulate picks, and then you can just build up the talent.
• 44:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: You got to hit on the picks.
• 44:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we know this is Brown's fans, but for anybody new, like, just draft a line could be James Hudson, could be Zach Zinter, who can't get other fields.
• 45:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Jedrick Willes.
• 45:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 45:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, we don't exactly have a good track record of using our picks.
• 45:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 45:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Everybody new to the fan base is like, man, that's 25 class sure does look good.
• 45:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's the best class in league this year.
• 45:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Blah, blah, blah.
• 45:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 45:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: It looks really great.
• 45:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: But that's about it, man.
• 45:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like if you were back and look at the history, it's not pretty.
• 45:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: So that's where I'm a little more pessimistic about the draft scenarios, because I'm
• 45:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, is Andrew Barry in this front office?
• 45:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: What are they?
• 45:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: Are they 20 25 drafts or are they 20 23 24?
• 45:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Who are you?
• 45:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 45:39
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• 47:57
  [SPEAKER_04]: Blake was down to me because I like the the great I gave the drafted initially until I did some research.
• 48:05
  [SPEAKER_04]: But like, oh, I think this is because I went into that draft already pessimistic about berries ability to get playmakers on this team.
• 48:16
  [SPEAKER_04]: Minus a few grades he did.
• 48:19
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, dropping wise.
• 48:20
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean, but sat just just take out the defense players.
• 48:25
  [SPEAKER_04]: What other players has he really brought in here that has done anything to help this team succeed for the future?
• 48:34
  [SPEAKER_04]: Besides this year, obviously this year he hit.
• 48:38
  [SPEAKER_04]: Before that, he had a nobody.
• 48:41
  [SPEAKER_04]: I mean.
• 48:42
  [SPEAKER_04]: We had like what a higher second or third round pick that we traded for a live or more, that worked out real well.
• 48:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: Remember, it was Elijah Moore and the pick that turned into Cedric Tilman.
• 48:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: So still didn't work out.
• 48:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: But he took two shots of that pick.
• 48:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: got me out for it and said you know a lot of terrible track record with offensive players in the draft like we just haven't hit on anything and I'm not talking about this year.
• 49:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm talking previous years and I mean he would have hit on J.O.K., but again, that's not an offensive player.
• 49:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: He would have hit on Alex Wright.
• 49:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: He was pretty good.
• 49:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, what he got out of Emerson is good,
• 49:28
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I mean, uh, the only offensive line player he may have hit on is Luke, uh, Whiplier, yep.
• 49:40
  [SPEAKER_04]: Whiplier, uh, but he hasn't been on the field enough to see what we got.
• 49:44
  [SPEAKER_01]: No, but I do like what I've seen.
• 49:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I do think he's got potential to at least be a good depth piece on the interior for, you know, the future next year.
• 49:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: I guess would be his last year on his rookie deal, but maybe he could be our starting center.
• 49:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he's kind of in that middle ground right now where he could be good enough to be the starter.
• 50:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: Or he could just be good enough to be the backup movie forward, but either with.
• 50:06
  [SPEAKER_04]: I don't know.
• 50:07
  [SPEAKER_04]: And I give, I give a little grace to,
• 50:15
  [SPEAKER_04]: Duan Jones as of his injuries, but when Duan is in there, he's a pretty serviceable lineman.
• 50:24
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yep.
• 50:25
  [SPEAKER_04]: I wouldn't say he's like, you know, warfare any of the great lineman in the NFL, but he's serviceable, probably better than Jed Wills,
• 50:35
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think if they were able to get him back on the right side next year and he could stay healthy, maybe we got a good right tackle, good starting right tackle.
• 50:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't think they need to, I think they need to cut out the try to put him at left tackle nonsense.
• 50:47
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like I know you got Jack on the corner right now, you're not going to the next year.
• 50:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: Put the one back where it's comfortable.
• 50:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I just don't know.
• 50:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: The one can't stay healthy.
• 50:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, maybe you make him your swing tackle and he's a valuable backup.
• 51:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: And, uh, I mean, I don't think anybody strives for that to be backup, but man, like, it's show me a season that he can last more than six games, you know?
• 51:12
  [SPEAKER_04]: Well, I see him as a supposedly quarterback one that's collecting a paycheck on the banjo.
• 51:19
  [SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.
• 51:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, and that's part of his history as well.
• 51:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: So, K-dog here in the chat says, tell me what GM hits on every pick.
• 51:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: None.
• 51:25
  [SPEAKER_01]: None.
• 51:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: That is totally, nobody says the interviewer has to hit on every single pick.
• 51:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: But when you go draft after draft after draft, to accumulate no body that can contribute, like the thing is, okay, so I know we gave up first round pick for the Sean Watson.
• 51:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: We gave up like a second round pick and that trade too and all that kind of stuff.
• 51:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: But at the fourth round in on, you should be trying to draft guys that you think, okay, this guy has a chance to develop maybe into a starter or a good rotational piece, but at the very least, I'm getting my special team's units built here.
• 51:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: And we've got nobody to even contribute there, like back in 2020, I mean, just to go to Kenny's point on the offensive side,
• 52:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: that never worked out for anything.
• 52:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: The next year, I mean, we don't take any offensive players.
• 52:10
  [SPEAKER_01]: I believe Anthony Schwartz, I think was the only offensive player we took.
• 52:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, Demetric Feltan later on the draft was a total nothing.
• 52:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: The year after that, it was David Bell, who never did anything.
• 52:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: Trump, Ford, who sucks.
• 52:22
  [SPEAKER_01]: Michael Woods, who was just a nothing throwaway pick.
• 52:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: The year after that, said ring-tillman.
• 52:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: Again, like then Devon Jones was a pick that looked promising.
• 52:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: But then in the fifth round, they take DTR.
• 52:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: So what else could you have gotten instead of a backup rookie quarterback that was on your team for a year and a half or whatever was like that made no sense and now this year we go and we use two picks on two more quarterbacks.
• 52:45
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like at some point, you've got some drafting depth for other positions and quit taking throwaway picks at quarterback, because you know you're, you're really not likely take the names of it.
• 52:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're not likely to get your starting quarterback in a third or fifth round.
• 52:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: I understand Shador Sanders could be and looks like he might be an exception to this, but in general, Dylan Gabriel picked his new baffles, and he continues to baffle me.
• 53:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: I had to watch highlights, I had to watch highlights to Dylan Gabriel because I actually didn't see him complete long passes in college, but I really was scratching when I head after the first couple of games.
• 53:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm like, why can't this ball go any farther than the line of scrimmage?
• 53:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, maybe like can we throw a slant in there?
• 53:26
  [SPEAKER_03]: Something.
• 53:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: And looking back, I mean, he definitely can throw the ball, but it just doesn't have it for the NFL game.
• 53:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: I mean, watching Shidorah at least get these long passes has been great.
• 53:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: And we're going to get something other than that as well.
• 53:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I think he's got great timing for the short pass, the screen pass.
• 53:49
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like, I think it's something you can build around, but I mean, time will tell.
• 53:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: Let's see what he's got these last three games.
• 53:55
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, Brad, anything else real quick?
• 53:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Cause I'm gonna, you can ask one more thing or give another take your real quick and then I wanna get Nate up here.
• 54:03
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then we got about 10 minutes till we wrap up.
• 54:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: So we'll get Nate up here in the next regular, so we wanna come up here and get your hands up.
• 54:11
  [SPEAKER_04]: My, my take on the interior barrier overall is he's been a serviceable GM unlike the ones we've had before.
• 54:22
  [SPEAKER_04]: Um, service, although it doesn't when you champion trips, that's all I'm going to say.
• 54:29
  [SPEAKER_04]: And, and, and, but, you know, if we, if, if out of everybody, we fire, we keep in your berry.
• 54:36
  [SPEAKER_04]: I'd be okay with it, but at the same time, if we bomb another draft, and we still have them here, I'd be like, well, I guess I was wrong on that.
• 54:50
  [SPEAKER_04]: I'm just hoping that, like, with Paul the pedestrian and some other people gone, probably that Barry can just focus on coach drafting for football and not like analytics nonsense.
• 55:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I don't see the way that he runs the cap will buy him another year to get to shine a lot.
• 55:11
  [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe he's stuck here till the shine of Watson's out the books who knows.
• 55:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Maybe and I would just remind everybody to like before we go into this draft with two first round picks this year.
• 55:19
  [SPEAKER_01]: Remember Andrew Barry has made three first round picks and six years.
• 55:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: It was Jed Willes that didn't pay an out to much Greg Newsome.
• 55:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: We saw how that.
• 55:27
  [SPEAKER_01]: I mean, he was okay while he was here.
• 55:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: But didn't turn into a long term, you know, second contract
• 55:33
  [SPEAKER_01]: And now we got Mason Graham, who I like and has shown flashes, but at the same time, like I mentioned earlier, we're still getting gashed up the middle of every game almost every place, so I don't know.
• 55:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: I still have my I'm waiting to see Mason Graham really turning to the dominant player that he needs to be worthy of that top five pick.
• 55:49
  [SPEAKER_01]: But we got Nate, Nate Tist, the greatest on the stage.
• 55:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: What's up, buddy?
• 55:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's going on, guys.
• 56:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: I don't think I'm going to make it to the Cavs game this week, but I might try to get up sometime here in the next month or so, but you got you, I don't think I'm going to make it up.
• 56:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, okay, so we were talking about, okay, got you.
• 56:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I might see, let's see if we can work some out, but not 100% sure yet.
• 56:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: Got the Browns Christmas tree all done.
• 56:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: That looks awesome man.
• 56:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: That looks awesome dude.
• 56:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it took a while, but it's all done.
• 56:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: But my view on the whole GM and coach thing is, I don't think we're gonna make any moves at coach or GM until the Deshawn Watson contract is off the table.
• 56:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: Simply because
• 56:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: It gives you the ability to actually upgrade.
• 56:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: If you're going to try to replace everybody now, when we're still dealing with a lot of the other stuff, including how Barry does his contracts.
• 56:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, it's going to be really hard for any GM or any coach to come in and do something different while getting out from under that.
• 57:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, if you're really going to get out from under it and be functional in my opinion, I think we have to wait another year before we make any changes at coach or GM.
• 57:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: However, I do think the biggest need is an offensive coordinator because our offense has been hot garbage for long time, long time, long time.
• 57:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: It sure has.
• 57:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I know the way that I can agree with you more on, oh, go ahead.
• 57:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: I said, the way he structures the contracts, I, and I know that that's been, I talked about this the other day on the show.
• 57:29
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's beneficial.
• 57:31
  [SPEAKER_01]: When you do it with the right players, but now he's got a track record of doing it with the wrong players.
• 57:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like we're still paying guys like John Johnson and one thornhill and these guys in free agency that
• 57:42
  [SPEAKER_01]: bad decisions.
• 57:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: You know, so I'm afraid at what point do the bad decisions either continue to compound and just make it worse or will they stop compounding and he actually starts giving these contracts to the right players?
• 57:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, what is lost like you like we we we said this last week as well like who do you think really wants to come here and deal with the the Sarn Watson mess and not like the optics of it like the mess of the the salary cap You know like who wants to deal with that?
• 58:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: You got this guy you want to develop should or let's say you get a guy that's bought should or but you got this guy that's worth 70 million sitting on your bench like what do you do?
• 58:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know, and you look at, if you're a coach, you want to come in, like generally people want a fast turnaround, right?
• 58:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: So there's something that we're working on the team.
• 58:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: You probably have the quarterback in place.
• 58:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Probably have a stead receiver.
• 58:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: And there's some probably some holes on the offensive line.
• 58:38
  [SPEAKER_03]: We had like no offensive line, and like I'm taking a look at the free agents right now.
• 58:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: They're all free agents.
• 58:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: You've got to attract an entire offensive line.
• 58:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: Protect for the guy that you want to make look good, whether it should order to shine.
• 58:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: You're probably stuck with those two because are you really going to get Mendoza, didn't you got Shoulder who you invested two assets in, which maybe it doesn't matter.
• 59:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's a small contract You just eat it and get rid of them, but then you still have to show them once and sit in there, right?
• 59:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: And then you got to develop these guys how you're going to do it with what receivers do we have?
• 59:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know what you got to look at this and like, well, who can I all get in like it's just it seems like a lot of work You know in the first year, but
• 59:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: I just don't find it very attractive, and that's where I totally agree with you, or he probably would stay.
• 59:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I see Josh now going, I don't know if I can handle another year this, you know what I mean?
• 59:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think we're probably like if they were to play it, how I would play it, to give them more options is this year.
• 59:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: don't sign any long-term free agents.
• 59:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: Nobody over like two years because it gives you the ability to free up your cap in the future.
• 59:48
  [SPEAKER_02]: And then on top of that draft either skill linemen and skill positions and defensive players of need and like the things that you need to build around a quarterback because we don't have to go all in on a quarterback.
• 1:00:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: right now.
• 1:00:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if Mendoza's sitting there at a top pick and like it's not a huge deal, then take it.
• 1:00:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: But don't trade up for a quarterback when you're going to put him in a position where he can't succeed, even if he's good.
• 1:00:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like your better bet is to take and build the team, even if we have a shit quarterback play and terrible offense and terrible this for like a couple years on a row, we have the ability to get out from under it.
• 1:00:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's comparative.
• 1:00:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: We invest, like let's say we trade both first round and picks for a quarterback this year.
• 1:00:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: Well, we don't
• 1:00:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: Is compared to if we just build around the needs that we have, which is offensive line and you know, maybe a wide receiver and things like that then it gives you the ability to say okay next year We can either go quarterback or we can sign a veteran or we can do this because we have the capability to actually function in the off season is compared to just having to
• 1:00:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: like move cap because right now we don't actually like clear cap we simply move it down the road and allow the cap to expand like we're not actually clearing our cap.
• 1:01:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: So like it's something that the saints have needed to do for years and they won't do it and we see where it gets them.
• 1:01:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like the saints are still in the same position you know since jubries retired nothing's changed.
• 1:01:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: They just roll the cap and roll the cap and roll the cap and roll the cap and it gets them nowhere.
• 1:01:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: and probably be bad next year, and be okay with that, because it gives you the foundation to build is compared to cutting yourself down at the knees every year and expecting to get better.
• 1:01:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: I would rather just suck for a year, because we've already done it, we know what it's like, like it's nothing new.
• 1:01:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's not like it's some, you know, it's not like the Steelers where every Steelers fan would be, you know, pick at torches in the fucking in the streets if
• 1:01:51
  [SPEAKER_01]: It is but also think about that for just a second.
• 1:01:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: So if you're saying keep the coaching staff in the front office and then you have let's say it's it's three straight three and 14 seasons
• 1:02:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: You think Kevin Sefansky's getting called like a lame duck coach now.
• 1:02:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: How's it going to be next year when it's like, well, now I'm I'm in the midst of the next year next year we could have a different GM in a different coach and we would be able to attract a new like pool of coaches and GMs because we, if we like if we draft positions of need is compared to a quarterback, it gives them something more to build around and it clears the cap and it gives them another year to where we could just scrub the entire slate clean.
• 1:02:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: because I don't see another GM doing contracts the exact same way as Andrew Barry.
• 1:02:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: And if they are, it'll be a relatively similar situation anyway.
• 1:02:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we probably need to just write out another year.
• 1:02:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: And then if they want to do like a, like if they want to do like a not a full rebuild, but like a coaching rebuild, like that would probably be the best time in terms of like attracting actually good coaches and GMs.
• 1:02:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: But either way you look at it, it's not good.
• 1:03:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like we are just not in a great situation at all.
• 1:03:04
  [SPEAKER_03]: Dude, like yeah, if you're talking about another 3 and 14 season man, stick my head in the ground or something, what am I going to do?
• 1:03:12
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, I can't take this anymore.
• 1:03:14
  [SPEAKER_03]: And I've heard people talk about that.
• 1:03:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: I want to see some weather.
• 1:03:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you're fun.
• 1:03:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: I'm not excited either.
• 1:03:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: I just don't want to do what the Saints do, which is just now they kick the can and kick the can and it doesn't go anywhere.
• 1:03:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: I think we could set ourselves up to be not only cap compliant, but we could be sitting in a situation like the Patriots where they had a high draft pick and they had the most available cap in the football and they had barely any large contracts on the books.
• 1:03:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: So we would still have miles and we would have, you know, a couple, like not quite as massive contracts, but from like a cap position, management situation, any GM would look at that and, you know, be granting year to year.
• 1:03:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, especially because they'd have older picks, they would have high picks and they would have older picks.
• 1:04:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: And to go kind of back.
• 1:04:02
  [SPEAKER_03]: We got 11 picks this year, so we got, we're not using all 11 picks.
• 1:04:06
  [SPEAKER_03]: We got lots of void to fill.
• 1:04:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: That.
• 1:04:09
  [SPEAKER_02]: I would have no idea what you were taking three offensive linemen right out the gate.
• 1:04:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: personally, like I wouldn't have any issue with that as much as we need one receiver and we need some other things with how how much you have to pay offensive linemen right now in how inconsistent some of the large contract offensive linemen are, I wouldn't be that mad about it.
• 1:04:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
• 1:04:32
  [SPEAKER_01]: And to talk about the Deshawn Watson thing like, you know, I'm on over the cap right now, just looking at his contract.
• 1:04:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I still don't know exactly how this updates whenever I change it from cut pre June one to cut post June one.
• 1:04:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I know like even Jack does talking about well, now that we've restructured last year, like now it's a post June one in 2027.
• 1:04:50
  [SPEAKER_01]: But even if you go look at 2027,
• 1:04:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's a $25 almost $26 million dead cap, like we would be eating $25 million just to cut him.
• 1:05:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And then it's, we're still paying them almost $17,000, the next year in 28, and eight, well I'm sorry, 17 million, what am I saying?
• 1:05:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Eight million then in 2020, nine.
• 1:05:08
  [SPEAKER_01]: So I've got to feeling there's a chance, not saying it's gonna happen.
• 1:05:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: But there's a chance they restarct for the contract to get in this year, just to continue to lower that yearly cap hit and spread it out over more years, which would push it to 20, 28.
• 1:05:22
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't know, I think that's what you have to do.
• 1:05:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's just like this never ending cycle.
• 1:05:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: So, I mean, does you see time then, like, and who wants to, that gets me back to my original thought process.
• 1:05:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: Who wants to deal with that?
• 1:05:36
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.
• 1:05:37
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be a big challenge.
• 1:05:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: If we don't take a quarterback in the first round, I would assume that next year, because we don't really have veteran quarterback money, even if it's a lower budget veteran quarterback.
• 1:05:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: The situation we'd be in would be shoulder Sanders guaranteed for six to seven games, unless he's absolutely horrible, and then we'd be right back to Dishon Watson, like that would be the look, because there's not another quarterback on the roster, or probably available in our price range that would be worth doing something else.
• 1:06:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Oh, I'm sure.
• 1:06:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: But if we're setting some schemes in and Shader is bad, it's a losing season anyway.
• 1:06:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: So why not?
• 1:06:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll find somebody to waste a fourth round pick on or something.
• 1:06:15
  [SPEAKER_03]: I think he's in taking a hold of right now.
• 1:06:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: You're not selling me anything, man, because I'm like, I'm out of here.
• 1:06:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't want to pay nothing.
• 1:06:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: I don't want to go to this new place, because I don't have a big shiny receiver.
• 1:06:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: My quarterback sucks.
• 1:06:25
  [SPEAKER_03]: And he should have been in jail.
• 1:06:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: blah, blah, blah, blah.
• 1:06:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: You know what I mean?
• 1:06:29
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, not sure.
• 1:06:30
  [SPEAKER_03]: If I'm about to shine, obviously.
• 1:06:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I
• 1:06:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: I'm obviously, you know, being like, Germany fan here, not what I believe, but that being said, Jimmy has some runs of business and the business is to get season ticket holders in.
• 1:06:47
  [SPEAKER_03]: And right now, all the moves that we're talking about isn't selling anybody anything.
• 1:06:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: And there's going to be no excitement for next season.
• 1:06:54
  [SPEAKER_03]: So they got to do something.
• 1:06:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
• 1:06:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I kind of agree on that.
• 1:06:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: they do.
• 1:07:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, Nate is there anything else you want to say, ask, talk about real quick before we wrap it up here today.
• 1:07:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Uh, I'm all set.
• 1:07:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: Good luck in the fantasy matchup here this week.
• 1:07:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's going to be a dog fight comes out better.
• 1:07:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's going to be, uh, I think this is this might be the first game in that league that I'm not projected to win like I've been projected like a 60% win chance almost every week.
• 1:07:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: And I think I'm only projected to like maybe four points or something.
• 1:07:28
  [SPEAKER_01]: I forget what it was, but it's not much.
• 1:07:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't have you predicted it's not objective by much, so yeah, good luck man.
• 1:07:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll see how it's going to be a matchup.
• 1:07:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Trash talking all weekend.
• 1:07:37
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to get a knee.
• 1:07:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: First sure.
• 1:07:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right.
• 1:07:40
  [SPEAKER_01]: Always have a good one.
• 1:07:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: You too buddy.
• 1:07:41
  [SPEAKER_01]: We'll talk to you later.
• 1:07:43
  [SPEAKER_01]: All right, well, thanks again to everybody who jumped in here today to watch the show live down here in the audience.
• 1:07:48
  [SPEAKER_01]: You guys are rocking over in the chat, having conversations and throwing stuff out there.
• 1:07:52
  [SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate that.
• 1:07:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's always fun to be reading and seeing as you guys do that too.
• 1:07:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: So make sure you join us.
• 1:07:57
  [SPEAKER_01]: Well, we got two more of these life guys.
• 1:07:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: We got two more preview shows.
• 1:08:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: And oh, by the way, while I'm thinking about it next week, this show, the Dog Pack Discord Live preview for the Steelers game, will be on Tuesday.
• 1:08:09
  [SPEAKER_01]: at 5 p.m. Not Thursday because that's Christmas.
• 1:08:13
  [SPEAKER_01]: And not Wednesday because that's Christmas Eve.
• 1:08:14
  [SPEAKER_01]: Like, I'm busy both days.
• 1:08:15
  [SPEAKER_01]: It will be Tuesday.
• 1:08:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: So just remember that.
• 1:08:17
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'll try to put it in here in Discord, market calendars for that.
• 1:08:20
  [SPEAKER_01]: But I'll remind everybody Tuesday morning.
• 1:08:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: Kenny, anything else before we go?
• 1:08:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: You just do something not I'm going to have to have my poker stick out and like do something do something.
• 1:08:32
  [SPEAKER_00]: I think Browns.
• 1:08:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: Hey, hey, all the best to miles man get that record, get it done with and just if you have to coast for the rest of the year, whatever, but do something Browns come on, pull out of that tail spin and show that you're you know, put that tape out there for you got yourselves and play some football, let's go.
• 1:08:53
  [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, play some football because we haven't seen a whole lot of football being played by this team here recently.
• 1:08:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: So hopefully
• 1:08:59
  [SPEAKER_01]: I don't know.
• 1:09:00
  [SPEAKER_01]: Hopefully they surprise this.
• 1:09:01
  [SPEAKER_01]: I'm not optimistic.
• 1:09:02
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it's going to be a rough one again.
• 1:09:04
  [SPEAKER_01]: But either way, we'll be there for we'll be with you guys.
• 1:09:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: APM Eastern after the game Sunday night with our live reaction show.
• 1:09:12
  [SPEAKER_01]: I think it'll just be me and Blake this week because Kenny and Justin are both going to be at the game and fighting all that post game traffic and all that crap.
• 1:09:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: So again, if you want to be part of these discord lives in the future join the dogs.com, sign up for the patreon, become official dog pack member sync up with it.
• 1:09:26
  [SPEAKER_01]: discord hang out with everybody that you see here and there's so many more that you don't see here that are in the dog pack or in the discord all the time chatting it up having a great time it's a great community so join the dogs.com.
• 1:09:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: We will see you guys Sunday night after what I projected be a blowout but either way we get to see the raining MVP come in here and hopefully Miles Garrett gets the sack record like Kenny said you guys get to witness history and we get to quit worrying about whether or not he's gonna get it so.
• 1:09:54
  [SPEAKER_01]: Go Browns, we'll see you guys on day.
• 1:09:58
  [SPEAKER_01]: Over our knees.
• 1:09:59
  [SPEAKER_00]: Whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo, whoo,
• 1:10:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: This episode is sponsored by Kalshi.
• 1:10:36
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• 1:10:56
  [SPEAKER_01]: Will the Browns win their game this week?
• 1:10:58
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• 1:11:01
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• 1:11:24
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