Latest / Foul Territory / Rockies fire Bud Black, Red Sox owner meets Devers, 1st pitch takes

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Rockies fire Bud Black, Red Sox owner meets Devers, 1st pitch takes · Foul Territory

0:00
Speaker 1: But they should start working with him now. They shouldn't
0:02
Speaker 1: wait till a month from now and say all right,
0:03
Speaker 1: we need you to play first. Like he needs to
0:05
Speaker 1: be out there now taking crow balls every day. He
0:07
Speaker 1: should have already been out there.
0:11
Speaker 2: We got a lot to do, a lot, a lot,
0:13
Speaker 2: lot lot to do. Happy Monday, everyone. I would say,
0:16
Speaker 2: AJ probably had the most exciting weekend. How was your weekend? NYC?
0:20
Speaker 3: Uh? Yeah, I mean NYC. Let's see, we don't even
0:23
Speaker 3: want to get into flights. But flight on Friday night
0:26
Speaker 3: delayed so late. I had to take a flight Saturday morning. Flew. Uh.
0:32
Speaker 3: They showed the next game, by the way, on the
0:33
Speaker 3: big screen. The Knicks got stomped, so.
0:35
Speaker 2: Curbs they showed the big screen was on Queen.
0:38
Speaker 3: Do you check my Instagram?
0:40
Speaker 2: Not every day? Jeez, I take a weekend offs here
0:44
Speaker 2: and there. It was actually I was paying attention to
0:47
Speaker 2: something that you did. Now, Cratz Agent doesn't play anymore
0:51
Speaker 2: right in the bigs, but he's actually still making an
0:54
Speaker 2: impact in Major League Baseball. You know what I'm saying.
1:00
Speaker 3: He's a motivator. I mean he motivates his ex teammates.
1:03
Speaker 3: But I want to know before we get to that
1:05
Speaker 3: I want to know which city's better, Chicago or New
1:07
Speaker 3: York City? Better of Chicago? Are you kidding me?
1:11
Speaker 2: He's biased?
1:13
Speaker 3: Are you kidding me? It's not even is that a question.
1:16
Speaker 3: That's not a question. Totally, that's not even a question.
1:23
Speaker 3: So what happens when you're on a plane for and
1:25
Speaker 3: then you drive ten hours home overnight from college? Yeah? College,
1:31
Speaker 3: you went to college. You're not you can't handle college.
1:34
Speaker 3: You can't handle it. It's too much for you. You're
1:36
Speaker 3: more of a high school guy. It's okay. Yeah, no, listen,
1:39
Speaker 3: Chicago's better. But I mean I am biased. I do
1:42
Speaker 3: like New York for like a couple of days. But
1:44
Speaker 3: they did show that the Celtic True Story. I walked
1:46
Speaker 3: into Mendy's office and the game was just starting. I go,
1:48
Speaker 3: you know, the Celtics are going to crush it. He's like, no, no, no,
1:52
Speaker 3: And then they were lost by like thirty.
1:54
Speaker 2: They were going to sweep.
1:55
Speaker 3: I mean, you didn't think they were gonna lose by thirty.
1:58
Speaker 3: Mendy had no idea. Yeah, he had it on, and
2:03
Speaker 3: so was so was count No, no, actually counts on
2:06
Speaker 3: baseball and sorry, but the hoopscam was on the big
2:10
Speaker 3: screen at City Field.
2:11
Speaker 2: Leading up to the game.
2:12
Speaker 3: They had it on the whole time, even when they
2:13
Speaker 3: were down by forty, they still had it on.
2:16
Speaker 2: Okay, So lastly, from that game Cubs and Mets on Saturday,
2:20
Speaker 2: AJ was on the call. Ken was down there as
2:22
Speaker 2: well Kate Horton's debut, which we'll get to later in
2:24
Speaker 2: the show. Postgame, Dansby Swanson spoke to Ken and gave
2:30
Speaker 2: AJ a shout out. We're not going to actually show
2:32
Speaker 2: the clip because I feel like MLB will probably flag
2:35
Speaker 2: it and get us in trouble for it, but we
2:37
Speaker 2: can show the tweet which has the quote quote I
2:41
Speaker 2: will have to give Aj Perzinski a hard time because
2:44
Speaker 2: he told me I better do something cool today. Of course,
2:47
Speaker 2: Dancy had a home run in that game and his
2:49
Speaker 2: team won. That was the only game they won in
2:51
Speaker 2: that three game. Would you say to.
2:53
Speaker 3: Him, Oh, you got to remember I played with Dansby,
2:56
Speaker 3: so I was there when he made his debut. So
2:57
Speaker 3: I've known Dansby for ten years now, so when he
3:00
Speaker 3: was just a pup, Like it's so weird, did you
3:02
Speaker 3: call these guys like young kids? Like he's thirty years old,
3:05
Speaker 3: so you're like, man, this young kid, you know, but
3:07
Speaker 3: he was a pup when I first had him. In
3:09
Speaker 3: twenty sixteen, he first came up, so I just was
3:12
Speaker 3: talking to him in the dugout before the game. I
3:13
Speaker 3: was like, you know, congrats on your baby because they're
3:15
Speaker 3: having him and mallory're having a baby. And then as
3:18
Speaker 3: he was kind of walking away, I was like, you know,
3:19
Speaker 3: do some cool today so I can say something good
3:21
Speaker 3: about you. And he goes, what do you mean. I go,
3:23
Speaker 3: you don't hit a homer and flip your bat and
3:26
Speaker 3: he goes, I don't batflip, and I go, do it
3:28
Speaker 3: today just for fun. So he hit the homer and
3:30
Speaker 3: he didn't batflip. Of course he did it. He did
3:32
Speaker 3: not know and that's why Ken Kenham asked a question,
3:35
Speaker 3: because if he saw the bat, he took two heaters
3:37
Speaker 3: right down the middle, took the slider in the third
3:39
Speaker 3: one he whacked for a homer, and I said that
3:41
Speaker 3: he was setting him up because he took the two
3:43
Speaker 3: heaters and then he got the one and didn't miss it,
3:45
Speaker 3: and so Ken asked him. It was a great question
3:47
Speaker 3: by Ken, and then Dansby's answer was hilarious, and so
3:50
Speaker 3: then I text Dansby after the game and I said, dude,
3:53
Speaker 3: nice Homer, but what about the batflip? And he just said, thanks,
3:55
Speaker 3: but you know, I don't backflip, and then you know
3:58
Speaker 3: the standard keeping touch. Hopefully we'll get you on the
3:59
Speaker 3: show so soon he said he would come on. So
4:02
Speaker 3: if anybody out there wants Dansby Swanson to come on
4:04
Speaker 3: the show, he's great. He's great. We had an awesome
4:08
Speaker 3: Hopefully we can get him on soon because we had
4:10
Speaker 3: an awesome conversation about hitting in today's baseball and it
4:13
Speaker 3: was a different conversation than I've ever had with any
4:15
Speaker 3: other player. It was really awesome.
4:17
Speaker 2: Really, yeah, okay, so we can bring that on.
4:19
Speaker 3: You need to have him on to have him discuss
4:21
Speaker 3: what we were talking about. It was really it was
4:23
Speaker 3: in depth and it was it was like a two
4:25
Speaker 3: minute conversation, but it was one of the coolest conversations
4:28
Speaker 3: I'd ever had.
4:29
Speaker 2: Okay, so we're gonna work on It's on my notes
4:31
Speaker 2: scheduled Dansby this or next week, Monday through Thursday. We
4:36
Speaker 2: gotta have aj on for that one. So you weren't
4:39
Speaker 2: on Friday, obviously you're traveling. You got Fox game on Saturday,
4:43
Speaker 2: you did miss a little bit of drama. So we
4:46
Speaker 2: actually have an update since we last did our show,
4:48
Speaker 2: because when we last left the Devers drama, it was
4:52
Speaker 2: pre one on one meeting with owner John Henry. Now
4:56
Speaker 2: let's charge. On Friday, John Henry, owner of the Red Sox,
5:05
Speaker 2: Sam Kennedy, President of the Red Sox, and Craig Breslow,
5:08
Speaker 2: chief baseball officer of the Red Sox flew to Kansas City. Man,
5:13
Speaker 2: they really went for it. Flew to Kansas City courageously
5:17
Speaker 2: to meet with Raphael Devers after he kind of blasted
5:19
Speaker 2: Craig Breslow and said essentially he wasn't going to play first,
5:23
Speaker 2: at least not for now. Henry spoke directly with Devers.
5:26
Speaker 2: Preslo just said in a group interview that was on
5:30
Speaker 2: Nessing that he called the conversation productive, although he wasn't
5:33
Speaker 2: in that conversation and no decision had been made yet
5:36
Speaker 2: about Devers in first base. Alex Korra also was in
5:39
Speaker 2: on that conbo but not sure how much talking he did.
5:43
Speaker 2: Thoughts here on what's happening, It's a lot, We've had time.
5:49
Speaker 1: I'm gonna let Krats go. I guess Krat's got to
5:51
Speaker 1: talk about this dayDay. This is all you do is
5:53
Speaker 1: just if you got to fly the owner in the
5:55
Speaker 1: GM to a place, you got a problem. Now I
5:57
Speaker 1: did find out he doesn't have a no trade so
5:59
Speaker 1: he can be traded. So that's kind of a big thing.
6:02
Speaker 1: If they could trade. Now will someone take him? I
6:04
Speaker 1: don't know, but he can be traded.
6:06
Speaker 2: He's got a lot of money on that deal he does.
6:08
Speaker 3: Here's a lot of years and money. The thing is
6:10
Speaker 3: he's still young, but and he can rake. Uh, I
6:14
Speaker 3: don't know.
6:15
Speaker 1: Gosh, why wasn't Craig Breslow in the conversation they're mad
6:18
Speaker 1: at each other, you'd still be like, I want to
6:22
Speaker 1: be in the conversation. At least sit there and listen.
6:25
Speaker 1: You don't mean to have to speak.
6:26
Speaker 3: I don't know. This is this.
6:27
Speaker 1: Whole thing is the whole thing to me is just
6:30
Speaker 1: crazy that it's come to this and it all started
6:33
Speaker 1: because all they had to do is pick up the phone. Now,
6:35
Speaker 1: the question for me is Alex Cora, Craig Breslow, John
6:39
Speaker 1: Henry Okay, is Corus stuck between Breslo and and Endeavors.
6:43
Speaker 1: It seems like that, right, But then why would chorus
6:45
Speaker 1: come out and say he's not playing first base, no
6:47
Speaker 1: matter what. Now, was that a shot at the GM
6:51
Speaker 1: or is it a shot at the player?
6:53
Speaker 2: Actually, I'm going to go with option D none of
6:56
Speaker 2: the above. I don't think Core is on either side.
6:58
Speaker 2: I think he's in the middle island. I think he
7:00
Speaker 2: just doesn't want him to play in the field. I
7:03
Speaker 2: don't think it has to do with Devers or with Breslo.
7:05
Speaker 2: I think Breslo says, hey, I'm a GM, I want
7:07
Speaker 2: to maximize the lineup. I'm gonna put Devers at first
7:10
Speaker 2: Kratz for me. I think Alex Cora has it in
7:13
Speaker 2: his head that Devers is best on this team as
7:16
Speaker 2: a DH. Part of that could be he knows him
7:19
Speaker 2: and he wants him to just focus on hitting. Part
7:20
Speaker 2: of that end coming off a shoulder injury last year
7:23
Speaker 2: and barely played in spring training and all that. Part
7:26
Speaker 2: of it also could just be that Devers is a
7:28
Speaker 2: bad defender and he doesn't have a lot of faith
7:30
Speaker 2: in him learning the position midseason.
7:33
Speaker 3: Or the fact that the other guys like it might
7:35
Speaker 3: be just an equal sum the other guys, according to Cora,
7:39
Speaker 3: they already have an awful defense. It's just an equal sum.
7:43
Speaker 3: If they just keep putting over putting guys over there.
7:45
Speaker 3: They had Nick Sogard over there, they have Rome Gonzalez.
7:49
Speaker 3: I forget who else. Toro, Abraham Toro played there like
7:53
Speaker 3: he's like maybe just the package of anybody that we
7:56
Speaker 3: put over there. It's gonna equal devers learning to play there.
8:01
Speaker 3: In the middle of the season, where Breslo is looking
8:03
Speaker 3: at it as I have X amount of money in
8:07
Speaker 3: a guy I think really a lot of it hinges
8:09
Speaker 3: on Yoshida when he come if he comes back, I
8:11
Speaker 3: get it his you know, his injuries might be worse
8:14
Speaker 3: than what they're what we think. But if he comes back,
8:17
Speaker 3: how can you maximize the most value in that lineup
8:22
Speaker 3: getting the most guys in? And I don't know any
8:25
Speaker 3: I don't know any GM who's like, man, I just
8:27
Speaker 3: want to have one dude pigeonholed at DH. It feels
8:30
Speaker 3: like it kind of comes down to some teams pigeonholing
8:34
Speaker 3: a guy at DH, like all right, well, this guy
8:36
Speaker 3: can't play right field anymore, so we'll put him at DH.
8:39
Speaker 3: And I think as a GM, it kind of really
8:41
Speaker 3: pushes you into a corner. And Chorus sees it day
8:44
Speaker 3: in and day out. And he's like, first base, ain't
8:46
Speaker 3: that easy. I'd rather take somebody that's a little more
8:48
Speaker 3: athletic and try to get them going.
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9:53
Speaker 3: It goes back to the original conversation that they had
9:56
Speaker 3: with the Rapidevers after they signed Bragman. Just pick up
9:58
Speaker 3: the phone and say, hey, we're thinking about signing Bragman.
10:02
Speaker 3: Are you okay with that? He's not gonna say he
10:04
Speaker 3: can't say no. He'll say yes now. And then the
10:07
Speaker 3: next question, obviously, is where am I gonna play? You
10:09
Speaker 3: promised me to be the third baseman and I'm not
10:11
Speaker 3: the third baseman. Fine, you have that conversation, but you
10:14
Speaker 3: try to do that pre Bragman signing, which they messed up. Okay,
10:17
Speaker 3: stuff happens.
10:19
Speaker 1: The next thing, though, is why is Alex Bragman so
10:21
Speaker 1: adamant that he doesn't play in the field? And now
10:23
Speaker 1: I get crats aside, like he has a bad shoulder,
10:25
Speaker 1: But why would he not take that Devors? But why
10:27
Speaker 1: would he not take ground balls somewhere? Just take him
10:30
Speaker 1: at third, take him at fir VP, walk out there
10:32
Speaker 1: and take twenty ground balls you can get Because no
10:36
Speaker 1: matter what, no matter what you think of Raffie Devers,
10:38
Speaker 1: at some point in his career he was probably gonna
10:41
Speaker 1: move to first base?
10:42
Speaker 3: Right?
10:42
Speaker 1: So why then they go back to the Red Sox
10:44
Speaker 1: and say, why haven't they had at least some practice
10:49
Speaker 1: for him there, some work for him there everywhere. Even
10:52
Speaker 1: when he was younger, everyone kind of said at some
10:54
Speaker 1: point he's gonna have to move.
10:55
Speaker 2: Why hasn't that happened since spring training?
10:58
Speaker 3: That's question? Why has this not happen?
11:00
Speaker 2: They said throw your glove away for this show.
11:02
Speaker 3: That's I know. That's why is Alex core so adamant
11:04
Speaker 3: about it?
11:04
Speaker 2: That's why? You know, part of the fandom and me
11:06
Speaker 2: looks and says, you asked for this team to do
11:09
Speaker 2: stuff before last spring training, after they had another mid
11:12
Speaker 2: year in twenty twenty four, they did stuff, and now
11:16
Speaker 2: they want you to be a team player and try
11:18
Speaker 2: first base. That's part of me. The other part is
11:21
Speaker 2: how do you mess up the communication? It doesn't sound
11:24
Speaker 2: that complicated. Talk to him in the off season that
11:26
Speaker 2: you're pursuing a guy that you think you have a
11:28
Speaker 2: really good chance at. Okay, then you get to spring
11:30
Speaker 2: training and say, hey, we'd like you to stay active
11:33
Speaker 2: at third and maybe even a little first. Is that cool?
11:35
Speaker 3: Now?
11:35
Speaker 2: Maybe that happened, but it doesn't appear that there's been
11:38
Speaker 2: a lot of communication with Devers and the rest of
11:41
Speaker 2: the big wigs in the organization. That's the part that
11:44
Speaker 2: throws me off, because if you're a superstar, sorry christ
11:49
Speaker 2: if you're a superstar and you're the top paid guy there,
11:52
Speaker 2: don't you feel like the respect level is getting a
11:55
Speaker 2: little bit weird with the organization. If you were him,
11:58
Speaker 2: we said it, this is what we he said.
12:00
Speaker 3: Everyone's calling him a baby and saying just go play.
12:02
Speaker 3: That's exactly what Devers has said. That's exactly what he said.
12:06
Speaker 2: But if you were him, would you be pissed at
12:09
Speaker 2: the team for the way that they've been communicating with you. Yes, hey, dude,
12:12
Speaker 2: we signed him. We haven't talked to you about it.
12:15
Speaker 2: Throw your glove away. One month later, hey, go over
12:18
Speaker 2: to first base. Doesn't it feel like he's being talked
12:22
Speaker 2: to as if he's the twenty sixth man and not
12:24
Speaker 2: the dh that's getting paid a lot of money and
12:28
Speaker 2: is really good at the plate. That's the part where
12:31
Speaker 2: I'm like, there's beef.
12:35
Speaker 3: There's beef, and how it's handled, and we obviously don't
12:38
Speaker 3: know who's covering up for who. Maybe Alex Cors trying
12:43
Speaker 3: to cover up for some things that Dever said, or
12:46
Speaker 3: Breslo's or COR's covering up for what Breslo said. We
12:49
Speaker 3: don't know who is covering up for who. But ultimately,
12:52
Speaker 3: at the end of the day, if you were on
12:55
Speaker 3: this team and you asked the team to get better players,
12:58
Speaker 3: they went out and did that clearly. They went out
13:00
Speaker 3: and got Crochet, they went out and signed Chapman, they
13:03
Speaker 3: went out and got Bregman. Now, if you're like, man,
13:08
Speaker 3: I want to go and win another World Series, now
13:12
Speaker 3: it's your job to do that. And as a GM,
13:16
Speaker 3: it's his job to get the players that you said
13:19
Speaker 3: you wanted. And I think whoever's talking to who or
13:23
Speaker 3: not talking enough to anybody it is it's ultimately on
13:27
Speaker 3: the players to go out and put their team in
13:29
Speaker 3: the best position to win. What I found interesting is
13:33
Speaker 3: that there was the report to come out Friday that
13:36
Speaker 3: some player was like, stop talking RAFFI.
13:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was on our show. Chris Smith joined us,
13:42
Speaker 2: and I mean, he's not going to say who it is,
13:45
Speaker 2: but he did say.
13:48
Speaker 3: Who has the juice in that room? Bregman?
13:50
Speaker 1: Who else has the juice in that room? To go
13:52
Speaker 1: to Devers and say that Bregman would be the first,
13:54
Speaker 1: only one and maybe story. I mean, if Bregman says
13:57
Speaker 1: it to Raffi, Raffi's like, dude, he could.
14:00
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know this is so this is
14:01
Speaker 3: just speculation, but you could look at it and be like, dude,
14:03
Speaker 3: you took my job. I'm not listening to you.
14:05
Speaker 2: I don't know if they said it to him or
14:07
Speaker 2: if he just said it, you know how, Like I mean,
14:09
Speaker 2: I'm just picturing when I covered players in the clubhouse
14:11
Speaker 2: more consistently, guys in a corner, he's just like, stop talking,
14:14
Speaker 2: like he Devers probably didn't even hear that. That was
14:17
Speaker 2: the way I took it, okay, not that he was like, hey,
14:19
Speaker 2: stop talking. I think he was just mouthing it. Because
14:22
Speaker 2: the Red Sox reporters that were all in the clubhouse
14:25
Speaker 2: said they felt angst from multiple players that were just.
14:29
Speaker 3: Like and heard it and heard it too. But you know,
14:33
Speaker 3: that's where some of the guys start getting a little mad,
14:35
Speaker 3: because the reporters reported that they heard guys disagreeing with
14:40
Speaker 3: what Devers was saying, not on the record, and then
14:43
Speaker 3: it was like the whole like at a boy Harper thing,
14:46
Speaker 3: And I was like no, no, no, no. Like this stuff
14:49
Speaker 3: was said, it just wasn't said on the record.
14:52
Speaker 2: So let's finish with this. Just quick poll, yes or no.
14:56
Speaker 2: Raise your hand if you think Raphael Devers plays first
14:58
Speaker 2: base for the Red Sox in twenty twenty five. Wow, clean, sweet?
15:04
Speaker 2: Oh you do think he does?
15:05
Speaker 3: Oh? Okay, crap, I think it will.
15:09
Speaker 2: I'm no, I'm.
15:12
Speaker 3: Not for not for a month on a consistent basis.
15:15
Speaker 3: I mean he came around, he said one time, he
15:17
Speaker 3: said one to play first base. I said he'll get
15:19
Speaker 3: out there. Somewhere along the way he'll get.
15:24
Speaker 2: Yeah. Because I think it's going to be a yes
15:25
Speaker 2: or no, and I think I'm just going no.
15:28
Speaker 3: I think the pressure will mount enough on Raffi, which
15:31
Speaker 3: is always kind of what happens, especially in big market towns.
15:34
Speaker 3: If they if the first baseman just keeps struggling, Yoshida
15:37
Speaker 3: comes back, they're gonna say, hey, we need you to
15:40
Speaker 3: do this. Yeah, but they should start working with him now.
15:43
Speaker 1: They shouldn't wait till a month from now and say,
15:45
Speaker 1: all right, we need you to play first Like he needs.
15:47
Speaker 3: To be out there now, take a girl balls every day.
15:48
Speaker 1: He should have already been out there because this was
15:51
Speaker 1: always a real thing, like I thought he would always
15:53
Speaker 1: they would at least start him at third and have Bragman.
15:56
Speaker 1: But I didn't realize Christian Campbell would be such a
15:58
Speaker 1: what he is right so then, but Cossas was always
16:01
Speaker 1: the question mark. So he should have been from the
16:04
Speaker 1: first day of spring training with the Yoshida and some
16:07
Speaker 1: of the other guys taking ground balls at first, that
16:09
Speaker 1: shouldn't have even been a question. It should have been Rafie,
16:12
Speaker 1: just go over there and take round ers. D You
16:13
Speaker 1: never know, okay, you never know. You might not play third,
16:16
Speaker 1: but you might get to play first.
16:17
Speaker 3: Yep.
16:17
Speaker 2: And I didn't get the impression they ever asked that
16:20
Speaker 2: what do.
16:21
Speaker 3: You what are you doing that you couldn't take him
16:23
Speaker 3: during during BP, even like one group, like there's no
16:27
Speaker 3: way you have something that you're doing. I used to
16:30
Speaker 3: take round balls. I used to catch up, like it's
16:33
Speaker 3: just one of those things. Move around, move around, get
16:35
Speaker 3: out there, And I don't know, I just I think
16:38
Speaker 3: it's I think it's on him if he wants the
16:41
Speaker 3: team to win. Truth.
16:44
Speaker 2: Hey, Kratz, do you notice anything cool on the desk?
16:47
Speaker 2: Let's get the desk in the shot here. So Kratz
16:49
Speaker 2: can observe.
16:50
Speaker 3: Thank you, Oh Subway series, Oh no, no, the Golden
16:54
Speaker 3: bat that aj one? Oh wait a minute of those
16:58
Speaker 3: Oh wait a minute, what is that? What is that?
17:02
Speaker 3: You hipster?
17:04
Speaker 2: It's presented to foul Territory for passing one hundred thousand
17:07
Speaker 2: subscribers on YouTube. So thanks to the dam thank you.
17:13
Speaker 2: We're at one thirty k now, actually, but thank you
17:16
Speaker 2: to everyone for subscribing to f T, for playing a
17:19
Speaker 2: part and obviously watching our videos interacting with us the
17:22
Speaker 2: whole deal. Cool.
17:23
Speaker 3: Nice, when's the next one? That's what I want?
17:25
Speaker 2: I don't know. I don't know what the next milestone is.
17:28
Speaker 2: Is it a million? There's nothing between.
17:29
Speaker 3: One hundred million. It's a big joke, that is what.
17:35
Speaker 3: That's what I was told. I was told it is,
17:38
Speaker 3: and it's like a gold or platinum. I'm not one
17:42
Speaker 3: hundred percent sure, but they were talking about it.
17:45
Speaker 2: But it's gonna be a minute until we get anything else.
17:48
Speaker 3: Yeah, it could be.
17:51
Speaker 2: Intimidating. I know we're at a good pace, like if
17:53
Speaker 2: people like the vanity of the six figures. Clearly that's
17:56
Speaker 2: played a part here. But yes, one million is a
18:00
Speaker 2: cent a goldplay bud, but silver is nice We'll take silver.
18:05
Speaker 2: It blends really nicely on the desk.
18:08
Speaker 3: That's so big league of you, Scott. Some dude makes
18:11
Speaker 3: an all star team in the big leagues and they're like,
18:14
Speaker 3: I want to make ten of them.
18:17
Speaker 2: Sometimes we get the asks for lightweight hoodies and I'm like, uh,
18:21
Speaker 2: they exist. They're awesome at Roeback.
18:23
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18:27
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18:30
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Speaker 2: out Roeback. All right, we're gonna bring on a guest
18:48
Speaker 2: in a couple of minutes to talk about this, but
18:50
Speaker 2: let's go over the breaking news in the last twenty
18:53
Speaker 2: four hours that Bud Black has been let go by
18:56
Speaker 2: the Rockies. He managed the team for a long time,
18:58
Speaker 2: almost a decade, but this will be a third consecutive
19:02
Speaker 2: one hundred last season. You can book that there's a
19:04
Speaker 2: chance that this team is the worst of all time.
19:08
Speaker 2: He's replaced by Warren Schaeffer, who will be the interim manager.
19:11
Speaker 2: He was the third base coach. Mike Redmond, the bench coach,
19:14
Speaker 2: is also out. Clint Hurdle is going to be the
19:17
Speaker 2: bench coach, who was just hired as the hitting coach
19:19
Speaker 2: a few weeks ago. I mean, what are we expecting?
19:25
Speaker 3: This? This is what we were expecting. Not a fire.
19:27
Speaker 3: Nobody want to see whim we get fired. But just
19:30
Speaker 3: I mean, I don't know. It's not his fault. We
19:34
Speaker 3: said this. It's not blood Bud Blackswell. It's not Mike
19:37
Speaker 3: Redman's fault. He's the bench coach.
19:38
Speaker 2: Who's fault.
19:40
Speaker 1: The people who brought in the players start with the
19:43
Speaker 1: owner of the GM, all of.
19:45
Speaker 3: Them, the scouts. I mean, I hate to see people,
19:48
Speaker 3: the development guys. It's a systematic failure. They're in a
19:53
Speaker 3: tough division.
19:54
Speaker 1: The one big player they went on side, Chris Bryant,
19:56
Speaker 1: he can't play because he's got a bad back right there.
19:58
Speaker 1: Starting pitching has been horrendous this year, even guys like
20:02
Speaker 1: you know that they were counting on Marquez Freeland, those
20:05
Speaker 1: guys that have been unbelievably bad. Dolander they've called up.
20:08
Speaker 1: He hasn't helped Tovar has been out for pretty much
20:11
Speaker 1: the whole year. It's just a systematic failure. That's there's
20:15
Speaker 1: no other way to put it. Question for both of
20:17
Speaker 1: you guys, who's the Rockies All Star? We had this
20:20
Speaker 1: conversation on Saturday, Who's the Rockies All Star?
20:23
Speaker 3: Peter, You're gonna look it up? Me?
20:27
Speaker 2: What is there to look up? I mean you want
20:28
Speaker 2: me to do that on the fly with this team?
20:31
Speaker 3: That was The reaction to Scott had was like McMahon,
20:35
Speaker 3: Brendan Doyle, I just had it. I just had a
20:38
Speaker 3: thing Brandan Goodman good Man, Hunter Goodman is I was saying,
20:46
Speaker 3: Nico Goodram, but no Hunt Hunter Goodman. I mean he's
20:51
Speaker 3: he's putting together, he's putting you know, he's put together
20:54
Speaker 3: a good year, like behind a dish, banging out dangers.
20:58
Speaker 3: But ultimately it is a culmination of a lack of moves.
21:05
Speaker 3: You bring in a few pieces here and there, you
21:07
Speaker 3: don't address major weaknesses. And Bud Black's like, you know what,
21:12
Speaker 3: the guys really like me, but we just we can't.
21:16
Speaker 3: We can't keep a lead. We can't and this year
21:19
Speaker 3: it's crazy. Their offense has been ice cold or I
21:22
Speaker 3: think they went like fifteen games without scoring more than
21:25
Speaker 3: five runs. A Colorado Rockies team without scoring more five runs,
21:30
Speaker 3: Like that's like a Giants team that just is pitching
21:32
Speaker 3: in defense, Like that's that's a crazy stat for a
21:37
Speaker 3: Rockies team.
21:38
Speaker 2: Bill Schmidt, who's running the front offic set, I think
21:40
Speaker 2: our guys are still playing hard. That's what I'm looking at.
21:42
Speaker 2: Guys are working hard every day. You basically said, I
21:44
Speaker 2: don't think we're at the point of firing Bud Black
21:46
Speaker 2: before Saturday's game. Then they lost twenty one nothing, and
21:48
Speaker 2: then on Sunday they hired Bud Black after they picked
21:52
Speaker 2: up a win. So let's talk this out right now.
21:55
Speaker 2: Patrick Lyons is the Rockies insider. He is joining us. Patrick,
21:58
Speaker 2: great to have you on. So where do we begin.
22:01
Speaker 2: How about Dave Roberts, who you know was mentored by
22:04
Speaker 2: Bud Black for a long time, saying I don't think
22:05
Speaker 2: Casey Stengel could change the outcome of that ball club,
22:08
Speaker 2: and that's not the manager's faults. So slice this one
22:11
Speaker 2: up for us. What's gone wrong and what possibly could improve?
22:17
Speaker 5: Well, you guys talking about it before we really hit
22:19
Speaker 5: the nail on the head with everything. It's been a
22:21
Speaker 5: systemic failure, you know, from from top to bottom, and
22:24
Speaker 5: a lot of those decisions come from owner Dick Montford,
22:28
Speaker 5: and he's the one that's been pushing these buttons and
22:31
Speaker 5: was the one that wanted Chris Bryant to begin with.
22:33
Speaker 5: And now Brian has been a part of four of
22:36
Speaker 5: the worst seasons in franchise history, the four worst seasons,
22:40
Speaker 5: and this one isn't even done yet. So there's been
22:43
Speaker 5: a lot of short changing, various areas, various departments from
22:48
Speaker 5: this organization, and it's really just been a lot of complacency.
22:52
Speaker 5: And you know, one thing you didn't mention that I
22:54
Speaker 5: know is really interesting to a lot of baseball folks
22:57
Speaker 5: is the fact that there's still thirty plus in the
23:00
Speaker 5: building on Saturday. For a team on pace to lose
23:04
Speaker 5: one hundred and thirty seven games, there was thirty eight
23:06
Speaker 5: thousand people to go see Padres Rockies. So it's a
23:10
Speaker 5: little bit recession proof. And so despite the fact that
23:13
Speaker 5: I think the Rockies are losing some money right now,
23:16
Speaker 5: they're able to get away with it without making those
23:18
Speaker 5: grander changes. And this has really just been something that's
23:21
Speaker 5: been coming down the pike for the last couple of
23:24
Speaker 5: years and it's just finally reached ahead.
23:27
Speaker 3: You said short changing. I mean, there's so many things
23:29
Speaker 3: I want unpack there, but the short changing you brought in.
23:32
Speaker 3: You got rid of Hensley Mullins Bam Bam. Mullan's a
23:35
Speaker 3: hitting coach, you got rid of You got rid of PJ.
23:38
Speaker 3: Pillitary last year because you went from three hitting coaches
23:41
Speaker 3: to two when every other team has three. Then you
23:45
Speaker 3: get rid of Bam Bam, you bring in Clint, who
23:48
Speaker 3: gets it back to two. And now Clint's now the
23:50
Speaker 3: bench coach. Like, do they think that just people are
23:53
Speaker 3: going to just poof up here and take jobs that
23:57
Speaker 3: help players improve on a daily basis.
24:01
Speaker 5: Well, that's that sure changing, right, that's trying to save
24:04
Speaker 5: money on the on the periphery of for coaches and
24:07
Speaker 5: then some of their developmental people and folks working really
24:11
Speaker 5: multiple jobs within the organization. You mentioned something, AJ said
24:16
Speaker 5: something about president of baseball operations. They have a team president,
24:19
Speaker 5: but they don't have a president of baseball operations. I
24:21
Speaker 5: know that's something that they're discussing right now behind the
24:24
Speaker 5: scenes within the front office of maybe adding a role
24:26
Speaker 5: like that to perhaps take away a little bit on
24:30
Speaker 5: the plate of Dick Monfort, or take a little bit
24:32
Speaker 5: away from the decision making processes from him, because he
24:36
Speaker 5: has been really at the forefront a lot of these
24:38
Speaker 5: moves and hiring Bill Schmidt, who has done some of
24:42
Speaker 5: his biddings. He's tried to do his best for the
24:44
Speaker 5: most part. But I think, you know, they've been handcuffed
24:47
Speaker 5: a little bit because of some of the decisions Dick
24:50
Speaker 5: Montfort has made and some of the choices that in
24:53
Speaker 5: some of the directions I should say that they've been
24:55
Speaker 5: wanting to go and a lot of that does have
24:57
Speaker 5: to do with saving money and having less They said
25:00
Speaker 5: streamlining was the reason why they were going from the
25:03
Speaker 5: three hitting coaches down to two. And it's despite the
25:07
Speaker 5: fact they're having, you know, one of the worst offensive
25:09
Speaker 5: seasons in franchise history. They're not gonna go back up
25:11
Speaker 5: to three, right, They've got one. Now, they've got some
25:14
Speaker 5: other guys coming along the way and in Jordan Pacheco
25:17
Speaker 5: and Nick Wilson. But still they are are short changing
25:20
Speaker 5: and not investing in the roster or in development as
25:23
Speaker 5: much as the other twenty nine teams in Major League Baseball?
25:27
Speaker 3: Patrick, is this a owner failure then, because I can't
25:30
Speaker 3: imagine that Dick Mamfray would not want to go get players, right?
25:34
Speaker 3: Or is this a and I say this all the
25:36
Speaker 3: time on this show, The Rockies have to do something different, right,
25:39
Speaker 3: They have to go back to the Blake Street Bombers
25:41
Speaker 3: and just say, you know, we're just gonna outslug it.
25:43
Speaker 3: We're gonna try and win sixty home games a year
25:45
Speaker 3: and take our chances on the road and just bash
25:48
Speaker 3: people to death or do something different, right? So is
25:51
Speaker 3: this a ownership failure? Is it a GM failure? It's
25:54
Speaker 3: not Bud Black's fault.
25:56
Speaker 1: I mean, Bud Black, say what you want about how
25:58
Speaker 1: we manage whatever, but his fault. He's only given certain players.
26:01
Speaker 1: He can't make players do things they can. I know
26:04
Speaker 1: they're gonna say different message, But is this some more
26:06
Speaker 1: of an owner? This can't be a GM fall. So
26:08
Speaker 1: it's got to start at the top.
26:09
Speaker 3: And that's never gonna change because he draws three thousand
26:11
Speaker 3: and three million a year and he's like, I'm cashing checks.
26:14
Speaker 3: I'm good.
26:16
Speaker 5: Yeah, owner in GM obviously have failed. But to your point,
26:20
Speaker 5: I think Momford has the cut the legs out from
26:23
Speaker 5: underneath his general managers in the past. Again, the Chris
26:26
Speaker 5: Bryan signing unilatterally coming up with the deal for Nolan Aaronado.
26:30
Speaker 5: There was a trade back in Gosh, I think it
26:32
Speaker 5: was twenty fifteen where they had an opportunity to acquire
26:36
Speaker 5: a big time prospect for two months rental for Jorge
26:39
Speaker 5: dale Rosa, and Peter Gammons at the time reported that
26:42
Speaker 5: Dick Monford stepped in and nullified that deal. In that
26:44
Speaker 5: prospect was Eduardo Rodriguez, and that's a guy that you know,
26:47
Speaker 5: if you put him into that Rockies rotation, you know,
26:50
Speaker 5: that might have changed certain things, you know, pretty quickly.
26:53
Speaker 5: So I think it's a lot of it has to
26:55
Speaker 5: do with Dick Monford and that sense of control. And
26:59
Speaker 5: it's not really clear why he doesn't want to go
27:01
Speaker 5: out and have baseball people making the baseball decisions with
27:05
Speaker 5: the amount of attendance that the Rockies get. You know,
27:08
Speaker 5: Dick Moffort does a great job as a businessman, and
27:10
Speaker 5: he's very loyal. He takes great care of the employees
27:14
Speaker 5: of the organization and the players, But on the baseball
27:17
Speaker 5: side of things, he's he's not gifted at all in
27:21
Speaker 5: any way, and he just you know, refuses to turn
27:24
Speaker 5: the reins over to someone who does know what they're doing,
27:27
Speaker 5: or even go outside the organization. That was something that
27:30
Speaker 5: when Jeff Bridi stepped aside in twenty twenty one, you know,
27:33
Speaker 5: Momford did say that, you know, we might have to
27:36
Speaker 5: go outside the organization and we'll certainly look after. Bill
27:39
Speaker 5: Schmidt was a point as the interim GM. He decided that,
27:42
Speaker 5: you know, making one trade at the deadline, you know,
27:45
Speaker 5: was a good enough job. And so Bill Schmidt continues
27:48
Speaker 5: to be the general manager and then you know, the
27:50
Speaker 5: next trade deadline in twenty twenty two, Colorado was the
27:52
Speaker 5: only team that didn't make a deal ahead of the deadline.
27:55
Speaker 5: So there's been a lot of complacency I think coming
27:58
Speaker 5: out of ownership and really much, if not all, of
28:01
Speaker 5: the Folcus really does you know, lay on Dick Monford's shoulders.
28:06
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28:25
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28:28
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28:41
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29:06
Speaker 2: you're all set. I've seen a theme with the historically
29:09
Speaker 2: bad teams in the last few years. They are losing
29:12
Speaker 2: significantly at the margins. Have you witnessed any players or
29:17
Speaker 2: any development issues within the Rockies that you can point out.
29:20
Speaker 2: I mean, the way it's described to me by players
29:23
Speaker 2: is that they'll go to most teams and it's a corporation, right,
29:26
Speaker 2: They've got information for them on what they can change.
29:28
Speaker 2: They've got amazing prep for them before every game, there's
29:31
Speaker 2: so many different resources and luxuries, and then they go
29:34
Speaker 2: to the Rockies and it's just a baseball team, Like,
29:37
Speaker 2: just go out there and play. And that's how much
29:39
Speaker 2: of a difference it is. And the game has passed
29:41
Speaker 2: by Dick Monfort because he's the one that has to
29:43
Speaker 2: actually approved budgets to do things like this. Often these
29:46
Speaker 2: things are not super expensive in the grand scheme of baseball.
29:49
Speaker 2: It's like, hey, we should really have this thing that
29:51
Speaker 2: every other team has. It costs two hundred K. He's like, Nah,
29:54
Speaker 2: we don't need it. So have you heard anything about that?
29:56
Speaker 2: Because that's the digging I've done, and I've heard that
29:59
Speaker 2: pretty frequently for while now.
30:01
Speaker 5: Well, Colorado certainly has said the quiet part out loud.
30:04
Speaker 5: And every time they bring in a new player, it's
30:07
Speaker 5: usually because he wanted to be here, not because necessarily,
30:11
Speaker 5: you know, we need an addition here, or we need
30:13
Speaker 5: an improvement, we need to step up in some sort
30:15
Speaker 5: of capacity. It's that this guy was willing to come
30:18
Speaker 5: here in a certain capacity. And so I think that
30:21
Speaker 5: that speaks volumes to the Rockies kind of going by
30:24
Speaker 5: the wayside and being as somewhat of a last resort
30:27
Speaker 5: for a lot of players. It was only a couple
30:29
Speaker 5: of years ago that they put together a pitching lab
30:31
Speaker 5: in their facility down at Salt River Fields down in Scottsdale, Arizona,
30:35
Speaker 5: and even that is still years behind. It was after
30:39
Speaker 5: the twenty nineteen season where they did immediate availability and
30:42
Speaker 5: I think Buddy even said, but Black said that, you know,
30:45
Speaker 5: the team was probably five or more years behind everybody
30:48
Speaker 5: else in Major League Baseball in terms of analytics departments,
30:51
Speaker 5: and then from there the analytics team dwindled down to
30:55
Speaker 5: where they they only had one at one point just
30:58
Speaker 5: you know, towards the end of the year the pandemic.
31:00
Speaker 5: So they've reinvested in that just a little bit, but
31:03
Speaker 5: they certainly fall way behind pretty much what is considered
31:08
Speaker 5: to be the standard across Major League Baseball and just
31:10
Speaker 5: about every category.
31:12
Speaker 3: Do all the three million fans that come out to
31:14
Speaker 3: these games want the Rockies to win? Or have they
31:18
Speaker 3: done a good job of making an entertainment? Like you'd
31:21
Speaker 3: go to a concert and you're like, I want to
31:23
Speaker 3: hear a good concert, but I'm here for the vibes.
31:28
Speaker 5: It's one hundred percent vibes. At this point, there have
31:30
Speaker 5: been people who've been longtime season ticket holders that have
31:34
Speaker 5: given up their season tickets, and it's pretty much considered
31:38
Speaker 5: to be the best outdoor sports bar in Denver where
31:41
Speaker 5: people hang out up at the rooftop and it's totally packed.
31:44
Speaker 5: The beers are somewhat affordable compared to a lot of
31:47
Speaker 5: the bars in Loto, And there was something that Purple
31:51
Speaker 5: Row they do a wonderful job where they had someone
31:54
Speaker 5: go down and talk with fans and some of them
31:57
Speaker 5: couldn't name any of the current players on the team.
31:59
Speaker 5: Certainly a lot harder with Charlie Blackman just having retired.
32:02
Speaker 5: Nobody knew any of the prospects. I've even heard tales
32:05
Speaker 5: of folks going up to the rooftop and asking, do
32:08
Speaker 5: you know who's even playing tonight? And that can certainly
32:11
Speaker 5: be a challenge when usually the fans are the ones
32:15
Speaker 5: that send the message to the front office that hey,
32:17
Speaker 5: things need to change and we're not going to show up.
32:19
Speaker 5: But they're continually is are people that will take the
32:23
Speaker 5: place of those hardcore fans, either because their transplants and
32:27
Speaker 5: continuing to move into Colorado, or because Denver is still
32:30
Speaker 5: relatively affordable. So no matter what team you root for
32:33
Speaker 5: when the Padres come to town. The Padres fans travel
32:36
Speaker 5: really well. We even saw Let's Go Tiger's chant during
32:39
Speaker 5: this past week, and I don't think folks from Detroit
32:42
Speaker 5: usually have that kind of income to be traveling and
32:45
Speaker 5: going to all kinds of various cities across the US.
32:47
Speaker 5: But yet they were able to go out and support
32:49
Speaker 5: their team in Denver. So it does feel more and
32:53
Speaker 5: more as these one hundred lost seasons continue to pile up,
32:57
Speaker 5: that it's almost a fifty to fifty break between people
33:00
Speaker 5: that are there to actually see the Rockies and people
33:02
Speaker 5: were there to actually see the opposing team.
33:05
Speaker 3: Well, there's a lot of teams that are running into
33:08
Speaker 3: that problem.
33:08
Speaker 1: But from what you just said, I don't know if
33:11
Speaker 1: you heard us talking about this before you came on,
33:13
Speaker 1: but who's the Rockies All Star this year? If you
33:15
Speaker 1: had to look at it right now in how many
33:17
Speaker 1: of those fans could name the guy who is going
33:20
Speaker 1: to be their All Star? Because I don't know who
33:22
Speaker 1: it is. I mean, you look at it, Goodman maybe
33:24
Speaker 1: would be the one, But there's a lot of good
33:26
Speaker 1: catching in the al So that's a rough spot to start.
33:29
Speaker 3: But who's their All.
33:31
Speaker 5: Star right now, if you're looking at wins Bo replacement,
33:35
Speaker 5: Jake Bird is probably going to do that. And sometimes
33:37
Speaker 5: the All Star teams will pick up a setup man
33:40
Speaker 5: and give that guy credit. In the past, I think
33:42
Speaker 5: Bud Black has been integral in getting the player that
33:46
Speaker 5: he thinks should go to the All Star Game, because
33:49
Speaker 5: usually it's two or three players that are kind of
33:51
Speaker 5: the best options. It was Herman Marquez's time in twenty
33:54
Speaker 5: twenty one, and so he ended up getting the not
33:57
Speaker 5: Elias Diez was neck and neck with you know, a
34:00
Speaker 5: couple other players like Ryan McMahon, but it was Diez's
34:02
Speaker 5: turn to get it. Last year, it was McMahon's turn,
34:05
Speaker 5: and it really felt like this year it still probably
34:08
Speaker 5: might end up being Breton Doyle. That's probably where my
34:11
Speaker 5: money would go if I were a betting man, that
34:13
Speaker 5: he'll he'll turn things around and be a little bit better.
34:16
Speaker 5: But now with Bud Black not there and not being
34:18
Speaker 5: able to talk with, you know, the the National League
34:21
Speaker 5: Championship winner, the manager of that side, it's I really
34:26
Speaker 5: don't know, Jake Bird, Breton Doyle, that's probably where it's
34:30
Speaker 5: gonna end up being.
34:32
Speaker 3: Did you see this coming? The Bud Black firing in
34:35
Speaker 3: the sense that, or was it when Clint Hurdle came in.
34:38
Speaker 3: Was it like, huh, oh, there's somebody prowling around here
34:41
Speaker 3: that has a chance to like supplant Bud. And did
34:46
Speaker 3: you think it was gonna be Clint that was gonna
34:48
Speaker 3: step in?
34:50
Speaker 5: Not necessarily, it did seem like maybe the writing was
34:53
Speaker 5: on the wall when when Clint was brought in just
34:55
Speaker 5: a little bit, and you know, they could they could
34:57
Speaker 5: cohabitate and be fine there. They're both, you know, two
34:59
Speaker 5: per professionals and respect each other, So that wasn't an issue.
35:03
Speaker 5: When Warren Schaeffer was added to the big league coaching
35:05
Speaker 5: staff as the third base coach, it really seemed like
35:07
Speaker 5: he was going to be this heir apparent under the
35:10
Speaker 5: tutelage of Bud Black, and it was really only going
35:12
Speaker 5: to be a matter of time when that would actually happen.
35:15
Speaker 5: And you know, even when that change made and Bam
35:18
Speaker 5: Bam was was let go as the hitting coach and
35:21
Speaker 5: you know, became the scapegoat so to speak, for a
35:24
Speaker 5: lot of the organizational problems that they've been having, and
35:26
Speaker 5: Clint Hurdle came in. That was a surprise to me
35:28
Speaker 5: because again, it's very rare to lose one hundred games
35:32
Speaker 5: in back to back seasons and then come back as
35:34
Speaker 5: the manager for year three, So even that firing was
35:39
Speaker 5: a surprise. And then you know, on Saturday night, with
35:41
Speaker 5: the twenty one to nothing loss, it felt like when
35:45
Speaker 5: Bud Black left that room that that was probably going
35:48
Speaker 5: to be the last time that I saw him. And
35:51
Speaker 5: I think because Derek Shelton was fired. The Rockies operate
35:55
Speaker 5: almost as like the twenty ninth team twenty nine in
35:58
Speaker 5: every way, and as long as there's one team that's
36:00
Speaker 5: doing worse than them in some capacity, they can always
36:03
Speaker 5: point and say, well, at least we're not those guys.
36:05
Speaker 5: And as soon as Derek Shelton lost his job in Pittsburgh,
36:08
Speaker 5: it seemed like, well, the Rockies are now number thirty,
36:12
Speaker 5: Bud Black has to be on the hottest seat. And
36:14
Speaker 5: with that loss twenty one to nothing twenty four hours
36:17
Speaker 5: after GM, Bill Schmidt said, hey, our confidence is with
36:20
Speaker 5: this guy. Everything's fine. Enough was enough, and they just
36:23
Speaker 5: had to do something different, despite the fact that it
36:26
Speaker 5: really is just lip service for a roster that isn't
36:28
Speaker 5: just going to get magically better overnight, because there's a
36:32
Speaker 5: new guy in charge.
36:34
Speaker 3: There's a good thing. Totis through for four hundred yards
36:36
Speaker 3: in that game against the Rockies twenty one. I mean
36:40
Speaker 3: it was unbelievable. Three Tuddies, Yeah, three tutties. All right.
36:44
Speaker 3: I mean, listen, we've beat adapt to dead. It's not
36:47
Speaker 3: Bud Block's fault. And we also is coming.
36:50
Speaker 1: But the White Sox slogan this year, as we've been told,
36:52
Speaker 1: is just don't be as bad as the Rockies. So
36:54
Speaker 1: welcome to White Sox Land, Rocky fans. Now, what's the future,
36:58
Speaker 1: That's what I want to know.
36:58
Speaker 3: What do they do? Who do they say sign? They're
37:00
Speaker 3: not gonna sign. They've shown no, you know, willingness to
37:03
Speaker 3: go on play in the free agent market. So what's
37:06
Speaker 3: the future. Because the Dodgers aren't going away, the Padres
37:09
Speaker 3: don't seem like they're going away, the Diamondbacks aren't going away.
37:12
Speaker 1: The Giants are now back in it with Buster Posey.
37:14
Speaker 1: How do they get back into some sort of let's
37:17
Speaker 1: start with respectability before we even start talking about playoffs.
37:22
Speaker 5: After twenty twenty one, when they lost Trevor Story and
37:25
Speaker 5: John Gray, and they had traded Nolan Aaronado before that season,
37:28
Speaker 5: it was a rebuild, and the Rockies don't like to
37:31
Speaker 5: use that word rebuild, which seems ridiculous considering you know,
37:35
Speaker 5: how poorly they've played the last three years. They now
37:37
Speaker 5: need to rebuild again, and they don't even have a
37:40
Speaker 5: ton of trade chips right now because of how poorly
37:43
Speaker 5: they've been playing. So despite the fact that they can
37:45
Speaker 5: get rid of guys on one year deals, they're not
37:47
Speaker 5: going to get a ton in return. That's not going
37:49
Speaker 5: to improve their roster all that much. So it's going
37:53
Speaker 5: to take a much more larger organizational overhaul, which I'm
37:57
Speaker 5: not convinced they are are committed in doing, but that
38:00
Speaker 5: would really be the only possible solution for them to
38:04
Speaker 5: get this thing back on track. And even then, if
38:06
Speaker 5: they were to do something like that, it might not
38:08
Speaker 5: be until twenty twenty nine, twenty thirty that this team
38:12
Speaker 5: ends up getting themselves back to some little bit of
38:14
Speaker 5: respectability because the guys that are in this clubhouse, you know,
38:18
Speaker 5: they've suffered through it. They've been they've been traumatized in
38:20
Speaker 5: many ways. Like Brenton Doyle, as great of a player
38:22
Speaker 5: as he's been, he's never been a part of a
38:24
Speaker 5: team that's lost ninety nine games or less like that's
38:28
Speaker 5: that's an unfortunate thing. And so cleaning house slowly but surely,
38:33
Speaker 5: and making some larger organizational changes, putting in a president
38:36
Speaker 5: of baseball operations, you know, revitalizing the minor league system,
38:41
Speaker 5: because despite the fact that they draft high every year,
38:43
Speaker 5: they're not developing as well as they should be, despite
38:46
Speaker 5: considering themselves a draft and developed team. And as you
38:49
Speaker 5: guys know, you talked about it. Last year with the
38:51
Speaker 5: White Sox they set a record for most losses one
38:53
Speaker 5: hundred and twenty one l's and yet they could only
38:56
Speaker 5: pick tenth in the twenty twenty five MLB draft. The
39:00
Speaker 5: same fate is befalling the Rockies right now because they
39:04
Speaker 5: are they can only select tenth in twenty twenty six,
39:07
Speaker 5: despite right now being on a one hundred and thirty
39:10
Speaker 5: three lost pace.
39:12
Speaker 2: And that is what I tell you of the lottery.
39:14
Speaker 3: Welcome to the White Sox, Tom, Welcome to the White Sox fandom.
39:17
Speaker 3: Rocky fans, congratulations.
39:18
Speaker 2: The lottery is great a lot.
39:20
Speaker 1: I love that they can't pick till tenth because it
39:22
Speaker 1: should discourage tanking like the NBA does and other leagues
39:25
Speaker 1: do good tanking.
39:26
Speaker 3: You should have to try to win.
39:28
Speaker 1: Yeah, and by the way, let me just say this,
39:30
Speaker 1: if they break the White Sox record this year, which
39:34
Speaker 1: they're well on their way to do, gosh, it sucks
39:36
Speaker 1: to be a White Sox and we can't have anything nice.
39:38
Speaker 1: We set the Ross record, they're gonna lose it after
39:40
Speaker 1: one year. At least let us have it for a
39:42
Speaker 1: couple of years.
39:43
Speaker 2: You guys won in two thousand and five. You've won
39:45
Speaker 2: him their twenty first century.
39:46
Speaker 3: Would still like at least let us have one nice thing.
39:49
Speaker 5: You've got the Pope. Do you need more than that?
39:51
Speaker 3: That's a great point. That's a great point. Yeah, we
39:53
Speaker 3: win the Pope an aj fan, Yeah, we win. Didn't
39:56
Speaker 3: you see him on our game on Saturday night? He
39:57
Speaker 3: was wearing my jersey? What do you want me to do?
39:59
Speaker 4: You?
39:59
Speaker 2: Was that the two?
40:02
Speaker 3: What do you mean? No?
40:03
Speaker 2: Did you guys do like a graphic or something?
40:05
Speaker 3: Yeah? They made him and my jury?
40:07
Speaker 2: Yep, I love it.
40:10
Speaker 3: Uh.
40:10
Speaker 2: Well, this was great, Patrick, Thank you so much for
40:12
Speaker 2: joining us. Everyone get Patrick'll follow at Patrick d Lyons
40:15
Speaker 2: l io NS. Thanks Patrick, appreciate it.
40:18
Speaker 5: Thank you guys.
40:19
Speaker 3: Have a good one.
40:21
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40:24
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40:27
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40:30
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40:37
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41:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what he said.
41:23
Speaker 2: That's what he said.
41:25
Speaker 3: That's what he said.
41:27
Speaker 2: That's what he said. Do we have something else dramatic
41:33
Speaker 2: going on in Boston? Let's read this outn Mceltics covering
41:37
Speaker 2: the Celtics.
41:38
Speaker 3: Celtics come back on that ass.
41:40
Speaker 2: Maybe maybe we'll see, We'll see. Sean McAdam said this,
41:43
Speaker 2: Robbie Hyde tweeting it out our Monster Territory host. There's
41:47
Speaker 2: some growing frustration within the Red Sox organization about outfielder
41:51
Speaker 2: Saddan Rafaela. More than once, Rafaela has been advised in
41:54
Speaker 2: the dugout to take the first pitch in his next
41:55
Speaker 2: step bat, only to swing freely minutes later. This is
41:59
Speaker 2: tough because because this is now Robbie talking, Raffaelle has
42:02
Speaker 2: been great lately, but it makes Robbie wonder what the
42:05
Speaker 2: Red Sox think about it's sticking long term. Could also
42:09
Speaker 2: be something to pay attention to with Roman Anthony, who
42:11
Speaker 2: has close to an eighteen percent walk rate, which ranks
42:14
Speaker 2: thirteenth in all of Minor league baseball. Yeah, he's been
42:16
Speaker 2: an on base machine in the miners. Rafaella clearly has not.
42:20
Speaker 2: He's got other strengths, but I mean, hey, you swung
42:23
Speaker 2: out a lot of pitches.
42:25
Speaker 3: Yeah, but there was times where I knew I couldn't
42:26
Speaker 3: swing at the first pitch, right. So I'll tell this
42:29
Speaker 3: story Brian Anderson, if you're listening, I love you'd be
42:31
Speaker 3: a We were playing Kenny Rogers and we were trying
42:34
Speaker 3: to get him out of the game. We had a
42:35
Speaker 3: whole thing, we had a whole meeting about he doesn't
42:38
Speaker 3: you know, he kind of nibbles. Everyone has to take
42:40
Speaker 3: a strike all the way through the lineup. So we
42:42
Speaker 3: go one through eight.
42:43
Speaker 1: Everyone takes a strike, tries to get deemed account first pitch.
42:45
Speaker 1: Brian Anderson swings to the first pitch in Our hitting
42:48
Speaker 1: coach Greg Walker at the time was like, son, he's
42:51
Speaker 1: from sald George.
42:52
Speaker 3: He's like, what the are you doing? BEA's like what
42:56
Speaker 3: He's like, didn't you hear the meaning? He's like, Oh,
42:59
Speaker 3: I forgot What what do you mean you forgot?
43:05
Speaker 2: Well he hit ninth.
43:06
Speaker 3: Yeah, it was a long time ago, but still, but
43:11
Speaker 3: these are the things.
43:12
Speaker 1: Though, when you're in Raphael is a little more established
43:14
Speaker 1: than what Brian Anderson ended up being. But these are
43:16
Speaker 1: the things that would get guys mad at you and
43:19
Speaker 1: then also coaches down on you and then they would
43:22
Speaker 1: send you out on you because they just like he
43:26
Speaker 1: don't listen.
43:27
Speaker 3: No, it's changed a little bit. Raphael has other strings.
43:29
Speaker 3: But this is these are the little things that you
43:31
Speaker 3: have to do. And it was just you know, when
43:34
Speaker 3: you got Jim told me.
43:35
Speaker 1: If they're taking a pitch for the team, and Kenny
43:37
Speaker 1: Rodgers pumped some eighty eight down the middle, like you're
43:40
Speaker 1: Brian Anderson, you gotta take it.
43:41
Speaker 3: I love you be I'm sorry I told the story.
43:43
Speaker 2: But that's a good story. But Rafaella is signed through
43:47
Speaker 2: twenty thirty one.
43:48
Speaker 3: I know.
43:48
Speaker 1: But this is also the thing where people get angry
43:50
Speaker 1: and are like other some teammates would be like, dude,
43:53
Speaker 1: if I have to take one, you have to take one.
43:56
Speaker 3: This is winning baseball. I remember Chase Utley took a
43:59
Speaker 3: two to zero pitch. We were playing Arietta at the time.
44:03
Speaker 3: Jake Ariott like good Jake Arietta. He got two to zero.
44:07
Speaker 3: It was a zero zero game, and he took a
44:09
Speaker 3: fastball rate down the middle two one. It wasn't his
44:13
Speaker 3: time to swing. Next batter swung at the very first pitch.
44:17
Speaker 3: It wasn't Ryan Howard at the time, but very next
44:20
Speaker 3: pitch he swings at the very first pitch of the
44:22
Speaker 3: at bat. Chase comes into dugout and was so pissed.
44:25
Speaker 3: He never he never said anything like he never called
44:30
Speaker 3: anybody out during games loud. He was so pissed. He's like,
44:34
Speaker 3: if I'm gonna take a pitch right down the middle,
44:36
Speaker 3: that means everybody's supposed to pay attention watch the game,
44:40
Speaker 3: and you're also taking pitches because this guy is the
44:43
Speaker 3: elite pitcher. Get him out of the game. Like it's
44:47
Speaker 3: about I think there's a shift in Boston that maybe
44:51
Speaker 3: Saydan doesn't necessarily see or something. And he's like, you know,
44:54
Speaker 3: the shift is we're gonna win. We're gonna take team
44:57
Speaker 3: at bats, and that's what you have to do. Not
45:00
Speaker 3: every hit is as productive as some at bats are productive.
45:04
Speaker 3: That don't come that don't come to fruition with a hit,
45:07
Speaker 3: Like you've got to play together all nine in the lineup.
45:11
Speaker 3: And this is a case where he's just probably got
45:13
Speaker 3: to learn. He's still young and his and his value
45:16
Speaker 3: comes from the defense.
45:17
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's twenty four, right, he's super fast. He's playing
45:21
Speaker 2: elite defense both eye test and metrics, so he is
45:24
Speaker 2: very valuable to the team. You know, from a Red
45:26
Speaker 2: Sox perspective, I think he's close to a two win
45:29
Speaker 2: player already, and roll only a quarter into the season.
45:32
Speaker 2: It's good numbers.
45:33
Speaker 3: It is all in defense. It's all in defense.
45:36
Speaker 1: It goes back to the conversation we had the other
45:38
Speaker 1: day when we had Cam on and I don't know
45:40
Speaker 1: who we were talking.
45:41
Speaker 3: I don't know who we were talking to. What we
45:42
Speaker 3: were talking about.
45:43
Speaker 2: The scoreboard, Evan Grant.
45:46
Speaker 1: Evan Grant, you played to the scoreboard, and the scoreboard
45:49
Speaker 1: tells you what you got.
45:49
Speaker 3: Now, Listen, did I swing a lot of the first pitch? Absolutely?
45:52
Speaker 3: Did I take a lot of pitches that I probably
45:54
Speaker 3: could have swung at Absolutely, Because it was if I
45:58
Speaker 3: get two, oh, and we're down four runs and there's
46:01
Speaker 3: nobody on base, I ain't swaying. Why would I, Because
46:05
Speaker 3: I can't hit a four run homer. We need to
46:08
Speaker 3: Even if I hit a home run, we're still down three,
46:10
Speaker 3: so I need to get on base for that. So
46:12
Speaker 3: there was a million Listen. Was I ever do always
46:15
Speaker 3: do everything right? Absolutely not. But I tried to do
46:19
Speaker 3: the right things, and I tried to do team things
46:21
Speaker 3: at bats. I mean, you know, anyone can get called
46:23
Speaker 3: it back to a bat. But there are times where
46:26
Speaker 3: again the scoreboard dictates how you play the game, and
46:30
Speaker 3: sometimes meetings dictate aja In an era of travel baseball,
46:36
Speaker 3: how many times do you see this? Travel baseball tournaments
46:39
Speaker 3: are one hundred percent a showcase for kids, and that's
46:43
Speaker 3: all they're doing is they're just showcasing themselves. First pitch out,
46:47
Speaker 3: Next dude comes up, first pitch rocket somewhere, probably an
46:52
Speaker 3: out because hitting is hard. I don't care what level
46:54
Speaker 3: you're doing it in, but kids aren't learning that. So for
46:57
Speaker 3: me as a manager, if i'm I mean a generation
47:01
Speaker 3: of players coming up, and I'm not saying this is
47:03
Speaker 3: Sadam's fault. I'm saying that this kind of thing was
47:08
Speaker 3: taught in the minor leagues. We used to have baseball
47:11
Speaker 3: one oh one when I was in the minor leagues
47:13
Speaker 3: with the Blue Jays. They don't have this, they don't
47:16
Speaker 3: have this education. In like early baseball, travel team baseball
47:23
Speaker 3: is about what can you do for yourself and get
47:26
Speaker 3: that knock instead of like learning how to play as
47:30
Speaker 3: a game, and the less minor league levels that you have,
47:32
Speaker 3: the less opportunities you have to learn how to win,
47:37
Speaker 3: especially because they don't care about winning as much in
47:40
Speaker 3: the minor leagues. I mean, I saw three pitch inning
47:43
Speaker 3: this year, which I never thought i'd seen the major leagues.
47:45
Speaker 3: I saw.
47:46
Speaker 1: I saw them hit double play, first pitch out.
47:50
Speaker 3: And it was the ninth inning, I think too. I
47:52
Speaker 3: was like what. I couldn't believe it. I was like,
47:54
Speaker 3: did I just see a three pitch inning? I did.
47:57
Speaker 1: I saw a three pitch inning in the big leagues never.
48:00
Speaker 1: I may probably have seen one before, but it would
48:02
Speaker 1: just when you see one, you're just like, and I
48:04
Speaker 1: have conversations, you know.
48:06
Speaker 3: Crowds talking about tree. I would. We both have sons
48:09
Speaker 3: and my son sometimes my son will take a pitch
48:12
Speaker 3: and people people ask.
48:13
Speaker 1: Me, why why did he take that two well fastball,
48:16
Speaker 1: And I'm like, well, or why did he take that
48:18
Speaker 1: first pitch?
48:19
Speaker 3: Heater?
48:19
Speaker 1: Well, the kid before made a first pitch out, so
48:22
Speaker 1: he's trying. Because especially in high school, like the quicker,
48:25
Speaker 1: you can get that starter out of the game because
48:26
Speaker 1: most teams.
48:27
Speaker 3: Have like two or three decent starters, maybe one. You
48:29
Speaker 3: want to get to the bullpen in most teams because
48:31
Speaker 3: it's just it's high school just ain't as good. So
48:34
Speaker 3: the quicker you can get that guy out. But there
48:36
Speaker 3: are times where you have to suck it up.
48:37
Speaker 1: And there were times, listen, I mean a lot of
48:41
Speaker 1: times after the other team scored, you'd be like, hey,
48:44
Speaker 1: take one, give our hitter, give our pitcher a break,
48:46
Speaker 1: our pitch out to back up some bases, right, or hey,
48:49
Speaker 1: the guy.
48:49
Speaker 3: Swung the first pitch, you got to take the next
48:51
Speaker 3: one if you have. If you make two pitches on
48:53
Speaker 3: two outs, the next guy's got to take two strikes.
48:56
Speaker 3: You should right, you're flying yeah, because you don't want
48:59
Speaker 3: I mean, at least make it a pitch.
49:00
Speaker 2: In right well to swing this back to Raphaela. The
49:06
Speaker 2: front office likes a lot of what he's done this year,
49:09
Speaker 2: even if you haven't seen the more classic OPS results.
49:13
Speaker 2: So last year, in a full season, he had a
49:15
Speaker 2: six to sixty four OPS. This year it's a six
49:17
Speaker 2: sixty seven. Actually, his rookie yar with six sixty seven
49:20
Speaker 2: as well, so you're getting the same OPS results. His
49:23
Speaker 2: walk rate is about double what it was last year
49:26
Speaker 2: in a full season. His expected numbers, which I know
49:28
Speaker 2: they're expected numbers, but they are way way higher than
49:32
Speaker 2: what they were last year, Like his expected slugan percentage,
49:34
Speaker 2: is five h nine, So you could say there's some
49:37
Speaker 2: batted ball unluckiness there. Barrel percentage numbers are numbers, I know.
49:41
Speaker 3: But it's early in the sea he expected.
49:44
Speaker 2: I'm just telling you that the front office perspective is
49:47
Speaker 2: we are seeing a lot of good indicators that this
49:49
Speaker 2: guy is improving at the plate, even though the chase
49:52
Speaker 2: percentage is still pretty wild.
49:54
Speaker 3: That you're going to have a good expected numbers when
49:59
Speaker 3: you swing at a lot of pitches, you're gonna have
50:02
Speaker 3: because you're getting your A swing off on a B pitch.
50:06
Speaker 3: So that is where I think front offices get that
50:09
Speaker 3: wrong with the expected stuff. If you have a dude
50:11
Speaker 3: that controls the zone and his expected numbers are higher,
50:14
Speaker 3: that's when you're gonna see that uptick. I agree with AJ.
50:17
Speaker 3: His numbers are his numbers, and when you're a swinger,
50:21
Speaker 3: you're going to get your expected numbers go up. And
50:24
Speaker 3: then it's it's almost like a crutch. It kind of
50:27
Speaker 3: like he's gonna I just can't catch a break. Well,
50:31
Speaker 3: you could catch a break if you wait for the
50:33
Speaker 3: pitch that you're going to drive, not just hit hard.
50:39
Speaker 2: No doubt. But I mean we talked about hobby Bayaz
50:41
Speaker 2: for the last three years swinging out of his mind,
50:45
Speaker 2: and he actually did corral it a little bit this
50:47
Speaker 2: year and look at him. Go it's a very valuable player.
50:49
Speaker 2: By the Tigers started swinging less, so they're.
50:53
Speaker 3: Talking to one of the all times swingers here. So right,
50:56
Speaker 3: But my point, I've put the ball in play a lot.
50:58
Speaker 2: Are you concerned about Rothi Yella as a big leaguer
51:01
Speaker 2: or do you think that the Red Sox.
51:03
Speaker 1: Then I think this was just twenty four. I think
51:04
Speaker 1: he made a mistake. He's made some mistakes, and we've
51:07
Speaker 1: all made mistakes and stuff, and I think you know,
51:11
Speaker 1: someone tweeted about it and said something about it, and
51:14
Speaker 1: it's just it's what happens in big markets more than
51:17
Speaker 1: smaller markets where you just nitpick something. Right, Oh well,
51:21
Speaker 1: oh well, the third bench coach for the Red Sox said,
51:24
Speaker 1: rafael is supposed to take We can write a whole
51:25
Speaker 1: article about this and get the fans against Raffaela like
51:29
Speaker 1: he's doing exactly what he's there for. He's playing great defense,
51:32
Speaker 1: he gets on if he gets on base, he puts
51:34
Speaker 1: some pressure because he can run.
51:35
Speaker 3: Like the numbers are what their numbers are. And I
51:38
Speaker 3: don't know. This is this shouldn't be a big deal.
51:40
Speaker 3: If so long as someone went up to him said, hey,
51:42
Speaker 3: you're not supposed to swing there, then they've done their job. Now,
51:44
Speaker 3: if he continues to do it like ten times, then
51:47
Speaker 3: you'll have a conversation like, hey, dude, but one time,
51:50
Speaker 3: who cares?
51:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, nothing, burger, Okay, I'm with you. I like the player,
51:54
Speaker 2: that's all. I think there's still very good potential there
51:56
Speaker 2: for him to even get the back on a little
51:58
Speaker 2: bit more than what it's looking like at least ops wise.
52:02
Speaker 2: But what do I know. Let's slap Ayj's up. First.
52:17
Speaker 3: I got a couple of birthdays. First, Lance Lens birthdays today,
52:19
Speaker 3: So happy birthday, Lance. But also I noticed that Low
52:22
Speaker 3: Whitaker's birthday is today, and Yogi Yogi Barra. But how
52:26
Speaker 3: the hell is Lance Lou Whitaker not in the damn
52:28
Speaker 3: Hall of Fame. He's got seventy five wars, seventy five war,
52:32
Speaker 3: and he's got all like four digits.
52:34
Speaker 1: When you look at your at Baseball Reference and they're
52:37
Speaker 1: all like four digits, that means you were really good.
52:40
Speaker 3: Seventy five War, seventy five Yogi Bears was only fifty nine.
52:44
Speaker 2: He got screwed.
52:45
Speaker 3: He needs to be in. Somebody figure out how the
52:47
Speaker 3: help we get Lou Whittaker in.
52:48
Speaker 2: Agreed.
52:49
Speaker 3: And then second of all, we had a conversation about this,
52:51
Speaker 3: and don't tell me that I'm not the Pope's favorite player.
52:56
Speaker 3: Just Sam, look at that. Wow, I mean that was
52:58
Speaker 3: right after he was introduced, you got I mean that.
53:02
Speaker 2: Was under the shirt right because we didn't see that.
53:04
Speaker 3: No, no, that was he took it off once the camera.
53:06
Speaker 2: Oh gotcha.
53:07
Speaker 3: I had a special spy there took a picture of it.
53:09
Speaker 3: Special whats you guys name Stanley Tucci. He's on his
53:12
Speaker 3: left right there too, taking a picture. You know, Stanley
53:14
Speaker 3: Tucci isci bat actor guy. The actor guy left.
53:22
Speaker 2: Well, got some similar looks, I know you're talking about. Well,
53:27
Speaker 2: congrats to the Pope for for obviously becoming the Pope
53:31
Speaker 2: and also flipping a white sox man.
53:34
Speaker 3: Apparently, if you need a cameo, Pope, you cameo me.
53:37
Speaker 3: Hit me. What a choice.
53:50
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53:53
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53:56
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53:59
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54:12
Speaker 2: called one eight hundred gambler