Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to the delightful Dylan Rees about his choice of The Dalek Invasion of Earth (1/6)

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Talks to the delightful Dylan Rees about his choice of The Dalek Invasion of Earth (1/6) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

0:41
Welcome back to hamster with a blunt.
0:43
Penknife the Doctor Who commentary podcast.
0:47
I am through this evening to have a brand new guest on the
0:51
podcast, mr. Dillon Russo.
0:53
Hello Dylan. Hello, Dylan.
0:55
How's it going? How are we all done?
0:57
Straight off the bat. You go out.
0:58
I'm really not forget how you doing.
1:00
I'm very well thanks. I'm very excited to be here to
1:03
talk about some real life, televised Doctor Who.
1:06
But when podcast colloid as well, indeed, Jade.
1:09
You have your very own Doctor. Who podcast.
1:13
I tell you, I tell you, I have a podcast called Doctor Who too
1:16
hot for TV named. After the Jerry, Springer,
1:20
spin-off video. I don't know whether anybody
1:22
ever not think that that tenuous reference, but our logos based
1:25
on the Jerry Springer logo and everything.
1:28
And we look at all things Doctor Who extended universe.
1:32
So, we look at Books and Comics and audio books and scripts for
1:36
unmade, stories and things like that.
1:37
It's all Nothing's too Niche for us.
1:40
As the as the catchphrase, for the podcast goes, it started off
1:43
with me and my brother but he no longer does it.
1:46
And now have a guest co-host every week, talking about all
1:49
things extended Universe, most recently, we've just done the
1:52
script for the unmade 30th Anniversary Story, the dark
1:55
dimensions as a record. This that's interesting.
1:59
Oh it's fabulous. And it terrible.
2:02
Terrible script, I think yours is the only podcast you know,
2:06
apart from mine that has touched on to the BBV spin.
2:09
Says well yes, yes, yeah, well, so I love the BBV stuff.
2:14
I wrote this is a plug. But many years ago, I wrote a
2:18
book called downtime, the Lost Years of Doctor Who which looked
2:20
at all of the BB V and real-time spin-offs and stuff like that.
2:24
And covered up that you covered up like the whole of the 90s
2:27
essentially and a little bit before and then sort of the
2:30
client of that industry, little cottage industry, shall we say?
2:35
And I've just always loved those spin-offs The Good, The Bad and
2:38
The Ugly. Ugly of them.
2:39
So if you are we do is be a fuck.
2:41
Dalek invasion hurt. Where can I get older?
2:43
That book, you can get a small period baby.
2:46
I'm telling you, you can get that from obverse book.
2:50
So do you like the black archive and stuff like that?
2:53
It came out in 2015 so it's quite a while ago.
2:58
But it doesn't deal with the new era of BBV, shall we say, which
3:01
is maybe for the best? I don't know.
3:03
I I've done commentaries on with my valve actually on all torn
3:09
and Shakedown and the devil of winterbourne because like this,
3:13
like, they were keeping the flame alive where they let you
3:16
know that, you know what, you know, the production values of
3:18
variables, sometimes performances are variable but
3:22
you know what? They were putting material.
3:24
I was eating it up at the time. Yeah.
3:27
So was I I used to love them, you know, I was like 11, 12 15
3:31
whatever when a like I was. So yeah.
3:35
It was all of my teenage years, those things sort of came out.
3:38
So I I've got, you know, very fond memories of them.
3:41
I think the production side of things, really suffers it when
3:44
you watch them now because it's a bit like a they were all shot
3:47
on video tape like service. Pre digital Revolution.
3:50
Also, a lot of people have copies of these things that are
3:53
from recorded from videotapes years ago.
3:56
So they're not the best quality, actually the DVD versions do
4:00
kind of scrub up as well as they can.
4:02
In fact, there's a think it's either the devil, the ghost of
4:04
winterbourne when it was scrubbed up in high definition,
4:07
I could see a man's penis too. Pants.
4:09
I was like y'all. Are you all right?
4:15
We're so obsessed with these BBV things.
4:19
Me and more went to see Joe Carson who plays.
4:22
So one is like, Natasha Alexander.
4:25
Yeah, the autons spin-offs and so at a local theater
4:29
production, incredible tools to. Yeah, that's the first we talked
4:33
about again. Oh yeah, darling.
4:55
But so your podcast is available, what on all record?
4:59
Because catches, yes, catchers platforms, whatever they're
5:02
called, I never really know what to call them.
5:04
I don't know where the catcher things come from.
5:06
But yes, you can get it there and you can find On Twitter at
5:10
Dylan does who and I post all the links up and everything like
5:13
that. But yeah.
5:13
If you're interested in it, if you're interested in tenuous
5:16
Doctor, Who spin-off sore, you know some of the more legit ones
5:20
as well. Then we try and cover the ball
5:22
and I know some people said, oh, but I don't know anything about
5:25
them so I'm not sure whether I should listen, we do do a quick
5:28
plot synopsis before each thing, so you don't, you don't feel
5:32
like you have to know the story of the faction Paradox comic
5:35
that lasted for two issues that we covered on one of the Um so
5:39
yeah. Just we try and make it
5:41
accessible. It's like all Universe of
5:45
Storytelling. They came out and that's how I'm
5:46
isn't it? Yeah, yeah.
5:47
I'm don't don't really know about if you kind of join with a
5:50
new series I think going down that kind of Niche Avenue,
5:54
that's kind of unique. And there are a lot of dogs who
5:57
podcasts out there that are doing unique things so well.
6:00
Yeah, there we go. But as the 90s is kind of the
6:03
basis for it, because that's my era, but we did we we've covered
6:07
things from the 60s rock. Towards the map.
6:10
And next year I'm going to try and cover a spinoff from every
6:14
doctor and I mean every doctor will be thinking now give me
6:21
those talk to confidential's that William Hartnell to your
6:23
back and you know this is comic strips an annual stop.
6:28
We covered an annual story in one of them in which the first
6:31
doctor gets completely naked. But honestly, I did the Romans
6:35
commentary the other day and I was getting very hot under the
6:38
collar and that's all Ernestine also, the only sort of seen in
6:42
doctor as well. Of course, we're going to be
6:52
talking about so a few questions and what are your general
6:59
thoughts on the first lap time of first dr.
7:02
Zira season 2 in general and the dark invasion of Earth that
7:06
we're going to talk about. Well, so, I love the Hartnell
7:10
error and whatever I am invited onto somebody's podcast to talk
7:14
about televised Doctor Who I've always itching for a chance to
7:18
talk Hartnell. I'm really not a fan of Susan,
7:21
so I'm quite glad that she sort of yes, the futenma story is
7:25
custom built for you this. But I, you know, I love William
7:31
Hartnell. I love, I love Ian and Barbara,
7:34
and Steven and Steven dodo Vicki.
7:36
Vicki is the queen. And I've it took me a long time
7:43
to learn to love that are alike when I got into Doctor Who, as a
7:45
kid, I did, I found it quite inaccessible for a long time.
7:49
It didn't feel like the Doctor Who I know.
7:51
So I guess that's why I like it a lot now because it sometimes
7:56
feels not as fresh as other areas.
7:58
Like I can tell you, what happens in Revenge of the
8:00
Cybermen and day of the Daleks verbatim, almost because I watch
8:04
the VHS is often repeats as a kid, but the hotner ones never
8:06
really got touched until I was in some of my Twenties, I guess
8:10
the, but I really kind of went back to them and we visited them
8:13
again. Again, again, as I said to you,
8:15
I would have picked the keys of marinus, but you'd already done
8:17
that and I wanted like a, you know, a lot of Hartnell six
8:21
parter. So it this, this one seemed like
8:23
a good one and maybe I was tempted by the reign of terror
8:28
as well, but I've recently done a podcast with the doctor who
8:30
show about Dennis spoon as work. So I just thought, you know
8:33
what, let's go for this because it's not one that I'm hugely
8:38
fond of It's not, it's never a go to Hartnell mine, and I've
8:42
got to be honest and I'm sure I'm not alone.
8:44
I much prefer the film version which I know much better.
8:48
Yeah, I think I prefer the theme to just just mostly for the
8:51
production value. Yeah.
8:53
Although this this story is some is one that when I first watched
8:58
it I just thought. Wow this is really creepy stuff.
9:01
Yeah. And the more I watched it, the
9:05
more I feel like we might be heading this way.
9:06
You know, we're moving down the Daleks On it quite scary.
9:10
Now, you know, I'm not with the heart.
9:12
No error. I remember like, what was your,
9:15
what was your least? Favorite subject at school?
9:17
It was either geography or yeah. Probably geography.
9:21
I reckon. I loved history.
9:23
Okay, right. Ocean one in San Jose.
9:26
And when I discovered Doctor, Who young, those are no
9:31
historical from really gripped me, I was like, my God, there's
9:33
a way I can actually learn about history.
9:35
That's going to keep me interested and I still adore
9:38
all. All of those and I tend to find
9:41
my go-to, hartnell's are the historical ones.
9:44
The master mythmakers, the gun fires, the Romans, the Aztecs,
9:49
and the science fiction ones. There's a couple of really
9:52
strong ones. The Daleks the Dive Master Plan,
9:55
I think is really strong as well but I tend to find the science
10:01
fiction ones. I don't know.
10:04
The BBC absolutely could realize historical, whereas, when we're
10:08
heading into the future, 3,500 pounds was a long way to
10:12
stretch, you know. Well, I think they make up
10:14
bloody Fair, stabbing this, they do, and I think, like, I think
10:19
my go-to Hartnell is, probably the Romans or gunfighters.
10:23
So I prefer, I think I like them sillier.
10:26
I also really love the reign of terror on the keys of marinus,
10:30
which I don't get a lot of love, but I think those are sort of
10:33
my, three or four go to use. This is still Whitaker script
10:37
editing. Yeah.
10:38
Isn't it? Life, isn't it?
10:39
Yeah. What does supposed to come in?
10:41
Is it actually Spooner comes in at some point during season two,
10:46
but these are this and planet of giants.
10:50
Oh, the higher out in season one.
10:52
Yeah, so Spooner is basically from the next story, on words.
10:56
I've got a lot of love for Dennis Spooner but I just think
10:59
he, I think, William Russell says it best in the Romans
11:03
documentary is like, suddenly all this humor hit the show and
11:07
we were saying, you know, instead of saying this Terrible
11:09
old science fiction, be movie dialogue.
11:12
We were just saying, very funny, witty lines with energy.
11:15
You know, lies that you might actually say.
11:18
I love it. He makes he makes the characters
11:21
real. Like, he makes them have, makes
11:23
them bicker in the interesting way and have interest in
11:26
relationships. And I think you do start to see
11:28
that formed here and towards the end of that first season.
11:32
But it's the second season where all those relationships are
11:34
really formed, especially when the annoying Susan's got left.
11:39
I know I'll I am Seasons least a lot.
11:43
I really do. Not enjoy Susan, and I've met
11:46
can't afford a few times as well.
11:48
Add a few little incidents with her one where my hand was
11:52
covered in ink and a well anyway it was whole Vicky comes in
11:58
those ships full of energy and excitement even up for the
12:00
adventure. Yeah, she's amazing.
12:03
But unfortunately we've got six episodes of season to get
12:05
through but I'm like you know, I My favorite to harness or my
12:11
go-to is, are the Romans and the gun fires?
12:14
Yeah, there's so much fun, really fun.
12:16
And and kind of Pacey, I think the Romans got a hell of a pace.
12:20
It gives the yeah, no, we're not allowed to wear a sari any
12:23
excuse to do it. And, you know, you're also I
12:26
wish you two are like, I do my favorite lives in all of those
12:28
who is Maureen. O'Brien going on.
12:31
By the way, I think I might have poisoned Nero.
12:33
You know, it's great. Yeah, it's a blast and it, It's
12:39
a, well, well, needed injection of humor because that you can
12:42
tell that the actors are just having a great time at all.
12:47
So, instead of watching a doctor, who Story full of jokes
12:50
that humor, let's go to a war-torn devastated Earth in the
12:55
sounds wonderful. You wanna count is in, let's
12:58
press play. Yeah, okay, so we'll cap Press
13:01
Play in 3 2 1. If we go, there we go into time
13:07
and space. So you think this is sort of
13:09
like the end of that sort of first era.
13:12
Yes. Coming out.
13:14
Yeah. I mean, it's interesting that it
13:16
was shot as part of the first season as well and held over
13:18
because this does feel like the natural almost like the natural
13:24
finale for that first season. Instead, they ended up in the
13:28
reign of terror, which is but I like it isn't exactly what I
13:30
would describe the season finale.
13:32
But yeah, it's still a Core of the story though that the
13:36
opening of this is fantastic. Do you remember the Terrance
13:40
dicks opening to the of Dalek invasion of Earth was again?
13:45
It was a dead man. What?
13:46
No coin. You've ruined man.
13:48
Through a ruined City. Yeah.
13:50
Something like that. But yeah, what a corker of this
13:54
guy. Just this must have seemed so
13:56
weird and the 60s, if you think about it, what Doctor Who's done
13:59
before? And all of a sudden, you've got
14:00
somebody talking themselves at the start of an episode.
14:03
It's not this. It's the Orange.
14:05
Doesn't it? It does.
14:07
And I do find like, they try so hard in this story to sell an
14:12
apocalyptic world. They're not always successful,
14:15
but, you know, they're really going for destroyed London and
14:19
like people who've got emotional trauma because of it but it, you
14:24
know, it's just it's a great premise.
14:26
Another worry seems like that's hardest well, when they pop out
14:34
and The windows are open up or leaning in his later on.
14:40
It looks quite hot. So I imagine they just opened
14:42
it. Or someone was probably just
14:43
having a crafty track in there. This is a perfect example of
14:49
Richard Martin's very bizarre Direction.
14:51
In this year, the camera is literally like Focus somewhere
14:55
above the console. And William hartnell's head is
14:57
just sort of, in short just about, you know, I really ought
15:01
to I was watching this today and I'm just like, I do Not a huge
15:05
fan of Richard Martin's Direction.
15:07
I certainly does a lot better when he's out on film than he
15:09
does in the studios. And this considering what they
15:13
get away with and what happens in other stories, like this
15:17
really feels like Studio band, the interior stuff in, like,
15:21
when they talk about them having tiny sets, I don't necessarily
15:24
get that on the Aztecs or something like that.
15:26
But here I'm looking at I'm going, what a tiny tiny space
15:29
that they're all in and yet we didn't I think you're right when
15:32
he's out on location. When he suddenly using wider
15:36
lenses and it's visually a lot more Sumptuous.
15:40
And even seeing the location where I was being pretty
15:42
shocking back then, because we had the part from, not William,
15:46
Hartnell walking, to Paris reign of terror.
15:49
We have no. She's seen any location work to
15:51
this point. Yeah.
15:52
It certainly gives the whole story a real epic fail.
15:56
But then here you are back on it, Tynan little Studio back
15:59
lot. I love that, though, you know,
16:01
yeah, I don't know. I just love the fact that I try
16:03
to create. Entire universe in the corner of
16:05
lime. Grove, you know.
16:07
Yeah, it's weird. Like I feel like by the time you
16:10
get to the Triton era the shows, and the producers of the show,
16:12
are very aware of the show's limitations, but in the heart
16:16
malaria, and I think this is one of the things that draws me to
16:18
it. They go, it doesn't matter that
16:20
we haven't got married. We are going to go where ever,
16:23
we want in time and space and nothing's going to stop us.
16:25
So, even if it does, look a bit shoddy by modern standards, it's
16:30
the ambition is just phenomenal. You get to a point in like
16:33
season 5. Five where they hit a formula,
16:36
like, we know how to make this the kind of expensive because
16:38
we'll have one of you to say and but it's certainly a bit
16:41
creatively bankrupt. Whereas here.
16:44
Yeah. Yeah, of course we're gonna go
16:46
to an alien planet with wasps and Alex loves my enlai.
16:50
Why can't we do that? And we're going to show Studios.
16:53
Yeah, we're going to show a London completely destroyed.
16:56
Originally a Terry nation in an earlier draft of this, Terry
17:00
nation was aware of the budget limitations and he was like
17:03
going to come out. It's going to be really Stay
17:04
there going to trip over a dead body.
17:06
And but I thought of somewhere somehow somewhere, no, that's
17:10
going bigger. And so you get a, you get this,
17:13
this big sequence of someone throwing themselves off in the
17:16
river and I think the season two is like, get big or get out.
17:21
Yeah, you start off with Planet a Johnson, everything's big in
17:24
that but then you've got like, you know, something like that
17:26
where Planet which is a pig? Ambitious story.
17:29
Yeah, the chase. Well we're not just a chase, you
17:31
know for a town we're going to go for all of time and space.
17:34
You know it's almost like they know they're popular, they just
17:36
do anything. Yeah the nation's brief was
17:39
basically do the Daleks but bigger and better and I mean
17:43
that's what they do is I always felt that I could get into that
17:48
Tardis with a slip underneath that a big lad, you know.
17:59
I, These regulars, I don't know. William Russell Jaclyn Hill,
18:05
I'll tell you now. They could sell anything.
18:08
Oh, absolutely. They just it doesn't matter how
18:10
ridiculous a situation they're in.
18:12
Like, they just it, you just believe them.
18:16
You believe that, they believe they're in the far future, or in
18:19
the past, and it doesn't matter how much the stuff would be
18:22
ridiculous. Stuff is around them.
18:23
And when William Hartnell, make some of his occasional fluffs
18:28
the actors around him, they know him so well, that they They make
18:31
those flops believable as well. You know, my favorite one is
18:35
gone. This just shows you the level of
18:36
geekery here. You know like my favorite
18:38
William Hartnell line fluff is when he gets his in the space
18:42
museum and then I wish Direction doctor and he goes up and Willy
18:46
Russell jumps into goes. Straight ahead, straight ahead
18:50
and turn to the right. But that's the, you know,
18:54
they've all come from theater and stuff like that.
18:56
And television still made like a play.
18:58
So that's what you do. If you're a Actor, in a
19:01
television in a play and someone dries, you can't have helped
19:04
them along because you have to, because you've got to get
19:06
through it. They really gelled at this.
19:09
Yeah. I remember I did when I did the
19:12
sensor eyes. I was, like, at that point, I
19:14
kind of thought like, this Ensemble has come together.
19:16
And yeah, they're just Perfectly Natural with each other now,
19:19
which is why I'm sure William Hartnell was as livid as he was
19:22
in this and in the chase when the regular started deserting
19:26
the show left, right? And Center Forth.
19:28
Yeah, it's interesting that the store me where they probably
19:32
become a unit. Is Marco Polo, which is
19:36
obviously missing from the archives, and I think it'd be
19:38
and I think that's not just as cast members, but as characters
19:43
to like it's written in that respect, because they spend its
19:45
months and months, they spend the Marco Polo.
19:47
And I think or so, it's a shame that we're kind of missing that
19:51
link from this season from this early season, or the first
19:54
season boy, those Teddy Snaps are enticing, okay, Poli?
19:58
I mean, that's a money on the screen in that, I'm telling you,
20:02
David Whittaker. Ow, I think doesn't get spoken
20:05
about enough. No.
20:06
Doesn't in terms of the scripts, he did them right?
20:09
Because I think it's Richard. Martin that said, you know,
20:13
Terry Nation wrote some pretty basic scripts and his ideas were
20:18
there and then David Whittaker added a lot of the substance of
20:21
the character work and there's definite sort of character.
20:25
Are we calling the character arcs?
20:26
Now character Journeys. Let's say throughout series 1
20:30
and 2 and I think a lot of those Whittaker It is 100% And there's
20:35
a lot of which he wrote a lot of those Dalek Comics as well.
20:39
And I'm apparently he wrote that the movies as well.
20:43
I think he'd at least it a pass on the movies if I'm remembering
20:47
correctly. So he he shapes all of the sort
20:51
of classic kind of first season, all the things we think of as
20:57
like, oh Terry Nation did that or so.
20:58
And so did that he is, he's the Terrance dicks of his day, you
21:01
know, like will never know how much of the stuff he really.
21:03
I wrote but he was rewriting it all and making it okay, here and
21:07
TV show. And, you know, I do think that
21:12
the story is obviously a lot tighter because it's 90 minutes,
21:16
or that's not even 90 minutes. The movie is it, I think it's 87
21:20
or something. And so clearly, you can fit this
21:23
narrative into an 87 minute movie and not really, but what
21:28
you do lose is a lot of this very early atmosphere and this
21:33
is what Terry. She does brilliantly.
21:35
I think I tell relation part one is, is usually where his
21:40
strengths are determination part, 4 or 6?
21:43
It's usually, you know, somewhere in the gutter, but
21:47
when you've just got people exploring the world youth, I'm
21:49
thinking of that first episode, the Daleks and here as well.
21:51
It's beat for beat, it's almost the same thing through their
21:54
exploring somewhere. That is unknown to them.
21:59
But you get, I mean, we've just seen a load of lovely location
22:03
footage, which I think, you know, helps us, get out of the
22:05
studio, even more, like in the Darwin's, obviously you've got
22:09
the whole Petrified Forest thing.
22:11
But also, again, we're talking about these guys being settled
22:15
into the roles, so I think we just missed that lovely line
22:18
where Hartnell goes. I'm not a half-wit which is this
22:21
fantastic. And his famous jolly good smack
22:24
bottom which was a beloved by him.
22:25
It was not in the script. So I feel like the emphasis was
22:29
all wrong though when they redid that in twice, Connors home.
22:33
Yeah. I mean how do you say it when
22:34
people when they reinterpret heart though?
22:37
They forget how extremely charming and funny.
22:41
He could be and they just making this terrible Grump.
22:43
Yeah, it's interesting but having said that my girlfriend
22:48
loves that. The first doctor has played by
22:51
David Bradley. She's not like a huge Doctor Who
22:53
fan or anything but it's her favorite characters it from the
22:56
new series of the first doctor played by David Bradley.
22:59
I'm Jackie Tyler. And Jackie that option.
23:03
We shows Great Taste of you all today.
23:05
Exactly. And so she said to me, could you
23:08
show me an episode of like the original actor?
23:12
I just want to see if it's the same and she was like, show me
23:15
the first one with the Daleks in.
23:16
So we didn't watch the whole story watched episode to
23:19
complete bloody also in that. Yeah, but she was like, oh, it's
23:22
100% the same person. It's a shoulder.
23:27
The web Planet. Yeah.
23:32
So she probably would've left me.
23:35
Yeah, it's it's interesting that it's actually that Bradley
23:39
version of the doctor and twice Upon a Time and people don't
23:42
like he's actually more recognizable as the first doctor
23:46
to someone who doesn't really like Doctor Who or doesn't or
23:49
isn't a fan that's fair though, I think.
23:52
Yeah, so it's sort of a caricature in a way and I found
23:55
it the same with the rich and handle versions are quite like
24:00
as well. But he's got gnashes his teeth
24:03
far more than A hard. No.
24:04
And although you know, Tiga needs a good telling off, so I
24:09
don't complain too much but there's definitely like an
24:11
emphasis shift. I think it's after this story.
24:14
I think he's still with that kind of, but very commanding,
24:17
very Stern with your model for a law this story.
24:19
And he kind of asked because it's all, you know, you poor
24:23
pathetic creatures, you know and then take on the dark but then
24:26
Vicky comes along and it just softens him well ye utter an
24:30
amazing way. Well yeah it gets the
24:32
granddaughter of it. Always was Didn't survive noise,
24:35
Paris casting around time and space for the whole time, I'd be
24:38
like that. If I answer was locked in time
24:41
and space with Susan, just miserable.
24:44
No, I'm being too. Kind of hoping that she doesn't
24:53
pull through and just dies there black.
24:56
Dysentery, or something like that violent.
24:58
Man. I just wish Mom would say when
25:02
they go off in the Card to the guillotine.
25:04
Like, you know. Yeah, just do it first.
25:07
Yeah, oh, we get, right, we're just about to get a robo man in
25:10
the Box. Who tips the box over himself
25:12
there because it didn't fall. Oh, that's right, that's right
25:18
to would go again then I think they what can I do at the time
25:21
three cups or something. It was, yeah.
25:23
I think I just don't think he knows how to work a studio at
25:26
all. I mean, being a director in a
25:29
studio is a very different thing to being a film director.
25:32
You know, it's more technical We both like mixing Vision mixing
25:36
and getting the cameras in the right place where actually and I
25:39
think he struggles to do that and kind of get the decent shots
25:44
that I think you would agree. He would hope to get.
25:46
So I'm always a little bit disappointed with his work.
25:49
Interesting here is I think Martin's are better filming
25:53
director and Terry nation is definitely a filming writer and
25:56
in the 1720 chips off. So you know all those spy shows
25:59
and things like he's in his element, he can recycle black
26:02
plot after plot, it's just loads of people.
26:03
Going around with God, car, chases and gums and you know, he
26:06
hasn't gotten too much about a plot.
26:08
Well, nation was already doing the same to this point Doctor
26:14
Who was his weekend work. So he'd write the same to Monday
26:17
to Friday and then he'd write doctors like it.
26:19
Sometimes each script took him eight hours to write which is
26:25
really incredible. I always tell that story that
26:29
Donald Tosh tales about. Yeah.
26:30
Where's the script sardonyx? Got it master plan, and he turns
26:33
out This tiny envelope like there's a synopsis for 16 full
26:37
of out. I'm off to America to sell the
26:39
darling. I do want like Donald toss does
26:43
have a reputation for embellishment, shall we say that
26:46
if so but Jenna let the truth. Get deep into a Doctor Who
26:49
convention it was cause I'm outta here.
26:55
Is that true? Are you sure that is such a man
26:58
of integrity? He was no good bullshit, you
27:00
know. Yeah.
27:02
It's Every now and then you'll see footage from a convention
27:08
from like those the eighties and you hear the stories that you
27:12
hear now. But there because they don't
27:16
quite get a laugh or a rise. Like they're more just normal.
27:19
And then over time, they just been embellished embellished
27:23
embellished in order to become that classic convention,
27:26
anecdote, and I turned around and the entire world was wearing
27:30
eye patches. Even though that I love that
27:34
when they go, for that door, there is definitely a Dell has.
27:39
This like an atmosphere of Doom to this isn't that?
27:41
There was a palpable atmosphere. So this first episode there is
27:46
and the guy who falls through the door is Peter Diamond, who
27:50
was also the robot man who died at the beginning.
27:52
So he's been in this episode twice, already seen the ruins as
27:55
well. Possibly, he was always getting
27:57
killed or stabbed, but this stuff, this stuff now with the
28:01
tracking shot, across with Barbara running, Our way through
28:04
the sort of devastated landscape is fantastic.
28:08
It looks like proper. It looks like a proper film.
28:11
It is like a movie? Yeah.
28:13
Like and it's a great little location.
28:15
I believe it was the Wood Lane Underground Station like the
28:19
exterior of that they had like an abandoned tube near there.
28:23
So it's I guess those are like where the trains are kept or
28:26
something. But it's it all looks really
28:29
good and I didn't realize until I watched this today.
28:32
All of that location footage. It's got music on it, but
28:35
there's no audio. So I'm not sure whether they
28:38
actually recorded audio for this and whether it's all done
28:40
silent. Okay.
28:42
You can already tell Kenya? No.
28:43
No. The music is quite effective.
28:45
Ah, drums going on in this, isn't there?
28:47
And yeah, and what militaristic beats.
28:51
Yeah, and then weird little sort of Night of the Living Dead sort
28:54
of organ synthesizer, sounds as well.
28:56
And very sort of discordant, isn't it?
28:59
Yeah, it's really like off. Putting it off.
29:03
The Daleks all sir you ever seen But Moon?
29:07
Yes, yes, sir. Looks like the songs that it
29:10
goes up to, but Moon. And now do you know why?
29:13
It's so wobbly? But obviously it's a shit
29:16
effects but that was drunk holding the street.
29:19
Well, that it's, they tried to do the strings from the bottom
29:23
rather than the top because they're like your I
29:25
automatically looks for the strings at the top.
29:28
But so they were like, we're doing them sort of, on Rod, to
29:32
type things at a Some but it's even harder to control.
29:35
So it looks shitter when the strings aren't actually where
29:39
they're supposed to be honest, he Delights us or trigger that
29:41
gets me hard. That's what I'm here for that
29:46
that source for in 2150 ad. It's gorgeous in.
29:50
In this yeah. Is there a model of that out
29:54
there isn't? I think because of who owns the
29:57
rights to those films, there's just no murch associated with
30:00
them which is a shame because you want a whole Army of Those
30:03
dialects give me a cushion pit action.
30:07
Figure, give me a model of at it.
30:08
I'm still waiting for a massive. This.
30:09
I'll be, you know, it's only a matter of time.
30:15
Only a matter of time. I like Terry Nation knows how to
30:19
drop you into a scenario dramatically.
30:23
I think he does it here. He does it in dollars master
30:26
plan. He does it in stories like
30:28
Android Invasion like he knows where to put you in the
30:31
narrative and How he builds up is episodes.
30:35
Episode ones with lots of clothes.
30:38
Yeah, you got to try and sort of build a picture together and
30:40
then usually, the answer is all the Daleks are here, not getting
30:43
in there. Yeah, they there are always a
30:46
great setup and I think I hate the kind of thing that ever is
30:51
like alternations. A bit of a hack.
30:52
It's not a bit of a hack. It was a very busy, man.
30:55
Who sometimes would require a good script Editor to give his
30:59
scripts of Polish. But here and the first, Dalek
31:03
story and Indeed the chase. I just think, you know, they're
31:06
quite tight stories and I mean, the chase episode 1, you.
31:09
We could probably lose their. Just sit around watching TV for
31:12
episode. One thing, I mean that's the
31:14
whole basis of this podcast though, right?
31:16
So though, well, exactly, I've built my entire focus on the
31:19
chase episode 1. I love that story of Hancock
31:23
saying that area. How dare they asked you to write
31:26
children's television, one nerve and then 10 years later, sipping
31:30
champagne, when Hancock's careers going down the pan,
31:33
you're right. Tara, Tony.
31:34
How you doing? Yeah.
31:36
It's is. And I like his other work.
31:38
I've seen them. And you know what?
31:40
I'd be really interested in is actually seeing some of Britain
31:43
Martin's, other work, maybe later in his career look, yeah,
31:47
I believe so because I just wonder whether if he, if he's
31:52
say made the transition into film or made the at least
31:56
working on TV shows that were all shot in film and maybe I'd
32:00
love to see whether he can actually pull off a decent.
32:03
Episode of something somewhere like on the documentary.
32:06
Martin talks a lot about you know I had all these visions of
32:10
what I wanted to do a doctor and I didn't have the time and I
32:12
didn't have the money now to a point, I think that's true
32:15
because in the budget was small, one, the time, you know, was
32:18
precious, but then you watch the chase, which I do love, but for
32:23
all the wrong reasons, then you watch the Dive Master Plan,
32:26
which is essentially the same story, but executed to the
32:29
fucking Hilt. And I'm like, well, he had the
32:32
same time. And he had the same money.
32:34
I think he might have a little less money on the doctors well,
32:37
quite possibly and is executed with so much more Panache I do.
32:41
Think there's certainly an element of the skill, the
32:43
director as well. Yeah, no I agree.
32:46
I agree. And I think it's a shame that I
32:50
don't know, like, I just don't think he's a good Studio
32:52
director and I don't think he was able to control the floor in
32:55
a way wanted to, and it's his stories that I think you see a
32:59
lot of the more sort of dodgy, a cliches of Doctor, Who acted Out
33:03
of light cameras, bumping into things and leave Mike's in shot.
33:07
And in fact, this version watching on DVD and I think the
33:09
same for the Blu-ray. They have digitally painted at a
33:14
few boom mics and stuff like that.
33:18
And I believe there's also a scene somewhere in here that was
33:21
shot in studio for it was supposed to be at night time,
33:25
but it was that shot as data and by mistake and they've dark and
33:30
that seen her bit further down the line.
33:31
But I couldn't tell you which one it is.
33:33
One of the few Doctor Who stories that we don't have the
33:37
original edit by the choice of the Restoration Team.
33:40
That's a look at the lovely shot though.
33:42
The high angle shot of the roadman, will ya, you see this
33:45
stuff is really great. And again, were inducted in the
33:47
movie, all of a sudden, I don't know what I think.
33:49
That's some Catherine's dogs or something like that.
33:52
Yeah, but it looks brilliant. But also sometimes he makes very
33:56
bizarre creative choices as well.
33:59
Like, I think the road men are a great idea when they start.
34:03
Talking and it's that sort of weird slurred and it like is the
34:07
idea of like, a sort of dehumanized person.
34:11
Yeah, it works. That's a bit try like it's a
34:15
bit. Embarrassing.
34:16
It is. It's also it makes me.
34:18
I do think there's some great stuff you could do with the robo
34:21
and and indeed they do it in the Dalek Empire series from Big
34:26
finish, but I do think here, like you, like, how are they
34:30
stopping anything? They all move really slowly and
34:33
The all they've got is whips. It's like, you know, I mean, if
34:39
you like being whipped great, you'll have a lovely time but
34:41
like I feel like anybody could outrun one of one of the robo
34:45
men and then not that much of a threat, which is a shame because
34:49
I'm sure they get it much better in the movie.
34:51
However, with that and comedy sequence of them all eating,
34:55
what they really little sugary sweets?
34:58
Yeah, the sort of sweets my nana used to buy me that were just
35:01
pure Spiel weird. Takes me there for bit like
35:04
those rainbow drops. You know, that's the one.
35:06
Yeah. Norbert equipment is trying to
35:08
do the synchronized eating. It's all right.
35:10
Yeah we are heading out. Now to one of the I think one of
35:16
the most memorable Cliffhangers. Yeah.
35:19
It's I mean it's one of those ones that's gone into like the
35:24
public conscience about Doctor Who as well in terms of it's one
35:26
of those classic clips that was always used on clip shows in the
35:29
80s and 90s. It's great fun.
35:32
There we go. This this First bit is the model
35:36
and then it cuts to. So as it rises from the water,
35:39
that's a model. And then when you go into the
35:41
wide shot, all of a sudden you're dealing with the an
35:45
actual Dalek, on location case must be like, they got a bloody
35:48
nerve. They've been promising in the
35:49
trailers, the Daleks, well, where the hell are The Darlings?
35:52
Well, what a great cat for the episode.
35:54
It's fantastic, isn't it? It's a different color to the
35:57
model because it yeah, it looks very different.
36:01
It's and I think I maybe they were losing I'm like I know they
36:04
had a lot of trouble pushing the Dalek out of out of the water
36:08
because they couldn't move on the surface.
36:12
But overall I how do you write that as an opener?
36:14
I think it's a corker of an opener despite the issues with
36:18
the direction. I think it's a belter.
36:21
Well at I'm going to do this at the end of each episode or I'm
36:25
going to hit you because we took to Twitter and asked if anybody
36:29
had some comments or questions for you about the Dalek invasion
36:32
of Earth. And we have a deluge of
36:35
questions, and there's more company in.
36:37
This is very exciting. Well, I don't know where I went
36:41
heard him yet. So everybody speaking.
36:44
The bunch to listen to this podcast.
36:45
Are you know, erudite wissy, Charming.
36:49
Let's find out. Okay, you ready?
36:52
Yeah. So Jim Allen be the lovely Jim
36:55
Allen B says is their scope for a spinoff series set during the
36:59
years that the Daleks occupied the earth.
37:01
Oh absolutely. I would love to To see the
37:04
Rebels versus the Daleks and just how desperate things could
37:07
get. You could do a really sort of
37:10
gritty drama about that. I'm there for it.
37:12
So I me up. Get dissed.
37:13
Get Disney on the phone or and now, we've just mentioned it, of
37:17
course, big finish spin-off. It will be out, it's Jason
37:21
Thompson. I think he's just put a comment.
37:23
He says, this is a pretty bleak tale for Doctor Who certainly
37:27
the grimmest, how is told so far?
37:29
I'd agree with that. Yeah, it's basically a war story
37:32
about narcy. Asian, the Daleks work better on
37:35
location and ever hear Richard. Martin may not get the
37:38
limitations of Studio direction that his location.
37:40
Work is superb. Oh yeah, a great.
37:43
A great. We didn't even need to do the
37:45
podcast. We could have just read that
37:46
comment. Okay, I'll do two more than Andy
37:53
Parkinson asked, which version did you see first the TV, or the
37:57
movie, the movie? I saw the movie a long time
38:01
before I saw the TV. Version.
38:03
In fact, when I first learned about Doctor Who missing
38:06
episodes, I thought this was missing.
38:08
So I just never even looked for the, the VHS as it was back then
38:14
and this story. So I know the movie version much
38:16
better than, I know this version.
38:18
We had ideas on a VHS, right? Yeah, I saw the movie first of
38:22
all, my mom tapes on a VHS and every she, but she kept her
38:25
hidden away and then when it was like a bank holiday and it was
38:28
pissing with rain and I'll be whinging.
38:30
I couldn't go out. She pulled out garlic as well.
38:33
The two movies and they come with her.
38:35
I know the dialogue in those movies, inside out and back to
38:39
front. Whereas this I've got I got a
38:41
lot washing, it new every time. Yeah, yeah.
38:43
I know, every time I'm watching this, even this time around, I'm
38:46
like, oh, this feels slightly unfamiliar in a way that the
38:50
film just doesn't well, he actually went on to ask.
38:53
Does that alter does the order you watch these in alter your
38:57
view? He saw the movie first and
38:59
although, it might be Blasphemous to say, and we
39:03
agree. With this I think I prefer the
39:05
movie version. Yeah absolutely.
39:08
Okay well here's the question then from Jean Hall.
39:11
Who's being a clue? Facetious is this the only
39:14
Doctor Who story that has a main cast member of are you being
39:18
served in it? Yes I believe.
39:25
Mrs. Slocombe this pussy might be in plenty of giant.
39:31
Yeah now I think apart from apart from Also, I think it is,
39:35
I think it is. Well, I'll say two more
39:37
questions for episodes 226, exciting stuff.
39:42
And if you hold my hand, let's skip into episode 2.
39:46
I sheltered. Let's do it.
39:49
I'll cut it there an awfully stuff.
39:51
Lovely, gravy, make this effortless.
39:55
Use your fine. I've got a driver bit when
39:56
someone's on this for the first time.
39:58
Oh, it's my pleasure. Yeah, well, it's I've listened
40:02
to quite a few of those He's so I feel like I know you even
40:04
though we've never met before. There we go.
40:06
Jesus Christ. 11 college with me, I feel like I've known you
40:10
for a lifetime are thinking, maybe it's not.