Latest / For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast / #310 - For Azeroth!: "Mogu and Estate Tax"

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#310 - For Azeroth!: "Mogu and Estate Tax" · For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast

0:00
Yeah, World of Warcraft definitely needs to introduce
0:03
the crafting system, the player housing craft and crafting
0:07
system to all of the professions.
0:09
Don't just have one crafting profession for housing, bring it
0:13
to all of them. All right, so tailoring.
0:16
Make those curtains. What the hell does mining put
0:20
in? We'll figure it out later.
0:21
I don't some beautiful salt lamps or something, I don't
0:24
know. Lava lamp for mining be perfect
0:27
chicken for Lauderon for the Karen tour for Pandaria.
0:36
For calendar to the burning region.
0:41
For Gilnaeus I have not done for the Lich King, for the Cindori,
0:49
for the Alliance. For the whore for Azeroth.
0:56
Hello and welcome back to a special episode of For Azeroth.
1:00
I am Manny, AKA the Trueville Manny, and today I am joined by
1:06
the one and only Corey Misledine.
1:09
Hello, Mr. Misledine. Hello Manny.
1:12
Thanks for having me on. Yeah.
1:14
No, this is this is a second take, pulling back the the
1:19
curtain. You were originally supposed to
1:22
have your episode over the holiday season, some technical
1:26
difficulties and you've been kind enough to like jump back
1:28
into the recording booth with me.
1:30
So thank you for that. I wasn't sure if you were going
1:32
to reveal that info or not, but yeah, my pleasure.
1:36
No problem. Oh, yeah.
1:38
Oh, yeah. No, I, I, I thank you because I
1:41
was all freaking out about it and be like, please can you come
1:43
back on? And you've been nothing but
1:46
chill about it, not give me any Flack about it.
1:49
And I think in that vein, showing that screwing up is not
1:54
the end of the world would be a good thing to put out there.
1:58
Yeah, you're right. Got to.
2:00
I heard something once that you showcase your mistakes and I and
2:04
I like that. I like that.
2:06
I like that too. I, I don't have a showcase that
2:09
big, but we'll, we'll, we'll put some choice points in there.
2:15
Today we're here to talk about Final Fantasy, the housing
2:20
situation in Final Fantasy and how the World of Warcraft can
2:24
learn lessons from that. So Corey, you are both a World
2:29
of Warcraft streamer and a fond of Fantasy streamer.
2:32
How long you been playing both those games?
2:35
I've been playing Wow pretty consistently since I started in
2:41
vanilla, but I didn't like it and then didn't really.
2:44
I came back and didn't really like BCI was also young, I was
2:48
like 12 or 13 and then started playing a lot more seriously in
2:52
2009, which is the account that I still have for Wrath of the
2:57
Lich King. Pretty much been playing ever
2:58
since then. For Final Fantasy 14, I want to
3:02
say I started it in 2020, kind of softly started it and then
3:09
started getting way more into it in about 2022.
3:14
And then it took me until 2024 to get caught up in the story
3:19
and actually be able to experience the game with
3:21
everybody else in their end game systems.
3:24
And you know that where the housing stuff really shines and
3:29
all that jazz. So been a while.
3:32
Yeah. And so as you've been going
3:37
through it, as you've acclimated to it, you can you can tell the
3:41
differences between the two different games, the two
3:45
different communities. So I guess a question would be,
3:52
because the community is so different, is everything in
3:55
Final Fantasy do you think would work in World of Warcraft or do
4:01
you think there are some things where the the mindsets are just
4:03
different in in general, not just in housing?
4:07
Yeah, I think, I mean, I think in Final Fantasy 14, there's
4:10
this little bit of, I want to say patience.
4:13
There's there's a little bit of we, we allow these things to
4:20
kind of settle and, and, and allow these things to breathe
4:24
whereas and wow, it's go, go, go, go, go.
4:26
I always I need to be, I need to get this, I need to get that.
4:29
I need to be, you know, I need to get into the top 10 of this
4:33
title or whatever I need for mythic plus I need to be chasing
4:36
this end game system all the time.
4:37
In Final Fantasy 14, it's a lot more like easy breezy cover girl
4:42
type of like I'll go get this glamour so I can make my
4:46
character look really good. And then I can do this raid that
4:49
I can progress savages with. And then I can maybe do this
4:53
other thing with the the crafting that I can do.
4:58
And I can go on this journey and do custom deliveries for 8 hours
5:01
or I can go to the Golden Saucer and play these mini games.
5:04
It's, it's a very, yeah, very different mindsets.
5:07
I think in both. I always say the big thing for
5:11
me is Final Fantasy 14 feels like a game to live in and World
5:16
of Warcraft feels like a game to work in.
5:18
And they both have their those those things to me.
5:21
Both have their places, which is why I play both.
5:24
OK, OK, so Final Fantasy, you have gone to the end game.
5:29
You've been playing with the housing situation that's that's
5:34
there. Give us a basic rundown of how
5:39
Housing Works in Final Fantasy. Yeah.
5:42
So you can get a house at pretty much any point as long as you
5:46
have enough gill for it and as long as you are lucky enough to
5:49
win. They use something, a housing
5:52
lottery system is basically how they that works.
5:55
So you'll there will be a plot that will be open, people will
6:01
try to buy it, they'll be put into a little lottery system and
6:05
then it'll pull and see who out of the people that listed for it
6:09
won. So it literally is a lottery
6:12
system. You get like a 5 day entry
6:16
period that you can do and then there's a results period that
6:20
lasts for four days. So if you don't go and confirm
6:23
your lottery results and finalize the land purchase, the
6:26
lottery will begin again. So, you know, if you're trying
6:29
to buy a house, you, you kind of want to enter into that and and
6:33
even if you lose, just hope that the person doesn't show up so
6:35
you can enter again. That's, you know, definitely a
6:39
problem, I think with the housing and Final Fantasy 14,
6:43
but we can get into that. There's also these there's
6:46
different types of plots in each area.
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Each ward that you can go into, there's a bunch of different
6:51
wards and then you can buy a large plot, which is very
6:56
expensive. You can buy medium plots and
6:58
then they have small plots as well.
7:01
There's also like a bunch of different residential districts
7:04
that you can go to. So if you like the vibe of a
7:07
certain city, you can go there and build your city there or
7:11
your your house there. There's also there's even
7:16
apartments that you can get which don't have a lottery
7:19
system. Those you can just grab and it's
7:21
basically just like a room. You have to be at least level 50
7:25
with one class to get that. And then there's also Guild
7:28
housing called free companies and those are, those are
7:33
different. You can buy a like if you're in
7:36
a Guild or free company that has housing, you can buy a private
7:40
chamber in there, which is basically similar to an
7:42
apartment, but it costs like 300,000 gill.
7:46
There's there's a lot in the housing system.
7:48
It's pretty expansive and expensive.
7:53
Definitely seems like a Gill sink gold sink.
7:58
It sounds like you do have a lot of options between those
8:02
apartments and the private chambers in your Guild housing
8:05
that anybody can sort of get and the limited housing that you
8:10
have to get the plots for. Now with the with the limited
8:16
housing, can you have multiple houses at a time?
8:20
Or is it that once you have a place you are able to then get
8:24
another place or enter into a lottery for another plot?
8:27
Yeah, once you have a place that is, that is your house, I don't
8:31
think they allow you to like you can, there are ways that you
8:35
can, you can like demolish your house in the free up the plot
8:39
and then they'll give you some of the money that you used back.
8:43
They also do that for if you, if you haven't been on the game in
8:47
a long time, if it has, if that house just hasn't been active,
8:52
it will be reclaimed by the game.
8:54
The game will just take the house back and and you won't
8:56
have it anymore. You will get your at least some
8:59
of your guilt back. But yeah, once you once you buy
9:02
a house that is your that is your house.
9:04
So then you'd have to do the whole process again.
9:07
You'd have to get it demolished and go back into the lottery
9:10
system if you wanted to change it.
9:11
There is some stuff that they're doing now of like if you bought
9:14
a small plot, that is you have a small plot, but you'll be able
9:20
to expand the inside of your house to be the size of a large
9:26
plot, for instance, if you just spend enough money to do that
9:31
like you've. Got a TARDIS?
9:32
Sort of. Effect going on yeah, you have a
9:34
little bit of a TARDIS thing going on you walk in and it's a
9:36
lot bigger than it looks, which I think is is awesome.
9:40
I think that is something that like that part in particular I I
9:44
really like and I hope that, you know, I hope that Wow offers
9:50
different size houses from the outside, but that the insides
9:56
can be pretty pretty much universally large like you can,
10:01
you know what I mean? They don't, we don't need the
10:03
outside to be indicative of what's inside all the time.
10:07
You know what I mean? OK, well the outside is
10:10
something that is somewhat unique to Final Fantasy, because
10:15
Final Fantasy has neighborhoods, right?
10:17
Oh yeah, so in Final Fantasy 14 you have the residential
10:23
districts. There's five residential
10:25
districts. So those are basically like what
10:27
city they're in the vibe of the place, you know, is it foresty?
10:31
Is it Limsa Lomensa type? So there's an ocean right
10:34
nearby? Or is it whatever the whatever
10:37
the thing would be? So all of those residential
10:40
districts, they each have about 30 wards to them.
10:43
And then in those wards, there's like 60 plots, I believe, maybe
10:51
more. And so each of those, each of
10:54
those wards is basically a neighborhood.
10:56
So you can walk around that and see everybody around you's house
11:00
and they can customize the outside of their house, they can
11:02
customize their yard. They can do all this stuff and
11:04
you can just really walk around their yard.
11:07
You sometimes you can't get into somebody's house unless they
11:09
have that set to be a thing that they allow.
11:12
Usually it's like they have to be on your friends list or you
11:15
know, or they just don't allow anybody into their house or
11:17
whatever the case may be. But you can freely walk around
11:20
and look at everybody's neighborhood, their houses in
11:23
your neighborhood. You can like wave to your
11:25
neighbor that's like out getting their mail cause literally there
11:28
is mailboxes outside of the houses.
11:30
It's really cool. I so I don't have a house 'cause
11:35
I'm poor in Final Fantasy 14 and in a lot of other things, but it
11:39
was specifically Final Fantasy 14.
11:42
I'm, I live in, I'm a roommate. I live in my buddy Tomas's
11:48
house. I live there.
11:49
I don't pay any bills. It's a great set up.
11:52
I don't have to pay electric. It's awesome.
11:55
He supplies everything. I haven't had to decorate.
11:58
He gave me a floor to decorate in the house.
12:00
Actually, he's like, OK, you need to do the upper level.
12:04
This is going to go really bad, but so I we were outside because
12:10
we all meet at our house for any time.
12:14
We're getting like a static together to go do a group.
12:16
We all meet at at mine Tomas house that I'm a roommate in and
12:22
some neighbor built a like a like a gingerbread house right
12:27
next door. So you look over, there's like a
12:30
serious stuff we're talking about like how we're going to
12:32
get this raid and like blah, blah, blah.
12:34
You look over and there's just a giant house made of candy.
12:37
It's really great that you can just see all that.
12:39
It's really cool. That is especially because it
12:44
something that other people will see that had nothing to do with
12:48
it. But like you just talked about
12:50
something else that I thought was really good is that this is
12:54
like a meeting place that you and your friends and the people
12:57
of your static group, your raid raid group will be like, yeah,
13:00
let's meet over at Tomas Place and you'll just be there in the
13:05
front front yard like getting together or if they have
13:08
permissions, like they can walk, walk in and stuff.
13:10
These people who are walking around the house, can they like
13:15
move anything? Can they pick up that chair?
13:16
So it'd be like, OK, I'm going to sit over here for a bit.
13:19
When it leaves does it like reset back or are those things
13:21
like stuck in place? Those things are stuck in place,
13:23
however the homeowner set them up.
13:25
I think there are settings though, that folks can turn on,
13:28
like allow people to like I can because I can, I can move stuff
13:33
in the house. So if I can move stuff in the
13:36
house and therefore other people probably could, but I think
13:39
that's up to the homeowner and how they select that.
13:43
But you can't like take somebody's stuff like I can't be
13:46
like, this is mine now, but I can change the like rotation of
13:49
the item so that like, you know, it's, it's got like a little
13:53
diagonal and I want it to be flushed to the flushed to the
13:56
side, whatever the case may be, you can do, you can do stuff
14:00
like that, which is, which is fun, which is neat.
14:03
And then Tomas gave you a floor to decorate.
14:07
So you have decorating privileges.
14:13
So that is something that like you can set up where it's like,
14:17
OK, this guy on my friends list, he's able to, he's able to do
14:21
the decorations. Does that mean that in a Guild
14:25
hall you could do the same thing where it's like, OK, officers or
14:29
like lieutenants and so forth can have these levels of
14:32
permission and the regular members, they only have this
14:35
level permission. Like is that all within this
14:38
system? Yeah, I the, the Free company
14:41
housing in particular is, is really cool because there's
14:45
also, so you have the private chambers where anybody can just
14:48
buy a chamber onto the house and it just adds like, I almost want
14:52
to call it like an instance. It just like spins up an
14:54
instance of that private chamber.
14:56
So you don't, you don't visually see that, oh, there's a, a new
15:00
room now in this hallway. It's just you, you go to a door,
15:03
you click on the door, a menu opens up and there's a list of
15:07
all the different private chambers that you could go
15:08
visit. So it's kind of like that, but
15:10
the free company houses also do there.
15:12
There's like company workshops inside for a, a free company
15:16
airship and submersible construction stuff that you can
15:19
contribute towards. You can use, you can staple
15:24
chocobos there and like change their, you can feed them
15:28
different things to change the color of your Chocobo.
15:30
You give them different veggies and fruits and stuff and it will
15:34
different combinations will change the color of them.
15:36
You can do that with your own house too, if you have a staple.
15:38
But, but there's also the the thing, if if no member in the
15:43
Free company goes in the house, I think it's like 45 days, it'll
15:47
be automatically demolished, which is again, like those are
15:51
some of the biggest issues. But yeah, a lot of the, I'm
15:54
pretty sure the and someone, someone can correct me if I'm
15:58
wrong on that. But yeah, they can do you can,
16:03
you can allow a whole bunch of stuff with the free company and
16:08
for the the individual house. OK.
16:13
We've a couple of times mentioned these limits on like,
16:16
hey, you've been inactive, your house is going to be demolished
16:20
or freed up for whatever reason. How long do the like terms of a
16:25
plot last for? Just as long as you're active or
16:28
is it just after a set period of time?
16:30
Hey, you've got to go back into the lottery system.
16:34
Oh, as long as you're, as long as you're still active, then
16:37
you're fine. So the for the Free Company,
16:40
it's 45 days. As long as somebody goes into
16:42
that house every 40-5 days, it's not going to go away.
16:45
It's totally fine and you'll have it forever as long as
16:48
somebody's doing that. And then the player housing is I
16:51
believe is also, I think that's also 45 days.
16:56
OK. Yeah.
16:57
So you can. I just had to double check to
17:00
see. So you can share your estate,
17:02
your house with up to three people.
17:05
So you can have three roommates living in your house with you.
17:07
And it's, it's actually a the tenant system.
17:11
They have a a tenant system you're.
17:13
Subletting you're. Yeah, so you allow you allow
17:16
those people to use your stables, your garden, they can
17:20
move and place furniture. Anybody in your tenant system
17:23
can can do that stuff. I don't know though.
17:26
I'm going to have to double check because now I'm unsure if
17:29
the tenant system applies to pre company housing.
17:35
OK. Well, while you're checking
17:38
that, I did have like a, a more general question.
17:43
Is that because you were talking again about this gingerbread
17:46
house, which seems very Christmas themed?
17:50
It's I guess there's a lot of themes and different looks that
17:54
you can go with your housing. Oh yeah, Oh yeah.
18:02
And it's independent from where your residential district is,
18:05
which is nice. You don't have to.
18:07
So if you're in the Lavender Beds, which is a housing area in
18:12
one of the starting era starting cities, Gordania, it's very
18:15
forest themed. You're you're not stuck with a
18:19
cottage that is of the same architecture type as Gordania
18:24
would be or anything like that. It's like if you're in Ogremar,
18:28
you're not stuck with ogre orc architecture or Ogremar or
18:32
architecture. You you'd be allowed to like
18:34
have the a blood elf themed thing even though you're in
18:37
Ogremar. Like you can do that with, with
18:41
the residential districts in Final Fantasy 14.
18:45
There's and there's ones that have nothing to do with where
18:47
the district is either. Like obviously the gingerbread
18:50
house. There's these new cottages that
18:52
they introduced fairly recently, I believe, that are the, the
18:57
art, it reminds me, the art style reminds me of like Final
19:01
Fantasy 9, you know, which is the best, one of the best games
19:05
of all time. So I yeah, you could.
19:08
There's so much, so much you could do with the outside, the
19:11
all of it. The.
19:14
Outside the outside stuff in particular is something that,
19:17
and I, I think we talked about it in the first, the first, the
19:20
first recording, the lost, the lost.
19:22
Episode. Where, you know, that's one of
19:26
my big hopes for the World of Warcraft housing is that we're
19:30
not stuck with like, first of all, I want to be able to see
19:35
everybody's external houses. Like I want to be able to see
19:39
that I want to be able to have that neighborhood that you can
19:42
walk through and be like, oh, that's so cool that someone
19:44
built that, that looks that looks really cool here.
19:48
You know, doesn't mean that they can like fully customize their
19:51
house, like I'm building a three floor mansion.
19:55
Just like I just want to see what people chose to do with
19:58
their gardens and stuff. I want to be able to feel like
20:00
I'm in a neighborhood, not like I'm teleporting to a room.
20:03
I'm using my Hearthstone and it's bringing me to a room that
20:06
I have that I can place stuff in, which is in my opinion is
20:10
like worst case scenario. OK.
20:13
So you're you're definitely looking for that more social
20:15
communal aspect in that housing in terms of like you like you
20:22
said, you like sort of hearth did this like instant for your
20:25
homes. Are you able to like quickly
20:28
teleport to them? Are they like connected to a
20:31
city? Like how do you like get to and
20:33
from them? Yeah.
20:35
So both if you have a house or you're part of a tenant system
20:39
or you have a friend or whatever that has it, you can you and
20:43
you're in like their party or whatever, or friends, you can
20:46
like right click on their name and teleport to their estate.
20:50
It's the same. If you want to teleport to your
20:52
house, you just open the ether, the ether teleportation menu and
20:59
it's just a menu and you just click on the, the, the state
21:02
that you want to go to your free company estate and you just,
21:05
you'll just go there. You can just anytime you're not,
21:09
you're not stuck having to wait for a cool down or I have to go
21:14
to the city 1st and then click on a list of that there.
21:17
That is something that you can do.
21:19
Like if you don't have, if you're not on somebody's friends
21:21
list, because this happens in Final Fantasy 14, is they,
21:24
they'll buy a large house and they'll, they'll RP it, turn it
21:28
into a, like a nightclub is a big thing that you'll see.
21:32
Yeah, nightclubs are really popular.
21:34
They'll have bars, speakeasies, stuff like that, that you'll go
21:37
do and RP and all of that jazz. But if you're not friends with
21:41
them, 'cause they're, they'll do like these huge events with tons
21:45
of people all at the house. You they'll give you like their
21:49
address, which is like, you know, whatever the residential
21:54
district is, the ward number and then plot number and you go to
21:58
the address just based on that. I love that RP element of
22:05
somebody like, you know, hosting the like nightclub in town or
22:09
this, the like Speakeasy and stuff.
22:11
And definitely people being able to like go to that party.
22:17
They just random people showing up.
22:19
That is something. Yeah, so there's a bunch of on
22:22
Twitch you'll you'll be able to find if you look up, if you go
22:25
into the Final Fantasy 14 directory, you'll be able to
22:28
find DJs and they're they're stream, they're stream DJ.
22:32
They're they're DJ ING obviously like making music, doing stuff,
22:37
but they're in Final Fantasy 14. So like they'll be DJ ING, but
22:42
you'll the screen, the game that they're playing is Final Fantasy
22:45
14. You'll see them in the in, in
22:47
the like their characters in the thing looking like they're
22:50
dancing, whatever, while they're actually, you know, spinning
22:52
records and stuff is that I don't know if people actually
22:56
still physically spin records. But listen, it's like it's
22:59
really cool. The first time that I ever even
23:02
knew that was a thing was during the IA hosted the MMO awards at
23:09
the in August maybe of last year and they were doing a like a
23:15
celebration party. So while the MMO awards were
23:17
happening, you could go everybody Iowa's there in Final
23:20
Fantasy 14, a bunch of other, you know, people were there and
23:24
you would go to this club and it was and they were hosted.
23:27
They were doing music and it was a club while the MMO awards was
23:30
happening. So it was like a a little like,
23:33
I don't know, Golden Globe Oscar celebrate.
23:35
It was really neat, really cool. OK, that that is pretty amazing.
23:42
I. I say cool loosely.
23:44
I just want to be clear, it's a very loose.
23:47
Incredibly interesting and I think that it like it is it is
23:51
genuinely cool to like have that capability and that sort of like
23:57
just community gathering, whether you yourself might be
24:01
interested in going to that or not.
24:03
Your mileage may may vary, but whatever.
24:06
I'm glad that like, that capability exists.
24:10
How does the game fuel all this? How Like, what are what are?
24:16
Where do you get your patterns? Where do you get the stuff to
24:19
make your furniture to set up your nightclub or your estate or
24:22
your Guild house? How do you do all this?
24:25
Everything, yeah, everything. Every time there's a new Rep
24:29
vendor or which they do in a really cool way.
24:32
I actually, that's one of my favorite things is they're, they
24:35
call them allied societies now, but they're like these Rep your
24:39
Rep farms, your daily Rep farms that you can do.
24:42
You get your daily quest. You get 3 for each allied
24:44
society. You can do up to 12.
24:46
So meaning you get, you could work on 4 allied societies a day
24:51
if you wanted to and you get wrap up and all those vendors
24:54
usually have furnishing items. Basically anything, any vendor
25:00
type person that's tied to something is going to have some
25:04
type of of thing you can buy. But then there's also the whole
25:08
job system. So in Final Fantasy 14, instead
25:11
of classes, you have the jobs that you can do there, you have
25:14
your combat jobs and but then you also have your your
25:17
gathering jobs and your crafting jobs.
25:19
And those have full blown rotations based on what you're
25:23
doing. So if you're, if you're doing
25:26
like woodworking stuff, like you actually have a rotation the
25:30
same way you would as ADPS to craft this item in the best way
25:34
that you can. And there's so much housing
25:38
items that are in that system alone that it's enough to fuel
25:43
the entire, there's so much. I mean, you can, you can
25:45
literally make, if you're doing wood stuff, you carpentry, I
25:50
guess is, you know what you would call that?
25:52
You can, you can like literally change your, the type of
25:56
floorboards that you're putting down in your house.
26:00
And then you can dye those and change the color of those
26:02
floorboards. So you design the, you, your
26:05
character crafted and made the, the things themselves that
26:08
you're actually laying down in your house.
26:11
And it's just such a, it's, it's really neat, but everything,
26:15
everything fuel, there's some, there's some type of, there's
26:17
vendors everywhere for those. And then you can, you can also
26:21
have vendors in your house. You can have crafting facilities
26:24
in your house, but there's no, the, the big thing is kind of
26:29
kind of tangent. The big thing about the housing
26:33
and Final Fantasy 14 is there's no player power associated with
26:36
it whatsoever. Like everything in there is just
26:40
quality of life stuff. Like you have vendors that you
26:42
get to put in yourself if you want, but those vendors aren't
26:45
going to offer you. They just offer you your basic
26:47
stuff. But it's nice to have.
26:49
There's no market board inside. Like you can't market board
26:52
auction house. You can't put that in your
26:55
house. But in the neighborhood there is
26:59
a market board or an auction house that you can go up to and
27:03
and go use. And in fact, when you're picking
27:07
your plot, that's actually a really cool thing to consider is
27:10
like, how close is the market board to my plot 'cause then you
27:15
know, that's going to help you a ton too.
27:17
And yeah, but there's no, there's no player power.
27:19
It's just a bunch of stuff that you get to do and, and kind of
27:22
have your hub of, of quality of life things to have right there
27:28
with you. OK.
27:30
So so no work benches for professions.
27:34
Yeah, you're not going to be like you.
27:36
You can have your yeah, you're not going to be able to like
27:41
they do have you can craft things anywhere by being your
27:45
job and your your character kind of sets up.
27:47
It's actually a really cool animation stuff that they'll do.
27:51
Gathering is different Gathering.
27:52
You have to actually go out in the world and get stuff from
27:54
nodes and everything else, fishing and all that jazz.
27:56
Fishing is really cool by the way, and Final Fantasy 14 highly
27:59
recommend it. Wows is very relaxing.
28:02
Final Fantasy 14's is like, Wow, like I could just fish in that
28:06
game. Not it's really cool.
28:10
Yeah, there's, there's no like characters when they start
28:13
crafting, they'll just kind of like set up a little like
28:17
grinding a grindstone and you'll see them and it changes the
28:20
whole animation. They're like sitting down doing
28:22
stuff. It's really cool.
28:24
But yeah, you can't, you can't do like, you know, like when we
28:29
look at player housing for Wow, obviously Garrison's comes to
28:33
mind and how isolating they were because of how much how
28:38
lucrative they were and how much power was in them and how the
28:43
the housing and Final Fantasy 14 doesn't have that.
28:46
It doesn't have like AI don't need to leave my house ever
28:49
because everything I could need is is here.
28:52
You're not going to have the the boss's spawn in your backyard.
28:55
You fight them with your team. You're like, OK, let me switch
28:58
over to the little pond back here, fish out whatever I need,
29:00
go over to the garden. You are.
29:02
You have to go out into the world to like progression
29:04
character. You can have a garden, but it's
29:07
it, the things that you get from your garden are so different.
29:10
And it's not herbalism, right? It's like a, it's so different.
29:14
It's like cooking items that you can cook or you know, stuff you
29:17
can feed your Chocobo or, you know, whatever, whatever the
29:20
things are, but nothing, nothing that's, you know, going to.
29:24
Buff food or anything like. That yeah, it's not going to,
29:26
it's not going to remove the necessity to go out into the
29:29
world. It's not like my real life
29:32
house, you know? Yeah, yeah, we, we all know Uber
29:37
Eats has your address unlocked. So then I guess the next part to
29:44
for the consideration is what can Wow learn from Final
29:49
Fantasy? What are the good things that
29:52
when you, if you could talk to a WOW developer and say like, hey,
29:55
this is what Final Fantasy does, you should really look at that.
29:58
What are the things you would point to?
30:01
I mean, they need, they need to have that level of
30:04
customization. They need it like being if, if,
30:09
whatever they do for the housing system in World of Warcraft, if
30:13
they do, let's say, let's say to start off, they have two
30:17
different residential districts, one in Ogemar, one in Stormwind.
30:23
If everything is just themed around living in Ogemar or
30:27
living in Stormwind, then I think they've failed.
30:30
You need to have some type of agency over what your house is,
30:36
how it represents you as a player.
30:38
They need to have, in my opinion, they need to have that
30:41
external aspect. You need to be able to see other
30:43
people's stuff at a glance to make it feel like this is
30:46
actually player housing instead of just a instance that you go
30:50
to and you can like put your items down and, and show off
30:55
like trophies to yourself like that.
30:57
Like who, who cares? You know what I mean?
30:59
Like, you know, you did that thing.
31:00
Do you really need? No, the point of it is like,
31:03
it's a social thing and it it needs to be, it needs to have
31:06
that social aspect and that customization aspect.
31:09
Even if you're somebody that maybe you don't want to
31:11
socialize and Wow, being able to play The Sims and Wow is, is
31:18
also a great thing too. You know, if that's what you
31:20
want to do is just like craft those things.
31:23
So having player agency over what how their house represents
31:28
them is super important to me. Having that external aspect is
31:31
super important to me. I'm very curious what World of
31:36
Warcraft is going to do with the war band system.
31:39
Like I can't imagine Final Fantasy 14 alts can be a thing.
31:45
Like you can have alts, but not nearly the way that it works.
31:49
And wow, like you can, you can, if you want, you can make an alt
31:52
and do it. But like the you still got that
31:56
character still has to do all the story, it has to do
31:58
everything. There's skips you can buy that
32:00
will allow you to just skip the whole story on that alt or
32:03
whatever. But a lot of people only really
32:06
use alts for like either they're playing in a different region or
32:10
a different data center, but now the data center's stuff is
32:13
linked or it's for RP. Whereas and wow, it's like, I
32:17
just want to play this different, this different class,
32:20
but you don't need that. So anyways, I so you're not
32:24
going to have a lot of characters in Final Fantasy 14
32:26
that all have a house. You probably have one house and
32:28
that's it. With World of Warcraft, because
32:31
there's so many alts, does that mean every, every character you
32:35
have can have a house? In which case they won't
32:38
possibly be able to do the neighborhood residential thing.
32:41
It'd be way too much. So I'm, I'm kind of feeling like
32:44
they have to do your war band house, like that's your house is
32:50
for your entire war band. So then they also need to allow
32:54
some way of representing the characters in your war band to
32:58
me. And I'm not sure how they can do
33:00
that effectively without like something like the private
33:04
chambers could work, you know, like if you had a house and then
33:08
you're let's say you're you're torn shaman.
33:11
I don't know why shaman came to my head.
33:13
That's weird. Maybe the torn shaman has a room
33:16
in your house and that when you walk into your torn shaman's
33:19
room, it's like, however that torn wanted to set it up is it
33:23
feels like that, but your house overall is whatever.
33:26
I don't know, but I, I hope that they do something like that.
33:30
And then the thing that I really don't want them to do, Manny, is
33:33
the lottery system. Don't do that.
33:36
Don't do the lottery system and please don't do the if you
33:39
didn't log in in 45 days, you don't get your house gets
33:42
demolished. Like, don't do that.
33:45
OK, so let's let's talk about that because that is the most
33:48
contentious part of it. But I think that is there to
33:53
allow for the neighborhoods to be not abandoned neighborhoods
33:58
to allow for the community. The way that I see it is that
34:05
you know that when you walk around these districts that
34:10
every house in there has somebody who's been on within
34:13
the last two months, month and a half, really, right?
34:16
So that they have been for some level of activity.
34:23
As soon as somebody is not active during that, their house
34:25
is demolished, it's freed up, another active person comes in,
34:28
so your neighborhood retains activity.
34:33
Because alts aren't as prevalent in Final Fantasy as they are in
34:39
World of Warcraft, people do definitely focus on a single
34:45
character more and the and the house that they they fought so
34:51
hard for is very cherished. If you were to do away with
34:56
that, how would you combat ghost towns?
34:59
How would you make the service sustainable where people don't
35:03
just like be like, yeah, I got AI, got a house, and then they
35:07
just keep it forever. And we have all of these these
35:09
different instances that are spun up with maybe one or two
35:13
active people in a district. Yeah, I, I, that's actually a
35:17
really good point. I don't know.
35:18
I don't think that there is a solution to that without being
35:23
personally what I, I hope Wow doesn't do.
35:25
But what I think they will do is I do think they will make it a
35:29
Hearthstone type thing. You use your, your Hearthstone,
35:33
your home stone, whatever, and you go to your room and your
35:37
your house like you're inside of it.
35:39
And then that and then Wow, they Blizzard doesn't have to worry
35:43
about any of that. They don't have to worry about
35:44
dead neighborhoods. They don't have to worry about
35:45
anything because you're going to your isolated house.
35:49
That that to me is like worst case scenario for player
35:53
housing. Well, OK, worst case scenario is
35:56
it just never comes into the game.
36:00
But yeah, I I think that that's realistically the only solution
36:06
to that idea. Or maybe they do keep the the
36:11
your house can go away and and just increase the time on that.
36:15
I think 45 days is like that means if you're not subbed for
36:21
two months, right? You just, you lose it and that's
36:25
that's like a that's tough because of the way that Wow
36:29
works is like, you know, the past two months of Wow, I
36:31
wouldn't blame anybody if they're not subscribed right
36:33
now. Save your $30 by not being
36:36
subbed right now. If you don't, if you know Siren
36:38
Isles doesn't appeal to you, you feel like you've done everything
36:40
you want right now, but like, you know, maybe maybe 80 days,
36:46
maybe 90 days, 90 days feels to me like a great compromise.
36:49
If you're not subbed to the game in 90 days, then OK, you know,
36:54
obviously I think that they should like if you, I don't know
36:58
if they'll do what Final Fantasy 14 does with you have to buy the
37:02
plot. You have to actually like get
37:03
that gold to or Guild to buy it. I don't think Wow's going to do
37:07
that. I think they're just going to
37:08
give you a house. Yeah.
37:11
I just think I, that's how I think they're going to do it is
37:14
they'll just give it to you. And I so like if they're just
37:21
going to give it to you, then who cares if it, if it gets
37:26
deleted because you were inactive, right?
37:28
Because you by the time when you come back, you'll just be able
37:31
to get it again. But then people would be upset
37:33
about having to set it all up again.
37:37
So you, you believe that. Wow.
37:39
I was going to go with like, hey, you heroes, you've done so
37:43
much for the world. Here is a plot of land to
37:46
recognize your deed, and now you are one of the Lords and ladies
37:51
of Stormwind or whatever, whatever they want and want to
37:55
give the reason for. Which means everybody is going
38:00
to have an instance of it that is active in the game.
38:03
And obviously in active accounts, they can just sort of
38:05
like archive the data or whatever.
38:10
The question becomes that Wow is a far less menu based game than
38:16
Final Fantasy. With Final Fantasy, you are more
38:19
used to being like, let me click on this crystal and here's all
38:22
the places, destinations I can go and, and click through that.
38:25
In World of Warcraft, it's here's the flight network,
38:28
here's a picture click where you're going less about like
38:33
toggling through through menus. Do you think that in a overly
38:37
instance version, like the more heavily instance version so that
38:41
you don't have the neighborhoods and stuff, Do you think that
38:43
breaks it? Or do you think it's going to be
38:44
that like, hey, you need to be in the party like we had with
38:47
Garrison's or otherwise get some sort of invite.
38:54
It'd be kind of cool to get an invite in in the mail and then
38:58
you get like a temporary Hearthstone.
39:00
Oh yeah, that'd be cool. I just putting stuff out but
39:04
like how do you think Wow deals with the menu system that this
39:07
would create? I, I think that Final Fantasy
39:10
14, it uses a lot of things that are feel like they aren't
39:19
immersive, right? The idea of like menu systems
39:22
and all of this stuff, it feels like it's not immersive.
39:25
You when you look at some of like the the abilities that are
39:30
used in the game, the telegraphs of like possibilities and all
39:33
that stuff, it's not very immersive.
39:34
It's very this is where this is going to go, but it's very clear
39:36
and very defined. You know exactly where this is
39:39
going to go. And then you can kind of pivot
39:42
around that and all that stuff. It feels like when you look at
39:45
that on paper, it sounds like that's not immersive at all.
39:49
But because of the way the game implements those things and
39:52
builds them up over time, you, it doesn't feel that way.
39:55
Everything feels very connected. It feels like there's a reason
39:57
why you're using these menu systems to be able to navigate
40:00
this world and blah blah blah, because you're teleporting
40:02
through all of the and World of Warcraft has.
40:07
Historically, try to keep things feeling immersive, which is why
40:11
we end up getting brown on brown with like this is the arena and
40:16
then the the boss, because the boss is digging into the ground.
40:19
It's using brown effects and like, yeah, that's more
40:22
immersive. But is it like, does it actually
40:25
like as you're playing a game does is that actually like, do
40:28
you feel like you're battling a big, a big Nerubian Lord because
40:33
of no, you just you're just mad that you don't know which
40:36
ability is where you need to be. And I feel like the menu system
40:39
is kind of in the same boat, right?
40:41
They've navigated a lot more towards menu systems in final in
40:46
World of Warcraft lately with like the with LFRS and and being
40:52
able to follower dungeons and all that stuff.
40:54
It I've seen people call it Q simulator, right where now you
40:58
have all the portals to things. You have to unlock those
41:01
portals. But once you have them, that's
41:02
basically a menu system, right? I don't think that it's and oh,
41:09
and there's a new pet. There's a new China pet.
41:13
It's like a little panda that you can get.
41:16
It's only on Chinese servers right now, but there is data
41:19
that suggests that maybe it'll be a lot on other servers.
41:22
You buy a pet, it's a little panda, super cute.
41:25
You can talk to it and teleport to any of the Mr. Pandaria raids
41:29
and dungeons. And it's a full menu system.
41:32
And is that, is that like really so bad in World of Warcraft?
41:37
It feels like they're leaning more towards that.
41:39
So I could see them implementing a menu system for player housing
41:45
to make it more accessible. I just would prefer the
41:49
neighborhood and I don't think they will, not right away
41:52
anyways all. Right.
41:55
So then neighborhood, even if it requires the inactive, is
42:02
preferable to you. Then obviously better than
42:06
nothing, but is that preferable to you?
42:08
Then everybody gets their instance home for an
42:13
indeterminate amount of time. Yeah, I think the instance, I
42:18
just think the instance home is just like I talk about
42:20
immersion, right. But like having an instance home
42:23
to me and you walk outside your back in the city that you you
42:27
just teleported from or where or wherever you just teleported
42:30
from to it to me that that ruins the immersion far more than like
42:35
like if I if I could teleport and be outside my house and see
42:38
the outside, like I could teleport to my neighborhood,
42:41
that doesn't ruin the immersion. Teleporting into my room does.
42:46
But you're right with having ghost towns and dead
42:49
neighborhoods by getting rid of that that I I just think there's
42:55
a compromise to be had where between the two games of, you
42:59
know, not having ghost towns, but also allowing some some
43:03
leeway on how much time 45 days is nothing right?
43:07
Like I-45 days passes before. Like you can ask my fridge.
43:11
I have ADHD like I there's there's definitely something
43:15
that's been in there for 45 days.
43:17
I should check anyways. The point is, I, you know, I 45
43:21
days just isn't enough time. And I don't think that 90 days
43:25
or whatever would create the feeling of a ghost town because
43:29
you'd still see the things there, right?
43:31
You would still see that there's a house there and all that jazz.
43:33
So, yeah, I don't know. I, I think a neighborhood is
43:38
important. I think the social aspect is
43:40
important. I just I'd be surprised if Wow
43:43
goes that way. OK, well, I mean, we can only
43:48
put the ideas out there and see what the devs come up with.
43:51
But I do like the social aspects.
43:53
I love that club or whatever, whatever party you want to throw
43:58
in your your house. I love the Speakeasy.
44:01
I I love just, even if it's an RP thing, like I have a
44:04
beautiful garden, you can host your wedding here and that's
44:08
that's something that people could do.
44:11
I love that social aspect, that housing, really.
44:15
I think that's the promise of housing writ large.
44:20
And you know, the different levels of permissions to allow
44:24
you to escape. That sort of thing is good.
44:28
And we'll see what Wow comes up with.
44:31
But when you're not talking about housing, when you're not
44:33
talking about Final Fantasy, when you're not talking about
44:37
World of Warcraft, which is most of your streams, where can
44:42
people find you? You can find me at I have like 3
44:46
different YouTube channels now but mostly if you just go you
44:50
best place to find me. Discord dot GG slash Missile
44:53
Dine Online is probably like just the best place to find me
44:58
if you want to hang out and talk about World of Warcraft and
45:01
Final Fantasy and RPGs and Hades too.
45:05
That's coming out this year that I'm very excited about.
45:08
OK, well thank you again, Corey for sitting down and recording
45:12
with me twice. And until next time, guys, may
45:16
all your hits be grits.