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The Leadership Principles That Make Better Advisors (And Built Root's Culture) · Root Ready

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome back to another episode of the Root Ready Podcast.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_01: Today, Eden and I are going to be talking about culture and environment and the importance that the environment around you has in shaping you, whether it's as an advisor, as a person, as anything.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_01: And what we're going to do is talk about how do we approach this at root?
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: What are some of the core principles that we hold that ultimately leads to a positive culture and firm environment?
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_01: But we don't want to just make it about that.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_01: We want to pull out principles that apply to anyone, anywhere, whether at root or otherwise.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: So, Eden, this episode was prompted by a great question that you sent me or a great comment that you sent me.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: Do you mind just sharing what was on your mind when you suggested this to me?
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: So just before I even jump into this, I think a lot of us feel like culture is kind of a buzzword, especially when you're exploring new firms, exploring new opportunities.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone uses that word.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: But what we really want to talk about today, and what I really wanted to ask you, James, more about is how did you approach developing a culture at root?
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: And what was most important for you to emphasize as you went into building this firm as far as creating an environment that facilitates the best work possible that bleeds right down to the client experience?
• 1:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: What what firm, you know, for people listening?
• 1:26
  SPEAKER_01: What firm doesn't say, well, what makes us different?
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: Well, it's our culture, and we really prioritize service.
• 1:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's almost like, well, geez, who wouldn't say that?
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: So what do we mean by that?
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: What does what are those fundamental aspects of what makes a strong culture, what creates a strong environment?
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_01: And again, I don't want to this is not just going to become a commercial here for Root.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_01: What we're going to do is pull out principles, extract things that anybody anywhere can apply to their firm, their lives, their work, and try to do it that way.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_01: What was funny though, Eden, is when you ask this question, it's like, I don't I think Root has a very strong culture.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: I think we have an amazing culture.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_01: I think we have an amazing team.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_01: But when you first asked this question a couple weeks ago, it's like, ah, I want to think deeper on this.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I like what actually is it?
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: Because it feels like where we are today is the culmination maybe of several years of little iterations and little changes and little things that we've done.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: So I didn't want to just say, like, here were the things that we did, and that led to a good culture.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's not those, like the things that we see are just that's what's visible.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: But what's what's the thing that underlies all those things, or this is the foundation of all those things?
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_01: And what I actually did yesterday, for people who are watching this on YouTube, you can see this journal that I have.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's a cute little flowery thing that I got at a thrift shop.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_01: This was actually a journal that I got when I got fired from my old job, and I was about to start root.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_01: I went back and just journaled.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_01: And you can see here it's just like pages and pages and pages of stuff.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_01: And what was fun for me is I don't think I've looked at this in eight years, literally until yesterday.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm gonna some of these things in here are fun to read.
• 2:58
  SPEAKER_01: They maybe don't fully apply to what we're talking about, but I think a lot will.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_01: But this was a um a journal entry from January 12th, 2018.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_01: And next to it, I have written 1.2 million in AUM.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: That's where root was at the time, and 1.1 million in AUM a process.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_01: So we were there, we were about to double, which is exciting.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: We're going from 1.2 to 2.3 million in total AUM at this time.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: So right at the very beginning.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like root was, I think, two launched in November of 2017.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_01: So this was two years in.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_01: I have written next to it.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_01: Business expenses are$2,000 per month, personal expenses are$2,300 per month.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_01: So if I can just get to$4,300 per month of revenue without factoring taxes, it will be so good.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I wrote, I said I'm writing to try to find clarity around whether I want to run a practice where I personally have around 125 clients and I have an admin person to help support, or do I want to build a team of advisors and I take more of a business management role.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_01: And then I have like solo advisor practice, pros and cons.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_01: Scaled slash multi-advisor practice, pros and cons.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_01: Because at this time I legitimately didn't know where and I like it wasn't like you write something all of a sudden it happens, but I was trying to at least say what are the things I can start doing today that will lay the foundation for the direction I want to go.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_01: So I have solo advisor practice, pros.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_01: I love what I do for clients.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_01: I get to know the client very well.
• 4:17
  SPEAKER_01: They turn into trusted, I enjoy spending time with them.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_01: I don't have to worry about managing a team.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I don't this is a funny one.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_01: I don't have to worry about setting an example for others by the way I dress.
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_01: I guess I missed that one anyway.
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_01: So that was funny to read here wearing a t-shirt.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: So, anyways, uh cons.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_01: I have uh I am the product.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's not as easy to step away from the business if if needed.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_01: Income is capped unless I'm bringing on much bigger, like the only way to grow income is to bring on bigger accounts.
• 4:52
  SPEAKER_01: Then I have the scaled slash multi-advisor practice, building a team.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I have pros.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_01: I would be freed up to work on the business and lead and not in the business.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I could develop young advisors and mentor them.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_01: I would have a lot of pride in building a business that served clients very well.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_01: Cons.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_01: Last advisor, I won't say his name, told me I can't manage people, and in my head, I believe it.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I wouldn't have the ability to be as close with as many people our clients as running with.
• 5:23
  SPEAKER_01: So it's just like a framework of like writing down pros and cons of where we are.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: So I don't think that applies so much to what we're talking about today, but I did keep reading, and some of these things did start to apply.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: So when I think about what was it that led to the foundations of where root is today, and I don't mean this just to be a journal reading uh podcast episode where I go through everything, but one of the things I wrote, I have no idea where this came from.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_01: If this was like a stream of consciousness, I don't think so, because there's some stuff in here that I think is I probably read a few books or read a few things.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: And I have the section that says, what does leadership require?
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_01: And so as I'm talking about, what are the principles that led to where root is today?
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: And I think this is something that whether you're an associate at root, an advisor at root, working at a completely firm, different firm altogether, these are the things I think the same principles that I biasedly believe make root into a great culture can be applied anywhere, whether with our firm, with our worker clients, with whatever.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_01: What does leadership require?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_01: Number one, unwavering courage and self-confidence.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_01: And then I wrote underneath that.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_01: Uh the owner of my last firm often didn't believe in what we did, so it's hard for me to.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: So I remember feeling this sense of, you know, when markets would get scary, when things would go get down, it would be like clients would be emailing and calling.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_01: And as a young advisor, it's like, James, you call them back, you email them.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, in retrospect, I'm glad.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like it pushed me into that and like it kind of forced me to learn.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: But it's like, I think the subliminal message was, hey, I don't actually believe in what we do.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: So you go have the hard conversations with clients because it's easy to be good when things are good, but can you remain steadfast and resolute when times are bad?
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like that I realized in an environment where maybe there's a lot of good things happening, but I you see what I don't know if it's hard for me to believe in the value of the work we're doing if the leader isn't believing in it.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's a principle that we can take with clients.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like if we don't believe and have conviction in the work that we're doing, in the way that we're investing, in the way that we're planning, why on earth would our clients ever expect that?
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_01: And when we hide from hard conversations, when we tiptoe around those in the meeting, when we avoid calling people, when we need to clients notice that.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_01: Like it just because it doesn't happen doesn't mean that they're not on the other end of that saying, okay, why is why is Eden bouncing around that issue?
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I wish she would have that hard conversation with me because it would show me that she has conviction in it.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_01: And by just avoiding it, it's showing this maybe she's not so confident in what she's doing.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_01: So that was, I think, a principle of I fully believe in what we're doing at root.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I think this is easy of like, I think that what we're doing is so transformational.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_01: Why wouldn't we want to scream it from the rooftops and get as many people as possible to get to experience the service we had, but that was one.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_01: Uh number two, self-control.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_01: Control myself before others.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: I think that even if I back way up here, one of the things, and this isn't designed to knock my prior firm.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_01: I learned so much or so many good things, but a lot of times the lessons you learn are from seeing things that weren't done the exact right way.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: And so you say, well, if I'm gonna do it, I'm gonna do it a little bit different.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_01: But there was almost this expectation, maybe it was just in my head.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_01: So I'll I'll preface it with that.
• 8:45
  SPEAKER_01: But it almost felt like, why is the firm owner who owns the business expecting me to care about this as much as he is?
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like there's this weird sense of um, I like I'm making 60 grand a year, 65 grand a year, and I'm working a lot, and it almost feels like I'm getting guilted for not caring as much by not working every weekend, by not working super late, every whatever it is.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_01: There was this sense of, okay, when I start this, I'm never gonna expect anyone to care about root as much as I care about root.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: Now, on the flip side, I'm gonna try to give everybody as much reason as possible to care about root as much as they can.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_01: So it's this um, I think there's this almost this unwritten sense that a lot of firm owners have of you're my employee, therefore you owe me your duty of work.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_01: And it's sure whatever, but it's like I how do I flip that?
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_01: I get the benefit of a lot of really talented, really driven, really smart people given their all for root.
• 9:52
  SPEAKER_01: Like, what can I do to make root deserving of that?
• 9:55
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it's like the relationship principle.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_01: I I remember a few years ago I was talking to a friend and he didn't love this, but he's like, man, I really wanna.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_01: He was single at the time.
• 10:03
  SPEAKER_01: He's like, I really want to find the right person, start dating, get married.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, okay, cool.
• 10:07
  SPEAKER_01: Like, tell me about the woman that you want to ideally attract, date, marry, etc.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_01: And he started describing the type of person he'd want to be in a relationship with.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_01: He didn't like this per part.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think it was like, well, it's like, well, why would why would that person choose you?
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: And there was this sense of like, hey, if you want that person, deserve that person.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like, don't, don't, don't talk about what you expect of others if you're not deserving of that yourself.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I think a lot of firms approach it this way of, I want the perfect employee, I want someone who's gonna grind for me, I want someone who's gonna give it their all, I want someone that's gonna have that ownership mindset.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: Well, why you then?
• 10:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like, why would that why would that person choose you?
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_01: Choose your firm.
• 10:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I think a lot of this talent shortage that people talk about, yes, like numbers-wise, there is a talent shortage in terms of how many firms there are, how many new people are coming to the industry.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_01: But on a micro level, like why would these talented young people choose your firm?
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_01: You know, so I think that's a principle that all of us, or or with clients, like we at Root obviously we have a lot of clients coming in, a lot of prospective clients coming in.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_01: And if we're not careful, it can lead to this mindset of okay, clients are lucky to be with us because we have so many people though that want to work with Root.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: As opposed to the mindset should be we are so lucky to work with you.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: And obviously, there's a balance here.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: There's we we we have high expectations of each other.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_01: At root, it's not like, okay, what can I do?
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_01: How can I grovel?
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_01: Eden, what do you need?
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_01: It's no, I'm gonna I'm gonna make sure that you have an awesome experience here, but I'm also going to expect a lot of you.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna expect a lot of the team.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna be expected a lot of, and I think that's the only way to make it happen.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that a lot of these is the principles of what made the root culture what it is, is flipping the script from Root's the employer, therefore you owe Root all of your duty, to Root owes you, like what can Root do to support the best and brightest?
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_01: What can Root do to become the place that's deserving of the people who are like Eden, who are like all the other advisors at Root say, I've got a lot to offer.
• 12:22
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm not gonna offer it to just any firm.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna offer it to the type of firm that pushes me and stretches me and also develops and invests a lot in me.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_01: So I've been talking for a lot now.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: Any of that resonating or any of that um not clear before I continue on with my cute little flower journal entry?
• 12:42
  SPEAKER_00: Well, we love the flower journal.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_00: I love that it's guiding the conversation here.
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: But there's a lot of stuff that you said just now that really resonated with me when I reflect back on you know, I shared in the first episode I joined, my background as I reflect back on those experiences, interviewing with different firms and actually going through working at those different firms.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of what you just said really resonated with me.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_00: And I particularly, really like the relationship framework because it does kind of feel like, especially early in your career, first job in particular, it does kind of feel like you are groveling and begging for any opportunity, any opportunity you can get.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_00: It almost doesn't even matter what the firm is, just let me get my foot in that door.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_00: And I love flipping that script to, well, what is the firm going to do for you?
• 13:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I think a lot of times when you ask that type of question in the interview, the answer is the culture.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_00: Well, the culture's really great here.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_00: So that's why you will want to work for us at this firm.
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_00: But there's not a lot of depth behind that answer.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_00: What does that really mean?
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: What is it about the culture that is making it worth it for me to be an employee of this firm?
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: And it's also sometimes a little bit of an expectation that, hey, the culture here is a big part of what we do.
• 13:59
  SPEAKER_00: And if you work here, you better get on board with it, whether you agree with it, support it, like it or not.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: You know, kind of that drink the Kool-Aid type of mindset.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: Definitely felt that at the bigger firm that I worked for.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's pretty common at kind of big firms.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_00: Drink that Kool-Aid.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_00: You better be on board with the culture if you're really going to be successful and thrive here, whether you kind of agree with the foundational principles of our culture or not.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: And we're just going to tell you in this interview, our culture's great.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: That's why you should work here.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 14:27
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, exactly.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_01: There are certain words that almost don't mean anything by themselves because they've been used and misused so many different times.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, what do you mean when you say that?
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's why it's helpful to pour through what are some of the principles that have led to what the culture is.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: So it's those principles that are more clear and can be more readily replicated, whether it's to build a firm, to build a client relationship, to be a better team member, whatever it is.
• 14:53
  SPEAKER_01: So I like that.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: Um I'm gonna go back to some of these.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_01: The next thing, uh, what were the what does leadership require?
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_01: Definite definiteness of decision.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_01: Have principles and stick to them.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_01: Definiteness of plans.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_01: Is definiteness a word?
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not sure if that's a word.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_01: I wrote it.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_00: We'll go with it.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_01: Definiteness of decision.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_01: Have principles and stick to them.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um definiteness of plans.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: I think we went over that.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, this one was, I think, is is widely applicable.
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_01: Habit of doing more than what I'm paid for.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_01: So how do I there was one of my friends, this was, you know, early 20s, you know, like you're just barely making it financially.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_01: And every time you go out to a meal, it's like, okay, we're splitting it, and who's Venmoing who?
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_01: And hey, you spent, you know, with tax and tip, your meal was actually$11.50, but you only Venmoed me$9.50 because that was the cost of you.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: And like that was a bit like those two dollars were a big deal when you're like just barely scraping by.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_01: And and I I had one friend whose name's Jonathan.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_01: And he would, you know, he would get a meal and it was$10.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_01: And it wasn't like he was making crazy money or anything, but then he would Venmo me$16.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I was like, oh my gosh.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: Like it wasn't a money thing, but there was this sense of he is literally paying more than he paid for.
• 16:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like he it's it it built such weird goodwill.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I can't like I don't have to worry about um is Jonathan getting more than he paid for?
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's just that trust built by throwing an extra couple bucks in there that I vividly remember that being like, wow, what a cool thing and what a cool principle to our clients do, like, hey, whatever you're expecting, can I go above and beyond?
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_01: I think with Root, it's like hey, whatever people are expecting out of a job, how do how does Root give more than is paid for?
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_01: Now, obviously, people aren't paying Root to work here and money, but they are paying with time.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: They are paying with years of their life, they are paying with a giant chunk of the hours that they have in any given week.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_01: So, how can we get in the habit of giving more than what we're paid for?
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_01: And ultimately, we think of that, oh, transaction, like I'm gonna come out behind if I do that.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I can tell you, like my friend Jonathan, like, he's he's not coming out behind by doing that.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_01: He is building so much goodwill with that simple Venmo transaction.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: How much goodwill has Root built by saying, Okay, if you're gonna give us your precious time and hours and energy, what can we go above and beyond to give back?
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_01: And that just becomes a virtuous cycle of, okay, you're gonna get like people working at Root are gonna give it their all because they know it's not a transactional thing where it's just gonna be um, okay, Root takes the excess and root comes out ahead in that transaction.
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_01: No, how can we outgive each other?
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: Becomes the cycle there.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_01: So, how can we do that for clients?
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: Go above and beyond.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Give them more than what they paid for.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, this is our service, but what are those little things that we can do?
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that's a principle we can take away.
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_01: Um, what does leadership require?
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_01: A pleasing personality.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_01: So just a simple one.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_01: You know, make someone that it may mean I don't I again I don't know where these came from.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: I just wrote them down.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_01: So this isn't like the gospel, this is the truth.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_01: Take it or leave it, but that was, I think, something I read somewhere.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_01: Uh next, sympathy and understanding.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_01: Next, mastery of details.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_01: So this is an important one to me.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like I see a lot of, um, especially today in the industry, a lot of larger RIAs are private equity-backed firms, even venture capital-backed firms.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I won't say there's anything wrong with that inherently, but you typically, and and I'm I'm maybe projecting here or speculating here, because I don't know all these people individually.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_01: But a lot of these CEOs, they don't know the financial planning.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_01: Like, sure, they know the basics, but like they're they're private equity people, they're finance people, they're people that can run the numbers on a spreadsheet and say, we can increase firm uh valuation if we engage in these transactions, we can increase EBITDA if we make these cuts.
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_01: We can like they can run the numbers, they can get the finances, but it's like do you really have mastery of the details?
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_01: And and to me, like the details of our advisory experience for our clients are so critically important.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_01: And so to me, it's very important that leaders don't lose sight of that, don't lose sight of what's it like to be in the meeting.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_01: Don't lose sight of, okay, when we're asking people to do this, like what's what are we actually asking?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_01: When you understand all the nuance and implications and the second and third order effects of all that stuff.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_01: So yes, you have to be able to step back and lead high-level and to see the big picture and to make sure the direction is the right one.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: You also need to know enough about the details and about the things that ultimately drive the client experience forward so that when you're making those high-level decisions, you're making so with full context and not just looking at the spreadsheet of what's this gonna do to firm valuation, what's this gonna do to firm profits.
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, next one, willingness to assume full responsibility.
• 20:04
  SPEAKER_01: So that is that concept of extreme ownership.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_01: I think this is a huge one.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_01: If something goes wrong, and I say, well, that was Eden's fault.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like I told people, I I gave training, I gave development, I gave support.
• 20:17
  SPEAKER_01: Eden, you lost that client.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's and obviously I'm just making this up for people listening.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: You blew, you like what's that gonna do to Eden's morale, to the firm's morale?
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_01: Like, even if it is, let's say, Eden should have done something.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, that that is the and this is true.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm not this isn't something you just say to say it because it sounds good.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_01: Like, no, that's that is my fault.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_01: Like, did we must have designed the wrong structure that Eden wasn't able to do what she needed as an advisor at that point.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: There's also something very free about accepting that.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like when when Do you ever listen to Tim Ferris or do you know who Tim Ferris says?
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: Can't say that I do, but I did just finish reading Extreme Ownership.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: So this is hit and hole.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so Tim, he had like the four-hour work week.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_01: He's got he was like one of the first big podcasting people.
• 21:06
  SPEAKER_01: Anyways, I I remember this is such a random story.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: Who knows?
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_01: I don't know why I'm saying it.
• 21:13
  SPEAKER_01: But he um Let's go with it.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_01: You know how some people on their podcasts, there's always a common question they'll ask their guests, or like a question to leave their guests with.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_01: And some of the questions are weird.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_01: Like, why do you even do that?
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_01: Just skip it, whatever.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_01: His question was like, if you could have if you could put anything you wanted on a billboard, what would it be?
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_01: And like a saying.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_01: Essentially asking, like, what is a saying that you think would make people's lives better if if they heard it?
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_01: And I don't know why, but like he asked that question one time, and I would say, yeah, I think I would put everything is your fault.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_01: Which is not like PC, and it's not, I think, what people like.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_01: But I think there's this like sense of freedom when you actually take it stops, you have agency.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_01: Like, okay, something's going wrong, it's my fault.
• 21:57
  SPEAKER_01: If it's Eden's fault and it's that department's Fault.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: I feel helpless and I just feel angst, and there's nothing I can really do with it because I don't have control.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_01: It wasn't my fault, it was their fault.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um it maybe protects my ego and my pride to say it was Eden's fault, but it also traps me in this sense of, oh, I can't do anything about it.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: Freaking Eden, why does she keep messing up?
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, there's nothing good about that.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think a leadership principle, whether it's for and by the way, you just mentioned reading extreme ownership, I everyone's a leader.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: If you have any influence over others, including yourself, you are a leader.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: Because you need to first lead your own life well before you can lead others.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: And the sense of um extreme ownership.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: If something's wrong, it's my fault, that's actually incredibly refreshing to me, incredibly freeing to me.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_01: Because if something's going wrong, I now have agency to be able to at least be a part of the solution to fix it.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: When it comes to clients, I've talked about this a whole bunch before, but hey clients, this thing happened, that thing happened.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um I forget if it was on a podcast episode Eden you and I did together, if it was right before we started doing the co-hosting here.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: But one of the earliest experiences I had as an advisor, we messed up on like some subscription.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_01: And when I say there was supposed to be an alternative investment placement, and like the client didn't fill something out or filled something out the wrong way.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_01: And it like led to, I forget the exact details, but like the wrong, not the wrong investment being held, but something got messed up in the process.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_01: And the instinct was to say, oh, well, you I mean you filled it out wrong, which was the reality.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_01: You he he did fill it out wrong.
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_01: He put the wrong thing in whatever the form was.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: But instead, that there was that sense, okay, you know what, there, this is no one's fault but mine, and I'm gonna tell the client, and it's probably gonna get me fired.
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_01: But it just felt like, okay, this is the right thing to do to take ownership.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_01: The benefit, though, that like I learned in that moment, the client was so reassured when it's like, oh, wait, James, like it wasn't James U F U, and all is okay, hey, thank you.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like, I'm I'm ups, I'm upset about this, but thank you very much for for kind of taking ownership.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: And it solidified the relationship because he then knew I can trust James.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_01: James is going to fix this.
• 24:14
  SPEAKER_01: If it turned into a, well, Mr.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_01: Client, you messed up this.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_01: Well, the he doesn't just say, Yeah, James, you're right, that's my fault.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_01: He says, No, James, what are you talking about?
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you're the advisor.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like, it just turns into a blame game when you're not taking ownership and nobody wins.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think this is a huge principle of what can we do, not just to say, I take ownership and it's my fault, my, but to mean it because it gives you more agency, it gives you more ability to actually influence how to improve that, and it's going to help build better relationships with those around you when you take that ownership.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: Is that resonating at all?
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_01: Or anything you would add to that, Eden?
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of what you're going through right now, I'm noticing just kind of the common theme of it's applicable both internally amongst ourselves as team members, but it also is applicable with our relationships with the clients.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_00: And all of these threads are bleeding through, just even talking about ownership.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes within Root and our teams, it's like a battle of like who wants to take responsibility for it because everyone wants to take responsibility for what happened.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_00: And that bleeds right through the client experience and being transparent and it all just builds trust.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_00: All of these things that you're talking about are a common thread amongst ourselves as team members and in our relationships with our clients, and all of it just leads to greater trust.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_00: And that is a huge backbone of the culture here and the environment we have.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_01: Love it.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_01: Love it.
• 25:39
  SPEAKER_01: So, yeah, for and again, for people just joining us, I'm just reading from a journal I wrote.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_01: This was eight and a half years ago now, and um the original question was, yeah, what's the what what led to that culture?
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_01: What are the principles?
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_01: And so as we're going through this, it's uh just talking about this.
• 25:55
  SPEAKER_01: This this is fun.
• 25:56
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, next one what does leadership require?
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_01: Cooperation, provide it and demand it.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_01: So make sure that we are all actively engaged in finding solutions together.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_01: Then there's a section.
• 26:08
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think I read this one beforehand, so hopefully this is good because I haven't uh screened out anything that's maybe not.
• 26:14
  SPEAKER_01: But the next section is what kills good leadership?
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_01: Inability to organize details.
• 26:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like there's part of leadership, and again, I'm gonna talk about this from this the framework of building root.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_01: But if you're an advisor listening to this, like think about the framework of building relationships.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_01: Number one, inability to organize details.
• 26:33
  SPEAKER_01: So to me, when it comes to building root, like if we're gonna roll out a new project or roll out a new thing, every project, like it used to be easy to roll out a project when there's three of us or four of us or five of us, like, hey, let's just all hop on and here's what we're doing, and everyone's got a part, and everyone's like we can connect enough because there's so few of us.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_01: Now that we're 80 plus people, like projects, even little ones, become very hard.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's it's hey, I message this, but then this team is like, well, what does that mean for us?
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_01: And it's like, oh shoot.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_01: Like I like that was supposed to be advisors, but now client service is like, well, you didn't think about, and and rightfully so, like, hey, you what about the downstream effects for us and what that means?
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_01: And um compliance is like, well, wait, did you even consider this?
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: And operations is like, well, it's like, oh shoot, yeah, you're right.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like that sounds good in theory, rolling this thing out, and it is good, but it touches so many different people.
• 27:24
  SPEAKER_01: How do you do this?
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: And so the ability to organize details, and I heard someone once call this the, I think the like the collaboration tax or something like this.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_01: Like your role as the CEO, your role as a leader is to get into the weeds, get into the details.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the Sequoia sales process that I briefly mentioned even two days ago on the our new sales process that we're rolling out on the team meeting.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um my job is to pay the collaboration tax of get in there and think deeply.
• 27:52
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, here's what we want to do, but what does this mean for advisors and the way kickoff meetings will be run and what needs to happen before then, and what needs to happen after then?
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: That's just step one.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_01: How are that we can get a message that?
• 28:04
  SPEAKER_01: How are we then going to train it?
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_01: How are that we then gonna track it?
• 28:07
  SPEAKER_01: How then are we gonna do just quality assurance on it?
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: How then are we gonna get and collect feedback on it?
• 28:13
  SPEAKER_01: What about operations?
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_01: Hey, now we need to collect these documents at this point, and these need to be in these workflows, and how do we do that?
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: Then how do we message that?
• 28:21
  SPEAKER_01: How do we make sure all advisors know what's coming in and when?
• 28:23
  SPEAKER_01: How do we make sure that that's set, that expectation is set with the client?
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_01: What about the sales team?
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_01: What's changing about how that fit call is being run?
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_01: How do we set expectations about what the client will already know or the prospect will already know coming into the fit call?
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_01: Uh so like there's just all these little things, and it's like the leader needs to pay that collaboration tax, which is just kind of getting into the weeds and thinking about who's impacted and how.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_01: How do we message this?
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_01: How do we collect feedback on this?
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_01: And how do we do it in a streamlined way?
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_01: Because if it's just a blanket announcement, and hey, everyone give me your feedback, like that gets so noisy and so crazy, and it's just no one wins, and people get frustrated because there's there's there's too much going on.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: So thinking through those details, organizing those details, and then advisors can fully operate in their zone of genius, and operations can fully operate in their zone of genius, and the sales team can fully operate in their zone of genius because that collaboration piece, the organizing of the details, um, happened ahead of time.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_01: I would say application for advisors is hey, you you go into a meeting with a client, a whole bunch of things have to happen.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm just making this up.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_01: Like we at least at root try to break this down into segments to make it a little bit easier.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_01: But you have a meeting with the client, a whole bunch comes out of that.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_01: We got to update our trust, we've got to update our tax strategy, we just change jobs, so we need to make sure that we're reviewing our uh our new benefits summary.
• 29:47
  SPEAKER_01: We need to update our there's a lot of organization that happens there.
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_01: And maybe you need to do, I don't know, the tax projection before you do the new home purchase projection, because a tax projection is going to be the thing that shows how much you own taxes, which tells you how much you have left over after taxes to buy the new home, which tells you how much you have.
• 30:04
  SPEAKER_01: So there's some organization that's done there.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_01: And so the principle is how can the leader, whether it's a CEO of an organization or the advisor in a meeting, organize those details to make it easy for the work to actually happen.
• 30:21
  SPEAKER_01: Does that resonate at all?
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: I I can see also this is again something that you can think about from the leadership kind of top-down perspective, but it's also totally from the bottom up.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: And I feel that really deeply here at root.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not just saying that to make you feel better, James.
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_00: I really do feel that from the top down and the bottom up.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_00: Just the the recognition of the details being important and that you're that work is not being put on people who it shouldn't be.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's again that ownership.
• 30:55
  SPEAKER_00: It circles right back to that ownership piece.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_00: If you recognize as the leader, there's something that needs to change, whether that's from direct feedback or we're just reassessing things, taking ownership of how are we actually going to approach this, you know, you don't see that as, okay, that's everybody else's job to figure that out.
• 31:13
  SPEAKER_00: Here you guys go, figure that out.
• 31:15
  SPEAKER_00: And that trickles all the way down even to the lead and associate relationship of who does what and being super clear about the details.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's just really cool the way that this can be looked at as a very broad cultural from leadership perspective, but it also can be very micro down to how we work in our pods and squads with RCS team, leads, associates.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: It all really bleeds through.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_00: Everything we're talking about here can be looked at very like high level, top-down, but also very micro within our individual teams.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_00: So that totally resonates with how we all work together on a high-level organizational scale, but also just within our individual teams and with our clients.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 31:58
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's exactly right.
• 31:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that goes back to forget which one was it.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um I wrote control myself before others, lead myself before leading others.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's that principle of if you see this, like look, if if Naomi is a lead is holding a certain standard, you're gonna hold that same standard.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's that's the leader here.
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_01: That's who I'm immediately.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_01: When Eden's a lead and she has her associate, that associate's gonna whatever standard Eden holds herself to, the associate is going to.
• 32:29
  SPEAKER_01: If Eden's consistently four minutes, five minutes late to each meeting, the associate's gonna say, say, sure, I can be four minutes to five minutes late to each meeting.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_01: If Eden is slow to respond to urgent client requests, the associate's gonna say, okay, well, whatever.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_01: I guess.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_01: So it's the standards that are held by the leader become part of that culture.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: And and culture ultimately, in some senses, is just like what's what standards are reinforced or accepted?
• 32:52
  SPEAKER_01: So what do we praise, what do we accept, what do we not accept?
• 32:56
  SPEAKER_01: That becomes a big part of it, but it's ultimately up to the leaders.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I would say that everyone at root is a leader in their own regard, various spans of control, that leadership.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: But what do we tolerate becomes a big part of the culture.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_01: I'll go through these last few here because I know we're running a little long.
• 33:12
  SPEAKER_01: But what kills good leadership?
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_01: Unwillingness to provide humble service.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_01: Next.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_01: Expectation to be paid for knowledge and not action.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_01: See that one a lot.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: I'm super smart.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_01: I've been in this business forever.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_01: You should pay me because who cares?
• 33:27
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care what you know, I care what gets done, I care about the action.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and so I think that was an interesting thing.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_01: I just remember feeling that with a couple people that I'd seen.
• 33:36
  SPEAKER_01: I was like, you expect a lot just because you know stuff, not because you're actually doing much.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_01: Now, that knowledge should lead to more informed action and to leveraged action because of that knowledge, but it should not be a replacement for the action.
• 33:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um next, fear of competition from the team, from followers, whatever it is.
• 33:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so, yeah, I think that you what would kill good leadership?
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: That that fear of, well, everyone else is hungry and growing.
• 34:04
  SPEAKER_01: No, accept that.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_01: Accept that um others are going to be working in their lane.
• 34:08
  SPEAKER_01: So don't fear that.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_01: What would kill it?
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_01: Lack of imagination and creativity.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_01: So I think Roots are very creative organization.
• 34:14
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's just one person.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's become part of the culture of if people have good ideas, let's use it.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care where it comes from.
• 34:21
  SPEAKER_01: I don't care if it comes from the person that just joined in an entry-level role two weeks ago, or if it came from someone in a leadership, senior leadership position that's been here for several years.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_01: How do we instill creativity and imagination in what we're doing?
• 34:34
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, what kills good leadership?
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_01: Selfishness, intemperance, disloyalty of my trust to others, emphasis on my authority, emphasis on my title.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_01: So people who hold their title, hold themselves in high regard.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and again, that kind of goes back to feeling like I'm you owe me because you're an employee, not I owe you, because you're giving me a lot of your life, frankly, to put it, by being here.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I think the general principle, if I was to summarize it, is roots shift was from they owe me to I owe them.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_01: Not I owe them, and hey, do whatever you want.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna do whatever I can to keep your no, like you I owe you, but like we also have high standards.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_01: And I and we have those high standards because really we owe it to the rest of the team who has those high standards to ensure that every single person here is contributing in a meaningful way, contributing to the team, to the culture, to clients, to what we're doing.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_01: So I hope that's helpful.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_01: I think that was just kind of a let's read James' old journal from two months into starting route.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_01: I think that some of those ultimately led, you know, going back to the we didn't get around to this, but you said that yeah, some of the things we do.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_01: Whether it's the ring the bell channel and Slack, which are just so fun to celebrate each other's wins, whether it's the way we do recognition, whether it's the way we um do any of that stuff, like those are the details.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_01: You can't just roll that out and expect, oh, our culture's cool now, our culture's great now.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_01: It's you've got to have the foundation of some of those principles, and then some of these tactics laid on top of it is the expression of those principles, but they don't ever replace the actual uh underlying principle itself.
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_01: Anything that you would add to any of this, Eden, before we wrap up for today?
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_00: I think just the last thing I would say that also ties into all of this is that everyone here at Root has these same kind of principles that we just talked about.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: The idea of being a leader for yourself.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_00: You don't have to be, you know, senior advised or anything, but everyone has a sense of internal leadership.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone has a sense of ownership of what they do.
• 36:49
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone feels that it's really important to foster trust and transparency amongst ourselves.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_00: And everyone at root does this in their own way.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_00: It's not you said, hey, here's A, B, C, D, this is how you do all of this, and everyone has to do it this way.
• 37:05
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone brings their own, and this circles back to the creativity, being imaginative.
• 37:11
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone brings their own authentic style to how they lead themselves, to how they lead their teams, to how they foster trust, how they have a transparency with their clients, with each other.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's not just like this textbook, everybody does it the same way.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's one of the coolest parts about the culture here is everyone's on board with it.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_00: Everyone's with those principles, but you also are very encouraged to do it in your own way.
• 37:35
  SPEAKER_00: Be yourself, be authentic.
• 37:37
  SPEAKER_00: And we all will win together if we're able to do that.
• 37:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that just kind of ties all of this together.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I love it.
• 37:45
  SPEAKER_01: I love, you know, I would like to think that that's the way it is, but it's good to hear obviously from other people at root who feel the same way.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_01: And the, I mean, the the last thing that I'll say with this is none of the culture that we have, none of it could happen if you don't get the right people on the team.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_01: You could have whatever principles you want, you could have whatever recognition programs you want, you could have whatever fun stuff you want.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_01: But if you have the you're starting with the wrong people, you just don't have the right ingredients to make it happen.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_01: But by having these principles, it's kind of like what came first, the chicken of the egg or the egg, is the people that embody this, or is it the principles that attract those people?
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that it's got to be you're just making it up at the beginning.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_01: You're just trying your best to do all of it.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_01: So you are the people at the beginning when it's just you.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_01: And then if you can become the type of firm, become the type of person that would attract others that are attracted to that type of standard, to those types of standards, you start to build a great flywheel.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_01: Now we have a team of 80-plus incredible people.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_01: Um, these standards we have to fight, we have to fight really hard to protect them because they don't just magically remain.
• 38:50
  SPEAKER_01: Like the the default state of everything is inertia and kind of trending back to average and trending back to um uh whatever.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_01: Not these things.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_01: Like we these are going to be a constant battle to keep to maintain, especially as we keep growing.
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_01: But it's so much easier to do that when you have a team of people who is receptive and protective of these principles because they don't want to lose them.
• 39:16
  SPEAKER_01: So um good, good, good episode.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_01: Eden, thank you for suggesting that.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_01: I think that um again, I hope that was helpful to read from the journal, the Wayback Machine that I haven't read in eight plus years, but I hope that's helpful for people who are whatever position they're in, whatever relationship they're in, whatever situation they're in, there's some core themes there that when you unpack, what does it mean to have a healthy culture?
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_01: What we're really saying is what does it mean to have a healthy environment in which you and others can operate in and do so together with those shared values and shared understandings of what is acceptable and praised and expected amongst the team.
• 39:55
  SPEAKER_01: So that is it for today.
• 39:56
  SPEAKER_01: If you're enjoying this episode and you're listening, subscribe on YouTube, um, Root Ready Podcast.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_01: Subscribe on Spotify or Apple, wherever you listen.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_01: And if you have someone that you think would enjoy this, please share the episode with them so more people can learn and hear and get all the uh hopefully great information that is shared here.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you everyone for listening, and we'll see you next time.