Latest / Mythmakers / Sidecast - LOTR: An Author's Journey, Book 2 Chapter 6

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Sidecast - LOTR: An Author's Journey, Book 2 Chapter 6 · Mythmakers

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Hello and welcome to the Fakers.
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With makers is the podcast for fantasy fans and fantasy creatives.
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brought to you by the Oxford Centre for fantasy.
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My name is Julia Golding. I'm an author that I also run the centre.
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Anyway, we are doing a journey through the Lord of the Rings.
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Looking at it from an author's point of view.
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And we have reached chapter 6 in book 2. That's the latter end of the Fellowship of the Ring.
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And this chapter is called Loth Lorean.
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Now immediately I say that I'm sure that you are coming up with strong visual images of your own
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of what you think that place is like.
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And it's an absolutely splendid chapter.
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And I think it really does display the enchantment of Tolkien's world building,
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particularly in the world of the elves.
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But interestingly also in the very same chapter in the world of the dwarves.
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And we'll be looking at that saying, well, suggesting how he does it.
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I don't know that well ever solve the mystery of the acumus effect of reading it.
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But I'll have a look at some of the things I'm noticed as an author.
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When I was analysing it, I was thinking that it's probably an chapter that falls into four sections.
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So first of all, we have the leaving the gates of Moria.
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And there's sort of a dwarven interlude.
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It falls energiac and wintery.
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That's the kind of imagery that's been invoked there.
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And then there's a transition into a more spring-like environment as they approach Loth Lorean.
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And this is a moment where they have a pause.
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And Legolas' notices that Frodo and Sam are lagging behind because they were both injured
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in the previous chapter.
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And there's a section with Frodo and Gimli talking about their journey.
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And there's the Nimrodal poem which Legolas recites.
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So the third section after that sort of slow entry into Loth Lorean is staying up in the
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treetops with Haldir, Rumil, and the other elves who are on watch.
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And it's when the orcs pass below.
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And it's held in the night time.
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And then the last section is a daytime in Loth Lorean as they walk blindfold to Karen Amroff,
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which is called the Heart of Elvendom on Earth.
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And it sort of leads into the heart of Aragon in a way.
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It's showing what his motive is in a very subtle way and it ends with Frodo and Aragon together.
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It also, I'm calling this the Time Slip section and you'll see why in a minute.
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Right, so let's turn to the details of the chapter itself.
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So the first thing technically to point out is it starts with speech.
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It's Aragon saying, recalling his words to warning Gandalf or the dangers of going to
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Maria, also reaffirming here's the one who is leading the way and also telling them
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they got to get moving.
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This technique of using speech if you compare it to other chapters which have slow entry points,
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it means you it's like a sprint start as opposed to a gentle wind up.
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It gives a sense of urgency to this section.
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Mainly Aragon and Gimli do the talking in this part, which is appropriate
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because it's a Gimli's reprise of the mountains being their enemies, even Shakespeare's fist
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at Caladras and there were echoes of pre-speeches in this section.
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If you're wondering, if you're looking in the detail, if you're wondering what wind is and what
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exactly that is in English, I will tell you.
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When is a colloquial name for furs or ghosts so a prickly bush
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talking very often liked using the older names or the more local dialect names, which fits because
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the point of view mainly is that of the hobbits and so they might well use a more familiar name to
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them. Anyway, I thought I'd just help you out on that.
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They're passing through on this side of the mountain, one of the many faded places in middle
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earth with its cracked stones and paths that are broken up and the broken columns.
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I think what you might want to fit to imagine is Tolkien is thinking of the Roman remains.
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Not so much left in the UK though we do have some particularly up like a Hadrian's wall in places
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like that but certainly what you might find in the landscape of Greece or Turkey, the idea of
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once fine civilization that has vanished and we are the little people who follow on afterwards
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and so his middle earth is full of places like this.
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Gimli is talking to Frodo at this point and Sam follows. Notice how many times Sam just latches
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on. Frodo is asked off to accounts or to come and see the place we're doing looked into the water
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and Sam follows anyway. It's actually hilarious the number of times that happens but it's his,
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he's basically Frodo's bodyguard isn't he? He's his right hand man so he's not going to be left behind.
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I always find it slightly odd that the two who do go Gimli are the injured ones in the party.
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Mary Pippin, you're passing up this chance to see this wonder. Anyway I suppose looking at it
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another way the choice to go on a kind of pilgrimage to see the mirror mirror is better with fewer
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people around it gives it a more solemn moment and Frodo as our main point of view is a good person
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to go with. Anyway it's a little niggle that's always got to me at that point. Why don't the others
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go as well? Anyway so here is the bit I was referring to where we get the magic of Tolkien's vision
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of the dwarf culture and it's done through the evocation of the mirror mirror which is this wonderfully
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deep lake that is thrust into the heart of the mountains like a spear point. Just think it's worth
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reading that section because it's so beautiful they stooped over the dark water. At first they
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could see nothing then slowly they saw the forms of the encircling mountains mirrored in a profound
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blue and the peaks were like the plumes of white flame above them beyond there was a space of sky.
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They're like jewels sunk in the deep shun glinting stars though sunlight was in the sky above
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of their own stooping forms though shadow could be seen. So it feels magical though I think
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Tolkien is picking on some possible in nature things here. I believe that if we're down very
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deep well and look up you can see the stars even though it's daylight. So there's a sense of that
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depth and also the fact that their reflections or shadows aren't on the water it gives that sense
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of the timelessness the age of the dwarven vision for which these mortals are not don't even make any
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imprint on the surface. I also want to just point out here something I've not thought of before but
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there is a resonance isn't there between this and the mirror of Galadriel. Another reflective
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pool that shows the past and also the future in the case of Galadriel. So she says
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she's looking ahead that it's they may find it magical but that's not her name for the same thing.
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It seems a bit similar in the case of the dwarven vision here it's not magic in there but it's
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something deeply felt deeply expressed of dwarven culture. So beautiful and it's notable that
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when the little party of three return and Pippin saying what did you see? What did you see?
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Pippin why didn't you go along? Sam is too deep in thought to answer and there is a definite
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deepening all the way through lot of the rings of Sam's reaction to cultures outside the shy.
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He was the most sheltered of them all but in many ways he is the most open and he is possibly
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the most changed too by encountering other cultures. And the fact that he is silent and is lingering
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over this vision I think and there's a page break is Tolkien asking us to also pause and think
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about the dwarf culture of Durin and his followers. And now when they get back they start to follow
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rivers. This is a chapter of following rivers and they actually start at the source of the silver
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load. If you look at the map you'll see the silver load is the river that goes from the mountains
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all the way into Anduin the Great River. So it is the silver thread running through Lothlorian
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and it's fitting that they start right up the source. Gimli says don't drink it's too cold.
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And we also get a tease here of Llorian in the distance as sort of the golden
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shimmer on the horizon. And we also find in this chapter two very good guides one of which is
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legolas and then as they actually get into Lothlorian he passes that over to Haldir but at this first
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half the chapter is our guide. And on in my edition page 149 he gives a very useful introduction
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to where we're going. They're like the woods of Lothlorian that is the fairest for the dwellings
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of my people. There are no trees like the trees of that land for in the autumn they're leaves
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for not but turn to gold. Not till the spring comes and the new green opens through they fall
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and then the boughs are laden with yellow flowers and the floor of the wood is golden and golden
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is the roof and its pillars are of silver for the bark of the trees is smooth and gray.
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So here folks the place that we're going to though we're visiting it in the winter we are
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almost changing into spring here because there is something about the beauty of spring captured
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forever in Lothlorian. That's the little teas. We then move on we're there sort of trying to
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reach safety before nightfall, arrogance hurrying them along and this section is from Frodo and Sam's
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joint point of view because they're feeling pretty rough and it's notable that the start of
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this next section we hear how both of them are feeling but we also get the sense that arrogance
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steps into leadership are faltering ones. He's used to being in the company one of the suspects
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of people who can keep up with him and he's having to adjust his ideas because the hobbits are failing
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but he shows his the good side of his character that's his blind side he shows a good side of his
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character by recognising and apologising that he was in the wrong and they must have been
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feeling pretty rough because Aragorn and Boramir carry them to the little Dell. Now I want to
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just pause on the little Dell you may not have thought about this since you last read it but this
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just I was saying that there are always these details which are lovely to rediscover no matter how
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many times you read your way through Lord the Rings. I find that stopping and thinking about places
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which I've just skimmed over before always come up with new delights and here it is the specificity
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of the place they stop so here we are it's a place that doesn't loom large in you know the
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lore of Middle Earth but so they they go past and yet another little stream and they go into a Dell
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about it stood fur trees short and bent and its sides were steep and clothed with heart's tongue
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and the shrubs of Waterbury at the bottom there was a level space through which the stream flowed
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noisily of a shining pebbles. So his evoking is a very common side actually if you're worth
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walking on someone like Exmor or Dartmore where Tolkien often went on walking holidays this kind
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of little Dell is absolutely somewhere you could go and find today. Beautiful it feels
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feels safe of course they're not safe yet but it's this sort of private space so they can do
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there a bit of medical attention that is required at this point but Tolkien doesn't forget
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the ticking clock because he don't want to lose the tension he mentions that already the sun
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was westering so we're in a northern hemisphere where days are short in winter and they haven't
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got long to find better safety than this. So some wonderful details and to come in this short
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bit of medical aid are arrogant swings into action as the hands of the king of the hands of the
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healer here and I love the little link back to Weathertop because he's still carrying with him
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the dried leaves of Athelas that proved so helpful when Frodo was hurt before.
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We also get a beautiful description of the male shirt we saw it briefly when Frodo was putting it on
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and when Bilba gave it to him but I think I this might be my favourite description of it
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and it's the first bit of levity after losing Gandalf it actually makes the surprise of it makes
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arrogant laugh. The silver corset shimmered before his eyes like the light upon a rippling sea
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carefully he took it off and held it up and the gems on it glittered like stars
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and the sound of the shaken rings was like the tinkle of rain in a pool. I don't know how possible
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all those things are but we're probably because I haven't heard that sound before maybe it's
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it sounds as if it might quite noisy to wear but anyway I it evokes something beautiful
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and this chapter is strangely often referring to the sea and to beaches and to those those
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things that come from westerns or from the undying lands even though we are far far inland and
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the male shirt seems to be almost like a seashell that's supposed to have the sound of the sea in
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it the male shirt seems to be falling into that kind of roll so I love that little description.
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This exchange between arrogant and gimmily and Frodo is also beautifully done by the way in the
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B.B.T. audio version of this particularly the little exchange between arrogant and gimmily.
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arrogant says here's a pretty hobbit skin to wrap an elven printling in. Now I'm not sure if he's
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a poet and didn't know it but there is obviously a rhyme there and gimmily is of course astonished by
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the workmanship and he has a wonderful bit of just odd dwarven or this he says I've never heard
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or tell of one so fair is this the coat that Gandalf spoke of then he undervalued it but it is
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well given so again he's not saying I want it he hasn't treasure doesn't hold a grip on his heart
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like it you know the danger of holding onto treasures as well made in Tolkien it also actually
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cast an interesting backlight to Thorin because though Thorin went a bit crazy with the dragonhaw
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he did give Bilbo this coat and that's an interesting thought to his generosity to his allies
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even though he went he got the dragon sickness anyway and of course Mary is the one who explicitly
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mentions Bilbo blessed the old hobbit so Bilbo is never far from Tolkien's mind and so he puts
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him in the mind of the fellowship at all times okay so off they go again when I was reading this
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section it's Frodo and Gimmily talking here I was reminded of how when you're walking
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that you have the chance to talk to different people in the party you can fall in with different
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people and this seems to be what's happening here and I like that feeling of the long extended walk
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where you have times walking alongside to different people and Frodo is actually for the I think
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for the first time confiding that he has heard or thought he heard perhaps somebody following them
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Gimmily is a bit dismissive of it here because he can't hear it now so therefore he says all I can
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hear is the night speech of Blanton Stone but at least Frodo's told someone and later we'll find the
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some of the sharper eared better trackers know that they're being followed but nobody tells each other
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never really quite understand why but anyway perhaps perhaps we'll work it out now they can't do
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anything about it at the moment I suppose is part of it so now we are on the edge of Lothlorian
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and the trees that Tolkien chooses to evoke here are poplars now poplars are tall thin trees
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with wonderful foliage that glitters in when the breeze goes through them they sort of have this
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sort of fluttery metallic sheen to them and they're often used as boundaries or border trees so you
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might see them on the edge of a road for example there's plenty of them in northern France that he
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might have seen when he was fighting there but also boundaries in sort of rural parts of southern
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England as well anyway so that's the tree he is evoking here so that to me reminds me of boundaries
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and maybe that's what he was thinking of but it's the trees he's looking at are not poplars
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they are the malons of course in the dim light of the stars their stems were gray and their
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quivering leaves a hint of fallow gold now this word word fallow gold is repeated a lot in this
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chapter gold silver pale blue green there's a limited color palette which makes the colors of
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Lothlorian even stronger there's not I don't think he mentions crimson for example or purple or any
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of those colors at all and they're all spring colors and the repeated use of this same
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limited set of spring light colors I think is part of how the spell of this chapter is woven
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it's like you hit the same notes and subliminally we are being lured in to imagine this spring light
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young world there is I must say a perplexing lack of communication in middle earth we mentioned it
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in the last couple of chapters about how they didn't know what happened to barlings people
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but even legolas who one would have thought elf would have time to you know walk up
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through the woods to find out what's happening he is relying on the stories of his people maybe it's
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not deserted I mean our goal knows for well it's not deserted but the fact that and legolas is his
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friend so this sort of mistyness about what's going on in other parts of middle earth always
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perplex me when actually we're talking about a land journey of a few weeks anyway the what's
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they're achieving here from a fictional point of view is they're not being told too early the
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surprise is being held back as to who and what is in control of Lothlorian why was errand sending
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his sons messengers there what is this power at the heart of Lothlorian
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but anyway the mystery is kept going for a bit longer
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Boramir ways in if you mention if you notice how many times really Boramir is
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pulling against the rest of the fellowship and here is one of them it's his I told you so
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moment he would much prefer a plane road though it led through a hedge of swords he does get a
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hedge of swords and he doesn't get through it of course when he eventually dies but he's not
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helpful they can't as arrogant as you can't go back this is we've got to go forward there is no way
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that's the only choice so he's being very unhelpful at this point and they have a debate about
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the meanings of unscathed and unchanged so Boramir says nobody goes through the woods without being
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scaved or they don't move come through unscathed and arrogant counters with unchanged because of course
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we later learn that he spent much of his youth there and that's where he fell in love with
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so for him it's a happy place of course and note also that in the conversations between Boramir
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and arrogant again arrogant tops Boramir it's as though he can't give Boramir the final word
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so the kingship stupid thing is is already at play because Boramir says then lead on but it is
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perilous rather than give him the final word arrogant says perilous indeed fair and perilous
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but only evil need fear it or those who bring some evil with them follow me that's a
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sort of sentiment that's repeated around Boramir after his heart is tested
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and the way that he is changing so that his desire for the ring takes over
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Legolas is still our guide and part of the information he is going on are the songs of his people
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and he talks about them telling the stories of Lothlorian but also about the places there so
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the river the next river they come across Nimrodel, Tripitri or Swala river is described as having
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rainbows on its falls and golden flowers on the phone or part of this color palette that
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of things which are shiny and gem-like and of course that golden keeps coming up
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and they wade across the river so it's a smaller river than the silver load because they can
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wade it at this point and it's described as a sort of cleansing experience so Frodo is our point
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of view here he lets the water flow over his tired feet it was cold but its touch was clean and as
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he went on and it mounted to his knees he felt that the stain of travel and all weariness was washed
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from his limbs it's a very important power of Lothlorian is that cleansing it's like a baptism
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isn't it the washing away of the burdens and it reminded me of the power of literature to have
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that baptising effect C.S. Lewis said that his imagination was baptized by reading
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George McDonnell's Fantasties he was reading it on a train it's a fantasy book from the Victorian
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era and the imagery and the power of the well-building and the messages of the book he describes
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coming out of the book and bathing everything else in this sort of newly baptized light
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and I think this is what we're getting here there's the power of this
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place is not only having that effect on the cleansing effect on the characters but I think it
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also has that bi-association in our minds as readers that's why part of the reason why it's such a
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powerfully a vote place there's another section later on which I'm going to highlight where this is
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very very acutely seen Legolas is the tale teller his telling stories of the Sunlight and Starlight
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upon the Meadows of the Great River that's where they are the Meadows by the Great River is where
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they later meet with Kiliborne and Galadriel before the world was grey now grey is actually quite
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a colour of Lothlorian because the grey cloaks for example but when the world was grey that's
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a sort of contrast to the golden age the silver age bronze age it's the sense of
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we are now in the twilight twilight of the gods in that sort of love northern myth that
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Tolkien has but it also shows the nostalgia of the elves that they are looking back and thinking
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everything was better before so they feel they are lingering fading whereas someone like
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Aragorn is coming into his kingdom he's going to build something it's going to start something
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they are at the end times of their particular contribution to Middle-earth
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now also here the river is given qualities of a living creature Tolkien's care for all things
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like of creation nature this totally fits in we have speaking trees of course and the river
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daughter is a sort of a voice of a river isn't she earlier on way back in the beginning of the book
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but here the river is alive and the voice it has is that of Nimrodel who is it's not that she's
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literally the Elva Maiden is there it's that her experience and her memory is in the waters
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the Nimrodel poem is a sort of a it's a ballad isn't it it's in ballad form with
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alternative rhyming lines stanzas of four lines and it's the love story
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unfinished love story of Nimrodel and Amroth it's a second unfinished love story
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because when Aragorn tells the story of Baron and Lucien who also doesn't finish that particularly
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is the song doesn't finish because it's much longer and the same thing happens here
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legolas stops and says i can't tell you the sad bits and he refers to the dwarves waking up the
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ballrog and so there is a repeat in Elv in in the sort of stories of Lothlorian of the similar
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idea of a thwarted love whereas Baron and Lucien of course is in the end a happy ever after
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kind of love story even though it has sorrow in it this one is that they are parted or we don't
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know if they ever found each other so it's that light again that tragedy and grief is always
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never far from the Elven experience and that is an undercurrent flowing through even somewhere
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as beautiful as Lothlorian like the river flows through a landscape so we get this little dip
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into the history of the reasons why the dwarves and the elves these parts fell out and that
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little nod to that is a reminder because it comes up obviously when they meet the Elven guards
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they're looking for a safe place to perch and i notice here that there's one of those lines which
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gets misplaced in the film so the way that gimley is imagined in the film is comic he is not as
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comical at all in the book i don't think i mean i'm just thinking that for Tolkien the hobbits
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of the comical ones and the dwarves of the dwarven race whereas in the film give these off
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and the ones are puffing away at the back and you know there's the sort of mind the beard jokes
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which is not that Tolkien really i hadn't really struck me until i saw what they did with this
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line anyway let me show you what i mean when they try and climb a tree and are told to drop down
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because the elves and guards are there it is the hobbits who are saying who are they what are they
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doing and legolas says they say that you breathe so loudly that they could shoot you in the dark
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in the film that line is given to Hal dear to sort of g up gimley to kind of you know needle him
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and Sam basically put his hand over his mouth so it's actually turned more into a Sam moment Sam
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later on is described snoring so he's a heavy breather is Sam and so it's the hobbits who are the
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funny creatures here and not the dwarves anyway just thought i'd point that out so legolas takes
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Frodo up into the talent notice guess who follows it's Sam and Hal dear now takes over as our
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useful guide to all things lothlorian and there's an interesting comment here about what the elves
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know about the hobbits again there's this lack of communication in middle earth because really the
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shares are that hard to find anyway he says we had not heard of hobbits or halflings for many a
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long year and did not know that any yet dwelt in middle earth now the dwarves knew because they'd
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been trading i'm walking through the shower but anyway the secret of the existence of the hobbits
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didn't penetrate very far and which actually helped them because saran took a while looking for
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them but anyway it was interesting that the suggestion is there were hobbits that were known
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previously and Hal dear is thinking they may all have vanished i guess maybe the hobbits think
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the same of the elves you know it maybe it goes both ways then legolas shows that he is
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used to these diplomatically awkward situations because he's describing who's in the party and if
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rather hoping that hal dear can't count um because he has to finally admit that the eighth person
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is a dwarf a dwarf said hal dear that is not well we have not had dealings with the dwarves since
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the dark days they are not permitted in our land i cannot allow him to pass that is interestingly
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an echo of what Gandalf says to the baroque you cannot pass so we've now got another block
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phrase very similarly as hal dear tries to stop poor old gimley who's not done anything wrong
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coming into his land but he's got a law which i think keleborn is quite keen to enforce
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and so he can't make the decision or he's only got a limited room of manoeuvre anyway Frodo steps up
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here and Frodo who is so passive in the film here's the one who makes some really good arguments
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why gimley should be allowed in he says it's one of dain's trusty people and friendly to Elron and
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chosen by Elron and so legolas gets made the sort of guarantor of gimley and note that this is
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the turning point actually for their friendship because when we leave lothlorian gimley and legolas
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have become the great friends that they're known for and so this moment where legolas
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sort of has to take responsibility for him is one of the starts of that really though his tone
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towards gimley has already been changing which is nice to see so the hobbits are now up in the trees
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and this is a lighthearted moment about their experience of having to sleep on a platform with no
35:08
edge i don't blame you that sounds pretty terrifying and Sam works his way up to quite a labored pun
35:18
the sooner i'll drop off if you take my meaning if this is the kind of hobbit talk which Tolkien
35:25
loved and other people told him could do with some cutting but we'll allow he has a voisier
35:32
hobbit talk for a while so we'll let him get away with it then so we're still in the darkness
35:38
in the nighttime section and this is where we get the orcs passing beneath them
35:45
nice to see sting being used have to keep reminding us when you've got these artifacts in a book
35:51
you can't just forget them for chapter 1 chapter it's nice to keep using them to remind us of
35:56
their presence but we also get the closest shave with golem he gets as far as two pale eyes looking
36:04
at Frodo this arrival of golem is a long long procedure isn't it i'd forgotten until i started
36:11
analysing this chapter just how how many times we almost but not quite meet him he gets another golem
36:21
must be one of the luckiest creatures in middle earth in some way because again he isn't killed by
36:30
the else because they're not sure if he's bad or not so he gets a lucky escape
36:35
we get a name of the the other elf wasn't yet been named orifin he is sent back to
36:43
warn of the incursion of the orcs leaving how dear and his brother rumil to conduct the
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travelers the next morning further into lothlorian so this is the final section of the book and
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this is done in daylight so we've gone from nighttime and orcs and rumours and the glimpses of golem to
37:06
a morning which is described as pale blue skies a fallow gold sea that's the description of the
37:14
the leaves that's one of the many mentions in this chapter of oceans and beaches in and inland realm
37:23
and one of the first things the encounter is the rope bridge nice to see here that pipin after having
37:32
been nerves about jumping the seven foot chasm he's not the one worried about the bridge he goes
37:40
across holding onto the rope very nimble and sam has one of his lovely grounding
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statements about how he's uncle andy couldn't have even done that and it can't speak to wonder
37:57
about all those tales that we don't yet hear about the the characters among the hobbits
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so uncle andy is obviously one about whom family tales were told but he brings in someone like
38:10
small and only famous within a family in this context where legolas is talking about
38:14
nimrodelle and amroth i like the fact that it's still this local folk folkloric presence in
38:21
with sam's grounding there the other thing i noticed when i was looking at this as an analytical way
38:29
is how the land is organized so the the naith which is where they're going to once across the river
38:42
is described as a spear hooking said it's like a spearhead between the arms of silver load and
38:52
anduin the great this stretch of land and it's a small detail but the mirror mirror is described
39:01
as a spearhead thrust towards the mountains the other way so in this chapter we've got recon
39:08
from one spearhead pointing that way to one pointing the other i don't suppose even talking
39:14
notice he did that but it does give a symmetry to this particular chapter journey we get the
39:23
the banter here between gimli and legolas with arrogant trying to make peace about whether or not
39:31
they should be blindfolded and gimli of course is annoyed or outraged to be singled out and
39:40
legolas is sort of saying get over it in elven terms and then when he is told that he has to be
39:46
blindfolded of course he is not pleased either anyway arrogant does show that he can wrangle his
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company by making the suggestion that they all go blindfold we get the sensory impact here
40:04
that if you're blindfolded you can't see so you have to rely on your other
40:13
your other senses and so Frodo who is our point of view that we are following
40:19
he he goes through what he can sense about the place they're going and i think one of the
40:25
spells cast by lotlorine is that it's a false sensory experience and that makes it feel more real
40:33
and more intense he could spell the trees and the trodden grass he could hear many different
40:41
notes in the rustle of the leaves overhead the river murmuring away on his right and the thin
40:46
clear voices of birds in the sky he felt the sun upon his face and hands when they passed through
40:55
an open glade so we are out in fact today i'm recording this on a day where i'm cutting the grass
41:02
sound would be pleased and if i go outside and sit in my garden that's exactly what i would feel
41:08
the sun on my face the birds in the sky so in a way i there always is a moment a chance to transport
41:18
yourself to lotlorine on a sunny spring day in the countryside in the UK so i that's why i love
41:27
the idea of lotlorine i suppose it's a more even more intense version of where i live in many ways
41:33
there is a fascinating thing that happens at the end of this chapter which is the time slip
41:40
moment when they leave they they talk about how time has changed being there and this is where
41:47
it starts to go all a bit strange and Frodo notices it he says he felt as if he had stepped over a
41:55
bridge of time into a corner of the elder days and was now walking in a world that was no more
42:03
in Rivendell there was a memory of ancient things in lorian the ancient things still lived on in
42:09
the waking world so and it goes on actually i was going to stop there but i like the next bit too
42:17
evil had been seen and heard there sorrow had been known the hells feared and distrusted the world
42:22
outside walls were howling on the woods borders but on the land of lorian no shadow lay
42:29
so it's a wonderful evocated you're stepping back into the past when you go into lorian and Frodo
42:39
because of his sensitivity to such things it fills that moment when it begins to slip
42:45
obviously not really in terms of the story but it has that feeling of being suspended
42:52
and out of time then they get the message that they're allowed to be blindfolded and the good
43:02
thing about that is that the moment they are told this is when they are at Kerin Amroth which is
43:10
this hill and the old heart of lorian so you get the ta-da ta-da moment it didn't like us in the film
43:19
always thought that painted backdrop and also it wasn't Kerin Amroth it was um
43:24
Galadron Keleborn's home that they that is shown that's not where they are in the book
43:32
so if you found that moment underwhelming in the film go and read the book moment because this
43:38
beautiful hill the old heart is the place that they have reached and it's empty it's not lived
43:46
in it's a hill with beautiful flowers and trees and the flowers that are given names
43:56
are Eleanor and Nifredil they are described in such a way that for a British reader sound very
44:04
close to cellandines and snow drops so the starshape yellow flower and the white green white flowers
44:15
very similar to those and they are the flowers that are the first ones that appear in January
44:19
in February here winter flowers at herald spring very very fitting for the positioning of lorian
44:27
in this chapter Frodo is a really marvellous point of view in this and there's a section here on
44:36
the page 365 and my copy where he's analysing what he feels about it all
44:45
everyone else is lying down by everyone else i think we can assume bib in a merry
44:52
are lying down but anyway he is thinking about it he feels as though he has stepped through a high
44:57
window that looked on a vanished world the light was upon it for which his language had known
45:04
all that he saw was shapely but the shape seemed at once clear cut as if they had been first
45:10
conceived and drawn at the young covering of his eyes and ancient as if they had endured forever
45:16
he saw no colour but those he knew gold and white and blue and green but they were fresh and
45:23
poignant as if he had at that moment first perceive them and made for them names new and wonderful
45:31
this reminds me of part of Tolkien's essay on fairy stories where he talks about the reenchantment
45:39
that fairy tales are able to bring into such simple ideas as trees and flowers and green
45:45
making thus perceive them afresh and again also that concept is in his poem miss appear
45:53
which is i would suggest you read if you want to understand how he makes lorian work
45:59
but if you want to see another writer doing a similar thing this section also reminds me
46:06
of the last battle where when they go through the stable door in cs lewis's book the nine year
46:15
they reach is more intense the greens are more green the blues are more blues and their idea that
46:21
you're sort of heading into the reality what is the most real place at all you could get philosophical
46:29
and say it's like meeting the pelotonic ideals in for real that's a possibility or it could be
46:39
almost like a concept of what is heaven compared to earth that's an idea that cs lewis plays within
46:48
the great divorce his meditation and what it might be like to be in heaven so this may be one
46:57
of the things that explains why lorian feels so different from everywhere else because this
47:02
place where everything is more real does feel a bit like an elven heaven but i would say that in
47:10
that there is a problem isn't there because it is the timelessness where it doesn't change
47:22
Frodo says he felt a timeless land that did not fade or change or fall into forgetfulness
47:27
that is also not living in a way because living is about change and it's interesting that
47:36
talking in his letters criticises the elves as being like imbalmers people making mummies
47:44
imbalming the past to not change so that's where he criticises them sounds also interesting here
47:51
because he is allowing himself to expand his idea of elves he says i thought that elves were all
48:01
for moon and stars but this is more elvish than anything i heard tell of i feel as if i'm inside
48:08
a song if you take my meaning that goes back to the idea of tales and songs being more intense
48:15
versions of reality so he feels like he stepped through into that out here is still with us as
48:23
our guide and him being there and explaining what they're seeing gives us a chance to connect our
48:31
experience in lothlorian back to the bigger context of the quest we don't want to forget what we're
48:37
about we don't want to just be like lotus eaters and stay in lothlorian forever they can see outside
48:42
the golden land and they can see as far as southern workwood where dull goulder which is the old
48:50
fortress in murkwood where shadow lies it is a stand in here for baradur one of the dark
49:00
loth citadels so it reminds us that while there is a bright light shining on lothlorian it is
49:06
only an island and here we get that idea of it being an island in a sea of change
49:14
proto actually under this spell it says he stood still hearing far off great seas upon beaches that
49:23
had long ago been washed away and seabirds crying whose race had perished from the earth
49:29
that's a hint at the sort of fossil record and how i live on a place with chalkdowns and
49:36
chalkdowns are were once seabirds i'm sure talking was thinking of that in the age of the earth but
49:42
also it connects the elves to the fact that they came from over the seas it's the seashell metaphor
49:49
again that the place where galadriel came from over the seas she brings it with her so the beaches
49:56
and the the oceans are present where she lives quite beautiful section all of this i loved
50:04
all the bells that are being rung for me in my imagination
50:09
and the last part the very last short part of it is meeting arrogant and it's lovely that
50:16
Frodo and arrogant have this moment together because they are really are two key protagonists
50:21
in the future of middle earth at this stage and arrogant is holding a bloom of Eleanor
50:29
and he's wrapped in some fair memory and the thing that Frodo notices is that the timeslit
50:36
happens to arrogant too and he's seen clothed in white young lord tall and fair and he's speaking
50:43
as if speaking to Arwen Arwen Van Emel d'Anne Mariae so this moment where time goes fluid and he
50:53
is both in the past and in the present Frodo witnesses but it also connects us to what arrogance
51:00
motive is it's not ever really thrust so strongly in our mind as it is in the film version of
51:07
this because it's a novel not a film but he is on his own quest to be the king of both Arnaud and
51:18
Gondor in order to earn Arwen's hand in marriage and so this is a moment which just nods to that
51:26
and it's notable that we started with a wintry elegiic stage saying farewell to
51:34
Gandalf visiting a stone memorialising a dead dwarven king that we end with an of golden
51:41
that's sort of silvery and white this is a golden elegiic moment a mixture of joy and grief
51:49
and Arwen says here is the heart of Elvendon on earth by the way he says it not how'd it again
51:56
film and here my heart dwells ever unless there be a light beyond the dark roads that we must
52:03
tread you and I so he's saying that that moment I had with Arwen that's where my that's that
52:10
maybe all I get unless we can come through to light after this come with me and rather than
52:17
shooting off ahead and leaving poor old Frodo to puff behind with his wound he takes Frodo's hand in
52:25
his and taking Frodo's hand in his he left the hill of Karen Amroth and came there never again
52:34
as living man I had to re-record that because actually my voice went all broke up because I find
52:40
that really beautiful I know these are fictional characters that we're talking about by this stage
52:46
we're really invested in them but also there's the sense of loss that Tolkien very much knew and
52:51
if you've had any loss of yourself the place that you never get to go back to that's associated
52:56
with those you've lost all of that is being channeled into this the friends that he lost during
53:01
the war for example the fears that he would not see them again that's a beautiful way to end
53:09
this chapter introducing us to Lothlorean and we'll now look forward to meeting our favorite
53:16
Elven Queen Galadriel in the next chapter but at the moment we will leave our heroes standing on
53:23
Karen Amroth.
53:29
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