Latest / INSPIRE STORY / Episode 4 - How to use your intellect as a tool for the good of the heart

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Episode 4 - How to use your intellect as a tool for the good of the heart · INSPIRE STORY

0:00
Speaker 1: What's the song. It's like, I don't know about is it?
0:02
I don't know about it.
0:02
Speaker 2: I don't know about you.
0:04
Speaker 3: I'm feeling twenty two. I'm not twenty two for long.
0:07
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm right now.
0:09
Speaker 2: Give me two weeks?
0:10
Speaker 1: Are you two weeks?
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Speaker 2: You're turn twenty three?
0:12
Speaker 1: Yeah? December? Well one direction for the fortune? Yeah?
0:19
Speaker 4: Ah?
0:22
Speaker 2: Shall we.
0:29
Speaker 4: Hello and welcome back to Aspire today? Have for you intelligence?
0:35
Look at these two intelligent men and meat in the
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middle sandwich between the intelligence.
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Speaker 2: Yeah you want intelligence?
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Speaker 3: Yes, I don't know what's going on.
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Speaker 1: It's definitely this.
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Speaker 4: So in order to get started on a good note,
0:50
let's begin in a prayer there the Father Son, Holy Spirit. Amen, Lord,
0:55
thanks for gathering us together. We offer up this time.
0:58
This next however, we'll be talking for your glory, and
1:02
we pray that together we may learn from each other
1:06
and that hopefully just one person out there will gain
1:09
just a little something from this and grow and faith,
1:13
hope and love.
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Speaker 3: We asked this in your.
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Speaker 4: Name, Amen, Father Son, Holy Spirits. Amen, I talk fast.
1:22
Speaker 1: I'd be good. You say you talk fast, but you
1:25
say a lot of words, so you cram a lot
1:27
of knowledge. It's like it's like you can say a
1:31
lot of words, but it's slow technically.
1:34
Speaker 4: Okay, okay, I just whenever I listened to my recordings,
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I'm just.
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Speaker 3: But it's fine.
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Speaker 2: That's yeah, all right, Hi ladies and gentlemen, welcome back,
1:46
Thank you for tuning in today. What we're talking about
1:49
is spire the eye, which stands.
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Speaker 4: For intelligent, intellectual, intellectual. Good job, I am bad at
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the admitment intellectual.
2:00
Speaker 2: So going through the normal spire UH in chronological order
2:07
as spiritual. We talked about that in the first one.
2:09
We talked about prayer, why we pray, what it is
2:12
to pray? Pe physical, we talked about do we love
2:16
our bodies, What is the benefit of exercise, why do
2:19
we do it, how does it play into a spire,
2:21
why is it important? And then how do we all
2:23
do it? And then now we are on I intellect.
2:27
So the main focus is we've been given an intellect,
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what does that mean? And how do we exercise and
2:36
grow and strengthen our intellect in our own lives. So
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I'm going to turn it over to Michael if you
2:43
could tell us in some basic sense what intellect within
2:48
the spire universe means.
2:51
Speaker 1: The inspire cinematic universe. So what it means to my man,
3:03
that's a tough question. I would say that the intellectual
3:10
part of it. For me, I think kind of as Catholics,
3:15
we know that the purpose of life is to know, love,
3:18
and serve God. I would say as human beings, it's
3:24
almost closer to finding the truth because God is the truth.
3:32
And so even if you're not Christian, even if you're
3:35
not spiritual, you should be searching for the truth, which
3:39
is God. And so, whether you're Catholic or not, if
3:44
you're doing SPIRE, the intellectual part of it should be
3:49
something that advances your search for truth, something that helps
3:54
you to come to a greater understanding of the world
3:58
around you, if you're Christian, the nature of God, the
4:04
nature of truth.
4:06
Speaker 2: Yeah, sweet, So how you like, how do you uh,
4:12
what are your What are some of the things that
4:14
you do in your spire daily plan?
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Speaker 1: I just said this a couple of times before. What
4:19
I do a lot is just listening podcasts, listening to debates. YEP.
4:24
I talk about this all the time. It's like my
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favorite thing to do, just because for so long I
4:30
kind of in my head I was like, if I
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want to grow intell Actually I have to read, and
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I don't really like reading. I know I should. I
4:40
want to get books. There's a book I really want
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to get called Is God a Moral Monster? I don't
4:45
remember who wrote Paul Copen, I think, but it's talking
4:48
about like the Old Testament and reconciling a lot of
4:52
the bad stuff that happened in the Old Testament with
4:55
loving God. Anyway, I want to get that book because
4:59
I should read.
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Speaker 3: Interesting topic.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to get that book because I should read.
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But in the past couple of months, I've kind of realized,
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like I don't have to just read. I can do
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other things, and that really pushed me to get more
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like podcasts. Yeah, like podcasts, watching YouTube videos, debates, all
5:22
that stuff. So if not every day, like five or
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six times a week, I will when I'm driving to
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school while I'm working, just turn on a video or
5:34
multiple videos about various different topics kind of just listen
5:40
to that because that's more compatible with the way that
5:43
I take in information. But it could be about arguments
5:47
for God, arguments for Catholicism, it could be just about
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the nature of life, of truth of God and all
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these things. So Basically the way I do it is
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just try and do something that advances my knowledge, advances
6:02
my intellect. But that's not really reading for me. It's
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just more watching videos, listening to podcasts and stuff.
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Speaker 2: Did you watch anything today or like, what would you
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do today?
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Speaker 1: I didn't today. I'm gonna have to admit I was
6:17
in school today, so well that I would say that
6:19
still counts because it's still you're trying to learn, You're
6:22
trying to you know whatever.
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Speaker 2: So, yeah, what were you learned about today?
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Speaker 1: Today? I had my managerial accounting class and my business
6:30
writing class, so.
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Speaker 2: We talked about, uh.
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Speaker 1: We were talking about work satisfaction or like workplace satisfaction
6:41
my business writing class, which is kind of interesting whatever.
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And then in my accounting class, we were talking about
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depreciation and all kinds of other stuff that I don't
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really I don't care about, but now I know more
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about it that before.
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Speaker 2: I don't care about it, but I know more about
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it college.
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Speaker 1: That's kind of yeah, cool, that actually sounds up a
7:04
lot of does Yeah.
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Speaker 3: What was the first question because I completely forgot it.
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Speaker 2: The first question was like, what does the intellect inspire
7:13
mean to you? And what do you think the value
7:15
of it is, and then how do you what's your
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pathway towards your towards that.
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Speaker 4: So the intellect inspired that. There's so much stuff about
7:25
that because a lot of people look at intellect and
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they think smart in the ways of the world, in
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the ways of science, or just knowing a bunch of things.
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Speaker 3: But there's a lot of variation there.
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Speaker 4: And I was talking with the priest at wash you
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father Fallon, and he's talks about he's been talking about
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in a class like setting thing a lot about the soul.
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And the intellect is an aspect of our soul. It
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is not something that lies within solely our body. So
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there is still the bodily aspect of like we use
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our mind in a way through the intellect, but the
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intellect as itself is something beyond. And so intellect to
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me is our way of truly understanding and appreciating who
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we are as we are as body and soul, who
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we are as God's children, and just the intellect of
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knowing better.
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Speaker 3: Where we are and where we are going.
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Speaker 4: I think, is what it is to me in a
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more philosophical sense, though in a more personal sense, intellectual
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falls into the idea of you know, just this inner mind,
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this inner thought, the ability to think. So I love
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visualizing things in my head. I'm a visual person in
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that sense.
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Speaker 3: You know.
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Speaker 4: I can take a three D object and rotated around.
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I'm in the sciences, So this is something I do
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a lot or even to just like visualize, not like
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as if I was seeing it, but visualize the entirety
9:12
of a scene playing out. Like, for instance, if I
9:15
was at one point thinking about this podcast, thinking about
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a future podcast we might do. I might visualize us
9:21
sitting here, but then I might also visualize how we
9:25
interact and talk throughout that. And so to me, intellect
9:29
is just the way we interact with the world, and
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it connects with our body in that way, because the
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body is how we touch and physically interact with the world,
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but the intellect is how we understand the world.
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Speaker 3: That makes no sense, but I said it.
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Speaker 1: It does. Hear what you're saying.
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Speaker 2: So then how do you in your life, Like, what
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are some of the ways that you exercise your intellect
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every day, whether you go out of your way to
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do it or if it's just you in your day
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to day stuff. What do you consider aspire completion?
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Speaker 4: Yeah, so you were saying a lot of stuff about reading,
10:04
and I do a lot of reading. Over the years,
10:07
I've read a ton of different books, predominantly fantasy books,
10:12
reading fiction, and things that aren't directly spiritual and directly
10:15
related to faith. It's still ways of increasing your intellect
10:19
and understanding and different avenues. I do school stuff, but
10:25
I don't know how much that advances my intellect. Most
10:27
of the time, I don't even understand what's going on.
10:30
It's the homework that does it, not the classes.
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Speaker 1: So I don't know.
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Speaker 3: I don't know why I go to class, but.
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Speaker 1: College attendance, the worst classes always are the most strict
10:41
of attendants. That's my experience.
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Speaker 4: But in terms of just advancing intellect, I really really
10:49
enjoy thinking about stuff, you know. It's the days in
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which I don't, you know, just think about something, whether
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or not it's something big and important or just a
11:01
minor issue like something about grass. I don't know how
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to explain how my mind thinks about stuff, but I
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just love thinking about things. So when I bike to campus,
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I might think through scenarios or I might, you know,
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contemplate on some inner aspect of my life. And another
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way that I advanced intellect is I do try to
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do some spiritual reading every day. I've the daily mass readings.
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Great thing. You can get an eyebe every app and
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it's just right there and you can read it in
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a couple of minutes, you could think about it in
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a couple of minutes more, and you can understand it
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in a couple of centuries.
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Speaker 1: It's pretty good. Yeah.
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Speaker 3: And then other books.
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Speaker 4: I've bought a lot of philosophy theology books recently and
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I just want to get through them. So that's how
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I would go into advancing my intellect. I'm much more
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on the reading side of things, though I do listen
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to podcasts, but into is not just reading things. It's
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so much more than just words.
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Speaker 2: Interesting.
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Speaker 1: Yep.
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Speaker 2: I think I've got a lot in common with that,
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especially you, Michael. Like I used to read a lot
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more when I had more patience and like a desire
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to read. It was a lot of fiction books, though,
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like the Percy Jackson series it was my thing. I
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love those books, but it was like much more. I
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started because I grew up and my dad was always
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very much teaching theology or talking about theology and stuff
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like that. But I never really cared that much about it.
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I more of just absorbed whatever he would tell me
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or whatever I would see. But then it was really
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when I started getting to the point where I wondered
12:45
who I was, and I started asking the big questions,
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and I started asking what's going on really? And where's truth?
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And what are we supposed to be doing while we're here?
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And then basically how did I How have I ended
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up where I'm at and where am I going? Was
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my big question. So then that's what really caused me
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to want to find answers. And I didn't like reading
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books and it feels like there's too many, like there's
13:09
way too big of a hill to climb and a
13:11
huge commitment and it's like bro, I grew up in
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gen Z, I like TikTok and YouTube, and that's what
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applies to my sense of attentions van. So my big
13:21
thing was I started listening to Jordan Peterson, and that
13:24
was really my first intro into like intellectual thinking, which
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was being able to articulate your ideas and and and that's.
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Speaker 1: A first step.
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Speaker 2: It was well, it was like I mean, it was
13:37
like there was other things that kind of led into it,
13:39
but it really that's where I was like, I feel
13:42
like I found some footing because the way that he
13:44
would explain things, it wasn't it wasn't words that I
13:48
had always heard before, kind of like well, God loves
13:50
you and like, you know, you need to do the
13:52
right thing. But it was like clean your room, here's why,
13:56
here's some science, here's some facts. Let's talk about the
13:59
philosophies that different influences that have gone into this truth,
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and this truth, here's how it compares here and here.
14:05
And it was like all getting into those details about
14:07
things was just super refreshing because it felt like, I
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think my personality is if I don't understand something, I've
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got like a sense of anxiety all the time. And
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so it's I really enjoy feeling like I've got to
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grasp on something and feeling like I can, like even
14:26
if I can't say it or articulate it, I can
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sort of like you said, visualize it, kind of get
14:31
it in my mind to where it's not this huge,
14:33
looming something. It feels more like if I can name
14:36
what it is, then I've got some control over it.
14:40
So I really like that. And but the medium was
14:44
always podcast because that was like I could listen to those.
14:48
At this job that I'm at, I'm blessed enough to
14:51
be able to listen to podcasts as I work, and
14:53
so I would just listen to those all day. And
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it was really annoying and really hard at first because
14:59
it felt like I was so far behind where I
15:02
wanted to be, because it was like, you know, kind
15:04
of taking that step into where does my what do
15:07
I think? And how do I view things? And answering
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those questions and looking for answers. It's such a huge
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step to try to grasp what's going on, how to
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explain it, how to understand it, and how to articulate it.
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And then so it was really hard, but it was
15:22
very rewarding to have that, to have someone that I
15:25
could listen to basically all the time. And then I
15:29
went through that process, and then I started watching YouTube
15:31
videos and learning things on my own and trying to
15:34
teach myself stuff that I wanted to know, mainly around
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like philosophy and all that stuff, just because it interests
15:40
me more. And then I've sort of sort of read books,
15:45
but it really is like audio is sort of the
15:47
main figure oute that I like to hear stuff, so
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It's been really important for me to help get a
15:54
grip on who I am and what my identity is
15:57
and where I stand in the world and what I
15:58
believe because I think the people the more people more
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often I talk to people that really haven't gone through that,
16:08
they kind of just accept whatever the narrative is. And
16:11
I think, especially today, it's so important to self investigate
16:17
and to find answers for yourself from good sources. Don't
16:22
make up your own answers. I don't think is the move,
16:24
but I mean to like find your own answers whatever
16:27
faith you're in, whatever religion. There's going to be so
16:30
much misinformation out there, so much indoctrination, and what do
16:35
you call that when they've got agendas, so many things
16:37
that people are pushing that it's not it's to sell
16:41
you something, it's to get you underneath whatever they want
16:45
you to be underneath, whether that be marketers, advertisers, politicians,
16:50
business owners, whatever it's going to be. It's that people
16:52
will benefit from your sheepish following and so and your
16:57
devotion of your energy to them. So I think if
17:00
the mind, if the body is made to live and move,
17:04
and the heart is made to love, the mind is
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made for truth, and so I think that searching for
17:10
truth in whatever it is that you're doing, whether it's
17:12
you're looking into like medicine or health or workouts, or
17:18
philosophy or religions or whatever it is, the mind is
17:21
made to find truth. And so the intellect is super
17:24
important to not to use. It's super important to use
17:33
as a tool for growing your person and who you are.
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So the ways that I do it really every day
17:39
is like listening to podcasts and I'll kind of go
17:42
on a stint of if there's a topic that interests me,
17:44
I will stay on that course for a while until
17:47
I get bored of it, and if it's not really applicable,
17:50
then I'll kind of go to what does pique my interests,
17:53
And so I stay on a lot of like more theology,
17:56
theology of the body, like psychology sort of tracks, and
18:01
so I listened to a lot of that stuff. But
18:04
I also really like listening to Joe Rogan or like
18:06
Andrew Huberman, Chris Williamson, those kind of guys that are
18:09
very much in like the podcast Realm, who just have
18:11
a lot of access to people that know a lot
18:14
about things and are very proficient in their areas. So
18:16
I try to tune into that, and then I try
18:19
to read, like some pages of a book I'm read.
18:22
I'm trying to read uh, JP two's Love and Responsibility.
18:26
Speaker 3: I should get that book.
18:27
Speaker 2: I've heard a lot of good things about it, and
18:29
that seems to be like one of his staples, so.
18:32
Speaker 3: I've definitely had a lot of good things about it.
18:34
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's uh, I'm like, I think thirty pages
18:38
in Yeah, it's pretty good.
18:41
Speaker 1: So what how long is it? Like?
18:43
Speaker 2: Three hundred pages?
18:44
Speaker 1: Yeah?
18:44
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a decent I'm trying, especially once you get
18:49
past the freston pages, which is index the tab of CONC.
18:53
Speaker 2: I did skip some of that.
18:57
Speaker 1: Experience.
18:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, but there's no no other way I'm going to
19:00
read it. So this is the best that he's going
19:02
to get.
19:03
Speaker 3: Just sometimes you just got to pull the band aid
19:05
and just do the thing.
19:06
Speaker 2: Yep, just jump into it. So that is the way
19:08
that I have been trying to exercise my intellect. And
19:12
then something cool that we had talked about before was
19:17
Andrew Huberman said that some people might know who he is,
19:20
but he's just a really popular science guy right now,
19:24
And there was a clip of him talking about that
19:27
if you read a lot of books from good leaders
19:30
and from people that you want to be like, you'll
19:33
begin to see the routines in the ways that they
19:36
will respond to certain situations or in certain environments. And
19:40
then you'll unconsciously or you'll subconsciously, start acting those things out,
19:45
because in a way, you're learning how to imitate their behavior,
19:48
and you'll start noticing that about yourself without even really
19:51
trying to do it. And so I really do believe
19:54
that because I think that you are what you eat.
19:58
I think that applies to food and to information, and
20:01
to vibe and to emotion. And so if you are
20:06
eating things of value, and you are filling your mind
20:09
with things that are true and good and pure and beautiful,
20:12
you're going to become that. And if you don't like you,
20:16
you can just look around. You are what you eat.
20:18
So whatever you're consuming, whether it be through your mind
20:21
or through your mouth, you will become that. And that
20:23
will emanate from you from like the energy of your
20:26
person and your behaviors and the things you say, the
20:28
ways you think. And so I try to read and
20:32
learn about Jesus as much as I can, to try
20:36
and be able to, you know, have some good stuff,
20:38
some good fruit coming out, instead of just kind of
20:40
this empty, empty knowledge and information that that's just to
20:45
boost my own ego. So I try to have a
20:47
focus of it's directed towards understanding my person and my
20:50
identity and how to love better instead of just serving
20:53
my own intellectual faculties.
20:56
Speaker 4: So on that you are what you eat. I think
21:00
that's actually just such a good thing to think about,
21:03
because you are what you consume, and so much with
21:08
modern media and all of this stuff, there's a lot
21:10
of bad stuff in the world, and it's very easy
21:13
to get consumed into the bad things of the world,
21:16
like all the evils going on in the different countries,
21:19
or the different wars going on, or this bad or
21:22
that bad or how this great leader did this horrible thing,
21:26
or how you know the people in the Catholic Church
21:28
aren't you know, all saints And there's all of these
21:31
different things going on, and it's easy to get consumed
21:34
into that. And to some aspects, it's good to know
21:36
the happenings of this world, but if that makes up
21:39
a significant portion of what you consume, then that just
21:43
makes you all focused on the depressing aspects of life,
21:48
but there is so much good. In fact, there's probably
21:52
far more good things in this world than things that
21:56
are going bad, and so we should if we spend
22:00
a lot of time on the bad things, you know,
22:03
consuming things, maybe listen to podcasts where talking smack about
22:06
this person to that person, because this person's really dumb.
22:08
Speaker 3: It doesn't understand that what we need to.
22:10
Speaker 4: Have so much more on the good aspects of life,
22:14
looking at the good of people, and if we consume
22:18
the goods of the world, then we'll do a lot better.
22:23
Speaker 1: Yeah.
22:23
Speaker 2: Yeah, because it is a big thing nowadays. If you
22:26
go on like your Instagram search feed or if you're
22:30
on YouTube shorts, it's like there's so many things to consume.
22:34
But it's just like fast food. It's just empty and
22:36
taste good in the moment, and then you're like there's
22:38
no sustenance and you're not filled up, and you don't
22:41
leave feeling happy. I mean, well, you feel leaven, you
22:43
leave feeling happy, but it's like it's not a happiness
22:46
that lasts. Some fast food restaurants are an exception. Shout
22:50
out to Canes. I always feeling happy and so.
23:02
Speaker 3: I don't love the question.
23:05
Speaker 2: Oh it's not charging, I would.
23:07
Speaker 3: Yeah it in definitely be right back.
23:12
Speaker 2: Uh so so what was I said?
23:15
Speaker 1: I would suck if it wasn't important. You're good.
23:22
Speaker 2: So we're still on the you are what you eat. Yeah,
23:24
there's like because there's bad, Like there's bad as in
23:27
negative things that if you fill your mind with what
23:30
the news is basically telling you like this, like it's
23:33
just violence and whatever is going to be the most
23:37
shocking in a sense that's bad. And then also just
23:40
the sort of mindless things. It's like that we consume.
23:45
You just begin to emanate that and you can tell
23:48
like tablet kids, like you know, tablet kids nowadays, it's
23:51
like you are not a kid that plays outside, runs around,
23:55
has an imagination, is creative, is tough, is respectful. You're
23:58
like a newly weird, soft, kind of weird smelling, weird
24:08
looking kid that doesn't really understand interaction well and social cues.
24:12
And you're like all you really know is like a
24:15
digital brain tickle and that's it. And it's like you're
24:22
just losing so much, like you're like we're losing our
24:25
own humanity from what we're consuming, because what we consume,
24:28
it's like it's not even it doesn't have any sustenance anymore.
24:34
Speaker 1: What do you get? Okay, I feel like personally our
24:39
generation and there are obviously exceptions, but as a whole,
24:44
I feel like our generation is just a generation that
24:47
has not been taught how to think.
24:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, we've been told what to know though, Yeah, you we.
24:54
Speaker 1: Know how to know. We just know things.
24:57
Speaker 4: We can know everything there is to know about everything
25:00
anyone ever knows because that's called Google.
25:03
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a different Maybe that's the difference between knowledge
25:07
and understanding. That's what we were talking about earlier.
25:10
Speaker 4: We're trying to yeah, separate because like, we can know
25:12
so much stuff through Google. We have instant access to
25:15
all of the world's knowledge. Some of it may be
25:18
a little too complicated to actually just immediately Google and
25:21
find the answer, but there is just there is not
25:24
a lack of knowledge out there. There's not a lack
25:27
of pathways of finding out what we want to know.
25:30
The lack is somewhat within us. As you were saying,
25:33
it's just like we need to know how to think,
25:36
to be able to process what we can read, to
25:39
be able to when we google something, to critically analyze
25:43
it and be like, yeah, that makes sense or that
25:46
does not make sense, because sometimes you can google things
25:49
and it will give you wrong answers. I've learned this
25:52
a lot in the sciences because at some point, when
25:55
you get far enough along in the sciences, Google needs
26:00
to catch up to what's, you know, the the newest learnings,
26:06
because the people putting stuff up on Wikipedia are not
26:11
necessarily the same people doing the research to actually understand it,
26:15
and so there could be a lot of misunderstandings out there.
26:19
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so kind of on that. So you're talking
26:23
about reading. What point it? Oh? Yeah, thank you. So
26:28
you're you're talking about reading, We're talking about listening to podcasts.
26:31
For you guys, personally, how do you think, like, how
26:34
do you go about taking in the information and then
26:40
differentiating between what is good and what is bad Because
26:44
you can look at the fruit obviously, but there's so
26:48
many podcasts. You can't just listen to podcasts and accept
26:51
everything that is said in the podcast. So how do
26:54
you personally differentiate between what is beneficial for you to
26:59
accept and introduced into your life and what is bad
27:04
or what will have a negative impact on life?
27:06
Speaker 2: What to accept this true?
27:09
Speaker 1: I mean, essentially, what you accept is true, because anything
27:12
that's not truth or not true will end up having
27:16
a negative impact. But in our modern society, it's so
27:22
often it's so hard to tell what actually is true
27:26
because everybody has an opinion, and everybody's opinion is at
27:30
least slightly different. So how do you personally go about
27:33
differentiating between what is true and what is false.
27:38
Speaker 4: We have a great gift in us that God has
27:42
given us. He has given us our mind, our body,
27:47
and through this we can actually use what God has
27:50
given us to understand whether or not what we're learning
27:55
is good or bad. These aspects of gut feeling, which
27:58
you can't always trust. You got feeling, But if your
28:00
God feelings tells you this doesn't feel right, this doesn't
28:04
hit right me.
28:05
Speaker 3: Then you can look deeper into that.
28:06
Speaker 4: If you got feelings like, yeah, that makes sense and
28:08
it works with everything that I've learned about life and
28:11
how things work and the teachings of the church or whatnot,
28:15
it makes sense, and I have no reason to disagree
28:17
with what this person said on that matter.
28:19
Speaker 3: You don't need to go further into that.
28:21
Speaker 4: But when your guts like something feels off about how
28:24
this person said that thing, then that that is a
28:27
sign that you could look deep into it. It's not
28:29
saying that that's a bad thing, because we obviously can't
28:31
have infinite knowledge. But God has given us this gift
28:36
of our conscience. Which conscience is not just that which
28:40
is can differentiate good from bad. You know, that is
28:43
your conscience of the you know, the devil and the
28:45
angel on your shoulders, but conscience in the sense of
28:48
we are able to think and through that, you know,
28:53
we should not just blindly accept everything that we're told.
28:58
We need to use our faculty of reason and our
29:01
faculties of understanding to be able to differentiate the good
29:06
from the bad, to differentiate the good from the better.
29:11
And yeah, so that's how I would answer that part.
29:16
Speaker 1: I think.
29:19
Speaker 2: I think that the way that I look at it
29:21
is that information in itself is morally neutral, but it
29:25
becomes a moral good or bad in its application and
29:28
then the consequences on human life. So if I am
29:33
I first would need some basis, if I'm engaging with information,
29:38
I would need some basis of a greater a greater
29:43
wisdom and a greater knowledge to guide and inform my
29:49
discernment between good or bad information. So having parents that
29:56
have an awareness of let's say, like the basic rules,
29:58
the Ten commandments. If you've got like the church who
30:01
spent years discerning things, they can sort of help guide
30:05
you in the beginning the formation of your own moral
30:08
conscience and then how to discern between what's good and bad,
30:11
and so having that formation, which is based on a
30:16
greater a natural moral law, in a sense is sort
30:20
of has to be ingrained in you and has to
30:23
be learned. But I think to a certain extent is
30:25
ingrained in you in your intuition and in your gut.
30:28
Speaker 1: And I think.
30:31
Speaker 2: It's better to always assume that there's something you don't
30:34
fully understand or fully know, or you don't have the best,
30:37
the widest picture of it. So it's always kind of
30:40
approaching it with humility. That way, you never get really
30:42
trapped and like, oh, this is the truth, this is everything.
30:45
Because if you're going through life and you're looking for
30:48
a sense of emotional security and you find that in
30:51
an idea and in an intellectual pursuit, then you're going
30:55
to become trapped in that and it's an emotional attachment
30:57
when really, if you're comparing ideas, it's supposed to be
31:00
an intellectual almost almost like a not a war, but
31:06
you're comparing two ideas and you're you're trying to discern
31:10
which one, in its application is more pointed toward the
31:14
towards the flourishing of human life. And so then as
31:18
you go through life, I feel like you get a
31:21
better sense of where those different pathways lead to, and
31:24
you can kind of tell something on its face where
31:27
it's going to go, and I think your gut knows
31:29
that before your mind knows that. So it's kind of
31:31
a combination of your logical comparison between two ideas or beliefs,
31:38
and then an emotional awareness of how of the consequences
31:42
of those things. So then when I'm listening to a podcast,
31:45
let's say, from someone who might not be the most
31:50
morally educated, but is very scientifically educated, then I can
31:55
understand that and see them for where they are because
31:57
of an understanding that we are all human being on
32:00
this earth, doing different things, in different journeys, with different battles.
32:04
So I can add that into my discernment of how
32:07
to take what they say. Do I take that as
32:10
this is now the highest truth? Or do I remember
32:13
that God in my relationship with Jesus is the highest truth,
32:16
and He is the highest truth, and all of these
32:18
things are some aspect of that. If it is true,
32:21
and if there is an objective reality to it, and
32:24
so I can still take that, but it doesn't mean
32:26
I also commune with the moral implications of whatever idea
32:34
it is. So I think a way I try to
32:37
look at it is to know something is in a sense,
32:40
to commune with it, kind of like Adam knew his wife.
32:43
So when you know something, it's a part of you
32:46
and you take it into yourself, and it's like you
32:48
are what you eat. So you want to know truth
32:52
and you want to get rid of lies, and so
32:56
as you mature and as you grow in that journey,
32:59
I feel like you it starts to become kind of
33:01
like what you're saying, something where it's it's a process
33:06
that can happen on its own, but it'll stop if
33:09
you just accept something as like an idol and then
33:12
you hold that up and say, this is unquestionable, this
33:15
is you know how it needs to be blah blah
33:18
blah blah blah.
33:18
Speaker 1: So, yeah, that's so interesting that you bring that up,
33:21
because that's one of the things that I've been really
33:23
fascinated with lately. It's like the idea of somebody becoming
33:28
so fixated on something that they think is true that
33:31
they don't they're not able to really accept any kinds
33:35
of truth from anything else.
33:37
Speaker 2: Because it's like an affront to their identity.
33:39
Speaker 1: Yeah. So like the best examples of this, And I
33:45
don't know how much we want to get into like
33:47
arguments and stuff. But Richard Dawkins and what's the other
33:52
guy's name, Matt Dillt Hunt, you, I don't know if
33:55
you know who they are. Richard Dawkins. I'm sure you
33:57
know who they are. It's just because I listened to
33:59
the podcasts, I watched the debates. I just the other
34:02
one is, oh gosh, I don't know. Richard Dawkins and
34:07
Matt deal Hunt here the two that stick out in
34:08
my mind the most though, and I especially atheists. Yeah, okay,
34:14
so do you not know who Richard Dawkins.
34:16
Speaker 2: I know who Richard.
34:18
Speaker 3: He's talk about this other guy.
34:20
Speaker 1: They are both atheists, but they have like a lot
34:22
of similar beliefs. And I think it was Richard Dawkins
34:27
that said something to the effect of even if God
34:34
appeared to him, and then wrote in the clouds, I
34:38
am God, believe in me. And he was standing in
34:42
front of Richard Dawkins, you know, glowing, you know, twenty
34:47
feet tall, making eye contact with him, and he said
34:50
I am God. He wouldn't sooner say that that was
34:57
him hallucinating than at that he had had a vision
35:02
of God. Because so many people, so of the atheists specifically,
35:08
have this weird kind of predisposition against the miraculous. That
35:16
doesn't mean that you should just accept like somebody says,
35:21
this miracle happened, you should just be like, oh, miracles happen,
35:24
that probably happened. But instead of that position, they're taking
35:28
the position that miracles never happen and nothing spiritual ever happens.
35:33
And so if there is any truth to those things,
35:36
they're closed off from it completely because they've decided that
35:42
they are not going to accept it, regardless of what
35:45
information presents itself. I think that's so interesting.
35:51
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I think it goes both ways too, especially
35:53
to people that are religious, because it's like this, it's
35:58
like you, it's like it's no longer an intellectual thing.
36:01
It becomes part of your identity almost too much. It's
36:04
like you connect your emotions and your heart and your
36:07
sense of self to it. And so then if anyone
36:10
comes with like an alternative viewpoint, it's like a direct
36:15
attack on your person.
36:17
Speaker 1: And so.
36:19
Speaker 2: I think that's what's so important about always growing intellectually,
36:23
which is really to investigate things around you and to
36:26
learn more and to understand more on the sense of
36:29
understanding who you are and your own ideas, but also
36:33
just to have become a more well rounded person. It's
36:36
kind of like never getting off the couch or never exercising,
36:41
you know, it's like you you become more of who
36:45
you are and you become to know yourself more if
36:47
you grow intellectually. But you can so easily become complacent
36:52
in that without realizing the value of truth. I feel
36:56
like we don't we don't value truth because we're entertained.
37:05
Speaker 1: Expand on that a little bit.
37:11
Speaker 4: So are you saying that we don't value truth? So
37:14
the reason why we don't value truth is because we're
37:17
entertained and we thus don't really seek it out. That
37:21
it's almost a distraction and.
37:23
Speaker 2: We're distracted from the hunger in our deepest selves. And
37:29
so the reason that we have a spire is to
37:34
help wake us up and reshape our minds to be
37:37
aimed towards a seeking out of where that hunger will
37:40
find its true fulfillment. And so I guess what I'm
37:45
trying to do is I'm trying to think, how would
37:47
I talk to myself if I was fifteen or whatever
37:51
years old, when I don't care about growing intellectually, and
37:54
when I don't like reading books that are complicated, when
37:56
I'd rather watch a movie, when I'd rather do whatever
37:59
it is that's entertaining. It's because I've got an ache
38:04
in my soul, but I'm filling it up with things
38:07
that are in the moment stimulating and pleasurable, but ultimately
38:12
empty and leave me empty. So it's like things will
38:15
awaken my hunger but then never leave me satisfied. But
38:18
I didn't really understand that the actual exercising of these
38:22
different gifts that we have will give us a deeper
38:27
understanding of those parts in our heart that have been
38:30
chasing things this whole time. I don't really know where
38:36
my point was apart from there's so many things in
38:39
my life that because I didn't know the truth, because
38:44
I didn't understand let's say, who I was or who
38:47
God was, or what the gospels really meant, or why
38:50
this was set up this way, or why we have
38:52
this tradition or why we have this ritual because I
38:55
didn't know those things, because I didn't know why I
38:58
shouldn't watch this video or I shouldn't do this thing
39:01
with this person, or I shouldn't smoke this whatever, because
39:05
I didn't really know. And it's like I was told like, hey,
39:08
don't do this, but I didn't know why, and I
39:12
didn't know what the consequences were and what the consequences meant.
39:15
I didn't know what it meant to love. I didn't
39:17
know what this was. And there were so many things
39:19
that had I known, had I heard the truth, literally,
39:24
I mean, as cliche as it is, the truth would
39:26
set me free. And so it's like that is there
39:30
that is so true because there's so many things I
39:32
was so stuck in and it's like I was trapped
39:35
and completely blind. But it's like every time I'm listening
39:38
to a podcast and I hear something true, it's like boom,
39:41
my mind is blown open. It's like I had no idea.
39:44
It's like the idea it's like every desire in your
39:47
heart that has led you to sin is a good desire,
39:49
and you desire something good, but you just stopped and
39:53
you're never going to be satisfied. But you just don't
39:55
trust that the thing, that the other thing will satisfy it.
39:58
So then you just have an issue with trust. It's
40:00
like I had no idea, but like that is such
40:03
a freeing thing, and I feel like there's so much
40:06
that we don't even we can't even comprehend how free
40:10
and beautiful life can be and how real it can
40:13
be because we're so caught up in this facade of
40:16
whatever is presented to me. I accept. Like in the
40:18
Truman show, this guy, I don't know if you guys
40:20
have ever seen that, but he says people will accept
40:23
what's presented to them, and so we accept what is
40:26
presented to us by advertisers, by entertainment, by people around us,
40:30
by sin itself, and by lust and from all of this,
40:33
and we accept that and then we're enslaved to it.
40:37
And the mind is one of the greatest ways to
40:39
actually escape from that prison. You know. It's like this
40:43
is my last boy. Sorry, I kind of get this.
40:46
So the lady that was stuck in Korea and North
40:49
Korea and escaped. Naomi Park I think it's her name.
40:53
She's been on Joe Rogan and Jordan Peterson. She talks
40:56
about how when she got to London or wherever she
40:58
went to go to school, she just read books all
41:01
day long because she had no exposure to information, to
41:06
knowledge to what's going on, and she just absorbed it.
41:09
She wouldn't even eat, or she would maybe take it.
41:12
I'm pretty sure she said, I wouldn't even eat all day.
41:14
I would not get up. I would just sit there
41:16
and read. And that's a person who was came from
41:19
having nothing. But now we take information for granted, and
41:22
there's so much of it. It's almost like we're we're
41:25
not lost because we don't see anything, but we're lost
41:27
because we see too much. And it's like to sift
41:31
through that is so massively important because if we don't,
41:34
we're missing the number one thing, which is who are you?
41:38
And who is God? And like that is massively important,
41:43
but we just don't even we are not. The culture
41:47
does not guide us in that. It just says, here's
41:51
a mic chicken, and like, be satisfied. That's the best
41:54
you'll get, and like you like it.
41:58
Speaker 4: I think a good analogy to this eight. And you know,
42:01
this being satisfied or entertained or distracted, it is picture
42:05
you can see this room in the video, So picture
42:08
this coffee table gone, and there's a.
42:10
Speaker 3: Massive hole in the floor.
42:12
Speaker 4: And then I put this rug over top of the hole,
42:15
and I'm just sitting here on the couch and it
42:17
looks no different to me. But as soon as I
42:20
try to walk across that, I'll realize that there is
42:23
no sustenance there. So if we take this ache in
42:28
our hearts, this massive gaping hole in who we are,
42:31
and we just cover it up with something such that
42:35
when we're just sitting down not really doing anything, then
42:37
we don't notice it. The fact that we don't notice
42:41
it by sitting down on this couch. It's hidden from
42:44
our sights, but there's still that lack there. And as
42:48
soon as we try to do something like as soon
42:50
as we get up to you know, go to the
42:52
bathroom and go do something else, like, we'll notice that
42:54
there is this ache, this missing longing. And I think
42:58
that yah actually goes into a lot of why depression
43:02
is such a prevalent issue in modern societies, because we
43:06
as humans have a natural ache and people have different
43:10
understandings of what should fill it. But what we do
43:14
in this modern culture is we take this ache and
43:16
we just put a thin film of entertainment above it
43:19
such that we don't notice that ache when we're entertained.
43:22
Speaker 2: Because we don't even give ourselves time to.
43:24
Speaker 4: We don't give ourselves time to, but we will at
43:28
some point have to get up from the couch and
43:31
go to the bathroom and then notice that there's this
43:33
massive gaping hole, and then that will crush us because
43:38
we don't know what to do with that, because if
43:39
we're just sitting here, there's a carpet. There, there's a carpet,
43:42
and now there's a whole, I don't know what to do.
43:47
Speaker 1: Something that you said a minute ago, and this all
43:50
ties together, was you said something about being enslaved. And
43:57
I don't remember where I heard this, But my favorite
44:01
thing to think about when it comes to this is
44:04
freedom is not the ability to do as you will.
44:08
It's the ability to do as you ought. And again,
44:15
I don't mean to keep on harping on poor Richard
44:18
Dawkins and Sam Harris and all those atheists and stuff,
44:21
but there when you listen to them talk about the
44:26
idea of a higher truth or an objective truth, or
44:32
a god or a higher power, where it's something outside
44:37
of them and outside of their ability to just say
44:40
this is you know, this is what I believe, this
44:42
is this is the truth because this is what I
44:44
believe without even thinking that there could be a truth
44:46
outside of that. When you listen to them talk so often,
44:52
you hear kind of this idea of a higher truth
44:57
that is outside of my will and outside of my
44:59
anti is going to enslave me, when in reality it's
45:04
the complete opposite. Because and you guys both said something
45:08
about this where we're so like, what's the word and
45:14
I'm looking for There's so much around us in terms
45:18
of information, in terms of content and entertainment, and we
45:22
think that being free is having the ability to go
45:27
do whatever we want, or watch whatever we want, or
45:29
listen to whatever we want, or say whatever we want.
45:33
But I mean, think about the people who do that.
45:36
Think about the people who reject any kind of higher
45:39
purpose or any kind of higher truth than everything is subjective.
45:43
They're not usually the happiest people in the world. Because
45:46
when you have that freedom, it's kind of an artificial
45:50
freedom because you think that you're you're just choosing things.
45:54
You're not choosing the truth, but you're choosing things to
45:57
cover up the whole. You're choosing things to artificially and
46:01
temporarily fill the void in your soul because you think
46:07
that choosing what you want is like the ultimate way
46:12
to do that, when in reality, you can't really fill
46:16
that hole unless there is a higher truth, unless there
46:20
is a higher purpose. You know.
46:21
Speaker 2: That's super interesting. So that plays into what Matt Walsh
46:24
was talking about where he goes, so we all have
46:26
we're born with these this ache in our heart. So
46:28
if you don't think that you have an ache in
46:29
your heart, try to sit still for ten minutes without moving.
46:31
There is something they're telling you to get up, move,
46:33
do something, breathe, look at something, eat something, whatever it is.
46:38
And so what what what Matt Walsh was talking about
46:41
is that we have desires in our hearts and because
46:44
of original sin, those desires are are twisted up so
46:49
they're headed in the wrong direction. They're selfishly aimed. So
46:52
if you think about the Jordan Peterson uses this all
46:54
the time. A two year old when it when it
46:57
will do whatever it wants and it expects the world
46:59
to bend around it. So it throws a temper tantrument,
47:02
wants this. It's hungry. Now, it's going to cry for this.
47:04
It gets angry. And so but as we grow up,
47:08
we discipline our desires and then we subject them under
47:14
higher values. And so it takes a certain discipline. So
47:18
you discipline yourself to not just be loud and throw
47:20
attenchment if you don't get your way, But it's so
47:21
that you stay in your friend group and you still
47:23
have friends, so that value is higher. And so you've
47:26
subjected your immediate passion, your fallen nature passions to want
47:32
whatever you want right in the moment, whatever your whims
47:35
decide to this higher value of let's say, the common
47:39
good of being in a relationship with people that see
47:41
you and talk to you and you get along with them,
47:43
so you learn those that's being becoming socialized. And so,
47:47
like you said, we think that getting whatever we want
47:50
right in the moment will make us happy. And that
47:53
thing that we want right in the moment, really that's
47:55
a desire that has not been purified. So it's a
47:58
desire that has not been changed, an appetite that hasn't
48:01
been matured, where it's like we just want our immediate
48:04
fallen nature self gratification, follow the women of the moment.
48:08
Where am I attracted to? Now where's this energy most
48:11
easily released? And so it's like this path of least resistance,
48:16
but it's the path of an immature, fallen natured person.
48:21
And so to grow out of that, you have to
48:24
learn to discipline those desires and those appetites and change
48:29
their course. Basically, to change the course of that energy
48:35
that comes up when you have a desire for something.
48:38
And so it's not to just unbridled respond to the
48:44
emotion of the moment, but it's to discipline your emotions
48:46
to respond in good ways so that when that moment
48:49
of desire and passion comes, it's like a ball of
48:52
energy and you learn that it's now subjugated to under
48:56
a higher value, which is whatever it may be, but
48:59
it can a you there instead of just being poured
49:02
out and released wherever you are all over the ground.
49:05
It's like a directed thing.
49:07
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, so I think that that kind of leads
49:11
into this idea. So father Mike Schmidts at Seek last year,
49:16
maybe you remember this in his talk, he said, and
49:23
what I want to get at with this is the
49:25
importance of an intellectual kind of faith. He said. Faith
49:31
is holding to what your intellect has accepted as true
49:35
despite your changing emotions. And I think that that is
49:39
exactly kind of what you're getting at because that's accepting
49:43
that there is the higher good that you have to
49:47
kind of subject your passions to. Yeah, so you can't
49:51
just you're like emotions in in that term. So if
49:55
you've already used and again, this is why I think
49:58
having an intellectual faith is so so so important because
50:03
emotional faith where you kind of are just like, you know,
50:06
I feel all the good. It's like I feel good
50:09
and the love of God and whatever, And you feel
50:12
good in the moment, But what happens when you're confronted
50:17
with something.
50:18
Speaker 2: That poses that like tragedy.
50:20
Speaker 1: Yeah, if something terrible happens, if you lose a family member,
50:23
if you're in a car accident.
50:25
Speaker 2: That's when you fall through the rug exactly.
50:28
Speaker 1: So if you're trying to fill that void with something
50:31
that you just want, if you're just I want X,
50:35
y Z, whatever, those things are not going to be
50:38
able to support you when those things happen. So if you,
50:46
let's say you reject the idea that there's any kind
50:48
of higher truth in your entire life. You think this
50:52
is just me and it's what I want to do,
50:55
and you go and you know, live a worldly life
51:00
with no base in any kind of higher truth, Like
51:06
what's gonna happen to you? This is even applicable for
51:10
Christians because if you just live your entire life and
51:14
it's all based on emotions and it's all based on
51:17
you know, whims and whatever, what's gonna happen when that
51:22
tragedy hits. Are you going to hold to what you believe?
51:27
Or are you gonna flip flop, You're gonna fall away,
51:30
or are you gonna go to something else? Because that's
51:32
all you've ever done is just go to the next
51:34
best thing that you think is gonna fill that hole.
51:37
And I'm gonna keep on saying it intellectual faith because
51:41
if you don't have that grounding in your intellect and
51:46
you don't understand things and you don't truly believe things,
51:50
you're not going to have any kind of base. If
51:53
you get shaken, if life pushes you, you're just gonna
51:56
fall or you're just gonna fall into the hole on
51:58
the floor instead of being able to use that intellectual
52:02
base to fill up the whole so that you have
52:06
something to fall on.
52:08
Speaker 4: I have a couple of things to say, because there's
52:10
been a lot of discussions in my mind has like
52:12
seven different points. But the first on freedom, because there's
52:15
something you said probably ten minutes ago at this point now,
52:19
is freedom is not the ability to do whatever you want.
52:23
It's the ability to do what you ought. And that's
52:26
actually such an impactful thing because if freedom is the
52:32
ability to do whatever you want, look into your own
52:35
life and tell yourself, have I always wanted the same thing? No,
52:40
it changes over time, and so freedom is the ability
52:43
to do what you want. And then you do what
52:45
you want now, and then you realize two years down
52:47
the line that you want something else, but what you
52:50
had already done has hindered your ability to do what
52:54
you want. Then were you truly doing the most truly
52:58
free thing, because and the first point, you're doing what
53:01
felt the most free in the moment, but it constrained
53:04
you in the future. That's just it's almost illogical having
53:10
freedom to do whatever you want when you take into
53:14
account human nature and the fleeting aspect of emotions and desires.
53:19
It does not logically make sense. And I think a
53:24
good analogy not another. It's an analogy because guys are talking.
53:29
I was thinking about gravity, and it holds us to
53:31
this ground and it's a constraint on us. If we
53:36
didn't have gravity, we could go wherever we want in
53:38
the universe.
53:39
Speaker 1: That's a really good analogy.
53:40
Speaker 4: But with gravity, it keeps us grounded, It keeps us
53:44
rooted in something such that we have something that we
53:47
know at all times. And this restriction of our ability
53:53
to go wherever we want as easily as we can
53:56
helps us understand that we have a community here, that
54:00
there are people around us, because if we could just
54:02
go wherever we want, there's nothing holding us in a communion,
54:07
and we're made to be a communion. And then I
54:11
had one last thing about emotions. Oh yeah, we've talked
54:15
a lot today's day talking about the intellect. And I
54:18
think something that's we've talked said a bunch of times,
54:20
is you know, subjecting the emotions to the intellect or
54:23
this or that.
54:24
Speaker 1: So the emotions as much as it's passions and desires.
54:27
Speaker 4: I would say, yeah, and so there is aspects of
54:30
truth in that, but I would also conjecture that passions
54:34
and desires and emotions, those are good aspects of our life,
54:37
and it's not like the intellect must always be superior
54:40
to those. There are some instances in which the emotions
54:43
the passions ought to overcome the intellect in that way,
54:48
because it's all about truth, and our own intellect is
54:52
flawed and isn't infinitely knowing, and so you know, sometimes
54:57
our emotions or our gut feelings or this or that
55:00
can take superiority over the intellect. But in the end,
55:05
it's all just a true balance of who we are.
55:08
Speaker 3: Because you talk a lot.
55:09
Speaker 4: About you know, balancing everything, and a balance of things
55:13
is balancing our intellect with our emotions. We can't just
55:16
ignore our emotions. They are an integral part of us.
55:18
We can't just ignore our intellect. It's an integral part
55:21
of us. It is highly important that we understand and
55:26
connect all of these different aspects of our life together,
55:28
because if we hold ourselves into different boxes in this
55:32
room without the connections, then it's just a small little
55:37
corner of the room falling, and that box will fall
55:39
and you'll lose who you are in that aspect. But
55:42
if all of us is just connected together more fully.
55:46
Then when the floor crumbles beneath one box, the other
55:49
boxes hold it up so you don't lose that part
55:51
of you.
55:53
Speaker 3: Anyway, that was my entire.
55:55
Speaker 1: I think the thing you're saying about community is really
55:57
interesting because now I'm thinking about it, it's very rare
56:02
that you find somebody who just individually believes something completely
56:10
different from everybody else. I think it's so interesting because
56:17
that kind of, in my mind, shows that people a
56:22
are ordered towards relationship and community. But then also that
56:30
like you're exactly like you're saying that the higher truth
56:34
that we're talking about is exactly what forms those communities.
56:37
Because you think about Catholics, Baptists, Evangelicals, even atheists. They
56:46
you can group these people together because they believe the
56:50
same thing and they have the same thing grounding them.
56:56
I think it's really interesting.
56:58
Speaker 2: Yeah, point that I would think about is if you're
57:03
looking at like I'm sure you guys have heard it
57:05
or seeing the TV shows, it's like, Oh, you're getting married,
57:09
you're gonna be tied down, you're a slave, you're trapped.
57:11
It's like, oh, I'm trapped now, and it's like but
57:13
if you would look at someone, I think once you
57:16
develop a better conception of what real love is and
57:18
what use is, and then what self gift or self
57:21
service like or self worship is. If you look at
57:26
somebody like I'm imagining a married person that says, I
57:32
have chosen.
57:33
Speaker 1: To be.
57:35
Speaker 2: Committed here freely. I chose this. I am making myself
57:39
a gift. Are you really free? To the person who
57:42
goes out and has one night stands all the time,
57:44
it's like, are you really free?
57:46
Speaker 1: Or are you.
57:49
Speaker 2: Enslave? To self worship to self service? And it's such
57:55
a confusing thing because it's like there's a narrative. I mean,
58:00
it's the basic narrative that's always been in the world.
58:02
It's like, will you serve yourself or will you serve God?
58:05
And we kind of see both of those options as slavery,
58:08
so it's like, oh, that sucks. So we're inclined to
58:11
just go, well, I'll just serve myself. That feels better
58:14
in the moment. But I think what you begin to
58:16
learn is that actually the service serving yourself is just
58:21
becoming enslave to your own fallen nature, and it's just
58:26
a downward spiral. But then serving God really means to
58:30
subject your brokenness and your own inclination to serve yourself
58:37
to something higher, and through that you find there's something
58:41
redeeming about that, and you actually find that your desires
58:46
will change, and this is what your heart is always
58:48
truly desired. But there's like a facade. It's the devil
58:52
that's basically saying no, that is not what it's going
58:55
to be like. It's going to be miserable. You're gonna
58:57
hate it. But really you have to do that to
59:00
go on to death. And then you will see there's
59:02
a there's a deeper experience of life, a more substantial
59:06
than what you've what you're first presented with. And then
59:10
there was one other thing that I, oh, I liked
59:15
what you say. So one thing that's easy to get
59:17
trapped in. This is something I got trapped in was
59:20
idolizing the intellect and idolizing the mind and assuming that
59:25
once a concept is articulatable, let's say and okay, I
59:31
understand this, that it's now a part of your person.
59:35
But something I learned from Christopher West was that this
59:38
was a really beautiful thing. Theology should be done on
59:41
your knees. So and then there's a joke. It's like
59:46
there were two doors. A bunch of theologian professors died,
59:51
and there was two doors. It's either go to heaven
59:54
or go to a lecture about heaven. And you see
59:56
them all going into the lecture about heaven. And so
59:59
that can be applied to anything of real human value.
1:00:03
And I think something I was stuck with is I
1:00:06
started trying to sort of change my life around. Was
1:00:08
if I figure out the truth and the right answer,
1:00:10
and I figure out who's right and who's wrong, and
1:00:11
who's got the better argument, who's got the bigger fist
1:00:14
and the bigger stick, then I win and I know
1:00:16
the truth and I've got it, and I'm secure and
1:00:17
I'm safe. But I was missing the main point, which
1:00:22
is for it to travel, the theology to travel from
1:00:24
my head into my heart, which is the same problem
1:00:27
the Pharisees had, which is why you always address them.
1:00:30
Was that you think you've got the law and you've
1:00:32
got the answers, you've got the truth, you know the history.
1:00:34
You're more educated than these people, so you are above
1:00:37
them and they are below you, and you've got the
1:00:40
free ride. But when it came down to like will
1:00:42
you love someone, will you be down on the same
1:00:45
level as someone else, whether they're sinners or not sinners,
1:00:48
or people you don't like, or whatever it was. And
1:00:53
they came face to face with that truth that it
1:00:55
wasn't actually in their heart and in their emotions. And
1:00:58
so just like you said, said you can't just take
1:01:01
the intellectual and say this is going to be where
1:01:04
I thrive. This this is the highest truth. And like
1:01:08
you said, the atheist they it's like, even if something happened,
1:01:12
if it's outside of my of the intellectual capacity that
1:01:16
I've categorized the world in, then it's not real. And
1:01:21
it's like, well, you've just idolized your own intellect and
1:01:24
your ability to understand things. But if you remember what
1:01:27
you were like when you were twelve years old, you
1:01:29
didn't even have the capacity to understand something. But if
1:01:31
you shut down and you say I don't know any
1:01:34
I know enough now to make a decision, it's like
1:01:38
you're twelve and I think that I think the same
1:01:42
thing will always apply. It's like at some point you
1:01:44
have to make little like commitments and decisions, but with
1:01:47
the best information you have. But I think the real
1:01:52
issue comes when you say there is nothing more I
1:01:55
need to know when it comes to the level of
1:02:00
your heart knowing you know. So the intellect is important,
1:02:03
but it will always be a tool that I think
1:02:06
should be subjected to the heart. So the right I
1:02:13
don't know.
1:02:14
Speaker 1: I don't know if I agree.
1:02:16
Speaker 4: Connected to maybe not subjected the head.
1:02:20
Speaker 2: The heart gives love to the head.
1:02:25
Speaker 4: I mean in similar ways, like the metaphor is you know,
1:02:28
the father is the head of the household. Doesn't mean
1:02:31
that he is the ultimate power and authority and is
1:02:35
in control and is better than the red. No, it's
1:02:37
just there is a purpose to having someone who is
1:02:41
the head. We have in the US a president ahead
1:02:45
of our state, and there are good aspects in that,
1:02:49
but that does not mean that this head of the
1:02:51
state has the ultimate power and authority over who we are.
1:02:54
Speaker 2: The head serves the good of the heart. Yes, that's
1:02:57
just like the president serves the good of the people,
1:02:59
or should.
1:03:00
Speaker 3: That's that's a good way of putting it.
1:03:02
Speaker 1: Actually, I think the government analogy is a good one
1:03:05
because there's the three branches of government that they're all
1:03:08
supposed to be equal in power, and they're all supposed
1:03:10
to be serving the same purpose and working together to
1:03:12
achieve that purpose.
1:03:13
Speaker 3: That at the point point that the fire inspire, at
1:03:17
the top of the fire always comes back.
1:03:21
Speaker 1: Yeah. Something I was just thinking about while you're talking
1:03:24
was the people who idolize their intellect. And it can
1:03:29
be Christians, it can be Atheists, it can be anybody.
1:03:33
But again this can use the atheist example because I
1:03:39
am Catholic obviously, but when you hear people say you
1:03:44
can even see this, I've like made a point to
1:03:47
not interact with these people because it's a bad habit.
1:03:51
I'm not going to do it anymore, but I would
1:03:53
always want to, like go on Instagram and you see
1:03:56
the comments and people are just saying, well, can your
1:03:59
sky daddy be even by an equation? If not, then
1:04:02
like I'm not going to believe in them, because like
1:04:03
science proves everything. Science is like science says this, Science
1:04:08
says that my intellect is saying that this is true.
1:04:12
But so there's nothing outside of it. And they think
1:04:15
that science and God are incompatible, which essentially, God isn't
1:04:21
a physical being in time and space. He's not bound
1:04:26
by the same things laws of ruth. Yeah, essentially, and
1:04:32
so science is a study of the laws of nature
1:04:34
and their effects on.
1:04:35
Speaker 4: The physical Obviously, science can't explain God exactly by definition
1:04:40
of what science is.
1:04:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you can have scientific evidence that leads you
1:04:44
in a direction maybe, but you can't prove God with
1:04:48
science because he's outside of science and he created the
1:04:50
very thing that science is studying, so he can't definitionally,
1:04:55
he can't be within it. And it's so it's kind
1:05:01
of sad when I see people who think this way,
1:05:03
where they say, you can't prove to me using your brain,
1:05:09
using equations in math and science, that this thing that
1:05:14
you can't even actually access through those avenues or venues.
1:05:20
I always get those two words, makes up avenues, I
1:05:22
say avenue avenues, Right, They're saying you can't even prove
1:05:26
this thing that they can't it's impossible to access through
1:05:29
these avenues. You can't prove it by using these things,
1:05:34
and so they just don't accept it and they say
1:05:36
that these things are contradictory and that you have to
1:05:40
believe one or the other, when in reality, science it
1:05:45
can't prove God, but it can lead you to God.
1:05:49
And God the idea of God lends credence to the
1:05:52
existence of science, and it's the fact that you can do.
1:05:55
Science in the first place is evidence in a sense,
1:05:59
So it's all tied together, and you can't say I'm
1:06:07
going to accept this regardless of what the evidence is.
1:06:11
But you also can't say this thing that my intellect believes.
1:06:18
I think that this is the truth, regardless of what
1:06:20
other experiences I have, regardless of what other kinds of
1:06:23
truth I experience. You can't say this is all that
1:06:27
there is. I'm not going to be open to anything else,
1:06:29
and that's what so many people do.
1:06:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, Jordan Peterson's had talked to Richard Dawkins and that
1:06:37
was a really good one. But I think the conclusion
1:06:40
in summary that Jordan Peterson came to, at least with
1:06:43
The New Atheist is that the scientific endeavor itself presupposes
1:06:48
an unscientific proposition. And so it's a logical fallacy in
1:06:55
a sense because it's it's first relying on something non
1:07:00
scientific to even begin the scientific pursuit, and so then
1:07:04
it's like, but then it claims that that proposition doesn't exist,
1:07:11
but it's just not acknowledging like that there's something that
1:07:13
came before the idea that the world is intelligible, and
1:07:18
so there's a value to that and there's a there's
1:07:20
something to be gained. And I think that was is
1:07:25
that kind of what you were.
1:07:26
Speaker 1: People And this wasn't Jordan Peterson, but it's people pursue
1:07:31
science because they expected law in nature in the first place.
1:07:34
So a lot of the original kind of big scientists
1:07:38
were Christians, because if you're not, you don't have any
1:07:41
basis to expect any kind of law in nature because
1:07:48
there's no I mean, there's no reason for it. If
1:07:50
everything is just the product of mindless, unguided processes, then
1:07:54
it's all just random and you couldn't expect there to
1:07:56
be any kind of intelligibility.
1:07:58
Speaker 4: Something that you said really makes me think, because that's
1:08:02
very much true that science in a vacuum is a
1:08:06
logical fallacy. If science and how it defines itself as
1:08:12
all there is, it is insufficient.
1:08:15
Speaker 1: Science can prove everything except for science itself.
1:08:18
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a good way of putting it. That can't
1:08:20
prove everything, but.
1:08:22
Speaker 4: But that idea remains. And this is coming from someone
1:08:24
who is pursuing science for a living, who is building
1:08:28
up a like that is who I'm planning and hoping
1:08:32
to be a scientist, pursuing truth and knowledge and so
1:08:36
when I say, you know, science and a vacuum is nothing,
1:08:38
that's not just dissing on science, because I hold science
1:08:41
up to be one of the greatest gifts we have
1:08:44
on this earth and one of the coolest things that
1:08:46
we can pursue. But if science is all there is,
1:08:51
it is pointless. It is a logical fallacy. It cannot
1:08:55
explain itself. In physics, we talk about how the world
1:09:00
was made, you know, the creation of the universe, the
1:09:03
Big Bang, and everything that we do in science is
1:09:08
us in terms of understanding the beginning is coming from
1:09:12
where we are and going backwards further, further, further, and
1:09:15
we noticed that things contract and it seems like it
1:09:18
explodes from a point and are like, this is how
1:09:20
the universe was made. And for some people that satisfies them.
1:09:24
Speaker 3: But that.
1:09:26
Speaker 4: Like science presupposes the existence of logic, It presupposes the
1:09:31
existence of existence. It presupposes the existence of the ability
1:09:36
to use logic to explain existence, and there is no
1:09:42
reason to suppose that on the basis of science. That
1:09:45
is an unscientific fact.
1:09:48
Speaker 1: I mean, okay, my favorite thing recently, at least I've
1:09:52
heard about this topic is John Lennox. Uh. He said
1:09:58
that science and God answer to diferent questions in the
1:10:01
same way that if there's water boiling on stove, you
1:10:05
could say why is there water boiling on stove? And
1:10:07
then somebody could say, well, because you know, he agitates
1:10:12
water particles and blah blah blah blah, and it does
1:10:14
this and it makes the water boil. And then he says, no,
1:10:16
it's boiling because John Lennox wants a cup of tea.
1:10:20
And those things are both true, but those answers answer
1:10:24
different questions and they're completely different, and the fact that
1:10:28
one is true doesn't mean that the other isn't. I
1:10:31
really love that's I love John Lennox so much.
1:10:34
Speaker 2: Oh okay, So one is answering the what and the
1:10:37
other is answering the why, or it's like why okay, yeah.
1:10:42
Speaker 4: And there's even more nuances in those questions. You can
1:10:45
talk about platonism and get into all of these intricacies.
1:10:50
Speaker 1: This for like three hours.
1:10:52
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean getting on.
1:10:54
Speaker 1: There, it's like an hour and twelve minutes or something.
1:10:57
Speaker 3: Yeah, this could be a new record for us.
1:11:00
Speaker 1: I think it's like an hour and twenty or something.
1:11:01
Speaker 3: That's the longest Yeah.
1:11:04
Speaker 4: So there's something that I've been thinking about this whole time,
1:11:07
and I think it would make good practical advice as
1:11:10
to how to use your intellect to approach the world
1:11:16
better in a practical here's what you can do sort
1:11:19
of way. And it has to do with you know
1:11:22
that one video where insert controversial topic. There's one person
1:11:26
that just is making stupid remarks and completely nonsensical. How
1:11:30
can this person possibly be understood? And then there's this
1:11:32
other person saying everything right, and it's just like, how
1:11:35
is this person not understanding this genius? I want you
1:11:39
in those cases and in out of the cases where
1:11:41
you can put people into a box of this person
1:11:44
believes this thing, therefore I trust everything they say about
1:11:46
this This person believes this thing, therefore they're wrong about
1:11:49
everything they're saying. I want you to use your intellect
1:11:51
in this case, not just put them in boxes and
1:11:54
be like, yeah, sure whatever, Use your intellect and try
1:11:57
to actually understand what this person who is saying this
1:11:59
stupid things is actually saying and where it's coming from.
1:12:02
To find the truth in the matter, because that is
1:12:04
something that I have found when I look at these
1:12:07
things in this way that in all of these videos
1:12:10
where there's these controversial topics and you've got one person
1:12:15
spouting the thing that makes sense and one person not.
1:12:19
When I actually look at it, I find that this
1:12:21
person who isn't spouting the things that make sense to
1:12:24
me has a lot of truth in it. Like people
1:12:29
don't say stupid things because they want it to be stupid. No,
1:12:34
they say things because there are different Like there are
1:12:38
truths that may be warped, may be misshapen, may be
1:12:42
placed in improper proportion to other truths, but their truths nonetheless.
1:12:46
And so I would say a good way of using
1:12:49
the intellect to establish your presence in the world is
1:12:55
to actually understand what people are saying. So when you
1:13:00
all these political videos on whatever topic, try not to
1:13:05
just be like ha ha, yes, my favorite speaker said
1:13:11
basically destroyed them in this argument. That is not the
1:13:13
point of an argument. It is not to destroy the
1:13:15
other person. It is to bring them to the truth.
1:13:19
I really hate, I really hate all those YouTube videos
1:13:24
where it's just like Ben Shapiro will destroys. That is
1:13:28
not the point of what we're doing here on Earth.
1:13:31
We are not here to destroy people. We're going to
1:13:33
build them up.
1:13:34
Speaker 2: In truth, you click that video be.
1:13:41
Speaker 4: Because isn't that why we click on the video? We
1:13:43
want to see, you know, Ben Shapiro go on someone
1:13:46
and it's like that that is us coming from a
1:13:48
place of pride. Now, it's not us being like, oh
1:13:51
Ben Shapiro is, you know, explaining the world. No, we
1:13:55
just want to see someone be beat down intellectually, and
1:13:58
it's like, that is not a good way of approaching things.
1:14:02
So try to understand where the person is coming from
1:14:05
and maybe understand that perhaps Ben Shapiir's way of just
1:14:08
beating them down is not the best way of approaching them.
1:14:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh yeah. So I also want to say this,
1:14:16
This isn't really related to that, but I think it
1:14:20
is another good thing to hit on because I might
1:14:23
have just had like kind of a personal revelation while
1:14:26
we're talking about this, and it ties into using your
1:14:32
intellect as a tool to serve the good of the heart,
1:14:34
or I think that's what you said. So I personally,
1:14:38
I think I've talked to you kind of about this before.
1:14:41
So I personally have struggled a lot with anxiety stuff
1:14:45
in the past, and a lot of that has stemmed
1:14:48
from me feel like I'll be in a situation and
1:14:53
I'll use my brain and I'll put two and two
1:14:55
together and I'll figure out what's going to happen before
1:14:57
it even happens kind of thing. And I've always struggled
1:15:01
with that, and I've always struggled with I think, like
1:15:07
putting two and two together because this is the logical
1:15:10
thing that will happen in this circumstance. And it it's
1:15:17
messed my brain up. It's totally messed with my head
1:15:19
for a long time. Because I'm ex because not as
1:15:24
much anymore. This is something that I've been working on
1:15:26
and like growing in. But in the past I've had
1:15:29
times where I completely submit myself to my brain and
1:15:35
what I think is going to happen and what I
1:15:39
think should happen in this circumstance without paying any attention.
1:15:45
Like the best example I would say is like you're
1:15:48
in a situation, you're experiencing something really good. In the past,
1:15:52
I've had problems with like you're in that situation and
1:15:57
you're so worried about, Okay, when is this going to end,
1:16:02
what's going to happen. It's going to make this not
1:16:04
be good? Ore overthinking in a sense. Yeah, But more
1:16:09
in terms of because you can think about anything. But
1:16:15
if I'm just like, when is this going to end?
1:16:17
What bad thing is going to happen? It's gonna take
1:16:19
this good thing away from me? You get so caught
1:16:21
up in those thoughts of anxiety and just that fear
1:16:27
that you forget that you're in the situation in the
1:16:29
first place. You're so caught up and worrying about losing
1:16:33
the good that you forget that you're experiencing the good
1:16:35
in the moment. And that's been something that I've struggled
1:16:40
with at times for a long time. And I would
1:16:43
say that that is in part at least due to
1:16:46
submitting myself completely to my intellect without listening to my
1:16:49
heart at all. You use your intellect as a tool,
1:16:51
but if you don't have anything to guide it, then
1:16:55
it's not going to lead you to a good place.
1:16:57
Speaker 2: So you say, it's kind of like getting lost in
1:16:58
your thoughts instead of letting your heart just experience human
1:17:01
life in a sense.
1:17:04
Speaker 1: Anyway, Yeah, I think getting lost in your thoughts, but
1:17:07
then you can extrapolate little, any bitty things that have
1:17:11
no meaning and just like go, you know, there's one
1:17:16
thing happens that might not mean anything, and instantly you're
1:17:19
just like a million miles away and you've already about yeah, exactly.
1:17:26
Speaker 4: Me, and thus, oh no, does that mean like last
1:17:28
week when I did this thing and they Yeah, it's
1:17:31
just the different ways that overthinking and overreacting was like, yeah,
1:17:34
we did have this sort of discussion before.
1:17:36
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I just I think my point with that
1:17:39
is just to say, use your intellect absolutely, and that's
1:17:44
kind of the whole thing we've been talking about here.
1:17:47
But again, and this is just tie it all together.
1:17:50
Don't completely submit yourself to it, because without the guidance
1:17:54
of your heart, your intellect won't lead you anywhere. It's
1:17:59
good sounding interesting.
1:18:05
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I like both of those because I
1:18:11
think nick like certain things. If you think about intellectually
1:18:16
in a certain way, it could be okay, it's time
1:18:19
for me to acquire information. But I think the point
1:18:23
that you were trying to say is there is more
1:18:29
that you can learn from other people than if you
1:18:32
learn to know them and think in ways that are
1:18:35
deeper than just the fact or the information presented. Because
1:18:40
there is only a certain amount of bandwidth that we
1:18:42
have to communicate our hearts to people, and we can
1:18:46
think that once we've communicated an idea, or someone's communicating
1:18:51
an idea, that's all that there is. And so all
1:18:53
I have to do is dismantle this argument and prove
1:18:56
that they were wrong, and they will logically accept the truth.
1:18:58
But really it's like you're acting their heart because they're
1:19:01
just trying to feel like they're loved and feel like
1:19:04
they're satisfied and have a grip on truth. And so
1:19:08
there has to be more to it than just seeing
1:19:12
everyone as an intellectual argument. And so I think that's
1:19:15
really valuable because that gets a nuanced to intellectual where
1:19:18
it's like every day if you're do inspired, don't just think, Okay,
1:19:21
I need to learn information. I need to know more things,
1:19:24
because once I know this thing, kind of like the
1:19:26
trap I fall into is I've got it boxed in,
1:19:28
I understand it, I've got it wrapped up. It's like
1:19:30
you're gonna miss another point of knowing to know something,
1:19:34
to grow your mind. To be intellectual is to know
1:19:38
somebody you know, and is to know something and commune
1:19:42
with it, and that's a human experience. And so something
1:19:45
similar that I've noticed in kind of in lines with
1:19:47
what you said, Michael was I would. I was a
1:19:54
I never knew how to listen to my heart because
1:19:57
I didn't trust my feelings, my emotions, because I thought
1:20:00
that they'd lead me astray. So I was like, I
1:20:02
will stick to purely logical, give me the truth, give
1:20:05
me the argument, and that's it. But that led me
1:20:07
astray because it became to where I was not. I
1:20:10
didn't know how to be tender. I didn't know how
1:20:12
to be human. So it was like, logically, why would
1:20:15
I spend the time to get people like me? It
1:20:17
doesn't make sense if my goal is this exactly, And
1:20:19
then it's like, kind of what you said, well, my
1:20:20
goals are going to change, so then it's like this
1:20:23
whole other problem that sprouts up. So really it is
1:20:26
in the middle. It's a balance between growing your mind
1:20:31
and being able to think and think things through and
1:20:33
sit down with yourself and learn to articulate your ideas
1:20:36
and point at what you're trying to point at and
1:20:39
grasp what you're trying to grasp, and communicate what you
1:20:42
want to communicate, because that makes you free. And like,
1:20:45
if you don't know how to communicate, if you can't talk,
1:20:48
if you don't know how to get your ideas out,
1:20:50
you'll feel you feel trapped, and so intellectual is supposed
1:20:55
to teach you, and it's supposed to be an opportunity
1:20:58
every day to grow in that ability to be free
1:21:01
so you can do the good, so you can do
1:21:04
more good, so you can learn to love people and
1:21:06
learn to know people. And then when you're in situations,
1:21:09
you can learn to trust your heart and you can
1:21:11
learn to see when the mind should take a back
1:21:14
sea to experience like the experience of the body and things.
1:21:18
Speaker 3: Yeah, so there's there's two aspects to intelligence.
1:21:21
Speaker 4: And the way we started off this podcast where we
1:21:24
were just like talking about like, oh, how do you
1:21:26
pursue intelligence, We're focusing on the one aspect, which is knowledge,
1:21:30
knowing things. How do you grow in how much you know?
1:21:33
But then there's the other just as if not more
1:21:36
important aspects of intelligence, which is application. How do you
1:21:39
apply what you know to your spiritual life to your
1:21:44
physical life. You're talking about stuff like two minutes ago,
1:21:47
you were saying things about relations and I'm like, that's
1:21:49
such a that's going to be what we talk about
1:21:51
next week, because like everything is interconnected, you know, this
1:21:56
intellect we need to be able to approach our relationships
1:21:59
with intellect. Yeah, and so intellect has two aspects, knowledge
1:22:03
and application. If you do not ever apply knowledge, knowledge
1:22:07
is pointless. If you have no knowledge, you can't apply anything.
1:22:11
So you need these two aspects to make a healthy intellect.
1:22:17
Speaker 1: I wonder if that's I keep on thinking back on
1:22:20
what we were saying before we even started about gives
1:22:23
the Holy Spirit the knowledge was some understanding. I wonder
1:22:26
if that's the difference between like knowledge and wisdom, is
1:22:29
knowing things and knowing how to apply them.
1:22:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with that.
1:22:33
Speaker 1: That makes it. I had something about understanding earlier though
1:22:38
I can't remember, but.
1:22:39
Speaker 3: We'll do a whole video on it because there's plenty there.
1:22:44
Speaker 2: Yeah, all right, well sweet. So then in conclusion, I'd
1:22:47
say doing something every day to grow in your intellectual life,
1:22:53
which is your capacity to think, to exercise reason, to
1:22:57
weigh different viewpoints, to find out who you are, to
1:23:00
find and know more about God through the intellectual route
1:23:04
is meant to lead to your heart and to learn things.
1:24:25
So I've got conversations with people and then come to
1:24:28
know myself and know God through the intellect, through the
1:24:31
pursuit of truth, now did you say you guys have any.
1:24:35
Speaker 4: Quick Well, I just want to reiterate my practical way
1:24:40
of applying the intellect is to when you disagree with someone,
1:24:44
try to understand them. Yeah, and don't just focus on
1:24:47
the disagreement. Try to find where you do agree because
1:24:51
I want one hundred percent no, okay, I want one
1:24:54
hundred percent believe that you do agree with the person
1:24:59
you disagree with them on far more than you might know.
1:25:04
Speaker 1: I don't really have anything to add to that. I
1:25:06
think that was a pretty good summary. Sweet.
1:25:08
Speaker 2: Okay, So this has been another Spire podcast. If you've
1:25:12
made it all, right, this is what we have to do.
1:25:14
If you got to this point. Should I do this? Yeah,
1:25:18
I'm till you do. If you get to this point,
1:25:21
we will give you. Okay, this is only going to
1:25:24
happen for the first three people.
1:25:27
Speaker 1: You have to tell you have to comment or something.
1:25:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, you can't tell anyone else. DM aspired today on Instagram.
1:25:35
If you cheated and you skip to the end, don't
1:25:38
do that. Don't don't get this.
1:25:40
Speaker 1: Well, nobody's gonna not to skip to the end unless
1:25:42
they get to the end, because they won't.
1:25:44
Speaker 2: Okay, that's true. That's true, but there might be one
1:25:46
person it's like, yeah, how about this, you have to Okay,
1:25:49
here's what we'll do. If you've gotten to this point.
1:25:52
The first three people that would d m us dmo
1:25:55
d m us on Instagram, Aspire today or so this
1:26:00
an email or something, or comment on the YouTube video.
1:26:02
Speaker 1: Don't comment actually, because those public and people are going
1:26:04
to see it.
1:26:05
Speaker 2: Don't tell them why you're commenting.
1:26:07
Speaker 3: This is complicated.
1:26:09
Speaker 2: But comment what parts stood out to you. And then
1:26:11
we will give you a free spire T shirt in
1:26:15
the color and size that you want, and it'll look
1:26:19
like it'll have the logo, and then it'll it you
1:26:22
can customize it wet, put the things on the back,
1:26:24
or we'll put something on the sleeves. Honestly, if you're
1:26:27
watching the video, just because we want to see if
1:26:31
there's actually anybody that's gotten through here. And then also,
1:26:35
as we're trying to learn how to do this better,
1:26:38
if we do get criticism, and we do get things
1:26:40
that you don't like and things that stick out to
1:26:42
you and bug you, we're going to have a better
1:26:44
idea of where we can grow. Just so that this
1:26:48
is more of an application to other people you know,
1:26:50
and obviously we're trying to figure out those things for
1:26:53
ourselves and figure out what sucks.
1:26:54
Speaker 4: And if we have to say anything that you think
1:26:56
is a problematic or hedicalized thing, tell us to actually
1:27:00
hear where I'm wrong on things.
1:27:03
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would love to hear that.
1:27:04
Speaker 2: And if we have to elaborate on something, that's yeah.
1:27:07
Speaker 1: If so, this is something that I was thinking about
1:27:09
the other day, Like, we want feedback. So if there's
1:27:14
people who hear this comment, dm us do whatever we
1:27:18
want to know how to make it better because our
1:27:20
entire goal with this we have two goals to help
1:27:24
each other grow, which we can do because we have
1:27:27
the immediate feedback of seeing each other. But our second
1:27:30
goal is to help other people to work towards the
1:27:33
same thing that we're working towards, and we can't. We
1:27:36
want to do that in the best way possible. So
1:27:38
if you have feedback, please please please let us know somehow.
1:27:44
Speaker 4: Especially if that feedback is until Michael to grows hair
1:27:46
out again.
1:27:48
Speaker 1: I've been thinking about it.
1:27:49
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's actually cool because what's fun about
1:27:52
doing this podcast with YouTube guys is that we are
1:27:57
all working towards the same thing. Using this same sort
1:28:00
of structure, which is the Spire thing. And it's kind
1:28:03
of like as it's a super cringy way to put it,
1:28:06
but I think having a community of people where you
1:28:09
can like where we're all doing the same thing, I
1:28:12
think it's really helpful. And I didn't have something where
1:28:14
it was like solid and it was like a community
1:28:16
that I felt like I fit in because it was like, well,
1:28:18
I'm not that interested in that stuff. I'm not that
1:28:20
interested in that. But I think with Spire, it it's
1:28:23
a really good centering piece and a really good center
1:28:28
it's a really good anchor I think for a lot
1:28:30
of people to sort of come around on. So I
1:28:34
think that it would be sweet if there if you
1:28:36
actually do use this and if you do like it,
1:28:39
and if these are of value to you, then it's
1:28:41
like we would love to talk to you about it. Yeah,
1:28:44
and you can just DM the Instagram page and it'll
1:28:46
be either me or Michael or Nick. We'll talk about
1:28:48
it as it is. But if you've got like questions
1:28:50
or things that you wanted us to talk about, like
1:28:51
if we're talking about relational next week, like we will
1:28:54
absolutely highlight whatever you share and like of course we're
1:28:58
you know, I mean, we're small enough now, so.
1:29:01
Speaker 1: It's like you might as well get it in.
1:29:03
Speaker 3: You can't have a fan.
1:29:04
Speaker 1: We have won somewhere in Florida. I don't know where
1:29:08
it is. There was some time in Florida that I've
1:29:10
never been before. Yeah, so.
1:29:15
Speaker 2: We're totally invited to do that. If you do it,
1:29:17
we will send you a free spire t shirt.
1:29:19
Speaker 1: So only the first three.
1:29:21
Speaker 2: Only the first three, just because it's like, bro, it's
1:29:24
not cheap. I mean, it's like, we just don't got
1:29:27
money to spend, so we'll make it work. So then
1:29:32
in conclusion, you want to send us out in prayer.
1:29:35
Speaker 4: Conclusion, that's prey, which is actually a great way to
1:29:38
do everything. But anyway, in the name of the Father Son,
1:29:42
Holy Spirits Him, Lord, thank you for this time, for
1:29:45
these discussions and the way we've learned and grown and understood.
1:29:49
And I think that we have pursued intellect in some
1:29:52
way today because of your gifts. And so we are
1:29:56
very thankful to you, Lord for this gift of our minds,
1:29:59
for the guests of the minds of.
1:30:01
Speaker 3: Whoever is out there.
1:30:03
Speaker 4: And we pray that maybe something we said today we'll
1:30:07
speak to someone's heart. We'll speak to someone's mind, and
1:30:11
that they will grow in faith, hope, and love. We
1:30:16
asked that we may all do this in your name.
1:30:19
Speaker 3: Amen.
1:30:22
Speaker 2: All right, thank you guys for tuning in, keep spiring,
1:30:26
keep going higher, and don't stop living life until you die.
1:30:31
Speaker 3: That's cliche.
1:30:36
Speaker 1: Go higher, high, aspire, aspire, Aspire.
1:30:44
Speaker 2: Good Funds
1:30:58
Speaker 1: M