Latest / Follow the Leighder / Science, Feminism, and Witchcraft | Mary Maksoud (@thesteministwitch)

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Science, Feminism, and Witchcraft | Mary Maksoud (@thesteministwitch) · Follow the Leighder

• Leigh/@followtheleighder: howdy folks and welcome back to another episode of Follow the Leighder. I'm your host, Leigh Larson, and joining me from just north of Toronto, Canada, hoo ho, Mary Maksoud the s the the stiminist witch online. Welcome to the studio, Mary. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Hi, thank you for having me. I'm very excited to be here. Leigh/@followtheleighder: my goodness. it is an honor. It is a privilege. Folks, I'm really excited to for y'all to get to know Mary. Mary is the creator behind The Steminist Witch. she carries a Phoenician-Lebanese lineage and is initiated into two Hawaiian lineages. She has a computer science degree, a master of education, NLP, and a hypnotherapy certification. She works in product management, currently leading AI literacy at a national Canadian organization. She's focused on ethics and literacy. Thank you, by the way, for your work on ethics and literacy in AI. And she founded the debug your bind method, her proprietary healing technique, and also hosts transformation retreats for women. She shows where ancestral practice and STEM are the same conversation in different dialects on her platform at The Seminist, which wow. That is. Incredible resume. Thank you so much. I mean, I I love how you started in the ground, you know, like the technical and the engineering, the computer science, and now Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. Leigh/@followtheleighder: you're like, I know who I am. And I think that is so and and especially you're you're staying connected with the AI literacy while also being deeply in the the healing, the spiritual. And I'm thankful again for your your voice online. Can you kind of talk about your upbringing, this Phoenician Lebanese lineage, this Hawaiian lineage, the two Hawaiian lineages? How did that play a role in how you approached life spiritually or theologically? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah, so I I actually grew up Maronite in Lebanon. So it's a faction of Catholicism. where I've always been very intuitive, but it was like you shouldn't be, right? it's there's a lot of stigma around being intuitive, having abilities that are not outside, like that go outside of the confines of what the church thinks is normal. but I was lucky enough that I had a father who studied parapsychology. So some of those intuitions and gut feelings were okay, but then kind of the visions and the premonitions were not. and I asked a lot of questions, but then I was shut down. I was like, you shouldn't do that. What happened was when I was a teenager, I did a boo-boo. I don't want anybody to do that. I did a Ouija board experience with a friend. I mean We start looking, and I started looking at Wicca, and I've always wanted to find that inner thing that used to drive me. And it went completely sour and it scared me so much. So I shut off Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: everything I knew until I was around 20 something, and I had literally a meningitis. So I was misdiagnosed with an bacteria in my ear and it crossed the blame blood bare brain blood barrier. went to my brain. I had a little tumor in my brain assist. I had a stroke and they wanted to operate on my brain. they needed to drill into my skull to relieve the tension. And as you noted at the beginning, I am very proud of my brain. It is basically my most prized Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: possession. So I didn't want anybody touching my brain. I was terrified. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. I don't blame you. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: And at that time I had started, yeah, and I had started learning about meditation and the power of meditation. I had read some books by Deepak Chopra, and I'm very disappointed of what came out about him now. It Leigh/@followtheleighder: yeah. huh, huh. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: just makes me like, so cringe. but in that moment, I did choose to just take antibiotics, refuse surgery, and basically figure this healing thing on my own. I have had a full recovery in my face and I basically was able to reduce my brain swelling. And that was my pivotal moment where I was like, there is so much more to this world than what we are taught and I'm going to find it. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Yeah. That is Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: So yeah. Leigh/@followtheleighder: beautiful. Well, talk about the NLP and the hypnotherapy certification. How does that kind of play a role? Like how talk about that in general. Has hypnotherapy helped you when you were going through some of these healing phases? Was it going through How how do you get yourself out and rebuild and retrust your your brain again? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: So I have to say, I actually studied neurolinguistic programming, hypnotherapy, and went to Hawaii to start studying about the Hawaiian practices after. So, and it was eye opening because when I actually went through my healing, I was like, okay, now I need to learn more. How does this work? What does this do? And then I met my now husband, and him and his mom had actually done NLP and He looked at me, took one look, and he's like, Yeah, this is made for you. Like you need to go and learn this because you already have such a personality that is hypnotic and charismatic, and this will just help you get your message across better. And also with the NLP came something called timeline therapy. and timeline therapy is what I found out has been taken from the Hawaiians. Anyway, we go back to all we always take. the ancestral Leigh/@followtheleighder: yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: stuff and rebranded somehow. So Leigh/@followtheleighder: of course. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: so I went and I learned that and I learned hypnotherapy. they were all within the scope of one course. so there's a practitioner and then a master practitioner and I did both of them. so I'm at that level of master practitioner. And I will say no one cannot be hypnotized. It's a choice because I am a living example of someone who had very different ideas of what hypnosis is. I used to think it's a form of mind control. Like a lot of people actually have reservations around it. And Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: then when I understood the mechanics and the fact that no one can make you do anything against your values. It's just not possible. And allowed myself, it literally is a choice. I was like, wow. So The way I describe this is now I use it with myself. It's very easy for me to get into a trance state. Like I just need to do three breaths, and then I'm like, I'm out. but the biggest thing that people can take away from that is it is how you access your unconscious mind and you allow it to take the wheels. And when it does, you're basically unlimited because it can do so much more than we can consciously. It is literally the driving force behind everything you do, but that's the way to access it. So now, whenever I need to do something, I need to channel energy, I will go into that state and just allow my unconscious mind to take control. And NLP helped in the sense that it basically rewires your brain. So I rewired my brain to be working for me instead of being a blocker. And that's how I use it with people. I use it to basically be able to communicate the most effectively with them, depending on how their personality is and what they're going through, and also to allow them to rewire certain parts of their brain. So that's what Leigh/@followtheleighder: I Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: I ended up with. Leigh/@followtheleighder: I think there's like hold on, we could make the whole episode about this, actually. But there's like there's there's so much I want to get into today. But when you you talk about no one can be so I appreciate what you're saying, like you can't be hypnotized beyond your values is a really strong Statement. I mean, ca I'm I'm thinking about what you're saying. Like, yeah, you probably could get me to talk say a whole lot of things or do a whole lot of other things, but no, like there's just certain things like value, like, and there's a lot of safety when you say it like that. Like, okay. Well, like if I'm not gonna portray my Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. Leigh/@followtheleighder: values, then I think I am a little bit more open to what this experience is instead of being like. being made into like a zombie like a zombie or a robot or like, you know, whatever the the thing is that you like lose agency or lose that level of autonomy. But it's almost kind of like what you're saying. It's like the choice to go below. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yes. Leigh/@followtheleighder: And and that's a a powerful a detachment also. What kind so I I I want to be respectful of of all cultures and rituals, but can you kinda talk about the you say there's two Hawaiian lineages? What is special about Hawaii, A, and then B, the the two separate ones and how do they unfold for you? What does that look like? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: So what is special about Hawaii I s I will say from a historical no Leigh/@followtheleighder: That's a rude I don't mean to say that rudely. I just mean sorry. But like but but w wha wh what drew you to these Hawaiian lineages? I love Hawaii. I love this. Sorry. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah, no, no. And and I wanted I have two approaches to this because one is historical because Hawaii was kind of the last place on earth to get colonized. So they preserved a lot of raw learnings because Leigh/@followtheleighder: Wow. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: no one touched them. So that is the one special thing about it. The other one is when I heard the chant, I just felt like this is for me. So that's the other, you know, more energetic side of it. I was like, I guess we're going to Hawaii then. You know, like it was just that. It was instant. Like I heard the chant and I felt like it just went inside my soul. And I'm like, I learned better than to ignore those signs. so that's how I ended up in Hawaii. And the two lineages. So there is one lineage that was very specific, and the story is available online for people. it was actually the lineage that is responsible for. What they call Opua, and Opua are energy clouds. That's the literal translation. and they were kind of guarded by a family for so long until they dreamt of the person they needed to pass the lineage on to. And that's how that happened. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: And the other one is more the, you know, the Hawaiian practices. But that specific Opua lineage is just, you know, those energy clouds. So that's why I say two, because they are separate. one is more where they got the NLP and the parts integration in the sorry timeline therapy and the parts integration in NLP from. And the one that really promotes ho'oponopono, which is vastly misunderstood. because although it is a forgiveness process, it is not you forgive, you forget, and you love your aggressor. There's so much stigma around that. It actually is very separate from that. It is you Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: heal the part of you related to that and you are allowed to say, okay, I have healed me, but you need to stay away and you need to keep your boundary, right? and and I because I hear a lot about that online, and I'm like, yeah, no, you got the wrong picture. so that's why it's two of them, because they come from different lineages and they're separate. And I I was fortunate enough to learn about both of them. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Was that you know, you you colonizing. We think about that and talk about that quite a bit on just on this platform or just the the Christian colonizing, Catholic colonizing. I went to the Philippines, speaking of Pacific Islands that I was there a month ago. I've I've lived on Hawaii. Speaking of which island were you on? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: the big island. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Big island. And this i like you I mean, you you understand Catholicism, you know how deeply this I mean, it's beautiful and it's powerful and it's like these traditions and then it's like the minute you step outside of it, whether it's these Hawaiian indigenous, whether it's the mystic, I mean it becomes so dangerous and so violent. How has looking at colonization history, looking at masculinity, violence, like how has that impacted the way you as a feminist spiritual woman have seen yourself as you go about your work? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: I love this question. I get asked a lot if I believe in God. I do. And it's not a man in the sky. Why is it a man in the sky? Has anybody asked that question? You know, I start there. I'm like, how has any has anybody asked why? And I will say the reason why I was drawn to Hawaii, like it comes full circle, is because I looked at so many world religions and I could see. All the similarities, and yet somehow all the differences. But we are ultimately all speaking the same language. There is a higher power, a creator, a source, whatever someone wants to call it. And that source, in my personal conclusion, is neither feminine nor masculine. It is where all the energies come from. So it cannot be. feminine or masculine because it created feminine and masculine. So technically it encompasses both because you need Leigh/@followtheleighder: Hi. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: to keep going to the higher level. And that's how I started looking at it. I'm like, okay, so I believe in God, whatever we want to name it. And I can see all the rituals and I can see the sacrifice and and I can see, you know, all that trail that exists in every single other place. Yet somehow one is considered right and the others are considered demonic, which begs the question why? So I've asked a lot of whys in my life that has that have somehow gotten me in trouble. And when I got to looking at it going like, Okay, so why is it always men? Why is it that only men are allowed to lead the church? Why is it that that that's where I started my beef with the system. And I think it's very important that I highlight my problem is never with anybody's faith. Faith works for you. And actually I feel bad for people who have no faith. Because it's such a powerful thing you can have and it's such a big driving force. My problem is with the system because Anytime something so pure and so beautiful is put into a system, it becomes corrupt. So I have a huge separation for me where the system is corrupt, it's an institution, and it has lost the faith. Look at it. All the wars that were waged in the name of God, all the killings that were because we want to tame others, from what? And At the same time, it is very much driven by the patriarchy, and I have my biggest issues there too, in the sense that how did we as women get to a point where we forgot? How did we forget? Like how how much programming did it take to get women to forget that we are creators? We are creators, we we are the portal to life. Like it it can't happen otherwise. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Right. Mm. Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: So this is where I started looking more into okay, how can you be actually spiritual? And that's the whole path I went down on. So Leigh/@followtheleighder: Or it it it it's talking about women being creators and also men being when left to their own devices, when they, you know, separate themselves so much from women, particularly in very clear gendered hierarchies, like how much A the patriarchy hurts itself by doing that? And like you just like just watching men suffer because of men's actions towards one another and And and I and and then it and then it all just comes down from there too. And I I think about that a lot, about how hard it is for us as women, as creators, as spiritual beings, to watch the dominant group, I guess you want to call it, be so cannibalizing when when like and and just so particularly like I know you're up in Canada, but the American administration, I know that there's other waves of this kind of nationalist religious rhetoric going on globally, but it's just a very cannibalistic, scary, and it really is operating in a scarcity mindset too, is what a scarcity, lonely, isolating mindset. Can you talk about the community you have built in your transformation work. I know that you're you're doing a lot online. You're you're posting all your sources. That's the cool thing. By the way, in her captions she puts her sources. she didn't have to. Like she could put that on a sub stack and here's a but like that's super cool. Inspire it's been inspiring me actually. but can you can you talk about the reverse? Can you talk about being like doing your healing journey and then turning and and being a healer now. and the community you have built as a response to the lonely, cannibalizing patriarchy. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah, so I have known my purpose for eight years. And my purpose is to teach women and heal them through energy, because energy is everything. I sat on that for a long time because it wasn't the right time. And then I also had people in my life, we all have relationships that shape the way we are. And I finally finished my loop of my karmic loop with the relationships that were bringing me down last summer. And it was instant after that relationship where it was like, you need to step into your power. It's time. So the idea behind what I want what I'm doing now started forming sometime in October. Really forming. And I've had lengthy discussions with my husband because, you know, we Both come from Lebanon, which is a super religious country. And there was also the fear of, you know, okay, we probably might lose family over this. I'm coming out and saying all of this is going the wrong way. Women deserve a bigger, better place. There is so much healing you can do through energy, through guided energy. And we were like, nope, this is your path. You go for it. So I started posting on this platform end of January, early February consistently, and I am mind blown. I am mind blown by the response, I am mind blown by the amount of women who are there for the message, because my following is ninety five percent women. I'm very proud of that. Like I I screamed that over the roof. I'm like, I have 90% of my following women. I have a huge Leigh/@followtheleighder: That's huge. That's huge. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: following in the United States, which tells you that people disagree with the narrative. I have 65% in the United States on Instagram and over 75% of my following on Facebook is also from the United States. And I wanted to make it accessible. So, my biggest point when I started this, I was like, how do I make the woo-woo very accessible to the woman who knows nothing about it? Well, you talk about science, because that was the biggest selling point for me. I couldn't have been on this path where I am right now if I didn't dive into quantum physics and neuroscience and do the research. Because when I started seeing that, I was like, So it actually has mechanisms behind it, unlike we're told. And I will say this to anyone who's listening, just because you know the magic behind something doesn't make it less magic. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Right. Right. Yes. Right. Yes. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: It's still magic. We glow. We Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: glow. I posted something today that's been doing very well. We glow. Our bones make electricity. Our hearts create an electromagnetic field around us. Does that make us less magic or more magic? I will say more magic. Leigh/@followtheleighder: I think that's a beautiful and it's a very obvious thing too. Like it doesn't make it less magic because even I mean, we hear this from scientists all the time. I mean, the more you study science, biology, anything, I'm floored any t I any time I start getting into the weeds of how things work in nature, I'm like, it's it it doesn't make it less anything just 'cause you know more. and that's there is also that sort of wonder that we can keep exploring and keep learning. There's just just there's just so much more to know. Like, so, so talk to us. when you can you talk to us about what is debug your bind method? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah, so I like I said, a big part of my mission is working with women to and and you know the the the word healing is very overused and Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah, yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: I what I provide is a full transformation on an identity level because what we do as women and men too, right? But again, my my target audience, the my mission is to work with women because of Everything that's been done to women. And everything that's been done to women specifically because they were knowledgeable. Because if you go look at the records, every time women were knowledgeable, were advancing, they were killed, they were named harlot, they were slandered, and then somehow a man discovers it. Like, okay. So that is why this is my mission, because it's time for women to remember. And what I've done is I've taken Everything that I've studied, computer science, I have a master of education, my certifications, all of my own neuroscience research and Hawaiian and Phoenician. So the Phoenician is really me just going and finding all the rituals and the old scriptures and working very hard on that and putting those in a six-month container for women where they come, they're high achieving. And it's still not working. Life is not working. Their inner state is not working. Relationship is not working. You can achieve a lot of things and still be out of balance. And those are the women that will come and they go through this massive transformation over six months where we dig very, very deep into their identity level problems, their identity level associations. Because we do tend to have those. Every single woman I've spoken to has some variation of I'm not good enough. Some variation of it. And we go very deep into what is the biggest identity level problem that you have associated with yourself? We take it out, and then we spend, and that's a full day, very intensive Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: work that we get go through. And then we've got Six months after, because if you clean something and you don't fill it with good stuff, it's gonna get filled with whatever. I Leigh/@followtheleighder: Right. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: always say you empty a cup and you leave it, it's gonna get dusty. So when we empty that cup from every single basically negative experience you've had in your life, genealogically, past lives, whatever you believe in, we need to fill that cup with new strategies, with new information with basically equipping this woman to embody the new identity, which is basically what her soul came here to do. That is her real identity over the six months. So it's a big program, it's a big undertaking, it's an investment in oneself, and it's just massive transformation. I've been through it. I never Leigh/@followtheleighder: Doesn't Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: do anything I have not experienced. That is my motto in life. I have to have experienced it, validated it, understood the mechanics behind it as well. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: And then I will go through that. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. What does it look like? when when these I I don't want to get too deep in your in the woods because this is your your material and your course, but when these women are doing these like deep unpacking work, are they in community with the other the it's a it's a cohort, right? I'm imagining, or is it one on one work? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: It is one on one work. This is one on one work. They do have I've created an asynchronous space, but for now it is for the one on one questions. A lot of times these women don't want other people to know yet that they're doing the work. And I feel like at some point they Leigh/@followtheleighder: Hm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: might be ready. because for a lot, there is such deep trauma that they're just like, I'm doing this work for me, and that's great. What I am hoping to achieve is ultimately once they're done with their program, they want other women who have done the work. They want women in a like-minded community. I actually just started a community for the women around me so that I start meeting them in person. because I really want that. And the retreat, on the other hand, is where people will have a chance to stay in touch afterwards because they're already. you know, coming to a container together. So they will form like lifelong friendships, which is my hope. And that's where there will be an online community that I will start adding women to and it start growing and creating those relationships. Leigh/@followtheleighder: I think that's so powerful that you're able to do these one on ones and also keep growing the the asynchronous. What kind of pushback have you seen online? Have have you had and not only online, but also like have you seen or taken women through your method and maybe it wasn't the right time or it wasn't the right fit or like there was something else there. I guess that's two questions. One is just online hate and the other is like within the the methodology, what what do the non success stories look like? But whichever answer you want to go with first, sorry to hit you with two. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. No, and you know, I'll address the for the methodology first because you know, we're still talking about that. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: I have not worked with someone who wasn't the right fit and the program is designed for that. So say they want to start working with me, I send the diagnostic because there's an asynchronous diagnostic with a lot of questions that I send at the beginning. And when I get that, I'm like, You're not ready. Like it's it's very clear from the answers or from the lack of answers or from the non-depth of answers that that person is not clear and not ready, I will be very clear. I will actually reach out and say, Hey, I think you might need some time. I don't think this is the right fit for you. at the end of the day, I am doing this. Yes, obviously I want to make livelihood out of it because I do want out of my tech career. because although I am really speaking very loudly around the literacy when it comes to AI. There's a lot of misconceptions about AI. And I find myself not wanting to be in the technology space as it's going in that route in general. It is disingenuous of me to be in that space. Even if I'm trying to do good, I'm still fueling that fire. And I don't want to be fueling that fire. So I do want to transition to helping women full time. And I value my integrity and to the point where if it's not the right time, it's not the right time and it's okay. And at the core level of myself, I believe in energy so much that I know the right people are gonna show up and that's it. You know, like if someone it's not the right time for them, and it has happened that it wasn't the right time for them, they did, for example. show up for something else. Like they showed up for a webinar. They showed up for a talk. Like they were still in that phase. And we have kept Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: the connection and we've, you know, moved past, well, it's not the right time to do this. And if it is Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: and when it is, you can come back. Leigh/@followtheleighder: You know, that's something I've thought a lot about because I'm I'm looking 'cause I live in Montana and I would love to get eventually into in person retreats and workshops. And I've been talking to folks about this and I s one of the things I think about is the o you have to be very clear, like your intake, what you're talking about, your diagnostics. You have to be very clear with the audience that you are trying to recruit. And I was thinking like I'm not Well, yes, I have a trauma informed care background and ministry. Like this isn't after crisis care or like there there's a level of of something that needs to happen before you can go into this depth because maybe you're too open. You're like something it's just and it's it's again, you talk about healing, that word being overused, but like healing is just such a it it it's a journey and and you're at different you need different things and you're able to look at different deep things at different times. Cause there were times I felt that I was in deep pain, willing to look at whatever I was going you know, I was like, I cut me open. I'm already gutted. Like, let's look at it all. Like when I was going through my divorce, but like three, four years later, there are things I'm learning about myself that I couldn't possibly swallow during the divorce 'cause I just couldn't do it. And so I I really appreciate you being so clear on your diagnostics because it could have caused harm when people aren't ready for a certain thing or they haven't gotten the last step solid. so thank you. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. I'll add to that, I had a situation where someone approached me and they were going through a divorce. And my immediate response was you finalize your divorce, then you come back. You can't heal a wound while it's bleeding. You can't. Everything needs time. And sometimes that answer Will rub people off the wrong way. It's like, what do you mean? I'm ready. Like, okay, you think you're ready. I trust my expertise and everything that I've learned to tell you. For me, you are not ready. You can go try someone else. And I will not touch this with a 10 foot pole until you are out of the crisis that you're in. Because you can't look back on a crisis while you're in it. You're still living it. So yeah, that's just one example. One that you brought up divorce, so it brought up the example, Leigh/@followtheleighder: yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: that very specific one, yeah. And then they came back. She Leigh/@followtheleighder: and it's and it's so true. Mm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: came back, we worked through the divorce, we worked through her business, and now she is with a partner that actually deserves her. And I'm very proud of her. Leigh/@followtheleighder: and and and that again, because you had the clear boundaries, you were up front, you were honest, you were authentic, and that you truly have integrity of what you're trying to do, she could trust that. When you said not today, she knew that she could come back tomorrow. And that's huge because a lot of there are a lot of grifters out there, there's a lot of scammers, there's a lot of unhealed healers that need a narcissistic fix. And so when you say I don't I Can't, you know, here's the l here's the boundary. There's there's a lot of safety in that. And it's I'll say, again, going back to the divorce thing, part of me wanting to do driven by the healing, of course, was I was in so much pain. But there was also a level of shame and hate where I was like, if I could just understand myself enough, then I could be perfect and made flawless and like. Y there was like this it wasn't a healthy let's examine ourselves. I mean and and I know it was and so even like these later four year later epiphanies, they're not driven yeah, they're like probably came from a painful thing, but it's not this hate or it's not this expectation of like, I'm just gonna be so refined if I can just dig and dig and dig and it's just like I don't know, it there's it there's just so many if Again, it's the safety and within ourselves that we create, the safety that you as a facilitator create with your boundaries, with your clear, like this is my audience. And I really appreciate that. and then also you're doing some real powerful work. again, with religious nationalism, with all this, you know, religious patriarchal stuff being so in our face. As I mean, historically, I know it always has been. Can you share a little bit about how you manage the the hate, the fear? do you get Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Well. Leigh/@followtheleighder: threats? What does it look like to to navigate as such a strong, powerful, quote unquote witchy woman? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. let's let's unpack that one. Okay. I I knew going into this the level of thick skin I should have. I knew it, right? It was I am speaking something that is going to make a lot of people very, very uncomfortable, specifically because I bring my sources into the conversation. So, and you know, I'm not diminishing what anybody else does because a lot of what they say I believe too. And it's the different level of hate you get when you've cited your sources and someone is like, Well, you're just dumb because you're dumb. Okay. And so I will say I do get a significant level of hate. mostly from men on Instagram. A lot of very Christian women on Facebook, which is very interesting. I have gotten one threat. I had posted a reel with me watering my plant outside and someone sent me a location. Little do they know that I'm all in technology and there's no way they can track my location. I know how I took with the video. The location was completely off. It was somewhere in the United States. And that but that was the one time where I was like, really, people do take it that far. I am very, very good at the block button. It is Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: my most reached for button. And I have a philosophy. I do not engage. I used to when I first started because I was like, I genuinely want to educate people. Like this is coming from a really good place. And then I figured these kinds of people do not want to be educated. Like clearly, when someone comes with such a level of like deeply rooted hate Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. yeah. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: for women and for just thinking outside the box, they don't want to be educated. And I I'll I'll say this to people who are, you know, doing this. You do realize that when you engage with content that you don't want. You are training your algorithm to keep putting that content in your face, right? I look Leigh/@followtheleighder: Correct. Right. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: at them and I'm like, You're telling me that I'm dumb, but technically you are fueling yourself to keep seeing the stuff that you don't like and just Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: keep in that loop. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah, absolutely. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Like what what is it? Why is it so hard to just scroll along? You don't agree with someone. It's a free world. At the end of the day, I am on social media. Yes, I bring my sources because that's who I am. I have a master of education. I was trained that way. I will always find where that came from. And I will debunk some myths along the way because why not? But it's still social media. So if you're expecting A scholar level dissertation in my caption. You're reading in the wrong place. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Well, I I think it's obviously I I I think it's important what you're doing. I I want to I wanna talk more about why you think the world needs the rise of of witches. What specifically and what does that mean to be a witch? Is it like a an official ordination? Do you go through a commissioning? Is there a c w who do we call? Like why Why are we needed and and how do witches become witches? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: So that is where that will definitely be my personal opinion. I feel like a witch is a woman who has accepted her power of creation and her inherent connection with nature that we are all as women born with. At the end of the day, we are all connected to nature, we are all connected to energy, we are all capable of this. The difference between someone who calls herself a witch and someone who doesn't is that that person has accepted that they are actually creators. So the word, the root of the word witch, unlike people think, it's not wise woman, it means to bend, to bend, to be able to mold. That's what a witch is. It's someone who is able to create their reality the way they want it, is able to. Use energy and the laws of the universe, because yes, there are laws, and manifestation is not just I wish for it and it comes, in order to achieve a level of success or influence or do good with it. Again, we talk about witches in the history as if you know, I I I get a lot of comments, and this is very common. Witchcraft is inherently evil because you have the power to influence, like. Okay, but technically what you're telling me is that prayer, where we pray because we want a certain outcome. Pray to God every single day for what you want and it will happen. But if I am using my own ritual, which is the same, basically repeating the same thing over and over again to get what I want, but my intention is good, I'm doing something evil. And this is where we go down to intention. I believe that anybody Who is doing good with intention is doing good no matter what they're using. And anybody who's doing bad things with bad intention, no matter what the methods that they're using are, are inherently doing bad things. It's just the way it is. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Right. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: So, which is someone who can literally bend reality to work for them? How is that bad if you have the right intention? And over the years it's been associated with wise women because Most of the people who were killed as witches, the women who were prosecuted, were actually wise women. And yes, I know there were men that were killed as witches, and it's mostly in the Nordic countries, and it's just over there that it was primarily men. But 83% of the witch killings were women. Can you imagine? And that's we're talking in Europe, over 60,000 women. That's that's not a that's not a small number. So, yes, Leigh/@followtheleighder: No. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: I am reclaiming the witch because they killed them because they were strong, they killed them because they were knowledgeable, they killed them because they were ahead of their times. They were the midwives, the herbalists, like they were landowners, business owners, not just doing, you know, like witchy stuff. They were just strong, independent women. So they killed them. Do you know that the C section? was actually invented in Africa by women before it became a medical thing. And no, I'm not telling people not to seek medical attention. And no, I'm not telling them that there were no mortality rates. But we are highlighting a pattern. And patterns matter when you want to understand society and the harm that has been done to a select group within that society. So that's why witch, and that's what I believe a witch is it's a strong, independent woman Who basically has come into her own. And I'm not saying that women who have come into their own and don't call themselves witches are doing it wrong. This is my outlook of it. I want that power back because it was through all of the historical prosecution that they took a lot of that power away from us. Leigh/@followtheleighder: It's I've done a lot of American, European subtle like my background is Swedish and s and Scottish with a little bit of American indigenous. So I've studied these like and I don't claim these, like I'm not walking around saying I'm indigenous or I'm Scottish. I'm swe it that's not what but I but it's it's the women in my ancestry that I've studied specifically wanting to know what at each generation what they were going through. And and that's why I claim Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Mm-hmm. Leigh/@followtheleighder: that indigenous, because there's a woman in my bloodline who made the decision to marry a white man to not go on the trail of tears. Like that's a a real survival story. Like, Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Real thing, yeah. Mm-hmm. Leigh/@followtheleighder: and then on the same token, I was reading about all the Scandinavian and then even like French and German, but how many European women came out, especially the American West and the Rockies and where I am like and Obviously you know, New England too. But they brought in the like you said, the midwife, the doula. They had institutions and training and formal schools back in Europe that these women would go to and they came and brought that to the United States and the all male American Medical Association immediately demonized it. I mean, like and and just what they did to the birthing ritual. At least I can say in the United States. I can't speak for Canadian women's history, but that's why I'm being like very specific right now. But And but I'm sure those patterns still apply. Like it was and even reading about the history of the American Medical Association, I mean, they they actively posted propaganda and sent out propaganda demonizing women in the birth room, saying that they were unclean, they were unhygienic, that only women who are pregnant should now leave their homes and come travel to a hospital, which by the way, they weren't even washing their hands at the time. Like it was like Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah, I know. Leigh/@followtheleighder: So many levels have messed up that you're like, wait, and all of and like this radically different. And it's yeah. So whether it's about healing, birth, like sexuality, all I mean, there are just so many ways that our power was taken. And we don't even know. We don't know. We just like we Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. No. Leigh/@followtheleighder: just we think that the American or, you know, the Canadian healthcare and going to hospitals or just whatever we're and again, I'm not with you. Like my mom is a gynecologist, women's health background. I'm fully supportive of the medical world if that's what you want. But I'm saying who is making those decisions for that system to happen. And Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. Did you ever heard of the Flexner report? So Leigh/@followtheleighder: No, Tom. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: that's how they they abolished and it it started in the United States, actually. I did I cause when I first started digging into it, it was like it started in the United States, and I was like, Did it actually start in the United States? Like the death of herbology and the death of like learning the power of plants. And it did. It's Basically, they've said they sent a man called Flexner to do a survey of all the medical schools. And he spent literally half a day in every single medical school before he decided that what they're doing is wrong. And then Rockefeller showed up with funding only for the schools who abolish anything related to herbalism and Fund petroleum-based pharmaceuticals because they can patent that and they cannot patent plants. I actually you can find that on my feed. I have all the sources, I have gone through all the sequence of it, but it is wild. It is all always follow money. Always follow the money. And it's like so Salem was a land grab. The Flexner report took away with Rockefeller of of course, took away all the power of natural healing. And now we find ourselves trying very hard to get away from all the chemicals and it's practically impossible. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. my gosh. That's a whole you just sent me down a rabbit hole for the weekend. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Ha ha ha ha. Leigh/@followtheleighder: That's I mean, I mean, we could go on and on. I mean, again, I I do a lot of Wild West women's history, so what a Rockies and pioneer settler indigenous and and that's a thing too when you look at a lot of indigenous communities, again I'm sure it's up in Canada too. nations had women in leadership roles, negotiating roles. there were even women at the war council because it was their Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. Leigh/@followtheleighder: sons that they were debating sending. Like it was and they had treaty negotiation powers in the United States would not work with the women who held leadership roles. That was I mean, out west they were like, No, we won't even talk to them. And how it forced the tribes to to then take on this Christian patriarchy that wasn't theirs. Like it like Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. Leigh/@followtheleighder: and how it changed them. And it's just my gosh, to see the effects are are so lingering. Can you talk about I know that we kind of went down into a negative space, you're you're back on on on with the healing. Can you give us, I know that your work is primarily deep, deep self investigative work. But for folks that are just like really starting to wrap their head around this, what are some some small rituals or some resources, books? I I know we'll we'll we'll promote your your following in just a second, but what are just some little ways that they can build something for themselves? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: So a very transformational book for me is Braiding Sweetgrass. I think that's exactly the title of it. It talks a lot, like it's it's a good deconstruction book to start looking at things from a different way. there's another book, but the author has become quite problematic. But the book had good things in it. it's called The Body Keep Score, and there are alternatives to it, but that's one that I've read. That's why the name stuck. I could send you some alternatives to that one, but it also talks about how trauma gets stuck in the body, actually, and not just in the mind, which is why I say what I say, and I sometimes get a lot of hate for it. Talk therapy is not the full picture and it's not enough. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Amen. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: It is a good starting point. It's a place where you find your patterns, and it does it cannot clear the Energetic residues that stay within your body. And you know, I get hate for that, and it's fine. And then I'm like, I go to talk therapy. And I find my patterns in talk therapy. And then I go to one of my friends that I actually studied with. We both did this journey together, and we work with each other because every practitioner needs a practitioner too. And I also warn people not to fall into the trap of I need to constantly be healing. It doesn't work like that. You can do deep work and you take time. You need to integrate that. You need to live with that change. You need to embody that change. And maybe along the way, something else happens and then you need to work on it again. But the fact of the situation is in the wellness industry, it's like. You constantly need to be healing, and or you're not advancing or you're not doing self-work. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Right. Right. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: you you know, like if you're constantly healing, you're not accomplishing anything. Because after Leigh/@followtheleighder: Right. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: the healing, you need to take time and you need to Leigh/@followtheleighder: Mm-hmm. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: figure out who you are again, and you need to basically apply that into your everyday life. So I think also for people if they're interested, start. Reading about hypnosis. There's a there's a book. Let me look, it's on my shelf. This one. It's called The Wizard Within. So this book will transform what you feel about your unconscious mind and its abilities because self-hypnosis is a thing. And if you are wary about letting someone hypno hypnotize you, start by doing it yourself, to yourself. And once you experience that, then you might be more open to allow other people to work with you, right? So small ritual every single day. I swear by meditation, and I will preface this by saying meditation for women, your mind will not go blank. We are women. It is impossible for our mind to go blank. That's a very masculine way of looking at meditation. Just sit with yourself. Because when you teach yourself to sit with yourself in silence for five minutes every day, you will learn so much about who you are and the patterns running in your head and also what your body wants to tell you. Because you will start literally feeling your body. We don't feel our bodies. We sit here and we're like, go, go, go. And then you just relax and you're like, My little toe is like not feeling so great today, you know? Very subtle Leigh/@followtheleighder: Yeah. All right. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: nuances. So that's a very good one. Another smaller one that I do, and you probably see it. I light a candle every morning with intention. It's a three second thing. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Right, right. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: But it just takes that thought, puts it into a word, and words are spells. Your words carry energy. So when you say and say it out loud, that's the key. You say it out loud. You take that intention. And for me, I took this candle this morning, lit it up, and I was I had a was working with a client before our podcast. And I like, my intention is for this client to have the best transformation they're looking for today. And I just put it there. And it did. It did. She left with Huge smile on her face. That always makes me so happy. Leigh/@followtheleighder: You are just such a beautiful soul and a beautiful mind. I'm so thankful that you were with us today. Just I really Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Thank you. Leigh/@followtheleighder: hope that you can come back and we can continue this discussion. maybe we'll find, you know, maybe a a new topic or different topic comes up we can do a deeper Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah. Leigh/@followtheleighder: dive on. But can you let folks know in the meantime where they can follow and learn more about you? Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Yeah, so I'm on Instagram and Facebook for the most part. It's at the stemistwitch. I do have presence on YouTube, but I'm not active there yet. And I have a sub stack that I'm just starting to look at. So I'm mostly on Instagram and Facebook. I do my best to respond to most of the people who send me messages. I get a lot of messages, and I can also be found through Linktree. And that's also the Steminist Twitch where you can find more details about my retreat and some of the fun stuff that I've worked on, which are free diagnostics to get to know yourself better. I do have a free olive oil grimoire because I'm Lebanese and we have olive oil. And what you'll notice if you actually download that is that I do put the neuroscience behind why every single ritual works. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Well. Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: Again, just because it's science doesn't make it less magic. Leigh/@followtheleighder: I'm just so excited for you, Mary. Thank you. Thank you. well, folks, y'all gotta let me know down in the comments what y'all thought about this conversation. I had a good time. If you have any questions, please like let me know what they are so I can ask them on the next go around the next conversation, Mary. I I I'm serious. I hope you come back. I Mary Maksoud, @thesteministwitch: I would love to come back and I want to thank you so much for reaching out when you did. So I'll tell you guys, very authentically, she reached out. I was still a much smaller creator when you reached out, but you just saw something there and you know, th the time is confirming what you saw. This message, you know, is is resonating and I'm very happy with that. And I'm also very happy that you, you know, had this conversation with me today. Leigh/@followtheleighder: Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, folks, like I said, let me know what your comments are down in the comments. Don't forget to like, follow, subscribe. You know the drill. This has been another episode of Follow the Leighder. I'm your host, Leigh Larson, and until next time, see ya.