Latest / Marci talks money (and life) / Money Progress Does Not Require Perfection with Clorissa Ritchie
Transcript
- Marci Grossman (00:16) Hello, I am MoneyMarci. Welcome. I am thrilled to welcome today's guest, Clorissa Ritchie. Clorissa is a senior content specialist at Westerra Credit Union in Denver, Colorado. Clorissa's nearly nine years of experience in the financial services industry has been fueled by her passion for making complex information accessible. She believes that content is more important than marketing - it's a way to advance financial well being, build trust, and spark advocacy. As a Colorado Young Credit Union Professional (CYCUP) and Community Resources Inc. board member, Clorissa has led financial literacy initiatives to empower communities. Recognized as Westerra's volunteer of the year in 2025, Clorissa proudly drives DEIB (Diversity, equity, inclusion and belonging), advocacy, and process improvements in the credit union industry, ensuring meaningful impact in her community and beyond. Welcome Clorissa. Clorissa (01:24) Thank you, Marci. Marci Grossman (01:26) So tell me, how did you get here? How did you end up in these positions in the credit union? Clorissa (01:32) I've always really been passionate about learning and I am obsessed with knowing all of the mechanics of how a credit union works. I love every inch of it. I love to learn all of it. And I think that passion for learning has taken me to where I am. I spend a lot of time in the branches and the contact center working with the members directly. And that led me to marketing, which has been a really unique path because I don't come from marketing. Which is very untraditional for an individual in a marketing path, but I think it gives me a little bit of a superpower because I've worked directly with the members. I've sat with them, I've talked to them, I've heard their stories. So when I'm speaking to my community, it's really coming from that lens of I'm talking to my community directly. I'm talking to my members, I'm not looking at necessarily the analytics and the statistics behind it. I'm very passionate about making everybody feel really comfortable with money. Marci Grossman (02:24) So if your background isn't marketing, what is it? Clorissa (02:29) Primarily it's member facing and sales and being in the branch and leading teams. I was a branch manager for a long time, assistant manager, I was a banker, a teller, I worked in contact center. So most of my banking experience came from being in branch. Marci Grossman (02:44) Okay, so you started and worked your way up. Clorissa (02:47) Yep. Marci Grossman (02:49) I've frequently told people that banks and credit unions are a great place to start on financial literacy. You've got these financial professionals already there with information to share. So if you could tell us a little more about what your credit union offers and how you're involved in that. Clorissa (03:05) Yeah. I think in general, even any credit union in the United States, you know, we're here for members. And I think that with technology being at our fingertips, we're exposed to so much information and it can be a little bit overwhelming. And I think that, we're a very technology driven society right now, but I think there's still a really important role that humans play in that. And I think that there might be not as much knowledge to know that you can just walk into a financial institution and ask questions and they'll set you up on the right path and you don't have to have the answers. You don't know you don't have to know which questions to ask. You just tell them your goals and they'll help you get there. Marci Grossman (03:46) Yeah, it's really important to take that first step to start the conversation because otherwise nobody knows what you know or don't know, what you understand. Sometimes it's hard to do because you don't even know where to start. But walk in there, wave the white flag and say, Hey, I want to know more about whether it's your account or lending or whatever other things you think the credit union might offer. Clorissa (04:12) Yeah. Marci Grossman (04:13) Now I love that you like to talk about money dysmorphia because I think that's a great phrase. I haven't heard it called that before, but I think it's important to understand that people don't understand their money and there's that connectivity. A great term. Tell me about that. Clorissa (04:31) We actually conducted a study within the Denver metro area that came to the conclusion that a lot of people, especially generationally, and it doesn't necessarily mean it's one generation against another. Every generation was posed with different challenges throughout growing up and what they heard about money growing up. And I think that really it set them on a path of how they felt about money and how they view money. And I think there's also a misconception that money isn't deeply emotional. People say there is no emotion in math, but money comes down to how you feel about where you're headed, whether it's now or building generational wealth for your children or planning for retirement, or I'm in retirement now, but I'm worried that maybe I'm not set up for success. So money dysmorphia at its core really comes into a lot of people are doing significantly better than they think they are, but they believe that they're behind the curve or they're not doing as well as they really truly are. Marci Grossman (05:32) Did you grow up talking about money? Do you feel when you ended up at the credit union that you had a good starting point? Or was that really where you started learning about financial information? Clorissa (05:46) Yeah, I would say that working at a credit union, I started pretty young. I was in my twenties when I became a teller at Westerra Credit Union. And everything that I've learned about money really has been because I work here. When I wanted to buy my first house, I asked a mortgage loan officer that I knew that worked at Westerra, like, I want to buy a house, what do I do? And she set me on the right path. And I've when I became a branch manager, I would tell my young tellers, like, this may not be your forever career, but really absorb the knowledge that you're learning here because it's going to help you. It's going to help your loved ones talk about money. Because growing up, no, we didn't talk about money in that sense. You didn't grow up hearing about it. It was usually taboo to talk about how much money you make. It was, there was really a stigma around it and and then a pressure to present that you're doing maybe better than you are and it's shameful to talk about money if you're not doing well. And it prevents people from feeling comfortable to talk about where they are and ask the questions because they feel like I should know this already. I should have this information. I know better. I know what I'm supposed to be doing, but I feel ashamed because I'm not. Or I feel like everyone's doing better than me. And it's just not that way. Everyone Everyone has their own individual challenges with money and it's not as always easy as it seems or sometimes it is easy as it seems. It's just have the conversation. It's okay. Marci Grossman (07:11) What are your thoughts on how to work toward destigmatizing those money conversations? Clorissa (07:17) I think vulnerability and being okay with talking about it, opening up the conversation, being a safe space and an understanding that everybody has a story to tell and it's okay to ask for help. It's okay to ask the questions. It's okay to talk about it. I think that's really the first step is just being more open to talking about it because I think that people will realize that you know, money isn't it doesn't need to be a taboo thing. And again, we're really into this space where we believe people are doing better than they think. And even if there is a hurdle they have to overcome, you there's always a path to start. You're never doomed. There's always a path forward. There's always steps to take. Marci Grossman (08:01) Do you have kids? Clorissa (08:02) I do, I have three. Marci Grossman (08:04) Okay. And are you talking to them about money differently than what you did or didn't do growing up? Clorissa (08:10) Yeah. and I I haven't always been perfect either. ⁓ I've been learning a lot through our work with money dysmorphia. I've learned a lot through really doing the research behind money and mental health. And I realized too where I kind of miss the mark with some of my children on, you know, my middle child just thinks that money is fluid and just buy me this and buy me that and he doesn't really think about it. Whereas my oldest has kind of developed a little bit of an anxiety around money. She is an obsessive saver. She is constantly telling us don't spend money on that. So it's interesting to see the polar opposites. And I think, you know, we I have to open up the dialogue a little bit more with them and help them understand that money is a tool and it's not something to be scary. It's not fluid. We have to work for it. Yes, savings is important, but it's not something that you need to lose sleep over. You know, so it's different. I think every child is a little bit different and the conversations should be approached based on your instincts as a parent and talking to your kids, but it is important to talk to them about it based on where they are and what their needs are. Marci Grossman (09:20) Right. And that's that's a really important point you bring up 'cause here are your two children and they're brought up in the same house, probably seeing the same things and the same conversations around money and they've interpreted it totally different, which just really highlights how much you actually have to have these conversations and not just assume that that what you say the first time is soaked in and interpreted the way you want to around something as complex as money. Clorissa (09:50) Yeah, and I think financial literacy, what we've really learned too in our work here at Westerra is that financial literacy at its core is not enough. You know, it's one thing to teach people what a CD is or a money market or a checking account, what is a debit card, how does a credit card work. Like that's all important, yes, but in a world where financial literacy is at our fingertips, we can easily find a definition for those terminologies. That doesn't necessarily mean that I'm gonna know what my spending habits are or that, you know, the money dopamine hits that come from your shopping online are going to be curved, you know, it's a habit, it's a behavior and you have to recognize what those triggers are and what your goals are and if your behaviors are aligning with what your goals are. Marci Grossman (10:39) Right. Now I know you're interested in the connection of money and mental health and how they influence each other. What got you there and and what would you like to share with the audience to help them repair these relationships? Clorissa (10:56) Yeah. ⁓ when we landed on our brand, which is You Can Do Money, it was a very positive message that we wanted people to know that money isn't as intimidating as one might think. And you know, you're doing better than you think you are. And wherever you are in life, there's a path forward for you. And that your credit union, your financial institution, we're here to back you up on it and we're here to support you. The money and mental health connection that I made, I started thinking, okay, well, we can tell people that they can do money, but what does that mean? And the underlying of it is the behaviors. You know, if you tell me to go build an airplane, I'm maybe not going to believe you, but if I'm given the tools and the resources to go build the airplane, then I can probably confidently do so. Maybe not. But it really put me in a space where we started researching. Marci Grossman (11:49) Yeah. Clorissa (11:52) mental health behind it and you know the dopamine and the spending for instance and or maybe the anxiety like my daughter has right now about obsessive saving. Like, yes, that's great, but you don't need to be so worried about it. So I just think that there isn't a lot of knowledge that money does directly impact your mental health. It makes people feel less than or, you know, worried because they're not doing as well as they think they are. It's very you can it can lead to depression and a lot of people are affected in just some of the recent like desktop research that we've been doing and kind of looking at the other research that individuals or companies have done initially is the mental health is a very big proponent of money. Marci Grossman (13:25) How can someone begin healing their relationship with money without feeling overwhelmed or ashamed about it? Clorissa (13:32) I think you know, really initially it's just opening up that conversation and I think acknowledging it is really where we are starting. It's identify what's causing it, identifying the trigger, and then working towards those behaviors. And it's also just being a little bit more gentle with yourself and breathe. You know, I think when we wrap ourselves up in the emotions of money, or we start spiraling with the stress and the depressive moments where I'm not doing as well as I think I am. Or, you know, am I going to be able to provide a long-term sustainable life for my children? What about college? What about after that? If can I even think that far? ⁓ it's just take a breath, look at the now, look at the steps now and the baby steps. And I think the other thing with it, you know, and it it's always it's so situational. So it's difficult to answer this question. So it applies to everyone. And I think the biggest key is that everyone's situation's different and that's okay and there is a path forward for you. You just need to look at the now and figure out what is my next step, what's the action that I need to take right now, and then move forward in baby steps and be forgiving. If I make a mistake, if something comes up, it's not the end of the world. I don't need to beat myself up about it. Just keep moving forward, keep stepping forward. It's gonna be okay. Marci Grossman (14:53) Right. Sometimes the hardest thing for people to realize is there isn't perfection. There isn't an absolute right answer. Everyone's situation, everyone's background, everyone's vocabulary, we're all coming into it from different places, from different emotional feelings about money. I mean I I love the dopamine hit when you buy something and then it sits in the back of the closet with tags on it. And then that becomes the anxiety part of it is, my God, I spent this money on something I'm never gonna use and you gotta find the balance for yourself and recognize that there isn't going to be perfection and sometimes it's hard to recognize progress when you're not seeing a perfect path. Clorissa (15:42) Yeah. And I think instant gratification culture has really played a part in that. And you know, I work in a lot of the search engine. So we we analyze a lot of search behavior on the internet and you know, people looking for side hustles and quick ways to earn money, it's not always quick. Your solve is not always gonna be quick. Sometimes the path ahead is a little bit longer. You're not going to have the debt paid off in a month, you're not gonna buy the house in a few months, you know. Sometimes maybe you are in a position that you don't realize, yes, the time is now and you're ready to go. And sometimes it's the path ahead is a little bit longer. And I think you really just have to be realistic and analyze your situation, partner with a financial institution or, you know, a partner, a financial partner that's gonna help guide you through that path and just be patient that sometimes the path ahead is a little bit longer. Marci Grossman (16:35) So what kind of financial literacy initiatives have you been involved in? Clorissa (16:41) We've done curriculum development. So when Colorado passed the financial education mandatories for schools, I wrote a curriculum for the teachers because one of the gaps that I I saw was that there wasn't a lot of resources being offered for the mandatory financial literacy. So that's available for free to teachers to download if they want. They can use it how they please. It's got tests, it's got lessons, it's got worksheets. And then we I've also written presentations for all ages in Colorado and we've been in classrooms. That's a pretty common credit union initiative for us to go into the classrooms and teach the basics of financial literacy. But more than that, I really look at life cycle content and financial education for adults. So on our website at westerracu.com, we have a learning section of the website that kind of goes high level into debt management or managing finances as a family, rebuilding my credit, really any sort of life cycle, planning for retirement. I really try to offer content to help anyone in the life stage that they are in. Marci Grossman (17:57) So that means even adults who don't know anything about financial literacy or don't know something about a financial topic they're interested in, there's a lot of resources available pre-written on your website so they don't even have to talk to anybody. But they could come into the branch and say, Hey, I wanna talk to somebody and you have people at the branch who could kind of help educate them and and answer their questions. Clorissa (18:23) Exactly. Yeah. I mean, generally if you're just starting out and you have some questions, digital resources are great. If you're someone who's more comfortable talking to a person, that's great too. I mean, everybody learns differently and I think that's what's so important about financial literacy and financial education is offering the resources in the way that someone learns. Marci Grossman (18:47) Yeah, it's important and we're switching from a time where nobody was taught anything about money, nobody talked about money, to an era where we have so much financial information available. Whether you're talking about banks and credit unions and their websites or financial professionals or even social media where there are probably thousands of people you can follow to share financial information who may or may not know what they're talking about, but they've got followers, so, you know, sometimes it's too easy to judge someone, well, if they've got a million followers, they must know what they're talking about. What can we do to bridge that gap and help people not feel going from overwhelmed because they don't have any information to overwhelmed because they have so much information. Clorissa (19:39) Yeah, I see that as a huge challenge and I've seen people come into the branch when I was a branch manager and ask me questions where they were confident that putting a car on a credit card was a good idea because someone on social media convinced them that it was. It can be very dangerous and it I think it's important for you to vet the resources that you're using and understand that the internet is full of information and some of it can be very dated, especially in the age of AI. AI is scraping the internet, so it could be serving you a resource that was taking place during the pandemic and is completely inaccurate now because the climate is different now. So there's that part of it where it's so important to really understand the individual you're taking advice from on the internet or the resource that you're using is current and accurate and understand where it came from. And really just take it as the surface level information. I firmly believe that it's just better to talk to a human about your personal information because a human is gonna be able to understand your emotional side of it. It's gonna understand where you're coming from, give you information based on what you're saying. And maybe the conversation shifts a little bit because you've said something that changes the landscape of it, you know, it's that open dialogue that a professional that is passionate about what they're doing is gonna be able to help guide you on. And I think it's gonna help just give that breath of fresh air. It's gonna be okay. We're in this together. I've got someone in my corner and I'm not being consumed or overwhelmed with all of the information being presented to me online, which in a lot of cases can make me feel worse because you know, this person's living a lavish lifestyle and all you have to do is, you know, sell on marketplace or something to that nature. And it's it can be overwhelming. It can set you up for defeat and make you feel even worse. Marci Grossman (21:33) And when you see it on social media, that doesn't mean that's really what you're seeing. You're not necessarily seeing the truth. I can put myself on a green screen and be living on a yacht. By the way, I am not living on a yacht, but just so you know, with AI I could be. but you know, you talked before about emotion and math and money and there's no emotion in math except crying but there shouldn't be any crying in math. But money is a it's a lot of emotion because it impacts so much of your life. You come with this past of whatever you learned or think you learned or took away from what you saw your parents doing to having to start being on your own and making those decisions, the ones that you feel concerned about, the ones you should feel concerned about and don't. All of these are are little pieces that keep adding up and there's a lot of emotion in money. And it's important to recognize that emotion that sometimes it's telling you something you need to know and sometimes it's baggage from before and going to financial professionals and learning more about your money gives you a better way to make those decisions maybe with a little less emotion and a little more logic, but emotion is always going to be a part of it because money is this tool and this resource and it's not unlimited. Clorissa (23:03) Yeah, exactly. That it that's spot on. You know, recognizing the emotion, understanding the emotional baggage part of it, I think it plays a role for all of us. I mean, we all grew up with money around us in some sense. And it doesn't matter what era you grew up in, it presented itself, whether it be positive or negative. Some of us were fortunate to have a family member who really taught us the right way. And I don't think this information again is applicable to everyone. Some people, you know, really have everything together. They feel confident. They were taught. They had everything in line. But there's always gonna be a moment where maybe you are unsure and maybe there is a hurdle that you're trying to overcome. And it's just always good to have someone that you can count on to trust and and talk to, whether it be a close friend or relative or a financial professional if you're obtaining advice. But I think at the core of it is just destigmatize it and be okay talking about it. Marci Grossman (24:06) Absolutely. Clorissa, before we wrap up, do you have anything else you'd like to mention that maybe we haven't covered? Clorissa (24:12) Yeah, I think that, you know, through all this work, I've heard a lot of great stories and a lot of great moments that have really inspired me professionally and personally. And I think that what I've what I've truly uncovered through all of my conversations is just it is it is deeply emotional, but there's always there's always this moment where you've connected with that person when you open up the dialogue and the conversation that like creates the safe space. And I've heard stories that you know, when someone was financially struggling, they kept $100 in their wallet. And as long as it was there, they knew they were okay. And that meant so much to me. And it really it carried with me. And, you know, even in my personal finances, I I started practicing that. I was like, you know, I need to keep money in my savings account because it's gonna make me feel more secure. It's gonna make help me. It's gonna build a habit. So I think wherever you are in life, just start the habit small. Savings start small. You don't need to go big or go home. Just start small, even if it's five dollars in your savings account because and just know like I've got this, I'm doing it, I'm gonna be okay, I'm gonna move forward one step at a time. Marci Grossman (25:22) Great. Clorissa, thank you so much for being my guest today. We appreciate you taking the time to join us here. Clorissa (25:28) Thank you, Marci. I appreciate you. Marci Grossman (25:31) And to my listeners, I will be sharing a link to Clorissa's information in the show notes. Please check her out. There is a lot of good information there. And don't forget to subscribe, leave us a review, and stay tuned. I'll see you next time. This has been MoneyMarci on Marci Talks Money (and Life). You got this.