Latest / The Ultimate Intimacy Podcast / 252. What Happens When You Try To Change Your Spouse? And How Does That Impact Intimacy?

Transcript

252. What Happens When You Try To Change Your Spouse? And How Does That Impact Intimacy? · The Ultimate Intimacy Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: You are listening to the Ultimate Intimacy Podcast, where we discuss how to find ultimate intimacy in your relationship.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: We believe that, no matter how many years you've been married, you can achieve passion, romance, happiness and ultimate intimacy at any stage of your life.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: Join us as we talk to not only marriage experts, but couples just like yourself and people who are just flat out fun.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: The Ultimate Intimacy Podcast is for couples who have a good relationship but want to make it even better.
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the Ultimate Intimacy Podcast with Nick and Amy, and we're going to start out by apologizing If I sound like I'm going through puberty.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: The plague has hit our household and we've all just been sick and hacking for like a week.
• 0:55
  Speaker 2: It's been like pretty bad.
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: So, anyways, if Amy and I are hacking or we sound like we're, uh, going through puberty or whatever, then you'll know the reason why I sound fine, you look fine too but you look smoking hot, I sound fine.
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: There is there is nothing, it's just nick, it's going through, there is nothing sick about amy.
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: She's looking amazing.
• 1:20
  Speaker 2: So, anyways, today's podcast is our thoughts on what happens when you try to change your spouse.
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: Have you ever tried to change me?
• 1:30
  Speaker 2: I, you know I was thinking about that and I would say, you know, a lot of people are probably thinking you know what?
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: What would what does it mean to change your spouse?
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: And I think there's things that obviously are healthy, your spouse, and I think there's things that obviously are healthy to try to get your spouse to change right, like biting your nails right.
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: So trying to get your spouse to not bite their nails, that would probably be a pretty healthy thing to try to get them to stop doing.
• 1:58
  Speaker 3: Or exercise.
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: Or exercise or things like that.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: But what we're talking about today is really trying to change.
• 2:05
  Speaker 2: You know bigger things, right?
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: Something that's not little, or or you know minute like that.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: Um, something bigger would be like trying to get your spouse to change their personality, or trying to get your spouse to change the way they think, or you know almost and again we'll kind of find a balance here but trying to trying to get them to change, to become exactly what you want them to be in your eyes, or what you think the perfect spouse looks like, I guess.
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: That doesn't work.
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: That absolutely does not work.
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: In fact, this is an episode we took a poll on because we want to show how ineffective this can be and how it can be very detrimental to your relationship as well.
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: So I'd say let's jump in start with the poll, read the poll answers, hear what others have to say about the questions we posed and then jump into why you shouldn't try to change your spouse and why that can be so detrimental.
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: Because I think we all do it, we almost all do it.
• 3:18
  Speaker 3: I'm totally guilty of that.
• 3:20
  Speaker 2: Oh, what have you tried to change with me?
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: Do you want me to start?
• 3:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, I'm just, I will save that for another day.
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: Have you ever tried to change your spouse?
• 3:30
  Speaker 3: 68% of our audience said yes.
• 3:35
  Speaker 2: And I wonder how that worked out for them 68%.
• 3:37
  Speaker 3: I'm actually shocked that it was only 68%, Because I feel like that's a pretty vague question and I think there's something that I don't know, even if it's like tiny little thing, like there's got to be something that we wanted to change.
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: Well, like I said, absolutely there's little things that we're going to want to change, but we didn't really specify in that question.
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: So I'm surprised it wasn't higher.
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: So we said if so, what were the results?
• 4:03
  Speaker 3: Did it hurt or help your marriage?
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna guess that like this was a 99 percent of the time it would hurt the marriage this is really big poll.
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: I'm surprised how many people answered this.
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: Um.
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: I'll just read some of these quick doesn't work, hurts, hurts.
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: Certainly did not help.
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: Cause more resentment.
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: Not successful.
• 4:24
  Speaker 3: Created more resentment, hurt, hurt.
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: I got like a hundred answers that just said hurt.
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: Um, it helped because he's seen the reason it was bad and then wanted to change nothing.
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: Stayed the same.
• 4:37
  Speaker 2: Okay, but I want to.
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: I want to hit on that one.
• 4:41
  Speaker 2: He saw what needed to change, so he was the one that made the changes, not his spouse trying to force him to change.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: I think that's a big difference?
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 4:53
  Speaker 3: It just said he helped because he saw the reason it was bad and then wanted to change.
• 4:58
  Speaker 3: Yeah, it takes some wanting right.
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: Like you can't force it.
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: People change every day, but they rarely change direction.
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: That's the problem resistance.
• 5:07
  Speaker 3: And after so many years she finally agreed it was the proper thing.
• 5:09
  Speaker 3: It did help.
• 5:10
  Speaker 3: Um, we got married young, so changing each other was almost needed, like growing up.
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: I actually like that answer because I do like I feel like a lot of us.
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: There are things that just, I think, naturally change when we get married.
• 5:27
  Speaker 3: We do just kind of grow up.
• 5:28
  Speaker 3: I mean we were young and I was 21 and I've changed.
• 5:33
  Speaker 2: Oh, and I have too.
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: I know, but I don't think it was like you need to do this or you need to do this.
• 5:57
  Speaker 2: I mean that's.
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: I think most people are pretty, I don't want to say stubborn, but I think the natural man is like don't tell me what I try to change your spouse.
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: It's not just a black and white like everyone's going to look different, but overall you know what are the devastating effects of trying to get your spouse to change, whether it's changed the way they think and, and sometimes again, that's not necessarily always a bad thing, but but oftentimes it can be it can be really, really hard.
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: I mean, we've dealt with this in our marriage.
• 6:26
  Speaker 3: I mean you come from different backgrounds and then you try to change their mentality.
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: It doesn't work.
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: It doesn't work um, I guess that's.
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: It's just hard.
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: I mean, I think that's why marriage is so hard is because you come from totally different paths, totally different upbringings, you have different mentalities on so many things like different perspectives, perspectives work, religion, just all those things, and you come together and like you can.
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: You can date a really long time and think that you know someone, but it almost takes marriage to really test that.
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: Do you know what I mean?
• 7:02
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 7:03
  Speaker 3: Um, anyways, I'm just going to finish some of these.
• 7:04
  Speaker 3: Uh, nothing worked.
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: Probably hurt, hurt ask for more effort.
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: Changes are always temporary.
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: Hurt definitely made my husband not feel respected.
• 7:15
  Speaker 3: We're going to talk about respect.
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: Um, he's so resistant even though he realizes that it would be good.
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: So that's stubbornness.
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: It hurt my marriage when I started praying for both of us, change actually started happening.
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: Um, changing each other drove a wedge between us, causing anger, bitterness and resentment.
• 7:33
  Speaker 3: There's a lot of those answers.
• 7:36
  Speaker 3: Um, made him mad, helped it first.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: Hurt at first, helped later.
• 7:40
  Speaker 3: Hurt, hurt, hurt, hurt.
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: Define the word change.
• 7:45
  Speaker 3: Some change could be a safety issue, therefore necessary.
• 7:48
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I wouldn't say I tried to change my spouse, did nothing, still just the same.
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: No intimacy, I mean, it just goes on and on and on hurt, hurt, hurt, hurt.
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: I can't change her, I can't change him and I like this one and pray and change my heart instead.
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: I love that.
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: I could keep going on all day long.
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: I got a lot of answers on this poll.
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: I love that because oftentimes it's maybe us that needs to make a change, for things to change, rather than trying to force your spouse to change to conform with what you think is the perfect spouse.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: Making a change and looking inwardly and saying, okay, what can I change or what am I missing?
• 8:33
  Speaker 2: That can affect change as well.
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: I think this is a tough topic because I don't think change is always bad, so I don't want to say that I'm against changing your spouse.
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: And so I don't want to say that I'm against changing your spouse.
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: I think that there are certain personalities, like if someone's like dealing with like anger, anger issues, low temperament, like that kind of thing, like helping them learn to be more patient or changing that aspect, or like a negative thing.
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: I think that can, it's how you do it.
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: I love it.
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: It's how you do it.
• 9:01
  Speaker 3: It's not that change is bad.
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: Like I have things that I would would.
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: I would look at myself and be like I should change that.
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: But if I'm forced to change that, like if you're like trying to change that on me, that would be negative to me.
• 9:14
  Speaker 3: But if I look at myself and I'm humble and I try to change it myself, it's a good thing.
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: It's about how you do it.
• 9:20
  Speaker 3: It's about how you go about it, right.
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: I love it and I think you're right on.
• 9:23
  Speaker 2: It's completely about how you do it, or how you approach it.
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: What your I mean what your purpose is right, right, like, is it selfish or is it that you truly can help or benefit your marriage with the both of you?
• 9:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I love that you said that.
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: Is it a selfish reason, right?
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: Do I want to change you because of a selfish reason?
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: Or is it literally something that will help our marriage and you personally?
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: That's how you go about it, right?
• 9:51
  Speaker 2: I mean a great example is, you know, I think dealing with someone who's maybe overweight, right, Like this could be approached in two different ways.
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: You could look at it and say, hey, I want us both to exercise and lose weight and be healthy so that we can live long, happy and productive lives together and be able to do things when we retire and things like that.
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: Versus, you know, I want you to lose weight because I need you to look good for me, I need my wife to look a certain way, or my husband to look a certain way, or you know things like that.
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: Like you know, you can get the same result, but kind of looking at them two different ways or approaching them two different ways.
• 10:35
  Speaker 3: It's always motive behind it, right, yeah, yeah, exactly yeah.
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: Is that a selfish motive?
• 10:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think that's kind of what we'll hit on.
• 10:42
  Speaker 2: Is you know, really, like you said, motive?
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so I think that's kind of what we'll hit on.
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: Is you know, really like you said?
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: I love how you said how, um, we try to change our spouse and so, um, I think I think, starting off, it can be really hurtful depending on how you approach it, because if I go to you and start trying to get you to change certain things um the way I want them to be changed, that could be really hurtful because it then makes you feel like, well, am I not good enough?
• 11:15
  Speaker 2: Does he not love me for the way I am?
• 11:18
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you know who I am, things like that.
• 11:24
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: It's hard.
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: It's hard because we get into marriage and I don't know.
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: I think we're all just, we're all guilty of this.
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: It's a hard topic because there you get into things, things get hard, you start having trials and personality traits come out that you didn't see when you weren't going through stuff like that right, like I think that we realized, we realized, oh, we have different personalities when things get really, really tough and they don't usually get tough until into the marriage, start having kids or have career issues, right yeah and then all of a sudden you're like I don't like that quality or something.
• 11:59
  Speaker 3: How do I fix it?
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: And you can't fix each other.
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: So you and I have both seen couples that have really tried to change their spouse or control them in certain ways.
• 12:12
  Speaker 2: What have you noticed about those type of relationships?
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: I mean, I'm thinking of a certain couple that I know, where the wife is nitpicking every little thing and trying to get her spouse to conform with exactly what she wants, and I I, I could see a huge um, how do I say this?
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: I could see a big impact on that person, um, based upon the way they were being treated and and how their spouse was trying to change them.
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: But what are your thoughts?
• 12:47
  Speaker 3: Well, I think this is where it starts affecting intimacy.
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: So when someone is not happy or trying to change somebody's personality or whatever it is about that person or their spouse, they start probably nagging or putting them down or just bugging right and it starts either making you feel depressed, lowers your self-esteem, and that affects all areas of intimacy, right Like emotionally.
• 13:22
  Speaker 3: You're just not going to feel connected when someone's making you feel like this.
• 13:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, especially if you're feeling like man, they don't love me for who I am and for my different, unique things, and that I think differently or do things differently, um, you can see how that would be really devastating when someone's trying to change you to be exactly what they want yeah but, I think some couples do get into marriage thinking they can do that and like it doesn't work like that absolutely.
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: I think it really creates unrealistic expectations, like if, if you come to me and said you know, we're constantly or even trying to get me to change certain things like my personality, who I am, different things like that I would feel like man, I'm never going to be able to live up to what she wants from me or what she expects.
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: It's always going to be something she's trying to change this, this, this so it'd be really hard to live up to those expectations and I would always feel like I could never achieve those expectations, which would be very difficult the whole conversation kind of gets me thinking like, do you actually love the person?
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: because if you're trying to change everything about them or major things about them, do you really love them for who they are?
• 14:36
  Speaker 3: I don't know, maybe that's a question you know well, exactly, but I know things come up in marriage that you didn't realize and I, it's just, I don't know.
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: It's tricky.
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: Well, and I think too, like our, our, like you said, the way we were raised, or the different perspectives, uh, or perceptions on things, those can be good things, that can help us get to see like a different point of view or, um, things like that.
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: So I think oftentimes it's good when we do look at things differently or we do things differently as well.
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: For sure Humility.
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly.
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: Perspective Yep.
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: I think too, when we try to change, when you try to force change on your spouse, you you wrote a lot of trust, um, you're obviously, you know, presenting those feelings of insecurity or they're going to your spouse is going to feel the feelings of insecurity, probably mistrust things like that.
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: That can obviously be be devastating 100% 100%.
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: How do you feel about communication?
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: What do you think happens when you, as a spouse, are trying to change or get your spouse to make changes?
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: What do you think happens to the communication?
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: that in any.
• 16:11
  Speaker 3: I think that when you're trying to either put down or nag about something that you don't like about your spouse, I think that they automatically are going to start to shut down right like I've heard that.
• 16:18
  Speaker 3: I've heard that, I heard that and then you start playing that game.
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: We played it before in our marriage oh, for sure um and it all became.
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: It all came from different upbringings and different perspectives.
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: And then, well, let's let's share that.
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: Let's I mean let's share that okay so, you know, amy, amy grew up to where her dad worked two or three jobs.
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: He was working, you know.
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: It seemed like 20 hours a day, yeah, and it was like the harder you work, the more money you make.
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: And growing up for me, my dad would constantly tell me work for yourself, work for yourself, don't work for someone else.
• 16:53
  Speaker 2: And so when Amy and I got married, that was something we saw totally different views on, and for a while we tried building a business and I was so dead set on that that I was like, no, this is my job, I don't need to go get a job, this is going to pay off.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: And Amy's perspective was hey, you got to do whatever you got to do and work two or three jobs, if you have to, to support this family, or one, or one or one.
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: And I was like, no, my dad one or one and I was like no, my dad, you know, I was brought up that I want to own my own business, I don't want to work for someone, right?
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: So those were two different, totally different perspectives on how we looked at things and they were totally opposite and neither one's right or neither one's wrong.
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: But that caused a massive amount of conflict, a disconnect in our marriage, almost to the point where we got divorced because of the financial issues that that caused.
• 17:51
  Speaker 3: And I felt like a lot of times during the marriage Amy was trying to get me to change that perspective, so to speak speak, and I absolutely am 100 going to agree with that because after years and years and years and years of having a husband without a job, I was like I was not raised like this.
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: Like a man puts food on the table and then I had to turn around and go be the working person and I was like what's going on?
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: I'm being the mom and now I'm being the dad too, and that was really rough on our marriage, like that almost broke us.
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: No, and I was what kind of man like doesn't go get a job and provides for his family and makes his wife do that.
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: Like I I was.
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to lie.
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: Like I was, I was having a rough time.
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and, like I said, from my, my perspective, I was like, okay, I am working, even though I'm not getting a steady paycheck.
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: The things that I'm doing are going to be able to pay off.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: Anyways, that's an example of two different perspectives to where neither one's right.
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: But I couldn't convince her about changing to my way, necessarily, and she wasn't going to convince me about changing to the way she felt.
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: But obviously we found a balance and and things got better.
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: And you know I won't go into all the details, but suffice us to say our relationship's awesome Things are great and we had to have that communication.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: But for a while, for a while it was very difficult to where the more she tried to change me or the more I tried to change her.
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: The more stubborn.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: The more stubborn we became and the more disconnected we became.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: And that's just kind of one example of, you know, trying to get our spouse to change to conform with what we believed.
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so I'll give a positive I'll.
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: Can we talk about a positive change?
• 19:48
  Speaker 2: yeah, absolutely okay so.
• 19:50
  Speaker 3: So that was a negative.
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: I mean, that was a really negative experience for us, but it came out being positive because we had to grow together as a couple.
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: Right, we're like, well, we're not getting divorced, we're going to make it through this, and this is what needs to change for both of us.
• 20:04
  Speaker 3: We had to find some common ground and turn our life around.
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: When we first got married, probably a year in, we started doing some business deals, real estate deals, and Nick brought in a couple friends that were partners, and Nick is a very like passive, very like passive, sweet, kind, peacemaker personality, which is awesome.
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: That's why he married him.
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: He's, he's amazing like that.
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: He was getting like how do I say this?
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: not walked all over, but like a peacemaker you were a peacemaker in a couple of these partnerships that were that were rough, and I felt like I, I need you, you should be more aggressive, you should be more aggressive.
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: And I think this is one of the situations like the people were talking about like, after a while, so many things happen that you realize, oh, I, I do need to maybe tweak this a little bit so it's not working because it's not working this way and it ended up being a great thing.
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: But the whole reason I bring that up is like it had to be something that he wanted to do, and vice versa with things that I've had to change about myself, like it's more the way you bring it up, like this isn't really working.
• 21:17
  Speaker 3: Maybe try this, but if you approach it with your spouse, and how?
• 21:22
  Speaker 2: how can I support you?
• 21:24
  Speaker 3: how can I support you?
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: Do you, do you agree?
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: Do you agree with that?
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: How can I support you?
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: like it's all about your tone and how you bring up something right, because there are good changes to make sometimes in your marriage, like I've learned a lot from his personality for my personality, that I've changed from him and and I would say both you and I, from when the day we got married to where we're at 22 years later, have made drastic changes for sure.
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: But the changes haven't been because I've tried to change you or you've tried to change me.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: The changes have been because we've sat down together as a couple and said, hey, what's what's working, what's not working, what?
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: And I think, utilizing our strengths and weaknesses better too.
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: I think earlier on I would try to utilize my weaknesses in areas where you should have been, you're the strong one in, maybe those areas and where we work together, rather than me trying to figure out how to get through areas where I'm weak and vice versa.
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: Right, like you know, now, now we're able to work together, I recognize there's areas I'm weak in and the areas I'm weak in, amy's typically strong and vice versa, although I don't know areas that you're really weak in.
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: Whatever, I have plenty.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I think we've really learned as well to recognize our weaknesses and strengths.
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: Rather than trying to change each other, embrace each other, because the areas I'm weak in and Amy's really strong I can really lean on her for that, and I, and vice versa, and so, instead of trying to change each other, we recognize that hey, these, these are actually good qualities and maybe we can balance each other out and work together on those and that's the moment that marriage changes is when it's just like arguing or fighting or disagreeing or anything else in your marriage.
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: The moment you realize you're a team and you're only going to win together, not being against each other.
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: That's the only way marriage works.
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: The minute we it was like year 10 or 12, you've heard our story the minute we sat down and be like this isn't working.
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: We got to make drastic changes right now, together, and we got to focus on moving forward as as a team and quit being against each other.
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: That changes everything, and so when you're trying to change your spouse in a negative way, that can't happen.
• 23:53
  Speaker 3: Right, that can't happen.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I keep going back to what you said earlier on is it's all about how you approach things?
• 24:01
  Speaker 2: Um, changing your spouse, about how you approach things, changing your spouse.
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: I would I like the term getting your spouse to change versus changing your spouse yes or helping, helping your spouse to change.
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: I guess helping your spouse to change if they, if it's something that they recognize should be changed right correct and that takes humility.
• 24:23
  Speaker 3: a lot of couples don't have humility anymore.
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: Like you get to a hard place in your marriage where you feel like they're always nagging or they're always like complaining about something and you kind of put up a wall like I don't want to hear it, like you'd start distancing yourself.
• 24:35
  Speaker 3: And once you put up that kind of wall, it's almost like a I'm sick of being disrespected kind of thing.
• 24:43
  Speaker 3: It's really hard to break that back down.
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: So it's it's key to like how you do it, how you say it and how you approach it.
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: Like it's it's.
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: It's a very careful thing, yeah, and one of the biggest things too, I think.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: When a couple tries, or a spouse tries, to change their other spouse, that other spouse is really going to feel a loss of like individuality, right, like who they are.
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: When they're trying to be conformed to a certain way and fit in this certain box and look a certain way.
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: It's really going to make them feel like they're changing who they are, right, right.
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: So if, if Amy came to me and said I don't like, you know your personality, you need to be more serious or you need to do this or whatever, that would be very tough for me because naturally I have a certain personality and I act a certain way, sometimes childish.
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: But my point is is you know, we're going to lose a lot of our individuality and our personality and things like that through trying to force the spouse to change.
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: Well, I mean, you see most of someone's personality when you're dating, right, when you're falling in love, when you're first married, like, you chose that person, probably because of their personality.
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: So I think we have to be very careful to be like I fell in love with that.
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: Why would I want to change that?
• 26:03
  Speaker 3: We don't want to have the same personalities.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: Marriage wouldn't even be as fun, right?
• 26:08
  Speaker 2: yeah, and so exactly, and I think it's important to embrace or try to figure out how you can look at, maybe things that you'd like to change, but how do you look at those as like a strength or a positive or something that's unique with your spouse?
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: I think a lot of couples struggle with like one spouse is and I've heard this from people that I know one spouse is more complacent with their lifestyle versus the other spouse who wants more.
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: And I hear this.
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: I think social media is doing this to a lot of people.
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: I hear this from a lot of husbands like my wife is never happy.
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: She needs more and more and more and more and more, and I just can't give her what all the things she needs.
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: Because I mean, here we are, like swiping on social media and like seeing these fancy lies, fancy vacations, fancy cars, fancy houses, whatever it is, and that stuff costs money.
• 27:01
  Speaker 3: And then the husband wife's are complaining and it's vice versa um, but my husband doesn't make enough, or blah, blah, blah.
• 27:08
  Speaker 3: Like a lot of husbands are suffering with this right now.
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and a husband just wants.
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: All the husband wants is like I don't need all that, I just want a happy wife and family, Like that's what his dream is.
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: Why can't my wife?
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: just be happy, right, like I work really hard to give her everything that I can give her, and that's kind of what's not fair.
• 27:26
  Speaker 3: That I'm seeing in marriages nowadays is that you kind of knew what your spouse was.
• 27:33
  Speaker 3: I mean, when you got married you fell in love and it wasn't about that, right.
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: And then life goes on.
• 27:38
  Speaker 3: You start realizing you need this or this or this, and then you blame your spouse.
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: I don't know, it's just hard.
• 27:43
  Speaker 3: I was like you kind of be careful with that, that wanting and wanting to change, and you're not good enough now because you don't provide enough, and I don't know.
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: I think it's a tricky spot to be in a lot of couples are suffering with this right now yeah, I agree, and I'm glad you brought that up, because that is so true it's so true, but I mean they're, like I said, like if one spouse is like a harder worker and another spouse is a little more complacent or just okay with their lifestyle, that's that's going to issues.
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: But, that's the great thing about change.
• 28:12
  Speaker 3: Can you know balance people out?
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: Like if one person's like, hey, let's work on this, and the other person's like, oh, okay, that's a good idea, Like you can become a team and find a healthy balance there, right?
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: Because, too much of something could be bad too, and I'm glad you brought this up, because this is actually something we talked about at our retreat a few days ago together.
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: Amy brought up and she says I feel like you know, you just aren't as driven or want to.
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: You know what are the words you used.
• 28:37
  Speaker 2: I don't want to put words in.
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: Complacent.
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: Yeah, Amy says I feel like you're more complacent and just okay with things.
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: I said that's not at all the case, but I'm really good at like 5 o'clock or 5.30 or 6 or whatever, when.
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: I'm turning things off, to try to turn things off, and I'm a workaholic Amy could work 900 hours in a day.
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: I could.
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: I literally could.
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: Like my mind never stops.
• 29:04
  Speaker 3: Like my computer never shuts down.
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: Like thank goodness I'm a mom and I have to do that for like my family.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: Like when my kids move out.
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: I'm not to be very careful about when my kids move out, yeah, but this is a great example of just like.
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: You know why.
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: Why are you not this way, you know, or why are you not this way?
• 29:21
  Speaker 2: And so talking about that, and rather than her trying to change me and I'm always telling her you need to relax a little bit more, you know, like so, rather than trying to, you know, change each other as to what we think's right, you know, sitting down as a couple and saying, all right, you feel this way, I feel this way.
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: How do we, how do we find that balance?
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: and, like I just said, we we talked about this at our marriage conference.
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: Actually, we're going to do a full podcast on this, but, um, I don't have my notes in front of me.
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: Um, greg was talking about at our marriage retreat how too much of something can actually be a weakness.
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: Like too much of a strength can be a weakness, and so, like I think of myself as like a work addict and like always trying to do more, be more, start more.
• 30:06
  Speaker 3: Like I have ideas in my head, I'm an entrepreneur, like it's never ending for me and I that has become like it can become a weakness because I don't stop right, like there's a lot of negatives to that and so we do find like it.
• 30:21
  Speaker 3: You can't find a really healthy balance when both of you are different.
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: I think that if couples could be like you're more like this, I'm more like this, I think it's a negative thing and you're like well, I think it's a negative thing and you're like well, I think you're a negative thing If you could look at both sides and be like we can really balance each other out.
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: Like that's what's so beautiful about different personalities is you know what You're kind of right, like.
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: That is too much as can be a negative.
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: And I think that's been a great thing because Nick's like, hey, let's go do something fun, let's go on a walk, let's go, you know, and you have more yellow personality and more fun insight.
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: He wants to go on a vacation and I'm like, okay, like once I'm there, I'm great, it's just getting me there, you know, and it's.
• 31:03
  Speaker 3: I think that, like this is the key to it is literally looking at your differences, the things that you want to change and be like maybe we could just find a balance with that.
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: And I know there's lots of different changes, but yeah, yeah exactly, and that that dives into intimacy, right?
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: So how does intimacy change when you're trying to get your spouse to, I guess, conform to what you want them, or when you're trying to change your spouse?
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: What do you think happens to intimacy?
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: Well, like I said, if there's resentment, if there's resentment at all, I think intimacy goes way down.
• 31:43
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's like we talk about barriers to intimacy all the time, and I think nagging is a barrier.
• 31:49
  Speaker 3: I think resentment's a a barrier.
• 31:51
  Speaker 3: I think resentment's a barrier, I think.
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: I kind of feel like I kind of feel like changing your spouse could almost be like nagging your spouse, right?
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: Because when you're nagging your spouse, you're like why can't you do this, why can't you change this, or I mean, it's basically kind of the same thing in a lot of ways, right, so, yeah.
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: So when I think of changing your spouse, that that word often comes to my mind Basically kind of the same thing in a lot of ways, right, so, yeah.
• 32:12
  Speaker 2: So when I think of changing your spouse, that word often comes to my mind is nagging.
• 32:16
  Speaker 2: And when you have a nagging spouse, like there's nothing worse, you're just like keep them the hell away from me.
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: And you know, you feel like you're walking on eggshells in everything you do.
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: I feel strongly about this.
• 32:30
  Speaker 2: eggshells in everything you do, I feel strongly about this.
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: I think it comes down to I think the opposite of trying to change something about your spouse comes down to appreciation.
• 32:43
  Speaker 3: So I'll give you another example.
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: In my life I've always wanted to change Nick in this way.
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: I've always wanted him to be a cook.
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's true I, he.
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: He tricked me when we were engaged.
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: We got married engaged really fast.
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: I showed up at his house one night this is right after we got engaged and he's like I lied to you, I have something to tell you and I was like, wait what?
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: I kind of freaked out.
• 33:04
  Speaker 3: He was joking, because he's a joker and he scared me no, I didn't say I lied to you.
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: I said there's something I know need you to oh, I haven't told you.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: There's something I haven't told you about me.
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: That's right, sorry.
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: And so I walked in the house.
• 33:17
  Speaker 3: I was a little nervous because I'm like here we are engaged, and he's like I'm not a very good cook.
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: And then he had this amazing meal, like candlelight dinner set how honest I was.
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: I told her that early on that I wasn't a good cook, and yet for 22 years she's expecting me to be a good cook.
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: When I told her upfront yeah, you did, you were honest, okay.
• 33:37
  Speaker 3: So I have spent 22 years trying to get my husband to just I'm like, can you just look at a recipe?
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: Like it would make my day if you just like actually made a meal Right.
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: And I become that nagging like, just cook a meal, just cook a meal.
• 33:51
  Speaker 3: And instead I'm like, okay, he knows how to go to the store and buy some pre-cooked meat, he knows how to buy a box of potatoes, he knows how to buy a bag of salad and a bag of rolls.
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: That's his way cooks dinner.
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: And instead of nagging that he didn't make it from scratch, I should be grateful that he's willing to go to the store and buy some stuff and take care of dinner that night.
• 34:11
  Speaker 3: And that's that's the kind of thing I'm trying to say is like I think that we can change the I'm trying to change you aspect and turn it into more appreciation.
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: I think that is the medicine for this right, like if you are more appreciative, like I love that you are more of a peacemaker, that helps our family, that brings a real balance to our relationship.
• 34:31
  Speaker 3: I'm grateful for that.
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: I'm grateful that you are willing to take over dinner two nights a week, whether it's the kind of dinner that I have in my mind or not.
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: I'm grateful that you're willing to do that, things like that.
• 34:43
  Speaker 3: If we can just be more positive in our relationships and embrace the differences that we have, the different personalities, the different weaknesses, the different strengths Like that's when we became a team and that's when we find ultimate intimacy, when your spouse feels valued and loved for who they are and appreciated for how hard they're working.
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: Like that's when your marriage becomes at a new level.
• 35:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's not that you can't try to help your spouse change, but, as we've talked about through the whole podcast, it's not that you can't try to help your spouse change, but, as we've talked about through the whole podcast, it's how you do it, it's how you approach it and I think just just kind of summarize, you know I mean just pulling that example again if you know, instead of, let's say you have a spouse that's overweight, instead of saying you need to lose weight, you look awful, you, you know this and that that that would be an awful way to try to force your spouse or get your spouse to change.
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: That's kind of verbally abusive too.
• 35:37
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but if, if you approach your spouse and said you know what I really want to participate and do a lot of activities together as a couple.
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: I want us to be healthy, I want us to be able to live and have a really fun retirement, what do you think about getting on a kind of an exercise plan together so that we can be healthier as a couple?
• 36:01
  Speaker 2: I mean, look at the difference in how that is approached to you know, obviously help with change in the relationship, absolutely.
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: Tone of voice.
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: That's all we're trying.
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: I guess bottom line that's all we're trying to get you to do is think of how you can implement change in your marriage as a couple, as a team, versus trying to change your spouse or trying to nag or trying to force that.
• 36:31
  Speaker 3: If you could just change that any kind of nag nagging that comes out of your mouth to compliments or or a form of appreciation like just that, one thing alone could turn your whole entire marriage around, I feel like yeah, for sure I totally agree.
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: So, anyways, we made it through the podcast.
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: I didn't cough, you didn't cough good yeah, people wouldn't have even known we were on our deathbed right.
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: So, um, we hope you enjoyed the podcast.
• 36:58
  Speaker 2: Hopefully next time we'll be a little more upbeat entertaining and entertaining as we start feeling better.
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: But we appreciate all of you listening to the podcast.
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: Please consider leaving us a review and reach out to us let us know what you think.
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: And until next time, we hope each of you listening to the podcast, please consider leaving us a review and reach out to us Let us know what you think.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: And until next time, we hope each of you find ultimate intimacy in your relationship.