Latest / Do You F*cking Mind? / 348. The science behind why a tactical cry is good for you (and crying to sad music too)

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348. The science behind why a tactical cry is good for you (and crying to sad music too) · Do You F*cking Mind?

0:00
Speaker 1: Hello, my beautiful beans, and welcome to the episode of Today.
0:03
Speaker 1: So in today's episode, we're going to be talking about
0:06
Speaker 1: crying and why a strategic cry can actually be good
0:10
Speaker 1: for you. There is quite a bit to talk about
0:13
Speaker 1: and the difference between We're going to be talking about
0:16
Speaker 1: the difference between reflex tears or basal tears, that's tears
0:20
Speaker 1: that you produce just to keep the eye, you know, lubricated,
0:24
Speaker 1: or if something flies into your eye, versus emotional tears.
0:27
Speaker 1: They're actually different and they contain different shit in it.
0:29
Speaker 1: We're going to talk about what gets released when you cry.
0:32
Speaker 1: We're going to talk about what's going on in the
0:34
Speaker 1: brain when you cry, why it's good for you to
0:36
Speaker 1: have a strategic cry. We're going to talk about when
0:39
Speaker 1: you cry to sad music, all of that. We're going
0:41
Speaker 1: to talk about the good and we're going to talk
0:43
Speaker 1: about the potential bad as well, so you get a
0:46
Speaker 1: really good understanding about crying and how it can actually
0:48
Speaker 1: be quite therapeutic for you if done in the right way.
0:52
Speaker 1: So I'm very excited to talk about that. The brain
0:54
Speaker 1: fact is also a very very heavily requested brain fact,
0:58
Speaker 1: surprisingly enough, and we're going to be doing the Brain
0:59
Speaker 1: Fact on EMDR. But before we go into the Brain Fact,
1:04
Speaker 1: I thought i'd give a little life update. It's not
1:07
Speaker 1: even a life update. I just thought i'd give you
1:08
Speaker 1: a little recommendation on something. So I actually finished reading
1:13
Speaker 1: this book a while ago, but I thought I would
1:17
Speaker 1: recommend it to you. And the reason I thought about
1:19
Speaker 1: it is because it was on one of my friends
1:21
Speaker 1: stores the other day. She actually has a podcast as well,
1:23
Speaker 1: a Psychology if your Twenties Gemma. I saw it on
1:25
Speaker 1: her stories and I'm like, fuck, babe, this is such
1:27
Speaker 1: a good book, Like forgot about it. I need to
1:30
Speaker 1: tell my audience about it. And it is The Midnight Library.
1:33
Speaker 1: So if you want an easy but very deep and
1:36
Speaker 1: thoughtful read, and it makes you feel it makes you
1:39
Speaker 1: ask yourself all these really important questions and kind of
1:41
Speaker 1: take a look at where you are in your life.
1:43
Speaker 1: It helps you to be more present and more grateful.
1:45
Speaker 1: It's a great read. I loved it, So the Midnight Library,
1:48
Speaker 1: very good book. Check that out. So there's a little
1:51
Speaker 1: recommendation for the day. And the next thing that I
1:54
Speaker 1: wanted to talk about before we get into the Brain
1:55
Speaker 1: Fact is that I have wanted to do this and
1:59
Speaker 1: I've done on a couple of but I want to
2:00
Speaker 1: do this more regularly. Is to Paul, well not even Paul,
2:03
Speaker 1: but ask my audience certain questions and get your response
2:07
Speaker 1: and read them out on the podcast.
2:08
Speaker 2: So I did this a few weeks ago.
2:09
Speaker 1: Then I stopped doing it, and I'm going to start
2:11
Speaker 1: doing it again because it's so fucking funny. And the
2:13
Speaker 1: reason that I thought about this one is because I
2:16
Speaker 1: was talking with my cousin the other day about really
2:19
Speaker 1: funny reasons as to why somebody dumped you. Funny or
2:22
Speaker 1: shocking or just really random and kind of out of
2:28
Speaker 1: proportion reasons as to why you've been dumped or why
2:31
Speaker 1: you've dumped somebody. And I promise that I'm going to
2:35
Speaker 1: share with you why I got dumped at the end
2:37
Speaker 1: of all of these that I'm going to read out,
2:39
Speaker 1: because I think that I've got a really, really classic,
2:43
Speaker 1: good one. I think it's going to be one of
2:44
Speaker 1: the most random reasons, almost outrageous reasons why somebody would
2:49
Speaker 1: break up with somebody else. So I'm gonna tell you
2:52
Speaker 1: about that after I read all of these, and there's
2:53
Speaker 1: are great you guys.
2:54
Speaker 2: So I asked the question on my Instagram.
2:56
Speaker 1: You guys sent through a bunch and they are very good,
3:00
Speaker 1: so let's just get straight into it. So the question was,
3:02
Speaker 1: what is the most random reason that someone's broken up
3:04
Speaker 1: with you? You could also say why you broke up
3:07
Speaker 1: with someone.
3:07
Speaker 2: Else, and let's get straight into it.
3:10
Speaker 1: Here we go. Because my name is spelled Rachel and
3:15
Speaker 1: not Rachel, so it's two different spelling. Two a's in
3:18
Speaker 1: one name signals crazy. Can you imagine being dumped because
3:22
Speaker 1: you got two a's in your name? They didn't feel
3:25
Speaker 1: obsessed with me, so they dumped me, Like I'm not
3:28
Speaker 1: obsessed with you either, bra Yeah, I know.
3:30
Speaker 2: Okay, this one.
3:32
Speaker 1: I dumped someone because when he ate ice cream, he
3:35
Speaker 1: would get it on his face and he would leave
3:37
Speaker 1: it there. That's like an eck. I know this story personally,
3:40
Speaker 1: and it kind of breaks my heart for the guy.
3:41
Speaker 1: But fair enough, because then you can't really kiss this
3:44
Speaker 1: person if they've got like dairy residue all over their mouth.
3:49
Speaker 2: Anyway, he said, it's.
3:51
Speaker 1: Just not one hundred percent, but really it's because I
3:54
Speaker 1: lost his mom's snorkel in the ocean. Because they got
4:00
Speaker 1: the ick from me from my dog voice when I
4:03
Speaker 1: spoke to my dogs I'd love to hear that. I
4:06
Speaker 1: wish you could send like a voice recording of what
4:08
Speaker 1: that sounds like, so I could agree or disagree if
4:11
Speaker 1: that's a valid dumping reason. Because I didn't work a
4:13
Speaker 1: white collar job. He had to take care of his
4:17
Speaker 1: cats and dogs and finish his thesis, so then he
4:19
Speaker 1: broke up with me. I was dumped because I was
4:22
Speaker 1: too OCD, because I was too good for them. That's
4:27
Speaker 1: such a reason, isn't it When people dump you because
4:29
Speaker 1: you're too good for them?
4:32
Speaker 2: He asked me to be his girlfriend, and this is
4:35
Speaker 2: so good.
4:36
Speaker 1: He asked me to be his girlfriend, and three days
4:38
Speaker 1: later I received a text message saying consider yourself single
4:43
Speaker 1: and never heard from him again. The balls to do that,
4:50
Speaker 1: like who is this person and what are they doing
4:52
Speaker 1: now with their life? I wonder It's like, where are
4:54
Speaker 1: they now? We should do a where are They Now?
4:56
Speaker 1: Series for Crazy Xes? Because I loved my job too much.
5:00
Speaker 1: It's like, don't be too passionate. Turn that down because
5:06
Speaker 1: they needed to love themselves more and find themselves. He
5:11
Speaker 1: wanted to say together, but said he could never love
5:14
Speaker 1: me because he just didn't have it in him.
5:18
Speaker 2: So why does he want to be with you.
5:19
Speaker 1: I don't understand. Oh this is a good one, because
5:22
Speaker 1: he didn't want to use his phone credit, texting me
5:25
Speaker 1: this was in high school. Fair enough. You know you've
5:28
Speaker 1: got to do what you got to do to save money.
5:32
Speaker 1: His therapist told him to. He was never in therapy,
5:36
Speaker 1: and therapists will never say that. Actually, therapists should never
5:39
Speaker 1: say that. However, I got dumped as an adult in
5:43
Speaker 1: my twenties by someone I really liked, loved, actually someone
5:46
Speaker 1: I loved together for years, and he told me that
5:49
Speaker 1: His therapist said to him, quote, you are delaying the
5:53
Speaker 1: inevitable by staying with her. Then he dumped me.
5:58
Speaker 2: So I don't know if a therapist to actually say that.
6:00
Speaker 1: I don't know if that's the right thing to do,
6:02
Speaker 1: but yeah, I feel your pain. We've all been there, well,
6:05
Speaker 1: at least you and I have been there. So there
6:07
Speaker 1: you go. Because I didn't support the football team that
6:10
Speaker 1: he did, because I was a vegan. I got dumped
6:15
Speaker 1: by my fifteen year old boyfriend when we were fifteen
6:18
Speaker 1: because he didn't have time for a relationship. We were
6:21
Speaker 1: fucking fifteen. You're a nice girl and all, but you
6:25
Speaker 1: swear too much. That would be me. I feel I've
6:31
Speaker 1: got like a what do you call it? Garbage mouth?
6:34
Speaker 1: Can't date you because you are vaping every blue moon.
6:38
Speaker 2: Okay, I found out from ask FM.
6:42
Speaker 1: Someone asked my ex about me and he said that
6:44
Speaker 1: we had split. Imagine, imagine. I'm guessing this is like
6:47
Speaker 1: a radio show and you just heard about it on
6:49
Speaker 1: the radio. Because I didn't want to have kids with
6:52
Speaker 1: him right away, because I was a student and he
6:55
Speaker 1: was jobless. The height of people who have no financial
6:58
Speaker 1: means who demand to children beyond because I refused to
7:04
Speaker 1: leave my dog home alone overnight, and then you got
7:07
Speaker 1: dumped because you care about your child. The Quran told
7:10
Speaker 1: him he had to because I spoke to his friend.
7:14
Speaker 1: It turns out that he was a Jehovah's witness and
7:16
Speaker 1: wanted to fuck around before being baptized. Then he had
7:20
Speaker 1: to dump you after the fact because I was too thoughtful.
7:24
Speaker 1: He said, I just wanted sex. You clearly wanted something more.
7:28
Speaker 1: I lasted as long as I could his mom. His
7:32
Speaker 1: mom and dad didn't approve and offered money to end it.
7:36
Speaker 1: He's ausler. He needed to find himself, but twenty four
7:39
Speaker 1: hours later he was dating his ex. Uh didn't have
7:44
Speaker 1: enough time to be the boyfriend that I deserved, but
7:46
Speaker 1: then dated a girl with a kid and not her up.
7:50
Speaker 2: My perfume gave him a headache.
7:54
Speaker 1: He ghosted me, and then he sent me a message
7:57
Speaker 1: months later saying, I hope you understand with a love heart.
8:03
Speaker 2: Yes, I understand perfectly.
8:05
Speaker 1: His parents thought that I was average looking and my
8:07
Speaker 1: parents had more money, so he felt threatened. His parents
8:12
Speaker 1: didn't approve of me because I wasn't a doctor, okay,
8:18
Speaker 1: because I didn't listen to a band's catalog in order
8:21
Speaker 1: of release. I was too loud during sex because I
8:26
Speaker 1: wasn't thick enough, and then last one because of a
8:30
Speaker 1: weird vibe he had after a conversation, but he never
8:34
Speaker 1: even explained what that vibe was.
8:36
Speaker 2: These are great.
8:37
Speaker 1: I think this hopefully will help other people feel a
8:39
Speaker 1: bit more empowered all or a bit more like Oh yep,
8:43
Speaker 1: this is just more common practice to be dumped for
8:45
Speaker 1: really outrageous reasons. Now I'm gonna explain to you, or
8:50
Speaker 1: just quickly tell you why I got dumped. I once
8:52
Speaker 1: got dumped. I was seventeen, he was twenty or nineteen
8:55
Speaker 1: at the time, and we had been dating for I
8:58
Speaker 1: think not long. Thank fuck. It wasn't long for many reasons,
9:02
Speaker 1: but anyway, we weren't dating for long.
9:03
Speaker 2: I was into it.
9:04
Speaker 1: I was into this guy and he dumped me like
9:07
Speaker 1: probably a month in. Because if you're not Australian, I'll
9:11
Speaker 1: explain this in a second, but if you're Astralian you'll
9:13
Speaker 1: get this because he was stressed because he needed to.
9:17
Speaker 2: Renew his Medicare card.
9:21
Speaker 1: Firstly, like props for creativity on that reason to I
9:27
Speaker 1: think I can think of a thousand more logical reasons,
9:30
Speaker 1: even if they're fake, to dump someone.
9:31
Speaker 2: But because you need to renew your Medicare card first.
9:34
Speaker 1: For those of you that aren't in Australia listening to
9:35
Speaker 1: this podcast, your Medicare card is a government issued card
9:39
Speaker 1: to every single Australian citizen, including children, that you present
9:43
Speaker 1: when you're at the doctor so you can get free
9:46
Speaker 1: health care or rebates on your health care where the
9:49
Speaker 1: government pays for a portion of it. So when you
9:51
Speaker 1: go to the hospital your Medicare card and then you
9:53
Speaker 1: don't have to pay anything. Right, your Medicare card gets
9:57
Speaker 1: sent out to you automatically. There's no process to renew.
10:00
Speaker 1: It runs out and you get mailed a new one.
10:03
Speaker 1: This kun't was stressed about his Medicare card, and so
10:10
Speaker 1: he dumped me. Like, in hindsight, that is a brilliant, brilliant,
10:15
Speaker 1: brilliant But luckily I wasn't too affected by it, maybe
10:19
Speaker 1: deep down because I'm like, this guy's an absolute like
10:23
Speaker 1: wet piece of bread.
10:24
Speaker 2: So we're really no one's losing anything.
10:26
Speaker 1: But I mean, imagine that happening to you if you
10:29
Speaker 1: really were in love with someone. That would just be
10:31
Speaker 1: such a blow because you're like, I know, that's not
10:33
Speaker 1: the reason anyway. Okay, let's get straight into the brain
10:38
Speaker 1: factor of today. I'm going to explain to you what
10:43
Speaker 1: this EMDR is and why it is a good treatment
10:50
Speaker 1: for PTSD and also other things as well, but in
10:52
Speaker 1: particular PTSD. So EMDR is I movement, desensitization and reprocessing. Okay,
11:02
Speaker 1: So it is designed to treat post traumatic stress disorder PTSD. Okay.
11:09
Speaker 1: So it has quite high or quite similar efficacy as
11:13
Speaker 1: in how effective it is in PTSD when you compare
11:16
Speaker 1: it to other psychological interventions and also when you compare
11:20
Speaker 1: it to pharmacological interventions as well. So if you look
11:23
Speaker 1: at a lot of studies around it, it is quite
11:25
Speaker 1: effective at treating patients with post traumatic stress disorder. Now,
11:30
Speaker 1: it's basically EMDR is basically a therapy designed to address
11:36
Speaker 1: any kind of condition that's stemming from traumatic memories. So
11:39
Speaker 1: the method basically involves moving the eyes in specific ways
11:44
Speaker 1: while you are reprocessing traumatic memories.
11:47
Speaker 2: So you're retrieving these traumatic memories, but your eyes are.
11:50
Speaker 1: Being moved in specific ways, and the aim is to
11:53
Speaker 1: help individuals heal from these distressing experiences quicker than other therapies. Now,
11:58
Speaker 1: it is based on this AIP model, which is adaptive
12:02
Speaker 1: information processing model. Now there's, by the way, there's many
12:04
Speaker 1: theories as to why e MDR works, but I'm only
12:08
Speaker 1: going to brush over a few because they're all theories.
12:12
Speaker 2: But it works.
12:13
Speaker 1: But the underlying reason as to why it works is
12:15
Speaker 1: a little bit it's debatable as to why. But it's
12:19
Speaker 1: based around this adaptive information processing model which is developed
12:23
Speaker 1: by Francine Shapiro. And this AIP model explains that the
12:27
Speaker 1: brain stores normal and traumatic memories differently, So how we
12:31
Speaker 1: store these traumatic memories is not normal, and traumatic memories
12:36
Speaker 1: are often stored in a way that prevents.
12:38
Speaker 2: This healthy healing.
12:39
Speaker 1: Hence, why we then have all these other issues that
12:41
Speaker 1: crop up when you have PTSD, So this causes ongoing distress,
12:44
Speaker 1: it causes sensitivity to related stimuli, all these other issues,
12:49
Speaker 1: and these improperly stored memories can then trigger overwhelming fear
12:53
Speaker 1: or anxiety or panic anger, especially in response to sounds
12:58
Speaker 1: or smells or sites like any any trigger. Basically, so
13:02
Speaker 1: what's happening here is during a md ARE therapy, individuals
13:06
Speaker 1: access these traumatic memories in a controlled environment. You're with
13:09
Speaker 1: a therapist and you combine these recalling of these traumatic
13:14
Speaker 1: memories with eye movements and guided instructions from the therapists.
13:18
Speaker 1: You don't do it alone, you do it in therapy,
13:20
Speaker 1: and the aim of this process is to help reprocess
13:25
Speaker 1: how that memory is then restored in the brain and
13:29
Speaker 1: therefore repair these mental injuries from these memories. Okay, so
13:34
Speaker 1: basically you're the aim is to bring them to the
13:36
Speaker 1: surface while you're doing these iron movements, and you're trying
13:40
Speaker 1: to make them less distressing and more manageable and reconsolidate
13:44
Speaker 1: them in your mind in a healthier way. Now, a
13:47
Speaker 1: big part of this therapy involves something called bilateral stimulation,
13:51
Speaker 1: like moving your eyes back and forth while thinking about
13:53
Speaker 1: the traumatic memory. So this apparently helps the brain process
13:57
Speaker 1: the memory properly. When you're doing this by lateral movement,
14:01
Speaker 1: you're using more areas of the brain. You're engaging more
14:04
Speaker 1: areas of the brain, and the theory behind that is
14:06
Speaker 1: that that helps store the memory differently in a way
14:09
Speaker 1: that's not going to traumatize you in the future. Now,
14:11
Speaker 1: one of the standout features of DR is this duel
14:15
Speaker 1: attention task. So this means that while you're focusing on
14:18
Speaker 1: the worst part of a traumatic memory, you are also
14:21
Speaker 1: following the therapist's fingers moving side to side. Okay, so
14:24
Speaker 1: some studies did find that this I movements the em
14:28
Speaker 1: part of the AMDR, the I movements is crucial for
14:32
Speaker 1: the success of the therapy, while other studies didn't see
14:35
Speaker 1: much difference when they compared EMDR with and without the
14:39
Speaker 1: I movement. But more there's a lot of research that
14:43
Speaker 1: basically says that as long as you're getting this bilateral stimulation,
14:49
Speaker 1: whether it's with I movement or without eye movement, you're
14:52
Speaker 1: still going to get a lot of positive benefits. So
14:54
Speaker 1: there's so basically we know that it works. Some people
14:57
Speaker 1: say the I movement is crucial for it. Some people
14:59
Speaker 1: say as long as you're getting by lateral stimulation. It
15:01
Speaker 1: doesn't have to be arm movement and it's still going
15:03
Speaker 1: to work. But there's no harm in doing the I
15:05
Speaker 1: movement component of it. So that's the original what okay? Now,
15:12
Speaker 1: early EEG studies found that emda's eye movement might change
15:15
Speaker 1: how the brain's hemispheres interact, and that means that it
15:19
Speaker 1: helps people recall these episodic memories. So we're not exactly sure,
15:25
Speaker 1: like I said, what causes it. But for those of
15:27
Speaker 1: you that are interested, it's effective. They've found it to
15:30
Speaker 1: be effective. If you want to try it. It's not
15:32
Speaker 1: going to be.
15:35
Speaker 2: Invasive as such.
15:36
Speaker 1: You're doing it in a controlled environment with a therapist,
15:40
Speaker 1: and I think give it a go. If you're interested
15:42
Speaker 1: in trying it, why not. It's not harmful. And that's
15:45
Speaker 1: basically what's happening. So we're seeing that for whatever reason,
15:48
Speaker 1: movement within the brain, some studies support the interhemispheric movement
15:52
Speaker 1: is what helps the reprocessing of this trauma so it
15:57
Speaker 1: becomes a memory and not a traumatic memory anymore.
16:00
Speaker 2: So interesting.
16:01
Speaker 1: Now let's get into the hectic topic of today's podcast,
16:06
Speaker 1: which is crying and why it is actually good for
16:11
Speaker 1: you or why a strategic cry is good for you
16:14
Speaker 1: and can help with.
16:14
Speaker 2: Your mood overall.
16:16
Speaker 1: Now, we've all fucking been there, right, We've all been
16:19
Speaker 1: in a position where we're in a lot of pain
16:21
Speaker 1: and then the only thing that helps is to cry
16:24
Speaker 1: it out. We need to, just like, we can't think
16:26
Speaker 1: about anything until we sob it out, either alone or
16:29
Speaker 1: with someone who supports you. And once you've cried, you
16:32
Speaker 1: actually feel a sense of relief, You feel a bit better,
16:34
Speaker 1: you feel like you don't need to cry anymore. It's
16:37
Speaker 1: you know, it's it's healing. And the idea of holding
16:40
Speaker 1: in your tears can be so painful, and it stops
16:43
Speaker 1: you from focusing or being in touch with the people
16:45
Speaker 1: around you and the conversations. Sometimes I've tried to withhold
16:48
Speaker 1: tears and it's been so detrimental for me. It's just
16:51
Speaker 1: been absolutely awful. And I probably couldn't even tell you
16:53
Speaker 1: what happened during that time frame because I was so
16:55
Speaker 1: heavily focused on holding back the tears. So let's talk
16:58
Speaker 1: about why it is so good to cry it out
17:01
Speaker 1: and why a strategic cry every now and then that
17:04
Speaker 1: is like moments where you allow yourself to cry where
17:07
Speaker 1: you almost like schedule in a cry can be very beneficial.
17:11
Speaker 1: So we're going to be talking about what happens in
17:12
Speaker 1: the brain when we cry, the hormones and neurochemicals involved
17:15
Speaker 1: in emotional tears versus other kinds of tears, what happens
17:19
Speaker 1: when we hold back tears in times where we want
17:21
Speaker 1: to cry, and so this repressive coping, and how it
17:24
Speaker 1: can be bad for our health. We're going to talk
17:26
Speaker 1: about music evoked sadness as a way of self soothing,
17:30
Speaker 1: So crying to music or putting on sad music to cry,
17:33
Speaker 1: why that can be good for you, And the difference
17:35
Speaker 1: between crying and making yourself think bad thoughts. Because I
17:40
Speaker 1: don't want this podcast to come across as confusing when
17:42
Speaker 1: I talk about suffering versus pain and all of that,
17:45
Speaker 1: so I will be addressing what I mean by that,
17:47
Speaker 1: And then at the end I'm going to talk about
17:49
Speaker 1: is there anything bad about strategically making yourself cry?
17:53
Speaker 2: Okay, So, one of the things that happens when we.
17:55
Speaker 1: Cry emotional tears is that it is a way of
17:59
Speaker 1: releasing stre hormones. Okay, there are stress hormones in your
18:03
Speaker 1: tears that you cry during an emotional crying session, that
18:08
Speaker 1: does not exist in these reflex tears or basal tears. Okay. So,
18:13
Speaker 1: for example, things that get released to prolactin. Prolactin is
18:17
Speaker 1: a hormone that got its name because it gets reduced
18:20
Speaker 1: during lactation and breastfeeding, But prolactin is a mood stabilizer
18:24
Speaker 1: as well, so it's also released men and women. Everyone
18:28
Speaker 1: has it, but it derives its name because it's heavily
18:31
Speaker 1: linked to lactation. You release oxytocin in your tears, right,
18:37
Speaker 1: which is like a bonding neurochemical helps you bond and
18:42
Speaker 1: feel like closer to other people. It. You release something
18:47
Speaker 1: called a drenocorticotropic hormone lou Okay, this one, I always
18:53
Speaker 1: say it wrong, luen kefalen, which is a stress hormonetas,
19:00
Speaker 1: and manganese. Okay. So the release of all of these
19:03
Speaker 1: actually help regulate your body's stress. And the aim of
19:07
Speaker 1: this release of these hormones in the tears is to
19:10
Speaker 1: bring you back to homeostasis when you are crying for
19:15
Speaker 1: the most part, unless they're like really happy tears and
19:19
Speaker 1: it's all joy and you're crying, But when you're crying,
19:21
Speaker 1: you are under stress, under a level of stress or
19:24
Speaker 1: intense emotion, and your body is trying to aid you
19:27
Speaker 1: in returning to homeostasis. So the release of these tears
19:31
Speaker 1: is actually very beneficial. So you're actually flushing out the
19:35
Speaker 1: things that you want to flush out.
19:36
Speaker 2: It's really really interesting.
19:37
Speaker 1: Those things don't exist in reflex or basal tears, Okay,
19:41
Speaker 1: tears that just exist there to lubricate your eyes. Repressive
19:45
Speaker 1: coping is where you are trying to cope by not
19:49
Speaker 1: thinking about these memories. Now, I'm going to talk a
19:51
Speaker 1: little bit about repressive coping versus forcing yourself to think
19:55
Speaker 1: of sad memories. When I talk about pain versus suffering,
20:00
Speaker 1: I talk about pain being inevitable and suffering being a choice.
20:04
Speaker 1: When you are hit with a wave of emotions and
20:08
Speaker 1: they are painful emotions, that is pain, That is you
20:10
Speaker 1: experiencing pain, and I believe and it's not you know what,
20:14
Speaker 1: it's not a belief. The science shows that when these
20:18
Speaker 1: emotions arise, it is a lot healthier to delve into
20:23
Speaker 1: the emotions and experience them, whether that mean to cry,
20:27
Speaker 1: to feel frustrated, to name your emotions, to vent to
20:31
Speaker 1: somebody else, to talk about your feelings out loud, either
20:35
Speaker 1: alone or with somebody else.
20:36
Speaker 2: It is a lot healthier to do that than to repress.
20:40
Speaker 1: So to when you get this wave of emotions, to
20:42
Speaker 1: say I'm not gonna cry, I'm gonna cry, distract, distract, distract, distract, distract,
20:47
Speaker 1: not let yourself feel anything, Drink away your pain, get
20:53
Speaker 1: on your phone, do all these things. The science shows
20:57
Speaker 1: that repressing as a form of coping is very bad
21:00
Speaker 1: for you for many reasons because you're not actually dealing
21:04
Speaker 1: with your emotions, so you're not learning and you're not
21:05
Speaker 1: getting that healing. It crops up and affects all kinds
21:08
Speaker 1: of other situations for yourself in the future, So it
21:10
Speaker 1: increases your level of fear for other situations because you
21:13
Speaker 1: didn't deal with it. It changes your attachment style because you
21:17
Speaker 1: could become more avoidant because you're not dealing with your
21:20
Speaker 1: own emotions, so you become less empathetic, less sympathetic when
21:23
Speaker 1: you don't allow yourself to be in touch with your emotions.
21:25
Speaker 2: Which is really interesting.
21:28
Speaker 1: And now this I didn't look into a study of this,
21:31
Speaker 1: but this could also be because women cry five times
21:34
Speaker 1: more than men, at least that's what's reported, roughly five
21:37
Speaker 1: times more than men, and women are also way more
21:40
Speaker 1: in tune with talking about emotions with each other, and
21:43
Speaker 1: they're very sympathetic, very empathetic, versus men who often will discuss,
21:49
Speaker 1: you know, events and circumstances, but are less likely. I mean,
21:53
Speaker 1: the generation is coming through are a lot better, and
21:54
Speaker 1: there's a big push for men to talk about their emotions,
21:56
Speaker 1: but they're less likely likely amongst men to be discussing
21:59
Speaker 1: emotional things on a regular basis like women do. So
22:02
Speaker 1: that could be some sort of a link where women
22:04
Speaker 1: are more likely to cry and therefore more in touch
22:06
Speaker 1: with their emotions and therefore more empathetic and sympathetic at
22:10
Speaker 1: least when it comes to emotional things like crime. Another
22:13
Speaker 1: thing that happens is that when you have this repressive
22:17
Speaker 1: coping strategy, it is linked to cardio vascular disease, hypertension,
22:23
Speaker 1: higher stress, higher levels of anxiety, and higher levels of depression.
22:28
Speaker 1: So not crying and repressing is linked to all of this.
22:33
Speaker 1: So when you feel the emotion, that's not you suffering.
22:36
Speaker 1: I never want you to think that when I talk
22:38
Speaker 1: about pain versus suffering it means don't feel your emotions.
22:41
Speaker 2: I'm all for and I do.
22:42
Speaker 1: Say this in these episodes, but when I brush over
22:44
Speaker 1: that statement, I want you to realize what I mean.
22:46
Speaker 1: Feel your emotions, go through them, and experience them for
22:49
Speaker 1: what they are suffering is I'm feeling pretty good today,
22:54
Speaker 1: Let's fucking open my fucking Instagram and go on my exes,
22:58
Speaker 1: feed and and ruin my day.
23:02
Speaker 2: Cock block myself from having a good time.
23:04
Speaker 1: Have demons create all these problems for myself because I've
23:08
Speaker 1: chosen to dig. It's like when you think I check
23:12
Speaker 1: your ex's phone, I mean check your partner's phone to
23:14
Speaker 1: see if they're texting anyone jig. That's suffering. You're causing
23:16
Speaker 1: yourself suffering. You know you're trying to dig for clues
23:21
Speaker 1: that something bad's going on. That's suffering. Okay, But pain
23:25
Speaker 1: when an emotion is arising should be felt so you
23:28
Speaker 1: can work through it and not try and avoid it. Okay.
23:31
Speaker 1: So suppressing your emotions actually makes them worse. It heightens them,
23:35
Speaker 1: it internalizes them, it grows inside of you, it does
23:39
Speaker 1: not go away on its own. Okay.
23:41
Speaker 2: And doing this chronically so not once off.
23:44
Speaker 1: If you do this as a once off, you're ultimately
23:46
Speaker 1: going to be fine. But if you do it chronically,
23:48
Speaker 1: if you're someone that never expresses your pain. It's going
23:52
Speaker 1: to cause you obviously anxiety and stress, but it's going
23:55
Speaker 1: to make you irritable, give your short fuse, it's going
23:58
Speaker 1: to affect your sleep, and then of course all all
24:00
Speaker 1: of that is going to lead to long term health
24:04
Speaker 1: conditions as well. So if you need to cry, cry,
24:09
Speaker 1: and I'm not saying cry even in the most inappropriate times.
24:13
Speaker 1: I understand that you might be talking to your boss
24:16
Speaker 1: and they say something you think it feels unprofessional to cry.
24:19
Speaker 1: That might be the case for you, and that's fine,
24:20
Speaker 1: don't cry in that moment, but then always allow yourself
24:22
Speaker 1: to then feel that after if you've been like, holded in,
24:25
Speaker 1: hold it in, go to the bathroom after it, have it,
24:28
Speaker 1: let it out, let the tears out, and then you'll
24:30
Speaker 1: notice you're like, oh.
24:31
Speaker 2: Okay, I needed to cry, feel a lot.
24:33
Speaker 1: Better call someone and cry it out on the phone,
24:35
Speaker 1: where you're like, sometimes I just call my my poor
24:37
Speaker 1: fucking mum. I think a lot of moms bear the
24:40
Speaker 1: brunt of the children's emotional outbursts, But sometimes I'll call
24:43
Speaker 1: my mom and be like, no, I just need to
24:44
Speaker 1: tell you everything that's get it off my chest.
24:47
Speaker 2: And I'm like oh, I feel so much better.
24:48
Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to me because I was able
24:50
Speaker 1: to cry and get it out in that moment.
24:52
Speaker 2: Okay, so crucial. It's so important.
24:55
Speaker 1: And for those of you that are in that position
24:57
Speaker 1: where you're like, well, I never really cry in the
24:58
Speaker 1: moment because I don't want to feel embarrassed or whatever,
25:01
Speaker 1: because you know, some people have this link to feeling
25:03
Speaker 1: embarrassment and they cry. The good news is that delayed.
25:08
Speaker 1: It's called delayed. So that's where you delay your cry.
25:12
Speaker 1: You had a really horrible thing go down, you suppressed
25:14
Speaker 1: it because you didn't feel like it was appropriate to
25:16
Speaker 1: cry in the moment, or maybe you're alone in public,
25:17
Speaker 1: you're like, I don't want a stranger to console me.
25:19
Speaker 1: I'm not crying in public. You hold it, hold it in,
25:22
Speaker 1: then when you let it out later, studies have shown
25:24
Speaker 1: that this delayed catharsis still produces very similar results to
25:31
Speaker 1: crying in the moment. So where you release, it's self soothing,
25:36
Speaker 1: it's calming, it's cathartic, you feel a lot better.
25:38
Speaker 2: You still release those hormones that you need to release.
25:41
Speaker 2: So putting on sad.
25:42
Speaker 1: Or emotional movie or music and using that opportunity to
25:46
Speaker 1: let yourself cry out the bottled up emotions from that
25:49
Speaker 1: day or from your week. It actually still has very
25:53
Speaker 1: very similar effects to crying in the moment. So if
25:56
Speaker 1: you're somebody that prefers to do it that way, if
25:58
Speaker 1: you're somebody that doesn't like to cry in front other people,
26:00
Speaker 1: but you still want to be in tune with your emotions,
26:02
Speaker 1: then just putting on a sad song or a sad
26:04
Speaker 1: movie is going to have very similar benefits for your mood,
26:08
Speaker 1: for your mental health, for the overall healing and catharsis.
26:11
Speaker 1: So that's a really good good thing to know now,
26:14
Speaker 1: I want to Oh and also, studies have also shown
26:18
Speaker 1: that crying delayed or in the moment helps improve healthy attachments,
26:24
Speaker 1: secure attachment, closeness with other people, and of course empathy.
26:28
Speaker 1: So and the reason for this, why it helps improve
26:32
Speaker 1: attachment is because you're not avoiding. You are facing your emotions,
26:37
Speaker 1: and you're allowing yourself to be in your emotions, and
26:40
Speaker 1: you're realizing that when you feel your emotions, it's actually
26:44
Speaker 1: not the worst case scenario. There is actually a level
26:48
Speaker 1: of you actually feel this weird, it's so funny.
26:52
Speaker 2: We avoid feeling it, avoid avoid.
26:54
Speaker 1: I don't want to go there because it's going to
26:56
Speaker 1: be a roller coaster of emotions. But for almost everyone,
27:01
Speaker 1: not everyone, I'll go into that in a second, but
27:03
Speaker 1: for almost everyone when you do go there, yes it's painful,
27:07
Speaker 1: Yes it's overwhelming, but there's a portion of it that's
27:11
Speaker 1: quite enjoyable and therapeutic in the sense of like it's
27:14
Speaker 1: this is healing. I kind of need to do it.
27:16
Speaker 1: The times are of repressed, repressed, repress, and then finally
27:19
Speaker 1: let myself cry it out. That's where you feel the relief. Okay,
27:23
Speaker 1: now let's talk about something called music evoked sadness. There's
27:27
Speaker 1: a study that was done. There's many studies that was done,
27:30
Speaker 1: but this one in particular in twenty fourteen in Berlin,
27:33
Speaker 1: it was done. It was called the Paradox of Music
27:35
Speaker 1: evokes Sadness and it was just like a massive server
27:38
Speaker 1: that was run and it basically found that people experience
27:41
Speaker 1: four different rewards while listening to sad music. Number one
27:46
Speaker 1: is the reward of imagination. Number two is the reward
27:51
Speaker 1: of emotional regulation. It gives you the opportunity to regulate
27:55
Speaker 1: your emotions, so if there's something underlying there, it gives
27:58
Speaker 1: you the chance to bring it up to the surface,
28:00
Speaker 1: deal with it, and then you feel a lot calmer
28:02
Speaker 1: after the fat empathy. It increases empathy and also you
28:07
Speaker 1: get the reward of the lack of real life implications.
28:11
Speaker 1: So you can cry it out in that moment listening
28:13
Speaker 1: to music, but you don't have to experience that in
28:16
Speaker 1: the real world setting. Okay, so you're able to have
28:20
Speaker 1: this self soothing therapy on your own. Okay. Now, when
28:26
Speaker 1: you have this music evokes sadness, you get this release
28:29
Speaker 1: of prolactin, and it makes us feel pleasure from our
28:34
Speaker 1: sad moods. It consoles us, and prolactin actually serves to
28:39
Speaker 1: calm you when you are crying specifically and also when
28:42
Speaker 1: you are under stress. So you're getting this calm, this
28:46
Speaker 1: calming hormone that is released when you cry and in
28:50
Speaker 1: prolact when this prolactin gets released when you cry. If
28:53
Speaker 1: you are in deep distress or in a traumatic event,
28:57
Speaker 1: you cry, and you probably don't feel the pleasurable effects
29:00
Speaker 1: because there's a lot of stress or trauma going on.
29:02
Speaker 2: However, when people cry to.
29:04
Speaker 1: Sad music when they're not experiencing something really deeply distressing,
29:09
Speaker 1: but there might be reminiscing, or they might just be
29:11
Speaker 1: going down, you know, like this emotional thing. Because there's
29:14
Speaker 1: not so much stress in the body, it's kind of
29:16
Speaker 1: like a tactical cry almost. Then you actually feel these
29:20
Speaker 1: really enjoyable effects because the prolactin can be felt because
29:24
Speaker 1: it's not having to deal with so much intensity of stress.
29:27
Speaker 1: You're actually feeling the effects of this prolactin, and that's
29:30
Speaker 1: where it can actually become pleasurable. That's where this cry,
29:33
Speaker 1: listening to sad music or watching a sad film starts
29:36
Speaker 1: to become enjoyable. Okay, Now I've got a friend, he's
29:41
Speaker 1: the best, and he told me a few weeks ago,
29:43
Speaker 1: so he's gonna love this episode. He told me a
29:44
Speaker 1: few ages ago actually that he will probably have a
29:48
Speaker 1: tactical cry once a week, and I was like, what
29:52
Speaker 1: do you mean, And he goes, oh, I'll just like
29:54
Speaker 1: put on a sad movie or whatever, and I just
29:55
Speaker 1: cry it out and I feel so good after, and
29:58
Speaker 1: I was like.
29:59
Speaker 2: What, But who has time?
30:02
Speaker 1: The starters and then doesn't anyway, so I thought I've
30:06
Speaker 1: been thinking about that for a while. Where he talks
30:07
Speaker 1: about this tactical crime, how good it makes him feel
30:09
Speaker 1: so and I thought, I've got to look into this,
30:10
Speaker 1: and then when I looked into it, I'm like, I've
30:11
Speaker 1: got to do an episode on this, obviously. But anyway,
30:16
Speaker 1: so listening to a sad song will help you grieve,
30:18
Speaker 1: It's going to help you heal from a heartbreak, and
30:21
Speaker 1: it's much more therapeutic than listening to a sad song
30:25
Speaker 1: and sitting in that moment to grieve and then step
30:28
Speaker 1: out of it and do something fine or enjoyable or lighthearted,
30:32
Speaker 1: versus using stalking your ex on social media as a
30:35
Speaker 1: coping mechanism. Notice the difference one is causing suffering because
30:39
Speaker 1: one is anxiety provoking, which is anxiety is basically the
30:43
Speaker 1: difference between where you are now where you think you
30:45
Speaker 1: should be. That's how I label.
30:47
Speaker 2: It, whereas the other one is more I need to heal.
30:51
Speaker 1: One is trying to change the reality, trying to control
30:55
Speaker 1: the external circumstances when you stalk your exes because you're
30:57
Speaker 1: trying to get some semblance of control, while the other
31:00
Speaker 1: one is I'm trying to soothe myself and heal got
31:04
Speaker 1: nothing to do with controlling something outside of you. And
31:07
Speaker 1: that is why it's very different to listen to sad
31:10
Speaker 1: music to help you heal and overcome something.
31:13
Speaker 2: Music evoked.
31:14
Speaker 1: Sadness is also really good for people that are trying
31:17
Speaker 1: to learn how to deal with their emotions through music
31:21
Speaker 1: instead of bottling it up. So if you are somebody
31:23
Speaker 1: that is listening to this podcast right now who really
31:26
Speaker 1: struggles to face your emotions, doing it through music or
31:30
Speaker 1: a film, but music is what the studies are primarily on.
31:34
Speaker 1: And also if you know somebody who never cries, never
31:37
Speaker 1: shows their emotions, send them this episode. Do it in
31:40
Speaker 1: private where you feel safe in a safe environment, listen
31:44
Speaker 1: to music, be alone, and allow yourself to be in
31:48
Speaker 1: touch with your emotions and cry and feel it and
31:51
Speaker 1: go through that wave and experience the pain that you've
31:55
Speaker 1: felt and validate those feelings for yourself. Because when you
32:00
Speaker 1: do this with music, it actually helps you to learn
32:06
Speaker 1: how to deal with emotions in the future.
32:09
Speaker 2: So it becomes a form of therapy.
32:11
Speaker 1: If you're somebody that bottles it up, bottles it up,
32:14
Speaker 1: bottles it up. The more you can access this way
32:16
Speaker 1: of coping by crying it out and being in touch
32:19
Speaker 1: with your emotions, the next time something intense comes up,
32:22
Speaker 1: you are able to work through those emotions in the moment,
32:25
Speaker 1: instead of bottling it up and having its surface out
32:28
Speaker 1: as anxiety or irritability later down the track in a
32:31
Speaker 1: few months, years, or for some people, they will bottle
32:34
Speaker 1: things up forever and then have a breakdown decades later. Okay.
32:38
Speaker 1: So it's very, very important. So if you're someone who's like,
32:41
Speaker 1: that's fucking me, do it alone. Start doing it alone.
32:44
Speaker 1: You don't have to do it in public. It's okay,
32:46
Speaker 1: you don't have to have shame about that either. Work
32:49
Speaker 1: through it alone. But you actually will find that the
32:51
Speaker 1: more in touch you up with your emotions alone, the
32:53
Speaker 1: easier it is to then open up to other people
32:55
Speaker 1: because your empathy and your sympathy goes up. Okay, now,
33:00
Speaker 1: to wrap up what we're saying, if you feel low,
33:05
Speaker 1: if you are struggling, if you feel sad, if you
33:07
Speaker 1: feel like you need to overcome some intense emotional pain,
33:13
Speaker 1: crying and listening to sad music is a really good
33:16
Speaker 1: way to face your feelings, to feel them and work
33:18
Speaker 1: through them, understand them and heal. Okay, it's cathartic, it
33:23
Speaker 1: helps you feel good. It's always going to be better
33:26
Speaker 1: than bottling it up. However, if you feel perfectly fine.
33:31
Speaker 1: Forcing yourself to regularly cry is not going to boost
33:34
Speaker 1: your mood, Okay, It's not like, Oh, if there's no
33:37
Speaker 1: reason to cry and you don't feel sad and there's
33:38
Speaker 1: nothing bottled up, go cry, because it's going to improve
33:41
Speaker 1: your mood, not necessarily.
33:42
Speaker 2: So the studies have also shown that.
33:44
Speaker 1: This works only in moderation as a way to help
33:48
Speaker 1: you cope with existing feelings that need to be faced
33:52
Speaker 1: and felt and moved through and not avoided. Okay, But
33:55
Speaker 1: becoming addicted and trying to cry yourself to sleep every
33:58
Speaker 1: single night with music, thinking this is going to boost
34:00
Speaker 1: my mood overall, it.
34:01
Speaker 2: Actually has the opposite effects.
34:03
Speaker 1: So if you do this all the fucking time and
34:04
Speaker 1: try and bring yourself into a low mood intentionally on
34:08
Speaker 1: a regular basis for no real reason other than you
34:11
Speaker 1: like you're seeking this intense feeling, it can actually lead
34:15
Speaker 1: to sadder moods overall, doing it chronically, doing it repeatedly
34:19
Speaker 1: all the time, so you want to look at it
34:20
Speaker 1: more off, Whow, I've had a really hard day. Wow,
34:23
Speaker 1: I feel on edge. Wow, I don't feel really good.
34:26
Speaker 1: Go home. If you feel a bit emotional, put on
34:28
Speaker 1: a so I think cry it out. I feel good.
34:29
Speaker 1: If you're going through a breakup, let yourself cry it out,
34:32
Speaker 1: but don't do it every fucking three seconds. Have the cry,
34:35
Speaker 1: and then do what I say when I go through,
34:38
Speaker 1: when I talk about a breakup thing. Then do the
34:40
Speaker 1: distracting tasks. Then do the things that are going to
34:42
Speaker 1: make you feel a bit better. You don't want to
34:44
Speaker 1: sit in this zone forever. The point of this whole
34:47
Speaker 1: thing is if you need to cry, cry, if you
34:50
Speaker 1: don't like crying in public, and you need sort of
34:52
Speaker 1: a guided way of crying, then use music to allow
34:55
Speaker 1: you to access those emotions in private or on your
34:58
Speaker 1: own time. Okay, but I'm not saying, and the studies
35:02
Speaker 1: are also saying, don't actively force yourself into this state
35:06
Speaker 1: of crying all the time for no reason, because that's
35:10
Speaker 1: not going to be the crazy.
35:12
Speaker 2: It's not going to give you all these benefits either.
35:13
Speaker 1: Okay, now I have to do I have to also
35:17
Speaker 1: mention at the very end of this to wrap it up.
35:19
Speaker 1: Just like anything else, these studies are focusing on general populations. Okay,
35:24
Speaker 1: so it is actually reported that I'm too. Up to
35:28
Speaker 1: one fifth of participants in some studies, not all of them,
35:32
Speaker 1: report not feeling great after a strategic cry and instead
35:35
Speaker 1: feeling weak, tired, depressed, and embarrassed. Okay, so if that's you,
35:42
Speaker 1: that might not be your thing to cry to music
35:45
Speaker 1: in your own time, Okay, So, but it's just to
35:48
Speaker 1: demonstrate that for most people it is effective. I often,
35:52
Speaker 1: you know, I by the way, guys follow me on
35:54
Speaker 1: TikTok alexis predez on TikTok because I do a lot
35:56
Speaker 1: of chat to camera brain facts, get amongst it and
36:00
Speaker 1: and just share because I'm trying to grow the TikTok.
36:02
Speaker 1: So everyone can get these snippets of brain facts. But basically,
36:06
Speaker 1: sometimes I'll share something on TikTok or Instagram and someone
36:10
Speaker 1: will say, like, maybe on this is how to cope
36:12
Speaker 1: with anxiety in the moment. And someone will say, I
36:14
Speaker 1: have anxiety and this does not work for me, And
36:18
Speaker 1: I'm like, that's fair because just like pharmacology, just like medicine,
36:24
Speaker 1: it doesn't work for everybody. You know, we are very
36:28
Speaker 1: complicated creatures, and what works for the general population might
36:31
Speaker 1: not work for you.
36:32
Speaker 2: What works for some might not work for you.
36:34
Speaker 1: You might have something that really works for you, but
36:36
Speaker 1: it doesn't work for the general population. What I aim
36:39
Speaker 1: to do with my podcast and with everything I talk
36:42
Speaker 1: about is speak about what the data is showing for
36:45
Speaker 1: the general population, and then it's up to you if
36:48
Speaker 1: you want to give it a go or not. But
36:49
Speaker 1: I don't think it's fair to slam somebody for giving
36:52
Speaker 1: some advice on what works for the general population, saying
36:55
Speaker 1: it's bullshit that doesn't work. I tried, it didn't work
36:57
Speaker 1: for me. It means it didn't work for you, but
36:59
Speaker 1: it doesn't mean it doesn't work. So, like everything, it's
37:02
Speaker 1: on a case by case basis. But I thought it
37:06
Speaker 1: would be really interesting that if it's someone that really
37:08
Speaker 1: loves a strategic cry, there is the science behind it,
37:11
Speaker 1: and that is why you feel good after you do it.
37:12
Speaker 1: You release these hormones, you release these chemicals, and if
37:15
Speaker 1: you're someone that bottles it up, please learn how to
37:18
Speaker 1: express your emotions and allow yourself to feel the emotions.
37:21
Speaker 1: It's going to do wonders for your mental health. It's
37:22
Speaker 1: going to do wonders for your attachment and how you
37:26
Speaker 1: connect to other people and how secure you feel in
37:29
Speaker 1: general with yourself, your relationship with yourself and your relationship
37:34
Speaker 1: with other people. Okay, and it's also going to help
37:36
Speaker 1: curb your fear in many situations, whether it's intimate or
37:40
Speaker 1: whether it's about your own abilities as well.
37:44
Speaker 2: I love that topic. I hope you guys loved it too.
37:46
Speaker 2: Please please, please please rate give the podcast a five
37:51
Speaker 2: star review if heaven't already.
37:52
Speaker 1: It really helps my podcast grow, it helps reach your audiences.
37:56
Speaker 1: Please review, share your stories of how the podcaster is
38:00
Speaker 1: helped you or how you found the podcast. I really
38:02
Speaker 1: appreciate it and it really really does help me. My
38:05
Speaker 1: podcast grows because of you guys and because of word
38:08
Speaker 1: of mouth, so I really appreciate us helping each other
38:12
Speaker 1: out me with a podcast with you guys and you
38:14
Speaker 1: guys sharing the word. So thank you so much for
38:17
Speaker 1: already doing that and for doing it today as well.
38:20
Speaker 1: Um that is all, Love you guys so much. As always,
38:23
Speaker 1: please remember, be kind to yourself, be kind to your brain,
38:25
Speaker 1: don't take shit from anyone, and especially don't take shit
38:28
Speaker 1: from yourself. Done that