Latest / Outspoken the Podcast / Roxy Jacenko's Bootcamp Back Flip, The Baby Reindeer Interview & Shower Snacks

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Roxy Jacenko's Bootcamp Back Flip, The Baby Reindeer Interview & Shower Snacks · Outspoken the Podcast

• 0:02
  Speaker 1: Hello and welcome to Outspoken. It's your dose of the
• 0:05
  Speaker 1: hottest influencer and pop culture news twice a week. Coming
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: up on today's show, Roxy Jasenko steps down from her
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: $ 10 million house giveaway. Piers Morgan is under fire for
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: interviewing baby reindeer's real-life Martha. And journalist Antoinette Latouf breaks
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: her silence over the inspired unemployed prank. But first, what
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: do you guys think about eating in the shower? Because
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Jade Tunchi has sparked debate after she uploaded a video
• 0:33
  Speaker 1: of her chowing down on a burger in the shower. Well,
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: I have been known to eat in the shower quite
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: a bit, but I've never gone as far as having
• 0:40
  Speaker 1: a burger.
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: I've only had snacks.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I have been known to also eat in the shower,
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: which probably won't surprise OG listeners because we have been
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: slammed for using our phones in the shower.
• 0:50
  Speaker 2: That's gross.
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever really eaten a meal, let
• 0:54
  Speaker 1: alone a chocolate in the shower.
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: Oh, you've got to try it.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: It's the best when you have a little snack and
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: you take it in there and you're just so comfortable
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: and warm. I do want to point out that Jade
• 1:03
  Speaker 1: Tunchi also is eight months pregnant. So I respect it
• 1:05
  Speaker 1: even more as a fellow pregnant woman. I'm actually thankful
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: that she reminded me of this because I haven't done
• 1:10
  Speaker 1: it for so long.
• 1:12
  Speaker 2: I can see how it would be nice in winter.
• 1:14
  Speaker 1: And maybe this is something that a lot of moms
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: do because it's probably the only time they get on
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: their own. The worst thing is when you get caught
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: out and you've left a wrapper in the shower and
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: you just look like an absolute pig to your partner.
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: I think I have like when I have a shower
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: at nighttime, usually it's an everything shower where I'm scrubbing
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: off tan or I'm shaving my legs. So And I'm
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: usually on my phone as well. So I don't have
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: an extra hand to hold food. I can't let this
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: get too out of hand. I feel like your partner, Amy,
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: is someone who could progress to eating in the shower
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: because I don't mean to call you out, but often
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: when I go in your bathroom, there are empty soda
• 1:46
  Speaker 1: water bottles and also beer bottles. I think Dale does
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: love a shower beer now and then. It is getting
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: a little embarrassing, especially when I've left my chocolate wrapper
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: and there's also beer cans in there.
• 1:55
  Speaker 3: I had KFC for dinner last night. And I feel good.
• 1:58
  Speaker 3: I feel good that I've held my head high. I
• 2:00
  Speaker 3: was backed into a corner.
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: My name is all over this.
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: Money can be made again by me.
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: Roxy Jacenko has announced she's stepping away from the controversial
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: $ 10 million house giveaway she was the face of. Now,
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: before we get into the recent drama, Kate, can you
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: tell us more about this competition? Well, Roxy launched the
• 2:18
  Speaker 1: promotion called Roxy's Boot Camps in a wave of publicity
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: on March 8th. She was absolutely everywhere promoting this competition,
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: which I'm sure she heavily regrets now. So she appeared
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: on the Kyle and Jackie O show and told the
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: host that she was giving away.
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: A $ 10 million home.
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: She also did an interview with Sunrise where she said,
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: you need to incentivize people to study. And what better
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: way than a $ 10 million house or Rolex or a
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: Birkin bag? Now, amongst the media attention, Domain ran with
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: a headline, Roxy Jasenko is giving away a $ 10 million home.
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: Mediterranean style waterfront pad. This competition was much more complicated
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: than your average home lottery. So to enter, you had
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: to sign up to the course. Prices ranged from $ 29
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: for one month's access to the course and one entry
• 3:07
  Speaker 1: into the competition to a $ 499 subscription, which provided you
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: then with 500 entries. The main prize promoted was a
• 3:16
  Speaker 1: $ 10 million home located in Cronulla, And the other prizes
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: included a Rolex watch and a Birkin bag, both valued
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: at $ 20, 000. This is such a huge incentive to enter.
• 3:26
  Speaker 1: It's not every day you see a $ 10 million house.
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: Up for grabs.
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: And that is why over 7,000 people signed up for
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: Roxy's course. A big part of the issue is, though,
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: that media reports didn't clearly state entrants only had a
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: chance of winning the major prize. So the first red
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: flag appeared during a Sunrise interview. when Roxy deflected from
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: answering the exact chances of winning the $ 10 million house.
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: So this led publication Crikey to dig into the terms
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: and conditions. And it turned out the winning prize wasn't
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: actually the house, but instead entry into another game of
• 4:01
  Speaker 1: chance for the home. So in the secondary competition, in
• 4:05
  Speaker 1: order to win the home, the entrant had to select
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: two winning envelopes out of 250 available envelopes.
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: To win the house.
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: So the odds of going on to pick the right
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: envelope alone was one in 62,250. Now, Crikey ended up
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: contacting Roxy about the low odds and she responded saying,
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: there is a chance and that is how we are
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: communicating the offer and always have been. We are offering
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: someone the chance to play to win the property and
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: guaranteed consolation prizes if it is not won via the method. Now,
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: the prizes that Roxy is referring to is the $ 250, 000 cash,
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: and also the Rolex and Birkin bag. So essentially, this
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: competition was committed to giving away those three prizes. And
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: then it seems like it was very unlikely to actually
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: go on to win the $ 10 million house. And as
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: for this $ 10 million home, it has been revealed that
• 4:56
  Speaker 1: it didn't even belong to Roxy, but instead it belonged
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: to her business partner, Yosef Tills, and his associate, Kazmin Alawi.
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: And according to the Sunday Telegraph, it was actually purchased
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: in 2020 for $ 3. 4 million after it failed to sell
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: at auction. But it was then listed again late last
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: year for $ 10 million but also didn't sell. Now, the
• 5:16
  Speaker 1: Daily Telegraph is also reporting that local Cronulla real estate
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: agents have expressed doubts that the house would even reach
• 5:22
  Speaker 1: the $ 10 million asking price. Now, on Friday night, Roxy
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: did share an eight-minute video announcing she was stepping down
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: as director from Roxy's boot camps. The backstory is very
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: interesting because she revealed that she had agreed to run
• 5:36
  Speaker 1: the competition after being approached by a stranger who direct
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: messaged her with the idea. She said she went on
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: to form a partnership with two people she said she
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: didn't know. Did this shock anyone else? Well, particularly because
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: Roxy does position herself as being a very savvy businesswoman.
• 5:53
  Speaker 2: And well-connected.
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 5:55
  Speaker 1: Well, it didn't take long for her to regret her
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: decision because She claims three days after the promotion commenced
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: that she felt really uncomfortable and she actually suggested to
• 6:04
  Speaker 1: her new business partners that they refund all of the purchases.
• 6:08
  Speaker 1: And she alleged that her request was rejected and that
• 6:11
  Speaker 1: the promotion continued.
• 6:13
  Speaker 2: Now, the PR.
• 6:13
  Speaker 1: Message was very clear in this video. I actually laughed
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: watching it because she said the same thing over and
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: over again. So she wanted her audience to know that
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: she has done everything within her power to ensure that
• 6:26
  Speaker 1: the three prizes continue.
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: Are given to the winners.
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: Now she claims after discovering the company bank accounts didn't
• 6:31
  Speaker 1: have funds to cover the $ 250, 000 prize, that she tried
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: to chip in the remaining 20K that was missing. Now
• 6:40
  Speaker 1: she said she would do so if the money was
• 6:42
  Speaker 1: put into a trust to protect it. Now she said
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: that that request was rejected and then she was told
• 6:48
  Speaker 1: that she had to stand down as a director and
• 6:51
  Speaker 1: she is now just a shareholder in the company.
• 6:53
  Speaker 2: She also confirmed.
• 6:54
  Speaker 1: That she no longer has access to that bank account
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: So she can't guarantee that the $ 250, 000 prize.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: Will be paid.
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: She did, however, say that she is holding the Birkin
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: bag and the Rolex as hostage. She also claimed that
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: she's out of pocket $ 350, 000. Now on Saturday, Roxy did
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: a follow-up video confirming that she would be personally refunding
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: all 7,000 plus customers who purchased a package from Roxy's bootcamp.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: She said the course would also remain available to everyone
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: who received a refund. Again in this video, it was
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: so clear that she was really sticking to the PR messaging.
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: She said so many times that she will be personally
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: fitting the bill, that the money is coming from her.
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: I mean, obviously, if you are going to be paying
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: that amount of money, you want people to know that
• 7:40
  Speaker 1: it's from you. Well, there is a rule when you
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: are communicating with people that you actually do have to
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: reiterate those points over and over again for people to
• 7:49
  Speaker 1: actually buy in and understand it. But it's not surprising
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: that she has, because how dirty would you be? Your
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: name is attached to this.
• 7:55
  Speaker 2: This isn't a good look for her. Oh, it's a
• 7:57
  Speaker 2: terrible look.
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and- the fact that, I mean, she has come
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: out and said, look, this doesn't look good for me.
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: My face is all over it.
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: I did find her PR.
• 8:05
  Speaker 1: Strategy around it very interesting because she is known as
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: being a very glamorous PR queen, but she chose to
• 8:12
  Speaker 1: film the video with no makeup on, in her pajamas,
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: with her hair slicked back. That was a very intentional move.
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: She was clearly trying to create sympathy for herself. She said,
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: My hands are tied.
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: I am exhausted.
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: I feel bullied. I feel distressed and I'm embarrassed. It
• 8:27
  Speaker 1: is a clever move because it is in stark contrast
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: to how she was portrayed in the advertisements for this
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: $ 10 million giveaway.
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: She was obviously very glammed up.
• 8:36
  Speaker 1: It really humanized her as well, I feel. And if
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: I'm someone who has purchased one of these tickets and
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: I'm sort of sitting at home thinking, what the fuck
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: is going on? I think one, okay, she's clearly jumped
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: on her social media as soon as she could to
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: let me know the messaging. And also if she's sitting
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: on there, with a hair all done in glamorous clothes,
• 8:55
  Speaker 1: expensive jewelry. I'm thinking, oh, you've clearly.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: Run away with the price.
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it also looks like it's been pre-planned, whereas
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: this looks like she's just jumped on and she's being
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: very emotive and wanting to just, as you said, instantly
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: get on there to update people. Yeah, there was definitely
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: a sense of urgency to this. I also found it
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: interesting that amongst providing the business details, she repeatedly spoke
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: about her weight and how it had been impacted by
• 9:18
  Speaker 1: the stress of the promotion. Let's throw to some of
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: what she said regarding this.
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: The course of the last two months which to be
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: really honest with you feels like two and a half
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: years for me um it's been nothing short of distressing
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: um stressful uh I am 49 kilos today alone I
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: have fainted twice things that have never happened to me
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: and I have had many businesses I've had many ups
• 9:46
  Speaker 3: and downs and I've powered through each and every one
• 9:49
  Speaker 3: of them.
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: In the second video, she followed up by telling her
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: audience not to worry because she had eaten KFC the
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: night before.
• 9:56
  Speaker 2: I get what she was trying to do.
• 9:57
  Speaker 1: She was trying to show that obviously this competition is,
• 10:00
  Speaker 1: taken an emotional toll on her and.
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: It's causing her a lot of stress. But I just
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: feel so.
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: Uncomfortable with her constantly putting out there how much she weighs.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: I think it's quite irrelevant. You can just say, I'm
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: very stressed and I've lost weight.
• 10:11
  Speaker 2: You don't have to say how much weight.
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: But also using it as a method to garner sympathy
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: when she has explicitly spoken about on an Instagram story
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: about how she works out five times a week. She
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: was caught up in controversy because she said she only
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: ate two boiled eggs and a Greek salad for dinner.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: She's spoken a lot about how she exercises five times
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: a week. Her weight loss seems quite intentional, particularly because
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: she also spoke about how she nearly died from taking
• 10:36
  Speaker 1: a Zempik. So it was strange to me that she
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: was then blaming this weight loss on the stress of
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: this competition. I want many people they actually expected to
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: sign up for this course? Because it's come out that
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: they've had 7,000 entries. If all of those 7,000 people
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: actually signed up to the $ 499 subscription, that adds up
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: to around $ 3. 4 million. It's obviously not enough to even
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: pay for the house.
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 11:01
  Speaker 1: And it's very unlikely that everyone is going to sign
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: up to the top package. Now, Roxy's former business partner,
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: Yosef Till's spoke to the Sunday Telegraph and he confirmed
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: that the competition will still go ahead without Roxy.
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: So Yusuf refuted.
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: Roxy's claims and said that the $ 250, 000 was safely sitting
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: in the company's bank account. And he said that he
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: only removed Roxy from the account after she shared the
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: Instagram video on Friday night. Yusuf claims that Roxy was
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: also set to take 50% of the shareholding. while he
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: and his other business partner would take 25% each. He
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: then went on to claim that Roxy resigned from the
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: company in mid-April, which resulted in him being locked out
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: of the company accounts and the bank account being frozen.
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: He also said he explored legal proceedings, but they were
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: averted when he was granted access to the accounts on
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: condition that Roxy was permitted to exit the business. Now,
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: it just seems like an absolute shit show. So There
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: were attempts made to repair this relationship and Yosef said
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: that it became irreparable on May 1st. I think the
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: most interesting part of his claim is that he said
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: he and his business partner were actually the ones that
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: wanted to originally resign from this business. And he claims
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: that Roxy got wind of this. So that is why
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: she then pulled the plug and announced publicly that she
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: was stepping down as director. So it sounds like they're
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: all trying to jump from this sinking ship. If I
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: had purchased one of these tickets, that would not fill
• 12:28
  Speaker 1: me with much confidence that I'm getting.
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: My money back.
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: I question what these guys are saying because they have
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: come to Roxy with this concept. They are the brains
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: behind this competition and she is merely the face of it.
• 12:41
  Speaker 1: I wouldn't say merely the face because she also agreed
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: to go ahead with it. These guys actually claim that
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: they approached Roxy and said that they wanted a celebrity
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: from the Ministry of Talent, which is a talent agency.
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: That she manages. And she said, no, I've actually got
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: the reach. That is what they allege.
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: I am so interested to see what happens when this
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: competition is actually drawn because Roxy said that she's refunding everyone.
• 13:03
  Speaker 1: So doesn't that defunct the whole competition?
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: Like how can it still go ahead? I've got a
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: photographic memory. I was top of the school apart from
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: the science.
• 13:12
  Speaker 1: What grade did you get?
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: All right grades. I mean, not top of the year
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: or anything, but all right grades.
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: When you do a degree, you get a.
• 13:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're asking me what marks I got for 13 subjects.
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: I can't remember.
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: Controversial UK broadcaster Piers Morgan is under fire for his
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: face-to-face interview with the so-called real-life Martha, who allegedly inspired
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: the hit Netflix show Baby Reindeer. Now, critics are questioning
• 13:36
  Speaker 1: the ethics of paying and interviewing an alleged stalker who
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: the show's creator, Richard Gad, claims is mentally ill. Sophie,
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: you like the rest of the world has been captivated
• 13:46
  Speaker 1: by this show. Yeah, this show has gripped me in
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: a way that other shows haven't for quite some time.
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: And I think it's down to the fact that it
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: has been promoted as a true story. This isn't just
• 13:57
  Speaker 1: based off a true story or inspired by real life events.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: Netflix has boldly said that this is a true story.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: And the show is absolutely fascinating. It is written by
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: Richard Gad, who also plays himself on the show.
• 14:09
  Speaker 2: See, when I was watching it, I didn't realize.
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: And that adds a whole extra dimension to it because
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: the show is just so confronting and raw. Yeah, it
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: does explore how he became the point of obsession for
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: a serial stalker called Martha whilst he was trying to
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: make it as a comedian. And I think the fact
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: that he plays himself in the show makes it even
• 14:31
  Speaker 1: more powerful.
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: What is pretty remarkable.
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: About this show is that it has turned its audience
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: into armchair detectives. So after watching this show, fans have
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: been trying to hunt down the real life Martha and
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: it was actually relatively easy for them to find her
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: because on the show, they used real messages and emails
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: that Richard says that the stalker sent him. And the
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: interesting thing about the messages is they were written in
• 14:56
  Speaker 1: such a specific way. There were a lot of consistent
• 14:59
  Speaker 1: messages grammatical and spelling errors. Yeah and fans were able
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: to cross-reference the messages on social media to the ones
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: on the show and it wasn't long before TikTok users
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: revealed who Martha was and they created all of these
• 15:12
  Speaker 1: videos online which generated a lot of engagement and a
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: lot of attention. Now the real life Martha was revealed
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: to be a 58 year old Scottish woman called Fiona
• 15:21
  Speaker 1: Harvey and And not long after her identity was revealed online,
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: journalist Piers Morgan was promoting that he had a world-exclusive
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: TV interview with her. So he wrote on X, world-exclusive,
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: the real-life Martha from Baby Reindeer breaks cover and gives
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: me the first TV interview about the smash hit Netflix show.
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: Fiona Harvey wants to have her say and set the
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: record straight. Is she a psycho stalker? I love that
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: he finished with that line because– clearly the interview was
• 15:52
  Speaker 1: already in the can. They would have had to do
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: so much persuading to get her on the show. It's
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: pretty incredible when you think a YouTube show actually beat
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: out these huge networks to get this interview. Well, I
• 16:02
  Speaker 1: think that that speaks more broadly about the entertainment industry though,
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: because TV is dead. I mean, Piers Morgan, he has
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: 2 million followers or 2 million subscribers on his YouTube channel.
• 16:14
  Speaker 1: In the space of three days, this YouTube has had
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: 9 million views. Now, this interview was very lengthy. It
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: went for 54 minutes and I was glued to every
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: single second of it, even though at times I felt
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: uncomfortable that I was watching it.
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: I think that's how a lot of people felt online.
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: You almost felt guilty for watching it and buying into
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: the sensationalism of it all. It was like watching a
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: car crash. You just could not look away. And it
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: is clear that Piers used this lengthy interview style as
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: a way to trip her up. Yeah. I could just
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: sense how much the producers had tried to say to
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: Fiona how she and Piers were the same. Because when
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: he asked her, oh, so what made you choose my
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: show to appear on? She said that she knew he
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: had also been persecuted like her. There was this connection there. However,
• 17:04
  Speaker 1: I think once the interview went on, it became quite
• 17:07
  Speaker 1: apparent what side Piers was on. Yeah, the amount of
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: smoke they would have blown up her ass to actually
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: get her to agree to do the interview.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then the tables were turned so quickly.
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: Now, during this interview, Fiona did claim to have only
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: met Richard a few times and she did deny sending
• 17:23
  Speaker 1: him 41,000 emails and 100 letters.
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: Instead, she claimed that she sent him only a handful
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: of emails.
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: And that he must have made up the rest himself.
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: It's funny because rather than denying the fact that she
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: contacted him via email, she just kept saying, oh, how
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: would someone possibly send 41,000 emails in the space of
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: a year? It's like, I don't know if that's a
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: good enough defense. And then she also said, oh, I
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: don't think I did. And he's like, well, how do
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: you not know if you've sent that many emails? She
• 17:51
  Speaker 1: also denied that she's been convicted of stalking Richard or
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: being sent to prison.
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: And also claimed to be a lawyer.
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: And she revealed her plans to sue both Richard and
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: Netflix for defamation. She did reiterate that she personally wouldn't
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: be suing them. She also said that her boyfriend was
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: a lawyer and he wouldn't be suing that she would
• 18:08
  Speaker 1: get a other lawyer to do so. Apparently, she has
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: been dating this lawyer for five years. Now, while she
• 18:15
  Speaker 1: said the show was defamatory, she also claimed to have
• 18:18
  Speaker 1: never watched any scene of the show. And in one
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: notable moment during this interview, she also boasted about having
• 18:26
  Speaker 1: a photographic memory, but was then unable to tell Piers
• 18:30
  Speaker 1: her law school grades.
• 18:31
  Speaker 2: So there were just so many.
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: Moments where Piers managed to trip her up and make
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: her look silly. This interview did her no favors whatsoever.
• 18:40
  Speaker 1: There were so many inconsistencies. And at some points I
• 18:43
  Speaker 1: felt like Piers was actually trying to help her out.
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: but she just didn't take the bait at all. And
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: some of her remarks about Richard have quickly become viral
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: memes on TikTok.
• 18:52
  Speaker 2: Let's throw to one of them. Leave me alone, please.
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: Get a life, get a proper job. I am horrified
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: at what you've done.
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: When I first saw these memes circulating, my first reaction
• 19:04
  Speaker 1: was to send them on and have a bit of
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: a laugh.
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: But when you think about it, It's actually really sad that.
• 19:10
  Speaker 1: This mentally ill woman is being taken advantage of by
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: a huge broadcaster and being mocked.
• 19:16
  Speaker 2: For all of our entertainment.
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: This is also not going to be good for her
• 19:19
  Speaker 1: legal case because this will be used as evidence against her.
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: What I found most surprising was following this interview, Fiona
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: came out and admitted that she was paid only £ 250
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: for this exclusive. And it turned out that she had
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: turned down a number of other morning shows. She said
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: that she felt used by Piers and that the questions
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: were rapid fire to try and trip her up. She
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: also said it was fast paced to catch me off guard.
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: Has she not seen any other interviews by Piers Morgan? No.
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: That is just his interview style.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: I do wonder if these morning shows didn't offer her
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: any money because ethically it looks really wrong to pay
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: an accused stalker to get.
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: Their side of events.
• 20:02
  Speaker 1: Like, I mean, if this was a male stalker, a
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: male older stalker, I don't think that we would give
• 20:07
  Speaker 1: them any airtime at all, let alone pay them for
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: their time and their side of the story. The UK
• 20:12
  Speaker 1: aren't really known for their media ethics and Piers has
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: faced a lot of backlash from mental health campaigners and
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: survivors of stalking over his decision to interview Fiona. Many
• 20:23
  Speaker 1: people have called it irresponsible and bizarre and I would
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: agree with them.
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because after.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: Baby Reindeer aired, Richard did tell the media that the
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: real person who inspired Martha was very mentally unwell. And
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: he also did urge fans not to try and find her.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: So it was an interesting decision for a broadcaster to.
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: Then go and spotlight this woman.
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: Well, while they did give her a platform to share
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: her side of the story, Piers Morgan was always going
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: to interrogate her. He fired questions at her and he
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: did pull apart her story. Yeah, I think plenty of
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: journalism students could learn a lot from watching.
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: Piers' interview techniques.
• 20:59
  Speaker 1: While many people are questioning the ethics over this interview...
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: It is clear that he pulled this interview off pretty flawlessly.
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: He demonstrated that he definitely has talent in interviewing people.
• 21:09
  Speaker 1: He gave her enough room at the start of the
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: interview so that she felt comfortable to share her side
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: of things. But then he was very clever on jumping
• 21:17
  Speaker 1: on all of her inconsistencies in an attempt to trip
• 21:20
  Speaker 1: her up and to get her to admit what she
• 21:23
  Speaker 1: had been accused of. While this may have been a
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: masterclass in interviewing, it was not in ethics. Because while
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: Fiona may have agreed to do the interview... it's quite
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: clear that she probably wasn't mentally fit to actually make
• 21:35
  Speaker 1: that decision or fully understood the repercussions of that decision.
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: If the show is anything to go by, she was
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: portrayed as a very lonely person who didn't have a
• 21:44
  Speaker 1: big support group around her. And if that is the
• 21:48
  Speaker 1: case in real life, it means that she wouldn't have
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: had the support of friends or family to actually step
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: in and say, this is a bad idea. I mean,
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: she did mention that she hadn't told her mum about
• 21:58
  Speaker 1: the interview. I mean, it's clear watching this interview that
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: there's two possibilities at play.
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: The first possibility is.
• 22:05
  Speaker 1: That Fiona is telling the truth and that Richard and
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: Netflix have overly exaggerated this story and her character and
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: pass it off as a true story. If this is
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: the case, a woman has been defamed and both parties
• 22:17
  Speaker 1: have left themselves open to legal action. I don't think
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: that that is the case, but that is one scenario.
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: The other scenario that is more feasible, in my opinion,
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: is that Fiona did do all of these things that
• 22:27
  Speaker 1: she's been accused of and the media are parading around
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: a mentally ill woman for clicks and entertainment. And the
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: worst thing is that we're all lapping it up. Like
• 22:37
  Speaker 1: I personally, as soon as this interview dropped, I couldn't
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: get enough of it. I just could not stop watching it.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: It was such compelling viewing. So I think we do
• 22:45
  Speaker 1: have to have a look at ourselves as well. I
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: couldn't help but also think that Piers Morgan has opened
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: her up for a counter defamation case because she kept
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: making comments about how Richard Gad is psychotic and mentally
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: ill himself and also making derogatory comments about Netflix.
• 23:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think even just.
• 23:04
  Speaker 1: Mental health aside from this, the ethics of giving an
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: alleged stalker the opportunity to give their side of the
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: story and rebut a victim's claims I think is just
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: very unjustifiable. I think that gender, as I touched on,
• 23:18
  Speaker 1: has really come into play.
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: With this decision.
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: If this was a 58-year-old man who stalked a much
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: younger woman, we wouldn't have opened up the possibility to
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: hear his side of events.
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: And I don't think that he would have been spotlighted
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: in this way.
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: In this show, Richard also made the point that police
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: didn't take his matter seriously due to it being a
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: woman who stalked him.
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: And this is despite the fact.
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: That in Baby Reindeer, Martha actually sexually assaulted Richard's character
• 23:46
  Speaker 1: on the show. So if any of that is true,
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: and then also an alleged sexual predator has also been platformed,
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: the whole thing is just uncomfortable. I don't understand how
• 23:57
  Speaker 1: it's even gotten to this point. And I think Netflix
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: are really to blame for it because they didn't have
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: to come out and promote this as a true story.
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: They could have easily said based on a true story.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but they clearly have all of the receipts. I
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: think that it's quite clear that there's a.
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: Did happen to richard and i just feel so bad
• 24:18
  Speaker 1: for richard you know he's put it very bravely put
• 24:21
  Speaker 1: all of his darkest moments into this show out for
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: the world to see but ethically sophie if they had
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: said based on a true story and people found this
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: real martha then it wouldn't have such massive repercussions for
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: this person i just have found this interview to be
• 24:37
  Speaker 1: so disrespectful to richard and i think what is so
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: scary about this is this is far from the end
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: of the story People are saying that we are seeing
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: Baby Reindeer 2 play out in real life. And through
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: taking part in this interview, Fiona has become somewhat of
• 24:52
  Speaker 1: a celebrity. In the interview, she even spoke about getting
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: a potential book deal where she was going to expose
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: her side of the story. And as we speak, she
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: probably has a ton of reality show producers or documentary
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: makers who are knocking on her door, offering her money
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: to be involved.
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: And I don't think that she should.
• 25:09
  Speaker 1: Be able to profit on allegedly any of this behavior
• 25:12
  Speaker 1: that has taken place. In saying that though, do you
• 25:15
  Speaker 1: think Richard could have avoided this by changing a few
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: things up, particularly sharing the exact messages that she shared
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: that were available on Twitter? I think it's a tough
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: one because when the show exploded in popularity, he made
• 25:29
  Speaker 1: a point of saying, I have tried to conceal the
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: real people's identities by making the character slightly different. However,
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: When we did meet the real life Martha, she looked
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: bang on to her, the actor on the show.
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: It was absolutely uncanny, the resemblance. It was spot on.
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: And also I've seen a lot of memes floating around
• 25:47
  Speaker 1: saying that all of the other characters look very much
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: like the actors as well. It's not just an appearance though.
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: It's the fact that they would easily know that those
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: tweets were available and could be searched. But I also
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: think why does he necessarily have to protect someone who
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: made his life a living misery in hell? Because it
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: protects him from a defamation case.
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: But it's not defamatory if it's true. There's a truth
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: defence there as well.
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: Yes, I know, but he probably doesn't want his show
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: overshadowed by having to now go to court and relive
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: all of the moments again.
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: Overshadowed?
• 26:18
  Speaker 1: This is probably the best thing for him if he's
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: going to want to bring out a second series. While
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: mentally it might be bad for him, I mean, the
• 26:24
  Speaker 1: thing that is a bit awkward is in the show–
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: in one of the last episodes, he admitted that he
• 26:30
  Speaker 1: sort of became obsessed with her and he couldn't let
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: her go. So a lot of people are saying, is
• 26:34
  Speaker 1: this a way for her to still be in his life?
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: Consent is very important to all children. Journalist Antoinette Latouf
• 26:48
  Speaker 1: has broken her silence, saying she was mortified by the
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: response to her involvement in the Inspired Unemployed's prank last month. Now,
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: alongside Antoinette, high-profile feminists Yumi Steins and Clementine Ford featured
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: at the Love Unboxed event in Sydney last month, which
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: was marketed as a thought-provoking discussion on love and marriage. Now,
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: the crowd at the time didn't know that the free
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: Q & A style panel was part of the Inspired
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: Unemployed's prank show called Impractical Jokers. So Jack Steele, who
• 27:20
  Speaker 1: is one half of the Inspired Unemployed, appeared on the
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: panel to give the perspective of a young male. And
• 27:26
  Speaker 1: some of his contributions to the panel were that he
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: thinks chicks did consent and he really likes girl writers. Now,
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: he was being fed these lines because the show was
• 27:35
  Speaker 1: a prank show. So this was part of a punishment.
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: The backlash was swift and it seemed like people were
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: more pissed off at the feminists that were on the
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: panel rather than at the inspired unemployed. Yeah, they definitely
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: copped it a lot. Now, Antoinette has opened up on
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: her podcast explaining that she previously had been unable to
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: comment about the incident as she and the other women
• 27:57
  Speaker 1: had signed a non-disclosure agreement. That's what a lot of
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: people did guess at the time. She admitted that she
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: and the other panelists had completely misread the situation and
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: was mortified that the audience felt duped. So she explained
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: that producers approached her to host the event and she
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: and the other hosts said that they answered the questions
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: posed to them on the panel very seriously. So they
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: felt as though their audience was still getting something from
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: the experiment. She said that they really thought that the
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: joke would be on Jack and the audience.
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: Would enjoy being annoyed at him.
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: However, when the joke was revealed, the producers were supposed
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: to come up on stage and back the women and
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: explain what happened, but they didn't come up on stage
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: and they were then left to deal with the upset
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: and the situation as it unfolded. Well, Antoinette said the
• 28:46
  Speaker 1: great irony of it was the three women mopping up.
• 28:49
  Speaker 1: We apologized profusely and apologized repeatedly and we listened and
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: we heard. Then we realized, damn, we all thought this
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: would land differently. We honestly did think it would land differently.
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: It's clear they misread the situation completely. There was a
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: lot of backtracking going on. Do you think it's fair
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: to blame the producers? Because I personally don't think it
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: would have made a difference if they came out and
• 29:10
  Speaker 1: backed them up. I think it was a bit naive
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: to assume that Jack was simply going to be the
• 29:15
  Speaker 1: butt of the joke and that there wouldn't be men
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: having a laugh. about feminism, because even the fact that
• 29:22
  Speaker 1: this was Jack's punishment to be put on a stage
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: with feminists who were going to pick him.
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: To pieces, it's clear that the feminists were the butt
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: of the jokes, not Jack.
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: Maybe it was this allure of working with the inspired
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: unemployed because they are extremely popular. Everything they touch seems
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: to turn to gold. And while they do put out
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: edgy jokes, people don't normally get too offended by them.
• 29:43
  Speaker 2: They're very lovable. They seem untouchable. The inspired unemployed are
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: like Teflon.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: They have slipped themselves out of this situation and left
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: the women to explain themselves, which Seems to be a
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: reflection of what happens a lot of the time in society.
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to hearing when Clementine Ford comes out
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: and what she has to say about it. If the
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: NDA has already passed, surely she would have said something
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: by now. I'm surprised that the NDA finishes before the
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: episode is aired. That's what's confused me. I'm really interested
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: to see this episode. I think if it does air,
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: we'll get more of an idea of what's gone down.
• 30:15
  Speaker 1: I think that is all we have time for today.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us for this episode.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: If you have enjoyed it, could you please make sure
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: you are subscribed on Apple Podcasts and also Spotify. And
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: if you are a longtime listener of the show and
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: really enjoy what we put out, we would really appreciate
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: it if you could leave us a five-star review. If
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: you do want to hear more content from us, we
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: release a subscriber episode every Thursday with bonus content. If
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: you're not already an Outspoken Plus subscriber, all the details
• 30:42
  Speaker 1: to sign up are in our show notes. This podcast
• 30:44
  Speaker 1: was recorded on the traditional land of the Kaurna people
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: of the Adelaide Plains. We pay respect to elders past
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: and present.