Latest / Beyond Fulfillment Podcast / From Family Business to Empowering Women Entrepreneurs: The Wyseminds Story with Julie Perkins

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From Family Business to Empowering Women Entrepreneurs: The Wyseminds Story with Julie Perkins · Beyond Fulfillment Podcast

• 0:00
  Julie Perkins is the founder of Wise Minds, a company dedicated to guiding women in business.
• 0:08
  Julie shares her inspirational journey from growing up in a high paced entrepreneurial family to taking on a pivotal role in expanding her family's eyeglass company, Specsavers, internationally.
• 0:20
  She opens up about the challenges she faced and the valuable lessons learned which now fuel her passion for supporting women entrepreneurs.
• 0:30
  Julie's story takes a turn as she discusses the pivotal life event of being diagnosed with stage 3C ovarian cancer, which ultimately inspired her to create Wise Minds.
• 0:42
  Tune in to hear Julie's compelling insights on navigating entrepreneurial challenges, the importance of aligning purpose with values, and her commitment to helping women keep their businesses thriving in today's competitive landscape.
• 0:58
  As always, if you found value from this content, please like and subscribe.
• 1:03
  Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of the Beyond Fulfillment podcast.
• 1:07
  I'm your host, Dave Goulis, and this week my guest is the founder of Wise Minds, Julie Perkins.
• 1:15
  Welcome, Julie.
• 1:17
  Well, thank you very much, David.
• 1:18
  Thank you very much for having me.
• 1:20
  Thank you.
• 1:21
  Absolutely.
• 1:21
  We appreciate you taking the time to be here.
• 1:24
  So, Julie, we're just talking off camera about how you grew up in an entrepreneurial family before starting your own business.
• 1:32
  Can you just walk us through your backstory and how you got started?
• 1:36
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:37
  Well, I come from quite a sort of high paced entrepreneurial family and I think if you're in that situation, there's no separation of life, home, family, it's all one.
• 1:47
  And subconsciously it sort of seeps into you how fun it is to run your own business and also gives you some of the benefits, the rules of what it's like to be an entrepreneur.
• 2:00
  I never heard my parents come back and say that they had a bad day with the boss or anything like that.
• 2:06
  It was always positive.
• 2:07
  It's always part of growing up for us.
• 2:12
  And then after opening the family business in the very first international place outside where they originally opened, and I did that for 25 years and it really inspired me, my journey to begin my own business to support women
• 2:31
  entrepreneurs to grow their business.
• 2:34
  And I thought, well, after the journey I've had, the failures, the ups and the downs, is there a way that I can gather that journey and to support women so we get more women opening up their businesses and
• 2:49
  most importantly, growing their businesses.
• 2:53
  Okay, so a lot, lot to unpack and get to there.
• 2:56
  So, so let's start with the family business.
• 2:58
  So you mentioned parents were entrepreneurs.
• 3:01
  Always positive, always growth oriented.
• 3:04
  It sounds like how, how early did you start working within the Business.
• 3:10
  Well, growing up in an entrepreneurial family, everyone will know there's always jobs to be done.
• 3:15
  And it was, we were Saturday kids really and we packed frames.
• 3:20
  We were involved in the business from a very early age, being there, being useful to our parents and thereafter our friends from school always had Saturday jobs.
• 3:32
  So we were very early stage.
• 3:34
  But as a proper job, I left after university and then looked at how we take the brand again overseas.
• 3:44
  So probably realistically about 23, 24.
• 3:48
  Okay.
• 3:49
  And so it was, it was an eyeglass company, is that right?
• 3:53
  It is.
• 3:54
  It's does spectacles and hearing and primary health.
• 3:58
  But back in those days it was just spectacles and then I took the brand over to the Netherlands and then supported it through northern Europe and did that for a good 25 years.
• 4:09
  Very few people could say I had the, really the time of my life, the career of my life and I learned a heck of a lot from a heck of a lot of great people.
• 4:18
  Okay, so the company originated in the Netherlands, is that right?
• 4:23
  No, the company originated in Guernsey in the Channel Islands, part of the British Isles.
• 4:31
  So I am an island girl, born and bred and I moved to the Netherlands which was the very first country that we opened up internationally and I've stayed here ever since.
• 4:42
  Really it's a, it's a center of new businesses opening and right place to be when you're looking at supporting early startups, for sure.
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• 5:48
  You'Re with out of university, you have this role to expand the company internationally.
• 5:53
  So sounds like a lot of sales, a lot of business development, a lot of telling the story and the vision and getting people to really buy in to bring it on.
• 6:04
  I mean, did you have any experience with that type of work prior?
• 6:09
  Well, I think One of the most important things to sort of mention is that specsavers, the company is born from partnership, it's born from joint venture partnership.
• 6:21
  So beginning that journey and actually our main priority, you mentioned telling the story, was going into a place where nobody knew the brand.
• 6:31
  How do you start day one.
• 6:33
  And that's building the story network about what it's done in the uk, how it's achieved its success, and through partners which were all qualified optometrists at the time, telling that story and gaining that buy in was the very
• 6:51
  first step.
• 6:53
  So having sold it and bought up with it in the uk, uk, in using that story, of course, I was surrounded by other great people doing it.
• 7:02
  So working here and understanding how do you gain your key partners on board by talking about the success, the story, and most importantly, the purpose and the values of which specsaver stood for.
• 7:21
  And I think that is one of the starting points of all companies coming in is telling that story about the change that it wants to make, why this place is the best place for it to make that change.
• 7:33
  And really the reputation that has built up from the uk.
• 7:39
  And I think that storytelling coming from a member of the family, I think is a very important part of.
• 7:47
  Of gaining that trust.
• 7:48
  And I think that's the same for all founders, is about gaining trust in that network as you start off.
• 7:54
  And that was a big part of that initial role of what I did.
• 7:59
  Wining dining workshops and telling people about that journey and the vision of change we wanted to make.
• 8:08
  And that's something that I work with women entrepreneurs today saying it's the first step is being able to tell your story with clarity and with where you're going with it.
• 8:21
  And being able to do that effectively, I think is such a key part of launching new brands and growing businesses in today's very overcrowded world.
• 8:32
  I think sometimes I agree.
• 8:35
  Okay.
• 8:36
  And so with that international expansion, right, and everything you set out to do with specsavers, like what type of challenges did you face?
• 8:45
  Like early on along the way when you were growing into the Netherlands and Europe and whatnot?
• 8:51
  Yeah, I think, well, the biggest challenge is, of course, momentum and coming into a very competitive marketplace, so standing there and being very different.
• 9:02
  But our model ensured that the people owning the stores were the people testing your eyes and being there, so actually emphasizing what's different.
• 9:12
  But one of the key challenges, I think, of opening up a business, and I probably knew it, more coming on and growing, I didn't know it from day one, is about getting all your stakeholders on board and of
• 9:26
  course under pressure.
• 9:28
  When you're growing a business, you're focused on customer, on volume, on proving and validating your model.
• 9:34
  But one of the key things that we forget is writing that stakeholders list very early on.
• 9:43
  Formerly it's called early governance, but now what I do is I look at who that list of people is you need to inform, including your family and friends, what are you doing, where are you going to be and
• 9:55
  what part of the role are you going to play in your home life as well when you're rapidly expanding and making sure your stakeholders, the direct stakeholders and the far stakeholders are getting that right message that, that feel
• 10:09
  involved in where you're going and what you're doing.
• 10:12
  And that's a huge thing that we did really for the first two or three years is grow that stakeholders, map who is involved indirectly and directly.
• 10:24
  And that was a massive, massive journey for us to really establish and overcome the challenge that we weren't the first into the market.
• 10:33
  And in a competitive market building that I think is absolutely key.
• 10:40
  Especially when you've got a previous journey that's done so well and you're there starting from scratch, it does help to build that team around you for sure and family and friends.
• 10:54
  That was a big challenge.
• 10:55
  It's a challenge for any founder.
• 10:57
  When you're working so hard and you're kind of off the scene and where do you fit in?
• 11:02
  Where are you going to appear?
• 11:03
  Being clear upfront and honest from day one about your vision, what you love about it and why it's important to you and the role that you're going to play.
• 11:12
  Going further forward, I think is key, especially you know, closer to home.
• 11:18
  Sounds like that, that almost provided like a support system to really help you push through those early times when maybe people aren't buying in as quick or things aren't taking off and it gave you more of a support
• 11:32
  system to fall back.
• 11:33
  That.
• 11:33
  Is that right?
• 11:33
  Yeah, that's a great summary.
• 11:36
  That's a great summary of what it is.
• 11:38
  Because any founder knows early stage is tough and you may have a dream and it's validated and it's amazing and it's fantastic.
• 11:49
  But sometimes that journey, translating that out is a lot slower, as we all know.
• 11:57
  So I think building that network and just as you've put it, I think is a perfect next step sometimes gets overlooked.
• 12:05
  We get carried away with the day to day operations, the hamster wheel of getting it going, but the actual power of our success as a founder and we're critical in those early stages is that network.
• 12:18
  And not just the people we know on business networks or in the industry.
• 12:22
  It's really those closer to home.
• 12:25
  Okay, all right, so let's fast forward.
• 12:28
  You have a long, successful run helping expand Spec Savers.
• 12:34
  And then what, like, what led you to.
• 12:39
  To start your own company, Wise Minds?
• 12:42
  Well, I mean, I've always been passionate about women in business and wanting businesses to grow.
• 12:50
  And I kept hearing time and time again, oh, I said, what have you done previously?
• 12:55
  And.
• 12:55
  And they said, well, you know, I had a business.
• 12:56
  And then I said, well, tell me about it.
• 12:58
  I said, it doesn't exist anymore.
• 13:01
  And I think, gosh, what a great idea.
• 13:03
  Why doesn't it exist anymore?
• 13:05
  And I just thought, if you found me two or three weeks earlier, I could have done some critical things that could have supported you to ensure that it could take a positive step forward.
• 13:18
  And quite often, why things go into early maturity, we know we blame ourselves for, but often it's, oh, you just need to do A, B and C.
• 13:27
  And that will get it back on track.
• 13:29
  And I think, gosh, the number of stories that I heard time and time again, and I always thought at one stage, I really want to do that.
• 13:37
  And then I got diagnosed with stage 3C ovarian cancer.
• 13:42
  And during that journey, I think is the time to really reflect.
• 13:46
  Okay, when I'm out of this, what I'm going to do is it's not just going to be a wish.
• 13:51
  And when I went into remission, I started Wise Minds.
• 13:55
  I knew it was what I wanted to do.
• 13:57
  It was there all along.
• 13:59
  And then geared by ill health, I just thought, well, now's the time.
• 14:05
  So that's really the story.
• 14:08
  Okay, so it's something that you had the desire to do.
• 14:11
  You always knew there was a need for it.
• 14:13
  And then that the cancer diagnosis sounds like it made you think, wow, well, if not now, then when?
• 14:21
  Exactly.
• 14:22
  Absolutely.
• 14:23
  Okay.
• 14:24
  All right.
• 14:25
  And so you have this decision that now's the time I'm going to do it, and then what happens next?
• 14:32
  Covid.
• 14:35
  But in a way, I always say that that was one of the greatest things that happened because of course, we were all helping each other, and I couldn't go out and do people shopping and stuff because I was
• 14:48
  only just from remission.
• 14:50
  And so I put the question out going, anybody need help saving their business?
• 14:56
  And of course, I had, I think, up to 10 companies went, yes, please, yes, please.
• 15:01
  And I think it gave me that opportunity to really trial what I was thinking in my head under big, challenging Circumstances.
• 15:12
  And my previous experience at Specsavers was really in a Great Recession of 2008 and 9.
• 15:19
  And that experience translated into another crisis of COVID It makes you keep it really lean.
• 15:29
  And I think it gave me a chance to trial when there was no choice under really difficult circumstances.
• 15:38
  What do businesses need to get themselves back on track or to take that step further forward.
• 15:46
  There was no room for error, so you had to really trial iterate.
• 15:51
  And this first concept, which got myself in the Netherlands open to market leadership, translated so well into companies go back to purpose, go back to the original story, unload what doesn't serve.
• 16:09
  Because if you didn't do that during the beginning of COVID survival was tough.
• 16:14
  You had to go back to what was most important.
• 16:18
  And that's basically what I did and then built the journey that I do now with women entrepreneurs to take them onto that next growth wave.
• 16:28
  Back to purpose values, back to the basics, step by step.
• 16:32
  How do you deliver it?
• 16:35
  And what is that thing that you're going to make that customer the hero of their story?
• 16:42
  And if you weren't doing that during COVID there was no room for fluff or fluff.
• 16:48
  There was no room for it.
• 16:50
  So in early startup, that lean approach, but driving with true purpose, not with the purpose we think we have, I think really sort of powered some of those companies forward.
• 17:04
  And it gave me the confidence to say, this is the program that supports women coming forward.
• 17:10
  And yeah, that was the sort of story of how do you take women's businesses into the next growth wave to keep that growth there and to prevent early maturity and closure.
• 17:24
  And I suppose Covid was the way that I sort of said, what is that process for preventing early closure?
• 17:31
  Because there was no choice.
• 17:32
  So, you know, in difficult times, sometimes the opportunity is there.
• 17:38
  Okay, yeah, I love that.
• 17:40
  Unload what doesn't serve, the way you put that.
• 17:43
  So when you're in that situation during COVID and you're helping, you're basically doing a, almost like a beta test for this new concept you have and you're working with these businesses.
• 17:55
  What were some of the.
• 17:57
  The challenges you saw that they needed to overcome or I guess the things that didn't serve that needed to be unloaded.
• 18:04
  Well, in Covid, every country had its own support from governments or thankfully, hopefully in some way.
• 18:11
  And the very first thing we did was to work out what the budget is.
• 18:20
  Because of course under pressure you're like, it's a disaster.
• 18:24
  I'm going to close.
• 18:25
  This is it.
• 18:25
  And it's exactly what it is when you're frantically opening a business.
• 18:30
  It's just in Covid, we calculated when a founder said, that's it, I'm closing.
• 18:37
  Okay, let's budget and find out what that closing period is.
• 18:42
  Let's start to talk reality.
• 18:44
  So you've got enough money, you've got enough subsidies or support from the government or money from yourself to last five months.
• 18:51
  So once we could get that time period open, say, right, we've got five, what are we going to do in those periods of time in order that you can turn around or exist and drive forward in that time
• 19:03
  period?
• 19:04
  And that's exactly what we do.
• 19:05
  Now.
• 19:07
  The most important thing, I think we often forget when we're opening businesses is what's.
• 19:14
  What are the guardrails?
• 19:15
  And I use two guardrails.
• 19:17
  One is the purpose, the vision, the values, what you're doing it for clarity, which is what I previously mentioned about what serves.
• 19:25
  And the other guardrail is that finance guardrail.
• 19:30
  What exactly value are you putting out there?
• 19:33
  How much does it cost you to put that value out there and what are you getting for that value?
• 19:38
  And always the controversial, what is the founder paying themselves for that value?
• 19:45
  And that guardrail is very important as that balance.
• 19:49
  And that's exactly the process that we use now that in Covid, it was very instant and the very first meeting was trying to tell someone, you know, work with somebody, I'm losing everything to okay, what does lose mean
• 20:03
  and what's our timescale we're working towards?
• 20:05
  I think most companies did that.
• 20:07
  But when you're sat on your own as a founder or with a small team, you really need to do that very, very this.
• 20:14
  What's the period of time we're actually talking about?
• 20:17
  What's the money and what's the value?
• 20:19
  And what can we do in that period of time to make sure you can survive that period of time then next step, that period of time.
• 20:27
  So that was very much the COVID.
• 20:29
  Strategy from my hand and makes perfect sense.
• 20:34
  But at that time too, when it first started, everything was shutting down.
• 20:39
  No one really knew how this was going to turn out.
• 20:42
  People clearly are emotional with seeing the threats to their business and their livelihood and whatnot.
• 20:47
  Like, how difficult was it getting founders to really think rationally, so to speak, and kind of walk down that path when, like you said, emotions were running so high?
• 20:58
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 20:59
  I mean, the most important thing on top of the what period of time we did, which is something that lives for today, is to take the founder out of their own Path and by that I mean if somebody
• 21:16
  is frantic, is how do you get them to step aside from themselves?
• 21:24
  And we had a little program which has grown today into making yourself redundant.
• 21:30
  Now, of course, we're not making the leader redundant, but taking that founder step by step out of their current position so that they can actually view into it.
• 21:43
  And we did that very clearly with taking them back.
• 21:46
  What took you here?
• 21:48
  What are your personal values?
• 21:50
  Why are you doing what you do with this business?
• 21:54
  I mean, why not just close?
• 21:56
  Of course we don't want them to close, but why are you taking that choices?
• 22:00
  What's the vision?
• 22:01
  And is that vision still valid today in today's world?
• 22:06
  How is it valid?
• 22:08
  And then we would work them back in terms of clear process, sorry, clear purpose, values of the organization and how they can make that change to make sure they were still on their golden thread path.
• 22:23
  That is the most important thing to try and get that belief in.
• 22:28
  And it's a very important part, is just trying to extract the emotion and the passion from oh my goodness, what's happening into something that makes them a leader for that period of time.
• 22:42
  It's not forever.
• 22:43
  It's for this period.
• 22:45
  And how do we do what we believe?
• 22:47
  Of course, it's a difficult journey.
• 22:50
  Active listening, understanding that as a coach in the time was a key part.
• 22:55
  But in terms of the practicality, to make the founder redundant out of the current situation, which was very emotional, and to reposition them in a way of right, this is your leadership role for the next four months.
• 23:08
  This is your one job.
• 23:09
  This is what you have to do and to try and inspire and keep everybody focused.
• 23:15
  And I know it sounds a bit like, well, when everything's falling apart, but you've got to control what you can control and your inner voice, your vision, and how that translates into your company and other people and that
• 23:29
  alignment of value is something that founders can influence if you can take them out and put them back in.
• 23:38
  And that's how we did it, really.
• 23:40
  Okay.
• 23:42
  All right, so now fast forward to what you're doing present day, where you know, we're past Covid and Wise Minds has been operating for a couple years now.
• 23:54
  So your focus is specifically is women entrepreneurs.
• 23:58
  So what are some of the biggest challenges that women entrepreneurs face today?
• 24:06
  I think they're twofold.
• 24:09
  They, funny enough, follow the guardrails.
• 24:11
  But I know that there are the headlines of the funding, the networks and the responsibility that we take upon ourselves to have broader roles in life.
• 24:24
  And these are the headlines that we always hear but some of the challenges that I look at is much earlier stage before funding is needed.
• 24:34
  And what my mission is is if I can change the number of women that can keep their businesses open so that we've got a bigger pool that are knocking on the funding door or just growing businesses, this will
• 24:51
  be a harder message to ignore.
• 24:55
  And I think some of the challenges start earlier on.
• 24:58
  I think women find it very difficult with the inconsistent revenues that you get in a startup.
• 25:06
  And what happens is it's not that it's different for everybody else, but what happens is that we start to compensate for that, work harder.
• 25:17
  It's my fault.
• 25:18
  Undervalue ourselves and most importantly, we actually don't get round to paying ourselves anything.
• 25:27
  After a while, this becomes the normal behavior.
• 25:32
  And it's trying to capture this area of understanding how businesses grow in a series of ways.
• 25:39
  And that is up and down.
• 25:41
  But how can we budget to understand that?
• 25:44
  How can we take choices looking at that, how can we plan a longer view as well as today?
• 25:50
  And these are the most important things that we work towards.
• 25:54
  Challenges we tend to hold tighter, hold on to people, et cetera.
• 25:59
  And what I try and do is try and educate about businesses growing in series of ways and that.
• 26:06
  How can you say goodbye to the past wave without losing that value and move successfully onto the next one?
• 26:12
  This is a huge transformation.
• 26:14
  This is part of what we do.
• 26:16
  And that's a massive part.
• 26:18
  How do you let go?
• 26:19
  And I was sort of liking it.
• 26:21
  We hold onto those initial stages like bringing up up kids or bringing up hobbies.
• 26:27
  We hold tight.
• 26:28
  But letting go is a very important part.
• 26:32
  How do we, how do we decide where to reposition ourselves?
• 26:36
  And that's one of the big challenges.
• 26:38
  And if we can get these waves right, we get it really right.
• 26:42
  And that means that when we look at what growth means to us, we can actually look at what funding we need, what support we need, what or what is enough for us.
• 26:53
  It doesn't always have to result in funding.
• 26:56
  And this sort of pattern is critically important, is to understand the waves, how we travel with the waves, how to let go and to stay the founder that we need to be on each of those waves.
• 27:09
  And if we can support women and teach women that style of growing businesses, it will increase the pot of entrepreneurs using it as a career.
• 27:19
  Not everything has to result in funding.
• 27:21
  It can just be doing something really great that you're fulfilled with, but doing it well, that's not building the business around you, but understanding how to keep just that little bit of Space between you and your business so
• 27:36
  that you can play all of the roles in your life, whether that be a mother, a friend, still doing the things that you love and that those are so, so important to sort of work with.
• 27:48
  Educating women about the pattern of business growth.
• 27:53
  And that's kind of what we do.
• 27:55
  So I mean, it sounds like from your perspective, getting that wrong or I guess not.
• 28:02
  Not understanding those patterns and maybe taking it too personal or whatever it may be is a major reason that you see female founders giving up too soon.
• 28:12
  Definitely think so.
• 28:13
  I think the number of women that I face and I sort of say, so what's the challenge?
• 28:17
  What's your question today?
• 28:19
  And their immediate response is, what am I doing wrong?
• 28:23
  And when they describe the picture, I say, oh, that's not you doing anything wrong.
• 28:29
  That's your business trying to tell you something because you're still trying to hold it onto it like a toddler and build it up like you did at the beginning.
• 28:37
  And it's desperately trying to grow as a teenager and you're holding it back.
• 28:42
  And the people, these great people that you've employed to help you or even part time to help you do it can't get a space in.
• 28:53
  So that important area about understanding these are natural patterns of business growth at early stage will definitely increase the number of women that can drive that forward for sure.
• 29:09
  Okay, and then so I, you made the metaphor there in terms of growing your business in the same way that a child develops and grows.
• 29:17
  I mean, is that, is that metaphor like a critical part of kind of what you teach in terms of understanding, like the, the cycle of a business?
• 29:26
  Yeah, I mean, we, we try and use as many analogies as, as possible.
• 29:31
  The one like a child, the toddler, and then as it goes to teenager, it needs more space, it needs influence from other people.
• 29:40
  And you as the originator need to take step back and you know, make sure you're so still mapping the pool for college funds.
• 29:48
  You know, that's your kind of job and transfer.
• 29:51
  But we sort of always use, we also use the metaphor of Mount Everest, which I think one of them is.
• 29:58
  One of the easiest ones to learn is when you get to Camp 4 and you're trying to summit towards the new wave each time.
• 30:08
  If you're trying to climb to the summit with everything that it's taken you to get to where you are without thinking what no longer serves me, you're too heavy to climb.
• 30:19
  And this isn't about discarding people randomly or processes.
• 30:23
  It's about going back to the start regularly.
• 30:27
  Purpose, values.
• 30:28
  Am I still aligned with what I do?
• 30:30
  Am I still changing the life of my customer?
• 30:33
  You know, going back to those basics, I mean, there's a whole graveyard out there of companies that, you know, became more involved in their own process, holding on tight in their own glory, than actually looking the fact that
• 30:46
  the customer had changed tack and they were no longer being served by you.
• 30:51
  So these basic questions, each time, very important.
• 30:55
  And regularly, those waves, early startup, especially in today's world, come pretty fast.
• 31:02
  Okay.
• 31:04
  All right.
• 31:04
  And Julie, if other women listening want to get in touch with you and learn more about your services and how you can potentially help them, what's the best way that people can reach out to you?
• 31:14
  Well, you can go and have a look on Wiseminds.com and that's wise with the Y and there's loads of stories that you can read and learn from.
• 31:23
  There's also I've talked a lot about alignment of purpose and values today, and if you want to do a little check, there's a questionnaire that will actually calculate how aligned you are at the moment in terms of being
• 31:35
  purpose led.
• 31:36
  So that's the best way, really to reach out.
• 31:39
  Okay.
• 31:40
  And we'll link that in the show notes for everyone.
• 31:43
  All right, well, Julie, thank you so much for taking the time to be here, sharing your story and all this valuable wisdom.
• 31:48
  We greatly appreciate it.
• 31:50
  Well, thank you very, very much for having me, Dave.
• 31:52
  It's been a lot of fun.
• 31:53
  Thank you.
• 31:54
  All right, and that's all the time we have for now.
• 31:57
  We will see you next.