Latest / I Don't Know You / How Doing What He Dreaded Unlocked Brenden Vogt's Discipline In Creative Growth

Transcript

How Doing What He Dreaded Unlocked Brenden Vogt's Discipline In Creative Growth · I Don't Know You

0:04
SPEAKER_02: Hey, I'm Matt.
0:05
SPEAKER_02: I'm a Jesus follower,
0:06
SPEAKER_02: husband,
0:07
SPEAKER_02: father,
0:07
SPEAKER_02: son,
0:08
SPEAKER_02: and friend who is super curious about topics like parenthood,
0:11
SPEAKER_02: creativity,
0:12
SPEAKER_02: and the tension between ambition and contentment,
0:14
SPEAKER_02: all while living in the distraction of the 21st century.
0:17
These conversations serve as a way for me to hear from people I
0:20
deeply respect on
0:22
SPEAKER_02: topics that I'm still learning about.
0:24
Can you give me 10 seconds of your time to ask if you could
0:28
share,
0:28
follow,
0:29
and review?
0:29
It would be a great help to make these conversations more
0:32
discoverable for
0:33
SPEAKER_02: like-minded creatives.
0:34
SPEAKER_02: My goal is to continue to make these as best as I can and bring relevant
0:39
SPEAKER_02: conversations to you that you'll find interesting.
0:41
SPEAKER_02: Thanks for listening.
0:42
SPEAKER_02: It seriously means so much to me.
0:44
SPEAKER_02: Today, I'm joined by my friend, Brendan Vogt.
0:47
SPEAKER_02: We're diving into the world of content creation,
0:49
exploring the challenges and triumphs that come along with
0:52
starting and maintaining
0:53
SPEAKER_02: a creative journey.
0:55
Brendan's discipline and ability to just start and improve
0:58
daily has been a huge
0:59
SPEAKER_02: inspiration to me.
1:00
We'll discuss how to balance creativity with life's
1:03
responsibilities and the
1:04
SPEAKER_02: lessons he's learned along the way.
1:07
SPEAKER_02: Enjoy.
1:09
The whole content creation stuff,
1:11
like there's a whole learning curve to getting it right.
1:14
SPEAKER_01: And I still don't have it fully right, but I have something that works.
1:18
SPEAKER_01: You know,
1:18
I think it's like what you're doing with the content creation
1:23
stuff is like you
1:24
SPEAKER_02: just have to start.
1:25
And that's like what you're and this is part of what I want to
1:28
talk to you today about.
1:29
It's just like the ability that you seem to have to just like
1:33
start and be
1:34
SPEAKER_02: disciplined enough to like
1:36
do something because i feel like so many people myself included
1:41
fall into the trap
1:42
of like i gotta i gotta study this i gotta research this and
1:46
we've talked about
1:46
that before where it's like some version of that has happened
1:50
for every creative i
1:51
think but then it's like the people that actually are
1:54
successful and make a
1:55
SPEAKER_02: difference like they just start doing stuff i think
1:59
SPEAKER_01: Well,
1:59
I'm smiling and laughing internally because I mentioned this in
2:02
one of my videos,
2:03
SPEAKER_01: but I I've literally been trying like almost every single year,
2:07
SPEAKER_01: like clockwork.
2:09
SPEAKER_01: I'm like,
2:09
SPEAKER_01: yeah,
2:09
I'm going to get up the courage to like start posting a video
2:12
and then I need to
2:13
SPEAKER_01: think about a video.
2:14
SPEAKER_01: And then it takes me way too long to think about a video.
2:16
And I get so nervous about like creating something and then I
2:20
go to post it.
2:20
SPEAKER_01: I'm like, oh, it's not perfect.
2:21
SPEAKER_01: And I don't post it.
2:23
And so like my first video officially on Instagram when
2:27
starting this whole thing,
2:28
SPEAKER_01: like for pretty much every day is I just said,
2:32
SPEAKER_01: I don't know what I'm talking about.
2:33
SPEAKER_01: And this is not going to be interesting.
2:35
Just move on if you find this video like this is not going to
2:38
be interesting,
2:39
SPEAKER_01: but I'm promising to get better every day.
2:41
SPEAKER_01: And I think that's the mindset that you need to have is start.
2:45
SPEAKER_01: It's going to be terrible.
2:46
SPEAKER_01: And then just improve something every single day.
2:50
yeah well that has been a huge inspiration to me as I've been
2:55
thinking about this
2:56
idea of like recording some conversations I've been wanting to
3:02
do this for so long
3:04
SPEAKER_02: and basically I feel like most of the
3:10
hurdles are like but they're myself like most people I think in
3:16
general are just
3:18
like I mean I'll speak for myself not most people I am a very
3:23
lazy person by nature
3:24
I think and so it's very easy to be like man I'm tired I just
3:29
worked all day I
3:30
don't want to do this but I say I always want to do it and I
3:34
think that's one of
3:35
the things that was so inspiring to me about when you started
3:38
doing all of like
3:40
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you're still like doing a video every day.
3:42
SPEAKER_02: I don't think you missed.
3:44
SPEAKER_02: I mean, maybe you missed like wine or something.
3:46
I'm behind a couple of days and life's like it doesn't always
3:51
come first priority,
3:53
SPEAKER_01: but I do try to to get it done.
3:55
SPEAKER_01: So I think I'm behind two days officially.
3:58
SPEAKER_01: So it's not about like with almost all goals.
4:01
SPEAKER_01: It's not about being perfect at it.
4:03
SPEAKER_01: It's about saying that.
4:05
SPEAKER_01: I'm trying my best.
4:06
SPEAKER_01: I'm trying to meet this goal that I set for myself.
4:08
SPEAKER_01: It doesn't even have to be every day.
4:10
SPEAKER_01: It could be five out of seven days.
4:12
But what matters is when you are down,
4:15
you start allocating things a little differently.
4:17
SPEAKER_01: And obviously,
4:18
SPEAKER_01: like in the grand scheme of things,
4:19
SPEAKER_01: family comes first,
4:21
SPEAKER_01: like your own priorities with myself,
4:24
SPEAKER_01: with God comes first,
4:26
SPEAKER_01: then my wife,
4:27
SPEAKER_01: then my family,
4:27
SPEAKER_01: then my kids.
4:29
SPEAKER_01: Some people put their kids way too high.
4:30
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
4:32
SPEAKER_00: That's a whole nother discussion.
4:34
SPEAKER_00: But I want to get into that fan.
4:38
It's and it doesn't always have the same order at every point
4:42
in your life.
4:43
SPEAKER_01: Like sometimes you just have to say,
4:44
SPEAKER_01: you know what,
4:45
like things are kind of going askew and I need to shift this in
4:48
top priority.
4:49
SPEAKER_01: And that's fine.
4:50
SPEAKER_01: But as long as you recognize for it's for a season.
4:52
But I think you should generally have a plan for how you
4:55
prioritize your life.
4:58
SPEAKER_01: But anyways, yeah, I think I'm behind two days.
5:00
SPEAKER_01: And
5:02
SPEAKER_01: I don't know, it's a struggle to find something interesting.
5:06
SPEAKER_01: My plan for social media posting is,
5:12
Not fully thought out yet,
5:13
but it's a mix of videos that I want to make that make me
5:18
happy.
5:19
SPEAKER_01: And I think most of those,
5:21
SPEAKER_01: maybe like half of those,
5:23
are those where it makes me happy to create this and it drives
5:28
me to pursue
5:29
something and learn about something and then distill that into
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something that's
5:33
SPEAKER_01: interesting for somebody else.
5:35
cause not always something that's interesting to you will be
5:38
relatable and
5:39
SPEAKER_01: interesting to somebody else.
5:40
SPEAKER_01: Um,
5:41
SPEAKER_01: then like maybe two out of 10,
5:43
SPEAKER_01: uh,
5:44
SPEAKER_01: videos will be like,
5:46
SPEAKER_01: okay,
5:47
SPEAKER_01: I have a goal for like,
5:49
I want to get more exposure and maybe get more followers and
5:53
get people talking
5:54
SPEAKER_01: about this topic that I'm interested in.
5:56
SPEAKER_01: And so like two out of 10 will be those.
5:58
SPEAKER_01: Um,
5:59
Maybe another two out of 10 will be like just purely to see if
6:03
something is sticking.
6:05
Like one of my most popular videos has like 1.8 million views
6:09
and like got like
6:13
SPEAKER_01: close to like 30,000 followers.
6:15
SPEAKER_01: And that's like most of my followers.
6:17
And so like the power law is definitely in play there where
6:19
it's like you finally
6:21
SPEAKER_01: made that one video.
6:24
SPEAKER_01: You can't go back in time, but assuming I made that one video.
6:27
SPEAKER_01: Like make it free without internet video.
6:29
SPEAKER_01: That was one that was popular.
6:31
SPEAKER_01: The other one was download restricted Instagram content.
6:35
That's like just right click and hit the inspect button and you
6:39
get to see kind of
6:40
behind the curtain of what your browser does and you can see
6:42
all the network
6:43
SPEAKER_01: requests and
6:44
download stuff that normally doesn't have a download button and
6:47
but that was
6:47
surprising because that's a normal thing that me as a developer
6:50
does just go right
6:52
click and see how things kind of work but then everybody was
6:54
like I didn't know
6:55
that was possible and like just got shared through the roof I
7:00
dove into metrics on
7:02
why possibly that one did better and it was just a whole mix of
7:06
things like it had
7:07
SPEAKER_01: high share rate high retention and
7:10
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, people stuck.
7:11
SPEAKER_01: They commented.
7:12
SPEAKER_01: Like, almost every metric was, like, an outstanding metric.
7:16
SPEAKER_01: I compared it against every other metric,
7:18
SPEAKER_01: and I don't think I've ever gotten close to another video like that.
7:22
SPEAKER_01: Well,
7:22
SPEAKER_02: that's,
7:22
SPEAKER_02: like,
7:22
SPEAKER_02: the deal with viral stories and reels in general is,
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SPEAKER_02: like,
7:28
SPEAKER_02: you're not going to get bangers every single time.
7:30
SPEAKER_02: But, like, that's why they're viral.
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SPEAKER_02: They're one of a kind, right?
7:34
SPEAKER_02: But also, like, in general...
7:36
you unknowingly maybe and and maybe knowingly i'd love to get
7:40
into that but like
7:41
stumbled upon something that was super shareable and that's
7:45
like the main metric of
7:46
instagram real there's like can i share this with my friends is
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this something that
7:51
i want to like talk about because instagram is just like a
7:55
messaging app at this
7:56
SPEAKER_02: point really like
7:57
SPEAKER_02: It's really good at allowing you to share content.
8:01
And that's like the main metric that most creators are like
8:04
looking towards is like
8:05
SPEAKER_02: how shareable is my stuff?
8:06
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
8:07
SPEAKER_01: I think most businesses even,
8:08
SPEAKER_01: I won't talk about my day job because that might get controversial,
8:13
but I think most companies that deal with like older than 13
8:18
year olds type
8:19
SPEAKER_01: platform optimize for time in the app.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: And like if you're on Netflix, they want you to watch more things.
8:25
SPEAKER_01: If you're on Netflix,
8:27
SPEAKER_01: YouTube, they want you to watch more things.
8:28
SPEAKER_01: TikTok, same thing.
8:29
So everything that's like consumable is like probably
8:33
optimizing for time in app
8:35
SPEAKER_01: watching content.
8:36
SPEAKER_01: And there's other like quality metrics on that.
8:40
If you're spending a lot of time and you're watching the same
8:42
video or like,
8:44
SPEAKER_01: let's say you spend hours in the app,
8:46
SPEAKER_01: but you only watch one video,
8:47
SPEAKER_01: like something's weird there.
8:49
So like there's other quality metrics,
8:51
but time in app watching content is one of the top ones.
8:55
And I haven't looked in a long time,
8:57
but that one that got 1.7 million views,
9:00
it's crazy.
9:01
SPEAKER_01: It boggles the mind to see how much watch time,
9:04
like if you aggregate all the people who watched it and how
9:07
much they watched it,
9:07
SPEAKER_01: it's like,
9:09
think over a couple years now of watch time yeah like that's
9:12
insane well it's wild
9:14
even when we were doing like our travel videos and stuff and i
9:18
mean i think we have
9:19
like 1300 subscribers on on youtube or something which is not
9:24
very many but like
9:27
SPEAKER_02: even our highest watched video i think is like
9:32
35,000 or something like that and the watch time on that all of
9:35
our videos are like
9:35
40 minutes long the watch time on that is like thousands of
9:38
hours and it's just
9:40
SPEAKER_02: crazy to think about like
9:43
SPEAKER_02: oh man,
9:44
like everybody that's watching this is even if they're like the
9:48
retention rate is,
9:49
SPEAKER_02: I don't know,
9:49
within like a little over probably 30 or 40% for people
9:55
watching the whole video
9:56
SPEAKER_02: through,
9:57
SPEAKER_02: but it's still like so high.
9:59
SPEAKER_02: And it's crazy to see like,
10:02
SPEAKER_02: it's crazy to see just like,
10:03
SPEAKER_02: man,
10:04
SPEAKER_02: this is such an interesting data point to,
10:07
SPEAKER_02: I feel like we're so in the weeds.
10:10
SPEAKER_02: I want to go back a little bit.
10:11
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
10:12
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
10:13
SPEAKER_02: and kind of introduce you a little bit.
10:15
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
10:16
you and I have known each other for a long time and we have
10:19
kind of found an
10:20
affinity with kind of entrepreneurship in general and business
10:24
building and brand
10:25
SPEAKER_02: building and estate friends.
10:28
SPEAKER_02: Not because of that,
10:29
but I think like we have always had something to talk about
10:33
because of those
10:33
SPEAKER_02: things.
10:34
You're someone I deeply respect and love and care about and
10:38
look to you as kind of
10:40
SPEAKER_02: an example of like,
10:41
SPEAKER_02: working really hard,
10:42
SPEAKER_02: being super disciplined,
10:44
being like an awesome dad and husband and like an awesome
10:48
follower of God.
10:49
SPEAKER_02: And like,
10:50
I think one of the main questions as I kind of start recording
10:53
more of these
10:54
SPEAKER_02: conversations is like,
10:56
SPEAKER_02: how do you kind of wrestle with
10:58
working hard and being ambitious and then also like being a
11:02
good dad and a good
11:03
husband like those things I feel like creativity and vocation
11:07
at least in the
11:08
western world a lot of times are like at odds with each other
11:10
um and so like that's
11:13
one of the main conversations I want to understand myself more
11:17
by like having more
11:18
SPEAKER_02: conversations like that and as someone who has like
11:23
has a very good job in the field that he's in and is well
11:26
respected and works
11:28
SPEAKER_02: really hard and does a great job at that.
11:30
You're a developer,
11:31
a full stack developer for a very big corporation that
11:35
everybody knows.
11:36
SPEAKER_02: It's very easy to find out what you do.
11:38
SPEAKER_02: But like, how do you manage that?
11:41
SPEAKER_02: I think those are some of my questions that I want to get into.
11:45
But I'm curious,
11:46
like how you kind of started to even like,
11:49
I feel like curiosity is such a,
11:53
that's such a big like value of yours like how did you kind of
11:58
breed curiosity in
11:59
your life growing up or was that always something that you were
12:02
just like excited
12:03
about just like learning new things and stuff yeah there's a
12:06
couple a couple points
12:08
there one is like the how do i approach structuring like time
12:13
especially with all
12:13
the different aspects that are in it with family work hobbies
12:17
business and whatnot
12:18
SPEAKER_01: and
12:19
SPEAKER_01: Then also like the curiosity one, I could just knock that one out.
12:21
SPEAKER_01: Like my dad was very instrumental in making me who I am today.
12:26
SPEAKER_01: And for better or for worse, like we never have perfect parents.
12:31
And I think it's part in us as humans to say,
12:35
what was my life experience like?
12:38
And how would I like to adjust that moving forward with the
12:41
people that I interact with?
12:42
SPEAKER_01: Or if you choose and are blessed to have kids, how do I instill that?
12:48
the qualities that I want to instill in my kids and not have
12:51
indirectly the ones
12:53
SPEAKER_01: that I don't propagated.
12:54
SPEAKER_01: And man,
12:56
SPEAKER_01: as a parent,
12:57
SPEAKER_01: I'm sure you know,
12:58
SPEAKER_01: and you will know more and more every day is that kids will pick up
13:03
SPEAKER_01: the good and the bad aspects of you.
13:06
SPEAKER_01: And you have to struggle.
13:08
SPEAKER_01: You have to really fight to correct that.
13:10
SPEAKER_01: And you have to be humble.
13:12
SPEAKER_01: I've had many conversations with my kid where I said,
13:15
SPEAKER_01: you know,
13:15
SPEAKER_01: that wasn't how I should have acted.
13:16
SPEAKER_01: I'm sorry.
13:17
SPEAKER_01: And oh my gosh, that goes so far.
13:20
And it is kind of hard to do because you feel like you're
13:25
obviously in the wrong situation.
13:27
SPEAKER_01: But I obviously it was also in the wrong.
13:29
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
13:29
SPEAKER_02: That seems rare though.
13:30
Like I feel like a lot of parents are not having those
13:33
conversations with their kids.
13:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
13:35
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
13:36
SPEAKER_01: That was one thing that I saw with my parents that, uh,
13:42
SPEAKER_01: They're obviously like awesome and they're still around.
13:44
SPEAKER_01: They help so much and they've done so much for my sister and I.
13:51
SPEAKER_01: But like I said,
13:52
SPEAKER_01: nobody's perfect.
13:53
SPEAKER_01: And I wish we could have more like...
13:58
level playing field conversations where it's like right now I
14:02
could be dad mode or
14:03
parent and you could be child and sometimes that's appropriate
14:07
but sometimes let's
14:08
just talk about people like you're a person I'm a person and
14:11
these are our natural
14:13
SPEAKER_01: tendencies and and this is where we should correct them because
14:17
as a believer of God,
14:18
God tells us to act a certain way,
14:21
contrary to our natural tendencies.
14:23
SPEAKER_01: And that wasn't right on my part or your part.
14:26
SPEAKER_01: And my oldest kid is five years old.
14:28
SPEAKER_01: And like,
14:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm still having kind of deep conversations,
14:32
SPEAKER_01: obviously not as deep as you could imagine,
14:34
SPEAKER_01: but still you try to sprinkle those little,
14:37
SPEAKER_01: little things in there.
14:38
SPEAKER_01: Um,
14:40
SPEAKER_02: Well,
14:40
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
14:40
I'm assuming that like even those conversations of like right
14:44
and wrong and like
14:45
SPEAKER_02: practical application of that in your own life with your five-year-old,
14:50
SPEAKER_02: like I would imagine a ton of people aren't doing that either.
14:52
SPEAKER_02: So it's like,
14:53
SPEAKER_02: it's cool to see even,
14:56
SPEAKER_02: and I'm assuming like he's meeting you in those conversations.
14:59
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
15:01
SPEAKER_01: I hold my kids to such a high standard.
15:03
It needs to be pushed intellectually first as like kids because
15:07
they're going to like,
15:09
be a roller coaster of emotions and stuff like that so it's
15:12
hard for you to tell
15:14
them to emotionally act a certain way but in those moments
15:18
where they are um
15:19
they're like ripe for the picking like they're calm they're
15:23
like mellow and you get
15:25
to like have deep converse deeper conversations than if they
15:28
were bouncing off the
15:28
SPEAKER_01: walls i push them intellectually to focus and listen and
15:32
SPEAKER_01: just an example of this,
15:33
SPEAKER_01: like out in public,
15:34
I put them in situations where they're forced to be
15:37
uncomfortable and either rely
15:39
SPEAKER_01: on me or like listen more closely to my instructions.
15:42
SPEAKER_01: Like in the grocery store, I'll say like, here, grab a cart.
15:47
And I will literally not touch anything in the store and I will
15:49
have them grab it.
15:51
SPEAKER_01: And if they- They probably love that.
15:52
SPEAKER_01: Oh, they love it.
15:54
And then if they can't reach for something or if they don't
15:57
know where something
15:57
SPEAKER_01: is,
15:58
SPEAKER_01: I'll tell them the things that we need.
15:59
SPEAKER_01: And if they can't find it, they can't reach it.
16:03
SPEAKER_01: I have them act as if I'm a stranger or an employee and they say,
16:06
SPEAKER_01: sir,
16:07
SPEAKER_01: like,
16:08
SPEAKER_01: can you put me to the strawberries,
16:10
SPEAKER_01: the dried strawberries?
16:11
SPEAKER_01: And oh yeah, they're up there.
16:13
SPEAKER_01: Oh, can you reach them for me, please?
16:14
SPEAKER_01: Dude, dried strawberries are on another level.
16:17
SPEAKER_02: Just like crack cocaine for small children.
16:21
SPEAKER_02: A dried fruit in general, man.
16:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so easy, so convenient.
16:26
that's just one example of me pushing them intellectually and
16:29
like even more
16:30
broadly as we kind of go back to the other subjects like I'm
16:33
thinking more and more
16:34
about a legacy that I want to leave with my kids and like
16:38
imagine if you were to
16:39
die any day would you be happy and content with how you've left
16:43
things like I don't
16:45
like to focus on those thoughts too much but like I think
16:47
that's an important thing
16:48
SPEAKER_01: to do and
16:50
SPEAKER_01: Pushing my kids is one aspect of that.
16:52
SPEAKER_01: Teaching them is another, especially with like content creation.
16:55
I want to get back into being a teacher of things and I'm not
16:59
too like prideful to
17:00
SPEAKER_01: think like I'm a know-it-all so therefore I should be a teacher.
17:04
SPEAKER_01: Like most of why I want to be a teacher is so that I can learn myself.
17:10
Like totally,
17:11
especially with the series that I'm kind of on right now with
17:13
electronics.
17:14
SPEAKER_01: I have never been deeper in electronic projects than like ever before.
17:18
And if that's the correct way to say that,
17:21
but like I am like knee deep in electronics projects.
17:24
SPEAKER_01: And it's fun because I've mentioned in one of my videos that I've been so
17:28
SPEAKER_01: discouraged with getting things wrong in the past.
17:30
SPEAKER_01: And that's usually where I stop.
17:33
SPEAKER_01: But then you have to say like, what did I do wrong?
17:36
And there's obviously a correct way to do something because
17:38
there's thousands of
17:39
SPEAKER_01: other people that can design something like this.
17:41
SPEAKER_01: So you have to just be humble and be a learner.
17:44
SPEAKER_01: And I think the best way to learn is to try to teach somebody.
17:49
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
17:50
SPEAKER_02: Well, that's like the old adage, right?
17:52
It's like for those that want to learn,
17:54
you just teach and then you mess up.
17:56
SPEAKER_02: And I mean, it's even like this is another old adage.
18:00
SPEAKER_02: But the idea of like when you are first learning anything,
18:04
SPEAKER_02: it's like you're watching someone else do it.
18:07
SPEAKER_02: Right.
18:07
And then that that person is teaching you on some level and
18:11
then you like kind of
18:12
SPEAKER_02: do it with that other person.
18:14
SPEAKER_02: Right.
18:14
And so they get to tell you about,
18:16
I mean,
18:16
there's a nice way to say this.
18:18
SPEAKER_02: I'm paraphrasing very poorly,
18:20
SPEAKER_02: but then it's like,
18:20
SPEAKER_02: then they watch you do it and then critique and give you feedback.
18:24
SPEAKER_02: And then it's like, now you're on your own doing that.
18:26
SPEAKER_02: So it's like,
18:27
SPEAKER_02: even in that learning and teaching are like so similar where it is like,
18:32
SPEAKER_02: if you really want to know something,
18:33
SPEAKER_02: like teach it to people and you'll have to figure out how to simplify it.
18:36
SPEAKER_02: You'll have to figure out how to make it accessible.
18:39
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
18:40
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
18:40
SPEAKER_02: There's probably like kids, I'd feel like.
18:42
really really teaches you how to like simplify things yeah yeah
18:48
yeah i was thinking
18:49
like there's watching somebody do something there's doing
18:53
something yourself like
18:55
doing the thing that you're watching them do there's teaching
18:58
somebody to do the
18:59
things and then there's probably like teaching others to teach
19:02
somebody else yeah
19:04
SPEAKER_01: yeah yeah it's like the meta aspect
19:07
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's where you just get a PhD in something.
19:09
And then it's like you start writing the books and you work at
19:12
Harvard or whatever.
19:13
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:14
SPEAKER_02: Someday, who knows?
19:16
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
19:19
SPEAKER_02: Wow, we're kind of all over the place.
19:20
I mean,
19:21
I haven't even really told you what the idea is for this
19:25
podcast,
19:25
right?
19:26
SPEAKER_02: I think I saw it on your newsletter.
19:27
SPEAKER_02: Okay, cool.
19:29
SPEAKER_02: Well, then it's... Forget the title, though.
19:31
SPEAKER_02: You're already... Well, the working title right now, and I'll probably...
19:35
make it this this for now but it's uh I don't know you and the
19:39
idea behind that is
19:40
really just like I'm in the process of like learning myself
19:43
still and one of the
19:45
most helpful things for me I'm very much a verbal processor but
19:49
over the last
19:49
decade plus I've been journaling a ton and taking a lot of
19:53
pictures and a lot of
19:54
videos of my life just for me and I found that those
19:59
disciplines to be extremely
20:00
helpful to look back on and learn more about myself and this is
20:03
something that I've
20:04
SPEAKER_02: been wanting to do
20:05
SPEAKER_02: For longer than I care to admit and haven't done anything about.
20:09
SPEAKER_02: And I think your inspiration for me is just like,
20:12
SPEAKER_02: dude,
20:12
stop like messing around with like trying to make a perfect
20:16
like I need a podcast
20:18
studio and I really need all these epic mics and I need to have
20:22
like Brendan set up
20:23
SPEAKER_02: with the like cool lights in the background.
20:25
SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
20:26
and the like the awesome lighting you have to make it look at
20:30
the it's just like
20:30
you got to start man and then you got to go from there and I
20:33
think that's like been
20:34
a huge inspiration for me in general with like even writing
20:38
regularly onSubstack
20:39
SPEAKER_02: and and just like messing around with the tool that that is and
20:44
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so I'm very grateful to your example in general.
20:48
SPEAKER_02: But yeah.
20:49
SPEAKER_02: Well, thanks.
20:49
SPEAKER_02: It's meaningful.
20:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
20:51
SPEAKER_01: I was going to say with the lights especially,
20:54
like it's so funny how I've tinkered around with so many
20:58
different things in the
20:59
SPEAKER_01: past.
20:59
SPEAKER_01: Like everything that
21:02
I end up like putting in my videos is at some form I've like
21:06
tinkered around with
21:06
SPEAKER_01: for so long and then finally was like,
21:09
SPEAKER_01: you know,
21:10
SPEAKER_01: like to turn this concept into a video is not too hard.
21:14
And I already know so much about this because it's been like a
21:16
hobby of mine and
21:17
SPEAKER_01: anybody can name hobbies of theirs,
21:19
SPEAKER_01: at least at some level.
21:21
SPEAKER_01: And so that's like where the lights come from.
21:23
I've tinkered around with programmable,
21:26
individually addressable LED lights for so long.
21:29
SPEAKER_01: And then this year, I did the light show for 2025.
21:34
SPEAKER_01: And these are kind of leftover from that.
21:36
Even the floodlights in the back are floodlights for the
21:39
holiday light show.
21:41
SPEAKER_01: So I'm like,
21:43
SPEAKER_01: even if I were to go and buy studio lights,
21:46
SPEAKER_01: they'd be not as functional or five times the price
21:51
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
21:52
SPEAKER_01: And I'm like, oh, this is like sweet.
21:53
Like I get to reap the benefits of my hobby and like knock like
21:58
two birds with one
21:59
SPEAKER_01: stone type of thing.
22:00
SPEAKER_01: And it looks so sick.
22:02
yeah yeah yeah it's fun to tinker around with right one of the
22:06
other cool things
22:07
i've thought about this for so long was the ambient light for
22:10
behind my tv like i
22:12
sketched that i was literally gonna a sketch yeah i was i was
22:16
gonna mention that
22:17
SPEAKER_02: the i saw the trailer i don't know when you released that video um
22:22
But the trailer for like Tron Ares or whatever that you did
22:26
with the ambient lights
22:27
SPEAKER_02: around the TV,
22:29
SPEAKER_02: it's so epic and it looks so good.
22:31
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
22:32
SPEAKER_02: And it's just plugged into whatever input is happening on the screen.
22:37
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
22:37
you could either do HDMI input or capture your screen from like
22:42
a laptop and share
22:43
SPEAKER_01: it to your TV.
22:44
SPEAKER_01: But that was like literally I could probably find a notebook of like
22:50
SPEAKER_01: 15 years ago that I sketched that is like high school.
22:52
SPEAKER_01: I don't, I don't even know.
22:54
SPEAKER_01: Like, is that 15 years ago?
22:55
SPEAKER_01: No, that was probably more.
22:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
22:59
SPEAKER_01: And I was like, that'd be so cool to do this.
23:02
And then it's just been like brewing in the back of my mind off
23:05
and on for so long.
23:06
SPEAKER_01: And then suddenly I'm like,
23:07
SPEAKER_01: wait,
23:08
SPEAKER_01: I could take this that I know how to do,
23:10
just stick a bunch of lights on the back and I know how to
23:12
capture my screen.
23:14
SPEAKER_01: And then you start like realizing that you have all the pieces that
23:17
the like major breaking down the problems that then you just
23:19
like fit them together
23:20
and you're like that was easy so I'm finding more and more
23:23
about those and that
23:24
SPEAKER_01: only happens when you just always stay a little bit busy and do some like
23:29
miscellaneous things fun and eventually chip away towards
23:32
bigger bigger things
23:35
SPEAKER_01: Well,
23:35
SPEAKER_02: that's a perfect segue into my first question,
23:37
SPEAKER_02: because you,
23:39
SPEAKER_02: at least from the outside,
23:40
SPEAKER_02: seem like a very busy guy.
23:43
SPEAKER_00: You're a dad to, well, it's almost four, right?
23:48
SPEAKER_00: Or is it three?
23:49
SPEAKER_00: It's three are out and one's cooking.
23:53
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, crazy, man.
23:54
And then obviously married and you have a dog and you have a
24:00
very two dogs.
24:02
SPEAKER_02: When did you get the second one?
24:04
SPEAKER_02: Shortly after the first.
24:06
SPEAKER_02: Oh, wow.
24:06
SPEAKER_02: Okay.
24:07
SPEAKER_02: Well, then I'm just a bad friend.
24:09
SPEAKER_02: No, we haven't caught up in a while.
24:11
SPEAKER_02: I know it has been too long.
24:13
SPEAKER_02: And then, I mean, you have a pretty demanding job from my understanding.
24:17
SPEAKER_02: And then on top of that,
24:18
SPEAKER_02: you're now a content creator and doing that successfully,
24:22
SPEAKER_02: which means that you're like grinding to like make that happen.
24:28
You like shared your schedule with me on some level and it just
24:32
sounds like
24:33
wild man like you're you're basically finishing the day with
24:37
like the family and
24:38
kids and stuff and then you're like working almost another like
24:42
well definitely
24:42
like another part-time job like what kind of season do you feel
24:46
like you're in now
24:47
like in all that you're doing does it feel like kind of the
24:52
beginning phase of
24:53
something or like the the middle like I don't know if you were
24:56
a farmer how would
24:57
SPEAKER_02: you describe the season that you're in I guess
25:01
SPEAKER_01: It's definitely not a farming analogy.
25:04
SPEAKER_01: It's more like trudging uphill with no end in sight.
25:09
SPEAKER_02: I think that's Sisyphus and the stone that he's trying to roll up there.
25:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
25:17
SPEAKER_01: I keep thinking of the funny video that's going around of...
25:22
SPEAKER_01: you know,
25:22
SPEAKER_01: as I,
25:22
SPEAKER_01: as I get older,
25:23
SPEAKER_01: I realized that like a good view is just like exactly what you need.
25:28
SPEAKER_01: And that's kind of like how I, um, think of it.
25:30
SPEAKER_01: Like you're just trudge a pill.
25:32
Like it's good exercise on the way up and hopefully there's a
25:35
good view on,
25:36
on the top.
25:37
SPEAKER_01: Um, I said this to my, um, one of my friends at church that, um,
25:43
SPEAKER_01: Having kids is hard,
25:45
SPEAKER_01: and there is obvious benefit to having a big,
25:51
SPEAKER_01: happy family in your old age.
25:53
SPEAKER_01: You get to just sit back and see everything else run,
25:56
SPEAKER_01: and all the hard work that you put in,
25:58
SPEAKER_01: you see...
25:59
grandkids start popping up and seeing them run around and
26:04
seeing them smile and laugh and play.
26:06
SPEAKER_01: And of course,
26:07
there's going to be loud screaming and crying and people
26:10
accidentally pushing or on
26:11
SPEAKER_01: purpose pushing somebody over in anger and
26:15
SPEAKER_01: Right now I'm in that.
26:17
But there's more and more moments where I get to see the
26:22
investment payoff.
26:23
And that's why I always said it to my friend is like,
26:25
this is an investment.
26:26
SPEAKER_01: And what investment do you put in your chips on day one?
26:30
SPEAKER_01: And you reap...
26:31
SPEAKER_01: like a massive amount of growth out of that, like very rarely.
26:36
And that's not how like the majority of investing your time or
26:41
your money ever plays off.
26:42
SPEAKER_01: That's a lottery game.
26:44
SPEAKER_01: And with having kids and having a family,
26:47
SPEAKER_01: like even just starting out with you deciding to get close to
26:52
SPEAKER_01: somebody else and like thinking, do I want to marry this person?
26:56
Like that is a huge step towards like humility and
27:00
sanctification and understanding
27:01
SPEAKER_01: that you're like,
27:03
SPEAKER_01: it's so selfish just to be yourself and think,
27:07
SPEAKER_01: oh,
27:07
SPEAKER_01: like what do I need to live?
27:08
SPEAKER_01: It's so easy to live by yourself, to feed yourself, to find a house.
27:12
SPEAKER_01: I'm saying like this is first world problems.
27:15
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
27:16
But like then relating to somebody else,
27:18
you have to die to yourself and really say like,
27:22
SPEAKER_01: How do I want to invest in the other person?
27:23
SPEAKER_01: Because this is the long road.
27:25
Like this is not just like I get to say hi to you for eight
27:28
hours of the day and
27:29
SPEAKER_01: like we're coworkers and get to like go home.
27:31
SPEAKER_01: This is a long road.
27:33
SPEAKER_01: And same thing with kids.
27:34
SPEAKER_01: Obviously,
27:34
it's much shorter than being married for life because they
27:37
hopefully eventually
27:38
SPEAKER_01: leave after 18 to 20 years or so if you set things up right.
27:43
SPEAKER_02: The statistics I'm showing pretty differently right now.
27:47
SPEAKER_02: I think you were looking at statistics from like 50 years ago.
27:52
SPEAKER_02: But yes,
27:54
SPEAKER_02: no,
27:54
SPEAKER_02: I would like to raise kids that are like they were back in the 50s,
27:58
SPEAKER_02: leaving home when they're like 17 or 18 or whatever.
28:03
If you look in some of the history books,
28:04
people are running countries by like 12.
28:06
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
28:07
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
28:07
SPEAKER_01: Well, maybe that wasn't the best idea either.
28:10
SPEAKER_01: But there's also a part that's probably not totally agreeable.
28:16
SPEAKER_01: Yes.
28:16
SPEAKER_01: A lot of other people.
28:17
SPEAKER_01: No,
28:17
SPEAKER_02: I think it's crazy to think about just the,
28:20
SPEAKER_02: I don't know,
28:21
I'm a product of the blessing and the hard work that our
28:26
parents' generation have
28:27
SPEAKER_02: like kind of given us.
28:30
But it is crazy to think about like,
28:31
oh yeah,
28:32
like a lot of people,
28:33
they were...
28:35
trying to figure out life very differently than like a lot of
28:39
people our age where
28:40
it's like people our age were probably at least like I feel
28:45
like you're a good
28:47
SPEAKER_02: example of like
28:49
how people were maybe thinking like 30 40 years ago where it
28:52
was like oh by this
28:52
time i'll already have my three or four kids or whatever and
28:56
it's like i think a
28:57
lot of people our age now are like not uh not thinking that way
29:03
and that's i mean
29:04
that's their own prerogative they're adults they get to make
29:06
decisions however they
29:07
want but it is really interesting to think about like the the
29:11
growth curve that
29:11
SPEAKER_02: you're talking about where it's like oh i'm in like the
29:15
the challenging like hike up the mountain season right now but
29:20
I'm also like
29:22
knowing that like I'm putting in the reps to look at the top of
29:26
the mountain and
29:27
like enjoy the view and I'm like gonna get there on some level
29:31
at a different pace
29:32
than like the people behind me that are maybe focused on other
29:36
things like they're
29:37
they're not in a marriage and they're not sacrificing in that
29:40
way and and I mean
29:41
there's nothing wrong with being single or dating or whatever
29:44
like that but it just
29:45
SPEAKER_02: puts a different perspective
29:48
in place when you are in those seasons earlier I think where it
29:51
does feel like oh
29:52
man I feel the weight of like some of these bigger questions in
29:55
life whereas if I
29:56
wasn't married and didn't have kids and wasn't thinking about
30:00
those things I
30:01
SPEAKER_02: probably would be like
30:03
SPEAKER_02: maybe having more fun on some level,
30:05
SPEAKER_01: but also...
30:07
SPEAKER_01: You can have an easier life without more responsibility.
30:11
SPEAKER_01: Totally.
30:12
SPEAKER_01: Your responsibilities,
30:13
meaning the dependencies that people have on you and the amount
30:18
of responsibility
30:18
SPEAKER_01: that you have,
30:19
SPEAKER_01: you can definitely have...
30:21
an easier,
30:22
like more enjoyable life because you get to dictate everything
30:25
that you do.
30:26
SPEAKER_01: The time that you wake up,
30:27
SPEAKER_01: the food that you eat,
30:28
SPEAKER_01: schedule that you have,
30:29
SPEAKER_01: like where you go to travel.
30:30
SPEAKER_01: You have a lot more money to travel potentially.
30:32
SPEAKER_01: So yeah, like that's 1000% true.
30:34
SPEAKER_01: But like,
30:37
SPEAKER_01: You don't optimize for just plain old living.
30:40
SPEAKER_01: Like, I mean, that's the first step.
30:42
SPEAKER_01: Like, survive.
30:43
SPEAKER_01: Then you learn to, like, thrive in certain areas.
30:46
SPEAKER_01: And then you ask yourself, like, where do I get fullness out of life?
30:50
SPEAKER_01: And so many people have different definitions,
30:52
SPEAKER_01: and not any one definition is necessarily fully correct.
30:56
But where I find my enjoyment is knowing that I've been in a
31:00
hard day's work,
31:01
SPEAKER_01: and I sit down for most of the day,
31:03
SPEAKER_01: so I don't know,
31:03
SPEAKER_01: like,
31:05
physical hard work,
31:06
even though I do wish that my day was...
31:09
It's all relative,
31:10
right?
31:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
31:11
SPEAKER_01: but,
31:12
SPEAKER_01: like,
31:12
SPEAKER_01: mentally I'm drained,
31:13
SPEAKER_01: and anyways,
31:14
SPEAKER_01: like,
31:15
SPEAKER_01: I put in a hard day's work,
31:16
SPEAKER_01: both day job,
31:19
SPEAKER_01: and,
31:19
SPEAKER_01: like,
31:20
SPEAKER_01: I was gonna go back to this,
31:20
SPEAKER_01: this is gonna be my first answer to your question of,
31:22
SPEAKER_01: like,
31:23
how do you approach like how you manage your time and where you
31:27
spend it wherever
31:28
I'm at I try to just be like work hard play hard sleep hard
31:34
like if like that will
31:37
make sense to you when you are exhausted like the sleep hard
31:40
it's like how do you
31:40
SPEAKER_01: sleep hard
31:42
you know,
31:42
when you're exhausted and tired because of screaming and work
31:47
and all that.
31:48
SPEAKER_01: So work hard, play hard, sleep hard.
31:51
SPEAKER_01: And then, yeah, you can't let off the gas when everything is going well.
31:56
SPEAKER_01: You can take like brief,
31:58
SPEAKER_01: like pauses and understand like,
32:01
SPEAKER_01: like retrospect and say like,
32:02
SPEAKER_01: wow,
32:02
SPEAKER_01: that was like a good year or that was a tough season or something,
32:05
SPEAKER_01: but just keep chugging along.
32:07
SPEAKER_01: It's
32:07
SPEAKER_01: You don't know where the end is.
32:09
SPEAKER_01: So like trying to take it easy.
32:12
SPEAKER_01: Like you've,
32:13
SPEAKER_01: you've ran like a lot more than I have,
32:15
SPEAKER_01: but the amount of running that I have done,
32:18
SPEAKER_01: it's the same thing.
32:19
If you think like,
32:20
oh,
32:20
I'm going to stop at this point,
32:24
you start giving up way too early.
32:26
SPEAKER_01: Your body starts telling you I'm tired a lot sooner than if you said,
32:29
SPEAKER_01: I'm going to go twice as far.
32:31
SPEAKER_01: Then you're like, okay, let's gear up.
32:33
SPEAKER_01: There's no time to complain and your body to get sore.
32:36
SPEAKER_01: Like I'm going to blow through that original goal that I had planned.
32:40
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
32:41
SPEAKER_02: the negotiating that happens when you're like tired on mile 18,
32:45
SPEAKER_02: you're like,
32:45
SPEAKER_02: you know,
32:45
SPEAKER_02: if I just walk for a couple minutes,
32:47
SPEAKER_02: it's like,
32:47
SPEAKER_02: well,
32:47
a couple minutes becomes half an hour and a half an hour
32:50
becomes like I totally I
32:52
SPEAKER_02: resonate with that,
32:54
SPEAKER_02: obviously,
32:54
SPEAKER_02: because I love running.
32:55
SPEAKER_02: But
32:56
um no i think that that is like a great parallel to to working
33:01
and how i feel a lot
33:02
of times when i'm like man this is really tough there's a ton
33:05
of ambiguity i don't
33:06
know how to answer this thing with work or this project that
33:10
i'm on like it would
33:12
be easier just to like turn off my brain and like watch some
33:15
netflix or something
33:17
and sometimes i end up doing that and then i realize oh that
33:20
wasn't a great idea
33:22
uh rather than like leaning into the discomfort or the
33:25
challenge um because like
33:27
the same thing with running is like oh the the obviously you
33:31
have to be smart about
33:32
it at mile 18 but if i keep running i i will continue to run
33:37
through the finish
33:37
line and then it'll be done but i think like to your point life
33:42
is is a race in
33:44
some ways but it's also a really long long race so you gotta
33:48
like how do you pace
33:49
SPEAKER_02: yourself and how do you have time
33:50
That's always the tension for me and why I'm curious about like
33:54
you have such a
33:55
SPEAKER_02: high capacity to like create and work on projects and stuff.
34:00
Like how do you,
34:01
how do you like even,
34:03
how are you prioritizing in this season?
34:05
Is it always the same priority or are you like constantly
34:10
subbing in different
34:11
SPEAKER_02: priorities depending on what's going on?
34:13
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's probably a good amount of the second.
34:16
SPEAKER_01: I am guilty of
34:18
SPEAKER_01: of thinking about a lot of different things,
34:20
SPEAKER_01: probably not at like the,
34:23
SPEAKER_01: like when I say I'm like work hard,
34:25
SPEAKER_01: play hard,
34:25
SPEAKER_01: sleep hard,
34:26
SPEAKER_01: I probably mix a lot of the two more than like how I said it.
34:30
Like I'll think a little bit about something and I write in a
34:33
notebook every day and so,
34:35
Just putting your thoughts down on paper in roughly the area
34:39
that you want it to so
34:40
that you can come back to it later and be more ready to knock
34:44
those things out of
34:45
SPEAKER_01: the park.
34:46
SPEAKER_01: That goes so far.
34:48
SPEAKER_01: That's like...
34:49
Step number one,
34:50
like when you go to school,
34:51
you should learn how to take notes.
34:53
SPEAKER_01: And when you go to like manage your time more wisely,
34:57
SPEAKER_01: you should learn how to structure your time well.
34:59
SPEAKER_01: Like it's just that like pre-work that you have to do.
35:02
SPEAKER_02: That's a great, that's a great insight.
35:04
SPEAKER_02: Like learn to take notes because I feel like that is a dying art.
35:08
SPEAKER_01: That should be a prerequisite to school.
35:11
I felt like I shifted note-taking styles like five times and I
35:15
still didn't do
35:16
SPEAKER_01: very,
35:17
SPEAKER_01: very well at it.
35:18
SPEAKER_01: I'm like,
35:19
SPEAKER_01: man,
35:19
SPEAKER_01: if I could just redo school with proper note taking,
35:22
SPEAKER_01: that would have helped so much.
35:25
SPEAKER_01: And there's like YouTube videos now,
35:26
SPEAKER_01: like now that I like look back,
35:28
SPEAKER_01: I'm like,
35:28
SPEAKER_01: okay,
35:29
there's videos now that people like having good study structure
35:32
and note taking
35:34
SPEAKER_01: like process and all that.
35:37
But even now it's like you can just turn on AI note taking and
35:41
then don't have to
35:42
SPEAKER_02: spend any brain power on it,
35:43
SPEAKER_02: which is like that's an interesting problem to solve for now.
35:47
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, but that's like somebody else taking your notes for you.
35:50
SPEAKER_02: That's my point.
35:51
That's my point is like you're you're losing whatever gains you
35:55
were getting from
35:55
SPEAKER_02: like taking physical notes.
35:57
SPEAKER_01: Yeah,
35:58
SPEAKER_01: but on that subject though,
36:00
SPEAKER_01: man,
36:00
SPEAKER_01: I use ChatTPT for everything,
36:02
SPEAKER_01: even stuff that I know about that I'm confident I know about,
36:06
SPEAKER_01: I will ask it to re-explain so that I can get almost,
36:10
like I know it's not unbiased because it's trained on data that
36:14
has inherent
36:15
SPEAKER_01: biases,
36:16
SPEAKER_01: but I will ask it a question that I already know my answer,
36:20
SPEAKER_01: which I assume is correct,
36:22
SPEAKER_01: and I'll get like a second opinion on the thing.
36:25
there's like informational things and then there's more
36:27
opinionated things.
36:29
So I definitely know like how to approach the answer that it
36:34
gives me in certain
36:35
cases and always take something like with a grain of salt when
36:38
hearing it with chat
36:39
SPEAKER_01: GPT.
36:40
SPEAKER_01: But it's,
36:41
it's so cool to just have it be a sounding board for your
36:46
thoughts and just have it
36:47
say words so that some of those words end up sharing other
36:51
things in your mind.
36:51
SPEAKER_01: You know, like when you said writing things down or speaking things, it,
36:56
SPEAKER_01: Serializing your thoughts is not easy.
36:59
SPEAKER_01: It comes easier for some people.
37:01
SPEAKER_01: It's not as easy as it may seem for me,
37:04
SPEAKER_01: especially watching my videos because the magic of editing.
37:07
SPEAKER_01: But serializing your thoughts makes you a better thinker.
37:14
SPEAKER_01: And it's just been great for that.
37:15
SPEAKER_01: And also just learning just different things.
37:17
SPEAKER_01: Getting a crash course is probably the best way to explain it.
37:20
SPEAKER_01: Getting a crash course in information,
37:23
even though you know not all of it's going to be accurate to
37:26
the nth degree,
37:27
SPEAKER_01: but it's great.
37:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
37:29
SPEAKER_02: Well, that's the beauty of, I think, a tool like AI.
37:32
I was just listening to this podcast and the guy was
37:36
interviewing Tony Robbins and
37:38
SPEAKER_02: Tony Robbins is like a really fascinating character.
37:41
SPEAKER_02: But he was just talking about how like everybody is kind of
37:46
with AI is that it's going to like restructure how the world
37:49
works and I mean it
37:50
already has on some level but I think there's like it almost
37:54
feels like there's
37:55
there's probably more than two types of people but it feels
37:57
like there's two types
37:58
SPEAKER_02: of people which is one is like the kind of pseudo philosopher
38:03
creator type that's like AI is stupid and dumb and if you use
38:07
it like you're you're
38:08
a lame person and it's totally bad and then there's the other
38:12
person that's like
38:13
like yeah I just use it because all my friends use it and it's
38:17
like available and
38:18
it's easy and it gives me cool answers and then I don't have to
38:22
think as much or
38:22
whatever but I think it's like such a it's like anything it's
38:26
just a really
38:27
SPEAKER_02: powerful tool and so it's like well why would you not want to understand
38:32
how to use a really powerful tool like you don't have to use it
38:36
there's nothing
38:36
wrong with using it or not using it I think it depends on the
38:39
application but I've
38:41
never understood the like well this is like this is just all
38:45
bad so I'm gonna like
38:46
not invest it was like oh no I think it's like you should
38:49
understand who was the
38:51
guy that said no thy enemy it's like even if you did think it
38:54
was all bad like you
38:55
SPEAKER_02: probably should understand it on some level just so you could like have a
38:59
intellectual conversation about it but I do feel like it's a
39:03
superpower to at least
39:05
like brainstorming stuff and using it as a tool not as like a
39:09
way to output stuff
39:11
and again I think there's people that are doing it well and
39:14
poorly I don't know it
39:16
seems like such a an unlock for so much of what you're talking
39:20
about where it's
39:20
SPEAKER_02: like
39:21
I feel like I would be leaving so much stuff on the table if I
39:23
didn't at least like
39:24
understand how the tool worked and like ideate with it
39:27
sometimes and understand
39:29
SPEAKER_02: what to use it for and not to use it for.
39:32
SPEAKER_02: But yeah.
39:33
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
39:33
SPEAKER_01: I think it was like, this was a long time ago, but...
39:37
SPEAKER_01: listening to Naval Ravikant's, do you know his stuff?
39:40
SPEAKER_01: He's like a big thing.
39:41
SPEAKER_01: That name sounds familiar, but I don't.
39:43
SPEAKER_01: What has he done?
39:43
SPEAKER_01: Entrepreneur,
39:46
and he's released a podcast from some of his philosophy-based
39:52
stuff that he posted
39:53
SPEAKER_01: on Twitter,
39:54
SPEAKER_01: but he's
39:55
He coined a lot of the talk around leverage and how some of the
40:00
resources that you
40:01
SPEAKER_01: interact with,
40:01
SPEAKER_01: there's different forms of leverage.
40:03
SPEAKER_01: And one of them is tools and software.
40:06
SPEAKER_01: And software is just another form of a tool.
40:08
SPEAKER_01: And...
40:11
So applying the tool and the leverage concepts around AI and
40:15
using AI is very accurate.
40:18
All it is is just gonna leverage the user and either in a good
40:22
way or bad way.
40:22
SPEAKER_01: Technology inherently is a leverage,
40:26
SPEAKER_01: is yeah,
40:26
SPEAKER_01: it's just a leverage for the user and anything like,
40:29
SPEAKER_01: I always say this,
40:31
SPEAKER_01: like nuclear technology,
40:32
SPEAKER_01: well,
40:33
SPEAKER_01: that could be a good thing,
40:34
SPEAKER_01: a very good thing or a very bad thing.
40:36
SPEAKER_01: Internet can be a very good thing or a very bad thing.
40:39
SPEAKER_01: AI is no different.
40:40
SPEAKER_01: It could be a very good thing or a very bad thing.
40:43
Even if you think about power tools,
40:45
power tools can greatly speed you up.
40:48
It can also like make you very lazy very quickly and think that
40:53
you know more than
40:54
SPEAKER_01: you actually do.
40:56
SPEAKER_01: And then you lose a finger.
40:58
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you can definitely lose a finger.
41:00
SPEAKER_01: That's the most obvious one.
41:02
SPEAKER_01: So the more powerful the tool,
41:04
the more you need to study it before you use it and know how
41:09
inherently it might
41:09
SPEAKER_00: hurt you or help you.
41:15
SPEAKER_00: And the emphasis on know it before you use it.
41:19
I was going to say that is one of the most interesting problems
41:23
that I feel like
41:24
we're seeing play out in real time is like the speed of big
41:29
tech and the speed of
41:31
SPEAKER_02: like...
41:32
these massive leaps in compute and llms and like basically not
41:39
enough people being
41:41
willing to ask the question that you just did which is like
41:44
know enough about it
41:45
before you like where where are the testing in the labs and
41:49
some version of that is
41:50
happening but i think because of the incentive structure that
41:53
we've built in the
41:53
SPEAKER_02: world that we're in
41:55
it's either like China's gonna beat us so we have to beat them
41:58
or it's like Apple A
42:00
is our company A like Apple is gonna be like so far behind or
42:05
so far ahead that we
42:06
need to like make sure that we're way ahead and stuff like that
42:09
and so it's like
42:10
and these incentive structures seem like but also I mean I
42:14
don't know there's so
42:15
many pros and cons to capitalism in general like now you're
42:17
getting into the
42:18
economics of so many different other things but it is such a
42:22
fascinating problem
42:23
SPEAKER_02: set to like
42:24
mess with and understand and be like is this a net negative or
42:28
a net positive it's
42:29
so gray I feel like yeah yeah I think we've had this
42:35
conversation a couple times
42:36
before but I said like when you give AI too much permission and
42:42
too many like
42:45
abilities like it it broadens the blast radius of things that
42:50
can happen like i
42:51
said if you if you were afraid that ai is going to like
42:54
propagate to the rest of
42:56
the world and start making like replications of itself with the
43:00
robot and whatnot
43:02
you probably gave it like access to logistics you probably gave
43:06
it access to like
43:07
SPEAKER_01: automated manufacturing um
43:10
There's obvious things that you did that you probably shouldn't
43:13
have done.
43:13
SPEAKER_01: One example, even in Amazon, and I think I'm...
43:21
SPEAKER_01: very sure this is public information,
43:23
SPEAKER_01: but like taking AI,
43:25
SPEAKER_01: taking down software stacks that should not be taken down,
43:28
SPEAKER_01: that like should just be continuing to run forever essentially.
43:31
SPEAKER_01: And somebody was like, yeah, okay, like do this, update this.
43:35
SPEAKER_01: And they didn't read what it was doing.
43:37
SPEAKER_01: And it just said like, oh yeah, I trust AI.
43:41
And then it just goes ahead and like starts tearing down the
43:43
infrastructure
43:44
SPEAKER_01: thinking that it's solving the problem.
43:46
SPEAKER_01: Insane.
43:47
It's so funny that like we've been thinking even well before
43:50
mainstream AI stuff
43:52
was released was like the way to solve the world's problems is
43:56
to get rid of people
43:58
SPEAKER_01: because people often are the source of all our problems.
44:01
SPEAKER_01: So if AI took over, that's basically Terminator right there.
44:05
SPEAKER_01: It's like, that's just like...
44:07
SPEAKER_01: problems by getting rid of the source.
44:09
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
44:10
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
44:10
SPEAKER_02: No, it's crazy to think about.
44:12
SPEAKER_02: I don't know.
44:14
all this conversation around ai um it kind of segues into my
44:19
next question and and
44:20
i'm curious if you're using like any tools to kind of plan out
44:24
anything in this but
44:25
like curious like in the chaos of all that life is and and all
44:31
you're going through
44:32
like what systems are you working with and using to kind of be
44:37
present in like
44:39
SPEAKER_02: marriage and family and and like
44:41
create positive momentum in like the entrepreneurial stuff that
44:46
you're doing
44:46
SPEAKER_02: because it just seems like
44:48
SPEAKER_02: you're always on top of it, but you're always doing so much.
44:52
SPEAKER_01: I'm curious.
44:53
SPEAKER_01: I'm glad it appears that way.
44:54
SPEAKER_01: But I think a lot of it is prep for life.
44:57
SPEAKER_01: And I've noticed more and more that it helps to like map out.
45:02
SPEAKER_01: I'm going to nerd out and just say a bunch of like technical terms,
45:05
but it does you a big service to map out the dependencies of
45:09
life because you can't
45:10
SPEAKER_01: do this before you do this.
45:14
SPEAKER_01: If you map out that
45:16
tree of dependencies and just say like first I need to do this
45:20
and that will allow
45:21
me to do this and then that will allow me to do this that goes
45:24
so far like I like
45:27
my view was I didn't want to get married until I had a start of
45:31
a career and that's
45:33
what I did I started a career started making decent money that
45:36
I was happy with and
45:37
SPEAKER_01: then I felt yeah I can get married and
45:41
SPEAKER_01: as long as I take care of that and make that grow, I can get married.
45:46
And I know I wanna have kids,
45:47
so I feel like being married is the perfect way to do that.
45:52
SPEAKER_01: And start stacking these things.
45:56
SPEAKER_01: And you never say,
45:57
SPEAKER_01: I don't think like I've,
45:59
SPEAKER_01: the big things you never fully let go of like the other things,
46:01
SPEAKER_01: like I still need to have a good career.
46:03
SPEAKER_01: I still need to have a strong marriage.
46:05
SPEAKER_01: I still need to have like strong,
46:07
SPEAKER_01: like,
46:08
SPEAKER_01: um,
46:08
SPEAKER_01: like teach my kids well and,
46:09
SPEAKER_01: and,
46:10
SPEAKER_01: um,
46:11
SPEAKER_01: take care of that.
46:12
Uh,
46:13
so with like the major responsibilities,
46:14
you never fully let go of those things.
46:16
SPEAKER_01: Um, um,
46:19
SPEAKER_01: But that's kind of how I approach it.
46:23
SPEAKER_01: Planning is huge in that.
46:26
SPEAKER_01: Every year I kind of do a retrospective of like, how did the year go?
46:30
SPEAKER_01: How did I...
46:33
SPEAKER_01: like approach different things.
46:35
SPEAKER_01: I have a couple of videos on how I do that, but a lot of note taking.
46:39
SPEAKER_01: Again, just like trying to serialize your thoughts.
46:41
And I also touch on,
46:42
in one of my videos,
46:45
the aspect of output goals and input goals.
46:47
SPEAKER_01: And it's good to have output goals.
46:49
SPEAKER_01: Like, I'll just do content creation as a thing.
46:51
SPEAKER_01: It's like, I want...
46:53
to get to 50 000 subscribers or 100 000 subscribers but you
46:58
have very little
46:58
control over that until you start identifying okay what are the
47:01
inputs to that and
47:03
you say like maybe structuring things having input goals is a
47:07
good thing i want to
47:08
post every day i want to have like i want to talk about these
47:12
things and do this
47:13
like once a week um there's the structure of smart goals i
47:18
don't know if you've i
47:19
SPEAKER_01: think you've heard of that i love me a smart goal yeah
47:23
But knowing how to set goals correctly is a huge thing because
47:27
it can encourage you
47:29
SPEAKER_01: or it could really discourage you if you set the wrong goals.
47:31
SPEAKER_01: So that's like the mechanics and the tactics of how I do things.
47:34
SPEAKER_01: I do want to mention that I have an amazing wife.
47:36
SPEAKER_01: And you know, Laura, she takes care of so much.
47:39
And as God's design,
47:41
like wife being a great helper,
47:43
she is an amazing helper.
47:44
SPEAKER_01: She takes care of everything at home.
47:46
SPEAKER_01: And that was awesome.
47:48
such a blessing to have a job that I can do my work at work and
47:53
Laura does her work
47:54
at home with the kids and taking care of the house I think
47:57
that's how I feel it
48:00
works best but yeah crazy man running around with three kiddos
48:05
and then a bun in
48:07
SPEAKER_02: the oven that's crazy when is when do you guys do?
48:11
SPEAKER_01: end of February so very soon that is coming up man that's wild
48:20
I told Laura that like,
48:21
doesn't it seem like this pregnancy has gone by so fast?
48:23
SPEAKER_01: She's like, yeah, I know.
48:25
SPEAKER_01: Like,
48:27
SPEAKER_01: Because the first one,
48:28
it's like going on a road trip to someplace that you've never
48:32
been to before.
48:33
SPEAKER_01: You're like, wow, you notice every little detail.
48:36
And then if you go again,
48:37
you're like,
48:39
oh yeah,
48:39
that seemed to go by a lot quicker.
48:40
SPEAKER_01: Or going to someplace ends up feeling longer than coming back.
48:47
SPEAKER_01: That's similar.
48:48
SPEAKER_01: But yeah, four kids kind of goes by quickly.
48:54
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
48:54
SPEAKER_02: How are you feeling?
48:55
Like any difference in how you're feeling about like having
48:59
four versus three?
49:00
SPEAKER_02: Or is it like, oh yeah, it'll be like more of the same.
49:03
But taking care of business-wise,
49:05
like,
49:06
it's going to just be more of the same.
49:08
SPEAKER_01: Like, we've already taken care of multiple kids.
49:11
SPEAKER_01: We know how to change diapers.
49:12
SPEAKER_01: We already have a lot of the equipment.
49:14
SPEAKER_01: Like, this is, like, another, like, financial term.
49:17
The marginal cost of having another kid is just,
49:20
like,
49:20
feeding them and changing another diaper.
49:22
SPEAKER_01: But, like, if you space the job, right?
49:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely like periods of losing last sleep.
49:28
But I mentioned one of the big stressors of life is as a man is
49:32
trying to provide
49:34
and knowing that there's big costs coming up ahead and life
49:39
seems to be outpacing
49:40
SPEAKER_01: your ability to meet those demands of providing for those things.
49:45
SPEAKER_01: The big things were housing and transportation and food.
49:50
being able to solve for both of those was tough because they're
49:52
very expensive
49:53
especially like the more kids you have the bigger the car you
49:56
need to get and
49:56
that's yeah more expensive same thing with the house you need
49:59
to get a bigger house
50:00
and so luckily we've knocked both of those out we have a
50:04
transit van and so that
50:05
like dude that thing is sick it's great it makes you invested
50:09
in the future yeah
50:10
SPEAKER_01: invested in the future uh
50:12
makes transporting all the carriers and strollers so easy
50:16
because you just plop it
50:17
in there you don't have to fold it or anything you just like
50:19
literally throw it up
50:20
there yeah but yeah like then moving to arizona was great
50:25
things are cheaper than
50:26
california housing wise yeah and lord willing we get to stay
50:32
here work wise i don't
50:34
SPEAKER_01: know there's like
50:36
SPEAKER_01: There's a bunch of things that like,
50:38
especially with the AI stuff is just adds more complexity to it
50:42
about like,
50:43
SPEAKER_01: There's huge costs to run AI,
50:46
SPEAKER_01: and that's obviously putting pressure on how companies do business,
50:50
SPEAKER_01: and especially the ones providing the AI services.
50:53
SPEAKER_01: They're like,
50:54
SPEAKER_01: we need to expand data centers,
50:55
SPEAKER_01: and that costs a lot of money,
50:57
SPEAKER_01: and we need to run those GPUs.
50:59
SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot of pressure to cut costs,
51:02
SPEAKER_01: both like cut buildings,
51:04
SPEAKER_01: the amount of buildings that we have,
51:06
SPEAKER_01: or simplify the locations that we do have,
51:10
SPEAKER_01: bring people back to hubs.
51:14
so that's yeah interesting that like technology is so freeing
51:20
it can allow us to
51:22
have talent like talented software engineers talented product
51:26
builders all across
51:27
the world yet we feel like we're still tied to a geographic
51:32
space i know that like
51:33
not everybody has the luxury of being able to work wherever
51:36
they can from a
51:38
SPEAKER_01: computer i feel like
51:40
SPEAKER_01: in the technology company,
51:41
SPEAKER_01: we're not utilizing that to the best of our abilities to simplify costs.
51:46
SPEAKER_01: And like, do we just make people's lives harder indefinitely?
51:51
Or can we actually reap some sort of quality of life back into
51:57
things like a 40 hour work week?
51:59
SPEAKER_01: Who set that up?
52:01
SPEAKER_01: Why is it five days out of the week?
52:03
SPEAKER_01: Those things come across my mind, like,
52:07
SPEAKER_01: Will it ever change to something else?
52:10
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you'll have to move to like Finland or something.
52:13
SPEAKER_01: What is it, 996?
52:13
SPEAKER_01: Who says that?
52:17
SPEAKER_01: That's like a thing from,
52:19
SPEAKER_01: I think it was like China,
52:21
SPEAKER_01: but now it's like in startups where it's like 9 a.m.
52:23
SPEAKER_01: to 9 p.m.
52:25
SPEAKER_01: six days a week.
52:27
SPEAKER_01: That's brutal.
52:28
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
52:29
SPEAKER_01: I hope that doesn't become the status quo.
52:31
SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
52:32
SPEAKER_02: I also think,
52:33
SPEAKER_02: and this is like one of my last questions,
52:35
SPEAKER_02: is like,
52:35
SPEAKER_02: I'll tie this in as best as I can.
52:38
SPEAKER_02: Basically,
52:38
SPEAKER_02: like,
52:39
it feels like your curiosity got the best of you when you were
52:43
thinking about
52:43
SPEAKER_02: starting to do content creation.
52:45
And it feels like what we were just talking about is like an
52:49
answer and response to like,
52:52
the status quo of kind of I don't know if it's capitalism I
52:56
don't know if it's like
52:58
how the work like society in general responds to big kind of
53:02
technological
53:03
SPEAKER_02: upheavals or it feels like we're at the beginning of like another
53:09
SPEAKER_02: I don't know, like industrial revolution type time.
53:13
And so it's like,
53:14
there's lots of like people being like,
53:16
Oh,
53:16
this is terrible.
53:17
SPEAKER_02: Like go back to horse drawn carriages.
53:20
SPEAKER_02: And then it's like, well, that like that's already passed.
53:24
Like we've,
53:25
we've,
53:25
we've now figured out that cars are available and those are
53:28
really nice.
53:29
SPEAKER_02: So like,
53:29
SPEAKER_02: we're going to start manufacturing cars more and,
53:32
SPEAKER_02: and the manufacturing line might be like seven days a week.
53:37
SPEAKER_02: 24 hours a day and you might do your shift or whatever but i think like
53:40
My question is more around like what drew you to content
53:43
creation specifically that
53:45
SPEAKER_02: you were like,
53:46
SPEAKER_02: yeah,
53:46
SPEAKER_02: yeah,
53:46
SPEAKER_02: yeah.
53:46
SPEAKER_02: I really want to prioritize this,
53:49
SPEAKER_02: even though like the type of job that I have is historically like,
53:54
SPEAKER_02: well,
53:54
SPEAKER_02: and there hasn't been a long history of it.
53:56
SPEAKER_02: I guess it's probably in the last,
53:58
SPEAKER_02: what,
53:58
SPEAKER_02: 40 years or something that like that you were like,
54:01
now is the time to be like very strategic about content
54:05
creation and building my
54:06
SPEAKER_02: own brand and entrepreneurship around that.
54:11
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
54:13
The most immediate thing I could say is it's getting harder and
54:17
harder to say that
54:18
SPEAKER_01: you can do something and for somebody to trust you.
54:21
SPEAKER_01: Because it used to be like,
54:24
SPEAKER_01: okay,
54:24
put it on your resume and then we can ask you a bunch of
54:26
questions about what's on
54:27
SPEAKER_01: your resume.
54:28
SPEAKER_01: And then it
54:30
like everybody could just put stuff on their resume or on
54:33
LinkedIn or whatever.
54:35
SPEAKER_01: And then you get asked a little bit of it.
54:38
SPEAKER_01: And now in tech,
54:39
SPEAKER_01: it's like,
54:40
SPEAKER_01: okay,
54:41
show me how you write this software while I watch you and maybe
54:45
talk through it a
54:46
SPEAKER_01: little bit.
54:46
SPEAKER_01: Let me hear your thought process.
54:48
SPEAKER_01: Let me see how you think.
54:49
SPEAKER_01: In other jobs, it's like, how do you actually do the job?
54:53
You come in,
54:54
let's like have you work for the day and we'll see how you
54:56
work.
54:56
SPEAKER_01: Like, let's see how you work.
54:58
SPEAKER_01: That is more the source of truth for how to evaluate somebody.
55:02
SPEAKER_01: And doing content creation is kind of like a hedge for that.
55:07
SPEAKER_01: It's like I get to show exactly what I do day in, day out.
55:12
SPEAKER_01: And this is like I get to show it every day.
55:14
It's not like I'm faking it,
55:17
saying I'm going to go study this for a year and then make...
55:19
like one or two videos,
55:21
like a lot of people can do that and they can do a lot in a
55:23
year.
55:23
But I wanted to hedge against the potential that it's going to
55:28
get harder and
55:29
SPEAKER_01: harder to show that you can do something.
55:31
And even with AI,
55:33
it's compounded that now people can,
55:36
like in an interview,
55:39
ask chat gpt to write them the code and we like we have that as
55:43
problems with work
55:44
it's like how do we interview somebody and trust that they're
55:47
not lying to us
55:49
through an ai and that's a huge thing but it's harder to do
55:52
that when you when
55:53
you're making videos and having to explain things it's
55:56
definitely easier because
55:57
you can edit the video but like it's a little bit more obvious
56:03
than just like
56:04
SPEAKER_01: writing on down on your resume like i can do this i have experience with
56:09
So that was like the rough thought of going into content
56:13
creation is a hedge against that.
56:16
SPEAKER_01: The other aspect is just,
56:17
SPEAKER_01: I mentioned this in one of my videos,
56:18
SPEAKER_01: is increasing your creative temperature.
56:21
SPEAKER_01: Even just on a physics level, I love this analogy.
56:25
SPEAKER_01: But if you are like absolute zero,
56:28
SPEAKER_01: you're cold,
56:28
SPEAKER_01: like there will be no interactions with any molecules around you.
56:32
SPEAKER_01: there's like very small probability that any chemical reactions,
56:36
SPEAKER_01: even if you're the most reactive of elements,
56:38
SPEAKER_01: if you're in a cold environment and you are cold temperature wise,
56:43
SPEAKER_01: you won't react.
56:44
SPEAKER_01: But as you increase your temperature, you start to become more reactive.
56:47
You start to like have these outputs of some things and they're
56:51
broader than yourself.
56:52
SPEAKER_01: And the like, there's at some point
56:57
SPEAKER_01: like a temperature where pretty much everything can combust.
57:01
SPEAKER_01: And that's, I think the moment where a lot of people have, where they've,
57:06
created this network so much and they've been so like reactive
57:09
in all these
57:09
different areas doing these different projects working with
57:11
collaborations on
57:12
people with people that like hockey stick curve like they have
57:17
all the opportunity
57:18
that they've wanted for so long and that's that doesn't come
57:22
without all the hard
57:23
work of increasing your temperature over time so that was like
57:27
a huge one i just
57:27
SPEAKER_01: wanted to like
57:29
SPEAKER_01: constantly be increasing my creative temperature,
57:31
even if it's just for like you encouraging yourself to do more
57:35
and try something
57:36
new or if it's towards the end goal of trying to have more
57:39
opportunities with
57:39
SPEAKER_01: working with cool people.
57:41
Like we always mentioned that we want to do something amazing
57:44
and cool one day.
57:45
SPEAKER_01: And so it's like,
57:47
I wonder if Matt's found the thing where he can have me hop on
57:50
board or if I have
57:51
SPEAKER_01: the thing where I can bring Matt on.
57:53
SPEAKER_01: I feel like one day.
57:56
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I don't know.
57:57
I think that's a piece of these conversations to me is like
58:00
trying to figure out
58:02
like what is that thing and wrestling through that and
58:05
wrestling through the idea
58:07
SPEAKER_02: of just like,
58:07
SPEAKER_02: oh,
58:07
SPEAKER_02: well,
58:08
SPEAKER_02: what is where does kind of ambition meet creativity?
58:11
SPEAKER_02: And then also like contentedness and like setting up to your point,
58:15
SPEAKER_02: like a good life for your family and
58:18
and doing right by them and providing for them and having time
58:21
to like spend with
58:22
them it's all of those big questions that are a piece of these
58:26
conversations to me
58:27
and and learning from people like you that that are are like
58:31
rapidly testing
58:32
through different ideas and iterations and you're i think like
58:37
there's so many
58:38
SPEAKER_02: parallels to like startup land and for
58:41
for a lot of the work that you're doing just because you're in
58:43
the tech world so
58:45
deeply but i don't know to me it's really like yeah i i'm i
58:49
think it's like a
58:50
lifelong journey on some level like you're you're never going
58:53
to arrive at like
58:54
this is the the one thing and i'm always like i think that's
58:58
the beauty of being
58:59
human is like you're always changing even for people that are
59:02
like i like doing
59:03
SPEAKER_02: this thing and i'm gonna do this forever it's like
59:05
SPEAKER_02: On some level, they evolve and change too.
59:08
SPEAKER_02: But I think I'm much more, I think you and I are similar.
59:13
SPEAKER_02: And that's why I think we get along so well is like,
59:16
there's always like new ideas that we're interested in and
59:20
curious about and we
59:21
SPEAKER_02: want to iterate on.
59:23
SPEAKER_02: And then it's just like a matter of prioritization where it's like,
59:26
SPEAKER_02: yeah,
59:26
I can't afford to do that right now with my time and the
59:32
sacrifice that I would
59:33
SPEAKER_02: have to make to do this other,
59:34
SPEAKER_02: like whatever that is.
59:36
So no,
59:37
I'm convinced that at some point we will work on something
59:40
together.
59:41
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
59:41
even this is awesome to be able to have this conversation with
59:45
you and to,
59:46
SPEAKER_02: yeah,
59:47
SPEAKER_02: I mean,
59:47
SPEAKER_02: so much of,
59:48
I think the idea of these conversations being recorded and
59:51
getting it out there
59:52
SPEAKER_02: for people to see as like a direct inspiration from you.
59:55
SPEAKER_02: So I'm very,
59:56
SPEAKER_02: very grateful for your friendship and just your time to,
59:59
SPEAKER_02: I know you have so many other things that you're juggling.
1:00:02
SPEAKER_02: So it's a, it's very meaningful to me for you to hop on.
1:00:05
SPEAKER_02: And I know you're an hour later cause you're in Arizona too.
1:00:09
SPEAKER_02: So there's just,
1:00:10
SPEAKER_02: there's so many obstacles to,
1:00:12
SPEAKER_02: to get us to this point,
1:00:13
SPEAKER_02: but I'm very grateful that you're,
1:00:15
you're willing to always hop on and talk through stuff and all
1:00:19
that kind of stuff.
1:00:20
SPEAKER_01: Let's do it in person next time.
1:00:22
SPEAKER_02: Yes, please.
1:00:23
SPEAKER_02: Yeah, at some point I need to come out there again.
1:00:27
SPEAKER_02: Before we end,
1:00:28
SPEAKER_02: usually,
1:00:29
SPEAKER_02: so I stole this from another podcast,
1:00:31
SPEAKER_02: but every end of the podcast,
1:00:33
they will have the previous guest ask a question of the most
1:00:39
recent guest.
1:00:40
SPEAKER_02: And so this is from the previous guest on the last conversation.
1:00:44
SPEAKER_02: And they have a question for you.
1:00:47
SPEAKER_02: What has been a really big challenge in your life that you've overcome?
1:00:50
Like you thought it was kind of the end of something and then
1:00:53
like how you got
1:00:54
SPEAKER_02: through that and you overcame it.
1:01:09
i don't know if other people think about this as much as i do
1:01:13
but i'm very like
1:01:15
retrospective about my life and introspective too and i have
1:01:19
these like internal
1:01:20
monologues about how i want to be and then like how i realize
1:01:25
how i am every day is
1:01:26
SPEAKER_01: a whole like trial day after day of
1:01:31
SPEAKER_01: Where do I want to be?
1:01:31
SPEAKER_01: And who am I now?
1:01:34
And this like struggle of just doing the things that you know
1:01:39
will get you closer
1:01:40
SPEAKER_01: to where you know will leave you in a better place.
1:01:43
And just knowing that your body is this like spaceship that you
1:01:48
need to work with.
1:01:49
SPEAKER_01: You need to like maintain and keep it healthy.
1:01:52
SPEAKER_01: But
1:01:54
it's going to trick you in a lot of different ways to pursue
1:01:57
things that you don't
1:01:58
SPEAKER_01: want to pursue.
1:01:58
SPEAKER_01: Even with content creation,
1:02:00
one aspect of that is getting really nervous about what other
1:02:03
people might think of
1:02:04
SPEAKER_01: you.
1:02:04
But then you find out on the other side that people don't
1:02:07
really care as much as
1:02:09
SPEAKER_01: you think they do.
1:02:10
SPEAKER_01: And so there's this disconnect of like,
1:02:12
my body was telling me to feel nervous and to do these things
1:02:17
and feel a certain
1:02:17
SPEAKER_01: way
1:02:19
SPEAKER_01: And you,
1:02:20
SPEAKER_01: like conscious and sober-minded,
1:02:22
knew that there would be a better situation down the road if
1:02:26
you just did these
1:02:26
SPEAKER_01: certain things.
1:02:27
SPEAKER_01: And then realizing that that's like a reality.
1:02:30
That came with like content creation because I felt like that
1:02:35
would be a cool thing
1:02:36
SPEAKER_01: to start showing other people.
1:02:38
I just don't know if they're interested or I feel like I would
1:02:40
mess up or just look
1:02:42
SPEAKER_01: stupid on camera.
1:02:43
SPEAKER_01: And part of that's true.
1:02:45
SPEAKER_01: But then you start realizing that like nobody really cares that much.
1:02:48
SPEAKER_01: And that's true in a lot of different areas.
1:02:50
SPEAKER_01: People are afraid to go to the gym because they feel like they want to be
1:02:54
SPEAKER_01: healthier,
1:02:54
SPEAKER_01: but they feel like they're not fit to go to the gym.
1:02:57
SPEAKER_01: But that's why you go to the gym.
1:02:59
SPEAKER_01: There's these contradictions in life.
1:03:01
SPEAKER_01: Or they're afraid to get started.
1:03:03
SPEAKER_01: I don't want to be a dad yet because I feel like I would do poorly at it.
1:03:09
But everybody's going to be poor at it because they've never
1:03:11
been a dad before.
1:03:12
SPEAKER_01: Like the only way to do it is to just buckle down and say,
1:03:15
I'm going to start doing things better and doing the things
1:03:18
that a good dad would
1:03:19
SPEAKER_01: do.
1:03:19
That's been the struggle is getting outside of my body and my
1:03:23
mind from like what
1:03:26
SPEAKER_01: it wants me to do and start
1:03:29
SPEAKER_01: just committing to the things that I do want it to do.
1:03:32
I had this thing for a while called do what you dread,
1:03:36
and I felt very strongly that your body
1:03:40
already subconsciously knows the things that it should do and
1:03:43
it shies away from
1:03:44
SPEAKER_01: them naturally.
1:03:46
SPEAKER_01: Like, oh, I just had a thought, like maybe I should work out today.
1:03:51
SPEAKER_01: But your body's first inclination is, oh, that would be a lot of work.
1:03:55
SPEAKER_01: Maybe I'll try another day.
1:03:57
SPEAKER_01: That's the time when you need to go to the gym right now.
1:04:00
SPEAKER_01: Your body just told you, you need to do this.
1:04:03
But like somehow you're like sinful body or your lazy body
1:04:08
overrode what your sober
1:04:10
SPEAKER_01: minded thought wanted to do.
1:04:12
SPEAKER_01: So when you dread something,
1:04:14
SPEAKER_01: that's when you should do that thing,
1:04:15
SPEAKER_01: assuming that it's like healthy and beneficial to yourself and society.
1:04:19
SPEAKER_01: That's really good.
1:04:21
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's awesome.
1:04:22
SPEAKER_00: Do you have a question for our next guest?
1:04:29
SPEAKER_03: Put me on the spot.
1:04:42
SPEAKER_03: I do have a question.
1:04:43
SPEAKER_03: I'm trying to figure out how to phrase it.
1:04:54
SPEAKER_03: It goes something like this.
1:04:58
Would you still be doing all the things that you're doing even
1:05:02
if nobody was looking?
1:05:05
SPEAKER_00: And would you do anything differently in light of that?
1:05:11
SPEAKER_00: I'm excited to hear how they'll answer.
1:05:14
SPEAKER_02: I don't know who's going to be on the...
1:05:16
SPEAKER_02: on the next conversation.
1:05:17
SPEAKER_02: So I'm excited to see who it is and how they answer that.
1:05:20
SPEAKER_01: Do I get to ask who asked the question that you asked?
1:05:24
SPEAKER_02: You can.
1:05:25
SPEAKER_02: It's my friend, David Orgil.
1:05:27
SPEAKER_02: I don't know if you ever met David,
1:05:30
but he's a brilliant filmmaker and creative and storyteller and
1:05:35
just has like such
1:05:36
SPEAKER_02: a heart for knowing people and making them feel seen and heard.
1:05:42
SPEAKER_02: And so his question, I think, came out of
1:05:45
SPEAKER_02: And it's a question that he asks people a lot.
1:05:47
SPEAKER_02: Like he's not like a surface conversationalist guy.
1:05:50
SPEAKER_02: He's like, I want to get to know you very quickly and like well.
1:05:56
And I don't,
1:05:57
I can kind of just graze over like,
1:05:59
oh,
1:05:59
the weather is great today.
1:06:00
SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't care about that stuff.
1:06:02
And so I think a question he asked a lot is that is what was
1:06:06
like a big challenge
1:06:07
SPEAKER_02: that you overcame?
1:06:09
SPEAKER_02: And like, how did you do that?
1:06:11
SPEAKER_02: And I think your answer of like doing the things that you dreaded
1:06:15
SPEAKER_02: have like made you the person that you are today,
1:06:17
SPEAKER_02: which is like a lot of the wrestling that I'm doing,
1:06:20
even just in thinking about talking to you as someone who's so
1:06:24
disciplined,
1:06:26
SPEAKER_02: like you,
1:06:26
SPEAKER_02: you haven't always been so disciplined.
1:06:29
SPEAKER_02: And I think like,
1:06:30
SPEAKER_02: the mentality of like doing what you dread,
1:06:32
SPEAKER_02: that idea of just like,
1:06:33
I'm going to go to the gym at 5am and I'm going to like post a
1:06:37
video on Instagram.
1:06:39
SPEAKER_02: And not because like anybody's telling me to do that is because like,
1:06:43
SPEAKER_02: I feel in my body,
1:06:45
SPEAKER_02: even the way that you were talking about that is like,
1:06:47
SPEAKER_02: that's something that I,
1:06:49
SPEAKER_02: I know I want to be doing in this season.
1:06:51
SPEAKER_02: And so I'm just going to like be disciplined about it and make it happen.
1:06:55
And then like prioritize accordingly with like making sure I'm,
1:06:58
I'm still available for,
1:07:00
the wife and the kids and family and church and all the
1:07:04
important stuff that goes
1:07:05
on but it's like i think that type of answer like that cuts to
1:07:09
the core of who you
1:07:10
are um and who i like see you to be and and who i want to be
1:07:15
more like so it's like
1:07:16
i love that question i'm going to start asking people that more
1:07:19
um because i think
1:07:20
SPEAKER_02: it just cuts through a lot of that fluff you know
1:07:24
SPEAKER_02: But yeah, sometime you should definitely meet David.
1:07:26
SPEAKER_02: He's an awesome dude.
1:07:28
SPEAKER_02: He has three kids and struggles with a lot of the same kind of like
1:07:32
man like am i doing the right stuff am i creating the way that
1:07:37
i need to be how am
1:07:38
i providing for like all those big questions that i think a lot
1:07:42
of a lot of my
1:07:42
wrestling is about that i'm curious about understanding from
1:07:45
other people and
1:07:46
learning from other people so yeah yeah well thank you my
1:07:50
friend thanks for making
1:07:51
the time i appreciate it definitely good luck with the podcast
1:07:56
thanks see ya see ya