Latest / The DEX Show: A Show for IT Change Makers / ChatGPT meets EUC w/ Geoff Wright

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ChatGPT meets EUC w/ Geoff Wright · The DEX Show: A Show for IT Change Makers

0:01
Welcome it, change Makers to the Deck Show with Tim Flower and Tom McGraw.
0:07
Let's get into it, ladies and gentlemen. I'm back with our favorite
0:12
guest, Jeffrey Wright. What's up, Jeff. Great to have you back
0:16
for the fourth time. That's right, pleasure to have you back on the
0:19
deck Show once more. How are you? I'm doing all right, MANU
0:24
chat chpt right, large language model stuff. I'm part of the chatbot nerd
0:28
crew over here. So I I've had I've been inundated by people asking me
0:34
like why why why why can't we use chat gpt to like just tell us
0:39
how to like, you know, scale the universe? And uh, it's
0:45
uh, you know, it's it's have you used chat chpt? We actually,
0:51
Um, you know obviously you don't listen to every single episode of a
0:53
deck Show, Jeff. That's what I'm saying, because I do. I'm
0:56
actually testing you. I'm testing to you. I'm testing you to see if
0:58
you remember what you said, if you would have heard the poem chat gpt
1:03
wrote about the Deck Show A very beautiful poem. Um, but as a
1:07
as a writer, scari or cool? It was cool. It was a
1:11
cool poem. You know it was scary and so far as um it was
1:15
quite good. You know that it was you know if you I find chat
1:19
GPT rather alarming, especially as I was trained as a writer and it seems
1:26
to be making great swaves of professional writers redundant in in one fell swoop of
1:32
innovation. Um, but go and talk talk talk to me about how how
1:36
you see the functionality coming interview man. I mean, so, I look,
1:42
I've tried it for some cool stuff. I've tried it. Um My
1:46
brother works at Microsoft, right, so he's a bing man. The being
1:49
in it, everybody's I mean, the only thing I've ever been just like
1:53
Google. Right, I go to Being and then I've been Google, and
1:55
then I go to Google. Right. But the the idea that um it
2:00
can do some really really mundane things that a lot of us do anyway.
2:07
But I think what's happening is is there's I think there's a lot of people
2:09
that like quietly in the corner. Go I That's exactly what I do all
2:15
day. Right. I talked to group A and then group B. Group
2:19
B ask me what group A is and then I, you know, I
2:23
spend an hour writing an email about green I or you know how we can
2:30
make a better program or how we can make And when I say program,
2:32
like, how can we make a better project or whatever? And dude,
2:36
you go, you go to chat gpt and you say, write me,
2:39
you know, write me a scalable program for a company to do digital experience
2:46
and using next think right, And I'm like, whoa it starts? Is
2:52
it perfect? No? But does it give you some pretty darn good ideas
2:57
because it's you know, scraping the universe from up till twenty twenty two,
3:02
right, it's pretty incredible. And you know, like somebody's I think yesterday
3:09
I saw an article that like one hundred and fifty one books were published on
3:13
Amazon by the author chat Chypt. Did you see this? No? No,
3:16
No, was that just in the last few days. Yeah, so
3:21
people are yeah, why not? It's but like you said, for people
3:25
that enjoy writing, there's an there's a creative twist that you know, some
3:32
authors and some people that really put a lot of time and effort into the
3:37
way they they they word They like words. Words are powerful things how people
3:42
interpret them, especially at a global company like ours, you know, around
3:45
the world, different languages, you know, write me a compassionate email in
3:51
fifteen different languages, addressing X and within about thirty seconds. You have a
3:59
pretty darn good starting point that, from what I've seen, would have taken
4:05
me a couple hours of like coffee time, focus time, you know,
4:12
reading it, reading it, bouncing it off people. So I understand people's
4:17
you know, people's desire to use this. I've had, I mean,
4:21
I own the chatbot here, so everybody has asked me like, why don't
4:25
we you know, why don't we do this? Now? You know,
4:28
why don't we have chat GPT? You know, why don't we have it?
4:30
Like? Why can't I see? You know, why can't I say?
4:32
Why does my laptop suck? And chat GPT goes, Oh, I'm
4:35
you know, sorry to hear your laptop sucks? Here? Let me check
4:38
these things, which is interesting, right because you know, from a from
4:42
a digital experience standpoint, what a powerful tool if everybody could really do that,
4:46
why does my experience suck? And using the platforms we have go,
4:53
oh, we noticed you have seventy five thousand favorites or cashes here, or
4:58
you're recycling business seven tea, you know, eighty gigs and you know,
5:01
wow, right, how awesome to have remote actions run from anything that potentially
5:10
could be impacting the end user or the customer or the people or you,
5:14
and you could do it. It's so agnostic. You could do it at
5:16
work. How also would it be at home? Right? My Xbox is
5:20
running slow chat GPT, Right, how do I do how do I do
5:25
a better job at Fortnite? How do I do a better job in Minecraft?
5:28
How do I do a better job in Call of Duty? Any of
5:30
the games? Like how do you do something better? And it does a
5:34
pretty darn good job. So that's that's been my That's been my that's been
5:41
that's been my world since like December, because, as I mean, you
5:46
and I are in it, December chat chypage dropped and it's just been insane.
5:54
It's been crazy since then. And now I'm seeing like you know,
5:57
student, you know, now I'm seeing like my local newspaper have like will
6:00
chat chypt like you know, read your mind. You know, there's always
6:03
that side of it, right, the singularity. How soon is it before
6:08
chatchypt like you know, you know gets married to your you know, gets
6:12
gets married, you know, has other chatchypt kids becomes the sentient mmmm,
6:19
your thoughts. No, I mean I love it. No, I feel
6:25
like we're it's interest, isn't it. We feel like we're we move as
6:29
a civilization so at such breakneck speed technologically right, like that seems to be
6:33
a characteristic of our entire lived lives. And yet the last few weeks have
6:41
have underscored the fact that it has been a while since we all saw something
6:45
that made our jewels drop and and just realize that the conditions of our existence
6:51
of being are about to be tilted by an invention, by an advance.
6:58
You know that it's it's good, it's look, disruption is going to happen.
7:03
That's what this is. This is like, this is this is super
7:09
disruption. Um. But being that I am a human being and that I
7:14
am the I I look, I love communication, I love I'm an analog
7:21
person through and through. So when everybody says like digital this and digital that,
7:27
and ones and zeros and ones and zeros, there's a lot of space
7:30
between the ones and zeros, there's a lot, right, And that's where
7:34
that you know, the analog comes in. And that's what I that,
7:39
dude, that's what I live for, is that analog experience that emotion that
7:45
nontent like the you know, the feeling you get when somebody you like is
7:48
around you. Right, that's not a digital experience. That's an emotion that
7:54
that's a that's that there's something there, right, there's that warmth from the
7:58
person or people that are you're around. Right. So my my focus now
8:03
is um and uh, let's talking about it, like I think we did
8:07
the Great Resignation like five years ago, right, whenever we did that,
8:09
that that episode, but to build on to build on top of that episodes
8:15
yeah, ten episodes ago. Gods. But the idea is there's so many
8:20
employees now and we've we've been we've been, um, I've been seeing it.
8:26
I actually took a guy out to lunch a couple of weeks ago.
8:31
Mid twenties. A lot of these I don't know gen z like people in
8:35
their twenties. And again, this isn't a blanket this isn't a blanket statement,
8:39
but I feel like there's a lot of people that have graduated college,
8:45
right. Some people were in college during COVID. They didn't you know,
8:48
like, there's your college experience, you've gone into it. A lot of
8:52
a lot of the people that I'm um, I'm seeing in their twenties.
8:56
Um, they resigned, they left. We've lost We've lost a few people
9:00
that were like they started and they've only been with the company, you know,
9:03
four months, six months, you know, less than a year.
9:09
Some of those folks are still here. But when I talk to them,
9:11
because that's a big part of what I love to do, it's just,
9:13
hey, how are you feeling at this company? How are you doing?
9:18
What are you doing? Like, you know, where do you fit?
9:20
What? What puzzle piece are you? And you know, the people that
9:24
are still here, some of them have said, you know, Jeff,
9:28
I had a sign on bonus that says I have to be here till X
9:33
date. And that's not the That's not the first thing I want to hear
9:37
out of somebody's mouth. Did you know what I'm saying? Like it's like,
9:41
hey, how how do you like this job? I got to be
9:43
here for another year? Yeah? You know you yeah, yeah, but
9:52
it's it scares me. I have a thirteen year old son, I know
9:56
he you know, I know kids. I know people that my brother has
10:00
kids in high school and that just graduated, right, and there is this
10:05
level of uncertainty that Tom, you or I, you know, we're in
10:09
our early thirties, right, so we're you know, we're you know,
10:11
late twenties earlier. How old are you? Jeff Induggets howl about you in
10:18
real real life, real life? He is four or five man? Four?
10:22
Five four? Over here? Are you are? Your forty? Yeah?
10:28
Are you really? No? Are you really? For you? All
10:33
right? So you so you hit that now you I was older, younger.
10:37
I just won't even ask I'm forty, that's no. Yeah, yeah,
10:43
I'm forty five and you and I I yeah, because you're if you're
10:46
forty, you're you know, you wake up and things hurt and you start
10:50
finding like you know, that's when you know your doctor starts telling you things
10:52
like you know, yeah, that's just how it is. Right when you
10:56
go to the doctor and you're like, hey, like I got a weird
10:58
thing and my shoulder hurts and my hair fallen out, and they're like,
11:01
yeah, that's what happens. Instead of addressing the issue, right, instead
11:05
of saying, yeah, you know, you might want to take this or
11:07
do this or do where this, they're just kind of like, hmm,
11:09
that's what happens. Suck it up, you know, I wake up in
11:13
my shoulders all messed up, and they're like, mm hmm, that's the
11:16
shouldertis you? Well you might, that's right. Oh dude, you want
11:22
to talk about city miles. I am the king of city miles. Dude,
11:26
I have unbelievable hard mileage on this. But anyway, the people that
11:33
I yeah, anyway, the people that I speak to that that are in
11:37
their twenties, there's there's a level of uncertainty that uh, you or I
11:45
never never really had, right, I mean, anybody in our our age
11:50
bracket, is we had you know, we had the Internet, we had
11:56
cell phones. Um, the idea of being constantly connected, which you and
12:00
I and people in our brandy we we deal with, right, we have
12:03
a phone, we know what we Okay, our boss is gonna get us
12:05
and whatever. But the people in their twenties in early thirties, I see
12:11
a sense of such a heightened sense of anxiety, uncertainty and stress. And
12:18
you know, one of the things I love, like, Hi, how
12:20
you doing? I'm okay? Are you really? Like is there anything I
12:24
can do to help? Like, well, we have all these things and
12:28
I have to do you know, do X, Y and Z for those
12:31
folks over there on the other side of the pond, or X, Y
12:33
and Z for us here on the East coast. The idea is, how
12:37
do they how do you help them, like understand that this is this is
12:43
unfortunately, this is how it's unfolding. This is how we're evolving, right,
12:46
it's an evolution. But how do you lower their anxieties? How do
12:50
you lower their their level of uncertainty and give them a very direct goal at
12:56
the company. And that's something I've been helping with a lot of a lot
12:58
of people. Either though we've lost some people. Let's just say, how
13:01
can I help you? Just understand that you're not alone, right, You're
13:07
one of all of us. Right, You're one of the people on planet
13:11
Earth that need to just focus on a task, focus on the goals,
13:15
Focus us folks on the bigger picture. Don't be scared. Chat GPT is
13:18
not going to take your job. And guess what if chat GPT takes your
13:24
role or some CEO out there, because that's the argument, right, it's
13:28
good versus evil captains of industry, board of directors, CEO's Wall Street somebody
13:35
at the top is saying, you know, we could use chat GPT and
13:39
large language models and AI to really bolster our company and our people right to
13:48
work less hours right, thirty hour work week right, or like shorten the
13:52
time and allow that the people that are at our company to focus or the
13:58
bad guys and I hate, I hate to say bad guys, but you
14:03
know the hey, we can employ fifteen hundred bots and lay off thirty thousand
14:09
people and be better about it because guess what AI in bots work twenty four
14:18
seven three sixty five, three sixty four and a half because you got to
14:22
reboot them, right, there's gonna be an update on these things every once
14:24
in a while, and it's it's it's a it's a scary sci fi very
14:31
orwelly and kind of vibe. So how do you think about when you think
14:35
about where you focused your career, particularly by the sounds of it in save
14:39
the last five years, Jeff? How much of an accelerant is chat GPT?
14:46
How much of how consistent is it with your with your current direction of
14:52
technological travel already in terms of what it makes possible of where it points or
14:58
how much of a alternatively, is it is it the opposite? Does it
15:01
is it? Is it a complete curveball that is tip to all your expectations
15:07
a Sunday. I assume it's a film about I want to hit out from
15:09
you. There's going to be a fork in the road that could lead to
15:13
two things. I believe. One is going to be like the human the
15:18
human element is going to be even more sought after. Right, It's going
15:24
to be you know, the feeling to touch. The analog experience is going
15:31
to be you know, like companies are going to pay for it and want
15:37
it and how do I get how do I get an emotional connection to humanity
15:41
in my company, in my place, in my role, all of it.
15:46
That's one fork. The other one is going to be a little bit
15:50
grayer, a little bit darker. Uh, and that's going to be implementing,
15:58
uh, you know, no taking right. So, so if you're
16:00
not aware Microsoft talked about chat chat, chips chat chepts already in the works
16:06
of being integrated into teams and other platforms. Did you know this? I
16:10
presumed so I hadn't heard. He's like, I guess. So the downside
16:18
to that is how many calls have you ever been in um where you know
16:22
you've got those note takers? You ever see like no takers. When you
16:26
join a meeting call in they're no case by the way, whenever when whenever
16:29
I'm on a call with anybody and I see everyone joins and then I see
16:33
no taker. Yeah, I literally I tell them, turn it off,
16:37
turn it off. I don't. I don't want you. I don't what
16:40
is this. I don't want a robot taking my words out of context.
16:42
Turn it off. But we are in some other companies. Again, I
16:48
told you my brothers at Microsoft. They they're they're they're using it as a
16:52
note taker, right, They're gonna put it into teams. And now somebody
16:55
can say, hey, Tom, you know, if you remember, or
16:57
if you recall, Tom, November twenty twenty two, you said this in
17:03
a meeting, like yeah, yeah, Like come like, yeah I did.
17:11
That's twenty twenty two, Jeff, this is today, Jeff, you
17:14
know, suck it up. I'm right. It's interesting. Actually, Jeff,
17:19
I hadn't even thought of it before I get you on the call today.
17:22
And now my head is full of privacy implications of GPT and the whole
17:29
capacity of this technology to scrape our identities up into views, very strange,
17:37
readily essentially conscious, Your entire being and just present it to whoever has potentially
17:41
requested it, right, I mean there aren't strict strictures on what canon can't
17:48
be accessed by this technology. Then for instance, you know, every every
17:52
utterance you've ever made on the Internet could easily be gathered up and and and
17:57
and given to a potential for instance, new employer, well, current employer,
18:02
whomever. Super duper agree with that. And that's that is a conversation
18:07
that I've had about now with this technology, and AI is that is today?
18:15
That is today, the day that every person has the record button pressed.
18:22
Of those people that are too young to know that there used to be
18:25
a record button that you would press on a tape deck or something like that.
18:27
But the like is today the day, Tom? Is today the day
18:33
that we record? And I hate to talk about like what is it black
18:37
mirror? I think it was black mirror, that actually for sure. And
18:42
they talked about how could you I mean, imagine imagine ten twenty years from
18:48
now, Tom, You're married, You're you have a wife and kids,
18:52
and your wife says to you, hey, Tom, let's go back to
18:59
March fourteenth, twenty twenty five. Of course, it's twenty thirty five.
19:03
Right, let's go back when you said this or you did that, or
19:07
hey, remember that, Like, how horrible of an argument is it going
19:11
to be? When you're like, you know, Tom, you said this,
19:15
and you're like, like, let's go back to the tape. I
19:19
didn't know it referring to the tape. Might be that might not be allowed.
19:26
Always right with my wife, Jeff, she might Yes, if you're
19:33
always correct, that's and Tom, as we all are. If you're always
19:36
right, oh, it could be a good thing. Right, if you're
19:37
always one hundred percent on point, then go then literally going back to the
19:41
live reel. Right, Hey, honey, I get I get I get
19:45
what you said. But let's go back. Let's go to the highlights here.
19:47
Let's let's rewind to three weeks ago when you said this or that.
19:52
That's that's that stinks, right, that's like, you know, part of
19:57
part of being human is making mistakes. Part of being human is finding the
20:03
edge by going over the edge. Right, nobody knows where that is.
20:08
If you have to go over, you have to fail. And I believe
20:12
that a lot of a lot of people think AI is going to remove failure
20:15
from humanity. Right, we can Oh, we don't. Why make mistakes.
20:21
We can't make mistakes. AI is going to calculate and you know,
20:25
modulate all of it to make sure that we don't make mistakes. It's going
20:29
to be perfect every time. How many how many mistakes led to incredible innovations,
20:36
right, like you know how many? You know, like what was
20:38
it the you know, penicillin, right, penicillin? So I forgot exactly
20:44
the story behind penicillin. But it's something it's something like somebody made a you
20:48
know, scientists made a sandwich, left the bread out, got moldy,
20:52
spilt some garbage on it, found that the moldy garden, you know,
20:56
found that the moldy piece of the bread had had a weird reaction with bacteria
21:02
on it. And they go, ah, hams. And if I'm sure
21:04
that scientists probably first said, like who knew ham sandwiches? That's the cure,
21:11
you know. But it's those mistakes that it's those mistakes that are such
21:17
a beautiful analogy to humanity, right, It's that beautiful, beautiful mistakes,
21:23
right, it's a it's a happy accident. It's things like that. Now,
21:29
I wonder, right, is that something that AI can do? Can
21:33
AI accidentally discover stuff that's amazing with A in a completely different discipline. Right,
21:41
If I'm a scientist and I'm working on AX, can AI help me
21:45
figure out a better way to kick a soccer ball? Right? Because I
21:48
was doing one thing and I did the other thing, and I and I
21:49
and I merged it together. I don't Again. The AI piece goes into
21:57
you know, consciousness. What is conscious? How do you measure certain things
22:02
you know in and around us without getting too off the deep end, right
22:07
of like you know, you know quantum theory and wormholes. But how how
22:12
do you ensure that AI runs runs in a sidecar with us and not overtakes
22:22
humanity? Uh? I think it can happen. Yeah, how do you
22:29
how do you lock the door once the horses bolted? It feels a little
22:32
bit like wasn't it a little bit like that? Well, it's it's out
22:36
now. I mean googles to ask. Maybe years ago, you know,
22:40
I remember seeing Ela musk On talking about this years ago, maybe for three
22:45
years ago, something like that, he said. He said at the time,
22:48
he said he'd he'd booked a meeting with Obama to specifically say, look,
22:53
I think we really need to be aware of the impact and significance of
22:57
AI, particularly if it becomes conscious or something. This is the biggest issue
23:03
in the world. And a bomb was like other things to do, you
23:07
know, like I got a busy day and you know, but and he
23:11
so he sort of shrugged and said, oh, well, you know it's
23:14
gonna go where it's gonna go, and not what you can do to Not
23:18
everybody is that far into the future, right, everybody? You know,
23:22
not not not every I mean, look, you know, not everybody goes
23:27
that far. Because I'll tell you what, it's a dangerous. It's a
23:32
dangerous exercise sometimes for some people. I often sit down and and we you
23:37
know, if if you if you don't, I'm sure some people do.
23:41
If you don't, Tom or like do that exercise of where are we in
23:45
twenty thirty five, twenty forty five, right, and the only reference we
23:51
have is the past. So I sit back and I say, in two
23:56
thousand, you know, you remember two thousand and two, thous in man
24:00
like I still rocked a pager. Nobody on Well, some people listening to
24:03
your podcast might know what a pager is it I did though I was a
24:12
nerd in college I know, like like news flash, I was a super
24:17
nerd in college and um, I had a I had like a bell clip
24:21
Nokia phone, and I had a pager and believe it or not, because
24:23
I was in it, right, because I was in it. This is
24:26
the truth. This is like, this is this was late nineties it people.
24:32
I would I had a pager because if there was a like an power
24:36
outage or there was um um, like we had a we had access databases
24:41
remember access Microsoft Access. So if there was a power outage or the building
24:47
or the call seem because I went to USC had an issue, um,
24:49
they would power it down. I would get a page and that page was
24:53
basically just saying like everything's off and we need you to like go and press
24:59
power buttons and all the stuff. Because at that point in time, there
25:03
was there was no dude. I don't even know if ups has existed in
25:07
the nineties, right, like maybe there was battery backups. I don't remember
25:11
of it, but that was what my pagers were. And then my Nokia
25:15
Nokia cell phone. That was just that was personal. But I remember having
25:18
like the guy I was like, you know, I got a cell phone.
25:22
The coolest dude ever now, look where we are. We have supercomputers,
25:26
right, the iPhone, the Android phones, like you have the compute
25:32
power of like ten times what it took to go to the moon on your
25:37
hand. That's what we did from you know, late nineties to now now
25:41
as we know, you could talk about a thousand different scientific rules. But
25:45
you know, technology keeps doubling and doubling and doubling. Right, So where
25:51
are we in the in twenty thirty five or twenty forty And again I have
25:55
a vested interest in that because my son is thirteen. I want to make
25:59
sure, like I give him the best swimming lane to take to success,
26:04
right as it does a dad as a fought like I just you want to
26:07
say, like make sure you go this way and avoid these things, or
26:14
you know, like autonomous driving. I drive a stick shift, right,
26:18
I'm a manual guy. I'm an analog guy. I love hearing things rev
26:22
and like physically touch things. Right, Um, all this autonomous stuff,
26:26
every other day, there's some other JABRONI like blowing off a freaking like flying
26:30
off into like a fire truck, or like you know, ramping off a
26:33
cliff. Because it's like, oh, I had autopilot on on my tesla.
26:37
You don't belong in a car if you have to just get in and
26:41
fall asleep or read a newspaper. We've all seen these videos of some some
26:45
bozo reading a newspaper or like that's AI. That's that is the best analogy.
26:51
I alway see like that's AI. You can trust it until you can't,
26:56
right, You can trust AI until you drive off a cliff and then
26:59
you're you know, someone's looking at the black box to say what happened.
27:02
Oh, I was eating breakfast, reading a newspaper and taking a nap while
27:07
I was my car was driving me to work. M hm hmm, yeah,
27:11
yeah, I feel really like, um, I think my my my
27:14
feeling about it or philosophically and about you know, AI and automation in general.
27:18
But worries me as a parent is um. You know, I really
27:22
think that work is good for us, you know, like I feel that
27:27
like without work and without responsibilities, um, we just kind of our characters
27:33
need evaporate, they deteriorate, you know. We we we need to be
27:38
responsible things for things, and I think we need to be meaningful for yourself
27:44
time for things. I think you just take speak for yourself time. I
27:51
think, I think meaning work work work, work can define some Um,
27:56
I know I know many of people that you know, work defines them.
28:00
And it's it's also where you are in life. I used to never understand
28:06
when I was in my thirties why my boss, who was in their late
28:08
forties early fifties, was like, you know, Sunday, Sunday afternoon,
28:14
I'm getting a flurry of emails, right, you know, nine o'clock at
28:18
night, sat you know, Saturday's phone calls. Like I never understood it.
28:21
I was like, dude, do you not have a life. But
28:22
they do have lives. It's just a different evolution, right, It's it's
28:27
they've already had their young kids. They've already got their kids out of the
28:32
house, right, they've already like they're there. I'm not going to say
28:36
alone, but but that really that's really what it comes down to. You
28:38
like the pyramid, you start getting to the top of this pyramid where you
28:41
know you have like one or two great friends, right or best friends?
28:48
Right? You know, Um, if you're lucky like me, like you
28:49
know, your wife's your best friend or like or one of your best friends,
28:52
and you have best friends. But it's a very it's a very small
28:55
group. And without without that, um, some people don't have that.
29:00
You have what you have work? Right? You have? What is?
29:06
What do? What do I stand for? What do I? What is
29:08
I? What? What do I do? And what's the meaning of what
29:11
I do? People are like, well, I'm a you know, I'm
29:14
an IT professional. I do I stuff. I make everyone's life better,
29:17
I make the experience better. I do like in Tune upgrades and I do
29:21
Windows eleven upgrades. And I'm making everybody's life better by doing what I do.
29:26
There's an impact. Right, But if you if you strip that away
29:32
from some people, um, it can get a little sad, right,
29:36
it can get really sad. Um. And I've known people that do that.
29:40
Like again, it's it's exactly what happens. It's a quickening when people
29:44
lose their jobs. Right, We've all seen these huge swatches of Microsoft laying
29:48
off ten thousand, Amazon, Google, um, Zoom. And again that's
29:53
a microcosum of everything, right, that's the macro. I've heard a million
29:59
software companies right now that are looking for a reason or an excuse to kind
30:02
of like you know, streamline the org chart. Right when that happens right
30:07
to people that are and and again talking back to those people in their twenties,
30:12
there was a there is a colleague of mine that doesn't work at Mondalize,
30:15
works at another company that is in their twenties, was laid off,
30:19
not married, no kids. But I called him because it was abrupt.
30:26
He was like I was working with him on a project. He was laid
30:29
off on like a Friday. On Monday. Of course, I get the
30:32
at office or whatever and I ping him, I ping him on on you
30:36
know, on messages, and I'm like hey man, and he's like,
30:37
dude, they called me, they let me go, and I was like,
30:41
dude, Like oh my god. So I called him. I'm like,
30:44
is there anything I can do? Because he was again he was a
30:45
cool person, smart gold drift like a cool person. And I was like,
30:51
how can I help you, Like, take a look at Mondale,
30:52
See if there's anything I could help you with, See if there's any roles
30:56
here. Let me. I know a lot of people. I know a
30:56
lot of cool people like Tom, like Tom and you. I'm like just
31:00
let me, let me, let me see if I can help you.
31:03
And he was so depressed. Tom like dark, like dark, like I
31:11
don't even know if I want to do this anymore. I don't know if
31:12
I want to even work anymore. I don't know if I want to do
31:15
any of this stuff. This is just that's right. I mean, he's
31:25
you know, and it's it. Look I guess. Thank thank god I
31:29
called him in a way because he was he was really down, really down,
31:34
And I said, look, man, don't go crazy, don't go
31:37
get bombed every night, like do what you need to do to get it
31:41
out of your system. But like you gotta get back on that horse.
31:45
This is life. Get back on that horse and go right. And he
31:52
was like, well, what do you think I I'm like, dude,
31:55
go like I can tell you that you can't stop right, Because he was
32:00
like, you know, I'm thinking about just like kind of like taking a
32:01
few months off. I'm like, mmm, I'm like, no, that's
32:06
not a good idea. That's like people that say like I'm just going to
32:09
take a few months off before I go to college, and they never go
32:14
to college or higher learning in general. Right, it doesn't matter if it's
32:17
college or not. Like, you know, you know, I want to
32:19
go to Electrician school. I want to go to trade school. I want
32:22
to learn how to like flag up a giant ostrich like I don't know whatever
32:24
whatever whatever it is you want to do, like don't stop even if you
32:30
start moving and it's in the wrong direction. The exercise like physical exercise,
32:37
mental exercise, spiritual exercise. You have to exercise. Whether you're jogging in
32:43
the wrong direction or not. You have to keep jogging. You have to
32:46
keep moving. Here's a question for you, Tom Good, here's neuralink.
32:52
Right, let's talk about twenty twenty fifty. Right, so you're given an
32:58
option to be an earlier opter. And they say, Tom, um,
33:01
the the io. The io is very slow right now, you know,
33:06
I ask you a question. You don't know the answer. You google it
33:08
on your phone, you read it, you read it, it goes in
33:10
your head. Right, It takes time, and it's not always one hundred
33:14
percent. In five years, you're given the opportunity to be an early adopter.
33:17
That io now is here, it's behind your ear it's injected into your
33:22
brain. And now you're able to get that that io that that time now
33:28
is in milliseconds. I ask you a question. You're able to connect to
33:34
you know, Internet of Things, cloud and now you can respond, Are
33:37
you one of those people that adopts it? Are you one of those people
33:40
that goes in for surgery to have your brain connected to the to the Google's
33:45
No, I don't think so, No, No, Why well, Um,
33:52
I think I think I believe you know, Look, I could just
33:55
be a fossil, Jeff, you know I could, but you know,
34:00
but I could. You know, what I think is my values could just
34:04
be just pure product of the past. You know. Okay, twenty years
34:08
from now, you're you're sixty years old, so fifty six, or you're
34:12
sixty years old twenty years from now, right, Um, ninety percent of
34:16
the planet has some type of you know, cyborg ish connection, whether it's
34:24
I'm sure you've seen mechanic alarms, right, mechanical eyes, you know,
34:30
work getting close to that anyway, Now you're the in the ten percent that
34:36
you're just you're like almost just an anomaly, right, You're a You're a
34:40
humanoid thing walking around that doesn't have the connection to everything. Right, Um,
34:49
think about this, twenty years from now, you have a team of
34:52
project managers and people working at your company that are all interconnected. Right.
34:57
If I have a thought and I'm thinking about something, and I'm working on
35:00
something. Tom already knows that I'm thinking about it because we're all in a
35:02
collective consciousness in this space. We have one drive for brains, right,
35:07
Hey, do you have access to my one drive in my head? Tom,
35:09
I'm giving you access right now. Poop, by the way, don't
35:13
don't look at this folder. That's not a good folder to look at.
35:15
Look at this folder right here, right, just stand on this folder.
35:20
I gave you access to this folder. It's it's a reality again. This
35:24
is my thought experiment of going into twenty years from now that in itself sounds
35:30
like somebody it sounds it solves a business problem. How do I get the
35:35
twenty five people on my team to be in perfect like synchronosity? How do
35:39
you make sure everybody is moving at the same pace, at the same speed.
35:45
And I'll tell you where it's gonna happen. First, it's gonna be
35:46
in military. You're gonna have military teams, you know, Seal Team six
35:51
seven eight. You're gonna have militia that's going to be perfectly synchronized to do
35:55
anything that a robot or drone can't do. And that's that's where if they're
36:01
not already working on it. I can imagine that somewhere that's that could solve
36:07
a big problem. Um, I'm with you, though, I really,
36:12
I really don't want it anywhere, you know. In me, I'm okay
36:16
with it being the way it is now. But hey, maybe I'm old
36:21
school. Yeah yeah, I mean, you know, but I do.
36:24
I think I share with you, Jeff. I share with you a sort
36:27
of fundamental optimism and a sense that, look, you know, one thing
36:30
people have a tendency to do is to overthink things and and and exaggerate our
36:37
sense of control in the first place, you know, like we are,
36:40
we're subject to already too things which is so much greater than us. And
36:45
you just have to make the best of your day and and and try and
36:47
live as a positively and directly as possible, don't you. But listen,
36:52
I mean, we're just a bad out of time, Jeff. This has
36:54
perhaps been of our of our four long conversations, This has perhaps been my
37:00
favorite one. And I forgot to say at the top. Tim would have
37:02
joined us. But it's actually traveling from I think the bye back to the
37:07
States. He was stopping off en route in London and fort maybe if it
37:13
was like his playing was early and you know from a lounge, you know
37:16
he might he might join us, but as obviously unable to send his best.
37:21
Sounds like you're head of the game and you've already but unacceptable. But
37:23
he said he sends his best and uh and look, absolute pleasure talking to
37:28
you again, Jeff. Until number five. Take care. It was it
37:30
was great, give me a lot to think about. And you know,
37:34
look, if anybody, if anybody is interested in in in thinking more about
37:37
the impacts of chat GPT, not only on it, but on humanity,
37:43
there's a reality by its episode from a couple of weeks ago you should check
37:45
out. There are there are articles on the decks hub links in the in
37:52
the description covering not just chat GPT, but the whole gammut of AI.
37:58
And it just leads me to say, thank you for joining us today.
38:01
Thank you so much, Jeff, and we will surely truly see you soon.
38:06
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