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Escaping Therapist Abuse with Amy Nordhues · She Speaks Life - Christian Women, Strengthen Your Faith, Bible Study, Grow Spiritually In Christ

• 0:02
  Hi listeners. Welcome to the.
• 0:04
  She speaks live podcast a weekly encouragement where we share our
• 0:09
  God's stories. I'm your host.
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  Jamie Elizabeth and I am so glad you are spending time with us
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  today to listen. Hi and welcome back to, she
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  speaks like podcast, I have with me, author, a me nor use who
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  will be sharing with us, a raw story, about her escape from the
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  abuse of a psychiatrist, and how God showed her a way out, and
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  brought her healing. Hi Amy.
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  I'm so glad you're here. Hi, thank you.
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  Well, I know you wrote a book about this, a memoir is called
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  Upon and as I was looking, you kind of had a play on words
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  there. You had PR ay, aye D.
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  And then above that are on top of the, a you put an e.
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  And then the subtitle is finding my freedom from therapist abuse.
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  And I wanted to let our listener know that your book was first
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  place and Inspire, Christian writers, great openings On test
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  for nonfiction and you have published many articles on this
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  topic and you have a Blog. And so I would love for you just
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  to Dive Right into where this all begins.
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  This abuse take us back. Yes in 2013, I start seeing this
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  therapist, he's also a psychiatrist and he is an Are at
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  my new church. I was attending Celebrate
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  Recovery the year before and really became what I say is a
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  new believer just really on fire for God, just realizing how
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  personal and present he was. And so, when I found out this
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  therapist was an elder at this new church that I was attending.
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  I just thought I was in. Excellent hands.
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  I went to see him really for issues, just surrounding past,
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  sexual abuse, low self-esteem. And I just wanted to work on my
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  marriage. Age and parenting and things
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  like that. I've been, you know, taken
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  advantage of many times in my lifetime but never have I ever
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  experienced grooming or like a slow manipulation.
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  No luring me into a relationship where I was supposedly if he
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  cared about me and I was special to him and he pretended as if he
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  was like a father figure to me. And so it was very a very slow
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  Insidious Process. And one of the reasons I write
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  the book is because I didn't even think as an adult, I could
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  be manipulated in a way in such a way.
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  And so I wanted other victims to know, you know, that they
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  weren't alone either and I wanted people don't understand
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  to be able to read the book and say, well, I kind of get it.
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  I kind of see how we could. All be taken advantage of in
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  this way. Yeah I got to say when you sent
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  me your book, I was reading it and that's one of the things.
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  That stood out to me how gradual this manipulation was.
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  Yeah, I've been seeing them once a week for an hour from I think
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  like April to December. So it's something that's almost
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  a year before there was even something that I noticed to be
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  maybe a red flag and even then it seemed kind of minor and I
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  thought well I'm just kind of overreacting and I'm probably
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  just a little too sensitive and and that and the events were so
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  far apart that I didn't connect any of Until I got out, it was a
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  year and a month that I saw him, and at the end, it was blatant
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  sexual abuse. Again, I still thought it had
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  come from a place of caring and concern and maybe he went too
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  far or maybe there was some weird relationship with his
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  mother. Something I still did not see
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  that was a Sinister Thing. Once I was able to get out and
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  look back, I realized it had been orchestrated starting on
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  day one. One and the whole thing had
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  been, you know, a joke to him. You know, I've never encountered
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  and that kind of evil, I've never encountered a sociopath
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  and real life, and I didn't even really hard for my brain to
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  grasp That you can do that to another human being.
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  You know, Justin was objects to be discarded, right?
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  So what made you think, what was that first thing?
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  That was like, oh this is like wrong, this is inappropriate.
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  The first thing was in December around Christmas time, I came in
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  and he offered to rub my feet or my shoulders for a Christmas
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  present and I panic and I froze. And you know, in my mind I was
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  thinking like, say something like pick one like, you know,
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  it, you know, didn't feel like a choice and and I felt like he's
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  a professional. He's like a grandfather type,
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  he's a therapist. He's probably offering this for
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  therapeutic reasons and you're just really oversensitive.
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  Like he's just asking to touch her feet.
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  Like is that really that big of a deal?
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  So I kind of like, talked myself Of down and again felt like well
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  you have to pick one or one or the other and I think I said
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  shoulder up and then the minute he started to, he came over and
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  rub my shoulders. It freaked me out and I said,
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  our feet rep Pedro just to get him back and sadly I felt like I
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  had to sit through that and pretend that it was comfortable,
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  it's like heaven forbid. I make somebody else feel
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  uncomfortable for making me feel uncomfortable.
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  It's like you know I knew that it was weird and I didn't I
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  don't know that I felt that it was wrong but I thought it was
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  definitely strange and definitely made me feel
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  uncomfortable. I just wasn't sure if I had the
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  right. It's like, who was I to tell
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  him? He was being an appropriate.
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  Mmm, so I sat through it and then it became commonplace and
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  he rubbed my feet after that, and I thought it was great.
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  And I thought I loved that I was More than just a regular client.
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  And I knew that he saw me as like a daughter and I truly
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  thought, you know, kind of being this may be this naive, new
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  Christian that God was blessing me in this way that he was
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  trying to show me that there could be safe, nurturing touch
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  from a male and that there can be, you know, sort of making up
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  for maybe nurturing that I didn't get as a child and
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  showing me, it's okay. And so I thought my reactions
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  were like, because of my experiences that makes sense,
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  and that God was trying to show me, it's okay if it's with a
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  safe person, that's that's fine and it's human and it's normal
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  to desire that so, Yeah, that was the first great brainwashed,
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  right? Yeah.
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  Just, you know it's utterly confusing.
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  I mean just imagine it's like sometimes I think you go to your
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  dentist and I mean I know that's different because you don't
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  build a relationship but they all the sudden offer something.
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  That's so out there. I mean, a lot of times I just
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  breathe and I just get through it.
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  I just get through it so that I can leave my brain doesn't know
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  how to Process 7th handle it. Yeah.
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  So you went through a abuse earlier on in life.
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  So do you think this was just kind of not healing from that
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  and just going into, you know, feeling like you don't have a
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  voice, you're not worthy enough. You think it just carried over?
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  Yeah, I definitely think that abuse at a young age, it kind of
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  puts a Target on your back and it lets, you know, that you are
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  not worth as much as regular people.
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  That this wouldn't have happened to you.
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  If you were that, there's something different about you
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  bad about you almost as if you need to make up for that, you
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  know, overcompensate for this Badness, that that we carry.
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  And so yeah, when when someone is then inappropriate with us
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  when we're older and we know that it isn't right?
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  We see it, but we don't feel that we have enough value.
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  To say anything to, like I said, make the abuser feel
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  uncomfortable. Hmm, right.
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  Okay. So when the this finally end,
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  like when was it like a Awakening?
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  You're like okay this is this is we're done here.
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  There was kind of A build-up but he started he tried to morph the
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  relationship eventually from a father-daughter to more
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  romantic. And that was extremely
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  unsettling to me and not. Okay, with me and I let him know
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  that. Is not okay with me that I
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  wasn't comfortable with that. But at the same time, as I was
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  attached. So I kept going back and I kept
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  thinking, well, well, he'll stop when I make him realize that
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  this isn't what I want. He'll stop.
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  But at the very end, when he started hinting towards sexual
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  things, I was like, oh my gosh, get me out of here and what
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  really cinched it for me was because again, you have to
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  remember, although I didn't want that, it was inappropriate.
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  I did think that he was a kind of person that he cared about
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  me, but that he was, I don't know, somehow tripped up or
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  somehow went too far. I didn't have the Sinister
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  piece. So at the very end Last session,
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  it's really sad for me to say this.
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  Every time I say it, but I asked him if he would just talk to me,
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  if we could keep clothes on and he could just talk to me, he's
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  my therapist and I'm begging him, you know?
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  Asking him. And his answer was so cold and
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  so cruel. And I saw then what I needed to
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  see that there's zero care and concern, for me, I mean nothing
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  to him and, you know, as sad as this is, I still felt like I had
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  to get through the session. I didn't feel I could just leave
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  because I mean that would be rude.
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  Right? So I kind of I get through that
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  session and I leave and I know I'm never going back.
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  So it Really, really seeing the evil there at the end, seeing
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  just the cruelty in the coldness.
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  I just had no idea that could possibly be there.
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  I suspected it. I was starting to see glimpses
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  of it but again I didn't know that could even really exist and
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  that's what I needed to see. And then I was and I was praying
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  just day and night at first I was praying, God, are you trying
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  to tell me to get out or is our or Satan, trying to take away,
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  something good, that you gave me.
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  I mean, I was so confused and then towards the end when it was
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  clearly, Be inappropriate. I still felt like I couldn't
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  leave him. It would devastate him too if I
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  left him because that's what he told me and he was, I thought he
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  was fragile and I felt guilty to leave and I was praying and God
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  literally said to me, Amy, he is not your problem to fix.
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  And I was like, you're right. And then I drove to my Pastor's
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  house and I told he and his wife, everything.
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  So the The bond is so confusing because even when I knew he was
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  hurting me, I still felt like I couldn't leave.
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  Yeah. Yeah, that's enemy.
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  The devil likes to confuse us. I'm sorry.
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  You went through that. Now, take us through the healing
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  process. Yeah, there's a lot of stages,
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  but in the very beginning, I didn't think I could survive it
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  and I literally clung to God, because he's all I had, I didn't
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  trust anyone not a soul, I didn't want to tell my husband,
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  I didn't want to tell anyone, I just wanted to get better and
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  move on and keep the secret. So you know, I so I come to God
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  and my faith was intact, but what I really needed to know in
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  the beginning was am I the only one on the planet?
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  That is this naive? That's this dumb.
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  That's this needy, whatever it was, it was bad about me and I
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  found an organization of adult. Victims of therapists and clergy
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  abuse. And I just hung on their words,
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  they just told me over and over, you're not alone and it wasn't
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  your fault. You're not alone, it wasn't your
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  fault. I started to accept that I
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  wasn't alone and that I wasn't the only one and that made me
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  feel better but it took a very long time for me to sort out,
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  what was my fault and what wasn't, I mean, I hated myself
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  because I didn't understand it and you know, eventually I tell
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  my husband everything because that's just you know, the In
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  that I am and and we have to begin our own roller coaster
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  healing process. Eventually I decided to report
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  this doctor to the medical board and that was another step.
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  And just speaking up for myself and even and, you know, just the
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  fact that people strangers wanted to fight for me was just
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  crazy to me. I just couldn't believe that
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  they would care about just me like and so that was healing and
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  I feel like God allowed me to be the only victim for a long time
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  because he wanted me to know that, even if it was just me, I
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  was valuable enough to be fought for Later on another victim
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  comes forward and there was some healing in that especially the
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  healing that I needed to accept that.
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  I had never been special to the abuser.
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  Anyway, that's just another stage.
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  You kind of have to, you have to grieve this illusion.
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  You have to grieve the fantasy that you thought it was and that
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  takes time. And then I eventually do file a
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  civil suit against anding up for myself.
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  Was healing, but the true healing came.
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  With really writing out what happened to me so I could
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  understand it seeing the intricate grooming.
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  And recognizing these lies that I've been believing about
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  myself. All these years and how they
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  were, you know, making me vulnerable to predators and, and
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  how they were just utterly damaging.
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  And so what I did was I started to write love Letters From God
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  to myself, even though I didn't feel it, I didn't feel God's
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  love. I didn't feel.
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  I deserved his love, but I knew that scripture didn't lie and so
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  I knew that it was truth. So, I wrote it anyway.
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  And so, I would just kind of throw it at God, like, well,
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  look what I did. Well, I didn't leave sooner
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  well, you know, kind of the but, but but and letting him say over
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  and over to me, child, this is how I see you and this was not
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  your fault and Love you, and I forgive you and eventually those
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  things started to kind of penetrate.
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  And that's where the true healing came is is the healing
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  of the self-hatred that I'd always carried.
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  So, I feel like God, use this experience to heal me from this
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  trauma, but also to heal me from traumas that started at the age
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  of three. Yeah, yeah, his truth taking
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  root in your life so that you can refresh.
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  Your renew your mind, right? What the word and what God says
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  to you. I love that.
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  You know, there was this enlightening and this Awakening
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  in your mind and heart that God told you.
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  Hey look, this is your identity, not what happened to you in
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  life. Don't Define Yourself by that.
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  You know, I give you your identity so did the
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  psychiatrist. True.
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  Stand up getting in trouble or what happened to him about a
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  week after my pastor did confront him.
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  And he agreed to step down as Elder.
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  Obviously, the medical board. Did their full investigation and
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  allowed him to surrender his license?
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  Which doesn't sound like a lot, but at least it did stop him
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  from practicing and my state and they let me know that it was
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  only the I think the fifth permanent surrender of license
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  in 20 years that they'd ever issued.
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  So typically a doctor can reapply for their license after
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  one year. But his was a permanent
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  surrender and that was healing and then yeah there's no
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  criminal legislation in my state for therapists abuse in 32 of
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  our state's there is Criminal legislation.
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  Against therapist sexual involvement with a client.
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  It's even it's completely unethical.
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  Even for therapists to be involved with a client sexually.
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  After therapy has terminated, it can still be damaging then
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  because you never the relation to therapist client
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  relationship, really never goes away.
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  And the therapist is always going to be in the position of
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  power there. So because I didn't have the
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  that opportunity available to me, I did file a civil suit
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  which was essentially just Just between, you know, me and his
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  insurance company but it was something.
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  It was just a way that I could fight for myself though.
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  Yes and no. Yeah, he deserved.
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  I don't think so but I had to really trust that God can handle
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  that and let that go and not get caught up in the unfairness of
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  it all. So God is a God of Justice.
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  He's just and the vengeance is his says scripture.
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  So even though we can't see In the natural God, you know, is
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  doing the work for us to bring Justice Wright and I wanted to
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  dive into your kind of the play on words of your book and maybe
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  share something that we didn't really cover in the book.
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  I thought that was such a great title.
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  Thank you. I yeah, I love that too.
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  It was important for me to have that title because it was the
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  prey pra. Why Why that made me trust him?
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  He was an elder at my church. He wore a cross necklace.
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  He was on the prayer team and we literally began our sessions in
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  prayer in his office. So I think I'm being preyed upon
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  when really it is PR see why that is happening?
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  You know, he the therapy was all about bringing Jesus into the
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  broken places and he said the Holy Spirit was his boss.
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  So it was very much in a spiritual setting.
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  And that made it hard for me to spot.
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  You know, the trickery mmm times when I would feel critical of
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  maybe something he was saying or suggesting, I would think a my
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  criticizing God, my criticizing like the holy spirit's plan or
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  the therapy. And then, you know, as far as
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  things we haven't covered in the book, I think just the
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  devastation and the pain that comes when adult victims come
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  forward. Forward.
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  I think, I think there's a lot of judgment about victims that
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  come forward and they have no idea what it takes, and what we
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  have to go through to come forward.
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  We have to risk, everything we have to risk.
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  You know, spouses that may not understand.
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  How are they going to understand?
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  When we don't even understand what just happened.
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  We have to risk your reputation. I had to lose, you know, my old
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  church to answer your question. Yes, I'm struggling in the area
• 20:01
  of church, but I tried to stay, And I just couldn't, and the
• 20:04
  gossip Mill was in full swing, you know, the pastor didn't
• 20:07
  inform the congregation of what happened, so it just got to be
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  whatever the gossip Mill, turned out.
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  So and I live in a smaller town and so I'll never know to this
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  day. When people look at me, you know
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  what, they know or what they think.
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  And I, again have to trust God, that that's one thing that I
• 20:26
  that I is important to me for victims to know, is that we
• 20:30
  don't know explanations to anyone and to victims of crimes,
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  No, explanations about the crime.
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  No, that's that's silly. I mean we would never expect
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  that but in our situation we are owed an X.
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  We owe an explanation / Society. At least that's how we feel
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  because so many people don't understand it and it can be very
• 20:50
  easily labeled an affair but for it to be in a fair, there has to
• 20:54
  be consent and for there to be consent, there has to be an
• 20:57
  equal balance of power and there is no balance of power between
• 21:01
  doctor-patient therapist patient.
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  Pastor congregant period. Now, what a false teacher a wolf
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  in sheep's clothing. Yeah, horrible.
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  And when I wrote this book, I hoped that the reader could see
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  that someone could go through a tragedy like this.
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  Even abuse by a religious leader and God can still be present and
• 21:26
  loving and you can still, you know, have your relationship
• 21:31
  with Jesus. Even when your relationship with
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  church has been obliterated and I, you know, it kills me to
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  think that these abusers would take away the relationship of
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  the one person that truly understands us and loves us
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  unconditionally my Is that victims can fight for that
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  relationship with Jesus, even when they can't trust the
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  church. That's okay.
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  Yeah, that's good. Thanks Amy.
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  Thank you for sharing this story.
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  I know it's not easy to go through and retell again.
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  You know, brings up emotions and whatnot but it's important for
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  us to bring these up to the surface so that we don't feel
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  like we're alone just like that. Helped you heal hearing other
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  women. How did they get through this?
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  This having other women come along beside you and say it
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  wasn't your fault and this is how I got through own and got
• 22:27
  healing. So it's important for us to
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  share our story and be a voice and I appreciate you coming on
• 22:34
  here and doing just that. Okay.
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  So where can people buy your book and connect with you?
• 22:40
  My website is the best for that, it would be a Min or to use.com.
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  Am yno Rd H UE s You can buy a signed copy paperback copy on my
• 22:51
  website and I and I send out of free gift or you can find the
• 22:55
  ebook or paperback on Amazon it's in Kindle unlimited.
• 23:01
  So if you have that it would be free.
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  And as far as my website, I have as many resources as I've been
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  able to come up with and you can email me and I will reply so
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  good. So yeah.
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  If you know anybody, if it's not you that can relate to this but
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  maybe know somebody that has gone through.
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  Abuse, or you may think they're going through it right now?
• 23:24
  That please share this story with them and the resources of
• 23:29
  Amy's website. Thanks Amy for coming on here.
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  Thank you so much for listening today.
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  I trust that God has encouraged you through this message for
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  more information on this ministry and to access free
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  downloads. Please visit my website at Jamie
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  Elizabeth.com and sign up. You can also find me on
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  Instagram and Facebook at Jamie Elizabeth she speaks life.
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  That's ja why m. Lee Elizabeth, she speaks life.
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  Until next time, my friends. I pray God reveals himself
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  through your own life story. Lee Elizabeth, she speaks life.
• 24:08
  Until next time, my friends. I pray God reveals himself
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  through your own life story.