Latest / ChangeMakers with Katie Goar / Episode 124: Kyle Kamrooz, Founder & CEO, Bonus Homes

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Episode 124: Kyle Kamrooz, Founder & CEO, Bonus Homes · ChangeMakers with Katie Goar

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: This is change Makers with Katie Gore finding the right
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: solutions for the affordable housing community.
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: This week's change maker is Kyle Camrouse, the founder of
• 0:16
  Speaker 2: Bonus Homes who's redefining affordable housing by empowering families to
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: grow wealth through home equity. His groundbreaking model turns homes
• 0:28
  Speaker 2: into lifelong assets, blending innovation with real world impact. Kyle,
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: Welcome to the show.
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: Thanks for having me.
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: Kate, it is great to have you, and I am
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: so excited to talk about home equity, home ownership and
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: all of the nuances of your model and exactly what
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: you're doing. But I love to start these podcasts by
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: first asking how did you come into this industry? How
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: did you first start? Just tell us a little bit
• 1:00
  Speaker 2: about your journey through recognition or just ay a creative
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: spark of energy.
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I actually started. I'd been in housing.
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: I tell people I don't know a lot of things
• 1:14
  Speaker 3: in life, but I've been Housing's my jam. I've been
• 1:16
  Speaker 3: in housing since the late nineties. I was eighteen years old.
• 1:19
  Speaker 3: My father got me into lending. I didn't want to
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: do it. I wanted to go do mergers and acquisitions
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: in Wall Street. That was kind of my thought and
• 1:28
  Speaker 3: I ended up getting into lending in mortgages and it
• 1:32
  Speaker 3: was fascinated by that. And then you know, rode the
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: wave in the two thousands when a lot of people
• 1:39
  Speaker 3: obviously buying homes avoided a lot of those interesting types
• 1:43
  Speaker 3: of loans. I've obviously caused a lot of issues, but
• 1:47
  Speaker 3: really learned the mortgage process and that helped me really
• 1:52
  Speaker 3: understand and I and what was unique was I started
• 1:54
  Speaker 3: from the back end. I started from like the selling
• 1:57
  Speaker 3: of a loan that you know, capital market, it's underwriting operations,
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: and then all the way up to the front the
• 2:03
  Speaker 3: point of sale with the consumer and fast forward from there.
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: Built several lending companies and broker shops, some of some
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: of the largest broker companies in California at the time.
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: Then became a national lender where I had fifty branches
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: in fifty states, and then you had the two thousand
• 2:21
  Speaker 3: and eight financial crisis, right, and so during that time
• 2:24
  Speaker 3: I got out of the industry around two thousand and seven.
• 2:27
  Speaker 3: But yeah, everyone felt the impact and that was it was.
• 2:29
  Speaker 3: It was an eye opening experience for a lot of people.
• 2:34
  Speaker 3: And so but I loved finance and I loved just
• 2:38
  Speaker 3: the lending and the finance. I was very fascinated with
• 2:41
  Speaker 3: mortgage and I was very fascinated with technology, and I
• 2:43
  Speaker 3: saw lived it. I breathed it every day. By that time,
• 2:47
  Speaker 3: I did, you know, hundreds of billions of loan volume
• 2:50
  Speaker 3: throughout my career at that time. And then I had
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: a fascination with learning how to code. So I started
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: to learn basic JavaScript coding, you know, coding for dummies
• 3:00
  Speaker 3: and some youtubes and stuff like that, and took some classes. Anyways,
• 3:03
  Speaker 3: it did some basic coding because I wanted to. I
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: saw how painful the mortgage process was and how manual
• 3:10
  Speaker 3: and subjective everything is, and not just the paper intensivity
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: for the consumer, but also the back end for the
• 3:18
  Speaker 3: lender was just mind blowingly manual. Everything was legacy systems
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: and so forth. And then this is now started to
• 3:26
  Speaker 3: go into the ushers in the digital age, where data
• 3:29
  Speaker 3: you can start leveraging data to make intelligent rules, right,
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: and that led me to start a company called Claudburga,
• 3:38
  Speaker 3: which allowed me to get into basically the software technology
• 3:41
  Speaker 3: space and doing something I loved and I was very
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: deeply passionate about, which was automating the mortgage process and
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: seeing how we could reduce the total costs of getting
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: alone and making it a lot easier by making everything
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: data driven, intelligent, driven, mobile friendly, et cetera. So built
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: that company. We had ten of the top thirty lenders
• 4:02
  Speaker 3: in the country that were using that platform. So now
• 4:05
  Speaker 3: I was on the other end of it. So I
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: was able to be relatable to some of these banks
• 4:09
  Speaker 3: and lenders, these massive lenders because I lived it and
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: I did that. And then basically in twenty twenty one
• 4:18
  Speaker 3: during COVID didn't plan on this, but ended up we
• 4:21
  Speaker 3: ended up getting acquired by Stuart Title and that was that.
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: So that was kind of the mortgage side. Bonus really
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: has been something that stemmed from really my years are
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: just being in this industry scene, the mortgage side, the
• 4:36
  Speaker 3: real estate side, the buy side, the south side, understanding
• 4:40
  Speaker 3: all of those right and then starting to decouple them.
• 4:43
  Speaker 3: And really the last part the bonus has always been
• 4:47
  Speaker 3: my passion, but all the stars didn't really start aligning
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: until those several years ago. But the premise of Bonus
• 4:54
  Speaker 3: really started from just this concept of every time I
• 4:59
  Speaker 3: can't tell you how many people and you might have
• 5:01
  Speaker 3: had people yourself that have had this, which is they
• 5:05
  Speaker 3: basically look back on their house on Zillo when they
• 5:08
  Speaker 3: sold it a decade later, right, And they sold it
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: a decade ago, and they look back and they're like, honey,
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: that house is now worth eight hundred thousand dollars and
• 5:20
  Speaker 3: we sold it for three fifty. And you're just like,
• 5:23
  Speaker 3: oh my god, if only I would have kept at home,
• 5:26
  Speaker 3: how much more wealth I would have had. That happens
• 5:29
  Speaker 3: every day, all day. I agree, Like, you know, what
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: was the home value of your childhood home, whether you
• 5:34
  Speaker 3: owned it or rented it. Is it worth more today
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: than it was back then? One thousand percent? Right? So
• 5:41
  Speaker 3: one core principle has always been throughout my journey in
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: home ownership and in just this, in this ecosystem of housing,
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: has been homes are the most predictable wealth generator ever. Okay,
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: regardless of down terms. I mean, we had the worst
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: in two thousand and eight to ten. Markets were just crushed.
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: But look what has happened even when the market was
• 6:02
  Speaker 3: that bad. Can it happen again? Yeah? Although I disagree
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: and say it won't happen to that extreme for a
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: myriad of reasons. But real estate, if you hold it
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: for a long period of time, you will always win.
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: You always will win. The problem is so that's core
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: principle one that I learned throughout this journey. Core principal
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: number two. The only option for most middle America, and
• 6:25
  Speaker 3: what Bonus is really focused on is bringing wealth back
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: to the middle class because frankly, there is no more
• 6:30
  Speaker 3: middle class. We do not have a middle class in
• 6:32
  Speaker 3: the society. When I grew up in the nineties and
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: the two thousands, they're somewhat of a middle class. It
• 6:36
  Speaker 3: is massively different than what I saw from when I
• 6:39
  Speaker 3: was a kid. The rich got richer and everybody else
• 6:43
  Speaker 3: and it is a massive gap of what's going on.
• 6:46
  Speaker 3: And so the middle class is what built America. And
• 6:49
  Speaker 3: at the end of the day, I grew up middle
• 6:50
  Speaker 3: class and what end of the day, what we're trying
• 6:53
  Speaker 3: to do is that this middle America is unfortunately being
• 6:57
  Speaker 3: locked out of being able to generate wealth because when
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: they want to move, Okay, rich people and the wealthy,
• 7:05
  Speaker 3: when they move, they've got options. You know what, Katie,
• 7:09
  Speaker 3: we can keep this house because we've got extra cash
• 7:12
  Speaker 3: that we can put towards a down payment on a
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: new house, or you know, Okay, I'm good, we can
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: we can still go ahead and buy this new house
• 7:18
  Speaker 3: and afford both both houses, turn this into a second home,
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: turn it into an airbnb, rent it out, whatever. Right,
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: Wealthy people have choice. Middle class most people, and when
• 7:29
  Speaker 3: I'm talking about NOLF, I'm talking houses between three hundred
• 7:32
  Speaker 3: I would say two hundred to five hundred thousand dollars
• 7:35
  Speaker 3: home values. Okay, a lot of people don't have choice.
• 7:39
  Speaker 3: Why because if they want to go buy a new house,
• 7:42
  Speaker 3: they need to put down money, and they want to,
• 7:44
  Speaker 3: especially in a market like this where rates are higher,
• 7:46
  Speaker 3: they need to put more money down. Right. They can't
• 7:49
  Speaker 3: just do a five percent down loan because their mortgage
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: is gonna be really high pay especially in this market.
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: But regardless, most people, even when the rates are down,
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: most people take that money from an old house and
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: they put it towards the new house, and they might
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: pay out some debt. Right they say, hey, you know,
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: let's pay off the car, let's do this, let's take
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: use it for part of it for a vacation, and
• 8:06
  Speaker 3: then let's take the remaining balance and let's go buy
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: a new house. That's what most people do. What and
• 8:13
  Speaker 3: and and in order to do that, in order to
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: get all your equity out of your house that you
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: built up over the years. What's your only option? Sell
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: because you can't do a line of credit. You can't
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: do a home equity again, home make credit a second,
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: there's just there's these tool uh you know, uh home
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: equity investments hgis. You can't do any of those things.
• 8:33
  Speaker 3: You can't do any of that because no one's going
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: to give you one hundred percent of your equity out right.
• 8:39
  Speaker 3: So what are you left with? Two options? One? Sell?
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: Two keep the house and and turn it into a
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: rent hall. Okay, but you can't get your equity out.
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: So if you think about it, millions of people are
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: are literally have no choice other than the cell because
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: most people don't want to be a land or most
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: probam people don't want to read their property. But guess what,
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: everybody agrees on this house, whether they like it or not. Right,
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: this house will be worth more in most markets, in
• 9:12
  Speaker 3: most areas, this house will be worth more in the
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: future than it is today. But you only have one choice,
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: which is selling. This why Bonus was created because I
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: saw in twenty ten my father and this is the
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: story that it is really the why I saw my
• 9:30
  Speaker 3: father have to sell his house for five hundred thousand
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: dollars in twenty ten, and he had to sell it
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: just because he needed to move. He had he had
• 9:37
  Speaker 3: about one hundred thousand of equity in there. Well, he
• 9:40
  Speaker 3: couldn't do anything, you know, he can't get a mortgage
• 9:42
  Speaker 3: or anything like that. Right, he knew. And he's in
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: real estate. By the way, my father he's like, he's like, God,
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: this house is going to be worth double in a
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: death sooner. I know this, and it's pains me to
• 9:55
  Speaker 3: get rid of this home, but I had no choice.
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: I can't rent it out because I need one hundred
• 9:59
  Speaker 3: thousand to go buy down in the new house. Right,
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: so you're in this little rat race, right that house
• 10:05
  Speaker 3: today is worth one point two million. Okay, my father,
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: if he would have been able to do a program
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: like Bonus, he would have been able to have an
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: extra three to four hundred thousand dollars of new wealth
• 10:18
  Speaker 3: that he would have had beyond his one hundred thousand
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: dollars and for a seventy three year old man. Right,
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: And you know my dad loved my dad, but you know,
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: not in the bestest situations as far as financially goes right,
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: that is a lot of money. There's a lot of money.
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: So we created a product that in essence gives you
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: another choice other than selling your home. And we really
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: created a new category called basically it's called a home
• 10:45
  Speaker 3: appreciation partnership. It's a half hap. And really what this
• 10:49
  Speaker 3: category allows us to do is exactly that it allows
• 10:52
  Speaker 3: us to cash out all of your equity as if
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: you sold it, but you're not selling it. We then
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: turn your property into an investment property. It's an asset,
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: and it becomes a passive investment for you. So now
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: you get all your cash as if you sold it.
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: Not a debt, it's not alone. This is an investment.
• 11:12
  Speaker 3: There's no interest rate on it. So, right, you have
• 11:15
  Speaker 3: a five hundred thousand dollars house, you have a three
• 11:17
  Speaker 3: hundred thousand dollars mortgage. Mortgage, you have a low rate
• 11:21
  Speaker 3: of three percent. Because most of America right now is
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: sitting on this low four percent interest rate and gets
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: what they're doing when they're selling it. They're getting rid
• 11:28
  Speaker 3: of gold because that low rate, which will probably never
• 11:33
  Speaker 3: see again, that low rate is literally the best lever
• 11:38
  Speaker 3: that millions and millions of homeowners have today. I have
• 11:42
  Speaker 3: a two and a half percent interest rate in my house.
• 11:44
  Speaker 3: That is gold right, And you have millions of people
• 11:46
  Speaker 3: who have great rates on their house because of what
• 11:48
  Speaker 3: happened during twenty seventeen or eighteen in twenty twenty one
• 11:51
  Speaker 3: with all the rates going down as cloth as they did.
• 11:54
  Speaker 3: So you've got this really unique advantage here for people
• 11:57
  Speaker 3: who have a rate below four percent to be able
• 12:00
  Speaker 3: to now do this bonus, which I'll go back to.
• 12:03
  Speaker 3: It is five hundred thousand dollars house, three hundred thousand
• 12:06
  Speaker 3: dollars mortgage. You have two or thousand of equity. So
• 12:09
  Speaker 3: typically when you sell it, you're gonna get your two
• 12:11
  Speaker 3: hundred thousand minus your seller agent, buyer agent, transaction fees,
• 12:15
  Speaker 3: all that stuff. And then you got the pain of
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: this uncertainty of listening your home on the market, right
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: showings on the weekend. You know, a buyer backing out
• 12:27
  Speaker 3: all those things. You got so many on notes. We
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: come in say we'll cash you out. You'll get your
• 12:34
  Speaker 3: cash in two weeks, don't need to show your house,
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: give you the two hundred thousand dollars lesson fees. Because
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: we're not really an agent. You can bring an Asian.
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: Asian can can also have you've been represented, or you
• 12:45
  Speaker 3: come direct and we'll cash out your two one thousand dollars,
• 12:49
  Speaker 3: you move out, and we're super flexible on how you
• 12:52
  Speaker 3: move out. Timing. It's up to you. And we've had
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: people that have needed to bought a new house and
• 12:57
  Speaker 3: it's a new construction and they're not out for four months.
• 12:59
  Speaker 3: That's okay, Still do the deal and you're still in
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: the home. We're not gonna kick you out or like that.
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: These are for people who want to move. They're already
• 13:06
  Speaker 3: decided we need to move for whatever life brought to them.
• 13:09
  Speaker 3: Now you got your two of thousand in cash, you
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: move out. Bonus now in essence, we gave you to
• 13:15
  Speaker 3: two hundred thousand dollars. Bonus says I'm gonna I'm gonna
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: give you the two hundred thousand dollars. I'm gonna now
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: take and manage this property on your behalf. I don't know.
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: We are not on title. We take the property. This
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: isn't any type of you know, wonky creative financing like
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: a subject to or or or alternative like rap mortgage.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: This is none of that. This is truly and again
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: I I uh, there's a reason why I'm in DC.
• 13:44
  Speaker 3: I'm spending a lot of time with Congress. There's there's
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: there's really no holes in what I'm about to say.
• 13:50
  Speaker 3: And here's why you You are still on title. So Katie,
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: you still own the home, right you now moved on
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: with life. You now have it as an investment property,
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: and you still can qualify if you want to get
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: a new mortgage. You can still qualify. People say, well,
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: how do I do that because I have this other
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: home and I have this new hope. While in mortgage world,
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: you can do that all day long, as long as
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: either you can either qualify with your income or you
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: can offset this because it's gonna be a rental property,
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: so there's guidelines around that where we can offset it.
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: So total part so it's not going to disrupt your
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: ability to get a new home. So you're a good there.
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: You now moved on. We turn this property into a
• 14:29
  Speaker 3: rental property. You never pay another dime on this house again.
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: So the idea of you being a landlord is gone.
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: You now have a rental property, but you're not really
• 14:39
  Speaker 3: a landlord because Bonus is handling everything. We have all
• 14:42
  Speaker 3: payments on the house, We cover any issues with the tenants,
• 14:49
  Speaker 3: we pay any fixes, it's all on us. You move
• 14:52
  Speaker 3: out and the roof caves in five days later, that's
• 14:56
  Speaker 3: on us. Okay. Three years later, the h fact blows up. Okay,
• 15:01
  Speaker 3: you're not gonna get it all from Bonus and saying Katie,
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: we need eighteen hundred dollars to fixate. That's not going
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: to happen. Right, we cover everything. It's in our contract.
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: So there's no out of pocket for you. You've moved
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: on with your life, enjoyed it, and you've taken that
• 15:16
  Speaker 3: two hundred thousand dollars. Whether you bought a new house,
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: whether you've traveled the world, whether you're renting, whatever you
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: want to do. You do whatever you want. It's your
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: it's your money, right and Bonus is now managing this asset.
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: And then after five years up to thirty years, remember
• 15:30
  Speaker 3: this is a long term hole. Yeah, you have the choice.
• 15:33
  Speaker 3: You it's your home. You have the choice onone to
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: sell it. And at the time of the cell you're
• 15:39
  Speaker 3: going to get a third of all the future appreciation
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: from the time that we did the transaction today to
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: what it's worth when you sell it.
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: That makes sense, Yeah, yeah, interesting, it's kind of like,
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna simplistically say this, but it's like you've taken
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: this middle class well building concept. You've been able to
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: realize real estate is getting going up in value, but
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: yet you're putting it in the piggy bank for that
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: future day, aren't you.
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: That's exactly right. Well, and here's the thing. This isn't
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: taking money away from people today to say, hey, like
• 16:16
  Speaker 3: a four to one K or when you invest in IRA,
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: when you message something, it requires you to take money today,
• 16:23
  Speaker 3: put it into an account, and then wait for tomorrow. Yeah,
• 16:27
  Speaker 3: here's the difference here. I'm giving you all of your
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: money today. You're cashing out that five hundred thousands example,
• 16:34
  Speaker 3: you're cashing out all of your equity. There's that's it.
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: So I gave you everything up front, and you're not
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: putting new money in. What we're doing is we're not
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: restarting the clock on your home. In other words, you
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: now the house is now has a three hundred thousand
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: mortgage which we're going to pay down. Right then we
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: have that low rate. Why give that up? And it's
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: a partnership. And then now you've got this two hundred
• 16:58
  Speaker 3: thousand dollars that you have the equity own. Okay, so
• 17:01
  Speaker 3: this isn't like and in essence, if you look at it,
• 17:04
  Speaker 3: we created a bonus wealth investment home. Right, it's like
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: a program. In essence, we're almost this home is almost
• 17:11
  Speaker 3: like a four to one K account that's set up
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: for you, right because in essence, you now have this
• 17:18
  Speaker 3: asset that right now you've already cashed all your equity.
• 17:22
  Speaker 3: So your equity is at a zero today. I mean
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: if you do this this today, but that's going to grow, right,
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: And that house might be five hundred thousand dollars today,
• 17:33
  Speaker 3: but in seven, eight, nine, ten years, I bet your
• 17:36
  Speaker 3: bottom dollar that house is going to be six seven,
• 17:38
  Speaker 3: eight hundred thousand dollars. Yeah. Now your house is eight
• 17:41
  Speaker 3: hundred thousand in twenty thirty six, let's just say so
• 17:45
  Speaker 3: eight hundred thousand dollars home. Remember this whole entire time,
• 17:48
  Speaker 3: you haven't paid a single penny. Yeah, we've managed it.
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: And here's the cool part. If you're worried about well
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: you're going to manage and stuff. We just gave you
• 17:57
  Speaker 3: two hundred thousand dollars with no payments. Back in twenty
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: twenty five, we would be the dumbest people in the world.
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: If we gave money like that with no interest rate,
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: if we didn't want that money to come back and
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: we wouldn't want to make a good return of it. Yeah,
• 18:14
  Speaker 3: So we have a vested, aligned ish incentive to make
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: sure what happens. The property is taken good care of,
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: the mortgage is taken care of, and the home is
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: optimized for the highest possible value, so that when Katie
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: and Bonus later on, when you want to decide to
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: sell it Katie for the eight hundred thousand dollars, we
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: are truly like, yeah, this is probably a good time
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: to sell. Now that eight hundred thousand dollars you sell
• 18:39
  Speaker 3: it for, you're gonna get the difference between eight hundred
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: and the five hundred, so that's eight hundred thousand, and
• 18:45
  Speaker 3: you'll get a third of that. So you're gonna get
• 18:46
  Speaker 3: basically one hundred thousand dollars for doing absolutely nothing. And
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: it's very similar to a four one K in the
• 18:55
  Speaker 3: sense that you're not actively managing your four one k,
• 19:00
  Speaker 3: actively managing your era. Right, you might move some mutual
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: funds around.
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: Yep, they just kind of piggybank out there, don't they's.
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: Out there, right, I mean, like you have no control
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: on what happens to the S and P five hundred, right,
• 19:12
  Speaker 3: So in essence, you're just hoping and you're giving yourself
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: time right to allow that to grow in value. It's
• 19:20
  Speaker 3: the exact same thing with a home. But society has
• 19:24
  Speaker 3: never given the everyday folks who are not investors, yeah,
• 19:28
  Speaker 3: who are not property flippers. They haven't given them a
• 19:32
  Speaker 3: turnkey solution to allow them to maximize wealth on their home,
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: which I would argue is a way more predictable generator
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: of wealth than anything else. And here's the other kicker.
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: That home that you lived in and you just moved
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: down on it just earned you two hundred thousand dollars.
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: You saw the value go up. You already saw it,
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: you believed it. This isn't like you're in singing bitcoin
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: and you just help it as well. Like I saw
• 20:04
  Speaker 3: this house. It grows up, right, I saw, And I
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: think that Mesa, Arizona is a great community and it's
• 20:10
  Speaker 3: only going to do better over the next ten to fifteen,
• 20:12
  Speaker 3: only going to do especially a lot of these communities
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: out there, right, So that is what's so powerful. And
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: this was like the light bulb moment for me, which
• 20:20
  Speaker 3: was like, there literally is no home wealth manager out there.
• 20:28
  Speaker 2: We do a lot of talking about the extremely low
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: income and the extremely high income, but there's not a
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: lot of conversation. Obviously, there's not been a model in
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: the dynamic for this middle class or whatever the term
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: you want to say. So, you know, is it just
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: the traditional real estate industry just hasn't they've been like, oh,
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: you know, be happy with the two hundred equity that
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: you had and now move along. Or is it You're
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: just people who have just like been like, well, it
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: is what it is. I mean, for whatever reason, this
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: concept of generating wealth in the middle class that everybody's
• 21:06
  Speaker 2: been fine with it just being the take your equity
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: and go and hope you can make the transaction.
• 21:12
  Speaker 3: Right we we we we We actually just got awarded
• 21:16
  Speaker 3: a we were a winner for the Brookings Institute. So
• 21:19
  Speaker 3: the Brookings Institute is a big thing tank in DC
• 21:22
  Speaker 3: and they had they had a competition that was building
• 21:25
  Speaker 3: wealth in Black communities, Okay, and we're one of the
• 21:29
  Speaker 3: solutions because they're just like, you know it, And I
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: would I would argue that that everyone knows building wealth
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: is is a multi, multi tenant approach. I would say, right,
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: but not everybody can bit invests in the stock market.
• 21:48
  Speaker 3: There's no real key solutions to that. And when you
• 21:51
  Speaker 3: own a whole Look, we're not. I have a big,
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: big sympathy and I'd worked a lot with first time
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: home buyers. That's a different animal, right, getting getting into
• 22:00
  Speaker 3: a home ownership, which is huge. Okay, that's not we're not.
• 22:04
  Speaker 3: We're not going there yet, right, although we will in
• 22:07
  Speaker 3: our in our second phase of Bonus, which I'll talk
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: about in a moment. What we're really focused on is like,
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: once you've got that house, you're a you're an investor.
• 22:15
  Speaker 3: You're living in the home, but you're investing in an
• 22:17
  Speaker 3: appreciating asset. And all we're trying to do is just
• 22:19
  Speaker 3: to teach folks to hold onto appreciating assets. There's things
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: called good debt and bad debt. Bad debts a credit card.
• 22:28
  Speaker 3: A good debt is a three percent mortgage on your house. Yeah, yeah.
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: And so the concept of these these I would call
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: it principles Warren Buffett, the Frank Vogels of the world
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: right that have this long term approach on what do
• 22:42
  Speaker 3: they say, hold stocks forever, long term, hold, don't play
• 22:46
  Speaker 3: the market, don't sell, don't get emotional about it. Right,
• 22:50
  Speaker 3: If you just hold on to the stock, you will win,
• 22:53
  Speaker 3: you know, and or the market. Right. And then Buffett
• 22:56
  Speaker 3: had that competition during I think it was during the
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: recession time when he bet the big huge hedge funds
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: that said, I will invest in the S and P
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: Vanguard S and P five hundred a million dollars. You guys,
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: take a million dollars and do it all this stuff
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: that you want to do, and in five years we're
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: gonna come back. We're gonna see who won. Right, And
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: all you do is like you just bought the the
• 23:16
  Speaker 3: thean Guard S and P five thing. He held on
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: to it. Things started going and then guess what, he
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: ended up winning the competition, right. And I think that's
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: the principle here, which is a long term hold. And
• 23:27
  Speaker 3: as I mentioned Middle America, and when I say middle
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: class to me in this context it's defined as people
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: who own a home. Right, Okay, you own a home,
• 23:38
  Speaker 3: you do not? It is very very very difficult for you,
• 23:42
  Speaker 3: for all, for people who own a home today. A
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: lot of people own a home today. It is very
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: difficult to own multiple homes and to build wealth. A
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: lot you really need to kind of you know, ideally
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: own multiple homes. The trouble is down payments and this
• 24:00
  Speaker 3: and this, right, managing landlord all that, And that's the
• 24:03
  Speaker 3: reason why you only have ten percent of people that
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: you know of single family homes out there, ten or
• 24:07
  Speaker 3: fifteen percent are I would call them investors, right, landlords
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: and whatnot, because there's a lot of that, you know,
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: that's their business in essence that they do everyday. People
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: the other eighty five percent of people out there, we
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: all want to make money, we all want to build
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: well for our families. That two hundred thousand dollars is
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: literally going to get sucked into the next house. Right,
• 24:29
  Speaker 3: So you can say, yeah, now you're building local the
• 24:31
  Speaker 3: next house. Sure, but why can't you have your old house?
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: Like why not? Like why do you have to give
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: up one in order to do another? That's all we're
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: trying to say. It's like, like you don't have to
• 24:42
  Speaker 3: hear it, but who doesn't want more of that, of
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: that ability, of that asset that you've already had. And
• 24:50
  Speaker 3: to be honest with you, what is up happening is
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: is you play this out that homeowner takes the two
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: hundred buys the new house puts in, the new house sells,
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: that one buys, the new house sells one, and then
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: by the time they're fifty sixty years old, they have
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: one home and all along the way, if they would
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: only have kept those assets, how much more in wealth
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: would they have had? How much more capital and future
• 25:10
  Speaker 3: would they have had back into their communities? So you
• 25:15
  Speaker 3: can to going back to your question is it's a
• 25:17
  Speaker 3: great question, which is basically that, like you know, isn't
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: it enough that you got your equity out? And my
• 25:24
  Speaker 3: answer to that is no, and number one, number two,
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: why should selling your home be the only option?
• 25:34
  Speaker 4: Right?
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: Everything else? We have optionality everywhere you go down the
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: grocery aisle, you have nineteen cereals. Right, we have options everywhere.
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: And this might not be for everybody, but for people
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: who want to build wealth and who want to have
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: an ability to say an extra one hundred to two
• 25:51
  Speaker 3: to three hundred thousand dollars of wealth for my family,
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: so where my kids are twenty or eighteen and I
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: can pay for their college tuition, especially if that time
• 25:58
  Speaker 3: when college wish is an even more expensive than it
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: is now, or life emergencies that happen and I don't
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: have money. I can't tap into my four one K
• 26:07
  Speaker 3: without a penalty. I can't tap it without penalty. Like boy,
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: I wish I would have bonused my house back then
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: because I would have had probably another one hundred thousand
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: dollars looking at what the value is today. All we're
• 26:18
  Speaker 3: doing is we're giving people. You know, the emotion someone
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: asked me this question, which is very fascinating, is the
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: the what's the emotion you describe but the people that
• 26:26
  Speaker 3: you do it, it's relief because in essence, you're getting
• 26:31
  Speaker 3: something you never would have had before, and you're building
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: yourself security, which we all want for your future, right right.
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: And by the way, not everybody, not everyone's going to
• 26:42
  Speaker 3: have a four to one K, and not everyone's going
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: to always pensions and stuff like that. Right most people
• 26:46
  Speaker 3: right now, the average savings for somebody, if you look
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: at the statistics, it's startling. It's like three thousand dollars,
• 26:52
  Speaker 3: four thousand dollars. So a lot of these people that
• 26:55
  Speaker 3: we will bonus their home and whatnot. You know a
• 26:59
  Speaker 3: lot of people which just in general they don't have
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: a savings. This might be the only vehicle for them
• 27:03
  Speaker 3: with the wealth of the retirement right, and.
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: A lot of people who have bought a home, they
• 27:07
  Speaker 2: believe in the area, the neighborhood they were buying to
• 27:11
  Speaker 2: what they hopefully could afford at the time. So you know,
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: they for whatever reason, that community was appealing. And so
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: you know, they can tell, you know, to say, hey,
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: this neighborhood is up and coming, this neighborhood is stable,
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: This neighborhood has arrived, and the values are going to
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: just keep going up. And you know, maybe their life
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: has changed, jobs, size of house they need or whatever.
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: And so you know, it's interesting though, because a lot
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: of people are not thinking as that property as a
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: transactional investment. They are thinking of it as buy it,
• 27:49
  Speaker 2: move up, move out, move on, And so this really
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: changes like the transactional piece of this completely.
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: It doesn't. Yeah, I mean you do move up, you
• 28:01
  Speaker 3: do move out, and you do move on with bonus. Yeah.
• 28:03
  Speaker 3: The only difference is you don't leave the carners behind,
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: right right, You don't leave you know, you sold you
• 28:11
  Speaker 3: sold the stock too early. You only would have kept it,
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: right you had that You're like, oh my god, if
• 28:18
  Speaker 3: I if I would have only had not sold Nvidia
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: stocky right, right, this is that this is in essence
• 28:26
  Speaker 3: giving you the ability for something that you know is
• 28:28
  Speaker 3: going to be worth more in the future. Yeah, and
• 28:31
  Speaker 3: and and for those people, by the way, i'd say this,
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: for those people who would say, I just want to
• 28:36
  Speaker 3: be done with this house, yeah, I don't want to
• 28:38
  Speaker 3: have to do it. Well I'm still carrying the mortgage
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: or you know, well it's still in my name. I
• 28:43
  Speaker 3: hear you, and I get that. However, what I would
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: say is we take all risks. We indemnify the homeowner
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: from everything. Really again, it's a true partnership, so they
• 28:55
  Speaker 3: have no no, it can no risk associated to this
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: to them at all. Nothing. We take all the burden
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: on right. And I would say, okay, we took those away,
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: and you've got that low rate, okay, and and and
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: yeah you are moving on. But if you realize it,
• 29:14
  Speaker 3: I mean, we've got homes right now with homeowners that
• 29:16
  Speaker 3: we've done for a couple of years. It's been out
• 29:20
  Speaker 3: of sight, out of mind, right, So like so I
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: think you know, it's it's get to know what we
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: do before you make a you know, a judgment on
• 29:29
  Speaker 3: or what someone like that doesn't happ right, We we
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: we we you know, we're the ones who have launched
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: this category, but there will be others and get to
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: know what they what what they truly will do before
• 29:40
  Speaker 3: you just come into the conclusions of like I can't
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: do it, you know, I just I want to get
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: rid of it because what's going to happen later on
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: is that house is going to double and you would
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: have missed out on basically free money just because And
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: here's the thing people, and we get this a lot
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: people say, what's the catch? This is too good to
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: be true. It really is like we're like, okay, cash
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: out everything I don't have. I don't have to have
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: people coming through my house. I get the cash in
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: two weeks. You now manage it completely, and then I
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: just get some paycheck later on later on down the road.
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: What's the catch? And what we tell people is we're
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: very selective on the homes that we make an offer on.
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: Very selective in the sense that it has to be
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: in a good neighborhood in a good city that we believe,
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: over the long run, is going to appreciate in value. Okay,
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: let me give you some examples, and there's a lot
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: of them, by the way, especially post COVID where you've
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: had this just movement towards the stub belts and whatnot.
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: We love Phoenix, we love Tucson, we love Birmingham, Alabama.
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: It is a great market. Memphis, Tennessee, huge market. Elon's company.
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: He's got his massive data center over there. I think
• 30:50
  Speaker 3: they're building another one over there with XAI and other
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: jobs are coming. Memphis is a big one. Nashville, Columbus, Ohio, wonderful, Mark,
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: Cincinnati's going great, Cleveland awesome, Charlotte, Raleigh, Durham, Greensboro, and
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: you know Colorado, Springs, Dallas, Houston, Houston's you know, got
• 31:14
  Speaker 3: a lot of I mean, wow, a lot of states
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: have insurance issues right now. You know Houston with hurricanes, yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: But great markets, Salt Lake, Provo, Okay, right, these are great,
• 31:28
  Speaker 3: great Minneapolis, and there's more. Right, We're not in every
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: market right now. We're about about you know, six to
• 31:33
  Speaker 3: eight markets, but these are great markets where people jobs
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: are being created over I think tons of manufacturing. You're
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: getting a ton of now investments coming in foreign and domestic, okay, right,
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: And and so it's just it's gonna get great. It's
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: just gonna be amazing over the next ten to fifteen years,
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: twenty years. As you do this as you as you
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: as you kind of you know, see what's going on
• 31:57
  Speaker 3: with the map, Right, I live in California. I'm moving
• 32:00
  Speaker 3: from California. We're not in California. We're obviously home Presce
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: is there, but yeah, you know, I'm actually going to
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: Arizona as well. So good quality home in a good area, right,
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: we want we want homes that are taken care of.
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: We don't want to renovate a home. We want a
• 32:17
  Speaker 3: home in a good area, good taking care. And I
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: tell people common sense, would you want is if you
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: were a tenant and you had a family, would you
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: want to live in your house and rent that for
• 32:27
  Speaker 3: twelve months? That's our barometer. And if we say yes
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: and we can get that, that's what we're looking for
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: as well. And then the other thing is is that
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: you were in the right place at the right time.
• 32:36
  Speaker 3: You got that low rate during that time, and you
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: got this goal that you're sitting on. Why not take
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: advantage of it like you're going to benefit from it.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: And I think when people start hearing that, they realize
• 32:48
  Speaker 3: that this isn't like a scam or anything like that.
• 32:50
  Speaker 3: This is like it's actually backed by data. It's like
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: a good home, good area that can rent well, has
• 32:56
  Speaker 3: long term and we built a lot of technology that
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: we can what's long term home pre appreciation look like
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: what happens with you know, macro microeconomic conditions. And the
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: last thing is you got this mortgage. And and for
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: those people who realize the value of that low cost
• 33:12
  Speaker 3: of capital, now you can have your cake and eat
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: it too.
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: I see what you guys are doing is kind of
• 33:20
  Speaker 2: part of that continuum of alternate housing finance.
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: Uh.
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: You know, we've had people on the podcasts who have
• 33:27
  Speaker 2: been in land banks, land trust. You know, we've had
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: some we've had some pad split types of concepts as well,
• 33:37
  Speaker 2: shared equity, a lot of different models. But you guys
• 33:41
  Speaker 2: are in that continuum. But you're a completely different model,
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: if you will, and a completely different target audience.
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: It really, it really is. And it's it's like, you know,
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: love pad split, love some of these things we're saying, hey,
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: let's take your house, or let's do some ad us,
• 33:57
  Speaker 3: or let's rent the room, let's optimize those things right
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: for us. And again, this has just been something that's
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: been tried and true for I mean, there's been something
• 34:05
  Speaker 3: just the principal mind for the longest period of time
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: is you really only have one choice when you want
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: to move, and it's to self because most people are
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: going aren't gonna rent. That was very very few people
• 34:13
  Speaker 3: and the only way to get your equity out of that.
• 34:15
  Speaker 3: And so you know, being in mortgage for such a
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: long time, every cash out refinance rate and term refinance
• 34:21
  Speaker 3: heelock second mortgage that I've ever done, and seeing you know,
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: your LTVs are seventy seventy five, eighty maybe eighty five,
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: and then now you've got this line of credit that's
• 34:32
  Speaker 3: tied to prime and then now it's tied to cost
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: the funds and just tied to all these indices that
• 34:37
  Speaker 3: are wobbly, right, so it's invariable. So but you still
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: have equity in the house. And it's funny. I always
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: I always was like, you know, I helped create like
• 34:47
  Speaker 3: loan products as well, and I was like, God, I
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: would love to just create this like one hundred percent
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: cashow all your equity and move out this. I was
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: talking about this like a decade ago. Well with this,
• 34:58
  Speaker 3: with the maturation of of shared equity. Right, this this
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: concept of being able to instead of paying a payment,
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: sharing the future upside together. That that started coming out,
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: which has been which has been an awesome, awesome vehicle.
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: You know, we've taken pieces from that. And by the way,
• 35:19
  Speaker 3: I don't if you know this, but I think it's
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: the cal haffa quick exactly on this. But California, whatever
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: you think of California, for California, they actually came up
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: with a model. And I'm gonna I'm gonna butcher this
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: the stats of this or the actual specifics, but they
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: give people to who buy a home I think up
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: to one hundred thousand dollars. Again, don't quote me. I
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: can't remember what it was. And then again there's a
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: criteria around this. And then what what the California government
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: said is we're gonna record a second lean on your property.
• 35:49
  Speaker 3: You're gonna go get a first mortgage and we're gonna record, right,
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: we recorded a second lea. But California said something which
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: is really fascinating, and this is and and and and
• 35:58
  Speaker 3: I think they get it. It's like, when you sell
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: this property, you don't the payback is we're gonna get
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: the money back but you're gonna give us a percentage
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: of the upside. So until you sell this, right, and
• 36:10
  Speaker 3: it could be twenty years from now, and I don't
• 36:11
  Speaker 3: know the details exactly, but until you sell it, you
• 36:15
  Speaker 3: don't have to pay anything on this. And then the
• 36:17
  Speaker 3: state of California, because they gave you that one hundred
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: thousand or whatever the dollar amount is, Yeah, is now
• 36:24
  Speaker 3: basically working with you and benefiting from the future upside
• 36:29
  Speaker 3: of this property and for California. And if you think
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: about it, it's beneficial for them because they're investing in
• 36:35
  Speaker 3: their own community. Yeah, it is a powerful This concept
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: of sharing in the upside is a powerful, powerful tool.
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: Whereas what we've lived in is we've lived in the
• 36:48
  Speaker 3: debt world for a very long time. If you think
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: about my world, you're the past thirty years of going
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: and getting money, Okay, tapping your equity has been all
• 37:00
  Speaker 3: about debt, right, Katie, you want to you want to
• 37:03
  Speaker 3: go up to fifteen thousand dollars to go you know,
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: thirty thousand dollars to get build your pool. Love that
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: for you? I love it. Oh, oh well, we need
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: to pay four hundred dollars a month at an interest blah,
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: blah blah blah blah. But you can get your money
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: and do whatever you want with it. It's her money.
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: Why am I paying more debt on it? Like? It's
• 37:21
  Speaker 3: just it's never it never yea for me that you
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: are penalizing me to pull out the money out of
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: my house in order for me to spend it the
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: way I should be spending it makes no sense, makes
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: absolutely no sense. And I don't want to go on
• 37:35
  Speaker 3: a tangent on cash out refis and whatnot. But what
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: we're trying to be able to do is to say
• 37:40
  Speaker 3: the world is evolving and a program like a hat
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: allows you to really partner. That's why it's called the
• 37:48
  Speaker 3: Home Appreciation Partnership. The alignment is unbelievable because we're giving
• 37:55
  Speaker 3: all the money up front and in order for us
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: to do anything and make money, we got a way
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: m right.
• 38:03
  Speaker 2: And it's interesting because you've got an alignment here of
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: the markets that you know, several of the cities have
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: been slowly increasing and several of them are new to
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: the table. In the cities you were talking about, so
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: you know you've you're seeing a really robust market. We
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: see a lot of times on the rents that have
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: been going up. We've been tracking rents for a long time.
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: You're seeing it on the home ownership sign. But I'm
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: fascinated because of the new cities to those markets and
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: and they're really good cities. So they are going to
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: get they are going to get stronger, and all the
• 38:42
  Speaker 2: economic data is pointing to that.
• 38:44
  Speaker 3: Well, and here's and here's the cool here here's the
• 38:46
  Speaker 3: interesting part. Okay, we built them all. So if you remember,
• 38:49
  Speaker 3: like the companies like you know, the ie buyers and
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: so forth, right, again, they serve the purpose, right, is
• 38:53
  Speaker 3: this convenience certainty, get out of your house quick and
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: move with life. Right, they've discount your house quite heavily.
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: But for the people who wanted to move, hey, go
• 39:03
  Speaker 3: and got open door, you got whatever, and take the
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: thing and kind of move on. Right, But if you
• 39:09
  Speaker 3: think about the model, and I mean if you look
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: at the like an open Door stock price or an
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: offer Pad stock price, if they're down ninety nine percent
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: because their model was so dependent upon they had to
• 39:18
  Speaker 3: flip these houses at bot Right, if you think about
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: what we've done, and again, those are good, great, good businesses,
• 39:26
  Speaker 3: good models. They suit a specific audience. But if you
• 39:29
  Speaker 3: think about what we've done. We want to hold these
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: assets for as long as possible. So the ups and downs. Yeah,
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: if Birmingham, Alabama has a crash, right and it goes
• 39:42
  Speaker 3: down twelve percent, thirteen percent, I mean, which is pretty big.
• 39:46
  Speaker 3: By the way, let's just say over the next year, Okay,
• 39:50
  Speaker 3: we aren't like, oh my gosh, we got to get
• 39:52
  Speaker 3: rid of this or whatever. Homelolder's not like, hey, what
• 39:54
  Speaker 3: do I do? And by the way, Homeolder now is
• 39:57
  Speaker 3: we're now negative. All of us are negative because the
• 39:59
  Speaker 3: houses work than what we bonus it for. What do
• 40:02
  Speaker 3: we do? What we do? We keep doing what we're doing.
• 40:05
  Speaker 3: We rent it out right because because rental market is
• 40:10
  Speaker 3: always there, and we actually have a huge rental shortage,
• 40:13
  Speaker 3: which not a lot of people talk about. We are.
• 40:16
  Speaker 3: The latest is that there is like one point two
• 40:17
  Speaker 3: million units short on the rental side, and that's a
• 40:21
  Speaker 3: huge market. And I would argue that's actually a very
• 40:23
  Speaker 3: important market because in order to be a buyer, you
• 40:26
  Speaker 3: need a renter. And if you can't find rentals, what
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: do you do? You go live with your parents, you
• 40:31
  Speaker 3: go live with So the rental market is going to
• 40:35
  Speaker 3: be there. We if that house is down thirteen percent
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: in Birmingham, Alabama. We got thirty years. Do you think
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: it's going to come back in thirty years one thousand percent? Yes, yep. Right,
• 40:51
  Speaker 3: So we are not pressured with a hap in our category.
• 40:56
  Speaker 3: Do you have to unload or sell or do anything
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: of these properties anytime. So that's the reason why we
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: tell the homeowners, we say you can't sell for five years.
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: Let's got we've got to build up the equity again,
• 41:05
  Speaker 3: right right. What we anticipate in what we will see
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: although a lot of our houses today actually have built
• 41:11
  Speaker 3: equity surprisingly in just two years. But what we're what
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: we will see is and I think we're looking at
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: this from a trends perspective, but my gut is most
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: people will most likely if seven to ten years will
• 41:25
  Speaker 3: be the timeframe where you're going to optimize on this
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: where you can probably get between seven to one hundred
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: thousand dollars of new money. Yeah, and that's getting a
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: really great time where then now you can go sell
• 41:35
  Speaker 3: that house in Birmingham and now you're up eighty ninety
• 41:37
  Speaker 3: thousand dollars because remember also even if the market's down,
• 41:40
  Speaker 3: you're not paying for anything. It's not affecting your debt obligations.
• 41:44
  Speaker 3: Nothing in your life is changing.
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: I believe in Birmingham it's an amazing sety act.
• 41:51
  Speaker 3: It is. It is what they're doing some awesome.
• 41:54
  Speaker 2: Downtown is looking beautiful. They're building beautiful apartments. One question
• 42:01
  Speaker 2: I was thinking of when you were talking about this
• 42:04
  Speaker 2: was are there missing pieces to policy? I mean, you're
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: in all these states, and you know, are there pieces
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: that that are missing that could better position what's happening
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: or is this just truly the market does what the
• 42:25
  Speaker 2: market does.
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, great question, great question. So let me talk on
• 42:29
  Speaker 3: the state side. Okay, so from a state standpoint, which
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: is something and also one of the reasons why you know,
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: I'm in d I live in d C as well.
• 42:38
  Speaker 3: Now national side, but also state side, there's definitely a
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: lot of when you created your financial category, there's a
• 42:47
  Speaker 3: lot of education awareness that you've got to create or
• 42:50
  Speaker 3: people would just go ahead and be like, I've never
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: heard of it. I think it's you know, I think
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: it's a scam, or I think it's a subteck two
• 42:58
  Speaker 3: or are you a are you a are you a heelock?
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: What are you right?
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: The classic we don't understand innovators syndrome.
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: That is not me, right, I mean again, and I
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: always go back to the Airbnb and I go like,
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: I was actually one of those people with the Airbnb.
• 43:11
  Speaker 3: I'm like, you're going to stay in a stranger's house
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: to sleep on their bed and they might have clean
• 43:16
  Speaker 3: sheets maybe, but right, and you would pay them to
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: do this, and and and then I'm going to take
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: off their trash when I leave and put it on
• 43:25
  Speaker 3: the front.
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: I would have missed it on the Uber. I would
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: have missed it on that one too, Like get in
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: a stranger's car?
• 43:33
  Speaker 3: What that's right? And then and then if you think
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: about with the Uber, it was like, I'll never have
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: my kids go in an Uber by myself. Right now,
• 43:42
  Speaker 3: you're like, hey, Susie, Bobby Ubers here enjoying have fun
• 43:47
  Speaker 3: in school, right because you know, you see everything about
• 43:50
  Speaker 3: the Driverer. You got all the so it is fascinating.
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: And look, we're in the early days and we're going
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: to experience that. That's one of our our our headwinds
• 43:58
  Speaker 3: that we will experience and we are experiencing because people
• 44:01
  Speaker 3: are one. It's a really really well structured product, well
• 44:04
  Speaker 3: thought out. We spent a ton of capital, a ton
• 44:06
  Speaker 3: of money and time to build this. But number one,
• 44:09
  Speaker 3: you know I always concourage you to poke holes, and
• 44:11
  Speaker 3: and people try to and and and really, you know,
• 44:14
  Speaker 3: we we think we've done a really good job. Can
• 44:16
  Speaker 3: we get better and better? Of course we can. But
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: the biggest thing is is that again it's like, you know, uh,
• 44:23
  Speaker 3: this sounds amazing. So if it sounds too amazing, it
• 44:25
  Speaker 3: must be too good to be true, right, And we're
• 44:27
  Speaker 3: just like, no, let us tell you why it's not.
• 44:28
  Speaker 3: So that's that's something that is going to be an
• 44:31
  Speaker 3: awareness campaign as we start kind of going right, as
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: we get going. But being back to your question about
• 44:37
  Speaker 3: a policy, state level policy specifically in Marcus, like Florida
• 44:43
  Speaker 3: and Texas, South Carolina, even parts of and Birmingham and
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: a few other markets as well. When you take a
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: property a primary residence and you turn it into an
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: investment property, your tax exemptions go up right, well go away.
• 44:58
  Speaker 3: So what happens is in Texas or it's just basically
• 45:02
  Speaker 3: let's say Florida, because Texas has a homestead. But let's
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: say Florida. You have a property in Florida, let's go
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: call it Tampa, and the house of four hundred thousand dollars.
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: Today you pay more property taxes, let's say three thousand
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: dollars a year, okay, and when you turn that into
• 45:17
  Speaker 3: a rental property, that property taxes is probably going to
• 45:20
  Speaker 3: go to six. And what makes that difficult is it
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: makes it hard to pencil from a casual perspective because
• 45:26
  Speaker 3: now your your taxes just doubled, right, So those are
• 45:30
  Speaker 3: some So those are now states. I mean, although I
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: know right now obviously the governor is trying to abolish
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: property taxes. But states that have these these these taxation
• 45:39
  Speaker 3: for VESC they did it in the right mindset to
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: to kind of push away the wrong people, right, like
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: corporations and stuff like that, you know. But but this
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: is something different because you know Katie who lives in Birmingham.
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: They are giving up Katie's property in Birmingham. She's going
• 46:00
  Speaker 3: to be moving to the other side of Bingham. Katie
• 46:02
  Speaker 3: is still going to own it and her neighbors around
• 46:05
  Speaker 3: Katie although that Katie still own it, yeah, and she's
• 46:09
  Speaker 3: still part of the community and the fabric of the
• 46:11
  Speaker 3: community and it's still her home. Okay, big difference then.
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah, somebody now coming in, right.
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: Or corporation coming in and then and then you lose that.
• 46:23
  Speaker 3: And that's also another big, huge piece of this too.
• 46:25
  Speaker 3: We're actually the anti corporation by being in rental properties.
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: We don't own the properties. Remember, we don't we don't
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: go on we do not take title. Homeowner still stays
• 46:36
  Speaker 3: on title, which is a huge piece of this, which
• 46:39
  Speaker 3: is also a big part of local. We're a very
• 46:42
  Speaker 3: local product and it's a big part of our push
• 46:45
  Speaker 3: with creating a local community, creating wealth for that community.
• 46:48
  Speaker 3: Most people who sell their home or move usually stay
• 46:52
  Speaker 3: within their area, right, I mean, obviously some people lead
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: to the state whatnot, but they're still there. So that
• 47:00
  Speaker 3: is a policy I would say from a standpoint specifically
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: like property taxes that we would address. Other than that,
• 47:07
  Speaker 3: on the on the federal side, there's a lot of
• 47:09
  Speaker 3: different angles, which we'll go into too much detail now,
• 47:13
  Speaker 3: but there's a lot of angles on the federal side,
• 47:16
  Speaker 3: especially with I mean, look, regardless of put politics to
• 47:22
  Speaker 3: the side, both sides of the aisle are trying to
• 47:25
  Speaker 3: make the middle class build wealth. And even just Secretary
• 47:29
  Speaker 3: best And just said a couple of weeks ago, he's like,
• 47:31
  Speaker 3: you know, we're trying to make bring wealth back to
• 47:34
  Speaker 3: main Street, not just Wall Street, right, because Wall Street
• 47:37
  Speaker 3: ticked up massively, Wall streets for the wealthy, if you
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: think about it. And and that's the mentality that's been
• 47:42
  Speaker 3: it's been for a lot of the people because a
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: lot of people can't invest in the stock market.
• 47:47
  Speaker 2: And they can't invest, won't invest. I mean, it's a
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: very complicated past.
• 47:54
  Speaker 3: Complicated and so when you're looking at not only just
• 47:58
  Speaker 3: this administration, but I would argue even the previous administration,
• 48:01
  Speaker 3: and just except both sides of the aisle. Both sides
• 48:03
  Speaker 3: of the aisle want to figure out ways because they
• 48:07
  Speaker 3: all see the destination of the middle class. Yeah they
• 48:11
  Speaker 3: have we and you can't deny it, and so so
• 48:14
  Speaker 3: and the other thing is too from a from a
• 48:16
  Speaker 3: just a macro perspective, the middle class, they don't have
• 48:20
  Speaker 3: a lot of options to build wealth in the in
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: the new world order, right, And they in essence, they
• 48:29
  Speaker 3: are stuck a lot of people with these low interest rates.
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: They're not moving, right, People aren't moving around.
• 48:36
  Speaker 2: Nobody wants to give that up.
• 48:38
  Speaker 3: They'll wants to give it up, and and and and
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: we've actually seen people that we've talked to that weren't
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: even thinking about getting rid of their home. They wanted to,
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: but they didn't think about it because they're just waiting
• 48:50
  Speaker 3: for race to come down. Because we live in this
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: very Drachronian view, which is I'm going to give up
• 48:55
  Speaker 3: my three percent. I'm going to go ideally to a
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: five percent, but right now seven percent. So I'm gonna
• 49:00
  Speaker 3: wait till it comes to the time. But I'm going
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: to wait, and I'm not going to enjoy my life.
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to move forward. I'm not going to
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: experience right because one thing we can't buy is time.
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: And you know I've got carpe DM tattooed on my
• 49:14
  Speaker 3: arm right here, be present. I try to live by
• 49:17
  Speaker 3: this every day. I do a really bad job because
• 49:19
  Speaker 3: I always think about the future too much. But at
• 49:21
  Speaker 3: the end of the day, this is a home right,
• 49:25
  Speaker 3: and Bonus is trying to give you the flexibility without
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: giving you the We don't want to make it punitive.
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: You shouldn't be punished by getting rid of this beautiful
• 49:33
  Speaker 3: asset that's gonna be worth more in the future just
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: because you need to move. And again, everything in society
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: right now, in one way or another, makes it financially
• 49:40
  Speaker 3: punitive for you just because you want to go live life,
• 49:42
  Speaker 3: and we're just like, you don't have to do that anymore.
• 49:45
  Speaker 3: Go enjoy yourself. And because I know a lot of
• 49:48
  Speaker 3: people who are locked in and they're like, could I move? Yeah?
• 49:52
  Speaker 3: I think I could. I would want to move. I
• 49:54
  Speaker 3: think you know, we've been here for ten years, want
• 49:56
  Speaker 3: to move to another spot. And they're not doing it.
• 49:58
  Speaker 3: And then all of a sudden, the year pass, two
• 50:01
  Speaker 3: years passes. Think about all these people who thought race
• 50:03
  Speaker 3: are gonna come down to the fives by now, right,
• 50:06
  Speaker 3: they've just been waiting, right, and they're just waiting and waiting.
• 50:09
  Speaker 3: They're just waiting their life that they just missed out
• 50:13
  Speaker 3: on it.
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: And it's impacting the market too because of all of
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: the supply and demand piece, because you have like a
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: whole bunch of people at this lower interest rate. I mean,
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: so you also see the market sort of like wondering
• 50:26
  Speaker 2: what's going to happen too, because people are waiting. That's
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: exactly what That's an interesting dynamic.
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you're seeing dynamic, right. And although we can't solve
• 50:35
  Speaker 3: the buying the new home interest rate for the what
• 50:38
  Speaker 3: we do solve for if you think about it is
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: your dollar costs averaging. When you bonus your home and
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: you're buying the new home. Think about it. We did
• 50:48
  Speaker 3: a house, you have a two point seventy five interest rate,
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: and I think we just we just we just we
• 50:51
  Speaker 3: close on a house that she had two point seventy
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: five conventional I think it was a FAJA two point
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: seven five inchestrate she locked in with the house. I
• 51:00
  Speaker 3: think it was at six in a quarter, and she
• 51:02
  Speaker 3: was basically literally told me this. She's like, Wow, you know,
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: I'm not a I'm not a numbers person, but I
• 51:09
  Speaker 3: basically if you take my two and a quarter that
• 51:13
  Speaker 3: I have on this mortgage balance that it's like two
• 51:14
  Speaker 3: hundred thousand on this house, and then she's got this
• 51:17
  Speaker 3: I think three hundred and fifty thousand doors mortgage on
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: this new house at six quarter. She's like, isn't that
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: about like an average of like a five percent and
• 51:23
  Speaker 3: I'm paying cumulatively. I'm like, bingo, right, we gotta we gotta,
• 51:31
  Speaker 3: we gotta teach ways of looking at wealth as a
• 51:35
  Speaker 3: holistic view. That's why net worth. When you think about
• 51:38
  Speaker 3: net worth, net worth is your entire picture of you,
• 51:41
  Speaker 3: of your portfolio. It's not just this one house. When
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: you throw a bonus into that net worth conversation, now
• 51:48
  Speaker 3: you get into the semantics low cost of capital, appreciating
• 51:51
  Speaker 3: asset bonus right here, other asset, other asset, and you
• 51:56
  Speaker 3: mix them all together. You got a pretty interesting portfolio.
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: Is if you've got the four one k, if you've
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: got these other things as well too. So you've got
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: to look at this holistically to be able to do that.
• 52:08
  Speaker 2: And you've given the middle class the ability to be
• 52:11
  Speaker 2: their CEO of their own real estate investment portfolio.
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: That's exactly, and that's wealth.
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: Exactly, I mean, and they haven't really been able to
• 52:21
  Speaker 2: have that as one of their own wealth building. And
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: when you know, it took me a minute to figure
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: out wealth building when it comes to generational wealth. I
• 52:31
  Speaker 2: come from an incredibly poor background, so it took me
• 52:36
  Speaker 2: a minute to get this concept. But then when you
• 52:38
  Speaker 2: see it, you go, oh, that's how generational wealth has
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: been created. Because they had the house, they paid off
• 52:46
  Speaker 2: the house, they either bought another house, or they passed
• 52:50
  Speaker 2: the house, passed it on to their kids. And you're like,
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: I get it. Now, you've been able to capture wealth
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: through real estate. Eat that's right as opposed to you know,
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: waiting for the random stock or whatever it was, right,
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: And so you're talking about a product with a group
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: of people to create a generational wealth that hasn't been
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: attainable except for doing what you said earlier. You know,
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: you sell, you sell.
• 53:19
  Speaker 3: You play the game. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's funny right here.
• 53:23
  Speaker 3: I tell people that, well, what do you what do you?
• 53:24
  Speaker 3: What do you do? Like, we're in the we're building
• 53:27
  Speaker 3: wealth for the middle class, and we just happen to
• 53:29
  Speaker 3: be in the real estate arena, right right. You could
• 53:33
  Speaker 3: have substitute real state arena for any other thing. Because
• 53:35
  Speaker 3: our core purpose, right and our fundamental reason for our
• 53:41
  Speaker 3: why is exactly what you just said, and it is
• 53:44
  Speaker 3: to build that long term generational wealth. We just created
• 53:48
  Speaker 3: a very turnkey solution that you don't have to think
• 53:50
  Speaker 3: about at all to be able to do it. And
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: it just so happens to be on your home right.
• 53:55
  Speaker 3: And that's where you know, sometimes we talk to agents
• 53:59
  Speaker 3: that are like, okay, yeah, we get you get into
• 54:01
  Speaker 3: the into the brass tacks of like the mechanics of
• 54:04
  Speaker 3: how it works, which is great, but you know, sometimes
• 54:08
  Speaker 3: we just got to level ourselves up a little bit
• 54:10
  Speaker 3: and think of it as a holistic view, which is, Okay,
• 54:15
  Speaker 3: I get this this financing why Well, the why is
• 54:19
  Speaker 3: because your client, as an agent, guess what, They're gonna
• 54:22
  Speaker 3: be wealthier in the future. And if they have more wealth,
• 54:24
  Speaker 3: what does that mean for you?
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 54:26
  Speaker 3: Right? The possibility that they can either buy a new house,
• 54:28
  Speaker 3: possibility that they can do it when you rising tide
• 54:32
  Speaker 3: lifts all boats.
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: You've heard, well, but do you also start giving people
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: the ability to invest in their own ideas, companies whatever,
• 54:40
  Speaker 2: I mean you know, exactly right, busines, when you've generated
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: this wealth.
• 54:44
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's exactly right. This isn't just about my father's
• 54:48
  Speaker 3: an entrepreneur. I go back to him again. He unfortunately
• 54:51
  Speaker 3: got crush during in two thousand and eight. And my
• 54:53
  Speaker 3: dad has always been an entrepreneur, right, he worked for himself,
• 54:58
  Speaker 3: selling his home and all that, and I'm not you know,
• 55:02
  Speaker 3: he sold this home way all those reasons of what
• 55:05
  Speaker 3: happened is like he didn't get another chance to go
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: and become entrepreneurial again because he's chasing the paper. Yep, yeah,
• 55:11
  Speaker 3: he's chasing the paper. He doesn't have time to be
• 55:13
  Speaker 3: able to do it. I guarantee you my father's emotion,
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: his energy, his mindset, and his creativity would have been
• 55:26
  Speaker 3: just better knowing he had this extra couple hundred thousand
• 55:29
  Speaker 3: as an example, think of how many people. And this
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: is where you go to the emotional tug. That's why
• 55:33
  Speaker 3: I said in the beginning of security that we provide
• 55:35
  Speaker 3: when you have a little bit of security, when you
• 55:37
  Speaker 3: know you've got something there that's going to be bruin
• 55:40
  Speaker 3: and it's going to be accumulating when you live your
• 55:43
  Speaker 3: day to day and you think about it, doesn't that
• 55:46
  Speaker 3: give you a sense of let me be proactive. Yeah yeah,
• 55:53
  Speaker 3: let me let me whether whether it's creating a new business,
• 55:56
  Speaker 3: starting an online you know what you call it shopify store,
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: whether it's not even making money, but just having time
• 56:04
  Speaker 3: to learn how to do whatever you want to do.
• 56:07
  Speaker 3: Security allows you for that, right and and a lot
• 56:12
  Speaker 3: of people can't because they don't have it, because they're
• 56:14
  Speaker 3: in the rat race. Yeah. Yeah, And again this is
• 56:17
  Speaker 3: where I bring up to my dad. My dad, if
• 56:19
  Speaker 3: he had the money, even though he's seventy three or
• 56:21
  Speaker 3: he was ninety three, if he had the ability where
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: he didn't have to be in the rat race right now,
• 56:25
  Speaker 3: he I guarantee you he would have started a business.
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: And he could have started a business. There's no there's
• 56:30
  Speaker 3: no age. And I'm not saying everyone's to start a business.
• 56:34
  Speaker 3: I'm just trying to say that, like, the possibilities for
• 56:39
  Speaker 3: your future are endless, and that's all we're trying to do.
• 56:43
  Speaker 3: And yet some people and we see this right now,
• 56:45
  Speaker 3: and I understand you know that again, you know we're
• 56:49
  Speaker 3: new and whatnot, but we also have sometimes we got
• 56:51
  Speaker 3: some agents out there, just to be candid, we got
• 56:54
  Speaker 3: some real estate agents who want to feel like, no, no,
• 56:58
  Speaker 3: they just want to sell. We're just now you you mean,
• 57:02
  Speaker 3: like you're costing them money by now you know the
• 57:05
  Speaker 3: list this right, And sometimes some of the homeowners we've
• 57:07
  Speaker 3: had some homeowners, most home owners are just like this
• 57:10
  Speaker 3: is and if I could do this, please, please please.
• 57:13
  Speaker 3: But you got some people out there sometimes you know,
• 57:15
  Speaker 3: the fear of the unknown, right. So again I heard
• 57:21
  Speaker 3: this analogy actually by my better half or you know,
• 57:24
  Speaker 3: everyone is a tree. You know, have you heard of
• 57:27
  Speaker 3: that before? Trees are you look at every tree. There's different, right.
• 57:31
  Speaker 3: Some trees reach to the sun, right, because that's how
• 57:34
  Speaker 3: they grow. Some trees shy away from the sun because
• 57:36
  Speaker 3: they don't need the sun. Some need more water, some
• 57:39
  Speaker 3: have stemp whatever, everyone's a tree. Everyone's a little different.
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: So this isn't going to be a solution for everybody.
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: But if you want to build a better life for
• 57:47
  Speaker 3: your future, and you want to build wealth, and you want.
• 57:51
  Speaker 4: To build security for your future or for your offspring
• 57:55
  Speaker 4: if you're older, your kids can't at the house, you
• 57:58
  Speaker 4: want to be able to build this future with some
• 58:00
  Speaker 4: security on an asset that you know has already made
• 58:04
  Speaker 4: you money.
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: Right right? It is it like we're saying, right going
• 58:10
  Speaker 2: into a different market, a different city with an exactly
• 58:14
  Speaker 2: you know.
• 58:14
  Speaker 3: We were saying, going to the new UAE, you know
• 58:16
  Speaker 3: stock market, d you buy send. We're saying, this is a
• 58:21
  Speaker 3: home that you walked the floors off right, you bought
• 58:24
  Speaker 3: it for three hundred, you sold it or you met it's.
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: It's five hundred. You know it could be worth eight
• 58:30
  Speaker 2: hundred if you can hold on, Yeah, and you know
• 58:33
  Speaker 2: it's it's it's doing the exact same thing for that
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: first time home buyer. So it's the very same, uh,
• 58:41
  Speaker 2: wealth generation, It's the very same. Like you're speaking to stability,
• 58:45
  Speaker 2: you're speaking to economic attainment, so all of those things
• 58:48
  Speaker 2: that it's happening for a first time home buyer, you're
• 58:52
  Speaker 2: just doing it now for the middle class or however
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: you want to categorize that group of I and.
• 58:59
  Speaker 3: That is when we say middle class because and I think,
• 59:02
  Speaker 3: like I said, the middle class, I don't think anyone
• 59:03
  Speaker 3: can define what the middle classes.
• 59:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, however, you write right what.
• 59:08
  Speaker 3: It is today. If you said to you in the nineties,
• 59:10
  Speaker 3: I can tell you what it was if you say today,
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: I don't think anyone really has a true definition of
• 59:14
  Speaker 3: the middle class. They can tell you what upper class is,
• 59:17
  Speaker 3: and they can tell you what no one really yeah, exactly.
• 59:20
  Speaker 2: Well, and even when you threw out the salaries, you know,
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: some people would be like, oh my gosh, you know
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: two hundred thousand, Well, you know what if they're under
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: crushing debt from medical debt, that two hundred one thousand
• 59:31
  Speaker 2: doesn't do much. And so you know that it is
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: all the middle class definition is can be a question mark.
• 59:39
  Speaker 3: Yes, is a question mark. And I think the way
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: that we would look at it today is you're doing okay,
• 59:47
  Speaker 3: but you're not doing great, and like you're you're you're
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: you're a you're a pitch away from like striking up,
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: you know in this sense, and and that is that
• 59:55
  Speaker 3: that is the hard part about this. And so if
• 59:57
  Speaker 3: like we can add this other now, bonus wealth account.
• 59:59
  Speaker 3: So again, if you think about it, look at us
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 3: as like this bonus wealth account and the account is
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 3: your home. And now you've got another tool as a
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 3: financial tool for you. Now, I will say this on
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 3: the first time home buyer side, bonus is about building
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 3: wealth for the middle class. Right, we also want to
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 3: be able to We're also believe in the asset economy. Again,
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 3: that's all we are doing, right, hold on to appreciating assets.
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 3: We want to be able to over time help first
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 3: time help tenants, be able to start earning equity and
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 3: be able to get equity right off of that. I rented.
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 3: My father didn't buy a house. He came here during
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 3: the revolution. My parents were from Ron. He came during
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 3: the revolution in the seventies. He didn't own a house
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 3: until two thousand and five. Those thirty years, Okay, we
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 3: rented forever. We rented so many times, and all that
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 3: money we spent for thirty years on rent, yeah, right,
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 3: And I always was just like, oh my gosh, just
• 1:00:54
  Speaker 3: as so, what we want to do is we evolved.
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 3: Our goal is to be able to get roughly ten
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: to thirty thousand over the next decade or so, I
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 3: would say ten to fifty thousand. It's kind of a
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: thing five to ten years, ten to fifty thousand homeowners.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 3: We call members bonus members that have bonus their home
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 3: across the country. Okay, with that, we will have deployed
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 3: anywhere between on average hundred to two hundred fifty thousand
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 3: per home. So that's you know, a lot of money,
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: billions of dollars, and then we would have created additional
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 3: three to five billion dollars of wealth on those families
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 3: that they have, so they got the billions that they
• 1:01:28
  Speaker 3: got in the front, and then another three to five
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 3: billion dollars for those families that they'll have in the
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 3: future that they never would have had other way. That's
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 3: our mission. That's our goal for V one. What we
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 3: want to do then as well, is we want to
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 3: be able to if you pay rent, and we could
• 1:01:44
  Speaker 3: do this once we have the bonus kind of ecosystem
• 1:01:46
  Speaker 3: of the houses and whatnot. You want to pay rent
• 1:01:50
  Speaker 3: your two thousand dollars and you're gonna pay market rent
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 3: to bonus By the way, we don't mark up rent
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 3: to tenants. We don't do any of that kind of stuff.
• 1:01:56
  Speaker 3: This isn't some of the you've seen some of these
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 3: prop co companies that have, you know, first time home buyer,
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 3: but then they charge the one hundred dollars higher than
• 1:02:03
  Speaker 3: the risk. Yeah, and that does that. That doesn't doesn't
• 1:02:05
  Speaker 3: work where you are. You are literally it doesn't work.
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 3: Question say, is that you're you're you're stretching a person
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 3: to rent to property so they think can maybe buy
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 3: later on. What we want to do is we want
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 3: to say you're gonna pay market rent for this this
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 3: this house, and if it's a bonus house, you're gonna
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: pay market rent. You the part of the proceeds of
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 3: the rent that you put in the twenty two hundred
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 3: dollars nothing more. You're not putting in an extra part
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 3: of those You're gonna build equity. Now renters can get
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 3: into the equity game, and that is where we want
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 3: to start evolving. That's been something of a kind of
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 3: like where I yeah, you know, like I said, for me,
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 3: my life has been a two act journey. It's been
• 1:02:49
  Speaker 3: this act of like we've been a renter and we
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 3: never owned anything, and I we never owned anything for
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 3: a long period of time. And then my dad finally
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 3: buys a house at a time when I already had
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: left a home, right, I was already fights like all
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 3: right too right now, So solve for for for that eventually.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 3: But but but really the middle class and really trying
• 1:03:09
  Speaker 3: to empower these people, empower all of us again middle
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 3: classes as well, and be able to help people to
• 1:03:16
  Speaker 3: do something that they wouldn't have been able to do
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 3: it become fully alive. I mean, there's an emotional piece
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 3: to all of this, yeah, right, financial transaction, there is
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 3: a there's an ethos to this story, and there's an
• 1:03:27
  Speaker 3: ethos to what we're trying to do and unlock and
• 1:03:31
  Speaker 3: and we just you know, we want people who want
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 3: to go on that journey with us. And and that's
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 3: the reason why we call our homeowners members, because they're
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 3: literally going on this journey with us as partners on
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 3: these on these assets to one day where they're just
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 3: like all of a sudden, like I can't believe it.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 3: I Mean, we just had a homeowner. I know, I'm
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 3: going I'm going off with the dovetail here, but we
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 3: just had a homeowner. It's fascinating. We did her house
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 3: in twenty twenty two. Okay, And and by the way,
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 3: past couple of years, and I think her house was
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 3: in Mesa. Past couple of years. Home prices haven't gone
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 3: up that much. Her house surprisingly has gone up a
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 3: little bit more than the average. Her house now got
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 3: in for four hundred and we cash out her correct
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 3: one hundred and fifty thousand dollars. That's what she had.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 3: Her house now is worth for eighty as we did
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 3: is January in two years. Yeahs like twenty thousand dollars
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 3: of wealth built she didn't even know about. And she
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 3: hasn't eve done anything and it's only been two years.
• 1:04:23
  Speaker 3: And so it's you're like you talked to her, You're
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 3: just like, She's like, this is really yeah. Yeah. Her
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 3: next question was, well, can I pull it out right now?
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 3: But but we're like, no, we're gonna let it ride.
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 3: Don't right, right, don't don't we'll sell too soon, right.
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 2: And it used to be you'd have to kind of
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 2: put a ton of money in it to get to
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 2: that level, but not right now.
• 1:04:49
  Speaker 3: No, And this is so and so this is what
• 1:04:51
  Speaker 3: I'm excited about. This has been something that I feel
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 3: I've been all the things I've done have kind of
• 1:04:57
  Speaker 3: like led me to be able to lever to this. Yeah,
• 1:05:00
  Speaker 3: and although I'm not in this, you know, I mean,
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 3: I love technology and that was my I love it
• 1:05:06
  Speaker 3: a lot, and we are doing a lot of technology
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 3: in here. Housing is just so near and dear and
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 3: you know, we got always crave around AI whatnot, which
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 3: is awesome. But nothing is going to take away from
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 3: shelter and nothing is going to take away from this
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: appreciating asset. It is real property. It's stuck on the ground.
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 3: No matter what ends up happening, if robots taking to
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 3: take take over the world, You're still gonna have this house.
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 3: They like you living in it, but you still have
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 3: this house in there.
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 2: Core basic me correct.
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 1:05:34
  Speaker 2: Well, Kyle, thank you for joining us today BNUS Homes.
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 2: We are looking forward to great things because you guys
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 2: are really It's one of the reasons we have this
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 2: podcast is to feature innovators and two change makers. I
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 2: hate to use the word influencers because you know it
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 2: kind of has that whatever image.
• 1:05:55
  Speaker 3: But I can't even I can't even I can't even
• 1:05:57
  Speaker 3: influence my better half.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: I'm I know right, I don't know we need to
• 1:06:02
  Speaker 2: reclaim that word. But but uh, innovators, change makers and influencers.
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 2: But I do appreciate you bringing this to the to
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 2: the conversation.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: Great questions and thoughts too. I really appreciate the conversation. Thanks,
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: thanks for having me.
• 1:06:14
  Speaker 1: On, Thanks for listening to change Makers with Katie Gore.
• 1:06:18
  Speaker 1: To find out more about Katie, go to quad L
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 1: dot com. That's q U a d e l dot com.
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: This has been a production of Forbes Books Radio