Latest / The Richard Sherman Podcast / Charles Woodson talks GOAT DB debate, Raiders dominance & Packers Super Bowl | Richard Sherman

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Charles Woodson talks GOAT DB debate, Raiders dominance & Packers Super Bowl | Richard Sherman · The Richard Sherman Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: What is that? Is that an Emmy?
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you boy got a little empty man, You boy
• 0:04
  Speaker 2: got a little indie bend. Okay, got a little back then.
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: All right, I gotta say it from stuff for the show.
• 0:16
  Speaker 3: Welcome back to the Richard Sherman Podcast, and today we
• 0:19
  Speaker 3: have an incredible guest, an idol of mine. Heisman Trophy winner,
• 0:25
  Speaker 3: NCAA champion, super Bowl champion, four time first Team All Pro,
• 0:31
  Speaker 3: NFL Hall of Famer, sixty five interceptions, thirteen defensive touchdowns,
• 0:38
  Speaker 3: twenty sacks. I mean, we're talking about one of the
• 0:42
  Speaker 3: greatest dbs to ever play, Charles Woodson.
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: Appreciate you joining me, Brother bridgid Man. Goodness see you man.
• 0:49
  Speaker 3: I had champ on a couple of weeks ago, and
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: you know, we was just talking dB play and all
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: these other cool things. But he was talking about the
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: goat at the dB posse and your name came up
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: as one of the best to ever play as who
• 1:05
  Speaker 3: he considered the best. How do you feel when people
• 1:08
  Speaker 3: talk about you like that, because I feel the same way.
• 1:10
  Speaker 3: I feel like you were the most versatile. You did
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: it for incredibly long time. I mean, you ended with
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: five picks in your last year in your farewell tour.
• 1:20
  Speaker 3: You still got your five books. So talk about what
• 1:22
  Speaker 3: that means to you, to get the respect of one
• 1:24
  Speaker 3: of the greatest cornerbacks to ever play.
• 1:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, man, it's you know, it's always I guess you
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: could say humbling. Humbling is experience. I have that because
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: you know, me and Champ are really you know, we contemporaries.
• 1:39
  Speaker 2: I mean, we was at this thing at the same time.
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: And you know, just as much as you know he
• 1:45
  Speaker 2: may have been watching me, you know, I'm on the
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: other sideline. I'm watching Champ, you know, because you know,
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: there's always a debate, you know, at the time, who's
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: the best at it, who's doing it, who's doing it
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: the best on the field, And so specially when he
• 2:00
  Speaker 2: came over to Denver and we're now in the same conference,
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: I had to watch Champ and uh, you know, special player.
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: You know he was. He was, he was one of
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: the ones you know out there on the field. So
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: you know, to have uh, guys like yourself, to have Champ,
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: guys who I know, you know, love the game, study
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: the game. You guys played the same position, and to
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: get that kind of recognition from your you know, from
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: your peers, you know, we all, you know, kind of
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: similar in age. You're a little bit younger than us,
• 2:32
  Speaker 2: but we we we come around at the same time.
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: And uh, you know it just what I when I
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: think about playing in the NFL, man, the only thing
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: I wanted to do was win a Super Bowl. When
• 2:43
  Speaker 2: when when it really boils down to anything, I just
• 2:45
  Speaker 2: wanted to win a Super Bowl. Everything else was just
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: me going out and trying to leave everything I had
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: out there on the field. You know, you know, playing
• 2:54
  Speaker 2: a corner, you know, uh, you know, people expect you to,
• 2:58
  Speaker 2: you know, play the game one way as a corner,
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: but that was never my my game. I was. I
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: needed to be all over the field. I needed I
• 3:08
  Speaker 2: needed to paint the whole picture, you know what I'm saying.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: So being on one side and just and just or
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: just guarding one receiver all the time every week was
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: not really my deal. I wanted to be able to blitz.
• 3:21
  Speaker 2: I wanted to be able to cover when I needed to.
• 3:24
  Speaker 2: I was going to tackle, you know what I'm saying,
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: with the best of them. And so I think that's
• 3:29
  Speaker 2: that's the thing that you know, a champ and yourself
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: look at, is that look in terms of defensive back. Man,
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: the dude did it all. I mean, you know what
• 3:39
  Speaker 2: couldn't he do? And when you look at you know
• 3:44
  Speaker 2: the categories of whether it's interceptions and all the other things.
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: I'm up there in all the categories. And so what
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: I was doing out there, I was impactful at it
• 3:53
  Speaker 2: and not just doing it just because I could do it.
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: And when you got the ball, you took it. You
• 3:57
  Speaker 3: took it to the crib. You tied for first all
• 4:00
  Speaker 3: time with thirteen return touchdowns International Football League. I mean,
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: your impact was incredible. But I want to take you
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: all the way back. I want to take you all
• 4:08
  Speaker 3: the way back. The kid from Fremont, Ohio.
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: Goes to Michigan.
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: I'm sure you've been asking this question a million trillion times,
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: but I got to ask you one more time. Yeah,
• 4:19
  Speaker 3: why because I know that's Yeah, you have to from
• 4:22
  Speaker 3: what I know about Ohio and Ohio fans, Ohio State,
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: it's the only place you go if you.
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: It's huge, that's huge. Yeah, you know you're going to Michigan.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: You know, when you think about football and the states
• 4:39
  Speaker 2: where football is like key, you know, people always talk
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: about California. They're gonna talk about Florida. They talk about Texas,
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: but Ohio is one of the ones too, you know
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying. And so uh in the state of Ohio,
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: you know, you hear stories of you know, kids being
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: born and them putting the buckeye in their crib and
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: all that good stuff. But I grew up in northwest
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: Ohio Fremont, which you mentioned, which really business wise is
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: pretty even as far as getting to an arbor. Uh
• 5:11
  Speaker 2: and and too Columbus. And for me, uh, the in
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: that part of the country, in Ohio and Michigan, like
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: it was, it was one or the other, like they
• 5:22
  Speaker 2: were the rival. So you couldn't really like both of
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: them at the same time, you know. So it's kind
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: of weird for me to see guys who kind of
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: visit both of them because I was, you know, I
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: grew up in the real that what I say, the
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: real rivalry time of the two schools. But my my
• 5:35
  Speaker 2: older brother was a Michigan fan and so like he
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: fell in love with the wing helmet and and all
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: of that stuff. And so I'm four years younger than
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: my brother, and you know, he's my first like childhood idol.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: You know, he played football, he was in the sports
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: and man, he liked Michigan, and I'm like, see that,
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: you know, that's big, bro. He liked Michigan. I like,
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: I like Michigan. And that's honestly, that's where it started.
• 6:04
  Speaker 2: And that was it. And so from the time I
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: was you know, you know, eight nine years old, he
• 6:11
  Speaker 2: liked Michigan. I followed Michigan. So when that game came on,
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: me and my brother was rooting for Michigan. And so,
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: you know, he always had dreams, you know, to go
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: to Michigan. Like I said, he played football. He didn't
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: get a chance to attend there. But then for me,
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: it's like when I have the opportunity, Michigan was always
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: going to be at the top of that list. And
• 6:33
  Speaker 2: it just so happens. You know, I go to school
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: and I do my thing in high school, and I'm
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: being recruited by Michigan and you know some other of course,
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: I visited Miami and visited Notre Dame. You know, Michigan
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: was always at the top, and it was like, you know,
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: the school down south, they're out of it, you know
• 6:52
  Speaker 2: what I mean. It's just it was it was a
• 6:54
  Speaker 2: whole rivalry aspect of it. And it was to me.
• 6:56
  Speaker 2: It's really that simple. Like it wasn't really anything against
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: him in terms of, you know, football wise, there was
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: always a great program. It was just a rivalry. I
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: couldn't like. I couldn't like him, you know. So that's
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: where that's where the old Michigan things came from. Man.
• 7:14
  Speaker 3: I love that, Man, I love that. People don't understand
• 7:17
  Speaker 3: the importance of an older brother. I got an older
• 7:19
  Speaker 3: brother three years, not four. So I'm sorry for y'all.
• 7:22
  Speaker 3: Didn't even get to go to high school one year
• 7:23
  Speaker 3: to Yeah, I know that probably hurt you.
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: A little bit, right, Almost almost played in my freshman year,
• 7:29
  Speaker 2: but but he was no, no he what happened? He
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: was uh no, we scheduled Miami, Mine of Ohio was
• 7:37
  Speaker 2: on our schedule, but he was gone already, so so
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: so so I just missed playing against him because he
• 7:43
  Speaker 2: was a running back. He was a running back, so
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: you would yeah, you would have loved sure, for sure.
• 7:50
  Speaker 3: It's It's crazy that like for me, my older brother,
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: everything he did, I just wanted to do a little
• 7:56
  Speaker 3: bit better. Yeah number he wore I wore. Don't even
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: know why I wore the number. He probably know why
• 8:02
  Speaker 3: he wore. I only wore because.
• 8:03
  Speaker 2: He right, right.
• 8:05
  Speaker 3: But but he was a big impact on everything I did.
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: He played receiver, so I was a receiver. He triple jumped.
• 8:12
  Speaker 3: I saw a triple jump. He did something. He went
• 8:15
  Speaker 3: to the minga. That's where I was going, like, I
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: don't know why I'm doing these things, but it seems
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: like a good idea because he But you were recruited
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: as a running back everywhere Michigan. So I could kind
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: of see you being a Golden Domer somehow, I don't
• 8:28
  Speaker 3: know why. It just feels like you could have been
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: you know, Tim Brown and all.
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I went down there, man, but I wouldn't. I
• 8:35
  Speaker 2: wouldn't feel it.
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: Man.
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: I knew I wasn't gonna be. I wasn't gonna be
• 8:38
  Speaker 2: a Golden Domer. So I knew that right off the bat. Uh,
• 8:41
  Speaker 2: you know, appreciated the opportunity, but it wasn't gonna happen.
• 8:46
  Speaker 2: But but interestingly, uh, yeah, I was running back in
• 8:51
  Speaker 2: high school and I was really being recruited, you know,
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: as running back for everything from everybody, I mean, including Michigan.
• 8:59
  Speaker 2: But I had these issues with my knees in high school,
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: and you know, I would you know, play through the
• 9:05
  Speaker 2: season and all of a sudden, you know, my knees
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: would get banged up, knees would swell up sometimes during
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: the season. You know, there was times when I was
• 9:12
  Speaker 2: you know, they were putting that that needle on my
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: knee and training out the fluid and trying to play.
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: And so when it came time, you know, you know,
• 9:22
  Speaker 2: for me to get ready to you know, choose schools
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: and whatnot, I was like, man, I'm not gonna last
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: playing running back. And so I remember talking to I
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: was being recruited by Jim Herman, who the defensive He
• 9:34
  Speaker 2: was the linebackers coach, I believe, and then he went
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: on to be our defensive coordinator. I think my uh
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: sophomore or junior year, either way, I remember being on
• 9:46
  Speaker 2: the phone with him saying, Hey, man, I'm playing defense
• 9:49
  Speaker 2: when I come up there, and he was like what
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: he was like really? I was like, yeah, man, I'm
• 9:54
  Speaker 2: playing defense. He was like, oh okay. He excited because,
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: like I said, I was being recruited as the running ba.
• 10:00
  Speaker 2: I mean I rush for two thousand you know, my
• 10:02
  Speaker 2: senior years, the tote the rock a little bit, you know,
• 10:06
  Speaker 2: but I associated that position with my knees, and that
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: was that was a conscious decision by myself to be like,
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: I'm a good enough athlete, I'm gonna be able to
• 10:14
  Speaker 2: play anywhere. So when I come to when I come
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: to Michigan and I'm coming, I'm playing defense and that
• 10:21
  Speaker 2: that's where that came from.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: Well you played more than defense, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 10:29
  Speaker 3: talk about that because I mean there's been so many players,
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: Travis Hunter being probably the most recent and like celebrated
• 10:36
  Speaker 3: player that's played both ways. But to win the Heisman
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: as a defensive primarily defensive player and still make plays
• 10:43
  Speaker 3: in the punk return game and offense.
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: What what? What was that?
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: Like?
• 10:48
  Speaker 3: I can't imagine how fun that was at a school
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: like Michigan, your dream school, getting to live one of
• 10:53
  Speaker 3: the biggest dreams anybody's ever had.
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: Man, it was. It was a great experience, man. First
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: of all, to go to a big time, you know school,
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: you know like Michigan, you know, with all of the
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: history that they have, and you know, I remember getting
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: there my freshman year and you know how you know,
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: when you're on your visits, you don't you don't see
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: the whole team. You kind of see the other recruits
• 11:14
  Speaker 2: might be a few people they are working out that
• 11:16
  Speaker 2: sort of thing. And I remember getting there and you know,
• 11:19
  Speaker 2: the first day of practicing and it's you know, just
• 11:22
  Speaker 2: walk on. So there's a lot of people there, but
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: you don't know who who's who, you know, who can
• 11:26
  Speaker 2: play at all? Right, And I'm thinking, man, that's a
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: lot more people at the position that I thought. So
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh man, uh, you know, I I gotta
• 11:37
  Speaker 2: go to work, you know. So then you know, of
• 11:39
  Speaker 2: course you start, you know, sized up the competition, and
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: you know, I knew, you know, what would I had,
• 11:44
  Speaker 2: you know, by you know, being at the practice. And
• 11:46
  Speaker 2: so then I worked myself up man into into that
• 11:48
  Speaker 2: starting role and you know, being able to you know,
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: make an impact my freshman year playing against Ohio State
• 11:54
  Speaker 2: end of the year having two picks, you know, being
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: you know, making it to the All Big Ten as
• 12:02
  Speaker 2: a freshman like that was that was unbelievable experience. But
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: but after that year, we were losing a mini tumor Mercury,
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: hays Uh Tomago Biakabatuca, like we were losing some offensive weapons.
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: And so at that time, I was like, you know what,
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: there's there's an opportunity if they want me to play offense.
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: So I was like, man, let me, let me. I
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: approached Lloyd Carr like, man, what'd you think about me
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: playing a few players, you know, on offense? And uh
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: he was like, you know, well think about that. You
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: know what we're running back. I was like, noah, no,
• 12:37
  Speaker 2: not the running back I played. I played a little receiver.
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: And so then that spring put me in a couple
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: of players on offense, and it was like, oh, yeah,
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: you know, we can do that. So that's kind of
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: where that started, you know, playing on that side of
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: the ball. And and honestly, man, I didn't play a
• 12:54
  Speaker 2: whole lot of offense like it. It seemed like it
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: because when I was in the game, I would get
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: the ball and I would make a play. But you know,
• 13:02
  Speaker 2: I went to Heisman in ninety seven and I think
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: I had a mayor had twelve catches. You know, I
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: may maybe twelve catches for like two hundred some yards.
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: But defense was where I made my hay. And you know,
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: Lloyd Carr always, you know, told me, he said, hey, man,
• 13:23
  Speaker 2: if anything slips on defense, I ain't I ain't putting
• 13:26
  Speaker 2: on offense. So I had to always keep the main thing,
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: the main thing in terms of in terms of playing
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: on that side of the ball. But when I when
• 13:33
  Speaker 2: I got in the game, pretty they pretty much knew
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: how I was going to get the ball. But that
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: was it probably twelve catches and but it was there,
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: you know, some impactful plays. And you know that that
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: whole season was kind of up and down in terms
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: of who was in front. You know, you had Peyton
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: and then you had a few other guys, you know,
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: Ryan Leaf, you had Randy Moss, and it was it
• 13:54
  Speaker 2: was a horse race all year. And you know then
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: of course the punt return which you mentioned. So for me, Man,
• 14:02
  Speaker 2: just a lot of a lot of great memories of
• 14:06
  Speaker 2: being Wolverine, being able to do, playing some great games,
• 14:12
  Speaker 2: playing in front of one hundred and you know, six
• 14:14
  Speaker 2: thousand at the time. Man, it was it was nothing
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: like it. Man. Special times, yeah.
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: Really special times and I mean still unbelievable seasons that
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: people go back and revisit all the time because it's
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: just legendary. It's legendary. You were one of the few
• 14:31
  Speaker 3: unique people that are Hall of famers in college, one
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: of the best ever and then get to the league
• 14:37
  Speaker 3: and might have been even better might have been even
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: better than you was in college, and you were, you
• 14:41
  Speaker 3: were a Hall of Famer in college, so I wasn't.
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: I wasn't in college.
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: For me, I was.
• 14:48
  Speaker 3: I was a good receiver for my first couple of years,
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: got injured. Me and Harborough went our separate ways kind of,
• 14:53
  Speaker 3: and then I went to defense and then was figuring
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: out the position. So I didn't have the whole four
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: years of playing corner and knowing the spot.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: I kind of was a.
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: Receiver out there at corner, and like everything that that
• 15:07
  Speaker 3: that I was doing was because I knew the place,
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: you know what I mean, So my pedal wasn't always right.
• 15:13
  Speaker 3: I still remember when we played a game against Green Bay,
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: they mosted me over in the slot and ran out.
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: I think it was Cob and I remember you text
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: me that day. You were like, hey, when you get there, hey,
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: square it up, you know what I mean, get you
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: outside leverage, trusted, trusted, and break downhill.
• 15:27
  Speaker 2: And I was like, no, I'm gonna do my best
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: to practice.
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: That and get it done.
• 15:34
  Speaker 3: But everything I was it always looked like I was
• 15:36
  Speaker 3: floating out there because I was just seeing the picture
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: and recognizing, like, hey, all right, triggers flat out in
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: dig all right, So that means my route is a
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: curl drive it like you know what I mean. That's
• 15:49
  Speaker 3: how I was basing everything and my pedal. No matter
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: how much I practiced it, no matter how much I
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: worked it, I could not get it as smooth as
• 15:57
  Speaker 3: dude who've played corner their whole life.
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: No, No, Well, the thing you knew how to do
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: is attack the football like that's that's really most important.
• 16:05
  Speaker 2: And you know, for me, I had man Vance Bedford
• 16:10
  Speaker 2: was my defensive backs coach at the University of Michigan,
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: And so you want to talk about back pedaling as
• 16:16
  Speaker 2: a corner. When I first got to Michigan, you know,
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: we got all the corners together and he was going
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: through different techniques and he had us back pedaling and
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: he was like, he was like, man, you're supposed to
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: be one of the top crews. He said, you can't
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: even backpedal. So I understand that that that part of
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: what you're talking about, because you know I was. I was.
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't never say I was the most technical defensive back.
• 16:45
  Speaker 2: I was gonna understand what you were trying to do
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: to me, and I knew how to get to the
• 16:49
  Speaker 2: right place, you know what I'm saying. So like the
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: back pedaling and patients at the line of scrimmage and
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: all that, I could just I could just play the game,
• 17:00
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. No, I worked on it
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: because you know, the coaches trying to get you to,
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: you know, get some sort of technique. But I wasn't.
• 17:08
  Speaker 2: I wasn't. I wasn't always you know, very technical, and
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: sometimes I would get out of technique and I had
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: to really consciously think about getting back into it. But
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: but what I did know how to do is what
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: you knew how to do. I knew how to get
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: to the football, and when I get the football, I'm
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: gonna do something with it. So that route recognition you're
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: talking about, that that was that was my deal, you
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: know what I mean. It was more so that than
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: being a technician and and you know, being being this
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: slow and and and doing this or that. It was like, nah,
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: you know how they lining up? Why is he lining
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: up there? Uh? How was he trying to attack my leverage?
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: That was that was that was my deal.
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: So you're incredible and started I think from what your
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: second game at Michigan and started thirty four straight. Then
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: then you get drafted.
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: By the Raid.
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: Into that culture, into to Al Davis and everything that
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: the Raiders were at that time. Uh talk talk to me,
• 18:13
  Speaker 3: walk me through that because people that some people know
• 18:17
  Speaker 3: the Raiders from early in the day, some people know
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: what the culture was when you played. But it's a
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: very unique fan base. It's a very unique like type
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: of place. And first off, that that stadium they needed
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: to get up out of there. So I'm glad to
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: think about it because I still remember stories where they
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: had roaches in there. I was like, hey, it's the
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: National Football League now.
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: And I got to it now. The stadium itself, man,
• 18:40
  Speaker 2: it you know, it left a lot to be desired
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: for sure. But in terms of playing in that stadium,
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: like the atmosphere of that stadium, you know, was second
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: to none, Like you know, running out there, man, and
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: like being introduced in that stadium in front of the
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: black Hole. You know, the amount of energy that was
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: in that stadium. I gotta tell you, man, it was.
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: It was nothing like that. Man. So I you know,
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: playing on dirt half of the year like we had,
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: it was history there, man, like it was. It made
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: it what it was it was ours. Now we didn't
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: like playing on the dirt, but we understood that. Man,
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: it's the Raiders. It is what it is. But but
• 19:21
  Speaker 2: being drafted there, man was Uh, it was just crazy
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: because you know, the Raiders West Coast team. I grew
• 19:29
  Speaker 2: up in the Midwest. You know they're gonna play, you know,
• 19:32
  Speaker 2: later on in the day, you know, so you don't
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: you don't always catch the Raiders. You know, when we
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: were young, we was outside playing at that time. You know,
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: we we outside were getting it done. But I'm drafted
• 19:44
  Speaker 2: to the you know, to the to the Oakland Raiders.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: And what I remember is that the guys who were
• 19:51
  Speaker 2: the guys you know, they were around Willie Brown was
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: around Freddye Blitchnikoff, Uh, you know, was around Cliff Ranch,
• 20:00
  Speaker 2: you know, Rest and Peace. He was around Lester Hayes,
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: he was around Jim Auto worked in the building. He
• 20:11
  Speaker 2: was around. So you get there, you know, to this organization,
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: you don't really I don't really necessarily know the history.
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: Of course I know the Raiders, but I don't know
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: the Raiders. And when you get in there and you're
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: a high draft pick and you play corner, you got
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: the guy who they call the Godfather of the bump
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: and run right there. It's like, oh, okay, okay, all right,
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. He like, you know, you
• 20:41
  Speaker 2: started learning about all these guys that Mike Haynes is around.
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying. You got great. So now
• 20:47
  Speaker 2: all of a sudden, it's like, oh, I play I
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: played corner. I got to be something here, Okay, I
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: gotta be something. I don't I don't really have a
• 20:56
  Speaker 2: choice when I when I get there, there was two
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: number to choose from because the numbers were taken and
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: it was like thirty eight or something and twenty four.
• 21:08
  Speaker 2: And so I'm really like, man, I don't because I
• 21:12
  Speaker 2: wasn't thinking about twenty four.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: I don't know.
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: I don't really know where Willie Brown that way. And
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: one day Willie Brown was like, man, what what you
• 21:21
  Speaker 2: thinking about what you're gonna wear twenty four? I was like,
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: all right, So now I put on twenty four and
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: I was like again I'm starting to I'm like, ah, okay, yeah, yeah, yeah,
• 21:37
  Speaker 2: I got it. I got it. And so you know,
• 21:40
  Speaker 2: those guys would you know, talk to the team, you know,
• 21:43
  Speaker 2: you know, before training camps and different stuff, like that.
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: We would watch they would show little clips of the
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: old Raiders and all that sort of thing, and man,
• 21:54
  Speaker 2: I was just I mean almost immediately, man, I like
• 21:57
  Speaker 2: I fell in love with that silver and black man.
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: It was like it fit me, you know what I mean.
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: And so you understood that it was built on you know,
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: there was the toughest there, and there was an expectation there,
• 22:11
  Speaker 2: you know, to win, even though they had gone through
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: their their you know, help post their Super Bowls. You know,
• 22:16
  Speaker 2: they had gone through a lot of turbentent time. But
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: that mistique of the Raiders was always there. I don't
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: care if we was four and twelve and you know,
• 22:29
  Speaker 2: five and eleven, it didn't it didn't matter, man. It
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: was the Raiders. And I always remember Willie Brown would say, man,
• 22:36
  Speaker 2: there's thirty one other teams in the NFL, and then
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: there's the Raiders. And that's the way we always looked
• 22:41
  Speaker 2: at it. And so man, I mean, I couldn't I
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: couldn't have asked for a better position than to be
• 22:49
  Speaker 2: drafted by the Oakland Raiders in nineteen ninety eight.
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: Who was it during your time with the Raiders, because
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: I'm sure draft day was incredible you talked about how
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: incredible it was on the field and in that environment.
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: Who was like a veteran that kind of helped you
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: mature into a to a pro in the National Football League,
• 23:09
  Speaker 3: Because I feel like as a young guy, you always
• 23:11
  Speaker 3: got a veteran that you kind of lean on, that
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: you kind of talk to. Whether it might be a
• 23:15
  Speaker 3: retired guy, might have been Mike Kynes or Lester Hayes
• 23:18
  Speaker 3: or one of those guys. But who was somebody that
• 23:21
  Speaker 3: kind of helped you transition from a college you know,
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: incredible college player to a to a true pro.
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I think there's there's more than one. I would say, Man,
• 23:32
  Speaker 2: I was fortunate that I came in. I felt like
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: I had some real dudes to really to really look
• 23:37
  Speaker 2: up to. First and foremost, rest in peace to another guy, man,
• 23:42
  Speaker 2: Eric Turner. I know, you know Eric Turner. Man, Eric
• 23:45
  Speaker 2: Turner was a safety. You know, had played for the
• 23:47
  Speaker 2: Browns and then now he was over with the Raiders.
• 23:50
  Speaker 2: Like he was he was my guy, you know what
• 23:51
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. He was really the one guy that kind
• 23:53
  Speaker 2: of took me under his wing. You know, we hung out.
• 23:57
  Speaker 2: We go over to San Francisco and hang out. We
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: you know, we we we ate together like that was
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: that was my That was my dude, and uh, you know,
• 24:07
  Speaker 2: I just remember, man, he was he was. He was
• 24:10
  Speaker 2: a fly dude too, you know what I'm saying. Like
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: he was he was fly. Man. I just remember I
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: would watch him. I'm twenty one, twenty two years old,
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: and I just remember, Man, we would we would going
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: away games, and you know, he'd have, uh, you know,
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: whatever he want. He was gonna dress. He was always
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: dressing fresh. He'd get on the plane, he wouldn't have
• 24:30
  Speaker 2: no bag. He might have like a little toiletry bag
• 24:32
  Speaker 2: or something, and I'd be like, dang, this dude always
• 24:36
  Speaker 2: getting on the plane. You don't got no bag. And
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: so then we would get you know, to uh the
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: other city we're in. Next day, come around he got
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: another outfit on going to the game. And so I'm
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: just watching this a couple of times, I'm like, like, dude,
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: I don't never see you with no bag.
• 24:53
  Speaker 1: Man.
• 24:53
  Speaker 2: How you always got to change How you always got
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: to change the clothes. But you know he was giving
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: it to the equipment people. They put it under the
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: pl and then he just picked it up when we
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: got there. When he got there. That boy smooth, but
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: he always had a fit going to the game. He
• 25:08
  Speaker 2: was gonna have something to wear while he was in
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: town at that game, and then he was gonna have
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: another fit for game day. And so I watched that
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: for you know, when I was a youngster, a couple
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: of years, you know, before he passed. And then later
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: on in my career I started doing that. I got
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: that from Eric Turner, so that that was a little
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: something that I picked up from him. But then I
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: had man, I had Eric Allen you mentioned earlier. He
• 25:33
  Speaker 2: came over from the Saints my rookie year. So I
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: got to watch you know, an og in the game
• 25:41
  Speaker 2: at the corner. You know, how he prepared, you know,
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: different ways that he was looking at you know, he
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: was he was he wasn't a press guy as much
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: he was he was he would play off, so I
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: was able to watch him and you know, pick his
• 25:56
  Speaker 2: brain about hey man, what you looking at? You know,
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: because he liked to start up and then back off.
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: He was trying to show them different looks. And I
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: liked that about his game. So I took that and
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: then I had offensive offensively, I had Tim Brown, you know,
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: so I got to work against him every day, and
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: and and you know the way he ran routes was
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: his own unique style.
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: Man.
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: He had a little pitter patter pitter pattern of his
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: feet when he would break it go in and out
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: of break. So I was able to get uh playing
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: against somebody who was a technician in that regard. I
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: had James Dent and he were lightning fast. So I
• 26:31
  Speaker 2: had all of these different things that you know, kind
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: of molded me as a player. But all of these
• 26:36
  Speaker 2: guys were veterans in the game. Man, So I was Man,
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: I was lucky. Yeah, I mean that's incredible, that's incredible.
• 26:46
  Speaker 2: What what what?
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: What?
• 26:48
  Speaker 3: Who do you think was your favorite because y'all had
• 26:49
  Speaker 3: that the AFC West. What was like your rival? Right?
• 26:54
  Speaker 2: Who was your rival in the in the division during
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: your time with the Raiders? Everybody?
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean.
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: Again, you know, Brian would tell us it's thirty one
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: other teams and there was a Raider. So I feel
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: like every team we played was a rival. You know,
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: my first game was playing against Kansas City Chiefs in
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: Kansas City or Sunday Night, Sunday Night football. You know,
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: they got Andre bad Moon Rising is down there and
• 27:33
  Speaker 2: that was my first you know, indoctrination into the to
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: the league. You know, I'm I'm I'm coming in. Man,
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: I'm hockey. I don't want the hides than them. I'm like, man,
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: you know, ain't nobody messing with me?
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: Man?
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: They hit me like three quick throws. I'm like, rising
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: ran this little I thought it was like a little lazy,
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: little skinny and I weaved outside. You know, you weave outside. Man,
• 27:59
  Speaker 2: You're done because he launched you to sleep. Oh man.
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: And as soon as it happened, I was like day.
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: And then he got on that goal post like spider Man.
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh man. So I had to tighten
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: up real quick. Uh in that game? But yeah, we
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: I mean, I mean it didn't matter, man, we had
• 28:23
  Speaker 2: everybody was a rival. Man. So that's I guess that's
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: the best way I can answer that.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: You talked about when we first started this conversation that
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: your only goal was to win the Super Bowl and
• 28:37
  Speaker 3: that's all you ever thought about, And y'all went, y'all went,
• 28:40
  Speaker 3: we y'all had a great team. Was that two thousand
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: and two? Yeah, And that's when Jerry came and you
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: guys had an incredible season. Talk talk about that season
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: and you know what you learned, and you know, sometimes
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: people feel like at the beginning of Super Bowl season,
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: you go through training camp and you're like, man, we
• 28:58
  Speaker 3: could feel it, we can feel it. We can feel
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: this team was special throughout the season. It feels special.
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: And then y'all just kind of ran into a jugger
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: out of the Tampa Bay team. But talk about that
• 29:08
  Speaker 3: season and playing with those those other Hall of famers
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: that that you guys had that season.
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, well we had. We had built up to that.
• 29:17
  Speaker 2: You know, my first two years we were eight and eight,
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: and then we I got to think of the sequence
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: and then we we ended up playing Baltimore in the
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: AFC Championship game and rich Gannon goes down, Sarah goes boom,
• 29:42
  Speaker 2: rich Gannon is out of the game, and then we
• 29:46
  Speaker 2: we had the tuck rule game, all right, So so
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: then we had the tuck rule and then you know,
• 29:55
  Speaker 2: the Patriots they go on, they win the Super Bowl,
• 29:58
  Speaker 2: and then you know that that that that next year,
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: Green's prayed, so then you know, they moved our old
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: line coach up to the head coach. But we still
• 30:11
  Speaker 2: have the same team. But we're a good team. I
• 30:14
  Speaker 2: mean we got veterans, like you said, Tim Brown, jer Rice,
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: Charlie GARNERM my main man was there. And offensive line,
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: you know, Grooden had you know, he was big about
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: officive line, defensive line. Office line was magnificent. So we
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: could run the ball. We can give it to how
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: you want to. Rich was diceing people up all season,
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: but personally for me, Earlier in that year, I broke
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: my shoulder against against Pittsburgh against Pittsburgh like maybe the
• 30:42
  Speaker 2: second game of the season or something. So I missed
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: a stretch of games, five games I think I missed
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: with my shoulder out. I come back, I play a
• 30:53
  Speaker 2: couple more games, then I break my leg fructured. I
• 30:57
  Speaker 2: fractured my leg and so then uh so I got
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: a little while did I tried to come back early
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: and kind of redid it, so then I missed. So
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: I missed quite a bit of time that season. But
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: our team, we started off the season fast, hit some
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: hit a roadblock, and then we end up hitting our
• 31:15
  Speaker 2: stride going into the playoffs. So that year I ended
• 31:19
  Speaker 2: up getting the surgery like a week and a half
• 31:21
  Speaker 2: before our first playoff game because we had to buy
• 31:25
  Speaker 2: a week so put the plate in my leg. I'm like,
• 31:29
  Speaker 2: I'm playing. You know what I'm saying. We got a
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: chance to go to the super Bowl. Man, it's all good.
• 31:34
  Speaker 2: So we get into the game. I think we had
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: we had the Jets be the Jets that we have
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: the Titans. Titans gave us a run, but we rolling. Man,
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: we got a good squad. But the difference in the
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: years that because of nine eleven, I believe things had
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: got pushed back. So we don't have a week. We
• 31:54
  Speaker 2: don't have a week a two week by before the
• 31:57
  Speaker 2: super Bowl. So right after the Championshi game, we're playing
• 32:02
  Speaker 2: the super Bowl next week. So we fly from yeah,
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: we fly from you know, from Oakland down in San Diego,
• 32:08
  Speaker 2: Tampa was coming over to uh San Diego. And then
• 32:14
  Speaker 2: that's the game where our center, Baron robbins Man he
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: rest in peace. He just passed away. He had an
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: incident where he ended up I think in Tijuana or
• 32:24
  Speaker 2: something like that. So we had we had a little
• 32:27
  Speaker 2: turmoil before the game, which that happens two weeks before.
• 32:32
  Speaker 2: If we got two weeks you know what I'm saying,
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: maybe that don't happen. But because it happened, and things
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: things happened that quick. The most dominant center I feel
• 32:42
  Speaker 2: like in the league at that time, he's out of
• 32:45
  Speaker 2: that game. So you know, you know, Tempa was they
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: had a good team. They started off a couple of interceptions, touchdowns.
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: You know, by the time we got back back in
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: the game, it was way too late. So that season
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: Man was personally with the injuries and then with things
• 33:03
  Speaker 2: kind of being sped up from the championship game the
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: very next week, the super Bowl. It wasn't our It
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: wasn't our day. Wasn't our day? Right.
• 33:15
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  Speaker 3: and let's get this party started. Well, you got to
• 35:01
  Speaker 3: have your day. It happened in a different with a
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: different organization, different colors, and other historic all time franchise,
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: but a totally different field than the Raiders. The Green
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: Bay Packers are a much different organization, much different fan base,
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: much more like small town field. But did it almost
• 35:21
  Speaker 3: feel like college again when you got to Green Bay? Yeah?
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: I think when you look at how you know the
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: stadium is situated, situated. It was right there in the
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: middle of town. You know, you go, you go to
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: that stadium, you know you're parking in people's driveways, and
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: you know, if you want to rent their house for
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: the game, you can rent the houses, houses across the street.
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: And the unique thing about you know, that small town
• 35:45
  Speaker 2: team is which Raiders fans are passionate of course about
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: the Raiders, that's their squad. Green Bay is a different
• 35:55
  Speaker 2: passion because they donated over time money to that organized
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: theation and to keep that team in Green Bay. So
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: they really walk around. I'm an owner of the Green
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: Bay Packers, you know what I'm saying. So so they
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: you know, they take they take great, great pride in
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: Green Bay. And so I ended up playing for another team.
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: Man with crazy, crazy tradition, you know what I'm saying.
• 36:22
  Speaker 2: The first two Super Bowls, Vince Lombardi, the trophy is
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: named after him, Title Town Like I always look at it, Man, like,
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: how fortunate Amn who have played for the Oakland Raiders
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: and then ended up playing for the Green Bay Packers.
• 36:37
  Speaker 2: And h Man had seven seven crazy years in Green Bay,
• 36:42
  Speaker 2: like you said, got got a super Bowl out of it,
• 36:45
  Speaker 2: super Bowl forty five. So you know, forever, forever grateful.
• 36:49
  Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying for my time in Green Bay.
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean for you to go to Green Bay.
• 36:56
  Speaker 3: You know, it celebrated as you were coming out of
• 36:58
  Speaker 3: college and with the with the Raiders. You want defensive
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: Player of the year. And and was that year ten
• 37:05
  Speaker 3: or year nine?
• 37:07
  Speaker 5: Uh, that's a good question. Yeah, I gotta be year eleven.
• 37:15
  Speaker 5: That was that was two thousand and nine. I came
• 37:17
  Speaker 5: out in uh ninety eight. Yeah, yeah, love you love
• 37:21
  Speaker 5: you here.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 37:23
  Speaker 3: So in year eleven you won Defensive Player of the Year.
• 37:26
  Speaker 3: I think you had nine books, uh, four force from
• 37:29
  Speaker 3: three or four force fumbles, a couple of touchdowns, but
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: just an incredibly impactful season. Like you said earlier, you
• 37:35
  Speaker 3: love to impact the game from the slot. You love
• 37:37
  Speaker 3: the blitz, you love to in that season, you was
• 37:39
  Speaker 3: doing it all. I remember Will Blackman Will Blackman's talks
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: to talks about you, boy, like you're a myth, like.
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: You never really existed.
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: I love black He talked about you like, boy, everything
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: you used to do, he used to tell us, Man,
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: we love to hear hearing the stories about you in
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: Green Bay.
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: But it was just cool to watch.
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: Man. You were impacting a run game the past game.
• 38:00
  Speaker 3: It just seemed like you knew the play. It seemed
• 38:01
  Speaker 3: like you were in a huddle when the offense called
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: to play and you were like, Hey, I'm gonna get
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: the ball from him like this, but I'm not gonna
• 38:07
  Speaker 3: act like I.
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: Know to play. I'm just gonna get there.
• 38:10
  Speaker 3: Take it from him to walk me through that season,
• 38:12
  Speaker 3: because sometimes you just feel like you're in rhythm. Sometimes
• 38:15
  Speaker 3: you just feel like the ball finds you. In that season,
• 38:17
  Speaker 3: it look like it found you every game.
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: Well, you know, it's when when you can impact the
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: game at different levels of the defense, then you're almost
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: in you're in attack mode. You know, if you're just
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: you know, in one spot all the time and they
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: know where you're at, then they can just they just
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: go ahead and do their thing somewhere else. You know
• 38:48
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying. You've gone through it. But I could
• 38:53
  Speaker 2: manipulate the offense just as much as they try to
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: manipulate the defense, you know what I mean. So through
• 39:00
  Speaker 2: me watching you know, film and understanding you know, h
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: multiple aspects of that offense. Because I may play corner
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: part of the game, I may play nickel. It might
• 39:13
  Speaker 2: be thirty percent here, I might blitch a couple of times.
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: I might drop back in the halffield they don't really know,
• 39:21
  Speaker 2: you know what I mean a lot of times. So
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: I was able to uh impact the game in so
• 39:29
  Speaker 2: many ways because I could do so many different things.
• 39:33
  Speaker 2: And you just read off you know, the nine picks
• 39:37
  Speaker 2: and the forced fumbles, the touchdowns. That's because I could
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: be different places, you know what I mean, and nobody
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: could really get a beat on it. So that season
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: was I mean, yeah, it was almost like you know,
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: I had a magnet, you know, in my hands, man,
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: and that ball was it was coming to me. You know,
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: I just had to be I just had to be
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: in the right place, you know what I'm saying, at
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: the right time, And yeah, it was. It was incredible
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: and I and I and I dropped the couple. So
• 40:05
  Speaker 2: so that's the one. Those are the ones I think about.
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: That's the one that keep you, those the ones that
• 40:12
  Speaker 2: think about, you know, because because I dropped a couple
• 40:15
  Speaker 2: and uh, you know, it just turned out to be
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: just one of those those like magical seasons that man,
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: it was when you hear people talk about the zone,
• 40:25
  Speaker 2: you know, it's like for that that that season, man,
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: you just you're in the zone.
• 40:31
  Speaker 3: Well, I love the way you talked about like impacting
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: and being able to dictate what the offense does. I mean,
• 40:37
  Speaker 3: a lot of these defenses now are using what you
• 40:40
  Speaker 3: did to to to draft players, and like Seattle uses
• 40:44
  Speaker 3: Nick m and warr and all these places, similar to
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: how Green Bay used you.
• 40:48
  Speaker 1: You could look at.
• 40:49
  Speaker 2: Uh and and Waltimore and Withers phone.
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, Baltimore uses Kyle Hamilton. You know, it's a
• 40:57
  Speaker 3: lot of people starting to starting to finally kind of
• 41:00
  Speaker 3: like use positionless dB play and New England was doing
• 41:06
  Speaker 3: it something in the Super Bowl. They have two safeties
• 41:08
  Speaker 3: that they kind of interchange his nickels, so when motion happens,
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: they'll just rock and roll their nickel to safety instead
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: of you know, trying to chase them all over the field.
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: It's it's kind of unique it's it's a good way
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: to play defense. But we've had this zone versus man,
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: versus following receivers versus oh you you follow number one receivers.
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: And I get so frustrated with this conversation because people
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: use it to downplay my game and like, oh, he
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: just played zone, so he wasn't that good. I'm like,
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: first off, I played everything that they called, you know
• 41:35
  Speaker 3: what I mean, third down, you only play man and
• 41:39
  Speaker 3: cover three if you only got one receiver to side,
• 41:41
  Speaker 3: you playing man. And but we didn't do as much
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: following unless it was unless he wanted me to, you
• 41:48
  Speaker 3: know what I mean, unless they wanted it was some
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: specific matchup, and and everybody else could hold their own
• 41:53
  Speaker 3: with their matchup, you know what I mean. That's the
• 41:54
  Speaker 3: thing people don't understand when youre following somebody, everybody else
• 41:57
  Speaker 3: got a stand up to. Oh you want to follow
• 41:59
  Speaker 3: and play man, Well, you better hope your linebackers play man.
• 42:02
  Speaker 3: You better hope your your your safeties can cover you.
• 42:04
  Speaker 3: You better hope your other corner can cover because he's
• 42:06
  Speaker 3: about that the longest day of his life if you
• 42:08
  Speaker 3: strapping and then he got to deal with So what
• 42:11
  Speaker 3: did you feel about that. Well, obviously you just said
• 42:14
  Speaker 3: how you feel about it, because you feel like you
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: can impact the game and dictate what the offense did.
• 42:18
  Speaker 3: And that's how we felt, like, Hey, if I'm over
• 42:20
  Speaker 3: here to the left, then what we do know is
• 42:23
  Speaker 3: they ain't throwing it over here, so we can you
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: can lean to the other hash we can. We can
• 42:29
  Speaker 3: kind of push covers that way, because if they come
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: this way, I'm taking the ball, and if they keep
• 42:34
  Speaker 3: coming this way, I'm gonna keep taking the ball until
• 42:35
  Speaker 3: they figure it out. I knew one thing I wasn't
• 42:38
  Speaker 3: gonna get beat on often was a nine ball.
• 42:40
  Speaker 2: I think of my Oh no, you got a lot
• 42:42
  Speaker 2: of that, the nine balls. I'm trying. I'm still trying
• 42:45
  Speaker 2: to figure out why they throw that ball.
• 42:46
  Speaker 6: Over the deep because because I was slow, still trying
• 42:53
  Speaker 6: to figure that one out. Hey, let's just throw the
• 42:56
  Speaker 6: nine ball over side. Okay, that sounds like a good idea.
• 43:00
  Speaker 2: Oh well, maybe we should have What are we doing.
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: Y'all letting these combines number?
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, for sure.
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: But I remember something you told me about like forcing fumbles,
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: and I tried to keep it in mind and attack
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: the ball every time every chance I got. But you
• 43:16
  Speaker 3: were like, hey, when you tackling, if somebody got him,
• 43:19
  Speaker 3: just just grab the ball. I guarantee they don't leave
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: without it.
• 43:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, no, no, no, no, running back receiver,
• 43:26
  Speaker 2: it's trying to go back to that sideline without the football,
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: you know, none of them. So you know, my my
• 43:32
  Speaker 2: thing was always let me if I couldn't disrupt it somehow.
• 43:37
  Speaker 2: And you're running, and then you start thinking about that ball.
• 43:41
  Speaker 2: You're You're gonna try to get down if you can,
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: to make sure. You know what I'm saying, you're down
• 43:46
  Speaker 2: by contact before I get this ball. This ball out
• 43:50
  Speaker 2: And then then a lot of times guys, man, they
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: forget that they're trying to gain, y'all. They worry about
• 43:56
  Speaker 2: trying to protect that football. So, man, ninety ninety eight
• 44:01
  Speaker 2: percent of my tackles, I was trying to get ball
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: first somehow. But the way I would go after the ball,
• 44:08
  Speaker 2: you know, I came down with force. I was gonna
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: rake a lot of times, but then with the other arm,
• 44:14
  Speaker 2: I'm gonna secure the tackle. So I'm trying to bang
• 44:18
  Speaker 2: it out all right, if I don't get it. At
• 44:21
  Speaker 2: the same time, I'm pulling. If I don't get it
• 44:24
  Speaker 2: out then I'm gonna make the tackle. So it's like
• 44:26
  Speaker 2: it's like three phases to it, you know what I'm saying.
• 44:29
  Speaker 2: And that was that was the way I tackled like
• 44:31
  Speaker 2: all the time.
• 44:34
  Speaker 3: What advice would you have for a young guy who's
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: trying to play as long as you did?
• 44:37
  Speaker 1: You played what.
• 44:38
  Speaker 2: Nineteen eighteen eighteen season eighteen?
• 44:42
  Speaker 3: What would your advice be for somebody to play as
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: long as you did, Whether it's taking care of your body,
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: your diet, stretching, sleep habits, what would you say to
• 44:53
  Speaker 3: to help them get there?
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: First? You gotta want to. I mean, you know, at
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: the end of the day, man, if you don't want
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: to be out there, if you don't want to, you know,
• 45:01
  Speaker 2: put that time in, you know, whatever it is, you know,
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: doing a little extra work here, a little extra studying.
• 45:08
  Speaker 2: Then you know, you you waste your time trying to
• 45:10
  Speaker 2: play it, you know, as long as I did. And uh,
• 45:13
  Speaker 2: I think you got to be a little bit lucky. Yeah,
• 45:15
  Speaker 2: to be honest, you know, I had my injuries. My
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: most of my injuries were you know the bones, you know,
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: so my shoulders, my legs, uh, but bone, you know, bone,
• 45:26
  Speaker 2: and he'll back stronger. So when you come back, you
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: know you're fine. You know, I think you've had some
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: ligament uh issues. Those those are a little bit more
• 45:34
  Speaker 2: taxing on you in terms of the comeback and the rehab.
• 45:38
  Speaker 2: Mind mostly I sit, I let it set in, heels
• 45:42
  Speaker 2: back stronger. I may have a little bit of pain throwing,
• 45:45
  Speaker 2: but I'm gonna be fine. It's not really gonna, you know,
• 45:48
  Speaker 2: slow me down. So I feel like I'm a little
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: bit lucky in that regard, in terms of the injuries
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: that I did sustain, you know, while while I was
• 45:56
  Speaker 2: in the league. And then I mean, too, man, you
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: gotta make plays, you know what I'm saying. I mean
• 46:04
  Speaker 2: at the end of the day. You know, I used
• 46:05
  Speaker 2: to have this thing I say, work hard, make plays.
• 46:07
  Speaker 2: You know, you work hard, you know, all throughout the week,
• 46:11
  Speaker 2: you know, whether it's the studying, whether it's the conditioning,
• 46:14
  Speaker 2: the practice time that you put in. But then on Sunday, man,
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: it's something got to show up. You know. If you're
• 46:20
  Speaker 2: just out there, you know, and all you do is
• 46:22
  Speaker 2: tackle all day and you ain't taking the ball away,
• 46:26
  Speaker 2: you ain't you know, you ain't intercepted, and you ain't
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: fumble recovering, you might get you five to six, you know,
• 46:33
  Speaker 2: and then they gonna be looking at somebody that can
• 46:35
  Speaker 2: take the ball away, you know what I mean. You
• 46:37
  Speaker 2: got to take the ball away or be so special
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: that you know, nobody can't throw it on you something
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: I don't know. But other than that, man, I don't
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: think it's to me. It's not that that that difficult.
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: If you can do certain things. First, you gotta want
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: it all right, You gotta work hard, gotta make plays,
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: and you got to be special at someth.
• 47:01
  Speaker 3: What do you think about the way the game is
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: evolving now? Because guys are getting less less books, they're
• 47:07
  Speaker 3: they're getting less picks, you know, and they're still getting played.
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: They're still playing at a high level. But it just
• 47:13
  Speaker 3: seems like guys aren't finding the ball as much this year.
• 47:16
  Speaker 3: Like a couple guys just got paid. I think McDuffie
• 47:20
  Speaker 3: just got thirty from the Rams, got a good trade,
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: great money for him. Salts got paid, you know, all
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: these guys. But you look at their career interception numbers.
• 47:29
  Speaker 3: I think McDuffie got three to or three, Saal Scott
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: to or three, and it just you know, but they're
• 47:36
  Speaker 3: playing really well, even Quen y'all. Mitchell quen y'all. Mitchell
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: had an incredible season. I think he had seventeen or
• 47:40
  Speaker 3: eighteen PBUs, didn't didn't really give up a touchdown all season,
• 47:44
  Speaker 3: tight coverage, really sticky, First team All Pro, but no interceptions.
• 47:49
  Speaker 3: You know, It's just it's just that the game is
• 47:51
  Speaker 3: so much different nowadays for these guys, and they're not
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: that they're not playing at a high level or are playing,
• 47:55
  Speaker 3: it's just it seems like they're finding the ball less.
• 47:59
  Speaker 1: Why do you think that it is?
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: Uh?
• 48:04
  Speaker 2: A couple of things. I think.
• 48:07
  Speaker 1: I don't.
• 48:07
  Speaker 2: I don't know if I think you have you have
• 48:10
  Speaker 2: to have a mentality, uh, in terms of making plays
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: like I can. I can know what the office is
• 48:19
  Speaker 2: gonna do. But if my only objective is to stop
• 48:24
  Speaker 2: you from doing it, but not to take the ball away,
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: then I've left part of that game out. So if
• 48:32
  Speaker 2: I knew a route combination was coming up, that they
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: was gonna run a little pen route too, he's gonna
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: sit down in five and then this guy's gonna run
• 48:39
  Speaker 2: a dig I'm not trying to be so on top
• 48:42
  Speaker 2: of him that they don't necessarily necessarily throw the ball.
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: But I wanted to throw it because I want to
• 48:49
  Speaker 2: attack it to get to pick. So I think you
• 48:51
  Speaker 2: have to have a mindset to to to want to
• 48:53
  Speaker 2: pick it off and not go in for a tackle
• 48:56
  Speaker 2: or a pass break or something or something like that.
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: So that part of it, you gotta be a little
• 49:01
  Speaker 2: bit different in that respect. The other thing, one of
• 49:05
  Speaker 2: my biggest pet peeves is guys don't turn around and
• 49:09
  Speaker 2: find the ball. It's too many. It's too many times
• 49:13
  Speaker 2: I see guys playing and they're talk. I know guys
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: to talk. Play through the hands man, Fuck them hands man,
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: you know what I'm saying. Especially I try to tell
• 49:24
  Speaker 2: my young guys my son's team is like, you gotta
• 49:27
  Speaker 2: you gotta be confident in yourself enough and not payic
• 49:32
  Speaker 2: to where you can read that receiver down the field.
• 49:34
  Speaker 2: If that receiver turns his head and he slows down
• 49:37
  Speaker 2: a little bit, that means you got time to turn
• 49:39
  Speaker 2: your head around find the ball.
• 49:41
  Speaker 1: Now.
• 49:41
  Speaker 2: If he just hauling and that balls out there, you
• 49:43
  Speaker 2: gotta catch up. You gotta go get it. But man,
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: as there's too many times I see guys either panic,
• 49:49
  Speaker 2: jump into a guy pass in the ference, play through
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: the hands, which is which is great Look, you knocked
• 49:54
  Speaker 2: the ball down, you make them line up again. I
• 49:57
  Speaker 2: got no problem with that. But that's that's the difference
• 50:00
  Speaker 2: between a good player, all right, making some good plays,
• 50:05
  Speaker 2: and a great player making great plays.
• 50:08
  Speaker 1: And I was my.
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: Mindset was make the great play. You know what I'm saying.
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: Every time, every time, make put myself in a position
• 50:17
  Speaker 2: to make the great play. And I always try to
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: go into a game, right And look, you don't get
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: to pick every game, but but I was gonna have.
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: I was gonna have four or five plays. You couldn't
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: line up in it and run it and not and
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: not and not throw it at my side. And if
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: you do, I'm picking that bad boys. And I look,
• 50:36
  Speaker 2: thank you very much, but I'm sitting here, I'm a
• 50:38
  Speaker 2: wait on it and I'm gonna pick it off. Now
• 50:40
  Speaker 2: you throw it on the other side of the field. Man,
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: all right, I missed that one. But boy, I'm searching.
• 50:45
  Speaker 2: That's like it's like my It's like I'm standing m oh,
• 50:51
  Speaker 2: I got one. You know what I'm saying.
• 50:54
  Speaker 1: That's the way.
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: That's the way I looked at it. And so that's
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: why you know, when when you when you talk about
• 50:59
  Speaker 2: guys not in the ball when I think about, you know,
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: my career, and so for me, right sixty five, I
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: got sixty five interceptions, and then because I did you
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: know all these other things, I got twenty sacks. Right
• 51:17
  Speaker 2: sixty five, twenty sacks. Like there's a combination seventeen games,
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: eighteen games. It'll never be done again never. You get
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying, because I don't. I don't think the
• 51:28
  Speaker 2: guys think about it the way I would have thought
• 51:32
  Speaker 2: about think about it and the way you said. Look,
• 51:35
  Speaker 2: I know what they running on the lay off a
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: little bit. I hope and pray that they throw it
• 51:41
  Speaker 2: because I'm going play. I'm going for the pig. I'm
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: not trying to smother you so much that they never
• 51:45
  Speaker 2: throw the ball over it. No, no, no, you know what
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: I'm saying.
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: So and the nine, the ninth ball is the easiest one.
• 51:52
  Speaker 3: That's why I used to you just play receiving that run. Yeah,
• 51:55
  Speaker 3: I'm receiving it. Like if I get you off that
• 51:57
  Speaker 3: red line and I get on the red line, I
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: know what they throwing it. I know what the quarterbacks
• 52:02
  Speaker 3: what they taught. They taught to throw it right off
• 52:03
  Speaker 3: that red line. If I can bump you off that
• 52:06
  Speaker 3: red line and I own it, then they should come
• 52:08
  Speaker 3: right down to me. If I go up there and
• 52:11
  Speaker 3: get it and I can bring it down. I do
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: that five six times a year. I'm employed, easy money,
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: and the league is simple. There's so many scenarios where
• 52:22
  Speaker 3: after an explosive play, they get to the fifty, they
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: get to the forty five, they like, hey, we want
• 52:27
  Speaker 3: to bomb.
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: One taking a shot.
• 52:28
  Speaker 1: Please do please take that shot. I'm here for it too.
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: And the way I practiced like I picked everything I
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: could in practice like it wasn't. I'm not bad nothing
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: unless I had to had to. And in practice it's
• 52:42
  Speaker 3: too easy, so you never really have to. So it's
• 52:45
  Speaker 3: just like what you said earlier, like how I'm practicing,
• 52:47
  Speaker 3: I'm only practicing to catch the ball. So I was
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: talking to a college coach the other day and he's like, man,
• 52:52
  Speaker 3: how do I get my guys more interceptions? Tell them
• 52:55
  Speaker 3: to stop battling the ball and catch it? Like it's
• 52:58
  Speaker 3: that simple, Like go catch the ball every chance they get.
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: Don't don't be like, oh that was easy, I bat
• 53:03
  Speaker 3: it down. If it was so easy, catch.
• 53:05
  Speaker 2: It, well, you talk to it like you said you
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: talked to Will Blackman, and you asked, you know, the
• 53:10
  Speaker 2: guys in Green Bay when I when I first got there,
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: you know, you watch them, you go through what you're
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: gonna go over, you know, once you get onto the
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: field that day, and it could be really simple stuff
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: and it could be walked through. Somebody walked through little curl.
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: I'm jumping in front of the catch it. Then we
• 53:27
  Speaker 2: get to our seven or seven period, all these different things,
• 53:30
  Speaker 2: and you know, I'm picking off four and five balls
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: all day and they're like, man, you know, how do
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: you know what's coming? First of all, we just watched
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: it in the film. We just watched it in the film,
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: and I said, man, I'm out here to make plays.
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: I'm not out here to let these guys just catch
• 53:48
  Speaker 2: the ball.
• 53:49
  Speaker 1: Now.
• 53:49
  Speaker 2: I'm not gonna do it to the point where i'ma
• 53:51
  Speaker 2: hurt somebody or hurt my teammate. No, I'm breaking in
• 53:54
  Speaker 2: front of the ball and I'm trying to pick the
• 53:56
  Speaker 2: ball off. So I was practicing that until it got
• 53:59
  Speaker 2: to a point in Green Bay where then we started
• 54:02
  Speaker 2: competition because they was like that made sense, you know
• 54:06
  Speaker 2: what I mean. So then Tramia started picking balls off
• 54:09
  Speaker 2: in practice. Sam Shields come he started picking balls off
• 54:12
  Speaker 2: in practice. I was talking to Joe with our coach,
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: he coaches in Green Bay, and he was just talking about,
• 54:20
  Speaker 2: you know, we had a three year stretch man when
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: we I think we had like eighty something picks in
• 54:26
  Speaker 2: three years. One year in twenty eleven, we had thirty
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: one interceptions in twenty nine sacks. You know what I'm saying, Like, we, buddy,
• 54:39
  Speaker 2: we on that we was getting the ball, but it
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: came from we gotta practice getting the ball. We practiced
• 54:48
  Speaker 2: getting the ball in practice, I promise you, because you're
• 54:51
  Speaker 2: gonna recognize it in practice, and then we get on
• 54:53
  Speaker 2: the field on Sunday, it's gonna start to click. I'm
• 54:59
  Speaker 2: going to pick it off. You don't see what I'm saying, Like,
• 55:02
  Speaker 2: you gotta make them players, man, you gotta make it.
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: Make it a habit.
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: You just you just gave wisdom right there. I hope
• 55:10
  Speaker 3: everybody's listening to that. You gotta make it a habit. Interceptions, turnovers,
• 55:14
  Speaker 3: taking the ball away, greatness. Great things are habits that
• 55:17
  Speaker 3: you form every single day in practice if you practice
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: it at a chance. I just never understood dudes, And
• 55:25
  Speaker 3: this is one of my pet peeves. And it used
• 55:26
  Speaker 3: to piss me off at practice. I go off on
• 55:28
  Speaker 3: something like this. They're gonna show it to you in
• 55:30
  Speaker 3: the meeting. Then they're gonna take you to the field,
• 55:33
  Speaker 3: walk you through the play pretty much, walk you through
• 55:36
  Speaker 3: to two periods of practice, and then go to the
• 55:40
  Speaker 3: field and then practice the same exact ones they walked
• 55:43
  Speaker 3: you through. If you get beat in the walk through
• 55:47
  Speaker 3: and then get beat in the practice of cutting, yo,
• 55:49
  Speaker 3: he ain't got it.
• 55:51
  Speaker 2: This is one of them. Yeah for real. Yeah, I'm
• 55:55
  Speaker 2: with you on that. Yeah, yeah, I couldn't believe it.
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: Okay, let me let me get to your to your
• 56:00
  Speaker 3: five corners of all time or DB's however you want
• 56:03
  Speaker 3: to put it, because I don't want to take too
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: much more you day. You know, we can sit there
• 56:06
  Speaker 3: and talk all day. What and what attributes you would
• 56:12
  Speaker 3: take from? Like if you created a dB, what would
• 56:15
  Speaker 3: he need to have to be great?
• 56:18
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing you just create yourself. You know, it was
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: funny because it's funny you say that people ask you
• 56:25
  Speaker 2: know a dB, hey put together? You know, you know
• 56:29
  Speaker 2: the attributes of your your best dB. You know who
• 56:33
  Speaker 2: can cover, who can tackle, you know who's fast. And
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: I'm thinking ship sixty five interception got thirty three forced fumbles,
• 56:47
  Speaker 2: thirteen touchdown, defensive touchdown, twenty sacks. What am I looking for?
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: But I think think for me, So I would say
• 57:02
  Speaker 2: in terms of that, then yeah, I'm gonna be able
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: to cover all those bases. But I think for a
• 57:07
  Speaker 2: corner man, you gotta have, you know, a couple of things. One,
• 57:10
  Speaker 2: you gotta have you gotta have some instinct. You know
• 57:13
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying. You gotta you gotta feel some things
• 57:16
  Speaker 2: that are happening around you when you don't know what's
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: happening gonna happen, you know what I'm saying. A lot
• 57:21
  Speaker 2: of time, get you study feeling. You know, you're gonna
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: feel really good about the test on Sunday, you know
• 57:28
  Speaker 2: what I'm saying. But they're there, but they're gonna sometimes
• 57:30
  Speaker 2: every now and I didn't have a wrinkle. You're like,
• 57:33
  Speaker 2: oh that's a little different. But your little feel funny,
• 57:37
  Speaker 2: feel funny. But your little your little spidy senses you know,
• 57:40
  Speaker 2: go off and you're like, all right, you feel your
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: way through it, you know what I'm saying. So you
• 57:45
  Speaker 2: gotta have a little bit of instinct. You gotta have
• 57:49
  Speaker 2: a no panic button. You know what I'm saying, when
• 57:52
  Speaker 2: that ball is in the air, Like I used to
• 57:54
  Speaker 2: watch guys play against Randy. When that ball get in
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: the air, man, you you would have thought there was
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: baby deer out there. You know what I'm saying, because
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: because they, for one, it was Randy, so they already
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: kind of feel in some kind of way. But then
• 58:09
  Speaker 2: when they see they see that, then they panic. But sometimes, man,
• 58:13
  Speaker 2: you just gotta you just gotta play ball. Man, it's
• 58:15
  Speaker 2: gonna happen. Sometimes somebody gonna get on top of you.
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: But but you gotta you gotta, you gotta be Uh,
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: you gotta have a little bit of a composure about
• 58:24
  Speaker 2: yourself when that ball is ball is in the air.
• 58:28
  Speaker 2: You gotta have You don't have to have elite speed,
• 58:32
  Speaker 2: but you got to have game speed, you know what
• 58:34
  Speaker 2: I'm saying. Like some guys can get on the track,
• 58:37
  Speaker 2: they'll blow your sights all but in the game, they
• 58:39
  Speaker 2: always behind, you know what I'm saying, always behind you.
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: Gotta you gotta play. You gotta be able to play
• 58:44
  Speaker 2: with great leverage. You know what I'm saying. Uh, you
• 58:49
  Speaker 2: got you gotta be tough. You gotta be tough like
• 58:53
  Speaker 2: those those are those are the attributes for me. Man,
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: you gotta be tough.
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: I believe it. You gotta be able to catch the ball. Yeah,
• 59:01
  Speaker 3: that's another thing for sure. I just don't get it
• 59:04
  Speaker 3: when dudes like it. And maybe maybe I'm taking that
• 59:07
  Speaker 3: for granted because we did it well and you did
• 59:09
  Speaker 3: it as well as anybody ever. I just wish I
• 59:12
  Speaker 3: wish they would it lacks up on these rules a
• 59:15
  Speaker 3: little bit so we could get a few more because
• 59:16
  Speaker 3: these quarterbacks is too protected, they too precise.
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: Many they's too comfortable. They feel good back there. They
• 59:23
  Speaker 2: just patting that ball around, you know. Then they get
• 59:26
  Speaker 2: hit and they looking up at the refl like it's
• 59:29
  Speaker 2: like nah, man, it's football, bro. Football.
• 59:33
  Speaker 3: So now they're the most accurate they've ever been, you
• 59:37
  Speaker 3: know what I mean. That's why I think some of
• 59:39
  Speaker 3: the pick numbers are going down because they're not scared
• 59:41
  Speaker 3: to get hit. They aren't there like, hit me so
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: I can get fifteen, you know what I mean.
• 59:45
  Speaker 2: Like if you.
• 59:46
  Speaker 3: Tackle me and I feel like it's wrong, you land
• 59:49
  Speaker 3: on me wrong, that's fifteen necessarily trying to hurt me.
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: You just ain't trying to not hurt me enough.
• 59:54
  Speaker 2: And nobody's scared of that.
• 59:56
  Speaker 1: No more, ain't nobody.
• 59:58
  Speaker 3: Scared and that's why they are there like standing there.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, read it out.
• 1:00:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but who are your top five corners of all time?
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: Uh? Top five? I'm gonna say, I'm gonna go prime
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 2: ride myself. Man, you know it's some good ones. Man,
• 1:00:22
  Speaker 2: get tricky, get treated because I'm yeah, I know, right,
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 2: because them my dogs. But I mean, it's it's hard.
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: It's hard not to have Champ. I think Champ was
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: thirteen times any times Champ makee pro bo thirteen times.
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 3: Something like that, some something crazy like that. He had
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 3: that ten pick year. We only gave up four catching
• 1:00:49
  Speaker 3: four or five catches or something.
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 2: Crazy like that. Yep, yep. And then man, uh, I
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 2: think it's gonna be somewhere between.
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 2: You know, well, I say that that I got, I'll
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 2: say those four. Then I'm gonna go. Nias Williams I
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: think was very underrated. H I'll go uh.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: You know, like.
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: Dyl Green is always gonna be up there. I feel
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: like these two players are are like and from the
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: same place. That's it's the reefs in ty Law. I
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 2: always put the always put those guys up in there.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: Somewhere yourself is gonna be in there, so so I
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: got to forward them from there.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 3: Man, it depends on the man.
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I can pick yeah, for sure. For sure.
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 1: I appreciate that. Man. I'll say this from my perspective.
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 3: Bro, It's a It's an honor and a and a
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 3: and a privilege for you to even have watched my game,
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 3: you know what I mean, For you to even have
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 3: have have seen my tape and seen me do what
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 3: I wanted to do and and and play the game
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 3: at a high level. Man, that was just such a
• 1:02:15
  Speaker 3: blessing for me. Uh, You're a player that I looked
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 3: up to when I when I was first transitioning from
• 1:02:21
  Speaker 3: the receiver to play corner, I sat there and got
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 3: on YouTube and watch you and Prime as much as
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 3: I could. I was like, I'm gonna figure something out
• 1:02:29
  Speaker 3: so I can do what they do.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 3: I might not have as much athletic ability, and I
• 1:02:34
  Speaker 3: was more athletic than people gave me credit for, but
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 3: I'm probably high for fours.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 1: I can jump about forty inches in a year.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 3: I can move, but it's gonna be above the shoulders
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 3: that that separates. And I always heard you talk about
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 3: that and talk about your preparation and talk about the
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 3: routes and talk about the concepts you were given in
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 3: the field, and it it had a huge impact on
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 3: my game. And so I want to I want to
• 1:02:56
  Speaker 3: say thank you from the bottom of my heart for
• 1:02:58
  Speaker 3: inspiring a young kid to to go out there and
• 1:03:01
  Speaker 3: and be able to go get the football as much
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 3: as he could and understanding that part of the game.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 1: You know, I couldn't.
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 3: I couldn't work in the slot like you were, Like
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 3: you did, you know, no matter how hard, I didn't
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 3: have no feel for.
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 2: That slide everything that slot. Yeah, and the slide. You
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: gotta go in there and bang too. Now you there.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: You got to see that guard.
• 1:03:20
  Speaker 2: You gotta go there. You gotta go in there. Some
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: of them, you know sometimes Man, I used to be
• 1:03:26
  Speaker 2: down there, man, and and uh, they're haveing some big
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 2: nickel and I'll be like the Sam linebacker. Man, and
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 2: some of them dudes, Man, they ain't trying to man
• 1:03:34
  Speaker 2: handle me. Man, I'm down there fighting for my life.
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: It's a different game in there. Hey, man, let me go, Man,
• 1:03:44
  Speaker 2: you better let me go. I gotta family, straight up,
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 2: straight up, different world down there.
• 1:03:52
  Speaker 3: It's a different worlds, that's it. It's different, man. And
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 3: and it was fun, you know, playing the National Football
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 3: League was fun getting you. And I remember, I remember
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 3: the day I went up to you to try to
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 3: ask you for your jersey, and I swore, I swore
• 1:04:08
  Speaker 3: you was gonna say no. I still got that jersey hanging.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 3: I was like, man, he's gonna say no, Like, who
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 3: is this nobody coming up to me? And you were
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 3: the coolest hell body. You was like, yeah, yeah, when
• 1:04:17
  Speaker 3: we get to the locker room, I'm gonna have I'm
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 3: gonna send it over. I'm gonna do this.
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: I said. Man, Yeah, Well you know what's what's crazy
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 2: about that is that I'm still old school. And so
• 1:04:29
  Speaker 2: when I first came to the man exchange jersey. Man,
• 1:04:34
  Speaker 2: nobody's changing. Y'all depends on depending on whether you want
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 2: to lost. Man, Man, get out my face. Man, you
• 1:04:44
  Speaker 2: try the same jersey now, y'all just whooped us?
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 3: Man?
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 2: You want my jersey too? Yeah? You want all the foilers?
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 1: You know. Look it was a preseason game.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 2: I knew I co Yeah you got in because I
• 1:05:01
  Speaker 2: probably wasn't playing much anyway, So straight up, clean, straight up, yeah, man,
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 2: that's funny.
• 1:05:09
  Speaker 1: That's funny. The dudes ain't no school no more. They
• 1:05:13
  Speaker 1: want to be buddy, buddy, take pictures after.
• 1:05:14
  Speaker 2: The game, joking, joking, get out there and get man
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 2: handled and then go up to the man that just
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 2: man handled and be like, man, let me get your jersey.
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 2: You know, it's you know, it's a new day. You
• 1:05:26
  Speaker 2: know I ain't knocking it, you know for two hundred Yeah, yeah, yeah, jersey. Yeah. Crazy, man,
• 1:05:33
  Speaker 2: it's crazy. It's a different day, a different day. It's
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: too different.
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 3: I don't know if I could coach it, man coaching,
• 1:05:42
  Speaker 3: I'll be talking bad about.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: Him in meeting.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 2: Nah yeah yeah yeah. It's like now nowadays, like you
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 2: know with the seven or seven, you know the kids
• 1:05:51
  Speaker 2: that's a five star over there. That's the fine.
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 5: Man.
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 2: I wouldn't give a good guy. What is we try?
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 2: We try a whoop buddy. You know what I'm saying. Man, So,
• 1:06:05
  Speaker 2: but it's all good? Is what is?
• 1:06:07
  Speaker 3: What is something you got to say that I didn't
• 1:06:09
  Speaker 3: ask you or or I didn't address that. You want
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 3: to get out there before we get off?
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 2: I think the only thing is, man, you you you
• 1:06:20
  Speaker 2: have a restaurant. What's your restaurant called It's Legion all right,
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 2: you know for everybody out there in Seattle. It's in Seattle, correct, yep, everybody,
• 1:06:32
  Speaker 2: everybody in Bellevue. You know what I'm saying, go by Legions,
• 1:06:35
  Speaker 2: man and check out my man's restaurant. You know what
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: I'm saying, Uh, support your guy, super Bowl, super Bowl champion,
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: you know, go out there and show him some love.
• 1:06:44
  Speaker 2: And then uh, you know, for myself. You know, I
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 2: got I got woods and whiskey, so we need to
• 1:06:49
  Speaker 2: get my whiskey and my wine. I got Intercept wine,
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 2: woods and whiskey. Legions, We're coming for you. We send
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: get together on sending somebody out there for you man.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 2: So uh yeah, yeah, that's uh, that's it man. You know,
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 2: I appreciate you having me on man and uh, you know,
• 1:07:04
  Speaker 2: having some good conversation.
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 1: I love it. I love it.
• 1:07:08
  Speaker 3: I appreciate you coming on as always. Brother. I hope
• 1:07:12
  Speaker 3: you and your your your boys are doing well. Your
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 3: family is doing well. I hope they. I hope you
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 3: get to go to Michigan, even though you know you
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 3: are dad, so like you don't want to go, but
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 3: then they're gonna offer him and then he's gonna be like, well.
• 1:07:22
  Speaker 1: I guess I.
• 1:07:27
  Speaker 2: Ain't no doubt, man. Yeah, that's exciting. Man. I Uh,
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: the kid has some decisions to make, you know what
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 2: I mean, and uh, you know it's just to help
• 1:07:40
  Speaker 2: him be in that position. Man, it's crazy. And you know,
• 1:07:43
  Speaker 2: of course I would love him to put on Amazing Blue,
• 1:07:46
  Speaker 2: but you know, I gotta, I gotta let him make
• 1:07:48
  Speaker 2: his his own decisions, so I'll respect it. I respect it,
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 2: you know, but we'll see as long as they don't
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 2: go to school down so can't do that, do that.
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 2: I appreciate you. I see you next time. O. Man,
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 2: I appreciate it. Mm hmmmmmmmmmmmmm