Latest / Empower Your Menopause / Episode 61: Menopause, Sex, and the Practice of Pleasure

Transcript

Episode 61: Menopause, Sex, and the Practice of Pleasure · Empower Your Menopause

• 0:13
  SPEAKER_00: Hello, hello, and welcome to the latest episode of Empower Your Menopause, the podcast where we talk about health, hormones, and happiness for women 40 and above.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: It's James here from Will Spey on 40 with my colleague Julie.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_00: And today we're going to navigate the menopause maze of sex and sexuality.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: So if your libido's gone missing, your body feels different, or you're wondering whether lube is only for your car, you're in the right place because we've got someone very special with us today.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: But before we introduce her, Julie, do you want to tell people?
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, before I'm very excited about today for a number of reasons.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_01: But before we get started, we would like to announce that the doors to Club Fabulous Beyond 40 are officially open.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: This is our membership for women 40 and above who want science-backed coaching, practical support, and a safe space for the messy middle.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: So you'll get access to guest experts like today's fabulous Melissa every month, plus live coaching, plenty of resources, and an amazing community.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_01: So if you're ready to feel clearer, stronger, and more energized, this is where the magic happens.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: You can learn more at club.fabulousbeyond40.com.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, we'll post that link in the show notes.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: So today, our guest is Melita Yelinich.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: She is a sex and intimacy coach and host of The Pleasure Zone, which is an amazing podcast.
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_01: I highly recommend.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_01: She's got a background in psychology, over 20 years of experience in holistic healing, and she blends biophysics practices, somatic body work, and energy modalities to help clients create safer and more pleasurable relationships with their own bodies as well as their partners.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_01: Melitza is known for her playful, stigma-free way of talking about sex.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_01: Clear, kind, and refreshingly practical.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_01: And when she's not coaching or on air, she's with her family on their southern Ontario homestead.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I love having conversations with Melitza.
• 2:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, where should we start?
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um, let's start with an easy one.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_01: What are some of the most common shifts you see?
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_01: What are some of the most common shifts you see in desire during peri and penny most parry and post-menopause?
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: I can't speak today.
• 2:27
  SPEAKER_01: And how do you explain like responsive versus spontaneous desire in kind of plain English?
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_03: So let's chew that in plain English.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_03: So I have to say that it's not consistent across the board, although a lot of times people assume that with menopause there's a decrease in interest because there's an assumption that all of a sudden you dry up like a prune.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_03: That's not true.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_03: Um I have to say that I have probably equally as many women that come to me who are post and pre-menopausal who are more horny than they've ever been in their lives, and their bodies are responding to it.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_03: And then I have equally as many who feel like they've completely lost it.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I can tell you that the difference between them for the most part are the women who are having happy, healthy relationships and uh sexual responses well into their, you know, post-menopausal years, are the ones who have looked at a lot of their stuff emotionally.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_03: So they've dealt with their traumas.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, not that they've not that you ever fully deal with your trauma, but you know how to navigate it and you know how to work with yourself and you know your triggers and you have great communication skills so you can speak with your partner about your desires.
• 3:44
  SPEAKER_03: The ones who are struggling are the ones who generally don't have those communication skills, don't know what to ask for, and have assumed that sex has to be the same at 50 or 40 and beyond than that it was when you were 20, and it definitely doesn't.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_03: So why does that happen?
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_03: I think it has more.
• 4:08
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, it's it yes, we can talk about the hormones behind it, and hormones are also affected by trauma as well.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_03: We know that too.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_03: Um, all kinds of things going off, like cortisol, which then affects estrogen, and then that's going to affect all kinds of things, right?
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_03: We could go to that or we could go to what's the root cause and what hasn't been dealt with.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_03: And so to me, I usually look at that and find out what hasn't been dealt with and what's holding you back from being fully expressive.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_03: If you have a lot of shame and you have a lot and you have a lack of communication and words to even describe what you desire, you're not going to be able to get it.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: So what we're saying then is that emotion or the emotional status of a lady who comes to see you is just as important as what physically might be happening in a in a body, right?
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: So if she's struggling with those communication issues that you just talked about, how does she open up to a partner in in those circumstances?
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: How does that conversation start?
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_00: Clearly, some of the people you see are further ahead on that journey than others are.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: So what advice do you give them?
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_03: So for a lot of them that don't have the language or even they don't even know what their options are, I usually guide them to um, I have like a little freebie on my website called my my yes, no's and maybes list.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_03: And I guide people to that.
• 5:36
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, if you can't say the words, let's learn some words and let's figure out what it is you are afraid of.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_03: Let's figure out what you like.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_03: And it's actually a really simple and vanilla list.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_03: I don't even get into kink there.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_03: And and I'm a big fan of introducing kink after 40 because or even before, as long as you have the communication to be able to navigate it.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_03: Um, because I think there's so much value in it as a healing modality, which is kind of a not something people usually think about with kink, but I I see it as a as a fantastic uh method of healing, especially traumas.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_03: So uh to empower women, right?
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_03: So that's one thing.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_03: I would start with simple conversations.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_03: It's surprising to me how many women are in their you know, 40s, 50s, and 60s, who, even in this day and age with we have so much information and we have so many different tools, so many women have never had orgasms, believe that they're anorgasmic, have actually gone to get therapies and been told by you know experts in the field that their, you know, their bodies don't respond.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and you know, there's not they can't figure out what's going on.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_03: And the funny thing is, usually my first question, which can sometimes it might sound invasive when I say it, but actually when people are coming to me, I think they almost expect it.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_03: My first question is have you ever been violated, abused, or sexually molested?
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm telling you every single time it has happened.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_03: So their bodies are now not being able to respond.
• 7:16
  SPEAKER_03: There's confusion, there's like a lot of conflict that happens when there's been some kind of sexual violation, especially if it's directed at the genitals or any like obvious sexual parts, right?
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_03: So then their bodies don't respond the same.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_03: And then sometimes those triggers pop up, and then all you feel is revulsion, and you don't really want to go there.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_03: So, how do I start a conversation?
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_03: Is sometimes I go bold with them to help them unlock like what is stopping you.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_03: And sometimes I go, just depends on the person.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_03: Sometimes I go soft.
• 7:46
  SPEAKER_03: Let's learn some words.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_03: Do you even know what oral sex is?
• 7:49
  SPEAKER_03: Because I've worked with women and I worked with a woman in her 70s who her and her husband were struggling a lot uh with intimacy, physical intimacy, and intimacy in general.
• 8:01
  SPEAKER_03: So I'm not when I talk intimacy, it's not uh penetration sex.
• 8:05
  SPEAKER_03: We're talking about creating intimacy.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_03: And she uh was afraid of oral sex, completely afraid of it, um, for different reasons.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_03: For I think a lot of it was what she was raised to think that it was disgusting.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_03: She thought it was all kinds of things, right?
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_03: So she um she also didn't want to touch the penis because that was disgusting to her, too.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: So for her, her whole sex life just involved somebody sticking their penis into her vagina, and that was sex.
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_03: So if that was your sex life, how enjoyable would that be?
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_03: Pretty zero to me.
• 8:43
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_03: So if it's never been good and you don't know any different, where do you go from there?
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_03: Even like figuring out words, even saying oral sex to her, she would just flush red and she's like, I don't know what to do with that.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_03: And she was hoping that I would have like the magic pill or here's the magic lube.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, no, this is bigger than that.
• 9:03
  SPEAKER_03: There's a lack of communication, there's probably been a lack of consent because there's a lot of things, especially with older women, where they've been bought into the idea that you're obligated.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_03: You need to lie down and take it.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_03: And there's, you know, there's a lot of um references in a lot of different uh religious texts that would tell you you're supposed to submit, but they don't read the other parts that say that that the husband is also to submit.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_03: They they neglect those parts.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_03: They only go for the parts that that would affect um, you know, that that would affect their choice.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_03: So I think a lot of that there's trauma that can be either, you know, we can have all those sexual traumas that can happen, we can have religious traumas that prevent you from even being able to like open up.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_03: And all of these things culminate.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_03: You're like 40 and you've lived your whole life thinking all these things are wrong and bad, and only sick people do that.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_03: And they don't realize that between two consenting adults who have communicated about it and have agreed on whatever they're doing, it's all good as long as there's consent and communication.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_03: To me, there's like three main C's like consent, communication, and curiosity.
• 10:19
  SPEAKER_03: And with those, you can have a really fun sex life.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_03: And even if you're you know, you feel like you've dried up like a prune, if you've got some curiosity, you're gonna be able to figure out other things that are a turn-on beyond you know, penetrative sex, which can also become difficult for men during andropause.
• 10:40
  SPEAKER_03: So that's a whole other thing to look at, too, is who you know, the pressure to try and perform can be really hard.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_00: One of the things that we get asked a lot about is people who say they've had a healthy, enjoyable, fun sex life with their partner, and then they reach a certain age, whether it be mid-40s, early 50s, and they just don't feel like it anymore, don't feel the same way or the same urges.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_00: I know you said that many of your clients actually come to you and they they do still have urge urge urges and they're feeling hornier than ever.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_00: But what about those women who feel as though they've got the three C's or had the three C's and then the three C's have kind of stopped?
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I would chalk that up to evaluating how great did you actually think it was?
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_03: Because a lot of times we're like, it was great.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, okay, if it was so great, then what happened?
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_03: Because most of the time when you I actually have an example that just happened recently was a relationship where two people were like, the sex is great, we love it, blah, blah.
• 11:45
  SPEAKER_03: They ended up actually getting they're going through a divorce because the only thing they had that they thought was good was sex, and actually it wasn't good.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_03: And when I when I looked when I was working with them, I was like, wow, these guys are they're actually lying to themselves.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_03: I didn't say that to them, I let them realize it on their own.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_03: But they were lying to themselves and that they were desperately holding on to the good sex uh to make sure that they had a good relationship and they weren't willing to look at, you know, was it fully consensual?
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_03: Were they fully able to ask for everything they desire?
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_03: Was their partner responsive to that?
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_03: Because they could have a great sex life because they think that their partner is offering something to them, but they haven't actually worked with different kinds of consent.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_03: And I love there's um, there's actually a book called uh, I think it's called uh gifting and the art of gifting and receiving the wheel of consent.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_03: And it's quite amazing at looking at the four different kinds of consent.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_03: So whether we're just allowing our partner to do whatever they want and we just accept it, that's like acceptance, right?
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_03: Um, which happens 99% of the time is like there's no, would you please do this for me?
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_03: I would really enjoy this, or I would really enjoy that, and thank you so much for doing this for me.
• 13:02
  SPEAKER_03: Or a partner saying, May I to you and may I, you know, may I touch your shoulder.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_03: And if your partner says no, then it's not to get offended.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_03: So having this like open dialogue during the actual act can actually change things a lot.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_03: But if you've been doing things by rote, and a lot of people do that, and they think it's been great because they've been doing the same thing forever, and they probably have the three main positions.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I kind of joke about that.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_03: I'm like, so you've gone missionary, you've gone doggy style, and on a rare occasion you might ride in cowboy.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_03: But you probably have your three main things, but beyond that, like how much foreplay and core play have you had?
• 13:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and foreplay, people usually chalk that up to about 10 minutes, but core play is like what you live, like your whole day, building up to your whole day.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_03: So if you've lost interest in your partner, are they fulfilling your love languages?
• 13:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like, are they actually giving you words of affirmation on a regular basis?
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_03: Are they having quality time with you?
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_03: Or is the only time you're getting together is to have your half an hour of planned sex?
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_03: Like, if that's the case, then you're not necessarily going to feel connected to your partner.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_03: That's another big C that's required.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_03: When connection starts to get lost, like you know, that happens in the internet.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_03: Things get fuzzy.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_03: And when the connection gets lost and things get fuzzy, we're like, but wait a second, there's still a connection, but the connection is fuzzy, so we need to get clarity, another good C, on what's causing that, another good C.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_00: But the C word is running rife, isn't it?
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yes, indeed.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_03: I do love the C word, but we're not gonna say that C word here.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_01: Not not not just yet, but I I find this feel interesting because I think there's there's a big difference between sex and intimacy, and like you were saying, the that intimacy and that communication that needs to happen for people to feel truly connected and and comfortable being intimate with each other.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_01: And I I I find that in our generation, certainly, a lot of these things have been so taboo, we don't even talk about down there, right?
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_01: We can't say vagina, we can't say clitoris, we can't say, you know, we have to we have to have little funny nicknames for our body parts because for some reason there's shame around that.
• 15:27
  SPEAKER_01: So imagine trying to, we can't talk about our own biology.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_01: Imagine trying to carry that into a conversation about sex and intimacy.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_01: So it makes sense that that would be really difficult.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, especially when things are changing.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_01: So so here's a question: if the brain doesn't feel safe, we know that the body isn't gonna say yes, right?
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_01: You were saying past traumas and and processing these things.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_01: What are I know you start with the communication, huh?
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_03: So the brain, even if the brain doesn't feel safe, the body sometimes responds, which is problematic.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_03: That's what happens sometimes during being violated, right?
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_03: Your brain will say, No, no, I don't want this, but your body is being stimulated, and just as a response to stimulation, your body doesn't know the difference, and it just has stimulated stimulation happening, which creates a lot of um confusion when it comes to like uh we'll call it grape cases, I think.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_03: So this can go out on social media.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_03: Um that is that is a huge issue.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_03: So then your body's been stimulated, you've said no, and every time after that, your brain has been trained to think that whatever happens, you just have to surrender to it, even though you don't want to, because you're in a situation that you could die if you fought or something like that, right?
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_03: So um, so that even though your brain says no, your body might still react.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_03: That's the very confusing part.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I imagine that is extremely difficult to navigate through because we're at the end of the day, we're animals, right?
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and that's that's how biology, that's how biology works.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um, do you have any other favorite sort of downshift rituals to to calm the nervous system, to sort of bring the mind and body in into sync?
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I'm a big fan of being a solo practitioner before you bring it into partnership, so this can apply to anybody.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_03: Uh to get your brain into sync is to actually give yourself remission.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_03: And and I say this because I I did these things on my own, and then I later realized that they were like, I think some of them were actually written in some books, and I was like, wow, look at me being congruent with authors who have studied things.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_03: But um, to get myself out of trauma, because I was I was violated in my life, and I needed to be able to navigate how to get out of that, and um I wasn't gonna let that be my uh defining factor of who I am, and I also thought that short span of time in my life, I don't want that to rule my life.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_03: That was like three hours of my life.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_03: That shouldn't be my definition, right?
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_03: So what I personally did was started to ask myself permission.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_03: I know this is gonna sound wacky, but to calm down and to get into my own groove, I would be like, hey body, is it okay if I put my hand like right here on my chest?
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I was like, whoa, it was really a weird thing to uh start to ask myself permission because I needed to retrust myself and to know that what I was asking me, myself and my body, because it's you know, I'm my soul to me, and my body is this thing I wear, like a piece of clothes.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_03: So, in order to integrate those, I needed to start having a conversation with my body to see what it was okay with, and then to also see like what body would what would you like?
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_03: Because my brain might like want one thing, and my body will say, you know what, not ready for that.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_03: But my brain's like, no, just get over it.
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_03: So it's to figure out how to because there's so many parts of us that will they they're not gonna be in align with each other.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_03: So, how do you get in alignment?
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_03: Is start to ask the questions of whatever is going on, right?
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_03: So ask your body, body, would you like to be touched?
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_03: And how would you like to be touched?
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_03: Because most of us have no clue.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, we assume that there's like one kind of touch, and it's like, oh, some kind of like rubbing thing, and you're like, that that doesn't work for me.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_03: So, what kind of touch are there?
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_03: And there's really great references to different kinds of uh playful experimental ways to touch.
• 19:50
  SPEAKER_03: Um, one is a woman named Jaya, and she does the touch blueprint, and you five different kinds of touch, and those are fabulous ways to figure out what you actually like, and you might like a combination of things, and and then being able to say that to you.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_03: So once you know when you've tried it with yourself, then when you meet a partner, you can say, you know what?
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_03: I discovered about me is I really, really like when somebody um just can like hover over my body, and I like that heat between hands.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_03: I actually really like that like heat between um bodies, so it's more energetic than anything.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_03: And uh I love the intensity of energetic touch.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, where some people like the intensity of having like deep massage, that doesn't work for me at all.
• 20:34
  SPEAKER_03: So when somebody's like, I'll massage you, yeah.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_03: No, please don't.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_03: That don't go with what everybody says.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_03: Massage your partner.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_03: No, they might not like it.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_03: So know what you like and then be able to say what you like.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_03: And those things are not um so life-threatening in a way to say, you know what, just start with like let's touch hands and see how I respond to the touch on my hand before even heading off to the genitals or the breasts or anything that would be our obvious things.
• 21:03
  SPEAKER_03: Let's start on the parts of the body that aren't so obvious that might not be so triggering, and then work your way there.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_03: And it might take you a day, it might take you a year, but just take your time and honor your partner as they give you feedback, like, yeah, that's good.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_03: I'm good right here, but don't go any further.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_03: And then and do that for yourself, too.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_01: It just reminds me so much of the line of Monty Python and the meaning of life.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_01: No need to go stampeding for the strength for the clitoris.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_02: That's right.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_00: As is the nature of conversation, we've kind of moved around from different subjects here through different areas of stuff that I think is really, really interesting.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: But for somebody who is looking to move their sex life back in a direction that they feel comfortable with, do you have a series of steps that you take cliently?
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_00: To or a process, what would what would be the first thing they do?
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_00: Is it self-exploration?
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_00: Is that what it's always self-exploration?
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_00: Or is it in introspection first?
• 22:09
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I suppose what comes to picking all the egg is a kind of depends on the person.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_03: So if there's a person who's coming to me who's very self-introspective and they do a lot of journaling, um, they know things, but they don't know have any tools, physical tools to deal with that, then I'll be like, okay, let's go on to you doing self-exploration with touch, and and then maybe go watch some movies and see what you find intriguing.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I'll usually like recommend a pile of different things to watch that aren't like pornography, but they might see different sex scenes that intrigue them.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_03: And um, it really depends.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_03: I I treat everybody so individually.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_03: I don't do protocol because I I don't think people fit into protocols well.
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and I I can see that there are certain protocols that can work, like get your blood work done and then let's look at things like that.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_03: I can get that, but then after that, it's all free-for-all.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so so yeah, it really depends on the individual and how do you get back to your sex life as you get back to you.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_03: Because your sex life includes you.
• 23:16
  SPEAKER_03: And most of the time, if you've excluded you, then your sex life goes to Pooh.
• 23:22
  SPEAKER_03: So your desires aren't included, your even everything in your daily life, if it's all about everybody else, then you're not even including you in that.
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, I'm I'm you know, driving Joey to the hockey game.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_03: I don't do hockey, by the way.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_03: But I'm dry, you know, doing all these things for the kids, I'm doing all these things for my husband.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_03: And then the martyrs, the whole like martyr syndrome kicks in, and it's like, I do everything for everybody, and nobody does anything for me.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_03: And then the anger and resentment kicks in.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_03: Well, that's just guiding you down a path to uh what the Gottmans would call the four horsemen of the apocalypse.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_03: So that would be, yeah, we don't want to go there.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_03: Um, we want to be able to get into all these different ways of having strong communication, and that's actually the key to really good sex is great communication.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_03: And 99% of the time, that's what's lacking.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, even just to get back to where you were at.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_01: Well, and I we talk a lot about self-care, and that's such a buzzword.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_01: I don't really like to use it, but right now I don't have a better term.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_01: But we talk a lot about setting aside that time to actually prioritize yourself, you know, all the metaphors you can't pour from an empty cup, etc., etc.
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it's true.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: It's very true.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_03: And designating, you know, people are like, well, who has the time for that?
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_03: Well, if you are not willing to set a time aside half an hour to have a conversation with your partner, then you don't want to invest in the relationship.
• 25:02
  SPEAKER_03: What are you doing in it?
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_03: I I usually throw it out that simply, and people then go, Oh, I'm like, so your partner is not worth half an hour of your time, and you and your marriage is not worth half an hour of your time.
• 25:16
  SPEAKER_03: That says a lot about you and your character and what you think and what you value.
• 25:21
  SPEAKER_03: And sometimes I I do kind of get to a point where I kind of stab and jab people to wake them up.
• 25:26
  unknown: Yeah.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not like I'm not like a soft coach.
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_03: I feel so sorry for you.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_03: No, wake up.
• 25:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and the truth is if you're not willing to invest the time, how can you expect things to ever get any better, right?
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:48
  SPEAKER_01: So I've I've got a fun question, or at least it might be a fun question.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um first toy roadmap.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_03: A toy roadmap.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_03: Okay.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_01: Like if somebody is curious and they feel a little bit, I don't know, about sex toys, like, where do you recommend they start?
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_03: So I used to sell sex toys.
• 26:16
  SPEAKER_03: So I did have I did do a lot of um, I was one of those like people who would come to your house and do those parties.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_03: So, first thing I I want to know about people is where do you find you get your best stimulation from?
• 26:30
  SPEAKER_03: Do you like clitoral stimulation?
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_03: Do you like vaginal stimulation?
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_03: Do you like anal stimulation?
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_03: Do you like all three?
• 26:36
  SPEAKER_03: Because there are toys that will stimulate all three.
• 26:39
  SPEAKER_03: Do you and then do you like to change if you're if you're masturbating with your hands, do you like to change the speed and the pressure?
• 26:48
  SPEAKER_03: Because then you'll want a different kind of toy that has different speeds, levels, and pressures.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_03: And then you also want to know do they have things like allergies, right?
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_03: So, some toys, if you're allergic to silicone, you definitely don't want a silicone toy.
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_03: And um, there are jelly toys out there, they're more like a jelly material.
• 27:06
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not a fan of those.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_03: They hold like a lot of bacteria, even when you clean them with the right stuff.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_03: And they degrade really fast too.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_03: If they're touching other products, they'll degrade fast.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_03: And storing them and cleaning them is important for first-timers with toys.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_03: So size will matter with toys too.
• 27:23
  SPEAKER_03: My first toy, I didn't have any of that knowledge, and I just went for what everybody was saying.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_03: Go buy the rabbit.
• 27:29
  SPEAKER_03: And the rabbit overwhelmed me.
• 27:31
  SPEAKER_03: I just I was like, what do I even?
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_03: I I passed out.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_03: I was like overly stimulated.
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_03: And I think my boyfriend at the time thought I might have been like electrocuted or something.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_03: He came in, he's like, Are you okay?
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_03: I was like, I don't even, I don't even know what just happened.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_03: That was like too much for me.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, and it depends on too, if you want to have partner play with them, so you can have remote controls and um all kinds of great different things.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_03: You know, you can have like the uh the panty vibrators where you're like going out to dinner because you guys are getting kinky and now you're trying to turn your partner on at dinner.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_03: Like it just depends on what you guys are into.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_03: And for your first toy, though, yeah, mostly how do you like to be stimulated is a number one.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_03: And then what kind of feelings of the um the material do you like?
• 28:16
  SPEAKER_03: And always, always keep them clean and store them properly so that you know, like who wants to go for a jelly sex toy that we you know you threw under your bed and then there's cat hair all over it?
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_03: Ow, like gross.
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_03: So store them properly.
• 28:33
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just gonna give you a really gross example just to make you think about storing them properly, keeping them clean.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_01: That's true though, because we do have a microbiome in our yeah in our private area, so we need to, you know, as much in the in the vagina and the and the intimate areas as we do inside the gut.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_01: So we have to look after those things.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and then one other question, because I know a lot of women in this phase of life um start having some aches and pains in places they didn't used to before for various reasons.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: Um what are some positions that might be a bit more comfy or like pillows and props that can help make that a bit more comfortable?
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so I think uh so depending on the situation, if a woman has like vulvadinia or vaginismus, um, I would want to look further into what's going on in case there is something medically going on there.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um it's it's not common that there is.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_03: Usually, what again, if you get to this the the true history of that person, there usually is uh stored trauma in there, and then doing different things to get that out first, and then do any position you like.
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but if if there are, yeah, I do like props, different pillows and things, and there are like specialty sofas out there that are really cool.
• 29:52
  SPEAKER_03: They're like they have like an S curve and you can do different things with them so you're more comfortable.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_03: They're about$700.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, so if you want to invest in something like that.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: Um, yeah, though, and they're and then they have like washable fabrics on them and they're lovely.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_03: And you can do they're sometimes sold as yoga sofas.
• 30:10
  SPEAKER_03: But they're so they're not really yoga sofas, they just help you stretch in different ways, and um, so those can be handy, especially if you need more support.
• 30:22
  SPEAKER_03: And but to me, I I'm like the queen of doggy style.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_03: Like that is my favorite all-time position of all time.
• 30:31
  SPEAKER_03: So I think everybody just needs to know what is your favorite position.
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_03: And if you can't get in that anymore, um, let's find out why.
• 30:39
  SPEAKER_03: Have you had hip surgery?
• 30:40
  SPEAKER_03: Has something happened?
• 30:41
  SPEAKER_03: Can we support your body in different ways?
• 30:44
  SPEAKER_03: And if you've had some kind of surgery, um, getting some fun things involved, like sex swings, so that you can actually hoist your body is really fun.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um, when you look into sex swings, though, some of the like low-end ones are awful.
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_03: Um tried them, they actually like cut into your flesh.
• 31:03
  SPEAKER_03: They're not made for a body that's more than a size two.
• 31:06
  SPEAKER_03: So you want to kind of like get ones that are better, stronger.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_03: And it's helpful to have a husband in construction who can like find the support beam and you know put it in the right place so you don't tear your ceiling down.
• 31:21
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_01: Say quality matters, right?
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, yeah, quality and these things you do want to get quality, especially with toys.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not a fan of getting like that ten dollar toy that's gonna degrade.
• 31:31
  SPEAKER_03: Get the ones, too, that are rechargeable because those batteries, too, if you leave them in there too long.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_03: Oh man, I wouldn't want to stick that in my body.
• 31:41
  SPEAKER_03: So yeah, luckily, most of them now are rechargeable.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, support systems of any kind.
• 31:48
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, there's so many out there.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_03: Swings, slings, you name it, they're so great.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_00: We we've talked about a heck of a lot of stuff, and half an hour's flown past.
• 31:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I sense we could be on here for an absolute age.
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_00: I wonder if you could just if you could distill things down, if you could say either one thing to every woman in the world or change one thing for everything, every woman in the world, what would that be?
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_00: What would be the defining thing that could almost negate you doing your job if you could make that happen?
• 32:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm not trying to put you out of work, by the way.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_03: I think if every single person realized that they are allowed to have pleasure, that would just change their reality.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_03: So many people have decided that they don't deserve it.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 32:36
  SPEAKER_00: That's really interesting.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_03: And pleasure can be in many ways, right?
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_03: It's like not walking around with a stomachache or a headache and having your body just be in a state of joy.
• 32:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, if we all had that, would we even need any of us as health coaches?
• 32:50
  SPEAKER_03: No.
• 32:53
  SPEAKER_03: No, you're allowed to have joy and you're allowed to make the choices that bring you that.
• 32:58
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: Amazing.
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_00: Well, thank you so much for bringing some Sass and Science to the podcast this week.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: My pleasure.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: Really, really super interesting.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_00: As Julie said at the beginning of the show, if you want support putting some of this stuff into practice, gates to our, or the doors rather, to our club Fabulous Beyond 40 are currently open for new members.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_00: You get live coaching, you get monthly guests experts like the fantastic Malicia and a community that gets it too.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_00: So it's club.fabulousbeyond40.com, and we'll pop that in the show notes as well, as well as details of Malicia and what she does and how you can get in touch with her.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for being here today.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_01: I always love our conversations.
• 33:40
  SPEAKER_03: Well, thank you for inviting me and having me.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely amazing.
• 33:43
  SPEAKER_00: So we're coaches James and Julia, Fabulous Beyond 40, reminding you to stay strong and stay fabulous, and we'll see you next time.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_00: Take care.