Latest / Coach Speak The Return / Episode 7 - Jordan Ebbs

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Episode 7 - Jordan Ebbs · Coach Speak The Return

• Matt Seidl: Hello everybody and welcome back to the pod. I'm Matt Seidel. Josh Trope is here as well, and we are excited to be joined by Jordan Ebbs, Director of the Academy in O three basketball. Jordan, thanks for coming on and how are things with you? The Academy by O3: Great. Thanks for having me. Been looking forward to it. Matt Seidl: All right. I know Josh has been Josh has been excited once he connected with you and said you were gonna be on. So we've been trying to get a time. Thanks for coming on late on a Sunday. But so Jordan, I will say this. while a lot The Academy by O3: I mean this this works. Matt Seidl: of people in the area I think they know your name, I think they know the program The Academy by O3: Mm-hmm. Matt Seidl: that you run, but if we ask a lot of them, they might not know exactly kind of like what your journey was as a as a player, both in high school and college. Can you kind of break that down for us a little bit? The Academy by O3: Yeah, that makes sense 'cause I'm not from here. I grew up in West Palm Beach, Florida. I went to Palm Beach Central High School, which is a six A school down there. They have very massive schools down there. I originally signed with Claflin University in Orangeburg, South Carolina. Ended up taking a medical red shirt and then transferred to Jackson College 'cause you know, back in the day you go from one university, you don't get to just go to the next university like these kids get Josh: Ha ha ha. The Academy by O3: to. So I had to go down and play at a junior college, which later on in life I realized was the best thing for me. nineteen year old Jordan didn't think that, right? So I I went into Jackson College with, you know, an ego and, you know, I'm not gonna say I was super highly recruited out of high school, but I had lots of options and, you know, blinked my f you know, snapped my fingers and I'm in Jackson, Michigan, playing at a D two JUCO. And it's not an you know Slap in the face, but it was a reality check. And then I quickly realized that hey, everybody has a story here. And that they were phenomenal players that I got to play alongside with. And, you know, even from coaching junior college basketball, you know, they talk about you're there for one of the three S's. And one of them is schooling. You know, either you didn't have the grades, another maybe skill where you lacked a certain skill. And then the third is the situation. And I quickly realized that majority of the players there are. are for the situation, whether it was taking care of a sibling, whether it was a sick parent, whether it was a troubled childhood and maybe needed to mature a little bit more. So I had the chance to do that at Jackson College. I had a great two years. ended up averaging a double double my sophomore year. I led the state in rebounds finished with all honors, all conference player. had a chance to continue my career and receive a scholarship to play at University of Texas and Permian Basin and Odessa, Texas. so a lot of culture shocks, right? So Florida Josh: Yeah. The Academy by O3: to South Carolina to Michigan to Texas are four extremely different states. and I loved it. And you know, I I wouldn't trade it. and I also played at lots of different levels in college basketball. So I think that's always stuck with me. You know, I'm a big advocate of With kids playing junior college basketball. I think it shaped who I was. It gave me an opportunity to learn how to balance the schoolwork along with you know being a college athlete. It's not it's not an easy go. And we had my first coach was Steve Finimore, rest in peace. And my second coach was John Willis. And John Willis, we were 5 a.m. If you're not there at 520, practice, you are running, and we did mm. Matt Seidl: Mm-hmm. The Academy by O3: Five thirty miles every Friday we did. You know, I mean the stuff he had us doing was insane, right? And it set me up for when I went and played at the university. I played for Dwayne Osborne, who's at Youngstown State, another military style coach. so I've taken everything from all those coaches, but I've definitely had a unique personal career that's kind of shaped me and shaped the way that I coach now. Matt Seidl: Cool man. Josh: Yeah. Yeah. Hey I know John and I knew Steve well and I mean two two great men too. I mean very different The Academy by O3: Mm-hmm. Josh: but but act both excellent men in in their different ways. So Yeah, they are very different. Yeah, that's for sure. Yeah. The Academy by O3: That's a great way to put it. They are very different. In the in their best ways. They I mean it was like a it was a culture shock. We were, you know, we were excited for change. We love things about Fintimore, but when Willis came around we were like, this is we are we're getting after it. So yeah, it was a good time. Josh: I love it. That's great to hear. Well, and I I love obviously, you know, you're great at what you do in your program and everything, but it's you know, what a great perspective to give to players in your program too, because you played at all those different levels and and you didn't have as they The Academy by O3: Mm-hmm. Josh: would say a normal path, you know. And so it's it's great for you The Academy by O3: Right. Josh: to be able to speak to the kids about that. when did you start the program? The Academy by O3: I you know, I didn't have like aspirations of coaching and training right away. Like I didn't know this is what I was gonna do. as soon as I finished playing college basketball, I moved back up to Michigan and there's a place called One on One Athletic Club in Ann Arbor, and there was a program being ran out of it called a DSL Sports. And I was going up there to just work on my own game because I was still like, Hey, am I gonna go play overseas? I just came off of MCL tear and I met couple guys who play overseas and they were there training kids and I said, Hey, you know, this looks good. I could make a couple of bucks and that just kind of one kid turned into two to three to now I have a team and then that program kind of fell apart. The guy ended up getting another job who ran it. And that's when it was like two thousand and fourteen I started Ann Arbor Basketball Academy. And I had a couple teams. I was renting gyms. you know I really specialized in really High school players at that time, getting them to college. And were part of the Adidas Gold Circuit back then. And then my last year, when I ran that program, we went to New York to LA. And that's when I met my business partner now, John Kronberg, who runs O3 basketball and O three sports. And we're just a good merch. You know, we complemented each other very well. Like I said, I worked with the older kids on like an elite level. He was phenomenal at younger kids at after school stuff. summer camps, just a very knowledgeable person. And we realized, hey, if we merge together, we'll have like an umbrella system where we have something for you, no matter your age or skill level, that will have something for you. And for me it was a no brainer. along with having a very nice facility, which was one of my big biggest obstacles in running the program was having a place to consistently run it, right? Especially when I have Josh: Yep. The Academy by O3: kids driving from an hour away and then you get to the gym and maybe it's cancelled or maybe there's a volleyball event going and so it's been great. We're coming up on almost about ten years together now and so yeah. Josh: It's awesome. What what ages do you guys cover then? The Academy by O3: really kindergarten through twelfth, but we do Josh: Okay. The Academy by O3: really start teams in about third grade. You know, kindergarten through second, we do more development leagues and keep here with us. we're even third and fourth grade gets diff the obstacles we face are we don't really have that many teams to compete against. So since we're a travel program, we're not allowed in like the big cat league or some of those leagues where it's community based. so there's not a whole lot of other programs for us to play consistently. So we start teams officially in third grade, but it's more for them to get used to practicing twice a week and, you know, just get some type of rhythm going by the time they're in fifth and sixth, then they'll go on and compete a little bit more. Matt Seidl: You kinda like Josh when you got kids from all over the place. Probably shouldn't be playing against community teams. I just I kinda thanks for teeing that one up for me, Jordan. But so I don't know if you remember this. This The Academy by O3: Yeah, I got you. Matt Seidl: would have been twenty eighteen. my son, I think, was kind of lined up. H we The Academy by O3: Mm-hmm. Matt Seidl: made a connection with you. We were gonna kinda like co-coach a team in your program. It was called it was called AABA. I used to call it ABBA. All the outsiders called ABBA, like it's some kind of musical group or something. But The Academy by O3: Yep. Yeah. Matt Seidl: And then it that 15U The Academy by O3: Dancing queen, yeah. Matt Seidl: team I think kind of fell through. But you guys have grown. I mean, since then it the evolution of your whole program. But what what components do you have underneath that umbrella that you alluded to? Like it's it's not just travel teams. There's some other components that you have, right? The Academy by O3: Yeah, no, that's a great question. we really operate off of like five pillars here. So one is what we already spoke on, which is the club and travel teams. And this is year round. Like our programs year round. This is what I do full time. you know, we run teams pretty much year round except the fall. We kinda slow down a little and that's mostly because we don't want to compete with kids playing football. I want kids to play football. We don't I don't want to miss my fall weekends in Michigan. It's the only good time of the year. And we just do a little more developing in the fall, but club teams, travel teams are one pillar. Another pillar is our academy training program, which is a year-round program that offers small group training sessions so kids can come in multiple times a week without having to schedule it and they could just drop in and train. and then they have open gyms each week as well. that's been a really big hit for us. And then our third pillar is our our leagues and clinics. So we run like a player development league, we run development leagues, we run like a shoot six week shooting course. our fourth is private lessons, which is pretty self explanatory. And then our fifth is our summer camps. So our summer camps, we usually run about ten to twelve camps per summer. One of the big ones being our Fab Five camp, which we are done for ten years now. this last year we had to max it out at a hundred and twenty kids. It's a great opportunity for kids to be in the gym all week, but also meet some of these legends and Matt Seidl: Mm-hmm. The Academy by O3: It's more like ten years ago the kids kinda knew who they were and they still do, but now they come in and they're like, Is that Jalen Rose? I'm like, No, that's Gabe Damie, he's a coach of mine. Like they have no idea Josh: Ha ha. The Academy by O3: who some of these guys are. So it's cool it's a cool chance for them to learn the history of the Fab Five and and meet those guys and we tell to go home and watch the thirty for thirty on them and to skip certain parts 'cause there'll be a little graphic for them. But it is it Matt Seidl: Right, yeah. The Academy by O3: is it's great, great opportunity for them to I'm gonna get some autographs and take some pictures and have some some guys. I mean, they do such a great job at just speaking to the kids and letting them know like what it really takes to, you know, not just be a great basketball player, but be a great human. So they're awesome. So yeah, we operate Matt Seidl: Beautiful. Great man. The Academy by O3: really off of those five and they and they keep me busy. Matt Seidl: A but Josh: yeah. Well, anytime anybody achieves greatness, there's roadblocks and potholes along the way. What has been the most challenging part of running your program? The Academy by O3: great question. And I I mean it's it's it's an easy one to answer because it's it's my biggest hurdle that I face and I face it twice a year, which is making cuts. You know, so the more that I grow, or the more that we grow, I should say, the more players want to come and try it for our teams. So that means I'm breaking we're breaking more people's hearts. There's then there's this balance of You know, you have these players who've been with you for two, three, four years who you love the parents, you get along with great, you see that the kid is improving, the kid has a great relationship with his coach, like everything seems like it's working perfectly fine. But then all of sudden here comes this new kid who would elevate the program and who also seems to have a great parent and also seems to be very respectful. And how do you stay true and loyal to both parties? And do I want to have this reputation of just picking returning players every year and not growing my program? and it's not so and so's fault that this parents just moved here, right? So it's like I wanna stay true to everybody. but then I always face, you know, a lot of disappointed families and disappointed kids because I have to enforce, you know, I we we d I take roster management very serious, right? I don't put twelve, thirteen kids on a team. So You know, a couple years ago it would be a tryout for one team and we're gonna put ten on at max and there'd be twenty, twenty-five kids. Now there's over fifty. So now, Matt Seidl: Mm. The Academy by O3: you know, during that week and then it's from third grade to twelfth grade. So like my wife will tell you, like, I'm a different person during that week. I call it my hell week. I try hard not to take it home, but I do. Like she knows that she made a joke the other day, it's like you need to go to a hotel after tryouts because Matt Seidl: Yeah. The Academy by O3: you're not in a good mood. And But it's difficult because you know it's it's not just the feedback, because of course I get that. And I've been able to tune that out a little better the more that I've done this. but the issue is that it's the quantity of people that I'm disappointing now almost, right? Before it'd be hey, there's these five families throughout our program that have been with us that I had to cut. Now it's like 15, 20 of them now. And they're people who came to your baby showers or are friends with my son at school and you know, so it's it's it's a very, very big challenge and it's unique because a lot of other businesses don't have to do this, right? So like if I owned a restaurant or owned a t-shirt company, the more clients, the better I wanna help everybody out. I'm not turning anybody down. With my business, it's the better I do, the more I'm turning people down. So that's Josh: Right. The Academy by O3: that's a challenge and it's never gonna go anywhere. And I think it's just I need to just Matt Seidl: Okay. The Academy by O3: focus on you know, the opportunities that other kids did get, right? There's kids who are on our practice team for multiple years and they finally made the team. Or there's kids who got cut three years in a row and you see him walk in, but he's bigger and he's moving better Matt Seidl: Ha ha ha. The Academy by O3: and now he's on the team. So it's it's it's it's you know, I have to balance what I give the energy to. but as you guys know, I mean you guys deal with parents a lot. Not every every parent thinks their kid is deserving of the spot for the most part. And during that that try out cut week. My inbox is flooded with a bunch of exclamation marks and it's just, you know, it's just what I have to deal with. But yeah, that Josh: Yep, I Matt Seidl: Well, it it I mean it it it The Academy by O3: that's the biggest challenge. Matt Seidl: it's tough for, you know, high school coach, but it's just once a year for a high school coach. You know, you like you just said The Academy by O3: Mm-hmm. Matt Seidl: you had to do it twice and then I think the the the volume The Academy by O3: Yeah. Matt Seidl: of it sounds like it's greater and and you still get relationships with kids. Yeah, that's I can I can only imagine. So but with obstacles I guess also comes reward. Or if there weren't some rewards you wouldn't be doing this and wouldn't be in this business. So what do you get out of this? What's The Academy by O3: For sure. Matt Seidl: the what's the most rewarding thing to you? The Academy by O3: Yeah, the rewards definitely outweigh it, right? I think what's unique about being a AAU coach and director is the amount of time I get to spend with some of these kids and families, right? So, you know, I've coached high school basketball, Matt Seidl: Okay. The Academy by O3: I've coached college basketball. What's different here is, you know, I have kids that I've coached literally from like third grade to twelfth grade. Right. That's a long time to be in somebody's life and to be in the driver's seat of their basketball journey. And, you know, just yesterday I was at the Michigan game and I ran into three or four kids who are now in their early twenties, but I remember them as a fourth grader. And you know, you get to really get to know the kids, you get to see them on their best days, you get to see them on their worst days, you get to see them mature and on and off the court. and then you just build lifelong lessons. You know, I've been invited to so many different weddings. I've been able to grow close with people who have trusted me with their kids. And I mean that's the ultimate flex as you could call it is someone trusting you with their kids, right? So I I enjoy Matt Seidl: For sure. The Academy by O3: that unique and that Josh: Yep. what advice if if The Academy by O3: Sorry, what did you say? Josh: I'm sorry. I said what what if you if you could give any advice to players and families in The Academy by O3: Mm-hmm. Josh: your programs that wanna play at the next level, what's the advice you would give them? What's what should be their focus or or just in general, what advice would you give them if they want to play at the next level? The Academy by O3: Yeah, I mean that's a great question. And I think we all know the the cliche right now is to talk about how the college landscape has changed and that, you know, it's it's a lot. It's the wild, wild rest right right now. And I think one of the you know, one things we have to realize is like the timing of the way that kids get recruited nowadays. Juniors and under are not getting recruited right now. Like if you're getting if you have an offer as a junior or younger, you are in the one percent and This is not to be a wet blanket, but the chance Matt Seidl: Yeah. The Academy by O3: of even that offer holding up by the time you're done with your senior year is very slim, right? Because there's lots of variables, right? Coaches are leaving schools. there are new opportunities to get new players. so it doesn't make a whole lot of sense for a college coach, even a junior college coach, to spend time and actively recruit a junior in high school. Because what we're doing is we're looking at the transfer portal of kids who thought they were gonna go D one and didn't get to go D one. Right. We're looking at the junior college players who are all Americans who want to transfer out of their junior college because they want to be on a winning team or they want to be for it with a coach who's better off getting kids to the next level. So the idea of of college coaches spending time on sixteen, seventeen year olds is it's pretty rare, right? So I think the advice I would give to you is to Stay the course, you know, be where your feet are at. Don't panic. Control the controllables, right? And those are your grades, right? You've got to show that you're mature in the classroom. You can't be a risk, right? Your body, you've got to show that, hey, I can compete with guys that are four or five years older than me. So you've got to have some muscle mass. You've got to be able to play off two feet. You've just you've got to be able to win position and hold a guy off in a box out. and then third is I think more off the court. Like you gotta be a good communicator. You've gotta show that, hey, I'm not a normal eighteen or nineteen year old, right? That I come from a good family or at least I have good communication skills. I'm very serious about this. I'm not gonna be a problem for you. You're not gonna regret recruiting me. So I think you control those three things first, but then I also think that you just are realistic in the back of your mind and say, Hey, I'm not panicking. I don't have an offer. Yes, you know, Jace from Grand Rapids has a big offer, or so Matt Seidl: Mm-hmm. The Academy by O3: and so had You know, this kid just got an offer, but the idea of that is like, hey, they're one percent. And that doesn't mean by the time you're not you're done with your senior year, you can't be a division one player or you can't have offers that are very meaningful to you. It's just the timing of it, right? So I think kids and parents both need to understand that you know, you gotta put yourself in a college coach's shoes. Are you gonna invest in all your time in a seventeen Matt Seidl: Yeah. The Academy by O3: year old or a twenty two year old? Josh: Right. No, I I yeah, I know the how I'd answer that, Matt Seidl: I appreciate you bringing up the communication piece too, man. Like that that's just that's that's just a lost art, heck with The Academy by O3: Mm. Matt Seidl: young adults, let alone high school age kids. So I think that's it's a big big point of emphasis, I'm sure. So The Academy by O3: Well, I s I see it even like with Yeah, thanks. I see it even with like my elite runs that I run on Sundays, which I kinda allow kids to, hey, DM me if you want to join, send me some information on you, whether it's like your AAU program that you played for or like a Huddle link or whatever, you know, we'll max out and then I'll have twenty unread messages and I'm like, Hey, maybe I can have room for one or two more. So then I start like, All right, this kid is yo coach, let me join. And then you go to his page, he doesn't have any clips of him. He doesn't even as his profile picture is him looking down at some gas Matt Seidl: Ha ha ha. The Academy by O3: station. Then you got another kid who's like, you know, super detailed. Hey Coach Ebbs, my name is so and so, my high school is this, my AAU program is this, I average this, I would love to be a part of your elite runs. And I'm like, it's who obviously who do you think I'm gonna go with, right? And it's like that, like like we just spoke on, Matt Seidl: Right. The Academy by O3: it's like you you have to be a good communicator. You have to sell yourself. Josh: Love it. I appreciate you coming on. Like I said, you're you're somebody right now that is what I try to explain to parents that are want their son recruited, you are the more important person in this process. There is no question about it. What I try to tell people is you get recruited playing AAU, and then my job is to confirm the a lot of the things you just said. The phone calls I get are Coach Trobe, are they a good kid? Are they good are their parents a problem? Do they get good grades? What are they like at school? I mean, I'm I'm more confirming that they're they're low maintenance. They were get recruited during AAU. and I so I'm glad you're on to that people hear that. The Academy by O3: Yeah, absolutely. Matt Seidl: let me echo what Josh said. We we appreciate all you do for for high school basketball in this area. I think the the development piece is great, taking young players and helping them accelerate their development. But then what you do with the high end kids and those families and I'm sure the college coaches appreciate that, that Josh: Yeah. Matt Seidl: you that you're accessible and and and run a legitimate program and the area and you know, I we're all I think we all kinda grew up in our early coaching days with common bond and and nothing against common bond, but you guys have kind of taken that this whole thing to another level and and some of the leagues that you guys are playing in and so forth and the affiliations just add credibility to it immensely. So again, appreciate you coming on, man, and good luck with everything this year. I'm sure we'll be in touch. The Academy by O3: No, thank you guys, big time. Appreciate you guys giving the opportunity. And yeah, we'll definitely be in touch. Jimpea I'll be at a bunch of games, so I'll see you real soon. Without a doubt, man. Without a doubt. All right, have it going guys. Josh: I hope so. I hope so. Alright, we'll talk to you, coach. Alright. Matt Seidl: Yeah. Josh: Alright. Matt Seidl: Okay, hey man, we're gonna move into the second quarter. And this is go ahead. Yeah. Josh: Be before before we do, I want to follow up one thing. Coach Ebbs was great. I want to follow up on something he said, and I didn't want to interrupt him. You know, I've been saying this for a long time as I listened to him talk, how much easier our lives would be as high school coaches if we ran our programs like AAU programs. If we only kept nine to ten guys. Like he said, I'm not gonna keep twelve to thirteen guys because you can't keep twelve to thirteen guys happy. You know, if we kept nine to ten guys or eight to ten and practiced with our JV team, how much easier our lives would be as high school coaches. One, our our kids would be happy because if they're on the team, they're getting playing time. Two, our parents would be happy because if if they're going to watch their kid, they're gonna play, right? Matt Seidl: Yeah, and I I definitely get the the small the small roster size for that, keeping people happy and so forth and like AAU programs do. What it does though is it that clashes with the whole philosophy and concept of educational athletics, giving as many students at your school an opportunity to be part of something, even if it means their roles might be different and not the one that they wanted. And so that that's what you gotta weigh back and forth. Josh: Okay, so no, I I I couldn't agree with you more. That's why we do it. I mean, I've kept fifteen for years, thirteen Matt Seidl: Right. Yep. Josh: things like that, because I agree with what you said, but put your AD hat on or even your old coaching hat. Think about where all the problems come usually in a program. It they come from the kids, right? They come Matt Seidl: I d you're not yeah, you're not a hundred percent. Josh: from the kids who don't play. You you know what I mean? So I Matt Seidl: Right. Josh: sometimes I I wonder do we you know what it what is the right choice. So anyways, that could be another Topic for another day, but go ahead. Yep. Matt Seidl: Roster size. I like it. I like it. All right. Back to that second quarter transition. We've got an interesting one today, and we're I don't even know how we're gonna do this, but we were we wanted to we wanted to rank again. So our our ranking today one through four, and we'll start with number four for each of us, is rank the four most memorable games of our coaching careers. Wow, and and memorable for whatever reason. Doesn't it it's it's totally up to the author of the story. So I put four together, I could have put forty together, but I'm gonna let you go first. You go ahead with your number four. Josh: Correct. Yeah, th this this was impossible. this took a while to put together this list. So the two the two games that I didn't make the cut, I just want to reference real quick, were the Amani Bates games that I coached in as the Chelsea coach. Well you know, and they should have. but you know, I was talking with Adam Hauser and Owen Brown, former players of mine from Chelsea, and we were talking about the Amani Bates games and things like that, and talking about the best games that that they played in. And I'll tell you what, those two kids played in in some of the greatest games I've ever been a part of in my time at Chelsea and and just really over the years. But the game that they played in that's gonna make it on this list is number four. And it's it was their junior year, 2019. I had a great senior class with Quinn Starkey and Hunter Neff and Hunter Lay and the Bell brothers. And we went over to Dexter, our rival Dexter, and they had us on the ropes. They had us beat all game long until we sent them to the free throw line at the end of the game. And then they didn't guard us after they missed the free throw, did not guard us very well coming down the floor and we hit a 35-footer to win the game at the buzzer to beat Dexter. Crowd goes on to the floor. The highlight was actually on Sports Center the next day, which is really cool. And it kept me with a perfect record against Tim Kane, which is, I mean, not really surprising, but also very cool. Matt Seidl: I think I know some of your assistant coaches from that game if I recall. I remember some was sending Yeah. Josh: Yeah, I I do remember somebody on the bench. I I think it's the only time one of those guys ever won a district was my assist as my assistant. Yeah. Matt Seidl: I don't know. Yeah, I don't know. For that to happen in the Dexter gym with him wearing blue and gold. That's it's hard to even imagine. But so my my my f number four is a is a loss. It's the only I think it's the only one I'm gonna talk about, a law. It was a four overtime thriller, girls basketball, Pinkney at Milford, the young Matt Seidel, and not that young, coaching against the legend Don Palmer at Milford High School. Four overtimes Pinckney loses to Milford 27 to 25. Now, if you remember Don Palmer's philosophy against the zone defense was to hold the ball. And yes, we came out in the zone because they were better than us. They were much better than us. But Don didn't really care. He was pretty stubborn. So he held the ball. We led 4-2 after the first quarter. We led 8-4 at halftime. And we led 12-4 going into the fourth quarter. He has the better team, and I'm just gonna and he's holding the ball even down, which was really stubborn for him because he usually only held it when he was ahead. Finally, they had to play, and they end up tying us something in the low 20s to get us into overtime. And if I think that's when he should have realized, like we could have been doing this the whole game, we'd probably be 15 or 20 up right now. Josh: Ha ha. Matt Seidl: Two, at least two in maybe three of the overtime sessions, once Milford got the ball of the tie game they played for the last shot. And I and that may have been when we were playing three minute overtimes and not four minute overtimes. And they would miss. And in the fourth overtime, they finally got the advantage on us and we had to scramble and lose by two. Twenty seven, twenty five, four overtimes. Absolute classic. But anyway. Josh: I I'm just gonna say that Coach Palmer is in the Hall of Fame. I have a ton of respect for him, like incredible basketball mind. If he's listening to this, which I doubt he is, but if he is, he should be embarrassed. And also you that is such a great example for the shot clock, once again. I mean Matt Seidl: Yeah. And hey, shout out to Stacy Rimmer. An uncharacteristic like fourteen or sixteen points for us out of our twenty five. And she really wasn't even a score for us, but she got hot from mid-range that game, back when mid-range was in vogue. So anyway, I had to I had to throw her in there. But all right, let's move let's move to what? Yeah, number three, Josh: Okay. Well go to your no you go to your number three then. I want to hear this. Matt Seidl: I'm just gonna I'm gonna term it the Johnny Benjamin game. A and and this was when I w this was when I was an assistant under the Josh: I know Johnny Benjamin from Dexter. Yeah. Okay. Matt Seidl: should be Hall of Famer Randy Swarland. I don't know that he's in the hall yet, but he should be. probably about 2006-ish. I was an assistant at the time. Very good Dexter team. I think we were probably sp fift 15 and 4 or something. Chelsea was 19 and already clinched the SEC championship and we're playing him in game 20, the final game of the regular season. Packed house at Dexter, 2500, 3,000 people, standing room only. And the stuff at the end of the game, they had us. We were it looked very bleak late. They had to get the ball in to win the game and they decide they run a great play and throw it deep. But the ball hits and bounces so high that the guy who caught it kind of panicked and had to he tried to make a layup as he caught it off the bounce and he missed it. And we had it up the court like in two or three seconds, and Benjamin hit a three at the buzzer to send it into overtime. And then at the overtime buzzer or very close to it. He hit a he hit like a shot off a high ball screen when they switched and he got caught on the big guy and hit another epic shot to win that game. It was the I call it to to this day the most meaningful, meaningless game of all Josh: Ha ha. Matt Seidl: time. And it was awesome to to spoil Chelsea's nineteen and season. Sorry, Robin Renyman, had to mention it, man. Josh: You've made it very clear that there are no meaningless games in that rivalry. Am I wrong to say that? Okay. Okay. Matt Seidl: th th it's true. That's true. I don't know why I said that then. All right. You're number you're number three. Josh: Okay, number three would be my state semifinal win over Detroit Douglas in 2014. And the theme of well. This this list and pretty much the theme of all my playoff coaching, it always includes a comeback. We're always down and we always come back. It it's just the way it is. And I I'd really like to be up, you know, in in the lead at some point. But we're in the semifinal game. we had to lead at halftime by two, playing great basketball, and then they absolutely stymied us in the third quarter. We scored two points in the third quarter, down nine going into the fourth quarter. we made a choice to go to our half court trap. And I'll be honest, I in back of my mind, I'm like, there's no way this is gonna work against two college guards, but we've got to try something to get going because we we just can't score in the half court. Needless to say, Matt Seidl: Mm-hmm. Josh: they threw it all over the Breslam gym and took some really bad shots. And then they cooperated and missed a lot of free throws down the stretch. we came back to take the lead. they tied it. And with a tie game, and and this is a crazy finish, tie game with nine seconds left, they steal the ball at half court and go in and turn it back over to us in a two on one situation and then follow us. we sent a freshman to the free throw line who had shot Matt Seidl: That's right. Josh: two free throws on the season and he made the front end and and we had a blowout win the next day in the state finals. But yeah, unbelievable game. Just the the range of emotions and and obviously a great win. Matt Seidl: I watched that on my computer downstairs and I remember seeing like, my god, you are living well, my man, you are living well. Josh: Ha ha. Matt Seidl: But that w that was a great that was a great ball game. So all right. That was your number three? All right, what is your number two? Josh: That was my number three. my number two, and it's and I guess we'll have to apologize to Robin Raymond for this one as well. this one it had incredible meaning to me because it was my first year at Milan. Game three and four. I inherited a milon program that had been three and thirty-nine the two years before I got there. And they were struggling, they were down, and and and I and I kind of you know walked into a a a tough situation as far as a mix of talent. I had a couple freshmen on the varsity, a couple seniors didn't want them to be there, that type of thing. And we go to Robin Raymond's Christmas tournament, game three or four, and we get a running clock put on us by Northville. The next day we're getting running clock put out on us by Pinckney. while that's happening, Chelsea wins the tournament. So they they win that thing. they beat both teams. Fast forward two and a half months later, we go to the district at Chelsea. And that was again back before seeding, and the best three teams were all seated on one side of the district. You had a loaded Willow Run team, a loaded Chelsea team, and a loaded FGR team, and they all had to play each other. And we got to play, we got a buy, and so did Skyline, and we got to play each other. Skyline didn't even have juniors or seniors in their school yet. Matt Seidl: that's right. Josh: Yeah. So we beat Skyline on Wednesday to set up game number two for me, which is on Friday night. There's a car accident on 94. We don't get to Chelsea until 7:15 that night. We we missed like warm-ups, the start of the game, everything. So they had to back everything up for us. We get off the bus, hurry up and change, warm up for 20 minutes. Might have even been 15 at that point. and again, down 11 going into the fourth quarter, and we have an Epic comeback. We go to the half-court trap. We couldn't miss. Andre Duffin hit every three he took in the fourth quarter that gym. CJ Levine, CJ Turnage with steals, Tori Martinson with every rebound. And we just went to the half-court trap and and Chelsea couldn't handle it. And we spoiled, which I think they thought was already going to be a district championship that night. And the reason that was so big for me, it was year one in that program, and that really is what. what made everyone believe like this this is gonna be special. We're gonna do some great things here. Matt Seidl: It also probably helped you get the Chelsea job a few years later. Josh: Yeah. It probably did. Yeah. Matt Seidl: My actually my number two is similar in this sense that it was the Pinckney Boys basketball team upset Howell in the ninety-two district final. We were a l we we went into the district ten and ten. If they would have there were seven teams in the district, if they would have said, Matt, you get to make out the bracket, I would have made it out exactly how it came out. One team got a bye, that was us. The three weak the three weakest teams were on the one side of the bracket. It was it was Heartland, Lakeland, and us, Pinckney. And on the four best teams were, you know, it's that's Milford and Brighton and South Lion and Howell all and Howell's like 19 and one. We barely survived the Friday game. We play like crap. We barely win and we're heading to Saturday af Saturday night's district final against Howell that has been winning war after war on the other side of the bracket, but they're very good. So much better than us, really, that season. we do a walkthrough at Country Elementary because I think they got some kind of craft show going on at the high school. We really I hadn't even reserved a gym for Saturday because I didn't think, you know, like what's it gonna matter? Right? No, I don't that's not totally true. But we we we end up playing Josh: Dennis Douglas would be mad if he heard you say that. Matt Seidl: we end up playing an extended zone that we refuse to collapse and just try to take away their perimeter shooting and no one zoned them because they were such a good shooting team. I think they were actually surprised. But yeah, we ended up we we get behind, we c we get ahead back and forth, we finally have a lead and we protect it at the end, and we had a little bit of a run late in the fourth and we win it. And there's two things I remember. One is this baseball three quarter court bounce pass from Dennis Douglas to one of his teammates who it escapes me for a unbelievable play for a layup that was critical down the stretch. Our crowd went nuts. And it's also when something came to me as they were down, I think, three, maybe, and they down two and they had one free throw left with like two or three seconds left. They needed to miss the free throw and get a tip in. And we decided to take like two or three intentional lane violations in a row while they were intentionally missing so that the w the ref had to blow it dead. And this came to us as we were walking out of the huddle and then we got to kind of see what they were trying to do. And eventually we ended up with the ball on a rebound and we we ran out the clock and won the game. That was incredible, man. W Dennis Douglas, Jason Shore, Christian Plush, Andy Reynolds, and Brian Carruthers. Nobody over six one in the starting lineup. And we had to go play Battle Creek Central at Charlotte a few days later and that was humbling. But that was an incredible, incredible game. So I had I had to mention Josh: I remember that Matt Seidl: that one. So Josh: Yeah, I remember that team well. I remember that game well. I went to that game and watched that game and Howell was an incredible three point shooting team. So that y you're right, nobody would zone because of that. Yeah. Yep. Matt Seidl: We just we just stayed outside the arc in this wide zone. We made it up, like I said, in an elementary tile floor gymnasium on Saturday morning. And hey, let's give it a shot. So we had nothing to lose. But all right, my number one, I'll make it quick. It I there's no way I cannot say it was the ninety six regional championship game, when we beat River Rouge at Lincoln High School on the eighty four foot court. That game was we we were We were on our heels. We were down, I think, double digits early in the fourth. They were in a half court trap and we just really had no answer. And we had these two huge plays that I remember turned the whole thing. One was a pick by our defensive point guard, like he was a our off guard, Darius Morris, rest in peace, by the way. He had a nice pick of their point guard at half court, took it in and maybe got it from like eight to six, got our crowd involved. And then our athlete Tykee Reeves on a miss free throw and man did we miss a lot of free throws that year with that team. He did you know, because back then you got to you can move as soon as the ball was released, even though they took that rule away after a while. And he had a nice little spin move and got inside a guy and had a tip in, I think, to either tie it or cut it to two. And then we just had all the momentum and and and put Rouge away. And that's Lamontist Stone and all those guys. So that that was a classic. And of course we had had country day waiting in the wings. for us and and we gave him a game but it was not to be. But that is one I'll never forget for sure. How about how about your number one? Josh: Okay. my number one, the 2025 regional championship at Ithaca High School. it wasn't like an epic win or anything like that. It was another come from behind win, and that was that whole postseason. we did it to Hanover and districts and Stockbridge in the regional semifinal and and then again in the regional final. but it was it was because It was the the last time I ever got a chance to coach both of my boys on one team. I think Zach might only played fifteen seconds in that game, but he was a great cheerleader as his his older brother Luke, you know, dropped twenty plus in that game and Luke and Timmy had eighteen Timmy Crowley, another great high school player. Luke and Timmy had eighteen of our twenty in the fourth quarter, just put us on their back and again down seven going into the fourth in that one. And but it was just it was it was Only year I ever got to coach my kids together. and that was the last time sort of winter regional with them that was special. And you know, I and I say that because you know, you we've both done this a long time. I mean, I know you mentioned before the podcast you've you've coached in what four or five decades? Is that I mean five decades. Yeah, Matt Seidl: That'd be five decades. I'm shooting for a six. Yeah, yeah. Josh: and you know, and over the last 20, 30 years, she's 30 years now, you know, we've given so much to so many kids and families to to be able to coach my boys together one time one year, that that was a memory I I'll always have. That's a a framed picture that will always be up. Matt Seidl: I know that was an emotional regional for you. It was emotional for me too. I think I shed tears after you won the regional championship as well, but not for the same reasons that you shed them. I couldn't I couldn't believe all three of those teams in a row couldn't close the deal against you guys. Man, I just come on, the the the club team. I was taking a lot of heat from Lumen Christie people back then. A lot a lot more back then than to these days. I wonder why that is. But anyway yeah, I was I was kinda I hate to say it, big fella. I was kinda hoping you guys might might go down that night, but you you guys had magic. You guys had magic like three nights in a row, three games in a row. So Josh: I I thought we were. Yeah. We did. Yep. Matt Seidl: all right. Well that's good that's great. That was that was fun doing. little storytelling for sure. So that gets us to our third quarter. We're gonna make this a quick quarter before we get into our football picks, but maybe at least one what we're watching. From each of us. I if you got more than one, feel free to let it rip. But why don't you go first? What are you watching these days? Josh: It's one thing, but I it's got many details, but I'll make it quick. I am I'm watching college football, and that's all I did yesterday. the stories, the the range of emotions, the and many different things. So, you know, I this week college football took a lot of heat for going to a 2014 playoff. I I'm in the minority. I love it. I think it's great. I'm all for it. I mean, there's never been more parody in college football. you know, the other thing I I think I need to say is let's recap yesterday. First w last week, last week Matt Seidl: Mm-hmm. Josh: Alabama gets robbed by the officials and the the no the the missed pass interference. Now there's no way to know if they would have beat Georgia, but they would have been in field goal range to at least tie it, you know. So then we have yesterday in the the great state of Utah. Not only do we have a no-called pass interference on the last play of the game, it also shouldn't have been the last play of the game. There was still one second left, but because the Pandemonium took over and the Mormons rushed the field. They didn't put they did not allow them to play the last play of that game with one second. So apparently. Okay, yeah. Well, I mean, apparently, Matt Seidl: Let's not make let's not make this about religion, okay? Let's not make this about religion, okay? Josh: if you go to Michigan, we add time, but if you play at Notre Dame, we take time away. I'm not sure how that works. But, anyways, the officiating was there, it was horrible. then I watched on replay because I was watching my Irish, you know, Florida State. A phantom holding call on Florida State that backs them up to basically the 40 yard line in overtime. Again, another like horrible officiating. So maybe this is a good lesson for you, Matt. Maybe you need to be a little nicer to high school officials, you know, Matt Seidl: Hmm. Josh: since college officials can't get it right. You know, I'm just just saying. Yeah. I know. it's it. Yeah. Well, Matt Seidl: Mm, mm. Yeah, they don't yeah, and and they even have replay. You know, you think with re with replay we wouldn't be getting a lot wrong anymore, so not good. Josh: don't know about that. But yeah. but then then let's go to the Michigan game. The Tommy Carr moment, the Lloyd Carr moment. I as we all know and those that listen to the podcast, I am not a Michigan fan, but I respect Lid Lloyd Carr, great coach. seeing him sitting there with with Greasy and rooting for his grandson and seeing Tommy Carr come in and which they should have had him come in about four games ago, but seeing him come in and and lead them to victory and the way he played, yeah, things got a little misty in in the living room, not gonna lie. That was very emotional to watch and awesome. also while that game was on it it you know in the background between third and fourth quarter you know can we please change Mr. Bright side the worst song in the history of college songs I mean every other stadium has a an electric song except U of who's gonna have a song that talks about somebody getting cheated on by their girlfriend. I mean just anyways hey well no no I've been in the big house many times yeah probably more than you I yeah yeah Matt Seidl: haters, dude. Have you ever b have you ever been in the big house when Mr. Brightside plays? When when that song plays? When that song plays, you've been there? Okay. I just want to make sure you've been there Josh: Yo, I've been there. Yeah. I I yeah, I yeah. Matt Seidl: when that song became a thing. Yeah. No, you gotta keep you gotta keep that forever, man. You don't change that. So alright. God, what a what a hater. What a hater. Josh: Yeah, it's yeah, well, okay. And then then what about the game before that? We're gonna talk about Ohio State and Indiana. I mean, let's stick to the motto don't trust a Spartan. I mean, Nick Marsh, maybe we should stay in bounds. I mean, like you're you got the game one, we're just gonna catch it and run out of bounds. he knew. Yeah, but what Matt Seidl: And when he when he put his h when he put his hands on his helmet you knew you knew he knew. He he knew. Josh: I mean, like again, why I mean again, you trust a Spartan, you get what you get. I mean it is what it is, but Matt Seidl: As a Michigan fan, I wasn't sure what I wanted on that one. I was at I was at the I was in Kentucky this weekend doing some stuff, but I I watched that that play live and I wasn't Josh: Yeah. Matt Seidl: sure if I want Indiana to lose so they're down coming into Ann Arbor this week, or if I wanted Ohio State to lose. But whatever happened happened. So it was exciting. I know that, so Josh: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and I and I I mean I I'll let you go. I could go on and on about all the all the upsets in the SEC and Arch Manning and Sarkesian, but go ahead. The I I think I got enough in. Matt Seidl: I'm gonna stay away from college. I'm gonna stay away from college football. I'm probably gonna make you uncomfortable with my what we're watching. There's gonna be totally different shift here. So if you if you wanna like disappear from the the camera and then come back when I'm done, that's fine. But I'm not gonna I'm not gonna offer opinions. I'm not getting into opinions right now, but I'm telling you, I can't not watch the forty-two vote by the Monroe Public Schools Board of Education this past week to ban transgender. Girls from the district's girls' sports team. And I want to make sure I got that right, so I'm going to read it. And that's a move. That's a move. The reason I'm watching it is because that's a move that the ACLU deemed a violation or against the law, because of the state's civil rights law. So I'm just watching, like, legally, how is this going to work out? I'm really curious. I read some comments. the Monroe Board of Education Secretary, I think her name is Mary Vincent. Let me read this to real quick. And this it just makes you kind of think, are we worried about the varsity teams scrimmaging JV teams? Are we concerned about girls competing in sports for boys? for boys, such as football? If we're really concerned about the safety of our athletes, shouldn't we be writing a policy that says no women in boys' sports, no JV versus varsity, because of the diff differentials in ability and age? And like, okay, that one that one caught me off guard. Interesting take. She was one of the two. of the six that voted against the ban. So now apparently I guess the the Supreme Court sometime last June they ruled that states can ban, they can have bans similar to what Monroe is trying to insert. but that's if the state then adopts, you know, that that policy and Michigan has not. The issue here in Michigan has no ban. So Monroe has kind of jumped the gun and that's what the ACLU is probably arguing about already. The timing is very interesting. We have a father of a Monroe student athlete, female student athlete who has filed a federal lawsuit against the district and a couple of the administrators because the daughter played against and allegedly shared a locker room with a transgender girl from another school last year, September. Well documented case. Again, not going to get into the politics of it or my opinion about it, but just watching this unfold and how all of this ends up. it's I don't want to call it theater because we got real people involved, but it is it's intriguing for sure. So that's kind of what what I'm watching. So again, you didn't leave, so I appreciate you respecting my All Josh: No, I enjoy listening to you. Yeah. Matt Seidl: right. All right. That that gets us out of the third quarter and we head the home stretch. We're gonna get into we haven't done this for a while. This is probably gonna be the last time we do it this this high school football season, at least. We are football our pig skin picks. By the way, you are currently eleven and six, and I am ten and seven. I'm only one game behind after I think I was three and one the last time we did this, you were two or two. So we're gonna pick four games. we'll make it quick. we've got the first we got two high school games, two college games, and we're gonna use our own schools in the high school games. We really haven't talked much about our own schools yet, so this is a chance to promote our kids or at least have a feel for it. So Josh, our first game is Lumen Christie versus Divine Child. I thought it was in Dearborn. You're saying they're playing it at Ford Field. Is that accurate? Josh: That is accurate. It's seven and one Lumen Christie versus seven and one Divine Child. That'll be at Ford Field on Saturday at four thirty. Matt Seidl: Huh. Huh. Forward field, huh? Just just snap your fingers and we get to play at forward field. Okay. All right. It's Josh: It's like I said, Catholics and Catholic and private schools could separate without an issue from the NMHSA. Yeah. Yeah. All right. Matt Seidl: Without an issue. I can see that. Well who do you who do you got who do you have in that classic and why? Josh: Last year, Divine Child won 17 to 14 at Lumen Christie. both teams have close wins over Notre Dame Prep this year. both teams have lost to upper division Catholic schools this year. just powerhouses. And You know, I think that this is a coin flip game. I don't think I know it's a coin flip game. I would say that Lumen Christie's offense is better than it was last year. And Divine Child had some key graduates from last year that that are not there that played huge roles in that win last year. Lumen does not want to shoot out. This this is a game that we want to control time of possession, control the pace. you know, Divine Child is big up front and and they want to play fast and they and they want this to be a high-scoring game. Guys like Aiden Gatewood, Great tailback, West Learned, great wide receiver tight end for Lumen, Benny Gaston, the quarterback, all are going to be key to us controlling the ball and moving the ball up and down the field. Jay Contact, who's been incredible for us this year, senior linebacker has just played outstanding, also plays a little bit of the fullback position. And then we just got Johnny Walters back on the defensive side as well from injury, as well as basketball star Broden Burgess is back on the field. Matt Seidl: Mm, hmm. Josh: now, that's all good things, but we also Also we had a huge loss this week at Notre Dame Prep. Division II commit to Northwood Cash Cooper suffered an injury at Pontiac Notre Dame Prep, and I do believe will be out for this game. So that will be a huge loss on the defensive side. That being said, Titans don't lose. I mean, if the Titans win out this year, if they win this game and then make a run and win it all, which I expect them to do, I do believe Herb Brogan will be the winningest coach in the history of Michigan High School football. So I'm picking the Titans. I'm gonna go 24-17. No, that's not true. They're not kicking foot field goals. What am I thinking? We're Matt Seidl: Yeah. Josh: gonna go 28-17, Lumen Christie. Matt Seidl: Remember, you you can get to twenty-four by just going for two all the time, but seven s 17 you can't do it. All Josh: No, we don't do that either. Yeah. What yeah, twenty eight seventeen Titans. Matt Seidl: right. I am a huge Divine Child Falcon fan this week. Just want you to know that. All I know is about Divine. I know Divine Child, because these two guys are in the headlines a lot. They have a quarterback named, I think, Drew Sheridan, a lefty, by the way, division one prospect, only Josh: Very good. Very good. Yep. Matt Seidl: a junior. They have a a wide receiver and a defensive back, Rashawn Ray Ray. R Ray Sean Ray Ray Thomas and I I think he had He had a huge game in the state finals last year, if I'm not mistaken, as a sophomore. He too is a junior. That combination on offense is going to be tough for the the the the Titans, at least hopefully. if if if you're a Falcon fan. I I just, you know, I just like when Lumen gets beat. Like I said, that regional, when you guys pull out win after win, it just it it tears at me, man. So I kind of need Divine Show to have have some success this week. I'm gonna go with the Falcons in a nail biter and a classic, because these are two very, very good football teams. So Alright. Alright, so there's there's our first game. Our second game. I will go first. This is this is Ida, the Ida blue streaks, six and two. coming into Pinckney. the Pirates are two and six, and this is senior night for Pinckney. Pirates had a tough year, no doubt. A lot of injuries, three one-score losses. So, you know, obviously in a perfect world you flip those and you're five and three and not two and six. But the bottom line is we are two and six. So I am confident though, knowing these kids and these coaches, that they are going to play well in their last home game and the last game of the season. Ida is solid, six and two, and they've won nine games the last two years. They were six and this year before running into Clinton and Hudson in both of their conference schools. We do play bigger, probably a stronger schedule than Ida. They are in the Lenway County League. Jax Raymond, our senior quarterback. I think he wants to go out. you know, he's got most of the Pinckney passing records, and I think he'd like to add maybe one or two more. I think he wants to go out well. We've got a really good sophomore named Easton McLaughlin, who's been playing with a club on his left arm all year, but he's a playmaker, both sides of the ball. Logan Ranowski, running back linebacker. I I expect Logan to have a big final game at Pirate Stadium. And Oliver Wendell, the maybe the the I don't know, not the best. We have a really good young receiving core. and he but he probably has the most yards and maybe the most stats this year. He leads that that crew. I think those guys together can maybe find a way to to beat the blue streaks, at least we're hoping. So I'm gonna go with the Pirates. How about you, man? Josh: All right, well, you stole a lot of my information, but I will remind you that Pinckney's two wins this year are against two and six Owasso and and eight Lincoln. So even though they have two wins, not very impressive. I do love that this is a Pinckney home game. Can you remind the listeners, what fight song do you guys play when you score a touchdown at Pinckney? Matt Seidl: It sounds a little bit like the Notre Dame fighting Irish fights. A little bit it sounds like it. Josh: A little bit? I th I think it's a lot like that. So I I love that Mr. Public School plays a private school fight song when his team scores a touchdown. I love it. The the I know deep down you love private schools and Notre Dame. It just shows right there. So I am hoping for an absolute shootout where both teams put up a ton of points and we can just listen to that Notre Dame fight song all night long. Unfortunately, as I have followed Pinckney this year, I've noticed that their defense is very like optional in in Pinckney. Sometimes we choose to play it, and well, more more often than not, they don't. So I'm going to go with Ida. in a high scoring affair forty nine to forty two blue streaks. Matt Seidl: Wow. I'm gonna be we're gonna be there till about eleven PM that night. So but we do throw it a lot, so my goodness. All right. All right, that that that's gonna take us to our college games. We've got two college games. Josh, you're gonna go first. The first one is Ole Miss at Texas. Josh: I'll make this quick. Texas is done and and Ole Miss is is coming. They came off the bye week. They've they fixed the defensive issues they have. They've had the best quarterback in the country. I like Ole Miss Texas seasons. They lose. Arch is in the portal and Sark's fired after Saturday. Matt Seidl: You might want to know Texas is a three and a half point favorite, by the way, at home. So just so you know, and I know I know you're a big Vegas, I know you're a big betting guy. Josh: Well, I will get on my bet I will get on my betting app tonight. Yeah. Matt Seidl: I want you to know this too. This is what I'm leaning on. Ole Miss, they they beat up on up and down Missouri team 31-3. Missouri is all over the place. Sometimes they're great, sometimes they like they were this past weekend. Texas loses to up and down Florida. Florida plays great, they play terrible, then they play great again. I think. Texas and Ole Miss could be a little up and down themselves. So if you flip how they played this past week, I kind of like Texas in this one to beat Ole Miss. So that's there's three we had three games so far and we have picked the opposite of each other. Why not? Yeah, so it's gonna Josh: That's Yeah. Matt Seidl: we're gonna find out who's got this competition or not. Our final game, why not? Indiana at Michigan. Michigan is a seven point underdog at home against Indiana. Indi I want people to realize Indiana did not dominate Northwestern. They did not dominate Nebraska, the two best teams on their schedule prior to Ohio State, which they lost to. They're not going to dominate Michigan either, despite Michigan's flawed product this year. and who does Indiana prepare for? Do they prepare for Tommy Carr or do they prepare for Bryce Underwood? the better question though I want to ask, why doesn't Michigan just play both those quarterbacks? You know, like just play both. They I know you, you know. Had this conversation with my son yesterday. You know, there's always a thing, you gotta pick one and put the other one as a second team. You can't go back and forth. Yeah, yeah, you can. You can go back and forth, especially when you don't have a perfect situation. If I'm Michigan, I start playing both those quarterbacks. I'm worried that Michigan's defense might not be as good as people realize, even though they did come up with those three big turnovers to spark that Penn State win. I'm gonna take Michigan in a season turning victory over Indiana, and they may rush the field on this one. Just saying. Anyway, defending national champs, you gotta rush the field when you beat It's not Western, but you know, maybe another chance to rush the field. That's who I've got. Who do you got? Josh: well, I'll just tell the listeners right here. take Mississippi's Ole Miss in the three and a half and lay the seven in the big house as a two-team parlay, and you will win some money. Indiana's gonna just, I mean, Indiana's gonna mop them up. It's not even gonna be, I mean, it might be close for the first five minutes. This is Indiana's defense is legit. And, you know, Nebraska's a tough team. And they were on the road in Nebraska. Ohio State might be the best team in the country. And they had them beat if Marsh could have stayed in bounds. This is going to be a 31 to 10 Indiana beat down. And yeah, that and I'm telling you what, I'm getting on my phone immediately after this podcast and putting that two game parlay together. Matt Seidl: Okay. All right. Four games. We have four different picks. Should be interesting to see how that goes. I don't claim to be a football expert, but I I can at least try to sell it. So and I and you knew I wasn't. There was a couple teams on our list that I w you knew I wasn't picking again, so that's for sure. So Josh: Right. Matt Seidl: all right, man. That was fun. looking forward to it again. we will be back next time. Josh, have a great week. and that fight song, I wonder why why do you know how Pinkney plays the fight song every time they score. that's right. It was that middle school game when the Paintney middle school team kept scoring on Chelsea over and over and over. That's right, I for I forgot about that. Josh: Well, it's it's like we tell our kids, you know, l let them celebrate now because they'll never beat you in high school. Yeah. Yep. All Matt Seidl: It's been a while. It definitely been a while. So all right, man. Have a good week. We'll see ya. Josh: right, see ya.